The chess/boardgame like aspect allows for deeper exploration and replayability, which enables a 1 year expansion cycle. Whereas most tcgs have a very short meta cycle in leagues. In Chess or Scythe or Dominion, you don’t need new content every month, you can replay with new strategies for years. Just swapping out 1 card (your Avatar) can change the entire way you play.
The game sells itself. I've converted not only a Magic player, but a Miniatures guy along with a D&D traveler. Playing Sorcery is more like a story telling session than a competitive battle. Peace!
EDIT: After posting this comment someone made this same point on the live feed so all props to them. On the sorcery topic I feel like the bigger problem is content creators being the trend setters for a large portion of players. Content creators can't support a channel covering a game with one release a year. Except of course talking about how it's going to fail. They are free to do this but the problem becomes a bigger deal if a company starts trying to appeal to the louder voices and alienate those that truly support them and their vision.
another brilliant stream, guys. I think sorcery has a long and bright future ahead of it. Also, I love when Steven says "they formulized it" in reference to world of warcraft. That's going in the vocab, right alongside "gimungous".
I read in a Tolkien that, while he was writing "The Hobbit sequel" (we call Lord of the Rings), his publisher asked him (basically) if he thought it would have a market since the drafts were looking very different compared to The Hobbit; Tolkien is supposed to have said, "The people who like this sort of thing will like this very much." I think that's the same chutzpah Sorcery has. It might not follow the conventional market wisdom, but the people who like what they're doing are guaranteed to like it very much. Maybe that is why people who maybe do not like it as much don't get it. I was always frustrated with competitive Magic players at the game store because I wanted to just play a relaxed game, not train for a tournament. That's why I haven't played Magic in nearly a decade. Sorcery not focusing on competitive play is one of the main pulls for me.
Honestly, yearly rule book updates works really well to nerf powerful abilities instead outright banning/bricking cards. The limited rarity aspect of deck building is great, but with the language on the cards being so broad, they can easily redefine keywords to balance the meta. If the mana rocks become to powerful from a competitive perspective they could easily change the rules on relics and which phase of the turns the mana effects become active. I also think the limited interaction on opponents turn is great. Everything is Sorcery speed (except dodge roll of course).
The reason I just bought some pre constructed decks are cuz this game only has one set releasing a year. I played Commander because my decks were evergreen, but the meta changes every set nowadays. I still play it and love it, but get fatigued on all the new cards and have to take a break every two months I play it :/ This game is very much made to fit into my availability - I’m excited to get it to the table :)
Definitely curious to see how this plays out. I have been loving Sorcery but do feel like once per year is a bit slow. I think every 6mo would be a nice sweet spot where I can appreciate the set for a while but not so long that I forget how to play the game
Would you guys think a game like Flesh and Blood could have a better opening experience similiar to Sorcery? If so, how? I find myself hardly justifying opening FaB in the last months similarly to what I did with MtG but for different reasons, MetG for the product overload/fatigue and FaB for not providing the kind of experience I would like, Sorcery is so satisfying and while I want to collect all FaB cards, my take is that even with the cold foiling the pull rates are so bad, I wish they upped the rates a bit for regular majestics at least, the rainbow foil cards' quality is not good (for as much as I would like to praise it), the limited experience is great (imho) and I don't know if the rates are purposeful so Ms don't come much and mess the limited power level but I wish I had a FaB opening experience like Sorcery (or even MtG tbh), opening ~70-75% of draft shaft when opening a case does not rewards the regular player from buying it, I also don't think box-toppers (like 2 Ms per box-topper and possible to open Ls too) would make it better but maybe?!? I also agree that 1-2 releases is very good to me and they can maintain themselves small enough to keep the company alive, seeing a lot of people craving for more reprinting sees that people want the cards, I hope they keep doing it for a while since nowadays the market is much bigger than when MtG started, I hope they don't stop printing the Core/PStone cards but I don't want that they streamline the process and become yet another TCG, I'm so happy for the set release lower speed, I hate the baked-in formula for what a TCG needs to do to survive. I also wish there was a distributor like you in Europe, the ones distributing Sorcery are miles away from you, I couldn't even get my Beta pre-ordered mat :(
i'm playing in the southeast uk! still have an unopened booster box to open and play sealed with. Often bring my cards to my local board game group. Where are you based?
