@@osiem_gwiazdek I would recommend a large size if you’re planning to purchase a Giant bike. Nonetheless, your best option would be to stop by your local GIANT dealership and test ride a bike. Best of luck.
By far the best comparison of rim vs disc I've heard: 12:45. Cracking bike, I rode the rim brake version for a hilly/technical tri course last year and the handling/braking really stood out to me. Keep up the great content!
First time I have seen one your video .... I love the fact you explain the highly technical stuff a way people will understand. Great job. Liked and subscribed.
Magnificent Giant TCR ADV SL,sublime colour and awesome built.Great channel to,no pretentiousness and pompous attitude like other so called bike guru's,and you're clean shaven like me Thanks again for a great channel.Cheers.👍
I bought the 2021 disc version. Without a doubt the best bike I have ever owned. Interesting point about compliance. I found that I was able to drop my tyre pressure by 5 psi and I got even better traction and it grips corners at greater speed and under brakes.
I'm 6'2" and ride the 2019 rim ML. Great bike. Very smooth, compliant and stiff under pedalling (1450W max) and braking loads. Mine's 6.9kg with Dura Ace mechanical and 45mm DT rims. My main criticism is lack of torsional stiffness under hard cornering. I weigh 76kg, but corner hard (ex motorbike racer). I suspect the twist is coming from the fork. There's some odd steering geometry too. Not as good as Spesh Tarmac, Colnago C series or Helium SL in that regard. But otherwise a very good bike and properly engineered. 30mm tyres? Eh?
I have been waiting for so long for this! Thanks for your review mate! It well and truly looks like a weapon. I'm glad you touched on the braking. Other than the slight weight penalty, I've been concerned about stories of rub involving disc brakes so glad to hear your view. The Advanced Pro 1 I rode felt great with disc brakes. I feel like if you went disc and weight weenied everything else, you could get to 7kg without pedals and sillyness in the front end with integrated bullshit. GVA's TCR is basically 6.5kg (according to GCN) with all the CADEX gear and the CCC team bikes generally seem to be light enough they can go deep dish and still be right on the limit. I had no idea how important it is to get that cut right on the ISP because I'm riding out on an Advanced Pro 0 propel right now. My only complaint about that mechanism is setting seat angle if you don't have a saddle cut-out can be trial and error. I'm already stressin' about getting the ISP right and have decided I first need to get the saddle right and getting a fitter. The Fabric Scoop has enough padding to add a few mm give or take. Lastly, I'd love to seen an objective view based on the information now about what you think of the new 2021 TCR's, even if it's just a short web-based review. You can see weights and detailed published on the JP site: www.giant.co.jp/giant20/bike_select.php?c_code=CA01&f_code=FD01&s_code=SR38
This would be great, i have a cube cyclo-cross bike, it's great off road, but when using it on the road the brakes are just too grabby. I have a steep descent after leaving my house onto a main road. I have to be more careful and start breaking early on the disk bike than on my carbon wheeled rim bike. The point of probably slowing the bike down without locking up the rear wheel is so hard to find. Obs this bike is built as a cross racer so is stiff so it's not the bikes fault, I'm using it in a way not intended. And my rim bike is a very nice bike. But still.
@12:33 The seat clamp has been redesigned for the 2021 model (it comes with two clamps - a short and a longer one). Apparently it's a bit lighter and "A proprietary 3M adhesive protector has also been added to the clamping section of the integrated seatpost, in a bid to help with weight saving without sacrificing strength and security due of the ‘thinness’ of the paint process." Curious to see what that actually means in real life when they finally hit the shops.
@@m4punisher25 I've got a strong feeling they're not. From what I've seen the new seatpost now has a "truncated" profile and the old one had the teardrop shape. cdn-cyclingtips.pressidium.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/2021-Giant-TCR-Advanced-SL-Disc-tube-profiles-1.jpg
I've been eyeing Giant as my next bike & I think I'm going to stay away from the ISP & stick with traditional seatposts - the downsides of ISP just don't seem worth it to me. The $ saved is also pretty sweet
Great review! I rate GIANT bikes. Some clever blokes (and girls) working there for sure. I wish the TCR was kept a bit more traditional though, IE: normal seat post. It looks like you wish you could put the saddle further forward, but obviously you don't have a choice of changing to a zero-offset seatpost or flipping around a negative offset seatpost, etc. Is your fit compromised? Or does it fit perfectly with the saddle rammed all the way forwards? (I also end up ramming my saddle all the way forwards on most of my builds, not for reach issues, but for 'getting over the BB' in a way I feel I can pedal efficiently.) Also... you mention a couple of things that most reviewers don't talk about - couldn't agree more. I think bike reviewers are really lacking behind. The fact that a single guy with 4k subscribers can do a better job that a company with 100+ employees and many more resources is quite embarrassing. Another thing I think that's overlooked is frame sizes. I imagine an XS (or XXS) build of this bike would ride TOTALLY differently. Not just the geometery for the headtube agles, fork trail, etc. (Most manufacturers will at most use two different fork sizes throughout the range, meaning XXS and XXL are basically shoe-horned in with less than ideal forks to match their head tube angles) But also from a layup and leverage point of view. The XXS head-tube would probably be totally different and even stiffer (again, layup depending) but especially that ISP. The ratio of ISP to seat tube would probably be almost 50% different for a shorter rider with a ~65cm saddle height. But most 'professional' publications / organizations just review one size. Anyway, sorry for the wall of text. Carry on!
