Thank you for all the tips. I filled fretholes with a rosewood veneer using a wood glue (it doesn't leave stains). That was my first defretting experience. I didn't have a sanding block yet, I ordered one but couldn't wait to start the job. So I made one block by myself. I sticked sand paper to my fretboard to have a radiused sanding surface and a piece of plain wood to make radius block. I didn't do a lot of sanding before applying polyurethane because I'm still waiting for a proper block.
Definitely wait for the block. the picture you sent me looks really good. the block is just to make sure that the veneers (or putty, for those who use it) are even with the rest of the fretboard. The poly will have to be sanded between each coat. use at least 10 coats. Don't get impatient. After all the coats are dry, put it back on your bass, and tune up, but don't play it for about a week. Let it sit, so the poly cures under the tension. If you don't the poly make start to break or peal off.
whichever you prefer. the wood filler is tough stuff made to endure more than the force of tension from a bass. veneers will give you a more professional look. however the margin for error is greater i would think. the wood putty is so much easier to use.
its similar to grout, only for wood. it will dry and look bad, but when you sand down the fretboard, the lines will become visible. I would recommend a radiused sanding bloack to make the job easier and more precise.
Thank you Vince. I don't know what's called either, but couldn't find any "putty" by Elmer's!? Others make some form of wood putty, and they would probably work fine too. But using something that's been successfully tested feels better! :) I like the idea of working in it with my fingers like that! Maybe I could leave a little hump/bulge, and make it easier to sand down later. Can't wait to do it! Thanks again for the inspiration and insight!
i just order a fretless from warmoth, waiting on the neck and body, should be here soon. this made me even more eager!! good to see some love for jaco and juan alderete. huge influences of mine as well.
@TheAlmightyBassist epoxy takes long to dry. i used several thin coats sanding in between each as apposed to pouring a thick layer on which can be messy and risky. took about 2 weeks.
If you choose not to coat it, it would be safer to use flatwounds than roundwounds. However, that may not be the tone you're looking for. When coated, the tone will be slightly brighter and will protect the fretboard from getting damaged by roundwounds.
i dont buff in between coats, only at the end. you sand to achieve a smoother finish and have the new coat adhere. the buffing happens at the end. I used a sponge drill buffer from stewmac and turtle wax, did the job, a nice mirror like finish.
give it a good wipe down with a damp cloth, make sure it feels and looks even. put the sanding block over top of the wood all along the neck to make sure the surface is uniform. when all the dust is removed, and the wood is dry of the damp cloth, i say go for the first coat.
@monkeypantsstealer epoxy still gets marked up and needs to be retouched every couple years. even epoxy won't retain its finish. i applied several thin coats of the oil based poly (its quite tough, even to sand), and to be honest, i havent noticed much difference from the epoxied board that i have on my pbass. it sounds similar and wears about the same, and i play this bass more often. ive had it for over a year like this, and im completely satisfied.
I only sand the wood with 200 grit. first five coats of the poly i used 200 as well, then went to a higher grit every coat after that, stopping at 1600.
nice. It's not a difficult project, but it does require some patience and attention to detail. sanding is the most important part, and can easily mess up your instrument. I wouldn't do this without a radiused sanding block. Don't bother if you dont have one. The veneers or wood putty are going to absorb the poly differently than the fretboard. levelling with a sanding block is the key to getting reliable intonation, and make playing it a lot more comfortable.
Bravo dude I just used a screwdriver "chisel" it under the fret & pivot it out so that will leave damage on the fretboard which is ok since it will sanded & planed down with lots of filing & sandpapering & elbow grease I did that with my Yamaha 5 string attitude bass which was getting old so needed reviving lol its not totally fretless as I still see where the frets used to be which is fine since I still need to find my way around cheers
Good point on that radius block (StewMac for about $10). But even if you can't swing a radius block, I hope everyone will use SOME kind of sanding block! Can you imagine someone just hand sanding afterwards!? :)
i did something similar with a cheaper bass from Soundsation. Only i have too little playing skills then i don't know how to refine it with a better nut and bridge and strings... I like very much your instrument and the way you play it!
