Great video! Now, a velocity comparison between your Gen 1 Ruger American 7mm-08 with 22 inch barrel and the Gen 2 without the can is in order. A real apples to apples comparison! Keep up the good work! Love your videos. Especially the 7mm-08 ones.
The best thing to do is exactly this: Chronograph your rifle with the bullets you plan to use, get a ballistic calculator, go with the energy and drop it tells you, and stay in those parameters. A longer barrel will increase your distance, but sometimes it’s nice to have a lighter and more maneuverable rifle. 👍🏼 It’s all give and take!
It’s funny that people get caught up in this. It’s not as substantial as people think. I went down this rabbit hole years ago when building a 308. Settled on a short barrel, took it to the field and animals reacted the same way to 16” velocity as they did with 24” velocity……down! Even shooting distance, learning mils and moa is where it’s at.
That's not untrue, but velocity gives you more advantages, it extends your range by giving more distance where your bullet will perform the way it's supposed to. All bullets are dependent on velocity to work correctly, and personally I'd rather have a longer effective range than a shorter one. The downside of a shorter barrel is overall effective range, while the downside of a longer barrel is less maneuverability, one of those is a non issue and one of those is a deal breaker. Longer barrels are better.
I've been shooting and hand loading the 7mm-08 for about 20 years using SP or HP bullets running at around 2,775 fps from a 22" barrel and perhaps I could have run them faster (but what for?!). I've accounted for well over 100 deer out to 300 metres (Reds and Fallow here in the UK) with this particular calibre and never lost one, not to say I haven't at all but the one's I did lose were with 7x64 and 6.5x55 and not the cartridges fault, mine! We shouldn't get hung up on bullet speed, start worrying if you can't put the bullet in the right place! I now use 150gr for long range target and 130gr copper at 2,850 fps for hunting with the 7mm-08, perfect. Which means the shorter barrel Ruger American will do just fine.
People keep saying the ACTUAL barrel length on these Gen 2 's is 18.75" as the muzzle break is included in the 20" measurement. I don't have one, so I can't check that, however, the muzzle velocity u got was great if it's an 18.75" barrel. I have 308 Ruger Scout with an 18.5' barrel and it's fine for me. I wouldn't want a 7mm Rem Mag in that barrel length.
I have an old browning abolt 243 with the boss system. It's advertised as a 22 inch barrel, but they are counting the boss. It's actually about 19.5 inches. But even from the shorter barrel I'm getting almost 3100 fps with 85 grain bullets. Not to bad.
7mm-08 and 308 are very good efficient cartridges 30-06 will be like a 308 in that barrel length, (magnum rounds also will underperform in that short barrel) so there are cases that need those few missing inches than others
More velocity isn't always better. I shoot a carbine Remington 7600 3006 18.5 inch barrel. At close ranges 10 to 125yds I was having major issues with bullets not exiting and overall not performing well. I turned some Hornady sst 165 down to 2475fps and they did an amazing job only recovered 1 projectile out of 8 kills this season. It was complete and mushroomed perfectly . Here in South Carolina in the woods hinting 125yds is a long shot.
I have a savage storm lighweight 7mm-08 that I shoot Hornady SST 139 Superformance. Never chronograph in a 24 inch barrel but suppose to be 2950. I cut my barrel down to 16.5 for nice woods light short gun. Chronograph at 2756. For losing 7.5 inches of barrel compared to the normal I was impressed. Need to find someone with a 24 inch barrel to see what they actually do.
I love the predator, for hunting that 18 inch is just sweet! Perfect weight and length for most hunting situations in the eastern half of USA! I understand long range out west wanting longer barrel lengths but if you look at some of those western hunting legends (Ron Spomer type guys) they like a shorter lighter rifle for spot and stalk and long hikes up in the hills! Just my opinion!
Your content is absolutely amazing, I have to say I’m impressed with all of your work, finds and to share it with us . I can’t say thank you enough. All your content is very helpful to all of us from the average person to the knowledgeable people involved in this great hobby / living . Cheers 🇨🇦
There are Calibers like the 308 Family that work well with Shorter Barrels(cases that hold under or around 45 grains of Powder), a 30-06 on the other Hand doesnt even if you handload and use faster burning powders to get 100% Burnrate with a good 85 to 92% Casefill. Magnums are even worse with Shorter Barrels Another good Cartridge for this is 8mm Mauser wich is the Reason why it has a strong comeback over the last Decade in Europe espacially in Germany where we often Hunt at Shorter Ranges (Driven Hunts, Hunting from Treestands....) and play around with Supressors way longer then my American Friends. So we Tend to want Handy Rifles (Short Barrels with Over Barrel Supressors to get the Shortest possible Package), i am a little bit on the conservative Side and say 20inch is a good compromise Speed and Performancewise others go as far as 14 inch for their go to everyday Rifles but some Calibers are way more suitable for this short of a Barrel then others. The newest and hottest Kid on the Block is 8.5x55 Blaser which is designed to work out of short Barrels without losing to much Power. I stay with my 20 Inch 308 loaded with 130gn Barnes ttsx at 3050ft/s even big Adult Red Stag and big Wildboar Keiler dont like them 😂
These new rifles are super tempting. How much of a difference does the supressor make? I'd be curious to see what the fps values are with it removed and everything else the same.
Scheels moved into my town. Scheels did not have this caliber in stock. Talked to manager and he called other Scheels and could not find one in that caliber. I waited a little longer and the manager found just one rifle. So I purchased it today 5/2024 and it will be in my store next week. Can’t wait to get it to the range. Bought it off your reviews who tee who!!!
