Frank Zappa - St Etienne - 1982

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 เม.ย. 2012
  • Frank Zappa - "St Etienne", France - 1982
    Extrait de "Video From Hell" de 1986.
    "St Etienne" est le second solo du titre "Drowning Witch" de l'album "Ship Arriving Too Late to Save a Drowning Witch" joué le 28 mai 1982 au Palais des Sports de Saint-Étienne.
    Zappa remporta pour cet album un Grammy Award en 1988, dans la catégorie Meilleure Performance instrumentale de rock (Best Rock Instrumental Performance, en anglais)
    Une chose assez étonnante est que cet album reçut un sticker "Parental Advisory" bien que l'album soit entièrement instrumental. Ceci est du au combat mené par Frank Zappa contre le Parental Music Resource Center (PMRC), qui a instauré ce sticker.
    Zappa Humor Inside : "Exotic French Sidewalk Entertainment inserted here for diversion while we re-synchronize original VHS footage to The Digital Audio Master"
    Shot with a Hitachi home
    video camera,
    by Thomas Nordegg
    during the concert in
    St. Etienne, France
    May, 1982.
    • Tech guru, Thomas Nord...
    * Thomas Nordegg was Frank Zappa's guitar tech back in the day. Later, he became guitar tech for his son, Dweezil Zappa, and for former guitarist in Frank Zappa's band; Steve Vai! Thomas Nordegg has quite an impressive effects setup, including lots of TC Electronic gear, and a bunch of rather unusual guitars that can pull off some amazing tricks !
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ความคิดเห็น • 237

  • @IbanezFan550
    @IbanezFan550 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +48

    I have transcribed and learned this solo... the fact that it was improvised is absolutely mind blowing. Genuinely.
    The phrasing and timing are remarkable, as is the completely unique style. There are no rock cliches or standard licks thrown in, it is sublimely musical and inventive for the entire six and a half minutes. Frank was a monster player!

    • @hafidimloul640
      @hafidimloul640 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      YES FRANK IS A FREAK'IN KILLING GUITAR ' PLAYER .HAFID 5:25

    • @stugerson4838
      @stugerson4838 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @IbanezFan550....ls your real name Steve Vai
      ?

    • @peipy44
      @peipy44 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      You are so right about the phrasing, really unique and totally distinctive.

    • @danmartinazzi
      @danmartinazzi 29 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      true! Nobody come close

  • @urbanbader4113
    @urbanbader4113 ปีที่แล้ว +15

    Phenomenal out of space world's most underrated guitar master ever. Okay 🤗 his ego might have been a little less whatever I never forget you. Francis Vincent you made my life so much wiser 👍🏽💯🏴‍☠️

  • @davidaldridge9341
    @davidaldridge9341 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Simply the most awe-inspiring guitar solo of all time...

  • @Syd4510
    @Syd4510 5 ปีที่แล้ว +46

    The greatest improvising soloist of all time, I reckon!

  • @BreezyandtheBlazers-vd3xw
    @BreezyandtheBlazers-vd3xw 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

    My favorite guitar solo of all time

  • @jeffbrett7849
    @jeffbrett7849 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    One of the most beautiful guitar pieces ever....sublime

  • @yoddeb
    @yoddeb ปีที่แล้ว +10

    This clip will blow people away a couple of centuries from now.

  • @marsharupe8112
    @marsharupe8112 8 ปีที่แล้ว +63

    This just blows me away. Frank was such a stunning guitarist.

  • @yoddeb
    @yoddeb 3 ปีที่แล้ว +18

    He sits there pretty calmly considering what is going on, i.e striking gold every few seconds. Fucking incredible improvisation. Thank you Frank!!

  • @xwarx1000
    @xwarx1000 3 ปีที่แล้ว +14

    Best , bravest and the most adventurous musician ever. RIP FZ.

  • @johnharpdalton4092
    @johnharpdalton4092 5 ปีที่แล้ว +29

    Frank struck gold that night and uncovered an untouched seam.... one that no-one else has found since.

    • @tagaudi
      @tagaudi 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      He worked a lot on this solo before and after he performed in Saint E

  • @urbanbader4113
    @urbanbader4113 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    A unique personality possessed by bringing his genius music 👍🏽💪 I'm enjoying it up since 45 year's Amen

  • @GuidoKGroup
    @GuidoKGroup 7 ปีที่แล้ว +27

    This guitar solo (from the "Ship arriving too late ....." tune) is divine. Unbelievable. You can learn so much from it. It stirs me to tears. Zappa rules !!!!

