In those days people bent the truth a bit to be kind to relatives. My dad's sister wanted to divorce her husband but he wouldn't give her a divorce, so she ended up living with the man she loved. We were all told they were married. My husband has a friend who didn't find out his parents weren't his until he was an adult. The husband was a taxi driver & he found a baby left in his taxi one night. He & his wife kept the baby & raised him as their son. Times were different.
it sounds like your grandpa Thomas was dating and messing around with Ella and got her pregnant a couple times and in those days they had to get married but the relationship didn't work out and then he met your grandma and then married her in Virginia because he already had marriage on the docket in the current state (so the lie may have been, let's have a destination wedding) but he actually love her and had a life with her and seemingly he had two families in two different households probably within the same parameters or block or neighborhood just different streets so he can access both sets of children and your grandma found out that her husband Thomas was previously married with other children and so they probably had a separation but in that day you didn't do separation so your grandma met dr. John and that was her new man... But she was still married legally to your grandpa Thomas until he end up passing and then her and Doctor John could be legal... This is absolutely The Young and the restless 1900 series...But I'm glad that you are finding truth in your family history... Keep searching sweetie...
My father-in-law was always very secretive about his family and I found out the facts on ancestry. What amazed me was that the scandals kept piling up. I went back another generation and just say, there was more. Phew! Don't need soap operas, ancestry keeps me entertained.
Secrets that our relatives had. Found out after my mom died in 2002 that she was married before marrying our dad but no marriage certificate nor divorce. Also in 1940 census she is stated to be 21 but was born in 1922 so she was actually 18. Says also that she had been married 5 years so was 13 when she got married. She lived on a reservation with her husband and father. Husbands name same as her father’s. Was her first husband a cousin, a Native American? Was her father Native American. Never spoke about her dad. Found out he was alive til 1951. We can only guess or suppose the answers cause she took most of her secrets to the grave.
a DNA test would answer one question, you might have indigenous ancestry. Indigenous people in the US and Canada had scant records until recently unlike my country of birth where i know my ancestry back hundreds of years ,but i doubt white people would have been living on a reservation. Good luck with your quest.
I had been wanting to have the Ancestry testing done for awhile and no surprises on my side but had a couple cool surprises on my husband's. Family legend always said that his great great grandfather faked his death the yr of a big flood, moved, changed the family name and started a new family by which my husband is a descendent. Turns out it was true. I was able to figure out who his gg grandfather was in his first life and verified it after a descended of his first wife reached out with a story of a disappearing gg grandfather rumored to have died in a flood. Then my husband also matched with his grandfathers sister who was adopted out as a child. Nobody ever knew what happened to her and assumed her dead bc of her health issues that led to her being adopted out. Through matching with him on Ancestry DNA she was able to get her in contact with her two living siblings with whom she had searched for for years.
Appalachia Jennifer dude! That’s amazing! I’m pretty sure mine’s just a matter of Pennsylvania not putting divorce records online yet! That’s amazing that you helped out like that.
That's interesting, it is a bit unusual, but more unusual that you found out. There were lots of married men and women who were on separate continents and then had new families, but without any divorce papers.
I realize this is an older video, but it just showed up on my TH-cam feed. I found the story fascinating. I love hearing about people's family histories/mysteries. I was curious about the connections between Ruth and her marriages. I did look up Dr Lange on the 1930's census. I was wondering if you noticed the age Ruth was at that time? And then the age she would have been at the time she married Thomas? I wonder if the age at the time of her first marriage is why Kay was born 6 years later? Again very interesting story.
I'm now 80 yo and luckily bordered two types of generations: pre birth control (the pill) and post birth control. Once birth control (the pill) came along, the world started to change significantly for women. Suddenly, women were "free." I remember the strict social hardships placed on females and at 16 yo I concluded that I will never get married. Women were second class citizens. In the 1970s in Canada a woman could not even own her property outright. My brother had to sign the mortgage for my mom. I remember when a girl got pregnant out of wedlock, parents would force her to give up her child. (I watch a lot of utube about those children, when grown up, searching for their moms.) A lot of heartache. We tend to think that the world is going to the dogs these days. But I remember how rotten it was when I was a child. Society really browbeat females.
Good work! I found similar stuff in my family tree. People saying they were never married before when they had been. People raising other people's children while the biological parent lived down the street for years. Two women both having babies with the same name in the same year - one the wife of my grand uncle and the other his mistress (and both babies were "Jr"). People going to Canada to have children out of wedlock, then coming back and portraying the situation differently. Those people had no way of knowing that someday EVERYTHING would come out.
Wendy Lynn I don’t know that it’s really bigamy. I made this vid over a year ago primarily for my friends and family. We all tend to think the divorce or divorces just aren’t part of the ancestry index. It’s not like I poured through courthouse records, I’m just looking online. That said, these people are my blood relatives and probably knew we would go poking. It’s a family trait! ;) Your tree sounds wild! Gotta love it!
@@GigglingKat I have found several divorces in my Family tree, and because almost all were in England,there is a ton of paper work connected with each one because it was a such a serious process. But if you marry someone else while still married to the 1st spouse, yes it's bygamy and a lot of it went on because those divorce laws were pretty tough to work around and even worse if you were Catholic.
What I found touching was the 'snap' of your grandmother. My mother's family had albums full of them. Everyone had a Brownie camera, in my childhood. Now, all are gone. My mother, her 8 siblings, cousins, gone. And the albums all disappeared, as everyone went off in different directions, to different lives. Thank you for the interesting look into your grandmother's past.
S. HURD- tell your cousins to write on back or in album 🤔 who people are. My MIL left me pictures " At Aunt and Uncles House- Boy We Had A Good time!"- only family member of that generation to post- decease her was Legally Blind- asked cousins- MIL was oldest of that generation- nobody recognized anyone so I can't pass them on. Just wait- when I die my children WILL STILL WONDER who they Are.
You do know that Pittsburgh is very close geographically to West Virginia, right? They could easily have lived in Pburgh and driven across the state line and married in West Virginia. That was common. :)
My parents “ran away” to W Va because Mom’s parents did not approve of Dad. They were married in church 3 days later. I was born 9 months and 1 Week later. My Grandmother always moaned that they got married because she was pregnant. My parents were married for 43 years.
Yes and Ruth hid it even though she was probably innocent in the whole dealing and had no idea he was a bigamist; because people would have still blamed her back then.
Unfortunately, in just about everything the woman received the absolute worst even though they were completely innocent! Soooooo glad I wasn't born then!
You said they are Roman Catholic Irish Catholic. If you go into the church records you can find more information. You also have to take into consideration that the Catholic Church did not allow for divorce. In the eyes of the church they was sinners so many was embarrassing of the situation so it would be kept a secret even from their own kids. Your grandmother more than likely my have not fully actually known or she may have and was drilled into her as a child that the secret was to be kept as a secret. She may also have grown up thinking her dad was a uncle not her father as that was common as well to save face. They probably did live in a large home. Many would cross state lines to marry so nobody would know any different about her marriage because of local papers would publish marriages in the papers. I had the same issue in trying to figure out my gg grandfather.
Yes, I know that the church wouldn’t have acknowledged the second marriage without some documented counseling- but there is a notorious fire in the records in the 50s that took out most of the date range involved. It’s not likely I’m going to find it and for the most part I’m okay with what I’ve found. My grandmother was baptized and confirmed under Dr John’s name and considered him her real father. We’re good following suit. The vid was mainly targeted to my cousins and friends who would share my amusement at finding a clue to The Big Mystery but I’m glad others find it interesting;)
This was fun to listen to. We’re thinking of doing a dna search for my maternal grandmother’s “children” she had after she left her marriage, when mom was very young. It’s all very fascinating to see history in these older documents.
..I always heard of my fathers brother had a child but no one believe it was his..well she showed up as a dna match as 2nd cousin so she had to be my first cousins child. She finally got in touch with me and told me who her mother (was my 1st cousin) and grandmother were, she knew nothing about her mothers father (my fathers brother) I wrote back to her and explained about her grandfather who died fairly young . I then invited her to my Tree so she could view all her relatives and ancestors which I had photos of including her grandfather. At least she could see what they looked like and I convinced her we now have proof that we are cousins thru DNA.