Im shorter barrel kinda a guy. I cut and threaded my gen 1 ruger american in 270 to 20" because i wanted a quicker, lighter and shorter barrel to put a suppressor on it. I didnt have a huge drop in velocity. It all depends on the cartridge and how much you lose. Its also good to know your minimum expansion velocity on the bullets your shooting and the velocity to get your max hunting range.
That’s a sweet rifle. If they made a metal trigger guard and a way to smooth out the bolt I’d bet one with a short barrel for Adirondack mountain hunting in maybe 308 or something. That velocity held up fine at that barrel length and outperformed my expectations for it
An extra 2 inches wouldn't make much of a difference. I have a 16 inch Ranch and 22 inch Predator in 6.5 Grendel, the Predator with a 120grn Nosler BT runs at 2400fps and the Ranch 120fps slower. So a bit more load development needed there, but they both shoot extremely well. As a bonus I can use 120 Sierra's and there is no change in point of impact, but the Sierra's don't hold together as well as the Nosler's.
Yeah, I think posted velocities are often 24 inch barrel, but who thought going from 24 to 20 would cost you 210fps? Once you get up past 16 inches the increments of increased velocity are reasonably small. Partly depending on powder, granted. If you were running US-869 out of a 338 Lapua I could see a dramatic loss from a shorter barrel.
If your gonna load for the 7mm08 use Winchester StaBall 6.5. That powder is made for that cartridge. I’m getting 1/2” to 1” groups and about 150-200 fps faster than any other powder I tried. Best powder cartridge combo I’ve found
I'm not sure what grain bullets you are shooting. There are several that will shoot out of the cartridge. Therefore there will be many powder/bullet combinations. I'm sure that in your rifle it shoots great. My findings of hand loading for 30 plus years is that compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges. Barrel length being the same to bullet weight to barrel twist. Then you have to figure in barrel harmonics in every barrel is different. So it's NOT as simple as what you state.
Another factor to consider is your powder burn rate and efficiency along with ballistic efficiency. IMR8208 XBR is another powder with higher burn efficiency and the speed is comparable. Winchester 760 is another powder that is capable of close ballistic efficiency and speed. If you know how to identify pressure signs, another powder to consider is Hodgdon H414. You can run a compressed load and achieve almost exact loads for speed and powder burned. Some times looking at the powder availability is very important too. Considering powder availability.......Just sayin.
@@NightSniper64 I’ve shot anything from 120-165 gr bullets with that powder out of two rifles. Both achieved 100-200fps than any other powder. Sometimes it is just that simple.
@@NightSniper64120 Barnes ttsx 3300fps, 140 nosler bt 3050fps, 150 nosler by 2980 fps, 160 nosler accubond 2910fps, 165 Sierra game changer 2850fps. All with book charges. 22-24 inch barrels. All sun moa. Sorry for making a suggestion . I didn’t know we had to get technical and make reloading difficult. Next time I’ll include my barrel harmonic data so he can adjust accordingly.
I've recently heard the more overbore a cartridge is, the more barrel length matters. Since the 308 is a near perfect design (for what it is) it doesn't lose much velocity per inch (to an extent) and since 7mm is pretty close to a 30 cal that makes sense. A 243 however would suffer greatly I suspect
Great video! I wish more people would do videos that are this matter of fact. With that data and ammo, you’re gettin a shade over 2400 ft/lbs at the muzzle stayin over 1000 ft/lbs out to about 470 yards. I understand that some people do take longer shots on deer, but the majority aren’t even trying to shake a stick 400 for deer. 2785 avg for a 140 grain bullet far more than enough for deer.
@@brianklamer3328 I believe I have seen a youtuber test with and without a can, maybe Military Arms Channel and the back pressure of the can did help increase velocity edit: I can't find the video and a few other videos I watched showed only a few FPS boost with the supressor
20" barrels seem to be a solid middle ground between the 16" and 18" barrels compared to the 22" and 24". Velocity gained after 20" really seems minimal in most common calibers like 5.56/.223 and .308.
Generally, the overbore cartridges like 243 or 22-250 prefer long barrels and more efficient cartridges like 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor don't mind shorties, but still appreciate longer pipes.
Larger calibers wont lose as much velocity because they can use faster powders. 308 and up is fine with a 20" barrel. 6.5 creed and smaller you want really want longer. The 7mm08 is right on the border. Im curious what they'll put on the magnum calibers when they come out.
Caliber size doesn't correlate to powder burn rate. It's more associated with overbore. 45 70 can use faster powder and it's a 45 cal 25 06 and 7mag use slower powders and are similar in overbore (diameter of projectile in correlation to case capacity) 300 blackout can use shotgun or pistol powder (very fast burn) slower powders benefit longer barrels... Basically overbore cartridges can take more advantage of a longer barrel.
@jcows12 when I say caliber , I'm referring to the diameter of the projectile, not the size of the overall cartridge. Just like you said, 45-75 being a large 45 cal can use fast powder. And 25-06 being a small 25 can uses slow powders.
