yeah but SSS potency goes up with chakras unlocked/opened, you have none unlocked in the start of a fight so why would it be there only to lock you out of every other ability for nearly 4 seconds?
I been playing mnk since 2.1 and no it’s not easier or harder because now u have lights bulbs to watch instead of a timer. The loop once learned muscle memory made it so u literally had no almost never even look at your hottbar and this was when we had added skills like fracture as an exception. Will it make it easier for new people ? Possibly sure…. But this as an overall statement, no. The change back to 1-2-2 is going to make it much easier than anything then when they tryed adding 3 added snap punches revolving around sitting in a flank position.
For those of you who don't want to do double Lunar opener, you will instead end up popping RoF before PB instead of after in the odd windows. The evens will be the same, which sort of makes the Solar odds maybe a little easier on muscle memory, but it depends on the fight kill time which is better.
I understand that we had a decade of 223 muscle memory for the stances, but I'm disappointed that they caved and got rid of the new 234 system already. I'm sure it also helped them rebalance new potencies, but it made the rotation so fresh and dynamic.
So if I'm understanding correctly, I am supposed to: (Opening PB charges) Elixir Burst -> Elixir Burst (One minute mark) Phoenix (Two minute mark) Phatom Rush -> Elixir Burst Always hold PB charges until 6-7 seconds left on RoF cooldown. Spend RoW as it comes off cooldown. Prioritize Leaping Opo uses wherever possible without disrupting that flow. If I'm off, please correct me.
Only thing I would add is to use PB after an opo gcd (hence the "use PB when 2 mins are under 7 seconds"). So you use PB after the next opo gcd once your 2 mins are under those 7 seconds.
It all depends on the killtime. If boss dies on 2 min bursts - makes sense to push PR to 2 min (and it is a 1st blitz there). In that case lunar+lunar, then solar, then PR+Lunar and repeat... If boss dies before 2 min or simply around an odd minut then u don't need to push PR to 2min. In that case lunar+solar then PR then again lunar+solar and repeat until bad guy dead. U can also force an unbuffed PR into a killing blow of sorts since PB is 40 seconds and u can use it quite ahead of time.
I feel mnk is weaker compared to older versions. Maybe if the riddles were ogcd or six sided star was just a ogcd with max chakras meaning 10 and a cooldown of 120. Or maybe add critical only only by positions once we get oppo etc.. orbs to spend
I feel like you’re onto something changing SSS to an OGCD. Tell me git gud but SSS feels clunky when trying to use as it is intended. Again just my opinion
I think there is a missed optimization here: both masterful blitz and fire’s reply grant you formless fist. By being in formless fists and not using it on an opo gcd it feels like a waste. Things get tricky because in my shallow testing (and horribly at execution), at 1.97 GCD I don’t seem to be able to fit “everything” entirely under riddle of fire buffs. By everything I mean, both blitzes, and both replies. Further, after every masterful blitz is an opo gcd, and after fire’s reply is an opo gcd. What seems to happen is I’ll have a fury ball leaping opo ready that isn’t buffed on the trail end of the 20 seconds. Even Wind’s reply is sometimes sketch though I think that’s just my practice. I’m sure if SS is fast enough, the other gcd fits, and perhaps is a potency gain? Monk feels like it’s at peak performance right now. I’m practicing and learning on my own, but I can’t wait to compare and see what the balance discord comes up with / says about it.
I do use an opo gcd every time I get formless fist though. And the current BiS is listed at a 1.94 gcd, so you could try melding some sks to see if that helps with fitting everything in the burst.
@@IlyaDalamiq Re-checked this morning on my PC instead of phone in slow motion. You're right, I thought I saw you go from blitz -> replies -> ppo -> [PB] -> opo; but indeed it's blitz -> opo -> replies -> opo -> [PB] -> opo.
I feel like monk needs the treatment that dragoon got, where you can start into blood phase right off rip if you want. Having to use an opener that uses two of the same masterful blitz attacks just doesnt feel right. Maybe bring back anatman and make it so that it gives you both a lunar and solar nadi upon use? It does seem kind of powerful, but it would make it fall in line with the rest of the jobs having an instant "powerful" combo starter.
