It took me almost three years, and a lot of calculated risk, but I finally reached my goal of $1,000,000 selling methamphetamines. I thought 5,000 buy ins would be a good conservative cushion for 1/2 NL. I should have known that was foolish. I'm very disappointed to hear I am $1,199,000,000 from what I really need to give up the street grind and take up the sweet simpler life of poker, but I will not give into despair. I will just have to work that much harder. Thank you Daniel. This was extremely helpful.
Professional poker players looks at this not like on the gamble, but more like "business". And sometimes u get bankrupt. But you know, where u were, and know, how to get back to that level, therefore u can afford to ask for another "starting capital". Even Daniel broke few times, that should not stop you for playing if u are not a recreational player
Bobby Manna the thing is most People would be broke in a few years after a small loan of a million dollars..... some people are better than that and can multiply it
"You're going broke, because they're better than you." Sadly, most people don't realize this fact until after they're broke. "If you can't spot the sucker in your half hour at the poker table, then you *ARE* the sucker." -- "Mike McDermott" from "Rounders"
We need a "Shark Tank" for poker. Next into the tank is Tom Dwaun, looking for a 15 million dollar investment to run big bluffs. Next is Mike Mattosow seeking a 65 dollar investment for a sit n go
I like how you bring up the important questions like skill level and willingness to gamble. So much better than saying you need x amount of dollars for a certain stake
x amount of dollars calculated from edge, standard deviation, and risk of ruin. It is a simple formula, and those are the variables. Google a bankroll calculator online
Here is Daniel Negreanu's Film - Kidpoker (Produced by NetFliX) - 720HD Complete Wach here ==> cut-urls.com/xtauh Resume : "To avoid Criticism say nothing, do nothing, be nothing." Have fun ;)
Bankroll rules are more about swings than number of buy ins. If you swing 2-3 buy ins every day then 30-40 is enough. If you swing 10bi a day then you need more like a 100 so 3 bad days in a row doesn't wipe out most of your roll. Another thing to do is to play lower during the day when the games suck and then take those winnings up to the next limit in the evening when all the fish show up. Then if you only lose what you won during the day you'll never have a losing day.
dude what the f are you talking about? It has nothing to do with per day, if you only play 2-3 buy ins a day that's all you go through. I'm not going to bother explaining everything because this was 6 years ago
My bankroll does even better when the rake is higher, like at Pokerstars. Another big boost to your bankroll is playing tons of hands, hoping to get SuperNova Elite, only to have it taken away at the end of the year. Thanks Daniel!
Pro live cash game player here. The real optimal amount to have for a cash roll is dependent on your standard deviation. I play a laggy style with a high standard deviation and fairly regularly have 10-15 BI swings. I have TAG buddies that rarely have swings bigger than 5 BI's. I prefer to have 4000 big blinds at the stake I'm playing while a TAG player could get away with having 1500 or 2000. This is for playing full time.
I always laugh at gamblers that say "you just need to win this much of a bank roll". I knew an old man at the track that used to say "I first win $100 then I just gamble with house money". And I was like "if you can determine when you win, why not just keep winning?". And I'm not sure I'm comfortable with a Poker "pro" telling me how much money I need to bring to gamble. "Bring $40,000...and come sit at my table".
2:00 SRY DANIEL but your answer is horrible on this one with all my respect on you! If you are a cash player 20 buy ins ESPECIALLY for a beginner player is a total disaster! Loosing session + bad beats + tilt = can sost 5 buy ins in just ONE ONLINE SESSION! After 7 years of online cash game grinding here is my personal viewr: 1) each session i invest NO MORE than 3% of my total bankroll 2) one time/hand limited session each day (lets say 200 hands or 2 hours session) 3) no refills are allowed! do not ever refill again! Its a bad habit! 4)if you double up you have two choices: a) move to the next level table OR b) LEAVE THE TABLE NOW and enjoy your winnings with a nice glass of wine
I'm not a poker player that plays a lot but I been in discussions about how much should your bankroll be when playing in a tournament. In my opinion, it really doesn't matter. Whether you're playing in a $50.00 game vs a $1000.00 game, your play shouldn't differ. If it does, then you are letting your bankroll determine how you play. Does anyone agree or disagree with me?
As a former risk management professional, think of poker as part of a personal asset allocation. For an amateur it is unlikely that a poker bankroll represents a significant percentage of personal net worth, so the risk of ruin can be relatively high. If you go bust, reload. For a pro, think of the poker pro as a small business owner who has possibly invested his life savings in his business. You want to maximize earnings subject to a very low risk of ruin. The goal is to maximize earnings; the risk of ruin is a constraint. Playing drunk HU vs. Phil Ivey, $1.2 billion is the WORST possible bankroll you can have, because it maximizes your loss. The best bankroll is $100 with no reload. At that investment you get to say you played HU against Phil Ivey, and you minimize your loss. I would pay $200 to play with Daniel.
Good on you for giving honest, responsible advice. You could easily go with some ‘follow your dreams’ bullshit and avoid the harsh realities of attempting to become a professional poker player. Bully to you- Kr Negreanu
As a rule of thumb from what I've read - it should be around 300 times per BB, or 150 per BB for tournaments (it could be more). I like the buy-ins theory. I play 1-3 (3-300 Spread) and I have about 5k save against it. However, I had to revisit the Why quit poker because I wasn't playing my best and it cost me. :(
Ok how about this. How do you feed your bankroll? I use to do a 33/66% profit split, bankroll/personal money. But I moved to a 50/50% split. Let me give you an example: To build a bankroll I used to buy in with what money I can afford from my monthly paycheck. So lets say your playing an 11 man £10 tournament with winner take all and you win that £110. I put £10 back from I sourced it from (personal to start with but bankroll once u have one) and then £50 goes to my bankroll and £50 to my personal money. Bare in mind I would change that split percentage if I ever made enough to go pro or could afford playing higher limits.
