The rabbi made, for me, one of the strongest points. Those who are sure they are right are the keenest to hear opposing ideas, because they are confident that the facts are for them. It is, by contrast, those who are least sure they are right who are keenest to shut down debate.
@@philipbrown2086 I very much agree, and you see this play out pretty apparently in debates like this. When you have, in my opinion, one side that totally outclasses the other, there is a huge difference in the demeanor of the two groups. These two were a very good example, simply looking at things as simple as their cadence of speech, posture, and hand gestures. There is an element of unease, that i hope im not just projecting on them, but seems relatively obvious. This same type of thing plays out when you watch a young student or protestor attempt to debate Jordan Peterson. They yell and scream and flail their arms to, in my opinion, distract from the weakness, even they see, in their own positions. Its like a form of cognitive dissonance that produces extreme anxiety, which then manifests as mental defense and physical aggressiveness.
lol I was so confused by that... Nothing has changed in 500 years..???? So if that idiot was sent back to the 16th century things would be the same for him? The world has changed more in just the last 100 years then it had in the entire previous 10 000 years, the quality of life is so many magnitudes better in 1st world countries then it was 100 years ago, for fucking every person living in it. This guys mad that racism still exists, his ancestors from the early 1900s were dealing with a lot fucking worse then his sad story of not being able to wear jeans :'( Not to mention a million ways to die that wouldn't even keep you home from work in todays world. Go back the 17th century then bud, and enjoy 40% of your children dying from infection, disease and everything else long before ever reaching adulthood.
My brain just turns off when someone starts with, "As a (insert race, gender, sexuality group identity), I feel..." None of that matters to your argument. Either you have good ideas or bad ideas, your group identity is inconsequential to the merit of your ideas.
Johan Doah I really disagree with that statements. People in the minorites experience things in society then people who aren’t this is just fact. And I believe as a human we should be able to hear from different perspectives whether we are in the racial minority or sexual because they have experiences that might be different then yours so listen, asses and then form your opinion
@@amalnasser4118 You can have all the experiences unique to you that you want...and I am happy to hear your personal experiences, but when someone wants to use that to push policy on me and strip me of my rights, please forgive me for not just rolling over and giving them up. Your personal experience does not make your ideas good or bad, they are good or bad on their own merits period.
John doah of-course my personal experiences is not categorize into right or wrong there just experiences from my point of view in a minority I understand your point I do no should impose anything in any way to infringe on your rights. And no please don’t apologize you have every right with disagreeing on my points I’m not asking to agree with everything all I need if for something to listen. Thank you for your comment.
@@amalnasser4118 It's not a "fact" at all. While being black might be different than being white, we are both Americans in the same society with the same basic rights. What we choose to do with any opportunities that we are presented, or that we create, is up to us as individuals. If you think the world owes you something, then you'll be in for a rough ride as an adult when people rightly tell you to "Grow up." Also, this preposterous idea that as a human being I can't possibly comprehend what it's like to be another human being is patently false. Empathy, sympathy, and our sense of fairness are built upon our ability to see things from a different perspective. It's foundational to any interactions you have with other people, and if you are lacking it, you're a psychopath. Intersectionality is about nothing but power, and trying to gain it over others. It is not based on any science, and we should all reject it completely.
@Andrea MENDENHALL I expect the proper word for it would be anguish. He was not trying to say that ideas were imparting physical violence. I remember once I observed a social studies class in a high school. The students were learning about some of the most horrific experiences suffered by ancient people after a conquest and it was all matter of fact. We do expect our children to absorb a lot and be thick skinned about it.
@Andrea MENDENHALL I wasn’t thrown in the deep end when I learned to swim. I was taught how to swim gradually but I became a very strong swimmer. There is more than one way to skin a cat.
People who have actually experienced discrimination are much more calibrated than that. What sets him apart is not his ethnicity, but that he's never been expected to show any resilience. I think that's exactly Jonathan's point in the Coddling of the American Mind.
@@disnotesfoyou And that's why you start out at kindergarten, elementary school and work your way up. You're eased into adult things. Just like your swimming. Nobody thrown in the deep end. What you're saying is like the US champion 100m backstroke complaining about being thrown in the deep end at the Olympics.
I don't understand what is wrong with teaching European history in a European university or what is wrong with having pictures of old European men on the walls of a European University? Kehinde Andrews says that with disgust as if it's a bad thing. We need to wake up to this and call it what it is, racist. He's speaking in disgust about the University as if there is anything wrong there.
I think he has an issue with the British curriculum in which empire and slavery was never taught. History went from the classics, to the middle ages and Tudors, to the enlightenment, and then to WW1 and WW2. That's pretty effed up as we have an idealised/imagined sense of national history. And unfortunately explains a lot about the current crop of political leaders and ethno-nationalist rhetoric that is creeping into the mainstream
I've been a soft-core liberal by the nature of my age (30) and geographic location (liberal state) not until I met my husband whose an economic conservative and socially liberal and we would have these huge quarrels in the beginning about various societal issues. Most of the times it'd end with me feeling emotionally overwhelmed and stating "enough, I don't want to hear you anymore" but internally knowing he has had the upper points and I was simply arguing on "borrowed problems" identified by the left like women inequality, racism (I'm Asian from 1st generation immigrants),etc. After having this awareness I started my exploration into the "other side" to see if I could be convinced or not and a good way to test how secured and solid my grounds are as a leftist endorser. Long story short, the so-called "conservatives" won me over in pretty much all political debates by their well researched facts, in depth analysis and ability to pose hard intellectual questions on problems which they themselves might not have answer to but the left often conveniently toss it under the umbrella of 'racism, gender, capitalism, etc.' and these are the evil of society. They are so superficial on their solution, rudimentary in their thinking, and loud on their virtues signaling. I'm still waiting for the day where both sides have equal weight in their claims and which I'm actually torn between the two but for now the scale continues to tip right.
Wow, it's truly fascinating to see these two ideologies go head to head in a civil environment in which neither side went ballistic and started shouting their beliefs rather than listen to other's ideas. I have to say though, that even hearing both of these sides, I disagree most with the people who are physically and politically on the left. Now don't get me wrong, I disagree with some things the gentlemen on the right said, but overall they seemed the most reasonable in their arguments and provided some possible solutions and causes to the issues discussed. That being said though, it seems where these people disagree is when it comes to responsibility and blame. The men on the right want people to look inward at their problems and take responsibility for their own lives and how they respond to adversity. They don't want people to dilute themselves into believing they are powerless and there's this invisible force keeping them down. They acknowledge that human beings are flawed and that you can't control every aspect of your life or what other people can and can't do or say, only how you respond to it. Meanwhile, the people on the left are arguing that someone else is at fault, and that someone else is making their lives miserable, and that someone else needs to fix it. They keep circling back to this idea that people are trying to hurt you and keep you down simply because of your gender, skin color, orientation, etc. Yet they don't seem to understand that the main reason they're seeing these sort of "microaggresions" everywhere is because they're looking for them. When you are of the mindset that someone is trying to hurt you in some way, whether that's physically or emotionally, you will see everything they do as an attack on you. It's a mindset that breeds paranoia, and distrust, and that's why they were talking about how people need to stop talking about racism and misogyny and all that, not to silence those who actually suffer, but to dissuade people into thinking they're victims and can't do anything about the problems in their lives because something else is in the way. They aren't trying to invalidate anyone, they're trying to encourage people to find realistic solutions to their own problems. Because I think that that is a genuine problem in our society, is that people usually want to have someone to blame, and want someone else to fix their problems, when sometimes, the problem lies within themselves, and so to there is the solution. Now that doesn't mean that every problem in your life is your fault, or that every problem you have can be solved by you alone, but it's important to have a sort of self-awarness in my opinion, to be able to recognize when a problem you have is your own fault, and when it's not, and when it is, it's important to be able to take responsibility and fix it yourself, because blaming others does nothing to fix the problem. Also, I am just baffled by Andrews. Like, what reality does he live in??? He acts as if nothing's changed and no progress has been made since the 1960's! Like, Johnathan even pointed out how much progress we've made as a society and he doesn't even comment on it! Dude, what reality are you living in??? And so that concludes my thoughts on this debate. I had more things to say, but I'm tired and have a headache and I really don't feel like writing anymore. Thank you and good night.
HAHAHA. Those arguing for safe spaces never do. Funny how that "Gen Z" rep mentions nothing of the rise of rabid identitarianism on the left and the unidirectional trend of de/no-platforming. We need to stop ascribing inherent legitimacy to "minority" voices; the loser on stage speaking about the "violence of white faces" is why. Also, how alarming this kind of thinking; what does that mean for his worldview? Suspicious of all whites, faces "violence" in situations in historically white countries - got a suggestion for him, go to a country that matches his desired racial demographics.
all the rational, educated adults on the other side are smart enough to know emotional arguments are inherently unstable &do not hold up to scrutiny...
@@WayneBraack Rational higly intelligent adults that suppor this left-leaning opinions. C'mon, im right and a lot libertarian, and it's amply obvious they can find someone who has dedicated their lives studying the left leaning arguments (argumentation is a science)
@@arthurwittmann6242 you'd think so but I haven't heard from or seen any of them doing debates like this. Who are they? I'm curious to hear from them too for balance.
She is possibly the best example I've seen of someone speaking a lot of words while saying absolutely NOTHING. I can listen to graduate level physiology or economics lectures while sorting out my laundry and doing the dishes, but listening to her speak was an absolute bore. As substantive as listening to someone with a bad stutter who just drank a pint of vodka.
Laris Vrahimis yet, I was glad to hear her perspective, as much as it made my brain hurt. I want to hear more from “snowflakes” and more leftist perspectives, as I don’t understand the logic. I want to understand
It crazy to watch a debate we’re one speaker maintains that there has been exactly zero progress with racism in university yet teaches black studies at universities
They are standing against a system that is hundreds of years old. I 'm white, I get it, wtf is the problem with this. I see the racism EVERYWHERE IN EVERYTHING. I do not even want to hear any of you white folks telling me it isn't there when as a white folk , I HEAR it daily, I'm exposed to fragile white people crying about shame and guilt and never once actually checking themselves. I'm white, so folks assume I'm on their side and and don't mind their blatant bigotry. I do mind. It's gross, and holds humanity back from evolution, and y'all need to do some research and introspective critique. I get that it is hard and defensiveness is a first reaction to being called out. It happened to me and it took a long time for me to learn, As, when it happened that I was called out (believing, mind you, that I was not a bigot) was when there were not willing people there to explain about privilege, what it is what it means to be living in it. There are folks willing to explain it-all over the internet and probably in your communities. There isn't progress because the underlying structures have never been properly addressed. How many black people you see in puzzles that are not exoticism in praxis? What Do you know of Africa's history of science, mathematics and architecture before colonization? that 's all
@@d.rabbitwhite Do tell -- what are just a FEW examples of these anecdotal interactions you experience on a "daily" basis? And where (geographically, organizationally, etc.)? Your remarks resonated & struck a chord w/ me -- as with countless millions others, of course -- as we live in an especially precarious time where ppl are given free pass on unspeakably evil "hate speech," like calling Obama "a bad prez," and only 90% or so of media & academia believe Trump is as bad or worse as Hitler.
@@Cronhour Since when is stating fact sarcasm? The far left is trying to make a comeback i hope we can stomp that shit out...because the next real wave of facism and racism is coming from the left...
I just saw that part (after Haidt gives a positive and realistic breakdown on the social progress that universities have come to largely provide over the past few decades in particular) and had to pause and take a break from the video because of the admittedly *hopeless* feeling that set in when she threw down the “profoundly patronizing” comment and gesture. Scrolled down and saw your comment haha.
@Gerry BerryDavid Starkey took out Laurie Penny with a massive overhand right of "I'm not taking any of your shit bitch." Its like candy. th-cam.com/video/oj9dA6E3fJw/w-d-xo.html
You can only negotiate with a peer. If someone claims victim status they’re placing themselves in a category that makes negotiation and debate impossible. Decent society requires the person who’s not the victim to submit to the victim. If the victim status is permanent (based on identity) then there’s absolutely no way to ever be peer to peer. Its a permanent, unresolvable bug. If we cannot negotiate we cannot communicate. We can’t have justice. Nobody is a victim based on their “identity” alone. This idea of minority identity equals oppression does not hold water when we look at outcomes across the western world. It’s a lie that all people of influence promote- all teachers, all politicians, celebrities. It’s cauterized into the Western world. I’m not surprised we are where we are. Those ideas can never lead to long term success. There is never going to be an end to this victim narrative because it’s a lever that can be pulled continuously and without end. There’s zero evidence to support this victim narrative and despite all evidence to the contrary the victim/oppression narrative much like a religious movement continues to occupy spaces of influence. At some point you just say NO.
I think gordon was expecting these debates with multiple black people who can barely speak English spewing as much gibberish in as short of time possible. only occasionally to be punctuated with a racial slur.
The ‘Devouring Mother’ who feels every person is either a helpless infant… or a tyrannical threat to infants… there are no middle ground of the strong, healthy people able to fend for themselves, make their own choices.
@@j_freed Its very easy for individuals to make broad assumptions based on a snapshot off apparent information I imagine it is very much different looking in through our own eyes and observing ..rather than a heartfelt experience through the individuals eyes ...after all we all have very different coping mechanisms.
the young activist makes no sense. period. Take a writing class in idea development.
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Lol yeah she talks about "The trappings of free speech" and I thought... you mean... being able to speak freely? Then she literally speaks of not allowing people whose views (in her opinion) are dangerous to have a platform. The painful irony and hypocrisy of this mindset is sadly lost on them.
That smugness of that Eleanor is offputting. And I'm left-leaning. There's something really wrong with her. I can't quite put my finger on it, but she doesn't seem sane.
I don’t know where that lecturer lives but if he’s from Britain as he sounds like he is, where exactly does he think graduates will work where they won’t meet diversity? Surely the UK is one of the most diverse societies in the world? I’m not much older than him I’d say but he sounds brain washed. His use of the word violence is utterly ridiculous. The people of Syria are experiencing violence. The victims of the bombings in Christchurch or Sri Lanka are victims of violence. An associate professor in a third level institution in the western world invited to speak in such company on such a stage is privileged and most certainly is not experiencing violence by merely a notion in his head of inequality. Good God we need to toughen up people!! It’s like a badge of honour to adopt weakness! Try forced immigration, death of entire families, false imprisonment for size if you want to talk about troubles... I honestly think we don’t have enough to worry about in the west any more and now we are just making things up to moan about.
Haidt was excellent, I thoroughly enjoyed his clear, coherent, analysis. I was expecting a debate and the others seemed to be regurgitating ideologies which made little sense.
I would love it, as a gay man, if these speakers on the left of the stage would stop using the LGBT as a trope for their arguments. You are not our protectors. The LGBT does not need your protection. We deserve to be treated as individuals first. You only speak for yourself Eleanor Penny.
Joe you don't need their protection ... Mate, u need protection from these idiots. She's already mentioned Muslim students and LGBT students in the same argument. The left loves Islam and Islam throws u guys off roof tops. The left has used the gay community, particularly gay men and when Islam has taken over and is rounding up and murdering u guys in the most barbaric ways imaginable, the left will be sitting by sprouting out "Not all Muslims".
J Davies The opposite is true - crazy people and bad ideas must be exposed in public so that they can be debated and defeated; it is worse for all of us if they suppturate below the radar.
Yeah well Hitchens was a mean-spirited man full of privilege and entitlement. If he understood the painful realities of the past, he would take care to not hurt the feelings of the already marginalized and oppressed, and he would listen more and talk less
@@fusion772 I have a simple solution for all those marginalized people. If you are unhappy with all those white speakers, all those old dead white men hanging on the walls and all that white history. Why not just leave? Go to the University of Riyad and get a degree on trans gender studies under sharia law. Go to the University of Brazzaville and study all about the rise of African technology. Oh that's right, that doesn't exist. There's nothing worth knowing about African history or breakthrough African technology. So in effect you are pissed off that all the great ideas in history came from those dead white men you can't stand looking at. Your problem friend is not those dead white men. Your problem is that your ancestors left you nothing worth being proud of. Your problem is not our racism, but rather your inadequacy. In short your problem is jealousy.
