Spears are better than swords: scientific proof
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 มิ.ย. 2024
- The spear was the most common weapon in ancient battles. There was a reason: spears work. Here, we try out spears against a variety of foes.
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The longer version of this video, with more commentary from Matt Easton and me, and all of all 65 bouts is here: • Spears are better than...
Thanks to Matt Easton for inviting me to Fight Camp 2018. Thanks also to my cameraman Alex Abdolwahabi, and to all those who participated. No one was hurt, unless you count injuries to pride.
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The fact that the swordsmen were experienced and the spearmen were inexperienced, just goes to show how good the spear is.
I imagine that the fights would go in an interesting way if the number of the inexperienced spearmen would be about 1.5 the amount of experienced swordsmen.
it just shows how it is also a great weapon for inexperienced troops, like peasant troops.
No diff than rifles vs other fire arms. Good bolt action, like I know from experience even basic training enough to get you hitting targets at 200yards, now any fully auto or fancy pistol etc? Ya…good luck closing 200yard gap to your effective firing range unless…put your firing selector on that assault rifle to single and *drumroll* use it as a normal rifle xD
And who were the ones taking the pole up their ass? The spear wielding peasants, that's who.
@@IRussian007 Because peasants couldn't afford armour.
It took me 12 minutes to realise this experiment was an excuse for them to play like children
Now now, that may be true, but we both know we would be no wiser :D
Yeah but if they tried to play like adults with children, they would be arrested.
@@AnonyMous-og3ct fair game.
"scientific"
Welcome to science.
What I've learned from this video is that the shotgun is the best weapon in medieval combat.
as was proven by Ash William
Not compared to the M134D Gatling gun
An attack helicopter is the best
Well... That’s not entirely wrong.
This is my boomstick!!!
What I learned from this video: HEMA practitioners get _really_ good at pretending to be wounded and falling down.
Same with Revolutionary or Civil War re-enactors, lol. My uncle used to be one and we'd go watch sometimes :D
It's like watching soccer.
Just lilke soccer players
@@Funcrafter01 wow very original
A glorious death is the best part
If someone is using a greatsword in a battle, you don't send another greatsword to take him out.
Exactly. You shoot him with a bow.
Or maybe an arquebus?
@@carloscastanheiro2933 There were definitely peasants in Portugal, and all over the world. Especially since the feudal system sort of, you know, requires peasants to function. We've all had peasants down our family line. And knights fought on horseback. It's not like Portugal had an all cavalry army.
@@carloscastanheiro2933 Do you have any sources to back up your claim that peasants did not fight on the battlefield during the 1300's?
The Portuguese at Aljubarrota(sp) were actually quite proficient with the crossbow. They used the crossbow along with their superior battle position to create a second Agincourt. They augmented their foot knights with trained crossbowmen, which had an advantage similar to the spear in that it was easy to train a new recruit to use the weapon.
I believe they were also supported by English longbowmen when English longbowmen were at their peak of prowess and those longbowmen did what they always did in terms of mowing down knights.
This was the beginning of the great alliance between England and Portugal that was valid as late as WWI and still exists on paper.
@@carloscastanheiro2933 English longbows with the right arrows could pierce platemail. Though they were huge bows and you had to be stationary to shoot them, knights could be stopped by bowmen.
but everyone knows that dual wielding shields is superior to everything
edit: stop fucking replying ur fucking up my notifications. ok. thank
Imagine you would tuck a 3rd one between your knees...
Theodoros Georgitsis nah, true triple use of weapons demand the third to be held with your mouth.
A two handed shield with a spear built in. Good times, good times.
my dear 3* shiruda class servant mashu is really the best
Can't kill what you can't hit.
I think we all learned that this look like a super fun day with your friends
Adam Bare yeah
Crap i pressed Y (drops spear)
Spears are also cheaper and easier to maintain.
I wonder what would happen if you used polearms instead of spears.
On Taka it also seems easier for beginner spearman to be affective
Pole arms are easier to parry and slower cos there is more protruding and useless metal, and they are longer than the spear in the video so are less agile so the swordsman would fare better
Papa Bless uh.... what fucking pole arms are you refering to lmao, most polearms are almost identical to a spear in weight especially glaives/partizans, bills, and lucern/poleaxes
Also if the swordsman closes in, the spearman can retract the spear (Holding closer to the tip). That can't be done with a sword, since the handle is the only part you can hold.
@@TaylorUmongusHas spearmen can also hold a knife in their 'off hand' while also holding the spear for closer combat
Medieval Sergeant: Do you know how to use that thing?
Lindy: Yeah, pointy end goes into the other man
AND KEEP THE SHIELD IN FRONT OF ME!
"Damn this guy's good!"
pointy end goes into the frenchman
A medieval sergeant is not a military rank but a vague title for the job of soldier (it means "serveant"). All hired soldiers who weren't knights were sergeants. Chains of command were fluid and ill defined.
kala captain the mask of zoro
"I think that enemy got.. the point!"
"I think that enemy got.. the point!"
"I think that enemy got.. the point!"
Am I the only one that gets this?
Didn't expect to see this reference here
Gee Archibald, do you think that enemy did or did not get the point?
@@adamburditt3941
Hyuh! I think that enemy got the point.
@@varuo8370 I get it too. "King dragon sends his regards"
"Why is it always the groin!?"- Every spearman killed by a sword
First
I'll second all of the above comments ;)
Replace the spear with sword
And remember, this is people who HAVEN'T perfected their use of spears the way they have with swords :)
If an inexperienced spearman will generally succeed against an experienced swordsman, then the spear is probably better ;)
Where are all the master spearmen?
@@phoenix4ever367 There are none, except Lindybeige, because people think the sword is cooler. And unlike in the medieval era they don't die in battle and show everyone else how wrong they are.
@@tomhill3248 lovely. At least I know what to grab in a pinch after all the ammo runs out.
@@phoenix4ever367 Actually that depends. In confined spaces you're better off with a trench spike or sharpened shovel.
th-cam.com/video/EIGIBJeRfnQ/w-d-xo.html
You might find this video enlightening. It is however a 30 minute video. But it does demonstrate where spears falter, as the bayonet was basically a spear.
