I'm honestly surprised someone hasn't made an updated version of the Epson R-D1. It was such a unique experience and the design is perfect for people longing for an analog-meets-digital camera.
R-D1 is built on a real film camera that was solidly engineered by a company that built many other manufacturers "oem" bodies. To prime the shutter you have to cock with the film wind on lever. Ie one is built on an analog camera using a well known and regarded film range finder, the other is a built from scratch to an evolving vision (this is V2) which might be losing a lot of the historical camera DNA that didn't make it into the final vision. That's why this is V2. I'm glad they have an update path built in the program, but the Bessa used for the R-D1 was very mature already. This makes the pixii NOT an updated version of the Epson which was analog camera with digital media, but the pixii is mostly a digital creature and fundamentally different, even if they both take pictures and focus manually. The experience is [very] different.
They are losing customers over the card slot thing. I would not buy this camera and I have the money to buy it, and the m lenses to use with it. That decision makes an already niche camera even moreso.
@@jw48335also the relatively small number of framelines and the APSC crop most people's existing set of lenses completely different focal lengths. Cool idea that needs refinement
😂 card or integrated mem... You are concentrating on superficial technical stuff, instead of creating. If that's what makes you choose a camera, than it's not art that you wanna make, but indulge your sense of owning specs... I love the idea of integrated memory and I have only used as cards and many have failed. I agree that both options would be nice, but it's far from important thing in life
@@windvI own cameras going back to 1946. I'm not buying a $3k luxury camera with a built-in death sentence. This is exactly the type of camera where these details matter. If I just cared about "art" I would never be looking at this camera.
For $3000, it should really have a full frame sensor. From what I gather it is a crop sensor. For anybody looking for a tactile quirky compact interchangeable lens camera, I highly recommend looking into a Sigma fp or fp-L. The kind of people that this camera is aimed at are also interested in vintage lenses, which work how they were meant to when used with a full frame camera. (The image sensor being the same size that 35mm film used to be.
Couldn't agree more! if it's full frame, it's a half-price M10/M11, It would be so competitive, making them the true budget Leica M. I can use my M lenses and get the full experience. But only crop? I don't know... for that price I rather get a Leica CL, which I can get L glasses and also adapt M lens, more options. plus CL has a screen...(Ultimately I want to take pictures with it, not just look cool with it, and having a screen makes it so much easier). They market it as it's competing with M10/11, but it's more like competing with the CL. which for me, for the price I rather get a CL(at least it's a Leica.....)
@@snappiness I have owned the FP-L for over a year and I love it. I customized it with a wood grip, I have a small collection of prime lenses. It has really motivated me to take my photography to the next level. It's been around for a while and I'm pretty sure its still the smallest body with a full fame 61mp sensor.
Given the chonk of the body I assumed it was FF. But yeah, you are right its APSC! Nothing wrong with that but like you say for the price and for the use case it seems like a bit of an own goal.
@@JimIBobIJones I think the sensor size may be influenced by the electronic shutter performance. Too big a sensor increases the rolling shutter distortion. It can happen at APSC but rarely.
To me that’s big time CEO speak that does the thing I’ve seen as I’ve worked in the tech industry for 15 years. It doesn’t actually address the question/concern but focuses on the benefit of the choice they as a company have made. Like what ACTUALLY happens if this gets bricked? Can you send it in for a memory recovery fix? Is there a viable warranty that states its real world cycles number? Does the he partition off a portion for recovery mode options? No concrete answer just a “we believe internal HD is a more robust solution that has a lower likelihood of failure so we went that route”
Yeah it is completely unreasonable of them to assume that someone who buys a camera for this amount of money won't have a fast enough SD card for it. Besides that, replacing an SD card slot on a device is trivially easy and cheap so I assume that's why they do it; to milk you of an extra couple hundred bucks in case this thing fails for some reason. Also, the way they dodged the question is very dishonest and Apple-esque. #righttorepair
Yeah his reasoning is complete bs. How is something that bricks the camera when it fails “more reliable.” At least when my sd cards die I can just swap it instantly. Not to mention I also have redundancy with a 2nd sd card. Imagine telling a client that all their photos might be gone and that you have to send the camera in before you can keep shooting.. “Can you do your wedding again in 2 months so I can shoot it completely?”
I was looking for this. Kinda sus to me, he answered it like real politician. And the consumer are tied up with the maintenance scheme, uh, "upgrade" scheme. 4:18
Even with swapable storage like SD cards, the camera is still going to have internal storage for the camera's operating system, and probably some space for buffering (or is that done purely in RAM in most cameras? I kinda doubt it). So you still have that internal storage that does get a bunch of read and writes and could fail and brick the camera. So your argument is that making that internal storage bigger and using it to read/write DNGs is going to make it much more likely to fail. I don't buy that argument, personally. Sounds like FUD. The concerns about warranty and repairs with a small startup are super valid, but then it's just buyer beware. If you can't take that risk, do go with a large established brand with a good repair program.
I'm not a fan of built in storage, it's awful from a usability and repairability standpoint. In order to replace the memory, you must disassemble and replace either the main board, or a daughter board. This board likely has more components than just memory, so you end up replacing working parts so the board is going to have to cost more. It'll be expensive for the parts and having to mail it in and have them do it for you. How do you get the pictures off the device? Do you do this by plugging in a usb port? USB ports also have a rated lifetime, so this will increase the strain on it if that's the only way to copy your photos off. If it's via Wi-FI, that will drain your battery and be fairly slow and incompatible with some peoples workflows. This also introduces a new problem in the field if you fill your memory since you can't just put a new card in, so you have to copy all your photos off to another device, then clear the memory before you can begin shooting again. I also don't think the write speed performance increase is necessary for this style of camera, the main advantages for that are in video, outside of that it would be in being able to flush the memory buffer at a higher rate when using a burst mode. So if you held a burst shot until the memory buffer is filled, the write speed would allow it to flush to storage quicker, and theoretically allow higher sustained rates of frame capture. The main benefit for removing sd cards in phones was to eliminate the back panel and improve water resistance which I don't think is applicable here as I'm guessing there's a tray for a removable battery, and if not, yikes. In my experience, the SD card slot has never been a reliability problem for me, so this solution introduces more problems than it solves. I've gone through many sd cards to the point where they fail, but I also buy stacks of them at a time so I never run out. If the slot itself were to fail, I would feel a lot more confident repairing that myself than integrated storage.
As a technician I will say I have seen plenty of failed soldered SSDs. Soldering the storage on such a device is not a good idea for longevity. The camera is pretty cool, I just don’t think it’s a good idea because most consumers can’t replace the flash chip should the company go under.
During the past month I have had the opportunity to borrow the latest version of the Pixii, comparing it to the M10M/R's that own. The Pixii does have some unique selling points: price, upgradable, and the ability to create a RAW DNG in black and white, even though the sensor is a color sensor. And its shutter is very quiet - pleasingly so. But in every other tangible way it is a failure - its ergonomics are terrible. It is like holding a brick and no 3rd party accessories exist to rectify that. It's viewfinder is nowhere as good or clear as a Leica one. The lack of a memory slot makes it impractical for news and event, which is what I use my M10's for among other things. If the internal memory fills up, you need to stop and deal with that vs. just popping in a new memory slot. It is not a full sensor - so focal lengths are treated and behave differently due to the crop factor. Material fit and finish is nowhere near as nice as a Leica - and it is oddly delicate and cheap at the same time. And here's the biggest thing - what is Pixii's potential as a company and a brand with such a niche solution? It is certainly possible they can survive on selling hundreds / year, but it is equally possible they fail, whereas Leica is more likely to remain. So, that brings you back to price - in my opinion for a more superior experience with less risk, you are better of buying a gently used M10 of some variation than buying a new one of these. Better ergonomics, comparable material results, more accessories, memory cards, brighter viewfinder, less risk.
As the owner of several rangefinders like the Yashica Electro GSN, Canon Canonet QL17 GIII, and Minolta Hi-Matic F, I absolutely love that feel you described. I am surprised this is your first rangefinder. The Argus C3 is a classic one especially that has weathered the years nearly flawless and I recommend buying one for pure enjoyment. Kudos on joining into a new system from the ground up, sounds like that was one of the bigger appeals.
Minolta CLE, Yashica GT/GS/GTN/GSN user here, also others. I have to say, i do really *love* a real focus patch into the middle with two overlapping images, like the way it should be - whereas usually a other "cheap" rangefinders are just using a square or diamond patch, to align into place, whileas focusing your rangefinder.
@@SlashCampable It's inherently bad design. The camera is for rich people who enjoy expensive toys, like a dentist who shoots on leica. The internal flash memory WILL fail, and the customer has no idea who provides it and what is the terabytes written spec of it (how long it will last.)
@@SlashCampable Lol I just checked their website and see they're releasing a 4336 dollar full frame camera which STILL does not have a card slot. And the storage only goes up to 128gb (which will cost more than 4336 dollars.) Literally the smallest SD cards I own are 256 gigabytes, and they cost less than 20 dollars. OMG AND IT STILL USES MICRO USB, over 8 years after it was deprecated and replaced with USB C. On a 5000 dollar product, they are saving 50 cents of a connector on a 5000 dollar product. It's rare I feel this way but I kinda hope this company goes under, what a shit show. They hate their own customers.
I would love to try one of these, such a beauty. I recently picked up an Epson r-d1 and there is definitely a magic and charm to a camera thats digital but uses a rangefinder focus system.
@flagger2020 So far, I am impressed with the amount of thought behind the camera. When I received it, the dial on top that corresponded with battery life was very badly out of alignment to the point where it was useless for checking the remaining battery life. Luckily, there is an option in the settings to calibrate the needles on the dial. Now it's spot on. The highest focal lens Ive tried on it so far is a 35mm (53mm after crop factor) and even though the rangefinder base length is short I had no issue nailing focus at the same speed as other rangefinders I've tried. Other mechanics such as shutter and shutter winding lever are all pretty solid and seem reliable! As far as build quality, the only weak point really is the frameline selector is plastic and a tad flimsy. But im almost exclusively going to use the 35mm so not too bad for me.
I really admire pixii for their work on this camera. Personally, I can't bring myself to buy it. The fact that the pixii has a cropped sensor (I like my 28mm too much) and isn't compatible with several m-mount lenses I own is unfortunate.
I'll take a 32 bit APSC over 14bit full frame, all day every day. Theoretically i can do a very natural looking picture without blown out tones without putting the camera on a tripod and doing 5-7 stops of exposure.
@@mrfuzzy2954 You're confusing the processor bit and bit depth of the sensor. There exists no 32 bit sensor. The highest bit depth sensors now are those found in medium formats that go up to 16 bit. This sensor is literally the same cut/architecture as the a6700, X-T3/4, and a 1.5x crop of the A7R4/5 sensor. The marketing fluff from Pixii doesn't make sense at all cos it basically means the processor is capable of 64 bit processing. It *doesn't* improve image quality. Just like how chucking a i9 processor into the computer won't turn your photos into a higher quality one in Lightroom.
Idk an SD slot, at least for redundancy, makes the difference for cameras. Especially as the camera gets older, you can always buy new memory. Maybe next time Pixii, lots of good ideas here!
The internal storage being more performant is nice, except I doubt that users of the pixii will shoot at high framerates. getting it off of the camera is an argument, but i think when the failure rate of the embedded storage is being mentioned, yet the fact that when an sd card fails you can buy a new one. While it is nice that they have the upgradability stuff it still means you rely on pixii themselves to fix broken memory. if they ever go out of business and your memory fails? good luck. you're in an even tougher situation than dead memory formats. Don't get me wrong, I would love a proper rangefinder, unlike the fuji digital rangefinder found on the xpro1 (which i own and do like) but hearing the reasoning from the ceo just make me think i should just save up for a leica instead, or heck even try to put a sensor in a film camera. I wish them the best and hope they will make a camera that would tick my boxes eventually. but for now there is 0 chance i'd even consider them.
