You made a great point about the importance of locations, History of Trunks took place in the same setting but the writers still made room for Visual Storytelling. *For ex:* Trunks picked up a burnt teddy bear, 18 was shopping, 17 was shown running down people in a Car, they both rode amusement park rides, Gohan fought in the rain and Trunks fought during sunset. These seemingly trivial details add so much depth to characters&themes, this type of basic "show, don't tell" storytelling was missing in Super. Speaking of Mai, I felt way more emotional connection with that random old man who shot 17 by saying "you demon you killed my son", that felt natural and in the manga 17 shoots him in the face. Mai feels so forced, the fact that she survived so many encounters with Black is nonsense..
I wished Future Trunks saved him and his granddaughter and have them together. I know it’s cliche but at least it’s better than have an old creature wished young again just to be paired with Trunks.
I agree with what you said about Trunks and mai. It’s forced and no matter how many times fans defend the couple you can’t get over the creep factor that she used to be older than His own parents. It’s her gangs fault that the whole Z gang is dead forever.
I also thought Zamasu's reasoning was very flimsy. He kills off the gods himself but rants about mortal inferiority? And if its so easy to kill the Gods, isnt that a flaw on them? I don't see this as good hypocrisy, but more like just dumb plot holes. Baby in GT was the better hypocrite becausehe did things ironically in nuance. Like him becoming and Oozaru just to keep up with Goku who did it to go SS4 before he was about to lose. Despite how much he hated Saiyans, he had a twisted way of becoming them to kill them. They tried this with Zamasu but his just lacks the thematic correlations. Zamasu seemed like a bad attempt at it from writers who don't understand how to do thematic irony. Zamasu's less of a genuine hypocrite and more of a poorly written contradiction.
Baby didn't want to become an Oozaru in the original but Bulma forcefully transformed him. Vegeta's body was progressively becoming like Baby's so it kinda worked in it's own way.
@sexallatusangelus4472 There's implications that this isn't the first time he's seen mortals act the way they do, and I do believe a lot of the impact of seeing Barbari, the first time he's seeing mortals IN PERSON was lost due to censorship. Their name implies that we were supposed to see some very...well barbaric acts or at least very brutal violence and the fact one of them shows up and attacks them, even after being pushed a away as a showing of the gods having greater power would've been the tipping point. Now, as for why any actual civilized races don't do anything to actually dispel the worthless notions, that is beyond me. Zamasu was a north kai prior, so unless his area had no mortals, or they were all just primitive animals, you would think he'd seen more civilized races. But then again...universe 10 is on the lower end of the mortal level ranking so maybe there wasn't actually that many civilized races to begin with. Universe 7 has a lot of civilized races, but they all live in rather poor quality lives. Universe 10 could possibly have very few mortal races to begin with, and only a very small handful of them actually have decent lives. Proportionally more than U7, but not that great either way. And I think the point of him killing the other gods was that at least originally he placed the blame of the failures of mortals on the gods who created them. Creators who in his mind, do very little to actually help their creations. It's that part, the refusal to actually do more ("Inaction, that's a sin too, don't you see it?") is what makes him start to take the actions he does. And the zero mortals plan started off as a mercy killing and then just kind of devolved from there. Again, most of this is implied at various points, but it's very off-handedly or done in passing. Honestly if super wasn't as censored nor rushed as it was, this could've been a hell of a lot better than what it ended up as.
The arc felt like a fanfic done by a fan that wanted to make dragon ball darker and edgier without it actually making sense for the reason you described plus Goku Black seemed like that writer wanted their villain to be cooler than everyone else and better than everyone else when it made no sense making him a mary sue.
@@kenonerboy Blood isn't edgy, it's gore. You can still have blood without even edgy but if you have "main character has an evil twin in a dark post apocalyptic time line"... Well that's edgy.
I agree that they introduced the wrong person in Trunkses life. Mai has no business being with Trunks. All her so called caring towards the children, feeling sad that Bulma is gone, acting all distraught and mourn those children doesn’t even feel sincere. She’s part of the good guys just to be paired up with Trunks and that’s it. Their romance was forced and pushed down our throats even more in the manga. I do wonder, what woman would you pair trunks with? And where would they meet? I always thought because of Trunk’s mystic and mysterious nature him and a female Supreme Kai would be a good match.
@Stephie Thiel Answering truthfully I don't believe he needs a relationship or that it would add anything to him, in all honesty I actually think it may take more away from him in the end by lessening his image as the mysterious teen who lost everything. I guess if I had to pick someone I would say introduce a new female character who works with machines or builds robots, as in its own way it symbolizes "rebuilding civilization". Plus I've always felt Future Trunks to have a bit of a cyberpunk aesthetic, and a character like that would mesh with his nature.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I always thought Trunks was asexual. I thought it was cool until they came up with this crap, only then I realised he deserves better.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 You know what would be a really neat treat? If you stopped spitting into your dimestore mic that only picks up on one headphone and actually got a decent one before making long form essay content on TH-cam. I agree with a LOT of your points, my fave is your Broly video as OG Broly was a big part of my childhood and I find a lot of Supers writing to be contrived bs too. However it makes it very hard to listen to a person with similar views when their mic is sounding like a cat in a garbage disposal. Notifications are off on this, dont bother replying, take it as a learning experience and fix this.
Mr. Satan in Future Trunks' timeline would have been interesting, because if the Cell games didn't happen then he wouldn't necessarily be a coward or fake his image for the cameras. He probably would have to be tough, and if he would surprise the characters from the present timeline for comedic effect. Or if he was less competent despite being serious as the opposite to his present character.
The fact that Zamasu himself stated the biggest issue in the series when stating “We’re here trying to destroy all mortals yet here we are using mortals power,” really is a damn shame.
I would have made Zamasu's plan make more sense if he used the Super Dragonballs to erase all mortals, but have Goku and Vegeta, Piccolo, Dende and Supreme Kai survive because they have God Ki? At least some sort of technicality to take him off guard before he meets Goku? Maybe that should have inspired him to take his body as a means of reclaiming it if he couldn't wish it away the first time. Then he meets Vegeta who also has God ki and gets angered at mortals escaping his wish from it. That would Goku and Vegeta would feel the pressure of being the last ones left other than the higher Gods who can fight him and all their friends erased out of no where. Similar to when Buu killed everyone and they had to fight on the Kai planet. That would also give more relevant to Piccolo if he needed to train with the Supreme kai in order to get stronger for that fight (replacing Trunks.) Then it would bring controversy if the other Gods found out all the mortals in their universes were gone out of no where as well. To at least make Zamasu seem competent and ask questions to the way things work in the universe.
God ki created more problems then it solved, god ki shouldn’t of been a thing or rather should of been a unattainable for mortals, god training would of made more sense. Training that would pushed goku & vegeta power to a level at a more affective and quicker paste. Goku would of been able to use ss3 with little drawbacks, and vegeta should of got ss3. ss god & ss blue is just to much.
I thought SSG was fine on it's own and it could've been the precursor to MUI honestly. I love the base form appearances and just having a form like SSB as a flagship for this new Gen of DB for DBS is pathetic. It's such a passionless form and thought it looks cool in some fan art, it still doesn't grab me like the previous form does.
5:06 Vegeta's rage boost still can't be justified due to how they previously worked in Dragon Ball. Rage boosts without resulting in a new transformation (like Goku's first use of Super Saiyan) were always exclusive to Gohan during the series' original run, making them at most an exclusive biological trait to hybrids and this was backed up several times throughout the manga (eg. both Vegeta and Goku commenting on how Gohan could access unknown power if he got angry in the Boo Arc rather than believing either of them could do so). That said, as terrible as Trunks' transformation in the anime was, it still makes more sense than Vegeta's rage boost due to Trunks' biology and surpassing what at the time would be top tier power through rage is far from unprecedented for Saiyan hybrids (Gohan going from far weaker than an average human to surpassing Raditz). Not defending Trunks' transformation at all since it's still a huge contrivance, but it doesn't break the world building anywhere near as much as Vegeta's "MY BULMA!!"
@Chou Eriito I don't necessarily disagree, but I feel debating "what's worse" in Dragon Ball Super results in an argument that can be more easily resolved by agreeing that they're both terrible, so I'll leave it at that. But yeah I hated how Vegeta experienced one of his most immense power boosts from Beerus slapping Bulma, which somehow granted Vegeta a greater boost than watching future Trunks die.
@@lErickl It's explicitly stated during Vegeta and Nappa's introduction that the hybrid genetics are the reason for Gohan's immense power ups through rage. This is validated multiple times in the manga such as Vegeta only bringing up the possibility of Gohan becoming far stronger with anger as opposed to he or Goku during the Boo Arc. The idea that a vast increase to Ki through rage being something those outside of hybrids can utilise in more recent media is an egregious retcon at best and a blatant plot hole at worst.
I REALLY hope you do a Dragob Ball relationships video. You are the ONLY person I've heard not agree with the parings in the show, and I'm really interested in what you think. Hope you see this.
Heaps of ppl are grossed out by Trunks and mai. On CBR and reddit ppl point out their disgust. I mean all Toriyama had to do is create her grand daughter,
I personally think the ToP arc is worse because it ruined multiple characters at once, make Goku look like a braindeath idiot, fan service taking priority over proper story telling to the point that Roshi made to the team over Yamcha, Yajirobi, any Namekian warrior or the kid Saiyans. In fact, characters got out of nowhere power ups and the arc didn't have any tension. Universes suppose to get destroyed, but nobody tried to fight for survival. Just to have a good fight or torture an established character. Oh, and the female Saiyans... so disgusting. And I don't think the Evil Goku arc trying to be "deeper" makes the ToP arc better when compared to each other. The ToP arc is ruined concepts, characters, ripped of stories and went overboard with fan service. Every episode has to have an homage to old better Dragon Ball. Memes and shitposts like Gohan Blanco are also referenced indirectly. There was a video by Mastar Media where he animated Gohan Blanco fighting Jiren which is traced from Gohan's fight with Super Boo. The exact same punches and kicks appeared when Goku went "mastered" ultra instinct against Jiren, just from a different angle. They also copied the Final Flash scene from Z with Vegeta vs Jiren taking away the magic of that iconic scene. But the Evil Goku arc is a close second. Trunks turned into a final fantasy reject character getting a bunch of out of nowhere power ups and looks depressed all the time. When we saw Future Trunks in Z, he didn't cry all the time. And eventually reached his goal. The new Future Trunks also gets emotional seeing a younger Mai in a matter that it's giving some pedophilic vibes. While when Trunks returned to the past in Z, he didn't feel anything for kid Gohan. Now suddenly, when he sees present Gohan, he keeps thinking of his mentor. It's worse at the end, where Zeno destroyed his timeline. Instead going through a character arc, it is treated as a happy ending, because Trunks can just go to another timeline. And the writers make it sound like the people he knows are the exact same ones Zeno or Zamasu killed in his original timeline. Also why is he shipped with Mai, a comic relief character. It's like shipping android 18 with Oolong. I cringed so hard. And the enemy is a time traveling Pink Super Saiyan Goku who is in fact an Evil Kaioshin. You think it can't more fanficy than that, but it does like the selfcreating spirit sword and Super Saiyan Rage. Wtf is that form? Why can't anyone else reach that form he did. Super Saiyan Rage? The entire point of reaching SSJ is rage. Its like saying I went swimming in a wet swimming pool and got burned by hot fire. I saw my image on a mirroring mirror. So redundant. What is worse is that it was meaningless, because: 1. Goku could have pressed the Zeno Button at any point sparing us all the nonsense that happened in that arc and the plotholes 2. There was a legimate way to make Trunks stronger in a short period of time, without that asspull power up: The God Ritual. The God Ritual is one of the laziest power ups and pretty convinient, ruining every hardship characters went through. But now that it's in, why don't characters use it to avoid shit like Bills appearing to happen? Even the ToP arc is guilty of this. They don't take advantage of having 6 Saiyans to make the god ritual. It would be smart for U7 and U6 to temporary ally to defeat Jiren. I wouldn't be a fan of U6 having another free power up, but at least God is justified because it has no risks. As for Trunks' blue hair, there were flashbacks of him with his purple hair, so I don't understand why they used the blue hair except because Toriyama drew it with blue hair. Regarding Zamas, he collected the Super Dragon Balls 3 times off screen and wished for nothing that he couldn't accomplish with any other set of Dragon Balls. It showed how pointless the Super Dragon Balls were, and that Zamas is mentally challenged. Why wouldn't he just wish the mortals to be gone, become a literal god as people imagine or peace. Instead he wished for immortality that gives him regeneration powers, Goku's body and the destruction of all Dragon Balls. Damn, he could have wished for more wishes. Remember, there are no restriction with the Super Dragon Balls. Also the show did a poor job with Gowas trying to teach him things about mortals. He can literally tell from drinking tea that he is evil, but besides the audience, nobody catched up. You brought up a good point about Zamas and nature. I feel the show didn't take advantage of having 2 Zamas. Future Zamas didn't meet Goku, minus Zamas from the past, thus the had more potential to develop as a character. But they only used him as means to give Goku and Vegeta someone seperate to fight and them then to fuse. Regarding the SSJB retcon, I addressed it in a video why Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan sucks. I recomment watching it, it shows more flaws of Super your average fanboy won't even catch even if you tell them that. You can also read it if you prefer that www.deviantart.com/mertyville/art/Super-Saiyan-God-Super-Saiyan-sucks-845265519 Super completely ruined Goten. He can't even open a door and it is implied through the ToP arc that Gotenks is weaker than Roshi. the closest thing to a good relationship in Dragon Ball was Bulma and Yamcha. It wasn't anything big, but it worked for what it was. I think the entire thing about Piccolo fusing should not be even worth considering. If that were that easy, why can't he just go to new namek and fuse with some Namekian warriors? My hopes were ruined with how Gohan was treated in the ToP arc because unlike Piccolo in the Evil Goku arc, he was build up to archive a new kind of power. instead he had trouble with a yadrat and what looked like Rob the Robot. There seems to be a misconception what filler is. Filler and canonity are completely different things like apples and oranges. Like colors and shapes. You can't say something is written by Toriyama, and it's not filler. Because Super itself is filler. We know the ending of Dragon Ball for several decades and Super takes place before Goku meets Oob. Non of the characters address the stuff happened in Super, and there is no tension in Super even if you ignore that. U6 arc would result U7's earth to move to another universe. Evil Goku arc was meaningless the moment the Zeno Button was introduced. The survival arc had no tension because nobody was really taking it serious and U7 defeated every single Universe as Jiren did nothing for several episodes. And later we find out, Jiren could have beaten everyone in a few seconds. Goku was getting caught off guard like an amateur.
@Sex'' Allatus Angelus For the moment, I thought thats going to happen in Dragon Ball Super But... No instead we get this shitty arcs. I thought Dragon Ball for now its about universe exploring or any type of that but I was wrong, the arcs in there was boring.
Depends which continuity we're talking about in terms of canon. The Super anime is most likely canon to the Kai anime continuity (despite obvious continuity errors), though you'd be hard-pressed to say the Super manga is canon to the original manga when there's clear differences such as the Namekians having 5 fingers in Super as opposed to 4 in the original manga.
Super had potential but more than half of it was wasted the real good in my opinion was dbs broly and some aspects of others that could have been made better
Canon has become useless to me. People arbitrarily decide that the mangaka is the best one to decide what's real and what's not because it's his creation but most of the times they don't understand jackshit about their own time-lines and creations. So whatever doesn't ruin consistency in character and events is Canon to me.
Honestly you say all the things I keep thinking about Super as a whole. If you feel like it I wouldn't mind seeing your opinion on the Dragon Ball Multiverse series.
for his hair, i thought the color changed as he got older. i've heard of that happening to people. i rationed it as the purple is a mix of his parents hair (sort of a mix of blue and black) and as he got older, the Blue gene was more dominant and the black faded out, leaving it a blue color like his mom. i didn't know they never explained it at all, i just made this explanation for myself because the purple was pretty iconic to me before they changed it
1:00:00 it's too bad that they didn't write Mai to be the leader of the resistance against Zamasu due to her guilt for serving Demon King Piccolo having basically been given a second chance at life by restarting as a child. Sort of how Vegeta was so protective of the Namekians when he first met Moro. Speaking of, i'm enjoying the writing of Super much more now that the ToP Arc is over and the manga has moved on to Moro and Ultra Ego, etc. These bits have been much more interesting than anything Super did previously
@Christian Kettlewell I honestly prefer the Moro and Granolah Arc to Zamasu and the Tournament of Power (though I do lean in favor of the Universe 6 Tournament against the latters), with a few minor tweaks I think they could have been good.
@Nice_Person7379 Thanks, I appreciate the compliment. I have dozens ideas for future videos, but my process of content creation has recently hit a snag, since I had to move a while ago, basically I lost access to a recording room, with that said though for future videos currently in the works I intend to use AI to replicate my voice.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033good luck. An alternate method would be to speak into the microphones into the bottom of a phone to better improve audio quality.
@@Nice_Person7379 Thanks, that's actually how I recorded my prior videos, but I still appreciate your suggestion. What I meant by saying recording room is an area where noise pollution doesn't pickup on my recording device.
Your words are very encouraging and I'm grateful. The types of videos I strive to make won't grant me quick success, but long term I believe they will be better.
Lonely Boy Adventurer I’ve watched the original vs super broly one as well as the black clover one and honestly such good content. I feel bad that they aren’t as successful as they should be but at the same time I’m glad they are there in that long form format cause it makes such a great listen.
Thank you for supporting for my channel and watching several of my videos I am very appreciative of it. In all honesty I enjoy making videos, now I admit I'd be lying if didn't say I get bummed if a video of mine doesn't succeed, but the primary reason why I made them in the first place was because many of their ideas swirled around in my mind, for some cases years and just finally getting to express them is satisfaction all its own. Even now a number of my video's view counts seem low, but for me I've seen them significantly rise from the depths, the day before I uploaded my Black Clover video I had 28 subscribers and total cumulative view count of around 1500, but now I have over 500 subs and a view count over 40,000, and its still substantially increasing everyday, even my older videos are gaining traction as well, which just further motivates. PS I apologize for responding so late, both times, I've been working on a behemoth of a video that I wanted to release before the end of the month and it required most of my computer time to finish on time, so I haven't been as attentive to youtube comments as I should be.
Great video again. All of the points are bang on! I've felt this about super for a while, it has retconned and hurt the original lore of DBZ and what made it so great.
@alphonsejohnson5601 I appreciate you respecting my writing capabilities, but I believe me pretending that arc doesn't exist would be a more suitable punishment than simply tearing it to shreds. This is probably why you commented, but did you get my reply in regards to Bayonetta 2?
@alphonsejohnson5601 No problem, and I'm always happy to see viewers return. Plus many of my old videos don't get as much attention as they used, so seeing new comments on them for me at least prevents the sensation of them getting left behind.
I love this review so much and I've seen parts of it so many times after finishing this review. This arc was so amazing in concept but in execution it was terrible, most specifically the ending which essentially ruins most of Trunk's arc in Z and the fact the writers had his whole timeline destroyed was such a crime against humanity, literally. I hope you breakdown the tournament of power because that alone in itself was also a nightmare.
@The1TrueGabrielDWilliams Awesome, I'm glad you you think so highly of my video. I have actually written a video analyzing the tournament of power, two in fact, though technically they're not purely about the tournament, as in the upload I compare the tournament to a similarly styled arc of One Piece. If you're interested the videos are called "Dragon Ball Super vs One Piece II: How to ..." and "Jiren vs Katakuri: How to do an Antagonist Right"
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I saw the Tournament piece yesterday but I'll be sure to watch the Jiren comparison review. But I have to say your ideas and concepts are so much better for the show and just explains how dumbed down this series has become over the years. I'll probably have to watch this video again today since it's one of the best reviews of a terrible arc I have even seen. If you also think DBS is garbage then you should check out Saiyan Scholar since he breaks down how terrible this series was in a review that's longer than yours. I hope you both meet and collaborate someday because that would bring about the best debates ever. But in conclusion, you're welcome and I look forward to seeing what you upload next time in the future.
