Why Emirates Doesn't Fly To Berlin
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- Emirates has long wanted to operate service to Germany's capital, Berlin. With the long-awaited opening of the city's new Brandenburg airport taking place in late 2020, it seems only natural that the Dubai-based airline operate service to the German capital. And yet it doesn't. So why is this?
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I get the impression Lufthansa has no interest in Berlin other than making sure that BER doesn't become a major hub and keeping all competition out of the German market.
Lh has no interest in BER cause they've got FRA as their hub. Frankfurt is central in germany, connected to railway and highways way better than Berlin, and FRA is currently building a new terminal to accommodate up to 100 million passengers a year
You got it absolutelly right.
Yes, LH doesn't even fly from BER to LHR or any other major European destinations. They're leaving all that to their daughter company Eurowings.
Lufthansa is blocking many carriers from flying to Berlin, but doesn't actually offer any long-haul destinations from Berlin itself. This is completely unacceptable and has been hindering the Berlin economy to grow for many years now.
Same in Hamburg and Düsseldorf, where they block Qatar Airways.
Lufthansa has said that they don't want to open another hub at Brandenburg, so I don't see why it could distrupt their market share, in fact Berlin is a popular tourist destination, and Emirates adding the city to it's connection will only increase tourism in the city, a win-win situation for both the city and the airline.
Maybe Emirates should buy AirBerlin, when it was going bankrupt
@@karampuk1974 If you want to see the success rate if Emirates bought AirBerlin, look at Etihad. That being said, Etihad already has a stake in them by the time AirBerlin collapsed, so why they need to buy an airline already own by a competitor
@@faisalofficialchannel6480 I was being somewhat sarcastic :P
The airport HAS built a gate specifically for Emirates’ A380. 🤦♂️
I don't think emirates would use the A380 on this route. The market in Berlin is too small.
The gates where planned before the A380 fizzled on the market and are more if a general futureproofing measure.
It has built it, but Emirates doesn’t and hasn’t ever used it.
Actually the gate was build for a ceased Airberlin
It wasn’t built for Emirates 🤦♂️
That’s misinformation, while they built a gate for the A380 it wasn’t built for Emirates. AirBerlin hoped to operate the A380 one day which is why they planned an A380 Gate. As they also knew about the restrictions when planning the airport (maybe planning is the wrong word 😉)!
If emirates gets permission to fly to Berlin maybe BER can finally use that a380 gate
They are already using it for regular operations, it's not a gate that is exclusive to a380 but can serve any other aircraft. It is also used by Qatar among others.
I've boarded an Embraer 190 a week ago from that A380 Gate. Found that quite ironic. 😅
If it wasn't for all the delays the A380 gate would have actually been useful
Currently Qatar and Scoot are the only long haul airlines flying to Berlin, the Capital City of Germany, with more than 4 Million people.
These flights combined at the time of writing add up to 1 daily long haul flight...
I don't get it because Germans are very active travelers...
I'm not sure if Berliners want to fly from BER to FRA or MUC just to take a long distance flight.
@@Sacto1654 no they don't! So i don't get it that airlines won't offer more long haul flights to the capital of Germany ;D
I'm sure things will change once the pandemic and the respective travel restrictions are over.
What I don't really get is why Lufthansa doesn't offer more direct flights from Berlin. They already have maintenance facilities at the airport, so they could really open a secondary hub there.
I blame Lufthansa, all they care is more money for the Investors, the people will benefit from more options
@@pocketdynamo5787 if LH opened a third hub at BER, it would certainly take traffic away from FRA and MUC, thus probably making some (long haul) flights to/from there uneconomic, leading to fewer flights to certain destination and a less efficient hub-and-spoke system. I would reckon that for LH it's simply more economic to see BER as one of the more profitable non-hub airports. And I guess since FRA and MUC are better connected internationally via other carriers, it makes sense to operate mainly from there as to be accessible for lots of passengers from other airlines (Emirates, anyone from North America,...).
When Qantas signed their joint business agreement with Emirates, there was speculation that part of the reason was so that EK could use the QF rights to Germany with one airline flying to BER and the other to FRA.
It sounds strange to me that Lufthansa refers to fair market access as a reason to freeze Emirates out of slots in Berlin’s newest airport. To me it sounds anti-competitive.
It's not for slots. It's to save their hubs
Anti-competition, you say.
How about German government letting Lufthansa pay zero taxes; give them free fuel when leaving any German city; and fund the entire operation financed by German taxpayers'. Only then it would be a 'Level Playing Field'.
Yep, that's what EK experiences in their home country.
Look up how Canadian government curbed EKs dumping the capacity in Canada. In my opinion, every country in the world should follow Canadian government's treatment of EK.
Keep it fair. Do not allow EK to fly to BER!
You mean the same way Emirates squeezes American carriers out of slots in Dubai??
@@fahadfaisal7855 absolutely right!
@@ishouldbeonmountrushmore1334 there's not any routes that Emirates competes with US Carriers on because all their routes run either to or from Dubai. And currently: no American carrier flies to Dubai.