Sensor in a film camera? That's just about every earlier generation DSLR. The Canon 5D is a great place to start. As for Leica, I think their most compelling product is the SL line. Mirrorless makes all the difference. If you can do without the Leica branding, checkout the Panaonsic S.
@@RobertLeeAtYT I owned a 5D mk2 (loved it, gave it to a friend who wanted to go to school for photography) and i currently own a Panasonic S1, I recommend against the leica SL for the simple reason that it is the same camera as the S1, more expensive and on top of that there is a solid alternative for both the SL and the S1 that is the S5. That aside, all of those cameras are not rangefinder cameras. and i'm not pointing at rangefinder style, actual rangefinder cameras as shown in the video.
Coming from a hardware guy POV you are right. The internal storage claims are BS, it simply just makes them more money doing it this way, it's exclusively fueled by greed. We have seen it before in the tech industry, this is nothing new but company greed.
Damn, I feel the exact same way about my Sigma SD Quattro H - blew quite a lot of money on it - it's unpractical as f, autofocus doesn't really work so manual focus is the name of the game - I wouldn't recommend it to anyone looking for an averagely good camera - as a camera nerd though, this is by far the coolest cameras I've ever bought and I don't think I would ever sell it, the images are just beautiful Of course Sigma isn't exactly a small company where you can get the CEO on the horn, but looking at the number and philosophy of Sigma cameras I think it's fair to assume it's not super far!
@@matthewsisson1234 I was super fortunate to catch a pretty big error on MPB's part, otherwise I couldn't afford it either ! It was listed at 640€ as a regular SDQ, while the SDQH generally commands prices upwards of 1300€ as imports from japan. that being said, 640€ is still the most money I've ever dropped on a camera lol
I’ve had an M for over yrs, before that I had Fuji’s. I just love the fact that everything is manual. It’s your creation, even if it’s good shot or bad. You have to be aware of your settings at all times. Never shot a pixii, but maybe I’ll look at the used market.
This honestly feels like a really good niche alternative to owning a Leica. You get a hybrid experience of shooting both digital and film, all for half the price of an actual Leica.
Except for the fact that Leica has shown strong pro-consumer intent with things like their L mount while this camera gives strong anti-consumer vibes with its non-user-operatable integrated soldered memory.
@@PooMonkeyMan I know. But it is a status item. And a Leica doesn't offer anything unique for me although their mirrorless cameras look very capable. I feel rangefinder cameras limit my capability...inaccurate focusing and framing. Slow and very limited lens choices. (E.g. I use TSE and zoom lenses.) Even the old Sony A6000 with lowly 16-50 is very capable when images are processed via DXO. An old relatively inexpensive full frame A7R2 produces amazingly good results. Most improvenents in recent years are in AF, video and burst speed/duration. (Which matter very little to me.)
Kudos to pixii for providing the only affordable alternative to Leica's rangefinders. Would love to play with this camera, even though I wouldn't pay this much for a toy I might use for a couple of weeks :)
@@GabrielSykes I'd like to own this camera but it really isn't affordable enough for my wallet. Will keep using my X-E2 for my poor "leica-ish" experience.
Honestly, I’ve seen used M10s go for less than the Pixii, and you get both a rear LCD as well as the option of an EVF! And if you can deal with APS and the Russian sensor oxide roulette, M8s are quite cheap these days…
@@FPSakari I have an x-e1 is the x-e2 much better in handling do you know. It took me a while to figure out how to get it to impersonate P shift mode which might be fixed on the e2. The e2 is supposed to have better af than the e1, but for purer leica experience we are meant to switch to manual af and my xf lens are focus by wire, so do you use manual focus lenses via adapters and how's the experience?
The thing is that they should try CFE cards instead of SDs, they are more reliable and the slots are better, I don't see argument againts this idea in 2023. It's a bummer for anyone considering one professionally, they should listen and fix this concern, I want to own my camera, no being dependent on their upgradibility program or whatever idea they have.
All of what you say is true. And it is not a camera for everybody. It is a bit quirky. But, it has great color and image. Pixii has tuned the sensor well. I have one and have had it for a few years. I got the CPU upgrade when it was offered. I am happy with the camera. I will be trying the native RAW B&W. David Barth and his crew have a gem here. A special gem. Thanks for you great review.
Could you post examples of the supposedly true B&W RAW vs the colour RAW converted into B&W? Cos from what I understand, it seems impossible to reconstruct the true B&W values once light has already passed through the bayer filter. I wonder if anyone has a M11 Monochrome to shoot in APS-C mode vs the Pixii to test this out.
The only issue with this camera is the APS-C. I know pixii is very high-tech and boutique item but it still is too much for small sensor. Considering how niche this is, its most probable and realistic competitor will be used leica bodies such as M8, M9, M240. They are old and slow in every possible way compared to pixii, but target audience of pixii probably would not care about that kind of stuff at first place. Digital leicas from 00's-early 10's have much better viewfinder/rangefinder and better color output.
After taxes, it's almost the same price as a used M10, they need to add a proper mechanical shutter and a full frame sensor(not for IQ reasons, just so M lenses retain they're original focal length)
Yeah I totally agree, I would def consider this camera if it had a full frame sensor (so i can use the same M lenses i use on my sony and bessa) but id rather just wait a couple years and save up for a used leica at this price point
I just purchased a film rangefinder camera after having a Canon Canonet during my teens and 20s. I just got a 1958 Konica IIIA and this camera has an incredible viewfinder that is big and bright with frame lines that move. My Canon, made 20 years later didn't have a rangefinder/viewfinder nearly as good.
I have a Pixii and the Fujis, XPro 1, Xpro2, and XPRO3. I had and sold my X100V. I also have a Leica Q2 Monochrom. The Pixii is a really amazing and incredibly frustrating camera. As a camera, the experience is similar to film or the Leica M-D or M10-D. I agree that the appeal includes being part of a very small and innovative group of users. It can be frustrating with the development issues. Inconsistent white balance, freeze ups, etc. The problems seem to be reducing as new software updates become available. It certainly isn’t my main camera, not even my 2nd camera, but I am happy to have purchased it.
Wow--it's great to see innovation and it's very cool that you're supporting it! I'm especially intrigued by the Pixii's monochrome mode. After reading about it on their website it seems like an interesting alternative to just discarding the color information of an image...
You hit the nail on the head at the end. It's absolutely fine to enjoy the existence of products ... while also acknowledging they are not for you. People have a really, really hard time with this concept. We have options for a reason. Buy the one for you, let others do the same.
@@kalinmir I don't see how that relates to my point unless you somehow misunderstood me. My point is simply: people judge products based on their needs instead of the solution the product offers, and often extend that judgment all the way to those who choose such a product. A nonsense take that's made many photography communities very toxic.
@@SourPlanet I'd say that a need for ease of repair (regarding internal memory) is quite universal even beyond photography...It is true that saying that a particular camera is bad based on its general categorization is nonsense...but I don't see people having issue with that here
@@kalinmir I don't really know what people have issue with, as I tend to steer clear of comments these days. Self care lol. I'm just going by a particular thing he said in the video. But yes, you won't catch me buying a camera that relies on internal storage. I've had enough storage of all types bite the dust to know better.
I just bought this camera and absolutely love it. It's not for everyone, and not for every occasion, but when I'm in the mood it's just a wonderful camera to use. I had a X-Pro but it didn't do much for me and never used it much. The Pixii is a whole new experience, plus you can "choose" your experience - as a traditional film alternative, or as a high-tech connected gadget. A lot of people comment on the sensor size, but I have to rebut - sensors have made enormous improvement over the last few years, so APS or m4/3 are just fine for 99% os applications. The design tradeoffs you would have to make to create a full-frame version of the Pixii would greatly detract from the user experience - it wouldn't a a "rangefinder" anymore, just some clunky big "thing" and probably mean bigger lenses too. So Pixii made absolutely the right design choice here. Same as the choice of M mount.
You’re missing the point. Every m mount lens is designed for a full frame sensor. Those who already have a collection do not want the focal lengths to totally change, which they would when used on this camera. The lenses aren’t any more compact on this camera because there aren’t any crop sensor m mount lenses
I take your point about the crop factor, it changes all your effective focal lengths and sure will put some people off this camera. To me it's not a major inconvenience since I have a range of lenses and so I can still take all the images I want. So yes, my 28 becomes my "normal". M mount lenses were designed for 35mm film, not digital and cameras like the Leica M need a lot of tricks in the sensor to counter distortion etc. increasing the cost (a lot) and complexity to make those lenses work. I don't feel the need for smaller lenses, since the Pixii already matches the classic experience and APS with modern sensor technology is just fine. I do understand your point, and all theses choices are tradeoffs. @@HenrySavageMode
The price tag is literally insane! All of the design choices they made coincidentally align with low R&D, production costs, and time. Photos that come out of the camera are really nice, nobody can deny that... The thing is, photos made with cameras *that cost 4x with the same form factor less are just as good. *Edit: that cost 4x lesss
No, you're just not the target audience for this camera. The target is the hobbyist who wants a digital Leica M (which makes him a contrarian), but goes off-brand (to be doubly contrarian) and appreciates the lower cost to boot. The Pixii isn't expensive - in context of how small the total market is for a camera like this.
@@RobertLeeAtYTI do get it. It's a very niche product and it's roughly half the price of LEICA. I still shoot film these days, and I used rangefinders. Trying to bring that experience to digital is not only redundant and gimmicky, but impossible.
@@RobertLeeAtYT The target audience is someone who is willing to pay up to half the price of the camera for a memory replacement because they are anti-repair. People will convince themselves of anything to ignore the fact they're being milked like cows by companies, small or big.
I have been a photographer since 1965. I've worked commercially since 1975. I have owned hundreds of cameras including many rangefinders. (Canon, Nikon, Linhof, Leica, Zeiss.) I never liked rangefinders and see them a a crude antiquated way to try to achieve focus and roughly frame an image. Their drawbacks are so numerous that by choosing to use a rangefinder you are handicapping your ability to focus and frame accurately...two critical functions. Using a camera with a good EVF will give you way more capability than any rangefinder camera provides. Being able to instantly review the image on an LCD or EVF to confirm it and shoot variations is absolutely rudimentary in getting better images. As for removable storage...dual slots provide critical redundancy for pros. But you all know this.
Your entire channel is built on using early digital cameras. In many of these I’m sure you’ve gotten newly manufactured batteries to help them run again back to their old glory. Memory cards have a defined lifecycle. (Good ones could be 5000 cycles). But in the life of a camera, some of the ones you use are pre 2000s. It would be a shame to have a fail point like internal memory to keep the camera from being run. It should also be noted, most manufacturers using internal memory are still offering removable media in conjunction. 5000 cycles may sound like a lot (and this is a generous number) but that’s just 200 cycles per year if the camera lasts the next 25 years. That may sound like a while (because it is) but it has planned obsolescence in a way
I love this camera, the only reason what made me chose Leica over the Pixii was full frame VS APSC. If the Pixii was full frame I would have bought it easily.
I bought the Mamiya 6 for the range finder experience... I wish Mamiya had done a digital version or I could slot a sensor into My Mamiya 6. I get Your way of thinking. You do not have to agree with everything You say to listen. Dipping into Your world is fun and surprising. Thanks WG.
