Yeah it almost sounds like he wasn't actually getting offers at the specific time. Why would Mixer give millions of dollars right before closing? I'd be pissed too.
so lying about a deal that isnt even on the table or a thought in existence to get paid more money by your employer, and the employer doing something about it... MAKES THEM AHOLES!? Sounds like you should never be incharge of any business.
LOL bro it was fantastic how players like Z and others were playing all Doc's original music during that tourney... big F U to the Purple Snake slumlords.
lmaoaoao petty?????? i hope you are no where near the inner workings of any business. Getting screwed over for more money and doing something about it, isnt petty in the slightest.
@@anorx5848 if they can do this to one of the top streamers , purposely change policy and because of their reach , ban him from Call of duty tournaments.. yeah petty is a good work to use for a billion dollar company .. wonder who they will choose to cancel next for the hell of it
@@slllyy4985 they do not have "weird sexist to men rules" lmaooo i bet you the majority of the company is men i really doubt theyre discriminating against their own gender why the hell would they
This has always made the most sense, seeing his agency and sponsors stuck with him, if it was something else bad, his agency and sponsors would have dropped him.
THIS x10000000 You guys really think Doc's many sponsors would stick with him if he had done something truly offensive, like sexual harrassment? Yet nearly all of them remain. Funny the ones who did bail on him, seem to be all companies with very close ties to Twitch.. such as COD not giving him a creator code. Such as a recent tourney not allowing him in...
COD dropped him as a partner and won't even send him keys. But the people who make COD are a bunch of cowards and probably don't know why he was banned either.
@@YungGupta still remember like it was yesterday. Everyone was speculating where he is gonna reincarnate. Of course he took his spot at the tippety top back right off the bat. GET EM OUT!!!??
@@Sader2 why are you even here if you don’t understand memes/ references/ internet culture. So far 68 other people understand and agree. Educate yourself.
than why is twitch not just saying it... why are they stil say "he knows" and nothing more. stil doesn't ad up. there is something why twitch doesn't want to say why, the same for the doc if he knows. there is a whole lot of ego on the line with this one.
Agreed. Just say breach of contract, end of story. Unless of course because of the big money involved and all the legal mess proving anything was they can’t say. But if it is that then doc and his legal team 100% would know this.
@@willallclasses8585 but then the question come why would doc just ignore it. thats why it so fishy .... and also why "we" wil never know about it. there are to many loose ends. you can make a tv show out of this one XD ....
Not really. Story dont add up. Was doc negotiating with twitch saying mixer offered more. Or did twitch get mad doc was talking to mixer without them knowing?
100% agree. they often tried to keep him to the side as he didn't o what they said. he always rsnted about not being on trending when he was having huge streams and unique events etc, instead we got a big titted boring chick eating cereal with minsweeper in the corner 4x4 px
Naw, they can't take any credit for that. They can't handle the 2x and had nothing to do with him getting as popular. Dumping him because they thought they were entitled to more of his % is super plausible...since they're like incredibly petty scam artists with double standards.
Every large streamer was probably courting offers from mixer/youtube/Facebook. And lying about said offer is common place in contract negotiations. This is the silliest reason ive heard yet. Twitch is a business not a best friends forever playhouse.
Yeah. Whoevers at the top of Twitch making the decisions, has a huge and fragile ego. They probably got butthurt at Doc trying to negotiate and are essentially trying to ruin his career. If this is the case, I hope the doc sues them into the ground.
@@WillyChambs Yea problem with suing Twitch is they have Amazon's lawyers....... CAA is a big company but next to Amazon they're like an ant walking along the base of the Empire State Building.
It had everything to do with his "toxic masculinity" persona and literally nothing to do with contracts or Mixer. And do you think someone like Doc would bend the knee to all the fruitcakes who work over at Twitch? Press X to doubt.
Saying it didnt have to do with mixer shows your projecting. He signed a twitch deal just days before mixer closed. Its obvious they wanted their money back and thats all. If there was no contract doc could talk about it, but because its probably inder a lawsuit currently he cant talk as it could cost him in court.
@@coffinsnail6930 I don't think you understand how businesses, contracts, and/or negotiations work. Twitch isn't going to go through all the legal paperwork and the cost of the lawyers and time it all takes to write up an exclusive contract just to permaban him 1 month later.
I used to go twitch on almost every weekday. Watch and sometimes sub to streamers if not for doc I probably would have never watched before and that was the case for thousands. Just look at how many streamers he has helped grow throughout the years. He was not only a top streamer but grew other streamers reach and fanbase as well. Now I barely ever go on it at all. From a business perspective I just can't think of any way why it would benefit twitch to ban Doc or it would have been public already.
It sucks but I actively avoid Twitch aside for catching some tourney action. Have found enough gaming entertainment watching Doc, ZLaner, and Stone. I'll literally go to watch a stream on Twitch and stop myself when I remember how much I hate them.
@@michaelblazejewski6121 I mean he can’t make nearly the same content considering he isn’t allowed to play with anyone affiliated with twitch. Yeah he still makes a lot of money, but unjust is unjust.
@@EJassassin1530 we don't know what happened. I honestly don't care about the legalities of all of it. No reason you can't be honest with your fan base. I believe he knows what happened in regards to his ban
That theory is plausible but it would be so petty and stupid from twitch lol it wouldn't surprise me but i don't think they are that dumb too. But that theory is plausible
Remember the people who run the company are still human. After ninja left they had a whole bunch of crap happen on his channel including the pen. One could say that could harm twitch, but with market share they don’t care, how it acted ninja was what they wanted. I could see them saying let’s ruin docs career, they have the market share for sure now, a lot of sexual allegations going on at the time (perfect time to be vague), and a big fuck you for thinking we owe you more than what we dictate lmaoo
@@Ratchetface wrong conspiracy bro. Why get rid of one, when they could have them all? It's amazon bro they aren't broke and Doc definitely wasn't losing money for them. Doc viewers probably hardly use the twitch now
1. Doc signed a big deal with Twitch AFTER Mixer mae him an offer, Doc chose Twitch. so he didn't lie. 2. Twitch dropped him after Mixer folded not when Doc was negotiating a contract ( most likely no more compeition so they getr shroud n ninja back so save money on Doc) 3.Twitch basically treated Doc likeshit for the last few years he was there as Doc would often talk about on stream, i always got the strong impression doc felt kinda unwelcome and Twitch put all their eggs with shroud, ninja, female streamers over Doc n he was rightly salty about it.
How is everyone including this reporter missing the point of these allegations. MIXER would not have made a multi million offer to Doc if it was about to go away, the point the guy was trying to make is that Doc could have made up an offer to get more leverage
@@superchickenlips1 I don't believe this is the simplest of all plausible explanations my dude, so occams razor wouldn't apply. Occams Razor would be that Doc did or said something bannable, so Twitch banned him.
@@DepecheMol No I think doc was using an old number sense twitch probably has the right to first negotiation. So when mixer went down they probably wanted his to sign for way less money.
The biggest bull*hit is the quote "Twitch helped Doc get big" ... Honey, Doc made Twitch big, they didn't do anything for him, he can stream wherever and still be an extremely good content creator! BTW these speculations are kinda annoying anymore, get over it!
i mean, doc 100% did not make twitch big. doc got popular in h1z1 days, and twitch had been around for a HOT MINUTE before that, with quite a large following with creators like Soddapoppin, You can go check the wiki, in 2014 twitch already had over 45 million unique viewers and was one of the most trafficked website in the US. H1z1 didnt come out till 2015, so its hard to give doc credit for this at all, but yes he did bring a lot of new people to the website with his entertainment, including me.
Agree. Gamers made twitch, twitch didn't make the gamer. Let's all remember that if people didn't use the product it would have died. They also had no alternative so people worked with what they had. If twitch started today, it wouldn't have survived.
Hmm. I don't see how this adds up. Doc reupped his deal with Twitch in March of 2020. Mixer shut down on June 22nd. I mean...of course Doc was courting other offers before he re-signed. Is this guy implying Doc was trying to get out of the 2020 deal with Twitch that soon?
Doc used offers from mixer to GET his large twitch deal, but when mixer shut down, twitch realized they dont need to match that giant number anymore. So they cut him.
@@ahhsean so Twitch gave him the big deal, securing the streamer they desperately wanted... and then banned him because of the contract negotiations, *after* probably paying him a large advance and a few months payment? How does that make sense?
@@CamMackay96 they had to keep him to limit mixers potential. They may not have wanted him but they couldnt afford to lose him. Once mixer was gone the incentive for the deal was gone too.
@@CamMackay96 In normal sports things like this happen every so often. A team will get a player to bench them so the other teams in their division do not have that player.
