@finalcountdown3210 and others: I am aware of the word string 'Pass the god damn butter' (or 'pass the golden butter'), but please notice that the purpose of this video is to point to the fact that if you shift your attention from a word string accentuating the 3-division to a word string accentuating the 4-division, your experience of the sound and feel of the basic pattern will also change!
Thank you for doing this video and posting, it is very cool. If I may be so presumptuous as to suggest a few modifications to make it even better: 1) different tones for the right and left hands, 2) a subtle background 8th note pulse (like a hi hat or shaker sound), 3) if the video switched hands at some point.
Very clever to use two circles instead of two straight lines. I’ve found it very easy to follow the beats of two palms and see the dots at the same time. Thank you for a useful instruction!
@Michael Camacho: First you have to realize that as soon you talk polyrhythms the terms (eights and semiquavers) become relative. Practically: - Subdivide your count in twelve. - The three eights take four of these subdivisions each. - The eight of the TA TI DA takes six subdivisions, whereas the two semiquavers take three subdivisions each.
Very helpful! I have seen several videos on polyrhythms, but I like your addition of the hands and phrases to emphasize one beat over the other. Pianists (such as myself) can watch this and tap out 1234 with the fingers of one hand and 123 with the fingers of the other hand.
@ixijmackixi If we count crotches/ quarter notes, the 4-count has triplet subdivisions, whereas the 3-count has semiquaver subdivisions. There are 12 subdivisions pr. cycle (measure). Both counts are initiated at the first beat, at the 12 o'clock position and merge again at the 13th, 25th, 37th, .. etc. subbeat, which all represent the first beat of a new cycle.
@drumsstop Thanks! Whether it is 3 over 4 or 4 over 3 in this context depends on which of the counting bases you chose. Apparently what you call 'consonant' are the meters with the 2- or 4-division as the base, but one of the reasons to present polyrhythms (-meter) this way is that our notation is somewhat deficient. In the tonal range the ratio 3:5 is more consonant than 4:7 but the notation and reading becomes rather obscure. So far I have animated more of the various types in Danish.
@shredrix Thanks for your appreciation! It is not exactly a metronome but a very simple animation composed by a number of normal image files put together in Windows Moviemaker and accompagnied by a sound track of saw tooth wawes generated in the sound editing program Audacity.
You can make it work both as 3 versus 4 and as 4 versus 3 depending on which of the counts you use as your pulse. Or in other words: depending on whether you pick the green or the blue word string as a reference.
Thanks a lot! I've been using this to help me play polyrhythms on the harp. I would recommend using two fingers with two different pitches on the piano even for people who are only looking to drum because the different pitch will reinforce the 4 and the 3 as separate beats.
@rstueckle Yes, there are many word strings which may lead you into polyrhythm. Your example and the more commonly used "pass the golden butter" (and "what atrocious weather") have in common that they emphasize the 3-layer. The advantage of the presentation above is that you can freely shift from one feeling to the other. And do feel free to substitute my strings! I have made a broader variety for other polyrhythms in danish. If you come up with good strings, do let me know!
Well, I'm not sure exactly what you meant by that, but having a solid understanding of time signature is also helpful to the understanding of polyrhythms.
Hello ohmphthschwru, There is one thing you seem to ignore: The video is a tool! What is important is not what you think it displays on the surface but the simple fact that when you use it as described you may get a grasp of polyrhythm in theory and practice. It only becomes polyrhythm when one layer is the pulse and the other layer is the beat. You make it become that!
I decided to learn chopin fantasia 66 as my first thing playing piano other than mary had a little lamb. It's really hard but I can play the first 4 measures. This is helping me get to the point where I can play the rest, thanks
It's true that basic polyrhythms played together create their own rhythmic "sound pattern". It is also true that if you do this on a drum or a table you will be playing 3 and 4 at the same time. ( you can do it with any of them 5&4-3&2-7&4 even 11) However YOU the musician are not hearing it as a polyrhythm until you can separate the rhythms in your head. In order to do this you need to be able to count each rhythm separately while both are playing at the same time. Then you are in a polyrhythm.