J De'Niz : That's so very kind of you to be so helpful and welcome her to your tree. My eldest (half) brother found another half-sister through DNA. My mother had married his father, but his father left after he was born. Apparently new couple? had a daughter. My mother finally managed to track him down and divorce him when she wished to marry my father. Had heard his father had later remarried and had two more boys. The half-sister was born not that long after brother though to another woman. His sister had been told her whole life, by her mother, that another man was her father, but by the time she found out who her real father was both parents had passed, so she never could find out why her mother lied. My brother, through my mother's old retained photographs, was able to provide her photos of her father though, she had never seen. My brother (Aus) is keeping in contact with his sister (UK), but it is unlikely they will meet up because of his health.
Found a very similar thing with my great grandfather around the same time period. Seems like back in the day when divorce was a lot harder people found themselves in the same kind of relationship difficulties that people do now, but they just all agreed to quietly move on and not speak about it.
The panhandle of West Va is right below the Pittsburg area. Some parts of W. Va had border towns that would marry people without a lot of questions. Very popular with elopement and underage couples etc.
i'm thinking that ruth and thomas were renting a room to the dr. then maybe ruth and the dr had an affair and thomas wouldn't divorce her so she could marry the dr. so they had to live in "sin" . most husband back then refused to get a divorce hoping the wife will come back to him. being very religious, living with a man without being married was a shameful sin
lynn miller possibly! Ruth’s mom owned the boarding house so that’s definitely how Ruth met Dr John. Just because I can’t find that Thomas divorced Ella he might have to marry Ruth and then Ruth left him for Dr. John.
Similarly my father (well before DNA research) found out his father's father (okay ... my great grandfather) was married in Norfolk U.K., apparently leaving wife and children to take up with a new partner in London, U.K. and having even more children. There was never any marriage documentation found for him marrying new partner, although it never was suspected they were not married. Bigamy was a very serious charge in those days; jail. This was a wealthy, high class family; children were never made aware of the situation. We assume the family took care of the legitimate wife and the original children. They are still a very wealthy family, but will not mention name for everyones sakes. The daughters (my father's aunts) behaved snobby and very unpleasant towards their brother's bride (my father's mother), even saying she was not good enough for him. My mother said my father's aunts would have been shocked to the core if they ever found out they were illegitimate; a shame his mother never had the opportunity to retort back to those sisters! She had a hard life as it was; lost first husband and only brother in WW1; one son. Remarried another WW1 career soldier; 5 children. Lost 1 daughter dysentary while stationed in India. That husband in his 30s (my grandfather) killed clearing trees for Soldier-Settler scheme in Western Australia. Returned to London with 3 young errant sons and remarried a third time. My mother said she was a very nice, caring lady.
AncestryDNA.com is the worst thing that ever happened to family secrets in the whole wide world. In 1997, a woman contacted me asking me for information about my grandmother. Who her mother had worked for in the mid 1940's. One discussion led to another and she told me that on the night her mother dies in 1992, her mother handed her a photo and told her that "This is your brother". Rolled over, faced the wall, and died in the night with no more comment. She had a younger brother and younger sister with black hair and black eyes. "Teri" had blond hair and blue eyes. I was the baby in the photograph from 1944. My 1/2 sister by my father. Everything fit. Along came AncestryDNA. My father is my father, but my grandfather isn't my father's father. The only relation I have to my father is through his mother, my Great Grandmother and my father's children. It gets better. That means that my 1/2 sister isn't related to me. Her mother was wrong about her father. My mother was an only child. Her mother had a childless brother. My father had two brothers who never had any children. AncestryDNA lists many, many 4th cousins or later. I'm just lost on the ocean.
I’m so sorry you’re feeling lost. I’ve been very lucky that all our surprises have been removed enough to be interesting or good. The vid is old and I’ve also uncovered that Kay had a child she gave up for adoption- my Mom has a half brother who seems like a really great guy but it’s still very surreal.
Well, this is all poopy confusing for you. So according to Coco Chanel, "When there's nothing you can do: wear black and put on red lipstick." Today, we grab the credit card and go get Botox. Then go out to movie!!!! My entire life we thought we were "colored", oops, surprise, Jewish. So shake your head; then after the movie; go to Red Lobster. Love you 👭girlfriend.
Funny thing about the age before ancestry groups, my grand parents on my dad's ide divorced after my aunt was born, but twelve years later they Had to get remarried. They had been 'friends with benefits', who knew!!!!! My dad never said a word. My cousin told me after my dad's funeral. I laughed until there were tears.
Thru ancestry we found that my husbands aunt was on,y half siblings to her two sisters and one brother. I always thought it odd she is stunning with Dark hair and blue eyes while her siblings are fair haired and brown eyes. Never put a lot of thought into it until helping do our family tree and got the DNA tests back for many to add in. I called her daughter who was working on a different area of our trees and said we need to talk. 😳
My grandfather [WWI era] was married at least 8 times. In multiple states [US] and other countries also. I think bigamy was much more common in the old days when record keeping was primitive.
Great story!! I have a bigamy story. My grandmothers grandmother had an incredible life story. My grandmother wrote down the story. In the past 6 years I’ve been able to piece together the details.
I have had nothing but positive experiences with Ancestry genealogical Service and Ancestry DNA!! Found my 70yr old formerly childless uncle a 37yr old daughter (he never knew existed!! They have since met and have been building a beautiful relationship. Really amazing stuff!! Feel blessed to have been the one to bring them together, she matched with me and I figured out who her dad was for her, ending her lifelong search for her biological dad!
georgette mitchell I am fairly good with it. So here’s a really helpful tip: Use your shared matches to figure out whose related to you on which side of the family by narrowing down who you know for certain is related to you on your moms side, then you’ll know that anyone else who isn’t connected to that side is a relation from your dad side. Closer matches are better to work with, from like the first couple pages of 4th cousins and closer, anything further than the first couple pages from the 4th cousins and 5th-8th, the shared DNA amount will be too little, too watered down to make any sense of those relations. Good luck!!! Who knows, maybe someday he or a close family member of his might take the test, like what happened with me and my new cousin!
NativeNYerChicHK thank you I will start there. I feel like this is so overwhelming at times. I get upset and want to give up. But I’m going to start with your advice thank you!
@@NativeNYerChicHK Bring up the interest you have about your ancestry.....and try to see if they have a deep interest in knowing all their relatives and having pic's of some of them....sortof try to peak their interest on the subject and just maybe they might do the ancestry thing....
It's not that wierd that he was a bigamist, when you consider that records were on paper, not on computers. If a guy abandoned his family and moved to another state, it would be easy to get married again, because they figured no one would ever know. Especially in religious communities where divorce was taboo, some found it easier to just split. I suspect there was a lot more of that than we know.
Sounds like my family tree search. Funny enough my mystery relative is also Thomas. He is listed on different census at the same time. His wife would live separately from him off and on through the years.
I have a mystery in my family as well, my maternal great grandmother disappeared, and my great grandfather remarried. No idea what happened to the biologic great grand mother!
Well bigamy seems to be the thing back then because I had a grandfather that did the same thing married in 1911 never divorced the woman and then married my grandmother in 1919
My Great Grandmother tried to divorce my G-Grandfather in the early 1900s. She was denied. Could you imagine having to go back to the guy you tried to divorce?! He must have been an a_ _ because when she died there was no mention of him in her obit. Back then you were your husband's wife (Mrs. John Smith). She was not and their was no mention of him what so ever. No preceded in death or living. Nothing. Just think it was one of his kids that filed the obit. He is also not buried with her. She got away from him in the end. BTW I got that info from GenealogyBank . com . Check to see if the area you are interested is there before you join. Court proceedings were in the newspaper in the past. Also don't attach other people's trees to your's. I had to totally deconstruct mine when I discovered some of the info was wrong.
Check the dates of the census, it is possible to be counted in more than one location. Information is given by those who live at the address. I have an ancestor who moved from Wisconsin after the census was taken, but also counted in Oregon as he had moved there before the census was taken at that location.
In my family one of my 2nd great grandfathers changed his name after my 2nd great grandmother died. He took his mother's maiden name. He was married 5 times outlived 3 wives who supposedly died of things like "heart attack" or" an accidental fall." His other 2 wives divorced him for wife beating. I am afraid he murdered my ancestress. Because my great grandfather ran away from home at 14(which turned out to be the year she died) and never spoke to his father again. We only learned this much because of my grandfather's sister, one of her granddaughters found a letter from the 2nd great grandfather had written to the family. She had kept it and saved it.