My assumption for the Replies being GCDs is to keep your GCDs spinning whilst being out of melee range, which I feel a lot more encounters force now in DT. The same conclusion I've come to for them getting rid of timers (outside of them apparently being too difficult for people to keep track of 😒)
Just want to point out, Brotherhood now allows you to stack up to ten Chakra which now puts Six Sided Star into the 1580 potency range when spending all of them. Under both Brotherhood and Riddle of Fire, it hits like a truck. Highest I have seen on my own testing has been 160k damage in one hit. Not only that, you can Riddle of Wind while waiting out the 3.9 second GCD. This helps to keep the uptime up a bit and fills the empty space in with faster melee attacks.
I am curious as to why so few are discussing the six sided star buff with brotherhood. Is it just too difficult/unreliable to reasonably capitalize on inside the burst window?
@@Rikadou it’s not a dps gain in nearly all situations. Six sided star has a longer gcd cool down meaning using it causes you to lose around 1-2 attacks after using it. It might be a gain if you get a crit direct hit with 10 chakras but that never something you can plan for and you are better off just spending your chakras normally and hitting your regular gcds.
Is there a reason we're still using Opo GCDs for the Double Lunar opener? Wouldn't it ideally be Coeurl GCDs? Opo -- 320 + 460 + 320 = 1100 Potency Raptor -- 420 + 540 + 420 = 1380 Potency Coeurl -- 420 + 520 + 520 = 1460 Potency Does using Opo GCDs make buffs or other things line up better later in the fight? EDIT: Nevermind, forgot about guaranteed crit.
Something I still don’t understand: If you are in Formless Shift and you don’t have Opo-Opo Fury, are you supposed to press Dragon Kicl or Leaping Opo? IcyVein says always Leaping Opo, but I swear, I can’t tell if you if I get the bonus potency or a Chakra orb when I do. Like that’s the most annoying thing I find with MNK right now is that I don’t know if my abilities are working or not. And during Perfect Balance, do you need the orb to get the bonus damage to Leaping Opo, or do you always need the orb no matter what? Honestly, my only real hang-up on MNK has always been which rules apply and how fuck does Formless Shift actually work. Coz the game tooltips suck.
Really great, was looking for this, but what about the standard opener? Looks like the double lunar one was used here. Can you make a video using the standard one?
With how it shakes out now you shouldn't really need to use a "standard" opener now unless theres some weird boss phasing you need to account for, you'll just be losing out on potency in the 2 min/ pot window.
FWIW, it seems at the moment that when your killtime is unknown, Solar Lunar is safer than double Lunar. If you go Double Lunar and your killtime doesn't work in its favor, the loss is significantly worse than choosing Solar Lunar and things not working out. There's a similar situation when raid buffs aren't aligned, so when it comes to random groups, Solar Lunar appears to be the way to go.
I watchdd another video where the guy mentions u charge all ur balls then spend all ur balls. From your video it seems u are filling balls then spending it instantly? Which on is correct?
I assume you're talking about opener/burst? If that is the case then you probably saw a video showcasing lunar/solar opener. I showcase double lunar in this one. Both are correct and their usage depends on killtime.
it's about equal to 2 MNK GCDs, both from potency and GCD's viewpoint. Only *slightly* stronger than Twin Snakes -> Demolish. It does have the potential to be stronger than Raptor->Coeurl, but 'potential' is the key word there. No reason to hope for a crit DH on Six-Sided Star when you can just do rotation normally and will always get good, consistent DPS. The potency buff is basically QoL, so you don't feel like you just wasted 2 chakra gauges during a forced downtime. Which rarely happens anyways in a fight you know.
To follow up on this, when you should use single-target or AoE attacks varies depending on what level you are. For example, while under level 84, Four-point Fury is a gain on three targets, but at 84 or higher, it's only a gain with four or more. AoE is rarely a high-pressure affair, though, and most jobs' AoEs are used starting at three targets, so, while you're learning, it's reasonable to just use AoEs whenever there are at least three targets.
