I'm late seeing this but think you nailed it. I've had this wheel for about 4 years now and very happy. It's the last wheel you will buy. That's an important factor when you discuss with your "finance department". Consumer wheels in contrast are disposable items.
Okay, I'm sold. I will have build the man-cave first but there is going to be a DD in there when its finished. Hopefully next summer. The detachable living room rig will have to do until then. Thanks for the review, looking forward to the in depth vids you mentioned.
Don't worry about the financial damage done to others, it happened to me a few months back when I got the OSW kit. Paid more for it as I just got it before the price drop. Below £1000 is excellent, I can now 100% recommend it to everyone. Also I have the same button box for the rim. What I like most apart from the strong FFB is the steering feel you get on this, especially when driving older cars that have very little or no electrical assistance for the drivetrain. Better than driving most modern cars imo. Cheers.
Great detailed information delivered in a brilliant and humorous fashion as usual. Many humble thanks for your continuing coverage of the sim racing universe!
The trusty "tax return" excuse , probably one of the most versatile excuses when it comes to spending money on things that are really nice but you probably don't "need" ;) Joking aside If you are already lost in the world of sim-racing and you have the cash up front these DD wheels might work out saving you money. In that they are far less likely to break than consumer wheels and the only thing you will probably upgrade on it is software + steering wheels....+ button boxes ...+ then you might as well get better pedals .....+ then you need a nicer rig +.... Might as well get VR ......+ might as well get better GPU for VR ...........
You're not wrong GM. I went from xbox controller, G27, Fanatec, and now Bodnar. Then those Fanatec pedals just don't seem good enough to go with my DD wheel, okay better upgrade to HE Pros. Hang on, what about ffb for your arse. Buys transducer kit.... 6 months later, hmmm just imagine full motion.... Yeah, got that too now. I'm not even mentioning the wheel rims, button box, paddle plates, handbrake.... blah blah blah. Now I'm wondering how amazing a projector and curved screen would be....... MUST STOP, HELP!!!!
Couple question, also your channel kicks ass. I watch your channel regularly 👍. You and Jimmy B. give my mornings some color. Anyway, cam this product be delivered to the states, I live here in California. and does the power supply support states regulations(UK=230 volts; USA=,120 volts) if not how do you manage the settings to allow it to work well and would I need a power plug adapter?
you should be able to buy versions for usa I'd asume the PSU has one of those switches on it alowing for different voltage use , I could be wrong lol. There are a few people selling simucube solutions best thing to do is always email the company you want to get it off :)
I see what you mean about not trying one unless you intend to buy. I haven't even tried one but your video makes me look at my t500 with contempt. I can see a small mige in my near future lol.
Just ordered one your review pushed me to buy the 20nm not the 13 cause I’d see over heating issues in compact series I thought it would be enough but I’m scared it wouldn’t hold up to this review so I had to get the same one Definitely need to find money for pedals and a shifter now tho Logitech stuff is going to be a joke with this on my rig
IRL you don't feel tiny bumps and painted lines through the wheel lol, most bumps are dampened by the tires and suspension I should think, i still want an osw though :)
You can filter it out if you want to , I think in real life you would feel the car slip if you slide onto slick painted lines though. Its just nice to have the option to feel absurd details though :) Also you can feel some painted lines though your bum in a real car so its nice to have that through the wheel if you don't have simvibe !
I agree, it is awesome if you can feel every detail and i wouldn't filter it out myself, i just thought it was funny when you said you can feel the painted lines lol.
Remember that a sim wheel is also compensating for the sensations that you get through the seat and inertia etc. You're right though, realistically except for maybe a go kart the feedback you get through the wheel isn't that detailed in a real car.
I mean road cars often the steering is worse than a T300 lol in terms of actual feel but then like you said the g forces make it seem as if its more responsive than it is.
Just make sure you padlock it to the bed first, then bring out the whip and only then make the online order for the DD wheel. You have to warm it up before going in for the kill.
As someone who runs a G27 between 40 and 60 percent FFB in most sims, is one of these still worth consideration? IE Is the detail still there if you run it at low torque? The reliability aspect also really appeals to me.
You can run it at really low strength and still get really nice detail , its like speakers though in that in some ways you do need high volume to get body shaking base. So to have really nice load around fast corners you would need higher FFB to experience that. But at its core the wheel is totally fluid and lose even when off , I mean if you rotate it slowly you can just feel the magnets very faintly but its very smooth. Maybe you should hold out a bit and see what other kits ollie puts out, they litrally just put up a 12Nm wheel sim-pli.city/collections/all/products/sw12-12nm-direct-drive-wheel thats even cheaper wont have the same top end power but will still benefit from insane detail + accuracy.
The 12nm version is the exact same price as the 20nm version now, so I guess after you commented he put the price up. Not sure why he's done that though. :(
I'll have to pop him an email and see whats going on :) Overall all the DD wheels seem to be dropping in price over the last 12 months so be intresting to see what happens. £1100 for what I have including button box and wheel though is an awsome price for what you get.
I don't know if you have the subs to get the major brands to play but I would love a comparison review of the CSW 2.5 and of the Thrustmaster TS-PC Racer. I have a 2.5 and know even not having tired a DD wheel it wont be as good but currently in Australia the options for a DD wheel are extremely limited (like many other smaller countries). even the 20nm wheel would cost close to 2000 after shipping and import taxes etc are paid. Also not everyone has a rig, or are just getting into sim racing (like myself) and buying a DD wheel right off the bat is a bit much as they have so many other upgrades to think about. I had a g27 setup, so a better wheel, new pedals, an actual sim rig (thinking of getting your rig even after paying 200 euro for shipping its cheaper then any soultion in Australia), triple screens or VR... So a comparison would be great, not only for smaller countries like myself where shipping becomes a massive cost and any import taxes but for those who are new to sim racing, might have the bare bones kit like a g27 on a single monitor attached to a desk and are looking to upgrade everything. Hearing your opinion would be great, i.e. are the top of the line non-DD wheels worth the investment or are people better off buying a t300/g27 using that and waiting until they have a rig etc to buy into a DD wheel.