if there are no other factors involved. what is the minumum #of big blinds we should join a cash game with so for instance you could say ok you should have more than 20 because otherwise you could very often lose a couple hands and then you are suddenly a short stack or you can say that 30 is not enough because you can't bluff or value bet as efficiently as you would want to under normal circumstance this question is asking the minumum bankroll that we should play with. i also wonder this because for instance i played 1-2 blinds nl in vegas, buyin was 100-300 and 100 seems a bit low bc you can become a short stack quickly. so ideally how many big blinds should we have to be able to play poker under normal circumstance
Deniz Demir 50 bb's. 1/2nl=$100 2/5nl=$500 I usually play 2/5 and buy in for 800. If you're playing 1/2, I highly recommend buying in for atleast 200. Most of the time in the 1/2 games, people don't base their raises on blinds. If they have a good hand they'll usually bump it up to 10 or 15. You really want/need to be deep enough to comfortably make a 3-bet without being all in, or almost all in. When you're not playing deep, it kinda takes the skill and the fun out of it! Because almost every hand that you play, you're gonna be all in!!! Plus, other players will try to push you around, but that's not always a bad thing! Those are usually the guys that will double you up!!!! I don't like big pots,,,,,, unless I have the absolute nuts!!!!! That doesn't happen very often. I like to play pot control, and this might sound strange, but it's easier to keep the pots small if you have a respectable stack. Buy in big, play small ball unless you absolutely have it, and play really smart! If you have a bad feeling, or you're not sure, FOLD IT!!!!! Get them later on! Find a better spot!!!! Having a good fold game is just as important as having a great call game!!!!! And if it makes you uncomfortable playing with that much money, leave!!!! Go home, save up, and go back when you have money that effects nothing in your life! It's meant for one thing only, poker!!!!!
Connor Hughes you should coach the world bro you sound like the 6th best on the world spinning 5 buys to 15 bro thats the sickest thing ive ever ever heard in poker bro absolutly sick mate out of control...you ever thought of writing a poker cash game book?? you could call it "5 buy ins to 20 how to beat poker big in a month" wait till that run bad kicks in mate you will be selling that iphone quickly...lmfao
Connor Hughes focused dont help when you get 2 outered on the river buddy 5 buy ins trying to be a cash game pro is the same as having $2mill in your account and buying in to the $1 mill one drop....yes you can get lucky and play well and run good and run up 5 buy ins to any amount its not impossible just suicidal espeically at live poker i play £2-£5 deep 2-3 times a week live and 3 days online on mtts for the £2-£5 i have 40 buy ins as the games swingy and i feel unsafe...
Building a bankroll up from 5 buyins can be done, but it requires, that you hit an upswing, before you hit a downswing. If you try this 100 times with the same skill, the same game etc., you will go broke maybe 25, 50 or even 75 times. And you are not even quite out of the woods yet, since a 20 buyin downswing is absolutly possible in cash game poker. But lets be realistic now. If you play 1/2 cash, you are not making a living from poker or planning to do so anytime soon. You have a day job, so poker should be considered a hobby, and if you lose the 1.000 $, you just need to take a break, until you have saved up another 1.000 $ from your salary. And as long as this will not knock you out mentally, there is nothing wrong with starting up with a small bankroll.
fundiver198 yes I'm playing as a hobby. Yes I experience bad beats. No I don't feel stressed bc I have a small bankroll. I feel I am one of the best players at the table of a 1/2 table at all times. The guy above me is obviously not very good.
Good advice. 50 buy ins for tournaments seems about right. Probably less if you're starting in low stakes or micro stakes where the average player is considerably worse. Assuming you are good and have put in considerable time reading/studying poker books.
Most people do not play with a designated poker bankroll. They either take from other income to play poker sometimes, or they are playing poker to pay their bills, and so their bankroll will go up and down with their expenses, just like their results. Fact is, if your gonna try to derive income from poker, you better be well-studied and very good, and you better be humble enough to find games you can actually beat.
Facts. Speaking from experience, if you are playing with your "need to live" money, ie bills, rent, expenses...it's hard way to be successful in poker. Set aside a completely separate poker bankroll which you will use ONLY for poker. This bankroll will determine what stakes you should play at. You can add money to it, if you are able to, each month, but you can't take any out for bills, rent, etc. Keep detailed records of your win/loss, stakes, etc. Over time you will get a clear picture if you can be successful at this.
I played a tournament the other day and folded jjs in the SB a couple of times then finally picked up K4 off jammed and got snapped by kks where did I go wrong Daniel?
I like Daniel always tells the truth. A piece of advice for the poker world from myself who has made chunks of money playing poker. The best way to build a bankroll is to spend 1 year playing tournaments and save all the money won from those and then in the second year use that bankroll to play cash games the following year. If you go broke that year then just repeat the process!! :-D always remember the pyramids wasn't built in one day, patience is everything!! gl
Vitor HdAR Yes you could but depends on the value. I only play the big tournaments where there is a lot of value I.e amateur players and fun players giving it a go because first place is a lot of money. If you can play tournaments every week were the final table money is big and the players in the tournaments are amateur players looking to get lucky than yes stick to those. But you will find that those kind of tournaments only happen a few times a year. I'm from London and in April there is a £5k buy in event and 1st place is GTD £1m, however there is satellites into the tournament from only £22 - £500 so you can imagine the types of players that are going to be playing. When sitting at a table in a comp like that believe you me I'm going to be asking the players who bought in directly or who won a seat!!!
