Which F-16 Should You Grind? - SAKO SNIPER
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ธ.ค. 2022
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Also the F-16 not pulling as much Gs is indeed the Fly-by-wire system. But Gaijin modelled the flight model too realistically, unlike the other jets where it performs 1.2-1.5times their G-loading capabilities. Probably a balancing reason but it is indeed annoyingly bricky.
Yes, give F-16 some gaijin magic, or limit other jets to their real world performance.
@@archerknight988 The solution is to limit the pilot more correctly. Pulling a sudden 13g's in any plane will gloc you instantly. In Wt you can do it for like 3s before you start to grey out. The F-16 should have about 1g more maxium g tolerance for the pilot due to the 30 deg reclined seat. The 9g limited FCS should be a gameplay advantage, especially with the WT mouse aim giving really poor control of g's. Everyone else will either have to get way slower than you or pull below max performance in order to avoid blackout and you can just point and shoot.
In any case, dogfighting at 1100 kph is stupid and not a thing. The solution to not getting shot by missiles is to 1. kill the enemies before the merge or 2. maintain situational awareness so you know nobody is in a shooting position.
other planes also modeled corectly but pilot not, people just shouldnt sustain continious 12g overload
@@boenk3742 That is a good point mate. Thanks
Real,i was pulling/11-13 constantly on my f5C
I hope they buff the f16s turn rate at high speeds. Currently it’s horrid.
Its litterly a f4
This so WT why did they make it fly like real life when no other plane flies like it does in real life.
The f16 is already dominating the top tier so why make it stronger?
@@Bobspineable you could turn it off with the paddle on the joystick
@@swiss6459 because US mains are brain damaged, they need to have clear advantages like back in the F14 days
Short answer:
F-16A-20 MLU - best overall, has BVR and strike capability with dumb bombs and mavericks
F-16A ADF (US and Italy) - 2nd place shared between the two, can use BVR missiles but has no strike capabiliry
F-16A (US) - 3rd place, no BVR, gets the best strike kit with access to dumb bombs, dumb rockets, mavericks and HOBOS.
F-16A Netz - Worst overall, as of currently it is basically the american F-16A but without HOBOS. It misses its additional countermeasure pods (x180 in total), its python 3s and its TAL-1 and TAL-2 cluster bombs, and it should get the HOBOS aswell because of Gaijin's "if it fits it sits" rule:
* the GBU-8 (HOBOS) was used by the IDF/AF in the deployment time frame of the F-16A Netz, particularly by A-4 skyhawks and F-4E Kurnass aircraft.
* The GBU-8's mounting electronics on the F-16A-10 Netz were never manualy removed by the Israelis, the variant we have ingame represents an early F-16A-10 Netz which should be a simply repainted F-16A-10 Fighting Falcon.
How accurate is not having air to ground weapons in the ADF though? Isn't it just a regular Block 15 underneath? I know it probably never carried bombs irl as it was an air defense variant, but it doesn't make much sense to remove the ability to carry even dumb bombs and rockets
@@jfv2312 ask the US air force engineers
@@jfv2312 it has nothing to do with accuracy, and everything to do with redundancy
Is it still worth grinding Israel? Even if the Netz is the worst because it’s missing a few things it still has the same engine, missiles and speed right? If so ima still grind Israel
Is the F16AJ any way same as the F16MLU?
Hello sako |
As a response to the compression on the viper that is very accurate . Its flight model is actually rather accurate aside from its low speed nose authority which is overperforming . What your seeing here is war thunder players have become accustom to jets pulling 11g sustained turns over Mach 1 which is totally unrealistic , the viper in real life limits its G to just over 9 G over Mach 1 so the pilot doesn't implode in the cockpit . The viper is maneuverable yes but its certainly not a "Turn fighter" its actually an energy rate fighter much like say a BF109 preferring to go fast and stay fast very much like an F104 its only reliable in a 2 circle nose to tail fight .