I can't even understand what the hell point that moron is trying to make, other than 'right wing bad!' It's right wings don't want free speech, we're all in favor of it, but just for some reason we'll scream, harass, threaten, intimidate, perpetrate violence, have massive protests against you IF you use it!
Well you have to remember Haidt has a lot more experience and wisdom, like she is still very young. He has much more perspective. When you're young you don't really know what's going on. Like he has kids, he is responsible for educating students. Penny doesn't have any of that. I tried to find a bio on her but couldn't much but my guess is she just hasn't had the real world experience of being responsible for other human beings like that. She hasn't had the experience yet of realising she is fundamentally wrong on something she felt really strongly about yet. Or of seeing her ideas and perceptions change over time. Stuff like that. So her condemnation comes easy to her. Going off her opening statement: she is basically proving Haidt correct in his description of gen z, and it is painful to watch. Like she basically is doubling down, on the kinds of things Haidt says gen z does or thinks. Insofar as she says anything, she is saying the reason why gen z acts this way instead of developing more robust individual ability to deal with issues, is because the issues are structural. And being a stronger individual can't answer structural issues. Whereas like the obvious answer would be there have been structural issues since the beginning of time, and basically the answer to that in all wisdom literature is: become a stronger individual. And part of Haidt and his co author's argument was based on cognitive behavioural therapy.
@Abdul Hannan Abdul Matheen In some cases I agree...but there are points where he could really get at the core issues, but lays down to try and placate feelings...which just emboldens them to use those feelings arguments more.
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@Abdul Hannan Abdul Matheen Hitchens was a bit of a one trick pony if we're honest. I must admit to worshipping him when I was in the adolescent phase of my atheism about 10 years ago (around the time that "The God Delusion" was fashionable), but as I developed my views he became less and less interesting to me. It's a great shame we don't have his devastating polemic wit to tackle the issues we see on our screen now. I am quite impressed with his brother, Peter, in the years since Christopher died, even if he can be a little black pilled for my taste.
i'm probably midway between both arguments with respect to colleges, but what gives with the snickering and sighs from people opposing Haidt. I've seen this in several videos with Haidt, and others arguing against safe spaces in colleges. I just dont get this part, and part of me thinks it speaks volumes of those people. Here's some advice to those advocating for full blown safe spaces, do not snicker or sigh while the opposing side is making their case. It makes you look immature
The idiocy of this woman was staggering. When she said that large political issue cannot be reduced to the personal psychological level. Where does she think politics comes from?
Incredible. Ask an academian with a lifetime of experience of reasearch and teaching - makes sense. Ask an barely adult activist ("journalist") and they'll jabber on for minutes uttering nothing but asinine drivel not even addressing what they were asked. If not so sad it'd be grounds for screaming laughter...
As a woman who went through university, I can honestly say I never felt an ounce of sexism or oppression. That young woman is actually quite authoririan. She doesn't see the fascism in her own remarks!
Leftists are always authoritarian, without fail. Orwell himself said, the next rise of fascism will come from the left. It makes me crazy when leftists try to invoke 1984 when talking about the right wing, when that novel was written as a cautionary insight on the LEFT gone rogue.
It's mostly about respect. Your boss can disrespect you but you can't disrespect him. We've actually had to write laws to limit the ability of owners and managers to disrespect their employees. You know, like when someone is maimed on the job and the boss used to just send the poor guy home to be nursed by his family. Both sides did agree that hates speech is unacceptable. So to paraphrase both sides, "I'm all for free speech as long as the speech I don't agree with can't be heard." 60% of Asians attend college; 42% of whites; 37% of African-Americans attend college; 36% of Hispanics attend college in the US. 58% of Asians; 40% of whites; 26% of African-Americans and shockingly only 18% of Hispanics attain a bachelor's degree. The success rate of blacks and Hispanics has a big drop off.
@Anonymoose 123 And why would that be? Why do you need mutual respect for free speech? Free speech gets 'strange idea's' out in the open. Without FS such idea's stay underground. Slowly burning under your feet, untill the floor gives way. There's a difference between FS and open discussion. FS means FS! NO MATTER what you say. Prohibiting FS, language, certain words, will only mean some idea's go out of sight. They don't vanish! They still remain! You just don't see them anymore. Keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer!!!
Once again I am stuck being embarrassed by my gender listening to another woman dribble on in nonsense. Women are a majority of the population. If women don’t assert their own power, then their limitations are self imposed. Any woman living under a society based on western ideology, is the freest that woman have been in all history. As a women who majored in the sciences, completed my legal doctorate, raises my children, and tries to find a little joy in the craziness and struggle of life, which is the same for all people in context, I can’t imagine pretending I am some shrinking violet in face of masculinity. Also, her opening statement shows her bias against reason. I wish I had the proper time to unpack it’s logical fallacies, but I have a life.
Its because your a successful modern woman and these two have took there fundamental features ie race and gender and blamed racism and sexism on why they are not succeeding, your skin pigmentation, gender and sexual orientation do not hold you back in a modern western society and the easy thing to do is blame our ancestors who did some horrible things to minorities and women and even to themselves and condemn the modern world I’m so glad I didn’t go uni, It’s the only valid point a modern pupil of academia has is the price and the degrees that don’t get you a job but this made up oppression of groups are a non starter it just becomes the oppression olympics
You have peculiar view of fascism. Fascism is defined by a militaristic and imperialist expansion with a strong nationalist base. If you think fascism is a left-wing creation, then I would wholeheartedly recommend a re-reading and analysis of post WWI Germany. I'd happily provide recommendations.
Yeah, I needed to see if anyone else had to pause there. "It's profoundly patronizing..." when someone asks me to provide some evidence or even a rational justification for my opinion. My indignation IS my evidence and you must concede or I simply label you a bigot.
She doesn’t even address his point. Not even once. She instead went on a rant about history. She is talking about tactics when she is right before your eyes changing the topic.
@Jeffrey Lebowski Ironically the UK mainstream is actually rather oppressive if you have wrongthink opinions. A lot of the stories I've heard recently coming out of the UK are outright dystopian. Express any level of disapproval / criticism towards minorities on social media and risk literally having cops knocking on your door telling you to be 'mindful' of what you say online. ( th-cam.com/video/QK3Ix0DhSs8/w-d-xo.html ) These are the kinds of cultures people like that woman create, and the irony is totally lost on them. Sad really.
That Poor Young Girl is Obviously being Severely Oppressed by "S's" , "T's", "ST's" & "TH's" . I guess she never really will have free speech as much as those letters are taxing her words lol
She was a word salad. I think it was her way of having to not actually answer anything. As Einstein once said, "if you can't explain it simply, then you don't understand it well enough".
@@eternalreign2313 The thing is, she is parroting 3rd wave feminist dogma perfectly. Peter Bohossian had her number a few years ago, but she is unable to deviate from scripture.
That wasn't the point...the point was lets do a hypothetical here(not based on reality) and see if there is anyway possible we can enter the shoes of someone else...I think the moderator did awesome in helping me see the far left point of view or at least thy nodded their heads in agreement with the scenarios she presented....but I still wasnt' able to feel their pain
You could hear it during the clapping. The people on the left got a lot less of it when they made their point. It doesn't help that they laughed at the one questioner at one point.
Dude when that black guy stood up and said in about three words that he wasn't on the dude's side I almost gave him a standing ovation. It's such a thing in the black community that if you don't accept the oppression narrative then you're basically a traitor to the race. There was something so brave about him just voicing opposition to what the guy on stage would deem to be "his own kind"
Can I just say that this moderator is absolutely brilliant. She is perfectly balanced, fair, articulate, and informed. At times its almost as if she summarizes the speakers' position as well as if not better than the speakers themselves. Its a masterclass in moderation.
@@mogznwaz Because this was recorded in the height of brexit discussions, thus making a nice contextually accurate joke about it being a brexit free safe space. Pretty sure even most smooth brainers would understand that.
@@mogznwaz You remind me of Kehinde Andrews, jumping on every tiny thing, pointing and shouting "see, they're biased!" When in reality, it was nothing or the sort.
Interesting analogy...! (I thought of book-burning the other day as an analog of 8th century iconoclasm, since the Church used icons not only for venerating -- not worshipping! -- the saints/martyrs, but also for educating the faithful, before the printing press, widespread literacy, commonly available books, etc.) Hmmm....
No it's 21st century fascism. A few decide what the majority hear. They use violence if necessary and will ruin your life if you dare step out of line and dare challenge their ideology. Universities are producing far left nut jobs who refuse to listen to anything the don't like, but instead of walking away they protest, they no platform, they use violence. Sadly MSM hardly speaks of this over here, though i must admit i think it's starting to come to a head and to the publics attention finally. Luckily those of us who don't go to uni don't have our head in the clouds, we don't have safe spaces to run too when some fella gives you a load of crap whilst your working as a waitress or retail worker. We have to actually go out into the real world after college or school and actually work, pay tax, whilst students spend their time getting hammered and rocking up hung over to their lectures, they pay no tax, their loans pay their bills and is all pretty much done for them. They have no idea how much of a b###h life is, they don't understand nor want to understand peoples worries about immigration numbers, who have valid real points and concerns, yet they can't be heard because it will hurt peoples feelings...what about peoples physical health when the NHS eventually collapses because the population growth is too rapid and the NHS cannot cope with the strain (this will happen, it's not if it's when), but these concerns that are rooted in common sense if nothing else aren't being heard. These liberal uni robots shut anyone down who tries to have a debate about it, anyone who challenges them are bigoted, racist, homophobes and best of all a fascist. ...funny the centre and right wing also liberals with common sense and a functioning brain thats able to think, don't want to shut the far left down, we want to debate, they don't want to hear so they suppress dissenters of their ideology.
@@libertasdemocratiam887 That's true ... you have social media to fuck up your brains even worse. There is no more center-right. It's gone to alt-right freaks glued to their Facebook and Google accounts that call shitposting "entrepreneurship". Get into the real world.
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Oh my god I am terrified to send my kids to university after listening to those two plums on the left.
@@susansargent396 please. Your children will do what all good children do and ignore you until they have gained enough life experience to decide what aspects of your philosophy is worth keeping and then ask you about it. Spend more time being a person your child can respect and will want to emulate some day.
Your preconception that ALL parents are NOT parenting, WRONG! The advise I gave was based on experience. You may want to confront you preconceptions, since clearly they have begun confronting you! What responsibilities have you voluntarily picked up? Or are you more of the #DirtyDNC ilk? @@daolong51279
They are not Democrats; they are twitter Bosheviks. They crave power and right now spouting such "political" gibberish gets dimwits a lot of power. Period.
I have been a lifelong leftist, but also don't call myself a leftist anymore (though morally speaking and so forth, I am slightly liberal, but mostly 'centre'). But the point, the left is going more and more extreme every year, I am becoming more and more of a right-winger without even moving... I am not wrong -- they are [far left]!
Please don't dismiss all 21 yo. There are plenty of mature, well rounded individuals at that age. They generally enter STEM fields though, or working hard to bring change to their family and community. I say this with confidence because I've met several.
The problem is, that any progressive pundit of any stature or maturity will ardently avoid such discussions. I give credit to the younger generations at least having the courage to debate people of opposing views. Granted the discussion points of these young people presented only succeeded in discrediting their own cause, but at least they were willing to take the stage.
@@msorsky1 "having the courage to debate people on opposing views". That would be valid if, in fact, she had been debating. She wasn't debating. She was proffering her perspective almost to the exclusion of anything the Rabbi was saying. At one point he posited a pretty reasonable (from my perspective) point for her to consider, and rather than speaking to it or debating it, she COMPLETELY dismissed it, and instead shifted to her own perspective and kept rolling. Anyone who wasn't paying attention could've missed it, but I suppose after watching a few of these exchanges, I've grown more and more aware of how far-left folks (and I say this as someone who's #WalkedAway...so folks, please save the silly retorts, they'll be fruitless on your part) are blatantly flippant about dismissing others points of view, regardless of how arguable or even TENUOUS their own position might be. In this video, it is completely apparent to me that neither of the folks to the left of (or right, depending on your physical position at the event) the dais was there to engage in a debate, and only were there to proffer their point of view, or depict themselves further as victims of "the system". Frankly, the fact that the young lady presented her position by outing herself as (perhaps, it was unclear if, in fact, she is) recovering from PTSD, was applying emotional appeal in a debate. I applaud her courage for being transparent about her circumstances and wish her well in her recovery, but frankly, it was used as a deflection mechanism (listen to it again, if you disagree) and/or an attempt to draw the audience closer to her position. If this were a real debate, the moderator should've stepped in and called it out, because generally, that is distracting from the exploration of the subject being debated.
@@msorsky1 As I've said before, I applaud her desire to step on the stage. But almost ANYONE could've done that. Step up on a stage. Courage would've been to actually prepared beforehand in the face of conflicting, opposing and challenging positions by others. Giving more beyond that is the equivalent of a "participation medal" for a sporting event. There are no "participation medals" for being an adult. You're either growing and learning, or you're not. There is no middle ground.
Gad Saad would be a good fit. He would put the two bigoted lefties in their place. I’m absolutely disgusted by their ignorant ideology. The so called professor is a disgrace.
The difference between Haidt and Hitchens is that people walked away from debates with Christopher emboldened in their beliefs and truly believing that their side won, whereas there is no chance to two on stage left walked away from this debate thinking that they won. Gentle persistence is an effective tactic for actually changing minds. A meek affect can be extremely persuasive. Hitchens was exciting, but only if you already agreed with him.
Well, in America it took a Civil War, with 360,000+ Union deaths, to move the ball from "slavery" to "freeman" for Black Americans. But that's literally NOWHERE.
@@stanbartsch1984 Well, if you want to be technical the Civil War wasn't ONLY for slavery. it was primarily for principle of States' Rights and taxation. But you could also say that they weren't "freemen". They weren't slaves but weren't free and you could say talking and solving problems did work because you had "I Have a Dream" "Malcom x speech", and "Brown v. Board of Education".
He was on GMB a while ago claiming the English Flag was a symbol of racism, when pushed he had to give the crusades as an example, despite the English Flag having not been used at that period.
one side: blatant racists demanding authorities give them special protection for arbitrary conditions. other side: bringing facts, research, history and logic to argue for freedom and the unique conditions that enabled us to prosper and free ourselves from authority. hmmmmm this wasn't a "battle" this was a slaughter.
I was there. The two idiots completely lost the audience. Towards the end no one applauded their racist, bigoted nonsense. They were dreadful and I felt so ashamed that they were all we had to offer to debate the two great and compassionate minds of Haidt and Sachs.
@Dwaine Castle ironically fox news is the only lame-stream entity that has it's toe in the water of truth, their pundits are obviously monitoring alternative-media for their talking points. your talking point was true in the early '90's now... not so much. the mainstream are dying and that is like the sword being dulled, the elites will not have that.
she wants everyone in the room to adopt their behavior to her personal pain/hangups. it's authoritarianism presenting itself as a victim. should be shamed... it's how evil manifests.
@NAREK ARUTYUNYAN You're not quite right about that. The cleverest oppressive systems *DO* allow certain forums for token "dissent" which are no threat to those in power. (1)Apartheid South Africa's white-only parliament had regular denunciations of National Party governments by the mostly English-speaking opposition. When the apartheid police killed black people in custody (often), the system allowed inquests which exposed the most horrific details _ but always exonerated the police. (2)Pre-independence Ireland was a system of crushing oppression for the vast majority, by British rule. But after Catholic Emancipation and particularly from the time of Parnell, the British Parliament had no problem with allowing Irish representatives to protest about their people's grievances _ which British governments, for the most part, then ignored. (3)Palestinians live under a system of deep discrimination, which among other things, involves large numbers of civilians being killed by aerial bombing. Yet one of Israel's highest judges is a Palestinian, and some Palestinians are allowed to vote in Israeli elections, making up roughly 20 to 25% of the voters. Few Palestinians would regard these concessions as meaning that they are not living under oppression.
