If I can think of another video idea for Kingdom, I'll definitely make something. I love the manga, but the more it goes on, the more complex it gets, as I'm sure you know. I had trouble just organizing my thoughts for the Keiyou Campaign. But hopefully this can sate you for a bit, lol
Another great banger Jompo! I didn't even consider the structure of story telling for wars was one of the reasons the 4th great ninja war felt off. The idea of the war arc in Naruto felt grand but it struggled to keep up the pace when everything went to small group battles, leaving a lot of the arc feeling divided. In contrast, Kingdom can have multiple groups fighting while still continuing the overall plot in a cohesive way, especially during the coalition arc.
I always really enjoy your videos even though they are very varied in topic since the great subtle humor while dissecting things in a interesting and concise way makes the videos top tier quality, it really is to bad it doesn't have the popularity it deserves but hopefully they will pick up in the future with more videos.
Thanks, I appreciate the positivity. I'll try to keep up the quality, regardless of the view count. I think if I just keep trying hard, views and stuff will naturally follow. At least that's what I tell myself, lol. And thank you specifically for commenting on a few of my videos. I'm happy that you've taken the time to watch them, and it's nice seeing a consistent name pop up.
ive seen my fair share of underrated TH-camrs, hell theyre all i watch but you top this list by a longshot, your vids are too high quality to not blow up
Time to add yet another manga to the ever-growing to-read pile. For real though, thanks for making me aware of Kingdom. It seems incredibly interesting.
Naruto should have used the ninja as spec ops and have the regular armies of the feudal lords hold the battle fields while the ninja supported them from the shadows. You know - like ninjas. Also, it would have been cool if their plan to collect the tailed beasts was to awaken the dead of the land from their graves to take over the world and unite it under a zombie army, with the impure world resurrection as the backbone, and maybe they had to do an imperfect jutsu do to Akatsuki failing to collect all nine tailed beasts within 9 months or something like that, a time limit that forces them to just kick the war off sooner rather than waiting to capture the last two tailed beasts.
I dont know anything about the feudal lord troops but alot of ninja in this show dont seem to be very good at being ninja. I would equate them more to warriors and magicians before asssassins.
In Narutos defense, it's easier to show actual strategies that exist, and were used, then to make up new ones around supernatural beings. Kingdom has actual history to take inspiration from.
I liked the idea for this video, but some points were hit or miss. Your best points were on the cultures of the different ninja villages coming into play. Your point on how the groups compare with their leaders is iffy since (but this is more complicated in the naruto verse since they can communicate using telepathy) Gaara does inspire the ninja forces when the battle starts when they have internal conflict(but I get what you are saying). Also, I think many felt floored by the madara fight simply bc the army included Onoki, Gaara, and naruto. The main character was running and saved when he was only a clone. This can show how much they need just one guy even when he is not the real thing. The intent is a bit different compared to kingdom. And your point on Naruto's war arc is secondary to character growth is a confusing point as the war arc serves as a conclusion for many character arcs and even has growth in some characters like naruto, sasuke, A, Gaara, onoki, choji, Shikamaru, and the fifth. Character growth is not everything, as characters can go through different arcs(negative, positive, and flat). In terms of development, the war arc develops a ton of characters. Sorry for the long comment like the vid tho
It's all good mate. The point about the Madara meteors is fair, though It should be mentioned that Onoki, Gaara, and Naruto were all low on chakra from their previous fights. It's a big cool move, yes, but the main characters mostly got out of it fine. I probably should have phrased it a bit better, but Onoki trying his best to stop the attack was a good scene. In the context of a war, however, with Gaara and Onoki ending up ultimately fine, and only the nameless ninja really getting stomped, it falls a bit flat for me. In the grand scheme of things, it's just Madara's opening gambit, and had little impact because it only really killed the nameless guys. But I think you got one of my points a bit mixed, the character growth point was to say that you can focus on both the war and the characters at the same time to make them both good (like Kingdom) as opposed to having a mediocre war but good character growth (Naruto). It's that you don't have to sacrifice one point for another, you can have both. Naruto definitely focuses mostly on character growth.