@The1TrueGabrielDWilliams Again, I appreciate your praise and continued support. Believe or not by name Saiyan Scholar directly referenced my channel before, though I think the video where he did so either got copyright struck or deleted. I uploaded a video titled "Explaining Goku's Cries ...", and a few months later he made his own iteration of it while also citing my video. We briefly communicated in the comment section and he admitted that he watched most Dragon Ball content. I'm not opposed to livestreams/collaborations, it's just a lack of time and I've never done one through youtube, so I'm not all that familiar with them.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Wow, it's pretty convenient you guys actually had an interaction. You are welcome mate and I enjoy your content. Well, hopefully it all works out in the end and you two find a way to expand your works across the community, you deserve it! :)
Whoa there! All that stuff you say they should have implemented would have required thought... and planning and- add effort. Fuck that! I was important to shart out this cash grab series in order to sell toys. We don't need to wait for the manga either, just make forms in all colours. Taste the rainbow! Another thing I don't think you mentioned is that Elder Kai is a partora fusion of his younger self and an old witch that happened several millennia ago. If the retcon stayed true to its own continuity, the fusion should have ended because the old witch is not a Kai. Lastly I think the Goku Black arc should never have happened at all. Universe 7 should have lost that tournament in the previous arc. Imagine the possibilities of now having U7 Earth in U6. Goku could have an opportunity to visit the Planet Sadala and see at least one Saiyan homeworld. Vegeta could have visited Planet Sadala as well to see how the U6 Saiyans measured up to the one he grew up with. And the series would have had more time to develop Cabba, Kale and Kalifla. There would even be more time to develop Hit and Frost. But like I said, all that would have required thinking and planning. That's too much work.
@Brian A. DBS has too much of the everything must go back to normal mentality. Universe 7 always has to win and nothing can amount to something at a later point. With the Potara earring I'm not 100% sure, but I think they said if at least one participant is a Kai the fusion stays permanent, again I'm not fully confident and even then it's still overall a poor concept. Yeah, Super only exists as a cash grab, though I do think they had an ulterior motive for the Super Saiyan Blue transformation; I'll just say as Dragon Ball became global, they probably didn't want a blond haired blue eyed transformation viewed as a "superbeing", but again at its core it's still just an excuse to sell more toys.
I know it's Toriyama's right to create these story arcs however he sees fit, but that's no excuse for lazy writing! For starters, what sense did it make to base time travel on multiverse theory if you don't understand how cause and effect work? If traveling to the past splits the timeline, then what point does it make for Trunks to keep zipping back between past and future, knowing that he can't rewrite his history? Second, the backstory is the same as before: Trunks’ world is in peril, and he again travels to the past to request help; why is he always in danger? Future Bulma had knowledge that the Namekian survivors were leaving on New Namek and had Namakian Dragons Balls. Also to point out is when the Nameks requested a new world to live on, it was just that, not wish for a new planet and then move it to a different space sector. So technically, Future Bulma should’ve send Trunks to New Namek and requested the use of their Dragon Balls for his needs! Third, Bulma’s whole purpose of sending Trunks to the past for help, was of course, entirely pointless. Everyone is dead, Zeno erases the timeline, and as a consolation prize, Trunks and Mai can live a duplicate version of the timeline that they risk their lives trying to save. It would've been better if Trunks stayed in the present, for at least he can grow closer to his father! Fourth, it's been stated by Whis and later Gowasu that the Time Ring is only designed to take you into the future and move back through time when making a returning trip; they're not created for traveling to the past as altering history is forbidden. What's the point in crafting a time manipulating device with a specific restriction, only to bypass it when it conveniently resonates with another time manipulating device? Toriyama seems to enjoy contradicting himself for the sake of doing the unexpected! And finally, the origin of Goku Black! Initially, it was believed that Zamasu created Black with the Super Dragon Balls as a loyal subordinate. This scenario is better suited in the series than Zamasu requesting the divine dragon to swap bodies. At the beginning of the third and final battle, Vegeta pointed out that Zamasu, having a Saiyan body, can never utilize its true potential since he doesn't have a Saiyan mindset. So theoretically, Goku Black shouldn't be able to defeat Goku in singles combat. Commandeering Goku’s body doesn't mean he can use it better than Goku can! Let me know your thoughts in the comments below!
@Jordan Robinson I appreciate your perspectives and yeah, nothing about this arc added up. The story creates exposition that shrinks everything. These supposedly intelligent characters not even planning past the most base elements. I honestly think Toriyama intentionally sabotaged Dragon Ball Super as a sort of Tom Sawyeresque joke i.e. make something that someone should like in a way they'll hate it.
Dragon Ball super as a whole reminds me of cringey fanfiction. DBS broly is an example of well writen fanfic but fanfic is still fanfic. what i'm trying to say is DBS seems like a hollow reflection from DB and Z. almost like a fan of DB taking over with out trully understanding what DB was to begin with..
You worded that perfectly, it feels like the writers had seen the original series, but have no comprehension of what made it so great in the first place.
@the swoly ghost dbs broly can't really be described as a fan fic considering toriyama wrote it himself but hey maybe he's lost touch with his own work to be considered a mere fan
A lot of Super feels like its written by people who've never watched the original and understand its nuances or, by people who just care about power ups. The writers just show they do not know how to write at all for this show.
Yeah, it's nothing but homages and references as well as recolor power ups. You know Super is awful when they copy actual fanfiction and rehash too much from the old show.
12:00 F**k I've just realized thanks to you that it was possible to fix at least one thing for him - it would've been MUCH better for him to try to destroy humans that BETTER than him! With a mindset "how dare any human to be better than us?!" It would've been still completely unmotivated, stretched, dull, pointless, unoriginal, uninspired, one-dimensional, illogical for this story - but at least it would've been SOMETHING. SOMETHING instead of a 14yo mindset hitting his puberty and suddenly "this world's got rotten and there is nothing left except for hatred all people are just bad and I'm just better than them and know better so they should be eradicated because bad things exists".
I'm glad I helped you realize that and in regards to your other comment on this video I didn't say I could turn him into gold, but I could at least turn garbage (Zamasu) into Bronze.
Something else about energy blades similar to the holdo maneuver from the last jedi, it brings the question of why no one else in the dragon ball universe canonical didn't think of using energy blades first I mean it can't be hard at all to think of them so why hasn't anyone else besides Vegito done it before as there's no way Zamasu is the first person to think of using it.
It was something that hard to pull off for anyone except for fusions (you can remember how even Gotenks was struggling to do just a big ring of energy and manipulate it), Ki-forms was able to be only basic like cowering the palm or finger or making a little ring that can only be launched and stacked on something. Only fusions was able to make a big and complex forms of it. Now Goku Black is just doing it.
@@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக் I've mentioned Sauzer. He was cowering his palm with energy, this is not the same as to create a fully intact blade with no basis it covers. Sauzer made the thing Goku made with his finger against Trunks but using the whole palm, so this is not something out of normal.
@@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக் it is not a real ki-blade. Goku was able to cut something with his finger too. Black and Vegetto have absolutely clear blades WITHOUT any basis - their lenght is not covering anything, it is a clear blade out of energy made out of nothing except for Ki, palms is only for moving those constructs. This is the difference - Sauzer can cut things covering his palms with Ki, just like Goku with his finger covered in Ki also - but neither of them can make his blade longer than his palm or finger, because this is just a palm/finger coverage.
I usually don't like these types of videos but, this was well constructed with no slander. This is the best criticism video of DBS I've watched so far.
I feel that the Manga and Anime should have swapped the Vegito versus zamasu fights because, given that in the anime the z fighters were able to put up more of a threat to merged zamasu, it would only make sense for a fusion of them to overpower zamasu like in the manga. Instead of making it an even bout like in the anime and, in the manga, Goku and Vegeta did not over power merged zamasu so it would make sense that if they fused they would be even with merged zamasu like how the anime portrayed them. Now the manga follows toriyama's structure of how useless Fusion is to this series, which is perfectly fine since that's how he wants to utilize fusion in his story, but the anime tries to be different in a stupid way. It just feels forced because fans wanted a fusion character to have to put effort into a fight which doesn't make sense here because, as I said before, Goku and Vegeta were already capable of giving zamasu some kind of resistance. So why would a fusion of them only make them equal to him? Especially when the number one rule with Fusion in Dragon Ball, at least according to how the Saiyans do Fusion, is you get overpowered like a motherfucker and, sure it's technically an ass pull because I don't think there's any point in the series where the Saiyans fuse together and they don't have abilities they shouldn't be powerful enough to produce. But that's just how Fusion is between the Saiyans so it doesn't make sense to contrive vegito's nerf in the anime like they did.
I definitely see your reasoning, especially since Goku's kamehameha had already overpowered/purpled Fused Zamasu prior. I'm convinced the anime adaptation's writers weren't on the same wavelength when writing the Vegito battle, which is why much of these episodes feel so incoherent.
If anything Gogeta should've taken Vegito's place. Because there is somewhat of a message about the main cast over-relying on gods to help them, AND it would be an even better nod to fan service because then Gogeta would've been made canon then and there, we also get to see a fight between both fusion types AND FINALLY, the shorter duration of that fusion type can also be used to explain why Gogeta ended up being unable to finish the fight in any significant way. I mean, they can even have him man-handle Zamasu, since he's half-immortal, and the time limit really being the only real thing that ended up costing them the fight. And well, how broken immortalitiy is.
I actually agree with that, but for this video I limited the arcs to stories exclusive to the Dragon Ball Super, and Resurrection F could technically categorize as a "Z" movie, so that's why I excluded it.
Revivial of F was terrible, but as far as contradictions to the world building that cause plot holes, flanderising established characters and having poor theme exploration, it's one of the less offensive in Super.
1:05:55 eh that's a double edged sword honestly a character being virtually invincible runs the risk of making the action boring then when a character needs to lick their wounds after being defeated and needing a new plan now that being said I do agree Goku and Vegeta frequent loses in this arc is a problem since its not only makes them seem week but the plot point is very repetitive but if done well can help emphasize how strong a character has become
One answer that makes sense to all these plot holes and ect very bad writing,forced writing,writing that under emotional or logical sense will never add up
The other weird part about the hair color change is when Future Trunk's came back and Kid Trunks told Bulma she asked him "does the occupant have blue hair?" When the last time she saw Future Trunks, his hair was purple so how was she aware of his hair being blue now? Honestly it would've made more sense if they changed his hair to blue in DBZ Kai/DB Kai because to me Super is more of a continuation/in the continuity of Kai more so than the original DBZ so it would've made more sense for Future Trunk's hair color to have been changed back in Kai. I give the Super manga credit because at least they changed both Future Trunks' and Kid Trunks' hair color to blue whereas the anime had Future Trunks have blue hair but Kid Trunks still had purple hair up until Super Hero (I think the only reason it's blue in Super Hero is because of Toriyama actually being involved in the production of it and his original character designs for Super is where the color change for Trunk's hair came from)
1:20:55 That's would've been impossible - the Dragon Balls can't ressurect anyone who was ressurected by it already (the rule per set) or anyone who died more than a year ago. This is can't be changed. Just for the note.
The more than a year part either only applies to large groups of people or was a trait erased when Dende upgraded Earth's Dragon Balls, considering Freeza's revival. Even in the original manga, the former is heavily implied with Tenshinhan and Chaozu having no issue potentially waiting another year to be revived.
@@choueriito2548 wrong. It applies to literally anyone any amount and this trait never was erased. There is no any statement like that. In the original there was no any nonsense like that. It was literaly the plot point of that protagonists was in a hurry because no one can wait for year.
@@SuperSaiyanDate That is incorrect. The necessity to revive their friends within a year is never brought up as a plot point in any of the arcs. In fact, the one year limit isn't brought up until Kami is conversing with Kaio and he specifically says it in relation to all the people Nappa and Vegeta killed, not just a single revive. His exact wording within the Viz translation is "Although, if you want to bring back everyone whom those two killed, I'm afraid we would be limited to those who died in the past year." Moreover, nobody was panicked at the prospect of Chaozu potentially having to wait another year, making it even more apparent this doesn't apply for single revives. The idea of the one year limit for everyone is a misconception likely made through the poor translation of the English dub.
@@choueriito2548 wrong. It was a literal plot point. I never talked about numerous incorrect English traslations you taking all this nonsense out. I am talking about the original only.
@@SuperSaiyanDate It is never once mentioned as a plot point that there's a time limit on a single revival. Again, the only time it's brought up is with Kami specifically talking about a mass revival on the level of Nappa and Vegeta's victims. At no point do the Dragon Team refer to there being a race against the clock to revive a single ally and the necessity to do so quickly is always pushed by other forces (usually an external threat), so unless you can actually cite your sources, it's clear you're incorrect on the matter.
You don't like Krillin and Android 18? I consider them to be the best in modern Dragonball in terms of healthy relationships. What do you not like about it or the Bulma/Vegeta relationship? Not trying to be rude, I'm just curious.
In all honesty I don't think the relationships of Dragon Ball have had good chemistry since the original series, Bulma/Yamcha and Launch/Tien. In the current Bulma/Vegeta relationship I pretty much feel Vegeta has basically become a rich woman's pet (domestication), a past aspect of Dragon Ball Z that I highly valued was that even when characters grew or developed, who they grew into stayed within the realm of possibility, but in the DBS era of relationship in regards to what Vegeta became I just don't see that as what he could be and instead feel like they changed his character. In terms of Krillin /18 I've always felt their pairing to be a bit contrived, like they don't really match up, everything that I feel 18 would want, Krillin lacks, whereas with Krillin I've always seen him as desiring a fun loving girlfriend, while 18 is kinda deadpan. To be honest in my opinion the best relationship post Dragon Ball would be Krillin and Maron (Garlic Jr Saga girlfriend). This will sound funny, but if I could put Android 18 into a relationship with any DBZ character I would have picked Hercule (Mr. Satan), because they actually possess good chemistry during The Buu Saga World Tournament arc and even Bio Broly. Like 18 basically wants money and luxury, which Hercule has, while she has the strength that Hercule would wish to say is his own. Plus it would mimic the real world equivalent of a model going out with a billionaire where its pretty obvious they're only there for the money. Hopefully this answers your question I realize I semi-changed the topic, its just a bit hard to answer truthfully without including all these side aspects.
You answered my question really well, thanks. You know I never considered 18 and Mr. Satan, but I could see it working. I agree with you on Tein/Launch and Bulma/Yamcha. Dragon completely shafted the normal people and their relationships. Tien and Yamcha are so irelevent that they can't even have romantic partners. I agree with Krillin and 18. I feel that up to that point krillin was considered a punching bag for so long, it was nice to see him finally win for a change. What are your thoughts on Gohan and videl?
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Also you could argue that Krillin brings out her more human side. Android 18 is the realist of the two and will always be straight with him. Though I do agree that the relationship could've benefited from seeing why they find connection in each other. Perhaps a look at their dates, downtime, and even their wedding.
I would say Gohan and Videl kind of works, but that's because their relationship is treated more like a background element, like with the other couples you see them interact more generally in a multitude of situations (Bulma went to Universe 6 Tournament, same with visiting Zamasu's future timeline, so she was around Vegeta, while Videl went to the Universe 6 Tournament, but Gohan didn't ), which makes Vegeta and Bulma feel a bit unnatural, wheres with Gohan/Videl I don't really feel the sensation that someone is trying to turn them into something they're not, so its a case of because [Gohan/Videl] are left alone, they don't really feel like they're breaking anything in the process. PS I've been experiencing a surge in comments lately many of which requiring long answers, so that's why I've been a bit slow to respond.
2:14 Ya I agree one of the things I liked about the Goku Black Saga (my preference of name) were the character interactions between Trunks and the characters in the present particularly Gohan, young Trunks and Android 18 all stuff that would've stayed if they just brought him in for the tournament (though who'd I'd cut would be a difficult choice Frieza would be obvious but it was also fun to see if fight along side our group but not in a oh im reformed way)
@SkySlasher I'd have to omit Frieza, because they had to bend the rules to allow him in anyway. Plus too much of his character revolved around "look at how evil he is" element.
The fact they revived Frieza who never showed inclination for training and improving because he was born powerful but didn't revive Cell who literally had saiyan DNA making him another fighting loving monkey to redeem is just evidence they don't give a damn about anything except banking on nostalgia and marketability.
I think it would have been cool if the idea you had of that immortal spirit of zamasu was attacking the z fighters and lile they had to go back to the present timeline and like learn the sword sealing thing from beerus lile how he did to old kai
@TheRealBaird YT The sword sealing technique would have been an interesting inclusion slash callback to the original series, especially since future Trunks wields a sword.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I feel like it aldo ties a little into the mysticism element you mentioned in the video like maybe the sword sealing isn't quite a ki technique but more like a sorcery thing so goku and vegeta or whatever character would be doing this would be out of their element
Thank you for feeding my burning hatred for this disgrace that is Super, lol. Also, as for Zamasu taking forever to kill all of mankind, it can be explained by saying that Zamasu and Goku Black wanted humanity to suffer so they can "pay for their sins". So that probably might be an explanation, even though I still hate Super. Any thoughts?
@Agamemnon Returns I'm happy to have done so. I will say your argument provides the best rationale for why Zamasu may have prolonged his plans, but to respond to that with his mindset of seeing mortals as a virus destroying something beautiful you'd think he'd want to eliminate them as fast as possible before they cause more devastation.
Yeah, you're right on that. If he really thinks of them as a virus that's eating away the earth, they would have done a lot more destruction than just turn a city into a damaged ghost town and leave out the rest of the earth
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 from 26:16 - 26:35, it actually kind of makes sense how Goku managed to overtake fused Zamasu. You have to remember that in the cell saga, Vegeta was weaker than Perfect cell. But with his final flash, Vegeta would have killed cell if the Android hadn't dodged at the last minute.
@Alphonse Johnson To be fair Cell allowed Vegeta to charge up and didn't fight back, whereas Zamasu actively resisted, but yeah other than this that is a good argument.
Super supa it's really a disgrace to dragon ball amd then you have some dumb fans talking shit about the great iconic timeless classic that is GT just cause it's not canon who gives a fuck about what's canon and what's not canon GT is objectively a million times better than that disgrace called super supa so I take not canon dragon ball all life thank you very much .
Without a thorough rewrite for all those arcs, it wouldn't change the quality of any of those arcs, particularly when the Moro Arc is founded on a huge plot hole anyway.
