Some ruts in corners on MX tracks are too deep to properly lean the bike over. There literally isn't room for the foot on the inside peg and can cause you to jam your foot into the ground. Side note..Rodger Decoster was known for keeping his feet on the pegs in turns back in the 70's.
Some ruts in corners on MX tracks are too deep to properly lean the bike over. There literally isn't room for the foot on the inside peg and can cause you to jam your foot into the ground. (Corect ) But Not allways Did Roger do this for the verry reason Stated
@@jacobtebrake6734 Only if you're used to waving your leg in the air. It's a mental thing, you don't think you're good enough to keep your feet on the pegs and avoid injury so you wave your leg in the air. A rider confident in his skills can keep his feet on the pegs.
I don’t disagree, but I broke my fibula doing exactly that of keeping the foot on the peg. I am about 9 weeks out and just getting back to walking. I wouldn’t say there is a right or wrong. Just bad consequence either way.
As a long time MX rider, I did my first CC race last month. When I was going through the trails and passing people, I noticed that most would sit down to take a leg off. It seemed to cost them a bunch of time. Feet on the pegs and standing as much as I could helped me win that race. Now I'm not racing against Pro's and I'm a middle of the pack Vet B rider in MX. I was racing an Open AM class. It had kids and vet riders. Watching the A or Pro classes race, they def look more like MX riders than the B-C riders.
I ride nw. Woods n track, I noticed I flow faster with feet on pegs n standing thru turns compared to when I'm tired n sitting. A good set of aftermarket pegs will insure legs will stay more planted knees holding bike, so when u hit a rock root or run u can steer bike with knees and counter what bike wants to do. Good vid man.
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed the video! Our next test should be which technique is faster over the course of 30 minutes or 1 hour. It's hard to tell how big of a difference it truly makes just from one or two lap times, however over the course of an entire off-road race it could add up to be a significant difference.
I like your videos, short n to the point, try riding without sitting, I ride a cr500 so my back wheel always hunting for traction so riding in the attack position seems to help until I get tired...that's when the mistakes seem to happen
I'm in the first 25 hrs. of operation on a new 450, and I've noticed myself riding faster and more confidently now that the bike is dialed in for the terrain. I've been focusing on using the throttle to steer through corners more often, and keep my feet on the pegs. It's definitely given me confidence and I'm carrying more speed everywhere. If the bike is set up poorly, it's much harder to use this technique because it won't put the power down smoothly. Balance is soo important, and a bike that won't stay under you when pushed causes fatigue way faster.
Maybe one consideration too is keeping your foot/leg safe through the corner. Many years ago I was helping with the Idaho City ISDE grass track and was observing on a particular corner and I watched a guy ride into the rutted corner with feet on the pegs. Part way in the wall of the rut caught the guy’s toe and in the course of ripping his foot off the peg it twisted and busted his lower leg. I just happened to see the whole thing as it unfolded.
Yes, safety is always a big factor when considering both of these techniques. There are pros and cons to both techniques. Some would argue that by keeping your feet on the pegs you are less likely to catch your foot and twist your knee. Others debate that keeping your feet on the pegs can increase the risk of being caught. My opinion is that you always will run an inherent risk with pointing your leg through turns, but there are many times where I use my leg to catch myself from falling completely over. Yes I run the risk of injuring my knee, on the flip side you reduce the risk of injuring your shoulder/arm from a bigger tip over. No right answer, just different opinions. I think it's best to practice both techniques depending on how conducive the terrain is.
@igot2wheelissues ... yes, it could be that his toes were pointed down too much, but it could also be that he started to bobble in the corner and his natural reaction was to start taking his foot off the peg and along the way got snagged. Not sure. It was probably just a fluke injury. Most of them are.
I usually teach beginners riding with the leg out - and then later do as me, keeping the feet on the pegs in all easy turns ☝ but I still put the leg out in tricky turns, sweepers, and ruts (like most pros) where you foot could get pulled off or squashed by the track 👍
As a newer rider I appreciate this content. Most of what I've have been seeing is people say to keep your foot on the pegs, but most of these folks are also talking about motocross tracks. I do try to keep my feet on the pegs as much as possible but it's nice to not feel so bad if I point my leg out in the turn in case traction gets weird. Thanks
I have spent a lot of time practicing this technique and thinking about how it applies to off-road terrain. While riding a controlled environment and repeating the same lap over and over again, like on a motocross track, it is much easier to implement this technique. When riding slippery, hard packed off-road terrain that is highly unpredictable and your also interpreting the terrain for the first time while riding, it can be much more difficult to consistently keep your feet on the pegs.
I'm glad you did this video. All you gotta do is watch your favorite pro rider at a race - All of them WILL have a foot out in at least 80% of the corners around the track. The sharper and slower the corner is the more you need the inside foot out if you're leaning (Ruts or not). Next time you try this test, notice how your upper body loses counterbalancing ability. No doubt it's beneficial but there's a time and place for it.
We all ride at diffrent levels and as ruts get deeper it can be a challenge to keep foot on inside peg.. but bike control and confidence is paramount.. as we grow older we find the ground gets harder and we dont bounce quite as well..
I am 61 been riding since i was 12 and never put my leg out due to the time I did it i jamed my knee! If ya do it all the time it is second nature you do not think about it!! When you ride with your feet on the pag you take the corner a little wider keeping your speed consistent!!
very good vídeo. I'm re-learning to ride a dirt bike, so I can get rid of some bad habits, and this vídeo helped me realize that I have to keep my feet on the pegs, unless I feel unsafe. good vídeo, great info. cheers
Yap. Except when it's wise to pointing your leg through ruts and turns (eg: enduro/cross training). IMHO there's not one technic that fits all. Cheers mate (e um abraço de Lisboa).
I can visually see how much smoother your lap with feet on the pegs was compared to taking your foot off. I personally like to ride with feet on the pegs as much as I can, especially off road. I just feel like I have more control over the bike and myself that way.