Hiya Daniel, I've learned to build my own bank roll through stars while juggling a job and college. I've deposited 20 dollars and I've tried to build it up from there. Since doing so any tourney I've won more than 40 dollars I've cashed out half and kept half in. And I've built up a good bankroll using this system. What I want to know is do you think this is a good system and if not do you think there is a better adjustment to the system
Duncan Macintyre cmon duncan your asking a man with a trillion dollas a 35c bankroll question when you seem like a smart guy....you should know the answere ffs!! of course its a good stratagy as you depositing small..ive burned thru loads of rolls playing mtts as the varience in the medium stakes + is crazy on stars hence why if you cannot play cash you will NEVER survive in poker! online or live.
A good bankrool (from a grinders view) is one that lets you play the stakes you fell confortable but also high enough to give you an aceptable win rate to cover your expenses.
Yea br is you're lifeline. of course sometimes things happen and you can lose your roll. it happens. but for it to happen time after time,maybe poker isn't for you.I understand the ups and downs in poker, and i understand poker isn't for everybody.I think some ppl get wrapped up and let their ego's get involved when it doesn't need to.Poker is full of beats and takedowns.You have to be mentally strong and a game plan is a big plus.
I think a lot of the old timers(Ivey, Matusow, and Antonius) and even some of the young guns didn't stress too much on BR management while starting out. That's what made them successful.
It‘s like with the stockmarket: Play with money you don’t need elsewise. So many young people dream of being a pro. Forget it and leave it to those few who are the full package of what it takes. Us others should consider our losses as the price for our entertainment.
That would be 20 max buy ins if you're full time right? If you can supplement your roll with another job to help with downswings then 20 seems high to me but maybe I'm just wrong.
This in my opinion was not good advice. The 20 buy ins "full" rule is very good, but you need to be willing to drop down in stakes if you are not running well. I have been playing full time for 4 years and have never had a down swing for more than 12 buy ins, so maybe I run well or maybe i'm solid, but going broke could happen to any one. Now that i'm flush I have a very low chance of risk of ruin. You want to get out of 1/2 NL as fast as possible. The rake is just too high to make it worth your time. Once you acquire a 20k bankroll you want to be playing 2/5. At 2/5 the rake isn't as big as a factor, and you can have some really good 2k+ nights once in a while. It took me about 1.5 years to get out of 1/2 NL but it is possible. Once you reach this stake you want to diversify your assets into other things like stock market - equities and other assets - so you aren't only in just poker. This is assuming you are beating 2/5 but I wouldn't move up in stakes until you have a solid foundation of dividend income because some of the 5/10 players are really good.
It seems counter intuitive to me to buy in for close to the table minimum. You wouldn't be able to stack people with your best hands, and if you use the all in bluff as a strategy you wouldn't have as much fold equity.
This decision should be based on how you view your edge more than your bankroll size. Are you a tournament player switching to cash who's knowledgeable about pot odds and equity? Then short stacking will be more profitable. Are you a limit player who understands combinatorics and post flop play? Then deeper is better. The rule of thumb is learn 100bb 6 max cash, but that doesn't mean short stacking full ring isn't also very profitable.
Joey Valentino short stacking is pointless you lose tons of money on Allin's I know people will say you loose less if loose but that's not how you should be thinking
but you can go all in on the flop and in some cases triple or quadruple up. also it makes me play tighter. last but not least it gives you more buy ins!
daniel, can u do a tip or video on playing heads up final table vs a better opponent that is owning you. Is it better to get it in with 40% equity when stacks are equal or play small ball and hope for the deck to hit you over the head?
hi neagreanu i am very proud and of your course i will ask you a question what is the best technique to improve my bankroll i have a hard time winning what is the best strategy i have a bankroll of 100 DOLLAR I play pokerstars,
I've been playing poker seriously for well over 50 years and for money 40+ years. Here are the stipulations: Live limit cash games only...no tournaments, no online play. I prefer $10/$20 games and would be quite happy with a $5/$10 limit game. Unfortunately for me, such games are not available to me in my geographic region. I can't even get a decent, honest no limit game. What L'Auberge casino calls "no limit' is actually a lie...there is a limit. Anyway, to be competitive you need at least 100 big blinds as a routine buy in. You need an overall bankroll of 1000 big blinds to handle those 2-3 week losing streaks that you will eventually find yourself in the middle of. I routinely play a fraudulently defined $1/$3 No Limit game because nothing else is available. So it's quite different trying to provide a "no limit" buy in or bankroll amount. I would suggest that you look at your casino's maximum buy in (in my case $500) and multiply that by the number of days per week that you actually buy in for (5 days or $2500/week). My longest losing streak ever was right at 30 days giving me a necessary bankroll of $10,000, but this number is largely dependent on how you manage your bankroll.
For 1-2 NL try to win a couple of, slightly better than small, pots per dealer. This is a good pace to average 20 BB’s an hour, which gets you to about $300 in 8 hours. My bankroll kept getting slaughtered until I got more disciplined and could fold big pairs on the River. My bankroll also stayed healthy and got better when I started to spot Players doing some shady sh#t at the table. Don’t buy in for max, instead go for 40-50% until you acclimate to the table dynamics. Win 4 sessions, then add 10% to your buy ins, and repeat.
Question for Mr. Little or anyone from the poker community. I am started to build a decent cash bankroll from my home games. Is it safe to deposit in a bank? Are they going to be suspicious of depositing 1-2k cash a few times a month? I just don’t feel safe keeping all this money at home, but I also don’t want the IRS involved. Any advice?
at what stakes cash game do players make moves. since we all agree 1/2is a joke. i wonder how many people start with "good bankroll advice" we all gotta start our roll somewhere unless using liferoll to get started ?
LuckySlydog I would say no. Simply Because if everyone at the table isn't straddling every hand then players who do not straddle have an edge. They're essentially making the pots bigger pre, so just tighten up and wait for spots where you can 3 and 4 bet to just steal preflop
Ive bout in for 120 and cash out for at least 450 over the last 3 weeks. I was previously buying in at 200, and losing or cashing out for 100, so food for thought.