@@pascalsimioli6777 Only for super im like that since the anime is garbage also if anyone is the problem its you considering how you most likely dont even know the main theme of the show or anything about gokus character you rat Goku’s depth Goku values his strength because of the events of his life. After losing his parental figure to a “monster”, his helpessness created a will to grow more powerful to defend himself and those around him. He trains to push himself to new heights and defeats the greatest evil in the world, Piccolo, and is then effortlessly defeated by his brother Raditz, When he asks Krillin to spare Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, he does not out of morality, but out of curiosity of how far he can push himself. He calls himself selfish for this, but makes the choice anyways. This is the first step of Goku’s change as a person, Goku is pure of heart by the standards of the Kinto’un and yet he is innately flawed. His pure mindset is a both a blessing and a curse. He sees the best in people, he wants to be the best he can be, and he assumes that those around him should share his values. Goku puts his son into a situation that he didn’t realize Gohan wasn’t prepared for, and even gives Cell a senzu because hes so confident. Depsite his flaws, Goku is extremly self aware. Towards the end of the Cell Games, he sacrifices himself and apologies to Gohan for not making the best choices. He even chooses to say dead because he realizes that his existence has drawn seveal enemies to Earth, and during the Buu saga, he tries to give the mantle of Earth’s defender to Goten and Trunks that he cant fight all of the battles anymore, even if deep down he wants to. Goku literally abstained from fighting, the one thing he has dedicated his life to his son. Kid Goku is a child all alone in the woods away from society and his lack of understanding of modern technology like cars which he describes as “monsters” is a result of his lack of indoctrination, speaking of indoctrination Kid Goku is a pretty great embodiment of curiosity, and freedom his curiosity is a result of his lack of teachings of subjects in modern society (lack of indoetrination), The flying nimbus is an magic yellow that Goku uses to transport those who have a pure heart are able to ride on the flying nimbus , clouds symbolize clear thinking and emotional purity these fit Goku well seeing how he is pure of heart and has strong set belifes on what is wrong or right, the nimbus also correlates to he freedom in the many way Goku is free is a set purpose or place Identity crisis Identity crisis is the questioning in ones own idenity, once Goku sees Raditz and Raditz unfolds the story to him and his friends about the saiyans their heritage and occupation and just on general how bad of people they are, Goku is quick to say that he isn’t a saiyan and that he is Son Goku from earth. This neglectance of identity isn’t surprising seeing how Goku and the sayians are opposites and have drastically different morals, Goku’s self acceptance Goku’s self acceptance coming from the realization that his saiyan heritage is something that can be used to good in the world to bring peace one might say the saiyan were ruthless and violent and ransacked peoples worlds to sell them when he accepts that’s he is indeed a sayian and tells Frieza he’s the super saiyan Son Goku, echoed through his speech “I am the light in the darkness” Goku here can be referring to himself the good out of the bad. The one good saiyan out of the many evil saiyans, Affect on world Goku’s affect on his world is the affect on his friends who eventually became his enemies and the whole physical world, Goku in the cell saga knew that if he kept residing on earth his friends said everyone else would be in danger so it was convenient he could use transporting cell to the king kai’s place and also just leave earth for the sake of peace In moral philosophy, deontological ethics or deontology is the normative ethical theory that morality of an action should be based on whether that action itself is right or wrong under a series of rules, rather than based in the consequences of the action, Goku has always kept this philosophy with him since a kid and this connects with his sacrifice great. Goku always had his morals over the consequences we can see this a lot with his interactions with vegetea ginyu and frieza, We saw many instances when Goku has put his morals above the consequences. For example, with his battle with Vegeta he could’ve killed Vegeta and bring peace. But he chose to let him alive because of his moral code and to fight him again. With Frieza he had the chance to kill him and yet he let him live becuase again he let his morals take over him and didn’t see the consequences Battle stance In saiyan saga goku and vegeta stance and position are contrast of each other. While Goku sgands below Vegeta showing that he is the low class warrior also shows his view on strength. Goku was always taught that there was always someone stronger than him while Vegeta was taught he was destined to be the strongest and Vegeta looking down shows that he believes that he is the strongest and his strength is complete. While Goku looking up shows how he believes that his strength us limitless and that there are others stronger than him. Both of their stance show how they were trained, Goku stance presents the turtle hermit school, they move low and find a weakness and strategies, Vegeta represent the elite saiyan training and how the fight full offensive seeing how both hands show are prepared to strike in showing his nature as a saiyan Spirit bomb vs great ape Goku and Vegeta main attacks contrast each other in the saiyan saga. The spirit bomb is said to take energy from your enviorment and goku being a saiyan yet denies his nature and stays with his nurture or his enviorment and it is also said that the spirit bomb is stronger when it absorbs the sun. Vegeta on the other hand uses his saiyan nature as his trump card which is great ape form and it is to be said to be powered up by the moon showing how goku symbolises the sun (being clear and self) while vegeta symbolize the moon (being a shadow and blocks the light) these two attacks symbolise their nature vs nature Both Goku and Vegeta were confusion on who they were. Goku was in conflict with his saiyan nature and we can see him in conflict with his own morals and identity where he spares nappa out of the goodness of his hear (nurture) while he spares Vegeta because he wants to fight him again (nature). We can see more of this in his fight with Frieza and how he toys with him, says he’s going to kill him, and is drowning in anger (nature) he also speares him, gives him ki, lets him leave (nurture). Vegeta is going throught the same thing but is apposite as well. Vegeta is in conflict with his humanity and his saiyan nature. He can’t see to understand who he truly is which leads him to Majin Vegeta and Vegeta putting up a facade while deep down he isn’t him true self. He even goes to greater lengths and abandon his own mortality to gain strength. What’s great is that they were facing the person who had the biggest impact on them in their entire lives. Goku to frieza and vegeta to goku. Another is how it contast their nature vs nurture dynamic where vegeta was in conflict with his nurture while goku was in conflict with his nature Nationalism vs patriroism Vegeta and Goku ideology both contrast each other as well. Vegeta ideology being nationalism and Goku being patriotism shows how they both took pride and identified with their race. This difference is how they toke in reactions when they witness the flows of the saiyan race tries to deny it and live in this false ideology that they are the perfect warrior which would cause him to go majin vegeta (trying to return the status of the saiyan race which vegeta believes are the perfect warrior) What I love about this part of the dynamic is how it showed the difference of Goku and Vegeta in terms of being free. Goku believing that humanity can move forward hows how free goku is while vegeta can get over the past and is blind by it Sacrifice Goku and Vegeta sacrifice parallel each other perfectly. Both Goku and Vegeta desire caused more harm to the people they vared about that caused more good to themselves. We can see this with Vegeta and Buu and how Vegeta’s tubborness caused buu to be revived. For Goku was his actions with the red ribbon army and his desire to fight which caused more harm than good. Both Goku and Vegeta said similar thing when they were about to sacrifice themselves. We can’t beat him by fighting. I’ve been thinking and I can’t come up with any other way to leave the earth” Both of these showed that they were looking past fighting and showing that these sacrifice mean something other than any fighting tenchqiues. They even saw a reflection of themselves when fighting Buu and Cell. What’s ironic about these two sacrifices is that both enemies back which showed how it was never themselves to being with and that it was someone one. They both contraduct themselves, Goku ppannrd in to stay away from earth and leave it to the next generation but then chooses to come back and help Gohan. Vegeta when coming back after sacrifing himself fights the same way and contradicts himself again. Written by Anco.
Goku’s depth Goku values his strength because of the events of his life. After losing his parental figure to a “monster”, his helpessness created a will to grow more powerful to defend himself and those around him. He trains to push himself to new heights and defeats the greatest evil in the world, Piccolo, and is then effortlessly defeated by his brother Raditz, When he asks Krillin to spare Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, he does not out of morality, but out of curiosity of how far he can push himself. He calls himself selfish for this, but makes the choice anyways. This is the first step of Goku’s change as a person, Goku is pure of heart by the standards of the Kinto’un and yet he is innately flawed. His pure mindset is a both a blessing and a curse. He sees the best in people, he wants to be the best he can be, and he assumes that those around him should share his values. Goku puts his son into a situation that he didn’t realize Gohan wasn’t prepared for, and even gives Cell a senzu because hes so confident. Depsite his flaws, Goku is extremly self aware. Towards the end of the Cell Games, he sacrifices himself and apologies to Gohan for not making the best choices. He even chooses to say dead because he realizes that his existence has drawn seveal enemies to Earth, and during the Buu saga, he tries to give the mantle of Earth’s defender to Goten and Trunks that he cant fight all of the battles anymore, even if deep down he wants to. Goku literally abstained from fighting, the one thing he has dedicated his life to his son. Kid Goku is a child all alone in the woods away from society and his lack of understanding of modern technology like cars which he describes as “monsters” is a result of his lack of indoctrination, speaking of indoctrination Kid Goku is a pretty great embodiment of curiosity, and freedom his curiosity is a result of his lack of teachings of subjects in modern society (lack of indoetrination), The flying nimbus is an magic yellow that Goku uses to transport those who have a pure heart are able to ride on the flying nimbus , clouds symbolize clear thinking and emotional purity these fit Goku well seeing how he is pure of heart and has strong set belifes on what is wrong or right, the nimbus also correlates to he freedom in the many way Goku is free is a set purpose or place Identity crisis Identity crisis is the questioning in ones own idenity, once Goku sees Raditz and Raditz unfolds the story to him and his friends about the saiyans their heritage and occupation and just on general how bad of people they are, Goku is quick to say that he isn’t a saiyan and that he is Son Goku from earth. This neglectance of identity isn’t surprising seeing how Goku and the sayians are opposites and have drastically different morals, Goku’s self acceptance Goku’s self acceptance coming from the realization that his saiyan heritage is something that can be used to good in the world to bring peace one might say the saiyan were ruthless and violent and ransacked peoples worlds to sell them when he accepts that’s he is indeed a sayian and tells Frieza he’s the super saiyan Son Goku, echoed through his speech “I am the light in the darkness” Goku here can be referring to himself the good out of the bad. The one good saiyan out of the many evil saiyans, Affect on world Goku’s affect on his world is the affect on his friends who eventually became his enemies and the whole physical world, Goku in the cell saga knew that if he kept residing on earth his friends said everyone else would be in danger so it was convenient he could use transporting cell to the king kai’s place and also just leave earth for the sake of peace In moral philosophy, deontological ethics or deontology is the normative ethical theory that morality of an action should be based on whether that action itself is right or wrong under a series of rules, rather than based in the consequences of the action, Goku has always kept this philosophy with him since a kid and this connects with his sacrifice great. Goku always had his morals over the consequences we can see this a lot with his interactions with vegetea ginyu and frieza, We saw many instances when Goku has put his morals above the consequences. For example, with his battle with Vegeta he could’ve killed Vegeta and bring peace. But he chose to let him alive because of his moral code and to fight him again. With Frieza he had the chance to kill him and yet he let him live becuase again he let his morals take over him and didn’t see the consequences Battle stance In saiyan saga goku and vegeta stance and position are contrast of each other. While Goku sgands below Vegeta showing that he is the low class warrior also shows his view on strength. Goku was always taught that there was always someone stronger than him while Vegeta was taught he was destined to be the strongest and Vegeta looking down shows that he believes that he is the strongest and his strength is complete. While Goku looking up shows how he believes that his strength us limitless and that there are others stronger than him. Both of their stance show how they were trained, Goku stance presents the turtle hermit school, they move low and find a weakness and strategies, Vegeta represent the elite saiyan training and how the fight full offensive seeing how both hands show are prepared to strike in showing his nature as a saiyan Spirit bomb vs great ape Goku and Vegeta main attacks contrast each other in the saiyan saga. The spirit bomb is said to take energy from your enviorment and goku being a saiyan yet denies his nature and stays with his nurture or his enviorment and it is also said that the spirit bomb is stronger when it absorbs the sun. Vegeta on the other hand uses his saiyan nature as his trump card which is great ape form and it is to be said to be powered up by the moon showing how goku symbolises the sun (being clear and self) while vegeta symbolize the moon (being a shadow and blocks the light) these two attacks symbolise their nature vs nature Both Goku and Vegeta were confusion on who they were. Goku was in conflict with his saiyan nature and we can see him in conflict with his own morals and identity where he spares nappa out of the goodness of his hear (nurture) while he spares Vegeta because he wants to fight him again (nature). We can see more of this in his fight with Frieza and how he toys with him, says he’s going to kill him, and is drowning in anger (nature) he also speares him, gives him ki, lets him leave (nurture). Vegeta is going throught the same thing but is apposite as well. Vegeta is in conflict with his humanity and his saiyan nature. He can’t see to understand who he truly is which leads him to Majin Vegeta and Vegeta putting up a facade while deep down he isn’t him true self. He even goes to greater lengths and abandon his own mortality to gain strength. What’s great is that they were facing the person who had the biggest impact on them in their entire lives. Goku to frieza and vegeta to goku. Another is how it contast their nature vs nurture dynamic where vegeta was in conflict with his nurture while goku was in conflict with his nature Nationalism vs patriroism Vegeta and Goku ideology both contrast each other as well. Vegeta ideology being nationalism and Goku being patriotism shows how they both took pride and identified with their race. This difference is how they toke in reactions when they witness the flows of the saiyan race tries to deny it and live in this false ideology that they are the perfect warrior which would cause him to go majin vegeta (trying to return the status of the saiyan race which vegeta believes are the perfect warrior) What I love about this part of the dynamic is how it showed the difference of Goku and Vegeta in terms of being free. Goku believing that humanity can move forward hows how free goku is while vegeta can get over the past and is blind by it Sacrifice Goku and Vegeta sacrifice parallel each other perfectly. Both Goku and Vegeta desire caused more harm to the people they vared about that caused more good to themselves. We can see this with Vegeta and Buu and how Vegeta’s tubborness caused buu to be revived. For Goku was his actions with the red ribbon army and his desire to fight which caused more harm than good. Both Goku and Vegeta said similar thing when they were about to sacrifice themselves. We can’t beat him by fighting. I’ve been thinking and I can’t come up with any other way to leave the earth” Both of these showed that they were looking past fighting and showing that these sacrifice mean something other than any fighting tenchqiues. They even saw a reflection of themselves when fighting Buu and Cell. What’s ironic about these two sacrifices is that both enemies back which showed how it was never themselves to being with and that it was someone one. They both contraduct themselves, Goku ppannrd in to stay away from earth and leave it to the next generation but then chooses to come back and help Gohan. Vegeta when coming back after sacrifing himself fights the same way and contradicts himself again. Written by Anco. @@pascalsimioli6777
Goku is a beloved character from the Dragon Ball franchise. He is often considered to be a one-dimensional character, but in reality, he is a complex and multi-faceted character. Goku’s character development is a result of his upbringing, his relationships with other characters, and his experiences throughout the series. In the Dragon Ball era, Goku lived in Mount Paozu, where he hunted and had a shed containing his most cherished possession - The four-star ball. The ball was his memento for Gohan, and because Grandpa Gohan was the one who raised and loved him, Goku cherished the ball more than anything else at the time. Goku was also shown talking to the ball, which showed he believed in reincarnation, which he must’ve learned from Gohan before his death. Bulma shows up to Goku’s location and introduces herself to him, Goku’s interaction with Bulma was the first of many scenes that showcased Goku’s little knowledge of the world and how he only knew as much as his deceased Grandpa Gohan taught him, and not by what he’s actually seen, which is why he couldn’t tell what most things were by mere sight alone and seemed oblivious to the world. He couldn’t tell Bulma was a girl until she told him and was later shown to be surprised by the features of a girl. Bulma explained to Goku about the Dragon Balls and how his grandpa’s ball was one of them, Goku wasn’t interested in exploring the world, but Bulma mentioned how Gohan informed Goku to treat girls with respect, which led to Goku deciding to join Bulma. This scene showcases a key side of Goku. His desire to honor Grandpa Gohan, a side that influenced his later actions in the series. Although he treats girls nicely, Goku didn’t have any romantic interest in girls. Goku was indifferent about beauty in women. He viewed all girls equally in terms of beauty because he didn’t have any human feelings to guide him to the human idea of beauty. He only found them stranger than men because of their features in comparison. This is a result of what Goku was used to growing up with only his Grandpa as well as his genetics (which we’ll get to later). This was shown in scenes such as when Master Roshi showed him two girls with Goku not being able to tell which one was beautiful, and when Goku brought back a huge and not so attractive woman when Roshi told him to bring back a pretty woman. Goku’s training with Krillin - the rival turned best friend through the bond they shared during the training, under the teachings of Master Roshi, which was reflected through the World Tournament itself, was what molded Goku into the fighter he grew up to be. Master Roshi taught Goku that there’s always someone better and that he shouldn’t be seduced by the adulation or status that comes with pursuing Martial Arts but rather see events such the World Tournament (and in turn the goals that inspired him and others to become martial artists) as only a checkpoint to evaluate his growth as a fighter, but not substantiate it. That there is no greatest and that the true value in working is the work itself and one should work purely to improve themselves, which worked perfectly in conjunction with Goku’s own purity @@pascalsimioli6777
Characterisation The way Cell sees himself as perfect mentally and physically stops him from seeing his imperfections. Such as him having wings, these wings don’t cause flight or advantage for Cell they are only weighing him down. On the surface Cell is viewed as a calm, collective and patient being. This is obviously not the case, he is very narcissistic and mentally distorted because of his “perfection” he thinks he’s superior to everyone and he must let everyone know. This narcissim is the reason he has to let everyone know he has “enough ki to destroy solar system” or that he gonna explode the earth. Cell desperately want to be victorious. In Cell’s first form he resemles an insect mostly because of ominous eyes and weird beak mouth. This is important because an insect is a symbol of greed and senusal pleasure. First from Cell obviously sucking life energy from others (greed). After Cell managed to absorb Android 17 he transformed into his semi Perfect form, this made him look more human like. This shows how he’s becoming more refined and closer to perfection. In Cell’s final form we see him with purple irises this has strong symbolisation of pride and ego, but most importantly royalty this having the obvious to Cell viewing himself above others Hypocrisy Parallels with Gohan Cell is the old generation of fighters he is a combination of all the z fighters apart from the young members. So when Gohan beats Cell this is him surpassing the old generation. Conversely, this doesn’t mean Cell isn’t apart of the new generation. He also achieved much more than the old generation of artifical androids. It’s out with the old and in the new. Gohan was held captive from the very beginning against Raditz. He was also held captive by his feelings of inadequacy it took Gohan emotions to overflow for him to espeace thid barrier. Gohan then changes to this cocky and arrogant person as his role models were Cell is the physical form of purpose fusing with desire, his desire to become perfect, fusing with his purpose to become perfect, this combination causes him to reach perfection, even when he is nearly killed by Vegeta when is overpowered by him, the law of purpose and desire acts on the scenario and Vegeta’s desire loses to Cell’s purpose, unless in the face of equal purpose and desire Cell views saiyans as dumb beings this is seen “I will never understand the way of these saiyans. This is because of how they will fight dependently and seek help leading them to misinterpet the situation. However we see Cell going power mad and overconfident leading to his failure. Another occurrence of cells hypocritical self is when he implies that children can be such a bother yet he goes through all the trouble of making some to kill the zfighters How he highlights the z fighters imperfections For Krillin we see his regret and guilt for not killing Android 18. His love towards Android 18 led Cell be coming perfect. As Ce transforms Trunks has thoughts about his timeline emphasising his anixety this is Trunks imperfection and self doubt (something the new generation carried) but after this we see Cell overreact in a irrational way as Trunks does. Cell on purposely used Vegeta flaws against him, his ego got the best of him. Cell then later let’s the z fighters get stronger as he waits while preparing the Cell Games wanting to test his new power like Vegeta but also fall. Gohan sees him self as weak and has feelings of inadequacy, while Cell sees himself as all power and has a huge ego@@pascalsimioli6777
Also super sayain lost its mystique a long time ago in the original series so I honestly don't get that complaint. That's honestly why I like the series every opponent is stronger so you better keep reaching new heights if you want to meet that challenge. In real life as well the guns or weapons of the past like the ones we use in civil war or spears were interesting weapons that set the standard but we can't keep using them since the enemies kept getting stronger with weapons of their own. That's how I view super sayain
I've actually addressed super saiyan losing its near divine like status multiple times, but those instances were insignificant compared to what Dragon Ball Super did to it and I generally felt there was some payoff for when Z did it. I don't think the half saiyans (or even Vegeta for that matter) should have awakened the transformation, but that price was well worth the cost if it meant having Gohan go Super Saiyan 2. I didn't like the idea of SS2 being surpassed, but the Super Saiyan 3 transformation sequence was so great, that it justifies its existence. Whereas with the transformations of DBS, had no worthy payoff, the closest would be ultra instinct or Blue Kaio-ken. It was the idea behind super saiyan that made it great not the fact that it bolstered the user's power. Responding to your other comment I am aware that blue is basically a hybrid transformation, but more recently I feel that its just become super saiyan 5 instead, in chapter 50 of Super , Goku had his energy siphoned away while in the blue state and he regressed back to super saiyan 3, instead the god or original super saiyan form, which makes Super Saiyan Blue seem more of like a tiered transformation than combination of the two.
Every Shonen has stronger opponents, you like something that isn't a DragonBall uniqueness. The difference is that DragonBall goes for vertical scaling (bigger numbers beat smaller numbers) while other (good) Shonen go for horizontal scaling (JoJo is always a puzzle between stand abilities and how they interact). Vertical scaling has a limit when you finish every gradient of hair color.