@skyelof Yes and you did a fine job. This is a very interesting visual concept of a basic polyrhythmic structure .Yours of course is: 3over4 = 3/4 to 1. (1to1= 4/4) There are actually four more "consonant" , basic, poly-metric structures. (including this one) the others are: 3over2 = 1&1/2 to1- 5over4 = 1&1/4 to1 - 7over4= 1&3/4 to1 and 8over4 = 2 to1 ( or double the original tempo) Like yours above, they all have their own unique rhythmic "sound pattern" when both are played at the same time.
Ha! I learned this years ago as "Pass the God Damned Butter"...excuse the language....its just how the person taught me. I don't know..maybe they were angry that day. I've since changed it to be a bit more all ages friendly to "Pass the Salt and Pepper"..something that a student will be reminded of every Thanksgiving. Thanks for posting this vid. I've thought a lot on this sort of graphical representation of rhythms..I'm glad to see others have too.
Yep, you know, I have a drum machine programmed with this 4 against 3..BUT.. I've must be able to find it, find a cord, find an adaptor.....and on and on ...but this is video is easier to find and ready to go..Thank You! and thanks to TH-cam.
This schematics is hilarious. The only thing I'd like to change would be the blob sound. Instead of the same sound on both hands, I'd prefer them to be slghtly different. Good job!
wow, i've been brainwashing myself with this for the whole afternoon. starting to get the hang of it... i guess... but this was really easy to follow and oh-so-helpful :) learning to play debussy's passepied.
You can check out our "Cadavre Exquis" as an exemple : th-cam.com/video/K72F1mejIaA/w-d-xo.html The only rule was - playing 3 against 4 and pass the last 20" to the next one.
I don't think you understand what I'm saying. I'm not disputing over the name of it. Some guy confused polymeter with polyrhythm, and I corrected him. I don't know what you want from me and why this matters so much to you. If you look it up anywhere, this is called a polyrhythm, two rhythms derived from the same meter. A polymeter is two meters at the same beat. There is no multi-time signature here, simply because it's ONE time signature, but having alternate rhythms playing within it.
I tried this and nearly breaked the table to pieces... thanks my notebook placed in the center and there was no command to smash doublehand punch in the middle
I wasn't saying that this video is a polymeter, if that's what you're thinking. I was responding to someone who confused polymeter and polyrhythm. This polyrhythm is NOT 2 time signatures. It can be 4/4 or 3/4, not both. In 4/4 , it would be 4 quarter notes, with 3 half note triplets played over it. In 3/4, it would be 3 quarter notes played over 4 quarter note quadruplets. These cannot realistically be the same, unless played at different speeds, matching the 4/4 triplet and the 3/4 quadruplet.
@drumsstop Thanks for your comment and, well, that may all be correct, it is a matter of definition. I didn't necessarily offer the presentation in order to live up to the that understanding of polyrhythm, but I did supply the counts as well at the palm of the hands.
How do you realize: 3 eighst against 1 eight and two semiquavers. I mean: TA - KI - DA against TA TI DA. It's 3 against two but the two it's subdivided.
Thanks for your comment! I hope I am not being too explanatory by pointing at what is particular here: That you may shift your attention between the 3-layer and the 4-layer of the polyrhythm by shifting the string of words! ... and thereby trigger the experience of 4 over 3 or 3 over 4 respectively.
Yes, and consequently the distance between the second beat of the 3-count and the 4-count is the same as the distance between the third beat of the 3-count and the fourth beat of the 4-count.
trying to play against three is way harder then the other way round.i always fall back to counting 1,2,3,4.is it better to change hands when changing the main rythm?
I think you aren't understanding what I was saying, because that has nothing to do with it. This is a polyrhythm. Playing 4/4 along with 3/4 is a polymeter, not a polyrhythm.
These videos (the one above is part of a series) are very minimalstic. Here each cycle of beats - each pattern - consists of 12 images which I made using Paintdotnet. The images were put together as a video in Windows Movie Maker.
I can play this easily by feel and can do it by starting with the 3/4 time, but even listening back to what I've done, I can't feel the 4/4 rhythm. Why is that?