The German market is heavily regulated to protect LH. Fair enough.
I understand also, that EK can not sell a premium ticket, J & F, less than LH on any outbound equivalent route that is also operated by LH.
Regulation also protects a state owned airline from 'buying' up the market and with oil paying the way its not healthy to allow more UAE flights than current. They buy market share at the expense of local markets and that has long term negative effects
The problem is that the german government can't allow Emirates to add a 5th or 6th destination and refuse other airlines the same benefits. I guess that is one of the main issues.
For Berlin it would be great to get more direct flights
This agreement only impacts airlines from the UAE. It could be changed at every point in time.
I live in Cologne and Düsseldorf airport (50min by train), airport Cologne Bonn (15min by train) Frankfurt (ICE train) are all accesible. I could even travel to Amsterdam. All of them have long distance flight
It's interesting to get this info, especially as a Berliner! 😃👍
I'm missing several carriers here. And I miss even more direct connections to international destinations without a stopover in FRA, CPH, PAR, MAD, AMD... 😳
you mean CDG instead PAR, right?
@@janrichter8662 I meant Charles de Gaulle (3LC CDG) in the Metropolitan Area Paris (PAR).
The same was valid in the past for the Metropolitan Area Berlin (BER) with TXL, SXF and THF. With closing of the latter 3 BER became the 3LC for Berlin-Brandenburg "Willi Brand".
RIO has GIG and SDU.
LON has LGH, LGW, LCY, STN, LTN and SEN.
NYC has JFK, EWR and LGA.
PAR has CDG, ORY and LBG.
The Metropolitan Areas SAO (São Paulo) and MOW (Moscow) have 4 3LCs each as well.
What's cph?
@@EarthIsFlat456 Copenhagen
@@EarthIsFlat456 Copenhagen
Düsseldorf serves the Eastern and Southern Netherlands. An area of 6 to 7 million people. Both Schiphol and Düsseldorf are at a comparable distance from the Dutch cities in the east and south of the Netherlands. Moreover, flying from and parking at Schiphol is very expensive.
That is why KLM offers a free shuttle service (tour bus) for travelers in the east and south of the Netherlands. The KLM bus is included in the ticket and the bus journey to Schiphol takes two hours. KLM hopes to compete better with Dusseldorf in this way, even if the KLM bus is loss-making.
Schiphol has far more destinations than Dusseldorf. Actually a lot of Germans take the drive to Schiphol and fly from there.
@@flopunkt3665 That depends on the location. Perhaps the Niederrhein but
people from Bergisches Land and Cologne area would more likely drive to Frankfurt, even from Ruhrgebiet since there dozens of ICEs directly to Frankfurt airport
Reminds me of AirAsia previously proposing to serve Singapore via _Senai_ Airport of _Johor Bahru_ city in neighbouring Malaysia (where operating costs would be lower), & have a free shuttle bus to cross the border (which unlike in the EU/Schengen area has border controls though, & pretty long queues indeed (1h+ in peak hours I heard)). Singapore's government rejected the proposal, probably because it's own Changi Airport would miss out on being able to charge AirAsia landing fees, but was later allowed when the bus was changed into a paid service instead. Later on Lion Air also suggested flying to _Hang Nadim_ airport on neighbouring Indonesia's _Batam_ island & then connect to Singapore from there via a ferry
@@TheFreakyable interesting. Frankfurt Airport has great long distance train connections to cities reaching as far as Stuttgart, Cologne, Düsseldorf within less than two hours. So it serves an area way larger than just the greater Frankfurt area.
I'm surprised KLM uses busses and not trains to directly connect Schiphol to every corner of the Netherlands.
Berlin Airport isn't called "Brandenburg Airport". It's Berlin-Brandenburg Airport, because it's a joint venture by the two federal states, Berlin and Brandenburg (which completely surrounds the city state of Berlin). Physically, it's actually located in Brandenburg, not in Berlin - albeit just outside the state of Berlin. Like Dulles, which is in Virginia, just outside the District of Columbia.
So Berlin-Brandenburg isn't the name, but the location. The airport's name is actually "Willy-Brandt-Airport", named after Germany's fourth chancellor and Berlin's former mayor. People in Berlin and Germany just call it by it's IATA-code, though: BER.
As a leisure traveler, I want the competition to drive down price and make travel more accessible to more people and for the product quality to improve to attract consumers.
