Bob, you are a much more patient guy than me. If they were my shoes I would have demanded a new pair. I paid for new I want new wether they are on sale or not. I would not have settled for refurb and a three plus week wait. I enjoy your videos very much and appreciate your honesty and candor. Keep up the great informative work. P.s. I own three pair of Allen Edmond,s shoes and enjoy the fit and quality. So far no issues.
FYI, there probably would have been a 2 week wait on a new pair. 11.5 3e in oxblood is not something they keep on the shelf. Plus I didn’t have to break in mine. Just other factors.
Robert I wanted to thank you for creating an honest and very informative video. I also would like to thank you for pointing out the struggle for folks with wide feet.
I just purchased two pairs of Allen Edmond's shoes, a Randolph Loafer in Chili and a cap toe oxford in Black, and happy with them. I had been wearing Bostonian and Johnston and Murphy since the mid-1990s, but the quality is missing today. I enjoy your reviews and opinions, and your assessments are generally correct.
To my viewers (and hopefully AE management): There were a few comments about requesting a NEW PAIR of shoes instead of repairing mine. Here are some other mitigating factors to that: 1. It would still take a couple weeks to ship in a new shoe. I believe the Oxblood MacNeil in calf was discontinued too. So it’s not like I could have walked out of the store with a brand new pair of that same shoe. 2. What if the new shoe has some other problem? Then I’m back at square one. At least I know the issue with mine. 3. I didn’t have to re-break these in. Just other factors to consider. I do wish they would have offered me a free upgrade to JR soles, or a $100 discount off of a new pair or something. I was put out and had to take 2-3 hours out of my day to drive up to the store. Please watch the following amazing video featuring interviews with the Allen Edmonds management & President by The Kavalier: th-cam.com/video/2lUaxYPTr0g/w-d-xo.html
Robert Powers as I said in my previous comment Bob, the stitching on the welt looks like it’s frayed at the back and the overall finish around the welt area still looks pretty shoddy for the price these cost, plus remember the laces section piping still looks like it could catch something and tear as it’s pretty poor as well. I love AE and have only had good personal experience of their shoes, however, the last new pair I purchased was about ten years ago and looking at yours I would regard these even at first as seconds not top new stock. I would not be happy with what they sent you back and I hope Alan Edmonds not only steps up to the plate and simply replace these but also do something about QC as these are really shoddy still and look like they have been fixed by an apprentice just taken on!
i bought several allen edmonds lately and the customer service, both in the store and on the phone has been incredible. i bought my shoes on sale, between 109 and 149 dollars, all originally 425 to 455(boots). no qc issues here.
Hey I'm a new viewer and newcomer to the world of dressing more elegant and formal. I'm still a young lad in college but I love your videos and I enjoy how well spoken you are in all of your videos. Please keep up all the great work!
I remember when you showed these the first time and quite a few of us said the quality was terrible, I’m glad you are sending them back. Their QC person needs to be issued with a new pair of glasses! Mind, I have now got to the part when you have them back. I’m not impressed with the welt stitching at the back, it looks frayed already
Bob, I think you portray a fair and accurate assessment of the ‘state of the state’ of Allen Edmonds. I’ve been quite fortunate with my AE purchases as I’ve bought over 15 pair of shoes/boots over the past 2 1/2 years or so. Many have been factory seconds and I’ve had difficulty finding any flaws with the shoes. On rare occasions I’ve received a shoe which I could not wear as the defect was so severe, however; for the most part I’m very pleased with AE’s quality. Customer service, is in my opinion, outstanding. In summary, I find your video to be very informative, interesting and as always, of very high quality. Great job! Ed
@@CobblerBob Don't go there! I know exactly where Ed is coming from. I bought my first pair of good shoes in April 2019. It's only August 2019, and I am at eleven pairs already!! 7 pairs of them are Loakes.
My first Allen Edmonds from them, I returned for similar reasons. I got 2 pairs but received 5 pairs of Allen Edmonds because of sizing issues from Nordstrom. All 5 Allen Edmonds from Nordstrom were in excellent condition. I wonder if others had similar experiences. The first pair from Allen Edmonds was clearly a 2nd's they wanted to get rid of just like yours.
I love AEs. Never had a problem and own 11pairs. Am curious about the QC nowadays though (Especially under their newer management). Heard a few unsavory stories which gives me cause for concern. Was planning on buying a new pair soon and will have to pay close attention. Love your videos. Keep up the good work!
Robert, I enjoy your style very much. You’re well-shod as we say in horse country. I had never heard of AE before viewing your videos and I believe I’ve bought about 6 pairs since I subscribed your channel, including various seconds, one pair off eBay which was a like new pair of Stockbridge, and two pairs of first one of which had to be sent back (boot speed hooks pointed straight down!) Your content and delivery certainly have a lot of value and I hope you go ahead and accept whatever other youtubers get as you deserve it much more than most others I’ve seen. Lastly, As an aviator and warbird enthusiast, I am pleasantly by your distracted by the aviation deco I see in the background. Two thumbs up!
Jerry Guffey LOL thank you! I was curious if people noticed it. The basement rec room is the only room my wife let me decorate. It looks like an Applebee’s, LOL.
You did the right thing taking the shoe's back, seamed fair to have resoled which turned out a nice job, they looked really well when you added some mirror polish to the toes, good luck with the shoes enjoyed the video, cheers Robert
Hello Robert. Thank you for this video. Very honest and necessary. People need to know even with quality garments and shoes, mistakes happen. But we can measure the character of a brand by the way they deal with such problems.
Hello Robert: I just found your channel and I subscribed to it. I also like shoes a lot. In my opinion, when a customer pays the price of the product, he and she deserve a perfect product in return. I am very much frustrated with the people who charge perfect price or fee but fail to provide flawless service or product. I totally agree with you that you received the faulty shoes, it was your right to go back and ask them to fix it. In my further opinion, you experienced hardship and stress with the shoes by giving your extra time and work to visit the store and then wait for three weeks to get it back. Allen Edmon was supposed to compensate you for the undue work, you did on those shoes because of their negligence. It is most likely that some of their shoes have flaws and defects like your shoes, but so many people do not have the confidence to confront others on the issue. Especially, the people who were commenting that you got the shoes on sale. So what if you got on sale. It does not mean that one should accept a defective product.
Glad to see they took care of you and stood behind their product. That's all you can ask for. In the end, a company is only as good as it's employees and when they mess up, it's important to make it right for the customer. Sounds like that's what they did. AE seems to really fill the niche like you said with their wider widths and numerous styles/colors. I don't see any other manufactures doing it. Best of luck and I'll be waiting on the next vid
Sometime you wonder, how quality control operates. I purchased some Blake-Rapid shoes. After looking at the shoes and the sole in particular at home, I noticed that the shoes were only half sewn. When lighting at a shop is not that great, it is sometimes very difficult to see flaws. However I got my money back without major discussions. Apart from the shoe brand I now make sure, that I buy all of my shoes from shops where I know they are customer oriented and service is great and you don't have to wait for weeks for the shoes to be repaired.
It was $0. You might have missed the explanation, but it was a defect that showed up very shortly after purchasing the shoes new. They were first quality, not factory seconds.
Really appreciate the effort you make to be honest and balanced. Absolutely agree that they should have offered you something substantial to compensate; when one is paying top dollar, inconvenience like this is not on.
I’ve purchased 3 new pairs of AEs and they are all excellent. Also a small sample size, of course, but that’s my experience. Thanks for everything you do Bob!
Hey Bob, as always great video! I own approximately 10 pairs of Allen Edmonds myself and want to share some thoughts if that's okay. My biggest problem with AE is yes these shoes are very expensive and why does the customer have to find the issues? Your defect was VERY noticable and many of the defects I've personally had to address were very noticeable as well. Yes they are handmade so I understand there are going to be small imperfections but what quality control personnel would look at your particular shoes and still send them out the door? That's my big question with Allen Edmonds over the past couple of years. Just my thoughts I guess!
Shea Ellington - yes, That’s why I pointed out what I believe their market niche is. For me, having very wide feet, it’s hard to find another shoe that I can try on at the store, know I’m getting a well constructed shoe that should last decades with styling I like for that $220-$350 range.
Appreciate your content and perspective very much. I agree- there’s no brand that offers what AE does. There’s higher quality out there but the size variety is smaller and the price can be much higher. They offer what they offer for a price that is far above the strip mall shoe stores, but a small fraction of the higher brands that would have the attention of someone like Kirby Allison. Add to that the prospect of the recrafting service and they become almost special in the industry. For those that don’t like them, cool. Pay more and get what you want. I think they’re of sufficient quality and value to be worth my money. The extreme value they offer on the 2nd hand market, with some recrafting attention or some local cobbler attention, is splendid! One could easily have a nice shoe, that takes a polish well, that can least for years, with a great fit, for under the $150 mark - that’s not bad!
Very interesting and well done, Robert. Thank you for showing us. Sorry for the issues with your shoes, but I'm glad AE took care of you. Keep doing what you're doing!
Hello Bob. First thanks for sharing, I really don't understand why people have to be rude, you make your videos to exchange ideas and create some value but it is your take an opinion, if someone thinks differently that's fine they should make their own videos and just show why they think the way they do. As per the issue on hand, as long as you are satisfied you should be ok, personally I think there are so many other options for shoes, even some that accommodate oddities like having one foot being larger than the other. Again thanks for sharing and enjoy the shoes.
