Summoner my beloved combination of glass cannon panic simulator during bosses with whips and afk simulator for chilling when building, fishing, mining...
As a summoner main, hard agree. Even when i am not playing summoner, i still end up playing summoner thanks to how easy it is to get spider armor, even it I only use it for grinding.
I got forced into summoner cause I got dragged into a multiplayer world where everyone (three others) had already picked the other classes and didn't want overlap This was my first Terraria experience so I latched on to summoner and never looked back My SO tries to ban me from being summoner but the second I find anything summoner related it is ON
@@CrowleyFledgelmao I had the same experience 😂. When I first started terraria I was playing with a friend and he picked the class I wanted to play, mage. So then I picked summoner cus I thought summoning pets to fight for me was interesting. Since then, I haven't been able to play any other class. The other classes just don't hit the same as summoner 😂
me watching this pretending I’m in the video 👁️👅👁️ Non creative ideas do well but they usually have very creative good editing like siphos musicals 🔥🔥🔥
I think the thing that makes summoner so hard is that it's still really underdeveloped. I'm not sure if it's the case anymore, but I remember counting the number of weapons to prove a point and there were literally more pre boss swords then there were minion staffs in the entire game, and a pretty significant chunk of the summoner weapon pool requires either significant RNG or massive amounts of farming. Not to mention seven of the eight hard mode ore sets still don't have a summoner option, they added the hollowed hood in 1.4.0.1 and just gave up
Main flaw of Melee is that every enemy deals damage on contact, most of them dont even have attack animation. So, you can't run through them and slice. True melee players are forced to be close with only one way to avoid damage - run away. Once I played Dead Cells and it was a refreshing experience when I could run directly into enemies and even roll behind them without taking a hit
I don't understand why they were mentioning new players for the summoner argument. Most new players aren't going to do a pure single class play through, they are explore the game and use what seems fun. Summoner is a no brainer for new players as who wouldn't want free damage? Just set it and forget it, then swap back to your nights edge, vortex beater, or whatever else. Thats certainly how I played my first run. Even now, after close to 2000 hours combined in modded and vanilla, I'm finding more enjoyment than I have in a while using mixed class armors. The red riding set being one of my favorite.
For the content being "uncreative" question, I feel that three thing where missed: 1: Most "creative" ideas inherently lack accessibility, meaning they are harder to produce or understand. I like to think of it like this, say a TH-camr wants to make a Terraria video, but hasn't played much, and hasn't interacted with the community much. What videos could they realistically make in a acceptable time frame? Basically just normal playthrough videos, this makes those videos extremely common. Same goes for watchers, if they are new to terraria the only videos they will understand are the more basic ones. 2: Creativity is generally defined by familiarity, meaning if something is unfamiliar in some sense, it is "creative". This means when you see something often, you generally consider it less creative. This ties into the previous point, accessible things are more common, and because they are more common they are more familiar, which makes then "uncreative". The other thing is that familiarity is different for each person, meaning something creative to me, might be perfectly normal to you. 3: TH-cam is a source of income for a lot for people , so doing what works to get views is rewarded with real world wealth. These things together is what leads to many popular concepts being "Uncreative". Theses are the concepts that are accessible, making them more common and giving them a wider viewer base. Or have been proven to work, giving more incentive to reproduce them. Either of which makes them appear less creative.
I mean, I'm pretty sure hitting with the blade of the melee weapon is more damage than not. If whip stacking is part of "the true summoner experience" then actually hitting with the sword is part of the melee experience.
Yeah but its not a crazy amount. Its not worth is what i mean. Whip stacking is almost necessary for a summoner to compete with the dps of other classes.
The content one is kind of a loaded question, because the most popular content in general on ALL platforms is the least creative stuff. Pop music is #1 for a reason
The whole "Summoner is a glass cannon" thing is actually a myth. The difference in survivability between Summoner armor and Ranger armor is almost marginal. Not only does Defense only really make a huge impact to your survivability when you stack Warding with Melee armor, but Defense is only one of many aspects to survivability. You have max health, health regen, dodges, i-frames, health potions and more. To continue about the "glass cannon" thing, excluding Hybrid builds, Summoner actually has close to if not the LOWEST DPS ceiling out of all the "classes" depending on the circumstances. This is most apparent with Plantera where triple whip stacking Blade Staff gets 35-36 seconds killtimes at the absolute fastest on Master mode, meanwhile weapons like True Excalibur and Flamethrower among others can get sub-30s killtimes. Even Venom Staff with manual mana potion timing can match Summoner there. 19:54 It's quite literally both at the same time oftentimes, that's the sad part. 26:07 And yet a large majority of popular Terraria videos today are uncreative and same-y.
Hard agree on the DPS issue but imo the difference in survivability is actually very noticable since summoners are much more reliant on armor and accessories to actually deal decent damage than other classes so they can't get as many of the other aspects of tankiness like DR or regen either.
I liked the melee rework regarding swords such as True Excalibur and True Night's Edge; Terrablade still has a projectile but less range. Those were probably the most prevalent "melee-range weapons" discussed before their rework. I think the Terrablade slash should really vanish drastically earlier or be a stationary slash that lingers for, idk, a millisecond. I'm not fond of the idea that giving melee less range directly equates to less fun but i have no point in that statement. I think melee needs some kind of incentive to get up close; either some movement "paired with weapon" or "singular high damage" move that's limited by range. For both, i think it would be neat if they related to some kind of right click function for melee weapons. (I'm not thinking of a right-click dash-charge move; just vague ideas).
I think melee just needs to have more true melee options, more swords like excalibur and horseman’s blade that are true melee but still kick ass, and then mabye some sort of melee accessory that boosts true melee dmg (not just true melee swords but the blade part of ranged swords like the terra blade) to reawrd being up close and personal
@@FloopytheStinker I wasn’t talking about the accessory part I was talking about the true melee weapons already in game and true melee in the normal game is not that hard you should try
Like last time, these were all written based solely on the chapter titles, so I may miss questions, or touch on points already in the video. - I'm pretty neutral on the first question. I don't think it needs to be completely reworked because it's pretty iconic (Hero's Sword comes to mind) BUT I feel there should be an extra-close range option for each tier. Does more damage, faster, but way closer without projectiles... Like the usual Terrablade, but also a faster, deadlier Terra-Katana, or something. So I could easily walk either way, therefore, neutral. - I wouldn't say Summoner is the most difficult class to USE in Terraria. But I would say it's the most difficult to LEARN HOW to use. Against standard everyday mooks, it's practically easy mode, and lets you just focus on building or whatever. But up against bosses, it's a whole other skill-set. You actually have to learn attacks, and get much better at dodging, and even employ some tactics from time to time. But once you've got that covered, it actively improves your skills in any of the other classes. Because now you know how to dodge and plan. ;) - Most popular Terraria content seems to be the least original? Hmm... I'd have to think on that one longer for a more conclusive answer. But off the cuff... Kinda? But only because the most popular content is usually "Watch the gamer suffer in the most stressful situations possible." And there's only so many challenges you can do with Terraria. Unmodded, that's going to be HardCore, Master/Legendary, getfixedboi. Modded, that's gonna be Calamity and it's various crazy challenges. I wish there were more building and chilling content out there, instead of always watching pain on screen. I mean, one of my favorite series was just the science of Terraria in various Mythbuster-esque experiments. But there's an epidemic of elitism in the Terraria community. If you can't beat it on the hardest tight-rope modes, you "aren't a real gamer", or even a "true Terraria fan". I'm not bad at the game, but I just want to have FUN playing it. Does anyone remember just playing games for fun? Because I'm starting not to remember that; and that makes me sad. - (final update) combined with... - (Terraria 2) - NEVER the LAST! - Okay, not that extreme. I'm pretty sure it's not going to be the last update, because they almost always do some balance tweaks, and exploit-patches. They might even do another feature patch, like they did with Old One's Army. But the engine is starting to reach it's limits, even in the current version, it's a little less stable than it has been. I'm sure it'll only get more apparent in that update. It's getting time for a full slate wipe. I'm thinking, we're all so excited about Terraria, and want it to go on forever. BUT... It would be cool to see what they can do with a whole sequel! We could get to be just as excited about stuff happening, but in another game. I'm not going to say I'd _rather_ they work on 2, but it certainly won't bother me when they do. Not EVERYthing has to be an [EITHER], [OR] situation. That only leads to stronger divisions in fanbases. To quote a popular commercial in recent memory, "Porque nos Dos." - Why not Both. Just because it's not YOUR point of view, doesn't mean it isn't actively a VALID point of view. (EDIT AFTER THE VIDEO) - What would be best for a Terraria 2, would actually be more of an Expansion Pack, than a Sequel. Like, make a new engine, and import all you could from the old engine into the new one, then you could expand on that. Like when Roller Coaster Tycoon released "Splash!" and "Wild!" completely new main mechanics and features. First added water flow mechanics, pool management features, Waterpark-Complex structures. The second added a whole lot of Zoo-like features, right down to animal enrichment, hygiene and, habitat landscaping. BUT you could then do all the new stuff in any of the prior scenarios. It was an updated engine, but it was still very much RCT3.
