This type of criticism, especially the wife character complaint, is the reason why in so many other similar movies they just kill the wife or husband and move forward, just look at The Punisher, family's dead, revenge tale, pretty straight forward, and sometimes that's all you need just good old fashion violence.
This movie’s mistake is making everyone else silent too. Joel Kinnaman can’t talk, fine. But we need the other people talking to have some urgency or world building. The wife having almost no line and texting are a detriment to the movie. I don’t hate the film, but it is disappointing.
I think Joel kinnaman is like Boyd Holbrook or scoot McNairy. They were born too late. They definitely would have had the Christian slater fame because they fit that role so well. We just don’t have those movie roles right now. Unfortunate because I’m such a big fan of all 3 of them.
Thank you for this review Dan. I'm a big fan of John Woo and I thought the hospital shoot out in the climax of "Hardboild" is still one of the best action sequences ever put on film. Not a big fan of his American films although "Face Off" was a trip in my opinion. Sad to hear about this film from your review but hopefully he can recharge and reinvent himself to rewrite action films to come. Thanks for your review and you should do a full review on your thoughts on the movie "Thanksgiving".
I don't think I have ever seen a movie's gimmick so actively ruin the movie at every turn. It drains any semblance of character or investment from the story. Add in the mediocre action and ugly look, and this was an empty movie watching experience. They don't even use Christmas in any meaningful way.
Dan, I know the holiday has already passed, but it would be great to hear your more in-depth thoughts on Thanksgiving. I thought it was Eli Roth’s best in years.
Going to get this in on Monday along with Dream Scenario and an advance screening of the the Boy and the Heron. Kind of glad I can lower my expectations, I might enjoy it more if its not too built-up.
On the note of the evolution of cinematic language being up for grabs for up-and-coming directors, I'd put out there that Brandon Cronenberg's "Possessor" (2020), Julia Ducournau's "Titane" (2021), and Charlotte Wells' "Aftersun" (2022) are all examples of new directors with strong and idiosyncratic voices.
If no one has seen red cliff 1 and 2 (not the cut down version - the separate movies), I would highly recommend it. John woo made this in 2008 and it's one of my favourites John Woo flicks. It's Chinese cinema buts it's really up there.
I loved Joel Kinnaman in Altered Carbon. I just loved his performance and Martha Higareda's performance. And Netflix cancelled it after the second season with Anthony Mackie. I love Anthony Mackie in his other filmas/fhows.
Great review, I saw this the other day as a Kinnaman fan. I was surprised (although I shouldn't be) at how off the marketing was. Luckily I really enjoy this kind of film and Kinnaman has some of the most expressive eyes in the business. There was a lot I didn't love, but it was cool to see some unique creative chances taken. I agree with all you said, especially the suburban white dad troupe. You worded that perfectly. My biggest take away was the odd reactions from characters due to the no talking. I think some of the reactions were lessened in the story because of it and not for the better.
I just saw it, I liked it. I was not expecting the "silence", I saw a trailer and no one spoke I thought it was just a stylized trailer playing on the silent in silent night. I like Joel Kinnaman's work. some scenes he really sells it. I'm still 50/50 if it a movie theatre movie
I was alone in a theater watching this, i feel that they placed John Woo in a box that told him do not deviate from the John Wick formula and it never meshed, despite the neat third act where they told him to cut loose. They are different beasts all together and it was far too tame from such a legend. I did like the duster making a come back and a throwback to Hard Boiled. I love his American stuff and this is by far his worst film, but worst for him is slightly watchable. 5/10
John Woo is an excellent storyteller, but sadly, he is mainly known for his action, double gunned shooters. So, not sure if it is his fault or studios won’t back him on anything else.
Kind of a bummer to hear. John Woo reinvented action films forever with his work in Hong Kong. I still consider Hard Boiled to be one of the greatest action films ever made, I even put it neck to neck with die hard.