Hey there Robert! Really makes me wonder about the Allen Edmond’s final inspection process...? Who is running that factory and have they heard of the term Poka-Yoke or the idea of mistake proofing their process?
So far I have not has any real issues with the AE's i have purchased. Three new pairs with very minor issues that pass the five foot test for sure. The wide widths are great as I have found that other shoes don't fit too well and I have to break our the ole stretcher. Great video.
The big issue here is quality control! They are great shoes but this pair had a very obvious defect that should never have left their factory. Shame on AE for not catching this one. Further, I have to agree you should have been offered a brand new pair. Not made to wait for 3 weeks while they recrafted the shoe. At the very least they should have offered you $100.00 discount on your next pair for the inconvenience. You may want to check with their corporate office.
Robert Sweeney A discount on another purchase actually would be a very smart idea. Also, a brand new shoe: 1. It would still take a couple weeks to ship in a new shoe. I believe the Oxblood MacNeil in calf was discontinued too. 2. What if the new shoe has some other problem? 3. I didn’t have to re-break these in. Just other mitigating factors.
Robert Sweeney I sent a pair for RECRAFTING and when they were unable to do so they offered to sent a new pair but weeks Went by without any information as to when the pair they offered would arrive . When I finally sent an email to Allen Edmonds customer service to raise my concerns they quickly refunded me the amount i had paid for the recrafting and that was fine but I wish they would have been honest as and more communicative from the beginning .
Great video Bob. It got me thinking to go and check my AE shoes to see how well they were crafted. I'm a picky guy and can say that I have not studied the stitching on them. People can say they've bought many pairs without any problems, and others say that they quit AE because the quality has gotten so bad. Who knows what's right!? I know the pair you got should have never left the factory, even as a 2nd! Perhaps, years ago we didn't have the internet as an outlet for people to share this info, so word didn't spread that there were issues. I believe the quality of the materials and methods they use to construct their shoes is worth the price....if constructed properly. They will last a long, long time and look great if properly cared for. But, the customer shouldn't have to closely examine each pair for defects, or order 3+ pairs to find one that is right. It's a shame if that is where things are at with AE. We know they aren't getting $400 for every pair they make (frequent sales, factory 2nd's, etc.) but maybe that's what it takes to be profitable and manufacture a grade A quality shoe in the US.
Jeff Brogan - yes, the AE factory put the heel taps on. I had installed heel taps on them before I returned them. Brian, the store manager, told me if they have heel taps on them, Allen Edmonds will put a new pair of heel taps on. And Yes, the Top Lift Is different than the old “Victory” Top Lift, It’s one I haven’t seen before.
I had similar with one of the Northampton shoe makers, was sorted eventually but I haven't bought any more from them since ! I also agree that you should have been given another new pair.
I love my new AE Stuttgart, but there are some huge quality issues the biggest being the heels are hugely different in size and shape. One actually looks like an apprentice piece. I've contacted AE and will see what they recommend.
I’m not sure what you mean by the “extra runner edge”? Are you referring to the heel tacks? They’re also called heel cleats. They don’t come with the shoes, I added them on. They are adhesive backed and are also held on with 3 small nails. Since I added them onto the shoes before I sent them back to AE to be repaired, AE put a new pair of heel tacks on before they sent them to me. I actually have an entire separate video on heel tacks.
Robert - I too have had quality problems with AE. Have purchase two new pairs in the past 11 months but have had concerns about the workmanship. A pair of 5th Avenues with marring in the leather and a pair of Sanford’s with blemishes on the toe - and when replaced, the heel counters in the shoe were not in the middle of the back. I was assured each time by customer service that both pairs were first quality shoes - not seconds at all. Very disappointing. Frankly, I’m having better luck redrafting pre-owned AE shoes of higher quality.
I just realized this whole AE's QC problem from my purchase last week. My lesson is that try not to buy those on sale. A lot of those are obvious defected and should be categorized as F2, but AE are selling them as F1 'on sale'. I ordered 3 pairs and had to return 2 pairs because of the stitching problem.
Daniel R - here’s another factor... I heard that the Macneil model is being discontinued. I couldn’t fathom that they would purposely let things like this slip, but being that it’s a model on its way out maybe they’re rushing to finish them or something?
Hi Bob, I always enjoy your videos. I agree that A-E offers much better sizing possibilities and access to stores in some areas. This somewhat balances out QC issues. In this case the shoe should not have made it pass QC but mistakes happen. The point to remember is how the mistake was handled and corrected. In this case A-E should get an A or B+ grade. They fixed it. Now back to sizing flexibility. I wear 5.5E and can get away with 6D or E. Yes that is small but what can I do? I’m the opposite of 11EEE. Problem is A-E doesn’t offer those anymore so I can’t coun’t on them. Right now I’ve found English made brands that offer some solution. Keep the videos coming.
Great video Rob. It often is a very touchy subject about knowing the downsides of one's favourite brand. It is much like cars as you were comparing it to. Although i love Mercedes cars, there are some problems with particular models that have huge problems. Even though i know that, I wont stop buying the cars. I just need to know that the faults are there so i can avoid exploiting the weak spots.
Great video, Robert. Just yesterday I watched The Kavalier’s 50+ minute video on the company, including interviews with the CEO and the VP of product management (I think). Anyway, interesting history on the company but it does seem they have some QC challenges to work through. I have two pairs of AEs: a dark brown Fifth Avenue pair that I wish I would’ve sent back for a wider size and a pair of black Tate wingtips that fit perfectly. I’d love to get something in oxblood for sure. Keep making these cool videos, man.
My problem with AE is their stores run on commission. I usually wear a EEE boot and the guy tried selling me an E width boot because they had it inshore. In other words, he just wanted a sale more than he cared about me walking away with well fitting and comfortable shoes.
Les Beery LOL, no, feel like I’m turning 21 again, had an ingrown hair or something that resulted in a big pimple and a blemish that’s not completely gone yet. I thought about putting make up on it but you have to draw the line somewhere.
Purchased my first AE black oxford and I’m not happy with the finish too. I should’ve believed the reviews about Quality Control concerns. I’ll never buy from them again.
This has been a common problem recently on the toe-especially the outer side on right shoes and inner side on the left shoe. The stitching tends to be very close to the edge on several new shoes.
Ethan - I find this interesting - what’s your experience, if you don’t mind me asking? Do you just buy a lot of AE shoes? Or do you work in the shoe industry?
Those AE McNeils In Calfskin look great . AE doesn’t make “Gunboats” , Longwingtips anymore, at least in Calfskin . They have a few Cordovan Shell left, no Calfskin. Alden Gunboats, Barrie Last, steel shank, double-oak soles go for $615.
Depot on review. I recently purchased a pair of “First Quality” Leeds plain toe blucher with an identical problem, plus other obvious defects. I had to return them, no replacements available sadly.
Chuck Boyle that’s too bad... there was an excellent video done by The Elegant Oxford on the subject of AE quality. Preston, who runs the channel and produced the video took a tour of the AE factory. He was told that according to their own stats, their reruns has stayed around 3%. Also, according to the vast majority of people I’ve seen post about mistakes, the overwhelming majority say their service on correcting the issue is very good.
I'm torn on AE's handling of this. You had only had those for a short time, it wasn't a loose stitch or anything, it was multiple QC issues. Why wouldn't they just give you a brand new pair and apologize for your trouble? You spent good money on a shoe that had to be returned and you were without them for weeks before they give you a recrafted product.
Mike McCoy - FYI a brand new pair would have taken a couple weeks to get. Also, is it better to repair the “devil you know” versus the devil you don’t? What is the next pair has another different issue? These were broken into as well, so I didn’t have to re-break them in. It takes quite a while to break in a double oak sole shoe.
@@CobblerBob - Simple, if a second pair has ANY issues, you never buy another pair of Allen Edmonds; problem solved. (An observation, not an insult: you youngin's are too forgiving).
the welt start position in the RH side shoe was not very smartly located. it is in the are where the sole bends more often and the stitching will have to work extra due to the flexing of the sole, thus being more prone to be less durable.
Marguit Valdez - I’m reading your comment with these shoes on. I’ll be dog-gonned... you’re 100% right and I never noticed. It’s frustrating. AE gets it almost right, but not quite. Argh.
@@CobblerBob Do not worry at all. I was curious about you having an almost cult following of AE. However, understanding they make shoes that truly fit you is a blessing that overrides these minor details.
Those should have never made it past Quality Control, and TBH I'd worry about the whoever did the outsole stitching didn't own up to the mistake. I know it is a stunningly skillfull job, but as it is done by a human, we all make mistakes. I'd have expected AE to just say that they would replace with a brand new pair. They state on the AE website that a pair of shoes can only be recrafted 2 or 3 times, so in effect they have reduced the life of the shoe by 25% to 33%. (I believe that is because the factory recraft replaces the welt, and making new holes in the uppers, whereas Steve at Bedos leaves the welt on, and adjusts the sewing machine to use the same holes) Maybe we are a bit different in Europe, but I'd be a bit disappointed in AEs dealing with that. I had the rubber quarter tip on a pair of Loakes fail. As that didn't mean the sole would need replacing I didn't mind them re-heeling them, and they even changed from combo heel to Dainite heel at my request. Add in that they supplied me with a pre-paid label to send them back, and they came back with new shoe bags, two pairs of laces, and in a new box, I was impressed. Hopefully they give you years of service, and ignore the haters, when I get a notification that Steve or yourself put up a new video, I grab a coffee and a comfy seat!