True but the deal was done knowing you had to go all in on Doc as you just lost 2 big names and had to stem the tide. Soon as those 2 come back considerably cheaper and with much lower liability long term than Doc. I can see Twitch wanting to get themselves out of a bad deal specially now circumstances have changed. Twitch is well known to be pretty petty and the fact they haven't leaked anything probably means they are worried about blowback on them PR wise
Doc has speculated on stream that twitch banned him so they wouldn't have to pay him after mixer went under. It's the only logical answer at the moment. If it was actually at the fault of doc, twitch would have gladly announced why he was banned. But since it's because they screwed up with contact negotiations, they don't want to talk about it
A 15billion dollar company is going to terminate a contract of a 20 million so they might get sued and possibly have to pay the full amount and not even gain any of doc’s view numbers since he will be on TH-cam. Logic
@@funkyfresh2259 twitch, like any other multi billion dollar company, would have something in their contracts that they can terminate someone for practically any reason. You see celebs and actors getting canceled every week now for no valid reason. You think they don't have contracts? These companies always put an out in the contracts so they can bail on it if things don't go their way. Logic.
Hope you’re having a hellava Wednesday Jake! Shroud & Ninja straight up left Twitch for more money and a career change. Remember, Ninja left in a very immature way. Later Twitch welcomes them back with open arms. I’m not seeing what The Doc did to negotiate is any worse than what those two guys did. Doc wanted to be with Twitch and used a common business tactic to do it. Something is missing still. Twitch reminds me of the girlfriend that will take her cheating boyfriend back, but not keep the good guy even if he is trying to leverage with you.
This could be a thing he ones said himself twitch ended the contract and he also said this on his stream that with his money they wanna buy ninja and shroud and other xx streamer so you never know
Doc vs Twitch is definitely a multi-faceted issue with something big on both ends, to the point where even people who knew parts of the story (i could see slasher knowing or inferring stuff like this) had to had stfu or else theyd be buried with them.
If Twitch is preveting Doc from participating in tournament, can't he sue them arguing they are preventing him from working? Twitch doesn't own those tournaments.
I think he was stopped as Twitch was sponsoring the tournament. Now where Doc may get the last laugh is if a ruling on his Twitch ban happens in a courtroom, and it goes in Docs favour, he’ll surely be able to claim back potential loss of earnings, viewership, sponsorships and potential tournament win payouts due to Twitch blocking him from playing in them. It could be a nice payday for Doc if Twitch fucked up.
I don't see how that could be a legit reason. If he were under contract then even if he had raised the price based on telling Twitch that Mixer offered more... how would it legally be possible for them to drop the contract unless it specifically stated in there that they were paying that price as a direct result of a Mixer offer? There would have to be specific reasons in their TOS or contract that would allow them to ban him, not just because they got taken to the bank and pouted about it. So... he either got banned for legit reasons or they just cried and didn't wanna pay him, seems like WE'RE EXACTLY WHERE WE HAVE BEEN THIS WHOLE TIME. Freaking no where. But seriously, fuck Twitch.
This doesn't make any sense, Jakeypoo. Ninja and Shroud accepted their contracts and made their announcements with mixer in Aug and Oct of 2019. Doc made his big announcement that he was streaming exclusively on twitch in March of 2020. He wasn't banned until June 26 of 2020. He wouldn't have still been negotiating his contract 3 months after he made the big announcement video. If he was banned for playing the middle ground between the two, it would have been around or after the time Ninja and Shroud made their announcements, but before he made his announcement that he was staying on Twitch.
This is the most credible reason i have heard to date and does tie somewhat into the re-hiring of Shroud and Ninja. Its only logical to assume Mixer made a play for Doc given his contract was up and he was literally the face of Twitch. Its also good business sense to go into negociations with leverage (Mixer Offer) so this elevates Docs stock forcing Twitch to overpay considerably for Doc, having just lost Shroud and Ninja. Imagine finding out that you were essentially played during negociations and that MIxer deal wasn't worth the paper paper it was written on. We know Doc was on campus for business (why would he be there if not for negociations). We know Twitch overpaid considerably (having just lost 2 big names). We know right after Mixers demise was public Doc was let go. So could you see Twitch being that petty and skeezy in trying to walk back Docs deal via an iron clad way to do it, a ban. I personally can, specially as you consider they were in negociations with Ninja and Shroud at the time to come back for a consideraly reduced price. Doc didn't leave, had he left Twitch wouldn't have paid him anything and his stock would be considerably cheaper once he came back. So essentially he was pushed and Twitch gets 2 of their golden boys back. Ultimately i think Doc would have proved to be trouble down the line so i can see Twitch not wanting to role the dice all on him, not if they had options elsewhere. Its smart business from both parties honestly. It also explains why Twitch hasn't leaked anything, it does make them look pretty petty and skeezy and bad PR is toxic so best just let it all blow over. Makes sense and timelines all add up, Doc says he doesn't know completely but i suspect he now does. No doubt he is bound by some NDA so skirting around it is the best he can do for now. Sure would be great to get this all resolved cause Doc being unable to play with friends and actively getting kicked from tournements months down the road is pretty shitty situation to be in if you're Doc
That's all well and good but none of that is a reason they were able to cancel his contract and ban him, it's motive (a petty one at that) but it's not a means to risk such a large lawsuit over.
@@mre1995 yea you cant just revoke a contract because "mixr shutdown and we just paid doc x amount of money, oh sht lets ban him cuz if we ban him we dont have to pay" i think people underestimate how thin of a line twitch is waking on legally..... if they go back and watch thousands of hours of doc streams they will find something, a word a phrase something that they consider "bannable"...... (assuming its nothing racist or homophobic) youd have to ban literally thousands and thousands of streamers to be consistent with their ruling...... pretty obvious breach.... i think twitch higher ups behind the scenes are shaking, they very well could collapse their platform if they leak why doc was banned
@@8thgstriker412 Well we have no idea, I would hope that people that have access to amazon's lawyers would have something airtight before acting. Doc's contract was not worth the risk of banning him purely out of spite/greed.
This still doesn't make much sense. Wouldn't twitch just try and renegotiate his contract? Completely banning him seems like a really bad business move. Even if twitch tried to renegotiate and Doc told them to fuck off, the amount of money twitch is going to have to lay out in lawyer fees and an eventual settlement is going to rival what his contract was anyway. Then again, everything I have seen from twitch as far as business acumen has always been trash, so it's possible this is just another bad decision in a long list of bad decisions.
Jeff Leach is not nearly as cool as the character he plays. The guy who they modelled Ghosts body after though is a whole other animal though. A real badass
@@timyrabbit The guy that plays Price is okay. And Clancy Brown is an absolutely stallion. This guy is just a whiny virtue signaller though that is too preachy on social media. I had to unfollow him
This has always made the most sense and it's not the first time people have suggested that this was due to Mixer, but it's not because they were mad about a bad faith deal... It's because their competition died, giving them a monopoly on Game Streaming again (youtube and facebook are far behind in viewership) and they wanted to be a profitable company so they terminated Docs super inflated contract and banned him for whatever reason they were legally allowed to. It's about the money people, the real world is about money, not petty grudges...
Twitch wants the rights to the character Dr Disrespect. Doc used mixer as leverage. Then Mixer failed and Twitch had all the power. Doc doesn't want to give up the rights to his character. So Twitch has him banned till he gives up.
Makes total sense as over the past three weeks, we had furnace issues and called a few places and used one over the other until one said, we can’t wait any longer and repaired another furnace like yours and they didn’t have any parts left. Well, called the other place and same thing, called a third and then it cost us an extra $119.00. This happens often and Twitch did the right thing from what I’ve heard. Should have signed the offer and everything would have worked out.
I've always thought this. Twitch didn't want to pay Doc because they knew they'd have to pay Shroud and Ninja again. It all adds up. Makes 100% sense to me 👍
I think the idea of renegotiating is plausible, however I feel like there would’ve had to be more than Twitch just deciding to kick him to the curb for a deal wouldn’t hold water. It’s pretty difficult to exit a signed contract legally, regardless of which side of the contract you’re on. What I think could have happened was that maybe Doc may have mentioned something along the lines of “Well, maybe you can negotiate terms with my lawyer, while I continue building my audience on TH-cam.” In which case the mentioning of TH-cam may have given Twitch the grounds they needed to exit the contract. Just speculation here as well, but that would make more sense to me how it could’ve went down.
It's very blatant it's business related, because none of his streams contain anything that's perm-ban worthy. The messed up part is this could happen to literally any other streamer in the event Twitch needs to cut back on spending.
If and when Twitch or Doc come out and tell the truth of what happened it's all speculation. That being said, this seems like a plausible reason and would explain why everyone's so hush hush about it until it's settled by their respective attorneys or whatever. Also, using other offers to negotiate a better contract happens in literally every business in the world. So if that is the case, i'm fully on Doc's side.