It's sad I couldn't get any set 1 cause it means I'll end up skipping the game when set 2 comes out. But it's aleast still fun watching the TC guys play it now and again =)
We've been going by "Covenant" for many years, actually! Just formalizing that wherever we can. Notice the intro says "Covenant", for instance. One day, the owners of covenant.com will sell that domain to us. One day.
I get that you guys are a big distributor for sorcery, but with everything you are saying, it is biased. Sorcery wants to be different but the prices say otherwise, also the buy a box promo cards say otherwise, one set a year is fine and no competitive play is fine, but if all of this was the point the set would be mass produced and prices of cards on the secondary market would be nowhere near what they are. Don't forget the curio cards that are accidentally inserted in packs, these are all signs of manipulation of the market and the players base.
You must be mistaken sir, most card prices are under a dollar with an acceptable pricing of more sought-after cards being expensive. This is a game where you don't need most of the expensive cards to even have fun playing and to win. Also, curiose are a part of the games mystery and chase and should be expected to be expensive since they are rare collectible cards and part of the games history. You may just not understand Sorcery sir.
@turtlebro0017 so explain to me why cores are in the $100 range and pstone is in the $250 range? The game is not being sold as a competitive game yet the prices say otherwise, the game is more relatable to a lcg.
@alain7516 having a short print of a set of cards that are being pushed as a casual game is the problem, all of the special cards that players are hunting for defeats the entire purpose of saying the game is not like every other ccg/tcg.
Always happy to listen to Sorcery chat.
There is nothing better than sorcery right now, you guys are keeping us alive down here in Texas
The chess/boardgame like aspect allows for deeper exploration and replayability, which enables a 1 year expansion cycle. Whereas most tcgs have a very short meta cycle in leagues. In Chess or Scythe or Dominion, you don’t need new content every month, you can replay with new strategies for years. Just swapping out 1 card (your Avatar) can change the entire way you play.
Sorcery is reigniting a flame in my heart that I haven't felt since early 90s M:TG. So refreshing
The game sells itself. I've converted not only a Magic player, but a Miniatures guy along with a D&D traveler. Playing Sorcery is more like a story telling session than a competitive battle. Peace!
Quality sure has an impact.
Amen@@teamcovenant
EDIT: After posting this comment someone made this same point on the live feed so all props to them.
On the sorcery topic I feel like the bigger problem is content creators being the trend setters for a large portion of players.
Content creators can't support a channel covering a game with one release a year. Except of course talking about how it's going to fail.
They are free to do this but the problem becomes a bigger deal if a company starts trying to appeal to the louder voices and alienate those that truly support them and their vision.
another brilliant stream, guys. I think sorcery has a long and bright future ahead of it. Also, I love when Steven says "they formulized it" in reference to world of warcraft. That's going in the vocab, right alongside "gimungous".
I read in a Tolkien that, while he was writing "The Hobbit sequel" (we call Lord of the Rings), his publisher asked him (basically) if he thought it would have a market since the drafts were looking very different compared to The Hobbit; Tolkien is supposed to have said, "The people who like this sort of thing will like this very much." I think that's the same chutzpah Sorcery has. It might not follow the conventional market wisdom, but the people who like what they're doing are guaranteed to like it very much. Maybe that is why people who maybe do not like it as much don't get it.
I was always frustrated with competitive Magic players at the game store because I wanted to just play a relaxed game, not train for a tournament. That's why I haven't played Magic in nearly a decade. Sorcery not focusing on competitive play is one of the main pulls for me.
Sorcery is good for you! It's the deep work, slow productivity version of TCGs.
Glad you guys have EC's ear.
If you're looking to rename this stream so the title doesn't involve a day of the week, I suggest Old Man Steven Complains.
Honestly, yearly rule book updates works really well to nerf powerful abilities instead outright banning/bricking cards. The limited rarity aspect of deck building is great, but with the language on the cards being so broad, they can easily redefine keywords to balance the meta. If the mana rocks become to powerful from a competitive perspective they could easily change the rules on relics and which phase of the turns the mana effects become active. I also think the limited interaction on opponents turn is great. Everything is Sorcery speed (except dodge roll of course).