Watching this made me think why did they pick Mai as Trunks lover it would have been much funnier if it was Videl further cementing trunks role of taking up Gohans role
zamasu feels like a worse Thanos tbh. I know that sounds cringey or whatever but think. A Super strong person in a godlike position who thinks mortals are flawed uses wish granting stones to complete his goal while the heroes try and fail to defeat them at fullpower. Then, after their goal is complete destroy the stones and are only saved due to a deus ex machina clean reset. I think Thanos is done much better however cause; he has reasons for his actions, the lack of resources to population; and has flaws, his god complex and ego. That and he actually completes his task with the wish granting stones rather than do inefficient wishes, and wasting time killing people individually.
@Pimpcat Forthelols I see what you mean and it's fine. The archetype and rationale worked much better for Thanos; Zamasu needed far more exposition than what he received.
@TheBuddah Thanks, that's a video I strongly considered in the past, but ultimately withdrew since as a channel I didn't just want to be tied to only one series and at the time I felt like I just uploaded too many Dragon Ball related videos, but yeah since I've got more content variety now, I will say that's an idea I'm willing to return to in the future, but I do have other projects I want to work on first.
3:20 Bulmas haircolor has always been fluctuating between blue and purple. This has been ever since the very beginning. Sure its weird that kid trunks is diffrent from future trunks, but whatchagonnado *shrug*
18:00 You can say about "the potential" all you want - but none of your ideas for Zamasu is good either. It is maybe slightly less bad than what've we got. Zamasu is the failure beyond repair strarting from it's basis.
And also, Toriama totally ripped off Toyble's Xicor and his version of West Supreme Kai. Xicor: A kai and Goku/ saiyan hybrid that's evil and want's to kill Goku. WSK: A Kai turned evil and wanting to rule over the universe. You cannot tell me that Xicor and Goku Black aren't the same character, except that Xicor is WAY better.
@Sawdog 2000 I've honestly been under the suspicion for a while that as a sort of Tom Sawyeresque joke Toriyama intentionally sabotaged Super by giving the fans what they wanted, but doing it in a way that they would hate it. People wanted female saiyans, but then writes them as obnoxiously as possible; people wanted more Vegito, then the Potara earring fusion suddenly became a temporary fusion, so it lost all of its significance. So considering the fact that you thought Xicor was a good character, I wouldn't be surprised if Toriyama jokingly wrote an inferior version as a sort of prank.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 If that is the case, I honestly have no more hope for the series to continue than I already did. Pranks are funny yes, but going that far is insane. If he and all the writers did do all that what you said, they must be spiteful as fuck!
Thanks for calling out the garbage that is this arc. This is the worst arc in all of Dragon Ball. Also while I am a bit annoyed that the dub changed Toppo to Top, I don't mind it that much. Dub is my preference for Dragon Ball
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Reason why I perfer the dub is because the voices fit the characters better then in the sub. While I respect Masoko, she is mis casted as Adult Goku, Adult Gohan, Adult Goten, and Bardock. The voices for the dub felt the characters way better and sound more natural. The only bad Funimation dub was the OG Z dub. The rest of the dubs ranges from good (GT, the Z movies, and OG DB) to god tier (Kai and Super).
Agree not a fan of mai being here. Like her design as we finally got her as a grown up again (hate the forced pliaf gang as kids bullsh$t. Gt versions much better) though I feel like if Mai gonna be here then I say have her as like a just a friend of trunks, since we’ll trunks only friend before her gohan is f$cking dead and that Mai could be a great way for trunks to have a new friend to trust and hang with again after all the emotional sh$t he went through
@Sora Bell With me I view color theory as relevant because its misuse bolsters the criticism of pointless transformations: Super Saiyan 2's spikier appearance promotes a wilder, more aggressive image, while 3's grown out hair sends a message that one pulls out something deeper from themselves, whereas the color swaps just seem like a random powerup without any relation to established story. By the way I appreciate you complimenting my points in regards to this topic.
I used to be a big fan of Dragon Ball I cannot stand to watch one episode of Dragon Ball super that's how bad it sucks they completely destroyed a franchise
Correction it's the zero ningen aka humans plan not mortals plan. Deities are mortal to in Dragon Ball. Zamazu is just Dragon Ball AF evil Western Supreme Kai. Black is Xicor, also known as Zaiko, is the main antagonist of DBAF. All of Super is just DB fanfiction done worst.
@NeoGamest123 Logic In my version (as well as with the wiki) the translation referred to it as the "Zero Mortals Plan"; you're right and they're wrong, but for coherency's sake slash to keep everyone on the same page, I remained with that translation. I appreciate you further articulating on this topic, I remember someone else mentioning Zamasu's similarities to Xicor and I agree with your overall thoughts on DBS.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 How can it be 0 mortals plan when the Kai themselves are mortal as well. The obsession with humans in this Particular arc is quite blatant and clear. What the opposite of mortal is immortal. None of the deity are immortal just to be clear. They have to wish for it. Ningen is most certainly not mortal. Japanese for mortal is 定命の Jōmyō no. The Japanese word for immortal is 不滅の Fumetsu no Japanese word for human is 人間 Ningen. It's well known that Funimation makes certain changes to anime when "localizing" anime for the west. The dub can be pretty awful and misleading at times. Since DB been very beneficial to them in the past they decided to save it even if it's terrible. DBS is blatant low tier anime trash which is quite noticeable.
In an interview with Saikyo Jump from June 2014, he stated SS2 & SS3 were nothing more than powered up variations of the super saiyan form, and it would be more beneficial for Goku to focus on his base and super saiyan form as it would sap less strength and raise his level more. Here's a link to the article and the specific point I'm referring to is the second to last question. www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/saikyo-jump-june-2014-issue-twel-buu-mysteries/ PS I haven't listened to this video in a while, so I admit may not have worded it the right way.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Toriyama Literally said "...Goku realized that mastering his normal state and Super Saiyan would raise his level more and sap less strength...", that means that his Overall Power Grows("Normal state"-base and Super Saiyan), he never stated the SSJ multiplier is gonna grow or that it's multiplier will surpass that of Super Saiyan 2 or Super Saiyan 3
@@near3394 Except he'd already clearly grown his base power dramatically in the arcs long after attaining SSJ and had mastered the latter in the Room of Spirit and Time, not to mention the context of referring to SS2 and SS3's faults prior, so Toriyama's statement would've been redundant if only talking about rehashing what had already been done.
The manga version of this arc is much better than the anime version it's not good but it's better than the anime version cause trunks being that powerful without a reason and the sword of hope was so dumb and nonsensical that it's sad .
I mean, he got erased and mortals are still everywhere. He ultimately only succeeded in fucking over Trunks. If that really equals a win in your eyes then I don't think we're going to agree on anything when it comes to Dragon Ball.
@@Daxinar I like him esthetically but damn he's so poorly written and the super goku black saga as a whole is an insult to any db fan plus I kinda despise db post 2000s .
Depends whether you're referring to the anime or manga. In the anime, perhaps, but I wouldn't call it "putting on a show" when Trunks showed himself to be a genuine challenge when both were in SS2. In the manga, Vegeta confirms that Trunks' SS2 at full power is comparable to SS3 Goku.
The sad and funny thing is that a lot of " fans" of dragon ball really thinks that this arc is the the best on super while it's the worst I mean it's not like the other arcs of super are better haha even the new ones on the manga are really laughable with moro and the cerelians and the granolah bar hahaha but damn this is even worse .
Imagine some dumb fans complaining about ssj4 gogeta defusing that have berth to one of the greatest scenes ever in dragon ball where Kid Goku does the universal genkidama .
Trunks being the lone hero funny enough goes against how the point of the Buu arc is Goku realizing that its a group effort and working together together is always going to surpass going alone.
@harrisoncora4259 I wrote this video several years back, so I could be misremembering, but I think the context was rage acting as a convenient get out of jail free card to match Zamasu/Black's strength, whereas at the time Super Saiyan rubbed off as a transcendent divine state (not just a power-up). Even consider that Goku didn't let rage consume him against Frieza. Super Saiyan emerges from desperation and being pushed to the limit: Kaioken/Spirit bmb failed and the presumed loss of Dragon Balls; Krillin's death merely served as the straw that broke the camel's back.
- Bulma created a machine that can TRAVEL THROUGH TIME but her creating a bullet that can hurt strong people is unbelievable? Ive seen ssj goku get hurt by a rock - Piccolo jr was able to deflect the mafuba because he knew the technique and prepared for it, since thats how they trapped his father before,. How in the heck was Zamasu supposed to counter it without prior knowledge? And yeah trunks learned it quickly but so what? Took roshi 50 years to create the kamehameha and goku learned it in 2 minutes just by seeing it once.
@@goofyahhprod I was watching this with headphones earlier too, I had bluetooth headphones. I recommend getting blue tooth headphones because the wires dont break
Super future trunks saga is so dumb stupid and nonsensical that they should have called it the mindfuck arc that doesn't makes any sense with future trunks and an evil goku but that would have sound bad haha .
Plus goku black should he called Evil Goku or negative goku I mean why the fuck they named him goku " black" haha . I repeat it and I will repeat it forever they should have not made super or at least they should have made it decently . For me and many others even if it's not canon Gt is the real sequel to Z .
1:16:35 It looks like they've tried to play it as safe as possible for the sake of incorporating Potara fanservice anywhere they want. They've just builded up a fanservice usage. But imagine the outrage if Vegetto was incorporated into ToP and he would've became unfused right in the fight. That would've been called the biggest writting axpulls possible. Or Kefla for example. But on a second thought - NONE OF THAT HAPPENED IN TOP EVER! KEFLA WASN'T DEFUSED BY A TIME LIMIT AND VEGETTO WASN'T EVEN USED! THIS RETCON WAS COMPLETELY USELESS FOR A SERIES' FUTURE! THE ONLY THING IT DONE IS RUINED VEGETTO IN THIS ARC, RUINED POTARAS IN THIS ARC - AND NOTHING ELSE.
Dude colors really arent that binary, is Japanese not some arthurian fanfic. I also dont think he calls himself goku black, i think he gets called that by trunks and co.
No, the granolah arc was the worst. Spoilers!! Now people can use the Dragon Balls to become the strongest in the universe. Ultra ego Vegeta was hyped up to be Vegeta's ultimate transformation, because the more damage he takes the more powerful he becomes, even implying the Vegeta is ascending to the realm of a God of destruction. Unfortunately, super dropped the ball and Vegeta NEVER won a single fight in that form. Ultra Instinct was retconed, at first, to even access Ultra Instinct you needed a clear mind and to let your instincts do the fighting for you, now goku can access Ultra Instinct while having emotions like anger, and it's even called true Ultra instinct, and Goku didn't even win a single battle. And then there's black frieza. Overall this arc was so bad that it makes the universe 6 Arc and the future Trunk Saga more tolerable.
And don't even get me started with the worst dragon ball movie ever aka tha super new broly movie that is so awful that makes look a shitty movie like resurrection of f like a masterpiece .
@@missxmarvel Well Emma some of the fight was good not all the fight tho some scenes with gogeta doing flashy moves were animated well and it was good to see him beat the shit out of that mentally ill big saiyan .
@@missxmarvel I wish they didn't made a new broly but instead they brought back the og broly even if it was impossible but hey who givesa fuck why not bringing back the most badass non canon villain ever seen on db .
When you make GT look good in comparison, a series fans and even Toriyama acknowledged as non canon before Super released, you know something went very wrong.
@Bionicle Prime On that note a recurring comment I've heard from people referring to Dragon Ball Super is that the only positive that came from it regards how it elevated GT in comparison.
Bionicle prime you clearly never saw the iconic timeless classic full of heart emotions amd passion that is GT 💀🤦🏻♂️ fucking dumbass clown 🤡 you're probably one of those " Dragon ball stans" that thinks that super is better than GT and that clearly has never seen GT cause bitch please ssj4 alone as a form/transformation is better than super supa as a whole and you think otherwise you're clearly out of your fucking mind so please never ever compare super supa to the great GT and honestly you might as well stop being a dragon ball fan or stan cause you don't deserve to be one cause having a personal and subjective opinion is one thing but to talk about GT like it's some trash ass piece of shit series like super supa is is objectively wrong so you're objectively wrong and your so called " personal and subjective opinion" in this case doesn't even count . Plus what's up with your nonsense " if it's not canon then it sucks" argument? Suoer supa it's canon right? Too bad cause it's trash meanwhile GT it's not canon right ? Well who gives a fuck about canon or not canon GT is a million times better than Super supa and that's facts and it's the perfet sequel to Z cause it follows up perfectly after the end of Z so please shut the fuck up dude and go jerk off to that trash canon shit called super supa that you love so dearly just cause it's canon 🤦🏻♂️💀 not even a 10 yo fan would have that retarded mindset of " if it's canon it's good if it's not canon it's bad" my god go get some help dude I'm serious I legitimately feel bad and sorry for you and your ignorance and stupidity on judging dragon ball . So your nonsense comment it's easily one of the dumbest and most wrong comments ever made in youtube history so congratulations for being an ignorant and stupid immature fan of dragon ball like many others now go watch super supa and leave the real dragon ball like GT and Z to us real fans and stans of the great Dragon ball . I know I may have been to harsh on you little kid but sometimes little dumb kids need to learn a lesson or more and with your nonsense stupid canon not canon mindset/mentality it's like you asked for it so don't get offended 😉 but you needed a verbal ass whooping like this . Goodbye . Plus GT IS OBJECTIVELY GOOD and not just in comparison to super supa but as a series alone so please little kid think before writing some bullshit nonsense illogical comments on youtube cause when you say some stupid ass nonsense shit like that you know you done something very wrong . Nobody gives a fucl bout canon or not canon cause GT it's not canon and yet is objectively a million times better than that canon disgrace called super supa and you can't say otherwise so either accept it or shut up . Plus what fans acknowledge GT as not canon ? You can only talk about yourself little kid you don't know shit about what other fans think cause guess what there are probably way more GT stans than super supa stans and there are way more dragon ball fans that rightfully like or love GT and hate or dislike that disgrace called super supa .
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Well dude don't take this the wrong way cause I really like you and your channel but GT has always been great for many reasons and sure it has a lot of flaws but to be honest GT has so much heart passion and emotions in him that it overcomes those many flaws and makes GT the objectively iconic timeless emotional classic that it is and that it always will be plus the " fans " that say shit like that probably never watched GT as a whole and probably only watched super supa and probably has never seen the original db and Z as a whole so basically just some irrelevant and wrong personal opinions of a bunch of fake fans that only watched that trash series called super and that doesn't know shit about the real dragon ball like the og seriesZ GT and all the amazing movies of the 80s and 90s so who cares about them plus just the ssj4 form alone it's better than a million super supa arcs combined so who cares plus only some dumb kids can have that " if it's canon it's good if it's not canon it's bad" mentality/mindset let's be honest lmao that's why to me and many others real fans of db the only sequel to Z that matters and that counts it's GT even if it's not canon unlike that awful super supa canon shit . Plus GT doesn't need super supa to be elevated in comparison cause GT is objectively a million times better than 10000 arcs of super supa so that's it .
@Bino Felix Nino and Narc Regarding the prior comment in my defense I'm taking a third person perspective of the situation (what others/the community think) rather than expressing my own sentiments. I try my best to acknowledge all commenter's comments, but at the same time I wish to avoid the potentiality of being lured into paragraph long responses, so many times I reply with a more neutral response to dodge such predicaments. By the way I'm grateful that you enjoy me and my content. On that note with many other videos I've gone out of my way to praise filler/non-canon material.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I kinda hate the term " filler" cause filler episodes makes an anime great and that's why I hate dragon ball kai cause imagine dragon ball z without all the fillers episodes and scenes it would still be a classic sure but imagine a dragon ball like that where they only fight and fight and fight and that's it and I bet you would surprised about this but some "fans" of dragon ball prefers kai over the original Z and I mean I can get it if they like it more for the dub but otherwise the og Z it's Z that's it plus a version that cuts more than 100 episodes and turns Z into a constant fight it's blasphemy cause the filler episodes makes the story and the characters a million times better and that goes for og db and GT too meanwhile to be honest super filler episodes are awful but that's obvious cause super itself it's a disgrace to dragon ball so of course the filler episodes sucks too aside for some good filler episodes tho but the point I'm trying to make is that kai is probably even more of a disgrace to dragon ball than super cause at least super is something new meanwhile kai takes OG Z and turns it into a trash ass piece of shit cut version of Z where they only fight and fight and fight that's why I find kai to be even worse than super . In the end filler episodes are essential to an anime cause without the filler episodes and scenes an anime would lost his soul and heart imo that's why I consider kai even more of a disgrace than super cause having such arrogance to cut some og Z scenes it's just blasphemy to me and many others .
![LBA's Top 132 Favorite Videogames [Part 1] 132-91](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/m4S9WfaA__Y/mqdefault.jpg)
You made a great point about the importance of locations, History of Trunks took place in the same setting but the writers still made room for Visual Storytelling. *For ex:* Trunks picked up a burnt teddy bear, 18 was shopping, 17 was shown running down people in a Car, they both rode amusement park rides, Gohan fought in the rain and Trunks fought during sunset. These seemingly trivial details add so much depth to characters&themes, this type of basic "show, don't tell" storytelling was missing in Super.
Speaking of Mai, I felt way more emotional connection with that random old man who shot 17 by saying "you demon you killed my son", that felt natural and in the manga 17 shoots him in the face.
Mai feels so forced, the fact that she survived so many encounters with Black is nonsense..
I wished Future Trunks saved him and his granddaughter and have them together. I know it’s cliche but at least it’s better than have an old creature wished young again just to be paired with Trunks.
I agree with what you said about Trunks and mai. It’s forced and no matter how many times fans defend the couple you can’t get over the creep factor that she used to be older than His own parents. It’s her gangs fault that the whole Z gang is dead forever.
I also thought Zamasu's reasoning was very flimsy. He kills off the gods himself but rants about mortal inferiority? And if its so easy to kill the Gods, isnt that a flaw on them? I don't see this as good hypocrisy, but more like just dumb plot holes. Baby in GT was the better hypocrite becausehe did things ironically in nuance. Like him becoming and Oozaru just to keep up with Goku who did it to go SS4 before he was about to lose. Despite how much he hated Saiyans, he had a twisted way of becoming them to kill them. They tried this with Zamasu but his just lacks the thematic correlations. Zamasu seemed like a bad attempt at it from writers who don't understand how to do thematic irony. Zamasu's less of a genuine hypocrite and more of a poorly written contradiction.
Baby didn't want to become an Oozaru in the original but Bulma forcefully transformed him. Vegeta's body was progressively becoming like Baby's so it kinda worked in it's own way.
@sexallatusangelus4472 There's implications that this isn't the first time he's seen mortals act the way they do, and I do believe a lot of the impact of seeing Barbari, the first time he's seeing mortals IN PERSON was lost due to censorship. Their name implies that we were supposed to see some very...well barbaric acts or at least very brutal violence and the fact one of them shows up and attacks them, even after being pushed a away as a showing of the gods having greater power would've been the tipping point.
Now, as for why any actual civilized races don't do anything to actually dispel the worthless notions, that is beyond me. Zamasu was a north kai prior, so unless his area had no mortals, or they were all just primitive animals, you would think he'd seen more civilized races. But then again...universe 10 is on the lower end of the mortal level ranking so maybe there wasn't actually that many civilized races to begin with.
Universe 7 has a lot of civilized races, but they all live in rather poor quality lives. Universe 10 could possibly have very few mortal races to begin with, and only a very small handful of them actually have decent lives. Proportionally more than U7, but not that great either way.
And I think the point of him killing the other gods was that at least originally he placed the blame of the failures of mortals on the gods who created them. Creators who in his mind, do very little to actually help their creations. It's that part, the refusal to actually do more ("Inaction, that's a sin too, don't you see it?") is what makes him start to take the actions he does. And the zero mortals plan started off as a mercy killing and then just kind of devolved from there.
Again, most of this is implied at various points, but it's very off-handedly or done in passing. Honestly if super wasn't as censored nor rushed as it was, this could've been a hell of a lot better than what it ended up as.
Trunks could’ve stayed in the present, waited a year, gathered the super dragon balls, and then wished for his timeline to be fixed.