Nice video, James. You captured the reasons I bought one of the first versions of this camera a couple of years ago. It is not for everyone but for anyone who buys it, they will have their own rationale and the camera will deliver. I really like mine and all you say is true. Upgrades are cool, process is fun, pictures are great (especially black and white) and David actually engages with his users. I also like the feeling of supporting innovation and entrepreneurs. I know not everyone is lucky enough to do that but if you are, it is a pleasurable pursuit and costs the same as many other strange hobbies or flashy cameras
I am a Fuji shooter. But honestly, nothing compares to SLR cameras where you really see your subject with the highest possible resolution and dynamic range. Also need less battery power and no startup time! ❤❤❤
perfectly put. why not just get an old Nikon, Canon, Pentax or any of the wonderful SLR film cameras to get back with nature. This camera is such BS, I can't believe people think this is the Holy Grail. Besides my small collection of Sony digital cameras, I still have my Nikon F2A and Nikon FE2. Here you can experience film photography and not simulate it with digital camera. Go the whole route, buy film, expose film, develop film, go to dark room and make B&W enlargements. Are these people trying to fake-replicate the past?
I have nothing against the idea of a more "analogue feel" digital camera - but the price is ridiculous and seems predatory when you consider that every omission is a major cost saving for Pixii. Its got a good sensor, but everything else is manual and they have intentionally cut out a lot of what you would expect in a high end modern interchangeable lens mirrorless camera. It has no autofocus. It has no rear display. It has none of the accompanying hardware and software elements. It only has a "dumb" viewfinder (i.e. not a hybrid like Leica's). These are all major cost savings. And yet this is 3x the cost of a top of the line, "everything and the kitchen sink" APSC camera like the Sony A6700. Build quality? I haven't seen a Pixii in the flesh so can' say - educated guess though I doubt it would justify a $2k price gap. It is full machined aluminium, which is a plus - but premium APSC mirrorless cameras have full magnesium alloy bodies and much more complex designs to accommodate more features. The Pixii is just a box. Economies of scale? Here I can see a more valid argument but I really can't imagine any economies of scale being so aggressive that it would cost Pixii 3X the cost to make a camera compared to Sony when what they are making lacks so many of the features that make modern mirrorless cameras expensive. Basically I think Pixii is using hipster street cred and artificial nostalgia to take its customers for a ride...
Great overview and wonderful camera. Aesthetically it is beautiful! I have a few film rangefinders and I can see the appeal over a slr. The more cameras ( good cameras) that are made the better, We need a bit of spice in the mix sometimes! Thanks for sharing and always great content. The money is secondary to the enjoyment that camera will bring!
I would love to own this camera. I think it’s one one of the most interesting cameras on the market. The underlying ideas behind it are refreshing, and the industry needs this kind of approach. The internal memory is something I think we will see a lot more in newer cameras going forward, Leica has it on a few models for instance. I suppose, the option to upgrade the internal memory might allude fears from future owners, but you’re up against years and years of ingrained photography workflow and the subsequent mindsets to overcome that. I’m so jealous you have one. Enjoy it :)
I can see the theoretical advantage of upgrading and replacing parts, but other than pricing I don’t see really anything valuable vs Leicas. I use them professionally, including two Ms. Some cameras are going the way of built in memory in addition to cards, but memory only means that you lose redundancy and add complication. And finally I believe liveview or an EVF is necessary in a rangefinder when you go below 35 or over 50 mm. It looks just like lack of space in the box driving such decisions and impacting performance Anyhow interesting to know and good that you asked their CEO, regardless of the (poor) quality of the answers he came back with.
It comes with 32gb and costs quite a bit of money to upgrade the internal storage. Where it costs a whopping $482 to upgrade to 128gb. Which is probably the main reason they don't allow external storage. A used Leica M (typ262) can be found cheaper and has a 24mp full frame sensor. Love to hear about rangefinder alternatives to Leica, but the CEO response, the way they market it on their website, etc sorta leave a bad taste in my mouth.
I know rangefinders are super niche, yet I’m still obsessed with them. The low key nature of the camera, and the super stripped back use are just really enjoyable. However I’ve been put off by the barrier to entry that a Leica has. I looked at the RD1 but the enjoyment of the rangefinder is in part the quirky old glass, so full frame really is essential so this is still a hit and a miss. I think the Fujifilm also missed with the XPro because of the sensor size too, I could live without a coupled rangefinder, I could live with EVF when I needed accurate focusing, but I want the quirky lenses and a optical finder, because it’s fine to zone focus for what I would use such a camera for.
i owned a pixii for about a year had it sent in for the processor upgrade. but ended up selling it... Hard part about there upgrades at least right now they are basically patches for a very start up camera company.... which going is to happen leica has decades ahead of them.. But it is good to see a company at least making the changes and offer an upgrade path at least right now. I wish them the best though i personally am way happier now owning an leica 10-p... I never thought i miss a screen (though its 9/10 fully off) its so much easier for the times i want to quickly review or hell get angle without zone focusing or using the viewfinder. Sure a screen always on or that shows a image preview you shoot your photo can be a distraction but.... Most cameras screens can be turned off in the setting for most cameras with a viewfinder... and can be a great tool when used correctly.
His reasoning for internal memory I'm not buying it. Memory can go bad at anytime. I know there was a report about Nintendo Wii U bricking because they are no plugged in for over a year. And Nintendo said the Switch needs to be plugged in once a year or the memory can go bad. SD cards go bad all the time. Come on how hard is it to make a SD slot and if the SD goes bad the worse is you put in another SD card. It would be best for dual card slots.
Personally I think Pixii should be applauded regardless of whether anyone likes it or not. A lot of people bang on about it only having internal storage (as does the Hasselblad X2D) even though you can attach a usb-c flash drive to it if you needed to free up space. I haven't used one but I have seen a set of 20x24" prints shot on the Pixii side by side with same size prints shot on a Leica M10 (same paper and same Epson P8000 printer) at the same time and with the exact same lens (28mm Zeiss ZM) and guess what, the Pixii prints knocked spots off of the Leica prints. Its a very Zen like camera, in some respects its very limiting (maybe a handful of usable focal lengths) but its also very liberating. If its not for you then fine but from what I know they have a waiting list, so somebody likes it.
Love all of your videos but this camera is definitely more interesting than most because it's from a new company and because it's digital rangefinder and because there's no LCD screen. Keep the coverage of this camera coming. Oddly, when I only shot film, I was always worried in the back of my mind that either something was wrong with the camera and I wasn't going to get any images. Now with digital, you (and I) might think I'd be quickly reviewing every image after taking it. I don't. The LCD screen is folded against the back of the camera not even visible.
"The desire is manufactured just as the product itself is manufactured". Novelty, simplification, throw back to the past + a few other ingredients = some people will pay $3K for the feeling they need this.
There is only one reason to not put upgradable memory on a camera and that is greed: They get to sell you the built-in memory at a much more expensive price than its worth, just like in laptops and phones. And the memory on a camera sees a LOT of write operations, so it will last only a few years before the flash memory gives the ghost and you have an expensive repair, or you have to buy a new camera. Any company that does this deserves to fail and burn imo. No love from me whatsoever here.
@@patrickjclarke the flash memory writing cycle is dependant on the size Vs what's written to it. The more writing cycles go by, the worse it gets, just like charging cycles on batteries. Idk what you use your laptop for but I never filled my 512 GB on my Lenovo in 6 years of usage. Yes the OS will use temporary files in storage and apple was famous for killing the early M1 Ssds due to this, but as a user I don't write heavily to an SSD on a laptop. However, I regularly fill my 128gb SD card on my cameras and I don't even use video. If you have a camera for video then the problem is 10 times worse obviously. Besides the timeframes are different: a laptop from 2015 is old and can be seen as needing replacement. But a camera from 2015 can still do almost everything a modern camera can. I bought a used camera from 2016 last year and it still looks and works like new! I just bought it a new battery and a new SD card and it was good to go. I use DSLR cameras from 2010 now and then even. You wouldn't be able to do that if a camera had built-in storage as that is just a wear part. Imagine a camera with a built-in battery and you'll see what I mean. I don't get people defending such companies, do you actually prefer that Microsoft limit what you could have done with your laptop? You know how cheap modern SSDs are? You could fit a 2 TB SSD in your old laptop for 80 bucks if Microsoft didn't decide to be greedy. So why are you actually happy about it?
@@TheRoadrunner11 I edit videos, do after effects, and photo stuff so constantly filling and using the SSD. And yes, by the time (on a computer) it fails I’m needing a newer faster model so I don’t want to go back to the janky days of everything can be user upgraded. I want reliable and performant. Cameras, yeah you could argue against that as I still have my first Sony A100 from 2006, but if it died tomorrow I wouldn’t cry. I can see an argument against battery being inside, but that’s not the case with the Pixii.
@@patrickjclarke Even if you will upgrade the laptop soon (I understand, I upgraded my 2014 Lenovo in 2021 too), I don't understand why you wouldn't want to have the option to upgrade things? The SSD and Ram won't be less performant or janky if you were allowed to replace them yourself. These are standard parts, especially the SSD. Soldering it on the Mainboard makes almost no difference to performance. They only did it so they can offer multiple tiers to sell you the storage at double the price. And it keeps getting cheaper with time. As a practical example from my laptop, in 2015 I bought it an upgrade to the previously mentioned 512 GB SSD and it cost 150 bucks. That same 150 bucks today could get me 3 TB of SSD! So while I understand laptops get old and needing to be replaced faster than cameras, I still don't support the argument that we don't need replacing abilities in them. And as for built-in batteries, it's only a matter of time once people accept the sealed in storage. The new insta 360 action camera came with both a built-in storage and a built-in battery and people seem to love it! Yes that is built-in everything on a video camera and no one is saying a word. I think people just aren't too diligent about the longevity of the things they own these days.
@@TheRoadrunner11 I get your points, and I used to be that way too, but now I just buy what I need and by the time I outgrow it, I need an upgrade anyway. My old Android phones, I HAD to have an SD option, and hated when I would get an iPhone (I use both for work) and it didn't have it...but now? I just want to set it and forget it. My latest iPhone is 512 GB and my iPad Pro is 1TB...I have options that meet my needs for a LONG time...and I guess I don't mind the price to just not worry about it anymore. And yes, it's less common to have janky ram modules that cause kernal panics, or a "removable" HD (true story) in a laptop that would lose it's connection and corrupt data (it also would do that on the DVD drive too. I agree there should always be options both ways, and think forcing companies to put in removable batteries, or use USB-C is the same thing as ONLY having proprietary things for everyone.
Nah that answer about the built in memory is absolute bull SHIT. Sounds like they either wanted to capitalize on the markup, or they couldn't figure something out during engineering to get an SD card slot in a good location. Never, and I mean NEVER have I ever heard of a photographer saying "man, these SD cards are so unreliable and slow I wish someone would force me to have internal memory ONLY." I would understand some internal memory like on the leica M11 series, but only internal and starting at 64gb with large markups for each option above it? That's just thievery. At the camera's measly 5 fps shooting capability with an apsc sensor there's no reason internal memory would be needed for speed. With that kind of answer there's no chance he's getting my money ever.
It is undoubtedly an interesting camera, and if it had a full frame sensor i would have bought one already; as it is, i cannot push that buy button.... The choice of not using removable sd cards is a good one, actually, Hasselblad and Leica are both heading in that direction too, and so will the other ones eventually.
I asked them about FF too, and if they would consider making one in the future - I didn't get a answer on future models, but he didn't seemed bothered at all about the crop on original M lenses and just said he thinks about it differently. I do think it's a fair argument for the full sensor, if even just for the sake of using some famous lenses in the size they were designed for.