  • @jean-francoisgleyze
    @jean-francoisgleyze ปีที่แล้ว +9

    magnifique merci Frank jf Gleyze

    • @hafidimloul640
      @hafidimloul640 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Merci pour le MAÎTRE INCONTESTÉ ET DÉFINITIVEMENT INCONTESTABLE, ET MERCI PUISSANCE 10 A TON COMMENTAIRE "J.P.G "

  • @TimPrendergast
    @TimPrendergast 7 ปีที่แล้ว +50

    this performance is why i wanted to learn to play guitar... it's pure meditation.

  • @Wizuu0274
    @Wizuu0274 3 ปีที่แล้ว +18

    Really can't look past Wackerman's playing here. It's like he and Frank are one and the same mind.

  • @seanbrennan5192
    @seanbrennan5192 4 ปีที่แล้ว +12

    He just kept getting better and better, never slowed down. Not until the cancer got him. RIP frank, you were a master of your craft.

  • @FreeBrunoPowroznik
    @FreeBrunoPowroznik 2 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    This solo is so exquisite, it even makes the magic guy worth watching!!!

  • @holtstertag1977
    @holtstertag1977 3 ปีที่แล้ว +16

    I can listen to this everyday and never get bored, as with most of his solos but this one is truly special!

  • @seanbrennan5192
    @seanbrennan5192 5 ปีที่แล้ว +29

    I don’t care, this is the best guitar solo by any human as far as I’m concerned

    • @tagaudi
      @tagaudi 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      dear sean. There are so many 'the best guitar solos' from where this one came

    • @frankfertier34
      @frankfertier34 2 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      @@tagaudi I am a very long time Zappa geek ("66) and I must admit this solo has a very unique meditative flavour, on par with some Holdsworthian gems (The 4.15 Bradford executive) th-cam.com/video/99v6ifd7wjk/w-d-xo.html

    • @seanbrennan5192
      @seanbrennan5192 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@frankfertier34 Thanks for the link! Holdsworth was one of the greats. Zappa respected him greatly, been getting into him a bit. I’ll add this one to my playlists

    • @esjope
      @esjope หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      You are not wrong. Zappa has played most of the all time best guitar solos in the history of the humanity.

    • @esjope
      @esjope หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      This is just so amazing solo. Too magnificent for us, regular people.

  • @jonplaysbass33
    @jonplaysbass33 5 ปีที่แล้ว +30

    This music heals my soul... Thanks from a big fz fan from Argentina ...

  • @bodhisattva71
    @bodhisattva71 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    *Truly a guitarist of the 4th dimension.*

  • @aks03755
    @aks03755 11 ปีที่แล้ว +48

    Perhaps one of the greatest guitar solos of ALL time.
    The part between 2:42 and 3:18 simply rips your heart out.

    • @zachshuler1143
      @zachshuler1143 6 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      aks03755 sounds similar to sinister footwear

    • @aks03755
      @aks03755 5 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      zach shuler Haha... funny to rediscover this comment of mine and your response 6 years after I originally posted! The last 5 digits are just my zip code. The first three letters, well...

    • @Alix777.
      @Alix777. 2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

      Genius underrated guitarist

    • @moi3557
      @moi3557 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      The whole lot rips mine out!

    • @urbanbader4113
      @urbanbader4113 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Yep 💯👍🏽

  • @SKoradov
    @SKoradov 8 ปีที่แล้ว +36

    Nobody else can play lake Frank. Genius!

    • @Mumon010
      @Mumon010 8 ปีที่แล้ว +6

      A truly creative individual.

  • @OldGuysWhoLikeOldComics
    @OldGuysWhoLikeOldComics 2 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    Thank you, Thomas, for shooting this extraordinary footage.

  • @meercaz8245
    @meercaz8245 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    I remember taping this off the VHS when i was 15 and listening to it over and over!

  • @jefffelderman2409
    @jefffelderman2409 6 ปีที่แล้ว +27

    R.I.P. to my favorite musician and biggest guitar inspiration, who departed this world 24 years ago. This solo, like so many others he played, is a masterpiece composition created totally "in the moment." His level of genius is unparalleled.

  • @jimpalmer792
    @jimpalmer792 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    It just does not get any better than this.
    [Except perhaps for Ancient Armaments .....].
    Miss you Frank.