First of all, thanks for introducing me to kingdom, that's a great recommendation! However, there's a problem with this video. It makes the "one size fits all" fallacy for storytelling. Not every war has to have the army be useful... Sometimes keeping them useless IS THE POINT. In Naruto, the army being useless was done ON PURPOSE, because it advances both the themes of the story and Naruto's character arc. Naruto at this point in the story has gotten too strong and feels he can take on all the world's burdens himself, this fight reinforces that idea in his mind. Later fights explore this concept further by making him fail and realize he needs the help of others in order to become truly strong.
I half agree. I do think there's a reason for the army to get stomped in Naruto, and thematically it can work, but themes shouldn't be at the expense of the narrative itself. Assuming this is the theme Naruto is going for, where working together to help others makes you truly strong, then I will still have questions like "why is it that when the kage work together they still lose to Madara, especially if the theme is about working together," and "does no one value teamwork in the slightest in any army? Logically why does every soldier fall apart, break formation, disregard rules, or ignore synced jutsu, even within their own village?" or maybe even "Why do the kage seem to be ready to 100% work together the whole time, but this isn't reflected at all by the armies themselves? Especially after Gaara's speech that seemed to bring everyone together?" It seems more like the theme is being forced by making the characters and world bend to its whim, rather than the events being natural. The narrative should compliment the theme, rather than the theme existing for a single character at the expense of the rest of the cast. Again assuming that your theme is the main throughline for Naruto, instead of having a narrative of... Villages distrust each other -> villages rally together into a ninja army (theme relevant, they should be stronger together) -> battles are 1v1 between named characters and enemies, but good guys still ultimately win (theme countered, teamwork mostly irrelevant) -> Madara arrives -> Madara defeats all the kage that work together, even though the kage work together from the start (theme countered again) It could instead have been adjusted in a way that allows the armies to be representative of the characters and themes themselves, for example Villages distrust each other -> villages come together to form a ninja army, but stick to their own villages and don't support each other, leading to losses (theme relevant) -> after massive losses, combined village strategies result in victories against the resurrected kage (theme still relevant, stronger together) -> Madara arrives and is overwhelming regardless (still fine) -> Kage struggle to sync up due to unfamiliarity with each other, victory may have been achieved if villages worked together from the start (theme still relevant) -> Madara defeats the kage because of their history of distrust between villages, trust is something that couldn't be achieved in a day, unless you have a pure heart like Naruto himself (theme secured). If the same theme could be achieved and reinforced even further through the army, then that would be a boon for the writing. Having tens of chapters devoted to showing incompetence to twist the world into being weak, just for the sake of Naruto feeling that responsibility lies exclusively on his shoulders, seems more like a missed opportunity that wastes too much time on setting up something that isn't firmly implied anyway. My main point here isn't even that you're wrong, it's just that I think it could have been even stronger if the army was utilized properly. A better written army acting as a grand metaphor for Naruto's personal revelation could be very cool. And Naruto seeing how far selfishness has taken Madara could make him call his own beliefs into question since teamwork ultimately failed. Maybe Madara, and by extension Sasuke, had the right idea by leaving everyone behind to become as strong as possible, especially after seeing how a properly functioning army couldn't even stop him. But Naruto knows things were going better when they were working as one, his belief is just standing against its greatest competition. So he can double down and commit to his belief in order to win in the end. But since the army was always weak even when working together, and since the kage lose when working so well together, the theme is confused. Madara's selfish solution looks just about as good as Naruto's, because the good guys seem to fail regardless of whether or not they work together. Ultimately we just have to take Naruto's word that friendship and working together is stronger than selfish strength, because Naruto is the only one who can really prove that to be the case. Having more proof in the army's performance could be very beneficial.
