PCIe Card Expansion System for Worship Ministry | Sonnet Echo Express Setup and Review
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ส.ค. 2024
- In this video, Jake walks through the building, setup, and usage of a PCIe card expansion system fo use with ProPresenter
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GEAR IN THIS VIDEO
Sonnet Echo Express SEIIIe Thunderbolt 3 Edition (3-Slot PCIe Card Expansion Chassis)
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Good Alternative Expansion Chassis (StarTech.com Thunderbolt 3 PCIe Expansion Chassis w/DisplayPort)
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Blackmagic Design DeckLink Duo 2 4ch SDI Playback and Capture Card
amzn.to/3awRPUP
Sonnet Presto Solo 10GBASE-T Ethernet 1-Port PCIe Card [Thunderbolt Compatible]
amzn.to/3dQlzyi
Sonnet Allegro USB 3.0 PCIe 4-Port (Mac and Windows Compatible)
amzn.to/39tJsIo
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JakeTechTips. But instead of dropping hardware, you're dropping knowledge.
XD that was hilarious
@Churchfront, Jake, I'm a ProPresenter trainer. You should use TWO for your lower thirds and do alpha (linear key). It looks like you're doing a lumakey, which is the WORST of the three types of keys (since it removes black). You've got the hardware, you should use it and you'll get MUCH better results (including translucency). I've got a tutorial on my channel about doing it, if you're interested.
What's the title of your video?
@@alefthree I think I found it. Is a 2yr old video the tittle is “Pro Tutorial: How to send an Alpha channel from ProPresenter 7 with a BMD Decklink duo2 card”
I'd strongly recommend using 2 SDIs for lower thirds to the blackmagic design. ProPresenter requires either NDI or 2 SDI connections to send a linear (alpha) key. Blackmagic only takes SDI so stick with 2 SDI outputs for the Black Magic Design ATEM switcher. Right now I am assuming you are using a Luma Key as your upstream key which works but doesn't allow you do have any black on your signal out (so no black text outline on your text). You could use chroma key instead and use ProPresenter's background setting to automatically add a, say green, background to your Stream lower thirds audience screen and that would give you more freedom of color choices to send out. Or just use 2 SDI outs on propresenter and use the Linear (alpha) Key and be able to send any color or whatever you want to your ATEM switcher and have no issues whatsoever. This helps a lot when displaying more complicated stuff (like long bible verses) on your lower thirds feed.
We don't use the Decklink but we use PP with a Kumo and we use the Green screen background as you mentioned. Works well. I am researching upgrading from the HDMI dongles to Decklink Duo 2 though.
Could you explain this set up a little more? I'm coming in after the fact and trying to fix some massive issues with keying right now!
This is why you would choose a Computer over a laptop when doing this kind of setup, as it is easier to customize to suit what you need in your studio and you wouldn't be needing that much of the dongles and buying them instead of using those funds for other things like maintenance etc, as you said in the video. Anyways, it is still a great video, very informative, this will really help people who are searching for solutions for their services, keep it up! its just my two cents, anyways, God Bless!!!
I need your help lol. We’re about to buy another desktop to run our presentation software but I need three outputs for our setup. Could a graphics card that had 3-4 display outputs work?
I had problems at first using a laptop and splitter to project to a projector and 2 TV screens as one screens would flicker constantly. The solution was a custom build pc with a dedicated graphics card. Problem solved.
I LOVE our Sonnet Echo! We got the BM Quadlink card and have 8 inputs or outputs from the computer! The best solution so far!
Welcome to the world of getting nerdy about tech and loving it! I so need one of these! Thanks for finding the solution to my problems. Once again. Keep doing what you do so well Jake!
Ive been researching how to do this lately so this vid is perfect timing.
You are such a blessing! I have no clue on what to do when it comes to video streaming but watching your videos made me informed and confident. Thank you so very much for what you do. God bless!