The arc felt like a fanfic done by a fan that wanted to make dragon ball darker and edgier without it actually making sense for the reason you described plus Goku Black seemed like that writer wanted their villain to be cooler than everyone else and better than everyone else when it made no sense making him a mary sue.
That would mean defying the Omni King. If he did that, then whats the point of having one?
@@GeteMachine Why would he care he erased the timeline because Zamasus spirit was spreading everywhere.
@@AxisChurchDevotee tf u talkin about dbz is 10 times edgier than super. Super doesn't even have blood
@@kenonerboy Blood isn't edgy, it's gore. You can still have blood without even edgy but if you have "main character has an evil twin in a dark post apocalyptic time line"... Well that's edgy.
I agree that they introduced the wrong person in Trunkses life. Mai has no business being with Trunks. All her so called caring towards the children, feeling sad that Bulma is gone, acting all distraught and mourn those children doesn’t even feel sincere. She’s part of the good guys just to be paired up with Trunks and that’s it. Their romance was forced and pushed down our throats even more in the manga.
I do wonder, what woman would you pair trunks with? And where would they meet?
I always thought because of Trunk’s mystic and mysterious nature him and a female Supreme Kai would be a good match.
@Stephie Thiel
Answering truthfully I don't believe he needs a relationship or that it would add anything to him, in all honesty I actually think it may take more away from him in the end by lessening his image as the mysterious teen who lost everything. I guess if I had to pick someone I would say introduce a new female character who works with machines or builds robots, as in its own way it symbolizes "rebuilding civilization". Plus I've always felt Future Trunks to have a bit of a cyberpunk aesthetic, and a character like that would mesh with his nature.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I always thought Trunks was asexual. I thought it was cool until they came up with this crap, only then I realised he deserves better.
I was actually thinking about Trunks getting with Chronoa because of Xenoverse.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 You know what would be a really neat treat? If you stopped spitting into your dimestore mic that only picks up on one headphone and actually got a decent one before making long form essay content on TH-cam.
I agree with a LOT of your points, my fave is your Broly video as OG Broly was a big part of my childhood and I find a lot of Supers writing to be contrived bs too. However it makes it very hard to listen to a person with similar views when their mic is sounding like a cat in a garbage disposal.
Notifications are off on this, dont bother replying, take it as a learning experience and fix this.
Mr. Satan in Future Trunks' timeline would have been interesting, because if the Cell games didn't happen then he wouldn't necessarily be a coward or fake his image for the cameras. He probably would have to be tough, and if he would surprise the characters from the present timeline for comedic effect. Or if he was less competent despite being serious as the opposite to his present character.
The fact that Zamasu himself stated the biggest issue in the series when stating “We’re here trying to destroy all mortals yet here we are using mortals power,” really is a damn shame.
Well it's the writer showing the hypocrisy with the villains goals/ideas
I think that's the writer showing Zamazu hypocrisy
I would have made Zamasu's plan make more sense if he used the Super Dragonballs to erase all mortals, but have Goku and Vegeta, Piccolo, Dende and Supreme Kai survive because they have God Ki? At least some sort of technicality to take him off guard before he meets Goku? Maybe that should have inspired him to take his body as a means of reclaiming it if he couldn't wish it away the first time. Then he meets Vegeta who also has God ki and gets angered at mortals escaping his wish from it.
That would Goku and Vegeta would feel the pressure of being the last ones left other than the higher Gods who can fight him and all their friends erased out of no where. Similar to when Buu killed everyone and they had to fight on the Kai planet. That would also give more relevant to Piccolo if he needed to train with the Supreme kai in order to get stronger for that fight (replacing Trunks.) Then it would bring controversy if the other Gods found out all the mortals in their universes were gone out of no where as well. To at least make Zamasu seem competent and ask questions to the way things work in the universe.
Way better than the bullshit Future Trunks arc.
God ki created more problems then it solved, god ki shouldn’t of been a thing or rather should of been a unattainable for mortals, god training would of made more sense. Training that would pushed goku & vegeta power to a level at a more affective and quicker paste. Goku would of been able to use ss3 with little drawbacks, and vegeta should of got ss3. ss god & ss blue is just to much.
I thought SSG was fine on it's own and it could've been the precursor to MUI honestly. I love the base form appearances and just having a form like SSB as a flagship for this new Gen of DB for DBS is pathetic. It's such a passionless form and thought it looks cool in some fan art, it still doesn't grab me like the previous form does.
1 minute in, already got my attention 😂
cool, I hope you enjoyed the rest too.
Trunks eating a Sausage 💀😭
5:06 Vegeta's rage boost still can't be justified due to how they previously worked in Dragon Ball. Rage boosts without resulting in a new transformation (like Goku's first use of Super Saiyan) were always exclusive to Gohan during the series' original run, making them at most an exclusive biological trait to hybrids and this was backed up several times throughout the manga (eg. both Vegeta and Goku commenting on how Gohan could access unknown power if he got angry in the Boo Arc rather than believing either of them could do so).
That said, as terrible as Trunks' transformation in the anime was, it still makes more sense than Vegeta's rage boost due to Trunks' biology and surpassing what at the time would be top tier power through rage is far from unprecedented for Saiyan hybrids (Gohan going from far weaker than an average human to surpassing Raditz). Not defending Trunks' transformation at all since it's still a huge contrivance, but it doesn't break the world building anywhere near as much as Vegeta's "MY BULMA!!"
@Chou Eriito
I don't necessarily disagree, but I feel debating "what's worse" in Dragon Ball Super results in an argument that can be more easily resolved by agreeing that they're both terrible, so I'll leave it at that. But yeah I hated how Vegeta experienced one of his most immense power boosts from Beerus slapping Bulma, which somehow granted Vegeta a greater boost than watching future Trunks die.
@@lErickl It's explicitly stated during Vegeta and Nappa's introduction that the hybrid genetics are the reason for Gohan's immense power ups through rage. This is validated multiple times in the manga such as Vegeta only bringing up the possibility of Gohan becoming far stronger with anger as opposed to he or Goku during the Boo Arc. The idea that a vast increase to Ki through rage being something those outside of hybrids can utilise in more recent media is an egregious retcon at best and a blatant plot hole at worst.
A blue beard would've looked weird. But I do agree.
I REALLY hope you do a Dragob Ball relationships video. You are the ONLY person I've heard not agree with the parings in the show, and I'm really interested in what you think. Hope you see this.
Heaps of ppl are grossed out by Trunks and mai. On CBR and reddit ppl point out their disgust. I mean all Toriyama had to do is create her grand daughter,
Trunks from Z would've trained in the present then went back alone to finish black.
@Yung blade
Yeah despite being a decade older, he somehow seemed more of like a helpless child, than when he technically was one.
I personally think the ToP arc is worse because it ruined multiple characters at once, make Goku look like a braindeath idiot, fan service taking priority over proper story telling to the point that Roshi made to the team over Yamcha, Yajirobi, any Namekian warrior or the kid Saiyans. In fact, characters got out of nowhere power ups and the arc didn't have any tension. Universes suppose to get destroyed, but nobody tried to fight for survival. Just to have a good fight or torture an established character. Oh, and the female Saiyans... so disgusting.
And I don't think the Evil Goku arc trying to be "deeper" makes the ToP arc better when compared to each other. The ToP arc is ruined concepts, characters, ripped of stories and went overboard with fan service. Every episode has to have an homage to old better Dragon Ball. Memes and shitposts like Gohan Blanco are also referenced indirectly. There was a video by Mastar Media where he animated Gohan Blanco fighting Jiren which is traced from Gohan's fight with Super Boo. The exact same punches and kicks appeared when Goku went "mastered" ultra instinct against Jiren, just from a different angle. They also copied the Final Flash scene from Z with Vegeta vs Jiren taking away the magic of that iconic scene.
But the Evil Goku arc is a close second. Trunks turned into a final fantasy reject character getting a bunch of out of nowhere power ups and looks depressed all the time. When we saw Future Trunks in Z, he didn't cry all the time. And eventually reached his goal. The new Future Trunks also gets emotional seeing a younger Mai in a matter that it's giving some pedophilic vibes. While when Trunks returned to the past in Z, he didn't feel anything for kid Gohan. Now suddenly, when he sees present Gohan, he keeps thinking of his mentor.
It's worse at the end, where Zeno destroyed his timeline. Instead going through a character arc, it is treated as a happy ending, because Trunks can just go to another timeline. And the writers make it sound like the people he knows are the exact same ones Zeno or Zamasu killed in his original timeline.
Also why is he shipped with Mai, a comic relief character. It's like shipping android 18 with Oolong. I cringed so hard. And the enemy is a time traveling Pink Super Saiyan Goku who is in fact an Evil Kaioshin. You think it can't more fanficy than that, but it does like the selfcreating spirit sword and Super Saiyan Rage.
Wtf is that form? Why can't anyone else reach that form he did. Super Saiyan Rage? The entire point of reaching SSJ is rage. Its like saying I went swimming in a wet swimming pool and got burned by hot fire. I saw my image on a mirroring mirror.
So redundant.
What is worse is that it was meaningless, because:
1. Goku could have pressed the Zeno Button at any point sparing us all the nonsense that happened in that arc and the plotholes
2. There was a legimate way to make Trunks stronger in a short period of time, without that asspull power up: The God Ritual. The God Ritual is one of the laziest power ups and pretty convinient, ruining every hardship characters went through. But now that it's in, why don't characters use it to avoid shit like Bills appearing to happen?
Even the ToP arc is guilty of this. They don't take advantage of having 6 Saiyans to make the god ritual. It would be smart for U7 and U6 to temporary ally to defeat Jiren. I wouldn't be a fan of U6 having another free power up, but at least God is justified because it has no risks.
As for Trunks' blue hair, there were flashbacks of him with his purple hair, so I don't understand why they used the blue hair except because Toriyama drew it with blue hair.
Regarding Zamas, he collected the Super Dragon Balls 3 times off screen and wished for nothing that he couldn't accomplish with any other set of Dragon Balls. It showed how pointless the Super Dragon Balls were, and that Zamas is mentally challenged. Why wouldn't he just wish the mortals to be gone, become a literal god as people imagine or peace. Instead he wished for immortality that gives him regeneration powers, Goku's body and the destruction of all Dragon Balls. Damn, he could have wished for more wishes. Remember, there are no restriction with the Super Dragon Balls.
Also the show did a poor job with Gowas trying to teach him things about mortals. He can literally tell from drinking tea that he is evil, but besides the audience, nobody catched up.
You brought up a good point about Zamas and nature. I feel the show didn't take advantage of having 2 Zamas. Future Zamas didn't meet Goku, minus Zamas from the past, thus the had more potential to develop as a character. But they only used him as means to give Goku and Vegeta someone seperate to fight and them then to fuse.
Regarding the SSJB retcon, I addressed it in a video why Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan sucks. I recomment watching it, it shows more flaws of Super your average fanboy won't even catch even if you tell them that. You can also read it if you prefer that
www.deviantart.com/mertyville/art/Super-Saiyan-God-Super-Saiyan-sucks-845265519
Super completely ruined Goten. He can't even open a door and it is implied through the ToP arc that Gotenks is weaker than Roshi.
the closest thing to a good relationship in Dragon Ball was Bulma and Yamcha. It wasn't anything big, but it worked for what it was.
I think the entire thing about Piccolo fusing should not be even worth considering. If that were that easy, why can't he just go to new namek and fuse with some Namekian warriors? My hopes were ruined with how Gohan was treated in the ToP arc because unlike Piccolo in the Evil Goku arc, he was build up to archive a new kind of power. instead he had trouble with a yadrat and what looked like Rob the Robot.
There seems to be a misconception what filler is. Filler and canonity are completely different things like apples and oranges. Like colors and shapes. You can't say something is written by Toriyama, and it's not filler. Because Super itself is filler. We know the ending of Dragon Ball for several decades and Super takes place before Goku meets Oob. Non of the characters address the stuff happened in Super, and there is no tension in Super even if you ignore that.
U6 arc would result U7's earth to move to another universe. Evil Goku arc was meaningless the moment the Zeno Button was introduced. The survival arc had no tension because nobody was really taking it serious and U7 defeated every single Universe as Jiren did nothing for several episodes. And later we find out, Jiren could have beaten everyone in a few seconds. Goku was getting caught off guard like an amateur.
@Sex'' Allatus Angelus For the moment, I thought thats going to happen in Dragon Ball Super But... No instead we get this shitty arcs. I thought Dragon Ball for now its about universe exploring or any type of that but I was wrong, the arcs in there was boring.
Truth, preach it brother. DBS was pure fucking garbage.
This is why I don’t think super is canon
Well the original Z is probably no longer canon. The new Broly movie is canon and based on minus.
Depends which continuity we're talking about in terms of canon. The Super anime is most likely canon to the Kai anime continuity (despite obvious continuity errors), though you'd be hard-pressed to say the Super manga is canon to the original manga when there's clear differences such as the Namekians having 5 fingers in Super as opposed to 4 in the original manga.
Thats not how it works 😂
Super had potential but more than half of it was wasted the real good in my opinion was dbs broly and some aspects of others that could have been made better
Canon has become useless to me. People arbitrarily decide that the mangaka is the best one to decide what's real and what's not because it's his creation but most of the times they don't understand jackshit about their own time-lines and creations. So whatever doesn't ruin consistency in character and events is Canon to me.
Honestly you say all the things I keep thinking about Super as a whole. If you feel like it I wouldn't mind seeing your opinion on the Dragon Ball Multiverse series.
for his hair, i thought the color changed as he got older. i've heard of that happening to people. i rationed it as the purple is a mix of his parents hair (sort of a mix of blue and black) and as he got older, the Blue gene was more dominant and the black faded out, leaving it a blue color like his mom. i didn't know they never explained it at all, i just made this explanation for myself because the purple was pretty iconic to me before they changed it
@Christian Kettlewell
I will say your interpretation is a good one and if Super included it; I would have found it satisfactory.
1:00:00 it's too bad that they didn't write Mai to be the leader of the resistance against Zamasu due to her guilt for serving Demon King Piccolo having basically been given a second chance at life by restarting as a child. Sort of how Vegeta was so protective of the Namekians when he first met Moro. Speaking of, i'm enjoying the writing of Super much more now that the ToP Arc is over and the manga has moved on to Moro and Ultra Ego, etc. These bits have been much more interesting than anything Super did previously
@Christian Kettlewell
I honestly prefer the Moro and Granolah Arc to Zamasu and the Tournament of Power (though I do lean in favor of the Universe 6 Tournament against the latters), with a few minor tweaks I think they could have been good.
By far the best Dragon ball analyst
@Nice_Person7379
Thanks, I appreciate the compliment. I have dozens ideas for future videos, but my process of content creation has recently hit a snag, since I had to move a while ago, basically I lost access to a recording room, with that said though for future videos currently in the works I intend to use AI to replicate my voice.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033good luck.
An alternate method would be to speak into the microphones into the bottom of a phone to better improve audio quality.
@@Nice_Person7379 Thanks, that's actually how I recorded my prior videos, but I still appreciate your suggestion. What I meant by saying recording room is an area where noise pollution doesn't pickup on my recording device.
Your videos are utterly fantastic holy crap you should have 100k subscribers at least
Your words are very encouraging and I'm grateful. The types of videos I strive to make won't grant me quick success, but long term I believe they will be better.
Lonely Boy Adventurer I’ve watched the original vs super broly one as well as the black clover one and honestly such good content. I feel bad that they aren’t as successful as they should be but at the same time I’m glad they are there in that long form format cause it makes such a great listen.
Thank you for supporting for my channel and watching several of my videos I am very appreciative of it. In all honesty I enjoy making videos, now I admit I'd be lying if didn't say I get bummed if a video of mine doesn't succeed, but the primary reason why I made them in the first place was because many of their ideas swirled around in my mind, for some cases years and just finally getting to express them is satisfaction all its own. Even now a number of my video's view counts seem low, but for me I've seen them significantly rise from the depths, the day before I uploaded my Black Clover video I had 28 subscribers and total cumulative view count of around 1500, but now I have over 500 subs and a view count over 40,000, and its still substantially increasing everyday, even my older videos are gaining traction as well, which just further motivates.
PS I apologize for responding so late, both times, I've been working on a behemoth of a video that I wanted to release before the end of the month and it required most of my computer time to finish on time, so I haven't been as attentive to youtube comments as I should be.
A lot of it shows more critical depth than most of the more popular DBTubers here that either just shill for Super, make videos of their headcanons.
@@GeteMachine *Cough* Geekdom101 *Cough*
super destroyed trunks character
Physically, mentally and emotionally, yikes.
Great video again. All of the points are bang on! I've felt this about super for a while, it has retconned and hurt the original lore of DBZ and what made it so great.
@CXRSED
Thanks man. I'm glad you enjoyed another one of my videos. I felt a lot of this had to be said.
I cannot wait for you to rip the Granolah arc to shreds.
@alphonsejohnson5601
I appreciate you respecting my writing capabilities, but I believe me pretending that arc doesn't exist would be a more suitable punishment than simply tearing it to shreds.
This is probably why you commented, but did you get my reply in regards to Bayonetta 2?
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Yes, I got it. Thanks. Edit: I also enjoy watching and commenting on your old videos.
@alphonsejohnson5601
No problem, and I'm always happy to see viewers return. Plus many of my old videos don't get as much attention as they used, so seeing new comments on them for me at least prevents the sensation of them getting left behind.
I love this review so much and I've seen parts of it so many times after finishing this review. This arc was so amazing in concept but in execution it was terrible, most specifically the ending which essentially ruins most of Trunk's arc in Z and the fact the writers had his whole timeline destroyed was such a crime against humanity, literally. I hope you breakdown the tournament of power because that alone in itself was also a nightmare.
@The1TrueGabrielDWilliams
Awesome, I'm glad you you think so highly of my video. I have actually written a video analyzing the tournament of power, two in fact, though technically they're not purely about the tournament, as in the upload I compare the tournament to a similarly styled arc of One Piece. If you're interested the videos are called "Dragon Ball Super vs One Piece II: How to ..." and "Jiren vs Katakuri: How to do an Antagonist Right"
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I saw the Tournament piece yesterday but I'll be sure to watch the Jiren comparison review. But I have to say your ideas and concepts are so much better for the show and just explains how dumbed down this series has become over the years. I'll probably have to watch this video again today since it's one of the best reviews of a terrible arc I have even seen. If you also think DBS is garbage then you should check out Saiyan Scholar since he breaks down how terrible this series was in a review that's longer than yours. I hope you both meet and collaborate someday because that would bring about the best debates ever. But in conclusion, you're welcome and I look forward to seeing what you upload next time in the future.
@The1TrueGabrielDWilliams
Again, I appreciate your praise and continued support. Believe or not by name Saiyan Scholar directly referenced my channel before, though I think the video where he did so either got copyright struck or deleted. I uploaded a video titled "Explaining Goku's Cries ...", and a few months later he made his own iteration of it while also citing my video. We briefly communicated in the comment section and he admitted that he watched most Dragon Ball content. I'm not opposed to livestreams/collaborations, it's just a lack of time and I've never done one through youtube, so I'm not all that familiar with them.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Wow, it's pretty convenient you guys actually had an interaction. You are welcome mate and I enjoy your content. Well, hopefully it all works out in the end and you two find a way to expand your works across the community, you deserve it! :)
Whoa there! All that stuff you say they should have implemented would have required thought... and planning and- add effort. Fuck that! I was important to shart out this cash grab series in order to sell toys. We don't need to wait for the manga either, just make forms in all colours. Taste the rainbow!
Another thing I don't think you mentioned is that Elder Kai is a partora fusion of his younger self and an old witch that happened several millennia ago. If the retcon stayed true to its own continuity, the fusion should have ended because the old witch is not a Kai.
Lastly I think the Goku Black arc should never have happened at all. Universe 7 should have lost that tournament in the previous arc. Imagine the possibilities of now having U7 Earth in U6. Goku could have an opportunity to visit the Planet Sadala and see at least one Saiyan homeworld. Vegeta could have visited Planet Sadala as well to see how the U6 Saiyans measured up to the one he grew up with. And the series would have had more time to develop Cabba, Kale and Kalifla. There would even be more time to develop Hit and Frost.