At watching your vid, it looked to me that with the feet on the pegs you got less wheelspin/roost. I would call it a better drive out of a corner. Now I 'm thinking how the same test will turn out on a 4 stroke, where there is less wheelspin compared to a 2 stroke?? I am feeling a lot for the feet on the pegs on my 4 stroke, except slippery situations. This vid makes it undeniable clear why feet on the pegs! Thanks for this.
Yes, I would agree that by keeping feet on the pegs you increase your traction on corner exits and decrease wheel spin. One of the advantages of eliminating a movement from the cornering process. If executed properly it can be faster.
Your assesment at 11:00 When both laps slow down, the gap in terms of distance will always reduce, as the gap in time stays the same, but you travel slower, so it equals less distance. Then when you power out of the corner, the gap will grow again in terms of distance because the speed is higher and the same time difference equals more length. As you reduce your speed by about a factor 3, the gap will also diminish then grow by a factor 3. If you want to actually compare the laps you need to look at the speeds on a perpendicular line to the track.....or, you need to look at the time difference of the two laps. Not the speed, and not the distance alone. The time difference is calculated by dividing the distance by the speed between the two laps. (m divided by m/s = s ... or ft divided by ft/s = s)
So one thing I learned from a pro instructor was that pointing your leg out also adds much needed extra weight (from your leg) to help the front tire stick in the corner. I like both techniques and have done both but I find that foot out is far better just because of the weight up front and when in deep ruts.
Look at old photos of Marty Smith and Roger DeCoster and you normally see the leg extended way out and the upper body leaning forward. This transfers a lot of weight to the front wheel for traction. Many riders today extend the leg while the body leans back. Feet on the pegs allows the upper body to lean forward as needed while keeping the legs out of harms way. And on todays tracks you see much deeper ruts than forty years ago too. Feet up lets the foot get swept back and not jammed into terra firma.
This is a hot topic for MX our grandsons are racing now (3rd generation) and have been applying it a lot the 9 yr old is really good at it and feels comfy with both wheels drifting and doesn’t panic when it happens on his 65 the middle one 7 yrs is good at it but a this point it costs him some corner speed, but he’s really fast on his KTM 50 in the heat of a challenging moto the faster rut’s have revert to foot up for confidence.
Great video. I’m just a fire trail guy in nor cal but for years now I’ve tried to keep it feets up. I believe it’s because in my head that takes more skill/touch and it makes you have more skills
Good comparison. Foot forward originatses from speed way . The old speedway riders did leg trailing but in the 60s found foot foward was way more effective for higher drifting speeds Scrambling(later called MotoX )took it up specially when was really muddy . Which is very common here in the UK and Europe. The only place leg trailing is still used is ice speedway
I like you.👍🏻🥰😎 Very good analysis of the new normal. Most of us, I'm 61 born in 61, grew up with the toe point turning technique. But, there was a 4x World Champion MX racer named Harry Everts who was of the pioneering generation of moto when bikes had 4 to 6 inches of travel who stood up most of the time to save their spine, he taught his son Stefan who became a 10x World Champion the same technique. I never gave the feet up a moments notice until the TV broadcasts started hilighting Eli Tomac and Chase Sexton using the feet up style. Watching this video, Stefan came to mind. He knew something a decade ago about feet up on the MX tracks.. TH-cam some of his racing videos and you'll see what I mean. You're correct in that a mx track is more consistent plus it's a closed loop, you off road heroes are racing wide open wild terrain and trying to consciously keep feet in the pegs IMHO is recipe for disaster. I go back to my Gary Semics, Tony D School teaching, "STAND for balance, sit for TRACTION." BRAAAP on, brothers. 💪🏻🇺🇸🥰💖😎🇯🇲💪🏾
yeah.. it may differs according to the situation..? when other rider is very near my arcing area can we change the legs to the situations.. can you explain how to handle such situations.. as a beginner having doubts in this video...
It seems if you lose front or rear traction in a steep bank turn you potentially pin your inside leg if you go down, with the foot out you can push yourself back up or ditch if you have to.
Thanks for this video. I recently participated in Rally Of Himalayas 2023...nd I ran a goood 550 km of off-roading from sissu to kaza and return. Mostly i keppt my feet on the pegs with all terrain tyres and not the knobby ones...while worrying that other riders will be way ahead of me. In reality, I was having a good speed and hardly i had to put my feet strangelling in dirt for no reason. Do check my Kaza POV n crash and let me know what u think about it. 🦉
Nice video and well edited but I would like to point couple things about reading the data. When analysing recorded data you should compare times and maybe min/max speeds on some section of a track. Lets say from start of a corner to start of a next corner. If you just look that map you get false conclusion because slower you go, smaller the gap seems to be even tho the gap is same 0,3sec. And also when you compare speeds @ 9:51 you get again false conclusion because feet on pegs data is couple meters ahead, which means that you had little more time to accelerate. You should compare speeds at the same spot at the track. If we look data "correctly", pointing leg has speed 28.7mph compared to 28.1mph @feet on pegs in that particular spot. :)
Been told never put foot weight on inside of bike on turns you will slide foot on outside of bike butt off the seat or get bucked the tires are turning that is what u need to feel thats floating with the bike if it's sand I'm gonna put Any inside leg out started 1978 going on 52 age love how strong you young guys are love the video it's complicated but body English is key
I think if you are just isolating whether or not the leg comes upon the corner… you’re not going to see much of a difference. There’s a lot more than keeping your feet on the pegs as much as possible. There’s also an emphasis on riding on the balls of your feet, essentially shifting your lower body further over the rear wheel, break at the hips vs knees, unlocking at the hips and avoiding butt-tuck when sitting, maintaining upper-body integrity/stability and not letting the bike throw you around, etc. The leg still comes up in corners, but the emphasis is really only for the minimum amount of time possible. It’s all about controlling the rear of the bike as much as possible, and that’s best when your feet are on the pegs.