I am not sure that I get your question. It shouldn't be wrong to be able to feel a rhythm (otherwise I wouldn't have chosen "I can feel the rhythm" for the 3-count), so if you can do the 3-count correctly what is your problem? One explanation maybe that most popular music being played around is in 4 time.
@@JoshNpublicgplus I suppose you have seen that the exercise has two sides!? My immediate answer would be to simply focus on the 4-count by using its string: "A PO-ly-RHYTH-mic FLOW" (or find a better string which accentuates the 4 beats)
Yes, definitely! I made one in Danish: th-cam.com/video/u6P2w7dJ3Mc/w-d-xo.html There are two obstacles: - Language: I need suitable word strings where the accents fall naturally within the pattern - I am not producing these videos for the moment ... but if you take care of the first part, I may come over the second!
Read the God damn text! ;-) I am aware of the butter line and many others, but please be aware that these animations were made in order to be able to freely change between a 3 count and a 4 count. The butter line only applies to the 3 count.
"Multi-time signature" isn't even a thing. It's called a polyrhythm. I'm not the person who named it, but that's what it's called and that's what this video is.
![POLYRHYTHM- Learn and MASTER 3:4 and 4:3 [MUSIC THEORY - RHYTHM- COUNTING]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/c1pejTgLuhA/mqdefault.jpg)
My dad walked and saw the satanic ritual-like shapes and heard me chanting the words and asked if I was practicing witchcraft. hahaha
hahahahaha
WE can FEEL the RHY- thm
you could be an adorable witch ❤
This advanced my musical mind a step, no joke.
jeezus , you're using a dc offset sample as a click ?
You're destroying speakers
@finalcountdown3210 and others:
I am aware of the word string 'Pass the god damn butter' (or 'pass the golden butter'), but please notice that the purpose of this video is to point to the fact that if you shift your attention from a word string accentuating the 3-division to a word string accentuating the 4-division, your experience of the sound and feel of the basic pattern will also change!
I cannot thank you enough for this video, I can finally play my piano sonata properly, thank you thank you THANK YOU!
Beethoven?
Same! I need this rhythm for Liszt
@@leacosic6673 liszt etude 6 var 2?
Scriabin sonata 5 ending
i know this is 10 years old, but i just want to say this made my life so much easier. thank you
Thank you! Now I understand how to do 4:3.
this video saved my life
Thank you for doing this video and posting, it is very cool. If I may be so presumptuous as to suggest a few modifications to make it even better:
1) different tones for the right and left hands,
2) a subtle background 8th note pulse (like a hi hat or shaker sound),
3) if the video switched hands at some point.
Very clever to use two circles instead of two straight lines. I’ve found it very easy to follow the beats of two palms and see the dots at the same time. Thank you for a useful instruction!
@Michael Camacho:
First you have to realize that as soon you talk polyrhythms the terms (eights and semiquavers) become relative.
Practically:
- Subdivide your count in twelve.
- The three eights take four of these subdivisions each.
- The eight of the TA TI DA takes six subdivisions, whereas the two semiquavers take three subdivisions each.
Pass the god-damn butter. That's what I was taught. One hand is Pass, God, But-
The other hand is Pass, the, damn, -ter Pass, the god damn, butter.
I heard "Not hard to get" worked for the 3 against 2.
*EAT* your GOD-damn VEGGies
Yes,this is realy good for those who have no idia what the polytythm is! Very good demonstation
this one is better than the recommended newer video. It's nice to have a speed buildup to learn this.
Whoever made this video - thank you. Thank you very much indeed. It is a truly excellent depiction of this important polyrhythm. Well done.
Yes! So much fun can be had with this stuff. Opens up tons of creative doors!!
Thanks again for posting this!
wowww u just made this soo easy!!! WOW!
just learned about polyrhythm and within a hour it took my playing to another level. a old dog learned a new trick
Ricketyrawd dawg could you give me some links to some videos I can use to learn polyrythym
I came here to confirm if the valorant theme by head splitter on Spotify is 3 against 4 or 4 against 3. It's 3 against 4
Very helpful! I have seen several videos on polyrhythms, but I like your addition of the hands and phrases to emphasize one beat over the other. Pianists (such as myself) can watch this and tap out 1234 with the fingers of one hand and 123 with the fingers of the other hand.
