Agree with you. I was more of an AoS player I was just starting to build my first 40k army when a friend showed me BA. I've jumped on the Warlord fanboy wagon ever since. I have 7 different BA armies, well over 1250 points each, for roughly the same amount I spent on one Warhammer army. The system is easy to master with few trips to the rule book. Every Warhammer game I have seen played involves books being referenced on a near constant basis. Everyone I know who tries BA after Warhammer is quick to join the BA crowd.
I think you hit all the nails squarely on the head of the 40k coffin. Welcome to Bolt Action. Subbed as I’m sure there going to be some battle reports coming our way.
THIS! As much as i love the lore, painting the models I hate how i end up spending more time in the book then playing the game. Ive been playing 40K for about 3-4 years and id say ive only just got to grips of what to do. thats without adding Stratagems etc. Bolt action however i picked up straight away and its just so much simpler. plus i can actually finish a game! I even enjoy losing for god sake.
I can confirm! I was not lying when I said i have not won a single game. And i'm talking well over 20. But its so much easier and more fun to play. I'm losing because of rolls, not because of forgotten rules or buff spamming opponents.
Late to the party, but one of the pros of the Warhammer is the fluff and community. There a lot to be engaged with and there's a lot of people and media to share it with. It's not for everyone, I certainly dislike the changes the made since I last played it in 3rd edition but it's there. Another great thing about Bolt Action is that there are other games you can use your army for: Chain of Command, What a tanker!, 1-48 tactics just to name a few. Just get a rulebook, use miniatures you have and you're good to go.
Cavalry units in bolt action are a rare sight on gaming tables but they're one of the best units imo. To get plastic ww2 cav one has to kitbash a box of american civil war cav with 20th century soldiers. A hobby saw is required for this but those cav guys will be an auto-include in your army once they're assembled and painted. The horse upgrade is 2 points and the guy gets advace rate 9", gets recce, and re-groups two D6" after a fight rather than the one D6" which can give them a nice cover bonus that they otherwise wouldn't have gotten.
Wow, I didn't know any of that. That's sounds great. I recently added a few motorcyclists troops to my last game but i didn't see much of a benefit. Other than looking cool. Maybe cavalry is the go.
I would have added that 40K, which I've been playing on and off since Rogue Trader (late '80s), tends to reinvent itself every 4-5 years. Guess what? It's pretty hard to reinvent WW2... IT'S HISTORY! And, there's no copyright on history either so you have multiple choices as far as miniatures suppliers. People always double take at the details on my Italieri model (if I recall correctly) 1:50 German 88 and crew. Totally agree with everything else you touch in this video... but I'm actually thinking of getting rid of my 40K collection after having given 9th ed. a final chance to redeem 40k for me. It didn't. Too gamey for me and, as you said, it doesn't support the cinematic feel I'm craving for.
I also am toying with the idea of dropping my army. Unfortunately its a custom built xenos rebel army so i can't even on-sell it. I Like your first point and hope to add it to a future video :)
I dropped 40K after too many rules changes that rendered "Army X" unplayable unless I changed 50% of the force : ie: you had to get those huge units or you got teamrolled / unit xyz is now nerfed.. oh, wait, it's now OP in this edition, but your *other* unit, abc, is now useless / sorry you chose Army X, it's a third tier one and we won't fix it, in regards to the new edition rules, unntil at least 5 years, enjoy loosing 90% of your next game with it Having the same ruleset for all weapons and 80% of the armies help fix that... and the fact that BA doen't change 25% of the rules between edition, each 4 years
Watched my son play 40 K with his friends for a few years, and then decided to give it a go myself. One game is all it took for me to decide I hated 40 K. I have now just got in to bolt action along with quite a number (12)other rules sets from other companies that I have been playing for between five and 35 years. Great comparison video by the way.
Some good points, but the bit at the start about pricing, yes GW is more money but £55 you can get the start collecting sets which give you 10 to 15 infantry, vehicle, a commander of some sorts and another specialised unit, saving you loads. You don't have to jump into 2000 point games straight away. And I kind of enjoy the smaller games where every little thing and decision counts more.
Bol Action is a really nice game. The mechanic's are really good (in particular the turn base system), easy to understand for new player if you start with low point games at 500 or 750 pts. This way you can show how every unti work and pass to something else (standart unit, mortar unit, vehicles, tanks... etc). The price tag is not bad. The model's are fine and for the vehicles you can take model from many company (like Warlord, Rubicon... etc). :)
Thats a great point! When i first started 'researching' Bolt action on youtube after seeing my first games. I got very confused with some videos being of bolt action games and others of chain of command. Very flexible models.