The problem with reworking melee to be up close is that being close to enemies sucks ass and the game isn’t designed around it No, I don’t want damage drop-off on my projectiles when I’m fighting daytime empress thank you
The summon discussion misses one important factor. Summoner progression is a pain. The first 3 minions you can have are the slime, Abigail and the Flinch. Those 3 have to physically reach the enemy to attack, which depending on what you're fighting, might spend 80% of the time moving around trying to reach the mob, not to mention that they do so little damage early on, that the fights are actually longer, which means you have more time to make mistakes and die on 1-2 hits. If you defeat Queen bee, you get the hornet staff, which is your first ranged summon, as it shoots projectiles. It's the first actually viable option, and you're already over 50% done with pre hardmode by that point. So far, you only have 2 whips available to you, the third pre hardmode whip being post Skeletron (the first whip is so weak and short ranged, isn't even worth using). If you cheese the blood moon event, you can get the vampire frog staff, which while being a contact damage summon, it actually does a fair amount of damage. That's when summoner actually stops being a pain 80% of the time and starts being a viable class. With this, you can defeat Skeletron and get the last while before hardmode. By this point there's only one other summon available before WoF, which is the Imp summon. While the best pre hardmode, as it shoots piercing projectiles, you can't fight with them near water, which might now be the worst thing ever, its certainly worth mentioning. So you have to keep switching summons to fit the current fight best, and hopefully you defeat WoF. Only after you get the Spider staff, things actually start kicking off. With a few exceptions, most summons can fight both on ground and in the air, and you just have to keep your distance. I would say summoner actually becomes the glass cannon it's known for right before post-mech. Sincerely, a summoner main
as another summoner main, i could also say that you are the most vulnerable to Wall of Flesh. i completed the game several times, and it's still my biggest fear
@@lomtick6654 yeah. I'm currently doing a Master For the Worthy run, and I'm currently trying to improve my building (because everything I build sucks) because the idea of fighting WoF is such a dread
@@net6406 yeah, I'm so excited for 1.4.5, only reason I am not complaining about how long it's taking, is that I trust Relogic to make it a great update. I like how they are making evil ore and meteorite whips, because evil ore feels solely melee and meteorite felt mage exclusive. I like how those resources are becoming more cohesive to the game overall
I think the class difficulty questions really come down to where you are in game progression. Different classes have different points in the game where they have better options than the other classes. Summoner struggles with WoF a lot more than melee and ranged and has a much rougher early hard mode, but then its power level spikes exponentially around post-Plantera. Ranger and mage have to aim a lot more than the other classes, but as soon as they get homing weapons/chlorophyte bullets that becomes irrelevant I do think summoner is the most difficult class to just *beat the game* with, coming from someone who has played every class. However, it's still worth noting that it has a lot of utility that the other classes don't (idle defense while fishing, attacking through walls, sentries)
Melee is by far the worst class throughout all of progression, it is entirely unviable after the first 20 minutes until blade of grass, which falls off very quickly making skeleton brutal, and your only valid option against the wall of flesh is the knights edge, which yall are saying should have as much range as it does 😭 (flamarang is the only thing that makes late pre hard mode melee bearable, but im talking about mostly swords) Hard mode you have to go for drippler crippler or bananarang because all other weapons suck, and until post planters you are limited to like 2 weapons. Melee would be entirely unviable against bosses if it didn’t have the range it did because the way bosses are designed in terraria. Yes Terra blade is insanely broken, but at any other stage of progression including after post plantera, every other class sweeps. Also someone said whips have smallrange which is what makes summoner hard but then how does knights edge have a lot of range 😭. I love melee truly, but terraria is entirely built around staying far from bosses and melee only really does that post mech boss and every other class does it better. Defense for other classes is really not that bad if you reforge for warding, but yes melee is naturally one of the best classes for basic enemies because they take knockback and melee has near infinite pierce. Also i primarily play in master and legendary mode, melee is broken in the two easy difficulties where tanking is viable
i feel like id agree that most popular content being uncreative is true is because there are two types of "most popular content" informative videos, which is inherently not very creative in topic because it's just repackaging statistics/news/strategy no-hit fights/challenge runs, which are kinda just what they say on the tin
What I personally want for melee is to have a very obvious incentive in going true melee or a disadvantage for choosing projectiles or boomerangs or the like. I know theres some already in game but further lowering projectile dmg would be good or flasks like ichor unless the weapon itself touches the enemy. Lastly, the spears need more love.
I think Terraria 2, but done in some way where it can be backwards compatible with characters and worlds, would be a good step forward. Terraria doesn't need more content after 1.4.5. it needs an engine update. It needs something to freshen up world gen and navigation. I know we're getting even more secret seeds, but I don't think that's enough. Minecraft's dimensions get brought up a lot in this discussion and I don't know if we need that, but it'd be cool to have interiors, doors/portals that lead to new worldspaces within the same world file. Barring that, let's take the fight to the Moonlord. Let's go to the moon. Or the Pillar planets. Something different from the standard Forest, Desert, Tundra, Caves, Ocean, Dungeon, Hell.
I would like to fight cthulu in his prime before he was weakened and sent to the moon. I think they should do what you said and just bring everything over from terraria into a better engine and add more bosses and that sweet sweet game progression.
To put the summoner debate into more clear words summoner has the lowest skill floor and highest skill ceiling. So based on the question of the most difficult do you consider a classes floor or ceiling when accounting for difficulty, or perhaps somewhere in the middle.
34:56 "Adding stuff to Terraria wouldn't be..." the word you might've been looking for was sacrilege. It keeps the identity of Terraria, and wouldn't harm it.
I beat moonlord first try as summoner and my first vanilla boss + expert!! I only used play lot of quality of life mod. One day I decided to true expert mode with no slacking as complete beginner I even never did eol, frost moon, pumpkin moon. And I went straight to summoner (I DID melee to get summoner loot). I died a lot but I also learn quickly. Summoner is so fun play that feel really bored to play any other class. Also that I did in 20fps 7 year old laptop. Oh man that whip stacking dps was amazing.
i remember seeing somebody joke that "terraria's final update" was on the opposite side of a spectrum with "disney's first gay character" there's going to be 100 or so of both of these
I think with the first question it would be cool if there was a separate True Melee class that shows up in hardmode. I don't know how it would work, but that would be really interesting
i think melee should just be called something else like fighter or knight... or maybe could have less defense when using longer ranged swords (nights edge, terablade)
I posit a suggestion for a potentially better third option than sequel vs update; how about a remaster (or remastery sequel) that brings the current game fully to a new, fleshed out, better system, porting all the previous features and content to a cutting edge and Many times larger/more powerful engine and framework? Possibly even bumping the pixel values up by one stage to keep the feel of the art, but make everything feel just a little more… intricate? Maybe thats not the right word… but… something… maybe not though, id have to see some test images to know if thats a good idea. But making everything able to have many times more content, much larger and more complex worlds, and *possibly other dimensions you could travel to (i mean, we already have logical portals from almost every event, boss, crossover, biome, and even a few odd ones like coin portals…) letting there be several times as many “worlds” to explore per world… or even just adding more layers to a world to allow new mechanics too… I will say i would be sad to see the base Terraria get left behind, so maybe the engine change would need to be a Massive update (like the 2.0 update)
I've always treated terraria equipment as something meant for making a specific task easier. Warrior sets are all around pretty good. I can understand why melee is stanned so much. You have high damage. High defense. Some of your melee options come with extended range. And you can fight like a ranger with none of the ammo loss or defense penalties. Ranger is pretty understandable. Not the greatest and bestest, but doable. I can agree though, it is made a bit more redundant with ranged melees. Mage is . . . Oof. Shit defense. But the damage CAN be good. But you're probably not gonna be wearing any dodging gear as you're gonna try to spellmaxx. So the best option here is to get all tech-wizard on the bosses using architectural exploits like hoik loops. Summoner. If you're fighting bosses, refer back to hoiking. Besides that, the summoner class is good for AFK farming. I treat summoner sets more like angler or miner equipment. It's there to make a tedious job less tedious. Which does make sense. You have the primary warrior, ranger, and mage classes. Then you have the miner/builder, fisherman, and . . . the . . . the bug guy.
the real balance would be getting rid of mana, and getting rid of ammo, to make them on par with melee. the only thing that makes melee different, from magic and guns, is it does not consume anything.
In regards to melee essentially being ranged, I don't inherently disagree but it only really applies to a few weapons. Prehardmode its like the star fury and enchanted sword, which I personally never use. Then in hard mode there's like... 3 I can think of? Terra blade, flying dragon, and influx waver? Most other melee weapons generally do a good job at being melee. Sure the beam sword exists, but who in the world is fighting mech bosses with it? Dao of pow for destroyer or bananarang for twins is way better. I definitely agree that post mech melee is the best class to use, but I think that's because there's like 3 swords that are just so much better than any other option that is true melee or otherwise. If they got a bit of a rework then I think melee would be fine.
Just my two cents on the last prompt, but I feel like Terraria 2 would be kinda hard to make without it basically being the exact same game at this point. Like what can they add that would warrant a completely new game instead of a new update? And I stand by it even more after the addition of features like the Aether biome, which very well could’ve been something to add in a sequel but it was added to the original game instead. Like what could feel new and unique enough that they need a sequel without it being so different from the original game that it feels like a completely new IP Re-logic created.