Pretty cool comparison I'm an older guy race Motocross when I was younger always was pointing leg. Got back into riding and now I'm trying to do feet on the pegs. I do believe with practice it's faster I believe you can get more traction to the rear wheel that way and in turn be able to put more power to the ground
It’s not new. Both are applicable depending on the conditions. Feet on the pegs is best for high speed corners unless your flat tracking. A deep berm requires you to get your leg up and out of the way plus added weight to the front wheel.
Feet on the pegs is more efficient can be applied anywhere however, there is time's when there is almost a flat track turn sometimes you need a foot out to balance but only applied in certain turns, obstacles, terrain. with feet on the pegs, elbows up, hip unlocked, standing makes for more efficiency and safety also with that technique your allowing more traction and stability for yourself and the bike. I have learned this technique way early thanks to the Likes of AJ Catanzaro, MX Factory, and Ryan Hughes. The Rider that we always think of with this technique is Eli Tomac. With his fitness combined, experience, and perfected the technique gave him the accolades he is credited to and currently in the lead for a championship. Feet on the pegs is a natural progression back to the roots of how we maneuver bicycles and it is a bulletproof technique.
I would say for speed, on the track, you keep your feet on.. i take my feet off and point like that on flat loose gravel, i dont know why either...? I guess i felt like i was putting weight on the front tire more?
Well its really a sitting or standing thing. You cant hang the leg out when you are standing! Euro riders have always preferred standing in turns, look at Stephan Everts or the bullet. In my case i cant stay standing for long, i am too unfit. So im not sure that feet up for me will help!
Don't over think it. Just do what feels right but obviously get your feet on the pegs as soon as possible so you can soak up the terrain with your legs.
not new my dad taught me this in the early 90's. but some ruts are too deep to keep feet on, thats the only time to take a foot off, and if your in that deep of a rut, you should have picked a different line...
Good stuff! Feet on both pegs as much as possible equates to more efficient riding overall. Racing is always a bit different t story though. I know that because we are stuck with a shifter on one side and rear brake on the other we r forced to be out of balance left to right when corneri g hard uphill or down etc. (Bicycle feet stay up more,we have total brake and acceleration control thru both turns) on a motorbike we either lose our ability to trailbrake while turning right or give up shifting g speed to the left, and any muscle pull/push to get that foot back on its peg requires time/energy and shouldn't upset the balance of the bike or your line, which again both require time/energy lost by the rider. Yes its all very small amounts but over time and distance and corners it does add up. It requires a different t line in most corners at speed, more like on snow or ice, bit more upright and more body movement fore/after to make up for the leg that's not swinging down to the I side and hopefully back in nice and clean.
Great video, but I believe this technique is a four stroke specific technique. The theory behind it has everything to to with four stroke engine braking and the transfer of weight to the front end from the engine braking during deceleration. With a two stroke your weight transfer with your leg weights the front end to increase front wheel traction. Two strokes don’t have much engine braking.
I think you traded intensity for intention on the corner exits, possibly because of how new and different this was for you. You had more focus on getting a good exit. Pair the focus with a better ability to force weight through your feet and I'm not surprised to see the speed delta.
Inside foot forward always seemed to help give me a bit more stability and confidence with the front end.. Perhaps it could make a small difference on bikes with slightly more rear weight bias? ...or maybe its purely a psychological nothing. I still dont know... it just feels like it helps and any confidence given is never a bad thing.
i point my leg because even if i lose a second here or there doing it. i saves me from losing 10 seconds from an unexpected fall . my leg has popped me back up so many times . i even seen pros that almost go down and that leg saves them
You should be measuring time difference on lit rather than distance. Because as you slow down distance will shrink but the lead time will stay the same.
Only in some corners, if you're not dragging a peg in a rutted 180 then you're not going fast enough. Plus you're limiting your weigh transfer by keeping feet on. A 2 lap comparison is not one. Watch fast 125 or 85 riders they carry more corner speed. True test run tight to mid figure 8's in soft ruts get you laps times for 30 laps, then you will see. Very little to no difference on open tracks, the difference comes on tight rutted tracks.
The reason this technique is an advantage now is pretty simple. The tracks and bikes have changed. Its always been an advantage to ride feet on the pegs standing up as much as possible. I been riding since 1984 and nothings changed in that aspect.. but the tracks are way more open than what they used to be. And then the smooth arcing turn of the 4stroke has made this more prevailant.. when you had sharper turns with peg dragging ruts and the 2strokes were more cut and thrust this technique was rarely an option without getting your feet ripped off the pegs. Even when riding on your toes. I would like to thinl my knowledge matters and is good because i have raced and been riding for almost 40 years. Alot of stuff i see are not new or ground breaking. Its just changes in tracks, machines, and other changes in the sport. Not that its something thats groundbreaking and new. It reminds me of the airforks.. i new it was a bad idea. I had them on a bike in the early 80's. I see alot of techniques brushed aside over the years. And they are still the best. Finger on the brake, finger on the clutch at all times. Elbows up . Head over the clamps. Techniques taught by gary bailey and gary semics all the way back. They still hold true today. "FEET ON THE PEGS".. I learned the hardway. Foot dragging and ruts equal "F'd up knees".
Seeing as the 'lap-times' could potentially be the same, I think 'on the pegs' is much safer , seems to be a tendency with all riders to 'correct' with a little dab here and there, which can break an ankle, knee, or leg, especially at speed. I've understood the leg-out to be a means of weighting the front, though after seeing another video on this issue, it seems that lately many have a different view of why the 'leg out front' in turns. I like using leg out front but consciously try to avoid any dabbing, and like to stand at times to avoid even thinking about it. lol
Nice vid! Is that data available? Corner speed and exit speed...corner speed and exit speed. FAR more important than any speed you have going into the corner. Just watch Jett and see how incredibly fast his corner and exit speed is.