I remember this blowing my mind. Someone was explaining his army to another player and said 'this one, this one and that one are all 3d prints.' I literally turned to the other player waiting for an objection or disqualification. Just a 'mmm Nice detail,' and on with the game. Mind blown.
Unfortunately on the day of the new 40K rules release, I had to join a queue to buy them, but by the time I made the front of the queue, I had to pre order the next new edition. 40K died years ago, when GW became a corporate beast. Warlord make playable games, where you can have fun and don’t feel the need to break every rule they make………….
hoping to get together with some knowledgable 40k friends next week and do a slow grow experiment. Slowly adding rules from Bolt action to 40k to find the best mix.
I got several of my friends out of 40k and into BA, I had been playing 40k through 7th and 8th but just got bored of it by the time ninth came out. I find the fan base to be rather toxic and no matter what you do some armies are objectively better or if you want to play a certain army competitively you have to take specific units. Not to mention constant FAQ rules changes etc, its a nightmare to actually stay up to date, not to mention the incredibly high cost of the rule book and codecs.
Yes, my main issue is with trying to make unique armies which i love. Even making all the fluff and stories for. But then it's nearly impossible to win a single game. Because only these 5-6 specific units and combinations are actually useful. Takes some of the uniqueness out i find.
Any chance you could do a video or know any videos that compares the size of the 40k figures to the Bolt Action ones? I’d like to make a Guardsmen regiment using the Soviets and possibly use some of their heads on space marines
40k figures are in heroic scale so while they are roughly 28mm like Bolt action. They are completely out of proportion with weapons, heads and muscles. Bolt action figures will look significantly smaller and skinnier. Not impossible if the whole army will be Bolt action, but you will run into problems if you start putting lasguns and heavy bolters on things. And their true scale tanks and artillery will look meek against 40k on the table.
@@madcapgamer4099 thank you, while all those would be bad for gameplay, I want mainly enjoy collecting so as long as I could maybe put a head or two on a squatty marine and then make the rest Bolt Action that is cool with me. Appreciate the response tho
@@madcapgamer4099 I want to use one of those little commie ushankas on a squatty marine, I do a build with MkVI that makes them look like DOOM guy and wanted a Soviet one lol
I agree with all your points! However it's a little unfair to compare some aspects of the games, for example the standardisation of weapons and stats works in Bolt Action because everyone is a human soldier but couldn't work in 40k because of the huge variety of races and weaponry. The big thing I think you're missing is really nothing to do with the rules at all, but what really makes 40k more appealing than other games is how good it looks. A game of 40k will always look more exciting than a BA game because the scenery and the models have so much more colour and variety, and every faction has a unique and wonderful aesthetic that is simply unmatched by anything else. I think most people spend more time preparing their models than actually playing the game so this is a major consideration!
I agree with you on both points. Though i did like the earlier versions of 40k where there was some weapon standardisation. I think the look of the models really does set 40k apart. (plus i did get to the end of my brainstorm list and think, hey i should have found something that 40k wins at.) I believe a follow up vid is in order with some well earned 40k points on the board.
I'll happily collect a couple 40k models to display but I find them to boring, uninspiring builds lacking real variety, feels hard to make it your if you catch my drift. Not to mention GW is awful for neglecting its factions, the standard IG infantry box is decades old and ridiculously bland.
"A game of 40k will always look more exciting than a BA game" - funnily enough when I was playing a game of BA in a game shop recently alongside a 40K table, the 40K guys came over to watch our game and told us how cool it all looked.
Thanks for this comparison... all the more reasons for me to avoid 40k. I haven't played BA yet but I've been building armies for K47 and I'm looking forward to being able to play when the bug passes. The game I've really gotten into is Deadzone. It has alternating activations (though not random like BA), small playing area (2'x2' is standard), fast combat resolution (simultaneous attack/defense rolls), and a strong emphasis on 3D gameplay.
Wow. That price difference is astonishing. Are the WH40K models particularly good or very detailed? Is the quality at least higher for that amount of money?!
They are incredibly detailed and quality models. (I still haven't gotten around to my pros of 40k video) but there are also alternative products out there and if the price is daunting there are always other options.