Hi Joe, great points. I make no pretenses that the XL size has the optimum layup. Im not sure i know any Taiwanese friends over 1.8m! But hopefully being Giant theyve tailored the layup accordingly. Who knows. I know in Liv, they've gone to lengths to reduce stiffness and add compliance. Which makes total sense as women are generally lighter so thus the traction model works differently.
Regarding STA, my effective seat angle here with the clamp flipped and saddle pushed forward is 74.4 deg which is pretty much perfect for me. My walty will have a 75 deg STA.
@@PeakTorque I think most companies design the M and then kind of extrapolate out from there. A rather rash statement but I believe the M of any frame is probably optimum. Would be nice to be 'normal' I guess! It'd be nice to see BB height drop as sizes drop under the assumption that riders would be using shorter cranks, but A) you can't guarantee they'll actually use shorter cranks and B) that would require more unique rear triangle molds and many manufacturers share the rear molds for as many sizes as possible to save costs. But... As you say, Waltly to the rescue. ;) What's your Mayday plans? Can you guys ride in the mainland these days or..?
@@PeakTorque Any news regarding your walty (waltly?) ? Would love to know what choices you made when getting to design a bike from scratch. Coming from someone with the same height as you, this would be doubly interesting for me personally
Awesome review. It's great how you quantify your opinions, as best as you can without destructive testing and a testing lab, with solid physics. Thanks.
Hey mate, what would be your pick between the two models below and why? Would love to hear your thoughts. 1. Tcr advanced sl 1 disc 2020 2. Tcr advanced pro 0 disc 2021 The 2021 model (pro 0) has more aero shape but sl 1 2020 is stiffer and better carbon.
Looking for a Giant TCR. It looks like you have had a few versions. Great to get you to share about the bikes pro's, cons, which one has been best for you and why etc. Cheers
Thanks I just ordered the black 2020 team version of this frameset and will be building it with di2, quarq power meter, and a pretty rad integrated front end. I'll take some pictures when it's done!
Have rode both bikes, not going to lie I’m biased to Giants but I love the TCR have owned three so far the SL is a different beast, the most stiff bike I’ve ever rode that’s also comfy enough to ride centuries on!
Did you weigh the levers? I am surprised you say dt swiss are lighter than the giant. As per what i have weighed giant is at 66g rear axle 56 gr front axle and from internet findings dt swiss around there as well. Thanks
why not go for a size large with a longer stem and not have your saddle all the way forward? Wouldn't that be stiffer/lighter? Im 6'4" and pondering this question for my next frame.
TCRs are generally an ok bike for carbon, id be putting rim brakes on them to save weight. no need for Disc unless MTB gravel or riding in the rain a lot.
Really liked the in depth review! What is your take on the new TCR 2021 compared to your model? Do you see added value/improvements or same old same old?
Surley stiff fork doesn't modulate the disc rotor less ? Or at all . I am sure it may modulate a skidding tyre throwing weight forward ? Ie the compliance has no effect on locking the wheel but can delay forward weight fling ? May need more explanation for my under mechanical engineering educated mind. Interesting channel btw
I’m 6’3’’ 91 kg. I received my large TCR advanced last autumn. In less than 150 kilo, the frame cracked right next to the seatpost. Received another frame a month later and it broke at the same place after only one ride. Both of the bike were bike fited by my local shop. Finally, I will get an XL after being it recommended by giant. I hope it wont break again…
How's the handling of the TCR compared to the Supersix Evo and Cervelo S2? Curious because I've considered getting a TCR and currently have the latter two.
I really enjoy your channel, its great to get proper unbiased, educated content. I have a dilemma, I am trading up and can afford a rim brake sl 2020 or a disc brake advanced pro, what in your opinion is the better bike?
Yo, Peaky. I’ve been looking at frame geometries over the last couple of days. I saw your video ages ago where you compare seat tube angle on your S2 and CAAD10 and explain the effect ST angle has on real reach. Watched it again but I seem to remember you going into even more detail on same in another vid. Where yo describe the effect that a degree either way can have. Is that the case or am I dreaming? Point me to the vid if it exists please. Cheers 👍
Fore/aft difference in saddle position can be calc'd buy (saddle height x tan(difference in seat tube angle)). Example. 845xtan(1.5) = 22mm further forward for a 1.5deg steeper STA.
grest review - the explaining part about the disc brakes at the end was very interesting. thanks. ...great bike, btw. fancyfancy :) ...would you recommend a lower grade TCR (e.g. Advanced pro) with rimbrakes, too?
Great video. Lots of useful info:) I've been looking at the Propel for my next bike but now I'm worried it won't take 28mm tyres well, is that true? I need my 28's and that would be a deal breaker.
I have the 2018 TCR SL 1 rim and a 2019 TCR Adv Pro 0 Disc. Honestly, weight aside, I think I prefer the quality of the ride on the 2019 Adv Pro 0 Disc. I find the SL (on clincher rims/tyres) transmits a lot more road noise through the frame. Can't decide whether to chop the SL for a new 2021 TCR when they arrive or replace my older 2016 Propel Adv Pro 0 for a newer Propel! The one bike I'm not changing is the Trinity....
YOU CAN NOT GET A AETUP FROM HOW OTHERS HAVE SET THEIR BIKE UP A set up is very personal and has very little to do with grouping people into heights Go to a bike fitter or watch bike fitter videos Your torso, limb lengths are different, different hip displacement, everything thing is different to people Measure twice but once, please take this advice
@Peak Torque, for my Giant 2011 a cutting tool was included but for the TCR 2021 there isn't anymore. I need to cut another 2mm and your printer tool would help a lot. Is it possible to get the data for 3D printing or the tool itself?