I will have a video out with AMS and the wheel soon , I had issues recording and streaming AMS ! just need to tweak obs settings or use fraps/shadowplay
How much FFB % do you normally run the wheel at? I'm asking this because Sim-plicity recently released a new SW12 kit, with a new MiGe motor that has a peak torque of 12Nm. Looking at that motor's specs, it seems to be much superior to the 20Nm MiGe and comparable to the motors used in the Bodnar wheels, in terms of everything (motor inertia, rotational speed, etc..) except for the peak torque and holding torque.. So do you think those 12Nm might be enough for people that already have a gym membership? :D
I think the end result of my settings I tend to have the wheel at around 65% maybe 70% Its hard to say without testing what the 12Nm motor would be like and if you need the 20Nm motor to get the extra fidelity and detail when running at lower strengths. Intuitively speaking though I'd expect the 12Nm motor to work and feel fantastic the only thing it would probably lack is some of the really high torque kicks you get from 20Nm wheel when that's run at higher stregths. As for the strength in general an interesting this is that sure its more effort than mass market wheels but if you drive smooth and properly then its not so hard , the DD wheels only really punish you if you drive bad or are driving say GP2 or top end cars that have super high torque at a basic level and shake allot lol.
Hi James , Im curious if the SW20 wheel is quirky as far as setting up games ,does it take a lot of computer knowledge. I have an Accu Force wheel that I cant use with Automobilista or ACC I have tried everything but a bullet to make either of those work with the Accu Force, If the SW 20 is this quirky then I dont feel so bad,but if its not Im shipping the AccuForce Wheel back and go withe Sw-20 or the SW12. Any insight is appreciated. Thanks again James.
Another great video review. I've ordered the SW20 and am looking at wheel + button box. Do you recommend the setup you went with in the review - OMP Trecento + sim-gear.co.uk's Suzuka MK1 Button Box? Also, what pedal set would you recommend if money were no object, and which one if money were more of an object? :-)
How is the shifter holding up to the power of the wheel? I guess the steering wheel bolts go all the way through the shifter and screw into the mount on the wheel?
sim-gear.co.uk here. That is correct, the bolts go through the button box and mount to the servo shaft. The wheel isn't strong enough to shear 4 or 5 M5 bolts in half. If you manage to break it, I promise I will send you another one and dedicate a hall of fame to you on my page :D
Could you make available your MMOS, Granity, PC2 and Assetto Corsa settings if you feel they are good. I got through my call with Simplicity yesterday but all the settings are a bit daunting. Current AS feels not too bad but PC2 feels terrible and I have no clue really what to play with to make it better. If you could make what you have available you'd save me, and probably others, a lot of time and hassle trying to figure it out. Or can you point to somewhere that you got your settings if you used someone elses? My setup is the same as yours for wheel and button box and SW-20. For some reason PC2 feels very weak even with gain set to 100%. Thanks.
I yep prefer the SW20 to AF wheel , slightly smoother and then slightly more punchy and precise with its FFB delivery. Both are good bits of kit though.
Not sure I'll get a reply here BUT worth a try .... Is your simetik rig coping with the high torque or have you switched to a tougher mounting cockpit? Looking at getting a proper set up in a few months and just picking bits out.
One more question about your DD setup. Were you able to mount it to your Simetik K2 rig as is, or did you have to drill holes to make it work? I think that's it for now. :)
Yep it works great thats what I have been using it with, of course its not 100% perfect and you do get some wobble in the rig but I think unless you had a much larger rig then that's going to be inevitable. th-cam.com/video/hWxXVlFZqnY/w-d-xo.html - this stream is with the SW20 on the K2 cockpit. I think to get a rig thats better with it you will probably have to spend 350 maybe 450+
Do you notice the lower resolution (13.2877 bit) on the Mige servo motor vs. the higher resolution (16 bit) of other motors like the accuforce that you tested?
No if anything the Mige motor feels higher resolution than the Accuforce as its less notch and smoother when it comes to rotating the wheel subtally. The encoder is separate to the small mage with there also being multiple solutions on the market. I cannot remember the exact value of the encoder I have on mine but its twice that of another OSW I have used and to be honest even with the one that's half as good it felt better than the AF wheel and just as precise.
Thanks for the quick reply and insights. If you are using the same version that is currently for sale on Sim-Plicity, then it is the MiGE 130ST-M10010 with 10,000 ppr encoder. Thanks again and keep the great content coming. Love that British humor. :)
I've always wondered how many force a real car does and how many n/m you need on your DD wheel to make it as real as possible. Tried to google with no success :(
Depends on the car , from personal experience Honda jazz feels to be around 4-6 Nm , Bog standard arrive and drive go karts feel around 9-12nm and then supposedly GP2 and indy cars can output over 30Nm. With FFB wheels its not necessarily the overall strength but how that power is delivered along with the rotational speed , I think in some cases with a simulator you might want to run higher FFB with certain cars to give a better feel of Gforces grip and ilusion of speed and in other cases you might want to run lower FFB as to not have RSI after a year of sim-racing lol.
This is not a complaint against it as it's obviously one to drool over and sell the wife and not eat for a year to get one.... With researching possibly buying one came across some references to EMI....not everyone having problems but easily remedied by grounding. If you put "osw wheel and EMI problems" into google comes up with webages. I know there's probably more sold out there with no problems just was asking out of interest
Thanks I'll have to look into it , I would have thought the SW20 case works well as a Faraday cadge and the issues are maybe for people that just have stuff bare and in the open.
AC and RF2 by far give the most information interms of the cars aligning themselves properly but then also the games giving you really good feel for the state of the car , front end grip , tire and suspension load as well as road texture.