The reason Bolt Action is so much cheaper is cuse you can't put a copywrite on ww2. So you can buy multiple armies from different companies. Tournaments even allow armies from companies that are not War Lord.
It's hard to convey how completely mind blown i was when i watched my first bolt action tourney (still wasn't playing yet) and one player explained how his armoured cars were 3D printed. And no one batted an eyelid. I thought we was going to be chased out. instead they admired the detail and got started.
I love Bolt Action. You should probably compare it to Star Wars Legion though, a more fair comparison. Be warned SWL will clean BA’s clock just as handily.
oh a challenge indeed! i will have to have an expert walk me through it. I have only played Imperial Assault and watched a few Legion games. The boxes of tokens scare me.
I would love for you to do a comparison, quite enjoyed your review! There’s certainly chatter about power creep, but the designer has shown an aptitude for rebalancing units and with a living rulebook online and the ability to adjust points on the fly.. it’s not the powercreep of 40k!
I disagree on most of this. To be fair, I only got to the end of round 2 before I checked out. I know he says at the beginning that he's still a fan of 40k, but the bias is very real. I mean, everyone's entitled to their opinion and I have no problem with people disliking decisions GW made with the rules, but he waxes poetic about the 'problems' with GW/40k, but glosses over the shortcomings of Bolt Action. Yes, the army rules are by and large more standardized (due to the nature of the setting), but the core rules are honestly far more complicated. 40k has 23 pages of rules, and they're only that long because they tried to write things out as explicitly as possible to stop people from trying to fudge the rules. Bolt Action's rulebook has somewhere in the region of 140 pages of rules (the rest is scenarios and core army rules etc...). Almost every game of bolt action I play we end up having to stop and look up rules just because there's so many, and some are kinda dumb (like the flak/airstrike rules). The price point is a relatively fair comparison (although there are ways to get into 40k under $1k), but doesn't mention the gap in quality. Citadel minis (at least the new ones) are far more detailed. As for the quibbles about 9th's changes, I whole-heartedly disagree. I find the more diverse missions to be a breath of fresh air. Take and hold missions are just so boring to me, and you can just do that anyway if you want. I'm not a pro-player by any means, but I've legit never had any issues keeping scores. When you do something that scores, write it down and how much. It's really not that complicated. The rerolls to me don't add any significant amount of time, no more time than blast templates do. But all that's really just a difference of opinion, the thing I dislike is just the complete lack of discussing anything negative about Bolt Action. I love the game but I have quite a few issues with it, and they come up almost every time I play. And many of the issues he mentions about 40k can happen with BA, and have for me in the past (games taking forever, rules getting complicated, etc..). I donno, there's just a clear bias here and I'm not a fan of that.
Thanks Joe for giving us as firmly counter opinion. It's interesting to see a fellow player of both games who comes down squarely on the opposite side of the fence. As the video says comments agreeing and disagreeing are all welcome. So thanks for adding to the discussion.
3rd edition WH40 k was fast and fun then we got 4th edition and things went down from here . Bolt action feels like the fun we used to have with warhammer and hey we don't have to have official figures . I have used old Airfix figures , it worked and dead cheap . Shame Games Workshop doesn't go back to the old rules but with balanced army lists
I fully agree. Igo ugo is boring and the 40k models are too expensive. Instead of building my third 40k army which I don't play much anymore due to the clunking rules I now have two bolt action armies and will eventually have three
Thanks David. Sometimes I thought I was the only one not coping with all the rules. Which armies have you gone for. I wen't Commonwealth and Afrika Korp for my first two.
My exact reaction after my first few fumbling games of Bolt-Action. 'So simple... What have i been doing all my life!?' We are half-way through our first ever 'Bolt-Hammer' bat rep and the early results look promising.
For me, 40K was never a balanced game, its rules were to serve its business interests: sell more models, but at least the old editions (3 ed~5 ed) it was a fun game, though not Balanced but interesting, until the latest version, it even lost the good of being interesting, which is sad
I agree. I remember playing older versions and being full immersed in the lore and even the mission objectives could help you lose yourself in the 'cinematic sci-fi world' at the tabletop. Now it's all points, points, points, stratagems, commandpoints math math math. No time to imagine you're an Imperial Guard captain rescuing a downed pilot from murderous Dark Eldar pirates anymore.