No clue why I was recommended this video as I don't ride. Still an interesting video though! Maybe someone can add a little insight for me, coming into the video I was under impression that keeping your feet on the pegs would allow you to use your knees a bit like a shock absorber allowing you to keep your centre of mass more stable. Also sticking your leg out just seems like a good way to bust an ankle or knee if you hit a rut wrong, though I do understand how it would be beneficial at lower speeds off road to keep the bike up right at times.
I pretty much always ride feet on the pegs but there is times where foot out is faster, really tight corners with a skinny deep rut seems to help get the bike turned faster or if the ruts are really deep like folding a foot peg deep. I think the biggest issue I see is people that are just sticking a leg out as a habit or think they are suppose to usually newer riders, compared to in this video he does it at the correct time and uses it to shift his weight, just dangling it out there really is just useless.
Interesting. However you would need to make 50 laps for each technique to be able to say something as you had 1,5 secs difference with the pointing leg. Also, you need to add time difference, not only compare distances when comparing the lines. When riding on straights the same time difference will have longer distance between the bike positions as you go faster there.
Been riding motorcycles for 42 year total and feet on pegs is best way to control your bike with least energy output to performance and gained performance
I feel like it def depends on skill level... A newbie would NOT be able to ride any rut without their leg out... I would argue keeping your turning foot on the peg would result in a faster turn but there's so many variables... Also depends on whether you're hitting the outside berm or inside rut.
I really feel like it was line that made a difference, I'm a leg out rider unless it's chop in the corner then stand up but I don't like the look of that leg straight locked out like that, keep them knees bent fellas
Great vid , like that you use speed comparisons , completely disect the observed facts. Maybe if you used lines more suited for feet up , you would likely find it faster yet , and on 4 stroke with typically heavier front bias , more traction and engine braking would likely even be faster. One of the fastest local riders often can be seen standing on the bike under full power after apex , drifting both wheels from inside to out , maximizing corner speed at apex . Definitely feet up is not a technique for squaring off corners imo .
Feet on the pegs for me stand up almost everywere the fastest thing about pointing leg out is how quick you will need knee surgery just ask Shane Watts how many knee rebuilds he,s had not good . You can be faster feet up i find standing works for me . Interesting vid . 👍
I think that if you put your foot out in the corners it definitely throws off the balance of your bike but it also gives you a little bit more comfort as far as stability some Riders wouldn't feel as comfortable leaving their foot on the pegs if you watch some of the older professional Riders such as James Bubba Stewart or Ryan Villopoto you'll see that that some of their cornering speeds they don't take their foot off at all and they're extremely fast when I raced I always used to stick my foot out in the corner and it definitely slowed me down after I noticed that I was doing it I tried to correct myself and it definitely made a difference it is a little bit more uncomfortable because you don't have the sense of stability because you're going slow and it just feels more natural to take your foot off to stick it out try not to because it'll slow you down a little bit
It looks to me you have better drive out of the corners when you have feet on pegs. Although at that last very tight turn you did with feet on pegs right before the last two tables, it appeared you didn't fly into the corner as fast because you braked early knowing you couldn't take your foot off. In that scenario I think you would have been faster if you took it off. That's why I think there should be a mix of both. Compromise which turns are wide enough to stay on pegs and get big drive, and which turns you should take a foot off so you can fly into the corner faster.
why are most public tracks like this one? 90% of jumps are tabletops' no rhythm sections with whoops, doubles or triples-- nothing requiring any rhythm. its like the owner told the guy over-seeing the track construction " i dont care what you do as long as people can catch some air without any skills required to go fast enough to do so"
Not nearly enough data, each turn could vary for many other human reasons. Leg forward puts more weight in the front end for turning traction, and easily recovery in a washout too
It seemed like Jeremy McGrath and Ricky Carmichael didn't stick there feet as straight out as the Old School Riders ! I wish I would have ridden feet up because I blew up my left knee and I think I could have kept racing had I used a different technique !
For every motocross technique that you've seen done a million times by guys that win races, there's at least one guy out there that nobodies ever heard of, that's never rode A or even B moto riding up on an enduro bike who will tell you that that technique is incorrect or improper form. If you listen to him you might as well start dragging your leg behind you like Ronnie Mac.
Some ruts in corners on MX tracks are too deep to properly lean the bike over. There literally isn't room for the foot on the inside peg and can cause you to jam your foot into the ground.
Side note..Rodger Decoster was known for keeping his feet on the pegs in turns back in the 70's.
Some ruts in corners on MX tracks are too deep to properly lean the bike over. There literally isn't room for the foot on the inside peg and can cause you to jam your foot into the ground. (Corect ) But Not allways Did Roger do this for the verry reason Stated
I think it’s worth keeping the feet on the pegs from a safety standpoint aswell.. less chance of jamming or twisting a knee.
But more chance of a wash out and getting stuck under the bike and breaking a fibula or the whole leg.
@@jacobtebrake6734 Only if you're used to waving your leg in the air. It's a mental thing, you don't think you're good enough to keep your feet on the pegs and avoid injury so you wave your leg in the air.
A rider confident in his skills can keep his feet on the pegs.
I don’t disagree, but I broke my fibula doing exactly that of keeping the foot on the peg. I am about 9 weeks out and just getting back to walking. I wouldn’t say there is a right or wrong. Just bad consequence either way.
@@jacobtebrake6734 ITS COMMON SENSE, no leg u fall on your face
@@jacobtebrake6734 - Damn that sucks . . Be careful
As a long time MX rider, I did my first CC race last month. When I was going through the trails and passing people, I noticed that most would sit down to take a leg off. It seemed to cost them a bunch of time. Feet on the pegs and standing as much as I could helped me win that race. Now I'm not racing against Pro's and I'm a middle of the pack Vet B rider in MX. I was racing an Open AM class. It had kids and vet riders. Watching the A or Pro classes race, they def look more like MX riders than the B-C riders.
You running in the woods feet on the pegs and butt off the seat is what it takes for 2 hours plus.
@@greghamilton637 ??? I don’t understand the comment.