I did it on the last video (which I watched just before watching this one) but I want to give my opinions on these questions before hearing their responses and maybe changing my opinion after and adding a few extra words #1 - I'd say disagree. I guess personally, I don't think of melee weapons as the projectiles a handful of them fire, but I think the biggest problem is how unrewarding using the true melee hits really are. I'd love to see melee weapons to be reworked to feel more like true melee weapons instead another sword with a projectile. I'd also personally love to see more melee weapons even with projectiles to feel more rewarding for hitting with the true melee attack vs the projectile. I feel like the "ranged" melee option of being boomerangs would actually be nice to be more prominent as the better long range melee weapon. Maybe this kinda might be agreeing in the long run, but I definitely feel it's not a problem, but more that, if anything else is added, melee should focus more on melee feeling like melee. #2 - I'd Strongly disagree. It may not be someone's playstyle, and it may not be nigh invincible like melee, but Summoner in itself, can be fairly strong. It's a different playstyle even after adding whips, where accuracy isn't necessary without specific weapons/ammunition like with range or mage. And against non-bosses, you're probably having an easier time for the most part, since the hard part you might run into is dps might be a bit lower against larger hp bars. I don't think Summoner is the hardest class to play, not for being summoner in itself, but someone might struggle with it, because it does feel at least a bit different from the other classes. I'd say, outside of bosses it helps because things are dealt with without you having to do anything, and even during bosses, you can focus more on dodging and still be doing damage. I also took this into the account of playing casually, since playing at it's best capacity would be be more of a question of mastering it, not just playing it. Mage would personally be the most difficult, because it has mana management to keep up the dps, as well as similar armor to summoner. Mage also has the benefit of longer range, with the drawback of having to actually aim well with most weapons to get good dps compared to summoner. #3 - I'd say slighty disagree. I can't say I have much of an opinion on this at all, since I rarely pay attention to what's the most popular challenges and all that, but I guess maybe I've just been privileged to find stuff I enjoy watching in general. Not much to really say on this topic. I guess, to add to it, just cuz a video has a pretty simple premise, doesn't mean it necessarily is "lacking creativity" as it'd be in how they present this challenge, however simple it is. #4 - Disagree. Simple enough, they've said they're on the final update before, but they just keep going. Even if it is the final update, I feel like mods will take the lead and try to make many more interesting add-ons you can create to make the game fun. They could very much keep the moonlord as the "end of the game" similar to how the ender dragon in minecraft is still considered the "end of the game" for speedruns and such. They could add more past the moonlord, without infringing too much on what is already there. I think the biggest things I'd like to see is more customization especially in world gen personally, which could also not change a "default" play through #5 - Neutral. I think there are pros and cons to each side, where creating a sequel allows you to deviate more from what is currently available, and maybe make bigger changes that would not be forced on all of those people who love terraria, while also allowing them to get a larger burst of income for people wanting to play said sequel. But on the flip side, having more things available to the game people already have could cause more people to want to play the game, as well as just expand what each playthrough is capable of. I think the biggest thing a sequel would have to do, is have some big changes that would necessitate a sequel instead of just being, terraria but different. They also wouldn't necessarily need to have it be similar to terraria at all really, if they just wanted to make a different game in general. Nothing is also stopping them from doing both, really, maybe work on smaller updates for terraria, and work on a new game as well. Maybe if ideas are dry on one end, work a bit on the other for a bit. My comment is definitely more of "rambling my thoughts" than anything statistically backed by fact.
I think the big thing is that for a lot of the melee weapons with ranged functionality, you lose a lot of damage by solely relying on the ranged functionality. Nobody using the beam sword's beam is happy with that damage, and even the terra blade is a 'best option' to run away and swing at a boss or enemies, but that damage is not stellar. I think a good compromise here for most of these weapons would be to increase the sword's base damage slightly and reduce the projectile damage, still keeping the mystique of sword energy/intent that avoids ridiculously sized swords while encouraging players to get in closer.
One thing I'll say about the true-melee argument is as much as I would love melee to be more true melee, I also see the game does NOT provide the tools to let that happen. When the game offers such a mix of vertical and horizontal movement options, but none of them are precisely sharp or flow well enough to let someone who is true melee stay within their optimal damage range while staying out of harm. The on-contact damage nature of the game does NOT help any prospects for true melee at all, and it's a shame cause I could well envision a version of terraria that minimises the effect of contact damage but also makes enemies dangerous up close and allow for true melee to thrive much better. Also it doesn't help that a good number of bosses move super fast and try and maintain a fixed position away from the player, such as Retinazer and most of Empress of Light's attack phases... Hell maybe if there was a grappling hook that let you hook onto enemies and bosses so you could be constantly closing the gap between yourselves and them that'd be cool
I don't think melee needs a _massive_ overhaul, but when you have stuff like the Spear of the Corruptor, which is a long ranged projectile that bursts into smaller homing projectiles that do more damage, with less effort, than most ranged weapons and spells _while being free to use..._ you've gotta admit it's a little silly. Maybe rework that one just a little.
8:50 I have recently started playing summoner, whip stacking does NOT take skill. It's one of my favourite techs of the class, it's fun as hell, I used obsidian armour all the way up to Plantera, I think it's the perfect blend of effort, risk, reward and honestly speaking, fun in the game. It does NOT take skill tho, it is holding left mouse button and spamming the keyboard keys to buffer the whip change. Optimal whip stacking, as in perfectly managing every whip swing and making sure you have as high uptime on your best whip as possible, I could 100% see that taking major skill, but anyone with 2 hands with no muscular or joint issues can whip stack at least 4 whips no problem. Tho this is on PC, I have no idea if it changes when accounting for mobile/console, maybe there it's different...
Summoners have much less weapons thrown at them or put in the path of progress, casually. It's easy to use the summons but the way you have to look for them, often using the wiki to find the secrets ways you have to take to just be able to attack with summons. If you're lucky, you have to travel almost across the world to find a Finch staff or get super lucky with slime staff. Then what? Spider staff in Hardmode, if I'm not mistaken. Flinxes isn't something you go to farm when your damage output is slime. So you're basically using slime or finches against Wall of Flesh, realistically. You rock that until you get a lucky drop from Plantera. Barring special events, you might happen upon Marsian Invasion and then it's the zappy ufo against cultist and then stardust dragon against Moonlord. With wiki knowledge or 400 hours of looking around, you might find the drop from Queen Slime to help you or fishing in Blood Moon when you're being assaulted from all angles. Pumpkin Moon isn't casual knowledge, Duke Fishron isn't something you just stumble upon. Casual progression is slime/finch, spider, pygmy, ufo, stardust dragon. Sure, I haven't played in several years and might have forgotten something. Meanwhile, you have many other weapons dropped in your lap or craftable with new materials.
Also summoner doesn't need too much defense because you easily can focus on dodging and avoiding enemy attacks, something terraria players really hate with how much they overhype empress of light
16:43 Crabbar and MappyGaming are two really creative content creators that do extremely well. Then you've got Chippy with his news and round-up videos, which I don't see many content creators do that kind of content. There's also challenge TH-camrs that are really fun to watch, like Sorbet Cafe who does some fun videos as well, like beating Terraria following the (now old) Wiki guide on how to beat the game, or beating Terraria with a dance pad. Even in the "less creative" spaces, there's good content to be had just through the TH-camr's personality. Then there's the madlad Thorobin with his "1 Year, 1 World" videos which is really unique in the "I spent X time in game" which is really interesting to see how you can get the most out of each progression point in the game.
Damn these guys are brain-dead. "Harder for new players" "If you are good at the game summoner is good" That is literally the definition of hard, if you need to be good at the game for summoner to be good that is an argument against summoner. "It is hard if you cant dodge attacks" Bro melee doesn't even need to dodge attacks, and ranger and mage don't need to be close enemies to reach max effectivness. Highest theoretical DPS does not make it easier.
i have a strong opinion about the zenith and how it is the best weapon in the game and i dont know if im alone in this it is by far the strongest weapon with the best dps for single and multiple targets only being beaten by really specific setups if this series continue could you ask if the zenith is a good addition to the game?
Why people hate the zenith like it is just a trophy and a cool weapon like endgame has nothing to do with other classes is just end every endgame set and weapons demolish moonlord is just that Zenith do it better than others in the past I never see people saying that Last prism was trash and make mage the best class like endgame is nothing because you don’t have nothing to do in the endgame
@@icaro8264 Yeah that could be but the every other weapon drop from moonlord do the work so claiming that zenith is trash just because is the best weapon and is after the last boss and you have no other obstacle in question of fights makes the weapon just a trophy and people treat Zenith like it broke the game when is meant to be gathered after everything so there’a no point in hating on the weapon
@@Guilherme-g3qI don’t think that people hate the zenith itself, they hate the fact that there aren’t any other zenith-like ultimate weapons for the other classes. It kinda sucks that only one class has access to an “ultimate final weapon”.
36:00 Minecraft 2 i want that, the game is terrible optimized from the very start because it was the very first, could minecraft live to the Minecraft 1 hype? Give 4 uptades and a better game engine, then yeah, especially if they get a direction to go qith that game About terraria 2 Funny stuff could happend, a sequel is a new game, so artstyle, world generation, objective, vision for weapons and classes, biomes, ALL if that could be improved with what they learn over the years and moddding community, something there less chance to happend than minecraft actually, since you know, terraria has a "fixed" vision, while minecraft is all over the place with no exact plan
What (lategame) melee needs is helmets like ranged has. There are so many different specialties of melee that play so differently (even conflating sword/spear, there's also boomerang, yoyo, and flail, setting aside "other"), so much moreso than ranged even with its helmets... to me, the greatest tragedy of melee is these other subclasses that then get overlooked because people want the best "melee" weapon. I'd suggest three subclasses, for managability: true melee (sword/spear), reach weapons (flail/yoyo), and projectiles (boomerang and shooting-swords, and let's toss in throwing too). True melee gives you large defense and damage buff on spears/swords but denies you any projectiles on your swords (so stuff like terra blade can be either "true melee" or projectile specialty). Other two are progressively weaker defense and give appropriate benefits. Melee does have a unifying "gameplay feel" in that once you have the weapon you're all set (i.e., they don't use ammo, mana, or summons) which makes it newbie-friendly, but the projectile swords are strong enough that they don't leave room for other playstyles to feel competitive. Specialized helmets might help compensate that somewhat.
summoner is difficult since you have to be somewhat close in range for summons to attack the enemies. also, pre-hardmode summons are not that great imo
My ideas for the Melee rework: The more MELEE damage you deal, either the more health you gain from MELEE attacks or the more armor you have (adaptive to your MELEE modifiers and the weapon you are holding). I know the Vampire Knives exist, but we need some more of that, but in traditional Melee format and not just projectile with Melee damage. Imagine Vlad the Impaler's uh... Impaler (Spear)! Also swords should have more large swipes with big hitboxes in circular arcs like the Fiery Greatsword and the Night's Edge without the need for a long-range projectile. Imagine if the Seedler and Chlorophyte Swords dropped a close-range seed that emits a poisonous cloud around the Melee player instead of generic long-range projectile. Another idea: Imagine if there are more close-range swords that have high knockback and allow players to parry enemy attacks and projectiles without the need for that one sword from the Dungeon Defenders 2 crossover and a Shield. All you do is swing when something is coming at you.
