What Bojack Horseman Teaches Us About Writing Endings
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
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Come check the writing behind the last two episodes of Bojack Horseman.
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This took a bit longer than expected to put out, but I hope you guys enjoy!! Who doesn't want three Bojack videos in a row haha?
I love the fact that I wrote a writerly text in my own Isekai, where I explore the aspect of ‘Identity’ and ‘Self’ of a human being. What makes us who we and does it even matter?
I also like how this show turned into a proper tragedy I can get behind. An action he took and had full self-awareness of ends up being his biggest regret.
Look up the lyrics for Life Underground by The Amity Affliction. That song is essentially your editors interpretation
I just got this from google: The cardinal bird
Red is a color of love, passion and devotion. Therefore, a red bird represents the same. Unlike migratory birds, red cardinals do not go away for winter. ... A cardinal may symbolize the fire of life that burns within our souls, even in the darkest and coldest times.
First off, I love your reviews on the show, they're fantastic. But, Since you enjoyed this ending (like many others), do you think it would be wrong to continue the show? I asked this because, the ceo of the company that animates bojack horseman, said that they're open for another discussion about whether or not to continue the show with Netflix. If this happened, would you be okay with them restarting the series?
"But isn't the point of art less what people put into it and more what people get out of it?" -Todd Chavez
This fits perfectly
I guess they put in this quote after there were discussions about the meaning of the episode in their office
This reminds me of the Legend of Korra scandal, where the ending was "thoroughly" confirmed by the authors, to the point of the audience going nazist and literally proclaiming: "Your ideas, your opinions, your doubts are no longer valid or needed, because a CANON was confirmed". And that's the very opposite of the world of fiction. It's like trying to turn fiction into the "flat earth" scandal. It's like trying to protect your Intellectual Property.
Bojack truly was "for the viewer", and the author was having fun. And can there be any more explicit explanation as to why was the show cancelled? A favorite show of the NETFLIX CEO? Because THIS APPROACH is NO LONGER SUPPORTED by the "free world of paid propaganda". 2020 here we come, it's been a long way.
Pretty sure this was a joke about Todd's personality and stupidity. He's just coughing up a popular phrase when it's convenient to the conversation. He's Todd, there's no deep meaning to it unless you yourself give it deep meaning, which ironically means you're proving the statement is true in your case.
Todd summarizing Barthes' death of the author theory lol
Sarah Lynn was changing ages throughout the episode because bojack knew her at all stages of her life
To add on, Bojack also brought Sarah Lynn to the house because he was the one that led her to her death.
I was really surprised that he wasn't aware of this interpretation or about the bird in the house because most of those details are being discussed in depth on the BJH subreddit.
The artist or whoever wanted Herb and Beatrice to age too but (I think) RBW told her that's too much (man) so only Sarah Lynn ages. Beatrice is seen old once later in the episode as well
Was searching for this comment!
I think it was because she died when she was 30 but her death truly started when she was a child, being molested literally (by her stepfather) and metaphorically (by Hollywood)
For me, Diane's line that "Sometimes life's a bitch and you keep on living," is the show's thesis. The show doesn't give us a neat ending because life isn't neat. And he didn't get an entirely happy ending. He acknowledges that there's a strong possibility of him relapsing once he doesn't have the structure prison provides. Hollyhock may never want a relationship with him again. Diane didn't invite him to her wedding as PC did and I do think it's the last time that they talk. But if it's not a happy ending, it's also got some hope. Mister PB is still his friend. PC and Diane found people who make them happy. He reconciled with Diane over his last call to her. Todd points out that even if he lapses back into addiction, he can try to get sober again. Things are cyclical but you keep moving forward. That was my takeaway from the show and I thought they did a great job being realistic about all of it and exploring that.
Yes I very much agree, was about to write something along these lines. I really like Diane's quote
I don’t know how anyone could interpret it any other way. ‘Savage books’ has been watching too many Christopher Nolan movies.
Thats my favorite quote. Its really how life is and when you've done so many wrongs over so long, the consequences can take just as long to play out.
I very much agree. Life, you wake up one day, you still have your past, and You can choose if you do good things or bad things, or none. Stuff happens. Then another day...
The show is literally one of the best shows about mental illness and addiction because of that line...Ugh the fact it is over sucks
"One time, a fan asked me, 'Hey, um, you know that episode where the horse has to give Ethan a pep talk after Ethan finds out his crush only asked him to the dance because her friends were having a dorkiest date contest? In all the shots of the horse, you can see a paper coffee cup on the kitchen counter, but in the shots of Ethan, the coffee cup’s missing. Was that because the show was making a statement about the fluctuant subjectivity of memory and how even two people can experience the same moment in entirely different ways?'
And I didn’t have the heart to be, like, 'No, man, some crew guy just left their coffee cup in the shot.' So instead, I was, like… 'Yeah.'"
Erik Romão That's it. That's the ending. Back in the 90s, Bojack was in a very famous TV show that nobody cares about and he was kind of a dick who eventually faded into obscurity after getting cancelled. Now he makes shitty horny unicorn movies.
"Death of the Author" and all that
- Perfect quote to sum up the video
- Bonus points for correctly using quotes within the quote
Lmao i forgot about that. Occam's razor
Isn't the point of art less about what people put into it and more about what people get out of it?
I'm curious as to why so many people wanted bojack to die. So much so, that they stitch episodes together and come up with their own head cannon that makes this the case. However, the actual ending that we got is so much better and closer to how life actually works. There rarely are definitive endings in life and the final moments in bojack really reinforce that. Just like Diane's quote that "lifes a bitch but sometimes you keep on living". This is bojacks tale in a nutshell and a narrative I personally like so much better than simply: he dies because this is the last episode. The end. That seems way to much of an easy out/typical tv trope and I really like the idea that bojack makes mistakes and, like the rest of us, has to live with, emotionally deal with and just keep going on.
I don't get it either, honestly, Imo Bojack dying would ruin the message of the show. It's like saying no matter what you do, life will eventually beat it out of you. "Life's a bitch, and then you die."
Bojack surviving, and then still need to persist, is such a better message. ("Life's a bitch but sometimes you keep on living") It's like Todd says, you get out, and then you break your previous record. There are no promises in life, but you got to keep trying. It's always been the message of the show, or at least what I've always gotten from the show.
TFfan665 yeah I think while it may have been emotionally powerful as an ending for the character I don’t think it would correctly have lined up with the philosophy and character journey of the show. I have more to say but it’s so long I think it should be it’s own comment
As someone who has dealt with depression and suicide, I HATE the idea of Bojack dying in the end. As mentioned in the video, it's a horrible message. And imo, would just be shocking and edgy for the sake of making people who haven't dealt with suicide and depression feel bad and like they're special for thinking it's sad (like a certain other Netflix show).
That's why I think he lived and am so satisfied with the ending. To me, it gives the message we may not want to hear but need to hear- sometimes life isn't amazing and grand and you don't get your huge movie star redemption arc. But there are little things, and that is what you need to keep fighting for. Just like how in TVFHD, Herb says he chose to live just because he wanted to watch a sports team and that was good enough. That's all he needed. Secretariat says he wished he didn't care so much.