I followed a pretty similar method with a few differences, I used veneers to fill the slots and I started with a couple of healthy coats of tung oil before applying Minwax polyurethane. I didn't achieve a glossy finish after wetsanding the final coat with 1500 grit sandpaper though. No idea how people get poly to shine after sanding the final coat because in my experience any sanding only leaves a matte finish that catches a little light at the right angle but definitely not a mirror (or even shiny) finish.
Thanks man, my buffing wheel was from stew-mac. its a spongey texture. I used turtle wax buffing compound on the wet sponge. I wet it in case there was friction heat.
Great job man. Looks and sounds great. I've tried to coat 2 fingerboards in the past with glue. One turned out pretty good the other was disastrous becasue I did it in hot weather with was a really bad idea. I have another neck (83 Jazz Japan) that I'm gonna try it on. It was crudely defretted by the person I bought it from but the neck is great. Makes it look like Jaco's as his was crudely defretted too.LOL. The neck is very worn also which feels great to play.
@8misskim thats cool, poly is cheaper though, and just as good in comparison to my epoxied bass. i spent alot on the epoxy and spent 7 bucks on the poly. i used west system from lee valley.
Amazing how relatively little you did, and got a decent result! You're happy, sounds good, looks like a success! I'm inspired! I just bought an old Squire to attempt this conversion on, and to be honest your simplified method appeals to me. When you say Elmer's Wood Putty, do you actually mean Elmer's Wood Filler? Could tell me a little more about this product and how you filled/injected it into the fret spaces? Thanks!
@DaemonWulf im not using any pedals, this is the bass straight into the soundcard. and yes these are roundwounds as stated in a previous comment. im using the bridge pickup. you can achieve the same tone with other pickups, but the bartolinis have a sound for fretless that i really like. i have another fretless that has mexican jazz pickups in it and i can achieve the same tone.
Thanks! I just recieved my sanding block. I sanded my neck using 80-100-200-400-600 grit sandpaper and I'm just curious is that's enough to proceed applying poly...
Sounds like the recordings dude! love jaco's stuff and im also designing my own fretless, i didnt know if i should use the polyurethane or expony but now i'll use the polyurethane haha, gonna do this on a cheap bass and later install a 62 p bass pickup, i fucking cant wait lol
Love the playing, and love the bass. I'm getting mine defretted possibly for my birthday. How long does it take for the epoxy to dry, and how long does the procedure itself take?
Hi, VInce! Thank you for sharing this! Really appreciate! I went to the store and bought the same Minwax polyurethane. Is this wood filler hard enough? I'm still thinking which way I should go: use veneer or wood filler. Did you try to play on your bass before coating? Did you notice any change in tone? Thank you!!!
I de-fretted my first bass once got into Jaco, never really had the idea to put a coat over it. I use flats on t but want to get the brighter tone hence my question; what kind of miniwax did you use and sand paper. I hate the fact how rosewood is much inferior :(
Hello just wanna say awesome job. and was wondering if you have a natural bass neck once you add wood putty, would you need to do the same steps you did?
Aside from intonation, have you had any problems with the bass? I know poly is not nearly as strong as epoxy and if you're using rounds you might be at risk to wear grooves in your finish
@DaemonWulf no effects, just clean. it would have been more jaco-ish if i had chorus on. if you want a sound similar to this i would highly recommend not using flats.
Hi - I am a fretless player and am considering a DIY fingerboard finish. Now that 6 years have passed - how is the polyurethane holding up? Did you have to add more coats as it wears?
Its holding up quite well, I may rebuff the finish sometime, but it hasn't really worn much at all. There are some string marks from using roundwounds, but thats expected. It isnt my main bass either.
Vince Di Francesco you can tell that round wound sound right off the bat. Flat wounds won’t have that growl. But tapewounds. I’ve played them in a black coated finish and are the best of both worlds. I use them on a fretted. Saw a bass the other day with the bottom two strings were on there own fretless board. Tuned in A and D i think check out Davie504 he has one and it’s about the coolest thing I ever seen.