Wow, praise and glory to God for all you're doing which is so helpful to us worship leaders all around the world, this made me as a song writer,worshiper began uploading newly worships songs to bless churches in my channel. God bless you brother!
finally someone explains this process. thank you so much. much love from Lagos, Nigeria
This is an awesome solution to the issues I've been running into this week specifically. Thanks for that! One tip I'd give for people new to putting together hardware like that is get an anti-static wrist strap and standing on a hard surface rather than carpet when building. I'm not sure how sensitive these components are to static, but it's really easy in building computers to fry a part and have to buy a new one if you aren't properly grounded
Your comments about techy stuff and IT guys had me bustin' up! Way to go! :-)
I love you... like truly. You answer my “Can I” questions every time.
Thank you so much Jake ! We did exactly that in our church and it allowed us to manage our dual video projection screen + stage display + lower thirds. We "just" needed to upgrade our Mac (from mack air to iMac with good graphic cards since our old one wasn't able to run any video in PP7 without very big lags...)
This is great for portable setups when you want to use SDI or even HDMI in a live event. I have a very powerful rig at home, but if I want to travel, I need a Rig that fits everything and I can't bring my big one with me. That being said, having a powerful laptop, or a Mini ITX computer build with this PCIe Expansion slot, it can fit in one Pelican Case. With Vmix installed and my arsenal of 3 DSLR's, I'm a mobile studio with this setup.
Thank you for posting this. It's just what I was looking for.
Thanks for the videos! Discovered your channel yesterday and I'm really loving it. We currently have a lockdown in South Africa, so I'm really enjoying your videos on online church tips etc. Thanks again!
Another good way to do it is with a thunderbolt dock. It doesn't give you PCI-E expandability but it does give you many USB 3.0, Ethernet, Video out, USB C, etc expandability. Not sure about the availability for Mac but Lenovo has plenty of good options.
Yes! But for his purposes, he actually needed PCI-e cards. At least the Black Magic video card.
@@craigallen7980 PCI-e is the cleanest way to do it, no question about that. But the one cable solution can be done similarly and less expensively with a thunderbolt dock. You can replicate all of the same functionality with USB 3.0 devices hooked into a dock, except maybe 10g ethernet-- haven't seen that in a dock. USB capture boxes are inexpensive and fairly reliable. For my portable setup (sans the ATEM switcher) I use 3x hdmi capture boxes and switch with OBS. Works nice. Or spend a little more money and get a BM Ultrastudio.
YES YES YES! I can't believe there aren't more tutorials like this!
Just ordered 2 Lenovo Tiny P360's. It has a total of 6 video out's. Perfect for what we are doing at church. The drawback is Windows, but we would have to buy extra equipment (like this video shows) if we went with Apple. Also, the units are easy to open, upgrade, fix, etc. Looking forward to getting things going in a couple of weeks. Pro Presenter is a pain on Windows at times. Had to force quit and restart during communion this past Sunday. Something happens every Sunday!
Wow. I just liked this video 30 times, lol. Such a huge helpful answer to a problem we were dealing with for too long. Thanks!
You should be able to use the second USB-C on the sonet as a pass thru and plug your current Ethernet adaptor there to keep it as one cable into your Mac. Just a thought for you.
Looks good, you should be able to use the spare part to send a key and fill lower thirds output to your switcher. This would allow you to have colours other than white in your lower thirds without looking weird.
Advantages of this include black outlines around white text, highlighting scripture verses in different colours or anything you would want to do with a lower third that isn't just the colour white.
Jake thanks for making this video. I have the tip you need. I have been building this exact same set up at my church and finally figured something out Monday. Thomas is right you should send a key and fill to the ATEM because if you are like me you will want do the preachers lower thirds live during the recording instead of in post and you are finding that it's not working unless you just do white text. I contacted Propresenter and this is how you do it. 1. The Stream screen from Propresenter - turn on alpha and choose external key. 2. The DLD 2 Card - you need to keep a couple of channels paired. 3. Blackmagic Desktop Video Setup comes with a little App - Live Key. Turn it on. 4. Run the 2 SDIs to your ATEM. 5. Setup the Downstream KEY in the ATEM - Key and Fill and select Pre Multiplied Key. Bam! you can send anything you want to the ATEM (Full screens, Black Translucent Boxes, etc). Anyone reading this - If I'm still doing this wrong let me know. But this worked for me. Drew.
