The reason he's such a chatterbox is explicitly to distract opponents, keep them from thinking clearly, and make them underestimate him, he's been manipulating people right from the start.
@@cryptokoolaid Spider-Man is actually one of a couple heroes including the Hulk and possibly wolverine with reverse plot armor. It's usually crappy writing that allows low to mid tier enemies to even land a hit on them. In actuality, they are all power players in their own right with scores of legitimate victories well above their weight class. Been following Spider-man for well over 30 years. He has an impressive resume. He often will take out enemies that it takes teams like the avengers, the fantastic 4, and the x-men on without help. He also has been taken on and won against teams of supervillains like the sinister six. He's solo'd Doctor Doom, Magneto, and Ultron in his respective comics.
I remember a long, long time ago when Kulan Gath turned NYC into a savage version of itself, it was Strange himself who stated Magik had an enormous potential and might someday become more powerful than himself. that was all the way back 1985. (damn, how time flies by...). Strange alone wasn't strong enough to undo Kulans doing, and in the end he used Magiks powers ontop of his own to ban Kulan.
@@TheGamingCrowMost forget those Kulan Gath issues, and I am not sure if it was JR Jr. Or Art Adams that did the art for that arc, wait it was JR Jr art--- it introduced Nimrod. I was buying these comic when I could go to the store and find the new issues on one of those spinning wire racks. God,.. I'm old. 😅
@@dakotatrue12 And that's the problem now. Everyone is "useless" when the X-Men are around. It's stupid, unbelievable and shows a lack of understanding the comic universe you're playing in.
Hmm scott was relatively stable. Emma was a manipulative time bomb. Illyanna was already lying to her brother to keep him the juggernaut to educate him. Colossus was the juggernaut. Namor was violatile. So I would 4 were exactly what you wrote.
Yeah, but that's pretty normal in comic books. It's not like the X-Men ever really show up when say the Fantastic Four are attacked. In an X-Men comic book other super hero teams usually won't show up unless it's a cross over or company wide event. It's kind of a given in an X-Men comic book that the stories are resolved by the X-Men, not the Avengers. I guess you could fault X-Men writers for not using the Avengers more often to resolve their problems if you wanted to, but that's just normal comic book writing IMO.
Well except having mutants on their time (former criminal mutants to be precise) basically from the beginning and so fostering good relationships between the two side and (when possible) always help the X-men when called...plus if we want to be precise, neither the x-men had rushed to help the Avengers when they were attacked preferring to remaing in their country luxurious house to do their emo kid routine. Honestly the Avengers hdd done for good human-mutants relations much much more than the X-men that frankly look more and more like a (racist) cult than a legitimate group of good guys
@@lukedalton Exactly, and besides like anything the avengers aren't a unimind. Some memebers of the avengers do more for mutants than others, some just partake in protest but will defend them from hatred if needed.
So having someone powerful enough to take on the Phoenix Five is no problem, but the Phoenix Five are a problem. It don't seem like they were a problem until the Avengers decided they don't like to be shown up. So the root of the problem was the Avengers.
The concern was that the phoenix would corrupt them and cause them to start taking things to far. Which is exactly what happened. To begin with the earth would have been destroyed if the Avengers let the X-men go through with their original plan. Which was to simply trust hope and pray for the best. The X-men were literally gambling with the lives of everyone on earth.
I'm sorry, but Marvel hates Cyclops. They kept making him the bad guy when the avengers were escalating this issue the entire time. They split the Phoenix. They tried to kidnap Hope. Scarlet Witch's no more mutants is the reason this entire fiasco happened. Black Panther is a moron for breaking up with Storm. And Wolverine is no help. He's the reason Hope ran, to begin with. I hated how this was a shitshow to blame it all on Cyclops. He's been Marvel's punching bag along with Spiderman's personal life. Captain America and Iron man hold equal responsibility, if not more than Scott, yet they are treated like Heros. I guess history is written by the victors. Didn't jean destroy planets as the Phoenix but that's all forgiven. I seriously hate Marvel writers sometimes.
If the Avengers hadn’t split the Phoenix the earth would have been destroyed. Hope literally asks Logan to kill her when she realizes she can’t control even a fraction of the power. Scotts the one who stops him with zero alternatives for dealing with the Phoenix. Also hope doesn’t run away at first because of Wolverine. She had already knocked out her classmates before Logan and Spidey arrived. At that point the Phoenix was already influencing hope. That’s why Logan’s the only person she trusts to do what’s needs to be done. The Avengers were honestly making reasonable request’s considering how powerful the phoenix force is. Sure cap was kinda aggressive about it but Scott’s still the one who struck first. The X-men were way to eager to gamble with peoples lives. Their only plan was hope and she clearly wasn’t ready. Even across 5 X-men they couldn’t control the Phoenix without being corrupted.
The avengers invaded Utopia and Cap demanded on Cyclops. Why wouldn't Cyclops strike first? Thanks to him mutants start been born again all over the world. An entire race has been saved from extinction. Cyclops was right!
@@osvaldodestefano6791 And thousands of Wakandians got killed in the process. Not to mention the hundreds of people that will die or get injured for every op mutant that suddenly comes into a power they can’t control. What a great trade off. If the X-men had given Hope up immediately she may have had enough time to train in kun-lun and fully been able to control the phoenix.
@@KingkuntaGG People injured happens with the little wars that the Avengers occasionaly do. But talking about Wakanda you're right. Namor was a piece of shit by doing that. What I'm saying is that: no one takes care better of your house than yourself. You know? Where were the avengers (and I mean every single one) after House of M? Lending a helping hand? The same heroes that always helped then when the shit gets global serious had to figured out how to survive by themselves. "Well they are barely extinct. Fuck it. It's not my problem." So I understand why Cyclops did what he needed to do. Because no one else had the courage to say: ok, I'm the leader. It's my responsability. And we can't forget how intimate he knows the power of Phoenix. And the Kun Lun thing was a card that the Avengers took in the middle of the crisis. It wasn't their first Idea. The Idea, as we could see was destroy the Phoenix with a fucking god armor. And can put myself on Cyclops's skin: "What should I do to save my people from extinction?" Everything!
No, they didn't favor Avengers. Avengers was always a B team, until the movies made them popular. Marvel had to start with Avenger hero movies because when Marvel was going bankrupt, all the popular heroes rights got bought up by movie studios (Xmen, Spiderman, Hulk, even Fantastic 4). No one tried buying the Avenger heroes because lack of popularity
Right, that's why there's more xmen toys, games, clothes, show, etc before the MCU began. The xmen are all cry babies anyway. They always 'accidentally' kill people, then go wHy dO tHeY hAtE mE I DiDnT mEaN tO kIlL tHe EnTiRe CiTy.
Nicely done. I usually don't have the time to go through storylines like these that take hours on other channels because of all the tie-ins that they include.
I was team X-Men through and through, the side chapters show exactly that Scott was the only one still in control before the Avenger's reckless plan empowered the others. in fact in those comic books, it was clearly shown that Scott was planning on stopping the other four, but Namor's attack and eventual defeat came too soon, With him being empowered more and more he spent time trying to fight back against the Phoenix force. Which is exactly why Cyclops hadn't gone on the offensive before Magik and Colossus fell. More importantly weeks before the event was released we had comic books on Avenger's side, showing that the Avengers were desperate. Captain America was still feeling the effects of the civil war, which never really went away. As he was forced to bow his head to the government. This influenced his bad decisions in Avengers vs X-men.
