To the individuals commenting 'knights don't move like that', some information: I know they don't move like that. I deliberately depicted an illegal move. I'll leave you to join the dots.
I'm gonna be honest... It's not very clear what you were going for. Maybe there's some deep philosophical symbolism going on, but I don't see it Edit: now that someone explained it, I see the connection. However, I still stand by my statement. It was placed at the beginning, when I had no idea what the video was about. Therefore, the title sequence didn't leave any impact. I thought "that's a funny knight" and moved on The video may have contained the answer, but I quickly forgot about the beginning move. The main content is what I'm here for, after all. The little knight maneuver was probably added near the end of the video production process. However, I feel most new viewers would likely misinterpret as they have no prior knowledge of the subject If what the commenter below me said is the intended explanation, then it's expecting me to jump through too many hoops. The switch from chess to abstract thinking *back* to chess is too much (A fake knight who is actually a pawn). Lastly, the symbolism doesn't connect with the video. The objective in chess is to checkmate/capture the king, which the knight did. The knight actually helped while the video is explaining how some people who think they are helping are, in fact, doing harm. No hate, @TheraminTrees I love your videos. I just feel like you could've chose a more fitting beginning. TL;DR Beginning sequence is too confusing and doesn't connect with the video
i mean - theramintrees has almost 300k subs, his videos get good viewership, and i found him through the algorithm, i didnt actively seek him out. its not that bad. theyd be losing money if they didnt push flashy short videos from people who upload daily, that viewership is just so much easier to monetise. as long as they allow theramintrees and others on the site and host their videos, you cant really complain. right?
Agreed - with the new algorithms, nothing good was coming up in the recommends. Only stuff I'd already watched, or random BS, in random languages. But then I tried typing 'Video Essays' (no context, just those words) in the search box, and a load of really good stuff came up. Still 95% rubbish, but that is better than 100%! That being said, the algorithms brought me here. Just after I'd watched Solar Sands new vid. I think this guy is in the same ball park, so that is something.
I love how you always refer to the subject as "we", it implicitly tells the audience that this can happen to anyone, and it prevents patholigisation and othering.
That's a good point. So many people think they are above being human and making all the mistakes that come with it. "Yeah, that happens to people who are *weak* , *unlucky* and *stupid* , but not *me* ". How in for a surprise they are when life humbles them to the fact that no one has got it all figured out. Whether it comes from a place of dishonesty or not.
Yeah, for stuff like schizophrenia I think it's important to distinguish the unique issues. But pretty much everyone is almost instinctively aware of problems like this and the "we" helps invoke that.
I’m sorry you experienced that. I’ve never even considered this a possible pitfall of parenting. Think I might have some stuff to unpack before having kids of my own so I don’t make the same mistake as your mother ❤
For some reason, your comment drew a connection for me. When my son was a baby, I would get very agitated and upset when he would cry for prolonged periods. Nothing new, obviously; millions of people over history have reported the same. But at the time I didn’t know that. I thought that if my baby cried for a long time, that meant I was being a bad parent. I was missing something, or not doing something I ought to be. Eventually, when I couldn’t get him to stop crying, I started getting angry. I felt like I wanted to MAKE him shut up. I scared myself. I was afraid that I would lose it, and hurt my child just because I was so angry that he wouldn’t stop crying. I told my partner about this, even though every fiber of my being told me to hide it out of shame, and fear of rejection. But then she told me it was normal. That lots of people feel that way. What matters is that you DON’T HURT THE CHILD. So… I didn’t. Your comment makes me think that some parents maybe haven’t realized this carries on into adulthood. Our job isn’t to make sure our children never experience pain, and never cry. We aren’t being bad parents when that happens. They’re inevitable. We end up being resentful, and harmful if we stick to the mindset that we have to always pull people out of their pain when and how we deem it necessary. That’s my take anyway.
A few years ago, I was in Lewisham and I saw a man running for his life down the street. He was being pursued by another man, who I presume was a street preacher. The preacher had a massive bible in his hand and was shouting; "STOP! I'M TRYING TO SAVE YOU!" I know how absolutely ridiculous and unbelievable this sounds but I swear I'm not making it up! Also, it was in Lewisham 🤣
God i do not trust people who claim to be empaths and use it to be invasive. Mainly because my body language is different from "frowning means sad, folded arms mean angry" type of body language and it shuffles. I get accused of lying about my feelings a lot by these people and its super odd when they dont listen to my words. I express myself by stating how I feel, not "showing" it. They expect to know how I'm feeling before I state it and thats not how I communicate at all. Its uncomfortable.
Sorry to hear about your issue, though in fairness - most communication is non-verbal. The fact you exhibit atypical non-verbal communication probably does fuck people up, we have a lifetime of people acting .... reasonably consistent and it informs how we interact. Then you come along and it contracts previous experience - it's not unreasonable to be doubtful of your sincerity. So I guess I'm saying ... that sucks, thank you for your patience.
@@padrescout Exactly this. It's very unfortunate, but a lot of people do experience emotions in line with their body language and deny it. That means that when somebody sincerely experiences things different tonwgat they're showing through body language there's a lot of doubt at play there. Hopefully the company you keep has gotten used to it and respects your sincerity!
_"Helping is about identifying and addressing the legitimate needs of a situation. When those things aren't done then whatever we think we're doing, we're not helping. And we might be straying into a parody of problem-solving, called drama."_ *Cough* Dr. Phil *Cough*
It's painfully ironic that the guy who displays suffering and mentally ill people on tv for the audience to gawk at as if they were at a zoo, is lecturing us about causing drama.
@@AD-dg3zz To be fair, he usually does get people the actual help they need. afterwards. Therapy isnt exactly cheap and rarely is it done as a charity. Sometimes we should compare ourselves to those we criticize.
Tyrone's story is so heartwarming. I've been around too many people that act superior to anyone and everyone. Hell I'd be lying if I said I never got in that head space myself. Hearing about his transformation and self reflection is inspiring.
Not really, I noticed at no point did someone actually sit down and talk to Tyrone until his issues were very far along, just either ignored him, or began to openly mock him. He had problems and no one really wanted to help him. Sure, some people need to sort their own problems out, but just as there are people who go through this and have eye openers, there's many more who end up on self destructive paths because no one tells them what they need to hear before it's too late. I just can't help but feel a bit of smug "WeLl I cAn'T hElP yOu!" from the video.
@@itsabug4274 You aren't wrong, although I do still find the outcome of Tyrone's story appealing. I don't think they had any obligation to try and 'fix' Tyrone given the environment, especially when he made clear his negative views of them. It's more of a widespread issue regarding men's mental health imo. It tends to get neglected or harmed in upbringing and forgotten about later in life. Mental health in general should be taken more seriously, but awareness of men's mental health especially needs aid.
@@itsabug4274 "sitting down and talking to him", although not a bad idea, is a lot more easier said than successfully done. If it was that easy, therapists would only need one session to help their clients. Hell, if anybody could do it, there would no places to learn how to be a therapist.
@@yosh3058 @Yosh He didn't have negative views though, he had an apparent savior complex. I want to also note the EXTREME irony in mentioning men's mental health often being disregarded right after you said there was no obligation to help (not 'fix', please don't put words in my mouth...) Tyrone with his issues. Also, yes there is an obligation. The teacher of the class has an obligation to fix any issues with their students, at the very least, mocking him in such a manner did nothing more than worsen the problem. That's pretty unforgivable when you're supposed to be a PSYCHOLOGY professor...
@@itsabug4274 I feel like perhaps they did try, Theramintrees just didnt think it important enough to include. Even if they did try and tell him how he was upsetting the group, hed be too stubborn in his preconceptions to listen. Ive been struggling with a savior complex myself, and I know how stubborn I can get when I get to that point. Like Theramintrees said, he was a draining presence and it would be even more draining to try and help him when he wouldnt listen.
@@tuekham9312 A good intention can start as legit but once it spirals out of control without necessarily reality checks the pavement turns to a mask. In either case, it’s the same destination.
I've experienced a great deal of proselytism where it is claimed that their intention is altruistic - to "save" me because they "care" about me. But it's revealing how little they actually listen to what I'm saying - other than to find ways to trip me up.
It would be fascinating wouldn't it to see how, in these kinds of situations, your words are being translated - to see all the omissions and substitutions, the corruption of meaning. I hope you and yours are well my friend. Lovely to see you.
@@TheraminTrees Interesting how the ones looking to profit off you like a free money dispenser are always the ones saying they “love” you, and “care” for you.
I feel you Hassan. It’s almost like they don’t care. They have a preprogrammed mission. Whatever you say doesn’t matter. I’m glad I’m not the only one that experienced this. I feel like most videos on the savior complex only talk about how this affects the person who is the savior and not those around them. I’m glad this video focused on how abusive they can be.
Chronic animal rescuers fall into this category. It took me a while to understand "you can't save them all." and later "you can't save anyone but yourself." Thaks for the great vid!
Sounds like a false dichotomy to me. If you can't save them all, it doesn't mean you can't save/help anyone but yourself. I can see how this false narrative of "being self-sufficient" (in fact - relying on powers that be) vs "having a saviour complex" is imposed on us. Via modern psychology amongst other means. They want us atomized. New 1984ish slogan of our times: Vulnerability = Empowerment. (And we are vulnerable if we choose to care about ourselves first and foremost... cause we simply can't. We are social beings and haven't evolved for it. We are totally vulnerable before Big Nanny State.) If we'll label the natural need to help each other as something unhealthy, as just a side of Karpman's Triangle - humanity is done with.
Another thing this can lead to is animal abuse, as horrid opportunists abuse animals so that they can “save” them for content. I presume that this is supposed to give warm fuzzies to the audience, but they always make me feel awful…
@@liammclin5722 I had this feeling, those movies when they get fully tech equipped approaching an starved animal or injured in the middle of nowhere....
@@stumblestutter this content is very popular and it is easy to harm an animal and then film rescuing. TH-cam should stop monetarization on such content, it will save more animals.
YOU TAUGHT ME CRITICAL THINKING FROM THE AGE OF 13! I cannot understate how critical your content was in teaching me how to view the world. I'm only 17 now, but I've come so far thanks to you and I'm not even in therapy yet. You helped me understand my situation while I was in it, and truly comprehend it when I got out. I used to suffer from the worst feelings of shame for being myself, to the degree I'd want to stop being. You then posted a video about malignant shame, and it didn't cure me or fix me, but it showed me that what I was feeling was okay, and a natural response to my environment. Thank you so much ♥️
I'm an old 22 year old but have been watching his content for many years too. He really does help a lot. The critical thinking is what helped me get out of unhealthy religous beliefs and out of abusive situations.
Used to be in your shoes. I'm glad you've got resources like this to support you. When I was your age all I managed to find for support were misogynistic/racist hate groups. This made my day a little better. I wish you luck in your journey and I applaud you.
As a 3D Artist I am truly blown away by how you manage to illustrate the situations you are talking about without taking away the clarity of your message. (Pleasing and easy to understand visually but not fully consuming ones focus and attention) To me your videos are truly a perfect combination of all the elements that create the ultimate positive and helpful content. Big thank you!! :)
Reminds me of a friend I used to have. A few months ago I was talking about being mad about something and she instantly assumed I wanted to die for some reason. She told my mom about it then when I confronted her about it she ignored me for like 2 months. When she finally texted me back she said that I couldn’t speak to her like that. Then acted like she was the one who was wronged. I apologized and asked her to apologize back. Then she said “I won’t apologize for caring.” So I ended the friendship. She contacted me again on a different app that I forgot to block her on. She started an argument and twisted my words. Now I have no intention of speaking to her ever again. I am still angry about it you can probably tell from the comment. She seriously could have ruined my life with her “caring”. It sucks because she was my only friend. But I would rather be friendless instead of that bullshit.