Thank you for this video! There seem to be no docks with 10Gb ethernet and thunderbolt 4.
Being able to construct a dock, like one would a computer, I didn't think such products existed!
Thank you I am glad you made a dedicated video for this
Loved the Linus tech tips reference
Awesome and Linus reference!
This is a great video - thank you! Also, 5:36 is hilarious 😂
Never had a ton of problems with dongles or cables shorting but I never liked the look. Surely does clean up so much of the setup though! I would only use the Usbs and deck link.
ProPresenter has an NDI Module that can do this over the network with no additional hardware. Won't work with the BMD switchers, but all of the more capable ones
...and directly with OBS and other Streaming Software.
ndi consumes a lot of resources and bandwith. not worth it for a macbook pro running everything at once
Yeah we just setup our lower thirds as a separate NDI screen for livestream and into OBS. The second screen does seem to slow Pro7 down a bit. Wondering does this expansion help that or is it more an issue of our computer processor?
If you're only sending lower thirds from ProPresenter, try setting your NDI screen resolution lower. You could send 720p for a 1080p screen and scale it without noticing a quality difference.
@@TroyNahrwold and what do you do if you need to play a full screen video? How do you get that to work with the alpha or chroma key settings.
Thanks, Jake, that was great!
Jake, you're foreverandeveramazing genius))
Great work Jake your awesome
This is Awesome! We just installed ours today. Only issue is that the duo card isn't registering. Any help?
:(
Just one tipp: Allways put dthe Card who produces the most heat in the highest Slot. so it won't heat up the other cards ;)
Good point. Thanks.
And yes... I'm laughing with you trying to put together tech!
So the sole purpose of the ethernet card in the Sonnet was to connect to Dante? I may have missed something. Thanks and great video.
Was wondering the same thing.
so cool i have two of these on order already..will be running on my intel nuc skull canyon
Abe Coulter if your running windows you might want to think about using NDI instead of a pci expansion hub.
@@Elvinchac no thanks it will work fine..i have used others and they worked fine
Thanks for the tip. Been searching an hour how to output the lyrics without media in PP7. :D
Im actually planning a state-of-the-art tech-solution for streaming our services. In my oppinion the future of communication is IP-based. We have seen that with our phones und now of course with our TVs. As a result of my researches I found Newteks NDI protocol for sending video-data over ethernet networks. That would especially come in handy for your PTZoptics cameras. For normal cameras HDMI-to-NDI converters from Maxwell are available. You wouldn't need that 4 channel SDI card. And what I've seen so far you already have a Gigabit-LAN established for sound via Dante which you could easily use for NDI. Also NDI provides the option of multicast, which means you could transmit one video stream for unlimited count of devices without needing more bandwidth for each receiver. Probably you would have to use another PC/Mac for this because the compression and decompression of NDI takes quite a lot of CPU-power. Have you considered using NDI for the scenario you are showing in this video? Greetings from Brunswick, Germany
NDI compresses your image though. I mean there is a reason its taking a 3Gbs 1080p 60fps image and using only 100Mbs instead. Then you have the bandwidth issue. His 3 different screens would be taxing the network 300Mbs+. Thats fine if he as a 1Gb connection but then all you need is some other random person in the network moving some files or download a large file to potentially cause spikes that could impact the NDI signals. Also HDMI to NDI converters are very expensive.
good job Jake
Hello Jake, thank you for sharing your knowledge. I am Pastor Henry and because of COVID 19 we are streaming our services. My issue I was you presented. I gave all Blackmagic switchers, Camera, Digital audio using the Dante system, and Pro Presenter 7 period I have not the capability of sending out multiple screens. This video gives me a solution here it is two years later, I just want to know if you still recommend this process.