@@scoobydoo316us The avengers fed their version of the events to Professor X, he was actually called before Scott fell, but arrived too late. If the Avengers had told him about their plans of training Hope to recieve Phoenix, and had Xavier used that info, things might have turned out a lot different
Or... Cap: Hey, I know you've been handling the whole Phoenix thing yourselves the past 20 years, but Marvel said we're finally supposed to care, soooooo... Scott: Go f**k yourself!!! Cap: Yeah, that's fair.
I'm a huge X-Men fan. This being said I remember when I read it that Cyclops had a vision of extinction if he didn't save the phoenix force. Does anyone else remember this? I think it was part of the introduction before everything started
@@mangareader7474 Lets be honest Colossus tried to kill Spider-man with only a quarter of the phoenix force influencing him...that shit is superhero meth!
Cable showed Cyclops a vision of a bleak future if Cyclops didn't save the Phoenix Force. He made him promise to do everything in his power to protect Hope. Cyclops kept that promise. Now why Cable didn't tell hope about this is beyond me.
I own just about every issue that was part of this event. When this series happened years ago I was subscribed to 2 or 3 Xmen and Avengers comics a week at Newbury Comics just so I could follow the entire story. The story was great, and the 1 vs 1 battle standalone comics were awesome as well.
Phoenix Five: *fix food supplies and end world hunger* Avengers: This is terrible what they're doing! Phoenix Five: *get rid of imperialistic nations' horrific weapons of war* Avengers: The humanity! What have they done?? Phoenix Five: *establish world peace* Avengers: NOOOOOO, this is the last straw! Won't anyone think of the WEAPONS CONTRACTORS?!! And thus, it was Earth's Mightiest "Heroes" to the "rescue"!
yes while they were doing good thing, they had an extreme power and a just as extreme ideology, its dangerous and could lead to world domination, the avengers just wanted to prevent the situation outright in the first place by not wanting the phoenix force to even come to earth, which in hindsight is pretty smart when your talking about a cosmic power with the abilty to destroy worlds easily
@@bradynielson8123 "Oh no, these peace-lovers who ended world hunger, ended war and established world peace might 'dominate' the world! Quick, let's restore power to the bloodthirsty, warmongering plutocrats who already control it so that Raytheon can make more money as kids get bombed! Because after all, the handful of billionaires who basically control everything clearly aren't 'dominating' the world."
@@bradynielson8123 I mean, bruh, I haven't read the whole comic, bruh, but from what I saw here, bruh, it seems pretty clear, bruh, that the Avengers were wrong, bruh. Bruh bruh bruh. What do you think is so terrible about what they did?
@n0wheregrrl While they did take over the Earth technically, there wasn't anything wrong with their initial actions. The PROBLEM was, being a member of a Pheonix Five is like having a tumor inside your head that gives you godlike powers. Even before Namor went crazy on Wakanda, got knocked out, and let the Pheonix 5 become the Pheonix 4, which one could argue is still incharacter for Namor on a bad day, Emma Frost admitted that the Pheonix took over her thoughts for a second and acted, nearly killing Hawkeye. Remember the scene where Beast leaves the Avengers telling he's seen no proof yet of them going mad? If Beast was in the room when Emma Frost admits that, he would of gotten his proof, and if he was still in their good graces, would of insisted on doing tests on her to see if anything could be done, and if they refused, he would of rejoined the Avengers sooner. Another analogy is by splitting up the Pheonix into 5, they created younger sun's with a much higher life cycle until Supernova. Aka Dark Pheonix. One can do a lot of good with 5 reality warping sun's, but they will all go Supernova very quickly just not as quickly as one Pheonix.
The thing that bugged me about this series is that it's very avengers sided only because of the movies, as they wanted to promote them more. If you think about it none of the events would've happen if the avengers didn't declare war on people they couldn't control. All the negative or at least the start of all the negative stuff is the sole fault of the avengers alone. Cause they know all lol it's was very easy to see that this whole series was only made to make mutants look bad as the prop up the avengers for the movies. Not saying Scott and the five didn't do bad stuff but they were also brought to that point by the avengers.
Incorrect. Their primary objective was to take Hope into protective custody. But they were up against an island full of powerful mutants. Cap was aware of what would happen should a diplomatic solution fail and the world is at stake.
Spider-Man really doesn't get the props he deserves from the super hero community IMO. He's one of the greatest heroes on the planet who his literally fought and teamed up with everyone, but he's still not the most well respected heroes amongst a lot of his peers. Its weird.
This was my favorite comic storyline when i was like 12. It still holds up all these years later. It feels alot different then most one shots stories. Almost anime like in plot structure.
it still kinda bothers me Wolverine was on the Avengers side in this story. i know he's been on both teams and I'm sure they wanted him butting heads with Cyclops like always but come on he's always an X-Man before he's an Avenger kinda seemed like he just betrayed the X-men and his fellow mutants. i also wish this was a more grey area battle after a while its clear Avengers = Good guys X-Men = Bad guys. i wish they could have just fought on differing ideologies instead of a magic fire bird from space making one side the obvious bad guys. I've always been more of an Avengers guy but even i was like why are they throwing the X-Men side under the bus like this? i can't imagine how X fans feel about this story
Remember that Logan went off on his own secret mission to kill Hope without Caps knowlege. He initially wasn't on the Avengers team so much as he was on his own team. It wasn't until the X-Men starting taking over the world and the Avengers were training Hope that Wolverine was solidly on the Avengers side. But by that point it was pretty clear cut which side he needd to be on. That's why the X-Men started defecting... Logan just did it ahead. While I did think the story made the Avengers to look like the good guys, plenty of X-Men fans would argue the X-Men were right and the Avengers were wrong. So it wasn't as black and white as I perceived it to be.
This is way after schism where Cyclops and Wolverine split the mutants up. Some followed Cyclops who believed they need to be more militaristic to survive. While another part stayed with Logan who established the Jean Grey School, to teach mutant children as Xavier once did. There is also the events of Avengers: X-Sanction which is prelude and very important to the context of this story.
Narrator: "without hesitation she says 'YES'"...😅😂😅 Canon: (Comic:) *she hesitates, as illustrated by the words in the bubble by her head that read: "I....I...Yes!!"
@@ph-1012 He held back Cyclops with half of the Pheonix Force with the Crimson Bands. Not insignificant. Thor, Wanda, Hope and Strange, Richard Rider, that Dragon and Iron-Man were probably the most significant non-Phoenix forces in this story. I’d like to think a full powered Magneto or Storm could’ve done something as well. None of them have anything on the strength of Spider-Man’s greatest power: Emotional Manipulation
I honestly don’t understand why anyone would side with the X-men here. They should know by now that tampering with the Phoenix always leads to disaster. The Avengers handled the situation poorly but they weren’t wrong to not want any of this to happen. Honestly the only person who acted with any common sense is Wolverine. He showed a level of practicality with knowing killing Hope might have to be an option, but was self aware enough to hear her out and not be reactionary like everyone else.
Isn't the first time Wolverine beat him. Coming out of House of M when he got his memory back, he fought Cap and was winning until iirc Nuke showed up and it became a three-way fight. I think it ended with Wolverine just leaving.