@@watto3535 people will have their biases. The best we can do is praise them when we agree with their behaviour (here, it was great), and rebuke when the behaviour is less admirable (according to you, the interview with Polish). This is how people adjust - by the carrot and the stick - albeit, here, they are upvotes & downvotes :D
The irony of this young girl sharing a public forum panel with Jonathan Haidt attempting to argue against the platforming of “right wing” voices in fear of legitimizing those views is astounding
The young woman on stage is a PERFECT example of the emotional immaturity & instability that Haidt has described. A Perfect Exhibit A. She's a jumble of emotion, I feel, I feel, my feeling are hurt....hardly a way to handle oneself at an intellectual institution - the opposite of rational thought.
@@Bejaardenbus I fainted half way through and now I have PTSD. I have an appointment with my state-funded defecation trauma specialist, and the shite has been ordered to attend empathy classes so it may never oppress another arsehole again. #EverydayShitism
George Orwell didn't see this coming.....he thought he was writing a work of Fiction in "1984". Keep it away from Eleanor, she will think it's a textbook.
@48:54 the Rabbi really brings in a fresh new perspective: "I get it - that you [ Gen Z ] live in a harder world in some ways, that you are rightfully angry. The question, though, is how do you use that anger to actually get people to listen to you?"
I can't believe that he is allowed to spew this divisive & racist stuff. I saw him on the BBC once. He feels very triggered by these flags 🇬🇧 🏴 although he chooses to live in the UK, he wants them banned. He is a privileged black man in the UK, because by their laws he should be arrested for hatespeech.
and when they run out of things to say that make sense they bring up slavery ... like i thought that went away 150 years ago.. wah my great great great great great great dad owned yours. wah.. so that now excuses them of being racist themselves.. let me state 2 things.. one.. i have never been a racist.. two. never owned anybody. get off the slavery thing. jesus. go back 1800 yrs. im sure my rallies could of been roman slaves.. .. have they stopped to think the reason why people treat them (both off them sitting on the left) differently is because they are pretty fu cking annoying..
@@thetayterminator1436 and the ugly stick too!! I'm so tired of people all crying about how life isn't fair...boo hoo...poor me...poor me ...pour me another. I can't listen to any more of this...and I need a trigger warning from these people because of the anxiety I'm feeling about people who want to stifle free speech and therefore I am censoring them...hows THAT for more of their walking contradiction. Leftism is a mental illness. People just look for reasons to be offended.
It was more than just identity politics, it was racist. He charged the entire audience and panel with "white fragility" and pissed on the pillars of our great civilization by calling them "dead white men". No white person could ever say the same thing to a black.
The pen is mightier than the sword. Yes they were not silenced just given the assumption that what they speak is the truth as nobody would listen to or confront them with facts. Thus their pen is allowed to work unimpeded, and unchallenged.
Oh my god.... Why are Haidt and Sacks put in front of this depressingly delirious dynamic duo? "author and (pro-authoritarianism) activist Eleanor Penny, and sociologist Kehinde Andrews, one of the UK’s leading (racist) thinkers on race and the history of racism." It's absurd that it's become accepted to be openly racist and authoritarian under the pretense of fighting the invisible army of nazi-racist-biggots, Maybe if Penny and Andrews took a long hard look in the mirror they would finally find them. In essence, to immerse oneself in any framework of thought within which the leading conceptual principles are anchored in ' racial' group distinctions (ultimately at the expense of both the concept of the individual and any form of personal responsibility/agency/sovereignty), will take most people down the road of ruin that will take you as far as the limits of self-deception allow you to.
@@filemot25 I guess you're right. I honestly have no idea how you could reasonably disagree with Haidt on this matter, he's one of the most respectful, considerate, nuanced, balanced and moderate intellectuals i've come across so far.
I love how at the very end Haidt is basically like, guys this whole thing is kind of a waste of time and your college years would be better spent elsewhere. 1:24:30
@@freethinker4liberty No disrespect to Peter, but he couldn't hold a candle to his late brother. If Christopher was resurrected to join the panel, all you would remember from the debate in 5 years would be the hitchslaps.
It does not take Hitchens to dismantle these imbeciles. It would be a complete waist to resurrect Hitch for this, he'd probably Hitchslap you for raising him from the depths of hell and wasting his time.
@@Steve_Just_Steve It apparently wasn't a waste of his time to take apart equally idiotic ideas encroaching on liberties in his time. And nobody said it takes a genius to show regressives are wrong, it's just that Hitch would make it more fun.
They show me how fucking stupid Conservatives are, forever whining about everyone else's wrongdoing other than their own. Trump is the perfect example of what is SO WRONG with the USA right now. And the ONLY chance our Country has is if Biden wins in November. Otherwise, the virus will NEVER end under Trump and unemployment is gonna never get better. Trump has no clue how to put Americans back to work. Obama had done that work for him, the first half of his Coup attempt with Putin. He's gonna be arrested, the moment he loses in November, so I"m looking forward to see him taken in to custody and thrown in prison with his horny black cellmate BUBBA! BUBBA will show Trump how RAPE IS REALLY DONE! He's had plenty of experience.
@@leelahasan3988 Thanks for asking Leela, I was giving a warning to all Americans that Trump's attacks on Freedom of speech is a terrible thing and LUCKILY people believed my comment and elected Biden, so I"m SO GRATEFUL THAT I MADE THAT COMMENT 7 months ago or Joe could have not won. The reason I wrote it is because Biden is president today. Thanks for giving me the opportunity to educate you. You can thank me later.
@@ColonPal Congratulations! You've won the "most arrogant comment of the week" award! You've also been entered for a chance to win the "Most arrogant comment of the year" award! Well done and keep up the overconfidence!
She said she had a PTSD diagnosis. She should research PSG -post traumatic growth. At some point, you need to deal with it and grow from any trauma, not stay stuck on it, seeing it and feeling it all the time.
When a 1 and a half hour video starts with *"open your mind to censorship"* ... you know its gonna be stupid as hell. Doesnt she see the irony of that statement?
Yet, what is with all the likes? I can only assume the answer to that is a resounding no, right? I was just about to quit it when she said that stupid sh!te. I am only 5 minutes in, so I hope it gets better.
I am straining to be open to censorship---it hurts. I'm going with the benefit of the doubt that there is some sort of logic to that line of thinking. I'm not too good with history but censorship never seemed like a path out of oppression.
The moderator is definitely bias to the left. You can imagine the outrage if she was thoughtfully jotting down the comments from the older Caucasian man, then pointed at the black student to hurry her thoughts along. Trust me, it's not only conservatives paying attention to sh¡t like that.
Watching any of her forays into interviewing intellectual opponents, on YT is a thoroughly uncomfortable experience & confirms her immovability beyond her orthodox leftism.
Considering how left-wing I am myself, the people on the left are impossible to even listen to. I'm having to skip through their sections because of the lack of substance. They're saying a hell of a lot for people who aren't actually saying much. I was looking forward to a genuine debate
@@adrianalexandrov7730 Exactly bro I'm a liberatrian/classical liberal too, which used to be at the centre-left in 19th and 20th centuries. But recently, this position has been shifted to the centre-right.
@@amanshukla8758 I find this left-right dichotomy misleading. Political trichotomy seem to be closer to reality th-cam.com/video/nQF4NZxT0ps/w-d-xo.html
@@adrianalexandrov7730 Damn right mate I do think the trichotomy is actually much more accurate than the dichotomy However there's also a rhombus-shaped spectrum Just telling
@Dwaine Castle The right is mostly about emotion based hatred like this. That's clear from the comments here. They live in a world of hatred, false online accounts, doxxing, and online bullying. Sad.
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@@soulscanner66 The comments here are no more representative of right leaning people in the wider world than the infantile screechings of Evergreen College social justice activists are of the left in general. It's a bit of a hackneyed cliché to point out how social media invites hateful interactions, we've all known this for years, it's what they are designed bottom-up to do; so obviously they will attract the worst fringes of all sides.
@ I haven't seen any SJW's go on a shooting rampage yet or drive their car into a crowd of protestors. Really, all they've done so far is smash a few Starbucks windows and torch a few police cars at G7 rallies. That needs to be handled with criminal charges, but it's pretty clear that it's alt-right ideologies that are translating the online hate into terror attacks on innocent people; the reality here is now undeniable. You act as an apologist for this alt-right online hate, yet here is nothing justified or normal about it. It's an old right-wing trope that people just won't accept anymore as the hate attacks multiply.
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@@soulscanner66 These are disgusting attacks and I wouldn't be so stupid as to offer a defence to any of them. Edit: Again with the presumption of my position.
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I would add that for every 10 islamic attacks, there is a right wing white guy doing the same, so yes, as one increases so does the other in proportion. I don't count school shootings in the USA as they are obviously a different beast altogether and seem to be completely indiscriminate.
I am so pleased to see the students challenging the younger speakers. I found a lot of what I heard from the left side to be borderline nasty with a sugar coating, regardless of the experiences they may have had to bring them to their conclusions. They're not ready to give straight answers to these questions without insulting the questioners.
This is like a street fight between Joe Rogan and a 22 year old college girl who identifies as a male MMA fighter. The question isn't who will win. The question is whether Joe will make it a point to humiliate her or try to avoid it.
@@michaelm3691 I'm inclined to believe that the two SJWs are so convinced by their convictions that no amount of humiliation, counter points, or truths would alter their mindset.
@@WomanNextDoor Yup. Unfortunately, the only thing they aren't dumb about is recognizing that these things do alter the mindset of *other* people. That's why they want to control the debate.
@@michaelm3691 I always think of this Marxist/socialist crap as corrupting the hard drive (the brain), no matter how much you try to erase it, it still leaves a permanent stain.
"Activist Journalist" is an oxymoron, either you're reporting the facts, or you're giving your opinion, but to these kids it's the same thing. It's also interesting that one side has actual academics and studies, and the other side has people who only give their opinions without any facts.
At least left wingers overwhelmingly believe the scientific community when it comes to the single most important issue of this century.
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Hmmm well sadly for this poor girl the only career that further education has equipped her for is to be a professional activist. Have we reached a utopia in which we no longer require anyone to actually be productive?
Well, you could be an activist and only report facts. It's all a matter of which facts you think are important to prioritize in reporting. Since there's no way to objectively prove which facts should be reported, and you can't report on everything, in that sense, non-activist journalism isn't really possible. That said, it's absolutely true that what passes for journalism these days overwhelmingly de-prioritizes facts altogether in favor of narrative, And justifies the practice with "journalism can't be objective" as if that permits the bait & switch
@@gordonthefreeman I didn't say anything about partisanship. I'm right there with you on that. I was just pointing out that every reporter has to choose which stories to cover and which facts are relevant. Even if all the reporting is truthful, the selection of what the people see will inevitably reflect what the reporter cares about and will therefore shape the implicit message the consumer receives. That process can be partisan or non partisan in how it shakes out, but it's inevitable.
@@grovertigo Yes Lovs, you could be an activist and only report facts but there would be an implicit bias in your 'narrative' . Sometimes its the facts that are omitted that obfuscate the truth. A journalist by definition should be free from bias and report all the facts. In law withholding evidence is just as much an obstruction of justice as fabricating evidence. Any attempt at deception is the same as a lie, regardless if it is done through delivering false information or the omission of critical information. People don't get away with flat out lies much anymore, but the omissions of truth from all sides is massively on the increase. Like in this debate, the side arguing that slavery is the the problem and thats why they demonize white people, fail to also mention that slavery largely was ended by white people.
She's a perfect target as a future hijab wearing woman. She's that broken - probably willing to believe that a symbol of oppression is actually a symbol of freedom to choose.
@@SurpriseMeJT The right does not use argument to engage intellectually. The right uses arguments to personally destroy people emotionally. Conservative are not what they used to be. This is clear to anyone who reads this thread. That's why they support fascism. They've learned from the fascists.
@@SurpriseMeJT The right sacrifice constitutional guarantees just because they hate Muslim women. They would sacrifice the West's most cherisshed ideals because of their emotiponal hatred of Muslim women. This type of violent feelings they intentionally inflame onlin is dangerous. It's intersting how the right assumes that Muslim women are rightful targets of their hate.
@@soulscanner66 I'm not traditionally on the right, but I've certainly left the Left. Why? women are great apologizers for their oppressors, just look at abused women who believe that their abusive mates are still caring people which the women love. This is what Islam does to women - turns them into victims of abuse by men. Both political party sides have ideologies supported by members that are apprehensible. Islam needs to be eradicated from our countries, because it's not freedom, it's submission and oppression. I speak from years of personal experience with Muslims. I am at the point where I believe that support of Islamic beliefs of any kind in treason - yes, it's that opposing to western constitutions, republics, democracies or any other system not Islamic.
Worst "non-discussion" I've ever suffered through. Guy on far left, instantly plays up the victim role and goes downhill from there.The two on the left are all about "self". Me, me, me. Nothing at all to contribute. I'm a victim of prejudice.
@@yueotsutsuki4553 Nothing wrong with it. Unless there is no real 'perpetrator', but only an overly sensitive 'victim'. You shouldn't be afraid to talk to a woman, because you might say something offensive, if the 'offense' is something normal. Like saying 'have a look' to a blind person. You a: aren't always (immediately) able see that someone is blind, and b: most blind people want you to talk 'normal'. It's usually other people that find it awkward. I'm not talking about things that are commonly seen as offensive. I'm talking about people with very long toes, that are almost hoping you'll say or do something they can make a fuss about. So, I'm not talking about real bullying, sexist behaviour and that kind of unlawful behaviour or behaviour generally found unacceptable (like slapping a woman's butt), but things like being called the wrong gender by accident (what happened to me regularly, when I had long hair. Despite my beard :) ). It sometimes seems being the oddball is the standard today and everyone is very, very very, entitled. But nobody talks about the duty that goes with rights and nobody talks about the responsibility that comes with priviledge. For me it's all a sign of decadence. Through history there's war. Not that I want war, but kids today have such luxury lives. They are spoiled rotten and can't handle any criticism. A war makes people aware of what's important and what's not. People who don't accept reality die and after the war everybody who's survived is very busy getting thing up and running again. It makes people humble. Now compare to the spoiled kids who think it's a crime if someone says something 'offensive' to them. Not DO something offensive, but just and only SAY something 'offensive'. If those offensive things are also seen as not offensive to 99% of people, than there is something going very wrong in society. It can and may never be that the few rule the many. Not in a democracy! And might you think there's no spoiling in kids today. Muscle mass of todays young generations is 30-40% less than kust 30 yrs ago. Twelve year olds have diabetes type 2, are obese, need physiotherapy for their necks and backs caused by smart phone use. Kids make hundreds to even thousands of selfies a day. How narcissistic can you get? And what's the gain? Cause people who do really offend are not going to think differently because a word is forbidden. So we got the N-word, the G-word, etc., etc. Does it mean there is no discrimination anymore? I can call my mate an *sshole without offending him. Why? Cause he knows my intentions! There is trust that I mean to tease him, not offend him. It's the way I say it that makes the difference. Today everyone has long toes and if you drop even a feather on those sensitive toes ....... Because they are programmed (brought up) to distrust and seek offense in everyone and everything and they're 'entitled'! We have a comedian here that made a sketch (in the 1970's) about a guy telling a joke. After starting with: There were 2 Chinese walking in the park. He gets an telephone call. The caller is offended because it's about 2 Chinese and that it's discriminating. 2nd Call is about walking in the park, disturbing the birds or some BS. Everytime the guy adjusts his story to match the caller's demands. So, you can imagine the story falls completely apart and at the end, the last caller says: wouldn't the joke be much better if it was about 2 Chinese walking the park, etc., etc.. At which pont the storyteller tries to pull put his hair and is pulled offstage by men in white doctor's clothes. Get my drift? If you let this thrive, you'll end up with an Orwellian society, where everyone is afraid to say anything to anyone. Life isn't always fun and cetainly never fair. The sooner you learn, the better you'll be able to cope.