Good for you. I really like this video because it summarizes what I already knew. It validates me. I have similar experiences to you. It wasn’t just one person. It was like three. I was going through a hard time and these people tried to leech off of me. I would been okay with the help if it was the way I wanted. By that I mean respectful. My concern was that if they see they can force to do that one thing it would spread to other things. My role in the drama was not asking for help from the right people. These savior types just like the video said. Don’t compute conflicting information. I hate them they are so arrogant. They only want you to listen to them.
What I like so much about your videos is that they’re very humanising and understanding while still holding inappropriate behaviour accountable. And accountability in this case is more about empowering people to change themselves, rather than putting them in an “evil” basket for the rest of their lives. Seeing that hope is possible for any of us who may be guilty of these patterns of behaviour/thought is heartening.
at 15:00, what you said about someone grumbling about a job and another coming forth with career ideas, took me back to when I interviewed as a Resident advisor back in college. They had asked me a question along the lines of: "Say a student comes up to you with a problem regarding their classes or similar, what would you do in that situation?" I'd basically said that it depends on what they're looking for. If they're looking for a solution, I can work with them to try and find it, but if not, I'll just hear them out. I told them that sometimes people aren't looking for a solution, they just, want someone to talk to. They'd thanked me and told me they wished more people understood that idea. I've never really stopped thinking about that moment over the years. That idea of being empathetic but not overbearing. I like to hope that I'm still following those principles well today. This video really hit home for me.
Thanks for being this type of person. I remember a strong conflict with someone who wanted to lecture me on what to do, while I repeatedly said I didn't want that (especially since it was advice coming from little knowledge and jumping to conclusions). Ironically I was not allowed to explain why this is not helpful.
I've begun filtering what I talk about and with whom because there are so many people who think that every utterance is an invitation for them to flex how smart and helpful they are. They don't care about their victims simply wanting to vent a little, they want to advise and correct. It's like a dopamine hit with these people.
This video has just woke me up to the fact I have been indulged in my own saviour complex for so long… thinking back I must have caused so many people harm… and just like you said, it was validation that i was digging for. What’s crazy is that I’d secretly root against people I knew, so that I could sweep in and “save the day”. TheraminTrees, thank you so much.
I see it a bit in myself as well, but not to the extreme of thinking I can read minds, but just the little bits of advise. For the most part though I joke around making fun with words like george carlin, or sharing knowledge of things like nitinol or the double slit experiment or talking about space. But if someone is looking for small object or something, I will start to help look and make suggestions like have you looked in the tread of your boot. Lost a screwdriver bit for 20 minutes one time cuz of that LOL. Finally thought to check our boots and there it was.
I relate to Tyrone's a bit. When I was a teen I started to engage with feminism and pride, etc, through the internet, but not in a more thoughtful approach like I do today. I took a very similar role of calling out people for no reason with little to no bases. Thankfully, this never ruined any relationship of mine, but it's very embarrassing to me.
@@mahima2630 you know, i dont know whats worse, being the embodiment of the "snowflake" or being its antithesis, the "anti-sjw" I resent the former a lot more lmao
@@catrielmarignaclionti4518 I dislike the former, but I only resent the latter. The former isn't working towards or empowering those that are working towards taking away anyone's rights.
I love the use of the ink-blots as representing the foundations of genuine personality. They're messy and human unlike the predefined social geometry of the rescuer, victim, and persecutor; real people aren't simple like stock characters.
I have never wanted to physically touch animated objects more in my life!!! I adore your animation style and narrative style!! It's like a strange relative to asmr as well as being immensely educational! Amazing work!
It's funny how I identified with the new call center volunteer. Touches from people I don't know, or I don't know well, bother me. I would have pushed her away, too.
@@eliyasne9695 it'd sell too! Would get a sale from me. I often listen to TT or HealthyGamerGG in the morning, but some days I don't because of my executive dysfunction (and emotional regulation) and I'll get into habits of scrolling endlessly on tiktok (kinda like babies sucking on thumbs to self-soothe?); Having a material reminder to wake up to would be helpful 😅 Kinda like a Buddha statue as gratitude to his wonderful lessons; or a bookshelf full of our favourite authors.
On my first social platform, I was introduced to the worst kind of online drama -- interpersonal drama. Being a good-natured, but ignorant 19-year-old, I always played savior to my friends. I was careful never to be pursuer, and wasn't weak enough to be a victim (majority of the time), but I'd always play savior. Playing savior came to a head in two notable situations. The first time was a group v group situation, so everyone was at fault. And I shouldn't have fed so much into the drama. The second, became the most shameful moment of my life. I'd grown such blind allegiance to my friends that I couldn't see the obvious signs that something was deeply wrong with a situation I got myself involved in. I'm not proud to say I nearly flew into hysterics. I even cursed for the first time in my life. Then I took the very people I hurt and forced them to play a complicated scheme of my own design... It wasn't until one of them worked up the courage to speak their mind that I realized how deeply I hurt everyone. I was so angry that I barely had empathy once I pushed them to tears at my feet. Some savior. Their tears still haunt me.
This is very important content. I have noticed "saviour" tendencies in myself, developed from how I was parentified as a teen. My friends tend to see me as a bit of a quasi therapist. And for some time I liked being in that role. I like giving advice and I think my advice is usually pretty good. The problem is that often it's not my place to give advice. I can't fix my friends' lives. Even if they're depressed and anxious and have low self esteem and I want to try and help them feel better. At a certain point I can overstep from being a supportive friend and that's been something I definitely need to work on. Same with when I've automatically stepped into "rescue" mode in arguments between friends, trying to mediate etc. It never ends well.
I feel this. A lot of my friends have serious problems in their lives and either don't or can't do anything about it and are also halfway across the country if not the world from me. Since I am little more than words on a screen and a voice in a box to them, I used to try and give advice whenever I could until someone got on me about it. I couldn't rationalize it at the time but I got the hint, and because of that I've gotten better at reading the meaning behind what people are saying, the difference between a cry for help and venting about a tough situation they don't know their way around.
I’ve had a couple of friends like this over the years. One of them wanted to write me a 12-step programme because I was feeling sad after I dumped my girlfriend (it was the right call, but I was still sad that it had come to that). When I said “it’s ok mate, I’ll bounce back, thanks for listening though” he got very tetchy and started complaining about how he had been such an angel trying to help me and he just couldn’t give anymore 🎻 . I think these people get addicted to basking in the glow of admiration and gratitude for helping you, and it puts their nose out of joint if you are able to deal with problems on your own. It’s as if they think you’re being disloyal.
I had a massive mental breakdown ~15 years ago, because I felt like I had no control over my own life. It was really difficult getting friends and family to understand that there was nothing they could do that could help - that their help was actually having the opposite effect. The one thing I needed at that time was control over my own life, and having everyone in my life trying to take that from me was soul-destroying. I don't think anyone had a saviour complex or anything, but I just wanted to give an example of the fact that sometimes the best thing you can do to help someone is to leave them alone. By all means offer help, but if it's rejected just let it go.
Very timely for me. I'm in Ukraine, and as you can imagine civilians engage in war-related drama all the time around me, dragging me in through my own autistic tendencies. Refugees who play as victims, volunteers who play as saviors, quasi-vigilantes who play as prosecutors (lots of people want to kill all war criminals and punish all looters, but they don't enlist), it's all here. I thought the whole nation went into a collective psychosis, turns out it's just the drama triangle I already know but almost forgot about, and some of us are doing the right thing by staying away from victimhood, taking disproportionate credit, and dehumanization of the enemy. This video will be a great resource to share with English-speaking Ukrainians.
God once said "But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."
I just wanted to say, YOU are literally in my top 5 creators (all platforms) when it comes to the quality and RELEVANCE of your content. Thank you for continuing to educate me & many others over the years.
@@CMDRunematti ikr! And it's ALWAYS helpful and engaging!? Christmas day fr 🥺 edit: For those asking for the full list, here it is, in no particular order: @Theremin Trees (Human Psychology) @Design Theory (Creativity & Innovation) @Elizabeth Filips (Productivity) @Film Booth (Social Media Growth) @Nathan Zed (Pop Culture) These creators are of course different niches & styles. But in quality, I think you'll find they are in the same league if you give them a chance. 😖
Seriously, its soo good. I dont get why jordan peterson is huge while trees is not. No video peterson has made that I have seen can explain deep things like this so simply and clearly. And his latest one of what makes the bible special just made me cringe so badly.
I completely agree - Theramin is a very unique channel. His introspection, insight, research is unparalleled. It also helps he has a soothing voice & enunciates everything beautifully. We love you Thermin, my favourite video of yours is "Respecting Beliefs", which is incidentally your most viewed! Keep up the great work, I will forever remain a subscriber, and do not care how long it takes to release a video because we know it's quality!
As a former Christian (21 years, a true believer no matter how many folks want to "no true scottsman" me) I can tell you this video hit pretty close to home. Since I stopped trying to be a savior everything has improved. Most importantly, my relationships are more genuine. I dropped the drama.
Just remember that no matter what, personal choices & beliefs should be your own decision, don’t let others influence you negatively (unless it’s ThereminTrees, he seems pretty smart ngl)
@@dryfox11 I pray theramintrees comes to Christ already so you guys can come to my pool party in heaven. Jhn 6:47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
Yep, I was at almost 2 decades of that for me. Ruined so many personal connections that could've been much more genuine, and the church, unknowingly or not, only enabled and worsened it. Things like activism and such were similarily dark paths too. Glad to be free, no matter how much people think I'm selfish for not being so generous a person now.
@@xXiLikePieOoTheees a problem though. He wasn’t just talking about the people, he was agreeing with OP in talking about the behavior that Christianity as a religion promotes, along with the people in the church bolstering it. It wasn’t just about the followers, but the religion itself from what I understood from his comment.
Fantastic, as always, but what's more, this one really hit close to home for me. Some time ago, I definitely suffered from the "rescuer" position, feeling as though it were my responsibility to use whatever means I possibly could to help others with their problems, leading me to give away a lot of my resources while feeling not self-satisfaction from doing good deeds, but frustration with the rest of the world for not making the same effort I was and despair and guilt because my efforts never seemed to be enough. Eventually, my personal and professional life became much worse, and I was unable to help others, putting me in the "victim" position, feeling as though I have no agency whatsoever, no ability to take any action to help resolve my own problems, most of the time. At times, I even find myself fantasizing about the "persecutor" position, having the incredible power to compel others to obey the moral precepts I hold highest through overwhelming force. I have a lot of work to do on myself to get out of this mess, and I think I need to find a therapist.
Ah! TheraminTrees here has solved the riddle of Arendt’s Banality of Evil. I see this clearly illustrated in this particular video. Critical and compelling work. Much appreciation.
I really needed this video right now. Being bombarded with news of all the bad things happening in the world I have felt more and more like I personally need to do something. Like going on an internet crusade to correct everyone even if it drains me dry. Just the intro helped me take a step back and reflect where I am going towards.