Some airlines may have an unfair advantage thanks to government ”sponsors” and can lower prices unfairly
As a German I want protection of national companies, a security of our transportation and infrastructure still being within our control and liability and an active engagement against market manipulation by unfair competition by despotic regimes gaining unethical advantages on the cost of human exploitation and slave work like china and the uae
@@hmvollbanane1259 Yeah so we will wait until the next crisis where the government is saving a useless company like Lufthansa or TUI with billions of euros so they can avoid exactly the taxes we saved them at first place
@@Habibi40404 my interest in them is not as a financial enterprise but as an integral part of our infrastructure. There are also tons of stuff I would like to be rectified when it comes to schools, buses and trains, however those changes are on a different page than national interests of maintaining at least a level of independence and sovereignty about it. I don't want to wake up to vital necessities suddenly being under control by other nations, especially ones that can pose a threat and threaten sanctions. Having domestic airlines guarantees that international comperitors can never gain a monopoly by shady business tactics in our transportation infrastructure and raise prices over theirs. Do you really want to see all German long distance flights having to stop in Dubai and thereby having all our international business meetings and so on outside the eu dependent on the uae's good will towards us and therefore able to exert power on our entire economy by blocking representatives traveling to destinations for deals they oppose?
As with anything in modern Germany, it boils down to bureaucracy.
Berlin is a rapidly growing Metropolis. Some of the major german cities such as Leipzig/Halle and Dresden are in close proximity to BER. A high-speed rail from these cities takes less than 2 hours to reach BER. The catchment area of BER is definitely not a problem. BER needs Emirates to get one stop connections to many destinations in Asia and Oceania. Qatar and Turkish airlines are not sufficient to give enough connections towards the East.
Absolutely it needs to be amended. Currently I am living and working in Berlin and I can tell there are many professional in Berlin who are looking for direct flight to Dubai via Emirates . As of now we need to go to Frankfurt and avail the services which is quite tiring. Berlin is s growing international cities and demand is huge esp with the opening of new Brandenburg Airport
I'm hopeful for Emirates to serve Berlin, it would be great for everyone. Emirates is a fantastic airline and I think being able to fly to this great and historic German city (and more places there) would unlock much business potential and make travelling there more convenient.
I think its likely flydubai
@@skylineXpert impossible, as all UAE airlines are limited on where to fly in Germany. Etihad also wouldn’t be allowed to fly to Berlin, they aren’t even allowed to fly to Hamburg like Emirates does. Etihad is limited to FRA, MUC and DUS
Does the US have such archaic rules limiting competition versus US flag carriers? (I know the US has a Byzantine law regarding passenger Port's of Call for ships, but I'm unsure about Air Traveler's.)
@@user-cc7vx7sw4z The flights between China and the US are really only useful for three airports in China: Beijing, Shanghai and Guangzhou. As such, the US-China agreement should be limited to these three Chinese cities.
@@Sacto1654 No, there is a new kid in town, Chengdu, and a future planned kid in town, Wuhan. China is only interested in Major tier 1 cities in the US anyway, and the US too. Opening too many routes can cause national security issues. Especially intelligence gathering by the US flying military airplanes masked as an airliner using a fake commercial call sign flying behind an airliner until the last minute, then diverge to gather areal intelligence. This puts everyone in danger, because China may fire at the real airliner as well as the fake one if it is impossible to figure out which one is real and which one is fake. This is especially true for United passengers.
Probably a reason why numerous low-cost carriers in Asia have overseas subsidiaries (AirAsia (AK) with it's parent company from Malaysia, but with subsidiaries in Indonesia (QZ), Japan & Thailand etc., Scoot (TR) with it's Thai subsidiary NokScoot, TigerAir (based in Singapore, but which has since been merged into Scoot under the SIA Group) with its subsidiaries in Taiwan/ROC & Australia having since been sold to China Airlines & VA respectively) (typically with the parent company/carrier having a 49.99% stake & a domestic investor taking the rest, so that the subsidiary is legally considered a domestic airline in whatever country it's based in) is to be able to get around the legal restrictions imposed on foreign airlines operating in various countries
Bilateral agreement typically means UAE needs to offer something in return - wonder what it is and if maybe the lack of it is the root cause of the slow negotiation?
Do you think any German airlines care about an additional UAE airport? They pretty much only need one lol. If they have the option to close down 3 more ports on both sides, they would.
you can make this same observation about US Flagged carriers...today only United has slots in Berlin, UA inherited the slots from PanAM when the carrier went into receivership and sold its assets to UA and AA.
In 2019 there used to be a delta service to JFK and an American flight to PHL. The lack of longhaul services to the old airports were due to TXL only having 2 gates that could fit something bigger than an 757.
Lufthansa is putting in hard work to keep longhaul flights away from Berlin as good as they can. More than 50% of passengers at FRA only connect through there and over 20% of them connect to and from Berlin. That's more than 6 million people a year.
So pointless to have to connect via Frankfurt. Thats a trip that should really be done via high speed train. I'm from Atlanta, the busiest airport in the world, and I can't get a direct flight to Berlin. Have to stop in CDG, FRA, JFK or AMS.
@@adamt195 The fastest train needs about 5h for the route, the flight takes just over 1h.
@@SuppenDfg it's 4 hours and very indirect. It could be about an hour and a half with a direct train.
@@adamt195 90min would be very hard to achieve. It would mean a straight line and a train going at max speed (~350km/h) without any stops in between and no other trains using the track. That's very unrealistic and also very uneconomic, mostly because there are flights between FRA and BER which don't need new tracks that would cost billions to build. Modernizing the existing tracks is the best you can hope for. That would reduce the time significantly, but it would still be much slower than flying.
