Both of them have strong arguments in a very logical way but Qaisar Raja is more logical and convincing. I am very happy to see this type of debate in Pakistan and wisely conducted by TCM team. It has definitely opened the doors for number of students/individuals to take part in the discussions on sensitive issues of the faith, religion and all type of "isms"
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Bahi Allah ko Jeans 👖 se kia problem ha. Music dance laughing TV instrument se kia problem ha, Shave karne se kia Jannat nahi milti ... I live in Siberia how I wear pajama above knees I will die in cold. Or yahan 4 month day rehta 😮
@@ishwardevi134 you cant "understand" islam at a state level. Its everyone's personal choice how they want to interpret/understand their religion and how they want to implement it in their life
@@quamrulsiddiqui4225 financial transaction main female witness aadhi hay, so let me ask you this. Ager aik bank kee CEO aurat hay, aur bank ka chapraasi mard hay, tou kia chapraasi kee witness bank kee CEO say ziada valuable hay?? Kia benazir bhutton kee witness bhee financial transaction main half consider kee jaati ho gee??
First of all I appreciate TCM for providing such a stage to debaters in order to present their contradictory ideas in a peaceful setting. Secondly, upload full episodes or entire program in a single episode, so we dont have to wait for their defending sessions & can go with either of them... Bunch of Thanks TCM😇🙌
these discussions need to happen more so that the people can rationally and on an academic level see that Islam is the answer and the way of life to attain true peace in this life and the next.
This is a commendable initiative by TCM. Respectful debates play a vital role in addressing important issues. Dr. Mehrub presented compelling arguments, and Dr. Qaiser skillfully defended the perspective that Pakistan was founded on Islamic principles, which resonates with the majority, so it should be upheld.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
قائد اعظم نے کہا تھا ،اپ آزاد ہے مسجدوں میں جانے کے لیے مندروں میں جانے کے لیے اور گرجا گھروں میں جانے کے لیے قائد اعظم نے کبھی نہیں کہا کہ ہم اسلامی قانون نافذ کریں گے ۔وہ بھی ایک سکیولر ریاست چاہتے تھے
Mr.raja actually represent the enternal voice of each pakistani So no words in his honor but extremely thanks to Allah almighty for such aknowledgement,bless in this modern tenure the Great Mr.QAISER raja
Absolutely on spot Mr. Qaiser Ahmed Raja! Need more intellectual debates to give thought of food to general public who are stuck btw modernism and islamic values.
Bhai 26 million Muslims including mufti wajdi sahib prefer living with Jews, Christians and atheists in Europe, USA and Canada,under western,liberal, democratic values then live with Muslims in Muslim countries
First of all thanks TCM for arranging this long awaited and thought provoking discourse/ debate. Both sides presented their arguments in a very academic manner but Qaiser Raja sahab's arguments were more logical and concrete.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Great great explanation by qaiser Ahmad raja with historical and current scenario . I listened to this man for first time , very impressed and completely agree
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
@@abdulmonam7243I agree. They want to burst out and inflict maximum collateral damage , just like Israhelli military. These people are a disgrace to their Islamic good names
Such an enriching talk! I swear I feel so fulfilled and content by listening to such a philosophically, intellectually and realistically informed debate! Thank you TCM! This is going to be a trendsetter and will hopefully trigger a cultural/structural change in the nature of debates we usually have in Pakistan!
Anyone cannot measure my level of happiness on this sound discussion but it is not a complete discourse due to limited time. Such types of dialogue are crucial for a democratic culture. Both conversants have strong arguments to prove their perspective
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
As paksitani women I dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
It's ur point of view not mine & also what majority Pakistani wanted & think r Islamic Rules also.If u see in the secular western countriesEurope,America etc discriminate women in many aspects for e.g women married in these western countries r known by her husband name no women independent Individual right While Islam given independent individual right of married women allowed used their Father sur name or old name as such.In work place secular western countries women officer paid lesser amount than male counter part while in Islam women work as officer got paid same equal amount.Islam allowed women she doing work & her earning is own,husband have no right of took earning from her.Witness of women r half in some cases not everycase because of at Arab era of that time majority women r not working women so know how of trades, business info r less known.
@@just_a_woman-h9s KIndly write the whole ayat for quran which is that let me quote you "Men are the caretakers of women, as men have been provisioned by Allah over women and tasked with supporting them financially. And righteous women are devoutly obedient and, when alone, protective of what Allah has entrusted them with.1 And if you sense ill-conduct from your women, advise them ˹first˺, ˹if they persist,˺ do not share their beds, ˹but if they still persist,˺ then discipline them ˹gently˺.2 But if they change their ways, do not be unjust to them. Surely Allah is Most High, All-Great." What Allah say first "if you sense ill-conduct from your women, advise them ˹first˺," ..it mean if you think that there is something happening in your back then advice her first after in the second commandment Allah say if they persist,˺ do not share their beds, and in the third commandment Allah say then discipline them ˹gently˺ which mean if she obeys you and ask forgiveness from Allah then be gentle with her and if she not do then it's permissible to beat her...now there are 2 stage before beating her why didn't you quote that like i am just shocked that why didn't you qoute the first two stages
@@wardahali9676 how many years did u live in West to give me this lecture about what rights women have in West and what kind of life they have?? Let me just give u one example. Islam puts a price tag on a woman ( haq meher) money at the time of nikha. A wife is nothing more than a live in maid who can be replaced by another maid anytime. All husband has to do is give her gaq meher money and divorce her. He can have 4 of those maids too. In west, their is no price tag money on a woman. The day she gets married, she automatically owns 50% of the assets husband has. In case if divorce, all the assets are divided equally between husband and wife. This is called EQUAL PARTNERSHIP. Islam main tou aurat ka gher hee nahi. Kyounkay usay kaheen say bhee nikala ja sakta hay
@@ishwardevi134 yeah, these people want pakistan to turn into afghanistan. There are 100s of secular countries in the world where people follow their religion .. I live in US, people go to mosques/churches, temples etc and practice their religion. Mr Qaisar is wrong when he said in. a secular state, a person will have to act differently when they come out of the mosque.