The mig29 in game also experiences massive compression above mach 1 but im not familiar with the systems onboard so i dont know if its a computer limit or physical characterizes , id suggest the latter as i dont think the mig29 has fly by wire but i could be wrong .
The F-16 doesn't have a g limiter, it has an AOA limiter, and it can be overridden by the pilot.
The Viper is the probably worlds best rate fighter but not turn fighter this is two different things which most wt players have to understand first, growling sidewinder in dcs can explain it to you very well
F-16 Irl can sustain 9g's ...Mig-29 cannot. The f-16 is HIGH maneuverability at High speeds. Mig-29 Is Horrible maneuverability at high speeds and is a good dog fighter at 200 -100and under knots. The F-16 pilots in dog fight with a mig-29 tend to GO vertical in a dog fight to beat the Mig-29 because its more maneuverable slow it won't keep up in a climb in a DF. The Irl KD for F-16 is Miles ahead of the Mig-29 for a reason, but War Thunder reality is lost more than most players realize its arcade reality means not a whole hell of a lot unfortunately. Also, No the Mig-29 did not have fly by wire. And is Nothing like the f-104 not sure what you were going for there but your 100x's wrong
IF gaijin want to make F16 real world accurate, why not make the rest of jets accurate...no more F-4, MiG-23 pulling 12G. This is a game after all.
@@archerknight988 hey dont have to tell me twice id love that lol .
The f16 is meant to two circle. At 350 knots it has some of the highest turning rates of any planes. Thats how it was designed so going fast and pulling hard isnt what it was meant for
Isn't that the speed zone where the F/A-18C shines
@@Mini_is_Drunk A lot of 4th gens are nuts at that envelope, actually
Your 100% wrong! F-16 was meant for high speeds at 9g's . The mig-29 was meant for Dog fighting 200 knots-100knots and even under. The f-16 maneuvers best at higher speeds. For F sake read some info before puking up BS
AFAIK it rates slightly better at 420-440 knots, which is a bit faster than a lot of other 4th gen jets. 350 knots is about right for an F-15 or F/A-18.
@@killingyouwithlogic5808a little above 400 knots is where the F-16 shines in the 2 circle rate fight, the notion of it being good at high speed is only because a slow F-16 is a dead F-16 because it performs sluggishly at lower speeds.
1:33 in a pool of blood, middle of the road
The F16 has a fly-by-wire system where the G-limit is literally hard wired into the plane and it physically is not allowed to pull more than 9Gs. Not because the plane can’t do it, but because pilots can’t. I remember watching some documentary on the F16 and they stated the same, but in that documentary they said the G-limit is 7.5. Not sure which is correct but oh well
MiG29 had a hybrid system where the G-limits could be turned off but it is not recommended. The thing is, both planes are absolute freight trains in terms of turning at high speeds and they only get their “real” agility below Mach 0.8. MiG29 can turn slightly better at lower speeds due to its construction, and F16 turns better at higher speeds, but both planes can’t turn well above 0.8 Mach. It is realistic.
The issue with War Thunder is that older planes that didn’t have an actual G-lock at all tend to turn better because War Thunder pilots are super humans that feel just fine at 10-13Gs, which shouldn’t be the case. No normal human can sustain high Gs for longer than a few seconds. F16 and MiG29 are realistic in this regard, and so are other planes. It’s the pilots that are unrealistic
I haven’t watched the video yet but have seen that almost every comment is about this
If I may suggest, try to keep your speed between 600 and 800kph for optimal performance. Of course, the best thing to do as you said is to clear more of em than the inverse, but if you do end up in a rare dogfight, then you’ll have to manage your airbrake and throttle far more than any other plane in the game.
Thanks for this the most detailed breakdown of the F-16s yet!
The redeiming advantage of the F-16A/Netz is that they are 270kg lighter than the ADF and 300kg lighter than MLU, it's very situational but in a few situations I got the upper hand while dogfighting other F-16 variants because of the higher sustained turn rate.