I know I shouldn't be replying to my own post, but having thought about it, and had a look at the AE website, a couple of thoughts:- 1. They did you the "Standard" recrafting package, rather than the "Prestige", which they only charge out at $30 more retail, would it have really hurt them that much to impress? 2. It wasn't just the QC department, or the person who did the outsole stitching, but the people in the stages after that thought "It's OK, it will do, not my problem." Any one of them should have the authority to say "That is not up to Allen Edmonds standards." and pulled it off of the production line. 3. I can understand your dilemna, as AE cater for your sizing. Those of us that are boringly in the middle of size ranges (I'm 8.5F UK, which is a 9.5D US) and always moaning that their size always sells out quickly don't always appreciate how tough it is for others.
John, I whole heartedly agree, they should not have made it out of the factory. I definitely thought of exactly what you were talking about, limited number of times that the welt can replaced. In this case though, the welt is damaged, so no matter who did it it would’ve needed to be replaced. I would have loved to have sent it to Steve at Bedos Leatherworks, but unfortunately I’m fairly sure he’s not gonna do it for free. One of the other reasons (I forgot to say this in the video) I was OK with the repair, is that Brian said they put their best craftsman on repairs on issues like this, and will stitch the New welt through the original holes. Of course I can’t verify that though. Me personally, I just find that I’m not as “aggressive“ when I’m in front of a helpful friendly person.
@@CobblerBob I can understand that, it is hard to be overly firm when you feel that the person is trying to be helpful. And we can appreciate that you are caring & polite, even to your own detriment at times. It won't stop us callling you a lucky so-and-so for the bargains you get with some of your thrifting finds though! :-) I do find myself questioning whether any manufacturers recrafting service pts their "best" people on it, as Loake seem to say that their recrafting is put back through the normal production line - th-cam.com/video/yhGNHcwO9zI/w-d-xo.html I do envy you being Stateside, and being able to send to Steve @ Bedos. I have been told that there is a good repair shop not too far from me, so strangely enough a pair of US made boots, from my first USA holiday, wil be taken there for some TLC.
I would have assumed that there would be an end of line quality inspection taking place prior to shipping the product to the customer or retailer. It appears that more than one person dropped the ball on Robert's pair. I was interested in purchasing a pair of AE shoes but now I think I'll pass. To me, if I have any concerns with the quality control of any given product, I'll simply move on. As I notice here, there are more than a few folks that do have QC issues with AE these day. I'll look elsewhere!
I've heard about quality control slippage from AEs that's started happening the past few years, but it seems like they're able to make up for it with their customer service quality most of the time. It was good to see a positive outcome here, and as much as I'm not a wingtip guy, I like the color contrast you put on the toecaps! Also, don't know if you know this or not, and I might end up e-mailing AEs about it at some point if nobody on here knows, but do you know if they offer recrafting for shoes that were made on a discontinued last? You probably remember those Byrons I bought on eBay...still in awesome shape, but I'm just wondering about this for when the time does come to get them redone. The Byrons were made on the 4 last, which is no longer used by them, so I'm not sure if they'd be able to recraft them or not. Hoping you may be able to shed some light on this!
@@CobblerBob That's good to know. Just in case, you know how much an independent cobbler would charge on average to resole a pair of GYW dress shoes? The $125 charged by AE isn't cheap, but it's not quite expensive either considering all the stuff you get for that. I just wouldn't want to spend a whole ton on getting them re-soled when the time comes if I end up having to use an independent cobbler (sorry to be a cheepie, lol).
I apologize for missing your comment! I personally would rather take my shoes to a GOOD local cobbler than AE recrafting to be honest. One other consideration that Trenton & Heath brought up that I did not consider in this video is that whenever AE recrafts a pair of shoes, they replace the welt, whether it needs it or not. In the case of these shoes, the weld DID need to be replaced, but a local cobbler would hand stitch on a new welt, through the original holes, thus not pokin another set of holes in the uppers and gemming. When AE does it, they stitch on the new welt with a machine, and it will poke a new set of holes in the uppers and gemming. After doing this a couple times, the uppers and gemming will become swiss cheese. That's why AE only will recraft I believe a couple times.
Surprised to see a quite a few comments stating that AE should've done this, should've done that -- the occasional mistakes happen, as long as the mistake is remedied in a professional manner we can all be a little forgiving toward a company that's still trying to put out quality product while keeping their operations in the US.
Hey I am from Canada and there aren't no AE stores close by. I wanted to know if the shoe size of AE shoes are similar to Florsheim sizing or is it a bit bigger or a bit smaller? Thanks. I was thinking of getting a pair. I normally take between a 9.5 and 10 D.
UnboxingMania - watch this video: th-cam.com/video/rHD7qa6l2VY/w-d-xo.html I’m not just trying to evade your answer or drive you to watch another video, but I think it will help. While watching that video remember: my Allen Edmonds 65 and 97 last size is an 11.5 3E. On a Brannock Device, my left foot measures 11.5 E or EE, while my right foot measures 11 EEE. An AE 65 last or 97 last in size 11.5 E is too narrow though. That being said, I have a pair of Florsheim Castellano Wing Ox’s in 12D that fit well. I CANNOT Comfortably wear an Allen Edmonds 12D. Nor can I comfortably wear a Johnston & Murphy Melton (cap toe oxford) in 12D. I had a pair of J&M Meltons 11.5 3E that fit very similarly to, or maybe slightly wider than the Allen Edmonds Park Avenue 11.5 3E. So based on this, I would go out on a limb and say that the Florsheim runs slightly wide, while the AE and J&M run true to size? Also, IF you compare two similarly constructed shoes, measure the widest part of the outsole. As I said, make sure they are similarly constructed. In other words, do not compare a Blake Stitched shoe to a Goodyear Welted shoe. I have figured out that if the widest part of a Goodyear Welted shoe is less than 4-3/8” wide, it will not fit.
I’ve ordered a pair of Chelsea Allen Edmonds for $495. The pair I received was terrible. I was extremely disappointed! I returned them and bought a another pair. This 2nd pair was just as worse as the other. I called Customer Service and asked what was going on...not only does AE have QC issues but their customer service has issues as well. (rude/unprofessional) I finally drove an hour to Atl and found a pair that was on sale for $345. This pair still had minor perfections but I took them thinking I better grab these just in case I don’t find a better pair. I went to the second store in ATL and looked at another pair and as as soon as I seen them I was glad I bought the other pair! SMH Allen Edmonds... And having gone through all this trouble I just ordered 2 pair of Dalton’s. (SMH) Im hoping at least one of them is a keeper...we’ll see. Thanks for your video!
I think they handled the situation well. I would have settled for a repair on the shoes, but I'm a little disappointed to hear they didn't offer you at least a future discount.
Everyone has some quality control issues from time to time . People are not taking up traditional trades and finding quality people at this point must be a major issue. I like you have odd feet except mine are very narrow and yes I can use orthotics to replace the volume in a standard width shoe but it never fits perfectly.
chef souffle - yes it’s rpowers3 at NEO.rr.com. By “gamming” are you referring to the welt? The Gemming is in between the insole and cork and cannot be seen without removing the sole. The welt does have a cut in it. Every Goodyear Welted shoe has a joint where the welt starts and stops.
Bob, thanks for making this, If for no other reason is it does showcase the customer service side of AE which I think gets lost. I know I have gotten shoes with small imperfections and I wrestle with is it ok, should I send it back. Great to know AE didn't give you a hassle.
AE quality control is pretty much non-existent anymore. I've had to go through 4 pairs of shoes from them before to get one without defects. Sad for shoes that are over $400 MSRP. I think it's time to save up a little longer and upgrade to Alden's or some other premium brand.
The italien brands dont have wide shoes because here in europe we dont have wide sizes. We have EU42 EU43 etc and sometimes half sizes like EU42.5 But never heard about the 42 wide, double wide or tripple wide. And i also dont know anybody you told me his feed would be to wide for a shoe.
Italians just don’t have wide feet then? Wow. I’ve read that many Asians have wide feet (I’m half Asian). I have a friend Hayden (he’s been in a couple of my videos) who was born in England that wears EEEs in Allen Edmonds too. It’s not uncommon here.
67spankadelik - th-cam.com/video/rHD7qa6l2VY/w-d-xo.html That may help. Here’s what I can tell you from experience… The major brands that I have purchased in the past are Bostonian, Florsheim, Johnston & Murphy, Allen Edmonds. Based on that, I’d say AE and Johnston & Murphy run true to size. I believe Florsheim and Bostonian run a little wider on their D widths, and don’t seem to make wide widths readily available. I have Bostonians and Florsheims in a 12 D that I can wear comfortably, but I can never wear an 11 1/2 D or 12 D in Johnston & Murphy or Allen Edmonds.
Thought you were very patient and I hope you get years of wear and pleasure out of your AE shoes. Thanks for sharing (p.s you've been hitting us again with the 'happy reggae' ;-))
Your welome... sometime I save time by Re-using music. I try not to use it too many times though. It Does take a while to sort through and find decent copywrite free music.