Hey Peak Torque, quick question: Do you think the frame can fit a 32mm (measured) tire? So close to pushing the button on the frameset, but I like big fat tires. :)
Hi @Peak Torque, just ordered the stl file for the isp cutting guide. Will print it from PLA, quick question here, what infill density should I use, or it doesn't really matter?! Thanks! 😊
I’m on a trek emonda frame now but have been definitely considering a tcr. I ride my emonda on lots of big rides as well. How does the tcr do for big rides as far as comfort?
Do you think that the position of the calipers in rim vs disk would have any sort of lever effect over the fork and therefore peak braking performance? I only have rim brakes and while in most situations I can lock the front wheel if I apply enough force, I wonder if the greater polar moment on the fork might cause the rear wheel to lift marginally earlier on rim brake bikes.
I'm not an engineer so cannot get my head around it but I agree that it is easier to lift the rear wheel on a rim brake set up. I would do this often on rim brake bikes but cannot ever remember lifting the rear on disc bikes. I find discs modulate speed well but are not as good for emergency stopping...when you really want to stop or slow right down from speed they are lacking. I think there is a lot of wind-up in the front wheel. I'm only 70kg and have used 32 and 28 spoke 3- cross front wheels and both still have a good but of flex when braking.
Hi. What stem length do you use? I have Focus Paralane 2017 in xxl, which looks quite similar in geo. I'd like to use it as well for iron 70.3 with aerobars. Already have saddle Spec Power moved forward and 0mm seatpost. Bow tying to find the good stem length. Looks like it should be shorter than for endurance to have proper elbows angle. Please advise.
Best review 🏆most informative and well thought out with pertinent and relevant information 👍I ride a large the seat tube length is a bit shorter than I like but I’m gonna give it some more time before I decide to switch out the frame for another disc sl frame or a tarmac frame. I’m gonna ride it as is til the shops open back up so I can test ride. Right now I’m using the 5 spacer and I’m at the safe line but still want a bit more saddle height
I use a cannondale synapse size 61 with an allu frame. My hand barely fits around the downtube at the widest point but it think its a cool look just like the tcr's downtube
Hi can you review Scott addict rc. scott seems to not update their bikes very often like other brands that come up with something every year. Is it because Scott nail their layup the first time. And thief hmx frames seem to be much cheaper than other brands.
I think the road bike industry should have kept the post mount brake standard from MTB. I have both kinds of brake system on 2 of my road bikes and the older post mount system is a lot easier to adjust and more powerful. The only difference is weight and maybe aero efficiency.
Glad to see this review. I guess with those thru axles, you won't be needing your Dura Ace QR's anymore? I run a retirement home for senior QR skewers and can offer them a good run out on my 2019 Adv SL to remind the world of their utter porn status :) Glad you're enjoying the SL. For the money it is insanely good.
In regards to my previous post I’m 188cm with approx 85cm inseam I think my seat tube length is 79cm but I don’t know if it’s uncut or someone cut it and just did a great job it looks to be uncut. I do want more saddle height because I feel my heels dropping and my knees are more bent than I like. I may try to get a bike fit once everything opens back up too before I decide to buy anything
What makes you not try one of the asian/chinese branded bike frames? The wheels hold up and you seem to rate highly enough, would you not try to test a chinese brand bike e.g. Winspace/YoeLeo etc..? If no lt why
1. I've tried a few. Not found them to be very stiff or confidence inspiring for heavier riders. There's no brand pushing them to a stiffness spec. 2. Geometry for tall riders can be weird. 3. Giant own their own factories, make their own carbon. There is no conflict of interest like other big brands using cheap factories.
@@PeakTorque Ah ok I get that for taller riders it could be harder with the geometry after looking at the charts. I was looking at getting one, not sure which as a project bike to fiddle with because the framesets are cheap but i'm 62kg at 5ft9 so could be a better shout. Its just hard to make a decision not being there or talking to riders using them etc..
Dwight out of interest, what brands are you looking at? I’m researching some Chinese alternatives too. Many of which don’t sell to Europe though. Elves look decent and Rollingstone also (although branding on the latter is gash in my opinion)
@@lasrachtech.1341 I don't have a lot of experience and haven't tested anything but Chinese wheels before. I have a teambike that's a non-aero bike and was looking at a Chinese aero bike to just see how fast I could make it cheaply to throw at some races (when they start again) when I go off the Island. Frames I looked at were: Winspace (Tested by a Minsk Conti Team & Pro Conti NZ Team - I follow one of them on Instagram and he seems pleased with the frame, can't say much for build quality from that though) As well as Yoeleo R9 and Pardus Virus. Like PeakTorque says though he is tall and heavier and I'm 5"8 and weigh 63kg so don't have the same limiters to test potentially. I'll report back if I do buy one and test it, am kind of close to buying an older aero frame from Scott on the cheap cheap right now so might not have to.
Winspace & Yoeleo don't seem to have Font that's to bad. Actually Winspace do, they have one font on the logo's that's OK and the other that looks like it's out of wackyracers. I think you tend to find in Asia they like the short, sharp, cool fonts and bike names like Hyper, Virus, Python, Tiger idk etc.. haha but IMO that's not a major drawback I don't really care
The disc fork must be stiffer plus heavier as breaking forces are concentrated at the hub whereas on the rim version the breaking forces are transmitted into the head of the fork via the brake caliper. I'd guess the rim fork must be more compliant with less material needed. Be interested interested to know if there are any aerodynamic advantages, if any of different seat stay arrangements. I suspect marketing b.s. Enjoyed the review.