Plus an experienced staff/spear man would not be predictably moving only forward and back all the time in response to the charges an sword attacks. A spear man who slips left or right an circles to the side or behind the attacking/charging swordsman would be exponentially better out in the field.
You what is funny? When you scroll through the news and find a headline "Stabbing: Four injured at university" and right afterward you get an alert for a new video "Spears are better than swords. Scientific proof."
I suppose there's a reason it's called a stabbing and not a cutting.
If only that person carried a spear, he would have gotten more than a measely 4 people.
Those pompous university rich kids and their fancy swords. Who's laughing now?
>you what is funny
Comedy is in the timing!
but muh only 1d6 damage
I KNOW! I hate that spears are so weak in D&D and Pathfinder...
Very inconvenient for about every damn character I want to build :P
In later editions I think they got a damage bonus vs. charging enemies and some nice extra reach, but still they aren't great. Oh the flaws of HP-based RPG combat.
Ever play 5e? a monk armed with a spear is a force to be reckoned with. It has the versatile trait so it can be two handed for 1d8, also the monk is able to use it with his martial arts ability as its a monk weapon. Assuming you rolled well for stats, at level one a monk with a spear can do 1d8+5 then 1d4+5.
Spear Master, boi. 1d6/1d8 ---> 1d8/1d10 + Reach
in 5e , pole arm master och sentinel , ooo boi
Send this to Bethesda to explain why they removed them in later Elder Scrolls games >.< spears are the best!
I've always wished more games had them. The only thing I don't like about spears in games is those where you often rely on target locking, where the spear is at a large disadvantage to those who can dodge. Which in reality is easily solved by using simple footwork.
I usually mod them back in, though sadly they usually use the same slashing animations as the other weapons, except for the occasional execution animations that feature thrusting.
@@killermouse01 Nioh 2 does spears incredibly.
Also the spear are far less costly to manufacture than swords, so it's alot more cost effective
Another plus, my wooden spear gets through airport scanners everytime.
Fuck yea
I passed at London Stansted with a 1m metal juggling stuff, when the officers saw me juggling he said it's ok.... I was really surprised but happy! 😀
You mean you got a pointy stick through airport security?
Oh, shit! I made a wooden spear. I'm so going to take over a plane now.
Mr. Chiweeni does 20 cocaine bricks count? Im about to smuggle some hurry I’m next in line for scanner!
I sort of no longer care what results you got. That looks like immense fun.
HEMA is immense fun.
It was :3
Full grown mean fighting with sticks
sounds hella fun to me
@@Kingrhem. It was fun for boys too, but a whack upside the head with a willow "sword" reduces the entertainment factor a bit.
LET THE SMACKING COMMENCE
The amount of groin strikes in this sport can be hilariously absurd
That's why it was wise to have your children as early as possible in those times. There might not be another chance to use your balls.
Most people in those times had 300 sons before they turned 20.
Hilariously absurd or absurdly hilarious?
My favorite part about this is that they're legitimately figuring things out, but they're obviously having a shit load of fun while doing it
I remember now, that when we played with Wooden swords as kids, sometimes someone would pick up a much, much longer stick, and you just felt helpless against it... I guess a Spear really also had a psychological effect on its enemies.... would you want to charge against these many long, and very pointy spears?
That's fascinating Martin :) As a kid I always found spears easier to deal with compared to swords
I remember feeling totally badass when i could overcome my longer stick wielding friend
Taniwha B never mentions sticks so we're forced to accept that they fought with swords and spears as a child.
Yes, although obviously they weren't sharp
never underestimate the effects of double pay for Gasselhauer :)
Probably why inexperienced peasant levy were just given a sharp stick
Good point
Hahaha "good point"
Peasant levies are exaggerated in the popular consciousness. They were a thing, but would never be the mainstay of an army. I suppose the misconception comes because of various recruiting practices (here I'm going to rely on my knowledge of the English military circa the 14th century) that would require fiefs to contribute fighting men, however, those fighting men would rarely be peasantry - they'd also usually be reasonably equipped, as it was a condition of providing the fighting men that they had to also have a decent kit.
Peasants were very good with the handling of the forks and sticks because they were their everyday tools; so they were good with the spear too (when needed).
Robert Grey i wonder how often shythes were used
A swing essentially can be think of as a 2D plane that comes towards you. Much larger area to block or parry.
The spear attacks as a point, trying to block it with a sword would be incredibly difficult.
think of it instead as a line against a plane. the part facing you is a point, but if you sweep sideways along the line the point moves as well. it is more difficult however because the line is moving toward and away from you at random intervals, and should it ever get close enough to intersect with your line (you) you lose.
Foreshortening tricks the eye also. Its difficult to guess the reach of a spear. You can get caught out easily.
Compared to a swing, the thrust is less likely to be blocked and more likely to cause lethal damage to your opponent.
I learned that from an animated Wonder Woman movie.
@@tomhill3248 👌
That's why you need a shield
FINALLY!!! FINALLY someone said it. *Spears are bloody awesome*
Great weapons, cheap to produce, long lasting, little mentainance, EASY to learn.
Just so many good points.
Not to mention their long history and role in human history.
Truly amazing but underrated.
Oberyn Martell> Arthur Dyne
This is why ancient Greeks to Romans preferred spears and even in their gods. Mars wields a spear and a shield.
Actually, a spear only has 1 point
@@Lftarded not just Ancient Greeks to Romans. Cave people right through to the modern day. Military people still learn to fix bayonets to their rifles and use them as spears.
I get irrationally happy seeing Lloyd running away after giving those introductions
I don't know why, but it was very Monty Python-esque
it totally was! i had the exact same thought @@iforbach4003
Like Totally Accurate Battle Simulator
Interesting to note as you point out the spearman attacks effectively to the soldiers attacking ether side of him which is exactly what pawns in chess do because presumably they were based off spearman
Holy shiet.
Sniper .93c that was my first thought too tbh
Mind = blown!
Oh, that didn´t even cross my mind. Thanks for that :)
Yep, that's why pawns attack diagonally and were originally called "pikemen"
What about dragons? Seems like dragons vs swords or spears would be worth testing.