@@CobblerBob No problem - I enjoy the shoe content. I've been buying off ebay here in the UK. I've had some good deals as well as a couple of not so good. I recently bought a pair of Church's tassel loafers in a nice brown leather; only I found out when I received them the sole was coming away from the upper; what is more, they had a 'false welt' so I couldn't get them resoled:-( I ended up getting my cobbler to glue the sole on - not sure how long it will last....but now I know to check for welt or at least a blake stitch.
I know what you mean. There are a lot of comments and reviews online about Allen Edmonds having quality control issues recently. I can say honestly that I've had a lot of luck with the shoes I’ve purchased from them recently. Even on Factory Seconds. But that being said, you do read some horrible reviews on the AE website, and to be fair, AE does respond to these issues publicly, and it seems they are more than willing to solve the issues people have with some of their shoes. I think people are a little harsh sometimes, I mean obviously we all want everything to be perfect when you invest in a pair of $300 shoes, but I guess when you have a factory and depend on people crafting things with their hands, there is always going to be a degree of variation in construction, right? I am still a fan of Allen Edmonds, I love their shoes. (Recently copped those Independence Collection Bartlett's on sale!) I just hope they stay on top of their game, and don't turn into like a Florsheim, or a Johnston and Murphy, where you can really see a drop in quality from what they used to be. The majority of AE shoes are still 360 Goodyear welted, and the quality of the leathers are still pretty damn good. I still have some wants from Allen Edmonds, and I am always looking for a good deal from them. And I hope they continue to be one of the premiere American shoe brands.
Returned the Dalton Boot 3x’s 1st time the started to rip up on day waited 2 months new pair was not a match they both shoes had spacing on the sole returned new pair I cannot wear the pain is way to much there appears to be a problem on the inside which crosses over on myy right toe..I have the same shoe in Oxblood had them for 5 years no problem wear with socks with out Sox dance ride my bike..I have 13 pairs of Allen’s There quality has dropped.
AE no doubt addressed the issue with your shoes. However, being a factory flaw, they should have exchanged your pair or added some value to your purchase. You are being inconvenienced by having to wait for the repairs to be completed as well as having to make the time to travel to the store on two separate occasions. They could have included a pair of shoe trees with the shoes to make up for their QC letdown.
Glenn Steven - yes, them coming back with a New set of shoe trees inside of them would’ve been a very smart move with a high level of perceived value. What are they, $30 retail? They probably cost 15 bucks to make? Not that it makes a big difference, but it was only one trip to the store, they shipped them directly to my office after the repair.
@@CobblerBob Hello Sir, would you mind telling me why when the Anglo-Saxons come to France, the French have to speak English and especially why when the French go to the USA they have to speak English? c'est bien Lafayette qui vous a sorti du caca it was le marquis de La Fayette who got you out of the shit, no?
I've bought Allen Edmonds for 10 years and have 10 different styles but I have noticed a drop off in quality control in the last 2 pairs bought. Was satisfied with the re-crafting on a pair of Mapleton's last year. I'm sure its hard to train the younger generation in the cobbler trade. The cobbler trade is going the way of mom and pop body shops, machine shops,welding shops, etc. I have looked at Alden's but closest store is 140 miles away and its best to try shoes on due to number of lasts used. I do plan on using The Hanger Projects Re-Crafting Services on the Parks and 2 pairs of Independence Collection. Kirby has numerous video's on the company he uses on TH-cam, impressive also.
These were obviously seconds hear in the U.K. they most I’ve payed is £220 for a pair of eves and grey I always give shoes a good glance to avoid issues, again in the U.K. finding a good cobbler to do a first class repair is like finding rocking horse shit
I’ve moved on from Allen Edmonds, the fit is sloppy and the finishing is not great. Took the step up to Carmina and the quality improvement is far worth the increase in cost. Far more stylish too
This is what Ive been telling you people about Allen edmonds shoes are full of flaws and defects it's not just your shoes Robert this brand it's gone down the hill that's why you see so many TH-camrs trying to promote their crap you don't see any body trying to promote Alden because there is no need because their shoes are solid no flaws and defects whatsoever.
I wish I knew where to start. Without trying to sound harsh, AE is in introductory luxury shoe. The only way to get consistently better footwear is to at least get into the $500 to $600 range. Then deal with long waits and limited styles. AE has never lied, they have always said that they source the best materials that they can. At their volume, you cannot expect the best calf made. There is just not enough to go around. AE has more QC issues during those two big sales every year when the pressure is on to pump out huge volume. As far as hand finishing is concerned, come on, at $395 spray on finish is the best you can expect. My last 40 pair of AE have been really good. But if you buy the Trunk Show shoes, they quality is right up there. For all that AE offers, the value is outstanding.
Phil Schiavone - so what I’ve just learned from your comment is that a new AE is not equal to all other new AE shoes? Timing & the channel through which you purchase a new first quality shoe can make a difference? Wow, I never knew that.
wow . The finish is horrendous for any self respecting company !! What was the QC doing ? I will sound like a bad guy but this requires an overhaul of the entire dept . The people really are not good at their job .
Manu B - ebay I say here is secondhand info, but apparently AE is struggling on hiring and retaining operators. It’s skilled labor, and I heard that even at $18 an hour they can’t retain good help. I’m sure every time the company is purchased, old timers close to retirement “hit the ejection seat” and retire. I have worked in manufacturing, and sometimes it’s astoundingly difficult to produce things consistently. Generally ownership/management change was the one thing that would create the biggest disruption in corporate morale. Workers’ attitudes are absolutely the most important thing in creating good product. I’m telling you, I can just picture it, there is somebody (or many people) in Quality Control and management going home at night in tears, missing dinners with their family, pulling their hair out while getting pressure from the top and bottom.
Robert Powers I think you pointed out the main reason why it is not as good at it used to be . I also understand the effort and skill required to maintain consistent output . All said and done in your case , it was a clear manufacturing defect and they should have just replaced it with a new one . Keep bringing out videos 👍Its a pleasure watching them !
This usually happens when you buy the Factory Seconds Brah... I never had a problem paying full price in the store....try that and I bet you get normal results.
I believe I covered this in the video, but these are not, I repeat NOT Factory Seconds. They are FIRST quality purchased on sale. Factory Seconds AEs will have a shoe profile shaped stamp on the bottom of the sole in the arch area. I hate to say this, but in the last few years, flaws on AEs are getting more common.
@@CobblerBob NO doubt AE's are going down in quality. I just checked out a pair of Beckett Simonon and WOW! You make outstanding content for sure! Thanks for all that you do with these projects!
This is why I never buy Allen edmonds there is no other brand that makes expensive shoes with so many defects and flaws and by the way they have a severe problem almost every pair of Allen edmonds shoes have defects and flaws trust me
Arvind Sahai - of course I am just speculating, but I was told that model went on sale because they were being discontinued. If they were on sale because of the defects, they should/would have been marked with a factory seconds stamp, which looks like a little shoe silhouette stamped into the bottom of the sole in the arch area.
Bob, you are a much more patient guy than me. If they were my shoes I would have demanded a new pair. I paid for new I want new wether they are on sale or not. I would not have settled for refurb and a three plus week wait. I enjoy your videos very much and appreciate your honesty and candor. Keep up the great informative work. P.s. I own three pair of Allen Edmond,s shoes and enjoy the fit and quality. So far no issues.
FYI, there probably would have been a 2 week wait on a new pair. 11.5 3e in oxblood is not something they keep on the shelf. Plus I didn’t have to break in mine. Just other factors.
Very nice Bob, they turned out good. Now enjoy them.
P.S. thanks for the shout out.👍👍
👊🏼
Posted the link to you 🤣, I should have known you were on the ball
Robert I wanted to thank you for creating an honest and very informative video. I also would like to thank you for pointing out the struggle for folks with wide feet.
I just purchased two pairs of Allen Edmond's shoes, a Randolph Loafer in Chili and a cap toe oxford in Black, and happy with them. I had been wearing Bostonian and Johnston and Murphy since the mid-1990s, but the quality is missing today. I enjoy your reviews and opinions, and your assessments are generally correct.
To my viewers (and hopefully AE management):
There were a few comments about requesting a NEW PAIR of shoes instead of repairing mine. Here are some other mitigating factors to that:
1. It would still take a couple weeks to ship in a new shoe. I believe the Oxblood MacNeil in calf was discontinued too. So it’s not like I could have walked out of the store with a brand new pair of that same shoe.
2. What if the new shoe has some other problem? Then I’m back at square one. At least I know the issue with mine.
3. I didn’t have to re-break these in.
Just other factors to consider.
I do wish they would have offered me a free upgrade to JR soles, or a $100 discount off of a new pair or something. I was put out and had to take 2-3 hours out of my day to drive up to the store.
Please watch the following amazing video featuring interviews with the Allen Edmonds management & President by The Kavalier: th-cam.com/video/2lUaxYPTr0g/w-d-xo.html
Robert Powers as I said in my previous comment Bob, the stitching on the welt looks like it’s frayed at the back and the overall finish around the welt area still looks pretty shoddy for the price these cost, plus remember the laces section piping still looks like it could catch something and tear as it’s pretty poor as well. I love AE and have only had good personal experience of their shoes, however, the last new pair I purchased was about ten years ago and looking at yours I would regard these even at first as seconds not top new stock.