@@snappiness i wasn't too bothered either back when i had my Rd-1 (which i liked so much that i bought it 3 times, all the different models they made), or my first digital Leica, the M8; however, once i switched to FF I would not consider going back to cropping my lenses' FOV again....
Excellent video, thank you. I am intrigued by this camera and its point of difference. What wide angle would you prefer on it? I was reading that the Zeiss 28mm ZM Biogon is a good match for the Pixii Plus. What are your thoughts? Greetings from New Zealand, Birgit
I'm trying to think too what they would have to get it down to and/or change to sell a lot more. I'm not sure they are really that concerned with selling a bunch. I don't even see them market anywhere (but maybe they do). They're like a custom bike frame builder that operates by word of mouth and charges thousands for a steel frame. But beyond their goals, I think it would such a cool setup to get into the hands of more people, and for that the price needs to drop quite a bit.
I don’t even like cameras…like, at all, but I nevertheless enjoy your channel. You have the makings of half million to one million subscriber channel and that’s down to the well executed presentation and your very obvious love for the subject. Were I you, I’d not make any apologies for the prices of the fine equipment that you purchase because you have nothing to justify to us. Also, by making a point of the price, you open yourself up to more criticism rather than less. Your body language and presentation don’t scream (or even hint) that you think you are better than your audience because you can afford x,y, and z kit. You come off as very genuine and genuinely a lover of photography.
Love the Pixii! People who are hung up on specs can keep buying boring uninspiring Japanese cameras. They will never understand cameras like the Pixii or the Leica or why someone would use a film camera anyway.
I love the idea of someone saying, “the exact camera I want doesn’t exist so I need to make it.” That’s what this camera is and ohhhh how I wish I could buy one.
This is a serious question,if you had the money,could this be the camera you keep forever. I would really like to know if the build feels like a lifetime in your hand. Thanks
I think this camera would be something you get down the road after you already have others. Perfect but with a lot of limitations, you wouldn't want it to be your sole camera. I my opinion
Yeah bullshit response from the CEO on the memory question. Massive props to you for acknowledging and taking it up to them with the platform you have! Sassy camera overall still, I'm half hoping that Fuji X-Pro 4 ditches the screen too - since Leica and Pixii have shown that it can be viable and desirable. X-Pro 3 is near perfect, but the flip down screen is a failure point (specifically the display ribbon cable) and one of the common issues with it. Fuji can't make a half decent mobile app though, so probably not happening.
For less than this thing, I got the Sony A7CR. Full frame with APSC crop mode if that's what you REALLY need. Non-rangefinder pulls you out of the moment? Please. Yeah, better to look for frame lines to make sure you're actually getting the shot than looking in the viewfinder and seeing the actual shot.
What appeals: rangefinder focusing, LCD up top for basic settings, no LCD screen, weight (around 500g), M mount (lens choices), no card slot (guys we been using phone cameras in the same way for years) What doesn't appeal: no full frame (but just saw new announcement), maybe battery life, price
Depends on whether it works or not. From what I understand, it seems impossible to reconstruct B&W RAWs after light has passed through the bayer filter, which is possibly one reason why no manufacturer has ever done it before. Until someone can pull a side by side comparison against the Leica M11 Monochrome in APS-C crop vs the Pixii, I'm not convinced.
Something has caught my curiosity. Maybe I missed something. But it looks like you have at least two different lenses for this thing. How would a range finder without a screen be able to focus both of them? Or was it 2 different cameras?
I'm not great at explaining, but they are rangefinder coupled lenses, so there is a connection between the focus and the focus patch that changes the focusing patch lens to lens (as long as it is an RF coupled lens)
I guess what I appreciate this over a Leica is that almost no one's buying this just for the prestige - which some but not all Leica owners definitely are. This is really for a kind of photo geek, not just for people who want to buy the most luxurious version of everything.
My *only* criticism about this camera, is the fact that it does not have a mechanical shutter. I don't mind the APS-C sensor, or the lack of removable storage, or other criticism, but *electronic shutters generate banding under artificial light, and rolling shutter*, this limits my usage of this camera. I currently use a Leica M240 which I purchased used, less expensive that the PiXii and more versatile for my usage, and I can upgrade to 64GB without paying an arm and a leg for the upgrade. This camera is very interesting but is niche within a niche. It is a great concept, but I feel it was too "young" to be sold in the market. I think most people will buy it out of curiosity and resell it soon after. I'll wait for a mechanical shutter version.
3:00 just because one says it's a good idea, doesn't make it so. Anyone can call themselves a King. While I have no intention of buying this camera, I do worry about the built-in memory. But! If you get a good five-ten years out of it which I'm sure you will, no problem. It's the resell value many years down the road that's iffy especially if Pixii goes belly up with no one being able to service it.
yeah would think that card slot would be point of failure but also it would be there if internal memory fails. Even micro sd slot for peace of mind would be better than no slot.
Beeing a epson rd1 owner I can just look at this with envy. It is much cheaper than a Leica. And I have so many range Finder lenses. While they all do fine on my fuji camera it’s not a rangefinder.
Even beyond repairability concerns, I'd find it annoying to have to plug my camera into a computer. It's nice to be able to swap out cards and move them like they're flash drives
*If i purchase a beautiful Car and treat it correctly but after 7-10 years i have 200K miles regardless if the inside of my car and how nice it looks outside the engine will need major work eventually. Internal Memory is written over and over it will start to corrupt data. Even in 10-15 years when this camera is nostalgic you kill re-sell value when we know its no reparable*
I find the whole memory thing weird. People freak out when they can’t shoot redundantly but no other device captures redundancy because the goal is just to work in the first place. My entry level Sony a6100 has had 1 image corrupt in its 4 year life and even then it just asked me to delete that one image, preserved the rest and I kept shooting. I then bought a new SD card and I haven’t had any issue since. I think people’s poor experiences with tech standards of the early 2000’s and 2010’s made them incoherent to change. I’ve never heard anyone say “my phone has internal storage that’s bogus what if I lose my files?!” I think memory issues among dslr’s gave everyone a bad taste in their mouth and now they simple will not get over it. A cellphone will be used daily, to take photos, videos, calls, emails, processing and downloading all kinds of media and not once have I wondered if the internal storage of my phone will die. People will hold this absurd line on repairability and certain features like dual storage and then still be in line every 3 years for something new; I find it fascinating how people live their lives off 1 singular bad experience
I think is an element of what you're saying that is surprising me too. I also sympathize with the right-to-repair crowd, from an ideal standpoint at least (not that I'm buying Framework laptops, I just like the idea). I like the idea of going back to a time where things could be fixed at home. And I think taking away the SD card slot when there doesn't seem to be a good reason and almost no one else is doing it (yet) just feels like a pointless stab in the back. So, while I don't feel as strongly, I do try to see that side. On a side note I did some side research on flash memory, and yeah it does seem like one of those things that should be in a Freakonomics podcast where society way over estimates the risk of one thing, and way under estimates the risk of something else that happens more often.
@@snappiness I should reiterate that I do enjoy repairability as well, I wasn’t attempting to come at it the concept of repair but at people’s overt need for things to be exactly as they demand. I once let them scare me into thinking I needed a second slot specifically because I do professional work but from my experience they held that opinion blindly because of poor prior experiences that happened to them years ago when technology was nowhere near as polished or capable. I’ll bet your pixii has button or screen failures before the memory degrades to a point of failure. All in all my main point is people stress about things that potentially no longer matter or only matter to a specific niche set of the clientele and people let that control their every move. Also Hasselblad has internal storage in the new H2D 100C but it does have a card slot too and that is a super niche camera but it’s there
Another difference between this and the Fujifilm is possibly the user experience in its interactions with its app. I own a Fujifilm xt-20 and getting it sync'd with the Fujifilm app does my head in. It is so bonkers annoying that I don't use it as much as I would like, for that reason. Also since the Pixii so seemlessly connects up with your phone or other device then onboard storage is not all that big a deal is it?
It has that option in the menu, but it's about the same size as the viewfinder, so the frame lines go away. It covers a bit more than the viewfinder in my experience. Wider than that and you just have to guess, because the viewfinder doesn't go that wide.
So, he basically, David, didn't answer the question. 3:18 The concern is, "what if the internal mem fails." The correct answer would ensure replacement within a particular time frame after purchase.
![Leica M10 vs Fujifilm X-Pro3 | The Best Digital Rangefinder [style] Cameras](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/PTrGoN7pXv0/mqdefault.jpg)
I'm honestly surprised someone hasn't made an updated version of the Epson R-D1. It was such a unique experience and the design is perfect for people longing for an analog-meets-digital camera.
Epson would break the photography world if they came out of nowhere again with an absolutely steller fullframe rangefinder.
Don't think cosina has enough bessa bodies left to do it.
Someone has: Pixii.
Erm, the Pixii pretty much *is* the updated R-D1 😅
R-D1 is built on a real film camera that was solidly engineered by a company that built many other manufacturers "oem" bodies. To prime the shutter you have to cock with the film wind on lever. Ie one is built on an analog camera using a well known and regarded film range finder, the other is a built from scratch to an evolving vision (this is V2) which might be losing a lot of the historical camera DNA that didn't make it into the final vision. That's why this is V2. I'm glad they have an update path built in the program, but the Bessa used for the R-D1 was very mature already. This makes the pixii NOT an updated version of the Epson which was analog camera with digital media, but the pixii is mostly a digital creature and fundamentally different, even if they both take pictures and focus manually. The experience is [very] different.
Yeah, not buying performance and failure arguments. At least give SD slot as a redundant memory and write photos to both at once.
They are losing customers over the card slot thing. I would not buy this camera and I have the money to buy it, and the m lenses to use with it. That decision makes an already niche camera even moreso.
@@jw48335also the relatively small number of framelines and the APSC crop most people's existing set of lenses completely different focal lengths. Cool idea that needs refinement
Until it's full frame and with a mechanical shutter it's kinda pointless anyway. No M lenses to compensate for the crop factor at all.
😂 card or integrated mem... You are concentrating on superficial technical stuff, instead of creating. If that's what makes you choose a camera, than it's not art that you wanna make, but indulge your sense of owning specs...
I love the idea of integrated memory and I have only used as cards and many have failed.
I agree that both options would be nice, but it's far from important thing in life
@@windvI own cameras going back to 1946. I'm not buying a $3k luxury camera with a built-in death sentence. This is exactly the type of camera where these details matter. If I just cared about "art" I would never be looking at this camera.
For $3000, it should really have a full frame sensor. From what I gather it is a crop sensor. For anybody looking for a tactile quirky compact interchangeable lens camera, I highly recommend looking into a Sigma fp or fp-L. The kind of people that this camera is aimed at are also interested in vintage lenses, which work how they were meant to when used with a full frame camera. (The image sensor being the same size that 35mm film used to be.
The Sigma FP is a really cool setup (I love quirky, as you probably guessed). Maybe I'll try it someday.
Couldn't agree more! if it's full frame, it's a half-price M10/M11, It would be so competitive, making them the true budget Leica M. I can use my M lenses and get the full experience. But only crop? I don't know... for that price I rather get a Leica CL, which I can get L glasses and also adapt M lens, more options. plus CL has a screen...(Ultimately I want to take pictures with it, not just look cool with it, and having a screen makes it so much easier). They market it as it's competing with M10/11, but it's more like competing with the CL. which for me, for the price I rather get a CL(at least it's a Leica.....)
@@snappiness I have owned the FP-L for over a year and I love it. I customized it with a wood grip, I have a small collection of prime lenses. It has really motivated me to take my photography to the next level. It's been around for a while and I'm pretty sure its still the smallest body with a full fame 61mp sensor.