Just keep track of your balance. Sometimes i am up by the end of the month and i test the higher stakes but so far i got wiped out so then i have to start fresh grinding it from the bottom w $100.
Daniel Negreanu!-I Watch-All Of Your Games&The Other Poker Pros-Also&I've Learned-Alot!&Thanks!-Raymond "Mike" Hong!&(I Love-CASH GAMES-Only!&I've Won!-14 Games-Total!-Including-One-No Limit Texas Holdem-"The Cadillac Of Poker"!-Mike!)&(Daniel!-I Always-Use-A CARD PROTECTORS!-Except-POKER-PRO Computer Poker Tables!-No Cards-Just A Glass-Screens!-Mike!)😎👍!!!!!!!!!
I have a question Daniel? Planning on coming down for WSOP this years with about 5K? What types of events should I target (Satellite?, Low Buy Tournaments 1K?, 2K?,) And Satellite meaning getting into Bigger Tournaments?
lol this is like what they say with stock investing, if your not comfortable with losing all this then don't risk it. If you got 5K, and you lose it and your okay with it, then you got what it takes
Daniel may be a phonominal poker player but even for someone who can make money playing poker this is possibly the worst financial advice I've ever seen
30K minimum (20 full buy ins) depending on your skill level...and the skill level of opponents, obviously. Really depends on how good you are at reading players and table reads, etc. If you haven't played at this level yet, I'd bump it to at least 40-50k for your learning curve. Good luck!
Hey Daniel you are my favorite póker player, I'd like to become a PRO player, I've played and won some tournaments in my city but I want to take the next step (wich I dont what it is). Can you give me some advice please???
A winning, successful poker player will usually have very bad advice on building bankroll for poker as they are winning players and their bankroll is built by playing more poker.
Hi Daniel. I'm a 18 year old from singapore and I'm interested to become a poker career in the future. Any advice? By the way, I love the way you play poker man. I have watched all your amazing reads and hands that you have played.
Only thing I will say there is no way to be a successful live tournament player because not enough tournaments without traveling and even if there was let's say your roi was 50%. On a 1600 buy in which takes 3-4 days you will make about $200 a day or $73000 a year if you could play a tournament every day. You would make more playing 1-3 cash. (Not counting super high rollers but if you have millions to blow you don't need bank roll management tips)
It took me almost three years, and a lot of calculated risk, but I finally reached my goal of $1,000,000 selling methamphetamines. I thought 5,000 buy ins would be a good conservative cushion for 1/2 NL. I should have known that was foolish. I'm very disappointed to hear I am $1,199,000,000 from what I really need to give up the street grind and take up the sweet simpler life of poker, but I will not give into despair. I will just have to work that much harder. Thank you Daniel. This was extremely helpful.
horsefly34 😂😂😂
upswing drougy polker
I laughed so hard when I read , 'selling methamphetamine'
That is hilarious.
How do they come up with this ish 🤣
If you need to "liquidate assets" to play cards, you have bigger issues than determining a bankroll lol
MRrcmaniacracing u have to have the balls and heart if u want to make it to a certain level u clearly don't
I play for fun
This is so true... If you borrow money to gamble, you have a problem and also are not using the correct bankroll management.
Professional poker players looks at this not like on the gamble, but more like "business". And sometimes u get bankrupt. But you know, where u were, and know, how to get back to that level, therefore u can afford to ask for another "starting capital". Even Daniel broke few times, that should not stop you for playing if u are not a recreational player
No, staking is fine, but if you have to borrow money cause you went bust, you're not managing your money correctly IMO.
I started my roll with a small loan of a million from my father.
Bobby Manna is that you Donald
Bobby Manna the thing is most People would be broke in a few years after a small loan of a million dollars..... some people are better than that and can multiply it
crunch9876 exactly if it was that easy to turn a million into 5-10 billion everyone would be at the bank taking out a loan!!!
it is pretty easy....buy bitcoins
Harmandeep Chatha hows that looking these days 😂
basically, don't ever ask daniel what is a good bankroll
basically, don’t ever play poker
Hater
Thank you Daniel! Always great advice. I'mma go grab that 1.2 billion dollars right now and start playing some 1 cent / 2 scent.
"You're going broke, because they're better than you." Sadly, most people don't realize this fact until after they're broke.
"If you can't spot the sucker in your half hour at the poker table, then you *ARE* the sucker." -- "Mike McDermott" from "Rounders"
rounders is the best poker movie! ;)
this one originally told by phill hellmuth
I won't quit until I find eight bigger suckers than me!😁
Facts
We need a "Shark Tank" for poker. Next into the tank is Tom Dwaun, looking for a 15 million dollar investment to run big bluffs. Next is Mike Mattosow seeking a 65 dollar investment for a sit n go
"You greedy pigs" Kevin O'Leary
OMG 😂😂😂
I like how you bring up the important questions like skill level and willingness to gamble. So much better than saying you need x amount of dollars for a certain stake
x amount of dollars calculated from edge, standard deviation, and risk of ruin. It is a simple formula, and those are the variables. Google a bankroll calculator online
I only have 1.1 billion right now. I can't wait to hit 1.2 so I can feel comfortable playing 1/2 NL.
Is that 1.2 billion in big bills or does it matter?
On my way to the ATM. Thanks bro
I have the 1.2 billion in $5 and $10 but I don't have enough suitcases and don't want to pay for a cash carrier/bodyguard
Here is Daniel Negreanu's Film - Kidpoker (Produced by NetFliX) - 720HD Complete
Wach here ==> cut-urls.com/xtauh
Resume : "To avoid Criticism say nothing, do nothing, be nothing."
Have fun ;)
so what we're saying is all I need to become a professional poker player is a small loan of 1.2 billion dollars?