    • @jimpalmer792
      @jimpalmer792 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Two Words: Goose Bumps !

  • @bigbananadealer846
    @bigbananadealer846 7 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    this shit is so fucking clean, dude is a fucking mastermind. seriously how the fuck did he do that

  • @OmnesiaBand
    @OmnesiaBand 6 ปีที่แล้ว +13

    Absolute genius of the highest order. Ineffable.

  • @KanuuDeTako
    @KanuuDeTako 11 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    I'm happy to watch a live video of Drowning Witch. It's one of the best songs of Zappa.

    • @ArtMuzak
      @ArtMuzak 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Totally agree

  • @myriadplanes
    @myriadplanes 4 ปีที่แล้ว +10

    Absolute bliss, what an amazing sound. Zappa is the highest. Pure joy

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    extraordinaire, thanks from france

  • @danmartinazzi
    @danmartinazzi 2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    No time no space here, pure art!!!

  • @sephiroth3082
    @sephiroth3082 3 ปีที่แล้ว +9

    5:38 is insane

  • @lastdaysguitar
    @lastdaysguitar 2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Frank LOVED phrygian

    • @seanbrennan5192
      @seanbrennan5192 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      It’s mixolydian. And Frank did love his mixolydian

    • @lastdaysguitar
      @lastdaysguitar ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@seanbrennan5192 He played in Phrygian as well.
      Geez, why do musicians feel they have to one up each other? I'm not talking about just this one song!

    • @seanbrennan5192
      @seanbrennan5192 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@lastdaysguitar Yeah he uses Phrygian as well. His bread and butter is definitely mixolydian though, I brought this song to my guitar teacher. It’s the only reason I know what mode it’s in lol. He uses Phrygian in Transylvania boogie, and he might actually use it in the first guitar solo of drowning witch. I’m not actually too sure judging by the sound

  • @rohanroll
    @rohanroll 4 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    THAT HELL OF A TONE HE HAD... ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    miss you Frank, still lovin you , irène from France

  • @charlysstore
    @charlysstore หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Excellent. Thanks for sharing and kindly regards from Deutschland

  • @bernhardsart
    @bernhardsart 2 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Pure Genius!!!!

  • @invernomuto00
    @invernomuto00 11 ปีที่แล้ว +12

    best ever improvisation period.

  • @alex222pak
    @alex222pak 4 ปีที่แล้ว +24

    "I don't do drugs, I am drugs" -Frank Zappa

    • @alex222pak
      @alex222pak 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      @Jeff Sylvester No, I think Dali stole it from Zappa!

    • @p.b.palaciosalmafuerte3463
      @p.b.palaciosalmafuerte3463 3 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@alex222pak jaja, so true.

    • @pipeandslippersman
      @pipeandslippersman 3 ปีที่แล้ว

      i think ol' frankie would have been a teeny bit pissed off about that quote being attributed to him. any half arsed internet search will throw up a dozen examples of how anti-drug he was. although, if certain people want to lump coffee and cigarettes into the mix - the man was a fucking junkie...

    • @tagaudi
      @tagaudi 3 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      "Sometimes people ask me: "Tell us, Frank. No, really, tell us, Frank: WHAT ARE YOU ON?"
      And then I tell them: 'I'm on duty!'"

    • @bikingfencer
      @bikingfencer 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      😄

  • @sound-ur1bq
    @sound-ur1bq 4 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    and the sound ! the sound he got was killing

    • @bikingfencer
      @bikingfencer 2 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      The Zappa revolution in performance was his ability to produce studio quality sound in live concerts.

  • @swamisMotelBand1
    @swamisMotelBand1 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Thank you Poitique

  • @pequeuxdarleux1480
    @pequeuxdarleux1480 6 ปีที่แล้ว +14

    masterpiece

  • @zey7974
    @zey7974 7 ปีที่แล้ว +13

    euphoric. just amazing..

  • @st939
    @st939 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Simply THE BEST, no comparison.

  • @jejzap1334
    @jejzap1334 5 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    I saw him 3 days after in Bordeaux - each time I see this video it remember me this epoque - thank you

  • @NickHolum
    @NickHolum 6 ปีที่แล้ว +19

    My favorite Frank solo I think. Can't look past Wackerman's playing here either. He and Frank are locked in esp.