@@feedjompo I agree with most of what you said here and agree with your criticism in the video that Gaara bringing everyone together doesn't make a whole lot of sense and that the different cultures aren't well represented in the war. I also really like your ideas for how the story could've better secured these themes. I think the next part of the war does a lot of what you're asking from the story, showcasing Naruto sharing chakra with everyone to have them fight the 10 tails together, having the army deflecting its giant bijuu-dama, having the other leaf ninja help defeat Obito in the chakra tug of war. I do think the early parts of the war are the most flawed overall, but one thing I disagree with you on is that Madara defeating the 5 kage. I never viewed the Kage's strategies as being particularly deep or in sync, it seemed like they were just improvising because they barely knew each other. Comparing that to the strategies utilized by team 7, for example, demonstrates how unfamiliar they were. EDIT: The video was amazing, keep up the great work! I also really enjoyed the one you did on Kingdom Hearts.
Thanks, yeah I can't help myself when it comes to talking about things like these and always end up writing paragraphs, but I'm glad you liked the videos.
Kingdom anime is actually pretty good...after season 2. The production on season 3, 4 and 5 is not exceptional but pretty good and it's nice to see the wars in motion with sound and color. Of course, the kingdom story is so great that it's still worth watching season 1 and 2 if you don't wanna read manga (and I don't). The horrible CGI in the first season becomes less and less frequent throughout that season and pretty much stops by the time season 2 starts although season 2 has some very lazy animation. Lots of panning stills with motion lines and battle sounds. Season 3+ was made years later with modern production standards and lets the series really shine. I'm convinced if season's 1 and 2 had the same production quality, the anime would be as popular as the manga.
Yeah, I noticed that the anime improved its visuals a lot, but I always struggle with the "it gets good after X" argument when trying to convince people to watch something. But I think Kingdom is okay in arc 1 and really good from then on in the manga. Basically you can spend less time to get more engrossed, and swapping from manga to anime is always a hard sell so I didn't bother to say it in the video.
Season 2 already gets better quite a bit. Even season 1 is at least not atrocious, I've seen series with worse animation or CGI that I still enjoyed because the series were good and animation not downright aggressive to my eyes.
I love kingdom, but you can't compare the two. Those two wars are completely different. Kingdom does it so much better because it's 2 armies fighting. Naruto is 50 dudes vs an army. But those dudes all have tanks, and the allies are just poorly equipped foot soldiers. The story telling is not the same, so idk how the comparison can be made. Good video either way, cheers
Thanks. I think they're comparable due to the fact that there is a massive army on the side of the Allied Forces. And that's kind of my point, if you only had footsoldiers and were going up against tanks, wouldn't you try to strategize so your forces could more effectively take the tanks out? Especially when synced jutsu appears to be pretty effective. It's why I ask the question "why even have a war if it's underutilized?" I'd agree that it's different, and has distinct focus, but I do think that the aspects of what make it a war could be improved. Hence my video, I guess. Thanks for watching though, I'm happy you liked it.
@@feedjompo Tanks outright destroy infantry. I view the named characters as better equipped (basically just dudes with RPGs). The most infantry can do is combined small arms fire, so that the RPGs can hit the mark. I feel like the show did that decently well. More strategy would be nice, but were talking about INSANE firepower from the enemies.
How do you not have millions of views this is terrific content
Well my upload schedule may have something to do with it lmao, I appreciate the complement.
Keep up thr kingdom content!!! We've been starved of it on youtube for too long and i really enjoyed this video
If I can think of another video idea for Kingdom, I'll definitely make something. I love the manga, but the more it goes on, the more complex it gets, as I'm sure you know. I had trouble just organizing my thoughts for the Keiyou Campaign. But hopefully this can sate you for a bit, lol
Another great banger Jompo! I didn't even consider the structure of story telling for wars was one of the reasons the 4th great ninja war felt off. The idea of the war arc in Naruto felt grand but it struggled to keep up the pace when everything went to small group battles, leaving a lot of the arc feeling divided. In contrast, Kingdom can have multiple groups fighting while still continuing the overall plot in a cohesive way, especially during the coalition arc.
I would never have considered it either if I didn't read Kingdom. Thanks for watching.