In West Virginia records were not always kept properly. Ex My great grandmother passed sometime after 1898 no record of her death has been found and Ohio was checked and when my great grandfather passed one of his daughters was not list in his obit.
Robin Rocha lol If you figure out why, let me know. I made this vid a year ago and for some reason it got over 16000 hits this past week. Where on earth did you all come from? ;)
You may want to pull copies of their Birth Certificates (legal full names), then their marriage/divorce/death certificates, and their Baptism CmRecords. Clarification of names - as it was not uncommon for boy brothers to carry a dad or granddad's name (like Thomas)as a middle name by 2 or more brothers in same or immediate families. Back then families share a 2 or 3 level home - or all lived under 1 roof. That's standar,d especially in urban areas. The Parish church may also have copy of marriage records and annulment records, if applicable. Never assume married on a census is accurate - especially prior to IRS Income Taxes - these began in the 30's I think. You have a bit of a puzzle to work through - but its doable. Poor Gram - the confusion and likely 1 sided story. It was serious business then to have a child out of marriage or to Divorce - nevermind the Church would be down your throat. That's likely why it's shaded - Social Stress could create a number of hardships. Try to be empathetic and open minded - it may turn out to be quite innocent. 🍀❤🍀
I have all of those things for Thomas? This vid was made over a year ago after trying to explain to friends and family so there’s a ton more of info and context I didn’t bother to list. They were Irish Catholic and my grandmother was secretive, but they and she were far from devout. Ruth was a flapper (arrested for dancing on cars) her sister was publicly divorced and remarried- there’s a brother who is as publicly gay as one got in the 20s. I am very empathetic to my own family. They raised us all to take joy in all human foibles. The only objection to the popcorn reaction would be that it wasn’t gin. :)
Oh honey, I feel you. On my Dad’s line back in VA my Great Grandmother x3 was living next door to an entire family, her son (my Great Grandfather x2) listed the neighbor as his Dad on a document that was part of his paper trail. She gave him her last name, and was living right next door to this man, his wife, and their 5 children!
I am researching and trying to find my paternal grandfather. My dad doesn't know who his dad is and his mom (my paternal grandmother) took it to the grave. She also disclosed nothing about her family either. But, upon research it looks like I might have found her dad (my paternal great grandpa) while looking up news articles and it's a can of worms. I am waiting on my results to put the pieces together and have more confirmation.
My ancestry should be a hoot. Going to try and make this simple. Bio Mom married RB had my brother, somewhere over next 3 years met my bio Dad and they “ married” mom never divorced RB ooops. My bio Dad is sent to Vietnam, while there he files for divorce, granted May 69, i was birn in summer of 69. Bio Mom meets BS gets pregnant ( within months of my birth) has baby, they marry. They divorce. Bio Mom shacks up with drug addicted lunatic, they marry, move to CA. and produce 2 more children. Ohhh by the way she took none of us with her. One brother here, the other there, and i was everywhere. Didn’t meet my bio Dad ( who knew all about me, and always lived within 30 minutes of me) when i was 40. People do NOT DO THIS TO CHILDREN. It is utterly soul ripping to the darkest depths and can not be undone. Fyi i can never have my birth certificate made true as bio mom was still legally married to RB ( first husband) when i was born. My bio Dad ( who went on to re marry 2-3x and had more children is GA . Forever have another mans name 👍
I think that for people living in Pittsburgh, a quickie West Virginia wedding might have been like a quickie Vegas divorce nowadays. In 1919, my 24 year old grandfather whipped across the border to WVA and married my 14 y.o. Grandmother under an assumed name. They did it again a year later, this time under his real name. My mother came along less than a year later.
Problem carrying one last name for decades. We use paternal grandfather's first name as a last name. For example, my father, brother and my brother's son have different last names. Each carries paternal grandfather first name as last name. There we count one generation to next and form clans system. Point here is you know who you related to. Women do not carry there husband's last name because we got our own lineage. Similar we carry our paternal grandfather first name as last name.
I know for a fact I have bigamist relatives but that wasn't a big deal as this was in Utah with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints. It wasn't until Utah was a state (or at least a territory) that that practice was abandoned. In fact, the people already involved in bigamy had to hide that fact, and I THINK the men had to escape to different areas.
John Labus this was when the census was conducted by door to door knocking and talking so all kinds of hijinks could ensue! :) I like the idea that when asked where her husband was, Ella just got teary-eyed and said, “he’s no longer with us” and just let the census taker draw their own conclusions...
@@GigglingKat It's kind of amazing what you could get away with back then. Official paperwork might be filled out at your work, so very possible to have incorrect info on things.
People could use any names until 1930, if I'm correct, a law was passed in US. My GGrandmother was married 7 times in the late 1800s, early 1900s on records her age would fluctuate. She was just gorgeous and those who remembered her told stories of what fun she was! Sue LOL
I know this is 5 years later, and I haven't seen any of your other videos or read any comments, but.... You say you are definitely connected through Patrick and that Patrick is a couple generations back from Thomas. Is it possible that you are dealing with two different Thomas's who are cousins? In other words, another branch off of Patrick. This duel life thing just seems very awkward!
You may want to write the county to see if there is a Divorce and make sure of the information and looking in Newspapers to find the notices and women during this time or most of time knew it was sinful to divorce in the Churches, so a lot of men just left and started new familie. This was done in Great British because Divorces were very costly...they would live with the other person, it was a common law marriage after an period of time.
Isn’t it fascinating?! Census takers would just ask the head of household who lives there & the details. If they wanted to avoid shame, they told what they wanted people to know- not necessarily the truth. The fallout from the shame could have been more life altering than life already was. I’d reach out and iron what wrinkles you can, that doesn’t mean you have to tell gma. Good luck. ❤️
P E. M. I know I used the word traumatized but this was aimed at friends and family. I promise that she really was fine with this - just a little nervous about what “it” could be.
GigglingKat I can relate to your story. 😊. My mother was born in 1917 and (her mother) my grandmother in 1898. There are some serious deep family secrets there. Both of them are deceased & family info has gone with them. I really want to take a DNA test and find out my history (not just the secrets which I may never know) but just the history. Which DNA test did you use, there are so many to choose from. Well, have a super day and thank for your sweet reply. Paula
Back then there wasnt tracking on people. It was too easy to just make a new identity or change your name ect. Remember how people are now so its not much different but they have more freedom
Lukia 21 I would say it was just SO easy.🤷♀️ I’m not sure if this is all so great.🤔. I mean, it’s YOUR life. If you want to disappear, I feel you should have that prerogative. UNLESS, you are doing it to keep/hide kids away from somebody. Then it is very wrong.
Super interesting to watch. I love hearing all the fascinating stories uncovered by people doing genealogical research. Thanks for sharing! I found a news article from 1891 about my 3rd great-grandfather. Apparently, he was murdered by his neighbor because he (my 3GG) was sleeping with the neighbor's wife! LOL (I know I shouldn't laugh at that, but it cracked me up)! The article contained such gems as (direct quotes from the article): "...They had not proceeded further than 3/4 of a mile from the Woods' house, when their attention was suddenly arrested by a man, who with a shot-gun, appeared from the road side with the remark: 'You are the scoundrel that has been prowling around my house.'" and "O'Neil fired, the shot taking effect in his victim's abdomen. 'Joe, you've killed me,' cried Woods as he staggered back. 'If I haven't, here's another load that will,' was the response and he raised his gun again, but was prevented from firing again..." Again, I know I shouldn't laugh... but come on, that's an entertaining read! :-P
What a story! ‘Scoundrel’ just isn’t a word we use any more, that’s part of the allure of the story. I guess the neighbor was a man of action & few words, 😉😉 Things were so different back in the ‘Good ole days’. My dad (born in 1913) told us kids a story of one of his neighbors who committed suicide around 1918. My dad says the neighbor was a wonderful upstanding part of the community and a moral, kind man. Anyway, The neighbor had been plowing in a field and need to urinate but was far away from a bathroom so he decided to relieve himself where he was working. Somewhere within eye shot was a little girl who saw him. She ran home and told her parents what she had scene. It became big news that he had exposed himself to the little girl. He could not live with the fact that people thought he was a “Bad man”, so he killed himself. It’s so sad, but really shows how things have changed so drastically in the past 100 years. Thanks for sharing your interesting story, it was definitely a good read.