1.2 billion, you just scared off all of the losers Daniel, lol
step one: Save 1.2 billion
step two: Poker Pro
Bankroll rules are more about swings than number of buy ins. If you swing 2-3 buy ins every day then 30-40 is enough. If you swing 10bi a day then you need more like a 100 so 3 bad days in a row doesn't wipe out most of your roll. Another thing to do is to play lower during the day when the games suck and then take those winnings up to the next limit in the evening when all the fish show up. Then if you only lose what you won during the day you'll never have a losing day.
dude what the f are you talking about? It has nothing to do with per day, if you only play 2-3 buy ins a day that's all you go through. I'm not going to bother explaining everything because this was 6 years ago
My bankroll does even better when the rake is higher, like at Pokerstars. Another big boost to your bankroll is playing tons of hands, hoping to get SuperNova Elite, only to have it taken away at the end of the year. Thanks Daniel!
bacardibum more rake is better for the players.
95% of online players:
- deposit
- play with 100% of your bankroll
- cop a bad beat
- think it's rigged
Got 1.1 billion atm so I guess I'll stay at $0.50/$1
good idea
But remember to buy in for the minimum.
Well I mostly play drunk and my bankroll is $20. What would you suggest in this situation for your future poker-yonce? :)
Do I just buy $20 worth of beer and watch WSOP on TH-cam? Prolly the best option.
Put it all in a PLO tournament. If you're going to get lucky, you might as well win big when you do
Happy M play a $20 mtt once a week then your reward is huge if loose it's a few beers.
A small loan from your parents of $1,199,999,980 should set you on your way.
Pro live cash game player here. The real optimal amount to have for a cash roll is dependent on your standard deviation. I play a laggy style with a high standard deviation and fairly regularly have 10-15 BI swings. I have TAG buddies that rarely have swings bigger than 5 BI's. I prefer to have 4000 big blinds at the stake I'm playing while a TAG player could get away with having 1500 or 2000. This is for playing full time.
You're the GOAT Danny!!!
I always laugh at gamblers that say "you just need to win this much of a bank roll". I knew an old man at the track that used to say "I first win $100 then I just gamble with house money". And I was like "if you can determine when you win, why not just keep winning?". And I'm not sure I'm comfortable with a Poker "pro" telling me how much money I need to bring to gamble. "Bring $40,000...and come sit at my table".
2:00 SRY DANIEL but your answer is horrible on this one with all my respect on you! If you are a cash player 20 buy ins ESPECIALLY for a beginner player is a total disaster! Loosing session + bad beats + tilt = can sost 5 buy ins in just ONE ONLINE SESSION!
After 7 years of online cash game grinding here is my personal viewr:
1) each session i invest NO MORE than 3% of my total bankroll
2) one time/hand limited session each day (lets say 200 hands or 2 hours session)
3) no refills are allowed! do not ever refill again! Its a bad habit!
4)if you double up you have two choices: a) move to the next level table OR b) LEAVE THE TABLE NOW and enjoy your winnings with a nice glass of wine
dum dum
and how far has that got you?
I'm not a poker player that plays a lot but I been in discussions about how much should your bankroll be when playing in a tournament. In my opinion, it really doesn't matter. Whether you're playing in a $50.00 game vs a $1000.00 game, your play shouldn't differ. If it does, then you are letting your bankroll determine how you play.
Does anyone agree or disagree with me?
As a former risk management professional, think of poker as part of a personal asset allocation. For an amateur it is unlikely that a poker bankroll represents a significant percentage of personal net worth, so the risk of ruin can be relatively high. If you go bust, reload.
For a pro, think of the poker pro as a small business owner who has possibly invested his life savings in his business. You want to maximize earnings subject to a very low risk of ruin. The goal is to maximize earnings; the risk of ruin is a constraint. Playing drunk HU vs. Phil Ivey, $1.2 billion is the WORST possible bankroll you can have, because it maximizes your loss. The best bankroll is $100 with no reload. At that investment you get to say you played HU against Phil Ivey, and you minimize your loss. I would pay $200 to play with Daniel.
Jay Onem what an awful, pointless comment. Lmao
The excitement of seeing a new D Neg vid in your sub-box
First things first, I need to rob a bank...
And not get caught
1.2 billion, not “a” bank
Good on you for giving honest, responsible advice. You could easily go with some ‘follow your dreams’ bullshit and avoid the harsh realities of attempting to become a professional poker player. Bully to you- Kr Negreanu
As a rule of thumb from what I've read - it should be around 300 times per BB, or 150 per BB for tournaments (it could be more). I like the buy-ins theory. I play 1-3 (3-300 Spread) and I have about 5k save against it. However, I had to revisit the Why quit poker because I wasn't playing my best and it cost me. :(
Ok how about this. How do you feed your bankroll? I use to do a 33/66% profit split, bankroll/personal money. But I moved to a 50/50% split. Let me give you an example: To build a bankroll I used to buy in with what money I can afford from my monthly paycheck. So lets say your playing an 11 man £10 tournament with winner take all and you win that £110. I put £10 back from I sourced it from (personal to start with but bankroll once u have one) and then £50 goes to my bankroll and £50 to my personal money. Bare in mind I would change that split percentage if I ever made enough to go pro or could afford playing higher limits.