I was just wondering do direct drive wheels work with game like ETS2 or other driving sims of that type, or is it just the Big racing sims they are compatible with?
The Answer Is say about 20% better , AF is not bad though especially if you are in the states. I didn't buy this wheel but if I was going to buy a DD wheel I'd go for OSW + real car rim of my choosing.
To my knowledge the accuforce uses a stepper motor and not a servo motor which !might! make quite a difference. I don´t own a DD wheel myself I simply informed myself about it by watching lots of reviews.
am I the only one that comes here only to simulate a Fanatec DD review :( I need some help PS you forgot to mention dirt rally 2.0 hahahahahahahaha joking ;)
Not sure the second one they released. I used the original very first one and that was fine I don't really see it being worth paying substantially more for higher resolution encoder. At no point using the lowest one did it ever feel low in input resolution.
How do you compare it to the Accuforce? Also, I got a 320mm steering wheel with my Accuforce and regret not getting a 350mm one. It feels small when driving most GT and road cars. Dont you think your 300mm is too small? :p
I prefer the SW20 as its mechanism is slightly smoother (more noticeable with smaller wheels) and it has a bit more punchy FFB. To be honest I think 300mm is the perfect size for a "general wheel" larger wheels make correcting the car harder / cause you to have to let go of the wheel more (when you mess up) and make the FFB feel less direct. You could argue that a larger wheel lets you put smaller inputs into the steering but to be honest I never found that an issue with the smaller rims (having got used to ant wheels on most consumer ffb wheels lol). I think It might make an interesting video in the future to try a 350mm rim as well as 270mm and really look at how it practically affects things. Wheel size does seem to trigger people I think its one of those things where it feels realy WRONG when you go from one size to another after spending years with one.
GamerMuscleVideos I've been using the thrustmaster 599 with a ts pc racer after upgrading from g25 and think I will stay 300mm when going direct drive, seems to be a good compromise
Checking the current price of this wheel motor, I can honestly say that I don't need a wheel setup this realistic/expensive for race games. When you spend USD$900 just on a motor, at that point I have to ask why you aren't driving actual cars...
hello i will love to have that direct drive with very good software is good at this time please because i will like to buy a direct drive but i dont know which i hesitate with an Accuforce and osw aurgury help me stp thanks
hard to say. Never put my ear next to it which is the only way you would hear anything. The controllerbox psu has a fan though. At least in my unit, which i regret a little, but it reminds me to turn it off when i stopped playing
It makes a quite hissing sound when under load that's barely audible so its effectively silent . whats noisy is if you run it at max strength and you then go over rumble strips / large bumps / crash , the noise will be of your sim-rig lifting off the ground or vibrating lol. If you had a rig that bolted directly into a concrete floor it would probably be totally silent though the driver would probably be making some noise.
I saw the first 4 minutes ... but i have to stop. Why ? 3:24-> clip !!!!! !!!!! !!!!!! Is it really clipping ??? You buy a super-strong and super-expensive wheel base... and it clips ??? Really ??? U really need more raw power ? Plz explain it to me
Surprise your spouse with a Louis Vuitton hand bag too smooth things ovee!!!! Then you "ta da" her with your Amazing DD Wheel, see, super easy, but you have to sell both kidneys!!! Great Review GM, thank you for sharing your thoughts, much appreciated.
OMG, no Dirt 4. That´s a shame and i told you that could happen. I love this title a lot. But maybe there´s a solution, at least for SimuCube. Google "dirt 4 osw", first link to the codemasters forum.
Don't believe the Bullshit. D4 is far better than DR in every aspect, especially physics. People just don't know fucking shit about Rally and think cars have to drift a lot, which they can, if you set them up like this. Played 28 hours so far and a lot more will come.
Does rF2 recognize this wheel? E.g. when i use my T300RS and drive F1 mod, rF2 knows this and setup wheel rotation to 400°. When i switch to GT mod, the game set it up to 540°. It really works good. And did you know opensimwheel.wikidot.com/ ? Please make a "Build your own DD Wheel" series ;)
You what m8 ? This is actually really cheap for what it is , for example other comparable systems have cost £4,000 or more. This kit is also not sold that far from the component cost, as in if you went out and bought the motor , controller cables and everything yourself you would only save maybe 100-150 and in some cases it would cost more as you could not buy in baulk + you would then have to spend hours of your time putting it together and you would also not have a warentee with that. You have to remeber this is not a mass produced device like the other consumer wheels
Ah it's really cheap for what it is. So the others that cost £4,000 were just totally, utterly and completely taking the piss, as opposed to just 'taking the piss'. As a business man myself, I very much doubt this kit is sold close to component cost. I'm calling bullshit on this occasion sorry. Tell you what, if these direct drive wheels are 'that good!' do a video called 'Are direct drive wheels PAY TO WIN'. Because they would put the majority who can't afford them at a disadvantage, Discuss......
.... Further, I spent a tiny amount of time searching out direct driven servo motors, which is effectively what these motors are: 13 N.m with 14mm shaft= 60 dollars, I very much doubt a 7 N.m jump to 20 N.m would be that amount of money. It's as I said, it's snake oil bullshit. As always...
the mige servos £300 are 20 nm constant where as your 13nm £60 is peak power with alot less ppr encoder..its fantastic value for money..Have you tried one? its not snake oil lol bloody troll......
The Bodner solutions were bespoke devices selling to a very small market and also uses higher quality motors than the OSW. If you are a "business man" then you would understand that a large part of the £4k solution's cost would be to recuperate business expenses R&D and other costs associated with selling a device to small professional market. If the OSW kits were ripping people off / massively overcharging then they would not have any sales as people would literally go out and buy the components individually, which is what they were doing before OSW kits came about. These OSW kits literally cost only slightly more than if you were to buy everything on your own and in some cases can work out cheaper as you don't have to spend your time wiring/soldering everything or paying postage and then configuring every single component by yourself. In a way a DD wheel is pay to win, but at the same time when it comes to hyper competitive sim racing they are at a point where FFB is generally a detriment to fast times and just having a lose wheel is fine. A DD wheel is more for immersion / some aspects of real world simulation and training , than it is to drive fast / win at the games. Of course sim racing with a DD wheel is still not close to "real" but its certainly really fun and its a bit of kit that's unlikely to ever brake.