If you buy shorter barrels just have to understand what you are giving up - but you can have most calibers - especially modern cartridges- in shorter barrels because they are burning powder more efficiently. Can you run a 16 or 18” 6.5 creedmoor? Yep and because it has a higher BC than a 308 it’s going to deflect wind better and have less drop despite it being slower than if it were shot out of an 20-24” barrel. I think that’s what a lot of people miss - you don’t give up much in terms of efficiency/ethical distance by having a shorter gun. But a shorter gun with a suppressor is definitely more handy. I think they will follow suit with other industry partners for their magnums and go 22”. I hope for the 6.5PRC they keep it at 20” though
When you go to reload the 7/08 i got best velocity with rel19 and H4350 and also 748 but maybe faster powder might be worth a shot maybe re15 or varget try it
Thanks for the video! I have the same gun in 204 Ruger, went out and shot Hornady Superperformance 40 gr Vmax with an advertised velocity of 3900 FPS and I was getting about 3550. It shot well under sub MOA, but velocity was down. I’ll keep shooting and try some handloads to see if it speeds up.
@@Dfleuryoutdoorsit’s not that the advertised velocities on boxes are for what the cartridge was designed for, more like nearly all ammo manufacturers do their chrono readings out of a 24” barrel for standardizing purposes
@@Dfleuryoutdoorsoh man I definitely can believe that. I have an ar 22" 204 and it will make your ears ring for days. I'm guessing a little longer barrel would help tame the muzzle blast. I put a liner compensator on and it helped to take some pain out of the report but still the loudest gun I think I've ever heard.
my guess is you loose approximately 20 to 25 fps per inch of barrel under 24. You should run the numbers with out your can and the break on. I don't think the number will be huge but I would expect it to be less than what you came up with. my 2 cents
Great intel brother. And heck yes that Arken SH4 are sweet! Dude i had no idea you were a arken affiliate with discount. Thanks. Buying a New SH4J 6-24 for my new Savage axis 6.5 creed build
So I have this exact chrono and am curious, after plugging in all your data into your ballistic app and shooting at distance to verify FPS and BC how much is your chrono actually off? I've found mine to consistently read low versus what my app (strelok pro) tells me. It's been the same on multiple of mine so far. Curious of your results
Those velocities seem right in line with what I would expect with 140 gr. I’m wondering how much that suppressor may be helping. I’d love to see the test again without the suppressor. Just for reference I’m getting an average of 2910 with a 24 inch barrel using 140 gr Sierra pro hunter and a max charge listed in the Sierra manual.
QUESTION: I am considering the Ruger American Gen2 Ranch in 6.5 Creedmoor, I generally want to use the rifle for Whitetail & Hogs - hence the shorter Ranch 16" barrel - how drastic of a difference in accuracy & distance would I be sacrificing with the 16" Ranch barrel over the standard 20" barrel?? Thanks. 👌👍👊💪😊
@@WHOTEEWHO How big a deal is losing that 200-300 fps if we are talking about a max yardage of 200 yards? Enough to warrant the 20" Standards barrel? Thanks so much!
rounds like 308 and 7mm-08, all your powder will burn in an 18-20 inch barrel, hence you'll get all of the velocity you're going to out of a short barrel.
There is still velocity to be gained after all the powder is burned because you still have preasure. Complete Powder burn will reduce muzzle flash. That said I still prefer the shorter barrels for a hunting rig. 100-150 fps won't make much difference if you know your ballistics and range. I know it's possible to take game beyond 400 yds but not for me. Typically a lot less.
I think the problem is that the choice of length is gone. If Ruger would offer the guns in "carbine" and "rifle" marketing terms and have the barrels be something like 18'' and 22'' or 16 1/2'' & 22'' I'd bet most people would have been much happier. Velocity of 1 load in the 20'' barrel length doesn't mean all that much. Different powders and different bullet weights react differently in shorter/longer barrels. The cartridges in the 7mm-08 powder volume class (such as 7mm-08, 308, 6.5 Creedmoor) average about 45-75fps gain/loss per inch of barrel depending on bullet weight and powder. The difference between 20'' and 22'' isn't going to make a big difference to a deer at 200 yards but it will change bullet drop and drift at 600 yards and beyond by a significant amount. Again, the big problem I see is choice. Give people the choice between a longer and shorter option and most people will be happy. And let's improve the look of that cheekpiece. It looks like somebody found an old recoil pad and some JB weld and slapped it together
The Ruger American Gen II "Predator" has a 22 inch barrel, the regular Gen II has a 20 inch and the ranch models have a 16 inch barrel as far as I've been able to find out.
My vote is barrel length only matters if you’re a long range western hunter. For someone like me hunting in the thick NH woods a shorter and lighter rifle is best. My Ruger American Predator with 18” barrel in 308 works perfectly for me. Slap on an $80 Bushnell 3-9 and good to go.
* How about shooting the gun without the can? Most shooters don't have a suppressor. It would be more relevant to see what the muzzle velocity actually is compared to what is printed on the ammunition box. Interested to find out what differences are realized between a plain barrel and one with a suppressor.
Here’s a couple barrel length/velocity stories you’ll think are just that, stories. 22” vs 18” 17HMR. 18” Ruger chronied almost identical to 22” Marlin 917V. And this will blow your mind or have you calling me a liar, but I have chrony data to back it up…..22LR MiniMag (both weights) faster in my 10” TC Contender match barrel than ANY of my rifles! Including a 26” Mauser (which was second slowest). So barrel length isn’t always what we think. But in centerfire I have seen more of the generally accepted 20-40fps drop per inch. Take care!
I believe you. Rim fires don't have a lot of powder in the case. Longer barrels let the powder burn off and lose velocity. That 10" match barrel has tighter tolerances as well.
I actually like the 20 inch barrel. It’s short and handy for backcountry hunting, but isn’t crazy short like those European 18 and 16 inch barreled rifles. It’s balanced. For a magnum I would prefer a 22 inch barrel, but it still works fine.