@@fnm441 sort of correct. But if you draw the free body diagram, the braking force from rim or discs manifests as an increase in tyre friction at the contact patch with the road. Thats the biggest bending load in both cases. You can google 'braking free body diagram'.
That's a really nice paintwork on that bike, but that bar tape looks awful. Like somebody wrapped a towel round it. A bloke as tall as the Empire State building cares about aero features of the frame set?
Sorry, but disc brake modulation has a lot to do with the actual brakes themselves. Go back to the early days of disc brakes on mountain bikes and witness the vast differences in modulation between brands. Disc design, heat dissipation, lever stroke vs caliper piston stroke, fluid expansion, friction levels and performance when heated characteristics of the pads.... all of these factors are major influences on braking modulation. Lucky for roadies theyve missed the old days of disc brakes which were basically just on and off, then when the brakes would heat up they'd either go spongy or like wood and basically lock up!
I currently weigh 104 kilo. I started at 128 kilo and have been riding a Cannondale SuperSix Highmod. I was nervous also but I got an amazing deal on the bike, so I took a chance. It hasn't caused any problems at all with the frame. I broke a couple of spokes, so I went with some heavier duty wheels until my weight came down to where it is now. (But still not using really lightweight wheels.) I think you would be more than ok on this bike.
@@dioright I actually did. Not every ride, but enough to be annoying. I went to 28c tires and pumped them up pretty high. I have tubeless on my new wheels. That has helped a great deal
It's good to finally hear someone giving a review of a bike that's over 6'0" tall...
I'm 6'4" and 89 kgs not far off him - its great to get a tall review
I’m 6’4” and 105 kegs. Brilliant to see other tall trees are out there.
6’4” 93kg 💪
Hi! What size frame do you use? I'm 6'1" with 37.5" inseam and I'm looking for the right size for me.
@@osiem_gwiazdek I would recommend a large size if you’re planning to purchase a Giant bike. Nonetheless, your best option would be to stop by your local GIANT dealership and test ride a bike. Best of luck.
By far the best comparison of rim vs disc I've heard: 12:45. Cracking bike, I rode the rim brake version for a hilly/technical tri course last year and the handling/braking really stood out to me. Keep up the great content!
First time I have seen one your video .... I love the fact you explain the highly technical stuff a way people will understand. Great job. Liked and subscribed.
Nice bike my man. Still loving my 2018 TCR Advanced 1. Hell of a bike for the money.
Magnificent Giant TCR ADV SL,sublime colour and awesome built.Great channel to,no pretentiousness and pompous attitude like other so called bike guru's,and you're clean shaven like me Thanks again for a great channel.Cheers.👍
Cheers, Reinhold!
It's funny how the subdued branding gives it a nude, audacious - as opposed to shy - demeanor. Nice bike.
I bought the 2021 disc version. Without a doubt the best bike I have ever owned.
Interesting point about compliance. I found that I was able to drop my tyre pressure by 5 psi and I got even better traction and it grips corners at greater speed and under brakes.
I'm 6'2" and ride the 2019 rim ML. Great bike. Very smooth, compliant and stiff under pedalling (1450W max) and braking loads. Mine's 6.9kg with Dura Ace mechanical and 45mm DT rims. My main criticism is lack of torsional stiffness under hard cornering. I weigh 76kg, but corner hard (ex motorbike racer). I suspect the twist is coming from the fork. There's some odd steering geometry too. Not as good as Spesh Tarmac, Colnago C series or Helium SL in that regard. But otherwise a very good bike and properly engineered. 30mm tyres? Eh?
Nice to see and hear a review of bike that’s not a medium size. I currently have a 2016 TCR SL . Great video...
I have been waiting for so long for this!
Thanks for your review mate! It well and truly looks like a weapon. I'm glad you touched on the braking. Other than the slight weight penalty, I've been concerned about stories of rub involving disc brakes so glad to hear your view. The Advanced Pro 1 I rode felt great with disc brakes. I feel like if you went disc and weight weenied everything else, you could get to 7kg without pedals and sillyness in the front end with integrated bullshit. GVA's TCR is basically 6.5kg (according to GCN) with all the CADEX gear and the CCC team bikes generally seem to be light enough they can go deep dish and still be right on the limit.
I had no idea how important it is to get that cut right on the ISP because I'm riding out on an Advanced Pro 0 propel right now. My only complaint about that mechanism is setting seat angle if you don't have a saddle cut-out can be trial and error. I'm already stressin' about getting the ISP right and have decided I first need to get the saddle right and getting a fitter. The Fabric Scoop has enough padding to add a few mm give or take.
Lastly, I'd love to seen an objective view based on the information now about what you think of the new 2021 TCR's, even if it's just a short web-based review. You can see weights and detailed published on the JP site:
www.giant.co.jp/giant20/bike_select.php?c_code=CA01&f_code=FD01&s_code=SR38
GREAT review! can you do a more detailed technical discussion on how the frame/wheel system affects braking performance? would love to learn more
Hey. Yes but i first need to re-visit my vehicle dynamics theory from university days!