@@arturama8581 Nice comment. About the most famous comedian in Belgium made a similar joke. People complaining about his joke, so then he had to adjust it, and in the end cuz of the adjustments it became an even more offensive joke. It's not possible to translate the joke into english alas.
@@arturama8581 brilliantly phrased! As a 21 y/o crazed by the current “woke” culture gaining momentum around me.. I agree with every word of yours 💯 It’s been maddening, listening to their hate and their rhetorics. And at just 21, I’m gravely concerned about the future generation. It’s a downward spiral from genZ
Queen of the Uetliberg oh my gosh it’s torture listening to the young girl who thinks she has it all figured out. Need more Jonathan’s and less of miss safe spaces
The highlight was when the audience member calls out Eleanor Penny as a Fascist (because she is) and then she was absolutely flabbergasted that anyone could possibly think that. It just goes to show how out of touch she truly is.
She struck me as way out of her depth up there alongside some high calibre minds, yet she still sits on that platform. So much for being disadvantaged...
I’m a gay female. I 100% believe in all sides having a platform. If we shut people down, that’s big trouble. I would go see Steve Bannon if he spoke at my University. I would also partake in the Q & A session and challenge him on anything I felt he was off base on. That’s true progress… listening to one another and having hard conversations. I see these people who claim to be speaking and acting on my behalf, and they are showing up to academic lectures and banging on cowbells and chanting over speakers so no one can hear them. It’s disgusting. Massively immature. Let people speak and then hold them accountable. And most importantly, find some common ground. Intersectional division never ends. I can find countless ways to describe how the people I encounter on a daily basis are NOT like me, but the healing begins when we look for ways we ARE ALIKE and things we can agree on.
@ETA4 And you are not a victim of Nazi either...how do you know that Nazi is brutal? Only western said so suddenly it's a fact? Maybe Nazi is a good organization, then criminalize by western to make them look really bad
You owe me something because of my melanin level/and or genitalia/and or sexual orientation/and or religious ideology. This is a bizarre dichotomy nestled inside a marxist lens of divide and concur, instead of principled reason.
That isn't Marxism he was very strongly against division hence 'workers of the world unite', marx was deeply against minority identity politics as it detracted from class, which unites the vast majority of the population. If you don't like something it doesn't make it Marxism
If the statistic he quoted (100 out of 18,000 UK professors are black) is accurate, Andrews is mad that 5.5% of all UK professors are black - when black people make up only 3% of the general population, i.e. almost double representation.
My GOD...she doesn’t think Steve Brannon believes in free speech, so she doesn’t want him to speak at universities. Do these ppl even listen to themselves??
@@lowfrequency1180 Eric, Bannon is a fucking liar, he won't expose his true thoughts because he's said he wants to UNDO the Civil Rights movement and eliminate half of the Constitution which makes him a tRAITOR to the USA. Now that Trump fired him, he's trying to pretend to be on the side of the Constitution, but he's already been exposed as a racist/nationalist/traitor scumbag just not as fucked up as Trump!
Bob Judd Umm, you can’t even have a civil discussion and yet you think anything else you say carries any weight whatsoever? Grow the fuck up and learn how to converse respectfully. I am sorry I didn’t catch the typo in Bannon’s name, thank God a noble spirit came along to insult me into a typo-free life, as I’m sure he’s already done. The absolute BEST part of all this is that I don’t even like trump. I simply questioned ONE COMMENT made by ONE GUY and you got triggered somehow. Political crack is bad for you, you know, so you might want to lay off so you can gain enough clarity to accept one fundamental truth: no matter who gets elected or whether or not that person has an R or a D next to his name, we end up with the same shit. It’s a fact. If you’re pissed off about “Trumps America”, take it up with your congressmen bc trump alone doesn’t have enough power to do a damned thing should congress actually do their jobs, so stop hyper-focusing on trump, open your eyes, and see reality for what it is. Do you really think it’s an accident neither party never TRULY gets anything accomplished? Bc you should know that’s statistically impossible. And while I dislike Trump, Biden is a moron who’s being used, his VP is more significant and so far she’s a scary bitch, so tell me how one side is any better than the other? You can’t. But as long as you keep pretending that conservatives or trump is the problem while ignoring the mess in your own house, you will do nothing more than continue to contribute to everything you just climbed on your rent-a-soapbox to bitch about, and that’s just sad. If you can’t do any better than “stupid bitch” any time someone DARES to speak their own minds, then fuck right on off bc nobody cares, and nobody will if you keep substituting your ideological lunacy for a valid argument. News flash, sunshine, but you don’t actually know everything, and the ppl you disagree with most often know something you don’t, so try shutting up and listening for a minute, maybe you’ll learn how to be civil.
Bob Judd and one more thing just bc I can’t allow this kind of stupidity to stand-ITS A FUCKING VIRUS. Maybe you should learn how those work before you accuse anyone of being “responsible” for it bc that’s a pathetically stupid thing to say. By your logic, Obama was responsible for every flu death during his tenure, and that’s about half a million Americans at least. Guess what, genius? There’s no stopping a virus. Only one virus has ever been eradicated from the planet and that’s smallpox. Let me let you in on a little secret about yourself-you believe dumb shit like “trumps a racist” and “trump killed ppl with coronavirus” bc you WANT to believe it, not because it’s true, accurate, or rational. I’ll leave you with one more fun fact-during the 2008-2009 financial crash, more than 250,000 ppl died of cancer bc they couldn’t get treatment due to the economic state we were in. Are you blaming Obama for that like you’re blaming trump? Or are you just a hypocrite armed with propaganda and he’s too unwilling to even notice? I’m guessing it’s the latter, but who knows.
Bob Judd you May very well be right, but couldn’t you have argued it with a bit more substance? Because as it is you illustrate William H’s point for him
It is difficult for me to believe that the 2 on the left were the best that could be provided for this debate\lecture. The girl has great difficulty in constructing a rational statement and the fellow is incredibly racist and sees everything through that lens. The adults on the right provide well structured statements, educated answers and focused entirely on the subject, with no prejudice.
Eleanor Penny's use of language - "cry of pain" - is itself very manipulative, Machiavellian and misleading here. she is also engaging in straw-manning her opponents, since literally no one is saying that university students reason solely from emotion, only that it is one among many factors. Her language, assumes that victimization, is itself aways victimization, and not either propaganda and/or a weaponization of victimization for personal and/or political purposes. This is also a "historical tactic that has been used to silence dissent and to get people to shut up basically," Ms. Penny. And yours is the "convenient narrative" which you are "inculcating" here and this invites a "damaging framework" right here. Moreover, whose private pain matters to the left and the woke? That of Ayaan Hirsi Ali, who has been publicly shamed and bullied and ostracized and humiliated and censored and silenced and repressed by the left, banned from discussing how she was violently physically and sexually tortured as a child? And that even one left-winger, claimed she deserved this assault and torture as a child? Is that Penny's view, that Hirsi Ali deserved to be tortured as a child? If not, why not condemn the left-winger who made this bullying remark? Does Hirsi Ali's "private pain" matter too, Ms. Penny? I think I know what your answer would be: a resounding: no.
And there it is with the white male fragility whereas white men are attacked on the regular by mental midgets who want to use their skin color as a cudgel for argument.
Actually, that was the very 1st time i saw leftists dare to participate in a public debate. Great progress already!-) Thanks. And also the two Johnathans are always pleasure to hear, although i'm a biased jew;)
"....for 500 years it has gotten us nowhere" says the Black University Professor living in the former Colonial Nation
The rabbi made, for me, one of the strongest points. Those who are sure they are right are the keenest to hear opposing ideas, because they are confident that the facts are for them. It is, by contrast, those who are least sure they are right who are keenest to shut down debate.
@Y T Haidt doesn't have analysis, he has nice little catch phrases that pretend reality is something different that it is, to make people feel good.
Thank you. I was screaming at my screen when he started spewing that absurdity. The lack of awareness is stupefying.
@@philipbrown2086 I very much agree, and you see this play out pretty apparently in debates like this. When you have, in my opinion, one side that totally outclasses the other, there is a huge difference in the demeanor of the two groups. These two were a very good example, simply looking at things as simple as their cadence of speech, posture, and hand gestures. There is an element of unease, that i hope im not just projecting on them, but seems relatively obvious.
This same type of thing plays out when you watch a young student or protestor attempt to debate Jordan Peterson. They yell and scream and flail their arms to, in my opinion, distract from the weakness, even they see, in their own positions. Its like a form of cognitive dissonance that produces extreme anxiety, which then manifests as mental defense and physical aggressiveness.
lol I was so confused by that... Nothing has changed in 500 years..???? So if that idiot was sent back to the 16th century things would be the same for him? The world has changed more in just the last 100 years then it had in the entire previous 10 000 years, the quality of life is so many magnitudes better in 1st world countries then it was 100 years ago, for fucking every person living in it. This guys mad that racism still exists, his ancestors from the early 1900s were dealing with a lot fucking worse then his sad story of not being able to wear jeans :'( Not to mention a million ways to die that wouldn't even keep you home from work in todays world. Go back the 17th century then bud, and enjoy 40% of your children dying from infection, disease and everything else long before ever reaching adulthood.
My brain just turns off when someone starts with,
"As a (insert race, gender, sexuality group identity), I feel..."
None of that matters to your argument. Either you have good ideas or bad ideas, your group identity is inconsequential to the merit of your ideas.
Johan Doah I really disagree with that statements. People in the minorites experience things in society then people who aren’t this is just fact. And I believe as a human we should be able to hear from different perspectives whether we are in the racial minority or sexual because they have experiences that might be different then yours so listen, asses and then form your opinion
@@amalnasser4118 You can have all the experiences unique to you that you want...and I am happy to hear your personal experiences, but when someone wants to use that to push policy on me and strip me of my rights, please forgive me for not just rolling over and giving them up.
Your personal experience does not make your ideas good or bad, they are good or bad on their own merits period.
John doah of-course my personal experiences is not categorize into right or wrong there just experiences from my point of view in a minority I understand your point I do no should impose anything in any way to infringe on your rights. And no please don’t apologize you have every right with disagreeing on my points I’m not asking to agree with everything all I need if for something to listen. Thank you for your comment.
@@amalnasser4118 It's not a "fact" at all. While being black might be different than being white, we are both Americans in the same society with the same basic rights. What we choose to do with any opportunities that we are presented, or that we create, is up to us as individuals. If you think the world owes you something, then you'll be in for a rough ride as an adult when people rightly tell you to "Grow up."
Also, this preposterous idea that as a human being I can't possibly comprehend what it's like to be another human being is patently false. Empathy, sympathy, and our sense of fairness are built upon our ability to see things from a different perspective. It's foundational to any interactions you have with other people, and if you are lacking it, you're a psychopath.
Intersectionality is about nothing but power, and trying to gain it over others. It is not based on any science, and we should all reject it completely.
A different person with a different background and different ideas? Yea... it totally doesn't matter
26:30 did that guy just say that learning in a University near white people is a "violent" space for him?
I believe he said something about not taking him literally, but nice job taking him literally.
@Andrea MENDENHALL I expect the proper word for it would be anguish. He was not trying to say that ideas were imparting physical violence. I remember once I observed a social studies class in a high school. The students were learning about some of the most horrific experiences suffered by ancient people after a conquest and it was all matter of fact. We do expect our children to absorb a lot and be thick skinned about it.
@Andrea MENDENHALL I wasn’t thrown in the deep end when I learned to swim. I was taught how to swim gradually but I became a very strong swimmer. There is more than one way to skin a cat.
People who have actually experienced discrimination are much more calibrated than that. What sets him apart is not his ethnicity, but that he's never been expected to show any resilience. I think that's exactly Jonathan's point in the Coddling of the American Mind.
@@disnotesfoyou And that's why you start out at kindergarten, elementary school and work your way up. You're eased into adult things. Just like your swimming. Nobody thrown in the deep end. What you're saying is like the US champion 100m backstroke complaining about being thrown in the deep end at the Olympics.
I don't understand what is wrong with teaching European history in a European university or what is wrong with having pictures of old European men on the walls of a European University? Kehinde Andrews says that with disgust as if it's a bad thing. We need to wake up to this and call it what it is, racist. He's speaking in disgust about the University as if there is anything wrong there.
I think he has an issue with the British curriculum in which empire and slavery was never taught. History went from the classics, to the middle ages and Tudors, to the enlightenment, and then to WW1 and WW2. That's pretty effed up as we have an idealised/imagined sense of national history. And unfortunately explains a lot about the current crop of political leaders and ethno-nationalist rhetoric that is creeping into the mainstream
That's fine for the European History department but what about the rest of the knowledge in the world?
I’m not sure what type of history he would expect to learn about in a European university .. 🤔
@@palvishah89 except slavery and the empire is taught in schools and so is the Holocaust
Kehinde hates the white man. He said they disgust him....a racist
I've been a soft-core liberal by the nature of my age (30) and geographic location (liberal state) not until I met my husband whose an economic conservative and socially liberal and we would have these huge quarrels in the beginning about various societal issues. Most of the times it'd end with me feeling emotionally overwhelmed and stating "enough, I don't want to hear you anymore" but internally knowing he has had the upper points and I was simply arguing on "borrowed problems" identified by the left like women inequality, racism (I'm Asian from 1st generation immigrants),etc. After having this awareness I started my exploration into the "other side" to see if I could be convinced or not and a good way to test how secured and solid my grounds are as a leftist endorser.
Long story short, the so-called "conservatives" won me over in pretty much all political debates by their well researched facts, in depth analysis and ability to pose hard intellectual questions on problems which they themselves might not have answer to but the left often conveniently toss it under the umbrella of 'racism, gender, capitalism, etc.' and these are the evil of society. They are so superficial on their solution, rudimentary in their thinking, and loud on their virtues signaling. I'm still waiting for the day where both sides have equal weight in their claims and which I'm actually torn between the two but for now the scale continues to tip right.
Less than .5% in the country but 80% of the panel
hmmm.. forever a minority therefore forever oppressed?? I cannot identify---I will never understand
Don't really care what they are. I care what they say.
Wow, it's truly fascinating to see these two ideologies go head to head in a civil environment in which neither side went ballistic and started shouting their beliefs rather than listen to other's ideas.
I have to say though, that even hearing both of these sides, I disagree most with the people who are physically and politically on the left. Now don't get me wrong, I disagree with some things the gentlemen on the right said, but overall they seemed the most reasonable in their arguments and provided some possible solutions and causes to the issues discussed.
That being said though, it seems where these people disagree is when it comes to responsibility and blame.
The men on the right want people to look inward at their problems and take responsibility for their own lives and how they respond to adversity. They don't want people to dilute themselves into believing they are powerless and there's this invisible force keeping them down. They acknowledge that human beings are flawed and that you can't control every aspect of your life or what other people can and can't do or say, only how you respond to it.
Meanwhile, the people on the left are arguing that someone else is at fault, and that someone else is making their lives miserable, and that someone else needs to fix it. They keep circling back to this idea that people are trying to hurt you and keep you down simply because of your gender, skin color, orientation, etc. Yet they don't seem to understand that the main reason they're seeing these sort of "microaggresions" everywhere is because they're looking for them. When you are of the mindset that someone is trying to hurt you in some way, whether that's physically or emotionally, you will see everything they do as an attack on you.
It's a mindset that breeds paranoia, and distrust, and that's why they were talking about how people need to stop talking about racism and misogyny and all that, not to silence those who actually suffer, but to dissuade people into thinking they're victims and can't do anything about the problems in their lives because something else is in the way. They aren't trying to invalidate anyone, they're trying to encourage people to find realistic solutions to their own problems.
Because I think that that is a genuine problem in our society, is that people usually want to have someone to blame, and want someone else to fix their problems, when sometimes, the problem lies within themselves, and so to there is the solution.