I dont like how the guy is trying to paint twitch as a victim where now I can be wrong when they screw people over all the time. Doc using a offer to get more money isn't dirty its business.
Using market value to negotiate a contract is exactly what any agent would do representing a client. If this was the case, doc would have made it public instantly. “Mixer offered me 30 mil and twitch only offered 20”.
Well to be fair they did delete all ninjas videos and showed porn when you’d searched his name but nothing with shroud and after that, with doc they prolly just pissed or somethin
well, in case of ninja and shroud they genuinely had a deal with mixer, but doc's case, he was lying to twitch sayin that mixer offered him money but in reality mixer didn't. so doc was tryin to extort money and that has legal complications
How does this make any sense.. his agency would be performing the contract negotiations, and of course they would use any leverage to increase the clients contract. Not only that Ninja left to Mixer on bad terms and didn't get a ban. So why did Doc loose his Activision and Discord partnerships, and not being able to attend many competitions or events.. imo someone at Twitch is trying to cancel Doc.. god damn snakes.
Yes, but assume that Twitch the whole time is raising their contract with Doc because they hear mixer is offering him more money. They eventually arrive at a deal and mixer shuts down. Twitch clearly had the contract driven up due to offers from mixer. They get mad and try to get out of the deal. Did doc lie about offers from mixer? Who knows.
how can you blame him . That is a typical business deal and how it works. So and so offering this what can you do? Then it really makes no sense that Ninja and Shroud not only shit on twitch and bailed for more money, whem mixer tanked, Twitch took them back.. Talk about a slap in the face to doc. From what i understand, they paid doc more than they wanted to to keep him at twitch once ninja and shroud left. I dont know exactly the contract terms but in this situation that happened im sure there were some interesting opts in there. So Mixer tanks, shroud and ninja get lucky and win the lottery and got double their contract ( what idiot negotiated that , a company is going bk closing doors yet have the money to pay them out in full double their contracts, let that sink in) so now Ninja and shroud are free agents , two of the biggest streamers around, they bone doc, let him go, split the money between shroud , ninja and there was a third person involved. They got them at a cheaper price for twitch had the leverage. Doc is left kicked to the curb and im sure there were gag's in place.
I think twitch gave doc the money, realized what they’ve done. And are now in court fighting it. OR... twitch gave part of it. Or didn’t. And doc is fighting for what he earn.
If I were in Doc's shoes, I'd do the same thing 10/10! If my contract is coming up, unless it says specifically I cannot talk to others during the length of the contract, I would totally talk to other organizations and see what they have to offer or willing to pay.
I remember he deleted a vod of him talking about leaving twitch for mixer and that him and shroud should go start their own platform and that he had stuff in the works . now i think we know why that vod was scrubbed. In other words " its in twitches hands , he was never in control !!! " lol .. Greed rick rolled doc and he doesnt want us to know.. Sounds about spot on with docs ego
People still care about any conspiracy theory with no clear answer. The assassination of JFK, the 9/11 attacks, who built the pyramids etc. If something is viewed as important by some of the public and there isn’t a clear cut answer, conspiracy theories will follow
If that's the case that Twitch thought Doc was "lying to them" about a Mixer offer, then the team at Twitch has to be one of the daftest teams in the history of business?? Mixer probably gave him an offer and then realized that there platform was unsustainable, but that doesn't make the offer fake??
Surely there would be some sort of breach by Twitch to tear up a contract based on the fact he talked to another platform well before signing a new deal with them for no reason other than mixer closing down? Seems unlikely to me that this is a plausible reason to terminate a contract under the law unless there was a clause within it that pretty much let them end a contract in that manner, but as everyone else, I'm just assuming things 🤷♂️
I think it COULD be a plausible story that doc used a supposed Mixer deal that was on the table to get a better deal at Twitch. Now imagine that doc „improved“ those numbers offered by Mixer, exaggerating as he always does, adding another 0 to the number when talking to Twitch. Suddenly the Mixer offer was 100M instead of 10M but Twitch isn’t dumb and was snooping around and this found out. They kicked Doc out off the contract for manipulating the numbers without showing much evidences and thus making it a grey area because Doc didn’t falsify documents BUT lied to get a better contract. Just imagine...
Twitch was going down after ninja shroud movement. Doc was the guardian angel for twitch. Why? If mixer bought Dr D , twitch will shutdown. So they convinced him with new “ temporary “ contract just to buy more time for twitch to survive. Mixer fall down, twitch ban Doc, and shroud ninja is back. It seems if Doc went to mixer things will go down pretty hard for twitch.
Makes zero sense as anyone on Twitch who streams Doc, can get banned. Just because Doc doesn't have a contract, doesn't mean he can't stream or get banned. Makes zero sense, so this theory is dumb.
@@COALEDasICE Doesn't account for other streamers getting banned if they stream with doc, why? Because he tried to get a deal with Mixer. Again, no sense to it.
@@jahoadley1 you clearly don't know how business works. They don't want him near their business for trying to Fuck them. Just like most if not any business man would do whether you were in the streets and one of your top dogs was to talking to the opposition all the way up to wall street. They dump you on the side walk to tell you to go Fuck yourself
So Twitch was embarrased. Shame on them, you got played, step up , be the bigger person offer him back or end ban so he can play with other streamers. Dr Disrespect is GOAT when it comes to Streamers
Ecactly that reason was my first thought, because it was a weird time between his new contract and mixer closing etc. For most people it makes no sense to ban a big content creator (wich makes good money for you). But doc is not the biggest streamer and without doc, twitch is still fine. Doc pissed twitch on the leg because he was lying, now twitch punished him and was making a statement to all contentcreators -> if you try to go on another platform, you are done (you can quote ninjas wife i think). Twitch target was to scare other creators to move from twitch, so if you move, your carrer is done. And for morst twitch partners that is the case. Now in the future people are scared of moving from twitch. Twitch now can have better deals, because they can say "same happens to you, just like doc, if you move".
Twitch also helped Shroud & Ninja build their careers and they went to another platform and left Twitch. It doesn’t add up that they’d let them come back and then ban Doc for using Mixer as leverage in a deal. Side note: It does kind of make sense that they paid a huge amount to stop him leaving and once Mixer shut down they realised they’d paid him too much and didn’t want to pay over the odds when there’s no competition anymore.
That just doesnt make sense to me. Becsuse they were mad he was saying he had another offer they decided to give up one of their biggest streamers that brings in millions for them? I dont buy that. Pro athletes get offers from other teams all the time and go back and forth with the teams negotiating.
At the end of the day, streaming is a business and job for these people. I don't understand why a company would ban one of their top earners for receiving and considering other offers. That being said, speaking of other offers potentially in the presence of someone who is an employer is tactless and will have repercussions. Realistically, twitch is no worse off without one guy, and he's still making bank. All this "drama" does is bring them more interactions and more money.
they already sign him, that's the point .. streamers sign contracts months ago before they tell the public .. they got angry when they find out he was playing and they had too much of pride to keep him so they said bye!
Doesn't make sense, that Twitch was upset, because Doc was flirting with Mixer, when they then take shroud back, who LEFT Twitch for Mixer, right ? But you never know what is standing in those papers. Doc said, on stream, he had offers from other platforms, but would never switch. TH-cam, because it is too saturated already, and Facebook Gaming only made him laugh really hard, with dozens of thousands in chat laughing along with him. Mixer was so fresh and new too. He was loyal to Twitch, at least on stream. He truly represented the imagination, being the face of Twitch, in such a funny way. And now it is just, that little purple platform, for him. As long it is no super sensitive info, i really would like to know, what the reason for the ban was, or if we will get told one day.
Doesn't make sense that they'd ban him in the manner that they did just for negotiating new deals for himself. Plus they had already given him the deal, they had already decided he was worth X amount of money. Something happened to where not only he is not worth X amount of money, we wont let him stream on our platform any longer. Crazy...
There’s absolutely no way they can terminate a contract because he negotiated more money leveraging another offer that fell through. Regardless of whether or not it fell through the offer was still real at the time. Doc had no control or knowledge of Mixer failing. Also, if you’re implying he signed the new deal and then was terminated without payout that can only be for serious breach of contract, which wouldn’t fall under “he tricked us with mixer so we paid him more”. Serious breach is basically only misconduct. It can only be misconduct because of how harshly Twitch are enforcing the ban. The silence is because it’s clearly serious af and doc / twitch both have lawyers involved. Until it’s settled legally, nothing will be said by either side.