This would be great, i have a cube cyclo-cross bike, it's great off road, but when using it on the road the brakes are just too grabby. I have a steep descent after leaving my house onto a main road. I have to be more careful and start breaking early on the disk bike than on my carbon wheeled rim bike. The point of probably slowing the bike down without locking up the rear wheel is so hard to find. Obs this bike is built as a cross racer so is stiff so it's not the bikes fault, I'm using it in a way not intended. And my rim bike is a very nice bike. But still.
@12:33 The seat clamp has been redesigned for the 2021 model (it comes with two clamps - a short and a longer one). Apparently it's a bit lighter and "A proprietary 3M adhesive protector has also been added to the clamping section of the integrated seatpost, in a bid to help with weight saving without sacrificing strength and security due of the ‘thinness’ of the paint process." Curious to see what that actually means in real life when they finally hit the shops.
Do you know if they are backwards compatible?
@@m4punisher25 I've got a strong feeling they're not. From what I've seen the new seatpost now has a "truncated" profile and the old one had the teardrop shape. cdn-cyclingtips.pressidium.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/2021-Giant-TCR-Advanced-SL-Disc-tube-profiles-1.jpg
I've been eyeing Giant as my next bike & I think I'm going to stay away from the ISP & stick with traditional seatposts - the downsides of ISP just don't seem worth it to me. The $ saved is also pretty sweet
You can't go wrong with either. But the non isp is definitely more practical.
Great review! I rate GIANT bikes. Some clever blokes (and girls) working there for sure. I wish the TCR was kept a bit more traditional though, IE: normal seat post. It looks like you wish you could put the saddle further forward, but obviously you don't have a choice of changing to a zero-offset seatpost or flipping around a negative offset seatpost, etc. Is your fit compromised? Or does it fit perfectly with the saddle rammed all the way forwards? (I also end up ramming my saddle all the way forwards on most of my builds, not for reach issues, but for 'getting over the BB' in a way I feel I can pedal efficiently.) Also... you mention a couple of things that most reviewers don't talk about - couldn't agree more. I think bike reviewers are really lacking behind. The fact that a single guy with 4k subscribers can do a better job that a company with 100+ employees and many more resources is quite embarrassing. Another thing I think that's overlooked is frame sizes. I imagine an XS (or XXS) build of this bike would ride TOTALLY differently. Not just the geometery for the headtube agles, fork trail, etc. (Most manufacturers will at most use two different fork sizes throughout the range, meaning XXS and XXL are basically shoe-horned in with less than ideal forks to match their head tube angles) But also from a layup and leverage point of view. The XXS head-tube would probably be totally different and even stiffer (again, layup depending) but especially that ISP. The ratio of ISP to seat tube would probably be almost 50% different for a shorter rider with a ~65cm saddle height. But most 'professional' publications / organizations just review one size. Anyway, sorry for the wall of text. Carry on!
Hi Joe, great points. I make no pretenses that the XL size has the optimum layup. Im not sure i know any Taiwanese friends over 1.8m! But hopefully being Giant theyve tailored the layup accordingly. Who knows. I know in Liv, they've gone to lengths to reduce stiffness and add compliance. Which makes total sense as women are generally lighter so thus the traction model works differently.
Regarding STA, my effective seat angle here with the clamp flipped and saddle pushed forward is 74.4 deg which is pretty much perfect for me. My walty will have a 75 deg STA.
@@PeakTorque I think most companies design the M and then kind of extrapolate out from there. A rather rash statement but I believe the M of any frame is probably optimum. Would be nice to be 'normal' I guess! It'd be nice to see BB height drop as sizes drop under the assumption that riders would be using shorter cranks, but A) you can't guarantee they'll actually use shorter cranks and B) that would require more unique rear triangle molds and many manufacturers share the rear molds for as many sizes as possible to save costs. But... As you say, Waltly to the rescue. ;) What's your Mayday plans? Can you guys ride in the mainland these days or..?
@@PeakTorque Any news regarding your walty (waltly?) ? Would love to know what choices you made when getting to design a bike from scratch. Coming from someone with the same height as you, this would be doubly interesting for me personally
Awesome review. It's great how you quantify your opinions, as best as you can without destructive testing and a testing lab, with solid physics. Thanks.
Hey mate, what would be your pick between the two models below and why? Would love to hear your thoughts.
1. Tcr advanced sl 1 disc 2020
2. Tcr advanced pro 0 disc 2021
The 2021 model (pro 0) has more aero shape but sl 1 2020 is stiffer and better carbon.
Great review.. an actual review and not simple regurgitations of vendor datasheet like other channels.
Looking for a Giant TCR. It looks like you have had a few versions. Great to get you to share about the bikes pro's, cons, which one has been best for you and why etc. Cheers
After purchasing my first Giant, I'm pleasantly surprised by how good it is!
Thanks I just ordered the black 2020 team version of this frameset and will be building it with di2, quarq power meter, and a pretty rad integrated front end. I'll take some pictures when it's done!
7.7kg is excellent for disc brake considering the size of the frame and those rims
More bling than those Ferraris down at Shek O last weekend!
Wait this guy is based in hk ?
I have a Trek Emonda....looking at the TCR......love the frame colour..very good review...you answered many of the questions i have!
Have rode both bikes, not going to lie I’m biased to Giants but I love the TCR have owned three so far the SL is a different beast, the most stiff bike I’ve ever rode that’s also comfy enough to ride centuries on!
Did you weigh the levers? I am surprised you say dt swiss are lighter than the giant. As per what i have weighed giant is at 66g rear axle 56 gr front axle and from internet findings dt swiss around there as well.