Could you when you get time do the speed test without the silencer and just with the muzzle brake to see if there is any difference then it would make a good comparison video because with the can it’s modified and the brake is stock
In the first 100 yards of bullet travel a 140 grain bullet from the 7mm-08 will loose 232fps in a 24 inch barrel. Between 300 and 400 yards it will loose 199fps. So if your really hung up on velocity from this barrel you can look at it this way. It would be like standing 50 yards further from the deer. Considering the 7mm-08 is very capable of taking a deer at 500 yards I don't think that 50 yards different or 50 fps difference in muzzle velocity would make any noticeable difference to hunter or the deer. There can be a more difference in calibers that are overbore like 243 or magnums or PRC cartridges thy nerf longer bsrreld tp strain tartar higher vrlovities. For hunters hunting at ethical distances its not a factor; you you just hav to stalk 50 years closer and you got the same prrformance on deer. So you can expect a 50 yards difference in Maximum point blank range and effective range with the 7mm08 Not enough difference to even consider. You just have to stalk 50 yards closer. About the only thing you notice is a little more muzzle blast. Not much of a penalty in the grand scheme of things. Wtiht reloads you can gain some of that velocity back .My Sako has a 21.5 in barrel and my reload are about 2800-2820 with 760 and 414 with various 140 grain bullet and. will push 160 grain bullets at 2590 fps.. That load kill a moose with one shot at 200yards with one shot and it was quartering towards me. It fell right there.Don't underestimate the 7mm-08. It's a very efficient hunting caliber.
I got to be the 1,000th like on this video! Thanks for addressing this - I think you mentioned that the 20" is really 18" because it includes the muzzle break. Your results confirm conventional wisdom that the 308 (and cartridges based on it) does really well accuracy and velocity wise with shorter barrels. You also get a little bump with the suppressor, right?
What’s your base line. The box velocity is never true. What’s the actual chronograph velocity’s from a 24” barrel and without the can on the generation 2.
I like the SHORT barrel, and lighter bullets. I've hunted with the 7mm-08 from 1982 until now. The 120gr. Hollow points are sure death on whitetail. The Remington 140 is to hard , I also reload. Great round, wish more rifles were putting this round out. Hint Springfield waypoint redline.....
Sir, I love your videos, I was wondering if you could do a long range test with your Ruger American Gen II in 7mm-08, say out to 600 yds.. all the videos on this caliber have been great and I am really thinking of picking one up. Thanks, Don
20 inches is the ideal rifle barrel length, in my opinion. It seems to run everything well with plenty of power and accuracy. I even prefer a 20-inch AR.
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Great video! Now, a velocity comparison between your Gen 1 Ruger American 7mm-08 with 22 inch barrel and the Gen 2 without the can is in order. A real apples to apples comparison!
Keep up the good work! Love your videos. Especially the 7mm-08 ones.
I traded the Gen 1 in on the Gen 2
Does the myzzle brake help with recoil
The best thing to do is exactly this: Chronograph your rifle with the bullets you plan to use, get a ballistic calculator, go with the energy and drop it tells you, and stay in those parameters. A longer barrel will increase your distance, but sometimes it’s nice to have a lighter and more maneuverable rifle. 👍🏼
It’s all give and take!
It’s funny that people get caught up in this. It’s not as substantial as people think. I went down this rabbit hole years ago when building a 308. Settled on a short barrel, took it to the field and animals reacted the same way to 16” velocity as they did with 24” velocity……down! Even shooting distance, learning mils and moa is where it’s at.
Agreed. That's how I was taught when shot groundhog matches some years back. Accuracy trumps velocity. Barrel life aside.
That's not untrue, but velocity gives you more advantages, it extends your range by giving more distance where your bullet will perform the way it's supposed to. All bullets are dependent on velocity to work correctly, and personally I'd rather have a longer effective range than a shorter one.
The downside of a shorter barrel is overall effective range, while the downside of a longer barrel is less maneuverability, one of those is a non issue and one of those is a deal breaker.
Longer barrels are better.
I've been shooting and hand loading the 7mm-08 for about 20 years using SP or HP bullets running at around 2,775 fps from a 22" barrel and perhaps I could have run them faster (but what for?!). I've accounted for well over 100 deer out to 300 metres (Reds and Fallow here in the UK) with this particular calibre and never lost one, not to say I haven't at all but the one's I did lose were with 7x64 and 6.5x55 and not the cartridges fault, mine! We shouldn't get hung up on bullet speed, start worrying if you can't put the bullet in the right place!
I now use 150gr for long range target and 130gr copper at 2,850 fps for hunting with the 7mm-08, perfect.
Which means the shorter barrel Ruger American will do just fine.
Love quick videos that get straight to the point. Good work.
Thanks for watching
I've always been intrigued by the nuances of barrel length and its effects on performance.
People keep saying the ACTUAL barrel length on these Gen 2 's is 18.75" as the muzzle break is included in the 20" measurement. I don't have one, so I can't check that, however, the muzzle velocity u got was great if it's an 18.75" barrel. I have 308 Ruger Scout with an 18.5' barrel and it's fine for me. I wouldn't want a 7mm Rem Mag in that barrel length.
Long actions, especially magnums, should be 22". We shall see!