Vince Di Francesco then you’ve never heard them. That’s what they are made for. As well as flat wounds. So you don’t buzz saw the fretboard to hell. But they actually sound good on either fretless or fretted. You don’t see many store bought fretless guitars with an epoxy or even heavy polyurethane coated fretboard. It’s generally just rosewood. just like a double bass. They don’t come with an epoxy coated fret board!? But the double basses don’t use the same type strings at all either. The only time you see someone epoxy or poly the fretboard is after a fretted conversion. Just like Jaco Pastorius did to his. Go out and buy or just look at some fretless electric basses and tell me how many have the epoxy or a heavy layer of poly on them. It’s just rosewood, and generally has a matte finish And flatwounds . But I do get your point. If you wanna use round wounds it’s best to toughen up the fret board or you’re gonna end up with major divots, given the way a fretless is played.
Dude, please dont assume what i know. I know tape wounds quite well as i had them on a pbass for years, i hate them, i dont see the point, like halfway beetween round and flat, pointless for my applications. As for epoxy jobs not being stock, you are misinformed. Also, there are plenty of builders that put epoxy, poly, or other type of coating on a fretless(sire, fender, f bass and others come to mind.) Also there aren’t many builders who expect quality and longevity from a bare rosewood fretboard. This only happens on cheap instruments (MIM Fenders for example). If they do not have a coating from the factory, it means that a denser wood (pao ferro, or ebony) has been employed. These woods resist wear much better than rosewood, which is less durable. I use rounds because they are the strings that sound the best. Sometimes what may seem like a bare rosewood fretboard may actually have an oil or satin finish with the purpose of looking bare.I epoxied for the sound as much as the fingerboard protection. . If a quality instrument hasno epoxy or poly on the fretbaord, its likely that the fretboard is made from a denser wood. Oh and an upright bass often will have an ebony fingerboard as well as flatwound or gut strings, these are nowhere near as biting as electric strings, but it is not uncommon for upright boards to be replained or replaced.
If its called wood filler, then its called wood filler, simple mistake, but it must be the same stuff. just take a small wad of it and rub it into the spaces with your finger.
It’s whatever man. Just my two cents don’t get all bent out of shape and spend half an hour on vindication. It’s all relative anyway lmao. I mean how much are you actually going to use a fretless bass in a giging atmosphere anyway? Say you make it big in a band. Maybe 3 songs. So whatever gets you off man
I'm not bent out of shape, just schooling you on your inaccuracies. But in the Pop/Rock/Metal world, I dunno, Mick Karn, Juan Alderete, Tony Franklin, Steve DiGiorgio, Colin Edwin, Gary Willis, Percy Jones, Steve Bailey, Jeff Ament, and Les Claypool are just a few players I can name from the top of my head that play fretless almost exclusively, and I didn't have to say Jaco. Its all relative, no? Oh, and none of these guys use tapewounds. I'm sure their combined 100+ years of experience have taught them nothing.
Hello just wanna say awesome job. and was wondering if you have a natural bass neck once you add wood putty, would you need to do the same steps you did?
Thank you for all the tips. I filled fretholes with a rosewood veneer using a wood glue (it doesn't leave stains). That was my first defretting experience. I didn't have a sanding block yet, I ordered one but couldn't wait to start the job. So I made one block by myself. I sticked sand paper to my fretboard to have a radiused sanding surface and a piece of plain wood to make radius block. I didn't do a lot of sanding before applying polyurethane because I'm still waiting for a proper block.
Definitely wait for the block. the picture you sent me looks really good. the block is just to make sure that the veneers (or putty, for those who use it) are even with the rest of the fretboard. The poly will have to be sanded between each coat. use at least 10 coats. Don't get impatient. After all the coats are dry, put it back on your bass, and tune up, but don't play it for about a week. Let it sit, so the poly cures under the tension. If you don't the poly make start to break or peal off.
whichever you prefer. the wood filler is tough stuff made to endure more than the force of tension from a bass. veneers will give you a more professional look. however the margin for error is greater i would think. the wood putty is so much easier to use.
its similar to grout, only for wood. it will dry and look bad, but when you sand down the fretboard, the lines will become visible. I would recommend a radiused sanding bloack to make the job easier and more precise.