@ixijmackixi If we count crotches/ quarter notes, the 4-count has triplet subdivisions, whereas the 3-count has semiquaver subdivisions. There are 12 subdivisions pr. cycle (measure). Both counts are initiated at the first beat, at the 12 o'clock position and merge again at the 13th, 25th, 37th, .. etc. subbeat, which all represent the first beat of a new cycle.
@drumsstop Thanks! Whether it is 3 over 4 or 4 over 3 in this context depends on which of the counting bases you chose.
Apparently what you call 'consonant' are the meters with the 2- or 4-division as the base, but one of the reasons to present polyrhythms (-meter) this way is that our notation is somewhat deficient. In the tonal range the ratio 3:5 is more consonant than 4:7 but the notation and reading becomes rather obscure.
So far I have animated more of the various types in Danish.
Nice work mate. I look forward to more
More of these for different polyrhythms please!
@shredrix Thanks for your appreciation!
It is not exactly a metronome but a very simple animation composed by a number of normal image files put together in Windows Moviemaker and accompagnied by a sound track of saw tooth wawes generated in the sound editing program Audacity.
thank you so much for this! Helped me so much with my polyrhythym tapping practice. Hard stuff, but it'll be worth it when I get it down.
You can make it work both as 3 versus 4 and as 4 versus 3 depending on which of the counts you use as your pulse. Or in other words: depending on whether you pick the green or the blue word string as a reference.
Thanks a lot! I've been using this to help me play polyrhythms on the harp. I would recommend using two fingers with two different pitches on the piano even for people who are only looking to drum because the different pitch will reinforce the 4 and the 3 as separate beats.
@rstueckle Yes, there are many word strings which may lead you into polyrhythm. Your example and the more commonly used "pass the golden butter" (and "what atrocious weather") have in common that they emphasize the 3-layer. The advantage of the presentation above is that you can freely shift from one feeling to the other. And do feel free to substitute my strings! I have made a broader variety for other polyrhythms in danish. If you come up with good strings, do let me know!
This is extremely helpful! Thanks man!
It is crazy, when I read one side I hear it differently than when I read the other side!!
That is my very intention: To make you able to shift your focus freely between the 3-count and the 4-count.
Illuminati confirmed
Real cool way to train polyrythms, thanks for uploading!
Well, I'm not sure exactly what you meant by that, but having a solid understanding of time signature is also helpful to the understanding of polyrhythms.
This is so useful! Thanks!
Hello ohmphthschwru,
There is one thing you seem to ignore: The video is a tool!
What is important is not what you think it displays on the surface but the simple fact that when you use it as described you may get a grasp of polyrhythm in theory and practice.
It only becomes polyrhythm when one layer is the pulse and the other layer is the beat.
You make it become that!
Really helpful. Much appeciated
this is great to get those triplet tempos down.
Amazing, really helped me out! Illuminati confirmed though
I decided to learn chopin fantasia 66 as my first thing playing piano other than mary had a little lamb. It's really hard but I can play the first 4 measures. This is helping me get to the point where I can play the rest, thanks
+Jason Box Score 10 for ambition! ;-) But go for it … and do try a few other, somewhat easier, pieces when you need a break.
It's true that basic polyrhythms played together create their own rhythmic "sound pattern". It is also true that if you do this on a drum or a table you will be playing 3 and 4 at the same time. ( you can do it with any of them 5&4-3&2-7&4 even 11) However YOU the musician are not hearing it as a polyrhythm until you can separate the rhythms in your head. In order to do this you need to be able to count each rhythm separately while both are playing at the same time. Then you are in a polyrhythm.
@skyelof Yes and you did a fine job. This is a very interesting visual concept of a basic polyrhythmic structure .Yours of course is: 3over4 = 3/4 to 1. (1to1= 4/4) There are actually four more "consonant" , basic, poly-metric structures. (including this one) the others are: 3over2 = 1&1/2 to1- 5over4 = 1&1/4 to1 - 7over4= 1&3/4 to1 and 8over4 = 2 to1 ( or double the original tempo) Like yours above, they all have their own unique rhythmic "sound pattern" when both are played at the same time.