I always really enjoy your videos even though they are very varied in topic since the great subtle humor while dissecting things in a interesting and concise way makes the videos top tier quality, it really is to bad it doesn't have the popularity it deserves but hopefully they will pick up in the future with more videos.
Thanks, I appreciate the positivity. I'll try to keep up the quality, regardless of the view count. I think if I just keep trying hard, views and stuff will naturally follow. At least that's what I tell myself, lol.
And thank you specifically for commenting on a few of my videos. I'm happy that you've taken the time to watch them, and it's nice seeing a consistent name pop up.
@@feedjompoand it did!
your 4 videos are awesome, thanks a lot for the high quality editing and humour
Thank you Benjamin Roblero
ive seen my fair share of underrated TH-camrs, hell theyre all i watch but you top this list by a longshot, your vids are too high quality to not blow up
Thanks my man
amazing video!!! loved it!!! this was a really original topic that i have never even considered before and the analysis was fantastic
Thanks! I'm glad you liked it.
Time to add yet another manga to the ever-growing to-read pile. For real though, thanks for making me aware of Kingdom. It seems incredibly interesting.
No problem, my main goal with this video was to advertise Kingdom, so I'm glad you're considering it.
Is it super good. As a Naruto fan, Kingdom is so much better especially during the coalition army arc. It's way better than 4th great ninja war.
Just finished Coalition Arc. Best war arc I have ever seen😩 That was sooooo goood
It's crazy just how good it is, and it keeps up the momentum afterwards. I don't know how Kingdom can consistently be written as well as it is.
Naruto should have used the ninja as spec ops and have the regular armies of the feudal lords hold the battle fields while the ninja supported them from the shadows. You know - like ninjas. Also, it would have been cool if their plan to collect the tailed beasts was to awaken the dead of the land from their graves to take over the world and unite it under a zombie army, with the impure world resurrection as the backbone, and maybe they had to do an imperfect jutsu do to Akatsuki failing to collect all nine tailed beasts within 9 months or something like that, a time limit that forces them to just kick the war off sooner rather than waiting to capture the last two tailed beasts.
I dont know anything about the feudal lord troops but alot of ninja in this show dont seem to be very good at being ninja. I would equate them more to warriors and magicians before asssassins.
Kingdom and the naruto waring states era could of been similar
13:34 holy moly i dont remember this tsunade
Ahhhh Naruto, it's our punching bag because we love it in spite of itself.
Might have to give kingdom a try
The live action Kingdom series is actually spectacular, imo.
Live action anime/manga adaptations are usually garbage, so I ignored it on principal. But maybe I'll take a peek if this one is the exception.
In Narutos defense, it's easier to show actual strategies that exist, and were used, then to make up new ones around supernatural beings. Kingdom has actual history to take inspiration from.
I liked the idea for this video, but some points were hit or miss. Your best points were on the cultures of the different ninja villages coming into play. Your point on how the groups compare with their leaders is iffy since (but this is more complicated in the naruto verse since they can communicate using telepathy) Gaara does inspire the ninja forces when the battle starts when they have internal conflict(but I get what you are saying). Also, I think many felt floored by the madara fight simply bc the army included Onoki, Gaara, and naruto. The main character was running and saved when he was only a clone. This can show how much they need just one guy even when he is not the real thing. The intent is a bit different compared to kingdom. And your point on Naruto's war arc is secondary to character growth is a confusing point as the war arc serves as a conclusion for many character arcs and even has growth in some characters like naruto, sasuke, A, Gaara, onoki, choji, Shikamaru, and the fifth. Character growth is not everything, as characters can go through different arcs(negative, positive, and flat). In terms of development, the war arc develops a ton of characters. Sorry for the long comment like the vid tho
It's all good mate.
The point about the Madara meteors is fair, though It should be mentioned that Onoki, Gaara, and Naruto were all low on chakra from their previous fights. It's a big cool move, yes, but the main characters mostly got out of it fine. I probably should have phrased it a bit better, but Onoki trying his best to stop the attack was a good scene. In the context of a war, however, with Gaara and Onoki ending up ultimately fine, and only the nameless ninja really getting stomped, it falls a bit flat for me. In the grand scheme of things, it's just Madara's opening gambit, and had little impact because it only really killed the nameless guys.