I’ve been seeing companies including the muzzle break on the barrel length here lately
I called Ruger directly and verified barrel length is not including muzzle brake
I just bought the 243 And it's for sure a 20" then muzzle brake
I have an old browning abolt 243 with the boss system. It's advertised as a 22 inch barrel, but they are counting the boss. It's actually about 19.5 inches. But even from the shorter barrel I'm getting almost 3100 fps with 85 grain bullets. Not to bad.
Thanks!
Thanks for watching!
7mm-08 and 308 are very good efficient cartridges
30-06 will be like a 308 in that barrel length, (magnum rounds also will underperform in that short barrel) so there are cases that need those few missing inches than others
Love them rugers and can’t wait to see how that trail hunter you picked up works. Keep up the good work.
More velocity isn't always better. I shoot a carbine Remington 7600 3006 18.5 inch barrel. At close ranges 10 to 125yds I was having major issues with bullets not exiting and overall not performing well. I turned some Hornady sst 165 down to 2475fps and they did an amazing job only recovered 1 projectile out of 8 kills this season. It was complete and mushroomed perfectly . Here in South Carolina in the woods hinting 125yds is a long shot.
I have a savage storm lighweight 7mm-08 that I shoot Hornady SST 139 Superformance. Never chronograph in a 24 inch barrel but suppose to be 2950. I cut my barrel down to 16.5 for nice woods light short gun. Chronograph at 2756. For losing 7.5 inches of barrel compared to the normal I was impressed. Need to find someone with a 24 inch barrel to see what they actually do.
I love the predator, for hunting that 18 inch is just sweet! Perfect weight and length for most hunting situations in the eastern half of USA! I understand long range out west wanting longer barrel lengths but if you look at some of those western hunting legends (Ron Spomer type guys) they like a shorter lighter rifle for spot and stalk and long hikes up in the hills! Just my opinion!
Your absolutely right!
Yep. In my hardwoods, my longest shot is 75 yards.
The suppressor helps velocity as keeping gases in the extended suppressor.
The suppressors slows down the gases so much the difference in speed with and without is very low. Which is kinda the whole point of a suppressor
Yeah, this is what I expected when I saw the complaints. There’s a point of diminishing returns on length in any caliber.
Your content is absolutely amazing, I have to say I’m impressed with all of your work, finds and to share it with us . I can’t say thank you enough. All your content is very helpful to all of us from the average person to the knowledgeable people involved in this great hobby / living . Cheers 🇨🇦
🙏🙏🙏 appreciate you watching
There are Calibers like the 308 Family that work well with Shorter Barrels(cases that hold under or around 45 grains of Powder), a 30-06 on the other Hand doesnt even if you handload and use faster burning powders to get 100% Burnrate with a good 85 to 92% Casefill. Magnums are even worse with Shorter Barrels
Another good Cartridge for this is 8mm Mauser wich is the Reason why it has a strong comeback over the last Decade in Europe espacially in Germany where we often Hunt at Shorter Ranges (Driven Hunts, Hunting from Treestands....) and play around with Supressors way longer then my American Friends. So we Tend to want Handy Rifles (Short Barrels with Over Barrel Supressors to get the Shortest possible Package), i am a little bit on the conservative Side and say 20inch is a good compromise Speed and Performancewise others go as far as 14 inch for their go to everyday Rifles but some Calibers are way more suitable for this short of a Barrel then others. The newest and hottest Kid on the Block is 8.5x55 Blaser which is designed to work out of short Barrels without losing to much Power. I stay with my 20 Inch 308 loaded with 130gn Barnes ttsx at 3050ft/s even big Adult Red Stag and big Wildboar Keiler dont like them 😂
These new rifles are super tempting. How much of a difference does the supressor make? I'd be curious to see what the fps values are with it removed and everything else the same.
Scheels moved into my town. Scheels did not have this caliber in stock. Talked to manager and he called other Scheels and could not find one in that caliber. I waited a little longer and the manager found just one rifle. So I purchased it today 5/2024 and it will be in my store next week. Can’t wait to get it to the range. Bought it off your reviews who tee who!!!
I certainly appreciate the numbers from the chrony. Thanks again for the good work.
Im shorter barrel kinda a guy. I cut and threaded my gen 1 ruger american in 270 to 20" because i wanted a quicker, lighter and shorter barrel to put a suppressor on it. I didnt have a huge drop in velocity. It all depends on the cartridge and how much you lose. Its also good to know your minimum expansion velocity on the bullets your shooting and the velocity to get your max hunting range.
That’s a sweet rifle. If they made a metal trigger guard and a way to smooth out the bolt I’d bet one with a short barrel for Adirondack mountain hunting in maybe 308 or something. That velocity held up fine at that barrel length and outperformed my expectations for it
An extra 2 inches wouldn't make much of a difference. I have a 16 inch Ranch and 22 inch Predator in 6.5 Grendel, the Predator with a 120grn Nosler BT runs at 2400fps and the Ranch 120fps slower.
So a bit more load development needed there, but they both shoot extremely well. As a bonus I can use 120 Sierra's and there is no change in point of impact, but the Sierra's don't hold together as well as the Nosler's.
Yeah, I think posted velocities are often 24 inch barrel, but who thought going from 24 to 20 would cost you 210fps? Once you get up past 16 inches the increments of increased velocity are reasonably small. Partly depending on powder, granted. If you were running US-869 out of a 338 Lapua I could see a dramatic loss from a shorter barrel.
I prefer shorter barrels so I’m glad they went that route. I’m curious what the barrel length for the 30-06/300wm and other cartridges will be.
Good info. Thx. I prefer 20 inch or shorter for using a can.