Given the chonk of the body I assumed it was FF. But yeah, you are right its APSC! Nothing wrong with that but like you say for the price and for the use case it seems like a bit of an own goal.
@@JimIBobIJones I think the sensor size may be influenced by the electronic shutter performance. Too big a sensor increases the rolling shutter distortion. It can happen at APSC but rarely.
To me that’s big time CEO speak that does the thing I’ve seen as I’ve worked in the tech industry for 15 years. It doesn’t actually address the question/concern but focuses on the benefit of the choice they as a company have made. Like what ACTUALLY happens if this gets bricked? Can you send it in for a memory recovery fix? Is there a viable warranty that states its real world cycles number? Does the he partition off a portion for recovery mode options? No concrete answer just a “we believe internal HD is a more robust solution that has a lower likelihood of failure so we went that route”
Yeah it is completely unreasonable of them to assume that someone who buys a camera for this amount of money won't have a fast enough SD card for it. Besides that, replacing an SD card slot on a device is trivially easy and cheap so I assume that's why they do it; to milk you of an extra couple hundred bucks in case this thing fails for some reason.
Also, the way they dodged the question is very dishonest and Apple-esque.
#righttorepair
Yeah his reasoning is complete bs. How is something that bricks the camera when it fails “more reliable.” At least when my sd cards die I can just swap it instantly. Not to mention I also have redundancy with a 2nd sd card. Imagine telling a client that all their photos might be gone and that you have to send the camera in before you can keep shooting.. “Can you do your wedding again in 2 months so I can shoot it completely?”
Very good point, at least the assurance of warranty and parts for servicing was needed.
I was looking for this. Kinda sus to me, he answered it like real politician. And the consumer are tied up with the maintenance scheme, uh, "upgrade" scheme. 4:18
Even with swapable storage like SD cards, the camera is still going to have internal storage for the camera's operating system, and probably some space for buffering (or is that done purely in RAM in most cameras? I kinda doubt it). So you still have that internal storage that does get a bunch of read and writes and could fail and brick the camera.
So your argument is that making that internal storage bigger and using it to read/write DNGs is going to make it much more likely to fail. I don't buy that argument, personally. Sounds like FUD.
The concerns about warranty and repairs with a small startup are super valid, but then it's just buyer beware. If you can't take that risk, do go with a large established brand with a good repair program.
I'm not a fan of built in storage, it's awful from a usability and repairability standpoint.
In order to replace the memory, you must disassemble and replace either the main board, or a daughter board. This board likely has more components than just memory, so you end up replacing working parts so the board is going to have to cost more. It'll be expensive for the parts and having to mail it in and have them do it for you.
How do you get the pictures off the device? Do you do this by plugging in a usb port? USB ports also have a rated lifetime, so this will increase the strain on it if that's the only way to copy your photos off. If it's via Wi-FI, that will drain your battery and be fairly slow and incompatible with some peoples workflows.
This also introduces a new problem in the field if you fill your memory since you can't just put a new card in, so you have to copy all your photos off to another device, then clear the memory before you can begin shooting again.
I also don't think the write speed performance increase is necessary for this style of camera, the main advantages for that are in video, outside of that it would be in being able to flush the memory buffer at a higher rate when using a burst mode. So if you held a burst shot until the memory buffer is filled, the write speed would allow it to flush to storage quicker, and theoretically allow higher sustained rates of frame capture.
The main benefit for removing sd cards in phones was to eliminate the back panel and improve water resistance which I don't think is applicable here as I'm guessing there's a tray for a removable battery, and if not, yikes.
In my experience, the SD card slot has never been a reliability problem for me, so this solution introduces more problems than it solves. I've gone through many sd cards to the point where they fail, but I also buy stacks of them at a time so I never run out. If the slot itself were to fail, I would feel a lot more confident repairing that myself than integrated storage.
As a technician I will say I have seen plenty of failed soldered SSDs. Soldering the storage on such a device is not a good idea for longevity. The camera is pretty cool, I just don’t think it’s a good idea because most consumers can’t replace the flash chip should the company go under.
During the past month I have had the opportunity to borrow the latest version of the Pixii, comparing it to the M10M/R's that own. The Pixii does have some unique selling points: price, upgradable, and the ability to create a RAW DNG in black and white, even though the sensor is a color sensor. And its shutter is very quiet - pleasingly so. But in every other tangible way it is a failure - its ergonomics are terrible. It is like holding a brick and no 3rd party accessories exist to rectify that. It's viewfinder is nowhere as good or clear as a Leica one. The lack of a memory slot makes it impractical for news and event, which is what I use my M10's for among other things. If the internal memory fills up, you need to stop and deal with that vs. just popping in a new memory slot. It is not a full sensor - so focal lengths are treated and behave differently due to the crop factor. Material fit and finish is nowhere near as nice as a Leica - and it is oddly delicate and cheap at the same time. And here's the biggest thing - what is Pixii's potential as a company and a brand with such a niche solution? It is certainly possible they can survive on selling hundreds / year, but it is equally possible they fail, whereas Leica is more likely to remain. So, that brings you back to price - in my opinion for a more superior experience with less risk, you are better of buying a gently used M10 of some variation than buying a new one of these. Better ergonomics, comparable material results, more accessories, memory cards, brighter viewfinder, less risk.
As the owner of several rangefinders like the Yashica Electro GSN, Canon Canonet QL17 GIII, and Minolta Hi-Matic F, I absolutely love that feel you described. I am surprised this is your first rangefinder. The Argus C3 is a classic one especially that has weathered the years nearly flawless and I recommend buying one for pure enjoyment. Kudos on joining into a new system from the ground up, sounds like that was one of the bigger appeals.
Minolta CLE, Yashica GT/GS/GTN/GSN user here, also others. I have to say, i do really *love* a real focus patch into the middle with two overlapping images, like the way it should be - whereas usually a other "cheap" rangefinders are just using a square or diamond patch, to align into place, whileas focusing your rangefinder.
The lack of SD card port shows some genuine spite towards the consumer base.
That's probably the weirdest take I've read on this camera.
@@SlashCampable It's inherently bad design. The camera is for rich people who enjoy expensive toys, like a dentist who shoots on leica. The internal flash memory WILL fail, and the customer has no idea who provides it and what is the terabytes written spec of it (how long it will last.)
@@SlashCampable Lol I just checked their website and see they're releasing a 4336 dollar full frame camera which STILL does not have a card slot. And the storage only goes up to 128gb (which will cost more than 4336 dollars.)
Literally the smallest SD cards I own are 256 gigabytes, and they cost less than 20 dollars.
OMG AND IT STILL USES MICRO USB, over 8 years after it was deprecated and replaced with USB C. On a 5000 dollar product, they are saving 50 cents of a connector on a 5000 dollar product.
It's rare I feel this way but I kinda hope this company goes under, what a shit show. They hate their own customers.
I would love to try one of these, such a beauty. I recently picked up an Epson r-d1 and there is definitely a magic and charm to a camera thats digital but uses a rangefinder focus system.
Congrats, how is it mechanically? Have you tested the RF alignment on longer lens? I'm still looking for a good one here.
@flagger2020 So far, I am impressed with the amount of thought behind the camera. When I received it, the dial on top that corresponded with battery life was very badly out of alignment to the point where it was useless for checking the remaining battery life. Luckily, there is an option in the settings to calibrate the needles on the dial. Now it's spot on.
The highest focal lens Ive tried on it so far is a 35mm (53mm after crop factor) and even though the rangefinder base length is short I had no issue nailing focus at the same speed as other rangefinders I've tried.
Other mechanics such as shutter and shutter winding lever are all pretty solid and seem reliable! As far as build quality, the only weak point really is the frameline selector is plastic and a tad flimsy. But im almost exclusively going to use the 35mm so not too bad for me.
I really admire pixii for their work on this camera. Personally, I can't bring myself to buy it. The fact that the pixii has a cropped sensor (I like my 28mm too much) and isn't compatible with several m-mount lenses I own is unfortunate.
You have that kind of money to drop? That blows my mind.
Yeah, I can see that. I did ask him about that too and why they landed on APSC, but I didn't get a clear answer.
I'll take a 32 bit APSC over 14bit full frame, all day every day. Theoretically i can do a very natural looking picture without blown out tones without putting the camera on a tripod and doing 5-7 stops of exposure.
same issue here. i am not married to my digital M body but i am married to a 50mm 1.4 lens.
@@mrfuzzy2954 You're confusing the processor bit and bit depth of the sensor. There exists no 32 bit sensor. The highest bit depth sensors now are those found in medium formats that go up to 16 bit. This sensor is literally the same cut/architecture as the a6700, X-T3/4, and a 1.5x crop of the A7R4/5 sensor. The marketing fluff from Pixii doesn't make sense at all cos it basically means the processor is capable of 64 bit processing. It *doesn't* improve image quality. Just like how chucking a i9 processor into the computer won't turn your photos into a higher quality one in Lightroom.
Idk an SD slot, at least for redundancy, makes the difference for cameras. Especially as the camera gets older, you can always buy new memory. Maybe next time Pixii, lots of good ideas here!
The internal storage being more performant is nice, except I doubt that users of the pixii will shoot at high framerates. getting it off of the camera is an argument, but i think when the failure rate of the embedded storage is being mentioned, yet the fact that when an sd card fails you can buy a new one. While it is nice that they have the upgradability stuff it still means you rely on pixii themselves to fix broken memory. if they ever go out of business and your memory fails? good luck. you're in an even tougher situation than dead memory formats.
Don't get me wrong, I would love a proper rangefinder, unlike the fuji digital rangefinder found on the xpro1 (which i own and do like) but hearing the reasoning from the ceo just make me think i should just save up for a leica instead, or heck even try to put a sensor in a film camera.
I wish them the best and hope they will make a camera that would tick my boxes eventually. but for now there is 0 chance i'd even consider them.
Sensor in a film camera? That's just about every earlier generation DSLR. The Canon 5D is a great place to start.
As for Leica, I think their most compelling product is the SL line. Mirrorless makes all the difference. If you can do without the Leica branding, checkout the Panaonsic S.
@@RobertLeeAtYT I owned a 5D mk2 (loved it, gave it to a friend who wanted to go to school for photography) and i currently own a Panasonic S1, I recommend against the leica SL for the simple reason that it is the same camera as the S1, more expensive and on top of that there is a solid alternative for both the SL and the S1 that is the S5.
That aside, all of those cameras are not rangefinder cameras. and i'm not pointing at rangefinder style, actual rangefinder cameras as shown in the video.
Coming from a hardware guy POV you are right. The internal storage claims are BS, it simply just makes them more money doing it this way, it's exclusively fueled by greed. We have seen it before in the tech industry, this is nothing new but company greed.
I love the concept of the pixii but for 3000 there's way more cameras that I'd rather buy with the money
Yeah, I definitely get that 😆
My only issue with the Pixii is that it's not full frame. I own Leica glass for my MP. It feels wrong to use it on APSC.
Yep. If this was FF I'd be mighty tempted by it.
I am guessing the cost difference between sensor sizes is big.
@@ChadWilson Most likely. It's already in a luxury class, so might as well go all in.
Lmao what a useless waste of money.
Damn, I feel the exact same way about my Sigma SD Quattro H
- blew quite a lot of money on it
- it's unpractical as f, autofocus doesn't really work so manual focus is the name of the game
- I wouldn't recommend it to anyone looking for an averagely good camera
- as a camera nerd though, this is by far the coolest cameras I've ever bought and I don't think I would ever sell it, the images are just beautiful
Of course Sigma isn't exactly a small company where you can get the CEO on the horn, but looking at the number and philosophy of Sigma cameras I think it's fair to assume it's not super far!