@@exoehin7396 For Flint Strike, one each, and spend Formless Fist on Rockbreaker. For Elixir Field and Tornado Kick, use Rockbreaker three times, and spend Formless Fist on Rockbreaker. You're close to 82, though, when Arm of the Destroyer upgrades into Shadow of the Destroyer. Once you get that, it'll be stronger than Rockbreaker, so spam it for EF and TK, and spend FF on it, too.
@@Gatsby3737 I'm adamant that anybody calling the job braindead or butchered have been fucking their rotations up since they slapped on the job stone.
@@PapaMidnite__ You cannot do old mnk stuff like optimal drift, and your 2 min burst window is now just spamming oppo skills with no need to account for durations of demolish or twin snakes, objectively more simple and not the "same rotation" as the person above said.
@@DivineRainor why couldn't you hold your burst now but could in EW? And telling people are spamming oppo skills is like telling me black mages are still hot swapping between ice and fire to only cast paradox. I think my statement still stands
@@Gatsby3737 "just there isn't any timers anymore" You're saying that like it makes no difference when it comes to optimising burst windows. Heck, it even made the regular rotation somewhat more involved than "hit the glowing buttons". Calling Monk braindead is a bit much but the job is undoubtedly pretty easy now.
absolutely terrible guide. I haven't played Monk since I got it to 90 in the last expansion and was hoping to get to know how to play monk after the changes this expansion. Instead all I got was a guy hitting a dummy showing of effects. Like, what happens if I go 2+1 instead of 3 different or 3 similar? Why are there two different Meditations that seem to do the same but have different colors? What positionals got changed?
@@IlyaDalamiq why would I be looking for a beginners guide at 90 tho? And in any case, you could have at least shown the skills and in what order they go on paper before just spamming moves on a dummy
@@Mistermixmasterdoing 2+1 is not part of the rotation. Why would he mention this if this is a ROTATIONAL video? If you need someone to explain all the skills to you and teach you when to use/not to use them, then you’re looking for a Wesk Alber video. The reason why you need a beginners video is you don’t know what the skills do. Essentially, you are not the target audience for this video.
That opener is so different now. Gonna have to relearn that muscle memory.
Thanks for this clear and concise guide. Having not really touched Monk since Shadowbringers I needed a BIG freshen up,and you did it perfectly.
ty for this!! the balance or icyveins havent updated for DT so this is mega helpful
And now that they have updated it, it’s still a confusing mess.
Okay cool, I was stressing out trying to fit the fire/wind reply under riddle window, but good to know I can just work that in after first PB.
great timing was searching for this just now thank you
i honestly thought Six-Sided Star will somehow fits in the opener with how high the potency *seems* on paper... but i guess not, huh.
yeah but SSS potency goes up with chakras unlocked/opened, you have none unlocked in the start of a fight so why would it be there only to lock you out of every other ability for nearly 4 seconds?
monk is easier now.
1) the button you need to press lights up. training wheels.
2) you only need to track riddle of fire.
But how do you pay attention to the boss while looking at the hotbars at the same time?
Not strictly true unless you ignore the aoe indicators.
@@EbonySeraphim why would you not ignore are indicators on single target lol
I been playing mnk since 2.1 and no it’s not easier or harder because now u have lights bulbs to watch instead of a timer. The loop once learned muscle memory made it so u literally had no almost never even look at your hottbar and this was when we had added skills like fracture as an exception. Will it make it easier for new people ? Possibly sure…. But this as an overall statement, no. The change back to 1-2-2 is going to make it much easier than anything then when they tryed adding 3 added snap punches revolving around sitting in a flank position.
@@lushdontu4015dunno, worked fine with previous expansions
For those of you who don't want to do double Lunar opener, you will instead end up popping RoF before PB instead of after in the odd windows. The evens will be the same, which sort of makes the Solar odds maybe a little easier on muscle memory, but it depends on the fight kill time which is better.
I understand that we had a decade of 223 muscle memory for the stances, but I'm disappointed that they caved and got rid of the new 234 system already. I'm sure it also helped them rebalance new potencies, but it made the rotation so fresh and dynamic.