If your gonna load for the 7mm08 use Winchester StaBall 6.5. That powder is made for that cartridge. I’m getting 1/2” to 1” groups and about 150-200 fps faster than any other powder I tried. Best powder cartridge combo I’ve found
I'm not sure what grain bullets you are shooting. There are several that will shoot out of the cartridge. Therefore there will be many powder/bullet combinations. I'm sure that in your rifle it shoots great. My findings of hand loading for 30 plus years is that compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges. Barrel length being the same to bullet weight to barrel twist. Then you have to figure in barrel harmonics in every barrel is different. So it's NOT as simple as what you state.
Another factor to consider is your powder burn rate and efficiency along with ballistic efficiency. IMR8208 XBR is another powder with higher burn efficiency and the speed is comparable. Winchester 760 is another powder that is capable of close ballistic efficiency and speed. If you know how to identify pressure signs, another powder to consider is Hodgdon H414. You can run a compressed load and achieve almost exact loads for speed and powder burned. Some times looking at the powder availability is very important too. Considering powder availability.......Just sayin.
Try CFE223 and 120 Hammer Hunters.
3250 fps and SD of 9
@@NightSniper64 I’ve shot anything from 120-165 gr bullets with that powder out of two rifles. Both achieved 100-200fps than any other powder. Sometimes it is just that simple.
@@NightSniper64120 Barnes ttsx 3300fps, 140 nosler bt 3050fps, 150 nosler by 2980 fps, 160 nosler accubond 2910fps, 165 Sierra game changer 2850fps. All with book charges. 22-24 inch barrels. All sun moa. Sorry for making a suggestion . I didn’t know we had to get technical and make reloading difficult. Next time I’ll include my barrel harmonic data so he can adjust accordingly.
I like the shorter version doesn't seem to hurt. The preformens you can get a shorter Bing bang up easier then a longer one up on target dude
Really enjoying the 7mm-08 vids. How much does that rifle weigh empty, including the suppressor, rail and scope?
I’ve learned that speed doesn’t kill. It’s the accuracy that matters
Better than I expected
Me too
I have a Gen 1 7-08 compact with the 18" barrel
I've recently heard the more overbore a cartridge is, the more barrel length matters. Since the 308 is a near perfect design (for what it is) it doesn't lose much velocity per inch (to an extent) and since 7mm is pretty close to a 30 cal that makes sense. A 243 however would suffer greatly I suspect
This is especially true with the new 7mm PRC.
Great video! I wish more people would do videos that are this matter of fact. With that data and ammo, you’re gettin a shade over 2400 ft/lbs at the muzzle stayin over 1000 ft/lbs out to about 470 yards. I understand that some people do take longer shots on deer, but the majority aren’t even trying to shake a stick 400 for deer. 2785 avg for a 140 grain bullet far more than enough for deer.
I appreciate you watching
Loving the ruger american gen 2 content!
Cool good info Hey to Paul Jr. ✌
Good evening wtw nation !👏👏
Heyoooo
I'm sure you've already done the video but I hope you might have done it With the straight barrel with the muzzle break and with the can.
I did not, but difference would be negligible I assume
Usually a can will affect accuracy if there is a fitment problem, but not velocity.
@@brianklamer3328 I believe I have seen a youtuber test with and without a can, maybe Military Arms Channel and the back pressure of the can did help increase velocity
edit: I can't find the video and a few other videos I watched showed only a few FPS boost with the supressor
Doesn't the suppressor act as a barrel extention? Just saying I think it does
20" barrels seem to be a solid middle ground between the 16" and 18" barrels compared to the 22" and 24". Velocity gained after 20" really seems minimal in most common calibers like 5.56/.223 and .308.
Generally, the overbore cartridges like 243 or 22-250 prefer long barrels and more efficient cartridges like 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor don't mind shorties, but still appreciate longer pipes.
Light & handy suits me just fine. I'd be okay with 2" less for "typical" flingin' & slingin' range.
Would like to see how that does with the 180 ELDs Hornady considering that rifle has a 1-8.5 twist. You'll have to load some.
As always thank you for my after work entertainment
Thanks for watching!
I wonder, when they take two inches off the barrel length, do they change the twist rate as well?
In this case, no
Not disappointed with this. Good. Big thanks
Larger calibers wont lose as much velocity because they can use faster powders. 308 and up is fine with a 20" barrel. 6.5 creed and smaller you want really want longer. The 7mm08 is right on the border. Im curious what they'll put on the magnum calibers when they come out.
Caliber size doesn't correlate to powder burn rate. It's more associated with overbore. 45 70 can use faster powder and it's a 45 cal 25 06 and 7mag use slower powders and are similar in overbore (diameter of projectile in correlation to case capacity) 300 blackout can use shotgun or pistol powder (very fast burn) slower powders benefit longer barrels... Basically overbore cartridges can take more advantage of a longer barrel.
@jcows12 when I say caliber , I'm referring to the diameter of the projectile, not the size of the overall cartridge. Just like you said, 45-75 being a large 45 cal can use fast powder. And 25-06 being a small 25 can uses slow powders.
If you buy shorter barrels just have to understand what you are giving up - but you can have most calibers - especially modern cartridges- in shorter barrels because they are burning powder more efficiently. Can you run a 16 or 18” 6.5 creedmoor? Yep and because it has a higher BC than a 308 it’s going to deflect wind better and have less drop despite it being slower than if it were shot out of an 20-24” barrel. I think that’s what a lot of people miss - you don’t give up much in terms of efficiency/ethical distance by having a shorter gun. But a shorter gun with a suppressor is definitely more handy.