Thanks
why not go for a size large with a longer stem and not have your saddle all the way forward? Wouldn't that be stiffer/lighter? Im 6'4" and pondering this question for my next frame.
TCRs are generally an ok bike for carbon, id be putting rim brakes on them to save weight. no need for Disc unless MTB gravel or riding in the rain a lot.
Really liked the in depth review! What is your take on the new TCR 2021 compared to your model? Do you see added value/improvements or same old same old?
Honestly, very little difference. I see the only improvements are possibly the seat clamp and front brake routing. The aero claims are v ambiguous.
Surley stiff fork doesn't modulate the disc rotor less ? Or at all . I am sure it may modulate a skidding tyre throwing weight forward ? Ie the compliance has no effect on locking the wheel but can delay forward weight fling ? May need more explanation for my under mechanical engineering educated mind. Interesting channel btw
Great review. Thinking of getting this frame. Could you tell me if it will support mechanical group sets? Can't find out online...
I’m 6’3’’ 91 kg. I received my large TCR advanced last autumn. In less than 150 kilo, the frame cracked right next to the seatpost. Received another frame a month later and it broke at the same place after only one ride. Both of the bike were bike fited by my local shop. Finally, I will get an XL after being it recommended by giant. I hope it wont break again…
Think the seat post clamp was overtightened?
What do you mean with frame Crack? The carbon itself split?
Tcr looks good. what is the weight of the wheelset without skewers?
How's the handling of the TCR compared to the Supersix Evo and Cervelo S2? Curious because I've considered getting a TCR and currently have the latter two.
Thanks for the review. Very informative video about TCR also learnt alot traction come under compliance
I really enjoy your channel, its great to get proper unbiased, educated content. I have a dilemma, I am trading up and can afford a rim brake sl 2020 or a disc brake advanced pro, what in your opinion is the better bike?
good bike! what is your iseam? and what is your seat height from bb center? and what is the length of your crank? beacase i also use tcr xl size
when you stand back the colour of the bike looks goldy, but up close it looks green...?
Yes, it is color shift paint.
what a stunning bike, congrats. what's the finish of wheelset, glossy? i want to get light-bicycle too, but i'd prefer a matte look.
Gloss yes.
Yo, Peaky. I’ve been looking at frame geometries over the last couple of days. I saw your video ages ago where you compare seat tube angle on your S2 and CAAD10 and explain the effect ST angle has on real reach. Watched it again but I seem to remember you going into even more detail on same in another vid. Where yo describe the effect that a degree either way can have. Is that the case or am I dreaming? Point me to the vid if it exists please. Cheers 👍
Fore/aft difference in saddle position can be calc'd buy (saddle height x tan(difference in seat tube angle)). Example. 845xtan(1.5) = 22mm further forward for a 1.5deg steeper STA.
Peak Torque A1 thanks boss 👍
Wish I could afford a bike with a nice paint job. Riding xmas trees all my life.
Yh the assholes never put a nice paintjob on lower tier models. Pisses me off.
thanks for this review, how much was the frameset ?
grest review - the explaining part about the disc brakes at the end was very interesting. thanks. ...great bike, btw. fancyfancy :) ...would you recommend a lower grade TCR (e.g. Advanced pro) with rimbrakes, too?
Absolutely yes. I also rife the Adv Pro rim brake. Probably the best value all rounder out there.
Great video. Lots of useful info:) I've been looking at the Propel for my next bike but now I'm worried it won't take 28mm tyres well, is that true? I need my 28's and that would be a deal breaker.
No thankyou will be tight on the new one at the seatstays. Fork and chainstay should be fine but seatstays....google some pics
Out of topic. How do you find the 100% s2 glasses? The black lens is good for road cycling? Or is the prizm road from oakley better? Thanks
I have the 2018 TCR SL 1 rim and a 2019 TCR Adv Pro 0 Disc. Honestly, weight aside, I think I prefer the quality of the ride on the 2019 Adv Pro 0 Disc. I find the SL (on clincher rims/tyres) transmits a lot more road noise through the frame. Can't decide whether to chop the SL for a new 2021 TCR when they arrive or replace my older 2016 Propel Adv Pro 0 for a newer Propel! The one bike I'm not changing is the Trinity....
I agree. The Pro definitely feels a bit softer.
Are you actually making a peak tourque frame? As I want one
these new giant paint schemes are lit, the advanced pro frameset's chameleon saturn is a beauty.
Would love to see an update after 3000k’s or whatever distance you think is best!
Beautiful bike! I just bought a 3t Strada and need to adjust my fit. i am 1.88 m tall. Can I ask what the stem length on your bike is?
YOU CAN NOT GET A AETUP FROM HOW OTHERS HAVE SET THEIR BIKE UP
A set up is very personal and has very little to do with grouping people into heights
Go to a bike fitter or watch bike fitter videos
Your torso, limb lengths are different, different hip displacement, everything thing is different to people
Measure twice but once, please take this advice
@Peak Torque, for my Giant 2011 a cutting tool was included but for the TCR 2021 there isn't anymore. I need to cut another 2mm and your printer tool would help a lot. Is it possible to get the data for 3D printing or the tool itself?
Big fan of TCR although I’ve only owned rim. I really dislike that colour scheme though! The lack of branding is welcome, however.
Amazing review keep doing reviews ,very good info here and facts 🤓
Do pro teams really put extra weights? Are deeper wheels not enough?