Now that doesn't mean that every problem in your life is your fault, or that every problem you have can be solved by you alone, but it's important to have a sort of self-awarness in my opinion, to be able to recognize when a problem you have is your own fault, and when it's not, and when it is, it's important to be able to take responsibility and fix it yourself, because blaming others does nothing to fix the problem.
Also, I am just baffled by Andrews. Like, what reality does he live in??? He acts as if nothing's changed and no progress has been made since the 1960's! Like, Johnathan even pointed out how much progress we've made as a society and he doesn't even comment on it! Dude, what reality are you living in???
And so that concludes my thoughts on this debate. I had more things to say, but I'm tired and have a headache and I really don't feel like writing anymore.
Thank you and good night.
Funny calling it a debate, one side had no argument
Harry Peach I love a balanced debate and I did love this. But they had an incoherent argument.
@@liamwinter4512 Yeah tbh it was actually a pretty interesting debate although a little cliche
Felt like more of a civil discussion rather then a debate. Which is probably good
HAHAHA. Those arguing for safe spaces never do. Funny how that "Gen Z" rep mentions nothing of the rise of rabid identitarianism on the left and the unidirectional trend of de/no-platforming.
We need to stop ascribing inherent legitimacy to "minority" voices; the loser on stage speaking about the "violence of white faces" is why. Also, how alarming this kind of thinking; what does that mean for his worldview? Suspicious of all whites, faces "violence" in situations in historically white countries - got a suggestion for him, go to a country that matches his desired racial demographics.
How many sides are there?
The set-up was unfair. They paired two rational and highly intelligent adults with two emotional and ideologically possessed children.
all the rational, educated adults on the other side are smart enough to know emotional arguments are inherently unstable &do not hold up to scrutiny...
What else would you find on that side of the argument other than emotionally unbalanced intellectually insufficient children?
@@WayneBraack Rational higly intelligent adults that suppor this left-leaning opinions. C'mon, im right and a lot libertarian, and it's amply obvious they can find someone who has dedicated their lives studying the left leaning arguments (argumentation is a science)
True.
@@arthurwittmann6242 you'd think so but I haven't heard from or seen any of them doing debates like this. Who are they? I'm curious to hear from them too for balance.
The young woman’s on the left incoherent rambling almost convinced me of her argument that some people have not earned the right to a platform.
LOL. Well played
She is possibly the best example I've seen of someone speaking a lot of words while saying absolutely NOTHING. I can listen to graduate level physiology or economics lectures while sorting out my laundry and doing the dishes, but listening to her speak was an absolute bore. As substantive as listening to someone with a bad stutter who just drank a pint of vodka.
She sounds like a stroppy teenager arguing with her parents
I couldn't understand her either. Hwew. Strained so hard to listen to her slightly incoherent speech.
Laris Vrahimis yet, I was glad to hear her perspective, as much as it made my brain hurt. I want to hear more from “snowflakes” and more leftist perspectives, as I don’t understand the logic. I want to understand
It crazy to watch a debate we’re one speaker maintains that there has been exactly zero progress with racism in university yet teaches black studies at universities
Very good point...and oh yeah “the far right is on the rise” yeah right...
@@justkiddin1980 is this sarcasm?
They are standing against a system that is hundreds of years old. I 'm white, I get it, wtf is the problem with this. I see the racism EVERYWHERE IN EVERYTHING. I do not even want to hear any of you white folks telling me it isn't there when as a white folk , I HEAR it daily, I'm exposed to fragile white people crying about shame and guilt and never once actually checking themselves. I'm white, so folks assume I'm on their side and and don't mind their blatant bigotry. I do mind. It's gross, and holds humanity back from evolution, and y'all need to do some research and introspective critique.
I get that it is hard and defensiveness is a first reaction to being called out. It happened to me and it took a long time for me to learn, As, when it happened that I was called out (believing, mind you, that I was not a bigot) was when there were not willing people there to explain about privilege, what it is what it means to be living in it. There are folks willing to explain it-all over the internet and probably in your communities.
There isn't progress because the underlying structures have never been properly addressed.
How many black people you see in puzzles that are not exoticism in praxis?
What Do you know of Africa's history of science, mathematics and architecture before colonization?
that 's all
@@d.rabbitwhite Do tell -- what are just a FEW examples of these anecdotal interactions you experience on a "daily" basis? And where (geographically, organizationally, etc.)? Your remarks resonated & struck a chord w/ me -- as with countless millions others, of course -- as we live in an especially precarious time where ppl are given free pass on unspeakably evil "hate speech," like calling Obama "a bad prez," and only 90% or so of media & academia believe Trump is as bad or worse as Hitler.
@@Cronhour Since when is stating fact sarcasm? The far left is trying to make a comeback i hope we can stomp that shit out...because the next real wave of facism and racism is coming from the left...
45:10 - I don't think I've ever heard someone say 'profoundly patronising' in a tone that was so profoundly patronising.
torch2k haha...I felt the same but didn’t put words to it. Bless you. 😂
She even went through all the gestures and shit.
I just saw that part (after Haidt gives a positive and realistic breakdown on the social progress that universities have come to largely provide over the past few decades in particular) and had to pause and take a break from the video because of the admittedly *hopeless* feeling that set in when she threw down the “profoundly patronizing” comment and gesture. Scrolled down and saw your comment haha.
I found even her hand movements to be "profoundly patronising." (but her ideology tops the list)
@Gerry BerryDavid Starkey took out Laurie Penny with a massive overhand right of "I'm not taking any of your shit bitch." Its like candy. th-cam.com/video/oj9dA6E3fJw/w-d-xo.html
58:16 "If you really have confidence that you are right then you never seek to silence your opponents." Rabbi Jonathan Sacks
Not one cohesive argument against free speech. Just endless whining from one person and meaningless word salad from the other.
Word salad. You poet. Kudos.
Fucking word salad? Wow. You are operating on a hiring brain level dude. I’m using that one. Hahaha
Word salad is the modus operandi of the postmodern left.
amen
@Scott Mamby citation needed
This wasn't really a debate. The guys on the left just repeat "But victimhood", 100 times in different ways.
Gordon Freemason was it only 100 times? Felt like 400
Gordon Freemason they are all from the left it's lefties vs far lefties
You can only negotiate with a peer. If someone claims victim status they’re placing themselves in a category that makes negotiation and debate impossible. Decent society requires the person who’s not the victim to submit to the victim. If the victim status is permanent (based on identity) then there’s absolutely no way to ever be peer to peer. Its a permanent, unresolvable bug. If we cannot negotiate we cannot communicate. We can’t have justice. Nobody is a victim based on their “identity” alone. This idea of minority identity equals oppression does not hold water when we look at outcomes across the western world. It’s a lie that all people of influence promote- all teachers, all politicians, celebrities. It’s cauterized into the Western world. I’m not surprised we are where we are. Those ideas can never lead to long term success. There is never going to be an end to this victim narrative because it’s a lever that can be pulled continuously and without end. There’s zero evidence to support this victim narrative and despite all evidence to the contrary the victim/oppression narrative much like a religious movement continues to occupy spaces of influence. At some point you just say NO.
I think gordon was expecting these debates with multiple black people who can barely speak English spewing as much gibberish in as short of time possible. only occasionally to be punctuated with a racial slur.
Just saved me 90 minutes. Cheers. Upvoted.
"Censorship is forbidding a man from eating steak because a child could not chew it." -Mark Twain
I like that. It says alot, with few words. I'm stealing it 😛
The Far Left does infantilize adults with pablum ideas and roof much coddling.
The ‘Devouring Mother’ who feels every person is either a helpless infant… or a tyrannical threat to infants… there are no middle ground of the strong, healthy people able to fend for themselves, make their own choices.
@@j_freed Its very easy for individuals to make broad assumptions based on a snapshot off apparent information I imagine it is very much different looking in through our own eyes and observing ..rather than a heartfelt experience through the individuals eyes ...after all we all have very different coping mechanisms.
The enormous spectacle of MEDIA has reduced the individual to a dot.
I wish I could thumb down individual speakers instead of the whole video.
Yeah, with they would implement that. Its more like a polling format.
the young activist makes no sense. period. Take a writing class in idea development.
Lol yeah she talks about "The trappings of free speech" and I thought... you mean... being able to speak freely? Then she literally speaks of not allowing people whose views (in her opinion) are dangerous to have a platform. The painful irony and hypocrisy of this mindset is sadly lost on them.
Oh my god I’d love to take that class.
She is Laurie Penny's sister, so I'm not surprised.
That smugness of that Eleanor is offputting. And I'm left-leaning. There's something really wrong with her. I can't quite put my finger on it, but she doesn't seem sane.
Not enough of the world listened to, I think. I'm about her age, her ideas seemed pretty off-putting to me too
she seemed obsessed with Milo Yiannopoulos. what I would pay to see her locked in an elevator, debating him. :-)))))
@@froggyfootball7572 But what would happen if Milo invited her to his room for some coffee?
Im very left leaning and I fucking hate her. She puts forth a frantic, manic energy that is off putting.
I don’t know where that lecturer lives but if he’s from Britain as he sounds like he is, where exactly does he think graduates will work where they won’t meet diversity? Surely the UK is one of the most diverse societies in the world? I’m not much older than him I’d say but he sounds brain washed. His use of the word violence is utterly ridiculous. The people of Syria are experiencing violence. The victims of the bombings in Christchurch or Sri Lanka are victims of violence. An associate professor in a third level institution in the western world invited to speak in such company on such a stage is privileged and most certainly is not experiencing violence by merely a notion in his head of inequality. Good God we need to toughen up people!! It’s like a badge of honour to adopt weakness! Try forced immigration, death of entire families, false imprisonment for size if you want to talk about troubles... I honestly think we don’t have enough to worry about in the west any more and now we are just making things up to moan about.
Haidt was excellent, I thoroughly enjoyed his clear, coherent, analysis. I was expecting a debate and the others seemed to be regurgitating ideologies which made little sense.
I would love it, as a gay man, if these speakers on the left of the stage would stop using the LGBT as a trope for their arguments. You are not our protectors. The LGBT does not need your protection. We deserve to be treated as individuals first. You only speak for yourself Eleanor Penny.
Indeed.
Joe you don't need their protection ... Mate, u need protection from these idiots. She's already mentioned Muslim students and LGBT students in the same argument. The left loves Islam and Islam throws u guys off roof tops. The left has used the gay community, particularly gay men and when Islam has taken over and is rounding up and murdering u guys in the most barbaric ways imaginable, the left will be sitting by sprouting out "Not all Muslims".
They use you as a shield for their shitty ideas.
Well said, sir.
JB - This your new account Milo?
I feel Eleanor Penny should be no platformed on the basis of crimes against reason, and for language abuse.
J Davies The opposite is true - crazy people and bad ideas must be exposed in public so that they can be debated and defeated; it is worse for all of us if they suppturate below the radar.
@@ciaraosullivan3755 Errr, I think irony just died.
She is insufferable. I wouldn't silence her, but my God I wish she would silence herself.
@@amandagriffin1751 Lol. I loved this
@@moonlitspider2827 Thanks. She really is garbage.
Christopher Hitchens put it best “If someone tells me that I've hurt their feelings, I say, 'I'm still waiting to hear what your point is.'
@Oners82 Great attitude! I had no idea he was dead, or when this was filmed.
Yeah well Hitchens was a mean-spirited man full of privilege and entitlement. If he understood the painful realities of the past, he would take care to not hurt the feelings of the already marginalized and oppressed, and he would listen more and talk less
@Oners82 That's right, he should use his privilege to uplift marginalized people rather than punching down against his moral superiors
@Oners82 It's not the obligation of the oppressed to explain their oppression. You should educate yourself
@@fusion772 I have a simple solution for all those marginalized people. If you are unhappy with all those white speakers, all those old dead white men hanging on the walls and all that white history. Why not just leave? Go to the University of Riyad and get a degree on trans gender studies under sharia law. Go to the University of Brazzaville and study all about the rise of African technology.
Oh that's right, that doesn't exist. There's nothing worth knowing about African history or breakthrough African technology. So in effect you are pissed off that all the great ideas in history came from those dead white men you can't stand looking at. Your problem friend is not those dead white men. Your problem is that your ancestors left you nothing worth being proud of. Your problem is not our racism, but rather your inadequacy. In short your problem is jealousy.
This was wonderful. Johnathan Haidt is a treasure. His books have had a huge impact on me.
Greatest thinker of our generation in my opinion
his attitude is superb too
Fake
Eleanor Penny can't articulate an argument to save her life.
I can't even understand what the hell point that moron is trying to make, other than 'right wing bad!' It's right wings don't want free speech, we're all in favor of it, but just for some reason we'll scream, harass, threaten, intimidate, perpetrate violence, have massive protests against you IF you use it!
Well you have to remember Haidt has a lot more experience and wisdom, like she is still very young. He has much more perspective. When you're young you don't really know what's going on. Like he has kids, he is responsible for educating students. Penny doesn't have any of that. I tried to find a bio on her but couldn't much but my guess is she just hasn't had the real world experience of being responsible for other human beings like that. She hasn't had the experience yet of realising she is fundamentally wrong on something she felt really strongly about yet. Or of seeing her ideas and perceptions change over time. Stuff like that. So her condemnation comes easy to her.
Going off her opening statement: she is basically proving Haidt correct in his description of gen z, and it is painful to watch. Like she basically is doubling down, on the kinds of things Haidt says gen z does or thinks.
Insofar as she says anything, she is saying the reason why gen z acts this way instead of developing more robust individual ability to deal with issues, is because the issues are structural. And being a stronger individual can't answer structural issues.
Whereas like the obvious answer would be there have been structural issues since the beginning of time, and basically the answer to that in all wisdom literature is: become a stronger individual. And part of Haidt and his co author's argument was based on cognitive behavioural therapy.
To be fair, you can't articulate a non-argument
The Ball, but you can articulate a terrible argument.
Exactly. She is the epitome of pseudo intellectual tryhard.
Haidt is a legend
He goes too soft on people trying to curtail free speech. He has a lot of good ideas, but he gives them too much ground.
@Abdul Hannan Abdul Matheen In some cases I agree...but there are points where he could really get at the core issues, but lays down to try and placate feelings...which just emboldens them to use those feelings arguments more.
@Abdul Hannan Abdul Matheen Hitchens was a bit of a one trick pony if we're honest. I must admit to worshipping him when I was in the adolescent phase of my atheism about 10 years ago (around the time that "The God Delusion" was fashionable), but as I developed my views he became less and less interesting to me. It's a great shame we don't have his devastating polemic wit to tackle the issues we see on our screen now. I am quite impressed with his brother, Peter, in the years since Christopher died, even if he can be a little black pilled for my taste.
Abdul Hannan Abdul Matheen may he Rest In Peace
i'm probably midway between both arguments with respect to colleges, but what gives with the snickering and sighs from people opposing Haidt. I've seen this in several videos with Haidt, and others arguing against safe spaces in colleges. I just dont get this part, and part of me thinks it speaks volumes of those people. Here's some advice to those advocating for full blown safe spaces, do not snicker or sigh while the opposing side is making their case. It makes you look immature
This Eleanor Penny has had gallons of Postmodernist Kool-Aid...
The idiocy of this woman was staggering. When she said that large political issue cannot be reduced to the personal psychological level. Where does she think politics comes from?
"Minority students are alienated in universities".
Solution: Let's alienate them further.
What could go wrong?
Incredible.
Ask an academian with a lifetime of experience of reasearch and teaching - makes sense.
Ask an barely adult activist ("journalist") and they'll jabber on for minutes uttering nothing but asinine drivel not even addressing what they were asked.
If not so sad it'd be grounds for screaming laughter...
As a woman who went through university, I can honestly say I never felt an ounce of sexism or oppression. That young woman is actually quite authoririan. She doesn't see the fascism in her own remarks!
Nazis suppressed freedom of speech. Their flag was colored red to attract the communists.
Leftists are always authoritarian, without fail. Orwell himself said, the next rise of fascism will come from the left. It makes me crazy when leftists try to invoke 1984 when talking about the right wing, when that novel was written as a cautionary insight on the LEFT gone rogue.