Sincerely
Pastor Henry
I like the contents you're making
Great info man!!
Great work!
Well done...
Perfect video explains everything thank you. So with all the outs being sdi are you sending the feeds to the tv and stage display with sdi cables and then sdi to hdmi converters?
Linus would be proud.
This is great info, thanks!!
Since you have daisy-chaining on that enclosure you could (for the time being) plug thet usb-c to ethernet adapter in that box instead of the macbook I suppose. Just to eliminate another wire coming out of the macbook
Yea those network cards take spf. Really awesome if you want to run fiber networking. I believe they also have a copper spf connection you can slide in there. #nerdy
It looks like that's what he put in there, an RJ45 SPF+ module. You can use fiber, RJ45 (Cat6/Cat5e etc) and also DAC (Direct Attach Copper). DAC is really only good for connecting two machines or to an SPF+ based switch
@Churchfront with Jake Gosselin Why don't you get an ARTnet to DMX adaptor? That way you wouldn't need the USB to DMX converter. You would just have to run your network closer to the lights
Good video, very helpful!!!
Great video, very informative
Awesome video! Quick question, are you using Wirecast with ProPresenter?
Ha! A wild Linus appears.
I would strongly recommend a dedicated graphics card if you are planning doing anything with video (inputting or outputting video).
Hello and thank you for all that you do to support this community. Were you able to find a PCIe ethernet card that was Dante compatible?
Thanks for this question... I need too to know it
My one question is how well would this work with a Mac mini?
Nice & Thanks :)
Hey, random question...what kind of stands are you using for your tv monitors? Thanks for all the great content 👍
Thanks Jake!! This is so helpful!! Question... What is the Ethernet card for?
i would have put the BMD card with the fan on the outer slot so it blows against the case rather than onto another card...the BMD cards can get a bit warmish
I notice a lot of HOW's running their PP7 Machines on apple and using one of these boxes to expand their SDI outputs, including mine. With how often iMac's and Mac's thermal throttle and how slow their processors are until you hit the $2K price range, and since our HOW has been experiencing a ton of technical issues with our apple machine running pp7 in this configuration, I'm honestly just thinking of offering to put together a midrange windows machine for around 1K-1200 that can have these cards directly installed and run better than the apple machine at half the cost. PP7 isn't a MacOs only software, and their windows version works exactly the same, arguably better. Would be nice having the expanded connectivity and performance for our Church. The only downsides are we lose 10Gb ethernet and an SD card reader built into the machine, but both of those can be added into the machine internally or externally, and in the case of the ethernet bandwidth, you really don't need 10Gb ethernet for outputting to a switcher, and it would take quite a few camera inputs to exceed the bandwidth of even a 1Gb cord.
Don't like dongles, get a mini PC. Dell has plenty of options can install duo's in them direct. Not a fan of Apple. Good that this unit also works with PCs.
Jake have you thought about using companion and a elgato stream deck to control the atem?
Thanks for wonderful information! Is this work with M1 chipset based Macs?
Some but not all cards. Check comp chart.
Great video, always helpful. By the way does it work with the M1 chip Mac?
You mentioned the ethernet card wasn’t picking up Dante sound. Did Sonnet ever get their chassis to work with Dante?
Wondering if it’s possible to have two separate Blackmagic capture cards at the same time connected to the system?
Lets say an 8 input output BM SDI card
and then a 4 HDMI BM card?
Either two thunderbolt sonnets or maybe a thunderbolt external that can handle two BM cards? 😅
Hi Jake! Thanks for this content. Can i ask a question about this setup? Does distance have any effect on this? Our current problem is broadcasting the video out from the Mac over like 20-30ft to the stage. Any thoughts? 🙂 Appreciate it brother!