Many people have gotten offers from Mixer and were not banned as a result of getting an offer or meeting with them. The only way I would buy this idea is IF Doc had a non-compete in his contract, for whatever weird reason only he would have such a stipulation. I think it is a result of him breaking his contract in some manner, but I doubt we'll ever really know what it was.
Im pretty sure he already signed a contract with them in November of 2019 and then negated it a few months into 2020. Twitch litterally made their add with him as their poster boy
That sounds like good business on Dr. Disrespect’s part. This would also mean that Twitch in addition to playing CYA went on a scorched earth policy. This if all true would also mean that any other rising or big name streamer should never do partnerships or business with Twitch, as they are allergic to negotiations and honoring their contracts.
If this is true, that sucks for twitch. Any lawsuit, which is likely happening if this is true, would absolutely favor doc. Especially if there’s an instant and unspecified reason for termination. Yeah California is an “at will” work state, but “because you tried to negotiate and talked to a competitor” isn’t a reason to fire someone. Any reasonable jury would agree and docs gonna have five Lamborghini diablos soon.
So what if that's the case. It's perfectly normal in business for one side to use offers from competitors as leverage in negotiations. That is in no way any kind of infraction. It doesn't explain why Twitch would treat him so badly as to pull the plug in such an abrupt way. Unless of course they decided to slaughter him to scare and bully the other streams not to ask for more money. Which would make them giant deuchbags.
While this alleged reason heads, I think, in the right direction. I can't see how it would lead to a ban from streaming on the platform. A renegotiation of contract...maybe, even a lawsuit for negotiating a contract in bad faith...maybe. But ban the face of Twitch from streaming on the platform and basically act like the Doc never existed on Twitch in the first place? I'm not convinced. However, if Doc was negotiating deals with other platforms while still under contract with Twitch...then I can see Twitch saying...nope, you don't do that so you have to go.
eh i don't buy that one. firstly why would that be so secret? like doc literally coulda said "tried re-negotiating, twitch said no and banned me" not really anything secret about a deal falling through. 2nd if that was how it went and all of a sudden mixer was shutting down, surely twitch would be like "right you can re-sign your contract for the same money or you can go elsewhere" in which case doc wouldn't be banned he would of just moved platforms. unless doc was still under contract with twitch and was still trying to leverage a deal which might of terminated his twitch contract then it kinda makes sense him getting banned. but again why so secret?
This isn't a bad theory and has some merit on the time line. The issue I have is that Doc can go searching for deals because his contract is about over. He can talk with mixer and see what they offer him. He can then use that as a ballpark estimate of what he is worth to other similar companies. There cannot be a legal reason for Twitch to ban him over talking with another platform, and Doc wouldn't lie about a contract he was offered. Like the man said he is a good business man, he would know that would blow up in his face if they caught him lieing about deals. Also didn't Doc sign a new contract with Twitch a few months before Mixer went under? Or am I remembering that wrong?
You're dead on. The one thing that caught me about it all is Doc saying he was there before shroud and ninja signed which would have put him at the mixer campus before august 2019 which seems like a long time before his deal with Twitch was announced in March 2020.
I don’t think it was mixer because he had already announced he was staying with twitch when mixer died. I think he was caught discussing signing with TH-cam while he was still under contract with Twitch. The timing lines up a lot better.
Only way I saw Doc going Mixer was if it was MORE than just the streaming platform deal. As in a marketing deal with Microsoft. But to take that kind of deal, he would have had to move his live content over to Microsoft's. Well when they made other deals and started falling apart, if I were Doc I wouldn't stock my content on Microsoft's platform either after long negotiations for months.
what would make sense to me is that doc lied to twitch about the amount he was offered from mixer. lets say doc said that they offered him 20million. Then twitch goes around and offers the same to him, only to find out months later that they only offered the doc 10 million. This could be it yeah? because why would they ban a man for making a good business deal
I'm not sure about the timing, but it kinda makes sense. The Doc tried to make more money out of Twitch by using the mixer offer, but when mixer announced they were shutting down, suddenly Twitch realized Ninja and Shroud were available again, so they ditched doc to afford those 2 new deals.Obviously for that to happen, Doc had to violate some term of the agreement and Twitch exploited it at the right moment, I mean, it's was a good business move from Twitch POV considering his strategy to make their content more attractive for advertising, Doc might be seen too risky for Twitch in that sense.
Whether or not Doc’s people said he had an offer from Mixer, there is no way Twitch finds out about whether or not it’s true. Using something done BEFORE the contract is signed as grounds to nullify the agreed-upon deal only would make Twitch MORE unethical.
Using another company as leverage for re-negotiation is perfectly acceptable. Twitch sounds like they are A-holes.
Yeah it almost sounds like he wasn't actually getting offers at the specific time. Why would Mixer give millions of dollars right before closing? I'd be pissed too.
If this theory is true then yeah you are right. Plus what doc did they do in the business world and also sports players do that too.
@@TheBox225 yes but that’s on them for falling for it
so lying about a deal that isnt even on the table or a thought in existence to get paid more money by your employer, and the employer doing something about it... MAKES THEM AHOLES!? Sounds like you should never be incharge of any business.
@@anorx5848 ha yes because it was definitely really good for twitch business! Right? Lmao.
It’s out of my hands but I’m still in controoooool.
You'll never take away, the power of my souuuuuuuuuull
Yayayayayayayayayayayaya
Yayayayaya
5-0
LOL bro it was fantastic how players like Z and others were playing all Doc's original music during that tourney... big F U to the Purple Snake slumlords.
20 years from now it will be featuring in BUZFEED Unsolved
Exactly what I was thinking, lol
@@architpateria8328 Ghoul Boys ftw
BUZFEED is still alive?
@@cedrickluge8854 Only when Ryan and Shane grace them with their presence, lol. Can't wait for next season of BuzzFeed Unsolved Supernatural
@@architpateria8328 i only watch if they're on
If that’s what it’s about then twitch is petty , NOONE should continue streaming for twitch
It has the best streaming system though. A million times better than TH-cam. They just have weird sexist to men rules and do shady things
lmaoaoao petty?????? i hope you are no where near the inner workings of any business. Getting screwed over for more money and doing something about it, isnt petty in the slightest.
@@anorx5848 if they can do this to one of the top streamers , purposely change policy and because of their reach , ban him from Call of duty tournaments.. yeah petty is a good work to use for a billion dollar company .. wonder who they will choose to cancel next for the hell of it
@@slllyy4985 they do not have "weird sexist to men rules" lmaooo i bet you the majority of the company is men i really doubt theyre discriminating against their own gender why the hell would they
@@slllyy4985 which is why , we shouldn’t support them
I feel so bad for doc. He's always playing alone man
he plays with zlaner all the time and just played with courage not to mention all the celebs
Dude makes thousands weekly lol no one should feel bad for him
He’s got every person he needs right there but he’s always alone.. think about it.
He's got Zcheater
@@TommyDavidVerbal you really think Z hacks ? If that was the case he wouldn't lose tournaments lol
This has always made the most sense, seeing his agency and sponsors stuck with him, if it was something else bad, his agency and sponsors would have dropped him.
THIS x10000000
You guys really think Doc's many sponsors would stick with him if he had done something truly offensive, like sexual harrassment? Yet nearly all of them remain.
Funny the ones who did bail on him, seem to be all companies with very close ties to Twitch.. such as COD not giving him a creator code. Such as a recent tourney not allowing him in...
COD dropped him as a partner and won't even send him keys. But the people who make COD are a bunch of cowards and probably don't know why he was banned either.
A few dropped him i heard
@@Chief--Thc I don’t think any dude. He has Scuf, Mountain Dew, Roccat, and Turtle Beach.
@@LadySKizo some pussy thing with Discord I think. But they’re spineless too.
The hype I felt after his first stream back is unmatched.
Doesn’t he stream on TH-cam now.
@@larry2281 yes. I'm referring to his first youtube one. Even where he didn't actually appear it was just the lambo at the gas station
@@YungGupta still remember like it was yesterday. Everyone was speculating where he is gonna reincarnate. Of course he took his spot at the tippety top back right off the bat. GET EM OUT!!!??
Yall are sad
I’d leave the purple-haired crazies too. Doesn’t matter where Doc is he will thrive because he’s doc. TH-cam allows more freedom for Doc.
for example not entering cod tournaments KEKW
@@Ttangko_ sadge
What/who are "purple hair crazies"
@@Sader2 why are you even here if you don’t understand memes/ references/ internet culture. So far 68 other people understand and agree. Educate yourself.
@@sivrahc lol stfu you pretentious asshole,
Now this seems like a very plausible theory.
than why is twitch not just saying it... why are they stil say "he knows" and nothing more.
stil doesn't ad up. there is something why twitch doesn't want to say why, the same for the doc if he knows.
there is a whole lot of ego on the line with this one.
