#Review
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 มิ.ย. 2024
- In this episode, we test out the RetroTink 5X upscaler on a variety of different retro cartridge & disk-based systems.
While the more conventional way to play retro video games is on a CRT television, my goal since getting back into retro games has been to hook everything up to my modern flat panel television. I know that may not be the most authentic or popular approach, but it's the way I enjoy playing. As such, over the years I have added a number of different devices to my arsenal to try to achieve this. The first product I tried was the OSSC, or the open source scan line converter. While it worked terrifically with my Sega systems, I ran into many issues owing to the timing and other programming of the OSSC when it came to using my Super Nintendo, Super Famicom, or N64. As such, for the last 2 years I have used RetroTink products for my Nintendo systems. While these provided two times line multiplication, it left me wanting a little bit more. That's where the latest from RetroTink comes in, the RetroTink 5X, design to go head to head with devices such as the OSSC and the FrameMeister
Chapters:
0:00 - Introduction
3:46 - Doki Doki Panic (Famicom Disk System)
6:39 - Popeye (Famicom)
8:26 - Double Dragon (Master System)
8:40 - Altered Beast w/Scanline Test (Master System)
9:07 - Sonic 2 (Genesis/JVC X'EYE)
9:31 - Super Metroid Composite/Component/SCART Comparison (Super Famicom)
10:10 - F-Zero X Composite/Component/S-Video/SCART (Nintendo 64)
10:42 - Rogue Leader Rogue Squadron 2 Composite/S-Video/Component/HDMI (GameCube)
11:32 - Earthworm Jim (Genesis/JVC X'EYE)
13:11 - Bonk's Adventure (TurboGrafx 16)
15:36 - Halo (Original XBox)
17:29 - Ratchet & Clank (PlayStation 2)
19:27 - Mario Galaxy (Wii)
24:03 - Initial Impressions
26:50 - Final Thoughts
One of the biggest weaknesses on the OSSC is that it does not accept composite video inputs at all. For this reason I started up my tests with composite video inputs from my Sharp Famicom Turbo Twin, one of my favorite systems in my collection. It plays both Famicom cartridges and Famicom Disc System Games. One weird issue that I ran into was the fact that there was overscan on the left hand side of the screen that I could never get rid of, regardless of the settings on the RetroTink 5x. It wasn't game breaking, but it was annoying. On the OSSC I could apply a vertical mask to cover that, but the RetroTink 5x does not have that feature.
Next I moved over to Sega systems, a weakness of the original RetroTink 2x. From the Master System to the Sega Genesis/JVC X'EYE, the RetroTink 5x worked nearly flawlessly. I say nearly because much like on the Famicom, The Genesis games had overscan at the bottom of the screen. Again, the OSSC offers a horizontal mask that I could hide this from being displayed. The RetroTink 5x does not have this feature.
From here I moved on to other systems, comparing component, composite, RGB SCART, and S video signals. They all looked wonderful, and as one would expect the better quality input signal you had the better quality the output was. Comparing the component video cables for the GameCube to a retro-bit prism HDMI adapter, the prism definitely looks better, at least to me, but the component video cables do look darn good.
Why it RoX:
- Does everything the prior RetroTink lineup did and more
- Works with all systems that I've tested
- Plug and play operation
- Inputs for component, composite, s-video, and RGB SCART
- Adjustable scan lines
- Pre-programmed profiles for specific systems
- Firmware updatable
- Compatible with common capture cards
What could be improved:
- Expensive!
- No onboard display
- Visible overscan with some inputs
- S-Video does not work on SCART to composite video adapter
- Micro USB and not USB-C for power
Should you buy one?
This is the $300 question, isn't it? I will be blunt about this, the RetroTink 5X provides the best picture quality and best compatibility out of any product in the RetroTink line. It combines everything those other units do and takes it to the next level. However, I don't know that I would classify it as a $300 improvement to the video quality of my RetroTink Pro. Is it better looking? Yes. But the RetroTink Pro also looks darn good. I would say if you have any of the prior RetroTink products, except for the mini, I would not be in a rush to buy this. You already have an excellent solution. But if you are looking for the ultimate ease of use upscaler, the RetroTink 5x is about the most user friendly unit you will find.
#RetroTink #RetroGames #Review
The footage used in this review are used under the Fair Use laws:
www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/te...
Notwithstanding the provisions of sections 106 and 106A, the fair use of a copyrighted work is not an infringement of copyright.
