I have a Synchronika (basically the Pro 700's slightly fancier-looking sibling) and the PID never showed a fill indicator when I had it on reservoir. However, the PID would indeed flash if it detected low water in the middle of pulling a shot, and then the machine would turn off the boilers as soon as the brew lever was disengaged. I agree with your critique of the design of the flow control knob; I was on the Home-Barista forums when WLL & ECM/Profitec premiered the flow control knob and asked why they couldn't make something larger and easier to grasp. They said it's because they wanted to enable >360° control and couldn't figure out a better way of doing so. Though I, too, don't turn the knob more than like 300° at most (~8 g/s being my preferred peak flow rate), and have set the "closed" position as such that the knob never has to turn towards 12 o'clock.
The Rocket Appartamento has been my dream machine for almost 3 years now, and when your Workflow Wednesday came in my recommendations it made me want it more. Now I finally bought it and it’s on its way to my place, I might post vlogs inspired by your Workflow Wednesdays. ☕️☕️☕️
This review was really nicely laid out and filmed. The video looks excellent on my OLED TV! Thanks for the video gear list. Best of luck with your channel.
With flow control I think the Stock Flow rate on Rotary machines is usually about 14g/s, which is about 1.5 turns usually (but seems to be about 2 turns on yours) If you got 125ml in 10 sec divide by 10 and you get 12.5ml/Sec. But I agree, it's probably not necessary to go that high, once you're at your machines max 9 or 10 bar pressure limit, and the coffee is providing enough resistance to brew at 9 bars, then I'm not sure if there's any real difference between 3ml/sec flow rate and 10ml/sec (if espresso is flowing out at about 1ml/sec it should keep up the same pressure even at 3ml/sec).
Hi Chris, I have watched the comparison Bianca vs p700. Your videos are really really really good. Thank you. Keep up the good work. Regards from Germany Kai
Okay so I have a pro 600 which is basically the same machine. I have to agree on the following points but not entierly : - Cup rest/tray : annoying to remove the cups, to fill the tank but with the pro 700 you basically have to connect it to your water point and not the tank, because thats the selling point of the machine (compared to a 600) imo. - the fact that the cup tray bends and can seem less well finished. I think its due to the fact that so much heat is comming to that piece that it feels like its done in purpose to have better tolerences. - regarding the « no water » in the water tank i have to agree this is imo the only downside of the machine. On the pro 600 it blinks « 114 » (lmao ok) and ofc it happens like mid shot and this is very annoying. I would have love an LED to indicate that you’re running low on water. But tbh if you know your coffee consomation per day, you’ll know when to fill it up or not, which is btw normally not something you should worry about on the pro 700. NB : also the footprint on the 700 is massive compared to the other one and you did well to highlight this ! Banger of a machine tho, end game for sure ! Nice review
I'm nearly ready to get the pro 600 how are you finding yours. Do you have any vids on youtube showing yours off. I havent found any up to date vids and I'm trying to find out if profitec are going to update the machine before i get one, as it has been the same for a few years now. An updated pid screen would be a nice touch.😉😎🇬🇧
@@l.l.coolray As said the only downside imo is the lack of LED to say that you're running low on water. I have no videos but ill be down to make a workflow video if people want it. It heats up fast. Amazing for latte art, outstanding from the box, cool packaging, decent foot print, amazing finish... the best machine under 2k€ for sure. Imo the only true candidate above it would be a Decent or a LMLM which are not in the same line as an e61 machine.
Hi @Enjoy, to the best of my knowledge the automatic shutoff on Profitec and ECM machines is purely meant to be a safety feature, a warning just isn‘t part of the package. After a decent amount of ruined extractions I tried my luck on Amzn and found a DIY kit to retrofit water tanks with a low (and high) level warning system. Now, whenever I‘m running low a slightly annoying siren as well as a blinking red light allow me to finish the shot and refill the tank before the deadswitch kicks in.