In a way, the Avengers were like a stand-in for the military industrial complex. What purpose would the Avengers really serve in a peaceful, post-scarcity utopia? Not much of one, for the most part ... so they had to stop it at any cost.
What Title issues are depicted with this great storyline? How many issues are there? This is a great way for me to start reading comics again after over 3 decades.
It was a nice story because you can get where everyone was coming from. Scott was hoping the phoenix would help his people although he could have never been sure this will work but he had to do it in his mind. His people were an endangered species and he spent all this time trying desperately to make sure they won't go extinct from all the threats they were facing. Cap saw a phoenix force that was destroying planets on its path for no reason coming to earth and of course he couldn't risk that force potentially becoming a threat to everyone especially by trusting a 16 year old girl who would have no idea what she was getting in for. Wolverine knew this was a huge gamble and he wasn't going to risk everyone. And when the war started well the two teams saw it as mutant vs human fight to see reason. After the war with the phoenix five they did good but they never considered you can't get the powers of a god and avoid being corrupted. They couldn't see it until it was too late to do anything about it. And if they did well who would give up the power of a god? And of course two teams of superheroes had a lot of fights.
So they immediately use the power to grow excessive amounts of food. But don't take into account the farms now unable to sell the food they've grown now that the cost of the grains have plummeted. Thus they go out of business. So now the world is reliant on the Phoenix 5 to make food for them every year and we all know how long that will last. Even the most simple altruistic things can have devastating longer-term consequences.
@@bloody4558 Nor do you need fictional food to feed fictional people. I thought it was a given that we all know we are talking about a fictional story. Anyway, how do you think people eat now on land that is unfarmable? The grain is purchased from elsewhere and shipped there. Only now the grain won't be purchased. So no farmers next year to buy grain from. Really its not complicated.
Colossus killing a bunch of whales in the story because he thought it was a good idea to give them crab legs so they could walk on land pretty clearly illustrates that the X-Men didn't know what the heck they were doing even if they did mean well. A good person making stupid decisions can be just as bad or even worse as a bad person who does.
Go out of business? First, the nations they were growing extra food in are brutally exploited under neo-colonialism anyway. It's not that they lack resources; it's that "developed" nations _steal_ their resources. Second, "Won't anyone think of the profit motive and the poor capitalists??" is a stupid response to the concept of ending hunger and making food plentiful. We don't live in economies; we live in _societies._ If the magic, made-up numbers only work if people are starving, then _fuck the made-up numbers._ We could easily restructure into a better, post-scarcity utopia in such a situation: one where being able to eat isn't gated behind having enough of the made-up numbers.
Cable solos the Avengers and the X men did nothing wrong. Wolverine acted out of character as a traitor and this story sucks but the art is cool. This was marvel jabbing at the X men because they didn't have the fox rights back yet. Disrespectful to fans.
This event is why I will always consider Cyclops to be the better man. I like Wolverine better yeah, but while Cyclops has had some problems in life, he was the victim in most of them. Wolverine however _is_ the recurring problem in his life.
@@azureheart2846 thank the writers that don't know how to write characters properly because they don't understand the characters they have been given to them to write for.
Wolverine wasn't acting out of character at all. Him plotting to murder Hope behind both Cap and Scotts back is exactly what he would do. Logan was never blindly loyal to the X-Men, or Avengers for that matter.
@@wallsterrence the power of the Phoenix Force is corrupting. Only a select few can use it without any problems. And Cyclops is not one of them. There was an issue where Cyclops realizes that he’s losing touch with his humanity, or something like that he’s a Mutant and they don’t like being referred to as humans. He talks to Jean's ashes, roll with it, and her final response was to point out his lack of emotion when talking to his wife’s literal ashes.
Ok , am I the only one who noticed Logan with POLAR BEARS in ANTARCTICA ? Because last time I checked they're on the wrong end of the planet . POLAR BEARS are in the Arctic , at the North Pole !
Question...isn't that Thor with the Odin force? And if it is, you cannot just push over Thor with the Odin force. He has fought the Phoenix force before...and has won hasn't he?
AFTER I WATCH THIS !! I REALIZED I HATE THE AVENGERS THERE JUST JEALOUS WHAT THE PHOENIX FIVE HAS ACCOMPLISHED .. LOOK HOW BLACK PANTHER STEP ASIDE FROM THIS WAR HE CLEARLY UNDERSTAND THAT THERE WAS NOTHING WRONG
Apparently Iron Fist is supposed to stop this but he does nothing except give a place to hide out for a while. They should really make up their minds on Iron Fist is he or is not useful, in of himself.
4:37 "Seing as how Logan just had his entire bidy burned, he's been healing for the past hour." - !? When did they downgrade his rate if regeneration, that's 1/12th the healing speed of Wolverine in the 1990's.
This must suck for Wolvy. Unable to choose which side to fight for knowing that he’ll end up breaking some friendships and bonds. Choosing whether to help his fellow mutants or avengers. Like jebus man he’s only a guy with claws and a healing factor, he can’t multiply like Multiple Man.
I like how after the Messiah Complex and the Young Avengers crusades they learned everything wrong with Scott Summers, and they still followed him. At least Emma learned that she's not good for him in the end.
Ion blame scott tbh i blame professor x. Half of what scott does is bc of professor x. He basically turned cyclops into his dream maker and when the burden was too much didnt know how to stop it. But it more so when cyclops lost jean he lost his vision of the world he wanted. Its more so cyclops cant move on from that and in turn he cant see professor x true dream. Cyclops is stuck in the middle
My take: Both sides were flawed, but Captain America and the Avengers went to the island with the wrong premise. They went to try and imprison the phoenix host, which was inevitably not going to work. By going in with the expression that their will be done they alienated the X-Men, who have way more experience with the phoenix force. The proper thing to do would have been to "call ahead." Begin a discourse. Treat the mutants with the respect that their world saving activities should have earned them. Then try and prep Hope to host the phoenix force With Dr. Strange's literally centuries of magical experience and Hope's ability to mimic all mutant powers (which means yes, regardless of Marvel's "retcon" Wanda IS still a mutant once Hope mimicked her) within her range and a telepathic bond to all, a shared consciousness would have dispersed the strain among them all, allowing Hope to properly utilize the power with guidance from all. Of course then we don't get The Avengers vs. The X-Men, so that was never gonna happen. I made that all up by the way, in about 10 minutes including typing time.
@@Chckster they would win, the x men, that is. you see, the x men pretty much live together and train together so they can work better as a team. also they have more members. :)
Eh. Sorry if I seem like a downer. But I don't know how to feel towards both groups, as of late. Plus, it seems like the "X-men" (Krakoa-wise, anyway) have been real head-scratchers. Especially when that Franklin Richards debacle (which bordered on manipulative kidnapping) took place. It will take a fairly long time for me to feel like I should care about the "Avengers" and/or the "X-men". Hopefully I will regain that spark. But again, that's just me.
how does it borderline on manipulative kidnapping when all they did was simply ask if franklin would like to visit kraoka yet the fantastic four started to attack first and even invaded kraoka just off the assumption that the x-men had kidnapped franklin when it was actually Doom who had kidnapped him & Kitty
2:20 The only reason Scott struck with that much power, at that range, is because he knew Cap would raise his the shield to block. Picture the scene without it. Now you've got Cap coming to talk to you on your beachhead and Scott Summers, the leader of The X-Men, CUTTING HIM IN HALF. What would become of Mutants worldwide if 'Cyclops murdered Captain America'? Ugly thought.