I wish there were more details on the difference between "saviors" and "supporters", with all that's going on in the world we could use some good intentioned people. I'm worried this video will enable the bystander effect, and possibly ironically pacifying more "supporters" who actually care by making them scared of being "saviors" while not affecting "saviors" who will just say to themselves "good thing I'm not like that".
tbh what has helped me the most has been going offline for as much as i can. and especially stay away from websites like twitter engineered to be as addictive and fuck with your emotions to that end as possible. it helps to keep in mind that the twitter algorithm was not created by people who want to give you all the information it was created to give you whatever incenses, awes, just 'activates' and burns you up as much as possible, leaving you with less energy time and mental space to work with in your life.
@@TheGreenTaco999 I think that being more aware of 'when to pick a fight' will instead decrease the bystander effect. Knowing when and why not to do something also makes it more clear when to do something and why.
@@mivical Hehe, never gave twitter a chance to begin with. But when living neighbour to Russia and having a literal war some countries away it is hard to avoid the topic even if I wanted to. There is lots of misinformation going around but it won't help starting fights with bots or discussing with people who never intended to listen in the first place or don't need to hear it since we both had the same opinions to begin with.
Tyrone's part reminded me about my discourses online. I used to be annoying and full of myself until I realized I was misinformed on some subjects after doing more research on what I was talking about, now I'm more reserved. Unfortunately, I came across a woman online who, unlike Tyrone, never improved herself after six years of arguing with people and even resorted to doxxing. It sucks having to shake her off :(
I just thought literally 3 days ago "Man, I can't wait for the next Theramintrees upload". And this time its about one of my prior complexes. Thank you, Sweater Baby.
As an Ex-Jehovah’s Witness, I just wanted to say thank you for these videos. Deconstructing my faith was disorienting and terrifying and your videos helped me immensely. I’m glad you’re still making them after all these years!
"Tyrone lamented that he really blew it with her. But he said that it was a useful reminder that in life you can't always mend what you break." I'm still working on that part right now. I have trouble with the idea of sitting with what you've broken and being unable to fix it. This video is what I needed. Thank you.
Everyone is strong & capable in their own ways some just need more help than others. The only way to help others is to help them help themselves, otherwise we’re just hurting them. It’s part of why I cherish my dad so much. He’s never pitied me for being disabled. He’s helped me learn new skills to help me compensate for the things I struggle with. He actually is my hero because he never tried to be
The idea of helping others plays differently in different people. As long as I remember myself, it wasn't about controlling others, and I question my actions when others don't quite understand me. By helping others we want to help ourselves, to quench our own internal demands, and these demands are different, this is how I feel it. Some want to gain validation and fame and feel superior, some are not okay with the current state of affairs, some feel uncomfortable when they see people suffering. We should not forget to start from saving ourselves, and also put more effort into understanding others - without this you can't help. Narcissists, self-entitled people are real, mental disorders are real, if someone wants to control actions of others instead of being able to distance from them, reconsider and get help. "The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants" and I don't believe in clear conscience and honesty of failed tyrants, not anymore.
I've always had a "teach a man to fish" mentality to helping and some people misinterpret it as me being cold. If you're capable of doing something yourself, I'd rather teach you to do it yourself than _"help"_ you. It also affects the way I treat children. Many adults think I'm cold, but I just want the kids to learn self-reliance. Too many kids expect help for EVERYTHING. To me, this is what "tough love" means. Doing something that appears to be cold, but in the long run, will be more beneficial to the person. Babying someone is not helping them.
Fascinating and informative, as always. One thing I've noticed is that these behaviours can be quite subtle at least early on. The irony of the drama is that it isn't always that dramatic, at least early on, which is what makes it quite pernicious.
Cheers. Yes, happens without noticing sometimes doesn't it? You only notice when you make a 'forbidden' move - like expressing a simple disagreement, or declining help. Suddenly you start seeing the costumes and stage lights.....!
I'm not quite sure why, but Tyrone's and Dimmy's story made me teary-eyed. I guess it's the feeling of how people can make so many mistakes, but notice the error of their ways, actually change themselves and apologize to the people they have hurt. I can't think of anything more humbling and humanizing.
I ruined my life over this. I worked in an industry where people are taken advantage of, and I tried to help someone who didn’t want my imposing “help”. I know how I was wrong now, but I wish I would’ve understood before I created so much chaos and destruction for myself and for others. Now I’m restarting my life.
Marian's story is interesting. I have a similar core tendency to make myself useful and helpful to establish myself in places. But I remember people telling me to maybe go into counselling or psychology because of my apparent talent in it and I always adamantly refused to do so. I recognized pretty quickly that I need to keep that energy focused on my "monkeysphere" if I don't want to overexert myself, and because I am mainly so seemingly talented at this because I know most people I apply it to for years. In their everyday life. Not just from weekly conversations. For a while I bought into the hype of "you're just so good at this" and that's when I became worse at it. It took me a bit to realise that all my social competence is not a talent or gift, but a skill I need to consistently hone, and an active effort I must consistently make.
Your videos have always been an inspiration and life changing. From your easy to swallow editing and pacing to your wonderful wisdom and life lessons you've learned in your field - I truly am thankful that you are uploading again after all this time!
Some doctors have a similar issue, explained in the excellent book "How Doctors Think". If you can't be immediately "fixed" from an incurable condition, or at least improved, some doctors can resent & mistreat you, because they don't get that validation from helping you. A doctor in Japan blamed me when his antibiotics failed to cure my UTI. I was pissing myself in agony for weeks, the infection hit my kidneys, but HE was annoyed to write a new prescription 🙄 I also had a pain management specialist who clearly wanted to be a therapist. She gave unwelcome hugs (especially egregious given how nerve pain makes any touch painful!) & when she found out my mom had died 15 years earlier, she told me that her mother had died the year before, but "don't worry, it gets better." Uh, yeah. I'm aware. I'm kind of the expert on dead moms here, if anyone is 😅
This could not have come at a better time. I don't want to get into too much detail because this is still a fresh wound for me, but I've been trying to force myself out of that "savior" position I forced myself into - so thank you for not just including what's wrong and how to identify it, but how to resolve your own issues if you find yourself stirring this sort of problem.
the most terrifying thought is that there`s another beatiful gem of a channel, filled with enlightening yet understandable videos like yours, but simply not recommended to me by youtube. We are all truly lucky to be here
I actually saw myself in both the victim complex and savior roles. Nowadays I concede that unless it's something very specific (an action or routine that tangibly helps) or emotional support I should never interject with my thoughts or try to intervene unless it is invited. But even then, I can't take away someone's challenges or responsibilities.
Theramin, I hope you're doing well. Your videos are very insightful, well-articulated, easy to understand and extremely helpful in identifying and responding to manipulative, exploitative and abusive dynamics, on several different scales - and so are worth revisiting frequently for anyone who wishes to be more secure in themselves. Regardless of whether you're able to add to it, your work here will continue to be impactful and is greatly appreciated.
I often find myself in a position of wanting to watch one of your videos but not having the mental capacity to listen intentively. But everytime I do watch and listen, it's always an overwhelmingly positive and enlighting experience. Thank you.
I appreciate so much the small details like " When partners-" and there is a gay couple. And small showings of personality like the person who won't take any bull
Ive learned so much about my past abusers through following your content. But today, I have learned about me. This video has made a meaningful impact on me, thank you.
As an Individual with Autism and ADHD, these videos have been an immense eye-opener for me into how I operate as a person. For years I had my sense of self destroyed, and these videos have been giving me the guidance to begin to rebuild what was destroyed within me. Thank you TheraminTrees, for being a gift of psychology and mental health.
@@scribblescrabble3185 exactly the right question-not just for OP but generally for people who have this complex to ask themselves. Half listening and skimming a conversation for the opportunity to interject your advice (as described in the video) is a recipe for imagining mistakes in the wrong places, and offering advice that doesn’t apply.
Your video on narcissistic double binds saved me from complete destruction and I can't find the words to thank you for all the knowledge that you have shared with us.
I’ve been told my entire life that I needed to be saved, usually by people who think that I’m inept or incapable of anything because of my autism. I had to claw my way out of my own incompetence by force of will, against resistance. I’m now in a research PHD program and working as a martial arts instructor. We use shock knives for knife fight training, which give a shock when hit without causing real pain, in order to prevent people from just tanking toy knife attacks. People who spar with me always go on the defensive because they know I’m so good. You can’t save people forever. We need to be able to save ourselves. Also, on a related note, never believe anything said by Autism Speaks.
Your channel used to trigger the shit out of me a few years ago, it popped into my mind again recently years later and i see so much more of myself and my world in this. Really high quality stuff
This video hit me hard. This honestly reminds me so much of my dad. Growing up my dad wouldn't let me do anything: I couldn't walk to school alone until I was 15, I wasn't allowed to do laundry, I wasn't allowed to wash dishes, I couldn't leave the house without him, if I found a staple on the ground I couldn't pick it up I had to show it to him so he could dispose if it himself. From the outside looking in it looked like my dad was a kind and caring man who was a little overbearing but honestly? It was hell. It was so smothering. And when I'd try to politely remind him that I was growing up and needed to learn how to do things on my own, he would play the role of the victim. I didn't love him at all. In fact I hated him. He sacrificed his life for me how dare I be so selfish and cruel!! His mother never loved him he would've loved to have himself as a parent growing up and I don't know I good thing when I have it!! He should have never had me and his life would be so much better off if he never had kids!! Because of him I grew up isolated and socially anxious and it's taken a long time to recover from that. It was worse when no one believed how bad it was, I felt like I was going crazy. It's exhausting being around him and to this day I never tell him about anything going on in my life before he dons his cape and swoops in trying to fix things that were never broken.
I'm sorry to hear that there are smothering parents out there that take things to this degree, gonna have to memorize this as something to never do if i decide to have children in the future
Yikes, sorry about your situation. Odd how quickly they whip it to “I never should’ve had kids” like that ISNT gonna screw with a developing young mind.
Your videos are among the finest available on youtube. Your insights are piercing as a laser yet gentle as a caress. There's no question you're a brilliant therapist and your clients are the luckiest people! I'd give my soul to have your voice! If it's possible to fall in love with no more than the sound of a man's voice, then I've done it with yours. Thank you for these brilliant videos.
@@TheraminTrees Due to financial circumstances, I can't afford to contribute to any of the youtube channels I love. But once that changes, yours will be the first I'll support. Your power to heal the mind is awesome. All thanks go to you.
_"Tyrone privately apologized to each member of the group for his previous behavior. But one member, June, always kept her distance. Tyrone lamented that he really blew it with her. But he said that it was a useful reminder that in life you can't always mend what you break."_ This reminds me of Bojack's character so much, especially his whole ordeal with Herb. Bojack had to learn throughout the series that life didn't work like the sitcom he had been a part of, "Horsin' Around".
I've always been a savior type, real controlling. Genuine thought I KNEW what was best for you, it was tough. I had a habit of only befriending drama riddled people who had a problem every 5 minutes. It was miserable for me, because my help was not only not helpful, they didnt want to be helped in the first place. It was just the drama I'd kick up trying to do something.
I'm very ashamed of myself right now. This video in some way validates my drama and thinking about it makes me uncomfortable. But thank you for the content, I hope I'll break this loop some day.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, please don't stop making content! This one is so nicely polished and fine tuned (I've seen almost all your videos) and the quality just keeps getting better and better with each one. The way you pace the topic, connect the visuals together, narrarate with a slow and calm pace; it shows so much maturity and calmness and demonstrates your expertise on the subject matter. I change as a person for the better every time I'm here, so I'll say it again, don't stop making these.