Hey Peak Torque, quick question: Do you think the frame can fit a 32mm (measured) tire? So close to pushing the button on the frameset, but I like big fat tires. :)
Phoebe Tan definitely not. They wont fit. The diameter will be the problem at the fork!
@@PeakTorque Thanks for the reply (and the awesome content!) Aww shucks. 2021 TCR it is I guess.
Hey PT, Will the appropriate Hambini BB (Shimano) fit this frame? is there clearance to pass it through the frame?
What do you expect from upcoming Canyon Aeroad 2021?
Hi @Peak Torque, just ordered the stl file for the isp cutting guide. Will print it from PLA, quick question here, what infill density should I use, or it doesn't really matter?! Thanks! 😊
Great I'll send it over! Thanks. PlA is fine! Anything above 40% will work. You don't need to clamp it that tight.
I really like the Blue/Red paint on the new 2021 SL Disc, going to wait for some retina searing neon before I take the plunge though.
Save money and buy a 2020. They're almost identical.
@@PeakTorque Nah I'd rather go for a 2018 (green). It's similar enough to the 2020.
2021 road frame is much more Aero, nice review thanks
What's the reach on that handlebar?? Looks deep!!
Such a damn fine bike! Thanks for the review. Do i need to rob a bank to afford a bike like this?
The heaviest part of this bike model is the seat post clamp. Damn heavy it is.
How does the tcr sl ride as compared to your supersix hi mod?
What was the skewers you upgraded to??
Love really in depth talks like this
I’m on a trek emonda frame now but have been definitely considering a tcr. I ride my emonda on lots of big rides as well. How does the tcr do for big rides as far as comfort?
I'll take my TCR over the Propel for longer rides anyday... definitely an all-day kinda bike
I have found my TCR to be a very comfortable bike. Ride quality is excellent!
Good, but I've not ridden an emonda
Do you think that the position of the calipers in rim vs disk would have any sort of lever effect over the fork and therefore peak braking performance? I only have rim brakes and while in most situations I can lock the front wheel if I apply enough force, I wonder if the greater polar moment on the fork might cause the rear wheel to lift marginally earlier on rim brake bikes.
I'm not an engineer so cannot get my head around it but I agree that it is easier to lift the rear wheel on a rim brake set up. I would do this often on rim brake bikes but cannot ever remember lifting the rear on disc bikes. I find discs modulate speed well but are not as good for emergency stopping...when you really want to stop or slow right down from speed they are lacking. I think there is a lot of wind-up in the front wheel. I'm only 70kg and have used 32 and 28 spoke 3- cross front wheels and both still have a good but of flex when braking.
Would you mind sharing the excel where you compared the bikes? :)
Hi. What stem length do you use? I have Focus Paralane 2017 in xxl, which looks quite similar in geo. I'd like to use it as well for iron 70.3 with aerobars. Already have saddle Spec Power moved forward and 0mm seatpost. Bow tying to find the good stem length. Looks like it should be shorter than for endurance to have proper elbows angle. Please advise.
I use 120 but for tri bars you'll want shorter yes. Send me a pic of your bike fit. Address in about tab. Cheers
I really like your glasses. Can you please tell the brand of the glasses?
100%
What happens if you change your saddle and need to adjust the height again? Or sell it on on 2nd hand? 🤔
Rims always because weight is the KING.
Best review 🏆most informative and well thought out with pertinent and relevant information 👍I ride a large the seat tube length is a bit shorter than I like but I’m gonna give it some more time before I decide to switch out the frame for another disc sl frame or a tarmac frame. I’m gonna ride it as is til the shops open back up so I can test ride. Right now I’m using the 5 spacer and I’m at the safe line but still want a bit more saddle height
What height are you? I'm 6'3'' and am torn between L and XL
@@keithcameron192 sorry for the late response I'm 6'1.75 85cm. I'd recommend the large unless you're very long in your torso or arms
Have you traveled with the ISP seatpost yet? How easy is it to pack into a travel case?
Yes i have. It fits fine in my polaris bike pod with cranks removed.
i had tcr in the past, problem i have with the bike is how wobbly it is and also... it doesnt look like designer cared about how it looks
Hey champ, looking at Light Bicycle wheels myself - Which rim did you go for? Im trying to decide between the AR46 and AR56 for 28mm tyres
On ISP, where do you grab it on a stand to do service? I like this but supersix wins specially the High MOd.
I'd probably just rest the top tube in the stand, unclamped.
I use a cannondale synapse size 61 with an allu frame. My hand barely fits around the downtube at the widest point but it think its a cool look just like the tcr's downtube
Hi can you review Scott addict rc.
scott seems to not update their bikes very often like other brands that come up with something every year. Is it because Scott nail their layup the first time. And thief hmx frames seem to be much cheaper than other brands.
Hey. Sorry I've no experience with Scott.
Good to hear a review that isn’t just reading a list of basic stock components from a website.
How are the light bicycle wheels potentially thinking of buying a pair ?
Only purchased the rims but they're great
I think the road bike industry should have kept the post mount brake standard from MTB. I have both kinds of brake system on 2 of my road bikes and the older post mount system is a lot easier to adjust and more powerful. The only difference is weight and maybe aero efficiency.
Glad to see this review. I guess with those thru axles, you won't be needing your Dura Ace QR's anymore? I run a retirement home for senior QR skewers and can offer them a good run out on my 2019 Adv SL to remind the world of their utter porn status :)
Glad you're enjoying the SL. For the money it is insanely good.