Screw the avengers police mentality. And, frankly, screw the two groups in the same universe. Where where the xmen during the invasion. Makes zero sense. Comics can be so stupid.
Scott was kinda right x men are only heroes when they are need if not needed they must be controlled that's why avengers barely help x men if Tony didn't lose his company he wouldn't help either
Human fear, you find your friend now has godlike powers and is active in literally making the world better place, first thought let’s kill our friends it’s too dangerous even thou we don’t actively hunt down similar calabure villains. I mean.
The show that makes Cyclops so cool. This character was so cool, that he needs to act as a martyr. Very interesting intakes that he is ready to loose everything even his ideals, to save the mutants. Do not forget that after house of m, mutants were dissappearing and losing powers. Cyclops is enemy number 1 but the mutants race is still alive...
The Avengers have certainly done worse~ they also denied mutants help when they were going extinct with House of M, now ironically they happily embrace one of the most wildcard dangerous mutants to exist Scarlet Witch. The Avengers were right about the Phoenix Force and corruption- but we've seen Dr.Strange channeling and becoming corrupted multiple times by interplanetary entities- we've seen The Avengers both try to steal and then execute Galactus' power and then kill Reed for saving Galactus and thus the Universe. They've done the incursions and WW hulk.... So the mutants and X-men have slipped here and there, but the avengers slip almost every step they take like with civil war.
The irony here is that, while they were busy worrying about power corrupting, the Avengers were already being corrupted by power: their own power. They were the aggressors here, time and again, and it was their repeated aggressions and escalations that led to, well ... all of it. They did the exact thing they were worried about: they let power corrupt them toward evil. The Avengers were the real villains of the story.
1)Self-righteous Captain America demands Hope Summers to be turned over. 2) The Phoenix 5 creates world peace.....the Cap led Avengers "Nah this isn't gonna work for us". It seems that the Avengers were the real threat to the world.
I just find these members interesting. Namor and Juggernaut with the x-men and Wolverine,Daredevil, Luke Cage, Red Hulk, The thing and Spiderwoman with the Avengers.
Everyone says Spider-Man talks too much. Until he defeats two phoenix powered mutants by himself with his words.
Spidey for the win.
Spider-Man got his ass whooped and used his brain to stay alive not a win that surviving thru sneaky tactics
@@leronewestern7540 That’s too many words to say, “Spider-Man still won the fight.”
@@coreyhead5777 but he didn’t he lost and got back up after magik and colossus fight each other to try and gain the phoenix force
@@leronewestern7540 Did Dr. Strange defeat Dormamu? Did Spider-Man defeat the Red Goblin?
The fact that Spider -man's few words were able to pit them against each other is hilarious to me. Didn't know Spidey was a good manipulator.
Fun fact: spider use his jokes to make others underestimate him but in reality he is one PhD from a doctorate
The reason he's such a chatterbox is explicitly to distract opponents, keep them from thinking clearly, and make them underestimate him, he's been manipulating people right from the start.
plot armor
@@cryptokoolaid Spider-Man is actually one of a couple heroes including the Hulk and possibly wolverine with reverse plot armor. It's usually crappy writing that allows low to mid tier enemies to even land a hit on them. In actuality, they are all power players in their own right with scores of legitimate victories well above their weight class. Been following Spider-man for well over 30 years. He has an impressive resume. He often will take out enemies that it takes teams like the avengers, the fantastic 4, and the x-men on without help. He also has been taken on and won against teams of supervillains like the sinister six. He's solo'd Doctor Doom, Magneto, and Ultron in his respective comics.
@@talyn3932 lol solo doctor doom
I always thought it stupid, and wildly unbelievable, that Magik could dupe Dr. Strange
I remember a long, long time ago when Kulan Gath turned NYC into a savage version of itself, it was Strange himself who stated Magik had an enormous potential and might someday become more powerful than himself. that was all the way back 1985. (damn, how time flies by...). Strange alone wasn't strong enough to undo Kulans doing, and in the end he used Magiks powers ontop of his own to ban Kulan.
@@TheGamingCrowMost forget those Kulan Gath issues, and I am not sure if it was JR Jr. Or Art Adams that did the art for that arc, wait it was JR Jr art--- it introduced Nimrod. I was buying these comic when I could go to the store and find the new issues on one of those spinning wire racks. God,.. I'm old. 😅
Yeah Dr Strange is oddly useless in this story.
@@dakotatrue12 And that's the problem now. Everyone is "useless" when the X-Men are around. It's stupid, unbelievable and shows a lack of understanding the comic universe you're playing in.
... and that Dr. Strange is nerfed
The Phoenix Five just feels like the Phoenix chose the 5 most insecure, volatile, untrustworthy mutants and turned them into power rangers.
This is very true HAHAHA
@@Insignia2 Very false HAHAHA
like, from the X-Men team, yeah probably... but what if it picked a villain like Apocalypse, Sinister, etc?
Hmm scott was relatively stable. Emma was a manipulative time bomb. Illyanna was already lying to her brother to keep him the juggernaut to educate him. Colossus was the juggernaut. Namor was violatile. So I would 4 were exactly what you wrote.
Scott is anything but "insecure, volatile, and untrustworthy" tbh
We gotta remember that the Avengers never done anything to help out the mutants whenever they were attacked.
Yeah, but that's pretty normal in comic books. It's not like the X-Men ever really show up when say the Fantastic Four are attacked. In an X-Men comic book other super hero teams usually won't show up unless it's a cross over or company wide event. It's kind of a given in an X-Men comic book that the stories are resolved by the X-Men, not the Avengers.
I guess you could fault X-Men writers for not using the Avengers more often to resolve their problems if you wanted to, but that's just normal comic book writing IMO.
The avengers have mutants on their team, and they have defended their rights at times.
Well except having mutants on their time (former criminal mutants to be precise) basically from the beginning and so fostering good relationships between the two side and (when possible) always help the X-men when called...plus if we want to be precise, neither the x-men had rushed to help the Avengers when they were attacked preferring to remaing in their country luxurious house to do their emo kid routine. Honestly the Avengers hdd done for good human-mutants relations much much more than the X-men that frankly look more and more like a (racist) cult than a legitimate group of good guys
@@lukedalton Exactly, and besides like anything the avengers aren't a unimind. Some memebers of the avengers do more for mutants than others, some just partake in protest but will defend them from hatred if needed.
Spoken like someone who does not know comic book history.
So having someone powerful enough to take on the Phoenix Five is no problem, but the Phoenix Five are a problem. It don't seem like they were a problem until the Avengers decided they don't like to be shown up. So the root of the problem was the Avengers.
Pheonix five: *creates world peace*
Avengers: And I took that personally
Um, the X-men be ame communist dictators and tried to remake the world in their image. HE-LLO?!
the phoenix five were always unstable, it was a matter of time before they did something terrible
The concern was that the phoenix would corrupt them and cause them to start taking things to far. Which is exactly what happened.
To begin with the earth would have been destroyed if the Avengers let the X-men go through with their original plan. Which was to simply trust hope and pray for the best. The X-men were literally gambling with the lives of everyone on earth.