Netz has received Pythons now 💀
appearently f16 IRL has a G-limiter so the pilot doesnt kill himself accidentially. Problem being every pilot in WT is a superhuman and can easily take like 12+g. so in WT the technology thats really good IRL is a detrement. as in gaijin fashion
It really shines in ground rb where you'll only encounter a couple of jets rather an entire fleet
Nice video Sako, Are you going to make videos for the new premiums? Also have a great day
The Chinese one has 50% more flares, does it not? On top of being able to carry both AIM-7Ms and Mavericks on the same plane.
The Netz needs the python missle and they’ll be matched up
Yeah. Currently no SAHR but at least we get the 9L
Sako could you do a video on the 2nd best premium in the game, the MiG-23ml.
The F-16 radar is also found on the M247 sgt. york.
Don't use AB when turning, F16 can sustain Mach 0.9 turns. It's designed that way, expect that later releases would be the same (until we get thrust vectoring aircraft in 2088)
All the F-16's are good and crush everything else it doesn't really matter
Also, never lost return flight to a mig29, I keep my speed below 850, but above 750, and I do just fine and I can out turn anything
Can u review the Wolfpack and compare it with the xm1, I’m trying to grind US ground and I’m not sure which one I should get
The XM1 pack will be 50% off during the christmas sale, while the wolfpack will not as its completely new
@@randomdanishman no
Simple, get the XM-1. It’s faster in most environments, more versatile and FAR more survivable
The xm1 is better in every way except for its m735 round. Fighting a good leopard 2a4 player with that round is a bit miserable at times
Correct me if im wrong? but does the Block 20 MLU have a better radar too. AN/APG-66(V2). Can we bring this up to gaijin
Once you bleed the mig29's speed you can outturn it however it still comes down to the pilot
The F16's best turn rate is 660 to 850 km/h. Outside of that range it's a brick. No fighter jet in real life is maneuverable past mach 1.
The problem is all other fighter jets in War Thunder can easily pull sustained >9G’s.
@@aybaws yep
except the way they model the other planes in the game, you can be maneuverable as fuck above mach 1 or at least whip that nose quickly enough to get a favorable firing solution faster and they do this by buffing the planes in the game a bit so we can do those things without ripping, every plane in the game has this buff... well except for the f16 now. the f16 right now is limited by what it can do irl, while every other plane in the game is buffed above their irl limitations, what people are saying is either apply that same buff that every plane in the game already has to the f16 fbw limitations or remove that buff for all the other planes so that now we truly are limited by irl performance
@@aybaws So can the F16 if you turn at its proper rate speed
@@orbitalpotato9940 nope, it gets clapped in a two circle by an F-104, no joke
I have the A6 what could I do the maximize rp?
link to skin for spit from intro, pretty please?
The F-16 is not classified as a supermaneuverable jetfighter btw, it was designed as an air superiority day fighter, it evolved into a successful all-weather multirole aircraft, however it is agile but not on the same level as the super-maneuverable Su-27 and Mig29
I saw you thought there would be an f-14 prem when do you think that would be released?
Give it 1 year they only really sell premium that r 1 or .7 BR bellow top 12.0 now and 12.3 in a few weeks
I always compare this jet to the 104 and then I get constantly shat on with a "Skill Issue" remark. They then try and teach me how to fly it despite my 100 matches in it... Seasoned Italian main, I know my 104s...
Stay low and fast in the early game
I have the mig29 and the r27er if it is to use it they are extremely strong, but the r60 suck, so yes, the mig29 is scary up close, from afar and quite difficult to use
Just curious, is your name based off of the Sako rifle company in Finland?
Another difference between the F16s:
All models post Block 15 are far less maneuverable, getting slightly worse the higher you go. All Block 10s are superior dogfighter models, as their tails and nose are lighter, pulling harder. The Chinese is a Block 20, which suffers the same maneuverability problems that the ADF has, without the benefits of the standard A
Chinese F-16 is overall the best for a single Falcon. It’s basically a combination of the American F-16A and the ADF without the downsides
Yup and 30 more countermeasures
The block 10 has a different FM than the ADF/MLU, it can turn better than the rest at lower speeds
FM is basically the same but its a bit lighter, 270/300kg less than the ADF/MLU respectively
Harrier Gr. 7 has the agm-65 D also
I feel bad for the tornado, like why didn’t they give it something special like ECM
Is the F16 still bad at mach 1?