Yes, you take control of your mind!
Awesome!
Magic ear....... Doors of perception blown open!
Interesting way to teach polyrhythms.
Super helpful!
Ha! I learned this years ago as "Pass the God Damned Butter"...excuse the language....its just how the person taught me. I don't know..maybe they were angry that day.
I've since changed it to be a bit more all ages friendly to "Pass the Salt and Pepper"..something that a student will be reminded of every Thanksgiving.
Thanks for posting this vid. I've thought a lot on this sort of graphical representation of rhythms..I'm glad to see others have too.
very good
This is great!
Yep, you know, I have a drum machine programmed with this 4 against 3..BUT.. I've must be able to find it, find a cord, find an adaptor.....and on and on ...but this is video is easier to find and ready to go..Thank You! and thanks to TH-cam.
Famous example of polyrhythm: Thela Hun Ginjeet, by King Crimson. 7/8 time played against 4/4 time.
This schematics is hilarious. The only thing I'd like to change would be the blob sound. Instead of the same sound on both hands, I'd prefer them to be slghtly different. Good job!
Thank you so much
wow, i've been brainwashing myself with this for the whole afternoon. starting to get the hang of it... i guess... but this was really easy to follow and oh-so-helpful :)
learning to play debussy's passepied.
It’s so much easier hearing it then trying to think it out 😂
Okay so i don't know shit about music so this video scared the hell out of me ... I thought this was like some kind of video to brainwash people ...
TV will brainwash you. This is harmless.
To learn this requires asome voluntary brainwashing.
super helpful
Fantasie Impromptu HERE I COME!
why would you use these impulses when they are truly bad for your hearing ?
I'm having a hard time with Polyrhythms in general, any other advice so that I can get better?
Focus on the composite
You can check out our "Cadavre Exquis" as an exemple : th-cam.com/video/K72F1mejIaA/w-d-xo.html
The only rule was - playing 3 against 4 and pass the last 20" to the next one.
I don't think you understand what I'm saying. I'm not disputing over the name of it. Some guy confused polymeter with polyrhythm, and I corrected him. I don't know what you want from me and why this matters so much to you. If you look it up anywhere, this is called a polyrhythm, two rhythms derived from the same meter. A polymeter is two meters at the same beat. There is no multi-time signature here, simply because it's ONE time signature, but having alternate rhythms playing within it.
The picture shows the alchemical nature also resides in music
ah thx!
I tried this and nearly breaked the table to pieces... thanks my notebook placed in the center and there was no command to smash doublehand punch in the middle
This is the terminator theme rythmic pattern isn't it?
It is easy to play. Love polyrhythmics
+Donna-Dina Ha!!! is it really?
yes it is, after some training)
yes it is, after some training)
I'm pretty sure for some people it's easy since we're all wired differently , what kind of training did you do? plz share :)
I played one rhythm with one hand and another one with another simultaneously
3 over 2 - 'Pass the butter'
4 over 3 - 'Pass the god damn butter'
5 over 4 - 'Pass the god damn fucking butter'
Good for techno!
I can now play Chopin nocturne op 9 no 2 bar 18 . Thank you.
@shredrix Welcome!
I wasn't saying that this video is a polymeter, if that's what you're thinking. I was responding to someone who confused polymeter and polyrhythm. This polyrhythm is NOT 2 time signatures. It can be 4/4 or 3/4, not both. In 4/4 , it would be 4 quarter notes, with 3 half note triplets played over it. In 3/4, it would be 3 quarter notes played over 4 quarter note quadruplets. These cannot realistically be the same, unless played at different speeds, matching the 4/4 triplet and the 3/4 quadruplet.
@drumsstop Thanks for your comment and, well, that may all be correct, it is a matter of definition. I didn't necessarily offer the presentation in order to live up to the that understanding of polyrhythm, but I did supply the counts as well at the palm of the hands.
How do you realize: 3 eighst against 1 eight and two semiquavers. I mean:
TA - KI - DA against TA TI DA. It's 3 against two but the two it's subdivided.