Avengers == ego.
I'm sorry, but Marvel hates Cyclops. They kept making him the bad guy when the avengers were escalating this issue the entire time. They split the Phoenix. They tried to kidnap Hope. Scarlet Witch's no more mutants is the reason this entire fiasco happened. Black Panther is a moron for breaking up with Storm. And Wolverine is no help. He's the reason Hope ran, to begin with. I hated how this was a shitshow to blame it all on Cyclops. He's been Marvel's punching bag along with Spiderman's personal life. Captain America and Iron man hold equal responsibility, if not more than Scott, yet they are treated like Heros. I guess history is written by the victors. Didn't jean destroy planets as the Phoenix but that's all forgiven. I seriously hate Marvel writers sometimes.
If the Avengers hadn’t split the Phoenix the earth would have been destroyed. Hope literally asks Logan to kill her when she realizes she can’t control even a fraction of the power. Scotts the one who stops him with zero alternatives for dealing with the Phoenix.
Also hope doesn’t run away at first because of Wolverine. She had already knocked out her classmates before Logan and Spidey arrived. At that point the Phoenix was already influencing hope. That’s why Logan’s the only person she trusts to do what’s needs to be done.
The Avengers were honestly making reasonable request’s considering how powerful the phoenix force is. Sure cap was kinda aggressive about it but Scott’s still the one who struck first.
The X-men were way to eager to gamble with peoples lives. Their only plan was hope and she clearly wasn’t ready. Even across 5 X-men they couldn’t control the Phoenix without being corrupted.
The avengers invaded Utopia and Cap demanded on Cyclops. Why wouldn't Cyclops strike first? Thanks to him mutants start been born again all over the world. An entire race has been saved from extinction. Cyclops was right!
@@osvaldodestefano6791 And thousands of Wakandians got killed in the process. Not to mention the hundreds of people that will die or get injured for every op mutant that suddenly comes into a power they can’t control. What a great trade off.
If the X-men had given Hope up immediately she may have had enough time to train in kun-lun and fully been able to control the phoenix.
@@KingkuntaGG People injured happens with the little wars that the Avengers occasionaly do. But talking about Wakanda you're right. Namor was a piece of shit by doing that. What I'm saying is that: no one takes care better of your house than yourself. You know? Where were the avengers (and I mean every single one) after House of M? Lending a helping hand? The same heroes that always helped then when the shit gets global serious had to figured out how to survive by themselves. "Well they are barely extinct. Fuck it. It's not my problem." So I understand why Cyclops did what he needed to do. Because no one else had the courage to say: ok, I'm the leader. It's my responsability. And we can't forget how intimate he knows the power of Phoenix. And the Kun Lun thing was a card that the Avengers took in the middle of the crisis. It wasn't their first Idea. The Idea, as we could see was destroy the Phoenix with a fucking god armor. And can put myself on Cyclops's skin: "What should I do to save my people from extinction?" Everything!
@@osvaldodestefano6791BALLS HAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHH
I will use the Phoenix Force to cook bacon and eggs
I'm gonna recycle so much more now. Derp.
I'll do a good ol Phoenix BBQ
@@999madgamer Noice 👍
No hash browns?!?
You've already gone dark Phoenix.
@@stephenmitchell9520 No, you go dark Phoenix if you burn the food.
Even though X-Men where the most popular book Marvel always favored the Avengers
No, they didn't favor Avengers. Avengers was always a B team, until the movies made them popular.
Marvel had to start with Avenger hero movies because when Marvel was going bankrupt, all the popular heroes rights got bought up by movie studios (Xmen, Spiderman, Hulk, even Fantastic 4). No one tried buying the Avenger heroes because lack of popularity
@@SuperMontsta that's good to know. F*** the avengers
Right, that's why there's more xmen toys, games, clothes, show, etc before the MCU began. The xmen are all cry babies anyway. They always 'accidentally' kill people, then go wHy dO tHeY hAtE mE I DiDnT mEaN tO kIlL tHe EnTiRe CiTy.
@@diehard200 Incel alert
@@diehard200it’s okay, the avengers don’t really exist, they can’t hurt you anymore.
Nicely done. I usually don't have the time to go through storylines like these that take hours on other channels because of all the tie-ins that they include.
Yep
I was team X-Men through and through, the side chapters show exactly that Scott was the only one still in control before the Avenger's reckless plan empowered the others. in fact in those comic books, it was clearly shown that Scott was planning on stopping the other four, but Namor's attack and eventual defeat came too soon, With him being empowered more and more he spent time trying to fight back against the Phoenix force. Which is exactly why Cyclops hadn't gone on the offensive before Magik and Colossus fell. More importantly weeks before the event was released we had comic books on Avenger's side, showing that the Avengers were desperate. Captain America was still feeling the effects of the civil war, which never really went away. As he was forced to bow his head to the government. This influenced his bad decisions in Avengers vs X-men.
Well said! 💪🏾
Cyclops was right. It’s a meme at this point, but it doesn’t make it any less true.
And what happened to Professor X. I can't remember what the avengers did to him
@@scoobydoo316us The avengers fed their version of the events to Professor X, he was actually called before Scott fell, but arrived too late. If the Avengers had told him about their plans of training Hope to recieve Phoenix, and had Xavier used that info, things might have turned out a lot different
Tell me you're a virgin without telling me you're a virgin - TH-cam comment Edition!
That brief perfect Phoenix force Era was a personal favorite as a 40- year x-fan. Great video!
The fact that Magneto didn't steal Caps shield and crush Iron Man shows how much plot armor the Avengers had
The fact that Dr strange didn't immediately one shot most of the X Men is even crazier
Cap: Hey, give us Hope.
Scott: Nah, we got this.
Cap: Oh, okay then.
*And war between the X-Men and Avengers was averted. The End*
Or...
Cap: Hey, I know you've been handling the whole Phoenix thing yourselves the past 20 years, but Marvel said we're finally supposed to care, soooooo...
Scott: Go f**k yourself!!!
Cap: Yeah, that's fair.
I'm a huge X-Men fan. This being said I remember when I read it that Cyclops had a vision of extinction if he didn't save the phoenix force. Does anyone else remember this? I think it was part of the introduction before everything started
Yes the cyclops used his visors to exterminate Charles Xavier
@@mangareader7474 Lets be honest Colossus tried to kill Spider-man with only a quarter of the phoenix force influencing him...that shit is superhero meth!
Cable showed Cyclops a vision of a bleak future if Cyclops didn't save the Phoenix Force. He made him promise to do everything in his power to protect Hope. Cyclops kept that promise. Now why Cable didn't tell hope about this is beyond me.
I own just about every issue that was part of this event. When this series happened years ago I was subscribed to 2 or 3 Xmen and Avengers comics a week at Newbury Comics just so I could follow the entire story. The story was great, and the 1 vs 1 battle standalone comics were awesome as well.
Cool. the art in the early issues was really cringe.
Phoenix Five: *fix food supplies and end world hunger*
Avengers: This is terrible what they're doing!
Phoenix Five: *get rid of imperialistic nations' horrific weapons of war*
Avengers: The humanity! What have they done??
Phoenix Five: *establish world peace*
Avengers: NOOOOOO, this is the last straw! Won't anyone think of the WEAPONS CONTRACTORS?!!
