Flattening Whetstones, Oil or Water Sharpening Stones
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ม.ค. 2016
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Learn how easy (and cheap) it is to true up sharpening stones. Join Steve Hay as he shares with you his quick and effective way of truing Sharpening Stones. Whether you use Oil Stones or Water Stones these quick and effective tips will help you keep a keen edge on all your cutting tools and enhance the pleasure you get from you woodworking endeavours. Cheers Steve - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
With regard to the stone that you lent out. You are a generous chap with your tools. When I was an apprentice I was always taught to return a tool in better shape than I received it.
Later in life I came to the conclusion that it is better to give away stuff than to lend it, and it costs about the same!
..and with much less stress attached. Good point. Thanks for the comment. Cheers Steve
LOL sooo damn true. Better to gift than lend, better for the mental health too…
Cheers!
Straight to the point with useful information. Not a posturing, long winded, "look at me", septic type vid. Well done Aussie.
Woodturning
Thanks, appreciate the feedback and you time to comment. Cheers Steve
totally agree mate and this is pretty much what I was gonna say.
I wish there were more instruction videos like yours, Thank you!!!
Steve, I really enjoy your friendly way of presenting...a real delight. And of course, I learn a lot while smiling too, Thanks!
Thanks for the feedback Richard. Sorry for the late reply seems I missed your initial post. Hope you are continuing to smile. Cheers Steve
I bought a slab of polished granite, initially it was for the kitchen but it proved not to be practical so the kitchen's loss is my gain. It’s really good because of its weight and the wet paper causes almost a vacuum sticking it to the stone.
Another great video Steve! When ever I get finished "rearranging" my shop(been at it for over a week now,) I've got a ton of sharpening to do. Cheers mate...rr
Thanks so much for a simple method of flattening stones. And planes too! Good stuff!
A pleasure snorman. Pleased you got something out of it. Cheers Steve
Simple. Most often times people over think things. Thank you so much for brining some clarity to this topic.
Hi Kevin. I only know simple. I'm not a complicated sort of guy. (to much to remember). Appreciate your feedback. Thanks. Cheers Steve
Thank you very much! Simple and straight to the point.
Thanks appreciate your feedback and comment. Also simple and straight to the point. Cheers Steve
I stumbled across your programme on channel 31, Melbourne late last year. I was rapt to find your videos here on TH-cam. I can now watch each video at my leisure and as often as needed. Please keep them coming. Hooroo, Mark.
+biggles1024 Thanks Mark, New Season starting soon on 31 a Hexagonal Box with inlay work. We'll have the facility to download all videos from our Vimeo Site soon via our e-shop. woodworkingmasterclass.com.au/shop Thanks for watching. Cheers Steve
Hi Steve
A little tip - before using wet & dry I soak the paper in water for about 5 - 10 mins, the paper becomes very flexible and sticks to the glass sheet and virtually never moves while flattening the stones.
Cheers John
+J onno Great Tip John, thanks for sharing. Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass it works very well too, used that technique myself for years.
@@shonaoneill5151 Good to know. Cheers Steve
Adding some dishwashing liquid is even better.
This was brilliant. I've gone to classes and such that teach how to sharpen, and how to take care of your stones, and want to get into it professionally. But this is the simplest, and cheapest, way I've seen to flatten a stone. Just brilliant.
Thanks, pleased you can use our ideas,appreciate the feedback. Cheers Steve
Perfect timing for this video I'm half way through restoring a stanly # 3. Thanks.
+Adrian Butler Love the #3 one of my most used Planes. Pleased we were able to help. Cheers Steve
+Adrian Butler I agree i just started flattening my granddad's oil stones yesterday and was struggling to no end.
+David Rahn (Dmrahn) Hope this gets them sorted for you then. I'm sure it would make your Granddad proud. Cheers Steve
finally I find an aussie bloke.... subscribed before I even finished watching.... nothing like a bit of knowledge that applies to home turf ( maybe no so relevant with this particular vid but when it comes to measurements and temperature etc). I like how you didn't mess around with bullshit and just showed us what we clicked on the video to see... and I have been doing the same thing so good to know ..thanks. nice work mate. cheers
Just what I needed. Great video, thanks
Thanks for the feedback Neil. Pleased you found it useful. Cheers Steve
New subscriber, because your presentation is so wonderful. Cheerful, informative and gets down to it. No blathering or long pauses like I've seen from guys who think they've got something to say. Love it!
Well thank you so much for the Comment and Sub. Hope we can continue to please and insipre. Cheers Steve
Thanks a lot Steve. You just gained a new subscriber brother!
Hi Stefano. Appreciate your Sub. Cheers Steve
Great tip using the glass and sandpaper. I've seen other videos where people draw a grid on the stone and when it's been erased you know it's flat.