Qaiser Ahmad Raja has impactfully advocated for the real purpose of Pakistan's creation, for Islam and for the sacrifices of our martyrs who died for the sole cause of an Islamic Republic of Pakistan. HATS OFF TO YOU SIR....
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s Islam doesn't allow beating of wife, that's how ill-informed you are about the subject and this exposes your ignorance as well. Also, You are not the only woman in Pakistan ..... So it's just your opinion, so just keep it to yourself. No need to bring this Filth of Secularism and Liberalism in Muslim countries.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Raja Qaiser Sir not only delivered a factual argument, but also assertively put this man in women's clothing in his place with a resounding slap. The facts spoke for themselves, and Raja Qaiser Sir made sure that this individual learned his lesson.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Great and logical points raised by mahrub Awan that state of Pakistan is breaking from within because of religious violence and duplicity. Religion should be left to be an affair of an individual not state
Thanks @TCM. You never disappoint your audience. ❤ Thank you for your efforts in promoting sensible, factual, informative and logical debate culture in a society where news channels spit misinformation, fallacies, and fake news out.
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
Thank you so much TCM for initiating this in Pakistan. It's much needed in this time and I hope people will learn some ethics of debate, whether offline or online, from this series. As far as opening statements are concerned, Dr. Mehrub is very to the point. Their concept of state as inanimate being is very strong and valid. Their style of debate is purely academic and one can say from their way of talking that they know how debates are done. Raja Qaiser's opening statement was good too but he started giving rebuttals in between which were not asked yet. Also, his way of debate is very amateur. His concept of religious state in Pakistan as a democratic decision is very valid. But one thing he said about forced conversion are due to secularism is totally ludicrous. But still I am not making any final conclusion yet. Let's see what happens in next episode. It's really amazing seeing what I used to see on channel "Jubilee". Its really proud seeing our own "Middle Ground".
@@bookaholic8136 this is the most futile generalization I have heard EVER. Let me make another generalization. 99% of people in Pakistan are not practising religion. Even "religious" persons who do forced conversions are not practising religion much. What about that? It's not about whether people propagating forced conversion are religious or not. It's about whether people enforce conversions at the hands of religion or secularism. And they do it in the name of religion. WE ALL KNOW THAT
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s 2 : share ? Women get share from her father Women get share from her husband (Haq mehr) Incase her husband dies she do get share too 😂😂😂😂😂
Brilliant and elucidated dilation by Dr.Awan regarding separation of Religion and State.That I am of the view is the historical moot issue which needs debate and discussion by accredited high intellect scholars and not by Generalists.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
This is a really great effort for educating people of Pakistan. I am very thankful for starting such a series. We need to know what is the really. I hope that this debate will reach to a great result.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s so you basically not want Quran as part of your daily life? so what are you doing in Pakistan come to our beloved India we can exchange the citizenship
@@just_a_woman-h9s We do not care, if you, the women, want something, then come and fight instead of begging for it. We will see how well you idiots fare. Know your place woman, the only reason you can even bark is not because of your struggle or emancipation but because of the collective weakness of men today, the moment this world order shatters, your will return to your righteous place. Nobody is going to give you your so-called rights, cry about it.
This is going to be big. Eagerly, keeping an eye on it. It would be a great discussion on prevailing intellectual discourses. I request the audience to embrace the difference of opinions and try to unpack the unsaid meanings behind it, rather than indulging in never ending debates.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
@@ishwardevi134 we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
Commendable initiative by TCM. We need more of such platforms where sensitive and controversial topics are debated with tolerance and respect. Great work!
TCM your efforts for arranging this discourse is commendable. We need these debates to promote the coexistence of different ideas and beliefs. But your decision to release it into divided parts won't be a good idea, it'll lose our interest and probably we could miss the other parts.
Tell your teacher that we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
No.. He just appealed to uneducated people and popularism. If you wanna go back to stone age then follow him and give power to the Mullahs.. See where that takes you :) most certainly ull be a second Afghanistan. Unlike Saudi arabia and uae you don't have unlimited oil and slave labor to build your country for you. He doesn't understand basic finance if he's blaming interest for the Pakistani economical crisis. Pakistan borrowed heavily in order to sustain itself while the local production didn't ramp up to meet local demand. You have your insane population increase to thank for that. And now you are crying that it's interest on the billions Pakistan borrowed to feed these people is the problem? You signed a contract and now are crying that you have to pay the money back? That's not how the world works.
@@JdownJdownoh you think following quran will lead you to stone age?? If you are a non Muslim than expecting these type of bullshit arguments is common from you guys, but if you are a muslim than you have insulted islam, if you will not ask forgiveness from Allah for this sin if you will not and keep resisting than you are not a Muslim anymore.
Qaiser grilled opposition very hard, but Mehrub also establish her statement in a good way. We have to respect both the intellectuals and also what a sound to ears verbally,itellactualy but also as a patriotic, of these two beautiful speakers.
I am a Muslim and a Pakistani. I want my country to work according to the principles of Islam. But I don't want any policy in my country which encourages discrimination based on religion.
Okay ..good Then What should be the policy of western Christan Country where Pakistani , Indian and Arab Muslims as well as other religion people who lives in ? Such type Hypocratic approach leads the distructuion for human kind.