G E T O U T Shad fan. This is lindybeige territory.
Spears would be better against dragons because you can throw them, but axes would be best, because they are the best throwing weapon. The dragon would still win most bouts of course.
@@williamscott2580 Well perhaps, but I think we both knew what I meant so does that matter? Also how heavy was the roman pila? I think the balance would be an issue more so then the weight. If it were just a matter of weight one would only need to be stronger. But balance effects a weapon in flight. So yes, a proper boar spear would not be a great throwing weapon, as it would dip too early. Still better then a sword though.
Good thinking!
Aaaaay spear fans stick together! Eh? Eh?
I'll leave😂
Whenever I get lost in the forest, I start practicing my sword/spear fighting. That way when a TH-camr comes to tell me what I'm doing wrong, I can follow him out.
Cost of a spear - one wooden shaft, one six inch pig iron spearhead - which is optional. Cost of a sword - three feet or so of the best available steel. You can use other metals but they tend to be heavy, brittle and don't keep their edge. You could equip ten spearmen for every swordsman, with no more training needed than "Stand in line, keep your spears up, shield forward!" There are good reasons massed spear formations were THE basic units of armies for three or four thousand years.
Also add to the fact that as the number of soldiers gets higher, so does the advantage for the spears. The spear men can not only support their neighbors, but also the rank in front of them.
What about the cost of shields?
They were usually wooden and thus still much cheaper than swords. Also, until plate mail was developed, pretty much every soldier of any variety used shields.
cloud from final fantasy could most likely kill 10 spear men
@@forgotmuhname4718 Zach could probably kill 100 Shinra troops before dying
Alternative tests(not shown) Bren gun 30, spears 0.
#LOL
Emus: 1
Machine guns: 0
By the gods! Emus are invincible! we could use them as Army!
*tries to tame Emus*
*Fails*
My experience with various Sid Meier's Civilization games:
Modern tanks: 1693
WW2 tanks: 1227
Attack helicopters: 279
Cruise missiles: 233
Spears: 0
You clearly never played the original then :)
7:22 large shields and aggression being good against spears is pretty much how the Romans beat the Greeks
Me before watching: **Spear > Sword. Dont @ me**
Me after watching: **Spear > Sword. Dont @ me**
“The two handed zweihander” means “the two handed two hander”
It takes two people to wield it.
@alvi syahri finally, a sword designed for the internet trolls.
That’s what happens you get people saying a random German word while speaking English just to show you how totally cultured they are. *rolls eyes*
Etymological fallacy. The origin of a word is not the same as its meaning.
@AndorianBlues explain for me please I’m not familiar with it.
of course the spear is better . . . it has more ｐｅｎｅｔｒａｔｉｏｎ
ｐｅｎｅｔｒａｔｅ ｔｈｅ ｆｒｅｎｃｈｍｅｎ
Wait, how you guys did that?
fsmoura Spartans Battle Of Thermoplayne 300 Movie: The Spartans were getting attacked from The front and this allowed them to kill much larger Persian Armies through Spear and Shield phalanx! The Perdians were told of a secret pay humano around them so they attacked with swords from front and back destroying The Spartans!
@@marydominguez6033 yeah, that's a normal battle tactic. Pretty simple.
Mary Dominguez yup but the reason swords were adopted later was because the romans learned how to pin spear phalanx from their greek neighbors with their shields and then move other roman soldiers in between to stab with gladius swords.
Spears are incredibly underrated. Even nowadays... why not literally spend five minutes to take down a good branch and make yourself a spear if you're camping out in bear, or wolf, or even shepherd dog territory?
Hey, that's what Rambo did! And of course he knew what he was about!
Rifles are better than pistols, not always as convenient, guessing it was about the same back in the day.
Luddhabuddha
The rifle loses some of its advantage in close quarters, like buildings and trenches.
That's actually a really good analogy.
You can also carry either a pistol your a sword even today your not going to draw as much heat as you would with a spear or rifle.
@@horseblinderson4747 it's also more convenient. I can definitely see why they went with a cutlass for ships instead of a longer sword.
Ankle Donna probably depends on the rifle. I’d find it hard to imagine anyone preferring a pistol over a short barrel rifle for cqb except for extremely tight quarters, like fighting inside a submarine or something.
Right. Good information. Now then, off on the crusades
DEUS VULT
DEUS VULT!
DEUS VULT!
DEUS VULT
DUES VULT
This just in: Having range on your opponent is usually helpful (more at 11)
HaveSomeRekage tell that to Mike Tyson
This Just In, Man Claims Spears Are Just Sticks with Swords Attached To Them. Historians are in Shock!
Any other Stormlight Archive fans here? I have a feeling that Kaladin would have a few things to show those spearmen.
Spear the perfect Walking Dead outdoor weapon against Zombies (barely used in series)
Honestly the best weapon against a zombie would be a metal bat or club. A spear, sword, even a hammer, can all get stuck into a body or skull. A bat just bounces right off and onto the next one lol
For zombies
Spear is the best weapon for those who cant fight(women childrens elders)
In movies they barely use them, like u said
@ Ezra Sitompul: Ok but the spear was used by some of the World's most conquering armies in History : Sumerians, Assyrians, Egyptians, Persians, Spartans, Greek Hoplites, Romans, Chinese Emperors Armies, etc.
For example Sarissa and European pikes were used with great effect on the battlefields.
Barely used in Walking Dead Series yes, but there are some cool movies who have cool spears in them : 300, Hero (Donnie Yen as as Long Sky), Conan The Barbarian (Burial Mount battle), GOT series (Oberyn Martell spear), in Chinese Wuxia movies and some Japanese Samurai movies spears are shown more often.
Sad that in modern Western movies spears have almost no prevalence compared to their effectiveness on real battlefields throughout History.
@@TheFailcat Then use a winged spear. That one doesn't get stuck.
well historically piercing weapons aren't that good against zombies because they only do 1/4 the normal damage. A pol-arm like a halberd would be better. Though the armor penetration goes to waste.