Grind the, what ever one you can get fastest
The aim7m is the least consistent radar missile I’ve ever used
I don't even like flying anymore but I enjoyed the video
before video started i immedieatly knew it was going to be the chinese one
When can we be expecting a mig 29 review?
1:38 hi!
wow its missing 1778 kgf of thrust on afterburner... balance i guess? should be 105.7 kN or 10780 ish kgf.
Hey guys I have a question. And pls answer so does f16 have a feature to lock enemies without directly moving the missile toward him like mig 29 pls I curious
No, it didn't have a helmet mounted display
@@SAKOSNIPER thx for answering ( you are my favorite content creator btw)
9G FBW limit is realistic. IRL people are not pulling 15G like we do in WT. Also F-16 is a ratefighter, not a turnfighter. You are meant to go 2 circle against an enemy and manage your speed. I am glad WT is turning away from the fantasy afterburner-ON 24/7 and full elevator META.
Use your superior thrust, manage your speed and closure. Nothing can beat F-16 in a ratefight, especially the C and V variant (maybe only F-22).
If you fight WVR 1 circle at high altitude and keep losing, don't blame the plane.
A-5C plays somewhat similiarly, where you just can't go AB all the time. Mig-23MLA has a sweetspot between 700-800kmh at full unsweep, so speed management is very important.
So if you say in the video, play it like the F-104, you are leading your audience on a wrong path my friend.
yeah, here's the catch though.
Fine that this one is realistically implemented, but other planes are not.
So right now, a phantom will out turn AND outrate an f16.
Same with the tomcat.
This is the thing that pisses me off about gaijin, theyre not consistent at ALL in that regard. which creates these situations.
@@Wienerslinky Outturn yes, outrate no.
And yes I agree other planes should get realistical pull. Its realistic battles after all. Which sadly is turning more and more into arcade battles. First they took out historical matchmaker, then they increased ticket bleed and reduced time from 45m to 25m. Everyone rushes in to the middle because of it to get RP.
Result is basically arcade with limited ammo.
This update is: "The good, the bad, and the ugly" ! And since I never liked the F-16's cheapish, casual look, it is "the ugly"!
In terms of your argument that the Mig-29 does better in a close range fight is because at top tier I've noticed that everyone's favorite turn fight is a 1 circle nose to nose fight, which is a great fight and typically leaves more in hand to favor ones turn radius instead of their turn rate! That being said the F-16 thrives in the complete opposite turn fight, a 2 circle turn, maintained at the aircrafts best ITR & sustained it can pull insane G's & also completely out-rate their opponent, Mig-29s do not have the same 2 circle fighting characteristics, simply the only thing wrong is that people aren't using the F-16 to it's fullest potential, upon my observations of course! Even the Viggen can get a nasty turn on the F-16 & wipe it's own ass with it's radar gunsight(Found this through playing the JA37D.. so much fun). But if you take a turn in the opposite direction as your opponent at roughly I think war thunder sets the F-16s ITR to be around 800 km/h & you manage to sustain that with sim controls, you will absolutely dominate the fight!
i tryed playing french planes like the bouragan and god this nation is a pain in the ass
true, once you get to the Mirage 3E you will be happy
I hope they give the idf f16 the python 5 missle that they carry in current day configuration. Game breaking yes, but configuration accuracy
they dont give a shit about configuration accuracy 😂 look what they did to the R-73
@@christopherrimann2219 you just cant let a man dream can you
@@loganwisnieski4913 we are two already,it's ok
Wow no MLU in the thumbnail, sad noises
9:07 what in gods name is that decal and how do i get it?