I know the pain. It looked very intimidating to my friends as well but a lot of persistent nagging, drink/pizza offering, breaking down to simplest/quickest forms of the game convinced them. (Mind you i still have to supply the armies and write the lists. but baby steps)
Where are you located? Players are out there and there's some fantastic community groups on Facebook. I've pretty much played Bolt Action every weekend for the last 2 years!
40k is a disaster of a ruleset, i just dont understand how people find it even remotely fun... Bolt action is a pretty boring setting but the gameplay is the most fun ive had in wargaming. A combination of the two would be the game of games.
Me who is really big into both games, watching this video like I'm new.
Always thought the main theme behind Warhammer games is to extract the maximum amount of cash from the gamer time and again.
Agree with you. I was more of an AoS player I was just starting to build my first 40k army when a friend showed me BA. I've jumped on the Warlord fanboy wagon ever since. I have 7 different BA armies, well over 1250 points each, for roughly the same amount I spent on one Warhammer army. The system is easy to master with few trips to the rule book. Every Warhammer game I have seen played involves books being referenced on a near constant basis. Everyone I know who tries BA after Warhammer is quick to join the BA crowd.
Same! the only people i haven't been able to convince, are the people that have never tried it. Soon as they play a game or two it just makes sense!
I think you hit all the nails squarely on the head of the 40k coffin. Welcome to Bolt Action. Subbed as I’m sure there going to be some battle reports coming our way.
I will even try to win a couple!
THIS!
As much as i love the lore, painting the models I hate how i end up spending more time in the book then playing the game.
Ive been playing 40K for about 3-4 years and id say ive only just got to grips of what to do. thats without adding Stratagems etc.
Bolt action however i picked up straight away and its just so much simpler. plus i can actually finish a game! I even enjoy losing for god sake.
I can confirm! I was not lying when I said i have not won a single game. And i'm talking well over 20. But its so much easier and more fun to play. I'm losing because of rolls, not because of forgotten rules or buff spamming opponents.
@@madcapgamer4099 that's the magic of bolt action! :D
*looks at bank account* welp... Bolt Action it is!
Late to the party, but one of the pros of the Warhammer is the fluff and community. There a lot to be engaged with and there's a lot of people and media to share it with. It's not for everyone, I certainly dislike the changes the made since I last played it in 3rd edition but it's there.
Another great thing about Bolt Action is that there are other games you can use your army for: Chain of Command, What a tanker!, 1-48 tactics just to name a few. Just get a rulebook, use miniatures you have and you're good to go.
two excellent points!
Thanks for promoting the differences between the two game systems, more people need to know what else is out there!
Cavalry units in bolt action are a rare sight on gaming tables but they're one of the best units imo.
To get plastic ww2 cav one has to kitbash a box of american civil war cav with 20th century soldiers.
A hobby saw is required for this but those cav guys will be an auto-include in your army once they're assembled and painted.
The horse upgrade is 2 points and the guy gets advace rate 9", gets recce, and re-groups two D6" after a fight rather than the one D6" which can give them a nice cover bonus that they otherwise wouldn't have gotten.
Wow, I didn't know any of that. That's sounds great. I recently added a few motorcyclists troops to my last game but i didn't see much of a benefit. Other than looking cool. Maybe cavalry is the go.
I would have added that 40K, which I've been playing on and off since Rogue Trader (late '80s), tends to reinvent itself every 4-5 years. Guess what? It's pretty hard to reinvent WW2... IT'S HISTORY! And, there's no copyright on history either so you have multiple choices as far as miniatures suppliers. People always double take at the details on my Italieri model (if I recall correctly) 1:50 German 88 and crew. Totally agree with everything else you touch in this video... but I'm actually thinking of getting rid of my 40K collection after having given 9th ed. a final chance to redeem 40k for me. It didn't. Too gamey for me and, as you said, it doesn't support the cinematic feel I'm craving for.
I also am toying with the idea of dropping my army. Unfortunately its a custom built xenos rebel army so i can't even on-sell it. I Like your first point and hope to add it to a future video :)
I dropped 40K after too many rules changes that rendered "Army X" unplayable unless I changed 50% of the force : ie: you had to get those huge units or you got teamrolled / unit xyz is now nerfed.. oh, wait, it's now OP in this edition, but your *other* unit, abc, is now useless / sorry you chose Army X, it's a third tier one and we won't fix it, in regards to the new edition rules, unntil at least 5 years, enjoy loosing 90% of your next game with it
Having the same ruleset for all weapons and 80% of the armies help fix that... and the fact that BA doen't change 25% of the rules between edition, each 4 years
Watched my son play 40 K with his friends for a few years, and then decided to give it a go myself. One game is all it took for me to decide I hated 40 K. I have now just got in to bolt action along with quite a number (12)other rules sets from other companies that I have been playing for between five and 35 years. Great comparison video by the way.