I couldn’t afford the Q-H, but did pick up an old SD15. It’s clunky and slow yet takes wonderful pictures. Don’t think I could part with it either.
@@matthewsisson1234 I was super fortunate to catch a pretty big error on MPB's part, otherwise I couldn't afford it either !
It was listed at 640€ as a regular SDQ, while the SDQH generally commands prices upwards of 1300€ as imports from japan.
that being said, 640€ is still the most money I've ever dropped on a camera lol
I’ve had an M for over yrs, before that I had Fuji’s. I just love the fact that everything is manual. It’s your creation, even if it’s good shot or bad. You have to be aware of your settings at all times.
Never shot a pixii, but maybe I’ll look at the used market.
I love it! Didn't know PIXII had one without LCD, I own a Leica M10-D myself so I know why this exists.
This honestly feels like a really good niche alternative to owning a Leica. You get a hybrid experience of shooting both digital and film, all for half the price of an actual Leica.
Except for the fact that Leica has shown strong pro-consumer intent with things like their L mount while this camera gives strong anti-consumer vibes with its non-user-operatable integrated soldered memory.
People buy Leicas to own a Leica.
@@Goldsteinphoto Not everyone can afford a Leica…
@@PooMonkeyMan I know. But it is a status item. And a Leica doesn't offer anything unique for me although their mirrorless cameras look very capable.
I feel rangefinder cameras limit my capability...inaccurate focusing and framing. Slow and very limited lens choices. (E.g. I use TSE and zoom lenses.)
Even the old Sony A6000 with lowly 16-50 is very capable when images are processed via DXO. An old relatively inexpensive full frame A7R2 produces amazingly good results. Most improvenents in recent years are in AF, video and burst speed/duration. (Which matter very little to me.)
Kudos to pixii for providing the only affordable alternative to Leica's rangefinders. Would love to play with this camera, even though I wouldn't pay this much for a toy I might use for a couple of weeks :)
In what world is 3 grand affordable?
@@GabrielSykes I'd like to own this camera but it really isn't affordable enough for my wallet. Will keep using my X-E2 for my poor "leica-ish" experience.
For now I'm happy to stay in the Panasonic Lumix DMC-L1 club for a weirdly satisfying rangefaker experience.
Honestly, I’ve seen used M10s go for less than the Pixii, and you get both a rear LCD as well as the option of an EVF! And if you can deal with APS and the Russian sensor oxide roulette, M8s are quite cheap these days…
@@FPSakari I have an x-e1 is the x-e2 much better in handling do you know. It took me a while to figure out how to get it to impersonate P shift mode which might be fixed on the e2. The e2 is supposed to have better af than the e1, but for purer leica experience we are meant to switch to manual af and my xf lens are focus by wire, so do you use manual focus lenses via adapters and how's the experience?
The thing is that they should try CFE cards instead of SDs, they are more reliable and the slots are better, I don't see argument againts this idea in 2023. It's a bummer for anyone considering one professionally, they should listen and fix this concern, I want to own my camera, no being dependent on their upgradibility program or whatever idea they have.
When I first moved to Germany I was told it's important to have a hobby and spend as much money on it as possible. So let the haters hate. 😅
All of what you say is true. And it is not a camera for everybody. It is a bit quirky. But, it has great color and image. Pixii has tuned the sensor well. I have one and have had it for a few years. I got the CPU upgrade when it was offered. I am happy with the camera. I will be trying the native RAW B&W. David Barth and his crew have a gem here. A special gem. Thanks for you great review.
Could you post examples of the supposedly true B&W RAW vs the colour RAW converted into B&W? Cos from what I understand, it seems impossible to reconstruct the true B&W values once light has already passed through the bayer filter. I wonder if anyone has a M11 Monochrome to shoot in APS-C mode vs the Pixii to test this out.
The only issue with this camera is the APS-C. I know pixii is very high-tech and boutique item but it still is too much for small sensor. Considering how niche this is, its most probable and realistic competitor will be used leica bodies such as M8, M9, M240. They are old and slow in every possible way compared to pixii, but target audience of pixii probably would not care about that kind of stuff at first place. Digital leicas from 00's-early 10's have much better viewfinder/rangefinder and better color output.
After taxes, it's almost the same price as a used M10, they need to add a proper mechanical shutter and a full frame sensor(not for IQ reasons, just so M lenses retain they're original focal length)
Yeah I totally agree, I would def consider this camera if it had a full frame sensor (so i can use the same M lenses i use on my sony and bessa) but id rather just wait a couple years and save up for a used leica at this price point
I just purchased a film rangefinder camera after having a Canon Canonet during my teens and 20s. I just got a 1958 Konica IIIA and this camera has an incredible viewfinder that is big and bright with frame lines that move. My Canon, made 20 years later didn't have a rangefinder/viewfinder nearly as good.
I have a Pixii and the Fujis, XPro 1, Xpro2, and XPRO3. I had and sold my X100V. I also have a Leica Q2 Monochrom. The Pixii is a really amazing and incredibly frustrating camera. As a camera, the experience is similar to film or the Leica M-D or M10-D. I agree that the appeal includes being part of a very small and innovative group of users. It can be frustrating with the development issues. Inconsistent white balance, freeze ups, etc. The problems seem to be reducing as new software updates become available. It certainly isn’t my main camera, not even my 2nd camera, but I am happy to have purchased it.
Wow--it's great to see innovation and it's very cool that you're supporting it! I'm especially intrigued by the Pixii's monochrome mode. After reading about it on their website it seems like an interesting alternative to just discarding the color information of an image...
You hit the nail on the head at the end. It's absolutely fine to enjoy the existence of products ... while also acknowledging they are not for you. People have a really, really hard time with this concept.
We have options for a reason. Buy the one for you, let others do the same.
products don't exist in a vacuum and if one manufacturer gets away with anti consumer practices the others will see it and adapt them as well
@@kalinmir I don't see how that relates to my point unless you somehow misunderstood me.
My point is simply: people judge products based on their needs instead of the solution the product offers, and often extend that judgment all the way to those who choose such a product. A nonsense take that's made many photography communities very toxic.
@@SourPlanet I'd say that a need for ease of repair (regarding internal memory) is quite universal even beyond photography...It is true that saying that a particular camera is bad based on its general categorization is nonsense...but I don't see people having issue with that here
@@kalinmir I don't really know what people have issue with, as I tend to steer clear of comments these days. Self care lol. I'm just going by a particular thing he said in the video.
But yes, you won't catch me buying a camera that relies on internal storage. I've had enough storage of all types bite the dust to know better.
Will it gain value or devalue? It does seem useless but i understand you're a collector. Respect.
I just bought this camera and absolutely love it. It's not for everyone, and not for every occasion, but when I'm in the mood it's just a wonderful camera to use. I had a X-Pro but it didn't do much for me and never used it much. The Pixii is a whole new experience, plus you can "choose" your experience - as a traditional film alternative, or as a high-tech connected gadget. A lot of people comment on the sensor size, but I have to rebut - sensors have made enormous improvement over the last few years, so APS or m4/3 are just fine for 99% os applications. The design tradeoffs you would have to make to create a full-frame version of the Pixii would greatly detract from the user experience - it wouldn't a a "rangefinder" anymore, just some clunky big "thing" and probably mean bigger lenses too. So Pixii made absolutely the right design choice here. Same as the choice of M mount.
You’re missing the point. Every m mount lens is designed for a full frame sensor. Those who already have a collection do not want the focal lengths to totally change, which they would when used on this camera. The lenses aren’t any more compact on this camera because there aren’t any crop sensor m mount lenses
I take your point about the crop factor, it changes all your effective focal lengths and sure will put some people off this camera. To me it's not a major inconvenience since I have a range of lenses and so I can still take all the images I want. So yes, my 28 becomes my "normal". M mount lenses were designed for 35mm film, not digital and cameras like the Leica M need a lot of tricks in the sensor to counter distortion etc. increasing the cost (a lot) and complexity to make those lenses work. I don't feel the need for smaller lenses, since the Pixii already matches the classic experience and APS with modern sensor technology is just fine. I do understand your point, and all theses choices are tradeoffs. @@HenrySavageMode
The price tag is literally insane! All of the design choices they made coincidentally align with low R&D, production costs, and time.
Photos that come out of the camera are really nice, nobody can deny that... The thing is, photos made with cameras *that cost 4x with the same form factor less are just as good.
*Edit: that cost 4x lesss
Exactly, it’s not like they developed new technology that camera should be half the price
No, you're just not the target audience for this camera. The target is the hobbyist who wants a digital Leica M (which makes him a contrarian), but goes off-brand (to be doubly contrarian) and appreciates the lower cost to boot.
The Pixii isn't expensive - in context of how small the total market is for a camera like this.
@@RobertLeeAtYT Just because one device is overpriced from hell to heaven doesn't mean, that pixii is in good price point.
@@RobertLeeAtYTI do get it. It's a very niche product and it's roughly half the price of LEICA.
I still shoot film these days, and I used rangefinders. Trying to bring that experience to digital is not only redundant and gimmicky, but impossible.
@@RobertLeeAtYT The target audience is someone who is willing to pay up to half the price of the camera for a memory replacement because they are anti-repair. People will convince themselves of anything to ignore the fact they're being milked like cows by companies, small or big.
I have been a photographer since 1965. I've worked commercially since 1975. I have owned hundreds of cameras including many rangefinders. (Canon, Nikon, Linhof, Leica, Zeiss.)
I never liked rangefinders and see them a a crude antiquated way to try to achieve focus and roughly frame an image.
Their drawbacks are so numerous that by choosing to use a rangefinder you are handicapping your ability to focus and frame accurately...two critical functions.
Using a camera with a good EVF will give you way more capability than any rangefinder camera provides.
Being able to instantly review the image on an LCD or EVF to confirm it and shoot variations is absolutely rudimentary in getting better images.
As for removable storage...dual slots provide critical redundancy for pros. But you all know this.
Your entire channel is built on using early digital cameras. In many of these I’m sure you’ve gotten newly manufactured batteries to help them run again back to their old glory. Memory cards have a defined lifecycle. (Good ones could be 5000 cycles). But in the life of a camera, some of the ones you use are pre 2000s. It would be a shame to have a fail point like internal memory to keep the camera from being run. It should also be noted, most manufacturers using internal memory are still offering removable media in conjunction.
5000 cycles may sound like a lot (and this is a generous number) but that’s just 200 cycles per year if the camera lasts the next 25 years. That may sound like a while (because it is) but it has planned obsolescence in a way
I love this camera, the only reason what made me chose Leica over the Pixii was full frame VS APSC. If the Pixii was full frame I would have bought it easily.
I bought the Mamiya 6 for the range finder experience... I wish Mamiya had done a digital version or I could slot a sensor into My Mamiya 6. I get Your way of thinking. You do not have to agree with everything You say to listen. Dipping into Your world is fun and surprising. Thanks WG.
Nice video, James. You captured the reasons I bought one of the first versions of this camera a couple of years ago. It is not for everyone but for anyone who buys it, they will have their own rationale and the camera will deliver. I really like mine and all you say is true. Upgrades are cool, process is fun, pictures are great (especially black and white) and David actually engages with his users. I also like the feeling of supporting innovation and entrepreneurs. I know not everyone is lucky enough to do that but if you are, it is a pleasurable pursuit and costs the same as many other strange hobbies or flashy cameras
A bit silly for me but a bit of a throw back if you want to, each to their own.