I ride nw. Woods n track, I noticed I flow faster with feet on pegs n standing thru turns compared to when I'm tired n sitting. A good set of aftermarket pegs will insure legs will stay more planted knees holding bike, so when u hit a rock root or run u can steer bike with knees and counter what bike wants to do. Good vid man.
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed the video! Our next test should be which technique is faster over the course of 30 minutes or 1 hour. It's hard to tell how big of a difference it truly makes just from one or two lap times, however over the course of an entire off-road race it could add up to be a significant difference.
I like your videos, short n to the point, try riding without sitting, I ride a cr500 so my back wheel always hunting for traction so riding in the attack position seems to help until I get tired...that's when the mistakes seem to happen
I'm in the first 25 hrs. of operation on a new 450, and I've noticed myself riding faster and more confidently now that the bike is dialed in for the terrain. I've been focusing on using the throttle to steer through corners more often, and keep my feet on the pegs. It's definitely given me confidence and I'm carrying more speed everywhere. If the bike is set up poorly, it's much harder to use this technique because it won't put the power down smoothly. Balance is soo important, and a bike that won't stay under you when pushed causes fatigue way faster.
Maybe one consideration too is keeping your foot/leg safe through the corner. Many years ago I was helping with the Idaho City ISDE grass track and was observing on a particular corner and I watched a guy ride into the rutted corner with feet on the pegs. Part way in the wall of the rut caught the guy’s toe and in the course of ripping his foot off the peg it twisted and busted his lower leg. I just happened to see the whole thing as it unfolded.
Yes, safety is always a big factor when considering both of these techniques. There are pros and cons to both techniques. Some would argue that by keeping your feet on the pegs you are less likely to catch your foot and twist your knee. Others debate that keeping your feet on the pegs can increase the risk of being caught. My opinion is that you always will run an inherent risk with pointing your leg through turns, but there are many times where I use my leg to catch myself from falling completely over. Yes I run the risk of injuring my knee, on the flip side you reduce the risk of injuring your shoulder/arm from a bigger tip over. No right answer, just different opinions. I think it's best to practice both techniques depending on how conducive the terrain is.
@igot2wheelissues ... yes, it could be that his toes were pointed down too much, but it could also be that he started to bobble in the corner and his natural reaction was to start taking his foot off the peg and along the way got snagged. Not sure. It was probably just a fluke injury. Most of them are.
I usually teach beginners riding with the leg out - and then later do as me, keeping the feet on the pegs in all easy turns ☝ but I still put the leg out in tricky turns, sweepers, and ruts (like most pros) where you foot could get pulled off or squashed by the track 👍
same
I think it depends on the time and place, been through rutted corners with both feet off the pegs
As a newer rider I appreciate this content. Most of what I've have been seeing is people say to keep your foot on the pegs, but most of these folks are also talking about motocross tracks. I do try to keep my feet on the pegs as much as possible but it's nice to not feel so bad if I point my leg out in the turn in case traction gets weird. Thanks
I have spent a lot of time practicing this technique and thinking about how it applies to off-road terrain. While riding a controlled environment and repeating the same lap over and over again, like on a motocross track, it is much easier to implement this technique. When riding slippery, hard packed off-road terrain that is highly unpredictable and your also interpreting the terrain for the first time while riding, it can be much more difficult to consistently keep your feet on the pegs.
I'm glad you did this video. All you gotta do is watch your favorite pro rider at a race - All of them WILL have a foot out in at least 80% of the corners around the track. The sharper and slower the corner is the more you need the inside foot out if you're leaning (Ruts or not). Next time you try this test, notice how your upper body loses counterbalancing ability. No doubt it's beneficial but there's a time and place for it.
Completely agree!
We all ride at diffrent levels and as ruts get deeper it can be a challenge to keep foot on inside peg.. but bike control and confidence is paramount.. as we grow older we find the ground gets harder and we dont bounce quite as well..
I am 61 been riding since i was 12 and never put my leg out due to the time I did it i jamed my knee! If ya do it all the time it is second nature you do not think about it!! When you ride with your feet on the pag you take the corner a little wider keeping your speed consistent!!
very good vídeo. I'm re-learning to ride a dirt bike, so I can get rid of some bad habits, and this vídeo helped me realize that I have to keep my feet on the pegs, unless I feel unsafe. good vídeo, great info. cheers
Yap. Except when it's wise to pointing your leg through ruts and turns (eg: enduro/cross training). IMHO there's not one technic that fits all.
Cheers mate (e um abraço de Lisboa).
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed the video!
I can visually see how much smoother your lap with feet on the pegs was compared to taking your foot off. I personally like to ride with feet on the pegs as much as I can, especially off road. I just feel like I have more control over the bike and myself that way.
At watching your vid, it looked to me that with the feet on the pegs you got less wheelspin/roost. I would call it a better drive out of a corner.
Now I 'm thinking how the same test will turn out on a 4 stroke, where there is less wheelspin compared to a 2 stroke??
I am feeling a lot for the feet on the pegs on my 4 stroke, except slippery situations. This vid makes it undeniable clear why feet on the pegs! Thanks for this.
Yes, I would agree that by keeping feet on the pegs you increase your traction on corner exits and decrease wheel spin. One of the advantages of eliminating a movement from the cornering process. If executed properly it can be faster.
@@ridewiththeknights an additional you are more gently with the throttle because you dont have your leg as safety when you are to aggressiv...
Your assesment at 11:00 When both laps slow down, the gap in terms of distance will always reduce, as the gap in time stays the same, but you travel slower, so it equals less distance.
Then when you power out of the corner, the gap will grow again in terms of distance because the speed is higher and the same time difference equals more length.
As you reduce your speed by about a factor 3, the gap will also diminish then grow by a factor 3.
If you want to actually compare the laps you need to look at the speeds on a perpendicular line to the track.....or, you need to look at the time difference of the two laps. Not the speed, and not the distance alone. The time difference is calculated by dividing the distance by the speed between the two laps. (m divided by m/s = s ... or ft divided by ft/s = s)
So one thing I learned from a pro instructor was that pointing your leg out also adds much needed extra weight (from your leg) to help the front tire stick in the corner. I like both techniques and have done both but I find that foot out is far better just because of the weight up front and when in deep ruts.