@@rajivdas2937 being a citizen of Pakistan I just expressed what I want from my country. If majority public of my country wants anything opposite of this, I have not an issue at all. And for western countries, the people living there will decide what they want. I don't have any right to force my opinion on western countries, if they want to run their country with basic principles of their religion, i am not going to oppose them If you accept for western countries what their majority public has decided and you don't want to accept what majority public of Pakistan has decided, congratulations you are a true hypocrite who just want to forcefully impose your thoughts on others 🙂
محترم قیسر احمد راجہ نے ہمارا سر فخر سے بلند کر دیا الحمدللہ کیا ہی بہترین دلائل اور بہترین انداز سے تمام گفتگو فرمائی ماشاءاللہ الله ہمیشہ سلامت رکھے ❤ قیسر احمد راجہ کو بلانے کے لیے بہت شکریہ
Which world your talking about.....? Western world is far superior to it's people irrespective of their religion whereas Islamic world which has religion as it's head but no human rights,this can be proved that people risk their lives to go to western world.Look at your own country.
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@MuhammadAbdullah-io2eu I will fight till my last breath not to have those sharia laws IMPOSED on me. I know only insecure looser so called men (znakay) who want to have power and control over women want sharia law because it made them GOD
@@just_a_woman-h9s Leave the country and go live in a secular country, they treat women like tissue papers and you know it very well. Property choro shadi bhi nahi miley gi, used, abused and left for another man to use. Men here respectfully take you in marriage, they give you inheritance, they provide for you and your children, meanwhile in a western secular society you’ll get a gora bf who will use you for all kinds of sexual activities, he won’t take you in marriage, he will not provide you since they believe in “equality” and you have to earn your own bread, he won’t give you any of his property, he will leave you if he knows you’re pregnant, he will leave you for another man to be used again when he’s bored of you.
you people want pakistan to turn into afghanistan.. There are 100s of secular countries in the world where people follow their religion .. I live in US, people go to mosques/churches, temples etc and practice their religion. Mr Qaisar is wrong when he said in a secular state, a person will have to act differently when they come out of the mosque
@@just_a_woman-h9s So if sharia is nafiz you burgers think we will force hindu and christian in pakistan to accept Islam. Reallyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy😂😂😂😂
@@lmnopq9376 how do u know? First of all , these are my own thoughts, but lets assume for a second i copied them, what difference does it make?? whoever i copied from is representing my thoughts and I am just trying to express how I feel. So use your little energy to focus on the points I have mentioned instead of "copy pasting"
Love the team TCM, who's dauntlessly arranging these types of discussions. But Dr. Mehrub Moiz has substantial statements and his/her way of talking about these sensitive issues is mind-blowing. Despite Dr, Raja Qaisar also has an enormous intellectual approach along with religious knowledge.
@@and_then_I_whispered I can assure you the Christian feels the same way as you do when he reads the Bible and Hindus feel the same when they read their holy books. Just because you get the release of dopamine, serotonin and endorphins from your brain when you pray and read Quran doesn't mean its a universal phenomena.
Honestly,despite everything mehurb arguements were coming from a much more depthful and factually eleborted ground then of Qasir,pakistan has two sides at this point but currently merhub point standa in correct however much controversial the majority conservatives find it
Agreed. There's a big issue with how qaisr is purposefully trying to misrepresent secularism. She is much more well read and intellectually honest when it comes to debates.
Thanks, we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism. 1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy) 2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men 3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half. 4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam. 5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian 6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions. 7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war 8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
Kitni asani se Raja ahmed sahab ne smjha dia k state koi islamic laws k basis pr chalna chaiye. Is trh minorities k huqooq b barqrar rahengy aur musalmano k bhi.
As an Indian🇮🇳, I feel sad where Pak🇵🇰 is going please don't let Pak be destroyed by these puppets of the west! India is really in suffering from Neo librasim n lgtv😢
@@just_a_woman-h9s What economy… look at the ground reality of India… so disproportionate . Have you seen the hunger index of India? Where is the worlds biggest Ghetto/ Slum ? India. Indian Sold Out “Godi Media” hides all the negative news.
Insightful and respectful conversation! Dr. Mehrub did well! Disappointed that the highlights for the next part show this discussion to be orienting toward trans exclusion, which is a direct attack on the speaker in my opinion.
If you're reading this, there is something I want to share. You will find majority of the people agreeing with Raja Sahab in this debate because that's what people want here in Pakistan. And interestingly you will find replies in these comments only. But still, why do we see or hear people against Islam alot? Because they are being supported by the media and the west, just like they support Israel.
Can we normalize early marriage (right after reaching puberty) which is what Islam encourages? Can we normalize the massive age difference between husband and wife (even up to 50 yrs) as it was 1400 yrs ago? Can we normalize polygyny which is a sunnah? If one is gonna condemn these aspects of Islam then they're following their nafs (personal preferences), not Islam. Many aspects including these will never be accepted by today's society, even by the ones who pray 5 all farz prayers, do hijab niqab / have a beard, only share Islamic content on social media, etc. What people truly want is "Progressive Islam" where they follow religion not based on shariah but on their own nafs. They'll pray 5 times a day but at the same time condemn someone who wants to do polygyny and even label him as a perv.
Mehrub Moiz Awan is awsome! Her arguements are so point on and way more logical. Qaiser Raja is only pointing fingers and giving examples from history which is only to provoke emotional reaction.
Sir Qaisar, hats off. you are not just defending the ideology of Pakistan, but enhancing youth's intellect as well.
Thanks to TCM for inviting Mr. Qaisar Raja for such a sensitive issue.
🤣😂
@@umroyaaryour braincells depleted?
@@umroyaarreal ID se aao Lindu 😁
Both of them have strong arguments in a very logical way but Qaisar Raja is more logical and convincing. I am very happy to see this type of debate in Pakistan and wisely conducted by TCM team. It has definitely opened the doors for number of students/individuals to take part in the discussions on sensitive issues of the faith, religion and all type of "isms"
Finally in our country these types of debates are happening. Bravo to team TCM.
Mr. Raja has gone through beautiful relevance & organization throughout.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Qaiser Ahmed is spot on! Wow!