Summoner (specifically if you use lightning aura sentry) is horrifically strong. You don't have to use menacing gear for it, you can invest into defense. I just suggest you get a high fire-rate gun to take care of higher hp enemies and bosses
Yall, @minerxen is probably talking about using Old One's Army items, they literally mention the lightning aura sentry. Old One's Army armor is literally multi-class summoner
@@enaznonnac9602 I'd say it's still primarily summoner if you take every armor sold for the Old One's Army into account as they all have summoners bonuses
About the Melee question: I only have 350 hours in Terraria so no expert but to me a "melee" build always was what I recommended new players as the "easy" mode build since you don't have to juggle mana (mage class) or ammo (ranged) but can just spam attacks from a safe distance while being very tanky. Like at the end of the day those 3 classes play similarly, only that the mage has to juggle more spells for debuffs and the ranger needs to farm ammo but at its core all 3 builds just hang back and shoot projectiles while dodging. This lack of identity for the melee class is why I think it could use a rework - it's functionally not different from the other 2. At the same time, the other classes despreately need some hyper wepon like the Zenith. That the arguably best weapon in the game occupies a melee spot already elevates that class too much imo.
As a Summoner main myself, I mostly like the class because it allows me to focus on dodging most of the time, since my minions do most of the work for me. I’ll sometimes get in to do some damage with my whips but for the most part it helps me dodge and weave attacks of bosses.
1. Terra blade and flying dragon range should be nerfed 2. I think summoner is just Undertale dodge it and the boss die to your summon and I loke it 3.yes but less viewed video like rather quenched video was creative 4 no 1.4.5 is not the final when red see how much money it does and every update is final updatelike robtop on geometry dash 7 year no update but still there is a mod even better is t.modloader in androuid 5. They should balance it and I think I want terraria update more 1. Disagree 2. Strong disagree 3. Strong disagree 4.disagree 5. Neutral like I like otherworld but after that why not adding mod in terraria that looks like otherworld and it's get money
@@jayjasespudnaive solution, this is just powercreep. If you buff everything to the strongest item's level then you just have to buff the bosses and mobs or they become pushovers, and if you buff everything but 1 item and all the bosses, it woulda been way smarter to just nerf the one problematic thing
on the summoner thing, as a beginer i must ask why not just go through this process - on spawn, summon in your summon - pick some other class, then have that summon add free extra dps with no investment is there ever a reason to not do this when playing anything other then dedicated summoner? would this not make summoner the easiest class in the game as you dont even need to build summoner to go summoner?
@@catkook543 summoning a free summon is just playing the game. What damage type does your armor boost? What is your main weapon? Thats your class, its not that complicated
@@catkook543 there's nothing stopping you from using a class and adding a summon for extra free damage. A lot of people actually do that. Thing is, most people only like to bother investing their time in getting the gear for their class, and since most summons you have to grind resources to craft the staff, if you're not "dedicated Summoner", as you called it, it doesn't seem to be worth the time. A "dedicated Summoner" makes their build viable via the amount of summons they have, as well as the summon itself and tag damage from whips. If you don't have the gear for summoner, you could have 3 summons at best (1 default, 1 with the summon station, and another with a potion). If you don't bother crafting or otherwise getting a good staff, then using a flinch or Abigail for free damage is basically worthless. And if you're not adding tag damage from whips if you are using another class, then why bother at all to begin with...
I like the design of melee weapons but I think it should definitley incentivize riskier play for more damage. Like imagine a terra blade dealing 25% more damage than it does now when within range of the blade and the projectile damage having falloff going from 75-25% as you get further away. Also total aside but I think it should be renamed to Arms Master because *pure melee* in terraria past wall of flesh and nights edge would be pretty miserable
16:30 Nah, the most difficult class is throwing. Mage can be busted. Ive been playing mage since 1.2 and i would say the magic class is one of the best classes in the game. Throwing class was so niche and bad it became part of ranged. (Im excluding mods when i talk about throwing. In the base game, throwing disappoints me.)
What I understand from the melee question is from those who agree : I know melee is the most op class, and I think we should nerf it and me myself never pick the weapons that are in the game and are good and close range myself because I want something easy while playing,from those who disagree: I know melee has more weapons than: night’s edge, terrablade, shadow flame knifes, solar eruption, true night’s edge.
melee is just broken really. saying you can choose to play long range or short range is clearly a flawed argument as the other classes have more range and way less defense
melee is a bit weird imo. in hardmode you dont ever use a weapon without a projectile as a part of it as its pointless to try unless you are doing a challenge. yet if they didnt have anything with range then melee would need far bulkier armor to play properly for "casual" people, making melee armor to op as it would be used for other classes. melee for now is just ranged with less steps as you dont need ammo and i dont think there is a way to balance it to make it good for everyone with calamity being the closest to balanced in all ways
Bro why in this arguments of melee being ranger with something more or less, I say and repeat pre-hardmode is just true melee like people for real use boomerangs in pre hardmode like no way Pre hardmode melee is for me the perfect balance the problem with the hardmode part is just that people play like they play ranger they just pick the meta (terrblade) and just use that when weapons like startling, horseman’s blade, true Excalibur and a lot of spears are really good but people just play over and over the meta like really just try something new people just use what other people use and don’t try other weapons and that’s why I think melee is not “ranger with more defense” like I can say that for all the classes and melee is the one with potential to be the least ranger of all classes but people just ignore the other weapons the other stages of the game to reduce the class
Y’all need to stop pushing so hard to make the game harder, take y’all sweaty ahh back to Dark Souls, where the game is hard but not fun. What you’re trying to make Terraria
You can just play easy difficulties if its too hawd for you. They are advocating thr game be balanced, and for the most optimal way to play melee to not be a ranged class with 2x defense. The difficulty is irrelivant, the theme of the class is what they have issue with
@@momoaa I play harder difficulties, and I think it’s perfectly balanced. But changing the game to fit some weird niche group’s preferences harms the overall experience for everyone
@@wordedhalo6746 well its not perfectly balanced, its ok to be wrong tho. You are not the arbiter of "everyone's" opinion btw and you definitely dont know whats best for them, this is merely your opinion.
Summoner my beloved combination of glass cannon panic simulator during bosses with whips and afk simulator for chilling when building, fishing, mining...
As a summoner main, hard agree. Even when i am not playing summoner, i still end up playing summoner thanks to how easy it is to get spider armor, even it I only use it for grinding.
one of my templates is always a summoner set just to farm stuff
@@BH5432that’s actually a really good idea
I have fond memories of seeing if I could actually FET away with using Obsidian Armor for the whole game. So much fun
another summoner addict here, really love the intensity of getting up close with whips, really missed it when playing a melee run ironically
Summoner isn’t a choice, it’s a life style. If you are going to commit to summoner you are REALLY going to commit to summoner
I got forced into summoner cause I got dragged into a multiplayer world where everyone (three others) had already picked the other classes and didn't want overlap
This was my first Terraria experience so I latched on to summoner and never looked back
My SO tries to ban me from being summoner but the second I find anything summoner related it is ON
@@CrowleyFledgelmao I had the same experience 😂. When I first started terraria I was playing with a friend and he picked the class I wanted to play, mage. So then I picked summoner cus I thought summoning pets to fight for me was interesting. Since then, I haven't been able to play any other class. The other classes just don't hit the same as summoner 😂
Hell yeah
Summoner 4 life
@@jokerofspades-xt3bs I'm with you guys first time I found a summoner weapon, I couldn't play anything else.
The Throarbin references go hard
Real
me watching this pretending I’m in the video 👁️👅👁️
Non creative ideas do well but they usually have very creative good editing like siphos musicals 🔥🔥🔥
You were in me and I'm in the video so 🤔
@@YARDlS wtff
😳
@@wildlmao I love yardis with all my soul
who's gonna tell him
Wow! That Bench guy has really great takes!
This is the SAME guy who doesn't consider Betsy a REAL boss.... you heard it here first folks........
@@Kepples It really isn't. I think Bench got some w takes. Betsy isn't that much of a boss, more like a mini-boss that is quite easy.
I think the thing that makes summoner so hard is that it's still really underdeveloped. I'm not sure if it's the case anymore, but I remember counting the number of weapons to prove a point and there were literally more pre boss swords then there were minion staffs in the entire game, and a pretty significant chunk of the summoner weapon pool requires either significant RNG or massive amounts of farming. Not to mention seven of the eight hard mode ore sets still don't have a summoner option, they added the hollowed hood in 1.4.0.1 and just gave up
Main flaw of Melee is that every enemy deals damage on contact, most of them dont even have attack animation. So, you can't run through them and slice. True melee players are forced to be close with only one way to avoid damage - run away.
Once I played Dead Cells and it was a refreshing experience when I could run directly into enemies and even roll behind them without taking a hit
I don't understand why they were mentioning new players for the summoner argument. Most new players aren't going to do a pure single class play through, they are explore the game and use what seems fun. Summoner is a no brainer for new players as who wouldn't want free damage? Just set it and forget it, then swap back to your nights edge, vortex beater, or whatever else. Thats certainly how I played my first run. Even now, after close to 2000 hours combined in modded and vanilla, I'm finding more enjoyment than I have in a while using mixed class armors. The red riding set being one of my favorite.