I would not be happy with what they sent you back and I hope Alan Edmonds not only steps up to the plate and simply replace these but also do something about QC as these are really shoddy still and look like they have been fixed by an apprentice just taken on!
i bought several allen edmonds lately and the customer service, both in the store and on the phone has been incredible. i bought my shoes on sale, between 109 and 149 dollars, all originally 425 to 455(boots). no qc issues here.
are those the double butyl soles on the shoes? i have those on my leeds 2 oxblood.
They are double oak (double thickness) soles yes, but not the butyl. I believe that’s the oil infused more waterproof leather.
@@CobblerBob yes, the butyl ones are more water resistant and wear longer.
Hey I'm a new viewer and newcomer to the world of dressing more elegant and formal. I'm still a young lad in college but I love your videos and I enjoy how well spoken you are in all of your videos. Please keep up all the great work!
I remember when you showed these the first time and quite a few of us said the quality was terrible, I’m glad you are sending them back. Their QC person needs to be issued with a new pair of glasses! Mind, I have now got to the part when you have them back. I’m not impressed with the welt stitching at the back, it looks frayed already
Bob, I think you portray a fair and accurate assessment of the ‘state of the state’ of Allen Edmonds. I’ve been quite fortunate with my AE purchases as I’ve bought over 15 pair of shoes/boots over the past 2 1/2 years or so. Many have been factory seconds and I’ve had difficulty finding any flaws with the shoes. On rare occasions I’ve received a shoe which I could not wear as the defect was so severe, however; for the most part I’m very pleased with AE’s quality. Customer service, is in my opinion, outstanding. In summary, I find your video to be very informative, interesting and as always, of very high quality. Great job! Ed
Ed F thanks again Ed! 15 pairs in 2.5 yrs?! 😲👊🏼😳👍🏼
@@CobblerBob Don't go there! I know exactly where Ed is coming from. I bought my first pair of good shoes in April 2019. It's only August 2019, and I am at eleven pairs already!! 7 pairs of them are Loakes.
My first Allen Edmonds from them, I returned for similar reasons. I got 2 pairs but received 5 pairs of Allen Edmonds because of sizing issues from Nordstrom. All 5 Allen Edmonds from Nordstrom were in excellent condition. I wonder if others had similar experiences. The first pair from Allen Edmonds was clearly a 2nd's they wanted to get rid of just like yours.
I love AEs. Never had a problem and own 11pairs. Am curious about the QC nowadays though (Especially under their newer management). Heard a few unsavory stories which gives me cause for concern. Was planning on buying a new pair soon and will have to pay close attention. Love your videos. Keep up the good work!
Robert,
I enjoy your style very much. You’re well-shod as we say in horse country. I had never heard of AE before viewing your videos and I believe I’ve bought about 6 pairs since I subscribed your channel, including various seconds, one pair off eBay which was a like new pair of Stockbridge, and two pairs of first one of which had to be sent back (boot speed hooks pointed straight down!)
Your content and delivery certainly have a lot of value and I hope you go ahead and accept whatever other youtubers get as you deserve it much more than most others I’ve seen.
Lastly, As an aviator and warbird enthusiast, I am pleasantly by your distracted by the aviation deco I see in the background. Two thumbs up!
Jerry Guffey LOL thank you! I was curious if people noticed it. The basement rec room is the only room my wife let me decorate. It looks like an Applebee’s, LOL.
You did the right thing taking the shoe's back, seamed fair to have resoled which turned out a nice job, they looked really well when you added some mirror polish to the toes, good luck with the shoes enjoyed the video, cheers Robert
Robert, thank you for another informative and, dare I say, entertaining video. Your efforts do not go unappreciated! Looking forward to the next...
🙏🏼 👊🏼
Loved your analysis!Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts.Fantastic job.Keep 'em coming.
Hello Robert. Thank you for this video. Very honest and necessary. People need to know even with quality garments and shoes, mistakes happen. But we can measure the character of a brand by the way they deal with such problems.
Hello Robert: I just found your channel and I subscribed to it. I also like shoes a lot. In my opinion, when a customer pays the price of the product, he and she deserve a perfect product in return. I am very much frustrated with the people who charge perfect price or fee but fail to provide flawless service or product. I totally agree with you that you received the faulty shoes, it was your right to go back and ask them to fix it. In my further opinion, you experienced hardship and stress with the shoes by giving your extra time and work to visit the store and then wait for three weeks to get it back. Allen Edmon was supposed to compensate you for the undue work, you did on those shoes because of their negligence. It is most likely that some of their shoes have flaws and defects like your shoes, but so many people do not have the confidence to confront others on the issue. Especially, the people who were commenting that you got the shoes on sale. So what if you got on sale. It does not mean that one should accept a defective product.
Thank you for the video and I am glad it all turned out better then I expected. God bless and Godspeed.
Homero Garza thank you!
Comments might be interesting to read but I wouldn’t pay much attention to them. You just keep informing and entertaining us.
👊🏼 you got it!
Glad to see they took care of you and stood behind their product. That's all you can ask for. In the end, a company is only as good as it's employees and when they mess up, it's important to make it right for the customer. Sounds like that's what they did. AE seems to really fill the niche like you said with their wider widths and numerous styles/colors. I don't see any other manufactures doing it. Best of luck and I'll be waiting on the next vid
Sometime you wonder, how quality control operates. I purchased some Blake-Rapid shoes. After looking at the shoes and the sole in particular at home, I noticed that the shoes were only half sewn. When lighting at a shop is not that great, it is sometimes very difficult to see flaws. However I got my money back without major discussions. Apart from the shoe brand I now make sure, that I buy all of my shoes from shops where I know they are customer oriented and service is great and you don't have to wait for weeks for the shoes to be repaired.
They did a great job. Would you mind sharing what did it cost you for this recrafting. 👍
It was $0. You might have missed the explanation, but it was a defect that showed up very shortly after purchasing the shoes new. They were first quality, not factory seconds.
Really appreciate the effort you make to be honest and balanced. Absolutely agree that they should have offered you something substantial to compensate; when one is paying top dollar, inconvenience like this is not on.
I’ve purchased 3 new pairs of AEs and they are all excellent. Also a small sample size, of course, but that’s my experience. Thanks for everything you do Bob!
Thanks for sharing, it's so hard to tell what the percentage of "bad" AEs are, since the good experiences get shared far less than the bad ones.
Hey Bob, as always great video! I own approximately 10 pairs of Allen Edmonds myself and want to share some thoughts if that's okay. My biggest problem with AE is yes these shoes are very expensive and why does the customer have to find the issues? Your defect was VERY noticable and many of the defects I've personally had to address were very noticeable as well. Yes they are handmade so I understand there are going to be small imperfections but what quality control personnel would look at your particular shoes and still send them out the door? That's my big question with Allen Edmonds over the past couple of years. Just my thoughts I guess!
Shea Ellington - yes, That’s why I pointed out what I believe their market niche is. For me, having very wide feet, it’s hard to find another shoe that I can try on at the store, know I’m getting a well constructed shoe that should last decades with styling I like for that $220-$350 range.
Appreciate your content and perspective very much.
I agree- there’s no brand that offers what AE does. There’s higher quality out there but the size variety is smaller and the price can be much higher.
They offer what they offer for a price that is far above the strip mall shoe stores, but a small fraction of the higher brands that would have the attention of someone like Kirby Allison.
Add to that the prospect of the recrafting service and they become almost special in the industry.
For those that don’t like them, cool. Pay more and get what you want. I think they’re of sufficient quality and value to be worth my money. The extreme value they offer on the 2nd hand market, with some recrafting attention or some local cobbler attention, is splendid! One could easily have a nice shoe, that takes a polish well, that can least for years, with a great fit, for under the $150 mark - that’s not bad!
EXACTLY! Spot on.
Do they require proof of purchase at the AE store? I'm one of those who has no clue where my receipts end up once the sun is down. Thanks.
Very interesting and well done, Robert. Thank you for showing us. Sorry for the issues with your shoes, but I'm glad AE took care of you. Keep doing what you're doing!
Hello Bob. First thanks for sharing, I really don't understand why people have to be rude, you make your videos to exchange ideas and create some value but it is your take an opinion, if someone thinks differently that's fine they should make their own videos and just show why they think the way they do.
As per the issue on hand, as long as you are satisfied you should be ok, personally I think there are so many other options for shoes, even some that accommodate oddities like having one foot being larger than the other. Again thanks for sharing and enjoy the shoes.
You’re welcome!
Hey there Robert!
Really makes me wonder about the Allen Edmond’s final inspection process...? Who is running that factory and have they heard of the term Poka-Yoke or the idea of mistake proofing their process?
So far I have not has any real issues with the AE's i have purchased. Three new pairs with very minor issues that pass the five foot test for sure. The wide widths are great as I have found that other shoes don't fit too well and I have to break our the ole stretcher. Great video.
Agree with you I wear 8.5 EEE Choices seem limited for high quality shoes that fit.
3:05 ... amazing stuff like this passes through the final inspection. they shouldn't even be sold as factory seconds.
The big issue here is quality control! They are great shoes but this pair had a very obvious defect that should never have left their factory. Shame on AE for not catching this one. Further, I have to agree you should have been offered a brand new pair. Not made to wait for 3 weeks while they recrafted the shoe. At the very least they should have offered you $100.00 discount on your next pair for the inconvenience. You may want to check with their corporate office.