And thus, it was Earth's Mightiest "Heroes" to the "rescue"!
yes while they were doing good thing, they had an extreme power and a just as extreme ideology, its dangerous and could lead to world domination, the avengers just wanted to prevent the situation outright in the first place by not wanting the phoenix force to even come to earth, which in hindsight is pretty smart when your talking about a cosmic power with the abilty to destroy worlds easily
@@bradynielson8123 "Oh no, these peace-lovers who ended world hunger, ended war and established world peace might 'dominate' the world!
Quick, let's restore power to the bloodthirsty, warmongering plutocrats who already control it so that Raytheon can make more money as kids get bombed! Because after all, the handful of billionaires who basically control everything clearly aren't 'dominating' the world."
@@n0wheregrrl bruh do u even know the story? They literally took over the world, mostly cyclops but still the dude turned out really bad.
@@bradynielson8123 I mean, bruh, I haven't read the whole comic, bruh, but from what I saw here, bruh, it seems pretty clear, bruh, that the Avengers were wrong, bruh. Bruh bruh bruh.
What do you think is so terrible about what they did?
@n0wheregrrl While they did take over the Earth technically, there wasn't anything wrong with their initial actions.
The PROBLEM was, being a member of a Pheonix Five is like having a tumor inside your head that gives you godlike powers.
Even before Namor went crazy on Wakanda, got knocked out, and let the Pheonix 5 become the Pheonix 4, which one could argue is still incharacter for Namor on a bad day, Emma Frost admitted that the Pheonix took over her thoughts for a second and acted, nearly killing Hawkeye.
Remember the scene where Beast leaves the Avengers telling he's seen no proof yet of them going mad? If Beast was in the room when Emma Frost admits that, he would of gotten his proof, and if he was still in their good graces, would of insisted on doing tests on her to see if anything could be done, and if they refused, he would of rejoined the Avengers sooner.
Another analogy is by splitting up the Pheonix into 5, they created younger sun's with a much higher life cycle until Supernova. Aka Dark Pheonix. One can do a lot of good with 5 reality warping sun's, but they will all go Supernova very quickly just not as quickly as one Pheonix.
The thing that bugged me about this series is that it's very avengers sided only because of the movies, as they wanted to promote them more. If you think about it none of the events would've happen if the avengers didn't declare war on people they couldn't control. All the negative or at least the start of all the negative stuff is the sole fault of the avengers alone. Cause they know all lol it's was very easy to see that this whole series was only made to make mutants look bad as the prop up the avengers for the movies. Not saying Scott and the five didn't do bad stuff but they were also brought to that point by the avengers.
This series proved to me more than ever that the avengers are bullies and the x men have saved the earth countless times yet none that mattered
and the artwork is bad
Absolute power corrupts absolutely
@@classyrobot5648 Exactly why the Avengers needed to be stopped.
The Avengers wanted to stop the Phoenix force ... How is that a popularity contest?
"Namor infested waters below."
🤣
2:15 So basically Cap and the Avengers openly came to attack Cyclops and his crew of mutants on Utopia, did I get that right?!?
Incorrect. Their primary objective was to take Hope into protective custody. But they were up against an island full of powerful mutants. Cap was aware of what would happen should a diplomatic solution fail and the world is at stake.
@@dwarrow25 not exactly diplomatic when you show up to another’s land and remove an inhabitant by force.
Classic American "diplomatic" solutions.
Yeah. Captain America was so badly written in this crossover. He had to be a hot headed ass because the script said so.
@@AT-gh9js What part about "the world is at stake" did you have trouble understanding? Diplomacy serves to prepare for as often as to avoid war.
Spider-man takes the mvp role here easy
Him Wanda and Hope
Spider-Man really doesn't get the props he deserves from the super hero community IMO. He's one of the greatest heroes on the planet who his literally fought and teamed up with everyone, but he's still not the most well respected heroes amongst a lot of his peers. Its weird.
@@noelbernabe8704 I'm not sure if its in this video but Cable reveals Spider-Man goes down in history as the greatest hero ever.
@@jspur22that is understandable guy saved the spider verse so many times
@@noelbernabe8704 well I wouldn't say he isn't well respected tho and he is differently a top marvel character forsure but in a sense you make a point
This was my favorite comic storyline when i was like 12. It still holds up all these years later. It feels alot different then most one shots stories. Almost anime like in plot structure.
it still kinda bothers me Wolverine was on the Avengers side in this story. i know he's been on both teams and I'm sure they wanted him butting heads with Cyclops like always but come on he's always an X-Man before he's an Avenger kinda seemed like he just betrayed the X-men and his fellow mutants. i also wish this was a more grey area battle after a while its clear Avengers = Good guys X-Men = Bad guys. i wish they could have just fought on differing ideologies instead of a magic fire bird from space making one side the obvious bad guys. I've always been more of an Avengers guy but even i was like why are they throwing the X-Men side under the bus like this? i can't imagine how X fans feel about this story
I'm more of an x fan and I don't like this story too particularly much. It was while marvel was doing the X men dirty because of their feud with fox.
Remember that Logan went off on his own secret mission to kill Hope without Caps knowlege. He initially wasn't on the Avengers team so much as he was on his own team.
It wasn't until the X-Men starting taking over the world and the Avengers were training Hope that Wolverine was solidly on the Avengers side. But by that point it was pretty clear cut which side he needd to be on. That's why the X-Men started defecting... Logan just did it ahead.
While I did think the story made the Avengers to look like the good guys, plenty of X-Men fans would argue the X-Men were right and the Avengers were wrong. So it wasn't as black and white as I perceived it to be.
He was roped into the situation by Cap and then kicked off literally by cap. Id say he was more his own team/3rd party not on avengers or xmen
This is way after schism where Cyclops and Wolverine split the mutants up. Some followed Cyclops who believed they need to be more militaristic to survive. While another part stayed with Logan who established the Jean Grey School, to teach mutant children as Xavier once did. There is also the events of Avengers: X-Sanction which is prelude and very important to the context of this story.
Wolverine alternate between boot licker and wild animal
For being the good guys they turn to violence pretty quickly instead of talking it out.
This better happen in the movies.. that’s straight money right there n a different way of telling the phoenix story we already saw twice
X-Men all the way…
Now & Forever…
Btw this is NOT first X-Men VS Avengers storyline. I read the original back in the late 80’s when I was a kid…😊
Narrator: "without hesitation she says 'YES'"...😅😂😅 Canon: (Comic:) *she hesitates, as illustrated by the words in the bubble by her head that read: "I....I...Yes!!"
"The extreme cold of the *_Antarctic."_*
"...Using the hide of a polar bear..."
Am I the only one who sees the problem?
“Starts war”
“Loses war until help bails him out”
“Blames other side for war”
He really is Captain America.
Polar bears in ANTarctica??? I call shenanigans.
Bought this story as an MP4 at a truck stop, some years ago. It was rather well done with an entire cast of actors performing the voices.
It's all fun and games until Doctor Strange shows up to the battle ...
he litterally got defeated easily by Magik in this and did nothing else lmao
@@ph-1012 He held back Cyclops with half of the Pheonix Force with the Crimson Bands. Not insignificant.
Thor, Wanda, Hope and Strange, Richard Rider, that Dragon and Iron-Man were probably the most significant non-Phoenix forces in this story. I’d like to think a full powered Magneto or Storm could’ve done something as well.