I just want to say thank you for highlighting that people can change for the better when given support. I feel like I'm constantly hearing now that "that person is toxic so never interact with them" and it's tiring. We can't drop people as soon as they show negative traits, because we all have something we need to work on. Thank you for the reminder that it's never too late to become a better person.
I’ve referred to my mother as having a “martyred saint” complex. Yes; exactly like this. Sadly, she is very attached to her “savior” self-image, regardless of how destructive it actually is.
As an ex-Christian, I feel the need to save my wife (and children) from their fundamentalist ideology. I love attacking Christianity's bad ideas. I do feel victimized by scripture's caricature of all non-believers being fools, wicked, etc. This video has helped me realize the need to take the cape off and make sure that I have fully recovered from my own indoctrination and nourished my authentic self before I too "go bad!"
Amazing video! As someone who works in the industry, great job with the visuals! One minor nitpick: at 6:18 your chessboard on the right alternates it's pattern vertically, however the one on the left follows it's pattern vertically. This is such a minute detail that it has no impact on the video, but I noticed and thought I'd mention it
I hope you are well. Your videos have been most helpful. I've had many struggles in my life but find some semblance of peace and calm in your words and relaxing voice. I was born into a world of violence. I used what I knew. You have helped, greatly in understanding the past that still torments me. I'm 53 and still struggling. To your young listeners, please listen to this person. Thank you again.
Can we just appreciate what an excellent writer this individual is? Master of the English word. Concise, clever, insightful, every now & then disarmingly poetic, and always beautifully articulated. I just enjoy everything he has to say, both in terms of content and style. I love it here.
I often find it hard myself, after spurts of “DRAMA” to distinguish whether I or those in my company were pawns to external manipulators or simply pawns to our own lesser character. Finding your sudden role shift as pawn to manipulator can also be rather distressing in my experience. Thanks for speaking on this subject. Its nice to have you back. In the states theres about to be a lot of these interactions. (The 2022 Midterm Elections)
I've been rewatching so many of your videos lately. My sister is a die-hard American conservative who thinks she's psychic and talks to god, but has been going to college for psychology in aims to be a therapist and seeing and comparing the way you talk about these cases is so fascinating as they're virtually worlds apart. She's too close to her beliefs to contemplate where deception may lie, instead projecting them onto those she's against, using her field of study to argue as an authority to assert her opinion as just, but when asked to reflect on this goes into rage or tears, yet you're so willing to step back and self-reflect to the point of deconstructing your own beliefs even if the thought has terrified you. Seeing you discuss others who are victim to such beliefs and relationships is always so refreshing. It's sensible, but always reminds me that people can change if they're willing to confront and understand themselves. I deconverted years ago and your content has turned shame into comfort. I always look forward to your next video and send them to friends when able and it's helped some get more control over their life. I just wanted to say thank you for your work.
I find it peculiar how I've started watching this video with just a pinch of curiosity towards the subject matter presented, only to realize a recent example of me engaging in drama as a saviour. Great content!
This guy, that voice, the screenplay, riveting. Thank you for your continued content creation, you are a beacon of stability, reason, hope for humanity in such geo political times. Thank you thank you
I have always felt that while the details may be complicated, the overarching principals should not. The "Drama Triangle" explains a whole host of groups and their behaviors. Thank you for the content and please do not stop.
So glad to see another video from you! The refusal to listen as conducive to "drama" is so important. I used to have a friend who simply never listened, no matter how clearly or calmly I said something. She even went off on me for "never taking her advice," by which she meant that if I told her about something that she thought needed correcting, and she then told me how to correct it, I was obliged to follow her advice or else "not be a good friend." I think now it was not possible to be what she wanted in a friend without being obedient to her.
Wow another video hitting close to home with great visual and audio. I always came here with either the intention to save myself from opressive situations and eventually started to do so with the intention to save others in situations I percieved similar to mine. It is a broad issue and I can feel the pushback in me right away, telling me 'no your situation is different'. But how you put it immediately made me relate and feel kind of bad at the thought of not helping people I've tried to even very recently and planned to do for other loved ones. I do think they do need help. And I hope to critically analyse with this to determine if I'm genuinely helping or perhaps my help was not wanted, in particular for members of the Org.
It’s important to remember: 1. There are many instances wherein an individual is in a unique position to help another, possibly at their own great expense, that does not constitute some type of complex or disorder. 2. You can avoid complexes by pursuing the net benefit within your interactions. Discounting your own wellness in the moral equation is no different than discounting someone else’s needs. 3. There is no shortage of legitimate social causes that should stir outrage and resentment in regards to the complacency of the general population. If you were an abolitionist in the 1850s, your disgust and rejection of those who support the inhumanity of slavery, whether passively or actively, would not constitute some sort of disorder or complex. Being compelled to address an extreme injustice is no character flaw. It is however possible, for said cause to be misguided. 4. Making a habit of putting one’s own selfish desires above others in dismissive self-victimization, wherein requests for help are seen as attacks, and others’ needs are continually rejected in favor of your own, is equally as disordered and likely far more destructive than the tendencies of those with low self-esteem.
It's funny how much it reflects with my actual situation. At the moment I have a work and studying a career while my brother does none. My family has been trying to motivate him from very passive ways to basically dragging him to interviews. It seems to have the adverse effect. I think my brother needs to hit rock bottom to realize where he really is, but my mother keeps financially enabling him. I believe it's the fault of our family and the school he went to, we built to him this fantasy of "you're smart boy, you just don't get good grades because the subjects are too boring for you". The reality is his brain works like any humans and needs to study or practice to be successful at life, and I think telling him he was a genius hurt his future. I quite honestly don't know how to help him, but this video taught me that maybe it's s good idea to let him figure it out. Your videos always make such a dive into the human psyche that I wish I had studied psychology instead of art. We are such complex beings in so many good and bad ways, and all that there is in between. Cheers.
Your videos never fail to teach me something new. For those of us who haven't access to therapy, and even for those who do... thank you. It was your content that woke me up from The Jehovah's Witnesses (not even one of your JW-focused videos either!), and it's your content that always has me thinking deeply about my past, present and future choices. Unlike many of us with self-induced saviour complexes, you're doing the work of a true saviour! :D
Having a saviour complex almost ruined my life a few times. I’ve had therapy to deal with it and I’m now in a supporter role with everyone in my life. I developed my saviour complex for a couple of reasons, both linked to an abusive stepfather. I could never “save” my mother from the marriage, no matter what I tried they are still married even now. Also, nobody ever came to save me. So I took all that hurt and pain and channelled it into saving others. Not realising it was about validation and control. It took several years to overcome. I still have those tendencies in me but I Chanel them into a supporting role and let people make their own mistakes, and stand on their own two feet.
I just wanted to give thanks to you man. I grew up with a lot of "bad actors" when I was young. My parents sent me to these religious classes that involved teaching kids of Christianity and were supposed to teach us about the bible. Yet, when I dared to ask questions and point out things I didn't understand, the instructors would tell my parents I was disrespectful and disruptive. Thankfully, over time I got to express my feelings with my mother whom apologized and listened to me. Your videos helped me gain the confidence to speak up for myself when I felt I was alone during my childhood. In truth, I should say sorry for never having left a comment on one of your videos yet. But regardless, thank you theramintrees. You are the best kind of teacher a person could ever ask for. Keep up the great work! 👍
Hearing about others with distressing issues and coming to realize and resolve them is so powerful. It's easy to 'other' people that have hurt me, and very infrequently useful. This content is what I wanted from attending church but never really got.
The stage and triangle of drama is a great way to think about this. I definitely hope I'll remember it next time I, or one of my friends, slip from supporter into savior. It took,,, a long, long time for me to learn that I needed to let people go in order to help them, that I needed to step back and take care of myself first, but it's one of the most invaluable lessons anyone can learn. It's made me a whole lot kinder, safer, and happier.
I really like how the language in this is based around "we" "our" "us" stuff like that instead of "you". Its non-acusitory and acknowledging these thought process' could happen with anyone, even the video maker
![my cluster B parent died and I felt.... nothing much (1/2) [cc]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/zcRUj8H3rc4/mqdefault.jpg)
![my cluster B parent died and I felt.... nothing much (1/2) [cc]](/img/tr.png)
![‘unconsciously’ seeking abusers? | bogus therapy [cc]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/S_I8G1BWdLM/mqdefault.jpg)
![resisting emotional blackmail | when 'compassion' corrupts [cc]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/PEexQAkhFpM/mqdefault.jpg)
![that's a red flag? but I do that.... [cc]](/img/n.gif)
To the individuals commenting 'knights don't move like that', some information: I know they don't move like that. I deliberately depicted an illegal move. I'll leave you to join the dots.
But... Knights in chess are called horses, aren't they?
what knights? i just watched this video but don't remember any depicted knights nor its move..?
@@anime.soundtracks first thing that happens in the video.
I'm gonna be honest...
It's not very clear what you were going for. Maybe there's some deep philosophical symbolism going on, but I don't see it
Edit: now that someone explained it, I see the connection. However, I still stand by my statement.
It was placed at the beginning, when I had no idea what the video was about. Therefore, the title sequence didn't leave any impact. I thought "that's a funny knight" and moved on
The video may have contained the answer, but I quickly forgot about the beginning move. The main content is what I'm here for, after all.
The little knight maneuver was probably added near the end of the video production process. However, I feel most new viewers would likely misinterpret as they have no prior knowledge of the subject
If what the commenter below me said is the intended explanation, then it's expecting me to jump through too many hoops. The switch from chess to abstract thinking *back* to chess is too much (A fake knight who is actually a pawn).
Lastly, the symbolism doesn't connect with the video. The objective in chess is to checkmate/capture the king, which the knight did. The knight actually helped while the video is explaining how some people who think they are helping are, in fact, doing harm.
No hate, @TheraminTrees I love your videos. I just feel like you could've chose a more fitting beginning.
TL;DR Beginning sequence is too confusing and doesn't connect with the video
@@Pit31415 A pawn cosplaying as a knight, is simple as that.
It really sucks that TH-cam doesn't focus on supporting this kind of long-form, well researched content that took ages to make.
maybe because it's not considered tolerant and "safe".
Yep, it's a pitty that most companies are only in it for the money. It even effects science.
12:30
i mean - theramintrees has almost 300k subs, his videos get good viewership, and i found him through the algorithm, i didnt actively seek him out.
its not that bad.
theyd be losing money if they didnt push flashy short videos from people who upload daily, that viewership is just so much easier to monetise.
as long as they allow theramintrees and others on the site and host their videos, you cant really complain. right?
Agreed - with the new algorithms, nothing good was coming up in the recommends. Only stuff I'd already watched, or random BS, in random languages.
But then I tried typing 'Video Essays' (no context, just those words) in the search box, and a load of really good stuff came up. Still 95% rubbish, but that is better than 100%!
That being said, the algorithms brought me here. Just after I'd watched Solar Sands new vid. I think this guy is in the same ball park, so that is something.
I love how you always refer to the subject as "we", it implicitly tells the audience that this can happen to anyone, and it prevents patholigisation and othering.
That's a good point. So many people think they are above being human and making all the mistakes that come with it. "Yeah, that happens to people who are *weak* , *unlucky* and *stupid* , but not *me* ". How in for a surprise they are when life humbles them to the fact that no one has got it all figured out. Whether it comes from a place of dishonesty or not.
Exactly what I was thinking
It personally makes me feel like im not alone in learning about these things, or even experiencing them
Yeah, for stuff like schizophrenia I think it's important to distinguish the unique issues. But pretty much everyone is almost instinctively aware of problems like this and the "we" helps invoke that.