Robert Sweeney A discount on another purchase actually would be a very smart idea. Also, a brand new shoe:
1. It would still take a couple weeks to ship in a new shoe. I believe the Oxblood MacNeil in calf was discontinued too.
2. What if the new shoe has some other problem?
3. I didn’t have to re-break these in.
Just other mitigating factors.
A fault that very much ruins the shoe, but at the same time one that is maybe not very visible when the shoe is brand new.
Robert Sweeney I sent a pair for RECRAFTING and when they were unable to do so they offered to sent a new pair but weeks Went by without any information as to when the pair they offered would arrive . When I finally sent an email to Allen Edmonds customer service to raise my concerns they quickly refunded me the amount i had paid for the recrafting and that was fine but I wish they would have been honest as and more communicative from the beginning .
Great video Bob. It got me thinking to go and check my AE shoes to see how well they were crafted. I'm a picky guy and can say that I have not studied the stitching on them. People can say they've bought many pairs without any problems, and others say that they quit AE because the quality has gotten so bad. Who knows what's right!? I know the pair you got should have never left the factory, even as a 2nd! Perhaps, years ago we didn't have the internet as an outlet for people to share this info, so word didn't spread that there were issues. I believe the quality of the materials and methods they use to construct their shoes is worth the price....if constructed properly. They will last a long, long time and look great if properly cared for. But, the customer shouldn't have to closely examine each pair for defects, or order 3+ pairs to find one that is right. It's a shame if that is where things are at with AE. We know they aren't getting $400 for every pair they make (frequent sales, factory 2nd's, etc.) but maybe that's what it takes to be profitable and manufacture a grade A quality shoe in the US.
Thanks for the video. I like how you went through the process of getting them refracted through a store rep.
Did they come to you with the heel guards? Also that toplift looks different from the typical AE rubber
Jeff Brogan - yes, the AE factory put the heel taps on. I had installed heel taps on them before I returned them. Brian, the store manager, told me if they have heel taps on them, Allen Edmonds will put a new pair of heel taps on. And Yes, the Top Lift Is different than the old “Victory” Top Lift, It’s one I haven’t seen before.
Robert Powers thank you for the info. If the “click” or “knock” sound lost with this new rubber heel? Hope not. Thanks again for your content!
I had similar with one of the Northampton shoe makers, was sorted eventually but I haven't bought any more from them since !
I also agree that you should have been given another new pair.
I love my new AE Stuttgart, but there are some huge quality issues the biggest being the heels are hugely different in size and shape. One actually looks like an apprentice piece. I've contacted AE and will see what they recommend.
Peter Adams from everything I’ve seen their customer service is very good on repairing/replacing shoes with defects.
Thanks for the video Bob, where did you get that rubber heel with that extra rubber edge? Looks pretty good, I own the exact pair, 11.5D. Oxblood
I’m not sure what you mean by the “extra runner edge”? Are you referring to the heel tacks? They’re also called heel cleats. They don’t come with the shoes, I added them on. They are adhesive backed and are also held on with 3 small nails. Since I added them onto the shoes before I sent them back to AE to be repaired, AE put a new pair of heel tacks on before they sent them to me. I actually have an entire separate video on heel tacks.
Semes like that one AE department represents the majority of AE's QC issues
Robert - I too have had quality problems with AE. Have purchase two new pairs in the past 11 months but have had concerns about the workmanship. A pair of 5th Avenues with marring in the leather and a pair of Sanford’s with blemishes on the toe - and when replaced, the heel counters in the shoe were not in the middle of the back. I was assured each time by customer service that both pairs were first quality shoes - not seconds at all. Very disappointing. Frankly, I’m having better luck redrafting pre-owned AE shoes of higher quality.
I just realized this whole AE's QC problem from my purchase last week. My lesson is that try not to buy those on sale. A lot of those are obvious defected and should be categorized as F2, but AE are selling them as F1 'on sale'. I ordered 3 pairs and had to return 2 pairs because of the stitching problem.
Daniel R - here’s another factor... I heard that the Macneil model is being discontinued. I couldn’t fathom that they would purposely let things like this slip, but being that it’s a model on its way out maybe they’re rushing to finish them or something?
Hi Bob, I always enjoy your videos. I agree that A-E offers much better sizing possibilities and access to stores in some areas. This somewhat balances out QC issues. In this case the shoe should not have made it pass QC but mistakes happen. The point to remember is how the mistake was handled and corrected. In this case A-E should get an A or B+ grade. They fixed it. Now back to sizing flexibility. I wear 5.5E and can get away with 6D or E. Yes that is small but what can I do? I’m the opposite of 11EEE. Problem is A-E doesn’t offer those anymore so I can’t coun’t on them. Right now I’ve found English made brands that offer some solution. Keep the videos coming.
Thank you! Wow, interesting!
Great video Rob. It often is a very touchy subject about knowing the downsides of one's favourite brand. It is much like cars as you were comparing it to. Although i love Mercedes cars, there are some problems with particular models that have huge problems. Even though i know that, I wont stop buying the cars. I just need to know that the faults are there so i can avoid exploiting the weak spots.
You nailed it! I knew that Allen Edmonds cobblers were drinking on the job. Definitely explains the quality control issues. Nice video!
Alan Albright 😂😂😂
Great video, Robert. Just yesterday I watched The Kavalier’s 50+ minute video on the company, including interviews with the CEO and the VP of product management (I think). Anyway, interesting history on the company but it does seem they have some QC challenges to work through.
I have two pairs of AEs: a dark brown Fifth Avenue pair that I wish I would’ve sent back for a wider size and a pair of black Tate wingtips that fit perfectly. I’d love to get something in oxblood for sure.
Keep making these cool videos, man.
Eye Heart Sushi - yes, i saw that video, and intend to finish watching it tonight!
My problem with AE is their stores run on commission. I usually wear a EEE boot and the guy tried selling me an E width boot because they had it inshore. In other words, he just wanted a sale more than he cared about me walking away with well fitting and comfortable shoes.
Miguel Vargas yeah, that’s not cool. He might make a quick sale, but he’d loose a lifetime customer.
I’m always happy when a company comes through after an error or a flaw. By the way, do you have a smear of shoe polish under your bottom lip?
Les Beery LOL, no, feel like I’m turning 21 again, had an ingrown hair or something that resulted in a big pimple and a blemish that’s not completely gone yet. I thought about putting make up on it but you have to draw the line somewhere.
Purchased my first AE black oxford and I’m not happy with the finish too. I should’ve believed the reviews about Quality Control concerns. I’ll never buy from them again.
You paid it well and it should be at its' best.
This has been a common problem recently on the toe-especially the outer side on right shoes and inner side on the left shoe. The stitching tends to be very close to the edge on several new shoes.
Ethan - I find this interesting - what’s your experience, if you don’t mind me asking? Do you just buy a lot of AE shoes? Or do you work in the shoe industry?
Those AE McNeils In Calfskin look great . AE doesn’t make “Gunboats” , Longwingtips anymore, at least in Calfskin . They have a few Cordovan Shell left, no Calfskin. Alden Gunboats, Barrie Last, steel shank, double-oak soles go for $615.
Depot on review. I recently purchased a pair of “First Quality” Leeds plain toe blucher with an identical problem, plus other obvious defects. I had to return them, no replacements available sadly.
Chuck Boyle that’s too bad... there was an excellent video done by The Elegant Oxford on the subject of AE quality. Preston, who runs the channel and produced the video took a tour of the AE factory. He was told that according to their own stats, their reruns has stayed around 3%. Also, according to the vast majority of people I’ve seen post about mistakes, the overwhelming majority say their service on correcting the issue is very good.
I'm torn on AE's handling of this. You had only had those for a short time, it wasn't a loose stitch or anything, it was multiple QC issues. Why wouldn't they just give you a brand new pair and apologize for your trouble? You spent good money on a shoe that had to be returned and you were without them for weeks before they give you a recrafted product.
Mike McCoy - FYI a brand new pair would have taken a couple weeks to get. Also, is it better to repair the “devil you know” versus the devil you don’t? What is the next pair has another different issue? These were broken into as well, so I didn’t have to re-break them in. It takes quite a while to break in a double oak sole shoe.
Mike McCoy - Exactly! As I said previously, he never got what he agreed to buy: a NEW, 1ST QUALITY pair of shoes.
@@CobblerBob - Simple, if a second pair has ANY issues, you never buy another pair of Allen Edmonds; problem solved. (An observation, not an insult: you youngin's are too forgiving).
Robert Powers yes, but now you have wasted a recraft, which put extra holes in your uppers. A new pair would have been better.
Definitely return them. You paid good money for these shoes and should expect the same in return.
the welt start position in the RH side shoe was not very smartly located. it is in the are where the sole bends more often and the stitching will have to work extra due to the flexing of the sole, thus being more prone to be less durable.
Marguit Valdez - I’m reading your comment with these shoes on. I’ll be dog-gonned... you’re 100% right and I never noticed. It’s frustrating. AE gets it almost right, but not quite. Argh.
@@CobblerBob Do not worry at all. I was curious about you having an almost cult following of AE. However, understanding they make shoes that truly fit you is a blessing that overrides these minor details.
Those should have never made it past Quality Control, and TBH I'd worry about the whoever did the outsole stitching didn't own up to the mistake. I know it is a stunningly skillfull job, but as it is done by a human, we all make mistakes. I'd have expected AE to just say that they would replace with a brand new pair.