Definitely got to reset my muscle memory. Thanks for the vid!
So if I'm understanding correctly, I am supposed to:
(Opening PB charges) Elixir Burst -> Elixir Burst
(One minute mark) Phoenix
(Two minute mark) Phatom Rush -> Elixir Burst
Always hold PB charges until 6-7 seconds left on RoF cooldown. Spend RoW as it comes off cooldown. Prioritize Leaping Opo uses wherever possible without disrupting that flow. If I'm off, please correct me.
Only thing I would add is to use PB after an opo gcd (hence the "use PB when 2 mins are under 7 seconds"). So you use PB after the next opo gcd once your 2 mins are under those 7 seconds.
@@IlyaDalamiq Gotchya, so PB always leaps off an opo gcd. Thanks for the help!
Anytime ^^
It all depends on the killtime.
If boss dies on 2 min bursts - makes sense to push PR to 2 min (and it is a 1st blitz there). In that case lunar+lunar, then solar, then PR+Lunar and repeat...
If boss dies before 2 min or simply around an odd minut then u don't need to push PR to 2min. In that case lunar+solar then PR then again lunar+solar and repeat until bad guy dead. U can also force an unbuffed PR into a killing blow of sorts since PB is 40 seconds and u can use it quite ahead of time.
Thanks for the vid! Just what I was looking for ^^
I feel mnk is weaker compared to older versions. Maybe if the riddles were ogcd or six sided star was just a ogcd with max chakras meaning 10 and a cooldown of 120. Or maybe add critical only only by positions once we get oppo etc.. orbs to spend
I feel like you’re onto something changing SSS to an OGCD. Tell me git gud but SSS feels clunky when trying to use as it is intended. Again just my opinion
I knew i wasnt using the free form shift from riddle of fire correctly.
I think there is a missed optimization here: both masterful blitz and fire’s reply grant you formless fist. By being in formless fists and not using it on an opo gcd it feels like a waste. Things get tricky because in my shallow testing (and horribly at execution), at 1.97 GCD I don’t seem to be able to fit “everything” entirely under riddle of fire buffs. By everything I mean, both blitzes, and both replies. Further, after every masterful blitz is an opo gcd, and after fire’s reply is an opo gcd. What seems to happen is I’ll have a fury ball leaping opo ready that isn’t buffed on the trail end of the 20 seconds. Even Wind’s reply is sometimes sketch though I think that’s just my practice.
I’m sure if SS is fast enough, the other gcd fits, and perhaps is a potency gain? Monk feels like it’s at peak performance right now. I’m practicing and learning on my own, but I can’t wait to compare and see what the balance discord comes up with / says about it.
I do use an opo gcd every time I get formless fist though. And the current BiS is listed at a 1.94 gcd, so you could try melding some sks to see if that helps with fitting everything in the burst.
@@IlyaDalamiq Re-checked this morning on my PC instead of phone in slow motion. You're right, I thought I saw you go from blitz -> replies -> ppo -> [PB] -> opo; but indeed it's blitz -> opo -> replies -> opo -> [PB] -> opo.
@@IlyaDalamiq Do you know the SKS cutoff to hit 1.94 gcd?
955
I feel like monk needs the treatment that dragoon got, where you can start into blood phase right off rip if you want. Having to use an opener that uses two of the same masterful blitz attacks just doesnt feel right. Maybe bring back anatman and make it so that it gives you both a lunar and solar nadi upon use? It does seem kind of powerful, but it would make it fall in line with the rest of the jobs having an instant "powerful" combo starter.
It would feel better if the replies were ogcd
I seriously doubt it. Chakra spam now during BH is kinda nuts as it is. And replies being GCDs are a nice ranged filler during a burst
In short. Monk + double weaves = bad time
Eh, I'm careful enough not to double weave. Maybe not fire since it grants formless, but it wind would be nice to be ogcd
@@cliftongamespoorly6333 on that i can agree but still it is kinda whatever since RoF is 20s now anyway
My assumption for the Replies being GCDs is to keep your GCDs spinning whilst being out of melee range, which I feel a lot more encounters force now in DT. The same conclusion I've come to for them getting rid of timers (outside of them apparently being too difficult for people to keep track of 😒)
Used to play MNK until they introduced Beast Chakras but unfortunately I never got a solid understanding of it.