ECO mode basically just turns the machine off I believe. I have the Synchronika which is similar, when water reaches a certain low level it will flash (it doesn't say fill though) then goes blank and turns off the boilers. The good thing about these machines is that it does give you a little warning so if you're in the middle of a shot it won't just stop mid-shot (like my Rocket HX did previously) it keeps going usually enough to finish your shot. You probably didn't notice the flashing before it turned off, unless it's different for the Profitec 700. Can you remove the sharp looking cup rail? On the Synchronika it kinda looks similar minus the rails, also the rear part of the Synchronika cup warmer actually has a hinged door for refilling the water reservoir.
Great review, I'm saving up to buy the pro 600, the model down from this one purely because of price, but it has most of the same features except for the pump which i don't mind. By the way a lot of people just lift the top off without removing the cups providing you have the space to set it down whilst you fill the reservoir. It makes the task a lot easier.🤫👏👍😎🇬🇧
Hey LL, I just purchased the 600, its a great machine, you will love it. I was tossing up between the 600 and 700. The 600 is a bit smaller, lighter, you get 2 bar steam pressure from the 1L steam boiler and pretty much everything else is the same. I moved up from the Rocket Appartamento, and it's a step up. Steaming is fine even if you are making multiple drinks. Put the savings towards a top end grinder. You will love the 600.
@@l.l.coolray Hi, when I got my Rocket I purchased a Eureka Mingon Specialita, 55m as I single dose. I purchased a 3rd party bellows for it, works very well for single dosing. I really like it, it performs well with the 600 and is very easy to open and clean, plus it is stepless. I like the compact size of the Migon series and they are quiet. I would look at the Migon XL or new Migon Turbo if I was buying new, they both have 65mm burrs I believe. I don't think you would notice much in the cup if you are making milk based drinks between 55mm and 65mm. I will probably keep my 55mm for a while see how it goes and potentially look at an upgrade to 65mm burr machine next year. Not sure if it is worth it though. Very happy with the Specialita. I am pretty sure Eurkea make the Rocket grinders in their factory. The Atom is a very big unit and not so good for single dosing.
@@l.l.coolray hi I have the Specialita 55mm. I was looking at the atom 60/65 or the new allgrounds. After a bit of research and talking to people who have the Atom and Specialita I will just stick with the Specialita. Most say there is not much difference in the cup between these grinders. I like the Specialita as it is compact and works well for single dosing, I purchased a bellows for it which works really well. Plus smaller foot print. If you are going to single dose stick with the Mignon series. If you want on demand go with the Atom. I only make 2-5 milk based drinks a day so in demand makes no sense. Hope this helps.
Thx for your time in replying, i went down the single dose rabbit hole for a little while, i enjoyed all the ins and outs of changing dose size and swapping between lots of single origin coffees, but i found myself focusing more on that, than just enjoying the coffee, so it has to be on demand for my next adventure. I will still have my morning routine but i can relax and enjoy the coffee and get an extra 15mins in bed 😆 👍😎🇬🇧
I have the Pro 700, why don't you just pick up the cup warming tray by the guardrails instead of removing the cups one by one? I find that much easier.
When you are spending 3000 plus a couple of hundred is usually not a deal breaker. I been look at only three machines cause for one they all have a rotary pump and have two broilers and can be plumbed. They are the ECM Sychronika, Lucca M58 Espresso and Profitec 700 and of them all I'm leaning to the ECM Sychronika cause of the superior finish and the gauges are at the top which I think would make a little easier to read. All my figuring is from watch these videos not seeing them in person.
I'm considering either the Synchronika or the Bianca. Looking forward to the comparison of the Pro700 to the Bianca. With as much attention to detail and polished surfaces, I am surprised that Profitec left the raw stamped edge of cup rail unfinished. My guess is that it might be an outsourced assembly and having it finished would require a renegotiated price on the component. I'm sure there is plenty of discussion between the manufacturing engineers, purchasing, and the marketing department on that one. 😉😉
Funny, I never saw the cup rail as cheap looking on mine-never occurred to me. I guess that part could be improved but it’s plenty solid at least. My only issue with the Pro700 is the pump is noisier than I’d like, but I’m used to it. It’s otherwise rock solid and dependable. Very happy with mine.