That sounds like a clever idea. Never thought of that might try it sometime. Cheers Steve
great information yet again Steve. Hope all is well with you and Bob. (such a good boy)
Thanks Nathan, Pleased you got something from it. Bob's good, should go on a diet though! But I shouldn't expect him to do something I won't, so we'll just love him all the more. Cheers Steve
Used many a sheet of wet and dry when working in the body shop. Looks like a good easy way to flatten a stone!
2 of my favorite things. Inexpensive and it works. :) Cheers Steve
Brilliant, to the point, top tip.
Thanks Shane, Pleased you enjoyed it and I appreciate the feedback. Cheers Steve
Great video just what I needed to know. Thanks
Thanks James, pleased it was of some assistance to you. Appreciate the comment. Cheers Steve
Fantastic tutorial Steve! (Now I need to go dig out my old cupped stones.)
+Jeremy McMahan And what else will you find on the hunt? If they are really badly cupped even start off with 80 or even 60 grit to get rid of the ridges. Cheers Steve
Good tips. Thanks Steve!
Great tips here Steve. I am in the process of making some investments in whetstones, both oil and/or water. I am slowly bldg my workshop & adding woodworking tools in the process. I have my eyes on some Arkansas stones, mined right here in America. They are based on hardness, not so much by grit. The Arkansas soft stone translates to roughly a 1200 grit surface. I was originally thinking on going with the electroplated diamond steel plates made by Trend, ( under a microscope, diamonds tend to scratch, stones smooth ) but I am re-considering that route for the moment.
Excellent demonstration using a piece of glass, wet & dry paper, kero & water & most importantly, it is AFFORDABLE!
Thank you,
Bill on the Hill...
Vermont, USA... :-)
Thanks Bill, it is a maze out there so get what you feel most comfortable using. All the best with you emerging workshop. Cheers Steve
Excellent presentation, you've saved many of us alot of $$$.
Thanks...
Hi Dave. Pleased you liked it and that I could help save you some money. Cheers Steve
Great, very helpful video. You just saved me a ton of money. I have 4 or 5 old stones that I picked up that are dished out and rounded. I know what I am doing tomorrow. Thank you Sir.
More than welcome Vinnie, appreciate your feedback and with the saved money you can but some nice timber, more tools or chocolate. :) Cheers Steve
Always fix and maintain tools. Part of owning tools and equipment is learning the maintenance to do yourself. A true value is learned by taking care of one's things.
Thank you Steve! So far your the first I have seen teaching how to flatten your stones! Very practical method. About your grinding wheel there a number of wheel dressers on the market here in the US! I think the largest selection is at Mc Master Carr they are on the web, they have all types of wheel dressers you can find something in many price ranges and or something that fit your needs. Thanks again.
Please you got something from it. Got the old grind stone worked out too thanks. Cheers Steve
If you also put your solvent UNDER the abrasive paper, your paper will be held tight and more flat to your glass, giving a more critically flat surface on the stone. In fact, as you start to work the stone, the paper will start to stick in place harder and even be more flat.
Great channel! Subscribed! Look forward to more content!
+Paul Griffin Thanks for jumping on board. Please you are looking forward to more. Cheers Steve
Great, cheers.
Brilliant many thanks indeed!
Pleased you can use it. Thanks for the feedback. Cheers Steve
Thanks Steve, excellent tip. :-)
+Tommy Fisher Pleased you liked it. Cheers Steve
+Tommy Fisher Pleased you liked it. Cheers Steve
Thanks Steve.
A pleasure Robert. Cheers Steve
Very good video Bloke.
Hi Frank, appreciate the feedback pleased you liked the content. Cheers Steve
Thanks for that information steve,i was wondering how to get mine flat now i know.....terry
Good Stuff, you will notice a vast improvement in blade sharpening once they are flat. Cheers Steve
Thank you Steve
Hi Robert, You are most welcome, pleased it helped. Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass 😀😊😎
Good. Once again tank you!
A pleasure dippy. Pleased you liked it and could take something away from it. Cheers Steve
many thanks and happy new year 2021 from Ireland
Hi Joe. Thanks and may you make 2021 the best year you possibly can. Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass thank you
@@joeennis2571
Steve, nice helpful video. A few points. If you squirt some Kerro under the paper onto the glass it will help hold it in place. The sharp edges on the glass can be knocked off with a stone. I always knock the corners down on the stone after flattening as they too can be sharp. Your Tormek wheel can be flattened out by putting it on the machine and dressing it with a 'wheel dresser' or an old sacrificial flat stone. An alternative to plate glass if it's hard to come by is a large ceramic (2ft. x 2ft.) floor tile. Most places will let you buy just one. Take a straight edge and find a nice flat one. ;-)
+Graham Orm Thanks, Graham Sage advice as usual. Not to concerned (now) about the other stone but was really miffed when it happened. Cheers Steve
Great video!