Exactly bro my first run was me with ranged weapons, melee armor and 3 minions from the position and station
For the content being "uncreative" question, I feel that three thing where missed:
1: Most "creative" ideas inherently lack accessibility, meaning they are harder to produce or understand. I like to think of it like this, say a TH-camr wants to make a Terraria video, but hasn't played much, and hasn't interacted with the community much. What videos could they realistically make in a acceptable time frame? Basically just normal playthrough videos, this makes those videos extremely common. Same goes for watchers, if they are new to terraria the only videos they will understand are the more basic ones.
2: Creativity is generally defined by familiarity, meaning if something is unfamiliar in some sense, it is "creative". This means when you see something often, you generally consider it less creative. This ties into the previous point, accessible things are more common, and because they are more common they are more familiar, which makes then "uncreative". The other thing is that familiarity is different for each person, meaning something creative to me, might be perfectly normal to you.
3: TH-cam is a source of income for a lot for people , so doing what works to get views is rewarded with real world wealth.
These things together is what leads to many popular concepts being "Uncreative". Theses are the concepts that are accessible, making them more common and giving them a wider viewer base. Or have been proven to work, giving more incentive to reproduce them. Either of which makes them appear less creative.
I mean, I'm pretty sure hitting with the blade of the melee weapon is more damage than not. If whip stacking is part of "the true summoner experience" then actually hitting with the sword is part of the melee experience.
Yeah but its not a crazy amount. Its not worth is what i mean. Whip stacking is almost necessary for a summoner to compete with the dps of other classes.
The content one is kind of a loaded question, because the most popular content in general on ALL platforms is the least creative stuff. Pop music is #1 for a reason
Popular music (pop for short) is #1 because it's whatever is popular at the moment it was made?
The whole "Summoner is a glass cannon" thing is actually a myth. The difference in survivability between Summoner armor and Ranger armor is almost marginal. Not only does Defense only really make a huge impact to your survivability when you stack Warding with Melee armor, but Defense is only one of many aspects to survivability. You have max health, health regen, dodges, i-frames, health potions and more. To continue about the "glass cannon" thing, excluding Hybrid builds, Summoner actually has close to if not the LOWEST DPS ceiling out of all the "classes" depending on the circumstances. This is most apparent with Plantera where triple whip stacking Blade Staff gets 35-36 seconds killtimes at the absolute fastest on Master mode, meanwhile weapons like True Excalibur and Flamethrower among others can get sub-30s killtimes. Even Venom Staff with manual mana potion timing can match Summoner there.
19:54 It's quite literally both at the same time oftentimes, that's the sad part.
26:07 And yet a large majority of popular Terraria videos today are uncreative and same-y.
Thank you shyguymask ❤️
preach
also, old one's army armor sets exist
Shyguymask showing up is a huge W
Hard agree on the DPS issue but imo the difference in survivability is actually very noticable since summoners are much more reliant on armor and accessories to actually deal decent damage than other classes so they can't get as many of the other aspects of tankiness like DR or regen either.
Melee dmg falloff is actually a goated idea
Thinking about manga, it could be cool if instead of range, melee was given more movement.
I liked the melee rework regarding swords such as True Excalibur and True Night's Edge; Terrablade still has a projectile but less range. Those were probably the most prevalent "melee-range weapons" discussed before their rework. I think the Terrablade slash should really vanish drastically earlier or be a stationary slash that lingers for, idk, a millisecond.
I'm not fond of the idea that giving melee less range directly equates to less fun but i have no point in that statement.
I think melee needs some kind of incentive to get up close; either some movement "paired with weapon" or "singular high damage" move that's limited by range. For both, i think it would be neat if they related to some kind of right click function for melee weapons.
(I'm not thinking of a right-click dash-charge move; just vague ideas).
That’s why the jousting lance is such a cool weapon
jousting lance is based
@@NevilsicoShard imagine a jousting lance with an inbuild ram-dash. We need more weapons that also aid mobility, like the umbrella and trident
I think melee just needs to have more true melee options, more swords like excalibur and horseman’s blade that are true melee but still kick ass, and then mabye some sort of melee accessory that boosts true melee dmg (not just true melee swords but the blade part of ranged swords like the terra blade) to reawrd being up close and personal
Man we already have that pre-hardmode true melee is goated and hardmode true melee is challenging but fun (spears are goated)
@@Guilherme-g3q what acessory are you talking about?
@@FloopytheStinker I wasn’t talking about the accessory part I was talking about the true melee weapons already in game and true melee in the normal game is not that hard you should try
wexel trying to form a coherent sentence sounds like a robot encountering an error. love him
The guy interrupts himself with a new thought every 0.6 seconds
Like last time, these were all written based solely on the chapter titles, so I may miss questions, or touch on points already in the video.
- I'm pretty neutral on the first question. I don't think it needs to be completely reworked because it's pretty iconic (Hero's Sword comes to mind) BUT I feel there should be an extra-close range option for each tier. Does more damage, faster, but way closer without projectiles... Like the usual Terrablade, but also a faster, deadlier Terra-Katana, or something.
So I could easily walk either way, therefore, neutral.
- I wouldn't say Summoner is the most difficult class to USE in Terraria. But I would say it's the most difficult to LEARN HOW to use. Against standard everyday mooks, it's practically easy mode, and lets you just focus on building or whatever. But up against bosses, it's a whole other skill-set. You actually have to learn attacks, and get much better at dodging, and even employ some tactics from time to time. But once you've got that covered, it actively improves your skills in any of the other classes. Because now you know how to dodge and plan. ;)
- Most popular Terraria content seems to be the least original? Hmm... I'd have to think on that one longer for a more conclusive answer. But off the cuff... Kinda? But only because the most popular content is usually "Watch the gamer suffer in the most stressful situations possible." And there's only so many challenges you can do with Terraria. Unmodded, that's going to be HardCore, Master/Legendary, getfixedboi. Modded, that's gonna be Calamity and it's various crazy challenges.
I wish there were more building and chilling content out there, instead of always watching pain on screen. I mean, one of my favorite series was just the science of Terraria in various Mythbuster-esque experiments. But there's an epidemic of elitism in the Terraria community. If you can't beat it on the hardest tight-rope modes, you "aren't a real gamer", or even a "true Terraria fan". I'm not bad at the game, but I just want to have FUN playing it. Does anyone remember just playing games for fun? Because I'm starting not to remember that; and that makes me sad.
- (final update) combined with...
- (Terraria 2) - NEVER the LAST! - Okay, not that extreme. I'm pretty sure it's not going to be the last update, because they almost always do some balance tweaks, and exploit-patches. They might even do another feature patch, like they did with Old One's Army. But the engine is starting to reach it's limits, even in the current version, it's a little less stable than it has been. I'm sure it'll only get more apparent in that update. It's getting time for a full slate wipe.
I'm thinking, we're all so excited about Terraria, and want it to go on forever. BUT... It would be cool to see what they can do with a whole sequel! We could get to be just as excited about stuff happening, but in another game. I'm not going to say I'd _rather_ they work on 2, but it certainly won't bother me when they do. Not EVERYthing has to be an [EITHER], [OR] situation. That only leads to stronger divisions in fanbases. To quote a popular commercial in recent memory, "Porque nos Dos." - Why not Both. Just because it's not YOUR point of view, doesn't mean it isn't actively a VALID point of view.
(EDIT AFTER THE VIDEO) - What would be best for a Terraria 2, would actually be more of an Expansion Pack, than a Sequel. Like, make a new engine, and import all you could from the old engine into the new one, then you could expand on that. Like when Roller Coaster Tycoon released "Splash!" and "Wild!" completely new main mechanics and features. First added water flow mechanics, pool management features, Waterpark-Complex structures. The second added a whole lot of Zoo-like features, right down to animal enrichment, hygiene and, habitat landscaping. BUT you could then do all the new stuff in any of the prior scenarios. It was an updated engine, but it was still very much RCT3.
The problem with reworking melee to be up close is that being close to enemies sucks ass and the game isn’t designed around it
No, I don’t want damage drop-off on my projectiles when I’m fighting daytime empress thank you
One prompt should be if Crimson is better then Corruption
First question i think they just need some more close range options throughout the game!
The summon discussion misses one important factor. Summoner progression is a pain. The first 3 minions you can have are the slime, Abigail and the Flinch. Those 3 have to physically reach the enemy to attack, which depending on what you're fighting, might spend 80% of the time moving around trying to reach the mob, not to mention that they do so little damage early on, that the fights are actually longer, which means you have more time to make mistakes and die on 1-2 hits. If you defeat Queen bee, you get the hornet staff, which is your first ranged summon, as it shoots projectiles. It's the first actually viable option, and you're already over 50% done with pre hardmode by that point. So far, you only have 2 whips available to you, the third pre hardmode whip being post Skeletron (the first whip is so weak and short ranged, isn't even worth using). If you cheese the blood moon event, you can get the vampire frog staff, which while being a contact damage summon, it actually does a fair amount of damage. That's when summoner actually stops being a pain 80% of the time and starts being a viable class. With this, you can defeat Skeletron and get the last while before hardmode. By this point there's only one other summon available before WoF, which is the Imp summon. While the best pre hardmode, as it shoots piercing projectiles, you can't fight with them near water, which might now be the worst thing ever, its certainly worth mentioning. So you have to keep switching summons to fit the current fight best, and hopefully you defeat WoF. Only after you get the Spider staff, things actually start kicking off. With a few exceptions, most summons can fight both on ground and in the air, and you just have to keep your distance. I would say summoner actually becomes the glass cannon it's known for right before post-mech.