    • @NickHolum
      @NickHolum ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@DWHarper62 idk id say aside from Vinnie and maybe Humphries , Chad is as complimentary to Zappa as anyone else

    • @NickHolum
      @NickHolum ปีที่แล้ว +2

      @@DWHarper62 idk, as a drummer… both Bozzio and Chester are two of my all time favorites… but those were different bands with different members, chosen for different musical directions. So if you want some bullshit internet debate where you make a fallacious and subjective statement and say “prove me wrong” then you can gfy. If you want to listen to a drummer who has a full catalogue of clicking with all time great guitar players (Holdsworth, Zappa, etc) there plenty of records to choose from. There’s even a specific double album by Frank called “Guitar” which features Chad on virtually every song… including this one. Or you can go to the first track from TBBYNHIYL… Heavy Duty Judy… the connection with Frank is immediate from the first notes of the concert. Chad is an absolute monster.

    • @NickHolum
      @NickHolum ปีที่แล้ว

      @@DWHarper62 doh'k Steven Crowder dbag ... I even said Vinnie is best, but you're too interested in dumb internet debates

    • @NickHolum
      @NickHolum ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@DWHarper62I’m probably not gonna lose any sleep tonight over being called an asshole by the guy who went all Steven Crowder on me.

    • @NickHolum
      @NickHolum ปีที่แล้ว

      @DWHarper62 Correct, you came into my comments with your Steven Crowder BS pushing your dumb opinion that nobody is interested in hearing about… so yes, gfy.

  • @alaingogniat7133
    @alaingogniat7133 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    RIP-genius Frank Zappa

  • @gregoryg3256
    @gregoryg3256 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    🌠 Wowie Zowie...Zappa eee...

  • @peipy44
    @peipy44 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    MAGNIFICENT

  • @periurban
    @periurban 9 ปีที่แล้ว +51

    All you shredders - do this instead. (Bet you can't.)

  • @laurentfraisse7300
    @laurentfraisse7300 2 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Présent le vendredi 28 mai 1982, mon premier concert de Zappa.

    • @seanbrennan5192
      @seanbrennan5192 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Lucky bastard! I was negative 14 years old…

  • @lautrichpirr7861
    @lautrichpirr7861 6 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    fantastisch

  • @davethecaveman
    @davethecaveman 10 ปีที่แล้ว +21

    best solo EVER

    • @moccagriselda
      @moccagriselda 5 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      Could have been outdone only by himself.

  • @pascaloprandi4053
    @pascaloprandi4053 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    un grand monsieur ce zappa

  • @user-or5xd8yn6t
    @user-or5xd8yn6t 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    PHANTASTIC!!!1!!

  • @aliensporebomb
    @aliensporebomb 4 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    I had no idea footage of this solo existed at all. Amazing.

  • @lostinthiswhirlpool
    @lostinthiswhirlpool 5 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    Correction :
    L'album pour lequel Frank Zappa eut un Grammy Award en 1988 n'est pas "Ship arriving too late to save a drowning witch", mais l'album "Jazz from hell", album qui contient ce solo...

  • @bancosolo
    @bancosolo 3 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    wow just perfect deep wow

  • @michelmuller7270
    @michelmuller7270 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    fantastique musicien..

  • @propellerkuh3230
    @propellerkuh3230 6 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    I see his paintings here, but more poetically. Eternal solo!

  • @ICA17887
    @ICA17887 3 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Zappa Genius.

  • @trestabernae7250
    @trestabernae7250 6 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    Que c'est bon.... Merci Frank

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    miss you Frank, lov you forever, irène from france

  • @gillesnoennec1968
    @gillesnoennec1968 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Zappa is a man who really loves music,that's why he's a genius. Thanks for all.

    • @user-yp2mw2ko9k
      @user-yp2mw2ko9k 5 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I also love music - does that make me a genius as well ?

    • @ViveLeQuebecLibreTabarnak
      @ViveLeQuebecLibreTabarnak 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      how autistic are you?

    • @FrankBurnham
      @FrankBurnham 23 วันที่ผ่านมา

      ​@@user-yp2mw2ko9kYES!!!! YES!!!! DEAR GOD YES!!! patterns, art, create!

    • @FrankBurnham
      @FrankBurnham 23 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Einstein played the Violen, not sure about Tesla.

  • @zolarczakl3880
    @zolarczakl3880 6 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    Today is 24 A.Z. RIP, Uncle Frank. Instant compositions every night. Solos could be ugly and dangerous or full of feeling, like this example.