Katerina St. Claire that’s a great comment. The other day I had to call the police about a neighbor who comes home drunk (and driving no less) every Saturday. The funny thing is, I had just called them the night before for someone who was emptying their truck contents into our dumpster. I hardly ever call the police! I was beginning to feeling like my new name should be Gladys Kravitz, lol. Well, here it is the third day in a row and what should happen, i found car keys and a cell phone on the ground next to my car when I was leaving the morning. So I took them to the police station, since after checking they didn’t belong to any of my neighbors. The funny thing is, when I was at the police station I told the police man, I was beginning to feel like Gladys Kravitz. I began to laugh and the police mans face was slightly blank, I think he had no clue what I was talking about. LOL. It’s nice to know someone out there remembers good ole Gladys. 👍🏻👍🏻
@@fiddlesticksgalore That reminds me about the 1980s when a young shy teen, worked at mother's place of employment, came to work with his story. He had been charged (then had a "record") with public indecency; exposure and urination, after being caught out in a laneway riding his bike home from work. He was such a young innocent that Mother thought it was hilarious. You would have thought the Policemen could have let him off with a warning; was only 15-16.
Sounds like my Grandfather. We knew he was married three times. My grandmother was his last marriage. First wife did not like his craziness I guess. She fled back home and never told him she was pregnant. Several years later he remarries has a daughter. Second wife leaves him because he allegedly chased her around the house with a knife. By the time he married my Gma he was at least 15 years older than her. They had seven kids. my mother did not know who the second wife was. Uncle was MUM. Told the uncle it doesn't matter I will find out. Sure enough I did.
Wow! Great detective work! Your story and mine have a lot of parallels except for the bigamy. My paternal grandmother was born in Pittsburgh. Her first set of parents (who I later found out weren't her biological parents) had some marriage issues. The wife committed suicide by swallowing mercury poisoning in 1916.
I do know that people get things wrong on their trees. That is why DNA is a good tool to find the truth. I have so many twists and turns in our tree. My head was spinning at one point. But I haven't looked at it for years now. I have forgotten a lot of it now. We moved twice and I have lost my password to my DNA ... I know as time passes more people are added. Does anyone know how I can find it again???
Done a lot of work on ancestry and Thomas, like many family names were repeated again and again and I would suggest that you have two Thomas's and it is not unheard of that you all have same ancestors. That does not mean every Thomas related to your ancestors (Parkers?) Is your grandmother's Thomas.
I cam see that. My Grandfather b 1900, had lost a brother as a child named William. My great grandparents parents had another son years later and named him William too. I think those things were common and naming people after relatives of same first name considered an honor.
That’s possible! Ruth’s marriage certificate has his name, parents and address. Ella’s has his address but not his parents. Large Irish family and there’s several Thomas in there. PS Am I on a list somewhere? This vid is over a year old but just got 2k hits and a ton of troll comments
@@GigglingKat Not that I know of I regularly watch genealogy videos. As a result, I get lots of suggested videos related to genealogy in my recommended feed. That is how I came across this video.
@@GigglingKat I got you as a suggested video also, and since I did Ancestry I watched, but I also watch "Who do you think you are" and "Finding Roots" and clearly youtube tracks that interest.
There may be divorces, but the records are hard to find. My great-grandfather was married 5 times. I have only found 2 divorces for him. But I have not gone to the courthouses in the towns where he or the estanged wives were living. But my grandmother who was his daughter did not appreciate him.
I am assuming you eliminated the possibility of cousins with the same name? My grandmother had 5 generations of male family members with the same names. Elswick, John, Henry, Lewis, Archibald, Roden and Ratliff. Made it hard to keep them straight.
I think I have but I really want to go back in time and explain to several of my ancestors IT'S OKAY TO GO A WHOLE GENERATION WITHOUT ANOTHER JAMES OR THOMAS I SWEAR IT WILL BE OKAY. But yes, I isolated it by address and the addresses were actually listed on the marriage licenses back then - which surprised me. I honestly think this is more that Thomas and Ella divorced, but those records aren't indexed on Ancestry yet. I made this video mainly for family and friends so I didn't go into all the things they already knew or had access to on my tree.
Been there done that. My mom’s family are totally “As the World Turns” all the way! Still trying to find out what happened to my great-great aunt Daisy.
When people were divorced, sometimes they listed themselves as widowed. There was a stigma attached to divorce and they didn't want it to be known. And then sometimes they were listed as married. It could go either way.
I have not done DNA but turns out my family is old Mormons. So in one census there would be husband a wife b and house servant c. In the next census it would be husband a wife c and house servant b. I just kinda figured who ever was home theday the census taker showed up got to be wife. Haha. It van be very confusing. Thank goodness Mormons are good at keeping records!
I did Ancestry last year and found out that my mother had a secret child at the end of WW2, so I have a half brother a decade older than myself, I made the mistake of answering his email, he wants a relationship but I don't so that is rather unfortunate. Other than that I found out from an English cousin that my grandfather slightly changed our last name (removed an S) and that I am 11% Norwegian which was a surprise (also found out that my last name is fairly common in Norway.) Anyway I enjoyed the experience.
In those days people bent the truth a bit to be kind to relatives. My dad's sister wanted to divorce her husband but he wouldn't give her a divorce, so she ended up living with the man she loved. We were all told they were married. My husband has a friend who didn't find out his parents weren't his until he was an adult. The husband was a taxi driver & he found a baby left in his taxi one night. He & his wife kept the baby & raised him as their son. Times were different.
@Alice Ransom Likely in alot of cases, but no, in this one there was only ever 1 woman for him.
Some states didn’t allow divorce so just leaving to another state for marriage…..we could say that.
it sounds like your grandpa Thomas was dating and messing around with Ella and got her pregnant a couple times and in those days they had to get married but the relationship didn't work out and then he met your grandma and then married her in Virginia because he already had marriage on the docket in the current state (so the lie may have been, let's have a destination wedding) but he actually love her and had a life with her and seemingly he had two families in two different households probably within the same parameters or block or neighborhood just different streets so he can access both sets of children and your grandma found out that her husband Thomas was previously married with other children and so they probably had a separation but in that day you didn't do separation so your grandma met dr. John and that was her new man... But she was still married legally to your grandpa Thomas until he end up passing and then her and Doctor John could be legal... This is absolutely The Young and the restless 1900 series...But I'm glad that you are finding truth in your family history... Keep searching sweetie...
My father-in-law was always very secretive about his family and I found out the facts on ancestry. What amazed me was that the scandals kept piling up. I went back another generation and just say, there was more. Phew! Don't need soap operas, ancestry keeps me entertained.
Too bad we can’t hear the stories! Of course, for me, this would only be cool stories as I’m not related!
Secrets that our relatives had. Found out after my mom died in 2002 that she was married before marrying our dad but no marriage certificate nor divorce. Also in 1940 census she is stated to be 21 but was born in 1922 so she was actually 18. Says also that she had been married 5 years so was 13 when she got married. She lived on a reservation with her husband and father. Husbands name same as her father’s. Was her first husband a cousin, a Native American? Was her father Native American. Never spoke about her dad. Found out he was alive til 1951. We can only guess or suppose the answers cause she took most of her secrets to the grave.
a DNA test would answer one question, you might have indigenous ancestry. Indigenous people in the US and Canada had scant records until recently unlike my country of birth where i know my ancestry back hundreds of years ,but i doubt white people would have been living on a reservation. Good luck with your quest.
DNA
I had been wanting to have the Ancestry testing done for awhile and no surprises on my side but had a couple cool surprises on my husband's. Family legend always said that his great great grandfather faked his death the yr of a big flood, moved, changed the family name and started a new family by which my husband is a descendent. Turns out it was true. I was able to figure out who his gg grandfather was in his first life and verified it after a descended of his first wife reached out with a story of a disappearing gg grandfather rumored to have died in a flood. Then my husband also matched with his grandfathers sister who was adopted out as a child. Nobody ever knew what happened to her and assumed her dead bc of her health issues that led to her being adopted out. Through matching with him on Ancestry DNA she was able to get her in contact with her two living siblings with whom she had searched for for years.
Appalachia Jennifer dude! That’s amazing! I’m pretty sure mine’s just a matter of Pennsylvania not putting divorce records online yet! That’s amazing that you helped out like that.