Look at old photos of Marty Smith and Roger DeCoster and you normally see the leg extended way out and the upper body leaning forward. This transfers a lot of weight to the front wheel for traction. Many riders today extend the leg while the body leans back. Feet on the pegs allows the upper body to lean forward as needed while keeping the legs out of harms way. And on todays tracks you see much deeper ruts than forty years ago too. Feet up lets the foot get swept back and not jammed into terra firma.
This is a hot topic for MX our grandsons are racing now (3rd generation) and have been applying it a lot the 9 yr old is really good at it and feels comfy with both wheels drifting and doesn’t panic when it happens on his 65 the middle one 7 yrs is good at it but a this point it costs him some corner speed, but he’s really fast on his KTM 50 in the heat of a challenging moto the faster rut’s have revert to foot up for confidence.
Great video. I’m just a fire trail guy in nor cal but for years now I’ve tried to keep it feets up. I believe it’s because in my head that takes more skill/touch and it makes you have more skills
Good comparison.
Foot forward originatses from speed way .
The old speedway riders did leg trailing but in the 60s found foot foward was way more effective for higher drifting speeds
Scrambling(later called MotoX )took it up specially when was really muddy .
Which is very common here in the UK and Europe.
The only place leg trailing is still used is ice speedway
I like you.👍🏻🥰😎 Very good analysis of the new normal. Most of us, I'm 61 born in 61, grew up with the toe point turning technique.
But, there was a 4x World Champion MX racer named Harry Everts who was of the pioneering generation of moto when bikes had 4 to 6 inches of travel who stood up most of the time to save their spine, he taught his son Stefan who became a 10x World Champion the same technique. I never gave the feet up a moments notice until the TV broadcasts started hilighting Eli Tomac and Chase Sexton using the feet up style.
Watching this video, Stefan came to mind. He knew something a decade ago about feet up on the MX tracks.. TH-cam some of his racing videos and you'll see what I mean.
You're correct in that a mx track is more consistent plus it's a closed loop, you off road heroes are racing wide open wild terrain and trying to consciously keep feet in the pegs IMHO is recipe for disaster.
I go back to my Gary Semics, Tony D School teaching, "STAND for balance, sit for TRACTION."
BRAAAP on, brothers.
💪🏻🇺🇸🥰💖😎🇯🇲💪🏾
yeah.. it may differs according to the situation..? when other rider is very near my arcing area can we change the legs to the situations.. can you explain how to handle such situations.. as a beginner having doubts in this video...
It seems if you lose front or rear traction in a steep bank turn you potentially pin your inside leg if you go down, with the foot out you can push yourself back up or ditch if you have to.
I've caught my foot on so many things especially off road riding I always want to stick it out and catch myself.
It worked for Stephen Everts and he was rather handy on a bike
Thanks for this video. I recently participated in Rally Of Himalayas 2023...nd I ran a goood 550 km of off-roading from sissu to kaza and return. Mostly i keppt my feet on the pegs with all terrain tyres and not the knobby ones...while worrying that other riders will be way ahead of me. In reality, I was having a good speed and hardly i had to put my feet strangelling in dirt for no reason. Do check my Kaza POV n crash and let me know what u think about it. 🦉
Nice video and well edited but I would like to point couple things about reading the data. When analysing recorded data you should compare times and maybe min/max speeds on some section of a track. Lets say from start of a corner to start of a next corner. If you just look that map you get false conclusion because slower you go, smaller the gap seems to be even tho the gap is same 0,3sec. And also when you compare speeds @ 9:51 you get again false conclusion because feet on pegs data is couple meters ahead, which means that you had little more time to accelerate. You should compare speeds at the same spot at the track. If we look data "correctly", pointing leg has speed 28.7mph compared to 28.1mph @feet on pegs in that particular spot. :)
Anyone who was fortunate enough to see Bob Hannah race during the 70's would notice that his feet never came off the pegs
Been told never put foot weight on inside of bike on turns you will slide foot on outside of bike butt off the seat or get bucked the tires are turning that is what u need to feel thats floating with the bike if it's sand I'm gonna put Any inside leg out started 1978 going on 52 age love how strong you young guys are love the video it's complicated but body English is key
I think if you are just isolating whether or not the leg comes upon the corner… you’re not going to see much of a difference. There’s a lot more than keeping your feet on the pegs as much as possible.
There’s also an emphasis on riding on the balls of your feet, essentially shifting your lower body further over the rear wheel, break at the hips vs knees, unlocking at the hips and avoiding butt-tuck when sitting, maintaining upper-body integrity/stability and not letting the bike throw you around, etc.
The leg still comes up in corners, but the emphasis is really only for the minimum amount of time possible. It’s all about controlling the rear of the bike as much as possible, and that’s best when your feet are on the pegs.
Ive always rode my bike on both pegs, my friends asked me if i ever feel like ima tip over , but on those sections i do put my foot out
Pretty cool comparison I'm an older guy race Motocross when I was younger always was pointing leg. Got back into riding and now I'm trying to do feet on the pegs. I do believe with practice it's faster I believe you can get more traction to the rear wheel that way and in turn be able to put more power to the ground
It’s not new. Both are applicable depending on the conditions. Feet on the pegs is best for high speed corners unless your flat tracking. A deep berm requires you to get your leg up and out of the way plus added weight to the front wheel.
Do you like that gear? I just bought the same set gonna tedt it out tomorrow. Seems to be the most minimalist comfortable pants I have ever worn.