Thanks, pleased you enjoyed it. Appreciate your time for leaving back feedback. Cheers Steve
No problems mate! You've got great content on your channel and I've subbed.
Thanks, :) Cheers Steve
I think i have to try this too. My stones need this...
+Willem Kossen It's a wonderful stress free way of spending a quite afternoon. Cheers Steve
Fantastic
Thanks, pleased you can use it. Cheers Steve
I have tried all the different sharpening methods, and now I use diamond stones, finishing with polishing compound on a leather strop (leather stuck to 3/4" ply) working free-hand (no sharpening jigs) as per Paul Sellers videos. I find this to be the best and quickest way of all, and no need to flatten the stones.
But, like the man says, you have to find what way works for *you.*
Pre-zactly.Whatever works, Works. Thanks for the comment and feedback. Cheers Steve
thanks steve
Not a problem. Thanks for the feedback. Cheers Steve
thanks for the right to the point on trueing the sharpening stones 1 question i trued up. a ruff grit stone and finished up with 320 and now the stone is smooth and is not cutting ruff anymore what do i? do i go back to ruff paper ?
Hi Robert, Rough up the flat surface with the grit your stone is meant to be and that should fix it. Cheers Steve
Good refresher. I do essentially the same, but with mineral oil in place of kerosene, and I don't use any grit higher than 120 for both oil & water stones. I do use some spray adhesive to stick the paper to the glass so it stays put. As it wears out, I peel it off, clean the glass and stick on a new sheet. I have two dedicated glass plates (one oil, one water) for my stones.
+Mark Hazlewood Nice to hear there are some other low-tech woodworkers around! lol Cheers Steve.
thank you
Thanks, Walter good to know people as using the tips. Cheers Steve
Great video, I would like to say making pencil lines in a grid pattern along the stone lets you see progress and what areas still need attention.
Great Idea David. Would not have thought of that. Thanks for the info. Cheers Steve
Seeing the color and the dry and wet parts help the best. No need in overcomplicating a simple process. That's the prob with sharpening in general. There's millions of techniques...but sticking to what's the simplest usually is for the best
Hi Steve , it works perfectly with my Norton stones. Complete blackish store became original Tile Red after spending early 45min and total 8 water sand papers . Many thanks for shearing. 😊
You're most welcome, pleased you got some good results from it. Cheaper than buying a new stone. Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass certainly Steve, I was about to order a quite exoensive set of cleaning stones , since my horning stones are precious to my work.
I used to dip in kerosene oil New oil stone prior to start using. Also we used water sand on glass to flaten hand plane base. But still veterens like you guys give these valuable tips only we realize that what practicle solutions available . So I owe you Steve. Tks again and all the best you.
@@upulmunasinghe6759 Thanks for sharing makes an "Old guy" feel good to know, we know some things at least .:) Cheers Steve
🤜🤛🙏💚
Good morning Steve , It is OK if I am your WAp number in order to share my works vedio and getting your feedback .
Tks
Many thanks for this info. Were your oilstones made of Silicon Carbide or Aluminium Oxide? Would you use different grits for either of these two types of stone to flatten them?
It has both, but I only use the Aluminium Oxide (Orange) side. Same paper would do both sides. Hope that helps. Cheers Steve
will this method work on the harder Arkansas stone?
Thanks for your vid . I will have to check out your other vids to see what you have . I have my Grandfathers sharpening stones , and just bought the sharpening jig for plane and chisel blades . My Question is ; how do I know if my stones are water OR oil stones . Thanks Cyril
Very interesting, thanks. I notice you worked 120 on a coarser oil stone first, then the finer stone. Won't there be grains off the coarse stone in the sand paper that will score your finer stone?
Hi Bella, Not that I noticed. Appreciate your feedback Thanks for commenting. Cheers Steve
Excellent. I have tried several methods and it is taking days on an old oilstone - only 2 inch. I tried concrete blocks; concrete; belt sander 100 grit red resin; normal sandpaper; the backs of 2 types of tile - I think one is ceramic; and a small diamond stone - one of the fold-up varieties for knife sharpening. Red (fine). It works but is far too small for the job. Also tried a small stone I have for flattening concrete. This whetstone has never been lapped but has not been used a whole lot either. It is like it is made of diamond itself!
Will give this a try.