I think they will follow suit with other industry partners for their magnums and go 22”. I hope for the 6.5PRC they keep it at 20” though
Doesn't the suppressor add some velocity? Would be interested to see with the brake sent or just the thread protector
Enjoyed the video thank you!
Thanks for watching
When you go to reload the 7/08 i got best velocity with rel19 and H4350 and also 748 but maybe faster powder might be worth a shot maybe re15 or varget try it
The 223 coming in an 1/8 twist is sweet
Thanks for the video! I have the same gun in 204 Ruger, went out and shot Hornady Superperformance 40 gr Vmax with an advertised velocity of 3900 FPS and I was getting about 3550. It shot well under sub MOA, but velocity was down. I’ll keep shooting and try some handloads to see if it speeds up.
One thing with .204 Ruger is the advertised velocity is likely using a 24” or 26” barrel, so a pretty big difference
@@noahgullion2 yup 204 was designed for a 26" barrel
@@Dfleuryoutdoorsit’s not that the advertised velocities on boxes are for what the cartridge was designed for, more like nearly all ammo manufacturers do their chrono readings out of a 24” barrel for standardizing purposes
@@Dfleuryoutdoorsoh man I definitely can believe that. I have an ar 22" 204 and it will make your ears ring for days. I'm guessing a little longer barrel would help tame the muzzle blast. I put a liner compensator on and it helped to take some pain out of the report but still the loudest gun I think I've ever heard.
How many rounds through your gun? Most barrels speed up once broken in. I'd worry more about accuracy than velocity myself.
My 18.5" 308 get deer just fine
Pretty sure you already have but have you seen the new Ruger Predator Gen 2. They have the 22 inch barrel with brake. Cool color also.
I've seen em online. Not seen any for sale tho
my guess is you loose approximately 20 to 25 fps per inch of barrel under 24. You should run the numbers with out your can and the break on. I don't think the number will be huge but I would expect it to be less than what you came up with. my 2 cents
How about without the can? Not everybody have the cans. Do they increase velocity?
Thanks for your hard work
Thanks for watching
Great intel brother. And heck yes that Arken SH4 are sweet! Dude i had no idea you were a arken affiliate with discount. Thanks. Buying a New SH4J 6-24 for my new Savage axis 6.5 creed build
Thanks for watching! I am definitely a fan of the Arkens
I have this rifle in 7prc and I’m way off the box speed with eldx from Hornady?
Is this normal? I’m 300fps lower 3 shot average is 2586 box is 3k 🤨😳. Shot other rifles to make sure my chrono was not off and those numbers were on.
I like the short barrel. I bought my gen 1 ranch for this reason... I like my stuff compact!
So I have this exact chrono and am curious, after plugging in all your data into your ballistic app and shooting at distance to verify FPS and BC how much is your chrono actually off? I've found mine to consistently read low versus what my app (strelok pro) tells me. It's been the same on multiple of mine so far. Curious of your results
Good info to have , especially for reloading .
Those velocities seem right in line with what I would expect with 140 gr. I’m wondering how much that suppressor may be helping. I’d love to see the test again without the suppressor. Just for reference I’m getting an average of 2910 with a 24 inch barrel using 140 gr Sierra pro hunter and a max charge listed in the Sierra manual.
Exactly that Barrel was 18.75 inches with the can on it it its more like 24 lol
Thanks for the information
QUESTION: I am considering the Ruger American Gen2 Ranch in 6.5 Creedmoor, I generally want to use the rifle for Whitetail & Hogs - hence the shorter Ranch 16" barrel - how drastic of a difference in accuracy & distance would I be sacrificing with the 16" Ranch barrel over the standard 20" barrel?? Thanks. 👌👍👊💪😊
Shouldn't lose any accuracy. My guess is you will lose 200-300 fps or so
@@WHOTEEWHO How big a deal is losing that 200-300 fps if we are talking about a max yardage of 200 yards? Enough to warrant the 20" Standards barrel? Thanks so much!
rounds like 308 and 7mm-08, all your powder will burn in an 18-20 inch barrel, hence you'll get all of the velocity you're going to out of a short barrel.
There is still velocity to be gained after all the powder is burned because you still have preasure. Complete Powder burn will reduce muzzle flash.
That said I still prefer the shorter barrels for a hunting rig. 100-150 fps won't make much difference if you know your ballistics and range. I know it's possible to take game beyond 400 yds but not for me. Typically a lot less.
I think the problem is that the choice of length is gone. If Ruger would offer the guns in "carbine" and "rifle" marketing terms and have the barrels be something like 18'' and 22'' or 16 1/2'' & 22'' I'd bet most people would have been much happier. Velocity of 1 load in the 20'' barrel length doesn't mean all that much. Different powders and different bullet weights react differently in shorter/longer barrels. The cartridges in the 7mm-08 powder volume class (such as 7mm-08, 308, 6.5 Creedmoor) average about 45-75fps gain/loss per inch of barrel depending on bullet weight and powder. The difference between 20'' and 22'' isn't going to make a big difference to a deer at 200 yards but it will change bullet drop and drift at 600 yards and beyond by a significant amount. Again, the big problem I see is choice. Give people the choice between a longer and shorter option and most people will be happy. And let's improve the look of that cheekpiece. It looks like somebody found an old recoil pad and some JB weld and slapped it together
Does it come with a thread protector, like most threaded barrels. I'm not a fan of muzzle brakes and I don't own a can to put on it.