Feet on the pegs is more efficient can be applied anywhere however, there is time's when there is almost a flat track turn sometimes you need a foot out to balance but only applied in certain turns, obstacles, terrain. with feet on the pegs, elbows up, hip unlocked, standing makes for more efficiency and safety also with that technique your allowing more traction and stability for yourself and the bike. I have learned this technique way early thanks to the Likes of AJ Catanzaro, MX Factory, and Ryan Hughes. The Rider that we always think of with this technique is Eli Tomac. With his fitness combined, experience, and perfected the technique gave him the accolades he is credited to and currently in the lead for a championship.
Feet on the pegs is a natural progression back to the roots of how we maneuver bicycles and it is a bulletproof technique.
Great video , thanks for that input I'm gonna try this out .... keep racing
I would say for speed, on the track, you keep your feet on.. i take my feet off and point like that on flat loose gravel, i dont know why either...? I guess i felt like i was putting weight on the front tire more?
Well its really a sitting or standing thing. You cant hang the leg out when you are standing! Euro riders have always preferred standing in turns, look at Stephan Everts or the bullet. In my case i cant stay standing for long, i am too unfit. So im not sure that feet up for me will help!
There is this guy, stefan everts...who did this 30 years ago😀
Don't over think it. Just do what feels right but obviously get your feet on the pegs as soon as possible so you can soak up the terrain with your legs.
If you got the balance but most will eventually wash out. Carmichael was talking at i think redbud how much balance it takes to stay on the pegs
not new my dad taught me this in the early 90's. but some ruts are too deep to keep feet on, thats the only time to take a foot off, and if your in that deep of a rut, you should have picked a different line...
Good stuff! Feet on both pegs as much as possible equates to more efficient riding overall. Racing is always a bit different t story though.
I know that because we are stuck with a shifter on one side and rear brake on the other we r forced to be out of balance left to right when corneri g hard uphill or down etc. (Bicycle feet stay up more,we have total brake and acceleration control thru both turns) on a motorbike we either lose our ability to trailbrake while turning right or give up shifting g speed to the left, and any muscle pull/push to get that foot back on its peg requires time/energy and shouldn't upset the balance of the bike or your line, which again both require time/energy lost by the rider. Yes its all very small amounts but over time and distance and corners it does add up. It requires a different t line in most corners at speed, more like on snow or ice, bit more upright and more body movement fore/after to make up for the leg that's not swinging down to the I side and hopefully back in nice and clean.
Great video, but I believe this technique is a four stroke specific technique. The theory behind it has everything to to with four stroke engine braking and the transfer of weight to the front end from the engine braking during deceleration. With a two stroke your weight transfer with your leg weights the front end to increase front wheel traction. Two strokes don’t have much engine braking.
I kind of new into dirt. What is the purpose o pointing your foot out?
I think you traded intensity for intention on the corner exits, possibly because of how new and different this was for you. You had more focus on getting a good exit. Pair the focus with a better ability to force weight through your feet and I'm not surprised to see the speed delta.
Inside foot forward always seemed to help give me a bit more stability and confidence with the front end..
Perhaps it could make a small difference on bikes with slightly more rear weight bias?
...or maybe its purely a psychological nothing. I still dont know... it just feels like it helps and any confidence given is never a bad thing.
Should do a sitting/standing lap time comparison.
i point my leg because even if i lose a second here or there doing it. i saves me from losing 10 seconds from an unexpected fall . my leg has popped me back up so many times . i even seen pros that almost go down and that leg saves them
Very difficult for me being a pitbike racer and bikes are 3 sizes too small but im still flyin pointing most of the time. Haha
Foot out is a comfortable feeling it's a counter balance but lose of traction like both techniques r most good
You should be measuring time difference on lit rather than distance. Because as you slow down distance will shrink but the lead time will stay the same.
Only in some corners, if you're not dragging a peg in a rutted 180 then you're not going fast enough. Plus you're limiting your weigh transfer by keeping feet on. A 2 lap comparison is not one. Watch fast 125 or 85 riders they carry more corner speed. True test run tight to mid figure 8's in soft ruts get you laps times for 30 laps, then you will see. Very little to no difference on open tracks, the difference comes on tight rutted tracks.
Looks like your riding a Sherco se 300 r ? Nice to see someone good driving a motocross course.
The reason this technique is an advantage now is pretty simple. The tracks and bikes have changed. Its always been an advantage to ride feet on the pegs standing up as much as possible. I been riding since 1984 and nothings changed in that aspect.. but the tracks are way more open than what they used to be. And then the smooth arcing turn of the 4stroke has made this more prevailant.. when you had sharper turns with peg dragging ruts and the 2strokes were more cut and thrust this technique was rarely an option without getting your feet ripped off the pegs. Even when riding on your toes. I would like to thinl my knowledge matters and is good because i have raced and been riding for almost 40 years. Alot of stuff i see are not new or ground breaking. Its just changes in tracks, machines, and other changes in the sport. Not that its something thats groundbreaking and new. It reminds me of the airforks.. i new it was a bad idea. I had them on a bike in the early 80's.
I see alot of techniques brushed aside over the years. And they are still the best. Finger on the brake, finger on the clutch at all times. Elbows up . Head over the clamps. Techniques taught by gary bailey and gary semics all the way back. They still hold true today. "FEET ON THE PEGS".. I learned the hardway. Foot dragging and ruts equal "F'd up knees".
Seeing as the 'lap-times' could potentially be the
same, I think 'on the pegs' is much safer , seems to be
a tendency with all riders to 'correct' with a little dab here
and there, which can break an ankle, knee, or leg, especially
at speed. I've understood the leg-out to be a means of weighting
the front, though after seeing another video on this issue, it
seems that lately many have a different view of why the 'leg out front'
in turns. I like using leg out front but consciously try to avoid any dabbing,
and like to stand at times to avoid even thinking about it. lol
Nice vid! Is that data available? Corner speed and exit speed...corner speed and exit speed. FAR more important than any speed you have going into the corner. Just watch Jett and see how incredibly fast his corner and exit speed is.
i wonder how physical and mental energy excursion comes into play and which one wears you out sooner
Very good explanation, thank you
A video about steering stabilizer and not having one?