@@SuppenDfg have you seen Chinese and Japanese high speed rail? Of course it doesn't make any stops in between, and of course it gets a fairly straight route. And yeah, no other trains use the track because it's a HSR exclusive track. 350kph is pretty average for modern high speed rail. The French TGV can do that. Even if it took 2 hours, that would still be good considering BER is far outside the city and the train would take you into the center
Emirates should replace either Hamburg or Düsseldorf with Berlin.
By the way, Berlin is not even one of Lufthansa’s main hubs.
Just because these cities aren't as popular it doesn't mean that they aren't also important
It‘s not even a focus city. We only have domestic flights from Frankfurt and Munich.
Düsseldorf is a very important city for business and also its airport is the 3rd busiest airport in Germany (the opening of BER might change this rank). Hamburg is the 2nd largest city in Germany and it is currently still underserved by long haul airlines. Emirates has a very big advantage by flying there, just like how Qatar is with Berlin right now. So dropping these cities and swap it with the other is almost impossible.
I am not extremely familiar with the topic but it seems like bringing the issue down to the lowest common denominator.
Something similar happened in Canada: Emirates wanted additional flights but the government flatly refused because Air Canada was not able to match.
It's not just Düseldorf, but the whole Rhein/Ruhr Metro area serving more than 10M people. Berlin metro area is about 4 million people, most likely with far lower yields.
Why should they give up two, very long served, profitable Destinations (in fact Hamburg was their most profitable German destinations pre COVID) to start an experiment serving Berlin?
Well, does Lufthansa service Dubai? If not, why not provide slots in exchange? What other Middle Eastern airlines service Berlin?
Qatar Airways serves Berlin from Doha.
They do but with a stop in Frankfurt. So basically no direct Lufthansa long haul flights from Berlin
As long they dont stop flying to Hamburg, i'm good with that
ja moin hamburg
@@Didyus moin Kameraden
@@hey4077 moin meister
They have no reason.
Berlin would make so much more sense than Hamburg 🤷🏻♀️
I love to see Emirates in stuttgart and Berlin sooner than later. Five stars Emirates.
They showed the Germans what excellent service is all about.
I'll assume this is a reuploaded video?
When you can use Lufthansa only for domestic travel from Berlin 😖
It's an absurd that such agreements exists. Emirates is already certified to fly to Europe and to Germany, therefore they should be able to fly to all international German Airports if they wanted.
you need to understand regulations better before sharing that deep knowledge you have. Certified to fly to Germany? what does that even mean? Agreements are just that agreements that define what you can and cannot do.
Good, middle eastern airlines with unlimited money should not be allowed to compete unfairly in western markets.
Then you’re going against the purpose of a free market which isn’t good.
@@GeminiJets37 it's not a free market when certain airlines get unlimited money from their oil-rich governments in order to be competitive.
@@davisbyer4791 The U.A.E giving government hand outs to privatized companies (in this case Emirates) absolutely has no affect on this what so ever. Airlines are suppose to be competitive with one another. The airline industry is called a “competitive market” for a reason.
@@GeminiJets37 it has everything to do with it! If one side is being subsidized by their government to compete with lower prices, it's no longer a fair competition.
@@davisbyer4791 not really, it actually is still fair. Emirates connects passengers to one airport from all around the world where Lufthansa is a German carrier that flies around Germany and to and from Germany to other nations. Emirates adding Berlin would not hurt a damn thing.
arabs; wanna fly to berlin
berlin: looks at new york "no thanks"
Qatar is Arab and they fly to Berlin lmfaoooooooo hahaha
So they should give up one of Frankfurt or Dusseldorf, as they essentially service the same regional market and take Berlin then. The rules are valid and should remain in place.
No they can’t, they’re also restricted to slots and can’t replace the capacity of Düsseldorf in Frankfurt. That just doesn’t work out. Also Düsseldorf serves Germany‘s densest populated area and parts of the Netherlands and was previously served with two A380s a day, just like Frankfurt was with 3 flights. They would only fly to Berlin once they got permission for a 5th airport
The people are ones being affected the most. If Emirates comes to Berlin it provides a direct flight to Dubai, which currently there isn’t any. At the same time Lufthansa has lobbying but wants its passengers to get to FRA or MUC to get to Dubai.
If Emirates says it’s not competing with Lufthansa, it can skip Frankfurt and change it to Berlin. It is a better spread of country that way. And from how many and which German destinations is Lufthansa allowed to fly to Dubai? It is often an exchange of destinations and frequency of flights.
German airlines can flight as much as they like to dubai as dubai follows openskies policy. Unlike Lufthansa, Emirates is open for competition.
I thought that was Hugh Dennis narrating for a moment there. O.o
A Dubai-Berlin route with Emirates makes sense, there is enough demand.