I have always said "Who needs soap operas? when you have family history" LOL great detective work.... I enjoyed your story.
My grandfather had three wives at once on two continents. They just moved on.
lol
That's interesting, it is a bit unusual, but more unusual that you found out. There were lots of married men and women who were on separate continents and then had new families, but without any divorce papers.
I realize this is an older video, but it just showed up on my TH-cam feed. I found the story fascinating. I love hearing about people's family histories/mysteries.
I was curious about the connections between Ruth and her marriages. I did look up Dr Lange on the 1930's census. I was wondering if you noticed the age Ruth was at that time? And then the age she would have been at the time she married Thomas? I wonder if the age at the time of her first marriage is why Kay was born 6 years later? Again very interesting story.
I'm now 80 yo and luckily bordered two types of generations: pre birth control (the pill) and post birth control. Once birth control (the pill) came along, the world started to change significantly for women. Suddenly, women were "free." I remember the strict social hardships placed on females and at 16 yo I concluded that I will never get married. Women were second class citizens. In the 1970s in Canada a woman could not even own her property outright. My brother had to sign the mortgage for my mom. I remember when a girl got pregnant out of wedlock, parents would force her to give up her child. (I watch a lot of utube about those children, when grown up, searching for their moms.) A lot of heartache. We tend to think that the world is going to the dogs these days. But I remember how rotten it was when I was a child. Society really browbeat females.
“What a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive”. Sir Walter Scott
Shakespeare.
Nope Sir Walter Scott, from Marmion: A Tale of Flodden Field
@@Quidditch54321 not Shakespeare
@@diggerfan1936 Ah, thanks, I will remember that.
I only responded to save you from the embarrassment I felt....lost big in a trivia match swearing the quote was from Shakespeare....it was not!
Good work! I found similar stuff in my family tree. People saying they were never married before when they had been. People raising other people's children while the biological parent lived down the street for years. Two women both having babies with the same name in the same year - one the wife of my grand uncle and the other his mistress (and both babies were "Jr"). People going to Canada to have children out of wedlock, then coming back and portraying the situation differently. Those people had no way of knowing that someday EVERYTHING would come out.
Wendy Lynn I don’t know that it’s really bigamy. I made this vid over a year ago primarily for my friends and family. We all tend to think the divorce or divorces just aren’t part of the ancestry index. It’s not like I poured through courthouse records, I’m just looking online.
That said, these people are my blood relatives and probably knew we would go poking. It’s a family trait! ;)
Your tree sounds wild! Gotta love it!
It doeant always all come out. I wish for everyone that they are dead and gone, and that no one cares anymore, when their secrets come out!
@@GigglingKat I have found several divorces in my Family tree, and because almost all were in England,there is a ton of paper work connected with each one because it was a such a serious process. But if you marry someone else while still married to the 1st spouse, yes it's bygamy and a lot of it went on because those divorce laws were pretty tough to work around and even worse if you were Catholic.
What I found touching was the 'snap' of your grandmother. My mother's family had albums full of them. Everyone had a Brownie camera, in my childhood. Now, all are gone. My mother, her 8 siblings, cousins, gone.
And the albums all disappeared, as everyone went off in different directions, to different lives.
Thank you for the interesting look into your grandmother's past.
S. HURD- tell your cousins to write on back or in album 🤔 who people are. My MIL left me pictures " At Aunt and Uncles House- Boy We Had A Good time!"- only family member of that generation to post- decease her was Legally Blind- asked cousins- MIL was oldest of that generation- nobody recognized anyone so I can't pass them on. Just wait- when I die my children WILL STILL WONDER who they Are.
@@peachmelba9333 Peach. Too late. All gone. Now everyone has their photos in their phone.
You do know that Pittsburgh is very close geographically to West Virginia, right? They could easily have lived in Pburgh and driven across the state line and married in West Virginia. That was common. :)
Yes, I just thought it was odd as the other things I had found on Ruth showed her active with a church in Pittsburgh
My parents “ran away” to W Va because Mom’s parents did not approve of Dad. They were married in church 3 days later. I was born 9 months and 1
Week later. My Grandmother always moaned that they got married because she was pregnant. My parents were married for 43 years.
Sounds like Thomas May have gone back to Ella after splitting from Ruth after she found out about his first marriage not being dissolved.
Yes and Ruth hid it even though she was probably innocent in the whole dealing and had no idea he was a bigamist; because people would have still blamed her back then.
Unfortunately, in just about everything the woman received the absolute worst even though they were completely innocent! Soooooo glad I wasn't born then!
You said they are Roman Catholic Irish Catholic. If you go into the church records you can find more information. You also have to take into consideration that the Catholic Church did not allow for divorce. In the eyes of the church they was sinners so many was embarrassing of the situation so it would be kept a secret even from their own kids. Your grandmother more than likely my have not fully actually known or she may have and was drilled into her as a child that the secret was to be kept as a secret. She may also have grown up thinking her dad was a uncle not her father as that was common as well to save face. They probably did live in a large home. Many would cross state lines to marry so nobody would know any different about her marriage because of local papers would publish marriages in the papers. I had the same issue in trying to figure out my gg grandfather.
Yes, I know that the church wouldn’t have acknowledged the second marriage without some documented counseling- but there is a notorious fire in the records in the 50s that took out most of the date range involved. It’s not likely I’m going to find it and for the most part I’m okay with what I’ve found. My grandmother was baptized and confirmed under Dr John’s name and considered him her real father. We’re good following suit.
The vid was mainly targeted to my cousins and friends who would share my amusement at finding a clue to The Big Mystery but I’m glad others find it interesting;)
This was fun to listen to. We’re thinking of doing a dna search for my maternal grandmother’s “children” she had after she left her marriage, when mom was very young. It’s all very fascinating to see history in these older documents.
I just watched this and you should give an update!!!
..I always heard of my fathers brother had a child but no one believe it was his..well she showed up as a dna match as 2nd cousin so she had to be my first cousins child. She finally got in touch with me and told me who her mother (was my 1st cousin) and grandmother were, she knew nothing about her mothers father (my fathers brother) I wrote back to her and explained about her grandfather who died fairly young . I then invited her to my Tree so she could view all her relatives and ancestors which I had photos of including her grandfather. At least she could see what they looked like and I convinced her we now have proof that we are cousins thru DNA.
J De'Niz : That's so very kind of you to be so helpful and welcome her to your tree.
My eldest (half) brother found another half-sister through DNA. My mother had married his father, but his father left after he was born. Apparently new couple? had a daughter. My mother finally managed to track him down and divorce him when she wished to marry my father. Had heard his father had later remarried and had two more boys. The half-sister was born not that long after brother though to another woman. His sister had been told her whole life, by her mother, that another man was her father, but by the time she found out who her real father was both parents had passed, so she never could find out why her mother lied. My brother, through my mother's old retained photographs, was able to provide her photos of her father though, she had never seen. My brother (Aus) is keeping in contact with his sister (UK), but it is unlikely they will meet up because of his health.
Found a very similar thing with my great grandfather around the same time period. Seems like back in the day when divorce was a lot harder people found themselves in the same kind of relationship difficulties that people do now, but they just all agreed to quietly move on and not speak about it.
Yes, the "widow" thing was common, too. I found that several times in my line.
The residence with “a whole bunch of other people” is more than likely a boarding house, very common back then.
NativeNYerChicHK yes, Kay’s grandmother owned it
Thanks for sharing your story! Gems like this definitely keep genealogy research interesting.
Today they are share houses lol
Today they are called homes with wives of unsuspecting cheating husbands…… 🤷🏻♀️
Relationships are listed on censuses. If they are boarders, they are listed as such
Hi from Ireland .....seemingly Thomas had a problem with his zipper !
The panhandle of West Va is right below the Pittsburg area. Some parts of W. Va had border towns that would marry people without a lot of questions. Very popular with elopement and underage couples etc.
i'm thinking that ruth and thomas were renting a room to the dr. then maybe ruth and the dr had an affair and thomas wouldn't divorce her so she could marry the dr. so they had to live in "sin" . most husband back then refused to get a divorce hoping the wife will come back to him. being very religious, living with a man without being married was a shameful sin
lynn miller possibly! Ruth’s mom owned the boarding house so that’s definitely how Ruth met Dr John. Just because I can’t find that Thomas divorced Ella he might have to marry Ruth and then Ruth left him for Dr. John.