Thanks
Great to hear Bruce, let me know how it turns out. Cheers Steve
Sorry this might be a repeat - not sure if 1st went. Tried course and med. wet emery cloth for metal stuck to a ceramic tile - hardly touching it at all - can barely see my felt pen marks fading. A $150 diamond lapping plate would work but for less I can buy a better and larger new water stone. My small, fine, DMT knife sharpener is the only this touching this oilstone. It is probably 35 - 40 yrs old and I suspect it is black Arkansas. Have spent 5-6 hrs so far - VERY slow progress. Maybe I have a black diamond and don't know it! Only stubbornness driving me now. My time would have bought 2 new stones!
I would try 60 grit wet and dry carborundum. Not emery paper. If that won't touch it then perhaps your're right a black diamond?? Very hard to help without actually having the stone to work with. Hope the stubbornness does'nt get in the way of having fun. Cheers Steve
Can you do it with the carb stones like from norton i.e. "man made" I have a large one that is becoming dished?
That's what I am using, man made Norton Carb and Aluminum oxide. Cheers Steve
Good video, thanks! i was wondering if this use of "plate glass" would be good for flattening the sole of a handplane as well?...i guess reasonably thick glass wont flex much?.......really dont want to spend hundreds on granite blocks with engineered surfaces etc....so expensive ! lol, do you use plateglass
for doing handplanes as well?
+Robert Pike Yes I certainly do, from small block planes to #7's. Depending on the condition of the plane I might start out with as coarse as 80 grit and work my way through to 240 grit. Once the first grit is right the rest is easy going. Cheers Steve
+Woodworking Masterclass ... awesome info, thanks steve! cheers ! :-)
this method works great! I was just wondering though, how often do you flatten your stones and how many times can you re use this sandpaper? maybe it's just here in Europe, but I end up paying around 1€ a sheet, so it would hike up quickly I suppose. still, a proper diamond stone goes for about 60 €, that's expensive.
I flatten mine maybe once of twice a year. Best way to judge is hold a straight edge over the width and when you can see a light under it it most likely would be a good time to flatten it. I'd use the paper as long as it's cutting. Cheers Steve
Aloha Steve, what do you use to adhere your stones to the wood bases ?
Thanks
Hi Mike, I don't they are just a good fit inside the boxes. Cheers Steve
What grit would you recommend if someone has a stone that's dished out
Hi Dave, Depending how for it is dished and the grit of the stone. I generally start with 240 grit then asses if I need one courser of finer and finish at 400. Cheers Steve
If you are using harder stones, like norton india, you don't need to a 2" wide stone to sharpen a 2" wide plane blade or chisel. A 2" plane blade is a heck of a lot shorter than your shortest knife, yet you can sharpen all your knives on a 2" wide stone! I can use a thin 3/4" wide stone to sharpen plane blades and chisels just fine by drawing the length of the blade over the stone. Slightly varying your angles and stokes, you can very easily maintain a smooth, positive camber on the surface of the stone, similar to how you can use a straight chisel to put a camber on a piece of wood. On a new stone, this means working the edges and corners down, first. Then the size of the blade compared to the width of the stone doesn't matter, anymore, and you don't ever put grooves into the surface. Like when you camber the top of a wood box - if you start leaving ridges in the wood from the corners of the chisel, you're chiseling one spot too much. You just mosey over and work a different area of the wood until it all blends together. With the hard oil stones, I don't ever have to flatten or resurface the stone, just maybe some slight shaping now and then around the edges and corners if/when they start to get too sharp or rough. Lest you worry that a curved stone will curve the edge of your chisels and plane blades over time, don't. It doesn't take any time to put a frown (or a smile) in the blade with a curved stone, if you want to. But having the ability to do either means you can also make an edge straight as you want just by paying a little attention. It's not much harder to keep a 2" wide plane blade straight on a crowned stone. And it's a lot easier to get a straight edge on very narrow chisels, compared to using a flat stone. With the harder stones, the benefit of more width is now going to mean the stone wears more slowly, overall. Not so much that you can sharpen wider things on it. With softer/muddier stones, you are using that large flat area to spread around the force and wear to prevent the stone from gouging and wearing unevenly. So your soft stone might be great for plane blades and kitchen knives, but you might not like to sharpen your fish hooks and awls on it. On a hard stone, you want to do the opposite, IMO. A very flat and hard blade on a very flat hard stone can even cause the blade to skate and the stone to glaze. (Norton india would require a very large area of contact to cause this, mind you; it's a very aggressive stone on the softer end of the spectrum of what I consider a hard-bonded stone). But if you keep the area of abrasion relatively small by curving the surface, it will be able to sharpen anything, and bur formation will be greatly reduced.
Thanks for all the great info and it's true. That said I personally still like the widest stones I can get. :) Cheers Steve
Where can I get some wider and longer good quality stones...