Sincerely, a summoner main
as another summoner main, i could also say that you are the most vulnerable to Wall of Flesh. i completed the game several times, and it's still my biggest fear
Also don't forget that Imps stacking is so bad because of i-frames
Luckily, we're getting 3 new whips for post-EoW/Brain stage in 1.4.5 (one crafted with meteorite and two others with evil ores)
@@lomtick6654 yeah. I'm currently doing a Master For the Worthy run, and I'm currently trying to improve my building (because everything I build sucks) because the idea of fighting WoF is such a dread
@@net6406 yeah, I'm so excited for 1.4.5, only reason I am not complaining about how long it's taking, is that I trust Relogic to make it a great update. I like how they are making evil ore and meteorite whips, because evil ore feels solely melee and meteorite felt mage exclusive. I like how those resources are becoming more cohesive to the game overall
I think the class difficulty questions really come down to where you are in game progression. Different classes have different points in the game where they have better options than the other classes. Summoner struggles with WoF a lot more than melee and ranged and has a much rougher early hard mode, but then its power level spikes exponentially around post-Plantera. Ranger and mage have to aim a lot more than the other classes, but as soon as they get homing weapons/chlorophyte bullets that becomes irrelevant
I do think summoner is the most difficult class to just *beat the game* with, coming from someone who has played every class. However, it's still worth noting that it has a lot of utility that the other classes don't (idle defense while fishing, attacking through walls, sentries)
Melee is by far the worst class throughout all of progression, it is entirely unviable after the first 20 minutes until blade of grass, which falls off very quickly making skeleton brutal, and your only valid option against the wall of flesh is the knights edge, which yall are saying should have as much range as it does 😭 (flamarang is the only thing that makes late pre hard mode melee bearable, but im talking about mostly swords)
Hard mode you have to go for drippler crippler or bananarang because all other weapons suck, and until post planters you are limited to like 2 weapons. Melee would be entirely unviable against bosses if it didn’t have the range it did because the way bosses are designed in terraria. Yes Terra blade is insanely broken, but at any other stage of progression including after post plantera, every other class sweeps. Also someone said whips have smallrange which is what makes summoner hard but then how does knights edge have a lot of range 😭. I love melee truly, but terraria is entirely built around staying far from bosses and melee only really does that post mech boss and every other class does it better. Defense for other classes is really not that bad if you reforge for warding, but yes melee is naturally one of the best classes for basic enemies because they take knockback and melee has near infinite pierce. Also i primarily play in master and legendary mode, melee is broken in the two easy difficulties where tanking is viable
i feel like id agree that most popular content being uncreative is true is because there are two types of "most popular content"
informative videos, which is inherently not very creative in topic because it's just repackaging statistics/news/strategy
no-hit fights/challenge runs, which are kinda just what they say on the tin
I agree that a terraria 2 would need to be more focused on an engine update. Perhaps making it even more moddable than it currently is
i will live and die on my summoner hill, it's melee but glass cannon
🤨
Average calamity player
@@muffins901 Whips are effectively a melee weapon with more "true melee" range and no projectiles.
@@simplysmiley4670 insert shyguymask's whip video here
technically yeah, but having passive dps makes a huge difference
1:26 the third tier hardmode ore swords, they're perfectly viable against The Destroyer and they're obviously melee.
I've always played summoner just because I just like the theme. Whether or not it's harder, I don't care.
What I personally want for melee is to have a very obvious incentive in going true melee or a disadvantage for choosing projectiles or boomerangs or the like.
I know theres some already in game but further lowering projectile dmg would be good or flasks like ichor unless the weapon itself touches the enemy. Lastly, the spears need more love.
I think Terraria 2, but done in some way where it can be backwards compatible with characters and worlds, would be a good step forward. Terraria doesn't need more content after 1.4.5. it needs an engine update. It needs something to freshen up world gen and navigation. I know we're getting even more secret seeds, but I don't think that's enough. Minecraft's dimensions get brought up a lot in this discussion and I don't know if we need that, but it'd be cool to have interiors, doors/portals that lead to new worldspaces within the same world file.
Barring that, let's take the fight to the Moonlord. Let's go to the moon. Or the Pillar planets. Something different from the standard Forest, Desert, Tundra, Caves, Ocean, Dungeon, Hell.
I would like to fight cthulu in his prime before he was weakened and sent to the moon. I think they should do what you said and just bring everything over from terraria into a better engine and add more bosses and that sweet sweet game progression.
Or maybe something like a Terraria -1, where you travel back in time
Like you said, I just want a engine update, I don't think I will keep playing depending on how different Terraria 2 is
To put the summoner debate into more clear words summoner has the lowest skill floor and highest skill ceiling. So based on the question of the most difficult do you consider a classes floor or ceiling when accounting for difficulty, or perhaps somewhere in the middle.
How does it have the lowest skill floor?
Melee have the lowest skill floor in my opinion, high damage and defense with decent range
Summoner is probably 3rd in terms lowest skill floor
34:56 "Adding stuff to Terraria wouldn't be..." the word you might've been looking for was sacrilege. It keeps the identity of Terraria, and wouldn't harm it.
I beat moonlord first try as summoner and my first vanilla boss + expert!!
I only used play lot of quality of life mod.
One day I decided to true expert mode with no slacking as complete beginner I even never did eol, frost moon, pumpkin moon. And I went straight to summoner (I DID melee to get summoner loot).
I died a lot but I also learn quickly.
Summoner is so fun play that feel really bored to play any other class.
Also that I did in 20fps 7 year old laptop.
Oh man that whip stacking dps was amazing.
i remember seeing somebody joke that "terraria's final update" was on the opposite side of a spectrum with "disney's first gay character" there's going to be 100 or so of both of these
I think with the first question it would be cool if there was a separate True Melee class that shows up in hardmode. I don't know how it would work, but that would be really interesting
i think melee should just be called something else like fighter or knight... or maybe could have less defense when using longer ranged swords (nights edge, terablade)
if that were the case melee would purely be worse ranged until zenith lol
I posit a suggestion for a potentially better third option than sequel vs update; how about a remaster (or remastery sequel) that brings the current game fully to a new, fleshed out, better system, porting all the previous features and content to a cutting edge and Many times larger/more powerful engine and framework? Possibly even bumping the pixel values up by one stage to keep the feel of the art, but make everything feel just a little more… intricate? Maybe thats not the right word… but… something… maybe not though, id have to see some test images to know if thats a good idea. But making everything able to have many times more content, much larger and more complex worlds, and *possibly other dimensions you could travel to (i mean, we already have logical portals from almost every event, boss, crossover, biome, and even a few odd ones like coin portals…) letting there be several times as many “worlds” to explore per world… or even just adding more layers to a world to allow new mechanics too…
I will say i would be sad to see the base Terraria get left behind, so maybe the engine change would need to be a Massive update (like the 2.0 update)
Terraria Experts in the video holyyy
I've always treated terraria equipment as something meant for making a specific task easier. Warrior sets are all around pretty good. I can understand why melee is stanned so much. You have high damage. High defense. Some of your melee options come with extended range. And you can fight like a ranger with none of the ammo loss or defense penalties.
Ranger is pretty understandable. Not the greatest and bestest, but doable. I can agree though, it is made a bit more redundant with ranged melees.
Mage is . . . Oof. Shit defense. But the damage CAN be good. But you're probably not gonna be wearing any dodging gear as you're gonna try to spellmaxx. So the best option here is to get all tech-wizard on the bosses using architectural exploits like hoik loops.
Summoner. If you're fighting bosses, refer back to hoiking. Besides that, the summoner class is good for AFK farming. I treat summoner sets more like angler or miner equipment. It's there to make a tedious job less tedious. Which does make sense.
You have the primary warrior, ranger, and mage classes. Then you have the miner/builder, fisherman, and . . . the . . . the bug guy.
Damage decay on melee would be SICK!
I like being a summoner because I love having cute pets help me. I was oblivious to it being hard. I do die all the time.
As a beginner learning Summoner I FEAR NOTHING
the real balance would be getting rid of mana, and getting rid of ammo, to make them on par with melee. the only thing that makes melee different, from magic and guns, is it does not consume anything.
In regards to melee essentially being ranged, I don't inherently disagree but it only really applies to a few weapons. Prehardmode its like the star fury and enchanted sword, which I personally never use. Then in hard mode there's like... 3 I can think of? Terra blade, flying dragon, and influx waver? Most other melee weapons generally do a good job at being melee. Sure the beam sword exists, but who in the world is fighting mech bosses with it? Dao of pow for destroyer or bananarang for twins is way better. I definitely agree that post mech melee is the best class to use, but I think that's because there's like 3 swords that are just so much better than any other option that is true melee or otherwise. If they got a bit of a rework then I think melee would be fine.
i wish they just re-make terraria in better more optimazide engine and expand on the concept
or a rogue like mode
@@fbidos Just play Hardcore
Just my two cents on the last prompt, but I feel like Terraria 2 would be kinda hard to make without it basically being the exact same game at this point. Like what can they add that would warrant a completely new game instead of a new update? And I stand by it even more after the addition of features like the Aether biome, which very well could’ve been something to add in a sequel but it was added to the original game instead. Like what could feel new and unique enough that they need a sequel without it being so different from the original game that it feels like a completely new IP Re-logic created.
I did it on the last video (which I watched just before watching this one) but I want to give my opinions on these questions before hearing their responses and maybe changing my opinion after and adding a few extra words
#1 - I'd say disagree. I guess personally, I don't think of melee weapons as the projectiles a handful of them fire, but I think the biggest problem is how unrewarding using the true melee hits really are. I'd love to see melee weapons to be reworked to feel more like true melee weapons instead another sword with a projectile. I'd also personally love to see more melee weapons even with projectiles to feel more rewarding for hitting with the true melee attack vs the projectile. I feel like the "ranged" melee option of being boomerangs would actually be nice to be more prominent as the better long range melee weapon. Maybe this kinda might be agreeing in the long run, but I definitely feel it's not a problem, but more that, if anything else is added, melee should focus more on melee feeling like melee.