THANK YOU!!!! That's been the bane of my existence, lol...
Thanks for your comment!
I hope I am not being too explanatory by pointing at what is particular here: That you may shift your attention between the 3-layer and the 4-layer of the polyrhythm by shifting the string of words!
... and thereby trigger the experience of 4 over 3 or 3 over 4 respectively.
Cool, it would've been better if each rhythm had a different sound though
Is the space between 3 and 4 on the clock exactly the same as the space between 8 and 9 on the clock?
Yes, and consequently the distance between the second beat of the 3-count and the 4-count is the same as the distance between the third beat of the 3-count and the fourth beat of the 4-count.
Pass the goddamn butter
Read the goddamn text! ;-)
trying to play against three is way harder then the other way round.i always fall back to counting 1,2,3,4.is it better to change hands when changing the main rythm?
I think you aren't understanding what I was saying, because that has nothing to do with it. This is a polyrhythm. Playing 4/4 along with 3/4 is a polymeter, not a polyrhythm.
Pass the goddamn butter, pass the goddamn butter...
Yes, but that only accentuates the 3-division!
Did you know with speeding very up of these you can acheive chords?!
Yes! I recommend this article: dantepfer.com/blog/?p=277
Skye Løfvander tnx! And ppl mostly don't know that rhythm is equal to pitch!!
is this video made for mindcontrol? o.O
Easiest way to remember the 3 over 4 is : Pass-the-god-damn-but-ter
Still dont understand!!!!
Did you use a special software to create this? If so, what is the name? Thanks
These videos (the one above is part of a series) are very minimalstic. Here each cycle of beats - each pattern - consists of 12 images which I made using Paintdotnet. The images were put together as a video in Windows Movie Maker.
I can play this easily by feel and can do it by starting with the 3/4 time, but even listening back to what I've done, I can't feel the 4/4 rhythm. Why is that?
I am not sure that I get your question. It shouldn't be wrong to be able to feel a rhythm (otherwise I wouldn't have chosen "I can feel the rhythm" for the 3-count), so if you can do the 3-count correctly what is your problem? One explanation maybe that most popular music being played around is in 4 time.
@@SkyeLfvander I just can't feel the 4 rhythm or have that as a base in my mind, I can only go from the reverse.
@@JoshNpublicgplus I suppose you have seen that the exercise has two sides!? My immediate answer would be to simply focus on the 4-count by using its string: "A PO-ly-RHYTH-mic FLOW" (or find a better string which accentuates the 4 beats)
Fantasie impromptu flashbacks
Is it possible to do a 5 against 4 one?
Yes, definitely! I made one in Danish: th-cam.com/video/u6P2w7dJ3Mc/w-d-xo.html
There are two obstacles:
- Language: I need suitable word strings where the accents fall naturally within the pattern
- I am not producing these videos for the moment
... but if you take care of the first part, I may come over the second!
Skye Løfvander ah thanx :)
+zunguproductions Here you go: th-cam.com/video/D2vwk2Megtw/w-d-xo.html
I came here because of Revêrie - Debussy but I still don't get it right..
pass the god damn butter
this video fucks with your brain
Who else sped it up for understanding the rhythm of fantaisie impromptu?
Me!!
"Pass the goddamn butter"
Very inspirational, thank you! Rhythm Podcast: Off-Beat & Syncopation:
th-cam.com/video/m98BIl_W7lE/w-d-xo.html
Let me now what you think!
Pass the God damn butter!
Read the God damn text! ;-)
I am aware of the butter line and many others, but please be aware that these animations were made in order to be able to freely change between a 3 count and a 4 count. The butter line only applies to the 3 count.
@@SkyeLfvander all good brother, no worries.
It helps me remember it that's all
Also, it can apply to the 4 count in a hilarious way:
Pass THE god DAM buh DER
@@MrMaxKeane :-)
"Multi-time signature" isn't even a thing. It's called a polyrhythm. I'm not the person who named it, but that's what it's called and that's what this video is.
Pass the God damn butter.
3 OVER 4 IS TRAP