Blessings
Don't know Clay. I find I have to actually sharpen in the skew to get the whole blade contacting the stone. Cheers Steve
Good shit my dude. I was looking at buying a flattening stone but they are so damn expensive, this seems like itll do just right. Im curious if anyone know if you need to change the sand paper grit based on the grit of the whetstone you are sanding?
Have not notices and real difference except if you use a finer grit it takes longer. :) Cheers Steve
Steve,should water stones be stored in water or should they be stored dry?Thank you for any feedback you could give.
Interesting question and I'm sure you will get a couple of differing answers. For my money the best way is to store them dry. Pre-soak for 10 minutes or so before using them. The only advantage I can see in storing them wet is that they are ready to use straight away. In my experience especially with natural (high grit) stones leaving them in water tends to deteriorate the surface of the stone over time. Not sure if it is the same with synthetic stones. I still store my man made Japaneses Stones Dry. Less messy as well. Cheers Steve
Also Steve ,could you kindly recommend for me a reasonably priced good honing guide pls.
Tks
Where do you live? Found this on ebay I use the original model made by eclipse, but these look OK There are some cheaper ones but they are made of Aluminium so not sure how they would stand up. Cheers Steve
Hi John, I have a combination silicon carbide oilstone I just flattened using this method with 120W&D paper on the coarse side only, using sewing machine oil. End result was the stone was flattened OK, but the stone is now fairly smooth and doesn't cut nearly as well. I tried to flatten the back of a chisel, and found the smooth untouched side of the combination oilstone cut better. I was using sewing machine oil on the stone at the time. Later switched to WD40, same result. The WD40 appeared to soak right into the stone too. Anyway, do you have any idea what might have happened to the coarse side of this stone?
Depending how rough you want it give it a couple of rubs with a courser grade say 60 or 40 grit. That will cause the stone to cut more aggressively. Cheers Steve
Thanks Steve, exactly what I was looking for (for my oil stones). I just wonder how long a paper of 120/180 will last (how many times do you use one sheet, or did you throw them away after truing these three stones in the vid?).
Hi Stefan, They last for a few tune-ups but it all dep[ends how much they get used on each one. You will know when they are not cutting well. Then replace them. Pleased you found the video useful Thanks for the feedback too. Cheers Steve.
Need bout 4 pieces
Hey Steve,
I am wondering if you know of any other lubricants that one could use for this process? I don't have any Kerosene on hand. Would something like paint thinner work? Air tool oil?
Hi Alecia, Definitely NOT paint thinner but Tool oil would be fine. Cheers Steve
After a few passes why do you turn the stone around? Does it help make sure it gets to the other side?
Hi Nicholas, Yes it creates an even wear as in the one position the downward pressure is not evenly distributed over the entire stone. Cheers Steve
I've done Arkansas stones before, but you sand forever to smooth those out. I always did mine dry and blew the dust away. Is that wrong?
Hi Virginia, Never wrong if it works for you. Cheers Steve
I like all your videos but in this case I would add that I think in the long run a diamond plate is more economic than sandpaper. I've had mine for over five years now and it's still perfectly useable.
+Richard Leon That's good to hear, they should last you many more years to come. I think the initial outlay is the bit that hurts.The oldest one I have is over 20 years old and still has a cutting edge. Cheers Steve
Great video!! Only a thou? Blimey mate I get limbo dancers coming through the dip in mine. This could take a while!!
Could be a New Stone, Kerry??? LOL. Cheers Steve
I'm using stones for sharpening skates with coarse and fine grits, using sharpening oil. Whit your reconditioning method, what sanding grits should I use on each side ? Which lubricant - water, mineral oil WD-40 ? Thanks for the video.
Hi yves, It all depends and the condition of the stones if really badly hollowed I would use a course stone initially to get rid of the dip maybe a 80 0f 100 grit when the stone is nearly flat then use higher grit until flat again depending on the stone grit I would finish at about the same as the stone for the final finish. All those lubricants will work on an oil stone but only use water on a water stone. My choice from the lubricants you mentioned would be WD40. Hope that helps . Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass Thanks a lot, Steve.
What liquid was that to wet the sandpaper? Looks like a good method. Kero?
Hi Robert. Yes Kero or Kerosene. Light machine oil is OK too. Cheers Steve
Hi Steve
I inherited some stones
How do i tell if they are oil or water stones
Obviously they are not maked
Thanks mate
No real easy way, I guess by using both you get to know. One way, in some cases if the stone crumbles easily its a water stone it is very hard under the finger nail fair chance it's an Oil Stone. Smell would be another way you may detect what was used on it previously. A photo would help. Sorry can't be more positive than that. My best bet would be if they are old then they are Oil stones. Cheers Steve
Hi there, my grandmother recently gave me a stone that was gifted to her before she married my grandfather which was over 50 years ago. She had it wrapped in cloth because the original person had soaked it in oil. Anyways I tried cleaning it up and all but it's very smooth. I can get it to really sharpen a knife. Is that just how the old stones were? I'll still keep it for the history but it may just be too old lol.