(Pub. L. 94-553, title I, § 101, Oct. 19, 1976, 90 Stat. 2546; Pub. L. 101-650, title VI, § 607, Dec. 1, 1990, 104 Stat. 5132; Pub. L. 102-492, Oct. 24, 1992, 106 Stat. 3145.) - เกม
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I ordered mine yesterday after chatting with you… thanks! Can’t wait to get it
Great review! Super Mario Galaxy looking beautiful!
Thanks for checking it out!
Thanks for the video. I think the only console based on this vid that looked the worst is PS2. Will you do comparison videos between OSSC and R5X in the future?
That's the plan!
Excellent video Gary!
Thanks man
looks good. hats off to mike chi. that dude is legit. hope he makes a fortune off this.
Agreed, you like to see good things happen for good people, and Mike is good people
Does it support the PS2's RGB Sync on Green?
Just curious on your tv setup (lcd, led, qled, oled) as you mentioned topping out at 1080p. I feel like the next step is showing on a 1440p gaming monitor or a tv that can handle that output to max things out. It would be nice for tvs to just be built to handle these signals with this upscaler out there now.
This is a 2014 UN60HU8550F - 60" 4K Ultra HD Samsung set. I believe it's an LED LCD, not OLED or Qled
Man i would like to buy retrotink5x but damn it’s so expensive to buy here in Europe ! I can get good brand ossc for about 170€ and tink would be like 450€ after shipping and taxes . Do you think even with that price difference it would be worth it ? I don’t know about that
i just bought the 5x, it is now $325 USD. my main use will be my modded PS2 with internal HDD that plays PS1/PS2 games. i have pretty well all the 8/16bit consoles and computers so i will get the full benefit from it. Expensive, yes... worth it... :)
I'd be interested to see how it handles those PS2 games (or was it PS1?) that had two different resolutions. Does it handle the transitions smoothly or does it crap out like other upscalers?
Gamecube has resoluition changes in the middle of games as well
SNES also supports S-video, just so you know. It looks pretty good for games which use a lot on dithering
The standard SNES does, but the SNES Jr and Super Famicom Jr (used here) does not without modification.
Amazing experience!!!! what is the capture card that you were using to record all the gameplays??
I use a Hauppauge PVR 60 Pro
@@RoXolid thank you!!!
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Hey men :) can you tell me if that the s-video input on the scart to composite adapter works?? And if it works on other devices like the ossc? It would be a Koryuu killer, I found it on Aliexpress and I would like to use s-video on a gbs control. Thanks in advance and great video, I can feel your excitement, hope I can get my hands on one on a coming batch :)
I cover this in the video & the copy below, it does not.
@@RoXolid Thank you men!! I skipped that part, I wanted to see the Wii footage 😅 I think that the s-video to scart can only be obtained by a decoder
All good!
I believe there is a Turbo Grafx profile on the 5x. You might have missed it if it's listed as PC Engine.
Now that you mention it, I think you're right.
12:17 Tommy Tallarico! I didn't know you did an interview with him! I grew up on Electric Playground with him and Vic!
Here to go:
th-cam.com/video/swXdl4IYl48/w-d-xo.html
Very curious how 5x compares to the mini consoles. (SNES mini vs original SNES + 5x)
The 5x delivers a lot less lag while still delivering an exceptional picture
You didnt turn on progressive scan for Ratchet and Clank :( Would have made it upscale a lot better.
Very interesting. I have the Retrotink 2x and the Retrotink Mini already. But I'm always in the market for a new upscaler
This is more awesome than you can handle, humanoid
@@RoXolid Woah woah Gary. I have been known to handle a lot of awesome.
NO, you really haven't there Dad-bod. You handle a pair of New Balance or Asics as you sip ice tea on the riding lawn mower.
@@RoXolid You better watch out with those dad bod comments. This body is a chiseled piece of fine machinery.
If someone was going to chisel anything wouldn't that do it taller than 5 feet?
You say you getting rid of the original ossc but wait until the ossc pro comes out what will be your reaction
I don't know that I am going to try it. I'm that happy with the RetroTink 5x Pro!
I’m at an impasse. One fork in the road has a 27” APEX crt with 2x s video and 1x component inputs that’s an hour away for $100. The other fork is a retrotink 5x paired with a 55” 4K with better than average latency (20.4ms with 480p content) I bought two years ago.
I know there’s pros and cons to both. I suspect that because I’m so used to the 55” TVs latency, it won’t be a problem with the retrotink 5x, but the way the CRT displays an image on the screen is just so good since it’s not pixel based.
Been trying to decide for over a week now. What would you all do?