No clue why I was recommended this video as I don't ride. Still an interesting video though! Maybe someone can add a little insight for me, coming into the video I was under impression that keeping your feet on the pegs would allow you to use your knees a bit like a shock absorber allowing you to keep your centre of mass more stable. Also sticking your leg out just seems like a good way to bust an ankle or knee if you hit a rut wrong, though I do understand how it would be beneficial at lower speeds off road to keep the bike up right at times.
Its indeed safer to keep both feets on the pegs. Many riders have learned this the hard way and destroyed knees and ankles…
I pretty much always ride feet on the pegs but there is times where foot out is faster, really tight corners with a skinny deep rut seems to help get the bike turned faster or if the ruts are really deep like folding a foot peg deep. I think the biggest issue I see is people that are just sticking a leg out as a habit or think they are suppose to usually newer riders, compared to in this video he does it at the correct time and uses it to shift his weight, just dangling it out there really is just useless.
Interesting. However you would need to make 50 laps for each technique to be able to say something as you had 1,5 secs difference with the pointing leg.
Also, you need to add time difference, not only compare distances when comparing the lines. When riding on straights the same time difference will have longer distance between the bike positions as you go faster there.
Been riding motorcycles for 42 year total and feet on pegs is best way to control your bike with least energy output to performance and gained performance
I feel like it def depends on skill level... A newbie would NOT be able to ride any rut without their leg out... I would argue keeping your turning foot on the peg would result in a faster turn but there's so many variables... Also depends on whether you're hitting the outside berm or inside rut.
I gotta try these when I learn to ride soon 😎
Short answers yes it's works because it helps with balancing and when you are about to fall you kick the ground to bring yourself back up
I really feel like it was line that made a difference, I'm a leg out rider unless it's chop in the corner then stand up but I don't like the look of that leg straight locked out like that, keep them knees bent fellas
how you like that sherco? i dig em
What is this shot on? Gopro 10?
Great vid , like that you use speed comparisons , completely disect the observed facts. Maybe if you used lines more suited for feet up , you would likely find it faster yet , and on 4 stroke with typically heavier front bias , more traction and engine braking would likely even be faster. One of the fastest local riders often can be seen standing on the bike under full power after apex , drifting both wheels from inside to out , maximizing corner speed at apex . Definitely feet up is not a technique for squaring off corners imo .
Feet on the pegs for me stand up almost everywere the fastest thing about pointing leg out is how quick you will need knee surgery just ask Shane Watts how many knee rebuilds he,s had not good . You can be faster feet up i find standing works for me . Interesting vid . 👍
I think that if you put your foot out in the corners it definitely throws off the balance of your bike but it also gives you a little bit more comfort as far as stability some Riders wouldn't feel as comfortable leaving their foot on the pegs if you watch some of the older professional Riders such as James Bubba Stewart or Ryan Villopoto you'll see that that some of their cornering speeds they don't take their foot off at all and they're extremely fast when I raced I always used to stick my foot out in the corner and it definitely slowed me down after I noticed that I was doing it I tried to correct myself and it definitely made a difference it is a little bit more uncomfortable because you don't have the sense of stability because you're going slow and it just feels more natural to take your foot off to stick it out try not to because it'll slow you down a little bit
It looks to me you have better drive out of the corners when you have feet on pegs. Although at that last very tight turn you did with feet on pegs right before the last two tables, it appeared you didn't fly into the corner as fast because you braked early knowing you couldn't take your foot off. In that scenario I think you would have been faster if you took it off. That's why I think there should be a mix of both. Compromise which turns are wide enough to stay on pegs and get big drive, and which turns you should take a foot off so you can fly into the corner faster.
Best rider in the country rides with feet on pegs..
why are most public tracks like this one? 90% of jumps are tabletops' no rhythm sections with whoops, doubles or triples-- nothing requiring any rhythm. its like the owner told the guy over-seeing the track construction " i dont care what you do as long as people can catch some air without any skills required to go fast enough to do so"
I think taking the corners with the leg out is mental: it gives you some sense of security.
RON TURNER rode feet on the pegs most of the time ! So did TRIPES
Ask Everts
Feet on pegs and standing in turns was mastered by Stephan Evertz.
What track is this?
I think you need short sector for comparison, not full lap.
And after watching this video till the end, you have done it))
First slo mo why would you ever stay seated and on the pegs? If you’re staying on the pegs shouldn’t you always be standing?
Not nearly enough data, each turn could vary for many other human reasons. Leg forward puts more weight in the front end for turning traction, and easily recovery in a washout too
It seemed like Jeremy McGrath and Ricky Carmichael didn't stick there feet as straight out as the Old School Riders ! I wish I would have ridden feet up because I blew up my left knee and I think I could have kept racing had I used a different technique !
Everyone knows that dragging your toe is fastest ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️
6 or 9 seconds faster to be exact.
I only lift a foot off the pegs in emergencys . to ensure max weight on the off side . Dirt & road bikes
Nothing new here ,but ya keep your feet on the pegs as much as you can
I learn if you mix the two i works best for me
Yeah but the leg out looks way cooler
“new motocross technique” woods guys: am i a joke to you?😂
It's much faster to stand in turns. Riding a husqvarna tx 300 makes it even easier
Feet on standing up, feet on pegs sitting down. Pointing toe. Imo depends on corner.
For what it's worth, I noticed you shift your body further forward while pointing your leg.
Bent Aberg raced with his feet on the pegs...... 1967/1978
It works better with four strokes . Less shifting
For every motocross technique that you've seen done a million times by guys that win races, there's at least one guy out there that nobodies ever heard of, that's never rode A or even B moto riding up on an enduro bike who will tell you that that technique is incorrect or improper form. If you listen to him you might as well start dragging your leg behind you like Ronnie Mac.
Marty Smith rode with feet on pegs shifting thru the corners. Not a new technique. That was back in the seventies. RIP Marty
When you do put your leg out you should be pointing your toe inward as well. 😅