@@jcbarker1 I missed out on a Pro 700, but ended up finding a really nice used Synchronika. I would have been happy with either. Mine seems to be running a bit high on pump pressure, as I see it go over 10 at times. I may adjust it. Also trying to pre-infuse seems fussier than I would have expected.
Read the written version of the review here: www.itsxris.com/post/profitec-pro-700-review An updated list of what's currently on my coffee bar: www.itsxris.com/brew All the behind-the-scenes equipment I use to make my content: www.itsxris.com/store
had both highly prefere the bianca, only drawback for me was more steampower on the pro 700, but bianca has more then enough for me + (in my book) looks better.
@@life_is_adventure yes, but that’s only the E61 flow control mod. It doesn’t give the same granularity, speed or precision that pump or needle driven flow control does.
Wondering if you an change the flow control to Bianca’s flow control. Also looking into the synchronika for future proof. I don’t make milk beverages but I used to say I didn’t care for espresso and only drank pour overs 😅 and now I’m fascinated with espresso…
Pro 600 MODE releases in the UK and presumably elsewhere shortly. That's a 600 with flow control valve and joystick controls for steam and hot water. That vs the Bianca is a video I'd like to see as they are the same price. MODE will still be vibe pump though but if flow control is Bianca's trump card then Profitec has that covered
@@itsxris be an interesting comparison I think. Bit different in the UK market as it looks like Profitec have released it as a direct competitor to the Bianca but not given it the full spec of the 700 to keep the price in line. Technically the Bianca is still the better spec but from a user perspective the comparison would be cool to see
In New Zealand we have both the 600 and 600 MODE, I checked it out both at our local store and the joysticks did not feel as nice to use as the dials, not sure why, I did hear that it is easier to service the standard dials, but not sure if that is true. I went with the standard 600, as I use darker beans and probably wont be using flow control. Flow control looks a bit messy on the Proftec, it is better on the Bianca.The 600 is much quite than my Rocket Appartamento they did a good job to make the 600 quite, the 700 is near silent. If you need better steam pressure and have the space go for the 700, otherwise the 600 will do nicely. 2 Bar pressure is really impressive and dual boiler really makes very smooth espresso. Very noticeable differences from a HX machine.
I've watched basically all your videos and they very informative. I only wish you would speak more slowly because it's very difficult to understand 50 % of the times.
@@itsxris That is what I was wondering. Whole Latte Love says on their site made in Italy... But I say the video of them in Germany. I was deciding between the Pro 600 or the Quick Mill Qm67 and I figured it really came down to german vs Italian engineering. Profitec and ECM just seem more cleaned up in the inside
I have a Synchronika (basically the Pro 700's slightly fancier-looking sibling) and the PID never showed a fill indicator when I had it on reservoir. However, the PID would indeed flash if it detected low water in the middle of pulling a shot, and then the machine would turn off the boilers as soon as the brew lever was disengaged.
I agree with your critique of the design of the flow control knob; I was on the Home-Barista forums when WLL & ECM/Profitec premiered the flow control knob and asked why they couldn't make something larger and easier to grasp. They said it's because they wanted to enable >360° control and couldn't figure out a better way of doing so. Though I, too, don't turn the knob more than like 300° at most (~8 g/s being my preferred peak flow rate), and have set the "closed" position as such that the knob never has to turn towards 12 o'clock.
The Rocket Appartamento has been my dream machine for almost 3 years now, and when your Workflow Wednesday came in my recommendations it made me want it more. Now I finally bought it and it’s on its way to my place, I might post vlogs inspired by your Workflow Wednesdays. ☕️☕️☕️
This review was really nicely laid out and filmed. The video looks excellent on my OLED TV! Thanks for the video gear list. Best of luck with your channel.
appreciate it!
Great video. It also has a quiet rotary pump too.
With flow control I think the Stock Flow rate on Rotary machines is usually about 14g/s, which is about 1.5 turns usually (but seems to be about 2 turns on yours) If you got 125ml in 10 sec divide by 10 and you get 12.5ml/Sec. But I agree, it's probably not necessary to go that high, once you're at your machines max 9 or 10 bar pressure limit, and the coffee is providing enough resistance to brew at 9 bars, then I'm not sure if there's any real difference between 3ml/sec flow rate and 10ml/sec (if espresso is flowing out at about 1ml/sec it should keep up the same pressure even at 3ml/sec).