@@zeldagoblin Exactly!
To paraphrase the deplatforming gal, "I'm all for free speech as long as the speech I don't agree with can't be heard."
It's mostly about respect. Your boss can disrespect you but you can't disrespect him. We've actually had to write laws to limit the ability of owners and managers to disrespect their employees. You know, like when someone is maimed on the job and the boss used to just send the poor guy home to be nursed by his family. Both sides did agree that hates speech is unacceptable. So to paraphrase both sides, "I'm all for free speech as long as the speech I don't agree with can't be heard." 60% of Asians attend college; 42% of whites; 37% of African-Americans attend college; 36% of Hispanics attend college in the US. 58% of Asians; 40% of whites; 26% of African-Americans and shockingly only 18% of Hispanics attain a bachelor's degree. The success rate of blacks and Hispanics has a big drop off.
@@disnotesfoyou And this is because? Have you studied the causes for this drop or are you just assuming?
@Anonymoose 123 And why would that be? Why do you need mutual respect for free speech? Free speech gets 'strange idea's' out in the open. Without FS such idea's stay underground. Slowly burning under your feet, untill the floor gives way.
There's a difference between FS and open discussion. FS means FS! NO MATTER what you say. Prohibiting FS, language, certain words, will only mean some idea's go out of sight. They don't vanish! They still remain! You just don't see them anymore.
Keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer!!!
Yeah, there is a difference between hate speech and speech that you hate
Very bad paraphrase. It happens a lot with paraphrase.
The two coddled minds opposite Haidt repeatedly demonstrate his point.
Once again I am stuck being embarrassed by my gender listening to another woman dribble on in nonsense. Women are a majority of the population. If women don’t assert their own power, then their limitations are self imposed. Any woman living under a society based on western ideology, is the freest that woman have been in all history. As a women who majored in the sciences, completed my legal doctorate, raises my children, and tries to find a little joy in the craziness and struggle of life, which is the same for all people in context, I can’t imagine pretending I am some shrinking violet in face of masculinity.
Also, her opening statement shows her bias against reason. I wish I had the proper time to unpack it’s logical fallacies, but I have a life.
Bravo Kirstin!
Its because your a successful modern woman and these two have took there fundamental features ie race and gender and blamed racism and sexism on why they are not succeeding, your skin pigmentation, gender and sexual orientation do not hold you back in a modern western society and the easy thing to do is blame our ancestors who did some horrible things to minorities and women and even to themselves and condemn the modern world I’m so glad I didn’t go uni, It’s the only valid point a modern pupil of academia has is the price and the degrees that don’t get you a job but this made up oppression of groups are a non starter it just becomes the oppression olympics
This was beautiful
Thank you! Especially your last sentence made me smile
Trump 2020
For a girl who's so fearful of fascism, the way she speaks about de-platforming people she disagrees with, looks like shes heading down that road...
It's rather confusing that someone with extreme socialist political views would be fearful of fascism...
You have peculiar view of fascism. Fascism is defined by a militaristic and imperialist expansion with a strong nationalist base. If you think fascism is a left-wing creation, then I would wholeheartedly recommend a re-reading and analysis of post WWI Germany. I'd happily provide recommendations.
@@comradeusa8351 Maoism
I laughed out loud when she claimed "I'm actually suspicious of government". Sure you are, just like every communist stooge.
Why do you always bring up the National Socialists of Germany? Is the self hate that bad?
45:10 "it's profoundly patronizing..." says the most condescending person in the room...
Yeah, I needed to see if anyone else had to pause there. "It's profoundly patronizing..." when someone asks me to provide some evidence or even a rational justification for my opinion. My indignation IS my evidence and you must concede or I simply label you a bigot.
omg, i was thinking the same think. what a joke.
She doesn’t even address his point. Not even once. She instead went on a rant about history. She is talking about tactics when she is right before your eyes changing the topic.
@Jeffrey Lebowski Ironically the UK mainstream is actually rather oppressive if you have wrongthink opinions. A lot of the stories I've heard recently coming out of the UK are outright dystopian. Express any level of disapproval / criticism towards minorities on social media and risk literally having cops knocking on your door telling you to be 'mindful' of what you say online. ( th-cam.com/video/QK3Ix0DhSs8/w-d-xo.html )
These are the kinds of cultures people like that woman create, and the irony is totally lost on them. Sad really.
as she rolls her eyes for the 47th time. :-)))
The young woman , rabbiting on , lost me in quick time, after she finished I had not a clue what she was on about.
That Poor Young Girl is Obviously being Severely Oppressed by "S's" , "T's", "ST's" & "TH's" . I guess she never really will have free speech as much as those letters are taxing her words lol
She was a word salad. I think it was her way of having to not actually answer anything. As Einstein once said, "if you can't explain it simply, then you don't understand it well enough".
the classic 'blind with bs' approach
mostly to deflect the focus from the real problem - lack of tolerance from the Left
@@eternalreign2313 The thing is, she is parroting 3rd wave feminist dogma perfectly.
Peter Bohossian had her number a few years ago, but she is unable to deviate from scripture.
Gentlemans club? Wtf....60 percent of students are female....facts> feelings
That wasn't the point...the point was lets do a hypothetical here(not based on reality) and see if there is anyway possible we can enter the shoes of someone else...I think the moderator did awesome in helping me see the far left point of view or at least thy nodded their heads in agreement with the scenarios she presented....but I still wasnt' able to feel their pain
I love how the end was basically the audience vs. the SJWs.
You could hear it during the clapping. The people on the left got a lot less of it when they made their point. It doesn't help that they laughed at the one questioner at one point.
Dude when that black guy stood up and said in about three words that he wasn't on the dude's side I almost gave him a standing ovation. It's such a thing in the black community that if you don't accept the oppression narrative then you're basically a traitor to the race. There was something so brave about him just voicing opposition to what the guy on stage would deem to be "his own kind"
Yes. I knew they had lost when all they had left was mocking laughter.
Can I just say that this moderator is absolutely brilliant. She is perfectly balanced, fair, articulate, and informed. At times its almost as if she summarizes the speakers' position as well as if not better than the speakers themselves. Its a masterclass in moderation.
And she's way hot.
Her first words are to make a joke about Brexit to her audience, giving away her - and their - bias IMMEDIATELY
@@mogznwaz Because this was recorded in the height of brexit discussions, thus making a nice contextually accurate joke about it being a brexit free safe space. Pretty sure even most smooth brainers would understand that.
@@NeilDeBarna It was lazy pandering then and it is now.. Period.
@@mogznwaz You remind me of Kehinde Andrews, jumping on every tiny thing, pointing and shouting "see, they're biased!" When in reality, it was nothing or the sort.
No platforming is the 21st century version of book burning.
Interesting analogy...! (I thought of book-burning the other day as an analog of 8th century iconoclasm, since the Church used icons not only for venerating -- not worshipping! -- the saints/martyrs, but also for educating the faithful, before the printing press, widespread literacy, commonly available books, etc.) Hmmm....
Yes
No it's 21st century fascism. A few decide what the majority hear. They use violence if necessary and will ruin your life if you dare step out of line and dare challenge their ideology.
Universities are producing far left nut jobs who refuse to listen to anything the don't like, but instead of walking away they protest, they no platform, they use violence.
Sadly MSM hardly speaks of this over here, though i must admit i think it's starting to come to a head and to the publics attention finally.
Luckily those of us who don't go to uni don't have our head in the clouds, we don't have safe spaces to run too when some fella gives you a load of crap whilst your working as a waitress or retail worker. We have to actually go out into the real world after college or school and actually work, pay tax, whilst students spend their time getting hammered and rocking up hung over to their lectures, they pay no tax, their loans pay their bills and is all pretty much done for them.
They have no idea how much of a b###h life is, they don't understand nor want to understand peoples worries about immigration numbers, who have valid real points and concerns, yet they can't be heard because it will hurt peoples feelings...what about peoples physical health when the NHS eventually collapses because the population growth is too rapid and the NHS cannot cope with the strain (this will happen, it's not if it's when), but these concerns that are rooted in common sense if nothing else aren't being heard.
These liberal uni robots shut anyone down who tries to have a debate about it, anyone who challenges them are bigoted, racist, homophobes and best of all a fascist.
...funny the centre and right wing also liberals with common sense and a functioning brain thats able to think, don't want to shut the far left down, we want to debate, they don't want to hear so they suppress dissenters of their ideology.
@@libertasdemocratiam887 Anti Semitism is missing off your list of accusations. That's the most common term used when criticism presents them.
@@libertasdemocratiam887 That's true ... you have social media to fuck up your brains even worse. There is no more center-right. It's gone to alt-right freaks glued to their Facebook and Google accounts that call shitposting "entrepreneurship". Get into the real world.
Oh my god I am terrified to send my kids to university after listening to those two plums on the left.
Teach them to recognize dreck, read the classics with them, the great philosophers; teach them to DISCUSS.
@@susansargent396 please. Your children will do what all good children do and ignore you until they have gained enough life experience to decide what aspects of your philosophy is worth keeping and then ask you about it. Spend more time being a person your child can respect and will want to emulate some day.
@@daolong51279 What kind of parenting did you get that you that's how you think children are supposed to behave?
Your preconception that ALL parents are NOT parenting, WRONG! The advise I gave was based on experience. You may want to confront you preconceptions, since clearly they have begun confronting you! What responsibilities have you voluntarily picked up? Or are you more of the #DirtyDNC ilk? @@daolong51279
Jesus I've been a Democrat for my entire life and even my brain is trying to kill itself every time the two on the left started talking.
But this is the left today.
I couldn't be a part of it anymore.
They are against freedom!
They are not Democrats; they are twitter Bosheviks. They crave power and right now spouting such "political" gibberish gets dimwits a lot of power. Period.
I have been a lifelong leftist, but also don't call myself a leftist anymore (though morally speaking and so forth, I am slightly liberal, but mostly 'centre'). But the point, the left is going more and more extreme every year, I am becoming more and more of a right-winger without even moving... I am not wrong -- they are [far left]!
Same here but I moved Right because of them.
The democratic party left you mate.
Having your feeling hurt by 'offensive speech' will never be as bad as being fined or jailed for speech.
Brilliant idea, get a 21 year old to debate grown adults...
Please don't dismiss all 21 yo. There are plenty of mature, well rounded individuals at that age. They generally enter STEM fields though, or working hard to bring change to their family and community. I say this with confidence because I've met several.
I give her credit for joining, but that wisped away when reason was ceded by her emotional appeal as a logic argument.
The problem is, that any progressive pundit of any stature or maturity will ardently avoid such discussions. I give credit to the younger generations at least having the courage to debate people of opposing views. Granted the discussion points of these young people presented only succeeded in discrediting their own cause, but at least they were willing to take the stage.
@@msorsky1 "having the courage to debate people on opposing views". That would be valid if, in fact, she had been debating. She wasn't debating. She was proffering her perspective almost to the exclusion of anything the Rabbi was saying. At one point he posited a pretty reasonable (from my perspective) point for her to consider, and rather than speaking to it or debating it, she COMPLETELY dismissed it, and instead shifted to her own perspective and kept rolling. Anyone who wasn't paying attention could've missed it, but I suppose after watching a few of these exchanges, I've grown more and more aware of how far-left folks (and I say this as someone who's #WalkedAway...so folks, please save the silly retorts, they'll be fruitless on your part) are blatantly flippant about dismissing others points of view, regardless of how arguable or even TENUOUS their own position might be.
In this video, it is completely apparent to me that neither of the folks to the left of (or right, depending on your physical position at the event) the dais was there to engage in a debate, and only were there to proffer their point of view, or depict themselves further as victims of "the system".
Frankly, the fact that the young lady presented her position by outing herself as (perhaps, it was unclear if, in fact, she is) recovering from PTSD, was applying emotional appeal in a debate. I applaud her courage for being transparent about her circumstances and wish her well in her recovery, but frankly, it was used as a deflection mechanism (listen to it again, if you disagree) and/or an attempt to draw the audience closer to her position. If this were a real debate, the moderator should've stepped in and called it out, because generally, that is distracting from the exploration of the subject being debated.
@@msorsky1 As I've said before, I applaud her desire to step on the stage. But almost ANYONE could've done that. Step up on a stage. Courage would've been to actually prepared beforehand in the face of conflicting, opposing and challenging positions by others. Giving more beyond that is the equivalent of a "participation medal" for a sporting event. There are no "participation medals" for being an adult. You're either growing and learning, or you're not. There is no middle ground.
Haidt is good but he isn't ruthless, where is Hitchens when you need him. Indignation is required.
As a professor he can't permit himself that liberty
Gad Saad would be a good fit. He would put the two bigoted lefties in their place. I’m absolutely disgusted by their ignorant ideology. The so called professor is a disgrace.
Omg yes. How awesome would it be to have Hitchens throw a few slaps on those fragile pots
The difference between Haidt and Hitchens is that people walked away from debates with Christopher emboldened in their beliefs and truly believing that their side won, whereas there is no chance to two on stage left walked away from this debate thinking that they won. Gentle persistence is an effective tactic for actually changing minds. A meek affect can be extremely persuasive. Hitchens was exciting, but only if you already agreed with him.
@@jefftravilla Good point.
"Sitting around talking and trying to solve problems has gotten us literally nowhere in 500 years." Uh....what?
Well, in America it took a Civil War, with 360,000+ Union deaths, to move the ball from "slavery" to "freeman" for Black Americans. But that's literally NOWHERE.
Their lack of logic is astounding.
So glad I'm not the only one that noticed that. What the actual fuck is this guy on?
@@stanbartsch1984 Well, if you want to be technical the Civil War wasn't ONLY for slavery. it was primarily for principle of States' Rights and taxation. But you could also say that they weren't "freemen". They weren't slaves but weren't free and you could say talking and solving problems did work because you had "I Have a Dream" "Malcom x speech", and "Brown v. Board of Education".
"The university is the market and the market is racism. " what the hell am I listening to?
I’m debating wether my last brain cell can survive the second half of this dumpster fire
These woke heroes want a genocide
If that black guy is a professor then we are all done with universities, nothing serious can come out of such a feeble man.
I know, can you believe it? He is a professor!!!!!! And he has access to young minds. That should scare the pants off sane people.
@@gordonthefreeman Ah, a classic Hitchens quote.
He was on GMB a while ago claiming the English Flag was a symbol of racism, when pushed he had to give the crusades as an example, despite the English Flag having not been used at that period.
@@gordonthefreeman i disagree. Give him all the platform he wants. Sunlight is the best disinfectant.
@@icecell platform to speak yes, platform to teach, fuck no
one side: blatant racists demanding authorities give them special protection for arbitrary conditions.
other side: bringing facts, research, history and logic to argue for freedom and the unique conditions that enabled us to prosper and free ourselves from authority.
hmmmmm this wasn't a "battle" this was a slaughter.
Free speech is a human right, not a special condition for only certain people. It's a universal principle.
I was there. The two idiots completely lost the audience. Towards the end no one applauded their racist, bigoted nonsense. They were dreadful and I felt so ashamed that they were all we had to offer to debate the two great and compassionate minds of Haidt and Sachs.
Adults arguing with children.
@Dwaine Castle ironically fox news is the only lame-stream entity that has it's toe in the water of truth, their pundits are obviously monitoring alternative-media for their talking points. your talking point was true in the early '90's now... not so much. the mainstream are dying and that is like the sword being dulled, the elites will not have that.
"as an academic..." lol, in gender studies?
Really she is a spoiled young shithole with trained dramatic voice and I really don't know what she ll become in a decade or two
Eleanor Penny sounds like she’s on the verge of tears every time she speaks.
She is totally wet anyway.
she wants everyone in the room to adopt their behavior to her personal pain/hangups. it's authoritarianism presenting itself as a victim. should be shamed... it's how evil manifests.
To me it seemed more like nervousness. I doubt she has ever spoken for such a large audience in a debate.
She's not much of an advertisement for UCL...
"deeply oppressive culture"s do not allow the oppressed to sit on a literal stage and lecture the oppressors of how evil they are.