But like I said, all that would have required thinking and planning. That's too much work.
@Brian A.
DBS has too much of the everything must go back to normal mentality. Universe 7 always has to win and nothing can amount to something at a later point.
With the Potara earring I'm not 100% sure, but I think they said if at least one participant is a Kai the fusion stays permanent, again I'm not fully confident and even then it's still overall a poor concept.
Yeah, Super only exists as a cash grab, though I do think they had an ulterior motive for the Super Saiyan Blue transformation; I'll just say as Dragon Ball became global, they probably didn't want a blond haired blue eyed transformation viewed as a "superbeing", but again at its core it's still just an excuse to sell more toys.
I know it's Toriyama's right to create these story arcs however he sees fit, but that's no excuse for lazy writing! For starters, what sense did it make to base time travel on multiverse theory if you don't understand how cause and effect work? If traveling to the past splits the timeline, then what point does it make for Trunks to keep zipping back between past and future, knowing that he can't rewrite his history?
Second, the backstory is the same as before: Trunks’ world is in peril, and he again travels to the past to request help; why is he always in danger? Future Bulma had knowledge that the Namekian survivors were leaving on New Namek and had Namakian Dragons Balls. Also to point out is when the Nameks requested a new world to live on, it was just that, not wish for a new planet and then move it to a different space sector. So technically, Future Bulma should’ve send Trunks to New Namek and requested the use of their Dragon Balls for his needs!
Third, Bulma’s whole purpose of sending Trunks to the past for help, was of course, entirely pointless. Everyone is dead, Zeno erases the timeline, and as a consolation prize, Trunks and Mai can live a duplicate version of the timeline that they risk their lives trying to save. It would've been better if Trunks stayed in the present, for at least he can grow closer to his father!
Fourth, it's been stated by Whis and later Gowasu that the Time Ring is only designed to take you into the future and move back through time when making a returning trip; they're not created for traveling to the past as altering history is forbidden. What's the point in crafting a time manipulating device with a specific restriction, only to bypass it when it conveniently resonates with another time manipulating device? Toriyama seems to enjoy contradicting himself for the sake of doing the unexpected!
And finally, the origin of Goku Black! Initially, it was believed that Zamasu created Black with the Super Dragon Balls as a loyal subordinate. This scenario is better suited in the series than Zamasu requesting the divine dragon to swap bodies. At the beginning of the third and final battle, Vegeta pointed out that Zamasu, having a Saiyan body, can never utilize its true potential since he doesn't have a Saiyan mindset. So theoretically, Goku Black shouldn't be able to defeat Goku in singles combat. Commandeering Goku’s body doesn't mean he can use it better than Goku can! Let me know your thoughts in the comments below!
@Jordan Robinson
I appreciate your perspectives and yeah, nothing about this arc added up. The story creates exposition that shrinks everything. These supposedly intelligent characters not even planning past the most base elements. I honestly think Toriyama intentionally sabotaged Dragon Ball Super as a sort of Tom Sawyeresque joke i.e. make something that someone should like in a way they'll hate it.
Welp, if you thought the one was bad, there's the one going on in the manga now, and let's just say... it's hitting rock bottom quite quickly.
Dragon Ball super as a whole reminds me of cringey fanfiction. DBS broly is an example of well writen fanfic but fanfic is still fanfic.
what i'm trying to say is DBS seems like a hollow reflection from DB and Z. almost like a fan of DB taking over with out trully understanding what DB was to begin with..
You worded that perfectly, it feels like the writers had seen the original series, but have no comprehension of what made it so great in the first place.
Lonely Boy Adventurer agreed
@the swoly ghost
dbs broly can't really be described as a fan fic considering toriyama wrote it himself but hey maybe he's lost touch with his own work to be considered a mere fan
A lot of Super feels like its written by people who've never watched the original and understand its nuances or, by people who just care about power ups. The writers just show they do not know how to write at all for this show.
Yeah, it's nothing but homages and references as well as recolor power ups. You know Super is awful when they copy actual fanfiction and rehash too much from the old show.
12:00
F**k I've just realized thanks to you that it was possible to fix at least one thing for him - it would've been MUCH better for him to try to destroy humans that BETTER than him! With a mindset "how dare any human to be better than us?!"
It would've been still completely unmotivated, stretched, dull, pointless, unoriginal, uninspired, one-dimensional, illogical for this story - but at least it would've been SOMETHING.
SOMETHING instead of a 14yo mindset hitting his puberty and suddenly "this world's got rotten and there is nothing left except for hatred all people are just bad and I'm just better than them and know better so they should be eradicated because bad things exists".
I'm glad I helped you realize that and in regards to your other comment on this video I didn't say I could turn him into gold, but I could at least turn garbage (Zamasu) into Bronze.
Something else about energy blades similar to the holdo maneuver from the last jedi, it brings the question of why no one else in the dragon ball universe canonical didn't think of using energy blades first I mean it can't be hard at all to think of them so why hasn't anyone else besides Vegito done it before as there's no way Zamasu is the first person to think of using it.
It was something that hard to pull off for anyone except for fusions (you can remember how even Gotenks was struggling to do just a big ring of energy and manipulate it), Ki-forms was able to be only basic like cowering the palm or finger or making a little ring that can only be launched and stacked on something.
Only fusions was able to make a big and complex forms of it.
Now Goku Black is just doing it.
@@SuperSaiyanDate Salza
@@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக் I've mentioned Sauzer.
He was cowering his palm with energy, this is not the same as to create a fully intact blade with no basis it covers.
Sauzer made the thing Goku made with his finger against Trunks but using the whole palm, so this is not something out of normal.
@@SuperSaiyanDate Slaza cut piccolo's shirt with it, it is a ki blade. Black&Vegito just have a denser/thicker Ki blade.
@@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக் it is not a real ki-blade.
Goku was able to cut something with his finger too.
Black and Vegetto have absolutely clear blades WITHOUT any basis - their lenght is not covering anything, it is a clear blade out of energy made out of nothing except for Ki, palms is only for moving those constructs.
This is the difference - Sauzer can cut things covering his palms with Ki, just like Goku with his finger covered in Ki also - but neither of them can make his blade longer than his palm or finger, because this is just a palm/finger coverage.
I usually don't like these types of videos but, this was well constructed with no slander. This is the best criticism video of DBS I've watched so far.
@Calvin Miller
I'm grateful for the compliment. I try to make my content as fact based and objective as possible.
I feel that the Manga and Anime should have swapped the Vegito versus zamasu fights because, given that in the anime the z fighters were able to put up more of a threat to merged zamasu, it would only make sense for a fusion of them to overpower zamasu like in the manga.
Instead of making it an even bout like in the anime and, in the manga, Goku and Vegeta did not over power merged zamasu so it would make sense that if they fused they would be even with merged zamasu like how the anime portrayed them.
Now the manga follows toriyama's structure of how useless Fusion is to this series, which is perfectly fine since that's how he wants to utilize fusion in his story, but the anime tries to be different in a stupid way.
It just feels forced because fans wanted a fusion character to have to put effort into a fight which doesn't make sense here because, as I said before, Goku and Vegeta were already capable of giving zamasu some kind of resistance.
So why would a fusion of them only make them equal to him?
Especially when the number one rule with Fusion in Dragon Ball, at least according to how the Saiyans do Fusion, is you get overpowered like a motherfucker and, sure it's technically an ass pull because I don't think there's any point in the series where the Saiyans fuse together and they don't have abilities they shouldn't be powerful enough to produce.
But that's just how Fusion is between the Saiyans so it doesn't make sense to contrive vegito's nerf in the anime like they did.
I definitely see your reasoning, especially since Goku's kamehameha had already overpowered/purpled Fused Zamasu prior. I'm convinced the anime adaptation's writers weren't on the same wavelength when writing the Vegito battle, which is why much of these episodes feel so incoherent.
If anything Gogeta should've taken Vegito's place. Because there is somewhat of a message about the main cast over-relying on gods to help them, AND it would be an even better nod to fan service because then Gogeta would've been made canon then and there, we also get to see a fight between both fusion types AND FINALLY, the shorter duration of that fusion type can also be used to explain why Gogeta ended up being unable to finish the fight in any significant way. I mean, they can even have him man-handle Zamasu, since he's half-immortal, and the time limit really being the only real thing that ended up costing them the fight. And well, how broken immortalitiy is.
Resurrection F is the worst arc
I actually agree with that, but for this video I limited the arcs to stories exclusive to the Dragon Ball Super, and Resurrection F could technically categorize as a "Z" movie, so that's why I excluded it.
Revivial of F was terrible, but as far as contradictions to the world building that cause plot holes, flanderising established characters and having poor theme exploration, it's one of the less offensive in Super.
1:05:55 eh that's a double edged sword honestly a character being virtually invincible runs the risk of making the action boring then when a character needs to lick their wounds after being defeated and needing a new plan now that being said I do agree Goku and Vegeta frequent loses in this arc is a problem since its not only makes them seem week but the plot point is very repetitive but if done well can help emphasize how strong a character has become
No pun intended btw
One answer that makes sense to all these plot holes and ect very bad writing,forced writing,writing that under emotional or logical sense will never add up
I agree i was disappointed with this arc
@garrettsherwood2346
I'm happy to hear you agreeing with me!
The other weird part about the hair color change is when Future Trunk's came back and Kid Trunks told Bulma she asked him "does the occupant have blue hair?" When the last time she saw Future Trunks, his hair was purple so how was she aware of his hair being blue now? Honestly it would've made more sense if they changed his hair to blue in DBZ Kai/DB Kai because to me Super is more of a continuation/in the continuity of Kai more so than the original DBZ so it would've made more sense for Future Trunk's hair color to have been changed back in Kai. I give the Super manga credit because at least they changed both Future Trunks' and Kid Trunks' hair color to blue whereas the anime had Future Trunks have blue hair but Kid Trunks still had purple hair up until Super Hero (I think the only reason it's blue in Super Hero is because of Toriyama actually being involved in the production of it and his original character designs for Super is where the color change for Trunk's hair came from)
1:20:55
That's would've been impossible - the Dragon Balls can't ressurect anyone who was ressurected by it already (the rule per set) or anyone who died more than a year ago. This is can't be changed.
Just for the note.
The more than a year part either only applies to large groups of people or was a trait erased when Dende upgraded Earth's Dragon Balls, considering Freeza's revival. Even in the original manga, the former is heavily implied with Tenshinhan and Chaozu having no issue potentially waiting another year to be revived.
@@choueriito2548 wrong.
It applies to literally anyone any amount and this trait never was erased. There is no any statement like that.
In the original there was no any nonsense like that. It was literaly the plot point of that protagonists was in a hurry because no one can wait for year.
@@SuperSaiyanDate That is incorrect. The necessity to revive their friends within a year is never brought up as a plot point in any of the arcs. In fact, the one year limit isn't brought up until Kami is conversing with Kaio and he specifically says it in relation to all the people Nappa and Vegeta killed, not just a single revive. His exact wording within the Viz translation is "Although, if you want to bring back everyone whom those two killed, I'm afraid we would be limited to those who died in the past year." Moreover, nobody was panicked at the prospect of Chaozu potentially having to wait another year, making it even more apparent this doesn't apply for single revives. The idea of the one year limit for everyone is a misconception likely made through the poor translation of the English dub.
@@choueriito2548 wrong.
It was a literal plot point.
I never talked about numerous incorrect English traslations you taking all this nonsense out. I am talking about the original only.
@@SuperSaiyanDate It is never once mentioned as a plot point that there's a time limit on a single revival. Again, the only time it's brought up is with Kami specifically talking about a mass revival on the level of Nappa and Vegeta's victims. At no point do the Dragon Team refer to there being a race against the clock to revive a single ally and the necessity to do so quickly is always pushed by other forces (usually an external threat), so unless you can actually cite your sources, it's clear you're incorrect on the matter.
You don't like Krillin and Android 18? I consider them to be the best in modern Dragonball in terms of healthy relationships. What do you not like about it or the Bulma/Vegeta relationship? Not trying to be rude, I'm just curious.
In all honesty I don't think the relationships of Dragon Ball have had good chemistry since the original series, Bulma/Yamcha and Launch/Tien. In the current Bulma/Vegeta relationship I pretty much feel Vegeta has basically become a rich woman's pet (domestication), a past aspect of Dragon Ball Z that I highly valued was that even when characters grew or developed, who they grew into stayed within the realm of possibility, but in the DBS era of relationship in regards to what Vegeta became I just don't see that as what he could be and instead feel like they changed his character. In terms of Krillin /18 I've always felt their pairing to be a bit contrived, like they don't really match up, everything that I feel 18 would want, Krillin lacks, whereas with Krillin I've always seen him as desiring a fun loving girlfriend, while 18 is kinda deadpan. To be honest in my opinion the best relationship post Dragon Ball would be Krillin and Maron (Garlic Jr Saga girlfriend). This will sound funny, but if I could put Android 18 into a relationship with any DBZ character I would have picked Hercule (Mr. Satan), because they actually possess good chemistry during The Buu Saga World Tournament arc and even Bio Broly. Like 18 basically wants money and luxury, which Hercule has, while she has the strength that Hercule would wish to say is his own. Plus it would mimic the real world equivalent of a model going out with a billionaire where its pretty obvious they're only there for the money. Hopefully this answers your question I realize I semi-changed the topic, its just a bit hard to answer truthfully without including all these side aspects.
You answered my question really well, thanks. You know I never considered 18 and Mr. Satan, but I could see it working. I agree with you on Tein/Launch and Bulma/Yamcha. Dragon completely shafted the normal people and their relationships. Tien and Yamcha are so irelevent that they can't even have romantic partners. I agree with Krillin and 18. I feel that up to that point krillin was considered a punching bag for so long, it was nice to see him finally win for a change. What are your thoughts on Gohan and videl?
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Also you could argue that Krillin brings out her more human side. Android 18 is the realist of the two and will always be straight with him. Though I do agree that the relationship could've benefited from seeing why they find connection in each other. Perhaps a look at their dates, downtime, and even their wedding.
I would say Gohan and Videl kind of works, but that's because their relationship is treated more like a background element, like with the other couples you see them interact more generally in a multitude of situations (Bulma went to Universe 6 Tournament, same with visiting Zamasu's future timeline, so she was around Vegeta, while Videl went to the Universe 6 Tournament, but Gohan didn't ), which makes Vegeta and Bulma feel a bit unnatural, wheres with Gohan/Videl I don't really feel the sensation that someone is trying to turn them into something they're not, so its a case of because [Gohan/Videl] are left alone, they don't really feel like they're breaking anything in the process.
PS I've been experiencing a surge in comments lately many of which requiring long answers, so that's why I've been a bit slow to respond.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I understand. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions. I wish you well and hope you have a good day.
2:14 Ya I agree one of the things I liked about the Goku Black Saga (my preference of name) were the character interactions between Trunks and the characters in the present particularly Gohan, young Trunks and Android 18 all stuff that would've stayed if they just brought him in for the tournament (though who'd I'd cut would be a difficult choice Frieza would be obvious but it was also fun to see if fight along side our group but not in a oh im reformed way)
@SkySlasher
I'd have to omit Frieza, because they had to bend the rules to allow him in anyway. Plus too much of his character revolved around "look at how evil he is" element.
The fact they revived Frieza who never showed inclination for training and improving because he was born powerful but didn't revive Cell who literally had saiyan DNA making him another fighting loving monkey to redeem is just evidence they don't give a damn about anything except banking on nostalgia and marketability.
Criminally underrated critique
@Bodega
Thanks, I appreciate the compliment
They actually changed his name back to Toppo in the English dub.
@NESS D BEST
Just out of curiosity when and in what media did they change it back: DVD, videogames, movie, etc?
I think it would have been cool if the idea you had of that immortal spirit of zamasu was attacking the z fighters and lile they had to go back to the present timeline and like learn the sword sealing thing from beerus lile how he did to old kai
@TheRealBaird YT
The sword sealing technique would have been an interesting inclusion slash callback to the original series, especially since future Trunks wields a sword.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I feel like it aldo ties a little into the mysticism element you mentioned in the video like maybe the sword sealing isn't quite a ki technique but more like a sorcery thing so goku and vegeta or whatever character would be doing this would be out of their element
Thank you for feeding my burning hatred for this disgrace that is Super, lol.
Also, as for Zamasu taking forever to kill all of mankind, it can be explained by saying that Zamasu and Goku Black wanted humanity to suffer so they can "pay for their sins". So that probably might be an explanation, even though I still hate Super.
Any thoughts?
@Agamemnon Returns
I'm happy to have done so. I will say your argument provides the best rationale for why Zamasu may have prolonged his plans, but to respond to that with his mindset of seeing mortals as a virus destroying something beautiful you'd think he'd want to eliminate them as fast as possible before they cause more devastation.
Yeah, you're right on that. If he really thinks of them as a virus that's eating away the earth, they would have done a lot more destruction than just turn a city into a damaged ghost town and leave out the rest of the earth
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 from 26:16 - 26:35, it actually kind of makes sense how Goku managed to overtake fused Zamasu. You have to remember that in the cell saga, Vegeta was weaker than Perfect cell. But with his final flash, Vegeta would have killed cell if the Android hadn't dodged at the last minute.
@Alphonse Johnson
To be fair Cell allowed Vegeta to charge up and didn't fight back, whereas Zamasu actively resisted, but yeah other than this that is a good argument.
Super supa it's really a disgrace to dragon ball amd then you have some dumb fans talking shit about the great iconic timeless classic that is GT just cause it's not canon who gives a fuck about what's canon and what's not canon GT is objectively a million times better than that disgrace called super supa so I take not canon dragon ball all life thank you very much .
This arc would've made sense if it was after ToP and Moro could've came after U6 arc.
I can definitely see that. Generally an evil parallel character will make more sense the later the release.
Without a thorough rewrite for all those arcs, it wouldn't change the quality of any of those arcs, particularly when the Moro Arc is founded on a huge plot hole anyway.
kill everyone then what ? lmao just dumb but he should be grateful zenny did it for him lmao
Goku black should have had a black hole kamehameha and the relationships in dragon ball arent bad
Thank you. You're part of the problem.
"UWUUUU ME LIKEY SILLY MOVES, UWUUUU ME NO LIKEY PLOT"
@@pascalsimioli6777 Only for super im like that since the anime is garbage also if anyone is the problem its you considering how you most likely dont even know the main theme of the show or anything about gokus character you rat
Goku’s depth
Goku values his strength because of the events of his life. After losing his parental figure to a “monster”, his helpessness created a will to grow more powerful to defend himself and those around him. He trains to push himself to new heights and defeats the greatest evil in the world, Piccolo, and is then effortlessly defeated by his brother Raditz, When he asks Krillin to spare Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, he does not out of morality, but out of curiosity of how far he can push himself. He calls himself selfish for this, but makes the choice anyways. This is the first step of Goku’s change as a person, Goku is pure of heart by the standards of the Kinto’un and yet he is innately flawed. His pure mindset is a both a blessing and a curse. He sees the best in people, he wants to be the best he can be, and he assumes that those around him should share his values. Goku puts his son into a situation that he didn’t realize Gohan wasn’t prepared for, and even gives Cell a senzu because hes so confident. Depsite his flaws, Goku is extremly self aware. Towards the end of the Cell Games, he sacrifices himself and apologies to Gohan for not making the best choices. He even chooses to say dead because he realizes that his existence has drawn seveal enemies to Earth, and during the Buu saga, he tries to give the mantle of Earth’s defender to Goten and Trunks that he cant fight all of the battles anymore, even if deep down he wants to. Goku literally abstained from fighting, the one thing he has dedicated his life to his son.