Thank you Vince. I don't know what's called either, but couldn't find any "putty" by Elmer's!? Others make some form of wood putty, and they would probably work fine too. But using something that's been successfully tested feels better! :)
I like the idea of working in it with my fingers like that! Maybe I could leave a little hump/bulge, and make it easier to sand down later. Can't wait to do it! Thanks again for the inspiration and insight!
i just order a fretless from warmoth, waiting on the neck and body, should be here soon. this made me even more eager!! good to see some love for jaco and juan alderete. huge influences of mine as well.
@TheAlmightyBassist epoxy takes long to dry. i used several thin coats sanding in between each as apposed to pouring a thick layer on which can be messy and risky. took about 2 weeks.
That is sick sounds great! I love how u can see where the frets were for (marking purposes) looks great too!
If you choose not to coat it, it would be safer to use flatwounds than roundwounds. However, that may not be the tone you're looking for. When coated, the tone will be slightly brighter and will protect the fretboard from getting damaged by roundwounds.
Literally the only useful video that I've found. Great work...looks and sounds like Jaco
feels dry, and quite durable. its been on for almost 3 years now and no major wear. I recommend it 100%.
i dont buff in between coats, only at the end. you sand to achieve a smoother finish and have the new coat adhere. the buffing happens at the end. I used a sponge drill buffer from stewmac and turtle wax, did the job, a nice mirror like finish.
give it a good wipe down with a damp cloth, make sure it feels and looks even. put the sanding block over top of the wood all along the neck to make sure the surface is uniform. when all the dust is removed, and the wood is dry of the damp cloth, i say go for the first coat.
@monkeypantsstealer epoxy still gets marked up and needs to be retouched every couple years. even epoxy won't retain its finish. i applied several thin coats of the oil based poly (its quite tough, even to sand), and to be honest, i havent noticed much difference from the epoxied board that i have on my pbass. it sounds similar and wears about the same, and i play this bass more often. ive had it for over a year like this, and im completely satisfied.
I only sand the wood with 200 grit. first five coats of the poly i used 200 as well, then went to a higher grit every coat after that, stopping at 1600.
nice. It's not a difficult project, but it does require some patience and attention to detail. sanding is the most important part, and can easily mess up your instrument. I wouldn't do this without a radiused sanding block. Don't bother if you dont have one. The veneers or wood putty are going to absorb the poly differently than the fretboard. levelling with a sanding block is the key to getting reliable intonation, and make playing it a lot more comfortable.
Bravo dude
I just used a screwdriver "chisel" it under the fret & pivot it out so that will leave damage on the fretboard which is ok since it will sanded & planed down with lots of filing & sandpapering & elbow grease
I did that with my Yamaha 5 string attitude bass which was getting old so needed reviving lol its not totally fretless as I still see where the frets used to be which is fine since I still need to find my way around cheers
Sounds really good. You did a great job on it.
Good point on that radius block (StewMac for about $10). But even if you can't swing a radius block, I hope everyone will use SOME kind of sanding block! Can you imagine someone just hand sanding afterwards!? :)
i did something similar with a cheaper bass from Soundsation. Only i have too little playing skills then i don't know how to refine it with a better nut and bridge and strings...
I like very much your instrument and the way you play it!
BEAUTIFUL!! And nice playing as well! :)
I followed a pretty similar method with a few differences, I used veneers to fill the slots and I started with a couple of healthy coats of tung oil before applying Minwax polyurethane. I didn't achieve a glossy finish after wetsanding the final coat with 1500 grit sandpaper though. No idea how people get poly to shine after sanding the final coat because in my experience any sanding only leaves a matte finish that catches a little light at the right angle but definitely not a mirror (or even shiny) finish.
I bought a buffing wheel for a hand drill and buffing compound. try that .
Thanks Vince, I think I'll do just that. Great playing by the way.
Thanks man, my buffing wheel was from stew-mac. its a spongey texture. I used turtle wax buffing compound on the wet sponge. I wet it in case there was friction heat.
Again, thanks! I appreciate you sharing with me what type of compound and choice of wheel, it really helps.