John Woo's Mission Impossible 2 remains my favorite entry in that series. Its the only that feels original and unique, whereas the others just blend together
Well that's certainly a take. Usually it's the least popular. Personally I kinda agree with you, I love m:i-2 an I think it's back half hits face/off levels of entertainment. That being said, I think ghost protocol and fallout are still the strongest entries for that series.
I was looking forward to it but I think it was actually the worst movie I’ve seen this year. The main character was pretty detestable in the first half and the no dialogue gimmick was so pointless. ( what does it matter if the main character can’t speak in a world where no on speaks ) the back half had some nice action but it wasn’t enough.
I don't think John Woo is necessarily a conservative right wing ideologue, but this movie was definitely made for that crowd. Dan only barely touched on the 'brown people bad' narrative of the movie, but it's pretty in your face through the movie. That and there's tons of conservative bait sprinkled throughout, like: our police are unable to do their job because the government has tied their hands behind their backs, 'blue lives matter,' the government is causing inflation to get out of control, people with tattoos are bad, torture on 'bad people' is okay if it gives you important information, the only defense to a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun, women contribute nothing of real value other than being support for men, men should act like men and boys should play with toys that will develop them into masculine men like train sets. This movie was essentially the answer to every movie that's considered to be woke. So if that's your thing, then this movie is for you . The movie would have been a lot better had it not taken itself seriously. The 'silent' gimmick could have been played for jokes. Instead, we got terrible drama acted out through laughably bad facial expressions. It's like watching mimes, but not purposely funny. The first half of the movie was just an absolute dumpster fire. I really think Dan went easy on this one because he might have respect for John Woo. But Dan, you're wrong when you said "that's not John Woos fault" for not keeping up with Hollywood. Sure this is a great movie 30 years ago, but he's releasing it today. If he didn't keep improving and got stuck in the 90s, then he made a bad movie by today's standards; that's 100% his fault.
John Woo has one of the more creative director cameos I've seen in this movie. There's an impressive graffiti mural with his face towards the beginning! I enjoyed the movie, but it won't be an "alternative" Christmas classic I put on every year. Just too bleak and depressing. That said I did love the gritty action and Woo still has the goods. Lot of impressive shots and sequences. You mentioned "Violent Night". That one was pure fun beginning to end and will definitely be an annual staple for me.
Except in interviews in Asia he and other producers have said "john woo has finally made a christmas movie". Said I. A lot of language. Almost as a tag line. there is no need to have the argument.
I'd argue it's a big part of the movie: the setting and decorations, it's the reason he's in LA, "Ho ho ho," ending the movie with Christmas music. It's a big part of the aesthetic. It's basically window dressing here.
The story would, yes. But Christmas is infused throughout stylistically in a way that makes it closely tied to the holiday and it plays into the story. Even down to the holiday gift tape John uses for the gun at the end. This movie has a Christmas tree up in the corner and a character wearing a Santa jacket. That’s about it.
The silence should work well for John Woo who I think always had problems directing English dialogue (see Broken Arrow, Face Off and MI:2), but excelled in visual story telling. I would expect John Woo capable of reinvigorating his action style, like George Miller, so it a surprise to have an average review. I certainly enjoyed *The Killer* more than reviews suggested, but it was an interesting choice for Fincher to film major fight scenes in natural light, often at night (very realistic for an assassin) when John Wick goes out of its way to light those scenes clearly to the benefit of the visual story-telling. This is where George Miller’s style is radically different, filming the brightest day, in wide-open spaces. This allows his action to flow across the screen without any barrier and I wonder if the stills from *Silent Night* suggest too much shadowy realism blocking the only way we have of relating to a mute central character?
Silent Night is a great movie. As for the comments that the guns shoot too many times, well the movie shows guns being reloaded numerous times. If there were 100 guys like this in every city crime would be eliminated. This movie so good that the fact that there is no dialogue in the movie is not even noticed unless someone points it out to you.
I'm not happy about the "white guy kills all the brown bad people" aspect of this film that should have stayed in the early '00s. If it was anyone else but John Woo (whom I've loved forever), I would skip for that alone, but I'll probably go see it in theaters either this or next weekend.