Lack of proper spears in "The Walking Dead" was the main reason I stopped watching it. Well, that and the wife getting sick of me shouting "A spear would have helped!" at the screen for the 2 seasons we watched it.
Give an applause to this man 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
Also: Bicycles. All of that walking was absolutely infuriating.
true.dat
How tf are spears going to be better than guns?
Assuming we are still discussing TWD, then I can think of several important ways spears are better than guns.. They never run out of ammo. They do not make loud noises. They are easily replaced. They require considerably less training than firearms.
That's why most people used both. Swords were a side arm afterall.
So, spears were shoulder arms? :-D
Generally speaking yes, but not always. Swords have been used as primary weapons in history in certain circumstances.
Steelinghades how about some source material to back that outlandish claim up.
@@Legohaiden I suggest you go look in a history book at such people as the Romans, but primarily, cavalry in the Early Modern Period.
Steelinghades perhaps you should revisit those same books? Romans did use swordsman on the front lines correct... but they had SPEARMEN directly lodging their spears right through gaps between heads and over shields... these were pikes. And Calvary was a back up unit in this time period... not a main force. Calvary was meant to rush in and rush out to cause damage and havoc among archers and rear guards... or to hit the backs of infantry.
I though I was watching Manchester United there for a second , the way they were all flopping about on the ground.
This video opened my eyes..
Next time I run into a battle again I will now pick the spear to be on the saver side
There are also a couple of other factors to take into consideration when using these weapons in battle:
1)You dont need as much room to attack with a spear so you dont risk injuring your own men as you swing your weapon.
2)You need a lot less skill and training to use effectively. So good for your reserve troops that dont get training. All they need to be told is to poke it at the enemy, which is almost a instinctive reaction when being attacked.
3) It requires a lot less metal which might of been in much demand and a much smaller blade meaning it would take a blacksmith a lot less time to make and sharpen into a blade.
And this are the main reasons, why spears were so common. Someone with a sword can also afford the proper armor to survive a stab or two from a spear.
Funny story (if you know or played a game from the Dark Souls series): I once got invaded by some douche weilding a big ass sword. He tried to fight me in a narrow space and always hit the wall. I had a spear and just stabbed him. True story!
3b) also way cheaper and eqsier to make
alex sere. that was the entire point of 3. you don't need a separate 3b.
@@KleenerBro jajajaja that was hilarious OMG I can't stop laughing lmao I can't believe that actually lol.
the guys looks like they having fun I wanna try that lol
www.hemaalliance.com/club-finders/ Our group is doing similar things in June. If you don't practice you'll just be fodder.
"don't try it at home" *in cheery tune*
could always play the video game chivalry midevil warfare
Gotta say this video was awesome. I learned a lot from it and thank you so much for the work put into this video. My late wife always said an experienced Japanese soldier with a naganata was a serious force to be reckoned with.
"So, what have we learned? KEEP YOUR SHIELD IN FRONT OF YOU!"
12:15 - "Our men are running from the field of battle! This is a shameful display"
Martin Kollarovic total ear?
Like for the saucy reference
"The men are wavering!"
MY LORD, OWA MEN AR RETRATIN MA LORD
Surely you mean Shamefur dispray ;)
Obviously, it's the pen.
spoon
Fork
We need another video.
Spears vs. pens vs. swords: The Ultimate Deathmatch.
Pens are just short spears if you think about it...
@@PandemicalShade penis too
I just realized that the experienced spearmen held their spears close to the ends with shields rather than holding it in the middle. Of course the range you get holding near the end is helpful but it isn't very accurate because the spear would be heavy
Tbf there were some shield that had a round cut or a corner cut at the top right from the user view (one example is the josting shield), so that they could put their spear in there, not only did it solve the problem of using the long spear one-handed, but also make shield surface always face toward the enemy, increase the defend ability of the spearmen, although it did bring some drawbacks
Probably why the zulus made the short spear, they must recognized the added length in a close encounter was a hindrance, especially against someone with a sword and shield considering like in the video, they won the majority of the battles against spears.
of course it is! apart from length and being nice and light vs length, ANYONE can use it with no training! That's almost more reason to use them or call them the best weapon alone! You can arm a whole village and send them against soldiers!
Better than swords, ok, but _NOT_ katanas . . . Katanas are so superior it's borderline magical. Scientists are still trying to understand why.
I truly hope this was a joke
What about katanas with removable pommels?
The only thing that can beat a katana is a longer katana, because the longer katana has more folds per inch
That's it. I'm sick of all this "superior European pommelled-swords" bullshit that's going on in the comments right now. Katanas deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that.
I should know what I'm talking about. I myself commissioned a genuine katana in Japan for 2,400,000 Yen (that's about $20,000) and have been practicing with it for almost 2 years now. I can even cut slabs of solid steel with my katana.
Japanese smiths spend years working on a single katana and fold it up to a million times to produce the finest blades known to mankind.
Katanas are thrice as sharp as European swords and thrice as hard for that matter too. Anything a longsword can cut through, a katana can cut through better. I'm pretty sure a katana could easily bisect a knight wearing full plate with a simple vertical slash.
Ever wonder why medieval Europe never bothered conquering Japan? That's right, they were too scared to fight the disciplined Samurai and their katanas of destruction. Even in World War II, American soldiers targeted the men with the katanas first because their killing power was feared and respected.
So what am I saying? Katanas are simply the best sword that the world has ever seen.
They could cut a tank in half
There's another most common weapon used that has been forgotten. THE ROCK!
A person with a sword and a shield, a rock would just have been a harassment weapon.
@@DavidEvans_dle Your open hand itself is faster and more versatile than anything. Trying to get hit by that with rock in hand and you tell me how you feel
The Rock yeah hes a cannibal
Or a throwing knife. take 3 of these along with sword or axe etc. throw straight at the bastards leg
A balanced Throwing knife (along w plenty of practice of course) is very lethal. Perfect for within 5-8 meters. & yes all u need is 1 leg or foot to be hit & the enemy wont be up for attack.
There's also Throwing axes - but I dont know much about their effectiveness
This was really awesome and enlightening, especially when you consider that all the speamen were amatures and all the swordsmen were professional to expert. Had those spearmen been professional spearmen who knew how to change their grips for different engagements, use the other end as a staff, etc, the the outcomes would have been way more devestatingly one-sided.