None of them have anything on the strength of Spider-Man’s greatest power: Emotional Manipulation
There are no polar bears in the Antarctic. JS...
"No team! Only Hulk!"
Thanks
i remeber hulk soloing the x-men and made them fight each other together w/ the avengers
I’m a 80s baby the X-Men have been my thing since the 90s
DareDevil just needs to go home
what's he gonna do
defend himself?
Yeah he was so outta place..
Sue them? :)
"Ugh god hell nah The Phoenix again I like to volunteer to be killed off first please I'm just not in the mood for this bull****..."
I honestly don’t understand why anyone would side with the X-men here. They should know by now that tampering with the Phoenix always leads to disaster. The Avengers handled the situation poorly but they weren’t wrong to not want any of this to happen. Honestly the only person who acted with any common sense is Wolverine. He showed a level of practicality with knowing killing Hope might have to be an option, but was self aware enough to hear her out and not be reactionary like everyone else.
It's just poor writing in all honesty.
In the end, Cyclops was right.
Anyone got anything to say about Wolvy getting the upper hand on Cap, and then Cap calls Giant man for help. 😂
Isn't the first time Wolverine beat him. Coming out of House of M when he got his memory back, he fought Cap and was winning until iirc Nuke showed up and it became a three-way fight. I think it ended with Wolverine just leaving.
Man basically the avengers are mad because they were not needed
In a way, the Avengers were like a stand-in for the military industrial complex.
What purpose would the Avengers really serve in a peaceful, post-scarcity utopia? Not much of one, for the most part ... so they had to stop it at any cost.
Professor X has been so humble knowing he can stop all of them just like Wanda 😭
He couldn't
@@sleeeeep He could.
Wanda couldn't but depending on which Xavier we could look at then yeah he could.
Lollll Wolverine killed a polar bear and carried it around to keep warm!!! This dude is the best.😂😂😂😂😂
Love this storytelling it’s fire please more vids like this
What Title issues are depicted with this great storyline? How many issues are there? This is a great way for me to start reading comics again after over 3 decades.
AvX (Avengers vs Xmen)
It was a nice story because you can get where everyone was coming from. Scott was hoping the phoenix would help his people although he could have never been sure this will work but he had to do it in his mind. His people were an endangered species and he spent all this time trying desperately to make sure they won't go extinct from all the threats they were facing. Cap saw a phoenix force that was destroying planets on its path for no reason coming to earth and of course he couldn't risk that force potentially becoming a threat to everyone especially by trusting a 16 year old girl who would have no idea what she was getting in for. Wolverine knew this was a huge gamble and he wasn't going to risk everyone.
And when the war started well the two teams saw it as mutant vs human fight to see reason. After the war with the phoenix five they did good but they never considered you can't get the powers of a god and avoid being corrupted. They couldn't see it until it was too late to do anything about it. And if they did well who would give up the power of a god? And of course two teams of superheroes had a lot of fights.
"The Avengers go to Far" title says as Namor commits near genocide in Wakanda.
Cyclops: "This isn't a war...it's a special mutant operation."
So they immediately use the power to grow excessive amounts of food. But don't take into account the farms now unable to sell the food they've grown now that the cost of the grains have plummeted. Thus they go out of business. So now the world is reliant on the Phoenix 5 to make food for them every year and we all know how long that will last.
Even the most simple altruistic things can have devastating longer-term consequences.
THat wouldn't happen on a land that was unfarmable before. You cannot harm fictional Farmers.
@@bloody4558 Nor do you need fictional food to feed fictional people. I thought it was a given that we all know we are talking about a fictional story.
Anyway, how do you think people eat now on land that is unfarmable? The grain is purchased from elsewhere and shipped there. Only now the grain won't be purchased. So no farmers next year to buy grain from. Really its not complicated.
Colossus killing a bunch of whales in the story because he thought it was a good idea to give them crab legs so they could walk on land pretty clearly illustrates that the X-Men didn't know what the heck they were doing even if they did mean well.
A good person making stupid decisions can be just as bad or even worse as a bad person who does.
Those damn mutants, they tok our jewbs
Go out of business?
First, the nations they were growing extra food in are brutally exploited under neo-colonialism anyway. It's not that they lack resources; it's that "developed" nations _steal_ their resources.
Second, "Won't anyone think of the profit motive and the poor capitalists??" is a stupid response to the concept of ending hunger and making food plentiful. We don't live in economies; we live in _societies._ If the magic, made-up numbers only work if people are starving, then _fuck the made-up numbers._ We could easily restructure into a better, post-scarcity utopia in such a situation: one where being able to eat isn't gated behind having enough of the made-up numbers.
Cable solos the Avengers and the X men did nothing wrong. Wolverine acted out of character as a traitor and this story sucks but the art is cool. This was marvel jabbing at the X men because they didn't have the fox rights back yet. Disrespectful to fans.
This event is why I will always consider Cyclops to be the better man. I like Wolverine better yeah, but while Cyclops has had some problems in life, he was the victim in most of them. Wolverine however _is_ the recurring problem in his life.
@@azureheart2846 thank the writers that don't know how to write characters properly because they don't understand the characters they have been given to them to write for.
Wolverine wasn't acting out of character at all. Him plotting to murder Hope behind both Cap and Scotts back is exactly what he would do. Logan was never blindly loyal to the X-Men, or Avengers for that matter.
wolverine fighting AGAINST the x-men feels very wrong
17:46 that sound came out of nowhere and spooked me D: it's nighttime and I'm still awake lol
The Avengers are real a$$holes it seems. Also, they always trying to find a way to do Cyclops dirty.
Scott Summers did nothing wrong.
He murdered the father of the xmen and let himself become the dark phoenix
>let himself
I’m sorry. Who divided the Pheonix into five parts that possessed Scott and his team again? Oh yeah, that was Tony.
@@edwinsolis5710 yea but who got power hungry?
@@edwinsolis5710 come harder next time
@@wallsterrence the power of the Phoenix Force is corrupting. Only a select few can use it without any problems. And Cyclops is not one of them.
There was an issue where Cyclops realizes that he’s losing touch with his humanity, or something like that he’s a Mutant and they don’t like being referred to as humans. He talks to Jean's ashes, roll with it, and her final response was to point out his lack of emotion when talking to his wife’s literal ashes.
Ok , am I the only one who noticed Logan with POLAR BEARS in ANTARCTICA ? Because last time I checked they're on the wrong end of the planet . POLAR BEARS are in the Arctic , at the North Pole !
Question...isn't that Thor with the Odin force? And if it is, you cannot just push over Thor with the Odin force. He has fought the Phoenix force before...and has won hasn't he?
War... What's it good for...Absolutely Nothin'.... Say it again!!...
Poor Charles gettin crispy
That Cyclops was my favorite ever.
The artist's rendition of these characters is jarring.
Logan giving that bear a big bear hug 😊😊😇
AFTER I WATCH THIS !! I REALIZED I HATE THE AVENGERS THERE JUST JEALOUS WHAT THE PHOENIX FIVE HAS ACCOMPLISHED .. LOOK HOW BLACK PANTHER STEP ASIDE FROM THIS WAR HE CLEARLY UNDERSTAND THAT THERE WAS NOTHING WRONG
Am I the only one a realize that the hero's are always fighting against themselves and most of the world's threatening issues is caused by them?