How many doves were there?
zero
Not one. There was a parakeet of some kind, but that’s it. It was actually very light on Woo tropes, disappointingly so.
Two turtle doves
The fictional city in this movie is called "The Doves"
@@Largentina.gotta get it in where you can I guess
This type of criticism, especially the wife character complaint, is the reason why in so many other similar movies they just kill the wife or husband and move forward, just look at The Punisher, family's dead, revenge tale, pretty straight forward, and sometimes that's all you need just good old fashion violence.
The husband cried when he returned home after being discharged from the hospital. His wife whispers, "it's okay."
I basically fell in love with Joel Kinnaman in Altered Carbon, I love him in everything so far. definitely going to see this one.
Same, it drives me nuts that Joel doesn't get the respect.
This movie’s mistake is making everyone else silent too. Joel Kinnaman can’t talk, fine. But we need the other people talking to have some urgency or world building. The wife having almost no line and texting are a detriment to the movie. I don’t hate the film, but it is disappointing.
For me it was the opposite , i loved the fact that no one talked , for some reason it made the emotions feel more compelling for me
I think Joel kinnaman is like Boyd Holbrook or scoot McNairy. They were born too late. They definitely would have had the Christian slater fame because they fit that role so well. We just don’t have those movie roles right now. Unfortunate because I’m such a big fan of all 3 of them.
Will you be reviewing Beyonce’s new movie as well?
Thank you for this review Dan. I'm a big fan of John Woo and I thought the hospital shoot out in the climax of "Hardboild" is still one of the best action sequences ever put on film. Not a big fan of his American films although "Face Off" was a trip in my opinion. Sad to hear about this film from your review but hopefully he can recharge and reinvent himself to rewrite action films to come. Thanks for your review and you should do a full review on your thoughts on the movie "Thanksgiving".
I don't think I have ever seen a movie's gimmick so actively ruin the movie at every turn. It drains any semblance of character or investment from the story. Add in the mediocre action and ugly look, and this was an empty movie watching experience. They don't even use Christmas in any meaningful way.
I'm so glad you are back Dan! Thanks for this review. Really didn't know much about it.
Dan, I know the holiday has already passed, but it would be great to hear your more in-depth thoughts on Thanksgiving. I thought it was Eli Roth’s best in years.
Going to get this in on Monday along with Dream Scenario and an advance screening of the the Boy and the Heron. Kind of glad I can lower my expectations, I might enjoy it more if its not too built-up.
On the note of the evolution of cinematic language being up for grabs for up-and-coming directors, I'd put out there that Brandon Cronenberg's "Possessor" (2020), Julia Ducournau's "Titane" (2021), and Charlotte Wells' "Aftersun" (2022) are all examples of new directors with strong and idiosyncratic voices.
Possessor still stuns me!
If no one has seen red cliff 1 and 2 (not the cut down version - the separate movies), I would highly recommend it. John woo made this in 2008 and it's one of my favourites John Woo flicks. It's Chinese cinema buts it's really up there.
I loved Joel Kinnaman in Altered Carbon. I just loved his performance and Martha Higareda's performance. And Netflix cancelled it after the second season with Anthony Mackie. I love Anthony Mackie in his other filmas/fhows.
what's with the penalty at the end of the movie?
Great review, I saw this the other day as a Kinnaman fan. I was surprised (although I shouldn't be) at how off the marketing was. Luckily I really enjoy this kind of film and Kinnaman has some of the most expressive eyes in the business. There was a lot I didn't love, but it was cool to see some unique creative chances taken. I agree with all you said, especially the suburban white dad troupe. You worded that perfectly. My biggest take away was the odd reactions from characters due to the no talking. I think some of the reactions were lessened in the story because of it and not for the better.
I just saw it, I liked it. I was not expecting the "silence", I saw a trailer and no one spoke I thought it was just a stylized trailer playing on the silent in silent night. I like Joel Kinnaman's work. some scenes he really sells it. I'm still 50/50 if it a movie theatre movie
A nice review, but I'm still unsure if I'll go see it or not.