@@Dice-Z "So many of *us* think *we* are above being human and making all the mistakes that come with it" fixed that for you
As Matt Dillahunty pointed out: the person who deliberately sets your house on fire and then plays hero after busting you out is not your friend.
My Mom wanted to 'save' me from my depression and I think really resented me for 'not allowing' her to.
how dare you do that to her 🥲
Still dealing with that to this day
I’m sorry you experienced that. I’ve never even considered this a possible pitfall of parenting. Think I might have some stuff to unpack before having kids of my own so I don’t make the same mistake as your mother ❤
@@auri7442 With this kind of thing, I suspect the better goal is to help someone with it, as opposed to saving them from it.
For some reason, your comment drew a connection for me. When my son was a baby, I would get very agitated and upset when he would cry for prolonged periods. Nothing new, obviously; millions of people over history have reported the same. But at the time I didn’t know that. I thought that if my baby cried for a long time, that meant I was being a bad parent. I was missing something, or not doing something I ought to be. Eventually, when I couldn’t get him to stop crying, I started getting angry. I felt like I wanted to MAKE him shut up.
I scared myself. I was afraid that I would lose it, and hurt my child just because I was so angry that he wouldn’t stop crying. I told my partner about this, even though every fiber of my being told me to hide it out of shame, and fear of rejection. But then she told me it was normal. That lots of people feel that way. What matters is that you DON’T HURT THE CHILD. So… I didn’t.
Your comment makes me think that some parents maybe haven’t realized this carries on into adulthood. Our job isn’t to make sure our children never experience pain, and never cry. We aren’t being bad parents when that happens. They’re inevitable. We end up being resentful, and harmful if we stick to the mindset that we have to always pull people out of their pain when and how we deem it necessary. That’s my take anyway.
"Let me in!"
"Why?"
"Because I want to save you!"
"Save me from what?"
"From I'm going to do to you if you don't let me in."
That sounds awfully familiar
"Because I'm just checking to see if you are OK."
A few years ago, I was in Lewisham and I saw a man running for his life down the street. He was being pursued by another man, who I presume was a street preacher. The preacher had a massive bible in his hand and was shouting;
"STOP! I'M TRYING TO SAVE YOU!"
I know how absolutely ridiculous and unbelievable this sounds but I swear I'm not making it up! Also, it was in Lewisham 🤣
It's believable. I saw some surreal sights in Lewisham growing up - and even more in Catford....
OMFG 😭, it's wild out here 😩
@@TheraminTrees I guess I should add Lewisham to the list of meme places alongside Detroit, Birmingham and Bergen, then...
so, a regular day in lewisham then
@@nordgeit What's wrong with Bergen?
God i do not trust people who claim to be empaths and use it to be invasive. Mainly because my body language is different from "frowning means sad, folded arms mean angry" type of body language and it shuffles. I get accused of lying about my feelings a lot by these people and its super odd when they dont listen to my words. I express myself by stating how I feel, not "showing" it. They expect to know how I'm feeling before I state it and thats not how I communicate at all. Its uncomfortable.
It sounds kind of gaslighting.
I have noted this too.
Right? Like, sorry I'm autistic
Sorry to hear about your issue, though in fairness - most communication is non-verbal. The fact you exhibit atypical non-verbal communication probably does fuck people up, we have a lifetime of people acting .... reasonably consistent and it informs how we interact. Then you come along and it contracts previous experience - it's not unreasonable to be doubtful of your sincerity.
So I guess I'm saying ... that sucks, thank you for your patience.
@@padrescout Exactly this. It's very unfortunate, but a lot of people do experience emotions in line with their body language and deny it. That means that when somebody sincerely experiences things different tonwgat they're showing through body language there's a lot of doubt at play there. Hopefully the company you keep has gotten used to it and respects your sincerity!
_"Helping is about identifying and addressing the legitimate needs of a situation. When those things aren't done then whatever we think we're doing, we're not helping. And we might be straying into a parody of problem-solving, called drama."_
*Cough* Dr. Phil *Cough*
Ah yes the guy who makes fun of people's suffering on stage in front of the people for content
It's painfully ironic that the guy who displays suffering and mentally ill people on tv for the audience to gawk at as if they were at a zoo, is lecturing us about causing drama.
TH-cam and TikTok "influencers." 🤢🤮
the hypocrisy from this dr is wild
@@AD-dg3zz To be fair, he usually does get people the actual help they need. afterwards. Therapy isnt exactly cheap and rarely is it done as a charity.
Sometimes we should compare ourselves to those we criticize.
Tyrone's story is so heartwarming. I've been around too many people that act superior to anyone and everyone. Hell I'd be lying if I said I never got in that head space myself. Hearing about his transformation and self reflection is inspiring.
Not really, I noticed at no point did someone actually sit down and talk to Tyrone until his issues were very far along, just either ignored him, or began to openly mock him. He had problems and no one really wanted to help him. Sure, some people need to sort their own problems out, but just as there are people who go through this and have eye openers, there's many more who end up on self destructive paths because no one tells them what they need to hear before it's too late. I just can't help but feel a bit of smug "WeLl I cAn'T hElP yOu!" from the video.
@@itsabug4274 You aren't wrong, although I do still find the outcome of Tyrone's story appealing. I don't think they had any obligation to try and 'fix' Tyrone given the environment, especially when he made clear his negative views of them.
It's more of a widespread issue regarding men's mental health imo. It tends to get neglected or harmed in upbringing and forgotten about later in life. Mental health in general should be taken more seriously, but awareness of men's mental health especially needs aid.
@@itsabug4274 "sitting down and talking to him", although not a bad idea, is a lot more easier said than successfully done. If it was that easy, therapists would only need one session to help their clients. Hell, if anybody could do it, there would no places to learn how to be a therapist.
@@yosh3058 @Yosh He didn't have negative views though, he had an apparent savior complex. I want to also note the EXTREME irony in mentioning men's mental health often being disregarded right after you said there was no obligation to help (not 'fix', please don't put words in my mouth...) Tyrone with his issues.
Also, yes there is an obligation. The teacher of the class has an obligation to fix any issues with their students, at the very least, mocking him in such a manner did nothing more than worsen the problem. That's pretty unforgivable when you're supposed to be a PSYCHOLOGY professor...
@@itsabug4274 I feel like perhaps they did try, Theramintrees just didnt think it important enough to include. Even if they did try and tell him how he was upsetting the group, hed be too stubborn in his preconceptions to listen. Ive been struggling with a savior complex myself, and I know how stubborn I can get when I get to that point. Like Theramintrees said, he was a draining presence and it would be even more draining to try and help him when he wouldnt listen.
“The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.”
More like "The road to Hell is masked as good intentions." A lot of people knowingly drag other down and excuse it's helping.
@@tuekham9312 A good intention can start as legit but once it spirals out of control without necessarily reality checks the pavement turns to a mask. In either case, it’s the same destination.
I love this quote.
I have always liked the 3 words from a tool song, pure intentions juxtaposed.
My favourite quote
I've experienced a great deal of proselytism where it is claimed that their intention is altruistic - to "save" me because they "care" about me. But it's revealing how little they actually listen to what I'm saying - other than to find ways to trip me up.
It would be fascinating wouldn't it to see how, in these kinds of situations, your words are being translated - to see all the omissions and substitutions, the corruption of meaning. I hope you and yours are well my friend. Lovely to see you.
@@TheraminTrees Really good to see you my friend ❤️
@@TheraminTrees Interesting how the ones looking to profit off you like a free money dispenser are always the ones saying they “love” you, and “care” for you.
I feel you Hassan. It’s almost like they don’t care. They have a preprogrammed mission. Whatever you say doesn’t matter. I’m glad I’m not the only one that experienced this. I feel like most videos on the savior complex only talk about how this affects the person who is the savior and not those around them. I’m glad this video focused on how abusive they can be.
Chronic animal rescuers fall into this category. It took me a while to understand "you can't save them all." and later "you can't save anyone but yourself." Thaks for the great vid!
Sounds like a false dichotomy to me.
If you can't save them all, it doesn't mean you can't save/help anyone but yourself.
I can see how this false narrative of "being self-sufficient" (in fact - relying on powers that be) vs "having a saviour complex" is imposed on us. Via modern psychology amongst other means.
They want us atomized.
New 1984ish slogan of our times: Vulnerability = Empowerment.
(And we are vulnerable if we choose to care about ourselves first and foremost... cause we simply can't. We are social beings and haven't evolved for it. We are totally vulnerable before Big Nanny State.)
If we'll label the natural need to help each other as something unhealthy, as just a side of Karpman's Triangle - humanity is done with.
Another thing this can lead to is animal abuse, as horrid opportunists abuse animals so that they can “save” them for content. I presume that this is supposed to give warm fuzzies to the audience, but they always make me feel awful…
@@liammclin5722 I had this feeling, those movies when they get fully tech equipped approaching an starved animal or injured in the middle of nowhere....
@@stumblestutter this content is very popular and it is easy to harm an animal and then film rescuing. TH-cam should stop monetarization on such content, it will save more animals.
They are animal hoarders. Most people who have rescue pets limit themselves to between one to four of the same species.
YOU TAUGHT ME CRITICAL THINKING FROM THE AGE OF 13! I cannot understate how critical your content was in teaching me how to view the world. I'm only 17 now, but I've come so far thanks to you and I'm not even in therapy yet. You helped me understand my situation while I was in it, and truly comprehend it when I got out. I used to suffer from the worst feelings of shame for being myself, to the degree I'd want to stop being. You then posted a video about malignant shame, and it didn't cure me or fix me, but it showed me that what I was feeling was okay, and a natural response to my environment. Thank you so much ♥️
yoo fellow 17 year old, gl on your future. you're not alone in having a sucky family, we're both gonna get out of this.
@@NotALotOfColonial_SpaghettiToG yes we will we can do this
@@NotALotOfColonial_SpaghettiToG i already have. it was hard and painful, but my life has never been better. i wish you the best
I'm an old 22 year old but have been watching his content for many years too. He really does help a lot. The critical thinking is what helped me get out of unhealthy religous beliefs and out of abusive situations.
Used to be in your shoes. I'm glad you've got resources like this to support you. When I was your age all I managed to find for support were misogynistic/racist hate groups. This made my day a little better. I wish you luck in your journey and I applaud you.
As a 3D Artist I am truly blown away by how you manage to illustrate the situations you are talking about without taking away the clarity of your message. (Pleasing and easy to understand visually but not fully consuming ones focus and attention)
To me your videos are truly a perfect combination of all the elements that create the ultimate positive and helpful content.
Big thank you!! :)
Thank you :8)
Reminds me of a friend I used to have. A few months ago I was talking about being mad about something and she instantly assumed I wanted to die for some reason. She told my mom about it then when I confronted her about it she ignored me for like 2 months. When she finally texted me back she said that I couldn’t speak to her like that. Then acted like she was the one who was wronged. I apologized and asked her to apologize back. Then she said “I won’t apologize for caring.” So I ended the friendship.
She contacted me again on a different app that I forgot to block her on. She started an argument and twisted my words. Now I have no intention of speaking to her ever again.
I am still angry about it you can probably tell from the comment. She seriously could have ruined my life with her “caring”. It sucks because she was my only friend. But I would rather be friendless instead of that bullshit.
Good for you. I really like this video because it summarizes what I already knew. It validates me. I have similar experiences to you. It wasn’t just one person. It was like three. I was going through a hard time and these people tried to leech off of me. I would been okay with the help if it was the way I wanted. By that I mean respectful. My concern was that if they see they can force to do that one thing it would spread to other things.