It's good to see that Pakistani Channels are awaring the youth on important issue. Loved the Debate and Mr Qaiser!!❤❤❤
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Bahi Allah ko Jeans 👖 se kia problem ha. Music dance laughing TV instrument se kia problem ha, Shave karne se kia Jannat nahi milti ... I live in Siberia how I wear pajama above knees I will die in cold. Or yahan 4 month day rehta 😮
Thank you Qaisar Raja for this. You literally ate 😂 when Qaisar Raja explained and gave examples, The look on Moiz's face was priceless.
Both gave factual points, but raja sb has a strong point about the birth of secularism. You can't just implement secularism without understand it
But you can implement islamic laws without understanding it😂😂😂😂😂
@@ishwardevi134 you cant "understand" islam at a state level. Its everyone's personal choice how they want to interpret/understand their religion and how they want to implement it in their life
@@just_a_woman-h9s Financial transaction mey witness ka hisab, 1 man = 2 Women, ye keya personal level se ya fir state level pe samjhenge?
@@quamrulsiddiqui4225 financial transaction main female witness aadhi hay, so let me ask you this. Ager aik bank kee CEO aurat hay, aur bank ka chapraasi mard hay, tou kia chapraasi kee witness bank kee CEO say ziada valuable hay??
Kia benazir bhutton kee witness bhee financial transaction main half consider kee jaati ho gee??
@@just_a_woman-h9svery good point!
First of all I appreciate TCM for providing such a stage to debaters in order to present their contradictory ideas in a peaceful setting. Secondly, upload full episodes or entire program in a single episode, so we dont have to wait for their defending sessions & can go with either of them... Bunch of Thanks TCM😇🙌
these discussions need to happen more so that the people can rationally and on an academic level see that Islam is the answer and the way of life to attain true peace in this life and the next.
This is a commendable initiative by TCM. Respectful debates play a vital role in addressing important issues. Dr. Mehrub presented compelling arguments, and Dr. Qaiser skillfully defended the perspective that Pakistan was founded on Islamic principles, which resonates with the majority, so it should be upheld.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Hats off to Qaisa Ahmed Raja for having logical approach to this debate.
tmkc
@@laudenaththetoiletcleaneryou are a RKB and BKM 🙂👍
he even couldn’t explain what exactly #shariat is … how one can expect to trust his logical approach ??
Logical 🤣🤣🤣😂
He is a joke.
قائد اعظم نے کہا تھا ،اپ آزاد ہے مسجدوں میں جانے کے لیے مندروں میں جانے کے لیے اور گرجا گھروں میں جانے کے لیے
قائد اعظم نے کبھی نہیں کہا کہ ہم اسلامی قانون نافذ کریں گے ۔وہ بھی ایک سکیولر ریاست چاہتے تھے
Mr.raja actually represent the enternal voice of each pakistani So no words in his honor but extremely thanks to Allah almighty for such aknowledgement,bless in this modern tenure
the Great Mr.QAISER raja
Absolutely on spot Mr. Qaiser Ahmed Raja! Need more intellectual debates to give thought of food to general public who are stuck btw modernism and islamic values.
Thought of food hahah koi Gujranwale se taluq lagta hai bhai ka. 😅
@@mellownuancethanks for pointing out mistake, typo error. ☺️ *food for thought
@@amaraqureshi265light hearted mazaq tha, super glad you took it nicely!
Bhai 26 million Muslims including mufti wajdi sahib prefer living with Jews, Christians and atheists in Europe, USA and Canada,under western,liberal, democratic values then live with Muslims in Muslim countries
Its funny to see two absolutely delusional people and part of their cults ( Raja Qaisar and Mehrub Moiz ) debate against each other ...
First of all thanks TCM for arranging this long awaited and thought provoking discourse/ debate. Both sides presented their arguments in a very academic manner but Qaiser Raja sahab's arguments were more logical and concrete.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Everyone should appreciate the beautiful efforts of TCM for this peaceful and ideal debate.On this amazing topic.Hatts off.
Mr. Raja has built his argument with strong and valid reasoning. Thumbs up for him
Qaiser Ahmad Raja has a big heart to handle the opposite arguments.
I was actually unaware of the militant and extremely violent history of secularism. Not anymore. Thanks to Q.A Raja.
Great great explanation by qaiser Ahmad raja with historical and current scenario . I listened to this man for first time , very impressed and completely agree
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Big W For Qaisar Raja !
Finally the intellectuals are coming at front in this situation of ambiguity in the country. Thanks to Mr. Qaiser Ahmed Raja for GREAT DEBATE
Its funny to see two absolutely delusional people and part of their cults ( Raja Qaisar and Mehrub Moiz ) debate against each other ..
Love & Respect for QAISER Sahab ❤🎉
Definitely in his team .
When you count the blessings count Qaiser Ahmed Raja saab twice 🙌🏻
Ma sha Allah 😍
Really well said
😂😂
Saab ...?? Saahab..🙂 Indians write it Saab which doesn't even sound good..and also wrong..just wanted to say otherwise no offense..😇
Listening to Mehrub is like watching a nuclear reactor getting out of control, just like in Chernobyl. 😂 . These liberals a ridiculous 😂
Because they don't have any logical argument or logic at all. Therefore, thye want to burst out.
@@abdulmonam7243I agree. They want to burst out and inflict maximum collateral damage , just like Israhelli military. These people are a disgrace to their Islamic good names
@@abdulmonam7243exactly every time, when they are in debate, they become so much emotional😂
That too being a gay😅
I'm sure you guys will say that about other women as well. Why shouldn't ppl be passionate about what they're speaking about
Such an enriching talk! I swear I feel so fulfilled and content by listening to such a philosophically, intellectually and realistically informed debate! Thank you TCM! This is going to be a trendsetter and will hopefully trigger a cultural/structural change in the nature of debates we usually have in Pakistan!
Sir Qaisar has come up with most logical & authentic reasons... Islam can only be practiced as a state!