  • @joaocarlosfavaro9789
    @joaocarlosfavaro9789 5 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    he can't be beat he can't be beat he can't be beat he can't be beat

  • @runrunrun6777
    @runrunrun6777 8 ปีที่แล้ว +18

    Best guitar solo ever.

  • @27solonsoho
    @27solonsoho 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Musical genius

  • @CarloFromaggio
    @CarloFromaggio 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Excellent job!!!!
    ¡VIVA TOM FOWLER!

  • @GuidoKGroup
    @GuidoKGroup 7 ปีที่แล้ว +10

    Perhaps one of Zappa's best guitar solos, ever. Zappa rules. #TheGuidoKGroup

  • @SeiStatoTu
    @SeiStatoTu 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Only for outer listeners, Very Franky. Thank You

  • @unkleskratch
    @unkleskratch 6 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    this live version is on the Jazz From Hell album- yes, its that clean.

  • @feuquegougueul1592
    @feuquegougueul1592 3 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    I really like it, but miss tthis concert at 100 miles from my home!

  • @jeffmold9058
    @jeffmold9058 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Phantasticuss fantastico!

  • @strav1231
    @strav1231 9 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    Just fucking wow! Thanks for this wonderful post - and thanks Thomas for sharing the filming....

  • @andrewmoser5539
    @andrewmoser5539 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Not only is this one of Frank's best performances, but we can see him get nervous at 3:15, and he breaks a string in the fade out at the end. What a fucking monster... Frank had been touring every year for a decade by this point (1972 to 1982), and like many OG rock performers, his playing got better with the more time he spent on the road. By 1982, Frank was fucking SCARY on the guitar, and this video is evidence of that fact.

  • @markusclemens6979
    @markusclemens6979 4 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    Hendrix?
    Page?
    Clapton?
    Zappa!!!!!!!

    • @moi3557
      @moi3557 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Page was playing in the sand compared to Frank.

  • @frankzappatik4337
    @frankzappatik4337 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Thanks

  • @patcol1485
    @patcol1485 12 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    Superbe morceau comme d'hab.

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    miss you Frank irène from france

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    miss u

  • @steveclarke12
    @steveclarke12 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Stunning!

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    oh Frank miss you

  • @wladimirtay69old
    @wladimirtay69old 7 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Ils n'ont rien à faire dans l'enfer,ils sont dignes du paradis !

  • @teamuncle
    @teamuncle 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Live Frank..........Astounding.

  • @fuegoranou9705
    @fuegoranou9705 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    viva Zappa, miss you, irène from france

  • @berthetolivier290
    @berthetolivier290 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    I was there !

  • @lucdeschenaux3322
    @lucdeschenaux3322 5 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    I love jamming on this masterpiece

  • @zappainfrance
    @zappainfrance 10 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    Sympa; merci beaucoup pour toutes ces précisions....
    Vu qu'on prend notre retraite à la fin de l'année on
    est content que d'autres
    frenchies prennent la rélève... !!!!
    Pour info nous avons eu le "chargé aux affaires culturelles"
    de la Ville de Saint Etienne
    il y a 2 mois au téléphone... il tombait des nues !!!
    arf arf ( chargé c'est bein le terme kill faut ! )
    There is No Hell ! ...
    :-c

    • @p.b.palaciosalmafuerte3463
      @p.b.palaciosalmafuerte3463 ปีที่แล้ว

      No entendi mucho, pero me parece que hablas sobre la reforma jubilatoria en francia?

  • @joaocarlosfavaro9789
    @joaocarlosfavaro9789 7 ปีที่แล้ว +12

    3:41 Heaven chord

  • @tristanlemusicien5433
    @tristanlemusicien5433 9 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    talentueux!!

  • @williameiffert494
    @williameiffert494 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    A lot of licks from "Yo Mama"

  • @gillesmasson4031
    @gillesmasson4031 2 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Yes

  • @MikkelGrumBovin
    @MikkelGrumBovin 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    O M G `! i - WE, miss Frank SO much,- 😭

  • @mariusarnaud4348
    @mariusarnaud4348 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Thx thoman nordberg

  • @zolarczakl3880
    @zolarczakl3880 5 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    5:33 The chicken and the spider technique of Frank Zappa.

    • @frankystrings
      @frankystrings 4 ปีที่แล้ว

      no. that's tapping. if sounds like a chicken. everything he plays in this solo is a chicken and spider technique