I was alone in a theater watching this, i feel that they placed John Woo in a box that told him do not deviate from the John Wick formula and it never meshed, despite the neat third act where they told him to cut loose. They are different beasts all together and it was far too tame from such a legend. I did like the duster making a come back and a throwback to Hard Boiled. I love his American stuff and this is by far his worst film, but worst for him is slightly watchable.
5/10
Really? The only American film of his I like is Face/Off.
John Woo is an excellent storyteller, but sadly, he is mainly known for his action, double gunned shooters. So, not sure if it is his fault or studios won’t back him on anything else.
Paycheck was awful
Thanks Dan, always check out your reviews.
Kind of a bummer to hear. John Woo reinvented action films forever with his work in Hong Kong. I still consider Hard Boiled to be one of the greatest action films ever made, I even put it neck to neck with die hard.
This was Joel Kinnaman’s audition for Punisher lol
I considered this as an Independent Experimental Art Film due to John Woo’s attempt on testing new grounds in film making…..
Thank you for picking that specific Hard Boiled poster as reference 👍
John Woo's Mission Impossible 2 remains my favorite entry in that series. Its the only that feels original and unique, whereas the others just blend together
Well that's certainly a take. Usually it's the least popular. Personally I kinda agree with you, I love m:i-2 an I think it's back half hits face/off levels of entertainment. That being said, I think ghost protocol and fallout are still the strongest entries for that series.
I haven’t seen 1 preview or ad for this movie. Wtf.
I'm curious cause of the shirt, any chance we get an Attack on Titan review? Spoiler or no spoiler. Also any chance of a Scott Pilgrim anime review?
I like it I give it at B I never realized was silence the whole movie till the end 😅
So... a remake of "Peppermint?"
That's what I was thinking too halfway into it. I enjoyed Peppermint more.
Dan, are you gonna post anything on TH-cam about New Zealand? Or maybe just tell us about it in the end of any video?
Yes, planning to share more later in a full video.
@@DanMurrellMovieshope you enjoyed NZ overall.
Just saw this and thought it was laughably bad but I appreciate the stylistic approach.
I was looking forward to it but I think it was actually the worst movie I’ve seen this year. The main character was pretty detestable in the first half and the no dialogue gimmick was so pointless. ( what does it matter if the main character can’t speak in a world where no on speaks ) the back half had some nice action but it wasn’t enough.
1:15 One minute in and I feel like this is a Punisher reimagining...
Are you sure this is not a Marvel movie? 🤣
Great review.
But Dan, are there doves? ARE THERE DOVES?!!!!
Saw this last night and it was fucking intense. If you want to see it, the theater experience is a must.
The trailer turned me off. Your review is giving me reasons to reconsider
It was pretty bad honestly. Dan didn't even touch on how boring and terrible the first half was.
Just like that one movie excessive force that is such an underrated action movie I enjoyed that one
Hard boiled is amazing. Ppl go see it
I don't think John Woo is necessarily a conservative right wing ideologue, but this movie was definitely made for that crowd. Dan only barely touched on the 'brown people bad' narrative of the movie, but it's pretty in your face through the movie.
That and there's tons of conservative bait sprinkled throughout, like: our police are unable to do their job because the government has tied their hands behind their backs, 'blue lives matter,' the government is causing inflation to get out of control, people with tattoos are bad, torture on 'bad people' is okay if it gives you important information, the only defense to a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun, women contribute nothing of real value other than being support for men, men should act like men and boys should play with toys that will develop them into masculine men like train sets.
This movie was essentially the answer to every movie that's considered to be woke. So if that's your thing, then this movie is for you .
The movie would have been a lot better had it not taken itself seriously. The 'silent' gimmick could have been played for jokes. Instead, we got terrible drama acted out through laughably bad facial expressions. It's like watching mimes, but not purposely funny. The first half of the movie was just an absolute dumpster fire.