Bojack is such a good series imo because it treats mental health and substance abuse very seriously and maturely. It doesn't sugar coat it for inspiration porn, but also doesn't play on shock value to guilt trip the viewers. It plays it like how it actually is.
"Sometimes life's a bitch and you keep on living."
I actually really liked the ending. One of my favorite parts was the joke bojack told to diane about the movie night in prison. It pretty much told us bojack is still plotting and it still backfires. Hes the same person and it told me bojacks gonna be alright. Best show
I cant speak for everyone, but for me, it's not that I liked this ending less but rather, I would've been absolutely ok if episode 15 was the last episode
I liked this ending. I do believe it left a bit to be desired, but it all came full circle. Bojack hit his absolute low point, but awoke to the fact that giving up on life is not an answer. Afterwards he went to jail and seemingly lost a few friends (like Diane&PC), and finally chose to walk down a better, yet imperfect path.
Jong dae every day I think that PC will still remain friends. She just realized that she needed to end her relationship as his agent/manager bc she ended up being an enabler. That is why she said she could recommend some good ppl when the were dancing.
the problem I have with this interpretation is that over the course the 6 seasons he reached his lowest point time and time again. multiple times he truly tried to improve and leave his past behind. we've seen this when he started jogging, when he started acting in a tv show again, when he went to rehab and when he became a professor. how are we supposed to believe that this is the time he REALLY turns his life around? idk but it's a boy cried wolf situation. fool me once, fair enough. but fool me 5 times and I'll stop giving a shit.
in fairness to the writers: if they had had more time (like 4-5 episodes) I think we would've gotten a much more satisfying ending.
Yeah him and PC did seem like they were ok at the end, they just lost some of that interdependence.
Also, I agree with showing bojack hit his lowest point over and over got repetitive. It's like he really didn't try to change even though he kept saying he wanted to.
I think that's why him finally almost dying is so important. He's tried to kill himself before but this time he really wrestled with his mortality. Maybe that's what he needed. And no the show assumes that he will eff up again--that's what Todd says about the Hokey Pokey. The point that he makes is life is full of ups and downs and there isn't one right answer (like dying) You try and you fail and then you turn yourself around
frank unodostres That's kind of the point. Self improvement and recovery is not a one and done thing. It is very much a boy who cried wolf scenerio. That's what made the ending so great. Because it was so realistic and relatable.
Sometimes you start doing good in life and you relaspe.
Sometimes you start doing good in life, but your past mistakes catch up with you and pull you down.
The show kinda would've cheapened it's message if the ending was just a happy one or if Bojack just died. A constant theme throughout the show is that there are no endings in life. Life goes on. It goes on and on until it doesn't and you're dead
"You never get a happy ending because there's always more show"
-Bojack
And then the flip side of that
Life is a bitch and then you die
"...Somtimes life is a bitch and you keep living"
-Diane
You're not supposed to truly believe that this time Bojack is gonna be alright. You never know when someone trying to recover is gonna finally make that one great big break through. What we do know is that before the final episode, Bojack tried to be better a d he was doing good for a bit. We know how much he's grown as a person. We know that Bojack has the tools to move forward and hopefully, he carves himself out a good life.
@@EggEnjoyer exactly! Well said
I really don't like any interpretation that involves Bojack dying, I think it's unsatisfying and runs totally counter to the rest of the show. The show is all about the morning after, that there are no clean-cut sitcom endings in life. Going on an alcohol and drug fueled bender and dying in a mansion is way too rockstar, and turns Bojack into something of a martyr. Having him wake, and have to face the consequences of his actions in life for real is way more meaningful to me. There's also the idea present that he's definitely not over his struggle, that our internal turmoil may never go away, like when he says to Todd he may relapse again, and Todd simply says "then you'll get sober again." This is backed up by Diane, being in probably the best place in her life, still having a smoking problem, and admitting to still having bad days. Bojack's journey of being a good person isn't over, because it will never be over, he's going to have struggles, but there's hope for him. I like that so much more than he just fucked everything up because his past came back to haunt him and aren't we so very dark and cynical. Honestly, I think that's rubbish.
Agreed. I really cringed at all his fan theories implying Bojack just died there in the pool, and the final episode is all in his head. He’s acting like BJ got off easy in the end, but honestly I think he had it *worse* by having to live through the consequences of his actions. Having him die in the pool there would spoil what I thought was an incredible message, and perfect send-off to the series
I could be giving too much credit, but I think the ending was purposefully unfulfilling and simple. I've seen people complain "we didn't find out what happened to Gina or Penny or Hollyhock!" and I felt that was the point? They're out of Bojack's life, and he - nor we as the audience - get that closure (think this is also why they chose to not show the contents of the letter). Bojack has always been a show with a theme of playing out life in comparison to fiction: consequences, the unavoidable passage of time, etc. That happens sometimes. We have ex-best friends and ex-lovers and they move on and we never find out what became of them.
Also yeah I h a t e the idea of him having died. It feels to me like people just want this grand dramatic ending and hate that the canon answer is... he had a relapse and recovered. Life goes on. But again, I think that's the point. And it's ironic people reject it in favour of a TV show ending: Bojack died, it was tragic, and the ending is just a symbolic fever dream.
We really do fetishise our own sadness.
(Not to mention what was said in the video - it's an awful awful and dangerous message. Relapses WILL happen no matter who you are and how committed you are to recovery. And I hate that people are basically saying Bojack needed to be punished for a relapse when he was doing so well (really by Bojack standards) all season).
I thought he would die because I thought it was going to tell a story that you can have many second chances in life, but there’s going to be one time where you won’t come back. Especially if a lot of the problems are caused by you.
@@NerdMiGerd totally agree.
@@davemillerirl I don't think that's giving too much credit. I think all of that totally tracks.
I like the fact that the ending displayed one of the key themes of the show: life doesn't have closure. Leave the audience wanting more
It's funny to me how this entire show was built around the concept that real life doesn't have nice little story book endings with closure and some big finish and yet SO many fans are complaining that this show didn't end with a big flourish
Bojack emulates real life, there is no grand finish, sometimes awkward small talk is how friendships end. There is no grand movie star speech, no ham fisted message about treasuring life after a near death experience, Bojack is sincere till the very end. Life is mundane, life is short, life doesn't give you closure, this was a perfect ending for a perfect depiction of a depressed alcoholic. Sometimes life's a bitch and you keep on living.
Wow, you took the last episode as Bojack making amends??? I took it as him expecting to make amends and finding out all his friends have moved on, become better people, and are happier without him.
Exactly, if we ever EVER got a S7 I don’t think BoJack would even be in LA. I think he’d move to NYC while we follow the others in LA
He made amends but it was a part of moving on, his friends wouldn't center their lives around him, PC wasn't going to work for him anymore, Todd would only continue to be his friend if he kept getting better, Diana was the one that was gone for good but they ended on good terms.
wow717 sometimes being happy that people have moved on from your toxic influence IS making amends
I mean they did move on but they obviously still cared about BoJack to a degree - all of them did apart from Holly Hock and we know deep down, she still cares about him and would eventually reconnect with him
@@BrokenBeats94 That's what I hope will happen, but thematically its better if she didn't and realistically, I don't think she will. Hollyhock cared about bojack, but she didn't have a need for him the way bojack did for her. And after hearing about one of the horrible things he did and then more after the interview, she reasonably decided to cut him out. And if she does reconnect with him I think that weakens the idea that bojacks actions had real consequences.