What makes no sense is to restrict the airline to only fly to four destinations in Germany which are all too important to be discontinued. And I'm sure it won't kill Lufthansa if Emirates would fly to Berlin, they already fly to LH's main bases FRA and MUC so it doesn't matter. I personally would like to see this route becoming reality
Sadly to say that new nonstop service for Emirates flight from DXB to BER is taking a VERY long time to materialize. So don't expect it would be launching soon in the near term future.
Berlin is well served by trains to Hamburg and vice versa. And for those who wants to make their way to Berlin from Dubai, they'll have to boarding EK flights from DXB to HAM. From Hamburg, they'll have to boarding a train to Berlin, which is about less than 2 hours. Same goes for Berliners and visitors in Berlin who wants to travel to Dubai, they'll have boarding a train to Hamburg, then boarding EK flights from HAM to DXB.
@@syafiqrizuan5588 You forgot to mention the taking s-bahn(?) train from Hamburg station to HAM :-(
Since there is a decent train connection between Berlin and Hamburg, I don‘t see why Emirates can’t relocate Hamburg to Berlin for instance. I understand Lufthansa‘s point.
Same goes the other way around. Both Hamburg and Berlin are very profitable markets and before Emirates gives up a destination that already worked well for them they will rather wait and negotiate to get rights for a 5th airport.
What I’m trying to say is that Hamburg is already served and works pretty well for them. They won’t just give up a destination they already know to move to an airport they don’t know the numbers of yet
@@spongebubatz I thought so too
It's not all that easy to get to the main ralway station (Hauptbahnhof) in Berlin from the airport
Take the U8, you can still smoke some heroin during the ride. ;-)
@@alielabdimarras7965 sus
AirBerlin went BANKRUPT waiting for BER to open. They had plans of a BER-Rio non-stop route, but the airport came too late and AirBerlin was gone. Now I still need at least one connection to go to Rio from Berlin and back.
Whaaaat? Air Berlin was perfectly fine with the other Berlin airports. Besides that most of their flights neither departed from nor landed in Berlin.
@@flopunkt3665 no they were not fine with Tegel. they reported that they actually lost money on every connecting passenger at Tegel. their entire plan was based on operating from the new airport
Because Munich Hamburg Frankfurt and Düsseldorf. Berlin is so far east. And there is only Berlín. The other cities are close to Netherlands Belgium Luxembourg and close to urban populated areas. In Berlin there is only city of Berlin and Poland and empty province. Overall the south of Germany is richer
No more flight necessary. More flights equals more pollution and so on. Are planes meant to land onto flooded land soon ?
I find it funny how "Brandenburg" is perceived as the name of the airport. In reality, it's the airport to both Berlin AND Brandenburg, which is the name for the surrounding region.
The airports actual name is "Willy Brandt" who is a former chancellor and mayor of Berlin.
Stuttgarts Airport also has a name and nobody cares about the names :)
Berlin had other long-haul connections with Hainan to Beijing, Miat Mongolian via Moscow to Ulan Baatar and United to New York. I believe they stoped during the pandemic. For LH a 3rd hub is not profitable and most major airlines have already a connection to FRA or MUC where passengers could transfer to LH or other airlines. BER is with the bankruptcy of Air Berlin just not a hub for any airline. Personally, i believe EVA would profit most of a connection to Berlin. They don't fly yet to Germany and their competitor China Airlines serves FRA only. With no connection to Japan/Korea/Taiwan from Berlin they would be faster to East Asia than other connections via FRA/MUC/DOH or SIN.
IIRC PRC airspace is closed to airlines based in ROC/Taiwan so I'm thinking how much of a detour EVA & China Airlines need to fly to Germany
I just realised, that Emirates don't fly to only a few capital cities in wester and northern Europe. Berlin and Helsinki.
In fairness, Berlin is a small regional city in Germany not a major capital city like Frankfurt am Main.
Did I missed something or since when does Berlin not have a population more than 4 times bigger than Frankfurt?
yes!!! competition keeps everyone on thier toes. and ultimately, the consumer/ the traveling public wins!!!!
an a380 in berlin would be magnificent
Every country in the world should treat Emirates just like the Canadian government treats them. Pick ONE city in the country and ‘deal with it’.
Outfits like EK simply dump access seats availability in all routes they fly (of course they can afford to…they don’t even buy their own fuel when they leave Dubai…a major savings for any airline…besides not paying any taxes) and can afford to fly with as low as 4% Load Factor in the economy across the Atlantic on regular scheduled flights. Which other airline can do that on a regular basis?
Emirates (Qatar/Eithad, etc.) ability to fly to any airport, and the daily/weekly frequency, should be curbed to ensure a level playing field.
I hope German government does not allow them to fly to BER!
EK well oiled lobbing has resulted in carrying more Indian traffic. Same trend in US. Enough is enough
this is the most random question that has ever to be answered
Pegasus flies to Dubai with a stop in Istanbul. Only about 8 hours. Not bad.