Not sure if you meant to say Can or Can;t get an edge?
Either way from the sounds of it, it could well be an Arkansas stone which are a very high quality natural stone still produced today. Stones come in a variety of Grits and if it is smooth it's purpose is not to create an edge but to refine one and maintain it. Barbers use stones as fine as 10,000 grit to keep there razors sharp as well as a leather strop. Sound like a nice stone so yes keep it and enjoy using it once an edge has been created. Hope that helps. Cheers Steve
I have Arkansas Stones,? Been using Horning oil , On them for years,? Works great,? But it Clogs the Stones Badly,? Was wondering if,? Just using water,? Will I get the same sharpening Results,? like I did when using the Oil.?
Once you've used oil on a stone, you can't go back to using water. You can boil the stone, and scrub it, and boil it again until clean, but that's a lot of work.
With honing oil, the trick is to wipe it after use, then generously wetten the stone with honing oil again, rub it in with your fingers, and then wipe it again.
Arkansas stones are, by the way, so tough that you seldom have to flatten them. And as they work with a crystalline structure and not particulates measured in grits like other stones, you should use a much finer paper than what's used for the stones Steve here flatten. And clogging isn't as much of a problem, again because it's the large crystalline edges that hone the steel, and not particles that detach like other stones.
The main problem with Arkansas stones is that most of what's on the market these days are rather bad, with hardness that varies throughout the piece of stone, leading to uneven results. Don't buy cheap ones.
Hi mr steve I have a cheep stanley stone I will try your method to flatten it . 🤔
Should work just fine. All the best with it. Old Stones are good stones. :) Cheers Steve
what do you mean by using ware on water stones , what is Ware
I think that was water. Didn't have time to watch the video through. At what time did I say what you thought I'd said? Cheers Steve
Hi great video,
My thought is that when flattening the stones there is some merit in not using a sand paper no fine than half the grit size of the stone, as there is risk of dulling the grit in the stone.
using a coarse paper grit flattens the stone easily yet still leaves a more open structure in the stone to carry the metal particles. using too fine a grit risks taking the edge of the grit in the stone, leaving it blunt.
Never really gave it that much thought Charles though you could well be right. I would imagine after a few runs with a blade the new grit will come to the surface again. Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass I use rough wood sand paper dry and flattens my stones all right.
No need of water sand paper or very fine grit. Good videos by the way. Thanks mate , from Qld. 🇦🇺
@@redangrybird7564 There are many way to do it. The best one is the the way that works for you. Thanks for the feedback. Nice to have someone one from sunny Qld. Cheers Steve
I wish I could say I thought of this but I can't. I did however discover this by accident. On another TH-cam channel, I saw about using loose grit to resurface stones with, also using a sheet of glass. I went up to my local Harbor Freight store, (something I swore that I'd never do), and bought a pack of four different grits for a rock tumbler. DO NOT buy the plastic jars of tumbler media as it is ceramic cones and would be useless for this purpose. I have 3 stones that I free hand sharpen with. One is a fine, black Arkansas stone, one is a medium grit stone labeled "India oil stone Made In U.S.A." believe it or not and one is a soft grit between the two. I have a couple of 10" X 24" tempered glass panels out of an old broken coffee table laying around so I used one of them. I used the coarse grit on the two coarser stones and the fine grit on the Arkansas stone. I followed the directions from the other channel. Where I departed from the directions was I didn't use oil, water or kerosene with the grit. I washed the stones with Dawn dish soap to get the oil out of them. Then I put a small pile of grit on the glass and rubbed the stones on it as directed in an oval pattern. What I noticed was as the glass got well frosted from the grit, The grating noise began to decrease and the friction between the stones and the glass increased. This started as the grit was worked out from under the stones and pushed to the perimeter of the work area of the glass. Then I noticed that a powder finer than baby powder began to also deposit itself around the perimeter of the work area. When I picked up the stone and looked at the surface, the fine powder was on all of the stone except where it was worn in the center. When the glass and stones got to this point, it took no time to work them flat. What I think is happening is the tempered glass is much harder than regular window glass and the gritty texture imparted to it from the grit stays in place like sandpaper rather than rolling around like the loose grit plus I think it is sharper than the grit that I bought. The baby powder was material worn from the stones because when I finished with each stone, I had more grit material than I'd started with. The only other thing is that I had to use the flat back of a knife occasionally to scrape the fine powder off from the stones as it would cake up and gap the stones away from the glass. I knew when I was done when there was no longer a hole in the fine powder on the surface of the stone when lifted from the glass. When I finished, I had to wash the stones again with Dawn as the ultra fine powder was stuck in the fresh grit surface of the stone. I haven't tried it yet but it occurred to me that if that fine powder was left in place and with the addition of a little water, it might act as a slurry stone for polishing an edge. I had a soft slurry stone with a matching hard rub stone for a straight razor years ago and I'm here to tell you that there is NO finer edge on a knife as I got with that stone. (Credit given to the stone.) I lost it somewhere but I'd give anything to get it back.