Lmao! I love it, we get stickers! xD That's a good monk! xD omg amazing I had a good laugh thanks xD
most useful rotation video i found so far
off topic but love your voice
Just want to point out, Brotherhood now allows you to stack up to ten Chakra which now puts Six Sided Star into the 1580 potency range when spending all of them. Under both Brotherhood and Riddle of Fire, it hits like a truck. Highest I have seen on my own testing has been 160k damage in one hit. Not only that, you can Riddle of Wind while waiting out the 3.9 second GCD. This helps to keep the uptime up a bit and fills the empty space in with faster melee attacks.
I am curious as to why so few are discussing the six sided star buff with brotherhood. Is it just too difficult/unreliable to reasonably capitalize on inside the burst window?
@@Rikadou it’s not a dps gain in nearly all situations. Six sided star has a longer gcd cool down meaning using it causes you to lose around 1-2 attacks after using it. It might be a gain if you get a crit direct hit with 10 chakras but that never something you can plan for and you are better off just spending your chakras normally and hitting your regular gcds.
@@Gatsby3737 the speedboost is the only benefice u get which means it is not meant to be used as normal chakra spender but only as an escpae finisher
thank you!
My 2nd main, it’s game over get ready!
Didn’t even know Road granted Formless fist 🤦 I guess I’m rereading my tooltips tn
Is there a reason we're still using Opo GCDs for the Double Lunar opener? Wouldn't it ideally be Coeurl GCDs?
Opo -- 320 + 460 + 320 = 1100 Potency
Raptor -- 420 + 540 + 420 = 1380 Potency
Coeurl -- 420 + 520 + 520 = 1460 Potency
Does using Opo GCDs make buffs or other things line up better later in the fight?
EDIT: Nevermind, forgot about guaranteed crit.
Yup :p
Something I still don’t understand: If you are in Formless Shift and you don’t have Opo-Opo Fury, are you supposed to press Dragon Kicl or Leaping Opo?
IcyVein says always Leaping Opo, but I swear, I can’t tell if you if I get the bonus potency or a Chakra orb when I do.
Like that’s the most annoying thing I find with MNK right now is that I don’t know if my abilities are working or not.
And during Perfect Balance, do you need the orb to get the bonus damage to Leaping Opo, or do you always need the orb no matter what?
Honestly, my only real hang-up on MNK has always been which rules apply and how fuck does Formless Shift actually work. Coz the game tooltips suck.
If no orb, press orb gaining skill, if orb, press orb spending skill. It's as simple as that. Doesn't matter if you have formless fist or not.
Really great, was looking for this, but what about the standard opener? Looks like the double lunar one was used here. Can you make a video using the standard one?
It’s the same thing but just instead of Lunar Nadi again use 3 different attacks for solar nadi
It is the standard now. Lunar+lunar on 0 and solar on 1. Then PR + lunar on 2
Its largely the same. For opener and 2min, you'll do Solar first (usually outside of RoF) so that you keep the Opo GCDs in RoF.
With how it shakes out now you shouldn't really need to use a "standard" opener now unless theres some weird boss phasing you need to account for, you'll just be losing out on potency in the 2 min/ pot window.
Double weaving buffs goes against my thought about mnk entirely, but the last elixir timing is so perfect. What if my ping doesn't enable that? ;(
Go for 1 faster gcd tier.
FWIW, it seems at the moment that when your killtime is unknown, Solar Lunar is safer than double Lunar. If you go Double Lunar and your killtime doesn't work in its favor, the loss is significantly worse than choosing Solar Lunar and things not working out. There's a similar situation when raid buffs aren't aligned, so when it comes to random groups, Solar Lunar appears to be the way to go.
@@rare9247 The Balance disagrees, but if there's another theorycrafting community, I'd love to hear about it.
I watchdd another video where the guy mentions u charge all ur balls then spend all ur balls. From your video it seems u are filling balls then spending it instantly?