I am a Fuji shooter. But honestly, nothing compares to SLR cameras where you really see your subject with the highest possible resolution and dynamic range.
Also need less battery power and no startup time! ❤❤❤
perfectly put. why not just get an old Nikon, Canon, Pentax or any of the wonderful SLR film cameras to get back with nature. This camera is such BS, I can't believe people think this is the Holy Grail. Besides my small collection of Sony digital cameras, I still have my Nikon F2A and Nikon FE2. Here you can experience film photography and not simulate it with digital camera. Go the whole route, buy film, expose film, develop film, go to dark room and make B&W enlargements. Are these people trying to fake-replicate the past?
Pixii is out-Leicaing Leica at being the Apple of cameras.
There is a lot here that feels Apple-esque, I think that's a fair comparison
I think the incredible genius with Pixii is they let the camera do what it does best and the smart phone do what it does best.
Do you still have the camera? I would love to see a video from a long-term user. Most of the videos i've seen are initial reviews.
I have nothing against the idea of a more "analogue feel" digital camera - but the price is ridiculous and seems predatory when you consider that every omission is a major cost saving for Pixii.
Its got a good sensor, but everything else is manual and they have intentionally cut out a lot of what you would expect in a high end modern interchangeable lens mirrorless camera.
It has no autofocus. It has no rear display. It has none of the accompanying hardware and software elements. It only has a "dumb" viewfinder (i.e. not a hybrid like Leica's). These are all major cost savings. And yet this is 3x the cost of a top of the line, "everything and the kitchen sink" APSC camera like the Sony A6700.
Build quality? I haven't seen a Pixii in the flesh so can' say - educated guess though I doubt it would justify a $2k price gap. It is full machined aluminium, which is a plus - but premium APSC mirrorless cameras have full magnesium alloy bodies and much more complex designs to accommodate more features. The Pixii is just a box.
Economies of scale? Here I can see a more valid argument but I really can't imagine any economies of scale being so aggressive that it would cost Pixii 3X the cost to make a camera compared to Sony when what they are making lacks so many of the features that make modern mirrorless cameras expensive.
Basically I think Pixii is using hipster street cred and artificial nostalgia to take its customers for a ride...
Great overview and wonderful camera. Aesthetically it is beautiful! I have a few film rangefinders and I can see the appeal over a slr. The more cameras ( good cameras) that are made the better, We need a bit of spice in the mix sometimes! Thanks for sharing and always great content. The money is secondary to the enjoyment that camera will bring!
I would love to own this camera. I think it’s one one of the most interesting cameras on the market. The underlying ideas behind it are refreshing, and the industry needs this kind of approach. The internal memory is something I think we will see a lot more in newer cameras going forward, Leica has it on a few models for instance. I suppose, the option to upgrade the internal memory might allude fears from future owners, but you’re up against years and years of ingrained photography workflow and the subsequent mindsets to overcome that. I’m so jealous you have one. Enjoy it :)
When we get this camera, it's not for taking burst photos.
I can see the theoretical advantage of upgrading and replacing parts, but other than pricing I don’t see really anything valuable vs Leicas. I use them professionally, including two Ms. Some cameras are going the way of built in memory in addition to cards, but memory only means that you lose redundancy and add complication. And finally I believe liveview or an EVF is necessary in a rangefinder when you go below 35 or over 50 mm. It looks just like lack of space in the box driving such decisions and impacting performance
Anyhow interesting to know and good that you asked their CEO, regardless of the (poor) quality of the answers he came back with.
Cudos to Pixii for even making it to the market! Respect!
It comes with 32gb and costs quite a bit of money to upgrade the internal storage. Where it costs a whopping $482 to upgrade to 128gb. Which is probably the main reason they don't allow external storage.
A used Leica M (typ262) can be found cheaper and has a 24mp full frame sensor. Love to hear about rangefinder alternatives to Leica, but the CEO response, the way they market it on their website, etc sorta leave a bad taste in my mouth.
I agree!
At that price i hope the usb-c is a thunderbolt 3 or 4 at least. And a 1tb nvme ssd in the internal storage…
I know rangefinders are super niche, yet I’m still obsessed with them. The low key nature of the camera, and the super stripped back use are just really enjoyable. However I’ve been put off by the barrier to entry that a Leica has. I looked at the RD1 but the enjoyment of the rangefinder is in part the quirky old glass, so full frame really is essential so this is still a hit and a miss. I think the Fujifilm also missed with the XPro because of the sensor size too, I could live without a coupled rangefinder, I could live with EVF when I needed accurate focusing, but I want the quirky lenses and a optical finder, because it’s fine to zone focus for what I would use such a camera for.
Fuji Xpro III seems like a better buy. 🤷🏽♂️
They should've went full frame to compete against Leica. That to me would've been a more compelling offer to a lot of people.
i owned a pixii for about a year had it sent in for the processor upgrade. but ended up selling it... Hard part about there upgrades at least right now they are basically patches for a very start up camera company.... which going is to happen leica has decades ahead of them.. But it is good to see a company at least making the changes and offer an upgrade path at least right now. I wish them the best though i personally am way happier now owning an leica 10-p... I never thought i miss a screen (though its 9/10 fully off) its so much easier for the times i want to quickly review or hell get angle without zone focusing or using the viewfinder. Sure a screen always on or that shows a image preview you shoot your photo can be a distraction but.... Most cameras screens can be turned off in the setting for most cameras with a viewfinder... and can be a great tool when used correctly.
His reasoning for internal memory I'm not buying it. Memory can go bad at anytime. I know there was a report about Nintendo Wii U bricking because they are no plugged in for over a year. And Nintendo said the Switch needs to be plugged in once a year or the memory can go bad. SD cards go bad all the time.
Come on how hard is it to make a SD slot and if the SD goes bad the worse is you put in another SD card. It would be best for dual card slots.
I don't know if the camera is interesting for me, but I really like the philosophy of the CEO behind it.
have this one for a while on my radar, yet I sold my M8 and RD-1. Seems I am not a rangefinder guy, I guess I have to get my hands on one day :)
Hi ))) Cool camera! This camera sounds very interesting. Thanks for the video!
Personally I think Pixii should be applauded regardless of whether anyone likes it or not. A lot of people bang on about it only having internal storage (as does the Hasselblad X2D) even though you can attach a usb-c flash drive to it if you needed to free up space. I haven't used one but I have seen a set of 20x24" prints shot on the Pixii side by side with same size prints shot on a Leica M10 (same paper and same Epson P8000 printer) at the same time and with the exact same lens (28mm Zeiss ZM) and guess what, the Pixii prints knocked spots off of the Leica prints. Its a very Zen like camera, in some respects its very limiting (maybe a handful of usable focal lengths) but its also very liberating. If its not for you then fine but from what I know they have a waiting list, so somebody likes it.
If they made a digital xpan with 2 apsc sensors, I’d definitely buy one
Love all of your videos but this camera is definitely more interesting than most because it's from a new company and because it's digital rangefinder and because there's no LCD screen. Keep the coverage of this camera coming.
Oddly, when I only shot film, I was always worried in the back of my mind that either something was wrong with the camera and I wasn't going to get any images. Now with digital, you (and I) might think I'd be quickly reviewing every image after taking it. I don't. The LCD screen is folded against the back of the camera not even visible.
"The desire is manufactured just as the product itself is manufactured".
Novelty, simplification, throw back to the past + a few other ingredients = some people will pay $3K for the feeling they need this.
There is only one reason to not put upgradable memory on a camera and that is greed: They get to sell you the built-in memory at a much more expensive price than its worth, just like in laptops and phones.
And the memory on a camera sees a LOT of write operations, so it will last only a few years before the flash memory gives the ghost and you have an expensive repair, or you have to buy a new camera.
Any company that does this deserves to fail and burn imo. No love from me whatsoever here.
Internal memory on a camera writes more than say, my 2015 Surface Book 2 SSD that’s still working just fine?
@@patrickjclarke the flash memory writing cycle is dependant on the size Vs what's written to it. The more writing cycles go by, the worse it gets, just like charging cycles on batteries.
Idk what you use your laptop for but I never filled my 512 GB on my Lenovo in 6 years of usage. Yes the OS will use temporary files in storage and apple was famous for killing the early M1 Ssds due to this, but as a user I don't write heavily to an SSD on a laptop.
However, I regularly fill my 128gb SD card on my cameras and I don't even use video. If you have a camera for video then the problem is 10 times worse obviously.
Besides the timeframes are different: a laptop from 2015 is old and can be seen as needing replacement. But a camera from 2015 can still do almost everything a modern camera can. I bought a used camera from 2016 last year and it still looks and works like new! I just bought it a new battery and a new SD card and it was good to go. I use DSLR cameras from 2010 now and then even. You wouldn't be able to do that if a camera had built-in storage as that is just a wear part. Imagine a camera with a built-in battery and you'll see what I mean.
I don't get people defending such companies, do you actually prefer that Microsoft limit what you could have done with your laptop? You know how cheap modern SSDs are? You could fit a 2 TB SSD in your old laptop for 80 bucks if Microsoft didn't decide to be greedy. So why are you actually happy about it?
@@TheRoadrunner11 I edit videos, do after effects, and photo stuff so constantly filling and using the SSD.
And yes, by the time (on a computer) it fails I’m needing a newer faster model so I don’t want to go back to the janky days of everything can be user upgraded. I want reliable and performant.
Cameras, yeah you could argue against that as I still have my first Sony A100 from 2006, but if it died tomorrow I wouldn’t cry.
I can see an argument against battery being inside, but that’s not the case with the Pixii.
@@patrickjclarke Even if you will upgrade the laptop soon (I understand, I upgraded my 2014 Lenovo in 2021 too), I don't understand why you wouldn't want to have the option to upgrade things?
The SSD and Ram won't be less performant or janky if you were allowed to replace them yourself. These are standard parts, especially the SSD. Soldering it on the Mainboard makes almost no difference to performance. They only did it so they can offer multiple tiers to sell you the storage at double the price.
And it keeps getting cheaper with time. As a practical example from my laptop, in 2015 I bought it an upgrade to the previously mentioned 512 GB SSD and it cost 150 bucks. That same 150 bucks today could get me 3 TB of SSD!
So while I understand laptops get old and needing to be replaced faster than cameras, I still don't support the argument that we don't need replacing abilities in them.
And as for built-in batteries, it's only a matter of time once people accept the sealed in storage. The new insta 360 action camera came with both a built-in storage and a built-in battery and people seem to love it!
Yes that is built-in everything on a video camera and no one is saying a word. I think people just aren't too diligent about the longevity of the things they own these days.
@@TheRoadrunner11 I get your points, and I used to be that way too, but now I just buy what I need and by the time I outgrow it, I need an upgrade anyway. My old Android phones, I HAD to have an SD option, and hated when I would get an iPhone (I use both for work) and it didn't have it...but now? I just want to set it and forget it. My latest iPhone is 512 GB and my iPad Pro is 1TB...I have options that meet my needs for a LONG time...and I guess I don't mind the price to just not worry about it anymore. And yes, it's less common to have janky ram modules that cause kernal panics, or a "removable" HD (true story) in a laptop that would lose it's connection and corrupt data (it also would do that on the DVD drive too.
I agree there should always be options both ways, and think forcing companies to put in removable batteries, or use USB-C is the same thing as ONLY having proprietary things for everyone.