For the most part, I also took the shows ending at it's face value. I think Bojack almost died (the second to last episode), but didn't (last episode). His "punishment" or result wasn't jail or death, but to be alone. He wanted love, so he drank with his parents to be with them. He wanted attention, so he chose to do a second interview and ruined his image. He wanted adoration, which is why he so enjoyed being a professor. He did these things to avoid his greatest fear: being alone. He thought he'd find solice in his fame, but in the end, he lost what kept him the furthest from being alone: his friends.
To me the flatline symbolized the death of all his relationships. Todd had already fallen away from Bojack before the last two episodes (which is why he wasn't there to help with the Sarah Lynn debacle). He broke Princess Caroline's heart when he openly spoke of how much he loved Sarah Lynn when he never told her the same, though she did so much for him. She was just another woman taken advantage of. Lastly, in The View from Halfway Down, he broke his last relationship by calling Diane and pitting the pressure of holding his life together on her as she was taking ownership of her own issues and depression. How terrifying, upseting, and confusing it would have been for Diane to think that Bojacks "death" could have been prevented from her picking up her phone and her taking on his problems as she always had. How dare he not try to take ownership of his own life and issues and try to pawn them off on people over and over again... He grew to be just like all the failed parents who passed their trauma to others, but instead of passing it to his kids, he passed it to every other person around him... which is why they all needed to leave or else they all would fall too.
It's heartbreaking... because he's trying. Bojack wants to get better... but it got so hard he ran away and tried to escape with death... and realized that death wasn't even what he wanted because it was the final loneliness! Luckily he gets a second chance, surviving the drowning, but he lost his friends in the process. Now he must truly face his fears of living alone knowing death is not an option.
Actually, he did tell Princess Carolyn that he loved her. When they argued after he fired her. He told her he loved her as much as he was capable of loving anyone, which was never enough. 💔
I agree with the “bones” of your theory, but I interpreted the end as a bit less grim. I don’t think his friends cut him off, but they’ve moved on and his days of taking more than he gives are over. This is more pronounced with Diane because he has really depended on her but she’s all in on her new life. She’s likely never going to return to California and she’s not going to extend herself to maintain any ties to the life she lived there. Nature is taking its course, BoJack is going to have to stand on his own two feet in a way he never has before, and he’s going to have to do his part when it comes to friendship. It will be a struggle for him, but it will be healthier for everyone.
I don't think that he lost his friends. If anything, at the end he might be closer to the real friendship than ever. They just refused to constantly put him before their own happiness and stated clearly that from now on he is the only one responsible for making himself better. But they all still love him and forgive him. They are still his friends, but for the first time in a healthy grown-up way.
I know I'm very late to the party but at the start of episode 17 there is a newspaper showing a few lines about Bojack's alledged death. Now this following sequence is a fraction of a second but the newspaper actually turnsaround and give some more information about his alledged death. He is alive and well.
"Isn't the point of art less what people put into it and more what people get out of it"
~Tood Chavez
"Maybe,or maybe art doesn't need a point maybe that why it call art"
~Tood Chavez
The fucker had it all planed. Thats good storytelling
Whilst it's nice to know that the complexities in writing lead to fans finding quite a lot of hidden themes through the ending, I'm still a strong proponent of the ending not being in any need of fan-expansion, it worked well enough in the sense that the world and it's characters will still be there trying to figure themselves out...doesn't need to be any sort of mindblowing epiphany to make it somewhat "deserving" of being a great show.
Mostly a standard farewell works wonders in character-driven shows -- in my opinion, aside from Todd's overarching storyline, every character went through some quite satisfying changes through the season.
I agree with this. I think "sometimes life a bitch and then you keep living" is the core of the theme of the last episode. That's just life
John Mraz It really is and I honestly thought it was pretty good ending. The message is simple and extremely human and relatable. I respect that. It was bitter Sweet.
I feel bad that some people couldn't enjoy the ending
Gustbk1 I think Todd could’ve had a much more satisfying conclusion. The whole mother plot line was so underwhelming. IMO they should’ve made her a complete snob that thought she was above her son and kicked him out due to that. Maybe it could’ve been a similar situation with Bojack where Todd isn’t able to reconnect with his mother and puts his family behind him. In the final moment with Bojack, the two could’ve bonded over their shitty parents and how they’re much better off without them.
JINX that’s me
I agree. There were definitely some rushed and undercooked plotlines for some of the non-Bojack characters out there, and a bit of moments.
Many of us think, well, taught to think that everything happens for a reason. Many of the plot lines have resolutions but few don’t. It’s that feeling of not knowing why it was there for or things happened for that keep us thinking about those moments and in some way block our minds to reflect on the things that do shape us and moments we can learn from.
And I don’t claim to know why Todd’s story ended in that way, but I’m okay with things being alright. It was an alright story. Life so far is alright, but just like bojack and everyone else, life isn’t over yet. One moment doesn’t define us, but moments shape our character by how we react to those momemts. And we can take control our story one moment at a time.
Hmm interesting interpretation. I mostly saw the final episode as the people who helped Bojack out the most through his many, many mistakes as moving on without him in their lives, and thriving without him. His friends care about him, but they made it pretty clear they don't want to involve themselves with him as they did before and they're all moving on without him. Which isnt necessarily a negative thing. I saw it more of a metaphorical death of the old Bojack and the start of a new one.
Yes!!! Exactly!!
yeah.. this is my take on the finale too.
it's not a negative thing at all in my opinion. I think it's actually a positive thing - to see examples of people you relate to grow and move on. they didn't turn on him, they just left their miserable toxic past behind. and it's a message to BoJack - you can do it too.
they were all miserable in their own ways and now they can all be better and happier. probably they'll never be as close as before, maybe even some people won't be in his life anymore. but they still love BoJack. him knowing that and knowing that they are being better is a motivation to be better himself.
I took the finale as more literal. And like how it ended. Bojack, despite all of his mistakes always made it out to the other side by either dumb luck fame or friends bailing him him out ....even if the other side is shitty.
In the end, he is on another journey to make it out, only this time with fewer relationships that were either enabling or toxic. Like Diane said, (paraphrased) life’s a bitch and then you keep on living. That is the fate that faces most of us.
I agree. I don't like the idea of writing this massive story about this fucked up man and ending it with "oh we he didn't really change but WHAT IF HE DID, HUH?"
I like that it shows that "Yeah, he did change. And everything is difficult but... it's still better now. And if you keep trying, it'll keep getting better. For you and for everyone."