The reason I just bought some pre constructed decks are cuz this game only has one set releasing a year. I played Commander because my decks were evergreen, but the meta changes every set nowadays. I still play it and love it, but get fatigued on all the new cards and have to take a break every two months I play it :/
This game is very much made to fit into my availability - I’m excited to get it to the table :)
Definitely curious to see how this plays out. I have been loving Sorcery but do feel like once per year is a bit slow. I think every 6mo would be a nice sweet spot where I can appreciate the set for a while but not so long that I forget how to play the game
You guys still have sorcery for $150 a box. I likes it 😎...
Could anyone identify the music playing at the beginning of the stream? My Soundhound app does not recognize it, but I would love to know. Thanks!
It's a licensed track that we bought. Not out in the world, sadly. But if you dig it, look into Chet Baker and Bobby Hackett.
they're back!
Would you guys think a game like Flesh and Blood could have a better opening experience similiar to Sorcery? If so, how? I find myself hardly justifying opening FaB in the last months similarly to what I did with MtG but for different reasons, MetG for the product overload/fatigue and FaB for not providing the kind of experience I would like, Sorcery is so satisfying and while I want to collect all FaB cards, my take is that even with the cold foiling the pull rates are so bad, I wish they upped the rates a bit for regular majestics at least, the rainbow foil cards' quality is not good (for as much as I would like to praise it), the limited experience is great (imho) and I don't know if the rates are purposeful so Ms don't come much and mess the limited power level but I wish I had a FaB opening experience like Sorcery (or even MtG tbh), opening ~70-75% of draft shaft when opening a case does not rewards the regular player from buying it, I also don't think box-toppers (like 2 Ms per box-topper and possible to open Ls too) would make it better but maybe?!?
I also agree that 1-2 releases is very good to me and they can maintain themselves small enough to keep the company alive, seeing a lot of people craving for more reprinting sees that people want the cards, I hope they keep doing it for a while since nowadays the market is much bigger than when MtG started, I hope they don't stop printing the Core/PStone cards but I don't want that they streamline the process and become yet another TCG, I'm so happy for the set release lower speed, I hate the baked-in formula for what a TCG needs to do to survive.
I also wish there was a distributor like you in Europe, the ones distributing Sorcery are miles away from you, I couldn't even get my Beta pre-ordered mat :(
I'd love to play sorcery ...... but it basically doesn't exist in the UK =(
Yeah, we're hopeful that international distribution improves next set.
i'm playing in the southeast uk! still have an unopened booster box to open and play sealed with. Often bring my cards to my local board game group. Where are you based?
@@faucetrememberly2399 london based, no stores here had any product on release because they'd sold everything on preorders =(
And since no stores had any stock to sell on release because they'd shipped it to ppl across the country basically noone got into the game locally
It's sad I couldn't get any set 1 cause it means I'll end up skipping the game when set 2 comes out. But it's aleast still fun watching the TC guys play it now and again =)
I just noticed there's no "Team" in the channel name anymore?
Did these two break up?
I hope they can patch things up for the kids at least.
We've been going by "Covenant" for many years, actually! Just formalizing that wherever we can. Notice the intro says "Covenant", for instance.
One day, the owners of covenant.com will sell that domain to us. One day.
I get that you guys are a big distributor for sorcery, but with everything you are saying, it is biased. Sorcery wants to be different but the prices say otherwise, also the buy a box promo cards say otherwise, one set a year is fine and no competitive play is fine, but if all of this was the point the set would be mass produced and prices of cards on the secondary market would be nowhere near what they are. Don't forget the curio cards that are accidentally inserted in packs, these are all signs of manipulation of the market and the players base.
having a collectable or rare aspect to some of the cards somehow undermines the legitimacy of the playing and collecting experience?
Thank you for the comment - not sure what the point is here. Could you restate it more directly?
You must be mistaken sir, most card prices are under a dollar with an acceptable pricing of more sought-after cards being expensive. This is a game where you don't need most of the expensive cards to even have fun playing and to win. Also, curiose are a part of the games mystery and chase and should be expected to be expensive since they are rare collectible cards and part of the games history. You may just not understand Sorcery sir.
@turtlebro0017 so explain to me why cores are in the $100 range and pstone is in the $250 range? The game is not being sold as a competitive game yet the prices say otherwise, the game is more relatable to a lcg.
@alain7516 having a short print of a set of cards that are being pushed as a casual game is the problem, all of the special cards that players are hunting for defeats the entire purpose of saying the game is not like every other ccg/tcg.