Some good points, but the bit at the start about pricing, yes GW is more money but £55 you can get the start collecting sets which give you 10 to 15 infantry, vehicle, a commander of some sorts and another specialised unit, saving you loads. You don't have to jump into 2000 point games straight away. And I kind of enjoy the smaller games where every little thing and decision counts more.
I am finding the same thing. The more complicated the rules get, the more I avoid tournament sized games and enjoy smaller squad bashes.
Bol Action is a really nice game. The mechanic's are really good (in particular the turn base system), easy to understand for new player if you start with low point games at 500 or 750 pts. This way you can show how every unti work and pass to something else (standart unit, mortar unit, vehicles, tanks... etc). The price tag is not bad. The model's are fine and for the vehicles you can take model from many company (like Warlord, Rubicon... etc). :)
Agree Agree Agree!
I enjoy both, but a real plus with getting in to Bolt Action is you can then use your models/army for any other WWII games, such as Chain of Command.
Thats a great point! When i first started 'researching' Bolt action on youtube after seeing my first games. I got very confused with some videos being of bolt action games and others of chain of command. Very flexible models.
Another plus is they don't even need to be Warlord Games models - you're allowed to use third party products and there's no stigma to it.
I remember this blowing my mind. Someone was explaining his army to another player and said 'this one, this one and that one are all 3d prints.' I literally turned to the other player waiting for an objection or disqualification. Just a 'mmm Nice detail,' and on with the game. Mind blown.
Unfortunately on the day of the new 40K rules release, I had to join a queue to buy them, but by the time I made the front of the queue, I had to pre order the next new edition. 40K died years ago, when GW became a corporate beast. Warlord make playable games, where you can have fun and don’t feel the need to break every rule they make………….
Would love to se a Bolthammer ruleset, have been trying to wrap my head around what that would look like as well.
hoping to get together with some knowledgable 40k friends next week and do a slow grow experiment. Slowly adding rules from Bolt action to 40k to find the best mix.
I would buy a Bolthammer ruleset. GW might have an issue but that's probably part of why I'd like to see it. :D
I got several of my friends out of 40k and into BA, I had been playing 40k through 7th and 8th but just got bored of it by the time ninth came out. I find the fan base to be rather toxic and no matter what you do some armies are objectively better or if you want to play a certain army competitively you have to take specific units. Not to mention constant FAQ rules changes etc, its a nightmare to actually stay up to date, not to mention the incredibly high cost of the rule book and codecs.
Yes, my main issue is with trying to make unique armies which i love. Even making all the fluff and stories for. But then it's nearly impossible to win a single game. Because only these 5-6 specific units and combinations are actually useful. Takes some of the uniqueness out i find.
Both games that's what I wanted to hear I love the lore but love the realistic bolt action brings , why not play both well said.
THANK YOU SO MUCH for this Video! Spittin' some truth here!
Any chance you could do a video or know any videos that compares the size of the 40k figures to the Bolt Action ones? I’d like to make a Guardsmen regiment using the Soviets and possibly use some of their heads on space marines
40k figures are in heroic scale so while they are roughly 28mm like Bolt action. They are completely out of proportion with weapons, heads and muscles. Bolt action figures will look significantly smaller and skinnier. Not impossible if the whole army will be Bolt action, but you will run into problems if you start putting lasguns and heavy bolters on things. And their true scale tanks and artillery will look meek against 40k on the table.
@@madcapgamer4099 thank you, while all those would be bad for gameplay, I want mainly enjoy collecting so as long as I could maybe put a head or two on a squatty marine and then make the rest Bolt Action that is cool with me. Appreciate the response tho
@@madcapgamer4099 I want to use one of those little commie ushankas on a squatty marine, I do a build with MkVI that makes them look like DOOM guy and wanted a Soviet one lol
@@craigerycocoa9669 I hope to see some pics !
What an interesting premise! Comparing two very different game systems, I love it!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Well done on this video fantastic. I agree with every point you have made between the two.