I really don’t think BoJack died, or that the final episode didn’t actually happen. I feel like they put a lot of emphasis on the line “life’s a bitch and then you keep on living” and it feels like they were trying to say something with that. Besides that I feel like the “the last episode is in his imagination” interpretation to be a little too Philbert-ish tbh. Especially bc he didn’t really GET closure. They made it pretty clear that Diane is never gonna speak to him again and overall it doesn’t feel like much like an ending to me. I think that was intentional and that’s one of the things the ending is saying. There are ups and downs and you’ll probably never feel content but you have to keep going. It kinda reminds me of what the jogger said about it getting a tiny bit easier every day
My personal interpretation of Sarah Lynn's quick aging is that she grew up before Bojack's eyes. Out of all the people Bojack sees in The View From Halfway down, Sarah Lynn is the only one who Bojack saw grow up. He saw Beatrice and Herb age overtime, but Sarah Lynn's the only one who he witnessed grow from a child to adult; a transition that was very quick and destructive for Sarah Lynn.
I feel like the heart monitor is a non-diegetic clue for the audience, an echo of the end of 'Horsin Around", meaning the end of this show, but also contrasting the nature of the two. One of them is a definitive ending. It has closure. The other one has not. It leaves plenty of unresolved plots/story hooks, it leaves BoJack in jail, but knowing that very soon he will be out of it... the ending left you thinking "well I guess that was decent"... I think that's kind of the point. "Closure is something invented by Steven Spielberg to sell movie tickets" after all. The show denying the audience that closure is the only way it could be coherent with its own meta narrative, imo. So the ending is "worse" than the rest of the show, because it would have otherwise undermined it.
Yes holy shit yes, that makes so much sense. They're saying the ending of him dying is the easy way out, the one horsin' around would take, whereas in reality there is no definitive ending and life goes on.
Have you watched any of David Lynch's films? He intentionally denies closure, because if you get closure, you're done with the story. You move on. You never really get at the meat of the matter.
But having no closure forces you to really think about it. It lingers with you forever.
Red bird: A cardinal is a representative of a loved one who has passed. When you see one, it means they are visiting you. They usually show up when you most need them or miss them.
Also when a bird flies inside a house it foretells an important message but if the bird is white or dies it is an omen of death
Don't understand why fans need theory about false last episode when show always was about deconstruction classic narratives (that really will be ended with death). Also it'll too easy for BoJack to just die. And also everything said by Savage Books about horrible message
But of course understand it is open for interpretation
I feel that saying the last episode is just in Bojack's mind really screws with the development of nearly all other characters (Aspecially pc). It being in Bojack's mind would also be a huge tonal shift from imagination to imagination.
Although, just because it's in his head doesn't mean it's not real. All these things could've still happened to them, and the fantasy is him being there to witness it.
It's not my favourite interpretation, but it's a possibility.
I agree with Philip. It really takes some mental gymnastics and wishful thinking to arrive at this interpretation.
I dont remember him knowing about jadah and pc or Diane planning to move to Texas b.c her bf/fiance before his swim.
@@kimsdayout yeah, he didn't. So, he is not dead.
This man will take any excuse to talk about bojack and I love it
yes i will watch every single video
I kinda feel like you missed where Bojack's arc ended up, and what made the last episode good. In the last episode we see that Bojack is finally in a place where the only reason for him to get sober is for its own sake, and he is going to have to do it without any of his previous dependencies. PC is his friend still, but isn't going to rep him anymore so can't just rely on her to keep his career afloat. Todd has his own job, his own apartment and a girlfriend, he will no longer be there for Bojack to vent his self hatred on. Diane is the person he used to validate himself regardless of his behavior, and finally he pushed her to a point where she has decided that she is going to move on. All of these people were able to quit enabling him without coming to hate him, and most without even totally cutting him out. Now Bojack's life is entirely in his own hands, he can't lean on anyone, and he can't blame his parents anymore.
I definitely would have preferred a redemption story, because I feel that the Bojack writers would have done a great job at showing us what that looks like with the complexity of how that person's actions affected others, but I think it was a fair take to show us that sometimes life isn't a broken bowl you can make more beautiful by repairing it with gold. Sometimes life isn't something you really get to repair, instead you only have the choice to accept the consequences of your actions and move forward.
I liked him alive. Life is shit but he still got the chance to get back to it. Plus, it’s not like everyone actively tries to stick to Bojack, they all distanced themselves from him to some degree. It felt like everyone was leaving him, to be honest, and them going on their separate ways means that we won’t have a show anymore.
Every time you say ‘The Bojack Horseman Show’, I think of the 2007 show that was created in the series lol
AKSHU DHAVALA lol same
I do have to say, I deeply dislike 'it was all a dream' theories...they feel so unoriginal and too easy.
There's a certain kind of poetry in ending a series about how life is not like a television series without any of the simple, easy answers or heart warming moments we've come to accept from TV. In the finale, Bojack and his friends just...move on with their lives. Maybe they'll all be happy. Maybe they'll have bad moments. "Life sucks and then you don't die", after all. Unsatisfying? Beautifully so.
But then that's just my interpretation. The wonderful thing about art like this is that everyone's view, how it made them feel, is valid.
Sarah Lin grows up in the episode to represent how she grew up, lived, and died around BoJack.
Personally, I like the interpretation that's the most obvious. Bojack survived the pool then goes to prison in life etc. The reason why is simple: the first episode of the show was Bojack meeting Diane, and the last moment were them sitting in silence, with Bojack remarking about how this may be the last time they see each other. Bojack is a story about two people who found each other, helped each other and hurt each other, two people lost in life, two people who, at the end of the show, didn't "solve" their problems, but were making steps. The last few anecdotes the show gives us is the prison story. Andy loses the movie he loves, but finds he loves the new movie just as much. To me this is Bojack telling Diane that he'll be fine without her. His new life without her will take some adjusting, but he'll survive. Then Diane tells him it's a beautiful night, referencing how the world is a beautiful place. Then silence. They just st there. They've said all there is to say to each other. They've both outgrown each other. Mr blue plays in the background, with the word 'I said I love you please believe me" "Don't hang your head so low that you can't see the stars" This is Diane telling Bojack I'm sorry. I'm leaving. I love you but this is it. Pleas ebeleive me. It's a beautiful night. And with that the show ends, as their relationship does.
I still personally really don't care for any interpretation of the show's ending that suggests that the finale is a continuation of that dying dream, even if your version of that is much, much better and more interesting/thought-out than most versions of the interpretation.
The way that it just sort of stops on an open note, that Hollywoob has sort of moved past its hatred of BoJack in the fickle way it always does, but he's still faced legitimate consequences for the lifestyle he lives, is some of this really fine storytelling in the way of the sociological and psychological crossing paths, and ultimately... Yeah. He's fucked up a lot of times, and is probably going to continue to do so, but running every day makes running get easier. People can both fundamentally change and fundamentally stay the same, and BoJack embodies that.
Beyond that, I feel like any "dying dream" or "afterlife" interpretation takes away one of the most major aspects of the story and BoJack's character arc: it ISN'T all about him. The finale simply being four dyadic exchanges between him and the other core characters of the show, highlighting just as much where they are now and how they've moved past being defined by their connection to him, yet at the same time how they've affected one another for the better or worse and helped shape them into the people they are today, is great. His friends have grown up and begun to live their own successful lives (sometimes in ways that BoJack couldn't have learned about before he went in the pool, if one assumes that his mind is just making this all up), and ultimately, as best highlighted by his conversations with Todd and PC... The world really isn't ABOUT him.
