ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ก.ค. 2024
- Element RC Ecto. Element RC Gatekeeper. These are two RC rock crawlers that are nearly exactly the same!
Same wheels. Same tires. Only two differences: the Gatekeeper's body is about 300g or 10oz heavier, and the GK also has bent/high-clearance front lower links.
Who will win on the comp course? Let's test!
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Small mistake at 7:14 - when the Ecto clears that finish gate, my 'scorekeeper' shows -10 in green when it should have shown -2. The score at the top is correct; this is only a cosmetic error. Noting to address any confusion. Sorry about that!
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Buy them here:
Ecto: asiate.es/aff?l=194761&i=76070
GK RTR: asiate.es/aff?l=188573&i=76070
Element RC Gatekeeper Kit: www.asiatees.com/display?Elem...
Manufacturer pages here:
Ecto: www.associatedelectrics.com/e...
Gatekeeper: www.associatedelectrics.com/e...
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Chapters:
0:00 Ecto vs Gatekeeper
2:13 Ecto Lap
7:26 Gatekeeper Lap
11:44 Results
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Follow us:
Website: rc-tnt.com/
Twitter @rctrailandtech and on Instagram:
/ rctrailandtech
WHERE TO BUY RC STUFF:
Buy kits, models & upgrades here: www.asiatees.com/shop-now?rc_...
Send money directly to people living in extreme poverty (lets combine our resources to help those most in need):
community.givedirectly.org/ca...
#rccrawling, #rcreview, #elementecto, #elementgatekeeper, #elementrc, - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
I did this with my Gatekeeper by replacing the cage with a body. For me, the biggest difference was when side-hilling. The cage would cause it to roll in a few situations where the lexan body didn't. But I find that I like the look of the cage enough to leave it on. I used the Ecto body on my Trailwalker which helped it to perform better than the original body. I also added more weight to the axles on the Gatekeeper and switched over to SOA to help compensate for the weight of the cage. Things worked out very well. Good video.
Ah very good, thanks for taking the time to outline your experiences there. Much appreciated.
Interesting! From the little crawling experience I have ao far, I find that a top heavy vehicle is worse for steep angle climbs, but from your video I gather that in certain cases it seems like that body extra weight definitely helps with a better planted rock climb!
You're close to an interesting point that I think many overlook, actually: broadly speaking, crawling is all about traction. And there's a tension between pressing the tires into the rock for grip (ie. with more weight) and with overcoming gravity and ascending over the rocks (ie. keeping the rig lightweight).
The solution to such a paradox is one of compromise, from the cheaper home fixes to the professional crawling rigs: get the car and ideally the wheels as light as possible, but then pack a significant amount of static weight on the outer corners of the front axles. This combination seems to be the most generally useful across a range of obstacles.
However, there are many less optimal solutions that still offer some advantages over a stock rig. The most common one is to add heavier wheels. You will get the benefit of improving the center of gravity and you get more 'press' onto the tires, improving traction. However, higher rotational mass comes at a cost of more wear on the drive line, less immediate punch when you want it, more heat in the motor and shorter runtime. But it's effective enough to still be worthwhile, including for me on some of my comp rigs (the Scale-1 / C1 rigs in particular).
Coming back to this video here, the GK is simply heavier overall, so you get that extra 'press' on the tires, improving traction. This works out, as long as the higher center of gravity doesn't cost you if the angles get too steep. For this set of obstacles, it worked out OK. On others, the GK would likely have lagged behind, particularly if there were more side-hill obstacles, for example.
It's a game of compromise and budget. Many possibilities! Keeps things interesting :)
The channel just keeps getting better, Craig. The little details are really adding up:
- The camera angles (and resolution not getting so pixelated, especially noticeable when seen on a big screen)
- Point scoring on the spot, to help visualize the reasoning for it
- The now established format of your tests
I'm really enjoying it all so much, and keeps getting better!
Also surprised about the result. I wondered if the Gatekeeper's dampers, allegedly a better quality than the RTR ones, could have also been a factor in the vehicle's better stability...
Ah! I did notice the colour difference in the shocks but hadn't looked closer. Maybe they are better? The performance feels the same between them both, but little differences may be hard to tell.
Thanks for the feedback, looking forward to doing more!