Thanks. I'm sure there is a lot i missed. And suggestions for a follow up welcome.
I agree with all your points! However it's a little unfair to compare some aspects of the games, for example the standardisation of weapons and stats works in Bolt Action because everyone is a human soldier but couldn't work in 40k because of the huge variety of races and weaponry. The big thing I think you're missing is really nothing to do with the rules at all, but what really makes 40k more appealing than other games is how good it looks. A game of 40k will always look more exciting than a BA game because the scenery and the models have so much more colour and variety, and every faction has a unique and wonderful aesthetic that is simply unmatched by anything else. I think most people spend more time preparing their models than actually playing the game so this is a major consideration!
I agree with you on both points. Though i did like the earlier versions of 40k where there was some weapon standardisation. I think the look of the models really does set 40k apart. (plus i did get to the end of my brainstorm list and think, hey i should have found something that 40k wins at.) I believe a follow up vid is in order with some well earned 40k points on the board.
I'll happily collect a couple 40k models to display but I find them to boring, uninspiring builds lacking real variety, feels hard to make it your if you catch my drift. Not to mention GW is awful for neglecting its factions, the standard IG infantry box is decades old and ridiculously bland.
"A game of 40k will always look more exciting than a BA game" - funnily enough when I was playing a game of BA in a game shop recently alongside a 40K table, the 40K guys came over to watch our game and told us how cool it all looked.
Thanks for this comparison... all the more reasons for me to avoid 40k. I haven't played BA yet but I've been building armies for K47 and I'm looking forward to being able to play when the bug passes. The game I've really gotten into is Deadzone. It has alternating activations (though not random like BA), small playing area (2'x2' is standard), fast combat resolution (simultaneous attack/defense rolls), and a strong emphasis on 3D gameplay.
interesting. i will be checking it out.
Wow. That price difference is astonishing. Are the WH40K models particularly good or very detailed? Is the quality at least higher for that amount of money?!
They are incredibly detailed and quality models. (I still haven't gotten around to my pros of 40k video) but there are also alternative products out there and if the price is daunting there are always other options.
The reason Bolt Action is so much cheaper is cuse you can't put a copywrite on ww2. So you can buy multiple armies from different companies. Tournaments even allow armies from companies that are not War Lord.
It's hard to convey how completely mind blown i was when i watched my first bolt action tourney (still wasn't playing yet) and one player explained how his armoured cars were 3D printed. And no one batted an eyelid. I thought we was going to be chased out. instead they admired the detail and got started.
I love Bolt Action. You should probably compare it to Star Wars Legion though, a more fair comparison. Be warned SWL will clean BA’s clock just as handily.
oh a challenge indeed! i will have to have an expert walk me through it. I have only played Imperial Assault and watched a few Legion games. The boxes of tokens scare me.
@@madcapgamer4099 I have both game and even if I'm a Star Wars fan, I really prefer Bolt Action. The power Creep in Legion are bugging me sometimes.
@@dominiclemire2540 oh no! there is power creep in SW too?
I would love for you to do a comparison, quite enjoyed your review! There’s certainly chatter about power creep, but the designer has shown an aptitude for rebalancing units and with a living rulebook online and the ability to adjust points on the fly.. it’s not the powercreep of 40k!
I disagree on most of this. To be fair, I only got to the end of round 2 before I checked out. I know he says at the beginning that he's still a fan of 40k, but the bias is very real. I mean, everyone's entitled to their opinion and I have no problem with people disliking decisions GW made with the rules, but he waxes poetic about the 'problems' with GW/40k, but glosses over the shortcomings of Bolt Action. Yes, the army rules are by and large more standardized (due to the nature of the setting), but the core rules are honestly far more complicated. 40k has 23 pages of rules, and they're only that long because they tried to write things out as explicitly as possible to stop people from trying to fudge the rules. Bolt Action's rulebook has somewhere in the region of 140 pages of rules (the rest is scenarios and core army rules etc...). Almost every game of bolt action I play we end up having to stop and look up rules just because there's so many, and some are kinda dumb (like the flak/airstrike rules). The price point is a relatively fair comparison (although there are ways to get into 40k under $1k), but doesn't mention the gap in quality. Citadel minis (at least the new ones) are far more detailed. As for the quibbles about 9th's changes, I whole-heartedly disagree. I find the more diverse missions to be a breath of fresh air. Take and hold missions are just so boring to me, and you can just do that anyway if you want. I'm not a pro-player by any means, but I've legit never had any issues keeping scores. When you do something that scores, write it down and how much. It's really not that complicated. The rerolls to me don't add any significant amount of time, no more time than blast templates do. But all that's really just a difference of opinion, the thing I dislike is just the complete lack of discussing anything negative about Bolt Action. I love the game but I have quite a few issues with it, and they come up almost every time I play. And many of the issues he mentions about 40k can happen with BA, and have for me in the past (games taking forever, rules getting complicated, etc..). I donno, there's just a clear bias here and I'm not a fan of that.