Thx 4 valuable info. U have wonderful TH-cams that are easy to understand, but that jarring noise at the end spoils everything!
if there are no other factors involved. what is the minumum #of big blinds we should join a cash game with
so for instance you could say ok you should have more than 20 because otherwise you could very often lose a couple hands and then you are suddenly a short stack or you can say that 30 is not enough because you can't bluff or value bet as efficiently as you would want to under normal circumstance
this question is asking the minumum bankroll that we should play with. i also wonder this because for instance i played 1-2 blinds nl in vegas, buyin was 100-300 and 100 seems a bit low bc you can become a short stack quickly.
so ideally how many big blinds should we have to be able to play poker under normal circumstance
Deniz Demir 50 bb's. 1/2nl=$100
2/5nl=$500
I usually play 2/5 and buy in for 800. If you're playing 1/2, I highly recommend buying in for atleast 200. Most of the time in the 1/2 games, people don't base their raises on blinds. If they have a good hand they'll usually bump it up to 10 or 15. You really want/need to be deep enough to comfortably make a 3-bet without being all in, or almost all in. When you're not playing deep, it kinda takes the skill and the fun out of it! Because almost every hand that you play, you're gonna be all in!!! Plus, other players will try to push you around, but that's not always a bad thing! Those are usually the guys that will double you up!!!! I don't like big pots,,,,,, unless I have the absolute nuts!!!!! That doesn't happen very often. I like to play pot control, and this might sound strange, but it's easier to keep the pots small if you have a respectable stack. Buy in big, play small ball unless you absolutely have it, and play really smart! If you have a bad feeling, or you're not sure, FOLD IT!!!!! Get them later on! Find a better spot!!!! Having a good fold game is just as important as having a great call game!!!!! And if it makes you uncomfortable playing with that much money, leave!!!! Go home, save up, and go back when you have money that effects nothing in your life! It's meant for one thing only, poker!!!!!
Does this mean I need a $1.2trillion bankroll to play $0.01/$0.02?
love these Videos. time to rock the poker tourny with my 50 dollar bank roll
Difference between online & live, live games are softer = less amount of buy ins needed. But I would say 100 Buy Ins for tournaments, 40 for cash.
Started 1/2 cash at 1k br $200 buy ins. Haven't gone broke yet, $14 an hour for 200 hours. It can be done w a small roll, gotta be focused tho. Gl ppl
Connor Hughes you should coach the world bro you sound like the 6th best on the world spinning 5 buys to 15 bro thats the sickest thing ive ever ever heard in poker bro absolutly sick mate out of control...you ever thought of writing a poker cash game book?? you could call it "5 buy ins to 20 how to beat poker big in a month" wait till that run bad kicks in mate you will be selling that iphone quickly...lmfao
I dont think my results are any good. Just showing decent results from an average player
Connor Hughes focused dont help when you get 2 outered on the river buddy 5 buy ins trying to be a cash game pro is the same as having $2mill in your account and buying in to the $1 mill one drop....yes you can get lucky and play well and run good and run up 5 buy ins to any amount its not impossible just suicidal espeically at live poker i play £2-£5 deep 2-3 times a week live and 3 days online on mtts for the £2-£5 i have 40 buy ins as the games swingy and i feel unsafe...
Building a bankroll up from 5 buyins can be done, but it requires, that you hit an upswing, before you hit a downswing. If you try this 100 times with the same skill, the same game etc., you will go broke maybe 25, 50 or even 75 times. And you are not even quite out of the woods yet, since a 20 buyin downswing is absolutly possible in cash game poker.
But lets be realistic now. If you play 1/2 cash, you are not making a living from poker or planning to do so anytime soon. You have a day job, so poker should be considered a hobby, and if you lose the 1.000 $, you just need to take a break, until you have saved up another 1.000 $ from your salary. And as long as this will not knock you out mentally, there is nothing wrong with starting up with a small bankroll.
fundiver198 yes I'm playing as a hobby. Yes I experience bad beats. No I don't feel stressed bc I have a small bankroll. I feel I am one of the best players at the table of a 1/2 table at all times. The guy above me is obviously not very good.
looking younger as you're getting older, keep it up dnegs
Good advice. 50 buy ins for tournaments seems about right. Probably less if you're starting in low stakes or micro stakes where the average player is considerably worse. Assuming you are good and have put in considerable time reading/studying poker books.
noooo he literally said that was cutting it close. The average tournament you want 200 buy ins, 100 on the lower end
Most people do not play with a designated poker bankroll. They either take from other income to play poker sometimes, or they are playing poker to pay their bills, and so their bankroll will go up and down with their expenses, just like their results. Fact is, if your gonna try to derive income from poker, you better be well-studied and very good, and you better be humble enough to find games you can actually beat.
Facts. Speaking from experience, if you are playing with your "need to live" money, ie bills, rent, expenses...it's hard way to be successful in poker. Set aside a completely separate poker bankroll which you will use ONLY for poker. This bankroll will determine what stakes you should play at. You can add money to it, if you are able to, each month, but you can't take any out for bills, rent, etc. Keep detailed records of your win/loss, stakes, etc. Over time you will get a clear picture if you can be successful at this.
I played a tournament the other day and folded jjs in the SB a couple of times then finally picked up K4 off jammed and got snapped by kks where did I go wrong Daniel?
marko SRB you shoved K4....
I like Daniel always tells the truth. A piece of advice for the poker world from myself who has made chunks of money playing poker. The best way to build a bankroll is to spend 1 year playing tournaments and save all the money won from those and then in the second year use that bankroll to play cash games the following year. If you go broke that year then just repeat the process!! :-D always remember the pyramids wasn't built in one day, patience is everything!! gl
Karim Benali oh that's what I was doing wrong thank bruh
marko SRB Well in case maybe your just not good enough to win, in that case just give up!
Shouldn't you play JUST the tournaments if that's where you're making money, then?
Vitor HdAR Yes you could but depends on the value. I only play the big tournaments where there is a lot of value I.e amateur players and fun players giving it a go because first place is a lot of money. If you can play tournaments every week were the final table money is big and the players in the tournaments are amateur players looking to get lucky than yes stick to those. But you will find that those kind of tournaments only happen a few times a year. I'm from London and in April there is a £5k buy in event and 1st place is GTD £1m, however there is satellites into the tournament from only £22 - £500 so you can imagine the types of players that are going to be playing. When sitting at a table in a comp like that believe you me I'm going to be asking the players who bought in directly or who won a seat!!!