It's ZoltanSultan's Decal
th-cam.com/users/redirect?event=video_description&redir_token=QUFFLUhqbEh0Zm1QeVZleEJ4RldobTMxZjFTVXI4MVVuUXxBQ3Jtc0tscVdjT2s2ekhwcXJsbU13VVU0NFlqY2hjZnRQcTdHUXJ5bXl3clYwd2pjcDV4VGdZTUgybDN3NHJmeHlBT2szd3h5WEx2WFAzQmozRHh1R2U0S2gxRTRiajA1TFlTMnVMQThGT2JNaGtsRnpFZGdUbw&q=https%3A%2F%2Fbit.ly%2F39W38Lg&v=6T_-XazBdoY
@@SAKOSNIPER Thanks mate
Is that Dutch scan for the f16 in the game or custom??
Skin*
@@bigj6691 if it’s on the American f16 or the Chinese one, then it’s a user skin. If it’s on the Israeli or Italian, then it might be purchasable. You can check by going into the skins section in your profile and looking for the respective f16
It's on live.warthunder
It's a Dutch skin from the demoteam, on live.warthunder for both US f-16s.
Have they buffed the f16?
Or is it still a brick at high spees
They increased the auto pilot to 12 g limit I think
Thx
They buffed the f16 it can now beat a mig 29 fairly consistently in a dogfight mostly if you go on one circle fights great at AOA the mig 29 is decent at rate fighting but not significantly better the the f16 also at high speed the f16 now hits 10g instead of barely hitting 9 before
Why did you remove yesterday's live stream?
Copyrighted music was playing in the background
@@SAKOSNIPER Understandable. Sad I missed the end.
Which are the two best challenger 2s?
Black night and 2f
@@CT--Echo-wi3dt what makes the 2f better then the chall 2?
@@luisgarces1382 extra armour, yet it doesn't make you so sluggish as the one im TES does
Why don´t you have discount code?
My channel isn't big enough:(
0:41 why would you turn off pulse doppler mode?
Normal radar is better if they are above you, pulse Doppler is only better if they are below you.
Doppler mode is easily notched
@@SAKOSNIPERaaah okay thanks
I’m still confused why they chose the f16 over the f15 when it resembles the mig-29 more
Because the f-16 is the American equivalent of the mig29; where as the f-15 is the equivalent of the Su-27
What doesn't make sense is that USA should have just received the F-16A and had both CAS and Air to air capabilities
I win almost every dogfight in the F-16A ADF people make the mistake of going into a dogfight full speed and leaving the afterburner on, if u bleed your speed you will slap mig 29s in the low speed dogfights
The chinese f16 has 90 countermeasures
The f16 is a good turn RATE fighter in real life not necessarily a good turn fighter.
The F16 being shit at turning supersonic is accurate. Its just aerodynamics, all fighters are like that irl. Thats why its so crucial to control airspeed.
Just look up the equation for aircraft turn radius, velocity is squared.
In this case it’s because they gave it it’s IRL fly by wire limitations, while the other planes in game no not have their historical limitations
@Squiddicus2 maybe on paper, but the jet actually has zero busniess turning as well as it does subsonic with no auto LEFs/TEFs in the game. That automatic change in camber is what makes the jet carve IRL.
@Squiddicus2 Plus, if it had its real wire by wire limitations, it'd be almost impossible to pull over 9gs ever. lol
@@xmodfreak2011 Maybe it's physicaly modeled just not graphically. I think the F4E was the same for a while.
But even so it's overperforming at low speeds right now. The FLCS is supposed to limit it to 26 degrees AoA but it's not AoA limited at all rn and its CL is too high.
@@appa609sure, it's just a game. And one made by a company that doesn't care if shit actually works right.
And I don't need a FLCS lecture, I've sat thru hours of those haha. I'm quite familiar with how the FLCS system in the Viper works. And it's not just AoA lol.
I haven't compared rates and radii, but I'll just say that it doesn't feel that unrealistic to me. But then again, I only know the blk 40.
The Netz, still having the same engine as all the others, is somehow faster and has a better t2w ratio lmao
Everybody complains about the F16 performance but they all take too much fuel.