Great video curious if you have a newer update with other options you would now recommend
me too i would like to see if there is a newer updated options now since its been 4 years now
Could you offer some more insight on the BMD side of the setup? Everything is being recognized and I have items assigned properly. But I can’t get the lower third to show on my ATEM.
My guess is that the resolution and frame rate you’re sending doesn’t match the settings in your ATEM.
Great information, I purchase the Sonnet Echo Express SEIIIe Thunderbolt 3 Edition (3-Slot PCIe Card Expansion Chassis) and install Blackmagic Design DeckLink Duo 24ch SDI Playback but Mac mini can not see card. Any work around it. It look easy on the video ( I fellow the same steps ).
very nice. just 1 question, will it work on window laptop using usb c connection?
4 years later there's a better PC that is the price of the mac mini which would work well with this configuration. The MinisForum MS-01 has two thunderbolt 4 ports, two 10GB SFP ports, two 2.5GB RJ45 ports, as well as respectable built in GPU and one low-profile PCIE slot, as well as 3 M.2 slots. And it's around the same price as a mid range mac mini. Speaking of LTT, they did a nice small NAS based on 4x M.2 drives using mini motherboard with an arm-based RK3588 SoC module. It's a convenient, portable desktop storage unit thart doesn't use up USB or thunderbolt ports since it's a NAS with two 2.5GB interfaces (could use link aggregation if your network switch supports it). Using 4x 4TB sticks it yeilded 11TB in RAID 5 config. I think having everything modular but small makes for a versatile solution that can adapt to any situation and is reasonably portable. External decklink is ideal for that.
I know this is an old video. But does anyone know if you can double up the Decklink Duo 2 in the same Expansion Chassis?
i honestly dont really know
Jake on the video card is that DVI plugs? How do I go from that to my adapters first hdmi, vga, cat 5
Great Job on this video. I have a question do you know if the 4 outputs will output Broadcast outputs such as 1080p 59.94?
Our church will be moving into an old movie theatre. We will be using the original theatre screens. What do you recommend for this set up? We plan to run propresenter from our IMac and need to send the feed to two projectors, a stage screen and possibly a couple lobby TVs. We also want to run IMAG to the projectors and use our ATEM mini to add lower thirds and scripture to our live stream. I am new to all this, so any help is so appreciated!
Hey Jake Great video ! but I have one question. What is the ethernet card for? I heared you say you use DANTE, but I'm not using DANTE I'm using just a regular net work hard wired by Cat 6e, Do I need the network card if I'm connecting the sonnet chassis to my M-1 Mac which is already connected by Cat 6e cabling to the network. What is the purpose of installing a network card to the sonnet chassie ? Again great video and keep them coming !
Hello dear brother. I have been following your channel for some time and I find the tips you teach on your channel incredible! in your last video I saw you talking about the pci box you used in the other video with the blackmagic atem, I would like to know which program you are using for the online church streming? I want to pass the letters of praise on the church's lec panel and at the same time on the stage!
here in the church I have 2 computers one to transmit the church on line and the other with the pro present on the led panel in the church!
my setup /
yamaha tf 5
yamaha hs8 monitors
atem studio hd black magic
black magic intensy 4k
My name is Daniel I'm from Rio de Janeiro Brazil! big hug and may God bless you very much !!
So helpful. But why Sdi and not hdmi card? Does that not exist. Btw. I hate dongles, as well.
Hey Jake nice video, i would want to know what blackmagic converter are you using to send feed from PP7 to your TV, HDMI to SDI 3G?? let me know please thank you🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
Could you please confirm why you are not using SDI outputs from your Atem Television Studio switcher. Sorry if my question is too naive. Thanks in advance! Appreciate your insights.
You need to drop something to really make it a Linus Tech tips video
Very nice Video! Iam working on a setup to get the Zoom Video Out Via SDI. Can I just add an Output from the Decklink as a Typical Desktop Output To display the Zoom Window?