They state on the AE website that a pair of shoes can only be recrafted 2 or 3 times, so in effect they have reduced the life of the shoe by 25% to 33%. (I believe that is because the factory recraft replaces the welt, and making new holes in the uppers, whereas Steve at Bedos leaves the welt on, and adjusts the sewing machine to use the same holes)
Maybe we are a bit different in Europe, but I'd be a bit disappointed in AEs dealing with that.
I had the rubber quarter tip on a pair of Loakes fail. As that didn't mean the sole would need replacing I didn't mind them re-heeling them, and they even changed from combo heel to Dainite heel at my request. Add in that they supplied me with a pre-paid label to send them back, and they came back with new shoe bags, two pairs of laces, and in a new box, I was impressed.
Hopefully they give you years of service, and ignore the haters, when I get a notification that Steve or yourself put up a new video, I grab a coffee and a comfy seat!
I know I shouldn't be replying to my own post, but having thought about it, and had a look at the AE website, a couple of thoughts:-
1. They did you the "Standard" recrafting package, rather than the "Prestige", which they only charge out at $30 more retail, would it have really hurt them that much to impress?
2. It wasn't just the QC department, or the person who did the outsole stitching, but the people in the stages after that thought "It's OK, it will do, not my problem." Any one of them should have the authority to say "That is not up to Allen Edmonds standards." and pulled it off of the production line.
3. I can understand your dilemna, as AE cater for your sizing. Those of us that are boringly in the middle of size ranges (I'm 8.5F UK, which is a 9.5D US) and always moaning that their size always sells out quickly don't always appreciate how tough it is for others.
John, I whole heartedly agree, they should not have made it out of the factory. I definitely thought of exactly what you were talking about, limited number of times that the welt can replaced. In this case though, the welt is damaged, so no matter who did it it would’ve needed to be replaced. I would have loved to have sent it to Steve at Bedos Leatherworks, but unfortunately I’m fairly sure he’s not gonna do it for free. One of the other reasons (I forgot to say this in the video) I was OK with the repair, is that Brian said they put their best craftsman on repairs on issues like this, and will stitch the New welt through the original holes. Of course I can’t verify that though. Me personally, I just find that I’m not as “aggressive“ when I’m in front of a helpful friendly person.
@@CobblerBob I can understand that, it is hard to be overly firm when you feel that the person is trying to be helpful. And we can appreciate that you are caring & polite, even to your own detriment at times. It won't stop us callling you a lucky so-and-so for the bargains you get with some of your thrifting finds though! :-)
I do find myself questioning whether any manufacturers recrafting service pts their "best" people on it, as Loake seem to say that their recrafting is put back through the normal production line - th-cam.com/video/yhGNHcwO9zI/w-d-xo.html
I do envy you being Stateside, and being able to send to Steve @ Bedos. I have been told that there is a good repair shop not too far from me, so strangely enough a pair of US made boots, from my first USA holiday, wil be taken there for some TLC.
Hello, what do you think about Loake quality compare to like AE? And which line do you think is best for value?
I would have assumed that there would be an end of line quality inspection taking place prior to shipping the product to the customer or retailer. It appears that more than one person dropped the ball on Robert's pair. I was interested in purchasing a pair of AE shoes but now I think I'll pass. To me, if I have any concerns with the quality control of any given product, I'll simply move on. As I notice here, there are more than a few folks that do have QC issues with AE these day. I'll look elsewhere!
I've heard about quality control slippage from AEs that's started happening the past few years, but it seems like they're able to make up for it with their customer service quality most of the time. It was good to see a positive outcome here, and as much as I'm not a wingtip guy, I like the color contrast you put on the toecaps!
Also, don't know if you know this or not, and I might end up e-mailing AEs about it at some point if nobody on here knows, but do you know if they offer recrafting for shoes that were made on a discontinued last? You probably remember those Byrons I bought on eBay...still in awesome shape, but I'm just wondering about this for when the time does come to get them redone. The Byrons were made on the 4 last, which is no longer used by them, so I'm not sure if they'd be able to recraft them or not. Hoping you may be able to shed some light on this!
Matt W - I’m Pretty sure they will recraft shoes regardless of whether or not they still produce them.
@@CobblerBob That's good to know. Just in case, you know how much an independent cobbler would charge on average to resole a pair of GYW dress shoes? The $125 charged by AE isn't cheap, but it's not quite expensive either considering all the stuff you get for that. I just wouldn't want to spend a whole ton on getting them re-soled when the time comes if I end up having to use an independent cobbler (sorry to be a cheepie, lol).
Looks like a training issue with a green shoe technician that wasn’t checked by a senior technicians and quality control
“Best people are at recrafting department “ ....maybe it makes sense to switch that? However, AE seems to get a lot of market pressure
I apologize for missing your comment! I personally would rather take my shoes to a GOOD local cobbler than AE recrafting to be honest. One other consideration that Trenton & Heath brought up that I did not consider in this video is that whenever AE recrafts a pair of shoes, they replace the welt, whether it needs it or not. In the case of these shoes, the weld DID need to be replaced, but a local cobbler would hand stitch on a new welt, through the original holes, thus not pokin another set of holes in the uppers and gemming. When AE does it, they stitch on the new welt with a machine, and it will poke a new set of holes in the uppers and gemming. After doing this a couple times, the uppers and gemming will become swiss cheese. That's why AE only will recraft I believe a couple times.
Yeah that's a return for sure great video
Thank you for posting.
Thank you for sharing love your channel great information
Surprised to see a quite a few comments stating that AE should've done this, should've done that -- the occasional mistakes happen, as long as the mistake is remedied in a professional manner we can all be a little forgiving toward a company that's still trying to put out quality product while keeping their operations in the US.
Hey I am from Canada and there aren't no AE stores close by. I wanted to know if the shoe size of AE shoes are similar to Florsheim sizing or is it a bit bigger or a bit smaller? Thanks. I was thinking of getting a pair. I normally take between a 9.5 and 10 D.
UnboxingMania - watch this video:
th-cam.com/video/rHD7qa6l2VY/w-d-xo.html
I’m not just trying to evade your answer or drive you to watch another video, but I think it will help. While watching that video remember: my Allen Edmonds 65 and 97 last size is an 11.5 3E. On a Brannock Device, my left foot measures 11.5 E or EE, while my right foot measures 11 EEE. An AE 65 last or 97 last in size 11.5 E is too narrow though.
That being said, I have a pair of Florsheim Castellano Wing Ox’s in 12D that fit well. I CANNOT Comfortably wear an Allen Edmonds 12D. Nor can I comfortably wear a Johnston & Murphy Melton (cap toe oxford) in 12D. I had a pair of J&M Meltons 11.5 3E that fit very similarly to, or maybe slightly wider than the Allen Edmonds Park Avenue 11.5 3E. So based on this, I would go out on a limb and say that the Florsheim runs slightly wide, while the AE and J&M run true to size?
Also, IF you compare two similarly constructed shoes, measure the widest part of the outsole. As I said, make sure they are similarly constructed. In other words, do not compare a Blake Stitched shoe to a Goodyear Welted shoe. I have figured out that if the widest part of a Goodyear Welted shoe is less than 4-3/8” wide, it will not fit.
@@CobblerBob thanks for the answer!! 👍
I’ve ordered a pair of Chelsea Allen Edmonds for $495. The pair I received was terrible. I was extremely disappointed!
I returned them and bought a another pair. This 2nd pair was just as worse as the other. I called Customer Service and asked what was going on...not only does AE have QC issues but their customer service has issues as well. (rude/unprofessional) I finally drove an hour to Atl and found a pair that was on sale for $345. This pair still had minor perfections but I took them thinking I better grab these just in case I don’t find a better pair. I went to the second store in ATL and looked at another pair and as as soon as I seen them I was glad I bought the other pair! SMH Allen Edmonds...
And having gone through all this trouble I just ordered 2 pair of Dalton’s. (SMH) Im hoping at least one of them is a keeper...we’ll see. Thanks for your video!
I think they handled the situation well. I would have settled for a repair on the shoes, but I'm a little disappointed to hear they didn't offer you at least a future discount.
Matt Sitton - yes, good point. I wish I would have thought of that going in! 😣
Everyone has some quality control issues from time to time . People are not taking up traditional trades and finding quality people at this point must be a major issue. I like you have odd feet except mine are very narrow and yes I can use orthotics to replace the volume in a standard width shoe but it never fits perfectly.
Great content and much appreciated.
It looks like the gamming is cut up, and not one piece.
Do you have an e-mail?
chef souffle - yes it’s rpowers3 at NEO.rr.com.
By “gamming” are you referring to the welt? The Gemming is in between the insole and cork and cannot be seen without removing the sole. The welt does have a cut in it. Every Goodyear Welted shoe has a joint where the welt starts and stops.
Disregard the trolls, Robert! I enjoy your videos
Bob, thanks for making this, If for no other reason is it does showcase the customer service side of AE which I think gets lost. I know I have gotten shoes with small imperfections and I wrestle with is it ok, should I send it back. Great to know AE didn't give you a hassle.
AE quality control is pretty much non-existent anymore. I've had to go through 4 pairs of shoes from them before to get one without defects. Sad for shoes that are over $400 MSRP. I think it's time to save up a little longer and upgrade to Alden's or some other premium brand.