It does not
Good video but u want loose much velocity not enough powder. And also depends on alot more factors
I'm waiting for the .300 win mag in gen2.
They aren’t a 20” barrel though are they? They are including the muzzle break in barrel length
What's the numbers with the factory setup vs that shusher can ?, if you wouldn't mind flinging them.
The Ruger American Gen II "Predator" has a 22 inch barrel, the regular Gen II has a 20 inch and the ranch models have a 16 inch barrel as far as I've been able to find out.
Need to see testing video of the stevens 334.
Coming soon
Should have done test without silencer. Probably would be slower .
My vote is barrel length only matters if you’re a long range western hunter. For someone like me hunting in the thick NH woods a shorter and lighter rifle is best. My Ruger American Predator with 18” barrel in 308 works perfectly for me. Slap on an $80 Bushnell 3-9 and good to go.
* How about shooting the gun without the can? Most shooters don't have a suppressor. It would be more relevant to see what the muzzle velocity actually is compared to what is printed on the ammunition box. Interested to find out what differences are realized between a plain barrel and one with a suppressor.
You should do that without the can on the front.
Here’s a couple barrel length/velocity stories you’ll think are just that, stories. 22” vs 18” 17HMR. 18” Ruger chronied almost identical to 22” Marlin 917V. And this will blow your mind or have you calling me a liar, but I have chrony data to back it up…..22LR MiniMag (both weights) faster in my 10” TC Contender match barrel than ANY of my rifles! Including a 26” Mauser (which was second slowest). So barrel length isn’t always what we think. But in centerfire I have seen more of the generally accepted 20-40fps drop per inch. Take care!
I believe you. Rim fires don't have a lot of powder in the case. Longer barrels let the powder burn off and lose velocity. That 10" match barrel has tighter tolerances as well.
I actually like the 20 inch barrel. It’s short and handy for backcountry hunting, but isn’t crazy short like those European 18 and 16 inch barreled rifles.
It’s balanced. For a magnum I would prefer a 22 inch barrel, but it still works fine.
Is there any difference in the speed without the can
Could you when you get time do the speed test without the silencer and just with the muzzle brake to see if there is any difference then it would make a good comparison video because with the can it’s modified and the brake is stock
In the first 100 yards of bullet travel a 140 grain bullet from the 7mm-08 will loose 232fps in a 24 inch barrel. Between 300 and 400 yards it will loose 199fps. So if your really hung up on velocity from this barrel you can look at it this way. It would be like standing 50 yards further from the deer. Considering the 7mm-08 is very capable of taking a deer at 500 yards I don't think that 50 yards different or 50 fps difference in muzzle velocity would make any noticeable difference to hunter or the deer. There can be a more difference in calibers that are overbore like 243 or magnums or PRC cartridges thy nerf longer bsrreld tp strain tartar higher vrlovities. For hunters hunting at ethical distances its not a factor; you you just hav to stalk 50 years closer and you got the same prrformance on deer. So you can expect a 50 yards difference in Maximum point blank range and effective range with the 7mm08 Not enough difference to even consider. You just have to stalk 50 yards closer. About the only thing you notice is a little more muzzle blast. Not much of a penalty in the grand scheme of things. Wtiht reloads you can gain some of that velocity back .My Sako has a 21.5 in barrel and my reload are about 2800-2820 with 760 and 414 with various 140 grain bullet and. will push 160 grain bullets at 2590 fps.. That load kill a moose with one shot at 200yards with one shot and it was quartering towards me. It fell right there.Don't underestimate the 7mm-08. It's a very efficient hunting caliber.
Great rifle just picked one up. Like how it well accept AI mags so I can run the 5 and 10 rounders.
And what is the speed with the 22" barrel???????
What velocity WITHOUT the can?!?
I got to be the 1,000th like on this video! Thanks for addressing this - I think you mentioned that the 20" is really 18" because it includes the muzzle break. Your results confirm conventional wisdom that the 308 (and cartridges based on it) does really well accuracy and velocity wise with shorter barrels. You also get a little bump with the suppressor, right?
What’s your base line. The box velocity is never true. What’s the actual chronograph velocity’s from a 24” barrel and without the can on the generation 2.
Can you redo this test without the shusher?
I like the SHORT barrel, and lighter bullets. I've hunted with the 7mm-08 from 1982 until now. The 120gr. Hollow points are sure death on whitetail. The Remington 140 is to hard , I also reload. Great round, wish more rifles were putting this round out. Hint Springfield waypoint redline.....
Why would speed change per bullet
What height rings where you running on this setup if you don't mind me asking?
Arken halo rings
Luv the Ruger's '' Great Video Adam 💯💥💥💥💥💥💥💥
Overbore cartridges like 243 will be effected much more
How about without the can?
Any speeds out of this rifle in 6.5 creedmoor???
Nope
Can we get some? Please
What’s the ring height another Great Video
Medium
Sir, I love your videos, I was wondering if you could do a long range test with your Ruger American Gen II in 7mm-08, say out to 600 yds.. all the videos on this caliber have been great and I am really thinking of picking one up. Thanks, Don
Yes I will. Stay tuned
@@WHOTEEWHO Thank you Sir look forward to it.
Just FYI having a suppressor on increase muzzle velocity!! 😂😂
Does the Can help increase velocity?
Very slightly
Cool stuff! 😀
20 inches is the ideal rifle barrel length, in my opinion. It seems to run everything well with plenty of power and accuracy. I even prefer a 20-inch AR.