#2 - I'd Strongly disagree. It may not be someone's playstyle, and it may not be nigh invincible like melee, but Summoner in itself, can be fairly strong. It's a different playstyle even after adding whips, where accuracy isn't necessary without specific weapons/ammunition like with range or mage. And against non-bosses, you're probably having an easier time for the most part, since the hard part you might run into is dps might be a bit lower against larger hp bars. I don't think Summoner is the hardest class to play, not for being summoner in itself, but someone might struggle with it, because it does feel at least a bit different from the other classes. I'd say, outside of bosses it helps because things are dealt with without you having to do anything, and even during bosses, you can focus more on dodging and still be doing damage. I also took this into the account of playing casually, since playing at it's best capacity would be be more of a question of mastering it, not just playing it. Mage would personally be the most difficult, because it has mana management to keep up the dps, as well as similar armor to summoner. Mage also has the benefit of longer range, with the drawback of having to actually aim well with most weapons to get good dps compared to summoner.
#3 - I'd say slighty disagree. I can't say I have much of an opinion on this at all, since I rarely pay attention to what's the most popular challenges and all that, but I guess maybe I've just been privileged to find stuff I enjoy watching in general. Not much to really say on this topic. I guess, to add to it, just cuz a video has a pretty simple premise, doesn't mean it necessarily is "lacking creativity" as it'd be in how they present this challenge, however simple it is.
#4 - Disagree. Simple enough, they've said they're on the final update before, but they just keep going. Even if it is the final update, I feel like mods will take the lead and try to make many more interesting add-ons you can create to make the game fun. They could very much keep the moonlord as the "end of the game" similar to how the ender dragon in minecraft is still considered the "end of the game" for speedruns and such. They could add more past the moonlord, without infringing too much on what is already there. I think the biggest things I'd like to see is more customization especially in world gen personally, which could also not change a "default" play through
#5 - Neutral. I think there are pros and cons to each side, where creating a sequel allows you to deviate more from what is currently available, and maybe make bigger changes that would not be forced on all of those people who love terraria, while also allowing them to get a larger burst of income for people wanting to play said sequel. But on the flip side, having more things available to the game people already have could cause more people to want to play the game, as well as just expand what each playthrough is capable of. I think the biggest thing a sequel would have to do, is have some big changes that would necessitate a sequel instead of just being, terraria but different. They also wouldn't necessarily need to have it be similar to terraria at all really, if they just wanted to make a different game in general. Nothing is also stopping them from doing both, really, maybe work on smaller updates for terraria, and work on a new game as well. Maybe if ideas are dry on one end, work a bit on the other for a bit.
My comment is definitely more of "rambling my thoughts" than anything statistically backed by fact.
I think the big thing is that for a lot of the melee weapons with ranged functionality, you lose a lot of damage by solely relying on the ranged functionality. Nobody using the beam sword's beam is happy with that damage, and even the terra blade is a 'best option' to run away and swing at a boss or enemies, but that damage is not stellar. I think a good compromise here for most of these weapons would be to increase the sword's base damage slightly and reduce the projectile damage, still keeping the mystique of sword energy/intent that avoids ridiculously sized swords while encouraging players to get in closer.
One thing I'll say about the true-melee argument is as much as I would love melee to be more true melee, I also see the game does NOT provide the tools to let that happen. When the game offers such a mix of vertical and horizontal movement options, but none of them are precisely sharp or flow well enough to let someone who is true melee stay within their optimal damage range while staying out of harm. The on-contact damage nature of the game does NOT help any prospects for true melee at all, and it's a shame cause I could well envision a version of terraria that minimises the effect of contact damage but also makes enemies dangerous up close and allow for true melee to thrive much better. Also it doesn't help that a good number of bosses move super fast and try and maintain a fixed position away from the player, such as Retinazer and most of Empress of Light's attack phases... Hell maybe if there was a grappling hook that let you hook onto enemies and bosses so you could be constantly closing the gap between yourselves and them that'd be cool
I don't think melee needs a _massive_ overhaul, but when you have stuff like the Spear of the Corruptor, which is a long ranged projectile that bursts into smaller homing projectiles that do more damage, with less effort, than most ranged weapons and spells _while being free to use..._ you've gotta admit it's a little silly. Maybe rework that one just a little.
8:50 I have recently started playing summoner, whip stacking does NOT take skill. It's one of my favourite techs of the class, it's fun as hell, I used obsidian armour all the way up to Plantera, I think it's the perfect blend of effort, risk, reward and honestly speaking, fun in the game. It does NOT take skill tho, it is holding left mouse button and spamming the keyboard keys to buffer the whip change. Optimal whip stacking, as in perfectly managing every whip swing and making sure you have as high uptime on your best whip as possible, I could 100% see that taking major skill, but anyone with 2 hands with no muscular or joint issues can whip stack at least 4 whips no problem. Tho this is on PC, I have no idea if it changes when accounting for mobile/console, maybe there it's different...
Summoner sucks in the most fun way possible (in boss fights*)
Summoners have much less weapons thrown at them or put in the path of progress, casually.
It's easy to use the summons but the way you have to look for them, often using the wiki to find the secrets ways you have to take to just be able to attack with summons. If you're lucky, you have to travel almost across the world to find a Finch staff or get super lucky with slime staff. Then what? Spider staff in Hardmode, if I'm not mistaken. Flinxes isn't something you go to farm when your damage output is slime. So you're basically using slime or finches against Wall of Flesh, realistically.
You rock that until you get a lucky drop from Plantera. Barring special events, you might happen upon Marsian Invasion and then it's the zappy ufo against cultist and then stardust dragon against Moonlord.
With wiki knowledge or 400 hours of looking around, you might find the drop from Queen Slime to help you or fishing in Blood Moon when you're being assaulted from all angles. Pumpkin Moon isn't casual knowledge, Duke Fishron isn't something you just stumble upon.
Casual progression is slime/finch, spider, pygmy, ufo, stardust dragon. Sure, I haven't played in several years and might have forgotten something. Meanwhile, you have many other weapons dropped in your lap or craftable with new materials.
This is why I love the Terraria community 😊
Also summoner doesn't need too much defense because you easily can focus on dodging and avoiding enemy attacks, something terraria players really hate with how much they overhype empress of light
16:43 Crabbar and MappyGaming are two really creative content creators that do extremely well. Then you've got Chippy with his news and round-up videos, which I don't see many content creators do that kind of content. There's also challenge TH-camrs that are really fun to watch, like Sorbet Cafe who does some fun videos as well, like beating Terraria following the (now old) Wiki guide on how to beat the game, or beating Terraria with a dance pad.
Even in the "less creative" spaces, there's good content to be had just through the TH-camr's personality.
Then there's the madlad Thorobin with his "1 Year, 1 World" videos which is really unique in the "I spent X time in game" which is really interesting to see how you can get the most out of each progression point in the game.
Damn these guys are brain-dead. "Harder for new players"
"If you are good at the game summoner is good"
That is literally the definition of hard, if you need to be good at the game for summoner to be good that is an argument against summoner.
"It is hard if you cant dodge attacks"
Bro melee doesn't even need to dodge attacks, and ranger and mage don't need to be close enemies to reach max effectivness.
Highest theoretical DPS does not make it easier.
Daily reminder that people hated bench for being creative and making the challenge fun in one of those pass the worlds videos
i love summoner but i dont like the glass (not at all )cannon. i want legendary summoner to be possible
i have a strong opinion about the zenith and how it is the best weapon in the game and i dont know if im alone in this
it is by far the strongest weapon with the best dps for single and multiple targets only being beaten by really specific setups
if this series continue could you ask if the zenith is a good addition to the game?
what's the dps cap for a summoner with a terraprisma in the endgame?
Why people hate the zenith like it is just a trophy and a cool weapon like endgame has nothing to do with other classes is just end every endgame set and weapons demolish moonlord is just that Zenith do it better than others in the past I never see people saying that Last prism was trash and make mage the best class like endgame is nothing because you don’t have nothing to do in the endgame
@@Guilherme-g3q not all players see moon lord as the end of the game, theres a lot of stuff to do other than kill bosses
@@icaro8264 Yeah that could be but the every other weapon drop from moonlord do the work so claiming that zenith is trash just because is the best weapon and is after the last boss and you have no other obstacle in question of fights makes the weapon just a trophy and people treat Zenith like it broke the game when is meant to be gathered after everything so there’a no point in hating on the weapon
@@Guilherme-g3qI don’t think that people hate the zenith itself, they hate the fact that there aren’t any other zenith-like ultimate weapons for the other classes. It kinda sucks that only one class has access to an “ultimate final weapon”.
Terraria 🌳
Very controversial take, I can’t say I agree
@@ChiefLogan_ I guess you can say… that’s what terraria TH-camrs think about the game
Melee should be not long rage but very big buff for true melee
36:00
Minecraft 2
i want that, the game is terrible optimized from the very start because it was the very first, could minecraft live to the Minecraft 1 hype? Give 4 uptades and a better game engine, then yeah, especially if they get a direction to go qith that game
About terraria 2
Funny stuff could happend, a sequel is a new game, so artstyle, world generation, objective, vision for weapons and classes, biomes, ALL if that could be improved with what they learn over the years and moddding community, something there less chance to happend than minecraft actually, since you know, terraria has a "fixed" vision, while minecraft is all over the place with no exact plan
@chiefLogan is the last question a cliffhanger for part 3? :)
What (lategame) melee needs is helmets like ranged has. There are so many different specialties of melee that play so differently (even conflating sword/spear, there's also boomerang, yoyo, and flail, setting aside "other"), so much moreso than ranged even with its helmets... to me, the greatest tragedy of melee is these other subclasses that then get overlooked because people want the best "melee" weapon.