Everyone has their own lives and goings-on and things with or without BoJack in their lives, some of which will either separate them forever or radically alter what their relationships can ever be, and again, Hollywoob and culture doesn't care about his scandals after they ruined his life for months. Turning all of this into some dream, or afterlife, or vision of what-could-have-been for BoJack takes the strength of that away by taking the story away from all the other central characters, which I think drastically weakens the ending in turn.
The final episode really couldnt be his view from halfway down, because that's what The View from Halfway Down was. It's just that Bojack was resuscitated
I like the designated ending. I don't think he lost all his friends as people suggests. Princess Carolyn, Todd and Mr peanutbettter are definitely still going to be a part of his life, even if not as proeminent as before. Diane wil distance herself from him, but (since is my mind) I believe they will eventually become friends again. I believe that after the finale he is going to continue to change and get better, never going to be perfect and I don't believe hollyhock wil ever forgive him, but I don't think he is dead and I don't think he lost all his friends. Life is a bitch and you keep living. I think that makes for a great ending.
Joao Paulo i agree! He didn’t burn jis bridges, and everyone has good reasons to stay away from him or be a little sus about him until he proves himself. Diane and Hollyhock are done, but that’s a consequence of mistakes. Todd, mr.pb and PC will still be around, although with different relationships (aside from mr.pb who is pretty much the same) life moves on, relationships change, shit happens and all you can do is keep trying.
Everybody forgets that Diane is fucked up too - she needs Bojack to feel better with herself
I agree with most of it, but in regards to Diane, I thought the show made it kind of clear that that may have been the last time he spoke to her. In the end, they are two people who really needed and related to each other (albeit in a very dysfunctional way) but have now moved on, have different paths ahead of them and don't really need each other anymore. It reflected real life pretty well imo; sometimes people drift in and out of your life and that's okay.
@@darko1295 you are 100% right. It's just some lie I tell myself, because we truly don't know what is going to happen in that fictional world. I mean, if the creators wanted to launch a short where bojack kills everyone that would be canon, it won't happen and it would be ridiculous, but if it did, it would be the true ending. But, since we don't know I want to think they became friends again, there is nothing stopping me from lying to myself in that single point, so that's what I do kkkk
I agree. He didn't lose his friends. They just established healthy boundaries.
I also believe that Diane is not gonna dissappear from his life completely. She's just decided to be happy with or without him. And in the last episode she feels like she could only be happy away from BoJack, but the thing is that life goes on and people evolve. Maybe one day they will be able to built a healthy relationship. It depends on how they both are gonna change in the future.
After re-watching The View from Halfway Down, I realised that in Bojack’s last meal he also has a bottle of water, which he complains after taking a sip that it tasted like chlorine, already hinting the viewer that it’s chlorine water from the pool where he was currently drowning...
I've seen the ending of Bojack as the death of Diane and Bojack friendship mirroring the beggining of the series, both of them above the ceilling as before. The cycle has come to an end and Bojack has to "move forward" alone. But I loved your video and the subjectivity must be really a basis for any creative product.
About the Pink Bird and some of the symbolisms behind The View from Halfway Down I suggest you to watch the video ""The View from Halfway Down" Explained | Confronting Mortality" from Johnny 2 Cellos, it's really insightful.
th-cam.com/video/9p-1AhQZjPE/w-d-xo.html
His video really helped me with the bird too. I like the idea that if the bird dies before leaving the house, then it's an omen of death. It fits well with the fact that the bird escapes in the recurring part of the dream that he always wakes up from, but dies in his truly near death experience.
And Diane is introduced as Bojack's ghost writer!! We're watching a show named after Bojack and about Bojack, but the time frame we get of his life is exactly when Diane is in his life. Plus she seems to be a character who acts as a mouthpiece for writer viewpoints more often than any other, to me.
The way I interprete the ending comes back to my favorite quote of the show "There's always more show". No matter how surreal that show was it was suppose to imitate life on the relatable level and I think that there's no better way to end a show that imitetes life with just simple "and the life goes on". You won't have proper closure to some matters in your live, some characters that you meet won't have their character arc finished properly because this is life. BoJack wasn't suppose to have some kind of closure for everything and everyone because his "show" isn't over because life just keeps going and "there's always more show" and it only depends on him what he will do next.
"I absolutely HATED the idea of BoJack getting closure in his final moments. The interpretation I prefer far more is that BoJack got closure in his final moments."
i think what he meant was that he realised he could have had this life in his final moments (like bojacks personal view from half way down discribed by the secreterian) but in the end he dies. its not exactly closure but more of a regret after he did get back in the pool knowing he would come out of it. so the message would be like dying is not the answer because it doesn´t give you closure and you will regret it, but your actions do have consequences so if you live like this you will die... but its not my opinion its just what i got from this video,
personally i like the normal ending cause it fits better with theme of the show and is supported really well by episode 15 (imo).
i am a simple woman
i see a video from savage books about bojack horseman, i click
""Isn't the point of art less what people put into it and more what people get out of it?" - Todd
Great video, Savage! Your BoJack vids are remarkably insightful, love your stuff.
I interpreted the ending as one where Bojack survives. The season gave him another interest other than being a star (teaching). The ending shows he has begun to engage in that process again even though he is in a different environment and is likely to continue on with it in his life once he is released. While he was in rehab, nothing he engaged in resulted in a new, positive influence in his life. But teaching clearly could be. He's okay with not being the star anymore.
Additionally, it gives the other characters the hint of closure to their main character conflicts. Such as, Princess Caroline being willing to help Bojack, but only by having someone else work for him, other people will not have control over her life. Mr. Peanutbutter has spent an entire year without immediately seeking out another relationship, which needs to be done if he's going to become better at listening to people's wants and desires (something that a genuine friendship with Bojack may give him). Diane is okay with not seeing Bojack again because she realizes she can't let her own happiness be dictated by the wellbeing of those she can have no control over. Todd has been steadily building his own life instead of being a directionless mess over the last year.
I'm sure there's more that could be said about the ultimate resolution, but I only watched the ending episodes once. Bojack was definitely the main character, but having the ultimate ending be only about his outcome and mental state kind of cheapens the relief of tension that all of the associated characters had coming to them as well. Without the timeskip, it sort of leaves the fates of everyone else up in the air. I wouldn't have been very happy with that, myself, as I feel that the journey of all the characters deserved some kind of closure.
Honestly, I went into the final string of episodes thinking that Bojack dying would feel a little too cheap for the quality of the writing I had expected to see, but any one of the other characters dying might make some kind of sense. So The View From Halfway Down really kind of surprised me. Until I heard the flatline turn into a stable heartbeat in the credits. That was absolute genuis.
I love the ending. Bojack and Diane just sit there in silence. The unspoken energy just feels right. There’s a question there and they’ll never get the answer. That’s very Bojack to me.
Re: the bird on the house in view from halfway down
I think it was the celts (?) Who believed a bird coming into your house was an omen of change, but if it died before leaving it was a mark of death
The bird almost got out of the window when bojack chased her to the kitchen before the black tar melted her into nothing at the end
My understanding was that the whole episode "The View From Halfway Down" WAS Bojack's view from halfway down and him wishing he had not jumped in the pool. At the end, he accepts his mortality. But, unlike Secretariat, he gets another chance and survives. Which seems random and lucky for Bojack, but I think the important part is that he has grown from the new perspective his view from halfway down has given him.