Kid Goku is a child all alone in the woods away from society and his lack of understanding of modern technology like cars which he describes as “monsters” is a result of his lack of indoctrination, speaking of indoctrination Kid Goku is a pretty great embodiment of curiosity, and freedom his curiosity is a result of his lack of teachings of subjects in modern society (lack of indoetrination), The flying nimbus is an magic yellow that Goku uses to transport those who have a pure heart are able to ride on the flying nimbus , clouds symbolize clear thinking and emotional purity these fit Goku well seeing how he is pure of heart and has strong set belifes on what is wrong or right, the nimbus also correlates to he freedom in the many way Goku is free is a set purpose or place
Identity crisis
Identity crisis is the questioning in ones own idenity, once Goku sees Raditz and Raditz unfolds the story to him and his friends about the saiyans their heritage and occupation and just on general how bad of people they are, Goku is quick to say that he isn’t a saiyan and that he is Son Goku from earth. This neglectance of identity isn’t surprising seeing how Goku and the sayians are opposites and have drastically different morals,
Goku’s self acceptance
Goku’s self acceptance coming from the realization that his saiyan heritage is something that can be used to good in the world to bring peace one might say the saiyan were ruthless and violent and ransacked peoples worlds to sell them when he accepts that’s he is indeed a sayian and tells Frieza he’s the super saiyan Son Goku, echoed through his speech “I am the light in the darkness” Goku here can be referring to himself the good out of the bad. The one good saiyan out of the many evil saiyans, Affect on world
Goku’s affect on his world is the affect on his friends who eventually became his enemies and the whole physical world, Goku in the cell saga knew that if he kept residing on earth his friends said everyone else would be in danger so it was convenient he could use transporting cell to the king kai’s place and also just leave earth for the sake of peace
In moral philosophy, deontological ethics or deontology is the normative ethical theory that morality of an action should be based on whether that action itself is right or wrong under a series of rules, rather than based in the consequences of the action, Goku has always kept this philosophy with him since a kid and this connects with his sacrifice great. Goku always had his morals over the consequences we can see this a lot with his interactions with vegetea ginyu and frieza, We saw many instances when Goku has put his morals above the consequences. For example, with his battle with Vegeta he could’ve killed Vegeta and bring peace. But he chose to let him alive because of his moral code and to fight him again. With Frieza he had the chance to kill him and yet he let him live becuase again he let his morals take over him and didn’t see the consequences
Battle stance
In saiyan saga goku and vegeta stance and position are contrast of each other. While Goku sgands below Vegeta showing that he is the low class warrior also shows his view on strength. Goku was always taught that there was always someone stronger than him while Vegeta was taught he was destined to be the strongest and Vegeta looking down shows that he believes that he is the strongest and his strength is complete. While Goku looking up shows how he believes that his strength us limitless and that there are others stronger than him. Both of their stance show how they were trained, Goku stance presents the turtle hermit school, they move low and find a weakness and strategies, Vegeta represent the elite saiyan training and how the fight full offensive seeing how both hands show are prepared to strike in showing his nature as a saiyan
Spirit bomb vs great ape
Goku and Vegeta main attacks contrast each other in the saiyan saga. The spirit bomb is said to take energy from your enviorment and goku being a saiyan yet denies his nature and stays with his nurture or his enviorment and it is also said that the spirit bomb is stronger when it absorbs the sun. Vegeta on the other hand uses his saiyan nature as his trump card which is great ape form and it is to be said to be powered up by the moon showing how goku symbolises the sun (being clear and self) while vegeta symbolize the moon (being a shadow and blocks the light) these two attacks symbolise their nature vs nature
Both Goku and Vegeta were confusion on who they were. Goku was in conflict with his saiyan nature and we can see him in conflict with his own morals and identity where he spares nappa out of the goodness of his hear (nurture) while he spares Vegeta because he wants to fight him again (nature). We can see more of this in his fight with Frieza and how he toys with him, says he’s going to kill him, and is drowning in anger (nature) he also speares him, gives him ki, lets him leave (nurture). Vegeta is going throught the same thing but is apposite as well. Vegeta is in conflict with his humanity and his saiyan nature. He can’t see to understand who he truly is which leads him to Majin Vegeta and Vegeta putting up a facade while deep down he isn’t him true self. He even goes to greater lengths and abandon his own mortality to gain strength. What’s great is that they were facing the person who had the biggest impact on them in their entire lives. Goku to frieza and vegeta to goku. Another is how it contast their nature vs nurture dynamic where vegeta was in conflict with his nurture while goku was in conflict with his nature
Nationalism vs patriroism
Vegeta and Goku ideology both contrast each other as well. Vegeta ideology being nationalism and Goku being patriotism shows how they both took pride and identified with their race. This difference is how they toke in reactions when they witness the flows of the saiyan race tries to deny it and live in this false ideology that they are the perfect warrior which would cause him to go majin vegeta (trying to return the status of the saiyan race which vegeta believes are the perfect warrior) What I love about this part of the dynamic is how it showed the difference of Goku and Vegeta in terms of being free. Goku believing that humanity can move forward hows how free goku is while vegeta can get over the past and is blind by it
Sacrifice
Goku and Vegeta sacrifice parallel each other perfectly. Both Goku and Vegeta desire caused more harm to the people they vared about that caused more good to themselves. We can see this with Vegeta and Buu and how Vegeta’s tubborness caused buu to be revived. For Goku was his actions with the red ribbon army and his desire to fight which caused more harm than good. Both Goku and Vegeta said similar thing when they were about to sacrifice themselves. We can’t beat him by fighting. I’ve been thinking and I can’t come up with any other way to leave the earth” Both of these showed that they were looking past fighting and showing that these sacrifice mean something other than any fighting tenchqiues. They even saw a reflection of themselves when fighting Buu and Cell. What’s ironic about these two sacrifices is that both enemies back which showed how it was never themselves to being with and that it was someone one. They both contraduct themselves, Goku ppannrd in to stay away from earth and leave it to the next generation but then chooses to come back and help Gohan. Vegeta when coming back after sacrifing himself fights the same way and contradicts himself again. Written by Anco.
Goku’s depth
Goku values his strength because of the events of his life. After losing his parental figure to a “monster”, his helpessness created a will to grow more powerful to defend himself and those around him. He trains to push himself to new heights and defeats the greatest evil in the world, Piccolo, and is then effortlessly defeated by his brother Raditz, When he asks Krillin to spare Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, he does not out of morality, but out of curiosity of how far he can push himself. He calls himself selfish for this, but makes the choice anyways. This is the first step of Goku’s change as a person, Goku is pure of heart by the standards of the Kinto’un and yet he is innately flawed. His pure mindset is a both a blessing and a curse. He sees the best in people, he wants to be the best he can be, and he assumes that those around him should share his values. Goku puts his son into a situation that he didn’t realize Gohan wasn’t prepared for, and even gives Cell a senzu because hes so confident. Depsite his flaws, Goku is extremly self aware. Towards the end of the Cell Games, he sacrifices himself and apologies to Gohan for not making the best choices. He even chooses to say dead because he realizes that his existence has drawn seveal enemies to Earth, and during the Buu saga, he tries to give the mantle of Earth’s defender to Goten and Trunks that he cant fight all of the battles anymore, even if deep down he wants to. Goku literally abstained from fighting, the one thing he has dedicated his life to his son.
Kid Goku is a child all alone in the woods away from society and his lack of understanding of modern technology like cars which he describes as “monsters” is a result of his lack of indoctrination, speaking of indoctrination Kid Goku is a pretty great embodiment of curiosity, and freedom his curiosity is a result of his lack of teachings of subjects in modern society (lack of indoetrination), The flying nimbus is an magic yellow that Goku uses to transport those who have a pure heart are able to ride on the flying nimbus , clouds symbolize clear thinking and emotional purity these fit Goku well seeing how he is pure of heart and has strong set belifes on what is wrong or right, the nimbus also correlates to he freedom in the many way Goku is free is a set purpose or place
Identity crisis
Identity crisis is the questioning in ones own idenity, once Goku sees Raditz and Raditz unfolds the story to him and his friends about the saiyans their heritage and occupation and just on general how bad of people they are, Goku is quick to say that he isn’t a saiyan and that he is Son Goku from earth. This neglectance of identity isn’t surprising seeing how Goku and the sayians are opposites and have drastically different morals,
Goku’s self acceptance
Goku’s self acceptance coming from the realization that his saiyan heritage is something that can be used to good in the world to bring peace one might say the saiyan were ruthless and violent and ransacked peoples worlds to sell them when he accepts that’s he is indeed a sayian and tells Frieza he’s the super saiyan Son Goku, echoed through his speech “I am the light in the darkness” Goku here can be referring to himself the good out of the bad. The one good saiyan out of the many evil saiyans, Affect on world
Goku’s affect on his world is the affect on his friends who eventually became his enemies and the whole physical world, Goku in the cell saga knew that if he kept residing on earth his friends said everyone else would be in danger so it was convenient he could use transporting cell to the king kai’s place and also just leave earth for the sake of peace
In moral philosophy, deontological ethics or deontology is the normative ethical theory that morality of an action should be based on whether that action itself is right or wrong under a series of rules, rather than based in the consequences of the action, Goku has always kept this philosophy with him since a kid and this connects with his sacrifice great. Goku always had his morals over the consequences we can see this a lot with his interactions with vegetea ginyu and frieza, We saw many instances when Goku has put his morals above the consequences. For example, with his battle with Vegeta he could’ve killed Vegeta and bring peace. But he chose to let him alive because of his moral code and to fight him again. With Frieza he had the chance to kill him and yet he let him live becuase again he let his morals take over him and didn’t see the consequences
Battle stance
In saiyan saga goku and vegeta stance and position are contrast of each other. While Goku sgands below Vegeta showing that he is the low class warrior also shows his view on strength. Goku was always taught that there was always someone stronger than him while Vegeta was taught he was destined to be the strongest and Vegeta looking down shows that he believes that he is the strongest and his strength is complete. While Goku looking up shows how he believes that his strength us limitless and that there are others stronger than him. Both of their stance show how they were trained, Goku stance presents the turtle hermit school, they move low and find a weakness and strategies, Vegeta represent the elite saiyan training and how the fight full offensive seeing how both hands show are prepared to strike in showing his nature as a saiyan
Spirit bomb vs great ape
Goku and Vegeta main attacks contrast each other in the saiyan saga. The spirit bomb is said to take energy from your enviorment and goku being a saiyan yet denies his nature and stays with his nurture or his enviorment and it is also said that the spirit bomb is stronger when it absorbs the sun. Vegeta on the other hand uses his saiyan nature as his trump card which is great ape form and it is to be said to be powered up by the moon showing how goku symbolises the sun (being clear and self) while vegeta symbolize the moon (being a shadow and blocks the light) these two attacks symbolise their nature vs nature
Both Goku and Vegeta were confusion on who they were. Goku was in conflict with his saiyan nature and we can see him in conflict with his own morals and identity where he spares nappa out of the goodness of his hear (nurture) while he spares Vegeta because he wants to fight him again (nature). We can see more of this in his fight with Frieza and how he toys with him, says he’s going to kill him, and is drowning in anger (nature) he also speares him, gives him ki, lets him leave (nurture). Vegeta is going throught the same thing but is apposite as well. Vegeta is in conflict with his humanity and his saiyan nature. He can’t see to understand who he truly is which leads him to Majin Vegeta and Vegeta putting up a facade while deep down he isn’t him true self. He even goes to greater lengths and abandon his own mortality to gain strength. What’s great is that they were facing the person who had the biggest impact on them in their entire lives. Goku to frieza and vegeta to goku. Another is how it contast their nature vs nurture dynamic where vegeta was in conflict with his nurture while goku was in conflict with his nature
Nationalism vs patriroism
Vegeta and Goku ideology both contrast each other as well. Vegeta ideology being nationalism and Goku being patriotism shows how they both took pride and identified with their race. This difference is how they toke in reactions when they witness the flows of the saiyan race tries to deny it and live in this false ideology that they are the perfect warrior which would cause him to go majin vegeta (trying to return the status of the saiyan race which vegeta believes are the perfect warrior) What I love about this part of the dynamic is how it showed the difference of Goku and Vegeta in terms of being free. Goku believing that humanity can move forward hows how free goku is while vegeta can get over the past and is blind by it
Sacrifice
Goku and Vegeta sacrifice parallel each other perfectly. Both Goku and Vegeta desire caused more harm to the people they vared about that caused more good to themselves. We can see this with Vegeta and Buu and how Vegeta’s tubborness caused buu to be revived. For Goku was his actions with the red ribbon army and his desire to fight which caused more harm than good. Both Goku and Vegeta said similar thing when they were about to sacrifice themselves. We can’t beat him by fighting. I’ve been thinking and I can’t come up with any other way to leave the earth” Both of these showed that they were looking past fighting and showing that these sacrifice mean something other than any fighting tenchqiues. They even saw a reflection of themselves when fighting Buu and Cell. What’s ironic about these two sacrifices is that both enemies back which showed how it was never themselves to being with and that it was someone one. They both contraduct themselves, Goku ppannrd in to stay away from earth and leave it to the next generation but then chooses to come back and help Gohan. Vegeta when coming back after sacrifing himself fights the same way and contradicts himself again. Written by Anco. @@pascalsimioli6777
Goku is a beloved character from the Dragon Ball franchise. He is often considered to be a one-dimensional character, but in reality, he is a complex and multi-faceted character. Goku’s character development is a result of his upbringing, his relationships with other characters, and his experiences throughout the series.
In the Dragon Ball era, Goku lived in Mount Paozu, where he hunted and had a shed containing his most cherished possession - The four-star ball. The ball was his memento for Gohan, and because Grandpa Gohan was the one who raised and loved him, Goku cherished the ball more than anything else at the time. Goku was also shown talking to the ball, which showed he believed in reincarnation, which he must’ve learned from Gohan before his death. Bulma shows up to Goku’s location and introduces herself to him, Goku’s interaction with Bulma was the first of many scenes that showcased Goku’s little knowledge of the world and how he only knew as much as his deceased Grandpa Gohan taught him, and not by what he’s actually seen, which is why he couldn’t tell what most things were by mere sight alone and seemed oblivious to the world. He couldn’t tell Bulma was a girl until she told him and was later shown to be surprised by the features of a girl. Bulma explained to Goku about the Dragon Balls and how his grandpa’s ball was one of them, Goku wasn’t interested in exploring the world, but Bulma mentioned how Gohan informed Goku to treat girls with respect, which led to Goku deciding to join Bulma. This scene showcases a key side of Goku.
His desire to honor Grandpa Gohan, a side that influenced his later actions in the series. Although he treats girls nicely, Goku didn’t have any romantic interest in girls. Goku was indifferent about beauty in women. He viewed all girls equally in terms of beauty because he didn’t have any human feelings to guide him to the human idea of beauty. He only found them stranger than men because of their features in comparison. This is a result of what Goku was used to growing up with only his Grandpa as well as his genetics (which we’ll get to later). This was shown in scenes such as when Master Roshi showed him two girls with Goku not being able to tell which one was beautiful, and when Goku brought back a huge and not so attractive woman when Roshi told him to bring back a pretty woman. Goku’s training with Krillin - the rival turned best friend through the bond they shared during the training, under the teachings of Master Roshi, which was reflected through the World Tournament itself, was what molded Goku into the fighter he grew up to be. Master Roshi taught Goku that there’s always someone better and that he shouldn’t be seduced by the adulation or status that comes with pursuing Martial Arts but rather see events such the World Tournament (and in turn the goals that inspired him and others to become martial artists) as only a checkpoint to evaluate his growth as a fighter, but not substantiate it. That there is no greatest and that the true value in working is the work itself and one should work purely to improve themselves, which worked perfectly in conjunction with Goku’s own purity
@@pascalsimioli6777
Characterisation
The way Cell sees himself as perfect mentally and physically stops him from seeing his imperfections. Such as him having wings, these wings don’t cause flight or advantage for Cell they are only weighing him down. On the surface Cell is viewed as a calm, collective and patient being. This is obviously not the case, he is very narcissistic and mentally distorted because of his “perfection” he thinks he’s superior to everyone and he must let everyone know. This narcissim is the reason he has to let everyone know he has “enough ki to destroy solar system” or that he gonna explode the earth. Cell desperately want to be victorious. In Cell’s first form he resemles an insect mostly because of ominous eyes and weird beak mouth. This is important because an insect is a symbol of greed and senusal pleasure. First from Cell obviously sucking life energy from others (greed). After Cell managed to absorb Android 17 he transformed into his semi Perfect form, this made him look more human like. This shows how he’s becoming more refined and closer to perfection. In Cell’s final form we see him with purple irises this has strong symbolisation of pride and ego, but most importantly royalty this having the obvious to Cell viewing himself above others
Hypocrisy
Parallels with Gohan
Cell is the old generation of fighters he is a combination of all the z fighters apart from the young members. So when Gohan beats Cell this is him surpassing the old generation. Conversely, this doesn’t mean Cell isn’t apart of the new generation. He also achieved much more than the old generation of artifical androids. It’s out with the old and in the new. Gohan was held captive from the very beginning against Raditz. He was also held captive by his feelings of inadequacy it took Gohan emotions to overflow for him to espeace thid barrier. Gohan then changes to this cocky and arrogant person as his role models were
Cell is the physical form of purpose fusing with desire, his desire to become perfect, fusing with his purpose to become perfect, this combination causes him to reach perfection, even when he is nearly killed by Vegeta when is overpowered by him, the law of purpose and desire acts on the scenario and Vegeta’s desire loses to Cell’s purpose, unless in the face of equal purpose and desire
Cell views saiyans as dumb beings this is seen “I will never understand the way of these saiyans. This is because of how they will fight dependently and seek help leading them to misinterpet the situation. However we see Cell going power mad and overconfident leading to his failure. Another occurrence of cells hypocritical self is when he implies that children can be such a bother yet he goes through all the trouble of making some to kill the zfighters
How he highlights the z fighters imperfections
For Krillin we see his regret and guilt for not killing Android 18. His love towards Android 18 led Cell be coming perfect. As Ce transforms Trunks has thoughts about his timeline emphasising his anixety this is Trunks imperfection and self doubt (something the new generation carried) but after this we see Cell overreact in a irrational way as Trunks does. Cell on purposely used Vegeta flaws against him, his ego got the best of him. Cell then later let’s the z fighters get stronger as he waits while preparing the Cell Games wanting to test his new power like Vegeta but also fall. Gohan sees him self as weak and has feelings of inadequacy, while Cell sees himself as all power and has a huge ego@@pascalsimioli6777
Also super sayain lost its mystique a long time ago in the original series so I honestly don't get that complaint. That's honestly why I like the series every opponent is stronger so you better keep reaching new heights if you want to meet that challenge. In real life as well the guns or weapons of the past like the ones we use in civil war or spears were interesting weapons that set the standard but we can't keep using them since the enemies kept getting stronger with weapons of their own. That's how I view super sayain
I've actually addressed super saiyan losing its near divine like status multiple times, but those instances were insignificant compared to what Dragon Ball Super did to it and I generally felt there was some payoff for when Z did it. I don't think the half saiyans (or even Vegeta for that matter) should have awakened the transformation, but that price was well worth the cost if it meant having Gohan go Super Saiyan 2. I didn't like the idea of SS2 being surpassed, but the Super Saiyan 3 transformation sequence was so great, that it justifies its existence. Whereas with the transformations of DBS, had no worthy payoff, the closest would be ultra instinct or Blue Kaio-ken. It was the idea behind super saiyan that made it great not the fact that it bolstered the user's power.
Responding to your other comment I am aware that blue is basically a hybrid transformation, but more recently I feel that its just become super saiyan 5 instead, in chapter 50 of Super , Goku had his energy siphoned away while in the blue state and he regressed back to super saiyan 3, instead the god or original super saiyan form, which makes Super Saiyan Blue seem more of like a tiered transformation than combination of the two.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 understandable i disagree but very valid reply
Every Shonen has stronger opponents, you like something that isn't a DragonBall uniqueness. The difference is that DragonBall goes for vertical scaling (bigger numbers beat smaller numbers) while other (good) Shonen go for horizontal scaling (JoJo is always a puzzle between stand abilities and how they interact). Vertical scaling has a limit when you finish every gradient of hair color.
Watching this made me think why did they pick Mai as Trunks lover it would have been much funnier if it was Videl further cementing trunks role of taking up Gohans role
@Neo Sitrin
I support that idea, it would've made returning to the past all the more amusing.