I take 30min without the fuel tank wich is 24min and when you get below around 15/13min it starts to pull 10g+ even at high speed.
It took me 5 games to noticed that but I can still see people after 100 games in it still taking full fuel and complain about the F16 starfighter playstyle...
Thanks for accurately identifying how the F-16 can’t dogfight anything. I have both the 29 and 16, 29 always wins in a dogfight and other TH-camrs are just glossing over this.
In terms of the F-16, it’s sweet spot for dogfighting is 600-800kph. The second you get below 800, it’s like night and day; you’ll just have to manage your throttle and air brakes more than usual but once your in that sweet spot, nothing really can keep you you in a rate fight
@@bubblesofthecoast6393 Correct, also: the second you drop below 800 KPH, you're dead in missile thunder.
Also correct: The F-16 is the only plane in the game with this retarded G limiting.
@@landocallbackesian3884 Honestly, I rather they’d make the other planes in line with the F-16 and tone down what they can do (or snap their wings trying) rather than the inverse of making the F-16 a threat even to the pilot itself.
I destroy Mig 29's in my USA F-16A all day, im not sure what you are talking about but I can assume its coming from your arse.
@@DM-qm5sc People are prolly either keeping af on or are getting too slow; either way, they fall out of thst optimal spot for the F-16 and get decked for it.
This is the jet that I will put a talisman on just for the nostalgia factor and the fact that I have flown in the jet. Is it a waste of 3100GE even though I have everything in the US tree researched? Absolutely. But nothing feels more right that flying this out, blasting Ace Combat music and saying cringe AF Ace Combat quotes in game chat.
I mean I did the same witht the f-14 since more aircraft will come to the game
Chinese has 90 coutermessures instead of 60
Bring back the old intro music!!
Problem with copyright, I might test it again
Yo my name in there
I don't understand why gaijin keep ruining the game, will it make more sense if they fix the game so more people be interested and buy they stuffs?
Chinese for sure
Also, the Chinese one gets 90 flares instead of 60
The FLight model is such a bullshit. F-16 needs to be fast to turn, the slower it gets the worse it turns. the Mig-29 Flight model would be way more fitting for the plane
that the shit it has right now.
Buff the turn rate so F16’s can turn the best over mach1…
Nerf the mig29 turn JUST a little bit more…
Leave flares OP as is, but give mig29 r73.
DONE
Patch fixed!
dear god..
none of them lol :D
Nooooooo but the F14 NEEDS to get its Aim9Ls to stay competetive!!!!!!!!!!
its phoenixes are still unmatched
Its still one of the best if not the best plane in game right now..
youre kidding right?
@@Wienerslinky Absolutly not
Its the plane with the best BVR capabillities and still pretty good at closer ranges. The F14 should sit at the same BR as the F16 and Mig29. I mean do you think its fair to say that the british and japanese F4 are equal to the F14? I dont understand why the american air tree gets more attention then any other by far. Just look how much people cried about the r73 even if it was super easy to flare (not talking about the last version guess that was not intended).
@@nuklear7074 nah was talking to the original dude. Giving the f14 aim9l's is mental to say the least
lets be real- this is only better than the MiG because ithe MiG nerfed into hell and its weapons are completly unrealistic. they are going to add the R-73s soon and fix the R27s. then the MiGs will hopefully dominate
Answer: None
Israël If u Dont have whole usa tot tree
correction: Taiwan not China
Taiwan is also known as "Republic of China"
Yeah but in War Thuder both Chinas are just one combined tech tree
Republic of China and west taiwan
chinese is the best
israel is now the only nation without bvr!
this is the most BS review i have seen f16 can hold its own in a dog fight the compressing part can be actually used to your own advantage where you can doge missiles with out wasting flaers and have duled 2vs1 and 3vs 1 in the f16 and won them all
The Tornado is from germany
Hi can you bye a primim plane joke jet in war thunder than grind every plane in the teck tree sorry my English is bad
Yes, but if you want to grind the whole tech tree you would need a rank 7 premium vehicle as they can effectively research 1 tier above and all tiers below them