Great job man. Looks and sounds great. I've tried to coat 2 fingerboards in the past with glue. One turned out pretty good the other was disastrous becasue I did it in hot weather with was a really bad idea. I have another neck (83 Jazz Japan) that I'm gonna try it on. It was crudely defretted by the person I bought it from but the neck is great. Makes it look like Jaco's as his was crudely defretted too.LOL. The neck is very worn also which feels great to play.
@8misskim thats cool, poly is cheaper though, and just as good in comparison to my epoxied bass. i spent alot on the epoxy and spent 7 bucks on the poly. i used west system from lee valley.
minwax oil based gloss. various grits of sandpaper from 200 grit stopping at 1500 grit.
Amazing how relatively little you did, and got a decent result! You're happy, sounds good, looks like a success! I'm inspired!
I just bought an old Squire to attempt this conversion on, and to be honest your simplified method appeals to me. When you say Elmer's Wood Putty, do you actually mean Elmer's Wood Filler? Could tell me a little more about this product and how you filled/injected it into the fret spaces? Thanks!
@DaemonWulf im not using any pedals, this is the bass straight into the soundcard. and yes these are roundwounds as stated in a previous comment. im using the bridge pickup. you can achieve the same tone with other pickups, but the bartolinis have a sound for fretless that i really like. i have another fretless that has mexican jazz pickups in it and i can achieve the same tone.
@ahasexotikos yea, ernie ball hybrid slinkys, nickel roundwound, 45-105
geeez man, that sounds fantastic! great work. youve inspired me to try to make my own
Awesome job man, looks fantastic, very Jaco. What happens if you don't coat it?
Thanks! I just recieved my sanding block. I sanded my neck using 80-100-200-400-600 grit sandpaper and I'm just curious is that's enough to proceed applying poly...
Great tone man.
Sounds like the recordings dude! love jaco's stuff and im also designing my own fretless, i didnt know if i should use the polyurethane or expony but now i'll use the polyurethane haha, gonna do this on a cheap bass and later install a 62 p bass pickup, i fucking cant wait lol
Great Job Vince! Play on!
thank you, Vince! I'll show you my results later!
Cheers!
Love the playing, and love the bass. I'm getting mine defretted possibly for my birthday. How long does it take for the epoxy to dry, and how long does the procedure itself take?
Hi, VInce! Thank you for sharing this! Really appreciate! I went to the store and bought the same Minwax polyurethane. Is this wood filler hard enough? I'm still thinking which way I should go: use veneer or wood filler. Did you try to play on your bass before coating? Did you notice any change in tone? Thank you!!!
very nice job. authentic tone
yea i bought one from stew mac, helped out perfectly
I de-fretted my first bass once got into Jaco, never really had the idea to put a coat over it. I use flats on t but want to get the brighter tone hence my question; what kind of miniwax did you use and sand paper.
I hate the fact how rosewood is much inferior :(
You did it with a hair dryer and nail clippers? Haha, that's amazing!
sounds fantastico.....r those stock pickups in that axe?
Hello just wanna say awesome job.
and was wondering if you have a natural bass neck once you add wood putty, would you need to do the same steps you did?
Awesome job dude
Aside from intonation, have you had any problems with the bass? I know poly is not nearly as strong as epoxy and if you're using rounds you might be at risk to wear grooves in your finish
bartolini's its in the description
Good work, good sound. Congrats!
Cool- great job and nice playing! Could you tell me how you got that resonant sound-- or is it just the nature of your bass?
technique, body wood, pickups, im not sure. vibrato is the key for fretless.
@8misskim yea and? i did it inside.
This stuff is oil based, yes? Does it kill strings quicker? Feel any oily? Or does it feel like a poly finish? Lasts a long time, yes?
@KnownAzTAF thank you!
@DaemonWulf no effects, just clean. it would have been more jaco-ish if i had chorus on. if you want a sound similar to this i would highly recommend not using flats.
Hi - I am a fretless player and am considering a DIY fingerboard finish. Now that 6 years have passed - how is the polyurethane holding up? Did you have to add more coats as it wears?
Its holding up quite well, I may rebuff the finish sometime, but it hasn't really worn much at all. There are some string marks from using roundwounds, but thats expected. It isnt my main bass either.