@@RCTNT I wouldn't know, but they do advertise the RTR ones as a lesser item than the kit ones... Interesting that you didn't notice any differences
@@YoShImUrA53 there's probably a lot I don't notice. Always more to learn!
Love this video! Finally someone has a great side by side comparison……thank you!!
Thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed it!
Surprising result for me. Great vid as always. Building my own course soon 👍🏻
Oh great! That's a fun and rewarding thing to do. Enjoy the process!
Your exactly right the weight keeps a RC more stable but it’s the strength to weight ratio that really matters. If heavy& under powered makes for not very much fun overall.
I agree a low powered rig is no fun!
I do think getting a low center of gravity is important. More weight helps with traction, but it otherwise detracts from performance.
Getting traction remains the goal and it's a simple concept but hard to implement well!
I love how many options we have in the pursuit of traction these days, that is for sure!
Great comparison demonstration, and unexpected outcome to be sure. I think that, like most people, I expected the Ecto to perform notably better than the Gatekeeper and significantly better than it did overall, was a nice surprise to see the actual results. Definitely makes one rethink one's assumptions and preconceptions. Nicely done, sir.
Thanks, I thought it would dominate too, honestly! I get value from these, too!
Very interesting video as always 👍
Stumbled across your channel and awesome comparisons. The Gatekeeper kit with the Bronze shocks are an upgrade and not many people know but the grey plastics are also an upgrade vs the black plastics on the Ecto. You are right, adding a little more weight upfront really makes this suspension perform better.
Keep on crawling and 2-Speed Baby! (make nitro great again)
Oh I see! Didn't realise that. Thanks for the info about the upgraded bits, I'll look into that. Good to know.
Also, welcome! Great to have you along! Cheers
Love the comp videos. I don't know if the floating points add a lot of time to editing these, but they're a clever touch. These were not the results I expected based on the Ecto's light body and presumably lower cg. It'll be fun to see how the Ecto does with a little weight down low 👍
Thanks Andy, it's in interesting machine and I'm looking forward to optimising it! Cheers
Nice video again. Keep doing what your doing it works. Thanks for sharing. John
Thanks John
I'm new to your channel and I love it. Look forward to new videos great job.
Oh nice Brian, thanks and welcome. Appreciate the comment :)
Cool track there dude,both trucks performed well 👌 👍👍
Thanks! Yep, they sure did. They're still really good machines, so I'm nit-picking here, really! Cheers
Hello.
I received my trailwalker element yesterday and I wanted to thank you for helping me make my choice.
I love this crawler, it's very, very good quality, the modulation is great, the 1.55 wheels are great, the tires grip really well, the steering bar at the back is probably the best thing I've I saw a crawler, even the bodywork, which I didn't find so terrible, is actually quite good and the quality of the lexan is very good too.
After a big walk in the mountains yesterday I can say that this is my best crawler to date.
I think I would only buy "element rc" now, for the price of the RTR I can't see any better for all this quality.
Thanks a lot .
The Frenchi .
PS: As usual great comparison!
Hey, that's great! I'm so glad you're happy with it. Element are making great vehicles these days :)
This is more a test of driver consistency than model differences. fun but not conclusive.
what is valuable are your comments on handling as you drive each unit.
I'll be the first to stick my hand up for that, I'm sorry for the inconsistency in my videos. It's difficult to film, talk and, y'know, drive competently! I'm getting better though!
Thanks for the constructive criticism and feedback 👍
Thank you!
Nice video! I’ve found in my crawling experience is adding weight in general seems to help plant the tires for grip and stability. Even weight on the chassis seems to help in most cases! Interesting experiment for sure!
Fair enough. I think there's some benefit there, but then the lower you can get the weight, the better. At or below axle height will beat chassis weight every time - but no weight anywhere makes things challenging in any case! Cheers
@@RCTNT yes, agree…the lower the weight the better, but for cheap experiments I’ve played with adding lead sticky weights here and there…works wonders depending on what your climbing or maneuvering on!
Great video as always!
Oh, look at that! Belated thanks, Scott! The mobile YT Studio app didn't alert me of the Super Thanks; only just found that now as I scrolled through to check I hadn't missed anyone's comments. Legend, very much appreciated, thank you!!
I am happy to support quality content that I enjoy. I don’t expect any special mention or thanks so no worries. Hopefully others will show their support and encourage you to keep making videos!