My name is also “Chris”. I’m envious that you are spelling it XRIS! Perfect!
Hi Chris, I have watched the comparison Bianca vs p700.
Your videos are really really really good. Thank you. Keep up the good work.
Regards from Germany
Kai
And which one did you purchased?
Okay so I have a pro 600 which is basically the same machine.
I have to agree on the following points but not entierly :
- Cup rest/tray : annoying to remove the cups, to fill the tank but with the pro 700 you basically have to connect it to your water point and not the tank, because thats the selling point of the machine (compared to a 600) imo.
- the fact that the cup tray bends and can seem less well finished. I think its due to the fact that so much heat is comming to that piece that it feels like its done in purpose to have better tolerences.
- regarding the « no water » in the water tank i have to agree this is imo the only downside of the machine. On the pro 600 it blinks « 114 » (lmao ok) and ofc it happens like mid shot and this is very annoying. I would have love an LED to indicate that you’re running low on water.
But tbh if you know your coffee consomation per day, you’ll know when to fill it up or not, which is btw normally not something you should worry about on the pro 700.
NB : also the footprint on the 700 is massive compared to the other one and you did well to highlight this !
Banger of a machine tho, end game for sure !
Nice review
I'm nearly ready to get the pro 600 how are you finding yours. Do you have any vids on youtube showing yours off. I havent found any up to date vids and I'm trying to find out if profitec are going to update the machine before i get one, as it has been the same for a few years now. An updated pid screen would be a nice touch.😉😎🇬🇧
@@l.l.coolray As said the only downside imo is the lack of LED to say that you're running low on water. I have no videos but ill be down to make a workflow video if people want it. It heats up fast. Amazing for latte art, outstanding from the box, cool packaging, decent foot print, amazing finish... the best machine under 2k€ for sure. Imo the only true candidate above it would be a Decent or a LMLM which are not in the same line as an e61 machine.
Hi @Enjoy, to the best of my knowledge the automatic shutoff on Profitec and ECM machines is purely meant to be a safety feature, a warning just isn‘t part of the package.
After a decent amount of ruined extractions I tried my luck on Amzn and found a DIY kit to retrofit water tanks with a low (and high) level warning system. Now, whenever I‘m running low a slightly annoying siren as well as a blinking red light allow me to finish the shot and refill the tank before the deadswitch kicks in.
@@l.l.coolray th-cam.com/video/l54y-_Vx_ts/w-d-xo.html for the 700 and this is for the 600, th-cam.com/video/bB0eg0hG638/w-d-xo.html
@@MrPrinceBela oh wow can you please link or tell me the exact stuff that you used for it please ?
ECO mode basically just turns the machine off I believe.
I have the Synchronika which is similar, when water reaches a certain low level it will flash (it doesn't say fill though) then goes blank and turns off the boilers. The good thing about these machines is that it does give you a little warning so if you're in the middle of a shot it won't just stop mid-shot (like my Rocket HX did previously) it keeps going usually enough to finish your shot.
You probably didn't notice the flashing before it turned off, unless it's different for the Profitec 700.
Can you remove the sharp looking cup rail? On the Synchronika it kinda looks similar minus the rails, also the rear part of the Synchronika cup warmer actually has a hinged door for refilling the water reservoir.
Great review, I'm saving up to buy the pro 600, the model down from this one purely because of price, but it has most of the same features except for the pump which i don't mind. By the way a lot of people just lift the top off without removing the cups providing you have the space to set it down whilst you fill the reservoir. It makes the task a lot easier.🤫👏👍😎🇬🇧
Hey LL, I just purchased the 600, its a great machine, you will love it. I was tossing up between the 600 and 700. The 600 is a bit smaller, lighter, you get 2 bar steam pressure from the 1L steam boiler and pretty much everything else is the same. I moved up from the Rocket Appartamento, and it's a step up. Steaming is fine even if you are making multiple drinks. Put the savings towards a top end grinder. You will love the 600.