My role in the drama was not asking for help from the right people.
These savior types just like the video said. Don’t compute conflicting information. I hate them they are so arrogant. They only want you to listen to them.
What I like so much about your videos is that they’re very humanising and understanding while still holding inappropriate behaviour accountable. And accountability in this case is more about empowering people to change themselves, rather than putting them in an “evil” basket for the rest of their lives. Seeing that hope is possible for any of us who may be guilty of these patterns of behaviour/thought is heartening.
at 15:00, what you said about someone grumbling about a job and another coming forth with career ideas, took me back to when I interviewed as a Resident advisor back in college. They had asked me a question along the lines of: "Say a student comes up to you with a problem regarding their classes or similar, what would you do in that situation?"
I'd basically said that it depends on what they're looking for. If they're looking for a solution, I can work with them to try and find it, but if not, I'll just hear them out. I told them that sometimes people aren't looking for a solution, they just, want someone to talk to.
They'd thanked me and told me they wished more people understood that idea. I've never really stopped thinking about that moment over the years. That idea of being empathetic but not overbearing. I like to hope that I'm still following those principles well today. This video really hit home for me.
What a great answer. That's real listening. Cheers for sharing!
Thanks for being this type of person. I remember a strong conflict with someone who wanted to lecture me on what to do, while I repeatedly said I didn't want that (especially since it was advice coming from little knowledge and jumping to conclusions). Ironically I was not allowed to explain why this is not helpful.
I've begun filtering what I talk about and with whom because there are so many people who think that every utterance is an invitation for them to flex how smart and helpful they are. They don't care about their victims simply wanting to vent a little, they want to advise and correct. It's like a dopamine hit with these people.
This video has just woke me up to the fact I have been indulged in my own saviour complex for so long… thinking back I must have caused so many people harm… and just like you said, it was validation that i was digging for.
What’s crazy is that I’d secretly root against people I knew, so that I could sweep in and “save the day”.
TheraminTrees, thank you so much.
I see it a bit in myself as well, but not to the extreme of thinking I can read minds, but just the little bits of advise. For the most part though I joke around making fun with words like george carlin, or sharing knowledge of things like nitinol or the double slit experiment or talking about space. But if someone is looking for small object or something, I will start to help look and make suggestions like have you looked in the tread of your boot. Lost a screwdriver bit for 20 minutes one time cuz of that LOL. Finally thought to check our boots and there it was.
Same
What the hell is wrong with you? Jk
I honestly think it’s just a high intelligence thing.
I relate to Tyrone's a bit. When I was a teen I started to engage with feminism and pride, etc, through the internet, but not in a more thoughtful approach like I do today. I took a very similar role of calling out people for no reason with little to no bases. Thankfully, this never ruined any relationship of mine, but it's very embarrassing to me.
Lmao same. It's embarrassing to recall.
@@mahima2630 you know, i dont know whats worse, being the embodiment of the "snowflake" or being its antithesis, the "anti-sjw" I resent the former a lot more lmao
@@catrielmarignaclionti4518 I dislike the former, but I only resent the latter. The former isn't working towards or empowering those that are working towards taking away anyone's rights.
I love the use of the ink-blots as representing the foundations of genuine personality. They're messy and human unlike the predefined social geometry of the rescuer, victim, and persecutor; real people aren't simple like stock characters.
I have never wanted to physically touch animated objects more in my life!!! I adore your animation style and narrative style!! It's like a strange relative to asmr as well as being immensely educational! Amazing work!
It's funny how I identified with the new call center volunteer. Touches from people I don't know, or I don't know well, bother me. I would have pushed her away, too.
Perhaps TTs should open a merch store selling 3D printed models of his works.
I find his voice very soothing.
His voice helps with the whole asmr feel :)
@@eliyasne9695 it'd sell too! Would get a sale from me. I often listen to TT or HealthyGamerGG in the morning, but some days I don't because of my executive dysfunction (and emotional regulation) and I'll get into habits of scrolling endlessly on tiktok (kinda like babies sucking on thumbs to self-soothe?); Having a material reminder to wake up to would be helpful 😅 Kinda like a Buddha statue as gratitude to his wonderful lessons; or a bookshelf full of our favourite authors.
On my first social platform, I was introduced to the worst kind of online drama -- interpersonal drama.
Being a good-natured, but ignorant 19-year-old, I always played savior to my friends. I was careful never to be pursuer, and wasn't weak enough to be a victim (majority of the time), but I'd always play savior.
Playing savior came to a head in two notable situations. The first time was a group v group situation, so everyone was at fault. And I shouldn't have fed so much into the drama.
The second, became the most shameful moment of my life. I'd grown such blind allegiance to my friends that I couldn't see the obvious signs that something was deeply wrong with a situation I got myself involved in.
I'm not proud to say I nearly flew into hysterics. I even cursed for the first time in my life. Then I took the very people I hurt and forced them to play a complicated scheme of my own design... It wasn't until one of them worked up the courage to speak their mind that I realized how deeply I hurt everyone. I was so angry that I barely had empathy once I pushed them to tears at my feet.
Some savior.
Their tears still haunt me.
Only a lucky few have been good people their entire lives. For the rest of us who have done wrong, shame is the mold that makes us better.
This is very important content. I have noticed "saviour" tendencies in myself, developed from how I was parentified as a teen. My friends tend to see me as a bit of a quasi therapist. And for some time I liked being in that role. I like giving advice and I think my advice is usually pretty good. The problem is that often it's not my place to give advice. I can't fix my friends' lives. Even if they're depressed and anxious and have low self esteem and I want to try and help them feel better. At a certain point I can overstep from being a supportive friend and that's been something I definitely need to work on. Same with when I've automatically stepped into "rescue" mode in arguments between friends, trying to mediate etc. It never ends well.
I feel this. A lot of my friends have serious problems in their lives and either don't or can't do anything about it and are also halfway across the country if not the world from me. Since I am little more than words on a screen and a voice in a box to them, I used to try and give advice whenever I could until someone got on me about it. I couldn't rationalize it at the time but I got the hint, and because of that I've gotten better at reading the meaning behind what people are saying, the difference between a cry for help and venting about a tough situation they don't know their way around.
I’ve had a couple of friends like this over the years.
One of them wanted to write me a 12-step programme because I was feeling sad after I dumped my girlfriend (it was the right call, but I was still sad that it had come to that). When I said “it’s ok mate, I’ll bounce back, thanks for listening though” he got very tetchy and started complaining about how he had been such an angel trying to help me and he just couldn’t give anymore 🎻 .
I think these people get addicted to basking in the glow of admiration and gratitude for helping you, and it puts their nose out of joint if you are able to deal with problems on your own. It’s as if they think you’re being disloyal.
You nailed it. How dare you be resilient and self reliant it really upsets these saviours bc then they mught have to look at themselves.
I had a massive mental breakdown ~15 years ago, because I felt like I had no control over my own life. It was really difficult getting friends and family to understand that there was nothing they could do that could help - that their help was actually having the opposite effect. The one thing I needed at that time was control over my own life, and having everyone in my life trying to take that from me was soul-destroying.
I don't think anyone had a saviour complex or anything, but I just wanted to give an example of the fact that sometimes the best thing you can do to help someone is to leave them alone. By all means offer help, but if it's rejected just let it go.
What an interesting memory, super scat boy 👀
@@Irondragon1945 Thanks.
@@superscatboy i was actually just pointing out your *interesting* username
@@Irondragon1945 Yes, I was aware of that.
Very timely for me. I'm in Ukraine, and as you can imagine civilians engage in war-related drama all the time around me, dragging me in through my own autistic tendencies. Refugees who play as victims, volunteers who play as saviors, quasi-vigilantes who play as prosecutors (lots of people want to kill all war criminals and punish all looters, but they don't enlist), it's all here. I thought the whole nation went into a collective psychosis, turns out it's just the drama triangle I already know but almost forgot about, and some of us are doing the right thing by staying away from victimhood, taking disproportionate credit, and dehumanization of the enemy. This video will be a great resource to share with English-speaking Ukrainians.
❤
God once said "But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same
And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."
@@michaels9985 quoting the Bible is the least helpful thing in virtually any situation.
@@JimJamTheAdmin i cant help anyone but there is someone who can
@@michaels9985 if you cannot help, why do you speak?
As an exmormon who served a mission, I can say that Gordon's story personifies the perspective of missionaries exactly.
I like how you use "we" instead of "them". Makes it feel more like a problem anyone can face rather than something that only "they" do.
I just wanted to say,
YOU are literally in my top 5 creators (all platforms) when it comes to the quality and RELEVANCE of your content.
Thank you for continuing to educate me & many others over the years.
it always feels like christmas when a new video appears, doesnt it?
@@CMDRunematti ikr!
And it's ALWAYS helpful and engaging!? Christmas day fr 🥺
edit:
For those asking for the full list, here it is, in no particular order:
@Theremin Trees (Human Psychology)
@Design Theory (Creativity & Innovation)
@Elizabeth Filips (Productivity)
@Film Booth (Social Media Growth)
@Nathan Zed (Pop Culture)
These creators are of course different niches & styles. But in quality, I think you'll find they are in the same league if you give them a chance. 😖
What's the other 4?
Seriously, its soo good. I dont get why jordan peterson is huge while trees is not. No video peterson has made that I have seen can explain deep things like this so simply and clearly. And his latest one of what makes the bible special just made me cringe so badly.
I completely agree - Theramin is a very unique channel. His introspection, insight, research is unparalleled. It also helps he has a soothing voice & enunciates everything beautifully. We love you Thermin, my favourite video of yours is "Respecting Beliefs", which is incidentally your most viewed! Keep up the great work, I will forever remain a subscriber, and do not care how long it takes to release a video because we know it's quality!
As a former Christian (21 years, a true believer no matter how many folks want to "no true scottsman" me) I can tell you this video hit pretty close to home. Since I stopped trying to be a savior everything has improved. Most importantly, my relationships are more genuine. I dropped the drama.
Just remember that no matter what, personal choices & beliefs should be your own decision, don’t let others influence you negatively (unless it’s ThereminTrees, he seems pretty smart ngl)
@@dryfox11 I pray theramintrees comes to Christ already so you guys can come to my pool party in heaven.
Jhn 6:47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
Yep, I was at almost 2 decades of that for me. Ruined so many personal connections that could've been much more genuine, and the church, unknowingly or not, only enabled and worsened it. Things like activism and such were similarily dark paths too. Glad to be free, no matter how much people think I'm selfish for not being so generous a person now.
@@jjhh320 People may have done that to you but Jesus never will. Jesus loves you bro.
@@xXiLikePieOoTheees a problem though. He wasn’t just talking about the people, he was agreeing with OP in talking about the behavior that Christianity as a religion promotes, along with the people in the church bolstering it. It wasn’t just about the followers, but the religion itself from what I understood from his comment.
Fantastic, as always, but what's more, this one really hit close to home for me.
Some time ago, I definitely suffered from the "rescuer" position, feeling as though it were my responsibility to use whatever means I possibly could to help others with their problems, leading me to give away a lot of my resources while feeling not self-satisfaction from doing good deeds, but frustration with the rest of the world for not making the same effort I was and despair and guilt because my efforts never seemed to be enough.
Eventually, my personal and professional life became much worse, and I was unable to help others, putting me in the "victim" position, feeling as though I have no agency whatsoever, no ability to take any action to help resolve my own problems, most of the time.