Why would you need this much torque? from the gamers that own these never use them to their full potential because if they did the game would be unplayable. Seems like after you get past 8 it makes no sense to be selling products that I'm sure we'll see that will be 100nM in the future. You people will be wasting your money. Honestly it isn't realistic even in the real world to be able to feel every single detail depending on what car your in. That's not true realism. It would be realistic I guess if you were playing a parking simulator and didn't have power steering. And why is it good to feel every single detail? Why is something that you'd even want? Also the box looks like something from the 1980's thing is fuck ugly
The reason it puts out 20Nm is because thats just what the small maige can handle as well as the PSU it does not really cost them much more to have a 20Nm Version Vs a 12Nm version as both would use same PSU and a 12Nm servo in the same class when it comes to rotational speed , smothness and other aspects good for driving simulators would still cost 80-150 so might as well just go for 20Nm. GP2 , 90s DTM , 90s F1 , 80s F1 , indy car and a bunch of others easily get to 20Nm and more so if a person wanted to have balls blown off it can be fun running wheel at max to get simular experance to driving those cars from a wheel feal perspective at least. Having the FFB give more detail than lots of real world car wheels your right is not "realistic" but then nether is having no feel from the Gforces suspention or other information you feel in a real car. so its nice to get that information from the DD wheel, if it does not impact the actual driving why not its a free bonus and unlike motion rigs does not have latency issues. Simplicity are looking to bring out a sub10Nm version soon for around 500I think it is and the market as a whole is moving in the direction of DD wheels that cost under £1k with wheel and buttons as in manny ways you are right most people dont need more than say 8Nm the main thing is getting the detail high precision input and the ability to set things up exactly as you want without it making the wheel slower to respond.
Sim Racing = 70% of the time setting up & 30% actual racing... love it!.
C SMITH real racing = 90% of time setting up and 10% of time racing.
But both are totally worth it.
Hate it for the same reason
I'm late seeing this but think you nailed it. I've had this wheel for about 4 years now and very happy. It's the last wheel you will buy. That's an important factor when you discuss with your "finance department". Consumer wheels in contrast are disposable items.
Loved it when you stroked the wheel with your finger. Captured a private moment there!!
Great piece of kit. Really good package and really good support from Ollie. Really loving mine.
Okay, I'm sold. I will have build the man-cave first but there is going to be a DD in there when its finished. Hopefully next summer. The detachable living room rig will have to do until then. Thanks for the review, looking forward to the in depth vids you mentioned.
great video . hopefully these become more accessible in years to come, from a price point
Just bought my SW20 v3, now the wait begins
Come back and let us know how you find it please :D
I’m waiting for mine too.
Don't worry about the financial damage done to others, it happened to me a few months back when I got the OSW kit. Paid more for it as I just got it before the price drop. Below £1000 is excellent, I can now 100% recommend it to everyone. Also I have the same button box for the rim. What I like most apart from the strong FFB is the steering feel you get on this, especially when driving older cars that have very little or no electrical assistance for the drivetrain. Better than driving most modern cars imo. Cheers.
Great detailed information delivered in a brilliant and humorous fashion as usual. Many humble thanks for your continuing coverage of the sim racing universe!
V2 Accuforce DD wheel
Just bought one they are awesome for value
Thank you for this video. You helped keep me from replacing my Fanatec CSR Elite with the Clubsport V2.5 and went with the SW20+ DD setup.
I'm not a minutte in and I know I will buy this. Been waiting for a year now. Time to blow the tax return on something usefull this summer.
The trusty "tax return" excuse , probably one of the most versatile excuses when it comes to spending money on things that are really nice but you probably don't "need" ;)
Joking aside If you are already lost in the world of sim-racing and you have the cash up front these DD wheels might work out saving you money. In that they are far less likely to break than consumer wheels and the only thing you will probably upgrade on it is software + steering wheels....+ button boxes ...+ then you might as well get better pedals .....+ then you need a nicer rig +.... Might as well get VR ......+ might as well get better GPU for VR ...........
I would wait ´till Fanatec shows its DD Wheel. Just to see how good it is and decide then.
If its good the only logical thing to do would be to buy both and use one for each hand, why else were humans born with two arms ?
You're not wrong GM. I went from xbox controller, G27, Fanatec, and now Bodnar. Then those Fanatec pedals just don't seem good enough to go with my DD wheel, okay better upgrade to HE Pros. Hang on, what about ffb for your arse. Buys transducer kit.... 6 months later, hmmm just imagine full motion.... Yeah, got that too now. I'm not even mentioning the wheel rims, button box, paddle plates, handbrake.... blah blah blah. Now I'm wondering how amazing a projector and curved screen would be....... MUST STOP, HELP!!!!
one year later - resizing.flixster.com/kN38bQp1TPFBwwuzulGvKdJknp4=/300x300/v1.bjsyMTYyNjU7ajsxNzM3MjsxMjAwOzIzOTY7MzA4Nw
the low cost of these systems is incredible, no brainer purchase,
industrial grade full servo system
You had me hooked at "shaft"
Couple question, also your channel kicks ass. I watch your channel regularly 👍. You and Jimmy B. give my mornings some color.
Anyway, cam this product be delivered to the states, I live here in California. and does the power supply support states regulations(UK=230 volts; USA=,120 volts) if not how do you manage the settings to allow it to work well and would I need a power plug adapter?
you should be able to buy versions for usa I'd asume the PSU has one of those switches on it alowing for different voltage use , I could be wrong lol. There are a few people selling simucube solutions best thing to do is always email the company you want to get it off :)
This video sold me....will be here in 28 days!