Sweet. Thanks!
goooood work buddy !!
Sweet!
What kind of strings are these
Elixir 45-105
thanks!
you must dry 20 celsius or warmer room ...
Two more questions- did you use flats, and would the epoxy job protect the fretboard if you were to use round wounds?
I use roundwounds. the epoxy does a good job of protecting it and doesn't wear nearly as quick as bare wood.
Vince Di Francesco you can tell that round wound sound right off the bat. Flat wounds won’t have that growl. But tapewounds. I’ve played them in a black coated finish and are the best of both worlds. I use them on a fretted. Saw a bass the other day with the bottom two strings were on there own fretless board. Tuned in A and D i think check out Davie504 he has one and it’s about the coolest thing I ever seen.
I can't imagine tapewounds sounding as good on fretless
Vince Di Francesco then you’ve never heard them. That’s what they are made for. As well as flat wounds. So you don’t buzz saw the fretboard to hell. But they actually sound good on either fretless or fretted. You don’t see many store bought fretless guitars with an epoxy or even heavy polyurethane coated fretboard. It’s generally just rosewood. just like a double bass. They don’t come with an epoxy coated fret board!? But the double basses don’t use the same type strings at all either. The only time you see someone epoxy or poly the fretboard is after a fretted conversion. Just like Jaco Pastorius did to his. Go out and buy or just look at some fretless electric basses and tell me how many have the epoxy or a heavy layer of poly on them. It’s just rosewood, and generally has a matte finish And flatwounds . But I do get your point. If you wanna use round wounds it’s best to toughen up the fret board or you’re gonna end up with major divots, given the way a fretless is played.
Dude, please dont assume what i know. I know tape wounds quite well as i had them on a pbass for years, i hate them, i dont see the point, like halfway beetween round and flat, pointless for my applications. As for epoxy jobs not being stock, you are misinformed. Also, there are plenty of builders that put epoxy, poly, or other type of coating on a fretless(sire, fender, f bass and others come to mind.) Also there aren’t many builders who expect quality and longevity from a bare rosewood fretboard. This only happens on cheap instruments (MIM Fenders for example). If they do not have a coating from the factory, it means that a denser wood (pao ferro, or ebony) has been employed. These woods resist wear much better than rosewood, which is less durable. I use rounds because they are the strings that sound the best. Sometimes what may seem like a bare rosewood fretboard may actually have an oil or satin finish with the purpose of looking bare.I epoxied for the sound as much as the fingerboard protection. . If a quality instrument hasno epoxy or poly on the fretbaord, its likely that the fretboard is made from a denser wood. Oh and an upright bass often will have an ebony fingerboard as well as flatwound or gut strings, these are nowhere near as biting as electric strings, but it is not uncommon for upright boards to be replained or replaced.
nice
no, just after
If its called wood filler, then its called wood filler, simple mistake, but it must be the same stuff. just take a small wad of it and rub it into the spaces with your finger.
@mkklmann putrid? thats jaco man
thats not true....my epoxy 1hour end its e nuff....i have epoxy 2 n componennt,end its great...for playing
Lollll
HA bass-ically
It’s whatever man. Just my two cents don’t get all bent out of shape and spend half an hour on vindication. It’s all relative anyway lmao. I mean how much are you actually going to use a fretless bass in a giging atmosphere anyway? Say you make it big in a band. Maybe 3 songs. So whatever gets you off man
I'm not bent out of shape, just schooling you on your inaccuracies. But in the Pop/Rock/Metal world, I dunno, Mick Karn, Juan Alderete, Tony Franklin, Steve DiGiorgio, Colin Edwin, Gary Willis, Percy Jones, Steve Bailey, Jeff Ament, and Les Claypool are just a few players I can name from the top of my head that play fretless almost exclusively, and I didn't have to say Jaco. Its all relative, no? Oh, and none of these guys use tapewounds. I'm sure their combined 100+ years of experience have taught them nothing.
Hello just wanna say awesome job.
and was wondering if you have a natural bass neck once you add wood putty, would you need to do the same steps you did?