At times, I even find myself fantasizing about the "persecutor" position, having the incredible power to compel others to obey the moral precepts I hold highest through overwhelming force.
I have a lot of work to do on myself to get out of this mess, and I think I need to find a therapist.
what you need is paramilitary training. take over the world!
@@caralho5237 Much appreciated. 😉
Ah! TheraminTrees here has solved the riddle of Arendt’s Banality of Evil. I see this clearly illustrated in this particular video. Critical and compelling work. Much appreciation.
I really needed this video right now.
Being bombarded with news of all the bad things happening in the world I have felt more and more like I personally need to do something. Like going on an internet crusade to correct everyone even if it drains me dry.
Just the intro helped me take a step back and reflect where I am going towards.
I wish there were more details on the difference between "saviors" and "supporters", with all that's going on in the world we could use some good intentioned people. I'm worried this video will enable the bystander effect, and possibly ironically pacifying more "supporters" who actually care by making them scared of being "saviors" while not affecting "saviors" who will just say to themselves "good thing I'm not like that".
tbh what has helped me the most has been going offline for as much as i can. and especially stay away from websites like twitter engineered to be as addictive and fuck with your emotions to that end as possible. it helps to keep in mind that the twitter algorithm was not created by people who want to give you all the information it was created to give you whatever incenses, awes, just 'activates' and burns you up as much as possible, leaving you with less energy time and mental space to work with in your life.
@@TheGreenTaco999
I think that being more aware of 'when to pick a fight' will instead decrease the bystander effect.
Knowing when and why not to do something also makes it more clear when to do something and why.
@@mivical
Hehe, never gave twitter a chance to begin with. But when living neighbour to Russia and having a literal war some countries away it is hard to avoid the topic even if I wanted to.
There is lots of misinformation going around but it won't help starting fights with bots or discussing with people who never intended to listen in the first place or don't need to hear it since we both had the same opinions to begin with.
@@naturligthinder The "choosing your fight" is essentiell.
And being able to apologize as well.
We miss you Theramin Trees
Beyond ecstatic you're still making content!
Seconded.
Came here to say this
Me too!!!
goated
Based.
Tyrone's part reminded me about my discourses online. I used to be annoying and full of myself until I realized I was misinformed on some subjects after doing more research on what I was talking about, now I'm more reserved. Unfortunately, I came across a woman online who, unlike Tyrone, never improved herself after six years of arguing with people and even resorted to doxxing.
It sucks having to shake her off :(
I just thought literally 3 days ago "Man, I can't wait for the next Theramintrees upload". And this time its about one of my prior complexes. Thank you, Sweater Baby.
As an Ex-Jehovah’s Witness, I just wanted to say thank you for these videos. Deconstructing my faith was disorienting and terrifying and your videos helped me immensely. I’m glad you’re still making them after all these years!
You're very welcome - I'm glad you made it out of that horrendous organisation.
@@TheraminTrees why do you barely upload?
@@danielali8372probably the animation,animation takes a lot of time.
I don’t know if you’ll read this but man you saved my life. You made me find purpose and gave me hope that it will get better. Thank you
Miss your content a lot bruh hope you come back soon
hearted? yo he is still there!
We love you ❤❤
"Tyrone lamented that he really blew it with her. But he said that it was a useful reminder that in life you can't always mend what you break."
I'm still working on that part right now. I have trouble with the idea of sitting with what you've broken and being unable to fix it. This video is what I needed. Thank you.
Everyone is strong & capable in their own ways some just need more help than others. The only way to help others is to help them help themselves, otherwise we’re just hurting them. It’s part of why I cherish my dad so much.
He’s never pitied me for being disabled. He’s helped me learn new skills to help me compensate for the things I struggle with. He actually is my hero because he never tried to be
I think i love Tyrone, to admit fault like that... its the most frightening thing in the world to me. That tranformation is beautiful
Tyrone was a gem.
The idea of helping others plays differently in different people. As long as I remember myself, it wasn't about controlling others, and I question my actions when others don't quite understand me. By helping others we want to help ourselves, to quench our own internal demands, and these demands are different, this is how I feel it. Some want to gain validation and fame and feel superior, some are not okay with the current state of affairs, some feel uncomfortable when they see people suffering. We should not forget to start from saving ourselves, and also put more effort into understanding others - without this you can't help.
Narcissists, self-entitled people are real, mental disorders are real, if someone wants to control actions of others instead of being able to distance from them, reconsider and get help.
"The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants" and I don't believe in clear conscience and honesty of failed tyrants, not anymore.
I've always had a "teach a man to fish" mentality to helping and some people misinterpret it as me being cold. If you're capable of doing something yourself, I'd rather teach you to do it yourself than _"help"_ you. It also affects the way I treat children. Many adults think I'm cold, but I just want the kids to learn self-reliance. Too many kids expect help for EVERYTHING.
To me, this is what "tough love" means. Doing something that appears to be cold, but in the long run, will be more beneficial to the person. Babying someone is not helping them.
I'm perpetually impressed at how much empathy you have for abusers who are also victims
It's absurdly perfect timing that this video came out when it did. I'm dealing with the situation right now and I need this.
Fascinating and informative, as always. One thing I've noticed is that these behaviours can be quite subtle at least early on. The irony of the drama is that it isn't always that dramatic, at least early on, which is what makes it quite pernicious.
Cheers. Yes, happens without noticing sometimes doesn't it? You only notice when you make a 'forbidden' move - like expressing a simple disagreement, or declining help. Suddenly you start seeing the costumes and stage lights.....!
I'm not quite sure why, but Tyrone's and Dimmy's story made me teary-eyed. I guess it's the feeling of how people can make so many mistakes, but notice the error of their ways, actually change themselves and apologize to the people they have hurt. I can't think of anything more humbling and humanizing.
I ruined my life over this. I worked in an industry where people are taken advantage of, and I tried to help someone who didn’t want my imposing “help”. I know how I was wrong now, but I wish I would’ve understood before I created so much chaos and destruction for myself and for others. Now I’m restarting my life.
Marian's story is interesting. I have a similar core tendency to make myself useful and helpful to establish myself in places. But I remember people telling me to maybe go into counselling or psychology because of my apparent talent in it and I always adamantly refused to do so. I recognized pretty quickly that I need to keep that energy focused on my "monkeysphere" if I don't want to overexert myself, and because I am mainly so seemingly talented at this because I know most people I apply it to for years. In their everyday life. Not just from weekly conversations.
For a while I bought into the hype of "you're just so good at this" and that's when I became worse at it. It took me a bit to realise that all my social competence is not a talent or gift, but a skill I need to consistently hone, and an active effort I must consistently make.
It's always a good day when TheraminTrees uploads.
My favourite tree-climbing ram indeed 🥰😅
Your videos have always been an inspiration and life changing. From your easy to swallow editing and pacing to your wonderful wisdom and life lessons you've learned in your field - I truly am thankful that you are uploading again after all this time!
Some doctors have a similar issue, explained in the excellent book "How Doctors Think". If you can't be immediately "fixed" from an incurable condition, or at least improved, some doctors can resent & mistreat you, because they don't get that validation from helping you.
A doctor in Japan blamed me when his antibiotics failed to cure my UTI. I was pissing myself in agony for weeks, the infection hit my kidneys, but HE was annoyed to write a new prescription 🙄
I also had a pain management specialist who clearly wanted to be a therapist. She gave unwelcome hugs (especially egregious given how nerve pain makes any touch painful!) & when she found out my mom had died 15 years earlier, she told me that her mother had died the year before, but "don't worry, it gets better." Uh, yeah. I'm aware. I'm kind of the expert on dead moms here, if anyone is 😅
This could not have come at a better time. I don't want to get into too much detail because this is still a fresh wound for me, but I've been trying to force myself out of that "savior" position I forced myself into - so thank you for not just including what's wrong and how to identify it, but how to resolve your own issues if you find yourself stirring this sort of problem.
Try writing in a journal to see the thing as it is as soon as possible. When the details are still fresh.
the most terrifying thought is that there`s another beatiful gem of a channel, filled with enlightening yet understandable videos like yours, but simply not recommended to me by youtube. We are all truly lucky to be here
I actually saw myself in both the victim complex and savior roles. Nowadays I concede that unless it's something very specific (an action or routine that tangibly helps) or emotional support I should never interject with my thoughts or try to intervene unless it is invited. But even then, I can't take away someone's challenges or responsibilities.
Theramin, I hope you're doing well. Your videos are very insightful, well-articulated, easy to understand and extremely helpful in identifying and responding to manipulative, exploitative and abusive dynamics, on several different scales - and so are worth revisiting frequently for anyone who wishes to be more secure in themselves. Regardless of whether you're able to add to it, your work here will continue to be impactful and is greatly appreciated.
"Kindly let me help you, or you'll drown, said the monkey to the fish helping him safely up a tree." Alan Watts
I often find myself in a position of wanting to watch one of your videos but not having the mental capacity to listen intentively. But everytime I do watch and listen, it's always an overwhelmingly positive and enlighting experience. Thank you.
I appreciate so much the small details like " When partners-" and there is a gay couple.
And small showings of personality like the person who won't take any bull
Ive learned so much about my past abusers through following your content. But today, I have learned about me. This video has made a meaningful impact on me, thank you.
As an Individual with Autism and ADHD, these videos have been an immense eye-opener for me into how I operate as a person. For years I had my sense of self destroyed, and these videos have been giving me the guidance to begin to rebuild what was destroyed within me.
Thank you TheraminTrees, for being a gift of psychology and mental health.
as someone with a savlous complex, I've learned the hard way when it's time to back off and let people make their own mistakes
yea, mistakes are often the best teachers
Is it a mistake though? Or do you consider it a mistake.
@@scribblescrabble3185 exactly the right question-not just for OP but generally for people who have this complex to ask themselves.
Half listening and skimming a conversation for the opportunity to interject your advice (as described in the video) is a recipe for imagining mistakes in the wrong places, and offering advice that doesn’t apply.
lol, how do you know what is a mistake in someone else's eyes?
@@avelione it isn't possible exhaustively, but employing social convention usually allows for a common perspective
Your video on narcissistic double binds saved me from complete destruction and I can't find the words to thank you for all the knowledge that you have shared with us.
I’ve been told my entire life that I needed to be saved, usually by people who think that I’m inept or incapable of anything because of my autism. I had to claw my way out of my own incompetence by force of will, against resistance.
I’m now in a research PHD program and working as a martial arts instructor. We use shock knives for knife fight training, which give a shock when hit without causing real pain, in order to prevent people from just tanking toy knife attacks. People who spar with me always go on the defensive because they know I’m so good.
You can’t save people forever. We need to be able to save ourselves.
Also, on a related note, never believe anything said by Autism Speaks.
Your channel used to trigger the shit out of me a few years ago, it popped into my mind again recently years later and i see so much more of myself and my world in this. Really high quality stuff
This video hit me hard. This honestly reminds me so much of my dad. Growing up my dad wouldn't let me do anything: I couldn't walk to school alone until I was 15, I wasn't allowed to do laundry, I wasn't allowed to wash dishes, I couldn't leave the house without him, if I found a staple on the ground I couldn't pick it up I had to show it to him so he could dispose if it himself. From the outside looking in it looked like my dad was a kind and caring man who was a little overbearing but honestly? It was hell. It was so smothering. And when I'd try to politely remind him that I was growing up and needed to learn how to do things on my own, he would play the role of the victim. I didn't love him at all. In fact I hated him. He sacrificed his life for me how dare I be so selfish and cruel!! His mother never loved him he would've loved to have himself as a parent growing up and I don't know I good thing when I have it!! He should have never had me and his life would be so much better off if he never had kids!! Because of him I grew up isolated and socially anxious and it's taken a long time to recover from that. It was worse when no one believed how bad it was, I felt like I was going crazy. It's exhausting being around him and to this day I never tell him about anything going on in my life before he dons his cape and swoops in trying to fix things that were never broken.