I really think Dan went easy on this one because he might have respect for John Woo. But Dan, you're wrong when you said "that's not John Woos fault" for not keeping up with Hollywood. Sure this is a great movie 30 years ago, but he's releasing it today. If he didn't keep improving and got stuck in the 90s, then he made a bad movie by today's standards; that's 100% his fault.
Great video!
Will you be watching beyonces concert movie? I saw the show live, very excited to see it in the big screen
John Woo has one of the more creative director cameos I've seen in this movie. There's an impressive graffiti mural with his face towards the beginning! I enjoyed the movie, but it won't be an "alternative" Christmas classic I put on every year. Just too bleak and depressing. That said I did love the gritty action and Woo still has the goods. Lot of impressive shots and sequences. You mentioned "Violent Night". That one was pure fun beginning to end and will definitely be an annual staple for me.
I think youre wrong about Killers of the Flower Moon. I believe its a masterpiece and will only get better woth age.
They have doves right
Nope
are the lots of doves?
So we're going to be arguing whether Die Hard is a Christmas movie or an action movie in a Christmas setting again? 😄
Except in interviews in Asia he and other producers have said "john woo has finally made a christmas movie". Said I. A lot of language. Almost as a tag line. there is no need to have the argument.
Hell yeah!
I mean Die hard the Christmas is incidental
I'd argue it's a big part of the movie: the setting and decorations, it's the reason he's in LA, "Ho ho ho," ending the movie with Christmas music. It's a big part of the aesthetic. It's basically window dressing here.
@@DanMurrellMovies but the story would play out them same if the would remove the Christmas stuff. It could be a New Year’s party Or a wedding. Etc.
The story would, yes. But Christmas is infused throughout stylistically in a way that makes it closely tied to the holiday and it plays into the story. Even down to the holiday gift tape John uses for the gun at the end. This movie has a Christmas tree up in the corner and a character wearing a Santa jacket. That’s about it.
Who hired Kid Cudi? He was was useless 💀
Best revenge movie is Peppermint, gimme more Jennifer Garner revenge flicks
Felt like that movie, especially with what Dan said about white people getting revenge on brown people.
Check out ANIMAL released today. It's the best R rated film this year
💀
It’s on my hit list although the 3+ Hour running time seems excessive
They still trying to make this guy a thing
Do yourself a favor and watch Godzilla Minus One instead of this.
The silence should work well for John Woo who I think always had problems directing English dialogue (see Broken Arrow, Face Off and MI:2), but excelled in visual story telling. I would expect John Woo capable of reinvigorating his action style, like George Miller, so it a surprise to have an average review.
I certainly enjoyed *The Killer* more than reviews suggested, but it was an interesting choice for Fincher to film major fight scenes in natural light, often at night (very realistic for an assassin) when John Wick goes out of its way to light those scenes clearly to the benefit of the visual story-telling. This is where George Miller’s style is radically different, filming the brightest day, in wide-open spaces. This allows his action to flow across the screen without any barrier and I wonder if the stills from *Silent Night* suggest too much shadowy realism blocking the only way we have of relating to a mute central character?
Fincher's "The Killer" was dull. John Woo's "The Killer" is fantastic.
This movie was complete and utter garbage. I would never rewatch this movie.
Silent Night is a great movie. As for the comments that the guns shoot too many times, well the movie shows guns being reloaded numerous times. If there were 100 guys like this in every city crime would be eliminated. This movie so good that the fact that there is no dialogue in the movie is not even noticed unless someone points it out to you.
This movie is so stupid. Absolute garbage
I'm not happy about the "white guy kills all the brown bad people" aspect of this film that should have stayed in the early '00s. If it was anyone else but John Woo (whom I've loved forever), I would skip for that alone, but I'll probably go see it in theaters either this or next weekend.
Aside from the "brown people bad", the whole movie feels like it's conservative bait. I'm sure it worked well for the target audience.
I just love this man Dan Murrell. He gets it