I would not buy a CRT, I am not a CRT Fan at all.
I know I'm 10 months late but I chose the RetroTink 5x route. I had the same thought process and found a free Sony Trinitron with so many ports it had me fully torqued. It was so heavy I had to get someone to help me take it home... then couldn't fit it in the door. Seriously. No matter what I did it wouldn't fit. I gave up on that and I'm glad I did. CRT's obsolete for a reason and I found that out that day. The RetroTink 5x will have me set for years of 1080p gaming which is exactly what I want. Yeah, a 4k version is coming out but not anytime soon. They will also cost way more. Why wait forever to pay more? 5x will be fine.
I may finally get an upscaler.
That's exciting!
Can you recommend which way I should go for SCART RGB vs Component. Currently researching east cable and auto switcher options for my PSOne/PS2/N64/GameCube/Megadrive.
You're going to see very similar performace from each to be honest. I use mostly HD Retrovision component cables, but also have a number of Insurrection Industries SCART cables.
@@RoXolid I’ve been looking at RetroGamingCables UK options for their RGB Scart cables and pairing that with my Retrotink 5x Pro that’s just landed. But need to find a good auto Scart switcher. (Hydra 8 port perhaps). Just didn’t want want to invest in all Scart if I would benefit more from Component.
@@lifeofeml SCART is just generally less expensive but I don't know that I've seen a major difference between the 2
About the Genesis underscan borders... is that with the 1080p (OVER) output? I would think that would cut the bottom and top borders off
I tried the over and under settings and I got that regardless
Ah, I gotcha. That's too bad
@@RoXolid 1080 Over definitely gets rid of it. After setting it to 1080 Over, did you make sure to hit up and down on your remote to move the image till it's off screen?
@@LockeTheCole I was wondering that as well. Also can you do left or right as it would have been nice for the SFC.
lol thanks for mentioning the 5 dollar scart adpater (minor thing, i know). I am still waiting on my 5x to arrive. Can you believe how rude people have been to Mike because they hadn't received their units yet? jeez
Great video, what settings did you use for the Nintendo Wii? The video looks sharp 🤩
Going back in my memory I think I just used the generic 4:3 mode with 1080P (Over) for the output.
@@RoXolid thanks, I’ll try it on mine! I’ll look for decent composite cables to make the best of it.
No, no, no, get component. I guess I didn't realize you were asking for cable advice. HD Retrovision component cables are awesome! And only like $30
@@RoXolid thank you for the advice, will do! 👍
@@RoXolid This much better than ossc? For Wii only
So does this make nintendo gamecube games 1080p? I just bought an mclassic and a retroprism. Is this the better option?? Do the gamecube games look better with this than the mclassic retroprism combination?????? I just want to play my Nintendo Gamecube games with the best possible option regarding how they look. Whether it's using component cables or hdmi converters along with an mclassic.
If you have the prism from retro bit along with the m classic, you have an exceptional solution and I would not compel you to go out and purchase this instead. I will tell you from my hookups I will continue to use my Prism, or my Carby, or my GCHD MkII.
@@RoXolid thank you so much for the honest reply. Appreciate it. You have a new subscriber 😀😀😀😀
Thank you so much! I'm glad I could help
I would not rush out to get a retrotink5x specifically for your gamecube unless you:
A. Own a pair of gamecube component cables, which isn't likely.
B. Have a later model gamecube without the digital out port and can't use a GCvideo adapter like the Prism or Carby.
I'll be waiting.
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wish they had hdmi input as well, could upscale say wiidual and gcdual to 1080p.
What cables are you using for the Xbox?
The Monster Component Cables
I’m sorry for my ignorance but I got the RetroTink. I bought component cables for my systems. I can’t seem to find an 8 port component to HDMI switcher. don’t I need them all plugged into that so I can run it through the RetroTink? Or what should I buy?
I guess my question is: how does the switcher hook up to the RetroTink? Via HDMI?
your question is vague, what exactly are you trying to do ?
@@kipper2k hook up an SNES, N64, Genesis, XBOX, PS2 and GameCube into this gcomp switcher I got and then through a RetroTink to my modern TV.
3 in 1 Out Component AV Video Switch Box, Composite 3 RCA AV Splitter RGB Selector from amazon, not sure if there is a box that will handle 8 inputs.... so 3 in and RGB out to RGB input on retrotink
3:10 You broke my brain when you plugged that in and the image on the TV changed...
Ha! Great timing!
wait, the gamecube has a hdmi cable?