I cried so hard, because it was so perfect. I know it might take a while for some people to understand, but they literally allowed us to sit with the characters for those last minutes. It was very symbolical and very true to the nature of the show. I enjoy hearing the different theories, but while the show is deep, I don’t think it’s THAT deep intentionally. Bojack is somewhat of a dark show, but I don’t think that just because the ending was somewhat bittersweet yet happy this means that it was bad. They left us wanting more but that was the exact point. The show has always been reflective to what real life is. You don’t get closure on a lot of things. I think people oftentimes want to find the “secret meaning” of so many creative things, instead of just enjoying them. It happens a lot with this show. I’m not trying to say that thinking of alternate endings and other meanings is wrong, but a lot of people focus too much and end up not quite seeing the positive.
TBH, I interpreted the view from half way down as BJ letting his past die and moving on. That is why in the next episode he was able to make amends for his mistakes
My favorite interpretation of the finale is that it's played entirely straight. Bojack lives, goes to jail and life moves on. When he comes out he doesn't know anything about anybody's life. PC has married for reals without him present and will not work with him again, Diane is engaged and furious and hurt because of him and may never see him again, Hollywoo has become Hollywoob because life can't go back to what it was... it's a good way to show that yes, you can improve on your mistakes, but everybody else is not required to wait for you, and may not forgive you entirely
14:04 I can relate so well. I was writing a composition for my school, and incidentally I thought "Well, 5 paragraphs, let's use A, B, C, D and E for the initials of the paragraphs, in alphabetical order" and I did.
The theme was "Reminders", and for my piece, it's about a motorist (Ah Huey) who, at the very end of the White Terror in Taiwan 1987, lost his mother to an unfortunate incident. He wakes up and prepares his morning for work, and he constantly sees his mother reminding him to do lots of things. Brush his teeth, ensure he had enough sodium for the day and so on. He didn't feel sad, or distraught or anything. It's just an empty feeling for him.
The very end of the composition was something like "Expected to be at work in half an hour, he got onto his motorcycle and started up his ignition." It started with an E, true to the theme I intended for the story haha. Of course, the idea was that while the work kept him wealthy, they didn't genuinely care, nor feel invested in him as an employee.
He was starting to move forward, and he hears another reminder "Don't forget to put on your helmet!" To which he shouts back "I know!" and drives off for about five seconds before he stopped. He turns around to find no one there, and spontaneously breaks down into tears. It's not the absence of his mother that forced his tears in that difficult time, it was acknowledging that he lost someone who cared.
Wrote that when I was 14, and though I can no longer find the paper with the composition, I don't need it anymore. It's in my heart for all of time.
9:16 I think the heart monitor represents the ending to bojack's relationship with Diane. The evidence I have is the songs they pick to add In the first montage of what happened to bojack after he came out the pool a song plays with lyrics like "I'm running through the pages and they start to turn in love with the life I've had not the one I've got." This could be referring to how he is trying to escape death as his time is running out the "in love with the life I had" part could refer to how he enjoyed his life in LA before when he was on horseing around before he herb was fired. "Tell me I'm the good guy, I wanna come in first. Here is celebrity at his worst" referse to Diane and how bojack sees her as the voice of reason to help him out and k believe it is a call back to the am I a good person speach at the end of downer ending. I could be reaching but I still think its good then u have the why the long face bit which u dont need me to talk about. Because he's a horse "cause I dont want to live here in this sunny place" could refer to how he doesn't want to live in LA "running from my time" "because I've been losing I could really use you on my side" refers to Diane in the same way as before because she helps him with different situations. But that is all bojack's perspective at the end we see Diane's in the song Mr blue which is about a her moving on from bojo "Mr blue I told u that I love u please believe me." From when bojack says "wouldn't it be funny if this was the last conversation we ever had" she then asks him to promise her that he will be ok without her. That's my theory hope u enjoy. Also I thought bojack's halfway down took place after secretariat performed his poem.
I see the final episode as the reflection of the thesis voiced by Diane, Todd, and probably several other characters throughout the series: you just keep living. For people with mental illness or problems with substance abuse, there will never be a moment where they will have forever triumphed over their demons and it’s nothing but endzone dances from here on out. The truth is that your demons will always be with you and you’ll spend the rest of your life struggling with them until you die. You’ll get better, you’ll get worse, but as long as you’re alive, there’s always the possibility of things getting better.
Recovery is never a clean victory. After the triumph that comes from hitting rock bottom and coming back up, eventually there comes all the little annoyances and struggles of living, which have to be dealt with. And like the episode said, you just keep living.
11 minutes in and started screaming NOOOOO after hearing your editor’s interpretation on the final episode representing Bojack’s metaphorical view from halfway down. And with the title card visual of him in the pool. Naurrr. I thought this show was done affecting me like this but here we are a year and a half later!!
I love how the comments disagreed with you peacefully
11:20 In some video I heard that bird flown in room is old sign of coming death, and he bring Sara to this house as girl maybe because of he does (or think he does) it in real life if house is something like death
I took the ending as what it's titled and how Diane phrases it. You need to meet some people, to become who you are supposed to be; and it was nice while it lasted.
Edit: All this "did he really die stuff" Seems to be a stretch.
I haven’t been able to get the poem “A View From Halfway Down” out of my head.
11:10 when a bird gets inside your house it's a sign of bad luck
I just like the idea of Bojack living and having to carry the consequences of his decisions. He never finds peace in life cause life is never truely peaceful if you think about it. There’s always something. You keep moving till death hits🤷🏾♂️
I watched Free Churo right before I saw these episodes first and theres a line about how "there are no happy endings because there always needs to be more show". I see bowjack dying as the "happy" ending for us because it was satisfying, but theres always more show so he doesnt die. The people in his life just get to be free from it, and the last episode is them freeing themselves from his show. What I find impressive is that The View From Half Way Down is the writers flexing that they know what we want and could do it, but theres always more show, so there has to be another episode.
Matthew Steigauf I really like this interpretation
After watching the final episode, I was in a way disappointed that it wasn’t what I expected, but after rewatching it I came to feel more that it was representative of how people grow up and apart, and strong friendships don’t always remain, but in a way I really felt connected and sympathized with the ending.
The interpretation where he died could tell the message that this is what happens to addicts who don't change. It's like a warning to others and can serve as a wake up call. I like the ending where he survives because it signify's that his journey goes on. He said that he's nearly broken his longest sober record and that it'll be scary when he comes back out because then he has to make the choice not to pursue alcohol and drugs. It also might not be realistic to do a complete 180 after the incident. Change takes time, but he's getting there slowly
Your interpretation is interesting. I'll have to go back and watch the last two episodes again.