Which on is correct?
I assume you're talking about opener/burst? If that is the case then you probably saw a video showcasing lunar/solar opener. I showcase double lunar in this one. Both are correct and their usage depends on killtime.
Why are you starting the perfect balance before RoF is up ? You're not buffing those OpoOpo GCDs that way
Because otherwise I can't fit in all the important stuff.
You can see that I only barely manage to fit the last blitz in the buff window.
Monk is FUBAR in it's current state. It needs a complete remake not overhaul.
Really? Six sided Star is not part of the rotation? That’s like 4 forbidden chakras
Not worth the long gcd
it's about equal to 2 MNK GCDs, both from potency and GCD's viewpoint. Only *slightly* stronger than Twin Snakes -> Demolish.
It does have the potential to be stronger than Raptor->Coeurl, but 'potential' is the key word there. No reason to hope for a crit DH on Six-Sided Star when you can just do rotation normally and will always get good, consistent DPS.
The potency buff is basically QoL, so you don't feel like you just wasted 2 chakra gauges during a forced downtime. Which rarely happens anyways in a fight you know.
I got a question whats the best aoe rotaion ?
Same as single target really minus the interaction with the job gauge.
Just 123 and use your formless fists on shadow of the destroyer.
To follow up on this, when you should use single-target or AoE attacks varies depending on what level you are. For example, while under level 84, Four-point Fury is a gain on three targets, but at 84 or higher, it's only a gain with four or more. AoE is rarely a high-pressure affair, though, and most jobs' AoEs are used starting at three targets, so, while you're learning, it's reasonable to just use AoEs whenever there are at least three targets.
@@tsbulmer i atm lvl 80 monk what aoe should i use with masterful blitz ?
@@exoehin7396 For Flint Strike, one each, and spend Formless Fist on Rockbreaker. For Elixir Field and Tornado Kick, use Rockbreaker three times, and spend Formless Fist on Rockbreaker.
You're close to 82, though, when Arm of the Destroyer upgrades into Shadow of the Destroyer. Once you get that, it'll be stronger than Rockbreaker, so spam it for EF and TK, and spend FF on it, too.
Braindead job now. Wow they butchered this job
…this is the same rotation as EW, just there isn’t any timers anymore
@@Gatsby3737 I'm adamant that anybody calling the job braindead or butchered have been fucking their rotations up since they slapped on the job stone.
@@PapaMidnite__ You cannot do old mnk stuff like optimal drift, and your 2 min burst window is now just spamming oppo skills with no need to account for durations of demolish or twin snakes, objectively more simple and not the "same rotation" as the person above said.
@@DivineRainor why couldn't you hold your burst now but could in EW? And telling people are spamming oppo skills is like telling me black mages are still hot swapping between ice and fire to only cast paradox. I think my statement still stands
@@Gatsby3737 "just there isn't any timers anymore"
You're saying that like it makes no difference when it comes to optimising burst windows.
Heck, it even made the regular rotation somewhat more involved than "hit the glowing buttons".
Calling Monk braindead is a bit much but the job is undoubtedly pretty easy now.
absolutely terrible guide. I haven't played Monk since I got it to 90 in the last expansion and was hoping to get to know how to play monk after the changes this expansion. Instead all I got was a guy hitting a dummy showing of effects. Like, what happens if I go 2+1 instead of 3 different or 3 similar? Why are there two different Meditations that seem to do the same but have different colors? What positionals got changed?
This is a rotation video, not a Beginners Guide to Monk.
@@IlyaDalamiq why would I be looking for a beginners guide at 90 tho? And in any case, you could have at least shown the skills and in what order they go on paper before just spamming moves on a dummy
@@Mistermixmasterdoing 2+1 is not part of the rotation. Why would he mention this if this is a ROTATIONAL video? If you need someone to explain all the skills to you and teach you when to use/not to use them, then you’re looking for a Wesk Alber video.
The reason why you need a beginners video is you don’t know what the skills do. Essentially, you are not the target audience for this video.
I still catch myself looking for my buff countdowns 🥲