Regression can be great when done well. Goku Black breaking Trunks was done well. The rest was not.
zamasu feels like a worse Thanos tbh. I know that sounds cringey or whatever but think. A Super strong person in a godlike position who thinks mortals are flawed uses wish granting stones to complete his goal while the heroes try and fail to defeat them at fullpower. Then, after their goal is complete destroy the stones and are only saved due to a deus ex machina clean reset.
I think Thanos is done much better however cause; he has reasons for his actions, the lack of resources to population; and has flaws, his god complex and ego. That and he actually completes his task with the wish granting stones rather than do inefficient wishes, and wasting time killing people individually.
@Pimpcat Forthelols
I see what you mean and it's fine. The archetype and rationale worked much better for Thanos; Zamasu needed far more exposition than what he received.
After this video I will never watch a single scene of this awful arc ever again .
"The only conflict color pink and blue can be use for is a gender battle and the pink user being a male it cant even applied to that" LMAO
Very good video. I would like to see you compare GT and Super. Both are bad for an equal amount of similar and different reasons.
@TheBuddah
Thanks, that's a video I strongly considered in the past, but ultimately withdrew since as a channel I didn't just want to be tied to only one series and at the time I felt like I just uploaded too many Dragon Ball related videos, but yeah since I've got more content variety now, I will say that's an idea I'm willing to return to in the future, but I do have other projects I want to work on first.
3:20
Bulmas haircolor has always been fluctuating between blue and purple. This has been ever since the very beginning. Sure its weird that kid trunks is diffrent from future trunks, but whatchagonnado *shrug*
18:00
You can say about "the potential" all you want - but none of your ideas for Zamasu is good either.
It is maybe slightly less bad than what've we got.
Zamasu is the failure beyond repair strarting from it's basis.
There was small references where Vegeta was teaching Trunks the galick gun.
Was that when Trunks fought Vegeta while in the Super Saiyan Grade 3 (bulked up) state?
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 In the transition cards, Vegeta was demonstrating it to him.
@Skeptic Autopsy
Cool, thanks for responding.
And also, Toriama totally ripped off Toyble's Xicor and his version of West Supreme Kai.
Xicor: A kai and Goku/ saiyan hybrid that's evil and want's to kill Goku.
WSK: A Kai turned evil and wanting to rule over the universe.
You cannot tell me that Xicor and Goku Black aren't the same character, except that Xicor is WAY better.
@Sawdog 2000
I've honestly been under the suspicion for a while that as a sort of Tom Sawyeresque joke Toriyama intentionally sabotaged Super by giving the fans what they wanted, but doing it in a way that they would hate it. People wanted female saiyans, but then writes them as obnoxiously as possible; people wanted more Vegito, then the Potara earring fusion suddenly became a temporary fusion, so it lost all of its significance. So considering the fact that you thought Xicor was a good character, I wouldn't be surprised if Toriyama jokingly wrote an inferior version as a sort of prank.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 If that is the case, I honestly have no more hope for the series to continue than I already did.
Pranks are funny yes, but going that far is insane. If he and all the writers did do all that what you said, they must be spiteful as fuck!
Thanks for calling out the garbage that is this arc. This is the worst arc in all of Dragon Ball. Also while I am a bit annoyed that the dub changed Toppo to Top, I don't mind it that much. Dub is my preference for Dragon Ball
@tippy1731
You're welcome and I I too prefer the Dub over Sub in regards to Dragon Ball.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Reason why I perfer the dub is because the voices fit the characters better then in the sub. While I respect Masoko, she is mis casted as Adult Goku, Adult Gohan, Adult Goten, and Bardock. The voices for the dub felt the characters way better and sound more natural. The only bad Funimation dub was the OG Z dub. The rest of the dubs ranges from good (GT, the Z movies, and OG DB) to god tier (Kai and Super).
Agree not a fan of mai being here. Like her design as we finally got her as a grown up again (hate the forced pliaf gang as kids bullsh$t. Gt versions much better) though I feel like if Mai gonna be here then I say have her as like a just a friend of trunks, since we’ll trunks only friend before her gohan is f$cking dead and that Mai could be a great way for trunks to have a new friend to trust and hang with again after all the emotional sh$t he went through
i thinkt he color theory here is kind of irrelevant but you make some interesting points. Pink can be evil
@Sora Bell
With me I view color theory as relevant because its misuse bolsters the criticism of pointless transformations: Super Saiyan 2's spikier appearance promotes a wilder, more aggressive image, while 3's grown out hair sends a message that one pulls out something deeper from themselves, whereas the color swaps just seem like a random powerup without any relation to established story. By the way I appreciate you complimenting my points in regards to this topic.
Well this arc makes more sense than heroes
The db heroes manga is good. It’s a bit violent like Z.
I used to be a big fan of Dragon Ball I cannot stand to watch one episode of Dragon Ball super that's how bad it sucks they completely destroyed a franchise
@Bruno Ramos
For me I really view Super as its own thing rather than a continuation of the original series.
Correction it's the zero ningen aka humans plan not mortals plan.
Deities are mortal to in Dragon Ball.
Zamazu is just Dragon Ball AF evil Western Supreme Kai.
Black is Xicor, also known as Zaiko, is the main antagonist of DBAF.
All of Super is just DB fanfiction done worst.
@NeoGamest123 Logic
In my version (as well as with the wiki) the translation referred to it as the "Zero Mortals Plan"; you're right and they're wrong, but for coherency's sake slash to keep everyone on the same page, I remained with that translation. I appreciate you further articulating on this topic, I remember someone else mentioning Zamasu's similarities to Xicor and I agree with your overall thoughts on DBS.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 How can it be 0 mortals plan when the Kai themselves are mortal as well.
The obsession with humans in this Particular arc is quite blatant and clear.
What the opposite of mortal is immortal.
None of the deity are immortal just to be clear.
They have to wish for it.
Ningen is most certainly not mortal.
Japanese for mortal is 定命の
Jōmyō no.
The Japanese word for immortal is 不滅の
Fumetsu no
Japanese word for human is 人間
Ningen.
It's well known that Funimation makes certain changes to anime when "localizing" anime for the west.
The dub can be pretty awful and misleading at times.
Since DB been very beneficial to them in the past they decided to save it even if it's terrible.
DBS is blatant low tier anime trash which is quite noticeable.
Toriyama never said SSJ is surpassing SSJ2 or SSJ3 in multiplier...
In an interview with Saikyo Jump from June 2014, he stated SS2 & SS3 were nothing more than powered up variations of the super saiyan form, and it would be more beneficial for Goku to focus on his base and super saiyan form as it would sap less strength and raise his level more.
Here's a link to the article and the specific point I'm referring to is the second to last question.
www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/saikyo-jump-june-2014-issue-twel-buu-mysteries/
PS I haven't listened to this video in a while, so I admit may not have worded it the right way.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Toriyama Literally said "...Goku realized that mastering his normal state and Super Saiyan would raise his level more and sap less strength...", that means that his Overall Power Grows("Normal state"-base and Super Saiyan), he never stated the SSJ multiplier is gonna grow or that it's multiplier will surpass that of Super Saiyan 2 or Super Saiyan 3
@@near3394 Except he'd already clearly grown his base power dramatically in the arcs long after attaining SSJ and had mastered the latter in the Room of Spirit and Time, not to mention the context of referring to SS2 and SS3's faults prior, so Toriyama's statement would've been redundant if only talking about rehashing what had already been done.
The manga version of this arc is much better than the anime version it's not good but it's better than the anime version cause trunks being that powerful without a reason and the sword of hope was so dumb and nonsensical that it's sad .
Plus zamasu should have take gohan body . Imagine future trunks seeing his best friend who taught him how to fight and survive being that evil .
All of them!
You can thank me for saving 1 hour of your time leaving a like under my comment!
?
90% of the filler scenes on Z are good or great so .
Zam was the one antagonist that destroyed an entire timeline. So...he won.
But he still trash so ... who cares .
I mean, he got erased and mortals are still everywhere. He ultimately only succeeded in fucking over Trunks. If that really equals a win in your eyes then I don't think we're going to agree on anything when it comes to Dragon Ball.
@@Daxinar Imagine defending like that a poorly written villain
I can imagine it. Zamasu got over big for whatever reason. No offense to any marks of his but I can't stand the guy.
@@Daxinar I like him esthetically but damn he's so poorly written and the super goku black saga as a whole is an insult to any db fan plus I kinda despise db post 2000s .
I agree with the rosé transformation being wrong for goku black but I gotta say that it looks stylish nonetheless haha .
Uh when goku used super saiyan 3 against trunks he was really just putting i on a show showing trunks the next level of power.
Depends whether you're referring to the anime or manga. In the anime, perhaps, but I wouldn't call it "putting on a show" when Trunks showed himself to be a genuine challenge when both were in SS2. In the manga, Vegeta confirms that Trunks' SS2 at full power is comparable to SS3 Goku.
@@choueriito2548lmao supers scaling is boo boo
1:02:30 I miss launch
His mic's power level is definitely under 9000.
The sad and funny thing is that a lot of
" fans" of dragon ball really thinks that this arc is the the best on super while it's the worst I mean it's not like the other arcs of super are better haha even the new ones on the manga are really laughable with moro and the cerelians and the granolah bar hahaha but damn this is even worse .
Idc trunks was my favorite arc
Imagine some dumb fans complaining about ssj4 gogeta defusing that have berth to one of the greatest scenes ever in dragon ball where Kid Goku does the universal genkidama .
9:25 describes every Naruto fight in a nutshell
Trunks being the lone hero funny enough goes against how the point of the Buu arc is Goku realizing that its a group effort and working together together is always going to surpass going alone.
“Getting powered up by rage is poor storytelling”? Didn’t Goku get Super Saiyan through rage?
@harrisoncora4259
I wrote this video several years back, so I could be misremembering, but I think the context was rage acting as a convenient get out of jail free card to match Zamasu/Black's strength, whereas at the time Super Saiyan rubbed off as a transcendent divine state (not just a power-up). Even consider that Goku didn't let rage consume him against Frieza. Super Saiyan emerges from desperation and being pushed to the limit: Kaioken/Spirit bmb failed and the presumed loss of Dragon Balls; Krillin's death merely served as the straw that broke the camel's back.
Watching your great video is making me realize that this arc is the worst thing ever done in all of dragon ball alongside the last movie tho .
Also super sayain blue is not a super saiyan 5 at all. It's more of a hybrid transformation
more like a recolor hybrid transformation
Color palette swap more like
- Bulma created a machine that can TRAVEL THROUGH TIME but her creating a bullet that can hurt strong people is unbelievable? Ive seen ssj goku get hurt by a rock
- Piccolo jr was able to deflect the mafuba because he knew the technique and prepared for it, since thats how they trapped his father before,. How in the heck was Zamasu supposed to counter it without prior knowledge? And yeah trunks learned it quickly but so what? Took roshi 50 years to create the kamehameha and goku learned it in 2 minutes just by seeing it once.
The fact that I can only hear this in my left ear is still better than dragon ball super
@@goofyahhprod I was watching this with headphones earlier too, I had bluetooth headphones. I recommend getting blue tooth headphones because the wires dont break
To be honest it's better to pretend that super never happened just like season 9 for scrubs I mean there's only 8 seasons on scrubs right? Yup .
Super future trunks saga is so dumb stupid and nonsensical that they should have called it the mindfuck arc that doesn't makes any sense with future trunks and an evil goku but that would have sound bad haha .
Oh my god the scene with goten and chichi is so wrong 😫.
Plus goku black should he called Evil Goku or negative goku I mean why the fuck they named him goku " black" haha . I repeat it and I will repeat it forever they should have not made super or at least they should have made it decently . For me and many others even if it's not canon Gt is the real sequel to Z .
1:16:35
It looks like they've tried to play it as safe as possible for the sake of incorporating Potara fanservice anywhere they want.
They've just builded up a fanservice usage.
But imagine the outrage if Vegetto was incorporated into ToP and he would've became unfused right in the fight. That would've been called the biggest writting axpulls possible.
Or Kefla for example.
But on a second thought - NONE OF THAT HAPPENED IN TOP EVER!
KEFLA WASN'T DEFUSED BY A TIME LIMIT AND VEGETTO WASN'T EVEN USED!
THIS RETCON WAS COMPLETELY USELESS FOR A SERIES' FUTURE!
THE ONLY THING IT DONE IS RUINED VEGETTO IN THIS ARC, RUINED POTARAS IN THIS ARC - AND NOTHING ELSE.
For real Frieza now can turn Golden and gain immortality off screen haha .
My god universe 6 sayians are just trash . No comment about those 3 awful characters.
Dude colors really arent that binary, is Japanese not some arthurian fanfic. I also dont think he calls himself goku black, i think he gets called that by trunks and co.
Plus the animation in this arc is really awful 😖 😱 . At least the universal survival saga have a lot of well animated scenes .
bro forgot about Planet Potafeu smh
Im sorry but the copy vegeta arc was the worst arc
Universe 6 is the worse arc
No, the granolah arc was the worst. Spoilers!! Now people can use the Dragon Balls to become the strongest in the universe. Ultra ego Vegeta was hyped up to be Vegeta's ultimate transformation, because the more damage he takes the more powerful he becomes, even implying the Vegeta is ascending to the realm of a God of destruction. Unfortunately, super dropped the ball and Vegeta NEVER won a single fight in that form. Ultra Instinct was retconed, at first, to even access Ultra Instinct you needed a clear mind and to let your instincts do the fighting for you, now goku can access Ultra Instinct while having emotions like anger, and it's even called true Ultra instinct, and Goku didn't even win a single battle. And then there's black frieza. Overall this arc was so bad that it makes the universe 6 Arc and the future Trunk Saga more tolerable.
I'd argue it's the best arc in the Super anime. It's not saying much but I'll give it that.
Come on guys relax they're all trash ass arcs in the end no need to fight about it 💀.
And don't even get me started with the worst dragon ball movie ever aka tha super new broly movie that is so awful that makes look a shitty movie like resurrection of f like a masterpiece .
Gogeta vs Broly was good though. The rest is trash.
@@missxmarvel Well Emma some of the fight was good not all the fight tho some scenes with gogeta doing flashy moves were animated well and it was good to see him beat the shit out of that mentally ill big saiyan .
@@BinoFelixNinoNarcPeppino I wished he got clapped with the Kamehameha. That would make the movie better.
@@missxmarvel I wish they didn't made a new broly but instead they brought back the og broly even if it was impossible but hey who givesa fuck why not bringing back the most badass non canon villain ever seen on db .
When you make GT look good in comparison, a series fans and even Toriyama acknowledged as non canon before Super released, you know something went very wrong.
@Bionicle Prime
On that note a recurring comment I've heard from people referring to Dragon Ball Super is that the only positive that came from it regards how it elevated GT in comparison.
Bionicle prime you clearly never saw the iconic timeless classic full of heart emotions amd passion that is GT 💀🤦🏻♂️ fucking dumbass clown 🤡 you're probably one of those " Dragon ball stans" that thinks that super is better than GT and that clearly has never seen GT cause bitch please ssj4 alone as a form/transformation is better than super supa as a whole and you think otherwise you're clearly out of your fucking mind so please never ever compare super supa to the great GT and honestly you might as well stop being a dragon ball fan or stan cause you don't deserve to be one cause having a personal and subjective opinion is one thing but to talk about GT like it's some trash ass piece of shit series like super supa is is objectively wrong so you're objectively wrong and your so called " personal and subjective opinion" in this case doesn't even count . Plus what's up with your nonsense " if it's not canon then it sucks" argument? Suoer supa it's canon right? Too bad cause it's trash meanwhile GT it's not canon right ? Well who gives a fuck about canon or not canon GT is a million times better than Super supa and that's facts and it's the perfet sequel to Z cause it follows up perfectly after the end of Z so please shut the fuck up dude and go jerk off to that trash canon shit called super supa that you love so dearly just cause it's canon 🤦🏻♂️💀 not even a 10 yo fan would have that retarded mindset of " if it's canon it's good if it's not canon it's bad" my god go get some help dude I'm serious I legitimately feel bad and sorry for you and your ignorance and stupidity on judging dragon ball . So your nonsense comment it's easily one of the dumbest and most wrong comments ever made in youtube history so congratulations for being an ignorant and stupid immature fan of dragon ball like many others now go watch super supa and leave the real dragon ball like GT and Z to us real fans and stans of the great Dragon ball . I know I may have been to harsh on you little kid but sometimes little dumb kids need to learn a lesson or more and with your nonsense stupid canon not canon mindset/mentality it's like you asked for it so don't get offended 😉 but you needed a verbal ass whooping like this . Goodbye . Plus GT IS OBJECTIVELY GOOD and not just in comparison to super supa but as a series alone so please little kid think before writing some bullshit nonsense illogical comments on youtube cause when you say some stupid ass nonsense shit like that you know you done something very wrong . Nobody gives a fucl bout canon or not canon cause GT it's not canon and yet is objectively a million times better than that canon disgrace called super supa and you can't say otherwise so either accept it or shut up . Plus what fans acknowledge GT as not canon ? You can only talk about yourself little kid you don't know shit about what other fans think cause guess what there are probably way more GT stans than super supa stans and there are way more dragon ball fans that rightfully like or love GT and hate or dislike that disgrace called super supa .
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 Well dude don't take this the wrong way cause I really like you and your channel but GT has always been great for many reasons and sure it has a lot of flaws but to be honest GT has so much heart passion and emotions in him that it overcomes those many flaws and makes GT the objectively iconic timeless emotional classic that it is and that it always will be plus the " fans " that say shit like that probably never watched GT as a whole and probably only watched super supa and probably has never seen the original db and Z as a whole so basically just some irrelevant and wrong personal opinions of a bunch of fake fans that only watched that trash series called super and that doesn't know shit about the real dragon ball like the og seriesZ GT and all the amazing movies of the 80s and 90s so who cares about them plus just the ssj4 form alone it's better than a million super supa arcs combined so who cares plus only some dumb kids can have that " if it's canon it's good if it's not canon it's bad" mentality/mindset let's be honest lmao that's why to me and many others real fans of db the only sequel to Z that matters and that counts it's GT even if it's not canon unlike that awful super supa canon shit . Plus GT doesn't need super supa to be elevated in comparison cause GT is objectively a million times better than 10000 arcs of super supa so that's it .
@Bino Felix Nino and Narc
Regarding the prior comment in my defense I'm taking a third person perspective of the situation (what others/the community think) rather than expressing my own sentiments. I try my best to acknowledge all commenter's comments, but at the same time I wish to avoid the potentiality of being lured into paragraph long responses, so many times I reply with a more neutral response to dodge such predicaments. By the way I'm grateful that you enjoy me and my content. On that note with many other videos I've gone out of my way to praise filler/non-canon material.
@@lonelyboyadventurer1033 I kinda hate the term " filler" cause filler episodes makes an anime great and that's why I hate dragon ball kai cause imagine dragon ball z without all the fillers episodes and scenes it would still be a classic sure but imagine a dragon ball like that where they only fight and fight and fight and that's it and I bet you would surprised about this but some "fans" of dragon ball prefers kai over the original Z and I mean I can get it if they like it more for the dub but otherwise the og Z it's Z that's it plus a version that cuts more than 100 episodes and turns Z into a constant fight it's blasphemy cause the filler episodes makes the story and the characters a million times better and that goes for og db and GT too meanwhile to be honest super filler episodes are awful but that's obvious cause super itself it's a disgrace to dragon ball so of course the filler episodes sucks too aside for some good filler episodes tho but the point I'm trying to make is that kai is probably even more of a disgrace to dragon ball than super cause at least super is something new meanwhile kai takes OG Z and turns it into a trash ass piece of shit cut version of Z where they only fight and fight and fight that's why I find kai to be even worse than super . In the end filler episodes are essential to an anime cause without the filler episodes and scenes an anime would lost his soul and heart imo that's why I consider kai even more of a disgrace than super cause having such arrogance to cut some og Z scenes it's just blasphemy to me and many others .
Wtf EVER this the BEST ARC is this worse than purple vegeta? GTFOH LOL