Jolly good, and now for something completely different.
There was at least one expert Spearman. If not spearman, than Quarterstaffer. Man was holding Oberhauen.
I´m not sure did you ask people to subscribing or not since I cound´t pay attention to the 100% of the clip.
However I think you didn´t, I feel the need to be updated about this channel and I´m hitting that bell button now.
Looks like a real person/group channel. Congratulations.
AND KEEP YOUR SHIELD IN FRONT OF YOU!
Spears were more prolific because you don't need extensive training to use them
Also cheaper to make, since the shaft is wood.
That is what I thought. It takes much more time and effort to become a decent swordsman than a decent spearman. Also spears are much more cheaper and easier in production than swords.
Shaft
MUCH cheaper. simple wooden shaft, and the spearhead requires *immensely* less advanced metallurgical skill than a good sword blade. BAsically any blacksmith that can make horseshoes, can make a functional spearhead. The same is most definitely not true for swords.
Also.. Training a spearman to minimum capability requires a minute fraction of the time that training a swordsman requires.
Goggles789, all of the skills you mention have been practiced to exhaustion, over several years, by any farmer of that era.
All you needed to teach a spearman was stuff like "don't panic. stay with your group. listen to your unit leader"
Eccentric, funny and informative. Thank you Lindy!
I raise my cup of coffee to you. Have been subbed for a while and want to thank you for not only the entertainment but, the lessons learned from your videos.
You don't need that level of testing to establish the premise, history is all of the support you need.
_What was the overwhelming majority of ancient and medieval soldiers armed with?_ Spears, halberds, voulges, billhooks, and other assorted reachy-extendy-hooky-stabby things. Even the Romans, who favored the gladius, still had spears. Officers usually had no spears mostly because they were there to direct traffic more than they were there to fight. The guys whose sole job was killing the enemy, who were expected to carry the battles, invariably had some descendent of the spear family.
The spear is so ingrained in our cultural awareness as the ultimate infantry weapon that when they developed infantry firearms, _they immediately developed a tool called the Bayonet so they also worked as spears_
I dont know much about the ancient warfare but I read somewhere that they designed the roman "Pilum" very special (weighted & more like a throwable javelin)which would penetrate on a distance before charging with their Gladius, and they always bent after impacting.
But I totally second your thoughts on the bayonet and spears in cultural awareness!I mean some countries still develop new assault rifles with a bayonet-mount so that you can use the issued knife on it if anything goes wrong.
Wasn't the bayonet just for the situation when you run out of ammo? Even the Great War clips had only 5 rounds :)
@@poiuyt975
No, you still had to charge to take ground for most of the history of firearms. Now they're just too effective to take ground by charging against infantry across open ground, but you still see some use in close quarters.
@@WorBlux I was thinking specifically about the Great War, where your statement is kinda true, but only because there weren't actual magazines for the rifles and in the trenches the close combat eventually ensued. After the invention of rifling which happened centuries after the invention of firearms it was always better to stay out of range of any side arms.
But I guess that it's a broader discussion not fit for the comment section :)
Wrong. Sorry mate.
The bajonett was developed centuries after firearms. Thats just a fact you have to face.
Also the romans only used around 1 centuri to be lancemen. And a Pilum doesn't really count as spear as you can not use it as one, as it is constructed to break as soon as you pull it out. So one stab and bye spear... terrible use of it, it is a throwing spear to kill on distance or if not deadly as blocked by the shield of a phalanx f.e. It broke the phalanx thanks to its breaking design and gives the legion an additional advantage.
The romans knew the weakspot of the phalanx very well and also the weakspots they had faced during their learning time (the celtic wars and the 3 punic wars)...Thatswhy the towershield, the pillar formation (advanced form of phalanx from the romans, that could form a testudo (lat. for turtle) when attacked by archery by raising backrow shields over the heads.)
The legionaire 4800 per Legion
and the Equites Legati (mouthed auxillery) 600 per Legion
used the Gladius as primary weapon.
from the other 600 Auxilleries the romans only asigned 100 to be spearmen and that is a hard punch against spears. Most of this auxillery was archer or battleengineers controlling the catapults and balistas.
The only romans always wearing spears were the Praetori, the life guard of the emperor.
Dual wielding was excluded from the tests because it would be too powerful.
pff, not likely ive faced duel wielding with a spear in a system that didnt allow hits below the knee or above the armpit and no stabbing upwards to reduce steel head injury
duel wielding isnt that powerful, you can easily exploit gaps.
it was sarcasm
#LOL
@@elgostine r/woosh
Dual wielding spears is the counter!
I just love your channel. My daughter and I want to train with spears now in addition to jiu-jitsu and archery. Great content...educational and entertaining! Thank you!
It was a cool experiment that looked like a lot of fun. The kite shields used are (I'm pretty sure) designed for mounted combat and difficult to use on foot. Although I'm sure they were used on foot by knights who choose to dismount. Some talented individuals there but none of them were good with a shield, except for the guy with the buckler.
I trained a bit with the staff and or spear. The shield can be very effective against the spear. There is a good reason for the hand cover (boss) on a shield being made of metal. When a spear thrusts at you, the idea is to attack the spear ..... not the person. Thrust your shield hard into the spear tip so that the spear becomes embedded in the shield. Then cut his lead hand or wrist.
The sword alone can also be effective against the spear. However, do not attack the spearman, attack the spear. The spearman has superior range, so, attacking the spearman means getting past the spear 1st. I was taught to use the sword to strike the spear at the closest non metal part. With the idea being to embed the sword into the spear. Its not easy but the fights would have lasted much longer if that tactic was used (one of the spearman in the video was very good). I know it probably was not possible as the blades were not live.
The fact that spear victories were quick and sword victories were messy and longer means that in group fight spearmen that won are done quicker and can help their friends, while swordsmen that would have won were still busy with their first opponent. That's probably a big factor explaining why in formation spears are much better. Time to kill is an important metric, totally ignored when just counting wins and loses in duels.