Agreed. Just say breach of contract, end of story.
Unless of course because of the big money involved and all the legal mess proving anything was they can’t say.
But if it is that then doc and his legal team 100% would know this.
@@willallclasses8585 but then the question come why would doc just ignore it. thats why it so fishy .... and also why "we" wil never know about it. there are to many loose ends.
you can make a tv show out of this one XD ....
Not really. Story dont add up. Was doc negotiating with twitch saying mixer offered more. Or did twitch get mad doc was talking to mixer without them knowing?
Dueling with women .
Twitch- You don't ban the Doc, The Doc bans you.
Did Twitch really help "build" Doc though? I remember back in the day Doc was RARELY on the front page of the purple snakes website
No they didnt help "building" doc. He did it all by himself. Its not like they had some script sent to him and he was acting on Twitch´s behalf.
100% agree. they often tried to keep him to the side as he didn't o what they said. he always rsnted about not being on trending when he was having huge streams and unique events etc, instead we got a big titted boring chick eating cereal with minsweeper in the corner 4x4 px
@@shanus11 exactly, I remember those times as well. Twitch has always seen him as 'problematic'
Naw, they can't take any credit for that. They can't handle the 2x and had nothing to do with him getting as popular. Dumping him because they thought they were entitled to more of his % is super plausible...since they're like incredibly petty scam artists with double standards.
Every large streamer was probably courting offers from mixer/youtube/Facebook. And lying about said offer is common place in contract negotiations. This is the silliest reason ive heard yet. Twitch is a business not a best friends forever playhouse.
Yeah. Whoevers at the top of Twitch making the decisions, has a huge and fragile ego. They probably got butthurt at Doc trying to negotiate and are essentially trying to ruin his career. If this is the case, I hope the doc sues them into the ground.
@@WillyChambs That would be Emmett Shear (Twitch CEO). And anyone who knows of him knows he’s weak & full of shit.
@@WillyChambs Yea problem with suing Twitch is they have Amazon's lawyers....... CAA is a big company but next to Amazon they're like an ant walking along the base of the Empire State Building.
Doc is too controversial for Twitch. They didnt want any part of him. They only want chubby cheeks blondes.😂😂😂
It had everything to do with his "toxic masculinity" persona and literally nothing to do with contracts or Mixer. And do you think someone like Doc would bend the knee to all the fruitcakes who work over at Twitch? Press X to doubt.
xQcL
Saying it didnt have to do with mixer shows your projecting. He signed a twitch deal just days before mixer closed. Its obvious they wanted their money back and thats all. If there was no contract doc could talk about it, but because its probably inder a lawsuit currently he cant talk as it could cost him in court.
@@coffinsnail6930 I don't think you understand how businesses, contracts, and/or negotiations work. Twitch isn't going to go through all the legal paperwork and the cost of the lawyers and time it all takes to write up an exclusive contract just to permaban him 1 month later.
What chubby cheeks are you looking at all I see is skin and bone LoL
He was too athletic for the purple platform
Now he’s stuck on the cornball platform
I heard doc cut off the wrong person on the way to the arena.
only facts
Vonderhaar?
I used to go twitch on almost every weekday. Watch and sometimes sub to streamers if not for doc I probably would have never watched before and that was the case for thousands. Just look at how many streamers he has helped grow throughout the years. He was not only a top streamer but grew other streamers reach and fanbase as well. Now I barely ever go on it at all. From a business perspective I just can't think of any way why it would benefit twitch to ban Doc or it would have been public already.
I haven’t been on since really either. Good to know I’m not alone. 🤝
It sucks but I actively avoid Twitch aside for catching some tourney action. Have found enough gaming entertainment watching Doc, ZLaner, and Stone. I'll literally go to watch a stream on Twitch and stop myself when I remember how much I hate them.
And exactly.. if the reason Twitch banned Doc was something that people would think "ok that's fair".. the info would be leaked by now. Straight up.
Twitch provided a platform. The Doc built himself which is the reason for his continued success.
Ah yes let’s ruin a mans career for trying to sign the best deal for his family.
Quit acting like the dude is barely making it.
Dont act like they didnt do the same to ninja just in a different way. Its not surprising.
@@michaelblazejewski6121 I mean he can’t make nearly the same content considering he isn’t allowed to play with anyone affiliated with twitch. Yeah he still makes a lot of money, but unjust is unjust.
@@EJassassin1530 we don't know what happened. I honestly don't care about the legalities of all of it. No reason you can't be honest with your fan base. I believe he knows what happened in regards to his ban
@@alexchat3020 ninja 😆..I remember back in the day shitting all over ninja in reach doubles lol
They wouldn't drop Doc for that after Mixer is already shut down. There's too much money to be made from him.
That theory is plausible but it would be so petty and stupid from twitch lol it wouldn't surprise me but i don't think they are that dumb too. But that theory is plausible
Remember the people who run the company are still human. After ninja left they had a whole bunch of crap happen on his channel including the pen. One could say that could harm twitch, but with market share they don’t care, how it acted ninja was what they wanted. I could see them saying let’s ruin docs career, they have the market share for sure now, a lot of sexual allegations going on at the time (perfect time to be vague), and a big fuck you for thinking we owe you more than what we dictate lmaoo
If they take the top guy and make an example of him then places 2-10 are damn sure going to tow the line.
Devin Nash 100% disagrees with this. He says there is no way Twitch will ever recover the millions these contracts cost them.
@@Ratchetface wrong conspiracy bro.
Why get rid of one, when they could have them all? It's amazon bro they aren't broke and Doc definitely wasn't losing money for them. Doc viewers probably hardly use the twitch now
So the theory is "Twitch hates competition"
Surprise surprise, a business which has a monopoly on the market they're in hates competition. In other news, water is wet and the sky is blue.
1. Doc signed a big deal with Twitch AFTER Mixer mae him an offer, Doc chose Twitch. so he didn't lie. 2. Twitch dropped him after Mixer folded not when Doc was negotiating a contract ( most likely no more compeition so they getr shroud n ninja back so save money on Doc) 3.Twitch basically treated Doc likeshit for the last few years he was there as Doc would often talk about on stream, i always got the strong impression doc felt kinda unwelcome and Twitch put all their eggs with shroud, ninja, female streamers over Doc n he was rightly salty about it.
This makes no sense. That sounds like very typical business negotiations.
Did you expect it to be a big conspiracy?
How is everyone including this reporter missing the point of these allegations. MIXER would not have made a multi million offer to Doc if it was about to go away, the point the guy was trying to make is that Doc could have made up an offer to get more leverage
Look up "Occam's Razor". You want it to be more interesting than it actually is.
@@superchickenlips1 I don't believe this is the simplest of all plausible explanations my dude, so occams razor wouldn't apply. Occams Razor would be that Doc did or said something bannable, so Twitch banned him.
@@DepecheMol No I think doc was using an old number sense twitch probably has the right to first negotiation. So when mixer went down they probably wanted his to sign for way less money.
The biggest bull*hit is the quote "Twitch helped Doc get big" ... Honey, Doc made Twitch big, they didn't do anything for him, he can stream wherever and still be an extremely good content creator! BTW these speculations are kinda annoying anymore, get over it!
IKR!!! Like get this twitch twitch sucking dude off the screen. He annoyed me lol
Doc is the whole reason why i even managed to find about twitch and then other streamers later on so i agree that this doesn't make sense
i mean, doc 100% did not make twitch big. doc got popular in h1z1 days, and twitch had been around for a HOT MINUTE before that, with quite a large following with creators like Soddapoppin, You can go check the wiki, in 2014 twitch already had over 45 million unique viewers and was one of the most trafficked website in the US. H1z1 didnt come out till 2015, so its hard to give doc credit for this at all, but yes he did bring a lot of new people to the website with his entertainment, including me.
Agree. Gamers made twitch, twitch didn't make the gamer. Let's all remember that if people didn't use the product it would have died. They also had no alternative so people worked with what they had. If twitch started today, it wouldn't have survived.
Hmm. I don't see how this adds up. Doc reupped his deal with Twitch in March of 2020. Mixer shut down on June 22nd. I mean...of course Doc was courting other offers before he re-signed. Is this guy implying Doc was trying to get out of the 2020 deal with Twitch that soon?
Agree, the timeline doesn't match up at all. Jakey should have caught on to this...
Doc used offers from mixer to GET his large twitch deal, but when mixer shut down, twitch realized they dont need to match that giant number anymore. So they cut him.
@@ahhsean so Twitch gave him the big deal, securing the streamer they desperately wanted... and then banned him because of the contract negotiations, *after* probably paying him a large advance and a few months payment? How does that make sense?