Turkish
Not just Emirates. many other national carrier airlines are interested to come to Berlin but the German politics and Lufthansa management are stopping them for their own benefit. plus the airport fee is one of the highest in the world.
Interesting. Qatar and Turkish both connect Berlin to the East, operating as a, duopoly on some routes. They do not however operate large capacity aircraft suggesting demand is adequately met. One should only support Emirates' entry if, through competition, this can improve value and convenience to the customer. I would not support them simply joining the present pricing regime or if all three carriers further reduce in-flight service standards to start acting like budget charters.
Yes it should be amemd, this will benefit both Emirates and German stakeholders
It wouldn’t really, Emirates being a state owned airline with many subsidies always meant a kind of unfair competition
Well there is a reason for the agreement. I think German is right to keep it too 4 locations. No more airports for German airlines to go in the UAE.
What silly reasoning...
@@nelsonricardo3729 how is it silly. What advantage does it give Germany to allow more flights from a foreign company? Germany isn't going to redo it's contracts for nothing...your thinking they would is silly logic. So what does Germany have to gain by letting them fly to another airport. Come on show me how my reasoning is silly
@@countbenjamin1442 It opens up Berlin for easy one stop connections through Dubai, something that Lufthansa can't offer. (e.g. Sydney - Dubai - Berlin) This is good for both Germans in and around Berlin, and visitors from Asia/Africa/Australia!
Why doesn't Lufthansa fly from Berlin/Munich to Dubai?
Maybe the agreement limits both sides
On 2011 Lufthansa decided to drop all their flights that don't touch FRA or MUC. The Berlin base (and others) were closed. While the shorthaul was taken over by Eurowings the Longhaul was focused in FRA and MUC. Berlin was thoughtfully neglected because direct longhaul flights from Germany biggest city would canibalise their hubs. LH flew BER-FRA every 40 minutes in 2019.
@@robinmorgenstern9927 Euronwing should fly Berlin to Dubai.
After airberlin closed easyjet took over all their continental flights. Eurowings only serves a handful of routes from Berlin. The biggest airlines by far are easyjet and ryanair
And eurowings is 100% owned by Lufthansa. So no they wouldn't
Can you highlight theThe same issue which is happening with India.
Bilaterals air service agreement with India and Middle East & South east countries
just get an contact to an european airline to fly that route and integrate that in your ticket system, problem solved
Please render this again.
Emirates should be granted access to this airport they are a magnificent service that will boost the German and UAE economy significantly.
Germany doesn't need the UAE
It has 2 sides:
1) Berlin does not really have any long haul flights, but that is because there is not really many business travelers going there... or at least that's how it has been. Rather politicians (on government flights) or just really big ones (on private jets), so it would be good to have something, but the current demand might still not be enough to cancel any of the other routes.
2) Lufthansa is very aggressive when it comes to defending their market positions. Might be only my conspiracy theory, but I always had the suspicion that somehow their hands were in making the BER airport so much delayed to not let AirBerlin become a major player... as they bet on that, and so they went bankrupt. And Lufthansa would do anything to keep only Frankfurt and Munich big for air travel (and Dusseldorf with Eurowings)
Emirates fly to Dublin and Glasgow that’s the closest to me that they fly to.. sadly not to belfast even thought there are quite a lot of flights to different continents
I want to fly to London then to Dubai so I can go on the a380
Belfast is a village though compared to Berlin
@@flopunkt3665 more like a large town.. Berlin has about 3.8 times more people than the metropolitan belfast
Can u talk about Syrian air and sham wings I need news about them and their dead history pls thx
Can you make one on why EK isn't operating their A380s to Jakarta's new terminal 3?
if there is demand, and the new terminal can handle it, then it will operate the 380, otherwise it wouldnt make sense
@@MostWantedRaed there's definitely demand (up to 3x daily flights pre-covid) and 2 or 3 A380-capable gates in the new terminal. But there must be a deeper story about lobbying and competition that hasn't allowed EK to deploy their A380s to Jakarta.
From my city Munich and Frankfurt a.M. are at least at equal distance, so , I don’t mind…
Thanks Lufthansa for not expanding yet blocking other airlines to fly to BER. Now I know why I have very few options with relatively higher ticket price to fly directly from BER 😡
I feel like if the route was so viable as they all make out then it would already have happened.
Nope, you totally forget about the regulations
i was wondering about this when i saw Qatar crew at my hotel while traveling in Berlin last month
Is LH operates flights from Berlin to Dubai?
No, they only have hubs in Frankfurt and Munich
@@spongebubatz so LH should fill the gap
@@PakaBubi they avoid Berlin and I don’t think they will fill the gap anytime soon, their Hubs are FRA and MUC, and that’s going to stay like that for a while
Why is Turkish Airlines able to fly at 10+ destinations in Germany ? When other airlines are not even permitted to enter more then 4 airports
That’s how the agreements are. Germany has a closer relationship with Turkey than with the UAE, that airlines from some countries get more rights when it comes to flying to a country shouldn’t be a surprise
Because we all Turkish people want you to feel our hospitality. :) Enjoy your flight with Turkish!