OK, Bit more complicated than mine. But if it works use it. Cheers Steve
Hi Steve. What kind of Japanese stone was that. Any personal preference when it comes to Japanese wet stones, a prefered brand?
Hi my prefered brands are from here www.japanesetools.com.au/collections/sharpening-stones Ask for Christian he will look after you I'm sure mention you were in contact with me. Cheers Steve
Woodworking Masterclass thanks for your reply. I takebit then you use the Cerax range of stones?
Just 1 a 1000 Grit. Cheers Steve
nice song
Courtesy of a mate of mine playing around on a guitar he had just made. Cheers Steve
So if water has been what you lubricate your stones with use water on the sand paper?
You can it works just as well. Cheers Steve
Woodworking Masterclass thanks I was concerned that you would run in to the same conflict as using oil on a stone that was used as a water stone prior by introducing kerosene
Water will work on most stones or abrasives but kero or oil only work on oil stones or certain abrasive papers. Cheers Steve
Harry Mason but what if that is only because you are so greasy that you spit 5w30.
if i do this to my Grit 8000 it won't ruin it's grit ? (or lower the grit from 8000 to sand paper grit lets say 220?)
Interesting question, but thinking about it the answer has to be no. If your stone is made from a certain sized grit that grit size will not change. What you can find however is that it will cut faster as there will be minute relief lines between the grits, for a short time, caused by the larger grit used in the flattening process. If you don't want them there rub the stone on the surface of the glass only in it's own slurry. Cheers Steve
Huge Thanks for the fast and informative reply, really answered my question and then some :) you have a new subscriber ^_^.
Thanks, and welcome aboard. Cheers Steve
the kerosene does add a little bit of lubricity so it doesnt catch the sandpaper while also not reducing friction so much ur goin to b there for n hour tryin to get somewhere and it also helps keep everything movin as far as dust not building up cant say iv ever seen blue kerosene tho, ours is red a blue can is designated for kerosene over here tho in the states and a yellow cans made for diesel and red for gas, yet diesels red and gas's yellowish lol makes sense right :p maybe they wanted some kinda contrast between the colors so u could see spilled fuel while keepin them primary, idk..
Hi Travis, Very color coordinated. Over here most stuff it in plain white cans or clear bottles. I personally go by the smell. :) Cheers Steve
In relation to your round stone, I just bought a wheel dresser from Total Tools for $28.00 made by Intech.
Thanks for that. I do have a diamond dresser but it takes a long time. I'll check it out. Cheers Steve
Ever tried diamond stones for it, Steve? I've had great luck using the diamond stones to flatten my water stones.
+Michael McCormick Yes, and they will work fine but not as cheap as a sheet of wet and dry. But if you already have one by all means use it. They are also excellent for flattening mechanized sharpening systems like the Makita 9820-2 or Tormek. Cheers Steve
Wow, what chisels are they? the 3/8" bench chisel you showed
Hi Scott, Harold And Saxon Ultramax . Cheers Steve
Woodworking Masterclass cheers mate!
Help guys. I have a flea market plane iron. I flattened the back and used a honing guide on some 150 grit sandpaper to prepare the iron for honing. I was doing that and used two sheets of sand paper and for the life of me can't get a burr on the back. I thought ok maybe I just can't see it but after running it on my 400 grit water stone for a few minutes, still no burr. They take off material but there is no burr on the back and the iron doesn't feel any sharper.
Are you using a Jig or free hand? Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass I was using a honing guide since it's my first time. I had it set up properly as well. Thanks.
@@vane5736 Hold the edge of the blade to the light if you see some reflection who need some more honing on the bevel. until you can not see any light reflection. Send me a pic if you like. Cheers Steve
Thank you.
are these holders handmade..?
Yes, made them myself mostly with a router though. Cheers Steve
Yes. Cheers Steve
Sreve what is the advante of using Kerosene instead of water?
Because the stone I use is an oil stone, not a water stone, I prefer to use kerosene, but it would still work with water. The other benefit of kerosene is that the steel will not rust if it is left wet. Cheers Steve
+Woodworking Masterclass Thank you for the clarification. By the way what is I use Kerosene for water stone would you suggest as well?