@@scottjlambert I enabled it recently when YT announced it and thought, why not? But I think they need to give us a way to track it beyond hunting it down through 4 layers of analytics!
But yes, point taken and again, my thanks for your support, Scott. I'm mainly glad you're enjoying my stuff. I'm working hard on improving and appreciate the gesture! Cheers
Thanks for the comparison. I enjoyed your comments about the two as you went through the course. I learned how a crawling competition works. I think you said the Ecto had the 550 motor which may give a little extra weight with the larger motor. Does it make any difference since the motors are to one side and not centered. Do people ever add weight to the opposite side of the motor to balance the chassis?
Thanks. There's little difference in weight between the two motors. I don't think most would worry about the balance issue, as long as suspension was tuned to get the rig to handle predictably. The differing motor speed is the bigger deal. That 14 turn 550 is perfect for the Ecto but not for crawling. I'll look into this as we seek improve it in future videos. Cheers
Craig, thanks for another outstanding comparison. I was thinking about an Ecto but after seeing this, I think I'll stick with my Capra and all of the ounces/grams it brings to the fight. I replaced the stock system with a Fusion Pro 2300Kv, a Spare Time Hobbies flat bottom skid, new steering servo, front brass knuckles and outer covers as well as weight in the front wheels, some ebay beadlocks wrapped in 1.9" Pro line Mickey Thompson Baja Pro X's for a grand total of 2750grams or 6.06 lbs.......and it climbs like a goat. The tires truly transformed this rig but it has many great features right out of the box. Now I just need to find an RC to mount the same MT Baja Pro Xs in a 2.2" size which I accidently bought the first time around. Maybe a bomber or Ryft. Anyway, I really enjoy your videos and appreciate the quality and time you put into them.
Oh cool! Glad you're enjoying yours so much, David. Thanks for the run down on what you've done. One remaining change I'm going to make to mine to take it even further is to lengthen its wheelbase a bit with longer (bent) links. That will lower the chassis and thus lower the cog, which I found sightly lacking on comp day.
I have so many new videos coming up. There are several new cars that you likely know little about that would take your spare tires there just perfectly. I'll do my best to get these videos out soon but there's almost a small hobby shop's worth of sweet new gear to show everyone here. I can't wait!
@RC-TNT I'm looking forward to your upcoming content....and potential addition for my "new shoes." Forgot to mention I put very light springs on the stock capra shocks which makes it sit nice and flat. Maybe not the best solution for a lower Cog.....but I couldn't be happier with the results.
Nice one. Tuning a crawler is deceptively heavy on detail isn't it!
Heeeeey Buddy!!!!
To get a fair comparison you should have moved the Gatekeeper body to the Ecto chassis. With the Holmes motor and HW1080 you have superior control of wheel speed and that alone makes a huge difference. The more planted feel has less to do with the weight than it has to do with the fact the stock Ecto motor is much faster and the stock electronics package sucks for throttle control. The first mod I did to my Element Enduro Sendero and Trailwalker was to ditch the stock radio and ESC for a Flysky GT3C and HW1080, before that neither truck was much use since reverse was pretty much an on/off affair. The real test would be RTR Ecto against RTR Gatekeeper since they use different motors and the Gatekeeper with the slower motor and more weight will be easier to control wheel speed. Sidehilling would be the most usefull comparison here, but I suspect the Ecto would slither across the slope with wheel speed while the Gatekeeper goes tumbling before it gains any composure.
Fair points, all. The motor is the big one to change on the Ecto, above all else. But that was also partly the point of the video. You're not wrong!
I may disagree with you on one point - the planted feel was there for the GK even off the throttle, like on that descent at the start of the course just out of gate 1, or going through gates 3 and 5. Just wiggling steering on the drop was more confident on the GK, even with no throttle.
It bears further investigation though, yes. I'll come back to the Ecto with more soon - a motor swap near the top of the list! Cheers
I think the weight of the cage makes the sway bar work harder . The sway bar is hardest one fitted as stock, there are other options, soft, medium and hard but you have to buy the hole sway bar kit.
Interesting! You're probably right about the extra weight there, but then I don't know if I like the sway bar on this as a crawler at all. I'll experiment and we'll see where we get!