@@CamMackay96 they had to keep him to limit mixers potential. They may not have wanted him but they couldnt afford to lose him. Once mixer was gone the incentive for the deal was gone too.
@@CamMackay96 In normal sports things like this happen every so often. A team will get a player to bench them so the other teams in their division do not have that player.
Why is it only on the employee to go into contract negotiations with “good faith”.
The Mixer deal used for leverage is just business tactics. it happens all the time in negotiating. there's more to it.
True but the deal was done knowing you had to go all in on Doc as you just lost 2 big names and had to stem the tide. Soon as those 2 come back considerably cheaper and with much lower liability long term than Doc. I can see Twitch wanting to get themselves out of a bad deal specially now circumstances have changed. Twitch is well known to be pretty petty and the fact they haven't leaked anything probably means they are worried about blowback on them PR wise
Doc has speculated on stream that twitch banned him so they wouldn't have to pay him after mixer went under. It's the only logical answer at the moment. If it was actually at the fault of doc, twitch would have gladly announced why he was banned. But since it's because they screwed up with contact negotiations, they don't want to talk about it
Its not a logical answer
A 15billion dollar company is going to terminate a contract of a 20 million so they might get sued and possibly have to pay the full amount and not even gain any of doc’s view numbers since he will be on TH-cam. Logic
@@funkyfresh2259 twitch, like any other multi billion dollar company, would have something in their contracts that they can terminate someone for practically any reason. You see celebs and actors getting canceled every week now for no valid reason. You think they don't have contracts? These companies always put an out in the contracts so they can bail on it if things don't go their way. Logic.
Hope you’re having a hellava Wednesday Jake!
Shroud & Ninja straight up left Twitch for more money and a career change. Remember, Ninja left in a very immature way. Later Twitch welcomes them back with open arms. I’m not seeing what The Doc did to negotiate is any worse than what those two guys did. Doc wanted to be with Twitch and used a common business tactic to do it. Something is missing still. Twitch reminds me of the girlfriend that will take her cheating boyfriend back, but not keep the good guy even if he is trying to leverage with you.
punch of bitches
This could be a thing he ones said himself twitch ended the contract and he also said this on his stream that with his money they wanna buy ninja and shroud and other xx streamer so you never know
Doc vs Twitch is definitely a multi-faceted issue with something big on both ends, to the point where even people who knew parts of the story (i could see slasher knowing or inferring stuff like this) had to had stfu or else theyd be buried with them.
If Twitch is preveting Doc from participating in tournament, can't he sue them arguing they are preventing him from working? Twitch doesn't own those tournaments.
Doc said in a stream a few months ago that lawyers were already involved
Agreed
Sounded more like it was the organizers. Maybe cause they are streaming on twitch and are worried about the tos
I think he was stopped as Twitch was sponsoring the tournament.
Now where Doc may get the last laugh is if a ruling on his Twitch ban happens in a courtroom, and it goes in Docs favour, he’ll surely be able to claim back potential loss of earnings, viewership, sponsorships and potential tournament win payouts due to Twitch blocking him from playing in them.
It could be a nice payday for Doc if Twitch fucked up.
Ya i think its still a legal matter, reason why he can’t really talk about it still
Doesn’t really explain why he would loose his COD partnership though
Purple Snakes are petty A-holes
Twitch has their ways ... also probably the same reason why doc wasn’t allowed to participate in the 100k Toronto ultra tournament
@@Ratchetface everything you said was on point besides the bend down part
I don't see how that could be a legit reason. If he were under contract then even if he had raised the price based on telling Twitch that Mixer offered more... how would it legally be possible for them to drop the contract unless it specifically stated in there that they were paying that price as a direct result of a Mixer offer? There would have to be specific reasons in their TOS or contract that would allow them to ban him, not just because they got taken to the bank and pouted about it. So... he either got banned for legit reasons or they just cried and didn't wanna pay him, seems like WE'RE EXACTLY WHERE WE HAVE BEEN THIS WHOLE TIME. Freaking no where. But seriously, fuck Twitch.
In a lot of Contracts they have a good Faith clause. So they feel he didn't negotiate in good faith they can use that clause.
This doesn't make any sense, Jakeypoo. Ninja and Shroud accepted their contracts and made their announcements with mixer in Aug and Oct of 2019. Doc made his big announcement that he was streaming exclusively on twitch in March of 2020. He wasn't banned until June 26 of 2020. He wouldn't have still been negotiating his contract 3 months after he made the big announcement video. If he was banned for playing the middle ground between the two, it would have been around or after the time Ninja and Shroud made their announcements, but before he made his announcement that he was staying on Twitch.
This is the most credible reason i have heard to date and does tie somewhat into the re-hiring of Shroud and Ninja. Its only logical to assume Mixer made a play for Doc given his contract was up and he was literally the face of Twitch. Its also good business sense to go into negociations with leverage (Mixer Offer) so this elevates Docs stock forcing Twitch to overpay considerably for Doc, having just lost Shroud and Ninja. Imagine finding out that you were essentially played during negociations and that MIxer deal wasn't worth the paper paper it was written on. We know Doc was on campus for business (why would he be there if not for negociations). We know Twitch overpaid considerably (having just lost 2 big names). We know right after Mixers demise was public Doc was let go. So could you see Twitch being that petty and skeezy in trying to walk back Docs deal via an iron clad way to do it, a ban. I personally can, specially as you consider they were in negociations with Ninja and Shroud at the time to come back for a consideraly reduced price. Doc didn't leave, had he left Twitch wouldn't have paid him anything and his stock would be considerably cheaper once he came back. So essentially he was pushed and Twitch gets 2 of their golden boys back. Ultimately i think Doc would have proved to be trouble down the line so i can see Twitch not wanting to role the dice all on him, not if they had options elsewhere. Its smart business from both parties honestly. It also explains why Twitch hasn't leaked anything, it does make them look pretty petty and skeezy and bad PR is toxic so best just let it all blow over. Makes sense and timelines all add up, Doc says he doesn't know completely but i suspect he now does. No doubt he is bound by some NDA so skirting around it is the best he can do for now. Sure would be great to get this all resolved cause Doc being unable to play with friends and actively getting kicked from tournements months down the road is pretty shitty situation to be in if you're Doc
That's all well and good but none of that is a reason they were able to cancel his contract and ban him, it's motive (a petty one at that) but it's not a means to risk such a large lawsuit over.
@@mre1995 yea you cant just revoke a contract because "mixr shutdown and we just paid doc x amount of money, oh sht lets ban him cuz if we ban him we dont have to pay"
i think people underestimate how thin of a line twitch is waking on legally..... if they go back and watch thousands of hours of doc streams they will find something, a word a phrase something that they consider "bannable"...... (assuming its nothing racist or homophobic) youd have to ban literally thousands and thousands of streamers to be consistent with their ruling......
pretty obvious breach.... i think twitch higher ups behind the scenes are shaking, they very well could collapse their platform if they leak why doc was banned
@@8thgstriker412 Well we have no idea, I would hope that people that have access to amazon's lawyers would have something airtight before acting. Doc's contract was not worth the risk of banning him purely out of spite/greed.
This still doesn't make much sense. Wouldn't twitch just try and renegotiate his contract? Completely banning him seems like a really bad business move. Even if twitch tried to renegotiate and Doc told them to fuck off, the amount of money twitch is going to have to lay out in lawyer fees and an eventual settlement is going to rival what his contract was anyway.
Then again, everything I have seen from twitch as far as business acumen has always been trash, so it's possible this is just another bad decision in a long list of bad decisions.
Ya I am gonna go with Twitch is a dumpster fire of a company
Jeff Leach is not nearly as cool as the character he plays.
The guy who they modelled Ghosts body after though is a whole other animal though.
A real badass
I mean you can say that about every voice actor/actor
@@timyrabbit The guy that plays Price is okay. And Clancy Brown is an absolutely stallion.
This guy is just a whiny virtue signaller though that is too preachy on social media. I had to unfollow him
Yeah he is kind of a douche irl, he hangs around Compound media a lot. If you are not familiar with Compound Media, look into them at your leisure.
@@Valhalla13375 Ok I will
@@Valhalla13375 I’ll look into it as well
This has always made the most sense and it's not the first time people have suggested that this was due to Mixer, but it's not because they were mad about a bad faith deal...
It's because their competition died, giving them a monopoly on Game Streaming again (youtube and facebook are far behind in viewership) and they wanted to be a profitable company so they terminated Docs super inflated contract and banned him for whatever reason they were legally allowed to.
It's about the money people, the real world is about money, not petty grudges...
Twitch wants the rights to the character Dr Disrespect. Doc used mixer as leverage. Then Mixer failed and Twitch had all the power. Doc doesn't want to give up the rights to his character. So Twitch has him banned till he gives up.