Love my DD wheel. I concur with slightly bald brit!
I see what you mean about not trying one unless you intend to buy. I haven't even tried one but your video makes me look at my t500 with contempt. I can see a small mige in my near future lol.
Just ordered one your review pushed me to buy the 20nm not the 13 cause I’d see over heating issues in compact series I thought it would be enough but I’m scared it wouldn’t hold up to this review so I had to get the same one
Definitely need to find money for pedals and a shifter now tho Logitech stuff is going to be a joke with this on my rig
would you be able to do a setup tutorial from rim/button box mounting, to pc/software installation and configuration ?
IRL you don't feel tiny bumps and painted lines through the wheel lol, most bumps are dampened by the tires and suspension I should think, i still want an osw though :)
You can filter it out if you want to , I think in real life you would feel the car slip if you slide onto slick painted lines though. Its just nice to have the option to feel absurd details though :)
Also you can feel some painted lines though your bum in a real car so its nice to have that through the wheel if you don't have simvibe !
I agree, it is awesome if you can feel every detail and i wouldn't filter it out myself, i just thought it was funny when you said you can feel the painted lines lol.
You can even feel ants when you run them over !
Remember that a sim wheel is also compensating for the sensations that you get through the seat and inertia etc. You're right though, realistically except for maybe a go kart the feedback you get through the wheel isn't that detailed in a real car.
I mean road cars often the steering is worse than a T300 lol in terms of actual feel but then like you said the g forces make it seem as if its more responsive than it is.
oh dear...my credit card is going to get a beating now!
Just make sure you padlock it to the bed first, then bring out the whip and only then make the online order for the DD wheel. You have to warm it up before going in for the kill.
Good idea, but I just placed an order for the sim gear big box instead to "warm her up".
Could you go in depth on the follow up videos for your drift settings in Assetto? Much appreciated! The steering looks spot on in BMW drift car.
sure thing , in the video I was just using game defaults + my normal MMOS settings for AC I'll have a drift vid up soon though !
Finally a wheel for my 2nd gen MR2! Wait, it's not? How disappointing...
That Simetik rig standing up to the DD & pedals? Always thought you needed something more hefty to mount such a strong heavy wheel & serious pedals?
Where the hell do you guys get your video logos... they look so professional!
As someone who runs a G27 between 40 and 60 percent FFB in most sims, is one of these still worth consideration?
IE Is the detail still there if you run it at low torque? The reliability aspect also really appeals to me.
You can run it at really low strength and still get really nice detail , its like speakers though in that in some ways you do need high volume to get body shaking base. So to have really nice load around fast corners you would need higher FFB to experience that.
But at its core the wheel is totally fluid and lose even when off , I mean if you rotate it slowly you can just feel the magnets very faintly but its very smooth.
Maybe you should hold out a bit and see what other kits ollie puts out, they litrally just put up a 12Nm wheel sim-pli.city/collections/all/products/sw12-12nm-direct-drive-wheel thats even cheaper wont have the same top end power but will still benefit from insane detail + accuracy.
Excellent, thanks for the reply.
The 12nm version is the exact same price as the 20nm version now, so I guess after you commented he put the price up. Not sure why he's done that though. :(
I'll have to pop him an email and see whats going on :) Overall all the DD wheels seem to be dropping in price over the last 12 months so be intresting to see what happens.
£1100 for what I have including button box and wheel though is an awsome price for what you get.
Wow, if your lap times were as quick as your youtube replies, you'd be world champion lol.
I don't know if you have the subs to get the major brands to play but I would love a comparison review of the CSW 2.5 and of the Thrustmaster TS-PC Racer. I have a 2.5 and know even not having tired a DD wheel it wont be as good but currently in Australia the options for a DD wheel are extremely limited (like many other smaller countries). even the 20nm wheel would cost close to 2000 after shipping and import taxes etc are paid. Also not everyone has a rig, or are just getting into sim racing (like myself) and buying a DD wheel right off the bat is a bit much as they have so many other upgrades to think about. I had a g27 setup, so a better wheel, new pedals, an actual sim rig (thinking of getting your rig even after paying 200 euro for shipping its cheaper then any soultion in Australia), triple screens or VR...
So a comparison would be great, not only for smaller countries like myself where shipping becomes a massive cost and any import taxes but for those who are new to sim racing, might have the bare bones kit like a g27 on a single monitor attached to a desk and are looking to upgrade everything. Hearing your opinion would be great, i.e. are the top of the line non-DD wheels worth the investment or are people better off buying a t300/g27 using that and waiting until they have a rig etc to buy into a DD wheel.
Is it worth getting the low power models of these DD wheels? Is there much of a difference?
Shame you didnt try it on the best sim for force feedback Automobilista,great informative video by the way.
I will have a video out with AMS and the wheel soon , I had issues recording and streaming AMS ! just need to tweak obs settings or use fraps/shadowplay
Excellent, i look forward to it.
Any review up to date till now?
Not able to see any review of simplicity, although it is really afordable, seems fishy
Which is better sw20 or the simxperience accuforce?
I need a RIG that can handle this but be easy to pack away. I have my setup in a spare bedroom ......
Any thoughts guys?
How much FFB % do you normally run the wheel at? I'm asking this because Sim-plicity recently released a new SW12 kit, with a new MiGe motor that has a peak torque of 12Nm. Looking at that motor's specs, it seems to be much superior to the 20Nm MiGe and comparable to the motors used in the Bodnar wheels, in terms of everything (motor inertia, rotational speed, etc..) except for the peak torque and holding torque.. So do you think those 12Nm might be enough for people that already have a gym membership? :D
I think the end result of my settings I tend to have the wheel at around 65% maybe 70% Its hard to say without testing what the 12Nm motor would be like and if you need the 20Nm motor to get the extra fidelity and detail when running at lower strengths.