There are lots of Turks in Germany, I think it's the largest minority group there. Turkish Airlines is far more useful to many German cities than Emirates
yasssss slay berlin to dubai we would live for that henny
But why is there an agreement like that ? Why just with the UAE
Because you need international agreements in an international world, and there aren’t just agreements for the UAE
germany is one of few countries that Emirates flies to in which the country's capital is not a destination. at least as of now. I know Uganda is another example because they fly to Entebbe and not Kampala the capital. Not sure if Emirates flies to Bern in Switzerland but they do fly to Zurich and Geneva also I think. Morocco they fly to Casablanca but not Rabat. I'm sure there are other examples
Bern has a pretty small airport which isn’t even served by many regular flights, so your assumption that Emirates only serves Zürich and Geneva is right!
@@spongebubatz interesting. Probably depends on the distance between the cities but then does Bern Airport only serve domestic flights? For example between Bern and Zurich, Bern and Geneva, Bern and Lausanne, etc. I suppose it depends on how far the cities are from each other though
@@salmanahjum-mathee9055 the only regular passenger flight is from Lübeck via Stuttgart, it only operates a few times a week
@@spongebubatz oh okay
***Indeed, When it comes to beauty it it Dubai NOT Mumbai!***
Yes!
Very nice.
No they shouldn't. Too many locations makes for unfair to German economy interests. Give one of the other locations up.
Lufthansa can also serve Berlin to Far East as well if they wanted ...
How? Emirates flights would put Berlin one stop away from many new places not served by Lufthansa, which would be good for both people in Berlin and visitors.
Emirates can leave Düsseldorf to get Berlin. Franfurt distance is only 240 km .
Düsseldorf is a very profitable destination which they can’t just replace with Frankfurt (as good as I know they’re also restricted on slots). Düsseldorf serves Germany‘s densest populated area and as a proven destination isn’t going to be suspended in favor of Berlin
Anyways Lufthansa is flying from Frankfurt and Munich to dubai so people from Berlin need to go to Frankfurt or Munich first if they want to go to dubai so still can chose Emirates from there
Four destinations in Germany for Emitates is more than sufficient.
Nope that's not how it works. My small Indian state of Kerala (pop 34 million) itself has 4 airports served by Emirates. Germany (pop 84 million) is wayy bigger and has an enormous influence in Europe and so a new DXB-BER route should have been made years back.
@@roshanantony64 Nope thats not how it works either, what ever the number of domestic airports a county has , is completely irreverent to what agreements countries make for allowing foreign airline access. Its usually based on a reciprocal agreement or sometime in exchange.
I wouldn’t be angry if Lufthansa have the good business class as Emirates have !! From Berliner
I don't fly LH anymore, due to stuff like that. the long haul flights from berlin are alltogether a joke.
Lufthansa isn't the be-all, end-all. Time for them to have some serious competition. Then maybe Lufthansa would concentrate on better customer service........
Lufthansa provides jobs for Germans, something the UAE carriers don’t do
Can't Emirates use Fly Dubai in this route??
No they have the same regulation as Emirates, except that they are not allowed to Hamburg.
We'll see more airlines serve Berlin because after all, it is now Germany's capital city and there is potential for huge economic growth there, especially in the long-needed renovation of the former East Berlin.
It has been Germany’s capital since 30 years now, but what could make demand rise is the added capacity BER brought
It's rather large parts of West-Berlin which are now in dire need of renovation.
@@flierfy True. Most of the "renovations" in West Berlin happened during the 1950's and 1960's.
By the way, I wonder could Flydubai fly from DXB to BER instead? After all, the 737 MAX 9 has the range to fly this route almost year-round?
@@Sacto1654 no, the regulations go for all UAE carriers and Emirates already got lucky by getting the permission to serve Hamburg as a forth airport. That’s also the reason that you see Etihad only the FRA, MUC and DUS
Edit: FlyDubai is a partner of Emirates, also I think all airlines have to split up the slots, so there’s no space for FlyDubai
I'm not connecting via Dubai, direct flight or nothing.
Why doesn’t Turkish airlines have such restrictions from the German government?
Because they have a better political relationship than the UAE. Also Turkish are the largest minority in Germany which is why there are many flights which are sometimes also operated by bigger aircraft. It shouldn’t be a surprise that for different countries there are different regulations
@@spongebubatz hmm seems pretty reasonable
from how many airports does Lufthanse fly to Dubai ?
frankfurt for sure and possibly munich, but not even sure about the second one. these are the two LH hubs and LH only operates long haul from there
Only from FRA
Absolutely not. But other airlines should start flights to Berlin asap!
Because Sir Tim Clark was in Warsaw in 1939.
😂😂
That’s why Emirates flies to Warsaw now?
@@paulsz6194 Yes
I snorted heavily reading this comment😂😂👍🏻
Not sure why they would consider DUS or HAM to be more valuable than Berlin.