I'd suggest three subclasses, for managability: true melee (sword/spear), reach weapons (flail/yoyo), and projectiles (boomerang and shooting-swords, and let's toss in throwing too). True melee gives you large defense and damage buff on spears/swords but denies you any projectiles on your swords (so stuff like terra blade can be either "true melee" or projectile specialty). Other two are progressively weaker defense and give appropriate benefits.
Melee does have a unifying "gameplay feel" in that once you have the weapon you're all set (i.e., they don't use ammo, mana, or summons) which makes it newbie-friendly, but the projectile swords are strong enough that they don't leave room for other playstyles to feel competitive. Specialized helmets might help compensate that somewhat.
That would make melee THE GOAT without doubt and is already the goat
summoner is difficult since you have to be somewhat close in range for summons to attack the enemies. also, pre-hardmode summons are not that great imo
I believe wexel is a masochist based on his Melee Hardcore opinion...
Summoner for most of the game because i can't be bother with hornets every 0.3 second , melee for boss fights because my dodge game is trash.
SUMMONER IS THE BOSS CLASS! STRAIGHT UP MAFIA BOSS! THE PRESIDENT! THE CEO!
*IT BEST! NO QUESTIONS!*
I love videos like these
terraria devs, take notes
Didn't yall have a final final update like 3 years ago?
Again, here I am agreeing 100% with wexel.
Will 1.4.5 be the final update? Nah. 1.4.6 Binding of Isaac crossover real /hj.
Me Searchingn for Throarbin in the Comments...
My ideas for the Melee rework:
The more MELEE damage you deal, either the more health you gain from MELEE attacks or the more armor you have (adaptive to your MELEE modifiers and the weapon you are holding). I know the Vampire Knives exist, but we need some more of that, but in traditional Melee format and not just projectile with Melee damage. Imagine Vlad the Impaler's uh... Impaler (Spear)!
Also swords should have more large swipes with big hitboxes in circular arcs like the Fiery Greatsword and the Night's Edge without the need for a long-range projectile. Imagine if the Seedler and Chlorophyte Swords dropped a close-range seed that emits a poisonous cloud around the Melee player instead of generic long-range projectile.
Another idea: Imagine if there are more close-range swords that have high knockback and allow players to parry enemy attacks and projectiles without the need for that one sword from the Dungeon Defenders 2 crossover and a Shield. All you do is swing when something is coming at you.
Speak of the devil 😂
Summoner (specifically if you use lightning aura sentry) is horrifically strong.
You don't have to use menacing gear for it, you can invest into defense. I just suggest you get a high fire-rate gun to take care of higher hp enemies and bosses
So play ranger.
Then you aren’t playing summoner, you are using a gun.
Yall, @minerxen is probably talking about using Old One's Army items, they literally mention the lightning aura sentry.
Old One's Army armor is literally multi-class summoner
@@DerpidyDerp but he said to use a fast firing gun. He’s telling you to play hybrid ranger-summoner
@@enaznonnac9602 I'd say it's still primarily summoner if you take every armor sold for the Old One's Army into account as they all have summoners bonuses
About the Melee question: I only have 350 hours in Terraria so no expert but to me a "melee" build always was what I recommended new players as the "easy" mode build since you don't have to juggle mana (mage class) or ammo (ranged) but can just spam attacks from a safe distance while being very tanky. Like at the end of the day those 3 classes play similarly, only that the mage has to juggle more spells for debuffs and the ranger needs to farm ammo but at its core all 3 builds just hang back and shoot projectiles while dodging. This lack of identity for the melee class is why I think it could use a rework - it's functionally not different from the other 2.
At the same time, the other classes despreately need some hyper wepon like the Zenith. That the arguably best weapon in the game occupies a melee spot already elevates that class too much imo.
Beans
agree with yardis' takes so much not cause i'm a "glazer" shut up
i hugely disagree with the first one
melee has variety, so do the other classes
they cant just exclude melee from the variety
Thats not what anyone said
As a Summoner main myself, I mostly like the class because it allows me to focus on dodging most of the time, since my minions do most of the work for me. I’ll sometimes get in to do some damage with my whips but for the most part it helps me dodge and weave attacks of bosses.
I will make the sequel to Terraria.
1. Terra blade and flying dragon range should be nerfed 2. I think summoner is just Undertale dodge it and the boss die to your summon and I loke it 3.yes but less viewed video like rather quenched video was creative 4 no 1.4.5 is not the final when red see how much money it does and every update is final updatelike robtop on geometry dash 7 year no update but still there is a mod even better is t.modloader in androuid 5. They should balance it and I think I want terraria update more
1. Disagree 2. Strong disagree 3. Strong disagree 4.disagree 5. Neutral like I like otherworld but after that why not adding mod in terraria that looks like otherworld and it's get money
Nothing should really ever be nerfed. Other options should be made stronger.
@@jayjasespudnaive solution, this is just powercreep. If you buff everything to the strongest item's level then you just have to buff the bosses and mobs or they become pushovers, and if you buff everything but 1 item and all the bosses, it woulda been way smarter to just nerf the one problematic thing
on the summoner thing, as a beginer
i must ask
why not just go through this process
- on spawn, summon in your summon
- pick some other class, then have that summon add free extra dps with no investment
is there ever a reason to not do this when playing anything other then dedicated summoner?
would this not make summoner the easiest class in the game as you dont even need to build summoner to go summoner?
Thats not summoner
@@momoaa what would you classify my description as then?
your using a summoner item to deal additional damage to the enemy
@@catkook543 summoning a free summon is just playing the game. What damage type does your armor boost? What is your main weapon? Thats your class, its not that complicated
@@catkook543 there's nothing stopping you from using a class and adding a summon for extra free damage. A lot of people actually do that. Thing is, most people only like to bother investing their time in getting the gear for their class, and since most summons you have to grind resources to craft the staff, if you're not "dedicated Summoner", as you called it, it doesn't seem to be worth the time.
A "dedicated Summoner" makes their build viable via the amount of summons they have, as well as the summon itself and tag damage from whips. If you don't have the gear for summoner, you could have 3 summons at best (1 default, 1 with the summon station, and another with a potion). If you don't bother crafting or otherwise getting a good staff, then using a flinch or Abigail for free damage is basically worthless. And if you're not adding tag damage from whips if you are using another class, then why bother at all to begin with...
@@momoaa to my knowledge of the game based off talking to my friendo, who is way more into terraria then i am
hybrid classes are quite common
I like the design of melee weapons but I think it should definitley incentivize riskier play for more damage. Like imagine a terra blade dealing 25% more damage than it does now when within range of the blade and the projectile damage having falloff going from 75-25% as you get further away.
Also total aside but I think it should be renamed to Arms Master because *pure melee* in terraria past wall of flesh and nights edge would be pretty miserable
16:30 Nah, the most difficult class is throwing. Mage can be busted. Ive been playing mage since 1.2 and i would say the magic class is one of the best classes in the game. Throwing class was so niche and bad it became part of ranged. (Im excluding mods when i talk about throwing. In the base game, throwing disappoints me.)
What I understand from the melee question is from those who agree : I know melee is the most op class, and I think we should nerf it and me myself never pick the weapons that are in the game and are good and close range myself because I want something easy while playing,from those who disagree: I know melee has more weapons than: night’s edge, terrablade, shadow flame knifes, solar eruption, true night’s edge.
melee is just broken really. saying you can choose to play long range or short range is clearly a flawed argument as the other classes have more range and way less defense
melee is a bit weird imo.
in hardmode you dont ever use a weapon without a projectile as a part of it as its pointless to try unless you are doing a challenge. yet if they didnt have anything with range then melee would need far bulkier armor to play properly for "casual" people, making melee armor to op as it would be used for other classes.
melee for now is just ranged with less steps as you dont need ammo and i dont think there is a way to balance it to make it good for everyone with calamity being the closest to balanced in all ways
Bro why in this arguments of melee being ranger with something more or less, I say and repeat pre-hardmode is just true melee like people for real use boomerangs in pre hardmode like no way Pre hardmode melee is for me the perfect balance the problem with the hardmode part is just that people play like they play ranger they just pick the meta (terrblade) and just use that when weapons like startling, horseman’s blade, true Excalibur and a lot of spears are really good but people just play over and over the meta like really just try something new people just use what other people use and don’t try other weapons and that’s why I think melee is not “ranger with more defense” like I can say that for all the classes and melee is the one with potential to be the least ranger of all classes but people just ignore the other weapons the other stages of the game to reduce the class
@@Guilherme-g3qchrist bro, punctuation
@@momoaa Sorry I am not from a English speaker country
Y’all need to stop pushing so hard to make the game harder, take y’all sweaty ahh back to Dark Souls, where the game is hard but not fun. What you’re trying to make Terraria
Dark souls is an apt comparison, but with an opposite difficulty curve.
Melee - hardest
Ranged/magic - Medium
Summon - easy
You can just play easy difficulties if its too hawd for you. They are advocating thr game be balanced, and for the most optimal way to play melee to not be a ranged class with 2x defense. The difficulty is irrelivant, the theme of the class is what they have issue with
@@momoaa I play harder difficulties, and I think it’s perfectly balanced. But changing the game to fit some weird niche group’s preferences harms the overall experience for everyone
@@wordedhalo6746 well its not perfectly balanced, its ok to be wrong tho. You are not the arbiter of "everyone's" opinion btw and you definitely dont know whats best for them, this is merely your opinion.
Summoner is the best class and "true" melee sucks.