The reddit interpretation reminds me of the Mass Effect 3 "indoctrination" theory. Fans struggling to come to grips with the ending grasping at straws to rationalise it in their own way. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
I liked Bojack's ending at its surface level (assuming what we saw is what happened essentially). He/we got closure with all of the characters meaningful to him that had died and then closure with the other characters were still alive. There's plenty to interpret (I like your observation about Zach Braff) and it delves deeply into death while also seeing Bojack punished for his crimes and growing more distant from those he considered friends. I think it was clearly visible that PC was happy to see him but had put up boundaries. Bojack again freaked Diane out causing her extreme anxiety when she was trying to have her "happy ending" and it didn't feel like they would be seeing each other again after the wedding. Todd is happy to see him but at the same time has continued moving further away from Bojack like he has been for the past few seasons.
My interpretation is that Bojack is alive but his punishment isn't necessarily death, but his friends drifting further away from him as they have finally come to the realisation that he isn't good for them. They have all taken their own steps to distance themselves from him. While the show is over, Bojack's life would continue on but somehow more lonely than he was when the show started.
Regardless of which ending is "right" that is the true beauty of a show like this. When I think of how my other favourite pieces of media conclude, there is rarely such ambiguity that requires digestion such as Bojack Horseman has. I think part of this has to do with how incredible the use of the "cartoon" medium is as it allows such freedom to create visuals that wouldn't work in "live action" mediums as well. While I can compliment shows like Breaking Bad for its writing and shot selection, The View From Halfway Down could never be recreated in any other form of medium. I think that's pretty special.
Thanks for this series of videos.
I don't if I am weird but suicides in storys are very fascinating and this show reached new levels with their final episodes
So, this awesome video essay was brought to us by the letter V?
This video is perfect, he teaches about not only art interpratacion, but about art creation in a increable way.
9:49 Your roommate’s theory is supported when Todd stops Bojack from choosing a door-one that leads down (to death), and one to life (up) and instead keeps him in limbo.
And by the article for the cancelled “Headless Horseman” that’s a red herring for his death.
Read the summary-the producer’s regrets that the show was cancelled before it could “come together” mimic Bojack’s lamenting that Becker-like his mom-“had all the right pieces but couldn’t put them together.”
Just like Bojack-as the finale shows-had the tools and relationships to avoid a relapse, but died not bc he was doomed to, but because he made a final choice.
The Good Place did their finale exceptionally well. Seeing the finale of my two favorite shows of all time back to back- and side note, I watched both on my birthday- that was an intensely emotional time, in a great way
My interpenetration was that the flatline represents the "death" of Bojack and Diane's friendship. It's not an accident that they show the flatline over their heads. What's more the show makes it clear that their friendship is over and they will inevitably drift apart.
The bird alludes to an old folklore that if a bird enters your home it's there to deliver a message, but if it dies before you can get it to leave then it's a harbinger of impending death.
I know I'm almost a year late but wanted to share my own theory/thoughts on the last 2 episodes!
I always saw the view from halfway down as Bojack's final suicide attempt and how his own "view from halfway down" WAS that episode. He got to talk to and see all the people who had died and who he couldn't make amends with. This loss of opportunity made him realise the amendments he wanted to make in his own life and I like to think that he never attempted suicide again.
The show to me has always been a TV show analysing how unrealistic TV shows are to real life eg. actions having consequences beyond a 20 minute storyline like in horsing around or a movie's character arc. That's why I think "the ending" was a perfect way of showing how not everything is resolved in our personal lives and people grow. That's why I think the show was a document of his life during the time he knew Diane. It wasn't "his story" because your story is never done until you die- which is why I also think it's a good suicide message. Nothing really ended due to the closing of the show, we are lead to see all the character's lives and goals after the show ends "life is shitty and the you keep living" (one of my favourite quotes). The last episode also shows that even tho he was 'a cartoon character' the realism of the show displayed how his actions still had consequences, even if he'd realised he was wrong and moved on. For example, he went to prison despite having gotten his life back together.
For what it's worth, Bojack didn't amend everything like you said. I think if the final episode was "his view from halfway down" it wouldnt show him going to jail or saying goodbye to Diane but it did. Furthermore, we're lead to assume that Hollyhawk didn't reach out to him and didn't forgive him which therefore shows he didn't solve all the damage he had done. We can as audience members think of the emotional consequences of this or him eventually amending things with her if that's what we would like. That's why, for a show that doesn't believe in traditional show endings, it was a ending. It managed to balance character's overcoming personal arcs they'd had throughout the show whilst still having other demons to fight, goals etc. It wasn't a happy ever after, it was these characters establishing their lives and homes with or without bojack. It showed how bojack couldn't rely on PC, diane or tod to establish and fix his life because eventually they would all grow again with or without him.
The view from halfway down was more of an "ending" than the other episode and it was really for the viewers to see summations of all the dead characters and how they impacted Bojack and all the personal battles they could never fight. It shows a climax to Bojack's relapse and ultimately served as a huge climax that would have totally ignored some of the key messages of life not being a TV show throughout the series if it WAS the real ending. The actual ending is the writer's way of mixing show long character arc climaxes with the notion that once viewers turn off the show, they still have life and consequences to deal with, just like what bojack struggled with which is why he believed in "don't stop dancing". After u stop dancing, what do you have left? The life you've made and the consequences of your actions.
This over-analysis is ultimately why I think the show's ending was perfect. It gave the audience everything they needed from the character arc whilst still maintaining their core message of death, real life vs TV and consequences.
thank you for coming to my TED talk :)
The red cardinal bird is a symbolic literary reference. Bukowski used it in his final novel "Pulp", where his main character chased after it, but saw it only in his death.
Also, i read some articles about the symbolic meaning of the bird, and turns out, it can be interpreted as a spark of life and hope in people. Really like that they wrote it this way.
I always thought some of the characters in Bojack Horseman deserved their own spin-offs, like probably Princess Carolyn or Todd maybe.
ppl talking about bojack makes me so emotional i just love this series
Wtf, the interpretation of the ending by your buddy is mind blowing and absolutely great
I was a bit weirded out by the end at first, but after watching it a couple times and digesting it, it really grew on me. I think it's a beautiful portrait of how life just kind of works out in its ways sometimes. Sometimes lives a bitch and you keep on living. Bojack is famous and broke into a house, the fact he's being discovered before he dies for good makes sense. The way people move on without him makes sense, and that moment with Diane on the roof, two characters that are in ways so alike yet so different, who's bond is broken by now, was amazing. It's not a final feeling ending, but that's sort of the point. There's always the day after, there's always more show. But this is nice. And it was fun as long as it lasted.
If JJ Abrams and Chris Terrio wrote the ending of Bojack Horseman:
*Hollyhock finishes burying Bojack Horseman.*
*There is a random stranger standing by*
Stranger: There’s been no one for so long. Who are you?
Hollyhock: I’m Hollyhock.
Stranger: Hollyhock who?
*looks around*
*sees Bojack’s ghost and smiles*
Hollyhock: Hollyhock Horseman, obviously.