Thanks Joe for giving us as firmly counter opinion. It's interesting to see a fellow player of both games who comes down squarely on the opposite side of the fence. As the video says comments agreeing and disagreeing are all welcome. So thanks for adding to the discussion.
@@madcapgamer4099 For sure, and by no means am I trying to be rude if it came across that way. Debates about nerd stuff are half the hobby for me lol
Holy shit! A calm level headed debate? On the INTERNET! Get out!
3rd edition WH40 k was fast and fun then we got 4th edition and things went down from here .
Bolt action feels like the fun we used to have with warhammer and hey we don't have to have official figures .
I have used old Airfix figures , it worked and dead cheap .
Shame Games Workshop doesn't go back to the old rules but with balanced army lists
Exactly why I love and am so enthusiastic about Bolt Action and why I dumped 40 K a long time ago.
WarHQ.co.uk I have both but I definitely agree with you the excitement levels for bolt action is high
I fully agree. Igo ugo is boring and the 40k models are too expensive. Instead of building my third 40k army which I don't play much anymore due to the clunking rules I now have two bolt action armies and will eventually have three
Thanks David. Sometimes I thought I was the only one not coping with all the rules. Which armies have you gone for. I wen't Commonwealth and Afrika Korp for my first two.
where can I find Bolt Hammer?
In an upcoming series of videos from the lab! 🧪 🔬
A few I know play with 40k models and Bolt Action Rules or order dice!
I was literally left with my jaw dropped on a few occasions. Especially the deployment for Bolt Action. So simple WHYYYYYYYYY!?!
My exact reaction after my first few fumbling games of Bolt-Action. 'So simple... What have i been doing all my life!?'
We are half-way through our first ever 'Bolt-Hammer' bat rep and the early results look promising.
For me, 40K was never a balanced game, its rules were to serve its business interests: sell more models, but at least the old editions (3 ed~5 ed) it was a fun game, though not Balanced but interesting, until the latest version, it even lost the good of being interesting, which is sad
I agree. I remember playing older versions and being full immersed in the lore and even the mission objectives could help you lose yourself in the 'cinematic sci-fi world' at the tabletop. Now it's all points, points, points, stratagems, commandpoints math math math.
No time to imagine you're an Imperial Guard captain rescuing a downed pilot from murderous Dark Eldar pirates anymore.
Just get into both games. Make it easier lol
por qué no los dos!
To bad I can't find anyone to play BA with like at all.
I know the pain. It looked very intimidating to my friends as well but a lot of persistent nagging, drink/pizza offering, breaking down to simplest/quickest forms of the game convinced them. (Mind you i still have to supply the armies and write the lists. but baby steps)
Where are you located? Players are out there and there's some fantastic community groups on Facebook. I've pretty much played Bolt Action every weekend for the last 2 years!
They are either 40k ppl ok battle tech the dont care for historical...much to my sadness.
@@WesternTabletop Sadly i got into Bolt action right before the covid lock downs. I can't wait for games days to be back in full swing.
@@vaughn7145 Sounds like the game clubs are for you mate. Make some NEW history enthusiast friends! :)
40k is a disaster of a ruleset, i just dont understand how people find it even remotely fun...
Bolt action is a pretty boring setting but the gameplay is the most fun ive had in wargaming.
A combination of the two would be the game of games.
Hi Marcus, I agree. If only i can have more friends look past the 'boring setting' and give it a go. I know they will have much more fun.
40k is boring crap
Might be nice to do something together perhaps. Let me know if it would be of interest to you.
the will is there. My technical skills might be lacking though.
MadCap Mac I feel your pain lol. Contact me on WarHQ.co.uk@gmail.com if you are interested and I’ll organise a chat and see what we can do.