Apparently Iron Fist is supposed to stop this but he does nothing except give a place to hide out for a while. They should really make up their minds on Iron Fist is he or is not useful, in of himself.
For no reason, Captain Merica! Lol! 🤣😂
I love how Cap just sends Wolverine to the exact location where Hope is at lol
There aren't polar bears in Antarctica.
The narrator said that Wolverine used a dead polar bear to stay warm in Antarctica?!😮
4:37 "Seing as how Logan just had his entire bidy burned, he's been healing for the past hour." - !?
When did they downgrade his rate if regeneration, that's 1/12th the healing speed of Wolverine in the 1990's.
This must suck for Wolvy. Unable to choose which side to fight for knowing that he’ll end up breaking some friendships and bonds. Choosing whether to help his fellow mutants or avengers. Like jebus man he’s only a guy with claws and a healing factor, he can’t multiply like Multiple Man.
I like how after the Messiah Complex and the Young Avengers crusades they learned everything wrong with Scott Summers, and they still followed him. At least Emma learned that she's not good for him in the end.
Ion blame scott tbh i blame professor x. Half of what scott does is bc of professor x. He basically turned cyclops into his dream maker and when the burden was too much didnt know how to stop it. But it more so when cyclops lost jean he lost his vision of the world he wanted. Its more so cyclops cant move on from that and in turn he cant see professor x true dream. Cyclops is stuck in the middle
Right because being with jean was all sunshine and rainbows for Cyclops
Governments don't like peace. Avengers assemble. 😒
My take: Both sides were flawed, but Captain America and the Avengers went to the island with the wrong premise. They went to try and imprison the phoenix host, which was inevitably not going to work. By going in with the expression that their will be done they alienated the X-Men, who have way more experience with the phoenix force. The proper thing to do would have been to "call ahead." Begin a discourse. Treat the mutants with the respect that their world saving activities should have earned them. Then try and prep Hope to host the phoenix force With Dr. Strange's literally centuries of magical experience and Hope's ability to mimic all mutant powers (which means yes, regardless of Marvel's "retcon" Wanda IS still a mutant once Hope mimicked her) within her range and a telepathic bond to all, a shared consciousness would have dispersed the strain among them all, allowing Hope to properly utilize the power with guidance from all. Of course then we don't get The Avengers vs. The X-Men, so that was never gonna happen.
I made that all up by the way, in about 10 minutes including typing time.
i couldnt stop watching/reading this
what a good as series of movies this would have been!
I have never been more happy for comics explained and the RobCore.
the x men should have hired a lawyer and sued cap
Avengers had She-Hulk and DareDevil so I doubt X-Men would win
@@Chckster they would win, the x men, that is. you see, the x men pretty much live together and train together so they can work better as a team. also they have more members. :)
my fav comic is xmen but... seriously how many times are they gonna kill Xavier lol
Eh. Sorry if I seem like a downer. But I don't know how to feel towards both groups, as of late. Plus, it seems like the "X-men" (Krakoa-wise, anyway) have been real head-scratchers. Especially when that Franklin Richards debacle (which bordered on manipulative kidnapping) took place. It will take a fairly long time for me to feel like I should care about the "Avengers" and/or the "X-men". Hopefully I will regain that spark. But again, that's just me.
Isn't the whole point the moral ambiguity that you can see the right and wrong on both sides...?
Whatever, team avengers this time
how does it borderline on manipulative kidnapping when all they did was simply ask if franklin would like to visit kraoka yet the fantastic four started to attack first and even invaded kraoka just off the assumption that the x-men had kidnapped franklin when it was actually Doom who had kidnapped him & Kitty
NGL, around the time this X-Men V Avengers storyline was going on I was like, "are they trying to make us hate both groups as much as possible?"
@@Tony-fq5bn Not hate, make you see that both can be good and bad at the same time depending on what you perceive.
Xmen are way more powerful. Not even close. Mind control alone should have the avengers all fighting each other while the xmen chill and watch
I bet anything that eventually, after the X-men have been introduced, Marvel will make a movie version of this story in the MCU.
It's about time.
Now make this for next gen consoles.
2:20 The only reason Scott struck with that much power, at that range, is because he knew Cap would raise his the shield to block.
Picture the scene without it. Now you've got Cap coming to talk to you on your beachhead and Scott Summers, the leader of The X-Men, CUTTING HIM IN HALF. What would become of Mutants worldwide if 'Cyclops murdered Captain America'? Ugly thought.
there is only one team Peter Parker the spider man team
Screw the avengers police mentality. And, frankly, screw the two groups in the same universe. Where where the xmen during the invasion. Makes zero sense. Comics can be so stupid.
Scott was kinda right x men are only heroes when they are need if not needed they must be controlled that's why avengers barely help x men if Tony didn't lose his company he wouldn't help either
Human fear, you find your friend now has godlike powers and is active in literally making the world better place, first thought let’s kill our friends it’s too dangerous even thou we don’t actively hunt down similar calabure villains. I mean.
Glad I'm not the only one who saw the Avengers being serious villains here.
For being "superheroes" they certainly keep effing up. I wouldn't trust them to be a neighbourhood patrol.
Umm, wasn't it the Scarlet Witch who said, "No more mutants..."? It definitely was not Jean Grey or the Phoenix...
Avengers vs X-Men
AKA
Disney tries to bury the x-men even further.
The show that makes Cyclops so cool. This character was so cool, that he needs to act as a martyr. Very interesting intakes that he is ready to loose everything even his ideals, to save the mutants. Do not forget that after house of m, mutants were dissappearing and losing powers. Cyclops is enemy number 1 but the mutants race is still alive...
The Avengers have certainly done worse~ they also denied mutants help when they were going extinct with House of M, now ironically they happily embrace one of the most wildcard dangerous mutants to exist Scarlet Witch. The Avengers were right about the Phoenix Force and corruption- but we've seen Dr.Strange channeling and becoming corrupted multiple times by interplanetary entities- we've seen The Avengers both try to steal and then execute Galactus' power and then kill Reed for saving Galactus and thus the Universe. They've done the incursions and WW hulk.... So the mutants and X-men have slipped here and there, but the avengers slip almost every step they take like with civil war.
The irony here is that, while they were busy worrying about power corrupting, the Avengers were already being corrupted by power: their own power.
They were the aggressors here, time and again, and it was their repeated aggressions and escalations that led to, well ... all of it. They did the exact thing they were worried about: they let power corrupt them toward evil.
The Avengers were the real villains of the story.
Cyclops was right,
People need to stop believing they can take the full might of a godly force without getting corrupted
1)Self-righteous Captain America demands Hope Summers to be turned over.
2) The Phoenix 5 creates world peace.....the Cap led Avengers "Nah this isn't gonna work for us".
It seems that the Avengers were the real threat to the world.
Sooo. How did everyone fight and function on the moon with ZERO oxygen masks etc? Plot armor ?
i love how the green hulk isnt their because banner would know this is fucked up
To quote col. Samuel Trautman you had done some pushing of your own: First blood
An old favorite.
I just find these members interesting. Namor and Juggernaut with the x-men and Wolverine,Daredevil, Luke Cage, Red Hulk, The thing and Spiderwoman with the Avengers.
I know it's a comic but polar bears are not found in the antarctic.