Lawde ka logical
Lawde ka logical
Anyone cannot measure my level of happiness on this sound discussion but it is not a complete discourse due to limited time. Such types of dialogue are crucial for a democratic culture. Both conversants have strong arguments to prove their perspective
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Hats up Raja jeeee ❤
Raja qaiser destroys, Dr. Moiz each and every word with sensible logic. Great work Raja qaiser
Both Mehrub Moiz Awan & Qaiser Ahmed Raja r given arguments but Qaiser Raja arguments r more sound & logical with full of evidences.
As paksitani women I dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
It's ur point of view not mine & also what majority Pakistani wanted & think r Islamic Rules also.If u see in the secular western countriesEurope,America etc discriminate women in many aspects for e.g women married in these western countries r known by her husband name no women independent Individual right While Islam given independent individual right of married women allowed used their Father sur name or old name as such.In work place secular western countries women officer paid lesser amount than male counter part while in Islam women work as officer got paid same equal amount.Islam allowed women she doing work & her earning is own,husband have no right of took earning from her.Witness of women r half in some cases not everycase because of at Arab era of that time majority women r not working women so know how of trades, business info r less known.
@@wardahali9676this is any hindu with fake name spamming everywhere
@@just_a_woman-h9s KIndly write the whole ayat for quran which is that let me quote you
"Men are the caretakers of women, as men have been provisioned by Allah over women and tasked with supporting them financially. And righteous women are devoutly obedient and, when alone, protective of what Allah has entrusted them with.1 And if you sense ill-conduct from your women, advise them ˹first˺, ˹if they persist,˺ do not share their beds, ˹but if they still persist,˺ then discipline them ˹gently˺.2 But if they change their ways, do not be unjust to them. Surely Allah is Most High, All-Great."
What Allah say first "if you sense ill-conduct from your women, advise them ˹first˺," ..it mean if you think that there is something happening in your back then advice her first after in the second commandment Allah say if they persist,˺ do not share their beds, and in the third commandment Allah say then discipline them ˹gently˺ which mean if she obeys you and ask forgiveness from Allah then be gentle with her and if she not do then it's permissible to beat her...now there are 2 stage before beating her why didn't you quote that like i am just shocked that why didn't you qoute the first two stages
@@wardahali9676 how many years did u live in West to give me this lecture about what rights women have in West and what kind of life they have??
Let me just give u one example. Islam puts a price tag on a woman ( haq meher) money at the time of nikha. A wife is nothing more than a live in maid who can be replaced by another maid anytime. All husband has to do is give her gaq meher money and divorce her. He can have 4 of those maids too.
In west, their is no price tag money on a woman. The day she gets married, she automatically owns 50% of the assets husband has. In case if divorce, all the assets are divided equally between husband and wife.
This is called EQUAL PARTNERSHIP.
Islam main tou aurat ka gher hee nahi. Kyounkay usay kaheen say bhee nikala ja sakta hay
Hats off Mr. Ahmed Raja Qaiser......brilliant, logical, factual.
Silly, stupid, fallacious arguments.
Logical 🤭🤣😂
Lol what
Then implement shria law in Pakistan
Like Afghanistan
@@ishwardevi134 yeah, these people want pakistan to turn into afghanistan. There are 100s of secular countries in the world where people follow their religion .. I live in US, people go to mosques/churches, temples etc and practice their religion. Mr Qaisar is wrong when he said in. a secular state, a person will have to act differently when they come out of the mosque.
Hatts off to Raja sahb. May Allah more power to you brother ❤
Really nice & factual talk Raja Qaiser Sahab. Jazak Allah
راجہ صاحب کے دلیل بہت مضبوط ہے کیونکہ پاکستان میں کبھی اسلام نافذ ہی نہی کیا گیا بلکہ دنیا کے کسی بھی ملک میں اس وقت قرآن کا نظام نافذ نہی
Qaiser Ahmad Raja has impactfully advocated for the real purpose of Pakistan's creation, for Islam and for the sacrifices of our martyrs who died for the sole cause of an Islamic Republic of Pakistan. HATS OFF TO YOU SIR....
What a healthy environment to see, different ideological minds are under debate without any badgering. Haven't seen such a thing in this decade
It happens everywhere all over the world. May be its new in Pakistan.
So far to sum up Qaiser Sahab got the Win for this part.Qaiser Sahab gave Detailed reasoning backed up by solid evidence..... Alhamdulillah
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s Islam doesn't allow beating of wife, that's how ill-informed you are about the subject and this exposes your ignorance as well. Also, You are not the only woman in Pakistan ..... So it's just your opinion, so just keep it to yourself. No need to bring this Filth of Secularism and Liberalism in Muslim countries.
@@just_a_woman-h9sहे Indian खूशरा😂😂😂
@@just_a_woman-h9sr u muslim?? I don't think so. If u r one, repeat shahadah.
Raja Qaiser well done 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Thnaks tmc team for your efforts to arrange healthy debates
Great debate. Full of factual points. Thank you TCM.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
ALLAH apko aur taqat aur istaqamt dain Islam k SALAAR bany ap. Bhai qaiser Ahmed ALLAH apko aur Ilam o danishmandi dain. Amen Elahi 🙏 ❤
Mehrub! What an eloquent, well informed presentation of facts, respect 💯
If your objective is baised and one-sided, otherwise both presented their finding well.
Phudina Chutnee ?
Presentation of facts 😅
Presentation of fantasies would be more accurate
One of the greatest initiative is taken by TCM.
Hates of Love❤
Raja qaiser is a Great man ❤
Raja Qaiser Sir not only delivered a factual argument, but also assertively put this man in women's clothing in his place with a resounding slap. The facts spoke for themselves, and Raja Qaiser Sir made sure that this individual learned his lesson.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Mr. Ahmed Raja Qaiser, a truly brilliant, logical, and fact-driven individual.
hahahahahahaha 🤣
@@ehsensiddiqui2057can understand your frustration
Great and logical points raised by mahrub Awan that state of Pakistan is breaking from within because of religious violence and duplicity. Religion should be left to be an affair of an individual not state
Thanks @TCM. You never disappoint your audience. ❤
Thank you for your efforts in promoting sensible, factual, informative and logical debate culture in a society where news channels spit misinformation, fallacies, and fake news out.