Have you tried running the motion-adaptive deinterlacing mode on this? You might want to use it with consoles that run at 480i because the deinterlacing is high quality (combination of bob and weave) and it's smooth. Then if possible, hook it up with the Mclassic and you'll get a better picture of 1080p because of the benefits the mClassc gives off. (Anti-aliasing, color enhancement, smoothing filter, jagged edges removal, sharpness, resolution upscale)
I'm going to do this with the OG Xbox game play sample video on going to do
Ok. Sounds cool 👍
Thank you for bringing up mClassic, I wasn't sure if it would do anything for the 5x!
You're welcome! For the 2x I think the combo of the 2x and mClassic is amazing. With the 5x, not really needed.
Hey how do you hook up an N64 (not modded) to the RetroTink 5X?
Without a mod the only way you can do it is either via S-Video cable or composite video
google "connect n64 to retrotink"
Is your tv a Sony,LG or Samsung 4K or 1080p?
The reason I’m asking because retro games don’t look that crisp and smooth on my tv.
A 2014/15 Samsung 4K set. But my TV has nothing to do with the captured footage as it is recorded straight off the 5x
The reason I asked was because all tv’s are not created equally some tv’s handle retro games better than others.
Like for instance my tv has poor clarity and doesn’t smooth the jagged edges off the picture like my old tv did.
I get that, but my point is the footage shown here bypasses the TV entirely
Would you say this is a good investment if you have a nes, snes, sega genesis, sega dreamcast, wii to play?
Absolutely! The only thing is your NES will only output composite unless you mod it, so don't expect a miracle, but the super nes & genesis can both output composite video via HD retrovision cables, and you can get a VGA to scart adapter for the Dreamcast
@@RoXolid Does the dreamcast show better via VGA?
@@RonnRicco yes it does
Still waiting for mine to be shipped! I think I’m one of the last ones to be shipped 😅
Be patient, it's a 2 person team and they are working very dilligently.
@@RoXolid I’m patiently waiting I still don’t have my hd retrovision cables so it wouldn’t do me any good now anyway 😂
You’ll be waiting a long time, same wait time for graphics cards and a PS5
@@charlieb308 👀 I already bought it…he already said two weeks…
Ummm, not the case. 4-6 weeks for batch 2
Your music is way too distracting
its far too loud
Can you run all this threw a system selector by chance
Yes, that is what I do
@@RoXolid sweets
How does it do with PSP/PSP Go?
I couldn't tell you, I haven't played my PSP in years. I might dig it out to try
So now the mclassic isnt necessary? I know this puts 1080, 1440, etc, but the mclassic helps for antialiasing and better colors, etc
I cover this in the video, stay tuned!
I'm considering moving the mClassic off my retro setup and exclusively to my Switch as soon as I get the 5x.
You know what, that's actually a great idea.
@@dionr1168 yeah, maybe ill do that too
@@RoXolid ill see the video, and many thanks for your answers
Will this work for an Amiga 500?
If you have the Amiga 520 adapter which provides composite video out yes it will
@@RoXolid i know its old question. you just need a 23 pin video cable to scart... Amigakit sell them
There's something funky going on in the Bonk's Adventure footage. There's a shadow that's shifting left and right, almost like the sampler is slightly out of phase and is cycling between too far left and too far right. Did you have the wrong console-specific sampler setting enabled at the time? Or could it be a bug in the auto phase detection?
as far as console-specific settings go - he says at 14:54 that he's using the Genesis profile. I'm curious about the specific phenomenon you're talking about - would you mind pointing it out? I saw what looks like (YT?) compression artifacts on the upper side of the green background under the trees and brown swirls in the ground doing weird stuff; and the rocks at that same timestamp were pretty funky.
@@hhectorlector So, he says there's no TG16 profile, but there is. There's a "SNES/PCE/PS1" profile, and the PC-Engine (PCE) is the Japanese name for the TG16. It's like NES versus Famicom. It's a 256-pixel wide profile, and the Genesis profile he's using is a 320-pixel wide profile, so that explains why the sampling and phase look so far off and keeps hunting back and forth failing to lock. You can see the effect easily on the left/right of the hearts in the top left or the white numbers in the bottom right. Watch them for a while and you see their focus kind of shift left and right as the auto phase detect fails to lock on (because the wrong profile is being used), or you can look at the text on the title screen and notice how there's not a hard edge between the sides of the text and the dark background.
no love for saturn?
Nope, not really
There was a lot of shimmer on the NES games.