Still got the DA skewers for the rim bike :)
In regards to my previous post I’m 188cm with approx 85cm inseam I think my seat tube length is 79cm but I don’t know if it’s uncut or someone cut it and just did a great job it looks to be uncut. I do want more saddle height because I feel my heels dropping and my knees are more bent than I like. I may try to get a bike fit once everything opens back up too before I decide to buy anything
I looks like your saddle is slammed forward on the rails , and the nose tilt is extreme degree down.
What makes you not try one of the asian/chinese branded bike frames? The wheels hold up and you seem to rate highly enough, would you not try to test a chinese brand bike e.g. Winspace/YoeLeo etc..? If no lt why
1. I've tried a few. Not found them to be very stiff or confidence inspiring for heavier riders. There's no brand pushing them to a stiffness spec.
2. Geometry for tall riders can be weird.
3. Giant own their own factories, make their own carbon. There is no conflict of interest like other big brands using cheap factories.
@@PeakTorque Ah ok I get that for taller riders it could be harder with the geometry after looking at the charts. I was looking at getting one, not sure which as a project bike to fiddle with because the framesets are cheap but i'm 62kg at 5ft9 so could be a better shout. Its just hard to make a decision not being there or talking to riders using them etc..
Dwight out of interest, what brands are you looking at? I’m researching some Chinese alternatives too. Many of which don’t sell to Europe though. Elves look decent and Rollingstone also (although branding on the latter is gash in my opinion)
@@lasrachtech.1341 I don't have a lot of experience and haven't tested anything but Chinese wheels before. I have a teambike that's a non-aero bike and was looking at a Chinese aero bike to just see how fast I could make it cheaply to throw at some races (when they start again) when I go off the Island. Frames I looked at were: Winspace (Tested by a Minsk Conti Team & Pro Conti NZ Team - I follow one of them on Instagram and he seems pleased with the frame, can't say much for build quality from that though) As well as Yoeleo R9 and Pardus Virus. Like PeakTorque says though he is tall and heavier and I'm 5"8 and weigh 63kg so don't have the same limiters to test potentially. I'll report back if I do buy one and test it, am kind of close to buying an older aero frame from Scott on the cheap cheap right now so might not have to.
Winspace & Yoeleo don't seem to have Font that's to bad. Actually Winspace do, they have one font on the logo's that's OK and the other that looks like it's out of wackyracers. I think you tend to find in Asia they like the short, sharp, cool fonts and bike names like Hyper, Virus, Python, Tiger idk etc.. haha but IMO that's not a major drawback I don't really care
How have the disc brakes changed your descending/cornering technique versus rim?
Later braking, more supple and relaxed upper body. Less tense on steep technical dh
The disc fork must be stiffer plus heavier as breaking forces are concentrated at the hub whereas on the rim version the breaking forces are transmitted into the head of the fork via the brake caliper. I'd guess the rim fork must be more compliant with less material needed. Be interested interested to know if there are any aerodynamic advantages, if any of different seat stay arrangements. I suspect marketing b.s. Enjoyed the review.
@@fnm441 sort of correct. But if you draw the free body diagram, the braking force from rim or discs manifests as an increase in tyre friction at the contact patch with the road. Thats the biggest bending load in both cases. You can google 'braking free body diagram'.
@@PeakTorque would you still choose the disc brake version or would you say that overall ride characteristics are similarly good on the rim brake TCR?
So much about the disc brake compliance. ABS disc brakes would be next. 😂😂
What is the brand of the light on the handle bar?
14:10 which is exactly what's causing the crashes in pro racing right now
I’m a one bike geezer. Santa Cruz Chameleon. Good channel.
Like the choice of brand for wheels
Proper review 👌 👏 👍 🙌 thanks 🙏
That's a really nice paintwork on that bike, but that bar tape looks awful. Like somebody wrapped a towel round it. A bloke as tall as the Empire State building cares about aero features of the frame set?
I might have missed it, but what size frame is this built on???
XL
Peak Torque cheers captain 👍🏻
Hello, can I ask this giant tcr isp XL size bike frame if no cut , how tall is the BB c to top of the seat post? Thx 🙏🏻
From memory, i think about 85cm
@@PeakTorque thx very much 😀
Excellent review!!!!
Sorry, but disc brake modulation has a lot to do with the actual brakes themselves. Go back to the early days of disc brakes on mountain bikes and witness the vast differences in modulation between brands. Disc design, heat dissipation, lever stroke vs caliper piston stroke, fluid expansion, friction levels and performance when heated characteristics of the pads.... all of these factors are major influences on braking modulation. Lucky for roadies theyve missed the old days of disc brakes which were basically just on and off, then when the brakes would heat up they'd either go spongy or like wood and basically lock up!
How the heck a normal user should be able to cur that clamp right?
89 kilo? I was sceptic on a lightweight frames, but if it's work for you them it's pretty robust.
I currently weigh 104 kilo. I started at 128 kilo and have been riding a Cannondale SuperSix Highmod. I was nervous also but I got an amazing deal on the bike, so I took a chance. It hasn't caused any problems at all with the frame. I broke a couple of spokes, so I went with some heavier duty wheels until my weight came down to where it is now. (But still not using really lightweight wheels.) I think you would be more than ok on this bike.
@@DaveCM You probably suffered from pinchflats?
@@dioright I actually did. Not every ride, but enough to be annoying. I went to 28c tires and pumped them up pretty high. I have tubeless on my new wheels. That has helped a great deal
whoa giant now ship their wheels with tune hubs? 😂