I'm sorry to hear that there are smothering parents out there that take things to this degree, gonna have to memorize this as something to never do if i decide to have children in the future
Yikes, sorry about your situation. Odd how quickly they whip it to “I never should’ve had kids” like that ISNT gonna screw with a developing young mind.
Not exaggerating when I call this one of the most important channels on here. Genuinely really informing and helpful. Thank you
Your videos are among the finest available on youtube. Your insights are piercing as a laser yet gentle as a caress. There's no question you're a brilliant therapist and your clients are the luckiest people! I'd give my soul to have your voice! If it's possible to fall in love with no more than the sound of a man's voice, then I've done it with yours. Thank you for these brilliant videos.
Jeff, that is so generous. Thank you.
@@TheraminTrees Due to financial circumstances, I can't afford to contribute to any of the youtube channels I love. But once that changes, yours will be the first I'll support. Your power to heal the mind is awesome. All thanks go to you.
So much better than the videos on the Psych2Go channel where almost anyone can be labelled as 'toxic'.
@@TheraminTrees 😍
@@TheraminTrees 😍
_"Tyrone privately apologized to each member of the group for his previous behavior. But one member, June, always kept her distance. Tyrone lamented that he really blew it with her. But he said that it was a useful reminder that in life you can't always mend what you break."_
This reminds me of Bojack's character so much, especially his whole ordeal with Herb. Bojack had to learn throughout the series that life didn't work like the sitcom he had been a part of, "Horsin' Around".
I've always been a savior type, real controlling. Genuine thought I KNEW what was best for you, it was tough. I had a habit of only befriending drama riddled people who had a problem every 5 minutes. It was miserable for me, because my help was not only not helpful, they didnt want to be helped in the first place. It was just the drama I'd kick up trying to do something.
I'm very ashamed of myself right now. This video in some way validates my drama and thinking about it makes me uncomfortable. But thank you for the content, I hope I'll break this loop some day.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, please don't stop making content! This one is so nicely polished and fine tuned (I've seen almost all your videos) and the quality just keeps getting better and better with each one. The way you pace the topic, connect the visuals together, narrarate with a slow and calm pace; it shows so much maturity and calmness and demonstrates your expertise on the subject matter. I change as a person for the better every time I'm here, so I'll say it again, don't stop making these.
I just want to say thank you for highlighting that people can change for the better when given support. I feel like I'm constantly hearing now that "that person is toxic so never interact with them" and it's tiring. We can't drop people as soon as they show negative traits, because we all have something we need to work on. Thank you for the reminder that it's never too late to become a better person.
Yep. I appreciate these videos for how they challenge my own toxic patterns. Thanks 👍
I’ve referred to my mother as having a “martyred saint” complex. Yes; exactly like this. Sadly, she is very attached to her “savior” self-image, regardless of how destructive it actually is.
As an ex-Christian, I feel the need to save my wife (and children) from their fundamentalist ideology. I love attacking Christianity's bad ideas. I do feel victimized by scripture's caricature of all non-believers being fools, wicked, etc. This video has helped me realize the need to take the cape off and make sure that I have fully recovered from my own indoctrination and nourished my authentic self before I too "go bad!"
Amazing video! As someone who works in the industry, great job with the visuals! One minor nitpick: at 6:18 your chessboard on the right alternates it's pattern vertically, however the one on the left follows it's pattern vertically. This is such a minute detail that it has no impact on the video, but I noticed and thought I'd mention it
I hope you are well. Your videos have been most helpful. I've had many struggles in my life but find some semblance of peace and calm in your words and relaxing voice. I was born into a world of violence. I used what I knew. You have helped, greatly in understanding the past that still torments me. I'm 53 and still struggling. To your young listeners, please listen to this person. Thank you again.
Can we just appreciate what an excellent writer this individual is? Master of the English word. Concise, clever, insightful, every now & then disarmingly poetic, and always beautifully articulated. I just enjoy everything he has to say, both in terms of content and style. I love it here.
I often find it hard myself, after spurts of “DRAMA” to distinguish whether I or those in my company were pawns to external manipulators or simply pawns to our own lesser character.
Finding your sudden role shift as pawn to manipulator can also be rather distressing in my experience.
Thanks for speaking on this subject. Its nice to have you back. In the states theres about to be a lot of these interactions.
(The 2022 Midterm Elections)
I've been rewatching so many of your videos lately. My sister is a die-hard American conservative who thinks she's psychic and talks to god, but has been going to college for psychology in aims to be a therapist and seeing and comparing the way you talk about these cases is so fascinating as they're virtually worlds apart. She's too close to her beliefs to contemplate where deception may lie, instead projecting them onto those she's against, using her field of study to argue as an authority to assert her opinion as just, but when asked to reflect on this goes into rage or tears, yet you're so willing to step back and self-reflect to the point of deconstructing your own beliefs even if the thought has terrified you. Seeing you discuss others who are victim to such beliefs and relationships is always so refreshing. It's sensible, but always reminds me that people can change if they're willing to confront and understand themselves. I deconverted years ago and your content has turned shame into comfort. I always look forward to your next video and send them to friends when able and it's helped some get more control over their life. I just wanted to say thank you for your work.
Sometimes villains are just broken heroes, indeed.
I mean ultimately a villian and hero can have the same goal but their execution or plan is what gives the label
It also explains many stories where heroes and villains flip
I find it peculiar how I've started watching this video with just a pinch of curiosity towards the subject matter presented, only to realize a recent example of me engaging in drama as a saviour.
Great content!
This sheds light on a lot of things wrong with the drama tube community.
This guy, that voice, the screenplay, riveting. Thank you for your continued content creation, you are a beacon of stability, reason, hope for humanity in such geo political times. Thank you thank you
I have always felt that while the details may be complicated, the overarching principals should not. The "Drama Triangle" explains a whole host of groups and their behaviors. Thank you for the content and please do not stop.
So glad to see another video from you!
The refusal to listen as conducive to "drama" is so important. I used to have a friend who simply never listened, no matter how clearly or calmly I said something. She even went off on me for "never taking her advice," by which she meant that if I told her about something that she thought needed correcting, and she then told me how to correct it, I was obliged to follow her advice or else "not be a good friend." I think now it was not possible to be what she wanted in a friend without being obedient to her.
Wow another video hitting close to home with great visual and audio. I always came here with either the intention to save myself from opressive situations and eventually started to do so with the intention to save others in situations I percieved similar to mine. It is a broad issue and I can feel the pushback in me right away, telling me 'no your situation is different'. But how you put it immediately made me relate and feel kind of bad at the thought of not helping people I've tried to even very recently and planned to do for other loved ones. I do think they do need help. And I hope to critically analyse with this to determine if I'm genuinely helping or perhaps my help was not wanted, in particular for members of the Org.
It’s important to remember:
1. There are many instances wherein an individual is in a unique position to help another, possibly at their own great expense, that does not constitute some type of complex or disorder.
2. You can avoid complexes by pursuing the net benefit within your interactions. Discounting your own wellness in the moral equation is no different than discounting someone else’s needs.
3. There is no shortage of legitimate social causes that should stir outrage and resentment in regards to the complacency of the general population. If you were an abolitionist in the 1850s, your disgust and rejection of those who support the inhumanity of slavery, whether passively or actively, would not constitute some sort of disorder or complex. Being compelled to address an extreme injustice is no character flaw. It is however possible, for said cause to be misguided.
4. Making a habit of putting one’s own selfish desires above others in dismissive self-victimization, wherein requests for help are seen as attacks, and others’ needs are continually rejected in favor of your own, is equally as disordered and likely far more destructive than the tendencies of those with low self-esteem.
Did Theramin Trees advocate for any of your criticisms? Did we watch the same video?
@@IheartDogs55 Not every comment is a debate, nor should you feel so compelled to defend someone you idolize.
It's funny how much it reflects with my actual situation. At the moment I have a work and studying a career while my brother does none. My family has been trying to motivate him from very passive ways to basically dragging him to interviews. It seems to have the adverse effect.
I think my brother needs to hit rock bottom to realize where he really is, but my mother keeps financially enabling him. I believe it's the fault of our family and the school he went to, we built to him this fantasy of "you're smart boy, you just don't get good grades because the subjects are too boring for you". The reality is his brain works like any humans and needs to study or practice to be successful at life, and I think telling him he was a genius hurt his future.
I quite honestly don't know how to help him, but this video taught me that maybe it's s good idea to let him figure it out.
Your videos always make such a dive into the human psyche that I wish I had studied psychology instead of art. We are such complex beings in so many good and bad ways, and all that there is in between.
Cheers.
Your videos never fail to teach me something new. For those of us who haven't access to therapy, and even for those who do... thank you. It was your content that woke me up from The Jehovah's Witnesses (not even one of your JW-focused videos either!), and it's your content that always has me thinking deeply about my past, present and future choices. Unlike many of us with self-induced saviour complexes, you're doing the work of a true saviour! :D
Yes he is back! Theramin has been of great help to me so much. I've recomended his channel to several people. :)
Having a saviour complex almost ruined my life a few times. I’ve had therapy to deal with it and I’m now in a supporter role with everyone in my life. I developed my saviour complex for a couple of reasons, both linked to an abusive stepfather. I could never “save” my mother from the marriage, no matter what I tried they are still married even now. Also, nobody ever came to save me. So I took all that hurt and pain and channelled it into saving others. Not realising it was about validation and control. It took several years to overcome. I still have those tendencies in me but I Chanel them into a supporting role and let people make their own mistakes, and stand on their own two feet.
I just wanted to give thanks to you man. I grew up with a lot of "bad actors" when I was young. My parents sent me to these religious classes that involved teaching kids of Christianity and were supposed to teach us about the bible. Yet, when I dared to ask questions and point out things I didn't understand, the instructors would tell my parents I was disrespectful and disruptive. Thankfully, over time I got to express my feelings with my mother whom apologized and listened to me. Your videos helped me gain the confidence to speak up for myself when I felt I was alone during my childhood. In truth, I should say sorry for never having left a comment on one of your videos yet. But regardless, thank you theramintrees. You are the best kind of teacher a person could ever ask for. Keep up the great work! 👍
I've not heard from you in sometime. Your videos are most helpful, I miss them, and you. I hope you are well.
BABE WAKE UPPPP NEW THERAMINTREES VIDDDDD
Hearing about others with distressing issues and coming to realize and resolve them is so powerful. It's easy to 'other' people that have hurt me, and very infrequently useful. This content is what I wanted from attending church but never really got.
The stage and triangle of drama is a great way to think about this. I definitely hope I'll remember it next time I, or one of my friends, slip from supporter into savior. It took,,, a long, long time for me to learn that I needed to let people go in order to help them, that I needed to step back and take care of myself first, but it's one of the most invaluable lessons anyone can learn. It's made me a whole lot kinder, safer, and happier.
I really like how the language in this is based around "we" "our" "us" stuff like that instead of "you". Its non-acusitory and acknowledging these thought process' could happen with anyone, even the video maker