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
Worth attending. Mehrub is good critical analyst.
Wow Ma Sha Allah Mr. Qaisar, you did It, man! You have delivered our message!
Thank you so much TCM for initiating this in Pakistan. It's much needed in this time and I hope people will learn some ethics of debate, whether offline or online, from this series.
As far as opening statements are concerned, Dr. Mehrub is very to the point. Their concept of state as inanimate being is very strong and valid. Their style of debate is purely academic and one can say from their way of talking that they know how debates are done.
Raja Qaiser's opening statement was good too but he started giving rebuttals in between which were not asked yet. Also, his way of debate is very amateur. His concept of religious state in Pakistan as a democratic decision is very valid. But one thing he said about forced conversion are due to secularism is totally ludicrous. But still I am not making any final conclusion yet.
Let's see what happens in next episode. It's really amazing seeing what I used to see on channel "Jubilee". Its really proud seeing our own "Middle Ground".
@@bookaholic8136 this is the most futile generalization I have heard EVER. Let me make another generalization. 99% of people in Pakistan are not practising religion. Even "religious" persons who do forced conversions are not practising religion much. What about that?
It's not about whether people propagating forced conversion are religious or not. It's about whether people enforce conversions at the hands of religion or secularism. And they do it in the name of religion. WE ALL KNOW THAT
Rational reasoning by Mr. Raja Qaiser.
Really appreciated.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
😂😂😂
@@ExamCracker912😅😅😅
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s 2 : share ?
Women get share from her father
Women get share from her husband (Haq mehr)
Incase her husband dies she do get share too
😂😂😂😂😂
Brilliant and elucidated dilation by Dr.Awan regarding separation of Religion and State.That I am of the view is the historical moot issue which needs debate and discussion by accredited high intellect scholars and not by Generalists.
Qaiser Ahmad Raja sb is spot on. Presented his argument logically with facts and figures and historical evidence.
What logically? all of his claims are fictitious and fundamentally wrong.
@@civilmonk1166 #SourceTrustMeBro
@@abubakarrashid9109 Akal and Islam didn't go hand with hand . If apply Islam then your akal will not function 🤣
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
@@civilmonk1166 Your Indians why are you supporting secularism in Pakistan
This is a really great effort for educating people of Pakistan.
I am very thankful for starting such a series.
We need to know what is the really.
I hope that this debate will reach to a great result.
amazing points put forward by dr mehrub. love it
Qaiser Ahmad raja nailed it🔥🔥🔥
Epic move to bring back proper debate sessions to the main stream audience. Giving proper time and proper framework for a debate atleast.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
Qaiser bhai zabardast ragda laga diya. Solid arguments
Huge appreciation for TCM for such initiative
Mr. Raja Qaiser 👏🏾
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s so you basically not want Quran as part of your daily life?
so what are you doing in Pakistan come to our beloved India we can exchange the citizenship
@@just_a_woman-h9s We do not care, if you, the women, want something, then come and fight instead of begging for it. We will see how well you idiots fare. Know your place woman, the only reason you can even bark is not because of your struggle or emancipation but because of the collective weakness of men today, the moment this world order shatters, your will return to your righteous place.
Nobody is going to give you your so-called rights, cry about it.
@@just_a_woman-h9syou do realise what you are listing here is not unique to Islam? It's been that way for the majority of traditional human history .
@@just_a_woman-h9sbro stop spamming in every comment ain't no one gonna listen u
Qaiser Bhai we with you jazakallah khair Allah pak apko himmt or isteqamat dy
This is going to be big. Eagerly, keeping an eye on it.
It would be a great discussion on prevailing intellectual discourses.
I request the audience to embrace the difference of opinions and try to unpack the unsaid meanings behind it, rather than indulging in never ending debates.
none of this shit matters....who is right and who is wrong....its jungle here army ka danda apki bund ky andar tak gya hua jo shaid ap sab log bhol rahay hain.....low iq kunts😂😂🤣🤣
This discussion is happening because
Jinnah failed to give any vision for Pakistan
@@ishwardevi134 we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@ishwardevi134that's not the case; kindly revisit credible literature sources.
Masha Allah ...
Qaiser Ahmed Raja ❤
Sir keep on going ...
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
Then leave sweetheart. No need for you to waste your time typing lengthy essays
@@87mbilalcorrect 💯😁
@@just_a_woman-h9s phir dfa ho jao Pakistan sy West pett bny rahoo unkay dollars py plny walon
@@87mbilal Why should I leave my country. You guys can go to Afghanistan. Sharia law is already implemented there
Commendable initiative by TCM. We need more of such platforms where sensitive and controversial topics are debated with tolerance and respect. Great work!
Thanks
tmc team for your efforts to arrange healthy debates
TCM your efforts for arranging this discourse is commendable. We need these debates to promote the coexistence of different ideas and beliefs.
But your decision to release it into divided parts won't be a good idea, it'll lose our interest and probably we could miss the other parts.
Qaiser Raja explained the views of majority beautifully, appreciate it .Hats off to you Sir❤
Our beloved Teacher
Qaisar Ahd Raja Sir🔥🔥.
Sir raja of cancer
@@muhammadali-pu2wgAwan bewakof aurat hai !jahil munafik hai yeh
@@muhammadali-pu2wgcancer for Hindus and weak people like you😂
@@muhammadali-pu2wgAnd you are a mother seller to west. Qaiser raja is destroying the the illegimate child dogs of west like you
@@muhammadali-pu2wg Have some shame. You, illiterate secular.
Qaiser Ahmad Raja is a Hero. Live long Qaiser Hero
He is an Islamist. Islamists are not good but a problem.
کمال کے دلائل ہیں راجہ صاحب کے ماشاءاللہ
#say no to secularism..... Our relegion is complete, compelte ,compelete.....❤❤❤❤❤
What about londiya😂
@@PeterJonathan-bl5ry 😁
can you explain what actually secularism is ??
just like your spellings.