*To test this*
1. Grab a stick and give it to your friend.
2. Grab a longer but strong stick then fight each other out.
The result will most likely be, you lose a friend (Unless you don't have a friend in the first place)
I like to think that I've not so much lost a friend as gained an enemy.
Are you kidding? Me and my friends used to bead each other with sticks all the time for fun.
Me and my brother literally fight each other with sticks
I tried this just now with my friend who is in a wheelchair and I still ended up winning.
Great analysis! Question - Would a dipylon shield help the spearmen to add a second point of controlling the spear (almost making it 2 hands on the spear) by leveraging the point of contact of the spear and shield ? I wonder this because there must have been a reason for these shields to have that shape, seems like the spear sits in the opening and you could add control to the spear with your shield. Just a thought !
I think things shake out differently when you actually have a fear of being killed or injured.
Impossible to simulate in a controlled environment, unfortunately.
it wouldn't change that much. If anything, it would make the spear even better. Keep in mind that, USUALLY, both sides would have that fear, so you can cancel out that factor and assume equal playground
@@juliofranciscogomezstoppel1860 I think It would benefit the spear, because the swordsman has to gain the courage to charge in. he would most likely hang back and the spear would win even more
no shit
The fear of death would just highlight the advantage of range that the spear has and keep the swordsman away
11:48 "Yoohoo motherf*ckers!"
Dead. I'm dead. Rip me.
The ol' northern warcry.
sword man used Taunt!
@@crestfallensunbro6001 5+ bonus speed and damage
When a 14.5 minute video can be summed up in one sentence, and I still watched the whole thing...
My brothers an I used to duel a lot with various weapons, and we did find the disparity of when someone got close up when you were using many polearms. The method that we found, was that we discovered that you can actually hold a dagger on one of your hands, and still effectively hold onto a polearm, as long as you didn't have to let go and grab the polearm over and over. When we started using that method, we actually found ourselves hoping we would get rushed, because we could purposely get our weapons caught in a bind, then stab them with the dagger. It was lethally fast and brutal.
Thats why the unsolids are the best warriors in GOT
unsullied
Hahahaha, Unsolids.
Unsolids XD
The gender unsolids
Castration
@@jasonbloho8015 bruh
**poke**
Edit: **stab**
interesting
Jab
*Thrust*
Which is better, a 14 minute long Lindybeige video or a 29 minute long Lindybeige video?
In this instance, I'd say perhaps the 14-minuter, but it's horses for courses.
my man
Watch both of them.
plox a 56 minute long Lindybeige video, obviously.
'Both of them, I'd say . ..
Great video! Really entertaining way of addressing the question
Where can i get some friends to go out and do this? Lmao
Jaris Perreira what are friends?
@@thecrabempire5767 I'm not sure, whatever it is, I don't have them.
don’t forget how neglected they are in videogames
To be fair, a sword or an axe is a lot more flashy, since with a spear you just poke at them really aggressively.
I got murdered by a good spearman in Dark Souls 2 the other day.
@Roenie spears are represented terribly in total war games. They lose to swords and beat cavalry. Shogun 2 is the worst in that way.
Skyrim and Oblivion, no spears nor crossbows...You cannot even attack with the staves, they're just for magic uuuuuugh
The worst offender must be the Shogun series, where you have "Katana" Samurai soundly beating Yari Samurai. It would be like having "pistol" infantry beating "rifle" infantry". All I could think when I first saw that was "wait, that unit of Samurai forgot to bring their Yaris or bows to battle?"
I’ve fought SCA wars with spears and can confirm that the are absoLUTEly game changing. We built 12 foot spears with thrusting tips and shield hooks and they were fantastically lethal against shield walls. With 4 spears and two sword-and-shield (to protect us against arrows, more on that later) we could collapse the corner of ANY shield wall, at will.
The way we did this was by pairing up. We would both poke around at the heads of two fighters in front of us, then one of us would hook their opponents shield and the other would stab that dude in the side of the face. This worked 100% of the time and because of the static “dead zone” in any shield wall engagement our sword-and-shield opponents couldn’t rush us.
You wanna kill spearmen, you need archers. After all an arrow is just a *really* long spear.
Or throw your sword like a real hero
Maybe try wooden swords?
Lol that's why soldiers wear helmets. A sword and shield will beat a spear any day
@@dragonfist7656 - Throw your primary weapon away...
You jest!
Dragon Fist prefer throwing a sword attached to a hero.
Very good, educational, fun video. Very well done, and Sir, i thank you!
Yeah like you said, from all my experience in SCA reenactment fighting, what you said is 100% the case. Most of the time Shield and sword, or sword and board as we loved to call it, won out against spears. But god damnit, is it not the most beautiful thing when you see that low strike or feint into a face or neck jab. I remember catching myself on the wrong side of that bad error. By far the greatest thing about a spear is having a line of swords and shields in front of you and jabbing wildly into the sea of free jab points. Keep up the great stuff man, love watching these videos. Reminds me of my college days. Almost inspires me to find a fighting group again :P. Though I think my gear needs repairs :).
But that isn't being fair. If they want to do that they would need to have the spear get a shield too, like a greatshield
But that isn't being fair. If they want to do that they would need to have the spear get a shield too, like a greatshield
This is also, as you pointed out, between *trained* swordsman and *novice* spearmen.
How much better again could the spearmen - who've already convincingly shown that they generally have the upper hand in this experiment - have done, if the spears has been wielded by experts in quarterstaff / Japanese bo?
Or trained in one-handed techniques to be able to properly use the long shield with their spear - rather than just randomly making things up as they went along, such as the miserable failure that was the one-handed overarm.
Because it should also be noted that a spear is like a quarterstaff / bo with a pointy bit on it. If you were also expert in the quarterstaff / bo, you could quickly switch techniques when the swordsman draws near and utilise the more defensive / parrying / closer-quarters techniques of quarterstaffing instead.
If untrained spearman could do this well, then how much more terrifying were trained spearmen - with training, with secondary weapons, with knowledge of the more "close quarters" techniques of a staff (as you could switch from spearing to staffing, if your opponent got too close for spearing) and so forth?