Nah that answer about the built in memory is absolute bull SHIT. Sounds like they either wanted to capitalize on the markup, or they couldn't figure something out during engineering to get an SD card slot in a good location. Never, and I mean NEVER have I ever heard of a photographer saying "man, these SD cards are so unreliable and slow I wish someone would force me to have internal memory ONLY." I would understand some internal memory like on the leica M11 series, but only internal and starting at 64gb with large markups for each option above it? That's just thievery. At the camera's measly 5 fps shooting capability with an apsc sensor there's no reason internal memory would be needed for speed. With that kind of answer there's no chance he's getting my money ever.
It is undoubtedly an interesting camera, and if it had a full frame sensor i would have bought one already; as it is, i cannot push that buy button.... The choice of not using removable sd cards is a good one, actually, Hasselblad and Leica are both heading in that direction too, and so will the other ones eventually.
I asked them about FF too, and if they would consider making one in the future - I didn't get a answer on future models, but he didn't seemed bothered at all about the crop on original M lenses and just said he thinks about it differently. I do think it's a fair argument for the full sensor, if even just for the sake of using some famous lenses in the size they were designed for.
@@snappiness i wasn't too bothered either back when i had my Rd-1 (which i liked so much that i bought it 3 times, all the different models they made), or my first digital Leica, the M8; however, once i switched to FF I would not consider going back to cropping my lenses' FOV again....
Excellent video, thank you. I am intrigued by this camera and its point of difference. What wide angle would you prefer on it? I was reading that the Zeiss 28mm ZM Biogon is a good match for the Pixii Plus. What are your thoughts? Greetings from New Zealand, Birgit
I honestly love the simplicity and concept of it being a rangefinder. Just cannot bring myself to pay so much. Maybe 2K I'd pay, but no way 3K.
I'm trying to think too what they would have to get it down to and/or change to sell a lot more. I'm not sure they are really that concerned with selling a bunch. I don't even see them market anywhere (but maybe they do). They're like a custom bike frame builder that operates by word of mouth and charges thousands for a steel frame.
But beyond their goals, I think it would such a cool setup to get into the hands of more people, and for that the price needs to drop quite a bit.
I don’t even like cameras…like, at all, but I nevertheless enjoy your channel. You have the makings of half million to one million subscriber channel and that’s down to the well executed presentation and your very obvious love for the subject.
Were I you, I’d not make any apologies for the prices of the fine equipment that you purchase because you have nothing to justify to us. Also, by making a point of the price, you open yourself up to more criticism rather than less. Your body language and presentation don’t scream (or even hint) that you think you are better than your audience because you can afford x,y, and z kit. You come off as very genuine and genuinely a lover of photography.
Tell it bro
Thank you for the kind words :) I'm glad you are enjoying the content!
Love the Pixii! People who are hung up on specs can keep buying boring uninspiring Japanese cameras. They will never understand cameras like the Pixii or the Leica or why someone would use a film camera anyway.
I love the idea of someone saying, “the exact camera I want doesn’t exist so I need to make it.” That’s what this camera is and ohhhh how I wish I could buy one.
This is a serious question,if you had the money,could this be the camera you keep forever. I would really like to know if the build feels like a lifetime in your hand. Thanks
These cameras are so cool. Id love to own one.
I've never used a digital range finder but I have a original Canonet I repaired that I use regularly, I really like the range finder setup.
I think this camera would be something you get down the road after you already have others.
Perfect but with a lot of limitations, you wouldn't want it to be your sole camera.
I my opinion
I REALLY want an Epson RD-1, but this Rangefinder is nice too
The Epson is so cool
@@snappiness it is but so expensive!!
Only thing stopping me from buying this camera is the built in memory.
Yeah bullshit response from the CEO on the memory question. Massive props to you for acknowledging and taking it up to them with the platform you have!
Sassy camera overall still, I'm half hoping that Fuji X-Pro 4 ditches the screen too - since Leica and Pixii have shown that it can be viable and desirable. X-Pro 3 is near perfect, but the flip down screen is a failure point (specifically the display ribbon cable) and one of the common issues with it. Fuji can't make a half decent mobile app though, so probably not happening.
I do think the Xpro3 is pretty dang sweet. Loving the risks Fuji is taking with some of their models.
Plz Pixii, make a FF camera, I'd buy it instantly. Currently rocking an M9.
For less than this thing, I got the Sony A7CR. Full frame with APSC crop mode if that's what you REALLY need. Non-rangefinder pulls you out of the moment? Please. Yeah, better to look for frame lines to make sure you're actually getting the shot than looking in the viewfinder and seeing the actual shot.
What appeals: rangefinder focusing, LCD up top for basic settings, no LCD screen, weight (around 500g), M mount (lens choices), no card slot (guys we been using phone cameras in the same way for years)
What doesn't appeal: no full frame (but just saw new announcement), maybe battery life, price
Surprised there was no mention of the monochrome raw file feature! Probably one of the most defining aspects of the camera for me
I'll have an update later with my thoughts/images after a few months, and will definitely talk about it there. I really like the mono mode.
Depends on whether it works or not. From what I understand, it seems impossible to reconstruct B&W RAWs after light has passed through the bayer filter, which is possibly one reason why no manufacturer has ever done it before. Until someone can pull a side by side comparison against the Leica M11 Monochrome in APS-C crop vs the Pixii, I'm not convinced.
Hey! Are you still shooting your videos on a K1 or did you decide to change up equipment?
I have been using a Panasonic g85 for about a year now. But I use my K-1 for photography still of course. Great camera :)
if you dont like the new sensor whenthey upgrade your camera, can you change and keep your old sensor ?
Something has caught my curiosity. Maybe I missed something. But it looks like you have at least two different lenses for this thing. How would a range finder without a screen be able to focus both of them? Or was it 2 different cameras?
I'm not great at explaining, but they are rangefinder coupled lenses, so there is a connection between the focus and the focus patch that changes the focusing patch lens to lens (as long as it is an RF coupled lens)
Love the use of the Undertale font
I guess what I appreciate this over a Leica is that almost no one's buying this just for the prestige - which some but not all Leica owners definitely are. This is really for a kind of photo geek, not just for people who want to buy the most luxurious version of everything.
A great photographer can take museum quality photos with a Zeiss Box Tengor.
My *only* criticism about this camera, is the fact that it does not have a mechanical shutter. I don't mind the APS-C sensor, or the lack of removable storage, or other criticism, but *electronic shutters generate banding under artificial light, and rolling shutter*, this limits my usage of this camera. I currently use a Leica M240 which I purchased used, less expensive that the PiXii and more versatile for my usage, and I can upgrade to 64GB without paying an arm and a leg for the upgrade. This camera is very interesting but is niche within a niche. It is a great concept, but I feel it was too "young" to be sold in the market. I think most people will buy it out of curiosity and resell it soon after. I'll wait for a mechanical shutter version.
3:00 just because one says it's a good idea, doesn't make it so. Anyone can call themselves a King.
While I have no intention of buying this camera, I do worry about the built-in memory. But! If you get a good five-ten years out of it which I'm sure you will, no problem.
It's the resell value many years down the road that's iffy especially if Pixii goes belly up with no one being able to service it.
yeah would think that card slot would be point of failure but also it would be there if internal memory fails. Even micro sd slot for peace of mind would be better than no slot.
@@FPSakari 100%
When all my photos are great, i'm buying a new camera.
So the CEO basically didnt give an answer to "what if the internal memory fails and your camera is bricked". He just said "nah it'll be fine" lol
idk why I want this camera so badly, but I do
Beeing a epson rd1 owner I can just look at this with envy. It is much cheaper than a Leica. And I have so many range Finder lenses. While they all do fine on my fuji camera it’s not a rangefinder.
Hey, the Epson rd1 looks so cool! I wish we got a true successor to that.
@@snappiness We all wished for that. But the RD-1 was a camera out of luck and nothing else ...
I have been following this company about a year or more. would like to have one but cost is too much at this point of my life. thanks
Luckily, I'm a 2 hour drive from this company. It is located in a world capital of precision watchmaking, hence its rangefinder. I trust.
Even beyond repairability concerns, I'd find it annoying to have to plug my camera into a computer. It's nice to be able to swap out cards and move them like they're flash drives
A used range finder can be bought much cheaper. I suppose it wouldnt be as fun to have the 2 combined. I dig the built in range finder. Very hip.
*If i purchase a beautiful Car and treat it correctly but after 7-10 years i have 200K miles regardless if the inside of my car and how nice it looks outside the engine will need major work eventually. Internal Memory is written over and over it will start to corrupt data. Even in 10-15 years when this camera is nostalgic you kill re-sell value when we know its no reparable*
I find the whole memory thing weird. People freak out when they can’t shoot redundantly but no other device captures redundancy because the goal is just to work in the first place. My entry level Sony a6100 has had 1 image corrupt in its 4 year life and even then it just asked me to delete that one image, preserved the rest and I kept shooting. I then bought a new SD card and I haven’t had any issue since. I think people’s poor experiences with tech standards of the early 2000’s and 2010’s made them incoherent to change. I’ve never heard anyone say “my phone has internal storage that’s bogus what if I lose my files?!”
I think memory issues among dslr’s gave everyone a bad taste in their mouth and now they simple will not get over it. A cellphone will be used daily, to take photos, videos, calls, emails, processing and downloading all kinds of media and not once have I wondered if the internal storage of my phone will die. People will hold this absurd line on repairability and certain features like dual storage and then still be in line every 3 years for something new; I find it fascinating how people live their lives off 1 singular bad experience
I think is an element of what you're saying that is surprising me too. I also sympathize with the right-to-repair crowd, from an ideal standpoint at least (not that I'm buying Framework laptops, I just like the idea). I like the idea of going back to a time where things could be fixed at home. And I think taking away the SD card slot when there doesn't seem to be a good reason and almost no one else is doing it (yet) just feels like a pointless stab in the back. So, while I don't feel as strongly, I do try to see that side.
On a side note I did some side research on flash memory, and yeah it does seem like one of those things that should be in a Freakonomics podcast where society way over estimates the risk of one thing, and way under estimates the risk of something else that happens more often.
@@snappiness I should reiterate that I do enjoy repairability as well, I wasn’t attempting to come at it the concept of repair but at people’s overt need for things to be exactly as they demand. I once let them scare me into thinking I needed a second slot specifically because I do professional work but from my experience they held that opinion blindly because of poor prior experiences that happened to them years ago when technology was nowhere near as polished or capable. I’ll bet your pixii has button or screen failures before the memory degrades to a point of failure. All in all my main point is people stress about things that potentially no longer matter or only matter to a specific niche set of the clientele and people let that control their every move.
Also Hasselblad has internal storage in the new H2D 100C but it does have a card slot too and that is a super niche camera but it’s there
Another difference between this and the Fujifilm is possibly the user experience in its interactions with its app. I own a Fujifilm xt-20 and getting it sync'd with the Fujifilm app does my head in. It is so bonkers annoying that I don't use it as much as I would like, for that reason. Also since the Pixii so seemlessly connects up with your phone or other device then onboard storage is not all that big a deal is it?
Does the pixii have 21mm frame lines ? Looking at your 21mm lens or the voightlander f4 21mm
It has that option in the menu, but it's about the same size as the viewfinder, so the frame lines go away. It covers a bit more than the viewfinder in my experience. Wider than that and you just have to guess, because the viewfinder doesn't go that wide.
Hassleblad has internal memory and some Ricoh have a small amount of built in memory. Like the 2mb on the gr
So, he basically, David, didn't answer the question. 3:18 The concern is, "what if the internal mem fails." The correct answer would ensure replacement within a particular time frame after purchase.
"We will fix it if we are still around when it fails... also it will cost you more than sd card would" :)
@@FPSakari precisely
Did you check the Leica M240 or the M246? They about the same price with a better value in the end.