But I think you got one of my points a bit mixed, the character growth point was to say that you can focus on both the war and the characters at the same time to make them both good (like Kingdom) as opposed to having a mediocre war but good character growth (Naruto). It's that you don't have to sacrifice one point for another, you can have both. Naruto definitely focuses mostly on character growth.
@@feedjompo Yeah I see what you are saying liked the video
yes good
First of all, thanks for introducing me to kingdom, that's a great recommendation!
However, there's a problem with this video. It makes the "one size fits all" fallacy for storytelling.
Not every war has to have the army be useful... Sometimes keeping them useless IS THE POINT.
In Naruto, the army being useless was done ON PURPOSE, because it advances both the themes of the story and Naruto's character arc.
Naruto at this point in the story has gotten too strong and feels he can take on all the world's burdens himself, this fight reinforces that idea in his mind. Later fights explore this concept further by making him fail and realize he needs the help of others in order to become truly strong.
I half agree. I do think there's a reason for the army to get stomped in Naruto, and thematically it can work, but themes shouldn't be at the expense of the narrative itself. Assuming this is the theme Naruto is going for, where working together to help others makes you truly strong, then I will still have questions like "why is it that when the kage work together they still lose to Madara, especially if the theme is about working together," and "does no one value teamwork in the slightest in any army? Logically why does every soldier fall apart, break formation, disregard rules, or ignore synced jutsu, even within their own village?" or maybe even "Why do the kage seem to be ready to 100% work together the whole time, but this isn't reflected at all by the armies themselves? Especially after Gaara's speech that seemed to bring everyone together?" It seems more like the theme is being forced by making the characters and world bend to its whim, rather than the events being natural.
The narrative should compliment the theme, rather than the theme existing for a single character at the expense of the rest of the cast. Again assuming that your theme is the main throughline for Naruto, instead of having a narrative of...
Villages distrust each other -> villages rally together into a ninja army (theme relevant, they should be stronger together) -> battles are 1v1 between named characters and enemies, but good guys still ultimately win (theme countered, teamwork mostly irrelevant) -> Madara arrives -> Madara defeats all the kage that work together, even though the kage work together from the start (theme countered again)
It could instead have been adjusted in a way that allows the armies to be representative of the characters and themes themselves, for example
Villages distrust each other -> villages come together to form a ninja army, but stick to their own villages and don't support each other, leading to losses (theme relevant) -> after massive losses, combined village strategies result in victories against the resurrected kage (theme still relevant, stronger together) -> Madara arrives and is overwhelming regardless (still fine) -> Kage struggle to sync up due to unfamiliarity with each other, victory may have been achieved if villages worked together from the start (theme still relevant) -> Madara defeats the kage because of their history of distrust between villages, trust is something that couldn't be achieved in a day, unless you have a pure heart like Naruto himself (theme secured).
If the same theme could be achieved and reinforced even further through the army, then that would be a boon for the writing. Having tens of chapters devoted to showing incompetence to twist the world into being weak, just for the sake of Naruto feeling that responsibility lies exclusively on his shoulders, seems more like a missed opportunity that wastes too much time on setting up something that isn't firmly implied anyway.
My main point here isn't even that you're wrong, it's just that I think it could have been even stronger if the army was utilized properly. A better written army acting as a grand metaphor for Naruto's personal revelation could be very cool. And Naruto seeing how far selfishness has taken Madara could make him call his own beliefs into question since teamwork ultimately failed. Maybe Madara, and by extension Sasuke, had the right idea by leaving everyone behind to become as strong as possible, especially after seeing how a properly functioning army couldn't even stop him. But Naruto knows things were going better when they were working as one, his belief is just standing against its greatest competition. So he can double down and commit to his belief in order to win in the end.
But since the army was always weak even when working together, and since the kage lose when working so well together, the theme is confused. Madara's selfish solution looks just about as good as Naruto's, because the good guys seem to fail regardless of whether or not they work together. Ultimately we just have to take Naruto's word that friendship and working together is stronger than selfish strength, because Naruto is the only one who can really prove that to be the case. Having more proof in the army's performance could be very beneficial.