@@maheenm what grinder are you using? I am looking at the new fausto touch or the atom 65 specialty
@@l.l.coolray Hi, when I got my Rocket I purchased a Eureka Mingon Specialita, 55m as I single dose. I purchased a 3rd party bellows for it, works very well for single dosing. I really like it, it performs well with the 600 and is very easy to open and clean, plus it is stepless. I like the compact size of the Migon series and they are quiet. I would look at the Migon XL or new Migon Turbo if I was buying new, they both have 65mm burrs I believe. I don't think you would notice much in the cup if you are making milk based drinks between 55mm and 65mm. I will probably keep my 55mm for a while see how it goes and potentially look at an upgrade to 65mm burr machine next year. Not sure if it is worth it though. Very happy with the Specialita. I am pretty sure Eurkea make the Rocket grinders in their factory. The Atom is a very big unit and not so good for single dosing.
@@l.l.coolray hi I have the Specialita 55mm. I was looking at the atom 60/65 or the new allgrounds. After a bit of research and talking to people who have the Atom and Specialita I will just stick with the Specialita. Most say there is not much difference in the cup between these grinders. I like the Specialita as it is compact and works well for single dosing, I purchased a bellows for it which works really well. Plus smaller foot print. If you are going to single dose stick with the Mignon series. If you want on demand go with the Atom. I only make 2-5 milk based drinks a day so in demand makes no sense. Hope this helps.
Thx for your time in replying, i went down the single dose rabbit hole for a little while, i enjoyed all the ins and outs of changing dose size and swapping between lots of single origin coffees, but i found myself focusing more on that, than just enjoying the coffee, so it has to be on demand for my next adventure. I will still have my morning routine but i can relax and enjoy the coffee and get an extra 15mins in bed 😆 👍😎🇬🇧
Yay the review is finally out! Thank you for the review,I've been having a hard time deciding a machine 🤣
I keep my cups on the tray when removing it. No issues for me.
I have the Pro 700, why don't you just pick up the cup warming tray by the guardrails instead of removing the cups one by one? I find that much easier.
risk of breaking all my cups if they slide off
@@itsxris Just tilt it back slightly, that works fine for me anyway
When you are spending 3000 plus a couple of hundred is usually not a deal breaker. I been look at only three machines cause for one they all have a rotary pump and have two broilers and can be plumbed. They are the ECM Sychronika, Lucca M58 Espresso and Profitec 700 and of them all I'm leaning to the ECM Sychronika cause of the superior finish and the gauges are at the top which I think would make a little easier to read. All my figuring is from watch these videos not seeing them in person.
I'm considering either the Synchronika or the Bianca. Looking forward to the comparison of the Pro700 to the Bianca. With as much attention to detail and polished surfaces, I am surprised that Profitec left the raw stamped edge of cup rail unfinished. My guess is that it might be an outsourced assembly and having it finished would require a renegotiated price on the component. I'm sure there is plenty of discussion between the manufacturing engineers, purchasing, and the marketing department on that one. 😉😉
just dropped my bianca V3 review and the bianca vs profitec is coming soon!
Funny, I never saw the cup rail as cheap looking on mine-never occurred to me. I guess that part could be improved but it’s plenty solid at least. My only issue with the Pro700 is the pump is noisier than I’d like, but I’m used to it. It’s otherwise rock solid and dependable. Very happy with mine.
@@jcbarker1 I missed out on a Pro 700, but ended up finding a really nice used Synchronika. I would have been happy with either. Mine seems to be running a bit high on pump pressure, as I see it go over 10 at times. I may adjust it. Also trying to pre-infuse seems fussier than I would have expected.
Why do you have to take the cups off to refill? My classika has a similar top rack and I just take it off with the cups
Read the written version of the review here: www.itsxris.com/post/profitec-pro-700-review
An updated list of what's currently on my coffee bar: www.itsxris.com/brew
All the behind-the-scenes equipment I use to make my content: www.itsxris.com/store
I just got an ECM Syncnronika and my PID does the same thing when the water is too low. I don't see any fill flashing at all.
No flow control is the real kicker for me. I’d be much more Inclined to go for the Bianca.
had both highly prefere the bianca, only drawback for me was more steampower on the pro 700, but bianca has more then enough for me + (in my book) looks better.
fair!