I would attribute that to the capture, render, or TH-cam compression. There was none while I was playing
@@RoXolid that’s composite. I’ve never seen a scaler capable of dealing with it though I’ve only used 3 different composite to hd scaler/converters
The Retrotink2x and 5x both do a great job of it. I filmed an NES/Famicom gameplay example tonight for another video and no shimmer on my TV
Composite has no business looking that good, hahahah
True story
I play my retro games on a Sony Trinitron crt, it´s cheaper and better then buying a RetroTink in my opinion. I you don´t want a CRT then Retrotink is a solid way but more expensive.
I don't ever want to own a CRT ever again. Never, ever, ever.
Dreamcast can do 480p over SCART.
Yeah, I just don't have a SCART cables for it. I know many OSSC owners used the VGA cable with the DC
@@RoXolid yeah, I plan to get a SCART cable for just the stuff that requires the 15KHz mode (Neo-Geo ports, Plasma Sword, Bangai-Oh), and leave my VGA box for all the remaining 31KHz stuff. Man, still amazed at how good Soul Reaver looks on DC at 480p.
For me I'm HDMI modding mine. Problem solved
bruh you showed the scanlines on a wii game instead of composite nes.
I showed them on the master system too. I'm not a fan of them so I just showed them here and there.
at 8:47 he says he's not much of a scanline guy so there you go.
Tooo expensive.... I bought my ps2 for $199 back in 2002..hehe.. So paying $300.. too much.for my blood...
For a single system I wouldn't recommend the 5x, that's where the Multi-Format would be best for $130.
I just got a ps2 with network adapter and hdd for $37. $300 really isn’t that much money in 2022. If you use it for the next 6 years, it’ll cost you 6 cents a day.
300 bucks, zoinks!
Yes ma'am!
He's got a pretty good price range covered. The RT2X Mini at $80, the RT2X Pro at $130, and the RT5X at $300. Kind of a big gap between the Pro and 5X, but the pandemic-induced part shortage has skyrocketed the cost of components by the time he went into production with the 5X. Hopefully the price can come down if component prices eventually come back down!
$275 now on his website
@@guspaz it's $275 now on his website
@@TheHistorianKing That's what it was at launch, unsure whether it will remain at $275 for batch 2
SMB2 > Doki Doki Panic
Will you admit the Genesis graphics are sharper than the snes when using these devices?
No, both systems look great with this. Some games look better on the Genesis, some look better on the SNES.
@@RoXolidThe channels that specialize in getting the best picture out of retro games say the Genesis has the sharper graphics not the snes.
They and you are entitled to your opinions. Just like some think retro games look better with Scanlines. Earthworm Jim is a perfect example, I think the SNES version looks better. However, I prefer the audio and additional levels the Genesis version. More comes down to how the programmers were able to best mage use of the hardware vs raw power of one versus the other.
@@RoXolid the popular opinion says the Genesis has the sharper graphics you agree? Even if you don’t agree?
I do not, and I'm not getting into a schoolyard debate. If you like the Genesis better, wonderful. If you like the SNES better, terrific. Just go out and enjoy playing games on both awesome systems.
The m classic is a rip off just ask retro rgb.
I respect Bob but he and I don't always have the same views. The mClassic + RetroTink2x is a terrific combo
you'll see Gary's sentiment repeated many times over from Bob's fans. idk what the mClassic ever did to him but I love it. and my left foot that it doesn't do anything for the 5x (sorry Gary if you said that in your vid ha - it's something I've heard a few people say already). I was playing Ogre Battle 64 @ 1440p and the mClassic DEFINITELY smoothed out the picture - making faces clearer and text easier to read.
Edit: spoke too soon haha just saw the end of the vid. tbh I only tried it in Ogre Battle 64 so far but overall I can't imagine not wanting it around for variety. Mike himself said the 5x is sharp not smooth (but he also said he thought the resolution would be adequate enough for people to not want AA/ what the mClassic does)
For some games and systems that need extra anti-aliasing, the mClassic *might* be worth having in the setup somewhere. For me, it wasn't enough of a difference maker so I will just be using it with the Switch moving forward myself.
More GameCube please.
I'm working on a separate series of videos just highlighting gameplay. The GameCube will be featured.
@@RoXolid Excellent! We can always count on you!
Thanks for that!
Real Super Mario Bros 2 >>>>>>>>>>>>> Doki Doki Panic = Super Mario Bros 2 USA = you couldn't pay me enough to play either of them again
Regardless of the history behind this weird mess Nintendo made of these games, I just don't like the vegetable throwing one. Doesn't click with me. 🤷♂️