@@feedjompo I agree with most of what you said here and agree with your criticism in the video that Gaara bringing everyone together doesn't make a whole lot of sense and that the different cultures aren't well represented in the war.
I also really like your ideas for how the story could've better secured these themes.
I think the next part of the war does a lot of what you're asking from the story, showcasing Naruto sharing chakra with everyone to have them fight the 10 tails together, having the army deflecting its giant bijuu-dama, having the other leaf ninja help defeat Obito in the chakra tug of war.
I do think the early parts of the war are the most flawed overall, but one thing I disagree with you on is that Madara defeating the 5 kage. I never viewed the Kage's strategies as being particularly deep or in sync, it seemed like they were just improvising because they barely knew each other. Comparing that to the strategies utilized by team 7, for example, demonstrates how unfamiliar they were.
EDIT: The video was amazing, keep up the great work! I also really enjoyed the one you did on Kingdom Hearts.
Thanks, yeah I can't help myself when it comes to talking about things like these and always end up writing paragraphs, but I'm glad you liked the videos.
i apologize but i will never end up reading either of these no matter how much i want to
I see your point buddy, but the Naruto anime looks better than the Kingdom anime so you're wrong?
Possible?
Oh right, sorry.
Kingdom anime is actually pretty good...after season 2. The production on season 3, 4 and 5 is not exceptional but pretty good and it's nice to see the wars in motion with sound and color. Of course, the kingdom story is so great that it's still worth watching season 1 and 2 if you don't wanna read manga (and I don't). The horrible CGI in the first season becomes less and less frequent throughout that season and pretty much stops by the time season 2 starts although season 2 has some very lazy animation. Lots of panning stills with motion lines and battle sounds.
Season 3+ was made years later with modern production standards and lets the series really shine. I'm convinced if season's 1 and 2 had the same production quality, the anime would be as popular as the manga.
Yeah, I noticed that the anime improved its visuals a lot, but I always struggle with the "it gets good after X" argument when trying to convince people to watch something. But I think Kingdom is okay in arc 1 and really good from then on in the manga. Basically you can spend less time to get more engrossed, and swapping from manga to anime is always a hard sell so I didn't bother to say it in the video.
Season 2 already gets better quite a bit. Even season 1 is at least not atrocious, I've seen series with worse animation or CGI that I still enjoyed because the series were good and animation not downright aggressive to my eyes.
I love the Kingdom series even with its awful CG and honestly it would be one of my top 5 if they had better anime adaptions.
I love kingdom, but you can't compare the two. Those two wars are completely different. Kingdom does it so much better because it's 2 armies fighting. Naruto is 50 dudes vs an army. But those dudes all have tanks, and the allies are just poorly equipped foot soldiers.
The story telling is not the same, so idk how the comparison can be made.
Good video either way, cheers
Thanks. I think they're comparable due to the fact that there is a massive army on the side of the Allied Forces. And that's kind of my point, if you only had footsoldiers and were going up against tanks, wouldn't you try to strategize so your forces could more effectively take the tanks out? Especially when synced jutsu appears to be pretty effective. It's why I ask the question "why even have a war if it's underutilized?" I'd agree that it's different, and has distinct focus, but I do think that the aspects of what make it a war could be improved. Hence my video, I guess. Thanks for watching though, I'm happy you liked it.
@@feedjompo Tanks outright destroy infantry. I view the named characters as better equipped (basically just dudes with RPGs). The most infantry can do is combined small arms fire, so that the RPGs can hit the mark. I feel like the show did that decently well. More strategy would be nice, but were talking about INSANE firepower from the enemies.
You said that you weren't going to mispronounce the names.
I'm not going to feed you tonight.
But papa, I need sustenance.
channel died?
Would you believe I'm 7/10ths the way done with my next one? I ran into some I S S U E S and it froze progress for like 3 months.
do not believe the charleton