THis apply's if your good. but we all are suckers
Hiya Daniel, I've learned to build my own bank roll through stars while juggling a job and college. I've deposited 20 dollars and I've tried to build it up from there. Since doing so any tourney I've won more than 40 dollars I've cashed out half and kept half in. And I've built up a good bankroll using this system. What I want to know is do you think this is a good system and if not do you think there is a better adjustment to the system
Duncan Macintyre cmon duncan your asking a man with a trillion dollas a 35c bankroll question when you seem like a smart guy....you should know the answere ffs!! of course its a good stratagy as you depositing small..ive burned thru loads of rolls playing mtts as the varience in the medium stakes + is crazy on stars hence why if you cannot play cash you will NEVER survive in poker! online or live.
A good bankrool (from a grinders view) is one that lets you play the stakes you fell confortable but also high enough to give you an aceptable win rate to cover your expenses.
Loving these videos Daniel! Do you have a schedule of when/what you upload?
Yea br is you're lifeline. of course sometimes things happen and you can lose your roll. it happens. but for it to happen time after time,maybe poker isn't for you.I understand the ups and downs in poker, and i understand poker isn't for everybody.I think some ppl get wrapped up and let their ego's get involved when it doesn't need to.Poker is full of beats and takedowns.You have to be mentally strong and a game plan is a big plus.
I think a lot of the old timers(Ivey, Matusow, and Antonius) and even some of the young guns didn't stress too much on BR management while starting out. That's what made them successful.
I don't prefer playing cash games I tend to lose money then, but really like playing tournaments. Is that okay?
It‘s like with the stockmarket: Play with money you don’t need elsewise.
So many young people dream of being a pro. Forget it and leave it to those few who are the full package of what it takes. Us others should consider our losses as the price for our entertainment.
That would be 20 max buy ins if you're full time right? If you can supplement your roll with another job to help with downswings then 20 seems high to me but maybe I'm just wrong.
This in my opinion was not good advice. The 20 buy ins "full" rule is very good, but you need to be willing to drop down in stakes if you are not running well. I have been playing full time for 4 years and have never had a down swing for more than 12 buy ins, so maybe I run well or maybe i'm solid, but going broke could happen to any one. Now that i'm flush I have a very low chance of risk of ruin. You want to get out of 1/2 NL as fast as possible. The rake is just too high to make it worth your time. Once you acquire a 20k bankroll you want to be playing 2/5. At 2/5 the rake isn't as big as a factor, and you can have some really good 2k+ nights once in a while. It took me about 1.5 years to get out of 1/2 NL but it is possible. Once you reach this stake you want to diversify your assets into other things like stock market - equities and other assets - so you aren't only in just poker. This is assuming you are beating 2/5 but I wouldn't move up in stakes until you have a solid foundation of dividend income because some of the 5/10 players are really good.
It seems counter intuitive to me to buy in for close to the table minimum. You wouldn't be able to stack people with your best hands, and if you use the all in bluff as a strategy you wouldn't have as much fold equity.
no, with table minimum you can call all in or bluffs, and if it's cooler, you don't lose much.
Also when you double up quit table, and repeat again
This decision should be based on how you view your edge more than your bankroll size. Are you a tournament player switching to cash who's knowledgeable about pot odds and equity? Then short stacking will be more profitable. Are you a limit player who understands combinatorics and post flop play? Then deeper is better. The rule of thumb is learn 100bb 6 max cash, but that doesn't mean short stacking full ring isn't also very profitable.
Joey Valentino short stacking is pointless you lose tons of money on Allin's I know people will say you loose less if loose but that's not how you should be thinking
your all in bluff wont have as much fold equity? Ya probably not but when you do get called you risk half of what you would have on a full stack.
but you can go all in on the flop and in some cases triple or quadruple up. also it makes me play tighter. last but not least it gives you more buy ins!
The 1.2 billion had me crying laughing
daniel, can u do a tip or video on playing heads up final table vs a better opponent that is owning you. Is it better to get it in with 40% equity when stacks are equal or play small ball and hope for the deck to hit you over the head?
hi neagreanu
i am very proud and of your course i will ask you a question what is the best technique to improve my bankroll i have a hard time winning what is the best strategy i have a bankroll of 100 DOLLAR I play pokerstars,
Zouhra Arabe wow, 100? USD? That's a lot of money bruh!!
Thank you very much for the great advice .
I've been playing poker seriously for well over 50 years and for money 40+ years. Here are the stipulations: Live limit cash games only...no tournaments, no online play. I prefer $10/$20 games and would be quite happy with a $5/$10 limit game. Unfortunately for me, such games are not available to me in my geographic region. I can't even get a decent, honest no limit game. What L'Auberge casino calls "no limit' is actually a lie...there is a limit.
Anyway, to be competitive you need at least 100 big blinds as a routine buy in. You need an overall bankroll of 1000 big blinds to handle those 2-3 week losing streaks that you will eventually find yourself in the middle of.
I routinely play a fraudulently defined $1/$3 No Limit game because nothing else is available. So it's quite different trying to provide a "no limit" buy in or bankroll amount. I would suggest that you look at your casino's maximum buy in (in my case $500) and multiply that by the number of days per week that you actually buy in for (5 days or $2500/week). My longest losing streak ever was right at 30 days giving me a necessary bankroll of $10,000, but this number is largely dependent on how you manage your bankroll.
I like how Daniel said Ivey and not Hellmuth :)
For 1-2 NL try to win a couple of, slightly better than small, pots per dealer. This is a good pace to average 20 BB’s an hour, which gets you to about $300 in 8 hours. My bankroll kept getting slaughtered until I got more disciplined and could fold big pairs on the River. My bankroll also stayed healthy and got better when I started to spot Players doing some shady sh#t at the table. Don’t buy in for max, instead go for 40-50% until you acclimate to the table dynamics. Win 4 sessions, then add 10% to your buy ins, and repeat.