Intuitively speaking though I'd expect the 12Nm motor to work and feel fantastic the only thing it would probably lack is some of the really high torque kicks you get from 20Nm wheel when that's run at higher stregths.
As for the strength in general an interesting this is that sure its more effort than mass market wheels but if you drive smooth and properly then its not so hard , the DD wheels only really punish you if you drive bad or are driving say GP2 or top end cars that have super high torque at a basic level and shake allot lol.
If my electric grid is 117V, would this work with the SW20? or I'll have to find a way to get 240V?
Hi James , Im curious if the SW20 wheel is quirky as far as setting up games ,does it take a lot of computer knowledge.
I have an Accu Force wheel that I cant use with Automobilista or ACC I have tried everything but a bullet to make either of those work with the Accu Force, If the SW 20 is this quirky then I dont feel so bad,but if its not Im shipping the AccuForce
Wheel back and go withe Sw-20 or the SW12. Any insight is appreciated. Thanks again James.
I bought a SW30 but I'm driver issues can I use the sim cube software ? thanks
Another great video review. I've ordered the SW20 and am looking at wheel + button box. Do you recommend the setup you went with in the review - OMP Trecento + sim-gear.co.uk's Suzuka MK1 Button Box? Also, what pedal set would you recommend if money were no object, and which one if money were more of an object? :-)
about to switch to OSW, and have a SImetik K2, can it handle an OSW? and what about mounting points? will i have to drill?
Hi. What button plate you using here please? Trying to track one down. Thanks
It's on pro-sim.no :) not sure if it has same name now
How is the shifter holding up to the power of the wheel? I guess the steering wheel bolts go all the way through the shifter and screw into the mount on the wheel?
sim-gear.co.uk here. That is correct, the bolts go through the button box and mount to the servo shaft. The wheel isn't strong enough to shear 4 or 5 M5 bolts in half. If you manage to break it, I promise I will send you another one and dedicate a hall of fame to you on my page :D
Could you make available your MMOS, Granity, PC2 and Assetto Corsa settings if you feel they are good. I got through my call with Simplicity yesterday but all the settings are a bit daunting. Current AS feels not too bad but PC2 feels terrible and I have no clue really what to play with to make it better. If you could make what you have available you'd save me, and probably others, a lot of time and hassle trying to figure it out. Or can you point to somewhere that you got your settings if you used someone elses? My setup is the same as yours for wheel and button box and SW-20. For some reason PC2 feels very weak even with gain set to 100%. Thanks.
In your opinion is this wheel better than the accuforce wheel ? With a button box and a steering wheel they both come to about the same price.
I yep prefer the SW20 to AF wheel , slightly smoother and then slightly more punchy and precise with its FFB delivery.
Both are good bits of kit though.
Not sure I'll get a reply here BUT worth a try .... Is your simetik rig coping with the high torque or have you switched to a tougher mounting cockpit? Looking at getting a proper set up in a few months and just picking bits out.
Chris Lenton did you end up getting the simitek? If so how is it holding up?
One more question about your DD setup. Were you able to mount it to your Simetik K2 rig as is, or did you have to drill holes to make it work? I think that's it for now. :)
Bryce Evans bump I have this same question
This is not the SW20 I was hoping for.
dreams smashed !
Did you try Richard Burns Rally and Dirt Rally on this wheel?
Have you tried it with the Simetik Cockpit yet? If so, do you feel it is up to far in tackling those high force feedback forces? :)
Yep it works great thats what I have been using it with, of course its not 100% perfect and you do get some wobble in the rig but I think unless you had a much larger rig then that's going to be inevitable.
th-cam.com/video/hWxXVlFZqnY/w-d-xo.html - this stream is with the SW20 on the K2 cockpit.
I think to get a rig thats better with it you will probably have to spend 350 maybe 450+
When are we going to get a better look or review of the sim-gear.co.uk button box?
Ooh this is old, good move on taking the initiative up top. You never go full Nutkins.
amazing video as always!
Would Fanatec wheels including all buttons work on a servo like this?
Kavoriken there are hub adapters available out there for fanatic wheels don't know about all the buttons but I would think so
You can get mods that make it work with it
Do you notice the lower resolution (13.2877 bit) on the Mige servo motor vs. the higher resolution (16 bit) of other motors like the accuforce that you tested?
No if anything the Mige motor feels higher resolution than the Accuforce as its less notch and smoother when it comes to rotating the wheel subtally. The encoder is separate to the small mage with there also being multiple solutions on the market. I cannot remember the exact value of the encoder I have on mine but its twice that of another OSW I have used and to be honest even with the one that's half as good it felt better than the AF wheel and just as precise.
Thanks for the quick reply and insights. If you are using the same version that is currently for sale on Sim-Plicity, then it is the MiGE 130ST-M10010 with 10,000 ppr encoder. Thanks again and keep the great content coming. Love that British humor. :)
I've always wondered how many force a real car does and how many n/m you need on your DD wheel to make it as real as possible. Tried to google with no success :(
Depends on the car , from personal experience Honda jazz feels to be around 4-6 Nm , Bog standard arrive and drive go karts feel around 9-12nm and then supposedly GP2 and indy cars can output over 30Nm.
With FFB wheels its not necessarily the overall strength but how that power is delivered along with the rotational speed , I think in some cases with a simulator you might want to run higher FFB with certain cars to give a better feel of Gforces grip and ilusion of speed and in other cases you might want to run lower FFB as to not have RSI after a year of sim-racing lol.
very good inspirational want one NOOOOOOWWWWW video. Did you have electrical interference issues as reported by some owners?
Not any I have noticed ! I don't actually know anyone that has had this issue. Do you have any links ?
This is not a complaint against it as it's obviously one to drool over and sell the wife and not eat for a year to get one.... With researching possibly buying one came across some references to EMI....not everyone having problems but easily remedied by grounding. If you put "osw wheel and EMI problems" into google comes up with webages. I know there's probably more sold out there with no problems just was asking out of interest
Thanks I'll have to look into it , I would have thought the SW20 case works well as a Faraday cadge and the issues are maybe for people that just have stuff bare and in the open.