TheDobbermn - you know... you might be right.
You as a shoe guy, how did you not notice these issues right out of the box?
ShowMe - it wasn’t noticeable until the welt started separating from the sole.
I cannot agree more! AE quality is poor at best.
The italien brands dont have wide shoes because here in europe we dont have wide sizes. We have EU42 EU43 etc and sometimes half sizes like EU42.5 But never heard about the 42 wide, double wide or tripple wide. And i also dont know anybody you told me his feed would be to wide for a shoe.
Italians just don’t have wide feet then? Wow. I’ve read that many Asians have wide feet (I’m half Asian). I have a friend Hayden (he’s been in a couple of my videos) who was born in England that wears EEEs in Allen Edmonds too. It’s not uncommon here.
Can anyone tell me if Allen Edmonds shoes are true to size?
67spankadelik - th-cam.com/video/rHD7qa6l2VY/w-d-xo.html
That may help. Here’s what I can tell you from experience… The major brands that I have purchased in the past are Bostonian, Florsheim, Johnston & Murphy, Allen Edmonds. Based on that, I’d say AE and Johnston & Murphy run true to size. I believe Florsheim and Bostonian run a little wider on their D widths, and don’t seem to make wide widths readily available. I have Bostonians and Florsheims in a 12 D that I can wear comfortably, but I can never wear an 11 1/2 D or 12 D in Johnston & Murphy or Allen Edmonds.
17:10 ... hahahahahaha! great analogy! "their good, BUT...."
Thought you were very patient and I hope you get years of wear and pleasure out of your AE shoes.
Thanks for sharing (p.s you've been hitting us again with the 'happy reggae' ;-))
Your welome... sometime I save time by Re-using music. I try not to use it too many times though. It Does take a while to sort through and find decent copywrite free music.
@@CobblerBob No problem - I enjoy the shoe content. I've been buying off ebay here in the UK. I've had some good deals as well as a couple of not so good. I recently bought a pair of Church's tassel loafers in a nice brown leather; only I found out when I received them the sole was coming away from the upper; what is more, they had a 'false welt' so I couldn't get them resoled:-( I ended up getting my cobbler to glue the sole on - not sure how long it will last....but now I know to check for welt or at least a blake stitch.
I know what you mean. There are a lot of comments and reviews online about Allen Edmonds having quality control issues recently. I can say honestly that I've had a lot of luck with the shoes I’ve purchased from them recently. Even on Factory Seconds. But that being said, you do read some horrible reviews on the AE website, and to be fair, AE does respond to these issues publicly, and it seems they are more than willing to solve the issues people have with some of their shoes. I think people are a little harsh sometimes, I mean obviously we all want everything to be perfect when you invest in a pair of $300 shoes, but I guess when you have a factory and depend on people crafting things with their hands, there is always going to be a degree of variation in construction, right? I am still a fan of Allen Edmonds, I love their shoes. (Recently copped those Independence Collection Bartlett's on sale!) I just hope they stay on top of their game, and don't turn into like a Florsheim, or a Johnston and Murphy, where you can really see a drop in quality from what they used to be. The majority of AE shoes are still 360 Goodyear welted, and the quality of the leathers are still pretty damn good. I still have some wants from Allen Edmonds, and I am always looking for a good deal from them. And I hope they continue to be one of the premiere American shoe brands.
Yes, I agree with you whole heartedly!
Enjoyed the video Robert!
Returned the Dalton Boot 3x’s 1st time the started to rip up on day waited 2 months new pair was not a match they both shoes had spacing on the sole returned new pair I cannot wear the pain is way to much there appears to be a problem on the inside which crosses over on myy right toe..I have the same shoe in Oxblood had them for 5 years no problem wear with socks with out Sox dance ride my bike..I have 13 pairs of Allen’s There quality has dropped.
That’s such a shame.
AE no doubt addressed the issue with your shoes. However, being a factory flaw, they should have exchanged your pair or added some value to your purchase. You are being inconvenienced by having to wait for the repairs to be completed as well as having to make the time to travel to the store on two separate occasions. They could have included a pair of shoe trees with the shoes to make up for their QC letdown.
Glenn Steven - yes, them coming back with a New set of shoe trees inside of them would’ve been a very smart move with a high level of perceived value. What are they, $30 retail? They probably cost 15 bucks to make? Not that it makes a big difference, but it was only one trip to the store, they shipped them directly to my office after the repair.
IN FRENCH IT IS POSSIBLE ????
took a couple years of Francais in high school, but have forgotten most of it. Google translate??
@@CobblerBob Hello Sir,
would you mind telling me why
when the Anglo-Saxons come to France, the French have to speak English and especially why when the French go to the USA they have to speak English?
c'est bien Lafayette qui vous a sorti du caca
it was le marquis de La Fayette who got you out of the shit, no?
I've bought Allen Edmonds for 10 years and have 10 different styles but I have noticed a drop off in quality control in the last 2 pairs bought. Was satisfied with the re-crafting on a pair of Mapleton's last year. I'm sure its hard to train the younger generation in the cobbler trade. The cobbler trade is going the way of mom and pop body shops, machine shops,welding shops, etc. I have looked at Alden's but closest store is 140 miles away and its best to try shoes on due to number of lasts used. I do plan on using The Hanger Projects Re-Crafting Services on the Parks and 2 pairs of Independence Collection. Kirby has numerous video's on the company he uses on TH-cam, impressive also.
These were obviously seconds hear in the U.K. they most I’ve payed is £220 for a pair of eves and grey
I always give shoes a good glance to avoid issues, again in the U.K. finding a good cobbler to do a first class repair is like finding rocking horse shit
Bob. Tune out the negativity, I love your channel. I look forward to seeing what Cobbler Bob is up to.
Uncle Warren 👊🏼
I’ve moved on from Allen Edmonds, the fit is sloppy and the finishing is not great. Took the step up to Carmina and the quality improvement is far worth the increase in cost. Far more stylish too
Nice video
This is what Ive been telling you people about Allen edmonds shoes are full of flaws and defects it's not just your shoes Robert this brand it's gone down the hill that's why you see so many TH-camrs trying to promote their crap you don't see any body trying to promote Alden because there is no need because their shoes are solid no flaws and defects whatsoever.
Posted this on Steve's page
I wish I knew where to start. Without trying to sound harsh, AE is in introductory luxury shoe. The only way to get consistently better footwear is to at least get into the $500 to $600 range. Then deal with long waits and limited styles. AE has never lied, they have always said that they source the best materials that they can. At their volume, you cannot expect the best calf made. There is just not enough to go around. AE has more QC issues during those two big sales every year when the pressure is on to pump out huge volume. As far as hand finishing is concerned, come on, at $395 spray on finish is the best you can expect. My last 40 pair of AE have been really good. But if you buy the Trunk Show shoes, they quality is right up there. For all that AE offers, the value is outstanding.
Phil Schiavone - so what I’ve just learned from your comment is that a new AE is not equal to all other new AE shoes? Timing & the channel through which you purchase a new first quality shoe can make a difference? Wow, I never knew that.
wow . The finish is horrendous for any self respecting company !! What was the QC doing ? I will sound like a bad guy but this requires an overhaul of the entire dept . The people really are not good at their job .
Manu B - ebay I say here is secondhand info, but apparently AE is struggling on hiring and retaining operators. It’s skilled labor, and I heard that even at $18 an hour they can’t retain good help. I’m sure every time the company is purchased, old timers close to retirement “hit the ejection seat” and retire. I have worked in manufacturing, and sometimes it’s astoundingly difficult to produce things consistently. Generally ownership/management change was the one thing that would create the biggest disruption in corporate morale. Workers’ attitudes are absolutely the most important thing in creating good product. I’m telling you, I can just picture it, there is somebody (or many people) in Quality Control and management going home at night in tears, missing dinners with their family, pulling their hair out while getting pressure from the top and bottom.
Robert Powers I think you pointed out the main reason why it is not as good at it used to be . I also understand the effort and skill required to maintain consistent output .
All said and done in your case , it was a clear manufacturing defect and they should have just replaced it with a new one .
Keep bringing out videos 👍Its a pleasure watching them !
This usually happens when you buy the Factory Seconds Brah... I never had a problem paying full price in the store....try that and I bet you get normal results.
I believe I covered this in the video, but these are not, I repeat NOT Factory Seconds. They are FIRST quality purchased on sale. Factory Seconds AEs will have a shoe profile shaped stamp on the bottom of the sole in the arch area. I hate to say this, but in the last few years, flaws on AEs are getting more common.
@@CobblerBob NO doubt AE's are going down in quality. I just checked out a pair of Beckett Simonon and WOW! You make outstanding content for sure! Thanks for all that you do with these projects!
This is why I never buy Allen edmonds there is no other brand that makes expensive shoes with so many defects and flaws and by the way they have a severe problem almost every pair of Allen edmonds shoes have defects and flaws trust me
Most of the people who would jump all over this, buy their shoes at Walmart!!
Why these shoes were put on sale because they had defects. This pair should not have put on sale in first place.
Arvind Sahai - of course I am just speculating, but I was told that model went on sale because they were being discontinued. If they were on sale because of the defects, they should/would have been marked with a factory seconds stamp, which looks like a little shoe silhouette stamped into the bottom of the sole in the arch area.
It is not up to standard.
Damn they failed big time. Were these Factory seconds? This is horrible quality.