This does make sense... and matches with the "Doc is done" chanting from some sources back in 2020.
Yes but no. Idk why tf you refer to his "character"
Makes total sense as over the past three weeks, we had furnace issues and called a few places and used one over the other until one said, we can’t wait any longer and repaired another furnace like yours and they didn’t have any parts left. Well, called the other place and same thing, called a third and then it cost us an extra $119.00. This happens often and Twitch did the right thing from what I’ve heard. Should have signed the offer and everything would have worked out.
I love being the best... there's just something about it
I've always thought this. Twitch didn't want to pay Doc because they knew they'd have to pay Shroud and Ninja again. It all adds up. Makes 100% sense to me 👍
Where's Slasher? He apparently knows everything...
I think the idea of renegotiating is plausible, however I feel like there would’ve had to be more than Twitch just deciding to kick him to the curb for a deal wouldn’t hold water. It’s pretty difficult to exit a signed contract legally, regardless of which side of the contract you’re on. What I think could have happened was that maybe Doc may have mentioned something along the lines of “Well, maybe you can negotiate terms with my lawyer, while I continue building my audience on TH-cam.” In which case the mentioning of TH-cam may have given Twitch the grounds they needed to exit the contract. Just speculation here as well, but that would make more sense to me how it could’ve went down.
Yo Jake, are you any good at Cod or do you just report on it!! I WANNA SEE SOME CRACKED FOOTAGE MY G.
It's very blatant it's business related, because none of his streams contain anything that's perm-ban worthy. The messed up part is this could happen to literally any other streamer in the event Twitch needs to cut back on spending.
This guy must be Slasher Jr because he is just making shit up too.
If and when Twitch or Doc come out and tell the truth of what happened it's all speculation.
That being said, this seems like a plausible reason and would explain why everyone's so hush hush about it until it's settled by their respective attorneys or whatever.
Also, using other offers to negotiate a better contract happens in literally every business in the world. So if that is the case, i'm fully on Doc's side.
I dont like how the guy is trying to paint twitch as a victim where now I can be wrong when they screw people over all the time. Doc using a offer to get more money isn't dirty its business.
he did say that his friends left twitch cause of how bad it is.
@@FuzzySamurai that is true
Using market value to negotiate a contract is exactly what any agent would do representing a client. If this was the case, doc would have made it public instantly. “Mixer offered me 30 mil and twitch only offered 20”.
So basically what I'm seeing in this Chat is that Some People understand how Contract Negotiations Work and Others Have no Idea!
One day this Twitch/Doc saga will be a documentary.
I’m confused ninja and shroud leave for mixer yet they take it personal with doc?
Well to be fair they did delete all ninjas videos and showed porn when you’d searched his name but nothing with shroud and after that, with doc they prolly just pissed or somethin
well, in case of ninja and shroud they genuinely had a deal with mixer, but doc's case, he was lying to twitch sayin that mixer offered him money but in reality mixer didn't. so doc was tryin to extort money and that has legal complications
How does this make any sense.. his agency would be performing the contract negotiations, and of course they would use any leverage to increase the clients contract. Not only that Ninja left to Mixer on bad terms and didn't get a ban. So why did Doc loose his Activision and Discord partnerships, and not being able to attend many competitions or events.. imo someone at Twitch is trying to cancel Doc.. god damn snakes.
I think it's even simpler the Doc is too masculine for the twitch platform they just wanted him gone.
Correct me if I'm wrong
Doc had already signed a big contract with the Purple Snakes before his ban.
Yes, but assume that Twitch the whole time is raising their contract with Doc because they hear mixer is offering him more money. They eventually arrive at a deal and mixer shuts down. Twitch clearly had the contract driven up due to offers from mixer. They get mad and try to get out of the deal. Did doc lie about offers from mixer? Who knows.
how can you blame him . That is a typical business deal and how it works. So and so offering this what can you do? Then it really makes no sense that Ninja and Shroud not only shit on twitch and bailed for more money, whem mixer tanked, Twitch took them back.. Talk about a slap in the face to doc. From what i understand, they paid doc more than they wanted to to keep him at twitch once ninja and shroud left. I dont know exactly the contract terms but in this situation that happened im sure there were some interesting opts in there. So Mixer tanks, shroud and ninja get lucky and win the lottery and got double their contract ( what idiot negotiated that , a company is going bk closing doors yet have the money to pay them out in full double their contracts, let that sink in) so now Ninja and shroud are free agents , two of the biggest streamers around, they bone doc, let him go, split the money between shroud , ninja and there was a third person involved. They got them at a cheaper price for twitch had the leverage. Doc is left kicked to the curb and im sure there were gag's in place.
SPECULATION, HEARSAY.
Stop! Just Stop!
I think twitch gave doc the money, realized what they’ve done. And are now in court fighting it. OR... twitch gave part of it. Or didn’t. And doc is fighting for what he earn.
something like this. No other explanation for having no explanation. Lawsuit.
If this is the reason then wtf, this is normal business practice...
This is what I speculated considering Docs Twitch partnership announcement, Mixer dying, then Doc getting “banned” were so close together.
Mmm this doesn’t up add and at the end of the day will find out one from Doc or twitch just leave the man alone
If I were in Doc's shoes, I'd do the same thing 10/10! If my contract is coming up, unless it says specifically I cannot talk to others during the length of the contract, I would totally talk to other organizations and see what they have to offer or willing to pay.
California doesn't allow non compete contracts though. Doc had every right to negotiate offers
So doc used mixer to get more from twitch that sounds like a smart as move wtf. Twitch salty because they over paid lol
I remember he deleted a vod of him talking about leaving twitch for mixer and that him and shroud should go start their own platform and that he had stuff in the works . now i think we know why that vod was scrubbed. In other words " its in twitches hands , he was never in control !!! " lol .. Greed rick rolled doc and he doesnt want us to know.. Sounds about spot on with docs ego
damn people still care about Docs twitch ban, it has almost been a year!
I think it’s the fact people don’t know WHY he was banned..
its been 8 months, and lmao people will care until it comes out.
People still care about any conspiracy theory with no clear answer. The assassination of JFK, the 9/11 attacks, who built the pyramids etc. If something is viewed as important by some of the public and there isn’t a clear cut answer, conspiracy theories will follow
yup. still curious about the whole thing.
@@logandavis954 yeah that makes a lot more sense!
If that's the case that Twitch thought Doc was "lying to them" about a Mixer offer, then the team at Twitch has to be one of the daftest teams in the history of business?? Mixer probably gave him an offer and then realized that there platform was unsustainable, but that doesn't make the offer fake??
And Slasher knew this all along. Just didn't want to say it out loud
Mixer literally shut down before Doc's ban, look it up.
Surely there would be some sort of breach by Twitch to tear up a contract based on the fact he talked to another platform well before signing a new deal with them for no reason other than mixer closing down? Seems unlikely to me that this is a plausible reason to terminate a contract under the law unless there was a clause within it that pretty much let them end a contract in that manner, but as everyone else, I'm just assuming things 🤷♂️
But that’s exactly what we thought it was. They wanted out of his contract so they banned him from ever competing again. Snakes
I think it COULD be a plausible story that doc used a supposed Mixer deal that was on the table to get a better deal at Twitch.
Now imagine that doc „improved“ those numbers offered by Mixer, exaggerating as he always does, adding another 0 to the number when talking to Twitch.
Suddenly the Mixer offer was 100M instead of 10M but Twitch isn’t dumb and was snooping around and this found out.
They kicked Doc out off the contract for manipulating the numbers without showing much evidences and thus making it a grey area because Doc didn’t falsify documents BUT lied to get a better contract.
Just imagine...
Ah, s$&t here we go again.
Twitch was going down after ninja shroud movement. Doc was the guardian angel for twitch. Why?
If mixer bought Dr D , twitch will shutdown. So they convinced him with new “ temporary “ contract just to buy more time for twitch to survive. Mixer fall down, twitch ban Doc, and shroud ninja is back. It seems if Doc went to mixer things will go down pretty hard for twitch.
Drinking my ca! Champions club for life!
Why wouldn’t they just pay him? He’s the greatest streamer of all time. Doc had to have pissed off someone high up at purple snakes inc.
They wouldn't want to pay him because they might've felt cheated. Of course I'm speculating, but it's a possibility..
Makes zero sense as anyone on Twitch who streams Doc, can get banned. Just because Doc doesn't have a contract, doesn't mean he can't stream or get banned. Makes zero sense, so this theory is dumb.
Not at all man, if he was looking at offers from mixer and at mixer campus, that's probably against TOS since was still under contract.
@@COALEDasICE Doesn't account for other streamers getting banned if they stream with doc, why? Because he tried to get a deal with Mixer. Again, no sense to it.