@@GigglingKat Since Thomas and Ella never divorced, would the second been legitimate?
Similarly my father (well before DNA research) found out his father's father (okay ... my great grandfather) was married in Norfolk U.K., apparently leaving wife and children to take up with a new partner in London, U.K. and having even more children. There was never any marriage documentation found for him marrying new partner, although it never was suspected they were not married. Bigamy was a very serious charge in those days; jail. This was a wealthy, high class family; children were never made aware of the situation. We assume the family took care of the legitimate wife and the original children. They are still a very wealthy family, but will not mention name for everyones sakes. The daughters (my father's aunts) behaved snobby and very unpleasant towards their brother's bride (my father's mother), even saying she was not good enough for him. My mother said my father's aunts would have been shocked to the core if they ever found out they were illegitimate; a shame his mother never had the opportunity to retort back to those sisters! She had a hard life as it was; lost first husband and only brother in WW1; one son. Remarried another WW1 career soldier; 5 children. Lost 1 daughter dysentary while stationed in India. That husband in his 30s (my grandfather) killed clearing trees for Soldier-Settler scheme in Western Australia. Returned to London with 3 young errant sons and remarried a third time. My mother said she was a very nice, caring lady.
AncestryDNA.com is the worst thing that ever happened to family secrets in the whole wide world.
In 1997, a woman contacted me asking me for information about my grandmother. Who her mother had worked for in the mid 1940's. One discussion led to another and she told me that on the night her mother dies in 1992, her mother handed her a photo and told her that "This is your brother". Rolled over, faced the wall, and died in the night with no more comment. She had a younger brother and younger sister with black hair and black eyes. "Teri" had blond hair and blue eyes. I was the baby in the photograph from 1944. My 1/2 sister by my father. Everything fit. Along came AncestryDNA. My father is my father, but my grandfather isn't my father's father. The only relation I have to my father is through his mother, my Great Grandmother and my father's children. It gets better. That means that my 1/2 sister isn't related to me. Her mother was wrong about her father.
My mother was an only child. Her mother had a childless brother. My father had two brothers who never had any children.
AncestryDNA lists many, many 4th cousins or later. I'm just lost on the ocean.
I’m so sorry you’re feeling lost. I’ve been very lucky that all our surprises have been removed enough to be interesting or good. The vid is old and I’ve also uncovered that Kay had a child she gave up for adoption- my Mom has a half brother who seems like a really great guy but it’s still very surreal.
Well, this is all poopy confusing for you. So according to Coco Chanel, "When there's nothing you can do: wear black and put on red lipstick."
Today, we grab the credit card and go get Botox. Then go out to movie!!!!
My entire life we thought we were "colored", oops, surprise, Jewish.
So shake your head; then after the movie; go to Red Lobster.
Love you 👭girlfriend.
Beth Parker you are just the sweetest little thing!
No puedes asegurar que tus tíos no tuvieran hijos.
Funny thing about the age before ancestry groups, my grand parents on my dad's ide divorced after my aunt was born, but twelve years later they Had to get remarried. They had been 'friends with benefits', who knew!!!!! My dad never said a word. My cousin told me after my dad's funeral. I laughed until there were tears.
Thru ancestry we found that my husbands aunt was on,y half siblings to her two sisters and one brother. I always thought it odd she is stunning with Dark hair and blue eyes while her siblings are fair haired and brown eyes. Never put a lot of thought into it until helping do our family tree and got the DNA tests back for many to add in. I called her daughter who was working on a different area of our trees and said we need to talk. 😳
My grandfather [WWI era] was married at least 8 times. In multiple states [US] and other countries also. I think bigamy was much more common in the old days when record keeping was primitive.
Indeed. Before shared and electronic records, that sort of thing was so easy. Move to another state, and start again.
Shoot those secrets will come out at the end. Sometimes sooner that that.
Great story!! I have a bigamy story. My grandmothers grandmother had an incredible life story. My grandmother wrote down the story. In the past 6 years I’ve been able to piece together the details.
Wow!!! You must've been freaking out as you started to get all of this info! No more secrets now that we have DNA.
I want to find something interesting like that in my family! So far we must have always been very boring!
I have had nothing but positive experiences with Ancestry genealogical Service and Ancestry DNA!! Found my 70yr old formerly childless uncle a 37yr old daughter (he never knew existed!! They have since met and have been building a beautiful relationship. Really amazing stuff!! Feel blessed to have been the one to bring them together, she matched with me and I figured out who her dad was for her, ending her lifelong search for her biological dad!
That is wonderful!!
NativeNYerChicHK how good are you on this ancestry? I am so desperate to find my biological dad. And I have had absolutely no luck
georgette mitchell I am fairly good with it. So here’s a really helpful tip: Use your shared matches to figure out whose related to you on which side of the family by narrowing down who you know for certain is related to you on your moms side, then you’ll know that anyone else who isn’t connected to that side is a relation from your dad side. Closer matches are better to work with, from like the first couple pages of 4th cousins and closer, anything further than the first couple pages from the 4th cousins and 5th-8th, the shared DNA amount will be too little, too watered down to make any sense of those relations. Good luck!!! Who knows, maybe someday he or a close family member of his might take the test, like what happened with me and my new cousin!
NativeNYerChicHK thank you I will start there. I feel like this is so overwhelming at times. I get upset and want to give up. But I’m going to start with your advice thank you!
@@NativeNYerChicHK Bring up the interest you have about your ancestry.....and try to see if they have a deep interest in knowing all their relatives and having pic's of some of them....sortof try to peak their interest on the subject and just maybe they might do the ancestry thing....
Oh I'm so glad its not just my family that is messed up
It's pronounced idle wild as in wasting idle time idle. Just add wild, idlewild.
Like the airport in NY before it became JFK Airport.
It's not that wierd that he was a bigamist, when you consider that records were on paper, not on computers. If a guy abandoned his family and moved to another state, it would be easy to get married again, because they figured no one would ever know. Especially in religious communities where divorce was taboo, some found it easier to just split. I suspect there was a lot more of that than we know.
Kat, you're so funny, life is a soap opera!
Sounds like my family tree search. Funny enough my mystery relative is also Thomas. He is listed on different census at the same time. His wife would live separately from him off and on through the years.
My aunt's ex is named Thomas and my cousin Thomas (his son) is the "bad boy" of the family. Definite connection! :)
I have a mystery in my family as well, my maternal great grandmother disappeared, and my great grandfather remarried. No idea what happened to the biologic great grand mother!
Well bigamy seems to be the thing back then because I had a grandfather that did the same thing married in 1911 never divorced the woman and then married my grandmother in 1919
Cool and impressive that you were able to find it out .. Loved it .. kind regards from Amsterdam.
You called it soap opera, in Trinidad we call it bacchanal 😆
My Great Grandmother tried to divorce my G-Grandfather in the early 1900s. She was denied. Could you imagine having to go back to the guy you tried to divorce?! He must have been an a_ _ because when she died there was no mention of him in her obit. Back then you were your husband's wife (Mrs. John Smith). She was not and their was no mention of him what so ever. No preceded in death or living. Nothing. Just think it was one of his kids that filed the obit. He is also not buried with her. She got away from him in the end.
BTW I got that info from GenealogyBank . com . Check to see if the area you are interested is there before you join. Court proceedings were in the newspaper in the past. Also don't attach other people's trees to your's. I had to totally deconstruct mine when I discovered some of the info was wrong.
Ok
Check the dates of the census, it is possible to be counted in more than one location. Information is given by those who live at the address. I have an ancestor who moved from Wisconsin after the census was taken, but also counted in Oregon as he had moved there before the census was taken at that location.
I had that happen too, it was hard to get the truth
In my family one of my 2nd great grandfathers changed his name after my 2nd great grandmother died. He took his mother's maiden name. He was married 5 times outlived 3 wives who supposedly died of things like "heart attack" or" an accidental fall." His other 2 wives divorced him for wife beating. I am afraid he murdered my ancestress. Because my great grandfather ran away from home at 14(which turned out to be the year she died) and never spoke to his father again. We only learned this much because of my grandfather's sister, one of her granddaughters found a letter from the 2nd great grandfather had written to the family. She had kept it and saved it.
In West Virginia records were not always kept properly. Ex My great grandmother passed sometime after 1898 no record of her death has been found and Ohio was checked and when my great grandfather passed one of his daughters was not list in his obit.