DUS serves the Rhine-Ruhr region of the most populous German state and also the southern Netherlands. It is highly profitable and definitely Emirates won't leave it. Similarly, HAM is one of the most profitable routes to Emirates. They can't experiment on BER by relocating from HAM, when HAM is already profitable. DUS and HAM are served by only Emirates from the middle East, whereas BER is served by Qatar Airways from the middle East.
Qatar Airways can actually increase the frequency to BER to provide more connections. Qatar is as good as Emirates.
@@hjr0021 Interesting. I never knew DUS was the main airport in the Rhine-Ruhr. I've always used CGN in that part of the world.
@@brettparnell8254 Well. DUS is the main international airport in the region and it has an excellent modern Infrastructure. It used to handle 2 daily Emirates A380 aircrafts pre-pandemic. CGN is way too old and it's infrastructure is not so impressive (from my personal experience). CGN is good for Low-cost carriers. :-)
They will do it soon.
How do you know?
@@spongebubatz Well, i think so. There is a group of businessmen in Berlin, that invest their time to advertise for long haul flights from Berlin. I think the political pressure will grow.
Since Lufthansa isn't even interested in BER and longhaul, the regulations are nonsense. Berlin has hardly any long-haul connections.
The limitation is also in place to prevent unfair competition, Emirates is heavily funded by the government
@@spongebubatz I agree, but if Lufthansa doesn't want to serve BER I really don't understand it. Lufthansa also received 9 MRD € corona sub this year "credit". I think Lufthansa is giving here an clear advantage.
@@SnurX Emirates isn’t just funded during difficult times but the whole time, which makes competition unfair. Lufthansa has to pay back what it has received, Emirates doesn’t. While I also think that regulations of the market aren’t the best solution in this case I’d say it acceptable that such regulations are in place.
By the way, normally the UAE carriers are allowed to only serve 3 airports, Emirates already got an advantage by being allowed to serve Hamburg as a 4th airport!
And the fact that Lufthansa doesn’t serve Berlin has nothing to do with the regulations
That's good , to protected local airlines from bigger airlines. It happened in Indonesia , they allow all airline to Indonesia , and now , Garuda Indonesia and other Indonesian carrier almost bancrupt
They can give up Munich, because Markt Schwaben which is part of the UAE is closer to Munich then Erdinger Moos. Emirates approaches Markt Schwaben since 2017 which is a domestic flight.
I'd like to know why Turkish Airlines is allowed to fly to 10 German cities, and not only from Istanbul but also from multiple cities in Turkey and each having many flights a day?
It’s obviously all about international relations. Germany has a better relation with Turkey, also Turkish are biggest minority in Germany.
Airlines from the UAE are also banned because of unfair competition to airlines that simply couldn’t compete given their business model. Emirates is government owned, one of the reasons they can offer the service they do
Emirates should only be allowed up to TWO airports access in every country, since the UAE is so small that other airlines can only fly to Dubai and Abu Dhabi. Emirates is being favoured, on top of it being government funded.
ig we'll have to do with only two long hauls (icelandair and qatar) :(
Icelandair isn’t really a long haul airline? Also what about United, Delta, American and Scoot, technically MIAT as well?
@@spongebubatz well they fly their 757s to berlin which is the second biggest aircraft we see here. all the american airlines havent been flying here yet either, not since Tegel shut down.
@@flightspottertv5627 that they haven’t served BER yet isn’t really a surprise, but do they have plans to continue service once the situation eases?
@@spongebubatz i'm not quite sure but I am positive that we'll see some transatlantic services in due time
Having flights to Frankfurt, Munich, Hamburg and BERLIN makes a lot more sense than to Düsseldorf.
No, Düsseldorf is a very important airport not just for Düsseldorf, but also for Cologne, the Ruhr area and parts of Belgium and the Netherlands. Emirates would already fly to Berlin if wanted to leave Düsseldorf, but Düsseldorf is profitable
Just because Düsseldorf is the German city you’ve probably heard least about does not mean it’s unimportant
@@spongebubatz "Heard" lol I like how you assume I've never been to it. It's a really underwhelming city to visit and I can't seem to find anything to justify a preference for Düsseldorf over any other major city. It's not even one of the largest cities in Germany. Hannover would make much more sense, to be honest. And let's be real: the only reason why Düsseldorf is served is because a lot of people go to Köln (so it's not even Düsseldorf's merit).
@ still it was served by two daily A380s. Why? Because it serves Germany‘s densest populated area and some parts of the Netherlands as well. Just because it isn’t appealing as a city does not mean that it doesn’t have the right to be served. In the end it all comes down to numbers. If Düsseldorf is profitable, why should it be changed?
With its hubs in Frankfurt and Munich, Lufthansa is actually the airline of Southern Germany. They shouldn't have a say in Berlin.
Maybe they shouldn't be allowed at all. I've heard stories from friends in the business about how they treat their flight attendants. Makes the stories about Panam in the 60s seem tame by comparison in terms of repression, possession and control of women on and off the clock.
I think it should be amended