But he has a flow control mod for less than the bianca. You can also buy Bianca paddle for like $250 or something
Whole latte love does provide flow control on the profitec pro 700.
@@life_is_adventure yes, but that’s only the E61 flow control mod. It doesn’t give the same granularity, speed or precision that pump or needle driven flow control does.
How loud/quiet is the machine? Wondering if it's worth the price to go to the 700 from the 600.
Ofir inbar has a video of his after fixing it. The water splashing in the cup is far louder than the pump.
Great video as always! Would you recommend Profitec 700 or Lelit Bainca V3 ?
Comparison coming soon!
@@itsxris when
What about this P700 versus the Rocket expresso Cronometro R? The P700 looks to excel in some details and better usability, do you agree?
Please review any bezzera products next
I'll try!
Are you running your Bianca at 135 degrees? It’s at over 2 bar at that temp.
Wondering if you an change the flow control to Bianca’s flow control. Also looking into the synchronika for future proof. I don’t make milk beverages but I used to say I didn’t care for espresso and only drank pour overs 😅 and now I’m fascinated with espresso…
Do you descale this machine the same way as a dual boiler?
If you still have your rocket could you possibly do a comparison of the pro 700 vs the appartamento. Thanks
Pro 600 MODE releases in the UK and presumably elsewhere shortly. That's a 600 with flow control valve and joystick controls for steam and hot water. That vs the Bianca is a video I'd like to see as they are the same price. MODE will still be vibe pump though but if flow control is Bianca's trump card then Profitec has that covered
noted! i'll see what I can do
@@itsxris be an interesting comparison I think. Bit different in the UK market as it looks like Profitec have released it as a direct competitor to the Bianca but not given it the full spec of the 700 to keep the price in line. Technically the Bianca is still the better spec but from a user perspective the comparison would be cool to see
definitely sounds like an interesting machine to look into for compare
In New Zealand we have both the 600 and 600 MODE, I checked it out both at our local store and the joysticks did not feel as nice to use as the dials, not sure why, I did hear that it is easier to service the standard dials, but not sure if that is true. I went with the standard 600, as I use darker beans and probably wont be using flow control. Flow control looks a bit messy on the Proftec, it is better on the Bianca.The 600 is much quite than my Rocket Appartamento they did a good job to make the 600 quite, the 700 is near silent. If you need better steam pressure and have the space go for the 700, otherwise the 600 will do nicely. 2 Bar pressure is really impressive and dual boiler really makes very smooth espresso. Very noticeable differences from a HX machine.
@@maheenm hi, where did you view the profitec 600 mode, I’m in Auckland. What was the pricing on the 2 models?
Love your review. How long does it take to get up to temp?
15-20 minutes in my experience.
Great review. One question. What is the temperature offset of this machine? Or profitec pro 600 if anybody knows. Thanks.
You can adjust this via the PID, check out Whole Latte Love, they did a video on the advanced PID settings. th-cam.com/video/Oh95qgfsdqk/w-d-xo.html
3L water tank!!!
Great video as always! The profitec is a beauty but the Lelit is on top!
I've watched basically all your videos and they very informative. I only wish you would speak more slowly because it's very difficult to understand 50 % of the times.
I changed the speed in the settings to 0,75 ratio! ;) I am German.
What about the Rotary Pump? Is it quiet? I'm trying to decide between R and V. I've had V pumps before and they are so loud in the morning.
its relatively quiet, better than a vibratory, but definitely still audible
Too bad that it's so damn heavy! Oh well.
It is not made in Germany. It is made in Milan, Italy. It is designed in Germany.
i had a facetime with the profitec team in Germany showing me the facility and where the machines are made
@@itsxris That is what I was wondering. Whole Latte Love says on their site made in Italy... But I say the video of them in Germany. I was deciding between the Pro 600 or the Quick Mill Qm67 and I figured it really came down to german vs Italian engineering. Profitec and ECM just seem more cleaned up in the inside
I think they’ve said they manufacture ecm, the pro 700 and 800 in Germany, everything else in Italy.