UMIT YAYLA No, I would only use water on a waterstone. Cheers Steve
Question.? Do any of you guys own,?Or use an Arkansas Black Stone,? That Iv'e been hearing ,? All kinds of good things about them etc.? Thinking of buying one & a Leather Strop also.? For doing my Hunting Knives etc.?
I have a Black Stone. I used to use it on my carving chisels. Nice stone but now I prefer to strop them on a leather wheel. I find it quicker. Cheers Steve
Glasspaper (wet/dry sandpaper) may not cost that much per sheet, but the costs add up over the years.
Cheaper is to flatten three stones with each other. Don't do it with two, or you can make one convex and one concave, but if you use three stones and switch the pair often, they all get super flat, and cheaper than "definitely the cheapest way".
Whatever works for you keep doing it. Cheers Steve
You could also imbed the loose debris in each other,so how much are the stones worth?Not sure if that will happen but I've read where others have said it did
I have a dual grit Stone, it is a aluminum oxide stone, one side dark grey the other lighter gray, is it oil based and does the sandpaper work on these types of stone
Yes, Joshua, that's the type I used in video. Cheers Steve
I use wet and dry on mine and it works fine. Depending how far out it is you may have to start at 40 grit and work your way up. That's on the Orange side. I never use the grey side I find it to course. Cheers Steve
Woodworking Masterclass I'm going to get me a better oil stone, the one I had got ruined, it was a cheap one, thank u for the information
shannonandsheila1 its a very cheap stone
It should still work though. Cheers Steve
Why the glass, and what else could you use instead of glass?
The glass should be a completely flat and waterproof surface... I'm guessing.
Yup, glass should be perfectly flat so it's a great surface to use.
You could also use a smooth ceramic tile. Whcih I do from time to time. Cheers Steve. You can catch us live now on www.twitch.tv/woodworkingmasterclass
Thanks for the tip. But my oil stone must be pretty hard. Been at it for 20 minutes and it is hardly reducing the hollow. Even tried 80 grit wet and dry. Just need more elbow grease I suppose.
Sorry got no suggestions without physically seeing the stone. But wet and dry will abrade steel. You could try a course diamond stone. But only if you have access to one. Bit of an over kill to buy one, would be cheaper to replace the stone. Cheers Steve
I have a norton India stone hat just refuses to get abraded. Interestingly the fine side more than the coarse. No sandpaper I can buy is doing anything to it. The only thing I ever found to help is sand on a flat concrete step with lots of pressure. But applying so much pressure on a only kind of flat surface finally gave me abrasion but the flatness I achieved with that was still underwhelming.
how often should one flatten waterstones?
Ideally in a perfect world before they need it. Best way to check is with a straight edge. Steel ruler. Hold it across the flat of the stone at different places and sight towards the light. If any light appears between the stone and ruler flattening is required. Cheers Steve
@@Woodworkingmasterclass Thanks! I think I'll just do it whenever I use the Waterstones. This way they'll stay true.
BEST TO USE KERO OR WATER ON GLASS (( B-4 )) PUTTING PAPER DOWN , HELPS FLATTEN PAPER & IT STICKS TO GLASS .
You are right. Thanks for the tip. Cheers Stee
Question 1: At 2:26, you say that your rotary grinding stone "really isn't worth anything at all" because of the rut in it, but you can dress it, right? Examples: th-cam.com/video/npJTTYMj-5E/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/Wq2tPttFpC8/w-d-xo.html
Question 2: Beginning at 3:35, you say that the coarser stone is less flat, so you'll smooth it first. I would be afraid that the coarser stone would leave a coarser slurry that would scratch the finer stone when you smooth it at 6:20. Is it necessary to completely remove all traces of slurry after flattening one stone before moving to another? Thanks!
Q1. I could but the groove was so deep the radius of the dressed stone would be to small to be od use to me as the hollow grind would be to steep for what I wanted. Q2. It removes stock more quickly which means more aggressively but not so much it damaged the finer stone. Q3. By removing the slurry you expose the cutting edges on the stone which means quicker cutting. But no you don;t have to remove it if you don;t want too. Hope that answers your questions correctly. The other thing is that is what I do so you can do it differently there are many way for get the same end result. Experiment for what works best for you. Cheers Steve
for my expensive japanese made water stones(naiwa/ chosera) it olly water on the paper. i can easily destroy the stones with stron chemicals, any thing else i could use
As I mentioned I have little experience with waterstones so I think water only would be the best option. See if you can get a copy of the manufacturers maintenance suggestions. Cheers Steve
Glass from a sliding door may be toughened if so it’s not flat
Hi Anthony. Thanks for that, but in reality it is flat enough the the proposed purpose. Cheers Steve