Antes se escribía a mano y muchos apellidos fueron cambiados "a gusto" del escribiente.
Why am I watching this? Dr. John was extremely handsome!
Robin Rocha lol If you figure out why, let me know. I made this vid a year ago and for some reason it got over 16000 hits this past week. Where on earth did you all come from? ;)
@@GigglingKat this week I start getting DNA testing videos in my feed and genealogy is a hobby, so here I am. Thanks for sharing this story.
He looks bi racial to me
Yes families will keep those secrets! Interesting story, thanks for sharing.
LUVJONZ99 thanks I’m glad others are as intrigued as I was!
Very intriguing! I feel like we need a sequel.
You may want to pull copies of their Birth Certificates (legal full names), then their marriage/divorce/death certificates, and their Baptism CmRecords.
Clarification of names - as it was not uncommon for boy brothers to carry a dad or granddad's name (like Thomas)as a middle name by 2 or more brothers in same or immediate families.
Back then families share a 2 or 3 level home - or all lived under 1 roof. That's standar,d especially in urban areas.
The Parish church may also have copy of marriage records and annulment records, if applicable.
Never assume married on a census is accurate - especially prior to IRS Income Taxes - these began in the 30's I think.
You have a bit of a puzzle to work through - but its doable.
Poor Gram - the confusion and likely 1 sided story.
It was serious business then to have a child out of marriage or to Divorce - nevermind the Church would be down your throat.
That's likely why it's shaded - Social Stress could create a number of hardships.
Try to be empathetic and open minded - it may turn out to be quite innocent.
🍀❤🍀
I have all of those things for Thomas?
This vid was made over a year ago after trying to explain to friends and family so there’s a ton more of info and context I didn’t bother to list.
They were Irish Catholic and my grandmother was secretive, but they and she were far from devout. Ruth was a flapper (arrested for dancing on cars) her sister was publicly divorced and remarried- there’s a brother who is as publicly gay as one got in the 20s.
I am very empathetic to my own family. They raised us all to take joy in all human foibles. The only objection to the popcorn reaction would be that it wasn’t gin. :)
Oh honey, I feel you. On my Dad’s line back in VA my Great Grandmother x3 was living next door to an entire family, her son (my Great Grandfather x2) listed the neighbor as his Dad on a document that was part of his paper trail. She gave him her last name, and was living right next door to this man, his wife, and their 5 children!
Is this the only video about this or is there another chapter
I am researching and trying to find my paternal grandfather. My dad doesn't know who his dad is and his mom (my paternal grandmother) took it to the grave. She also disclosed nothing about her family either. But, upon research it looks like I might have found her dad (my paternal great grandpa) while looking up news articles and it's a can of worms. I am waiting on my results to put the pieces together and have more confirmation.
Did you ever any results? What were they? If you don’t mind.
Good work but illustrations would’ve helped keep it straight. Might be impossible to do however!! Lolo
Now..who out there..don't believe in.. DNA..??? ...you really did your homework on this search. ..congratulations to you
Thank you for sharing your story!
My ancestry should be a hoot. Going to try and make this simple.
Bio Mom married RB had my brother, somewhere over next 3 years met my bio Dad and they “ married” mom never divorced RB ooops. My bio Dad is sent to Vietnam, while there he files for divorce, granted May 69, i was birn in summer of 69. Bio Mom meets BS gets pregnant ( within months of my birth) has baby, they marry. They divorce. Bio Mom shacks up with drug addicted lunatic, they marry, move to CA. and produce 2 more children. Ohhh by the way she took none of us with her. One brother here, the other there, and i was everywhere. Didn’t meet my bio Dad ( who knew all about me, and always lived within 30 minutes of me) when i was 40.
People do NOT DO THIS TO CHILDREN. It is utterly soul ripping to the darkest depths and can not be undone. Fyi i can never have my birth certificate made true as bio mom was still legally married to RB ( first husband) when i was born. My bio Dad ( who went on to re marry 2-3x and had more children is GA . Forever have another mans name 👍
Very interesting! And yes, please send us an update if you can.
I think that for people living in Pittsburgh, a quickie West Virginia wedding might have been like a quickie Vegas divorce nowadays. In 1919, my 24 year old grandfather whipped across the border to WVA and married my 14 y.o. Grandmother under an assumed name. They did it again a year later, this time under his real name. My mother came along less than a year later.
Problem carrying one last name for decades. We use paternal grandfather's first name as a last name. For example, my father, brother and my brother's son have different last names. Each carries paternal grandfather first name as last name. There we count one generation to next and form clans system. Point here is you know who you related to. Women do not carry there husband's last name because we got our own lineage. Similar we carry our paternal grandfather first name as last name.
I know for a fact I have bigamist relatives but that wasn't a big deal as this was in Utah with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints. It wasn't until Utah was a state (or at least a territory) that that practice was abandoned. In fact, the people already involved in bigamy had to hide that fact, and I THINK the men had to escape to different areas.
Ella could have divorced but covered it with a widow story. Back then, who knows what people got away with?
John Labus this was when the census was conducted by door to door knocking and talking so all kinds of hijinks could ensue! :) I like the idea that when asked where her husband was, Ella just got teary-eyed and said, “he’s no longer with us” and just let the census taker draw their own conclusions...
@@GigglingKat It's kind of amazing what you could get away with back then. Official paperwork might be filled out at your work, so very possible to have incorrect info on things.
People could use any names until 1930, if I'm correct, a law was passed in US. My GGrandmother was married 7 times in the late 1800s, early 1900s on records her age would fluctuate. She was just gorgeous and those who remembered her told stories of what fun she was! Sue LOL
I know this is 5 years later, and I haven't seen any of your other videos or read any comments, but.... You say you are definitely connected through Patrick and that Patrick is a couple generations back from Thomas. Is it possible that you are dealing with two different Thomas's who are cousins? In other words, another branch off of Patrick. This duel life thing just seems very awkward!
Great story. I'm going through my own soap opera on ancestry. I was able to find my father's birth parents 👍🏻
You may want to write the county to see if there is a Divorce and make sure of the information and looking in Newspapers to find the notices and women during this time or most of time knew it was sinful to divorce in the Churches, so a lot of men just left and started new familie. This was done in Great British because Divorces were very costly...they would live with the other person, it was a common law marriage after an period of time.
What happen in the dark must come out in the light.
Do you know where in WV? I have family in PA, I have no idea where they are.
Brenda Morris nope! Apparently it was a little like getting married in Vegas
Isn’t it fascinating?! Census takers would just ask the head of household who lives there & the details. If they wanted to avoid shame, they told what they wanted people to know- not necessarily the truth. The fallout from the shame could have been more life altering than life already was. I’d reach out and iron what wrinkles you can, that doesn’t mean you have to tell gma. Good luck. ❤️
Super cool story (your poor grandma😢😢). Thank u for sharing.
P E. M. I know I used the word traumatized but this was aimed at friends and family. I promise that she really was fine with this - just a little nervous about what “it” could be.
GigglingKat I can relate to your story. 😊. My mother was born in 1917 and (her mother) my grandmother in 1898. There are some serious deep family secrets there. Both of them are deceased & family info has gone with them. I really want to take a DNA test and find out my history (not just the secrets which I may never know) but just the history. Which DNA test did you use, there are so many to choose from. Well, have a super day and thank for your sweet reply. Paula
We have a few similar skeletons. I’m convinced most families do.
What is the circle with the crossed lines in it in this video at 4:15-17? How Ancestry DNA SOLVED Kay's Mystery by GigglingKat?
Idle-wild. Thats how it is pronounced by us yinzers. We even have an amusement park called idleWild.
Back then there wasnt tracking on people. It was too easy to just make a new identity or change your name ect. Remember how people are now so its not much different but they have more freedom
Lukia 21 I would say it was just SO easy.🤷♀️ I’m not sure if this is all so great.🤔. I mean, it’s YOUR life. If you want to disappear, I feel you should have that prerogative. UNLESS, you are doing it to keep/hide kids away from somebody. Then it is very wrong.
Super interesting to watch. I love hearing all the fascinating stories uncovered by people doing genealogical research. Thanks for sharing!