Which simulator does it feel best on .... explicitly AC
Racing__Apex I'd say I like Automobilista ffb the most, followed by Rfactor2 then Assetto Corsa
imo, automobilista has the best FFB of any game. But AC/iRacing/RF2 all feel
great.
AC and RF2 by far give the most information interms of the cars aligning themselves properly but then also the games giving you really good feel for the state of the car , front end grip , tire and suspension load as well as road texture.
I need to try AMS properly I had some random issue with recording it :(
I get great results with my OSW on all the major sims, but AMS stands out for sure.
Idk about that kind of fidelity with movement that seems slightly to sensitive lol
Is it true these ca nbreak your arm? i am scared...
were they not aware that "SW20" is the chassis code for the 2nd-gen Toyota MR2 or....
Dalton Bedore lol the SIM wheel probably rolls faster.
brilliant my son
How does the simetek cockpit hold up with this beast?
It's not 100% rock solid but it's as solid as you are going to get for under £400. I think it does an awesome job myself !
I was just wondering do direct drive wheels work with game like ETS2 or other driving sims of that type, or is it just the Big racing sims they are compatible with?
If the Osw Direct drive is running SimUCUBE software it works great in ets2
Thanks for the reply
Dsl dite moi une dernière question quel est votre direct drive personnel merci
I placed an order for the Accuforce V2 ....did i make a mistake? how much better is this???
The Answer Is say about 20% better , AF is not bad though especially if you are in the states. I didn't buy this wheel but if I was going to buy a DD wheel I'd go for OSW + real car rim of my choosing.
To my knowledge the accuforce uses a stepper motor and not a servo motor which !might! make quite a difference.
I don´t own a DD wheel myself I simply informed myself about it by watching lots of reviews.
why you use mmos firmware?
am I the only one that comes here only to simulate a Fanatec DD review :( I need some help PS you forgot to mention dirt rally 2.0 hahahahahahahaha joking ;)
do you use OSW with simetik k2? Is the K2 good for osw? Thanks!
+Manu Casasnovas yes thats what I use.
Would be nice if Sim Plicity answered his emails, guess he doesn't want to make a sale. good luck getting a 1 hour phone call..
ich warte noch was fanatec dd wheel mäßig, ende des jahres auf den markt bringt! :-)
8:50
*Mario Kart*
What encoder are you using with this wheel, the 40K or 2M one?
Not sure the second one they released. I used the original very first one and that was fine I don't really see it being worth paying substantially more for higher resolution encoder. At no point using the lowest one did it ever feel low in input resolution.
How do you compare it to the Accuforce?
Also, I got a 320mm steering wheel with my Accuforce and regret not getting a 350mm one. It feels small when driving most GT and road cars. Dont you think your 300mm is too small? :p
anasmak11 I have a 320mm Momo and I'm looking at getting a Sportline 300mm
I prefer the SW20 as its mechanism is slightly smoother (more noticeable with smaller wheels) and it has a bit more punchy FFB.
To be honest I think 300mm is the perfect size for a "general wheel"
larger wheels make correcting the car harder / cause you to have to let go of the wheel more (when you mess up) and make the FFB feel less direct.
You could argue that a larger wheel lets you put smaller inputs into the steering but to be honest I never found that an issue with the smaller rims (having got used to ant wheels on most consumer ffb wheels lol).
I think It might make an interesting video in the future to try a 350mm rim as well as 270mm and really look at how it practically affects things. Wheel size does seem to trigger people I think its one of those things where it feels realy WRONG when you go from one size to another after spending years with one.
GamerMuscleVideos I've been using the thrustmaster 599 with a ts pc racer after upgrading from g25 and think I will stay 300mm when going direct drive, seems to be a good compromise
1:04 you forgot to say "have them financially take your eyes out and come back for the sockets"
Checking the current price of this wheel motor, I can honestly say that I don't need a wheel setup this realistic/expensive for race games. When you spend USD$900 just on a motor, at that point I have to ask why you aren't driving actual cars...
hello i will love to have that direct drive with very good software is good at this time please because i will like to buy a direct drive but i dont know which i hesitate with an Accuforce and osw aurgury help me stp thanks
I prefer the OSW to AF wheel but I have not tried the AF v2.0 just the first one.
vr or osw?
Can I use any button box for this?
Tyler T you can use any seperate device you want. I use a usb button box on an omp trecento wheel.
What usb button box do you have? And how much did it cost yah? Thanks very much for the reply guy
How loud is it?
hard to say. Never put my ear next to it which is the only way you would hear anything. The controllerbox psu has a fan though. At least in my unit, which i regret a little, but it reminds me to turn it off when i stopped playing
It makes a quite hissing sound when under load that's barely audible so its effectively silent . whats noisy is if you run it at max strength and you then go over rumble strips / large bumps / crash , the noise will be of your sim-rig lifting off the ground or vibrating lol.
If you had a rig that bolted directly into a concrete floor it would probably be totally silent though the driver would probably be making some noise.
I saw the first 4 minutes ... but i have to stop. Why ?
3:24-> clip !!!!! !!!!! !!!!!!
Is it really clipping ??? You buy a super-strong and super-expensive wheel base... and it clips ??? Really ???
U really need more raw power ?
Plz explain it to me
I wish DD could transfer to console
Dennis warn gimx adapter lets you emulate another wheel for consoles
I think fanatec are the only guys to provide a DD wheel for console
Surprise your spouse with a Louis Vuitton hand bag too smooth things ovee!!!! Then you "ta da" her with your Amazing DD Wheel, see, super easy, but you have to sell both kidneys!!! Great Review GM, thank you for sharing your thoughts, much appreciated.
You really do look like someone who works at morrisons.