I thought the same thing
@NAREK ARUTYUNYAN You're not quite right about that. The cleverest oppressive systems *DO* allow certain forums for token "dissent" which are no threat to those in power.
(1)Apartheid South Africa's white-only parliament had regular denunciations of National Party governments by the mostly English-speaking opposition.
When the apartheid police killed black people in custody (often), the system allowed inquests which exposed the most horrific details _ but always exonerated the police.
(2)Pre-independence Ireland was a system of crushing oppression for the vast majority, by British rule. But after Catholic Emancipation and particularly from the time of Parnell, the British Parliament had no problem with allowing Irish representatives to protest about their people's grievances _ which British governments, for the most part, then ignored.
(3)Palestinians live under a system of deep discrimination, which among other things, involves large numbers of civilians being killed by aerial bombing.
Yet one of Israel's highest judges is a Palestinian, and some Palestinians are allowed to vote in Israeli elections, making up roughly 20 to 25% of the voters.
Few Palestinians would regard these concessions as meaning that they are not living under oppression.
@@nicholassaint5149 All well, but not the case here!
I just wish this would have been said to the speakers in the left
great moderator, take every statement and ask a challenging question from the other side, beautifully socratic
Best moderator I've ever seen if I'm being honest
@@Mart-Bro Maybe on this video but if you see her on BBC she's a left-wing poster girl. Watch her interview with the Polish ambassador.
@@watto3535 people will have their biases. The best we can do is praise them when we agree with their behaviour (here, it was great), and rebuke when the behaviour is less admirable (according to you, the interview with Polish). This is how people adjust - by the carrot and the stick - albeit, here, they are upvotes & downvotes :D
"I don't want you to be safe ideologically or emotionally. I want you to be strong. I'm not going to take the weights out of the gym..."
"This is the gym..."
Not Sparta, although those guys definitely had a great gym! 😄
That quote was heaviest take away of this debate? ? ?
Haidt nailed it. The two on the left kept proving his point lol
@@nildaluzrodriguez what's your take?
The irony of this young girl sharing a public forum panel with Jonathan Haidt attempting to argue against the platforming of “right wing” voices in fear of legitimizing those views is astounding
The young woman on stage is a PERFECT example of the emotional immaturity & instability that Haidt has described. A Perfect Exhibit A. She's a jumble of emotion, I feel, I feel, my feeling are hurt....hardly a way to handle oneself at an intellectual institution - the opposite of rational thought.
I feel I must agree with you
@@mistermelorious I feel I must take a shit. I will let you know how I feel afterwards.
@@whirled_peas How was it? We're here when you need to talk.
@@Bejaardenbus I fainted half way through and now I have PTSD. I have an appointment with my state-funded defecation trauma specialist, and the shite has been ordered to attend empathy classes so it may never oppress another arsehole again. #EverydayShitism
@@whirled_peas I'm very happy to hear that you're getting help.
The only diversity the progressives dislike is diversirty of thought
any thought actually in this case
George Orwell didn't see this coming.....he thought he was writing a work of Fiction in "1984".
Keep it away from Eleanor, she will think it's a textbook.
Nah, he saw it coming. Just because technology changes, Authoritarians remain the same. This is simply the cycle of humanity.
It was never fiction
@48:54 the Rabbi really brings in a fresh new perspective: "I get it - that you [ Gen Z ] live in a harder world in some ways, that you are rightfully angry. The question, though, is how do you use that anger to actually get people to listen to you?"
Johnathan Haidt made them look bad. They're arguing against the guy who wrote the book and wrote it well.
If the guy on the far left ( no pun intended) switched the words "black" and "white" within everything he said, he would be arrested...
In the UK lol yeah. Not the U.S
Here we have free speech.
Shadow Ling free speech ?
Think I remember that from my childhood....
I can't believe that he is allowed to spew this divisive & racist stuff.
I saw him on the BBC once.
He feels very triggered by these flags 🇬🇧 🏴 although he chooses to live in the UK, he wants them banned.
He is a privileged black man in the UK, because by their laws he should be arrested for hatespeech.
@@shadowling77777 IN the Us he would be killed.
and when they run out of things to say that make sense they bring up slavery ... like i thought that went away 150 years ago.. wah my great great great great great great dad owned yours. wah.. so that now excuses them of being racist themselves.. let me state 2 things.. one.. i have never been a racist.. two. never owned anybody. get off the slavery thing. jesus. go back 1800 yrs. im sure my rallies could of been roman slaves.. .. have they stopped to think the reason why people treat them (both off them sitting on the left) differently is because they are pretty fu cking annoying..
The two sitting on the left: angry, emotional and incoherent.
The two sitting on the right: Charming, poised and lucid.
They are oppressed and will always choose to be.
Don't diss thier choice of career.
@@robtalbot3852 That Poor Young Girl is Obviously being Severely Oppressed by "S's" , "T's", "ST's" & "TH's" .
wisdom comes with age
@@thetayterminator1436 and the ugly stick too!! I'm so tired of people all crying about how life isn't fair...boo hoo...poor me...poor me ...pour me another. I can't listen to any more of this...and I need a trigger warning from these people because of the anxiety I'm feeling about people who want to stifle free speech and therefore I am censoring them...hows THAT for more of their walking contradiction. Leftism is a mental illness. People just look for reasons to be offended.
@@newsletter4826 true shit son
God she is so lost and everyone there is so polite to her, she needs a hug and then an eduction to help her grow up.
No, what she needs is something very different, but what it is, I cannot say.
I knew that the guy on the far left was crazy when he started doing identity politics within the first 10 seconds of him speaking.
It was more than just identity politics, it was racist. He charged the entire audience and panel with "white fragility" and pissed on the pillars of our great civilization by calling them "dead white men". No white person could ever say the same thing to a black.
@@jonnyw82 i wondered if one of those dead white men may had been William Wilberforce, i doubt he's ever heard of him.
I loved the black dude, was the only one tha made any sense.
Just imagine the argument the black professor would have if he didn’t play identity politics or the race card. He would have nothing to say
Crazy? Nah, he was just close-minded and not able to see problems from different angle than his own.
Ideas don't cease to exist by being silenced.
When the pen is removed the sword becomes inevitable.
Deus vult brother
That's horrifyingly beautiful.
Brilliant
you've been hit by, you've been struck by the thought criminal
The pen is mightier than the sword. Yes they were not silenced just given the assumption that what they speak is the truth as nobody would listen to or confront them with facts. Thus their pen is allowed to work unimpeded, and unchallenged.
Oh my god.... Why are Haidt and Sacks put in front of this depressingly delirious dynamic duo?
"author and (pro-authoritarianism) activist Eleanor Penny, and sociologist Kehinde Andrews, one of the UK’s leading (racist) thinkers on race and the history of racism."
It's absurd that it's become accepted to be openly racist and authoritarian under the pretense of fighting the invisible army of nazi-racist-biggots, Maybe if Penny and Andrews took a long hard look in the mirror they would finally find them.
In essence, to immerse oneself in any framework of thought within which the leading conceptual principles are anchored in ' racial' group distinctions (ultimately at the expense of both the concept of the individual and any form of personal responsibility/agency/sovereignty), will take most people down the road of ruin that will take you as far as the limits of self-deception allow you to.
@Ulf ViKings I'm awkward with any compliment but thanks nonetheless hahaha
Honestly - because they have no real intellectuals to argue for them
@@filemot25 I guess you're right. I honestly have no idea how you could reasonably disagree with Haidt on this matter, he's one of the most respectful, considerate, nuanced, balanced and moderate intellectuals i've come across so far.
I love how at the very end Haidt is basically like, guys this whole thing is kind of a waste of time and your college years would be better spent elsewhere. 1:24:30
Give me strength! If only God would resurrect Christopher Hitchens for this debate.
No need, there's Peter.
@@freethinker4liberty No disrespect to Peter, but he couldn't hold a candle to his late brother. If Christopher was resurrected to join the panel, all you would remember from the debate in 5 years would be the hitchslaps.
It does not take Hitchens to dismantle these imbeciles. It would be a complete waist to resurrect Hitch for this, he'd probably Hitchslap you for raising him from the depths of hell and wasting his time.
@@Steve_Just_Steve It apparently wasn't a waste of his time to take apart equally idiotic ideas encroaching on liberties in his time. And nobody said it takes a genius to show regressives are wrong, it's just that Hitch would make it more fun.
I hear you. I miss him so much.
These comments cheer me up. Knowing others care about the free exchange of ideas over feelings and grievances gives me faith in humanity.
They show me how fucking stupid Conservatives are, forever whining about everyone else's wrongdoing other than their own. Trump is the perfect example of what is SO WRONG with the USA right now.
And the ONLY chance our Country has is if Biden wins in November. Otherwise, the virus will NEVER end under Trump and unemployment is gonna never get better. Trump has no clue how to put Americans back to work. Obama had done that work for him, the first half of his Coup attempt with Putin.
He's gonna be arrested, the moment he loses in November, so I"m looking forward to see him taken in to custody and thrown in prison with his horny black cellmate BUBBA!
BUBBA will show Trump how RAPE IS REALLY DONE! He's had plenty of experience.
@@ColonPal how on earth did you get what you said from what the first comment said.
@@leelahasan3988 Thanks for asking Leela, I was giving a warning to all Americans that Trump's attacks on Freedom of speech is a terrible thing and LUCKILY people believed my comment and elected Biden, so I"m SO GRATEFUL THAT I MADE THAT COMMENT 7 months ago or Joe could have not won.
The reason I wrote it is because Biden is president today. Thanks for giving me the opportunity to educate you. You can thank me later.
@@ColonPal
Congratulations!
You've won the "most arrogant comment of the week" award!
You've also been entered for a chance to win the "Most arrogant comment of the year" award!
Well done and keep up the overconfidence!
i didn’t mean to dislike your comment my b
She lost me at “Deeply Oppressive Society.”
surely its more oppressive to silence people than to let them spew whatever they want
Yes, she lost me at many points, but "profoundly patronizing" was where i started fast forwarding through her.
For me, it was 'PTSD'. She's having vietnam flashbacks of the time she was wolf whistled.
@@leskobrandon691 ...which she said in a profoundly patronizing way.
I’d love to see what she calls the Atlantic slave trade.
She said she had a PTSD diagnosis. She should research PSG -post traumatic growth. At some point, you need to deal with it and grow from any trauma, not stay stuck on it, seeing it and feeling it all the time.
But why? People wear PTSD as a badge of honor. It's like the "Get out of jail free" card in Monopoly.
When a 1 and a half hour video starts with *"open your mind to censorship"* ... you know its gonna be stupid as hell.
Doesnt she see the irony of that statement?
Yet, what is with all the likes? I can only assume the answer to that is a resounding no, right?
I was just about to quit it when she said that stupid sh!te. I am only 5 minutes in, so I hope it gets better.
@Jochanan Berohart deleted that idiotic pro-censorship statement. Just as well, I was about to tell 'em just how ignorant he/she was.
I am straining to be open to censorship---it hurts. I'm going with the benefit of the doubt that there is some sort of logic to that line of thinking. I'm not too good with history but censorship never seemed like a path out of oppression.
The moderator is definitely bias to the left. You can imagine the outrage if she was thoughtfully jotting down the comments from the older Caucasian man, then pointed at the black student to hurry her thoughts along. Trust me, it's not only conservatives paying attention to sh¡t like that.
Watching any of her forays into interviewing intellectual opponents, on YT is a thoroughly uncomfortable experience & confirms her immovability beyond her orthodox leftism.
You can see immediately which side is arguing from emotion and not logic.
That's very apparent in this debate, I agree. The lady sitting to the right hand of the facilitator particularly makes emotional arguments.
These 2 kids are the proof of what Haidt is saying.
absolutely
Amen.
Yes and the more they spoke, the more they proved his point
I don't think the young woman's two mom's would agree with that.
@@joemendiuk5683 Hahaha!
We can mostly agree that only Haidt and Sacks were the rational people in this debate.
Of course. I knew that before I clicked play. The black man did nothing but complain about white men. Racism. Racism. Racism. So tired.
Considering how left-wing I am myself, the people on the left are impossible to even listen to. I'm having to skip through their sections because of the lack of substance. They're saying a hell of a lot for people who aren't actually saying much.
I was looking forward to a genuine debate
all the same, what a great opportunity to put their weak position in it's place. I've been enlightened having heard these two men on the right side.
Maybe you're classical liberal, or say libertarian?
Those seem to be on the right now. Center has moved )))
@@adrianalexandrov7730 Exactly bro
I'm a liberatrian/classical liberal too, which used to be at the centre-left in 19th and 20th centuries.
But recently, this position has been shifted to the centre-right.
@@amanshukla8758 I find this left-right dichotomy misleading.
Political trichotomy seem to be closer to reality
th-cam.com/video/nQF4NZxT0ps/w-d-xo.html
@@adrianalexandrov7730 Damn right mate
I do think the trichotomy is actually much more accurate than the dichotomy
However there's also a rhombus-shaped spectrum
Just telling
ELEANOR PENNY SPEAKS GIBBERISH
@Dwaine Castle The right is mostly about emotion based hatred like this. That's clear from the comments here. They live in a world of hatred, false online accounts, doxxing, and online bullying. Sad.
@@soulscanner66 The comments here are no more representative of right leaning people in the wider world than the infantile screechings of Evergreen College social justice activists are of the left in general. It's a bit of a hackneyed cliché to point out how social media invites hateful interactions, we've all known this for years, it's what they are designed bottom-up to do; so obviously they will attract the worst fringes of all sides.
@ I haven't seen any SJW's go on a shooting rampage yet or drive their car into a crowd of protestors. Really, all they've done so far is smash a few Starbucks windows and torch a few police cars at G7 rallies. That needs to be handled with criminal charges, but it's pretty clear that it's alt-right ideologies that are translating the online hate into terror attacks on innocent people; the reality here is now undeniable. You act as an apologist for this alt-right online hate, yet here is nothing justified or normal about it. It's an old right-wing trope that people just won't accept anymore as the hate attacks multiply.
@@soulscanner66 These are disgusting attacks and I wouldn't be so stupid as to offer a defence to any of them.
Edit: Again with the presumption of my position.
I would add that for every 10 islamic attacks, there is a right wing white guy doing the same, so yes, as one increases so does the other in proportion.
I don't count school shootings in the USA as they are obviously a different beast altogether and seem to be completely indiscriminate.
I am so pleased to see the students challenging the younger speakers. I found a lot of what I heard from the left side to be borderline nasty with a sugar coating, regardless of the experiences they may have had to bring them to their conclusions. They're not ready to give straight answers to these questions without insulting the questioners.
Professional victims - vs - Professionals.
No contest really.
This comment wins
This is like a street fight between Joe Rogan and a 22 year old college girl who identifies as a male MMA fighter. The question isn't who will win. The question is whether Joe will make it a point to humiliate her or try to avoid it.
@@michaelm3691 I'm inclined to believe that the two SJWs are so convinced by their convictions that no amount of humiliation, counter points, or truths would alter their mindset.
@@WomanNextDoor Yup. Unfortunately, the only thing they aren't dumb about is recognizing that these things do alter the mindset of *other* people. That's why they want to control the debate.
@@michaelm3691 I always think of this Marxist/socialist crap as corrupting the hard drive (the brain), no matter how much you try to erase it, it still leaves a permanent stain.
"Activist Journalist" is an oxymoron, either you're reporting the facts, or you're giving your opinion, but to these kids it's the same thing.
It's also interesting that one side has actual academics and studies, and the other side has people who only give their opinions without any facts.
At least left wingers overwhelmingly believe the scientific community when it comes to the single most important issue of this century.
Hmmm well sadly for this poor girl the only career that further education has equipped her for is to be a professional activist.
Have we reached a utopia in which we no longer require anyone to actually be productive?
Well, you could be an activist and only report facts. It's all a matter of which facts you think are important to prioritize in reporting. Since there's no way to objectively prove which facts should be reported, and you can't report on everything, in that sense, non-activist journalism isn't really possible.