I found a news article from 1891 about my 3rd great-grandfather. Apparently, he was murdered by his neighbor because he (my 3GG) was sleeping with the neighbor's wife! LOL (I know I shouldn't laugh at that, but it cracked me up)! The article contained such gems as (direct quotes from the article): "...They had not proceeded further than 3/4 of a mile from the Woods' house, when their attention was suddenly arrested by a man, who with a shot-gun, appeared from the road side with the remark: 'You are the scoundrel that has been prowling around my house.'" and "O'Neil fired, the shot taking effect in his victim's abdomen. 'Joe, you've killed me,' cried Woods as he staggered back. 'If I haven't, here's another load that will,' was the response and he raised his gun again, but was prevented from firing again..."
Again, I know I shouldn't laugh... but come on, that's an entertaining read! :-P
I'm very sorry for your 3rd GG but that's an amazing story and I laughed too! It's fun too hear all the antics! Thanks for sharing.
Soooo many things like that happened. Everyone knew and nobody cared except for the "Gladys Kravits" of the day...
What a story! ‘Scoundrel’ just isn’t a word we use any more, that’s part of the allure of the story. I guess the neighbor was a man of action & few words, 😉😉 Things were so different back in the ‘Good ole days’. My dad (born in 1913) told us kids a story of one of his neighbors who committed suicide around 1918. My dad says the neighbor was a wonderful upstanding part of the community and a moral, kind man. Anyway, The neighbor had been plowing in a field and need to urinate but was far away from a bathroom so he decided to relieve himself where he was working. Somewhere within eye shot was a little girl who saw him. She ran home and told her parents what she had scene. It became big news that he had exposed himself to the little girl. He could not live with the fact that people thought he was a “Bad man”, so he killed himself. It’s so sad, but really shows how things have changed so drastically in the past 100 years. Thanks for sharing your interesting story, it was definitely a good read.
Katerina St. Claire that’s a great comment. The other day I had to call the police about a neighbor who comes home drunk (and driving no less) every Saturday. The funny thing is, I had just called them the night before for someone who was emptying their truck contents into our dumpster. I hardly ever call the police! I was beginning to feeling like my new name should be Gladys Kravitz, lol. Well, here it is the third day in a row and what should happen, i found car keys and a cell phone on the ground next to my car when I was leaving the morning. So I took them to the police station, since after checking they didn’t belong to any of my neighbors. The funny thing is, when I was at the police station I told the police man, I was beginning to feel like Gladys Kravitz. I began to laugh and the police mans face was slightly blank, I think he had no clue what I was talking about. LOL. It’s nice to know someone out there remembers good ole Gladys. 👍🏻👍🏻
@@fiddlesticksgalore That reminds me about the 1980s when a young shy teen, worked at mother's place of employment, came to work with his story. He had been charged (then had a "record") with public indecency; exposure and urination, after being caught out in a laneway riding his bike home from work. He was such a young innocent that Mother thought it was hilarious. You would have thought the Policemen could have let him off with a warning; was only 15-16.
Sounds like my Grandfather. We knew he was married three times. My grandmother was his last marriage. First wife did not like his craziness I guess. She fled back home and never told him she was pregnant. Several years later he remarries has a daughter. Second wife leaves him because he allegedly chased her around the house with a knife. By the time he married my Gma he was at least 15 years older than her. They had seven kids. my mother did not know who the second wife was. Uncle was MUM. Told the uncle it doesn't matter I will find out. Sure enough I did.
Wow! Great detective work! Your story and mine have a lot of parallels except for the bigamy. My paternal grandmother was born in Pittsburgh. Her first set of parents (who I later found out weren't her biological parents) had some marriage issues. The wife committed suicide by swallowing mercury poisoning in 1916.
I wish you had included the ages of your ancestors.
I do know that people get things wrong on their trees. That is why DNA is a good tool to find the truth. I have so many twists and turns in our tree. My head was spinning at one point. But I haven't looked at it for years now. I have forgotten a lot of it now.
We moved twice and I have lost my password to my DNA ... I know as time passes more people are added. Does anyone know how I can find it again???
Done a lot of work on ancestry and Thomas, like many family names were repeated again and again and I would suggest that you have two Thomas's and it is not unheard of that you all have same ancestors. That does not mean every Thomas related to your ancestors (Parkers?) Is your grandmother's Thomas.
I cam see that. My Grandfather b 1900, had lost a brother as a child named William. My great grandparents parents had another son years later and named him William too. I think those things were common and naming people after relatives of same first name considered an honor.
The two Thomas' could potentially be cousins, not the same man.
That’s possible! Ruth’s marriage certificate has his name, parents and address. Ella’s has his address but not his parents. Large Irish family and there’s several Thomas in there.
PS Am I on a list somewhere? This vid is over a year old but just got 2k hits and a ton of troll comments
@@GigglingKat Not that I know of I regularly watch genealogy videos. As a result, I get lots of suggested videos related to genealogy in my recommended feed. That is how I came across this video.
@@GigglingKat I got you as a suggested video also, and since I did Ancestry I watched, but I also watch "Who do you think you are" and "Finding Roots" and clearly youtube tracks that interest.
@@GigglingKat it just showed up on my recommended feed, probably because I looked at DNA test reveals recently.
lol - you're all welcome - it was just so odd to suddenly have the views shoot through the roof
There may be divorces, but the records are hard to find. My great-grandfather was married 5 times. I have only found 2 divorces for him. But I have not gone to the courthouses in the towns where he or the estanged wives were living. But my grandmother who was his daughter did not appreciate him.
Papa was a rolling stone, wherever he laid his hat was his home....
We luck 🍀 out everything was what we were told on both sides. My Dad 99. 98 % o2 % we thought vikings pillage the village !
I am assuming you eliminated the possibility of cousins with the same name? My grandmother had 5 generations of male family members with the same names. Elswick, John, Henry, Lewis, Archibald, Roden and Ratliff. Made it hard to keep them straight.
I think I have but I really want to go back in time and explain to several of my ancestors IT'S OKAY TO GO A WHOLE GENERATION WITHOUT ANOTHER JAMES OR THOMAS I SWEAR IT WILL BE OKAY.
But yes, I isolated it by address and the addresses were actually listed on the marriage licenses back then - which surprised me.
I honestly think this is more that Thomas and Ella divorced, but those records aren't indexed on Ancestry yet. I made this video mainly for family and friends so I didn't go into all the things they already knew or had access to on my tree.
I also found out family secret when I did my DNA my great grandfather had two family’s a couple of miles apart
Save your descendants thousands of dollars by not keeping secrets. Just own your stuff.
The tangled webs we weave!
My husband found out this year that his grandfather had changed his last name. He had been a brick wall genealogically speaking.
Been there done that. My mom’s family are totally “As the World Turns” all the way! Still trying to find out what happened to my great-great aunt Daisy.
Is it possible, that there were two men named Thomas? Thomas Jr. married one wife, Thomas Sr., his widowed father, married other wife?
ya, that's quite the twisted tale. but it makes sense. just surprised noone called the cops on him. maybe that's why he enlisted in the military?
When people were divorced, sometimes they listed themselves as widowed. There was a stigma attached to divorce and they didn't want it to be known. And then sometimes they were listed as married. It could go either way.
I have not done DNA but turns out my family is old Mormons. So in one census there would be husband a wife b and house servant c. In the next census it would be husband a wife c and house servant b. I just kinda figured who ever was home theday the census taker showed up got to be wife. Haha. It van be very confusing. Thank goodness Mormons are good at keeping records!
I did Ancestry last year and found out that my mother had a secret child at the end of WW2, so I have a half brother a decade older than myself, I made the mistake of answering his email, he wants a relationship but I don't so that is rather unfortunate. Other than that I found out from an English cousin that my grandfather slightly changed our last name (removed an S) and that I am 11% Norwegian which was a surprise (also found out that my last name is fairly common in Norway.) Anyway I enjoyed the experience.
why don't you want to know your brother?
@@bonisteel1 Yeah, I guess I don't understand that either. While I'd be surprised to find a half sibiling, I'd be more than happy to get to know them.
Give it time...you might change your mind. My sister and I have 6 half siblings we didn't know for many years. Now it is a blessing to us....and them.
You a coward 👎
Religion had a huge effect on marriage and families . So things get kept secretive .
I think there are two Thomas’ but closely related say uncle brother or cousin.
Really interesting.
I'm so mixed up from this weird 🤪 story....lm not sure my name is Sue. 🤗
This is a twisred soap opera for sure. I am sorry for your confusion and for all of the secrets. Bless you.