LOL ! "Morrisons Makes It"
OMG, no Dirt 4. That´s a shame and i told you that could happen. I love this title a lot. But maybe there´s a solution, at least for SimuCube. Google "dirt 4 osw", first link to the codemasters forum.
+Leynad Jee dirt 4 is not very good so it's not that much of an issue. Need to try it with dirt rally still though !
Don't believe the Bullshit. D4 is far better than DR in every aspect, especially physics. People just don't know fucking shit about Rally and think cars have to drift a lot, which they can, if you set them up like this. Played 28 hours so far and a lot more will come.
Apology accepted!
Does rF2 recognize this wheel? E.g. when i use my T300RS and drive F1 mod, rF2 knows this and setup wheel rotation to 400°. When i switch to GT mod, the game set it up to 540°. It really works good. And did you know opensimwheel.wikidot.com/ ? Please make a "Build your own DD Wheel" series ;)
Im so cheap that im only dreaming about these things, and if i do get the base I’ll probably end up taking a wheel from a wrecked car
Allo reponder svp je devrai acheter un osw ou Accu force pro v2 svp
I think the OSW is better than the AF , but have not tried AF pro 2
Okay GMV, your fault... i just bought one.. ;)
yeah. basically plug and play.
You are partly to blame for causing critical damage to my bank balance..... Ty
Haha. Rookies class pileup at charlotte
Wires and boxes all over the place,but hey I have the best wheel,look at me!
This is set up is worth $1200.
Some chance they'll send you this wheel for a review:
sim-pli.city/collections/all/products/sw7c-7nm-direct-drive-wheel
Too heavy for practical desktop use.
Man this thing will break your hands if you dont take care....just sayin its nothing for beginniers.
"Forza 7 is a sim" face @ 2:07 :D
If only, Mario kart 8
Only way to play Mario kart 8 is with a DD wheel.
Yep, and Cemu is doing a great job :-)
LOL @ the price. Do they think we're fucking mugs or something?
You what m8 ? This is actually really cheap for what it is , for example other comparable systems have cost £4,000 or more. This kit is also not sold that far from the component cost, as in if you went out and bought the motor , controller cables and everything yourself you would only save maybe 100-150 and in some cases it would cost more as you could not buy in baulk + you would then have to spend hours of your time putting it together and you would also not have a warentee with that.
You have to remeber this is not a mass produced device like the other consumer wheels
Ah it's really cheap for what it is. So the others that cost £4,000 were just totally, utterly and completely taking the piss, as opposed to just 'taking the piss'. As a business man myself, I very much doubt this kit is sold close to component cost. I'm calling bullshit on this occasion sorry. Tell you what, if these direct drive wheels are 'that good!' do a video called 'Are direct drive wheels PAY TO WIN'. Because they would put the majority who can't afford them at a disadvantage, Discuss......
.... Further, I spent a tiny amount of time searching out direct driven servo motors, which is effectively what these motors are: 13 N.m with 14mm shaft= 60 dollars, I very much doubt a 7 N.m jump to 20 N.m would be that amount of money. It's as I said, it's snake oil bullshit. As always...
the mige servos £300 are 20 nm constant where as your 13nm £60 is peak power with alot less ppr encoder..its fantastic value for money..Have you tried one? its not snake oil lol bloody troll......
The Bodner solutions were bespoke devices selling to a very small market and also uses higher quality motors than the OSW. If you are a "business man" then you would understand that a large part of the £4k solution's cost would be to recuperate business expenses R&D and other costs associated with selling a device to small professional market.
If the OSW kits were ripping people off / massively overcharging then they would not have any sales as people would literally go out and buy the components individually, which is what they were doing before OSW kits came about.
These OSW kits literally cost only slightly more than if you were to buy everything on your own and in some cases can work out cheaper as you don't have to spend your time wiring/soldering everything or paying postage and then configuring every single component by yourself.
In a way a DD wheel is pay to win, but at the same time when it comes to hyper competitive sim racing they are at a point where FFB is generally a detriment to fast times and just having a lose wheel is fine.
A DD wheel is more for immersion / some aspects of real world simulation and training , than it is to drive fast / win at the games. Of course sim racing with a DD wheel is still not close to "real" but its certainly really fun and its a bit of kit that's unlikely to ever brake.
Why would you need this much torque? from the gamers that own these never use them to their full potential because if they did the game would be unplayable. Seems like after you get past 8 it makes no sense to be selling products that I'm sure we'll see that will be 100nM in the future. You people will be wasting your money. Honestly it isn't realistic even in the real world to be able to feel every single detail depending on what car your in. That's not true realism. It would be realistic I guess if you were playing a parking simulator and didn't have power steering. And why is it good to feel every single detail? Why is something that you'd even want? Also the box looks like something from the 1980's thing is fuck ugly
The reason it puts out 20Nm is because thats just what the small maige can handle as well as the PSU it does not really cost them much more to have a 20Nm Version Vs a 12Nm version as both would use same PSU and a 12Nm servo in the same class when it comes to rotational speed , smothness and other aspects good for driving simulators would still cost 80-150 so might as well just go for 20Nm.
GP2 , 90s DTM , 90s F1 , 80s F1 , indy car and a bunch of others easily get to 20Nm and more so if a person wanted to have balls blown off it can be fun running wheel at max to get simular experance to driving those cars from a wheel feal perspective at least.
Having the FFB give more detail than lots of real world car wheels your right is not "realistic" but then nether is having no feel from the Gforces suspention or other information you feel in a real car. so its nice to get that information from the DD wheel, if it does not impact the actual driving why not its a free bonus and unlike motion rigs does not have latency issues.
Simplicity are looking to bring out a sub10Nm version soon for around 500I think it is and the market as a whole is moving in the direction of DD wheels that cost under £1k with wheel and buttons as in manny ways you are right most people dont need more than say 8Nm the main thing is getting the detail high precision input and the ability to set things up exactly as you want without it making the wheel slower to respond.