*Hollyhock Manheim-Mannheim-Guerrero-Robinson-Zilberschlag-Hsung-Fonzarelli-McQuack, obviously
@@alejandrobabio3940 it's about how rey adopted the Skywalker name in The Rise of Skywalker
That's the best video of yours and it's must watch for any writer struggling with themes and worrying about planning too much.
sarah lynn changing ages made sense to me because bojack watched her grow up but she never became a realized adult, and she is the embodiment of his concept of her, so she reflects the way an adult views a person they have watched transform from child to adult, like when someone makes you think of you family and you remember a younger sibling or cousin as a younger version of themselves because you have lots of memories from when they were littler
“Luck is the residue of design” reminds me of a quote my father has said my entire life: “Chance favors the prepared mind”
My interpretation is that he survives and the final message is that life goes on if Bojack is there or not, it doesn't wait for him. But also that you don't get a pretty bow to resolve everything, you don't go always get closure. If you want it you have to work for it. Bojack gets multiple options of what he wants to pursue and if he stays in any particular persons life. Death is an easy way out but gives no satisfaction and when faced with it head on he sees the reasons to stay alive.
“Life’s a bitch, then you die, y’know?”
“Well, sometimes... but sometimes life a bitch and you keep living.”
much prefer the literal interpretation of the ending, leaving the viewer to think. I think it leaves a more permanent mark on the viewer to search for their own interpretation, the ending wasn't extravagant, it was mellow and real... all the things we think we know about writing should be ignored.
I'm not very good at wording my opinions, but I'll try with a comparison. Compare Kimetsu no Yaiba with Vinland Saga. Kimetsu no Yaiba has grand beautiful visuals and a striking story with some hard hitting emotional scenes.... but it just doesn't have the same impact as the more slow, brutal and philosophical Vinland Saga, it leaves questions for the viewer in an unconventional way that Kimetsu no Yaiba will never be able to. I think Bojack was ultimately an optimistic show from the start, and it has affected me like barely any other media ever has.
Bojack is over, and I think everything might just be better now
I think it's perfect that a series about how life isn't like a sitcom didn't end with something totally dramatic, nor with a total status quo, but with life continuing to change whether we want it to or not
the bird flying around the house was a literal red herring
I think the reason Sarah Lynn gets older throughout The View from Halfway Down, is because she died the second she got cast on Horsin’ Around, thus why she starts the episode at the same age as she started the show.
This logic also applies to BoJack’s mom, who died (inside) about the same age as she had BoJack - and she gets old at one point in the episode as well.
Contrasting these characters, Herb was the only one in the episode who does not appear as old as he was when he died. This is because Herb found peace. He doesn’t appear in the dream as a dying cancer victim, because he died happy.
You've been your perspective of it makes the poem when His dad read it and bojacks reaction to the poem seem all the more understandable.
You earned a like with your first opening statement about the entire series
Sarah Lynns different ages were the ages Bojack could've helped and get a closer connection but didn't. Same with Herb, that's the age he was when Bojack could've saved their firendship, the last time they connected. Beatrice was probably this age the first time Bojack saw her dance, the only happy memory of her.
This definitely helps me appreciate and enjoy the ending better than I initially did. The last episode where he tries to make amends with everyone, and everyone essentially shows and/or tells him outright that they've moved on with their lives and are frankly better off without him, I interpreted that as yet another instance of Bojack "not getting it", and thought the overall message of the episode was less to do with Bojack specifically, and was more of a message directly to the audience to not be like Bojack; to come to terms with the fact that you won't always be forgiven for your actions, and in a sad, yet true way that was okay, and it was something you just have to learn to move past and grow from. I don't necessarily like the interpretation that he died, mainly because I guess in some weird slightly twisted sense I didn't think Bojack deserved the 'peace' that came along with dying, but at the same time I could see it being a good narrative ending about how some people do end up dying with unresolved issues and damaged relationships.
Regardless of interpretation, I love when a show has the guts to follow through with a truly sad/bad (emotionally bad, not narratively bad) ending. It's not often we get to see it, and even less often we get to see it done right.
Your preferred interpretation blew my mind.
It's so dark.
It feels like the ending Bojack thought he deserved.
I wasn't happy with the ending either, but this new interpretation has changed that. I love the idea of Bojack having a view from halfway down.
Another interpretation of your interpretation is that Bojack continuing to live is still his view from halfway down.
Life itself is one long free fall. We all jumped off the bridge the moment we were born. We are all on our way down, and nothing will stop it. What this show teaches us is how beautiful the view can be on our way down, and it begs us to notice it. The view from halfway down is our reminder that life is worth living, as Secretariat realized. His last regret of not noticing the view until it was too late is a cautionary tale to the rest of us. Notice and appreciate the view while you still can.
Bojack heeded that advice and continued to live, finally appreciating his view from halfway down. To me, that’s the most satisfying conclusion to Bojack’s arc.
That the ending should always be on the penultimate episode? :D
That you're wrong?
I think I saw the finally episode not as coming to terms with death but instead with life. He realizes he can’t keep the same friends he’s always had and has to handle things himself after he’s messed everything up. The finally flat line is the death of his old relationships. The death of his old life.
What Raphael Bob-Waksberg said definitely proves to me that depth can exist even if it's not strictly intended by the creator
Bird in the house is an omen of death
In my writing, I usually have a very general outline of where I want the start to go, where a lot of big moments need to be in the middle, and how it needs to end. And the rest is just improvising as I'm writing and try to think of what would make for the most interesting for the characters and what arcs I could play around with there. Having a general outline can be handy, but never try to plan out each specific little thing before you even start writing the story.
Interesting if somewhat flawed take on the ending.
Great video as ever, just a shame that the point of the final episode seemed to miss the mark for you.
I definitely thought that the final episode was more about Diane and Princess Carolyn’s growth than it was about Bojack at all. We’ve seen these two women sacrifice all of themselves time and time again for their love of Bojack. But in the final episode, they were ready to move on. To acknowledge their love for Bojack but to move on to healthier lives - in their careers, in their perceptions of themselves, and in their romantic relationships. It’s says so so much about a show/text when viewers can pull a million and one interpretations from it. Bojack Horseman is a show I’m sure we’ll all come back to time and time again. What an amazing ride it was.
I struggled with suicidal thoughts my entire life, I almost did it a number of times but never went all the way through.
This episode it's punch in the stomach because I can see myself sitting at that dinning table. After I watched this episode the first time, I decided that it was time for me to ask for help, I don't wanna see the view from half way down and this show it's a great reminder of that.
One of the main themes of the show was how life keeps going; u can be happy one moment and u can fuck up badly the next, and there will always be something next, til u die I guess. So I see how Bojack dying at the end could be a satisfying ending, but personally I like the idea of him beinf pushed to try to live again. It's also interesting how the rest of the main cast was able to put their lives together. And idk. To me it's more satisfying to think he'll have to start again, and again, and as many times as it takes
I’m totally convinced BoJack is alive. Apart from the creators literally saying it, there’s a giant suggestion. If BoJack hallucinated/imagined the whole 16th episode, how would he imagine himself at PC’s wedding with Judah? Nobody expected those two to get together (from the characters’ perspective), so why would BoJack of all people?
"Life's a bitch, and sometimes you keep on living." Bojack didn't completely overcome his issues ("What if I relapse again?"), and there were real consequences to his actions, he ultimately loses everyone he cares about: Todd, Caroline, Diane, all because of what he did to them. He's forced to live on with his life. He doesn't get an easy out, or any solid solutions except that no matter what, he has to keep living his life.