Would you suggest a payday loan to start my poker career?
RedneckRectum yes also find a loan shark, that combo is perfect.
At 200% interest, I would call a payday loan and a loan shark the same thing.
Joe Lazar I've seen over 1000% before 😂
bill gates plays 1/2 nlhe
haha
How did you come up with .2?I Am litlle concerned I don't have that much
Question for Mr. Little or anyone from the poker community.
I am started to build a decent cash bankroll from my home games.
Is it safe to deposit in a bank? Are they going to be suspicious of depositing 1-2k cash a few times a month?
I just don’t feel safe keeping all this money at home, but I also don’t want the IRS involved.
Any advice?
Get a Tibetan mastiff. Problem solved!
was loving the advice until dan shot me down with a 12 guage right at the end 😂😂😂
What's the reason you'd buy in for minimum if you had 20 buyins?
at what stakes cash game do players make moves. since we all agree 1/2is a joke. i wonder how many people start with "good bankroll advice" we all gotta start our roll somewhere unless using liferoll to get started ?
"Play drunk" jajajajaja
this video just inspired me to be a poker coach LMFAO brilliant
Jack Williams ask doug polk if you need any advice on coaching hes the best in the world (so he says!)
Andrew Oneill LMFAO brilliant
In a 1/2 nl game where the regs always button straddle to 5, doesn't that essentially make it a 2/5 game? Thus increasing your BR requirements.
LuckySlydog I would say no. Simply Because if everyone at the table isn't straddling every hand then players who do not straddle have an edge. They're essentially making the pots bigger pre, so just tighten up and wait for spots where you can 3 and 4 bet to just steal preflop
Travis Versace 3 and 4 bets are RARE in 1,2 games . they usually push you all in and 5 people call, it's crazy.
This is where table selection comes into play. Move to a table where they aren't doing that.
My table minimum for 1-2 is 40 dollars though
Ive bout in for 120 and cash out for at least 450 over the last 3 weeks. I was previously buying in at 200, and losing or cashing out for 100, so food for thought.
Just keep track of your balance. Sometimes i am up by the end of the month and i test the higher stakes but so far i got wiped out so then i have to start fresh grinding it from the bottom w $100.
Daniel Negreanu!-I Watch-All Of Your Games&The Other Poker Pros-Also&I've Learned-Alot!&Thanks!-Raymond "Mike" Hong!&(I Love-CASH GAMES-Only!&I've Won!-14 Games-Total!-Including-One-No Limit Texas Holdem-"The Cadillac Of Poker"!-Mike!)&(Daniel!-I Always-Use-A CARD PROTECTORS!-Except-POKER-PRO Computer Poker Tables!-No Cards-Just A Glass-Screens!-Mike!)😎👍!!!!!!!!!
Holy shit. Daniel Negreanu in 4k HD Quality (never seen this quality setting before on youtube xD).
That is soO going to be my first question and catch him for a photo during break!
Can you do a video on who your hair plug guy is?
I have a question Daniel? Planning on coming down for WSOP this years with about 5K? What types of events should I target (Satellite?, Low Buy Tournaments 1K?, 2K?,) And Satellite meaning getting into Bigger Tournaments?
Did you play in the events that year?
great videos Daniel, thanks :)
Did Daniel have hair transplant? Looks great
Well said
Very interesting thank you
Finally an actual answer.....now all I have to do is start saving...then here I come Phil Ivey
lol this is like what they say with stock investing, if your not comfortable with losing all this then don't risk it. If you got 5K, and you lose it and your okay with it, then you got what it takes
If you have a job you like, all you need is one min buy-in. Good Luck!
It was not the answer I wanted but the answer I needed
Daniel may be a phonominal poker player but even for someone who can make money playing poker this is possibly the worst financial advice I've ever seen
What is a good bank roll for 5-10 NL with 500 to 1500 max buy in Daniel? Thank you
30K minimum (20 full buy ins) depending on your skill level...and the skill level of opponents, obviously. Really depends on how good you are at reading players and table reads, etc. If you haven't played at this level yet, I'd bump it to at least 40-50k for your learning curve. Good luck!
Hey Daniel you are my favorite póker player, I'd like to become a PRO player, I've played and won some tournaments in my city but I want to take the next step (wich I dont what it is). Can you give me some advice please???
What did you do?
Well there you go.
Mister Daniel I believe 500 to 1 minium is the ratio to play against the sharks .
1.2 billion?
No problem man. That's pocket change.
Signed: US Congress
More rake is better tho, right dan?
how many buyins would If I want to stay alive in online tournaments?
ha ha ha ..I like your vlog . you are one of the best poker player and also a very funny one !
One with a lot of rake!
Rec player - 10 buy ins at your level is optimal because more than that is wasted capital
Well shit. I only have $1.1B Daniel. Thanks for dashing my dreams.
Despre ce bankroll vorbești? În română nu știi?
YO I love you guy.. but buy a microphone man!
i have 500 dollars on stars account what buy in you recomend daniel on torneys because i like torneys??
2,5$
A winning, successful poker player will usually have very bad advice on building bankroll for poker as they are winning players and their bankroll is built by playing more poker.
Always a jokester....
There's always one at the limit table!
Hi Daniel. I'm a 18 year old from singapore and I'm interested to become a poker career in the future. Any advice? By the way, I love the way you play poker man. I have watched all your amazing reads and hands that you have played.
god daniel is such a cool dude :D
Only thing I will say there is no way to be a successful live tournament player because not enough tournaments without traveling and even if there was let's say your roi was 50%. On a 1600 buy in which takes 3-4 days you will make about $200 a day or $73000 a year if you could play a tournament every day. You would make more playing 1-3 cash. (Not counting super high rollers but if you have millions to blow you don't need bank roll management tips)