You should also consider that these swordsmen arent experienced in anti spear technique either so it wouldnt probably be as one sided as you expect. Also spear hafts arent as thick as quarterstaves.
Spears can sometimes work this way as a quick interruption but the simplest techniques usually reigned supreme in a fight and good backpeddling, getting at angles, and choking up on the spear as a guy got close usually works better than using the more momentum and confusion based strategy of a bo staff. You have to end the fight quickly and move on to the next guy and getting the pointy end away from the other man only prolonged a fight against a guy that is probably already more defensive than a spear.
I have quite a bit of training in Bo and Jo. One of the spearman was actually pretty good. He kept his spear and his lead hand protected most of the time and he was deceptive with his strikes. he was lacking close quarter technique and not sure if he had grappling technique either but for a novice he was impressive.
Yup, I think this is why mass spearmen in warfare back then was so effective for many, many years.
@@paskovalokki6589
Anti spear technique?
What would that be?
And are you sure spears are thinner than, say, a one and an eighth inch quarterstaff?
The spears in the video didn't look that thin.
And then you get the nagamaki which has an identity crisis
The really weird one is the sword attached to a staff attached to a crossbow attached to a trebuchet.
A real identoty crisis would be a very short spear
to counter that point: Assegai
Gallen, trebuchet for long-distance and battlements, then if they close in, crossbow for mid-long range, then for melee, you have a spear to keep them at a distance, and if they close that, you have a short-arm.
Truly the perfect weapon. It makes the Katana look like a magic wand!
A nagamaki is a naginata which is overcompensating for "physical inadequacies real or imagined" :P
A little late to this, came I. Best video I've seen in eleventy weeks, to be sure, without a doubt.
Bravo!
Totally Accurate Battle Simulator in Real Life
you are always welcome to Achile Marozzo "Ludus magnus" style of tournament, all over Italy. Mixed armes tournaments with speers, heavy shields and all other weapons included. We will be glad to host you!
This turned out to be a loooong comment :D
In Finnish boffer fighting we fight in large groups - the main event of the year has around 600 participants, and groups consist of around 10-60 combattants. This has gone on for around 15 years.
Watching this I could say before you started that in these 1vs1 matches if you have experienced fighters, the spear will usually win until you get to those large heater shields that you had. Once the swordsman has a large shield, it becomes a question of controlling that spear for the time it takes you to rush in. After the swordsman has closed in, the spearman's survival has most to do with how fast they can block and run away. The exception is if you have a sidearm such as a dagger or short sword. Then you have your chance to counter against an unwary swordsman.
On the battlefield 1vs1 situations sometimes do happen after the major groups have clashed, or if you are otherwise in a skirmish situation. If you find yourself without a shield or with a small one against a spearman, then your best option is to just find a buddy with either a large shield - or a longer spear.
For group vs group action, an even or even-ish spread of different weapons is absolutely essential. The spears, pikes and archers do the vast majority of the killing work. Some archers also adept at disturbing opposing spearmen by staying very close or in the front line and simply threatening them with arrows. You're pretty quick to duck behind a shield if someone is pointing an arrow at you -> and you can't use your pike when you're ducking behind a shield -> your opponents have an easier time poking holes in you and your friends.
In this sort of line work, really, the sword and shield people have 2 jobs: To stay alive, and to keep the spearmen and everyone else alive. Notice how neither of these jobs are killing the enemy? Sure, in the event of a rush or break attempt you occasionally get to swing at someone, but most of your time is definately spent waving your shield in front of your spearman so THEY can work. There's also something to be said for controlling distance so that you present a nice enough target for the enemy that their spearmen want to try and poke at you - leaving them open for your spearmen to poke at them - while staying alive yourself.
Of course, if you were to have ONLY spears in your group... Well, then, a well timed rush would finish you off pretty quickly, like in the video. There is an exception though: Some groups are skirmish focused and use short spears. They don't get into dug-in line situations where they could easily get rushed, preferring to find their way past enemies and keep on the move. This is effective - but won't always win the day if you actually need to go somewhere the others are guarding, or guard some place the others want to get to.
But in the end I find the "is a sword better than a spear" question moot. They are all integral parts of formations. If you show up all spears, you are vulnerable to groups with shield and who know how to time rushes - you're the proverbial glass cannon. If you show up all shields and swords, you'll just get ground down by enemies with longer poky bits than you - you're the proverbial brick shithouse. Combine the two, and add in support from a couple archers, halberdiers, zweihänders... And NOW you become a fighting unit.
Oh yeah the shield and spear style? There is a group who do that as well. There's a couple of places for it: One is going up against opponents without spears OR larger shields - you have an easier time striking them with your one-handed spear style, and your shield keeps you a bit safer. The other is when assaulting opponents who can't rush you and don't have spears - now you have your leisure at poking them with your superior range. A third one is if you're defending or are in a locked in shield wall type situation. They have carved half-moon slots in their shields so they can support the shield in it even while they have locked shields. When supported by she shield, thrusting becomes an easy mechanical operation with the other hand. Not much control or accuracy though. In the end, even in such a situation they are usually vulnerable to pikes which can just stay outside their range and keep on poking. This group though, always carry a sidearm actually strapped (or velcroed, oh the modernity) in their shield. This allows them to abandon the spear very quickly and switch to sword and shield.
Thank you for this comment, this is most interesting.
I really would like to know - what sort of spears were you using? 2 handed stabbing spears? This is my guess from the comment you made that "swordsmen keep their spearmen alive".
One more question: again what spears are they using in the groups that you said "Some groups are skirmish focused and use short spears."
I'm asking as we did ancient Germanic framea short spear reenactments and that sound similar.
@@detachedinsight8651 Hey! The spears vary in length depending on their use. Line spears meant for use while protected by shieldmen are longer ones, from around 4-6 meters. Some call them Pikes. The shortest ones that see proper use are, I *think* between 2,5-3 meters, used by the rare shield-and-spear types and those groups with most or only spears.
Anyone who's interested is more than welcome to visit Finland to see. The next main event is 5.-7. July. :) There are several smaller scale events too around the year.