You're amazing! Can i request if you can create a windows version setup of PCIe Card Expansion System for Worship Ministry? Thanks a lot! God Bless!
Who handles the power needed by the SDI cards ?? the chassis or the computer ?? I mean if I wanted to use 2 DeckLink Quad 2 cards, should I have a powerful computer, or the chassis can handle them??
Can u do this with easy worship and if so can u do a video step by step on how to.
Awesome Video! Sir can I ask you? Can replace decklink duo 2 with CalDigit TS3 Plus to match my needs, I need 1 port for LED Screen, 1 for Stage Display, 1 for Atem Blackmagic TV Studio, 1 for TV monitor??
Thank you so much.
God bless
Hey! Any idea if Audinate and Dante worked out their beef with one another?
Just wanted to confirm, I. Bought this exact kit as per your recommendation. Did not set it up yet. Does the box have to connect to a TB port that does display out. Or can it connect to any TB3 port.
Hey you mention at the beginning of the video about your HDMI going out and the projector going out. I have this problem a lot. I've changed HDMI cords 5 times but still does it. could you help me understand why this maybe happening? Thankyou!
We had this happening with our setup as well Tremell, and it was solved on our end by lowering the refresh rate on that particular screen output (in our case the confidence monitor). You should be able to find the refresh rate in your display settings.
Jason Williams Thanks a lot! Going to check it out now. Thankyou!!
Make sure the HDMI cord you are using is rated at being able to carry the resolution and refresh rate you are sending it at the distance you have it. The longer the distance of a HDMI cable, the more expensive it is to send the signal. A 4k 60hz HDMI 75feet cord cost $300+ for a reason. A 75feet HDMI cable sending 1080p at 30hz can use a $50 hdmi cord instead.
Stumbled into this video looking at Blackmagic stuff.
With reference to 11:55 and Dante Cards --
I have a "Sonnet Echo Express SE I - Thunderbolt 3 Edition" enclosure with a "Focusrite RedNet PCIeR" Dante card installed inside.
This combination works on Windows 10 Pro 64bit (ASUS Z170 Board and Asus ThunderboltEX 3 card) and also works on my 2014 Mac mini with an Apple Thunder Bolt 2 cable + Apple "Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) to Thunderbolt 2 Adapter" plugged into the Sonnet.
Focusrite have conflicting support information here:
focusritepro.zendesk.com/hc/en-gb/articles/360002277660-Which-Thunderbolt-chassis-can-I-use-with-the-RedNet-PCIe-and-PCIeR-card-
versus the Sonnet PDF information shown in the video/on their website, which is annoying.
(13:00)
The only issue I have had is getting the PCIe-R driver to install correctly on OSX, I'm fairly new to MacOS and it took a little time to troubleshoot and resolve. The driver is a kernel extention (kext) which will be depracated at some point in the future, so needed additional steps to resolve.
I've not done a huge amount of testing on this configuration yet though, but not had any issues with routing audio etc between the card DVS.
Are you using the same computer for your pro presenter presentation and camera control? If so is it better than using 2 seperate computers.
What's the minimum recommended computer specs to run with this setup, using all available SDI outputs? Would a Macbook Pro 13 inch with 2 GHz Quad Core Intel i5 and Intel Iris Plus Graphics (1536 MB) be sufficient?
What grade of SDI cable are you using? Is that an important factor since you're running progressive video?
hi thank you for sharing knowlage) which macbook do you using? it is not overheating?
so how does the SDI cable connect to the screens or the projector, which version of the Blackmagic box?
Hi Jake have you tried this with an M1 mac? I am looking to build one of these expansion bays but I am not sure if this will work on the M1 mac book pro since it doesn’t support eGPU’s. this is a different from eGPU so I am hoping someone has tried this and got it working.
We have the same setup. The computer and Pro recognize the deck link but can’t get anything to output. Any ideas?