That said, it's absolutely true that what passes for journalism these days overwhelmingly de-prioritizes facts altogether in favor of narrative, And justifies the practice with "journalism can't be objective" as if that permits the bait & switch
@@gordonthefreeman I didn't say anything about partisanship. I'm right there with you on that.
I was just pointing out that every reporter has to choose which stories to cover and which facts are relevant. Even if all the reporting is truthful, the selection of what the people see will inevitably reflect what the reporter cares about and will therefore shape the implicit message the consumer receives. That process can be partisan or non partisan in how it shakes out, but it's inevitable.
@@grovertigo Yes Lovs, you could be an activist and only report facts but there would be an implicit bias in your 'narrative' . Sometimes its the facts that are omitted that obfuscate the truth.
A journalist by definition should be free from bias and report all the facts.
In law withholding evidence is just as much an obstruction of justice as fabricating evidence.
Any attempt at deception is the same as a lie, regardless if it is done through delivering false information or the omission of critical information.
People don't get away with flat out lies much anymore, but the omissions of truth from all sides is massively on the increase.
Like in this debate, the side arguing that slavery is the the problem and thats why they demonize white people, fail to also mention that slavery largely was ended by white people.
Elanor espouses authoritarianism while saying fascism is dangerous...🤨
The young woman is not even willing to have a conversation.
She's a perfect target as a future hijab wearing woman. She's that broken - probably willing to believe that a symbol of oppression is actually a symbol of freedom to choose.
@@SurpriseMeJT The right does not use argument to engage intellectually. The right uses arguments to personally destroy people emotionally. Conservative are not what they used to be. This is clear to anyone who reads this thread. That's why they support fascism. They've learned from the fascists.
@@SurpriseMeJT The right sacrifice constitutional guarantees just because they hate Muslim women. They would sacrifice the West's most cherisshed ideals because of their emotiponal hatred of Muslim women. This type of violent feelings they intentionally inflame onlin is dangerous. It's intersting how the right assumes that Muslim women are rightful targets of their hate.
@@soulscanner66 I'm not traditionally on the right, but I've certainly left the Left. Why? women are great apologizers for their oppressors, just look at abused women who believe that their abusive mates are still caring people which the women love. This is what Islam does to women - turns them into victims of abuse by men.
Both political party sides have ideologies supported by members that are apprehensible. Islam needs to be eradicated from our countries, because it's not freedom, it's submission and oppression. I speak from years of personal experience with Muslims. I am at the point where I believe that support of Islamic beliefs of any kind in treason - yes, it's that opposing to western constitutions, republics, democracies or any other system not Islamic.
Eleanor Penny and Kehinde ‘I’m black’ Andrews are truly representative of everything I loathe about today’s society.
Worst "non-discussion" I've ever suffered through. Guy on far left, instantly plays up the victim role and goes downhill from there.The two on the left are all about "self". Me, me, me. Nothing at all to contribute. I'm a victim of prejudice.
So what's wrong with being a victim if you are a victim? How about not blaming victims but instead the perpetrator?
@@yueotsutsuki4553 Nothing wrong with it. Unless there is no real 'perpetrator', but only an overly sensitive 'victim'. You shouldn't be afraid to talk to a woman, because you might say something offensive, if the 'offense' is something normal. Like saying 'have a look' to a blind person. You a: aren't always (immediately) able see that someone is blind, and b: most blind people want you to talk 'normal'. It's usually other people that find it awkward.
I'm not talking about things that are commonly seen as offensive. I'm talking about people with very long toes, that are almost hoping you'll say or do something they can make a fuss about. So, I'm not talking about real bullying, sexist behaviour and that kind of unlawful behaviour or behaviour generally found unacceptable (like slapping a woman's butt), but things like being called the wrong gender by accident (what happened to me regularly, when I had long hair. Despite my beard :) ). It sometimes seems being the oddball is the standard today and everyone is very, very very, entitled. But nobody talks about the duty that goes with rights and nobody talks about the responsibility that comes with priviledge.
For me it's all a sign of decadence. Through history there's war. Not that I want war, but kids today have such luxury lives. They are spoiled rotten and can't handle any criticism. A war makes people aware of what's important and what's not. People who don't accept reality die and after the war everybody who's survived is very busy getting thing up and running again. It makes people humble. Now compare to the spoiled kids who think it's a crime if someone says something 'offensive' to them. Not DO something offensive, but just and only SAY something 'offensive'. If those offensive things are also seen as not offensive to 99% of people, than there is something going very wrong in society. It can and may never be that the few rule the many. Not in a democracy! And might you think there's no spoiling in kids today. Muscle mass of todays young generations is 30-40% less than kust 30 yrs ago. Twelve year olds have diabetes type 2, are obese, need physiotherapy for their necks and backs caused by smart phone use. Kids make hundreds to even thousands of selfies a day. How narcissistic can you get?
And what's the gain? Cause people who do really offend are not going to think differently because a word is forbidden. So we got the N-word, the G-word, etc., etc. Does it mean there is no discrimination anymore? I can call my mate an *sshole without offending him. Why? Cause he knows my intentions! There is trust that I mean to tease him, not offend him. It's the way I say it that makes the difference. Today everyone has long toes and if you drop even a feather on those sensitive toes ....... Because they are programmed (brought up) to distrust and seek offense in everyone and everything and they're 'entitled'!
We have a comedian here that made a sketch (in the 1970's) about a guy telling a joke. After starting with: There were 2 Chinese walking in the park. He gets an telephone call. The caller is offended because it's about 2 Chinese and that it's discriminating. 2nd Call is about walking in the park, disturbing the birds or some BS. Everytime the guy adjusts his story to match the caller's demands. So, you can imagine the story falls completely apart and at the end, the last caller says: wouldn't the joke be much better if it was about 2 Chinese walking the park, etc., etc.. At which pont the storyteller tries to pull put his hair and is pulled offstage by men in white doctor's clothes. Get my drift? If you let this thrive, you'll end up with an Orwellian society, where everyone is afraid to say anything to anyone. Life isn't always fun and cetainly never fair. The sooner you learn, the better you'll be able to cope.
They are filled with a lot of hate, and i dont think they can build anything lasting good out of that
@@arturama8581
Nice comment. About the most famous comedian in Belgium made a similar joke. People complaining about his joke, so then he had to adjust it, and in the end cuz of the adjustments it became an even more offensive joke. It's not possible to translate the joke into english alas.
@@arturama8581 brilliantly phrased! As a 21 y/o crazed by the current “woke” culture gaining momentum around me.. I agree with every word of yours 💯
It’s been maddening, listening to their hate and their rhetorics. And at just 21, I’m gravely concerned about the future generation. It’s a downward spiral from genZ
This was painful to watch. And I managed without a trigger warning. Jonathan and Jonathan speak truth.
Queen of the Uetliberg oh my gosh it’s torture listening to the young girl who thinks she has it all figured out. Need more Jonathan’s and less of miss safe spaces
Are you sure? Sounds like you could've needed one if it was so painful.
The highlight was when the audience member calls out Eleanor Penny as a Fascist (because she is) and then she was absolutely flabbergasted that anyone could possibly think that.
It just goes to show how out of touch she truly is.
The level of special stupid on the left is shocking!
she said: those who fail to learn from history are naive(pharaphrasing ofcourse) well she then is naive
She struck me as way out of her depth up there alongside some high calibre minds, yet she still sits on that platform. So much for being disadvantaged...
Can anybody point out at what time in the video that happened? I can't force myself to listen to her. I tried, I just can't.
@@h4rq try 107:35 during the Q&A
I’m a gay female. I 100% believe in all sides having a platform. If we shut people down, that’s big trouble. I would go see Steve Bannon if he spoke at my University. I would also partake in the Q & A session and challenge him on anything I felt he was off base on. That’s true progress… listening to one another and having hard conversations. I see these people who claim to be speaking and acting on my behalf, and they are showing up to academic lectures and banging on cowbells and chanting over speakers so no one can hear them. It’s disgusting. Massively immature. Let people speak and then hold them accountable. And most importantly, find some common ground. Intersectional division never ends. I can find countless ways to describe how the people I encounter on a daily basis are NOT like me, but the healing begins when we look for ways we ARE ALIKE and things we can agree on.
Someone needs to explain what the “violence” means to that professor
Did anyone tell the black gentleman it's 2019? He thinks it's 1940.
He won't believe you! He talks like someone who thinks slavery ended in 1991
If only.
more like 1834
Wouldn't it be before 1841 since he is from britain ?
@ETA4 And you are not a victim of Nazi either...how do you know that Nazi is brutal? Only western said so suddenly it's a fact? Maybe Nazi is a good organization, then criminalize by western to make them look really bad
You owe me something because of my melanin level/and or genitalia/and or sexual orientation/and or religious ideology. This is a bizarre dichotomy nestled inside a marxist lens of divide and concur, instead of principled reason.
Marxism is founded in principled reason.
+
RBGHfam Well said man...
That isn't Marxism he was very strongly against division hence 'workers of the world unite', marx was deeply against minority identity politics as it detracted from class, which unites the vast majority of the population. If you don't like something it doesn't make it Marxism
No, if Conservatives weren’t such cunts and just let people live there’d be no arguments, just differing levels of apathy about things.
@@ALphaMach1ne This is some next level ostriching right here.
every time I see eleanor penny on anything im absolutely mystified as to how she got an invitation
She got more than 1?
"To say that university students reason purely from emotion is just untrue." Proceeds to make hyperbolic emotional statements.
Thank you, Jonathan and Jonathan for sacrificing IQ points for humanity.
Props to viewers also (it’s cost me a handful of IQ points just listening)
@@ChristianHunter it cost me a peaceful state of mind...and it's all the video's fault
They are absolute heroes for sitting through this
I'm pretty sure Jonathan Lord will spread his ass cheeks to deplatform anyone who criticizes Israel or Judaism.
@Stone Cold I'm pretty sure Tel Aviv is the gay capital of the world so they clearly choose that lifestyle over Torah in Israel.
I’m sick of the specious word games these left wing racists spout; word salad. Reducing every human interaction to power relationships
If all there is, is power relations, then how can they even condemn Nazis? There must be something else.
If you assume that all human relationships are adversarial, then we can never progress as a species. That's the problem with conflict theories.
If the statistic he quoted (100 out of 18,000 UK professors are black) is accurate, Andrews is mad that 5.5% of all UK professors are black - when black people make up only 3% of the general population, i.e. almost double representation.
The professor on the left shows his immaturity ,when he does his head shakes,while others are saying their stuff,what a lousy proff
Cyber Bruiser unfortunately, some professors are hired for...never mind...
My GOD...she doesn’t think Steve Brannon believes in free speech, so she doesn’t want him to speak at universities. Do these ppl even listen to themselves??
THANK YOU! I thought I was going mad there for a moment. Why didn’t someone on that panel point out the irony there? Or at least start giggling? 🤯
Bill Maher interviewed Steve Bannon. He was quite pleasant and reasonable throughout the conversation. I think she could learn something from him.
@@lowfrequency1180 Eric, Bannon is a fucking liar, he won't expose his true thoughts because he's said he wants to UNDO the Civil Rights movement and eliminate half of the Constitution which makes him a tRAITOR to the USA. Now that Trump fired him, he's trying to pretend to be on the side of the Constitution, but he's already been exposed as a racist/nationalist/traitor scumbag just not as fucked up as Trump!
Bob Judd Umm, you can’t even have a civil discussion and yet you think anything else you say carries any weight whatsoever? Grow the fuck up and learn how to converse respectfully. I am sorry I didn’t catch the typo in Bannon’s name, thank God a noble spirit came along to insult me into a typo-free life, as I’m sure he’s already done. The absolute BEST part of all this is that I don’t even like trump. I simply questioned ONE COMMENT made by ONE GUY and you got triggered somehow. Political crack is bad for you, you know, so you might want to lay off so you can gain enough clarity to accept one fundamental truth: no matter who gets elected or whether or not that person has an R or a D next to his name, we end up with the same shit. It’s a fact. If you’re pissed off about “Trumps America”, take it up with your congressmen bc trump alone doesn’t have enough power to do a damned thing should congress actually do their jobs, so stop hyper-focusing on trump, open your eyes, and see reality for what it is. Do you really think it’s an accident neither party never TRULY gets anything accomplished? Bc you should know that’s statistically impossible. And while I dislike Trump, Biden is a moron who’s being used, his VP is more significant and so far she’s a scary bitch, so tell me how one side is any better than the other? You can’t. But as long as you keep pretending that conservatives or trump is the problem while ignoring the mess in your own house, you will do nothing more than continue to contribute to everything you just climbed on your rent-a-soapbox to bitch about, and that’s just sad. If you can’t do any better than “stupid bitch” any time someone DARES to speak their own minds, then fuck right on off bc nobody cares, and nobody will if you keep substituting your ideological lunacy for a valid argument. News flash, sunshine, but you don’t actually know everything, and the ppl you disagree with most often know something you don’t, so try shutting up and listening for a minute, maybe you’ll learn how to be civil.
Bob Judd and one more thing just bc I can’t allow this kind of stupidity to stand-ITS A FUCKING VIRUS. Maybe you should learn how those work before you accuse anyone of being “responsible” for it bc that’s a pathetically stupid thing to say. By your logic, Obama was responsible for every flu death during his tenure, and that’s about half a million Americans at least. Guess what, genius? There’s no stopping a virus. Only one virus has ever been eradicated from the planet and that’s smallpox. Let me let you in on a little secret about yourself-you believe dumb shit like “trumps a racist” and “trump killed ppl with coronavirus” bc you WANT to believe it, not because it’s true, accurate, or rational. I’ll leave you with one more fun fact-during the 2008-2009 financial crash, more than 250,000 ppl died of cancer bc they couldn’t get treatment due to the economic state we were in. Are you blaming Obama for that like you’re blaming trump? Or are you just a hypocrite armed with propaganda and he’s too unwilling to even notice? I’m guessing it’s the latter, but who knows.
2 adults on the right.
2 stunted adolescents on the left.
Vice versa dumb-fuck.
Bob Judd you May very well be right, but couldn’t you have argued it with a bit more substance? Because as it is you illustrate William H’s point for him
It is difficult for me to believe that the 2 on the left were the best that could be provided for this debate\lecture. The girl has great difficulty in constructing a rational statement and the fellow is incredibly racist and sees everything through that lens. The adults on the right provide well structured statements, educated answers and focused entirely on the subject, with no prejudice.
@@davidprince1138 - Well said.
Adults are to the viewers' right, right? ;-)
Eleanor Penny's use of language - "cry of pain" - is itself very manipulative, Machiavellian and misleading here. she is also engaging in straw-manning her opponents, since literally no one is saying that university students reason solely from emotion, only that it is one among many factors.
Her language, assumes that victimization, is itself aways victimization, and not either propaganda and/or a weaponization of victimization for personal and/or political purposes. This is also a "historical tactic that has been used to silence dissent and to get people to shut up basically," Ms. Penny.
And yours is the "convenient narrative" which you are "inculcating" here and this invites a "damaging framework" right here.
Moreover, whose private pain matters to the left and the woke? That of Ayaan Hirsi Ali, who has been publicly shamed and bullied and ostracized and humiliated and censored and silenced and repressed by the left, banned from discussing how she was violently physically and sexually tortured as a child? And that even one left-winger, claimed she deserved this assault and torture as a child? Is that Penny's view, that Hirsi Ali deserved to be tortured as a child? If not, why not condemn the left-winger who made this bullying remark? Does Hirsi Ali's "private pain" matter too, Ms. Penny?
I think I know what your answer would be: a resounding: no.
24:20 yikes. Straight out the gate with the postmodern drivel. At least take me to dinner first
And there it is with the white male fragility whereas white men are attacked on the regular by mental midgets who want to use their skin color as a cudgel for argument.
Actually, that was the very 1st time i saw leftists dare to participate in a public debate. Great progress already!-)
Thanks. And also the two Johnathans are always pleasure to hear, although i'm a biased jew;)