Ex-Muslim here, now an atheist. I left Islam in 2016 and finally freed myself from this death cult ...
My teacher Qaisar Raja is always 🎉❤
Tell your teacher that we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
So let me ask u first a question that you have raised a question on Qur'an.Are u a muslim? Then we shall discuss forward.Kindly state.
@@just_a_woman-h9sjin ko islamic law's nhi pasnd woh Pakistan say dawa ho jayn kn zabardasti kar raha ha 😅😅😅
Hmari taraf sy "Go To Hell" 🥱🥱
@@just_a_woman-h9sभक पगली😂😂😂😂😂
@@hollywoodclips9988bhai 99% Pakistani will flee..including mullahs..look at sheikh uthman,Wajidi,qadhi ,gamdi etc all mullahs live in America….haha
Outstanding explanation by Qaiser Ahmed Raja❤❤..more power to you.
Keep it up Qaisar Raja 👍
Raja Qaisar nailed it 🔥🔥
No.. He just appealed to uneducated people and popularism. If you wanna go back to stone age then follow him and give power to the Mullahs.. See where that takes you :) most certainly ull be a second Afghanistan.
Unlike Saudi arabia and uae you don't have unlimited oil and slave labor to build your country for you.
He doesn't understand basic finance if he's blaming interest for the Pakistani economical crisis. Pakistan borrowed heavily in order to sustain itself while the local production didn't ramp up to meet local demand. You have your insane population increase to thank for that. And now you are crying that it's interest on the billions Pakistan borrowed to feed these people is the problem? You signed a contract and now are crying that you have to pay the money back? That's not how the world works.
@@JdownJdownoh you think following quran will lead you to stone age?? If you are a non Muslim than expecting these type of bullshit arguments is common from you guys, but if you are a muslim than you have insulted islam, if you will not ask forgiveness from Allah for this sin if you will not and keep resisting than you are not a Muslim anymore.
chal nikal. Tum logon ki bas abaadi zyada hai jahilon ke mulk mein.
@@JdownJdown
Man don't worry! Our Allah and the system he gave us (Islam ❤) Is enough for us In Sha Allah!
Qaiser grilled opposition very hard, but Mehrub also establish her statement in a good way. We have to respect both the intellectuals and also what a sound to ears verbally,itellactualy but also as a patriotic, of these two beautiful speakers.
I am a Muslim and a Pakistani.
I want my country to work according to the principles of Islam.
But I don't want any policy in my country which encourages discrimination based on religion.
Your second liner is literally discriminatory to people of other religions.
That is not possible under sharia Law, Non-muslims do treated like secondary citizens under sharia law
Okay ..good
Then What should be the policy of western Christan Country where Pakistani , Indian and Arab Muslims as well as other religion people who lives in ?
Such type Hypocratic approach leads the distructuion for human kind.
@@notafrahrandi tawaid ghasti....This country was envisaged to be Islamic country you want Lgbt
@@rajivdas2937 being a citizen of Pakistan I just expressed what I want from my country. If majority public of my country wants anything opposite of this, I have not an issue at all.
And for western countries, the people living there will decide what they want. I don't have any right to force my opinion on western countries, if they want to run their country with basic principles of their religion, i am not going to oppose them
If you accept for western countries what their majority public has decided and you don't want to accept what majority public of Pakistan has decided, congratulations you are a true hypocrite who just want to forcefully impose your thoughts on others 🙂
Raja Qaiser❤
😂😂😂
محترم قیسر احمد راجہ نے ہمارا سر فخر سے بلند کر دیا الحمدللہ
کیا ہی بہترین دلائل اور بہترین انداز سے تمام گفتگو فرمائی ماشاءاللہ
الله ہمیشہ سلامت رکھے ❤
قیسر احمد راجہ کو بلانے کے لیے بہت شکریہ
Brother Qaiser Ahmad Raja Sahib has spoken exactly about the rights of humanity. Because if there is Islam, the rights of humanity will be given.
Which world your talking about.....?
Western world is far superior to it's people irrespective of their religion whereas Islamic world which has religion as it's head but no human rights,this can be proved that people risk their lives to go to western world.Look at your own country.
Fantastic Mr.Raja Qaiser 👏
we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
@@just_a_woman-h9s here is a deal AAA no !
@@MuhammadAbdullah-io2eu I will fight till my last breath not to have those sharia laws IMPOSED on me. I know only insecure looser so called men (znakay) who want to have power and control over women want sharia law because it made them GOD
@@just_a_woman-h9s Leave the country and go live in a secular country, they treat women like tissue papers and you know it very well. Property choro shadi bhi nahi miley gi, used, abused and left for another man to use. Men here respectfully take you in marriage, they give you inheritance, they provide for you and your children, meanwhile in a western secular society you’ll get a gora bf who will use you for all kinds of sexual activities, he won’t take you in marriage, he will not provide you since they believe in “equality” and you have to earn your own bread, he won’t give you any of his property, he will leave you if he knows you’re pregnant, he will leave you for another man to be used again when he’s bored of you.
@@just_a_woman-h9syou're not the representative of Pakistani women.
Qaiser raja sb Maa Sha Allah dalaail aur facts k saath aur izaat o ehtaram k saath baat kr k dil jeet laity hoo ap. Love from Oman
Qaiser Raja is pure Love!
Qaiser raja came up with some valid points with proper references ,giving historical evidence ,logic was there so i think he won that round for sure
you people want pakistan to turn into afghanistan.. There are 100s of secular countries in the world where people follow their religion .. I live in US, people go to mosques/churches, temples etc and practice their religion. Mr Qaisar is wrong when he said in a secular state, a person will have to act differently when they come out of the mosque
@@just_a_woman-h9sYou copied someone comment and then paste it 😂😂😂
@@just_a_woman-h9s So if sharia is nafiz you burgers think we will force hindu and christian in pakistan to accept Islam.
Reallyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy😂😂😂😂
@@lmnopq9376 how do u know? First of all , these are my own thoughts, but lets assume for a second i copied them, what difference does it make?? whoever i copied from is representing my thoughts and I am just trying to express how I feel.
So use your little energy to focus on the points I have mentioned instead of "copy pasting"
@@just_a_woman-h9s your thoughts come from westren civilization so these are not your own thoughts😂😂😂
Love the team TCM, who's dauntlessly arranging these types of discussions. But Dr. Mehrub Moiz has substantial statements and his/her way of talking about these sensitive issues is mind-blowing. Despite Dr, Raja Qaisar also has an enormous intellectual approach along with religious knowledge.
State of Pakistan is nothing without ISLAM
The state of Pakistan is quite dire with Islam. Maybe you need to look at your surroundings a bit more before making sweeping statements as such
@@JW-be8wf you a Hollywood fan sir!
Ex-Muslim here, now an atheist. I left Islam in 2016 and finally freed myself from this death cult .
@@Ammeo I guarantee you, you've never prayed or read Quran, lol...
@@and_then_I_whispered I can assure you the Christian feels the same way as you do when he reads the Bible and Hindus feel the same when they read their holy books. Just because you get the release of dopamine, serotonin and endorphins from your brain when you pray and read Quran doesn't mean its a universal phenomena.
Honestly,despite everything mehurb arguements were coming from a much more depthful and factually eleborted ground then of Qasir,pakistan has two sides at this point but currently merhub point standa in correct however much controversial the majority conservatives find it
Agreed. There's a big issue with how qaisr is purposefully trying to misrepresent secularism. She is much more well read and intellectually honest when it comes to debates.
Thanks, we paksitani women dont want following islamic laws in paksitan so we want secularism.
1: Men can have multiple sexual partners (by practicing polygamy)
2: Women should be given half the share in inheritance as compare to men
3: Female witness/testimony should be considered half.
4: Women can be divorced anytime and all a man is required to do is give her haq meher money and kick her out of the house regardless of how many years she spent their raising kids. There is no concept of join marital assets in Islam.
5:Custody of kids over 7 should be given to father incase of divorce because a female cant have a role of a guardian
6: An adult female (regardless of her age) needs a male "guardian" all her life and she can NOT make ANY decision without consent of her guardian (either father, husband or brother). Adult men dont have any such restrictions.
7 :Men can have concubines/londis and can sleep with women captured in war
8: Men are incharge over women and have a right to beat their wives (quran 4:34)
Kitni asani se Raja ahmed sahab ne smjha dia k state koi islamic laws k basis pr chalna chaiye. Is trh minorities k huqooq b barqrar rahengy aur musalmano k bhi.
CANT WAIT! SIR QAISAR RAJA WE'RE WITH YOU!🤜🤛
Ku bhai londi dy ga tujay kia wo jo uska saath ha ?
Teri q jal rahi ha ? Bus yahin tak freedom of expression tha ? 😂
@@flashbullgaming6915 freedom of expression rakho ,londyan rakhna kara insaniat ka kaam ha?
@@khangul4170 Londi ko teri ammi say zyada haqooq miltay thay
@@flashbullgaming6915 londi ko bycha jata tha. Tari ammi ko abba baychtay hn kia?
As an Indian🇮🇳, I feel sad where Pak🇵🇰 is going please don't let Pak be destroyed by these puppets of the west! India is really in suffering from Neo librasim n lgtv😢
What the fuck ...why are living in india it's even sharia law ..go Afghanistan..Islam is anti humanity religion
I agree with you!
We also need real ISLAM in Pakistan, so every citizen is treated equally under Law. ISLAM is only way to provide Justice to all.
@farmanSeema, really? you are suffering in India? Look at your economy vs Pakistan's economy. Tum loag tou chaand per puhunch gaay ho.
@@just_a_woman-h9s What economy… look at the ground reality of India… so disproportionate .
Have you seen the hunger index of India? Where is the worlds biggest Ghetto/ Slum ? India.
Indian Sold Out “Godi Media” hides all the negative news.
@@just_a_woman-h9s No point in going to a dumb rock to compensate for a being a shithole.
Insightful and respectful conversation! Dr. Mehrub did well!
Disappointed that the highlights for the next part show this discussion to be orienting toward trans exclusion, which is a direct attack on the speaker in my opinion.
Anxiously waiting for the rebuttal round. Too much interesting debate😂
If you're reading this, there is something I want to share. You will find majority of the people agreeing with Raja Sahab in this debate because that's what people want here in Pakistan. And interestingly you will find replies in these comments only. But still, why do we see or hear people against Islam alot? Because they are being supported by the media and the west, just like they support Israel.
because media try to make minds of youth on secularism.
because of media sensation and attention seeking plus promoting the western injected agenda
Can we normalize early marriage (right after reaching puberty) which is what Islam encourages? Can we normalize the massive age difference between husband and wife (even up to 50 yrs) as it was 1400 yrs ago? Can we normalize polygyny which is a sunnah?
If one is gonna condemn these aspects of Islam then they're following their nafs (personal preferences), not Islam. Many aspects including these will never be accepted by today's society, even by the ones who pray 5 all farz prayers, do hijab niqab / have a beard, only share Islamic content on social media, etc.
What people truly want is "Progressive Islam" where they follow religion not based on shariah but on their own nafs. They'll pray 5 times a day but at the same time condemn someone who wants to do polygyny and even label him as a perv.
Mehrub Moiz Awan is awsome! Her arguements are so point on and way more logical. Qaiser Raja is only pointing fingers and giving examples from history which is only to provoke emotional reaction.
As a person who's very neutral on such issues. I do think mehrub's arguments were very stronge.
A very good debate overall, from both sides.
Well Done Raja Qaisar SHB.
Thank you so much, TCM, for arranging such an important debate and clearing our concepts regarding theological and secular states.