@@RCTNThave a play around with it. I tried my gatekeeper rtr with out sway bar , shocks were way to soft in the stock positions, lots of flex but terrible torque twist when climbing.
@@areadierc2803 thanks, I will. I've been thinking of removing the bar and putting in stiffer springs and some upper links. Dunno yet, haven't sat down with it at the work bench. Looking forward to tinkering though!
I'm seriously looking at getting myself a Gatekeeper kit because exo-cages just rule for me.!
I'm a bit worried about building it though because my carpal tunnel has gotten so bad lately that I'm struggling to do the more fiddly tasks....
I'll maybe get an RTR but I don't like the paint scheme & some of the electrics would be swapped straight out too.
I really wish more companies would do 80% rollers, my last 3 RCs have been rollers & I couldn't be happier with them.
I still get the sense of accomplishment even though I've only fitted electrics & painted it.!
Stay safe out there mate & best wishes from Scotland 🏴 🙏 ❤️ 📻 🕹️ 🔋 🚗 🚖 🚕 🚔 🚚 🚙 🚘 🚓 🚒 🚑 🚐 🚎 🚤 🚁 🛩️.!
Look at that long list of emoticons, lol
I feel for you with the carpal tunnel, had a decade of that then another of slow recovery.
The idea of a slider isn't bad, honestly. Makes sense. The kit was fun to build and it went together quickly. Do you have a small electric screwdriver? Might help.
In any case, thanks for watching on, Alan. Hope your hands/arms improve a bit. Chronic pain or injuries are no fun.
Ive been meaning to ask.. but what is your comp rig? n do you have a video using it on a comp course... no I've never owned a comp rig nor done any competition crawling.. just very curious..lol
Ah! There are 4 comp rigs here. The yellow C2 / Performance Scale one can be found a few times through my Truck vs Truck playlist:
Truck Vs Truck: th-cam.com/play/PLP6qQhzesLdrc3HYilqYxYElb7uBkjEcq.html
There are also three other comp rigs, one of which has video:
th-cam.com/video/NkMp5FG-LlQ/w-d-xo.html
The other two are a Pro/MOA RC4WD Bully II and a 2.2 Sportsman class (both visible in my 6 month video, What's In My Garage?). No videos on them, but I probably should get around to doing that!
Hi mate, love the channel. On my way to the hobby shop, gatekeeper/ecto or sendero hd?? Appreciate your feedback. I currently run a Vaterra Ascender K5 blazer, so thinking the ecto for something different.
Cheers!
Go the new Ecto or a Gatekeeper. Gives you a bit of variety given your Ascender. But any 3 of them are great rigs. Sorry I'm a bit late, let me know what you got and what you think!
@@RCTNT thanks for your reply. unfortunately they were all out of element stock. Found a good deal on a Capra kit! Might end up going for that now. Can’t make up my mind, so many choices🤦♂️
@@tankt.v.9218 There's no hurry. I find I never regret waiting if the thing I want isn't available now. Better to get it right - you only get one chance to spend that money!
That being said, the Capra is pretty neat. I've got a Capra vs Gatekeeper video here - search my channel, you'll find it. Might help if you're considering those two!
You'll be surprised how much some weight down low helps.
I'm expecting a significant improvement, but weight also hides other issues. My aim will be to get it as good as I can and then add some weight. It'll be a cracking good rig after that, I think!
いいね👍️
チャンネル登録しました🔔
Have you ever tried a gmade gom would like your opinions
Oh, interesting! No, I haven't yet, just the BOM. I'll have to add this to my list, thank you!
It's a keeper that ecto! 🤣
The value is hard to deny!
@@RCTNT I meant it's a (gate)keeper, that ecto 🤣 you missed it
@@polishguywithhardtospellna8227 oh dude, a dad joke! It totally wooshed over my head, that's awesome! I love it, lol
gatekeepers only problem is the body
Heavy old thing with a big nose, eh?
@@RCTNT i put a regular proline ranger on mine and it is beautiful on side crawls
@@Larry-qh2kp oh nice, I bet it is! Great rigs aren't they
There is a LOT of reinforcing cross bars that aren’t needed at all. Remove those, the plastic radiator, and fuel cell and you can easily get the cage down to under 10oz!
The roofline is also lower than the Ecto body.
With a little work, it works great.