@@AleksiJoensuu Thanks for the speedy reply. Are the shorter 2.5 meter spears based on any specific historical period or ethnic group?
My own experience was mostly in weapons from the late republican Roman period, including contemporary Gallic and Germanic weapons.
For sword&spear infantry (mostly Germanic melee spear) we found that anything longer than 2 meters became rather unwieldy when used single handed.
Most, if I recall correctly, chose a shaft lenght no longer than 1.5 meters. So when using a shield, you would sacrifice reach for ease of use. We wound that in infantry combat, the extra range is not worth giving up the shorter spear's ability to parry, fence and cut with the wrist swing motions. Of course the range was not as needed against the Celtic slashing longsword as it might be against say a medieval long stabbing sword.
OIf course, our short Germanic framea would have a major disadvantage in the medieval battlefield - it simply wouldn't be as effective against cavalrymen. But for facing either Roman or Celtic style armed foot opponents, we found this short fencing spear to be much better than any swords of the period.
How large are the shields the spear&shield guys are using? In our exercised we found the 70cm diameter Nydam-bog-style round shields to be best for us ewith the spear, as they were small enough and light enough that one could also use them to hit the enemy with the edge.
Six hundred fighters! Sounds like an extremely fun event. Where and when does it happen? Would like to watch to better understand how the mass fight works.
@@detachedinsight8651 re: Historical basis of spears: I don't know really! I'm not a very historically oriented practitioner of the sport. I should ask people some times, at least I might learn something. :) The group who uses the round shield with a cutaway together with a sword is spartan themed.
re: Shorter spears: The current rules say a spear may not be used for slashing, only thrusting. It would be interesting to see if we might get more short spears used as slashing weapons if the rules were changed. With current rules if you had a 1,5 meter spear you would probably just get shanked by groups with 4 meter pikes, or bull rushed by folks with shields and swords, as before. Of course again if you were to go against a group who only had shields and swords and they were unable to rush you, that extra half meter againsta swordsman would be an advantage I'm sure.
Re: Fencing spears: It would be very interesting to see that in practice!
I always had the same thinking and the experiments seems to offer a good test to the hypothesis. Excellent argumentation.
I'd recommend watching Roger Norling (friend of Matt's) of the Gothenberg Free Fencers. He's spent a lot of time on Meyer's polearms, and he's well learned and quite boss at it.
2:42 why is it always the groin???- dying warrior's last words XD
Weren't swords a rich man's weapon? Just considering the amount of metal required to create one sword compared to a spear, it seems like spears would've been much cheaper. That might explain why they'd be used so much compared to swords. Like.. many guerilla groups today still use machetes and very few use laser guided bombs but that's got more to do with the availability of the weapon than its quality.
@furiousmat
I was thinking about expense as well, plus the training time that would be needed to effectively wield a great-sword or what not. The spear seems so much cheaper and requires less training.
exactly but it was just a funny video they wanted us to enjoy, not scientific work... I read in the comments that it might be the creators sence of humor.
Spears were cheaper, though, depending on the time period, swords were not always very costly. Even Lindy mentioned in a past video that, during the 1500s I believe, a man could go to town and buy a sword for "tuppence" - Or, two pence.
@@Stuckinair Dude, calm the hell down. It was a simple mistake, and one that wasn't even entirely wrong.
as a guerilla who uses laser guided bombs i find this comment in poor taste.
That video has got to be lots of fun to make.
So in other words, the spear was the AK47 and AKMs of the acient world.
This is wrong... the swordsmen would have just all unscrewed their pommels and ended the spearman rightly by unleashing a deadly pommel volley ;-)
Ill admit they did the but they didn't do that often it would throw of the weight of the sword tremendously
Always end him rightly
comes with the real risk that the spearmen use their spears as baseball bats, hitting those pommels out of the park.
Wardens mains united
That'd be pretty magical to see. "We shall block out the sun with our pommels!" tossing aside the useless pointy end.
Both are trash compared to a trebuchet
The one with the swordsmen or the one with spearmen guarding it?
All of them are trash compared to my machine gun.
and I'm from Barrow in Furness where we built trident, shoot that down! @@leekenyon8705
not short range XD
Say hello to the Atombomb.
Lindy's face whilst running and his running are great to watch!!
The reasons why sword is still king: 1) once you get inside the spear's reach, you'll win. 2) the sword is a better defensive weapon for blocking. 3) more range of motion. Thrust, chop, slice and counterstrike.
12:00 What about spearmen without shield in a formation? You did not try this one.... Against all odds, you missed the ULTIMATE YARI A-SHI-GA-RU formation! What a shame!
It's kinda hard to find the other 196 spearmen for the Yari unit though.
kek, any villagers will do. male > 14 yo. :D
Oda Yari Ashigaru with weapons and armour upgrades, invincibru
those are quite unbeatable by swords men i think but more prone to missile attakcs
What about a pointed stick?
Noo... What if a man armed with a banana attack me?
I'd be more about running into madman with a bag full of pommels hopped up on mushrooms
That happened to my sister!
Gallen Dugall
I thØught she wäs bìtten by a mØØse?
She has had a hard life.
A big factor for the sword is the dependence of spear formations to maintain their integrity. If you’re intimidated and facing a bold enemy where their swords are going to close-in fast, you give the advantage to the swordsman (and once morale is lessened and the formation breaks, it’ll spiral into the melee chaos that favours the swordsmen). I think this is why the ruthless Sea Peoples and their common usage of swords were so effective against perhaps more timid Near Eastern warriors armed only with spears and shields.
imagine wanting to run head in against a spear wall. there were no civilization that militarized outside of spears. people talk about breaking the formation, they dont even know how hard it is to break it lol
@@vincentprime740 That's precisely why you either have big shields or heavy armor (or both) to protect you against the spear tips as you close in to your optimal range.
Might I point out that King Shaka of the Zulu nation, used a SPEAR & SHIELD to GREAT success. Granted, cowhide is not the best material for a shield, but its more the shape and design that matters. Lightweight, durable, full body protection and could also be used as a secondary weapon used to expose your opponents flank for the kill shot. The longer, wider blade of the spear head in combination with the shortened staff made for a more balanced stabbing weapon.