@@jahoadley1 you clearly don't know how business works. They don't want him near their business for trying to Fuck them. Just like most if not any business man would do whether you were in the streets and one of your top dogs was to talking to the opposition all the way up to wall street. They dump you on the side walk to tell you to go Fuck yourself
@@COALEDasICE Clearly you have no concept of business.
So Twitch was embarrased. Shame on them, you got played, step up , be the bigger person offer him back or end ban so he can play with other streamers. Dr Disrespect is GOAT when it comes to Streamers
damn im early today
Truth 2nd early
Ecactly that reason was my first thought, because it was a weird time between his new contract and mixer closing etc.
For most people it makes no sense to ban a big content creator (wich makes good money for you). But doc is not the biggest streamer and without doc, twitch is still fine.
Doc pissed twitch on the leg because he was lying, now twitch punished him and was making a statement to all contentcreators -> if you try to go on another platform, you are done (you can quote ninjas wife i think). Twitch target was to scare other creators to move from twitch, so if you move, your carrer is done.
And for morst twitch partners that is the case. Now in the future people are scared of moving from twitch. Twitch now can have better deals, because they can say "same happens to you, just like doc, if you move".
Twitch also helped Shroud & Ninja build their careers and they went to another platform and left Twitch. It doesn’t add up that they’d let them come back and then ban Doc for using Mixer as leverage in a deal.
Side note: It does kind of make sense that they paid a huge amount to stop him leaving and once Mixer shut down they realised they’d paid him too much and didn’t want to pay over the odds when there’s no competition anymore.
@@brittperry7050 Yeah no sh*t Sherlock he came back after Mixer shut down😂
That just doesnt make sense to me. Becsuse they were mad he was saying he had another offer they decided to give up one of their biggest streamers that brings in millions for them? I dont buy that. Pro athletes get offers from other teams all the time and go back and forth with the teams negotiating.
At the end of the day, streaming is a business and job for these people. I don't understand why a company would ban one of their top earners for receiving and considering other offers. That being said, speaking of other offers potentially in the presence of someone who is an employer is tactless and will have repercussions. Realistically, twitch is no worse off without one guy, and he's still making bank. All this "drama" does is bring them more interactions and more money.
Doesn't make sense. They wouldn't *ban* him after Mixer shut down. Twitch would just sign him for less or let him go.
they already sign him, that's the point .. streamers sign contracts months ago before they tell the public .. they got angry when they find out he was playing and they had too much of pride to keep him so they said bye!
Doesn't make sense, that Twitch was upset, because Doc was flirting with Mixer, when they then take shroud back, who LEFT Twitch for Mixer, right ? But you never know what is standing in those papers. Doc said, on stream, he had offers from other platforms, but would never switch. TH-cam, because it is too saturated already, and Facebook Gaming only made him laugh really hard, with dozens of thousands in chat laughing along with him. Mixer was so fresh and new too. He was loyal to Twitch, at least on stream. He truly represented the imagination, being the face of Twitch, in such a funny way. And now it is just, that little purple platform, for him. As long it is no super sensitive info, i really would like to know, what the reason for the ban was, or if we will get told one day.
Doesn't make sense that they'd ban him in the manner that they did just for negotiating new deals for himself. Plus they had already given him the deal, they had already decided he was worth X amount of money. Something happened to where not only he is not worth X amount of money, we wont let him stream on our platform any longer.
Crazy...
There’s absolutely no way they can terminate a contract because he negotiated more money leveraging another offer that fell through.
Regardless of whether or not it fell through the offer was still real at the time. Doc had no control or knowledge of Mixer failing. Also, if you’re implying he signed the new deal and then was terminated without payout that can only be for serious breach of contract, which wouldn’t fall under “he tricked us with mixer so we paid him more”.
Serious breach is basically only misconduct. It can only be misconduct because of how harshly Twitch are enforcing the ban.
The silence is because it’s clearly serious af and doc / twitch both have lawyers involved. Until it’s settled legally, nothing will be said by either side.
Many people have gotten offers from Mixer and were not banned as a result of getting an offer or meeting with them. The only way I would buy this idea is IF Doc had a non-compete in his contract, for whatever weird reason only he would have such a stipulation. I think it is a result of him breaking his contract in some manner, but I doubt we'll ever really know what it was.
Im pretty sure he already signed a contract with them in November of 2019 and then negated it a few months into 2020. Twitch litterally made their add with him as their poster boy
That sounds like good business on Dr. Disrespect’s part. This would also mean that Twitch in addition to playing CYA went on a scorched earth policy. This if all true would also mean that any other rising or big name streamer should never do partnerships or business with Twitch, as they are allergic to negotiations and honoring their contracts.
If this is true, that sucks for twitch. Any lawsuit, which is likely happening if this is true, would absolutely favor doc. Especially if there’s an instant and unspecified reason for termination. Yeah California is an “at will” work state, but “because you tried to negotiate and talked to a competitor” isn’t a reason to fire someone. Any reasonable jury would agree and docs gonna have five Lamborghini diablos soon.
So what if that's the case.
It's perfectly normal in business for one side to use offers from competitors as leverage in negotiations. That is in no way any kind of infraction.
It doesn't explain why Twitch would treat him so badly as to pull the plug in such an abrupt way.
Unless of course they decided to slaughter him to scare and bully the other streams not to ask for more money. Which would make them giant deuchbags.
It does sound feasible but it still doesn't explain why Discord and Activision cancelled their partnerships with him at the same time
While this alleged reason heads, I think, in the right direction. I can't see how it would lead to a ban from streaming on the platform. A renegotiation of contract...maybe, even a lawsuit for negotiating a contract in bad faith...maybe. But ban the face of Twitch from streaming on the platform and basically act like the Doc never existed on Twitch in the first place? I'm not convinced. However, if Doc was negotiating deals with other platforms while still under contract with Twitch...then I can see Twitch saying...nope, you don't do that so you have to go.
eh i don't buy that one.
firstly why would that be so secret? like doc literally coulda said "tried re-negotiating, twitch said no and banned me" not really anything secret about a deal falling through.
2nd if that was how it went and all of a sudden mixer was shutting down, surely twitch would be like "right you can re-sign your contract for the same money or you can go elsewhere" in which case doc wouldn't be banned he would of just moved platforms.
unless doc was still under contract with twitch and was still trying to leverage a deal which might of terminated his twitch contract then it kinda makes sense him getting banned. but again why so secret?
This isn't a bad theory and has some merit on the time line. The issue I have is that Doc can go searching for deals because his contract is about over. He can talk with mixer and see what they offer him. He can then use that as a ballpark estimate of what he is worth to other similar companies. There cannot be a legal reason for Twitch to ban him over talking with another platform, and Doc wouldn't lie about a contract he was offered. Like the man said he is a good business man, he would know that would blow up in his face if they caught him lieing about deals. Also didn't Doc sign a new contract with Twitch a few months before Mixer went under? Or am I remembering that wrong?
You're dead on. The one thing that caught me about it all is Doc saying he was there before shroud and ninja signed which would have put him at the mixer campus before august 2019 which seems like a long time before his deal with Twitch was announced in March 2020.
fair take, but how would this play into the recent COD tournament exclusion the doc faced which was supposedly related to his twitch ban?
I don’t think it was mixer because he had already announced he was staying with twitch when mixer died. I think he was caught discussing signing with TH-cam while he was still under contract with Twitch. The timing lines up a lot better.
Only way I saw Doc going Mixer was if it was MORE than just the streaming platform deal. As in a marketing deal with Microsoft.
But to take that kind of deal, he would have had to move his live content over to Microsoft's. Well when they made other deals and started falling apart, if I were Doc I wouldn't stock my content on Microsoft's platform either after long negotiations for months.
what would make sense to me is that doc lied to twitch about the amount he was offered from mixer. lets say doc said that they offered him 20million. Then twitch goes around and offers the same to him, only to find out months later that they only offered the doc 10 million.
This could be it yeah? because why would they ban a man for making a good business deal
I'm not sure about the timing, but it kinda makes sense. The Doc tried to make more money out of Twitch by using the mixer offer, but when mixer announced they were shutting down, suddenly Twitch realized Ninja and Shroud were available again, so they ditched doc to afford those 2 new deals.Obviously for that to happen, Doc had to violate some term of the agreement and Twitch exploited it at the right moment, I mean, it's was a good business move from Twitch POV considering his strategy to make their content more attractive for advertising, Doc might be seen too risky for Twitch in that sense.
Whether or not Doc’s people said he had an offer from Mixer, there is no way Twitch finds out about whether or not it’s true. Using something done BEFORE the contract is signed as grounds to nullify the agreed-upon deal only would make Twitch MORE unethical.