_Ugh, I got excited to post the video and didn't fully explain why I liked the first ranked AP as much as I did:_ The first book is so completely open world and sandboxy and there's threats that are above your level that can kill you... but also losing a fight is not actually a TPK because of the rules which allows the GM to go ham wild on their players.. and even if you ran the first book like 3 times each group would do it differently and would effectively run a different game every time. I will say there's a LOT of combat though, most of our sessions have been tough combats. But, it's been a blast and I think it merits the #1 position. I should have put this in the video. Whatever, you can read it now!
I have really enjoyed running the first book so far but it really feels like the author/s forgot some key facts while doing it or had some moments that really feel strange (like in part 3 when a major event happens and the party then fights...2 at level enemies) or that the enforcer is supposed to be with them at all times but will say stuff like "if they don't rescue this team in time, they can just loot them as there is no enforcers around"
I experienced Fist of the Ruby Phoenix as a player and it was pretty epic, I agree it deserves this #1 spot. We did all three books with a 4-player party and had a blast! As a lot of the people in our group are fighting game players, we homebrewed a meter system and our own 3-action attacks beginning from book 2 so we could do some cool Super Moves during tournament fights. (Book 2 was my favorite of the three but not for this reason, but I'll agree Book 1's sandbox intro is a strong opener)
@@xXAgeOfHadesXx Yeah, there's some editing errors. I usually have an enforcer around with the main group at all times, and I think even the number #1 slot is gonna need to benefit from GM fiat because yeah...
@@enduni 1-20 APs are well-liked, but the 3-book ones are where the design shines. More focused storytelling overall, and you're more likely to finish one.
It too me forever to realize, that the subtitles are not from TH-cam but that you made and edited them in yourself. Now I speak fluent English but I absolutely love subtitles and they help me a lot in understanding everything in a video, and stay concentrated. So I absolutely appreciate these. Thank you so much! On top of, thank you so much for this ranking and overview, as I was considering buying one of these to help with learning to DM! ♥
Holy crap... so many people agree with you with likes... i gotta keep putting in subtitles! i was *this* close to not putting them and I'm kicking myself for even thinking of not doing so. Thank you for the feedback!
@@CrusherEAGLE Personally don't like the burned-in subtitles like in this video. They are bad for my accessibility and would much rather you use the built in subtitle feature (otherwise I am relying on the machine-attempted auto generation) which allows me to use my own customisations and colour management that I have set up for my own ease of reading. Unfortunately these burned-in ones do not add anything for me, and in fact add extra clutter to the otherwise clean visuals. Appreciate the opinionated video though :)
Great job, thanks for sharing. I appreciate that your position is different from many reviews as you are looking at it from the perspective of someone who runs often, rather than the only adventure someone might run for 2 years. Some of them play/feel a lot differently than expected if you run them again. Subbed after this and your foundry videos.
You gave good reasons for your ranking, thanks. I've been playing with the thought of combining Season of Ghosts and Fists of the Ruby Phoenix by making the Big Bads of both APs split parts of the same being (chaotic and lawful half, both evil) and have the players find silver feathers created by this Big Bad for Hao Jin in the past in Season of Ghosts which transport them to Danger Island immediately after the end of Season of Ghosts as irregular participants, which Hao Jin finds intriguing.
@@CrusherEAGLE Feel free to use it. My players voted for a Reign of Winter conversion as the next game, and since we can only play 2-3 hours a week, and not even every week, it takes us VERY long to finish an AP.
Great content. Keep up the great work. The Glass Cannon Network is running Gatewalkers. I'm enjoying it so much that I catch the weekly live premieres and rewatch episodes. They just started the 2nd book. Live premieres are Thursday nights at 8 pm Eastern, 90-ish minute games.
Nice to see Fists of the Riby Phoenix love! Ive run it foe two groups. Both had a blast. They also approached it very differently: one group was heroic heroes being role models. The other would cheat and lie if they thought they could get away with it. Its got exploration, combat, a surprising amount of RP in book 2, and is very open for a GM to improvise. I added a new team foe each group that was tailored for them (one was our group from Curse of the Crimson Throne, minus my Bard who was performing duding the tournament so couldn't participate). Kingmaker is one I'm having a harder time with. Because yeah, its really long, and thr kingdom rules are a mess. Having the deck stacked so hard against you after a few levels is just not fun when you are supposed to be building a kingdom. Its hard not to knock it down in the rankings when a core part of the premise is such a mess, but i also fond the story over rated somewhat as its so long that sometimes it foesnt feel like we actually have any stoey going on and are just out looking for something to do. Maybe its just not suited to my group. (Meanwhile i rate Extinction Curse quite highly as i ran that and my players loved it. So I guess we could just be odd.)
As a player who is also about to finish Seasons of Ghosts, I agree its great though it has some mostly fixable issues, many of them can be fixed at session 0. A few non-spoiler things that kinda stickout: 1.) Despite the name, you aren't fighting that many undead. A lot of the monsters are pulled from Asian horror, and while undead are common you also get what is essentially equivalent to fae or fiends as well, so don't have players go all-in on undead fighting or they might be disappointed. 2.) Let the players understand that the town and NPCs matter, and they have to be willing to invest in it to make the AP work. I think one of the reasons why the combat is kinda easy, without going into spoilers, is that a big part of the campaign is also helping the town go through this crisis with as little loss as possible. Some of the most intense parts of the session were not in combat, but out of combat moments where the consequences were the consequences were dire from a story stand point. This is the type of AP that is built for players who really are into the story and will try to remember and interact with any named NPC you give them, so if your players are like that they will probably enjoy it. 3.) Also, yeah MASSIVE TRIGGER WARNING for people with arachnophobia. You can probably edit a lot of that out, though note don't give them the player's guide because the art will definitely trigger it. EDIT: (4.) Oh and this game is freaking stingy with money and items, though it has some cool unique stuff. Maybe a good campaign to ABP?
Session Zero with my players for Season of Ghosts is this Saturday and I couldn't be more excited! I fell in love after reading the story and I'm glad to hear from multiple sources it's as good as it reads.
I've just started DMing a campaign for the first time in 30 years (career, kids, etc). Running Agents of Edgewatch. We're halfway through book 2. More than anything, your videos keep me enthusiastic about PF2e and Foundry. "Motivational", if you will. Thanks!
Hi, first found your channel from your Starfinder Cosmic Birthday Actual Play. One of the few Actual Plays that made it past Ghost Levels for that adventure for me to be able to listen while doing house work as I also prep as a GM for that adventure. This video was great quality in terms of editing and engagement. Very much enjoyed it and getting quality feedback about adventures is tough to find since it takes so long for any group to finish even a book of them. So appreciate the video.
Cool video man, I love how Paizo does put in more efforts into their Modules than 5e, tried reading a couple of them and I can certainly agree while Paizo's isn't perfect, they do provide enough content and base ground to make homebrewing or fixing things easier, compared to the other.
Wow everybody's talking great stuff about Season of Ghosts all of sudden! Also your alert about how long Kingmaker lasts was a little scary since my party plays it twice monthly. We have been at it for 8 months and just hit level 5
I am running Abomination Vault and Ruby Phoenix at the moment. It is my third time running AV and I have added a lot more links to town and side quests to improve the RP side of the mega dungeon. We are nearing the end of Book 1 of Ruby Phoenix but I am finding the whole Tournament structure a bit boring actually. Not read the other two volumes yet. Just grabbed Quest for the Frozen Flame as it was in the Humble Bundle which I am looking forward to running as I really like the description of that. I have been told Volumes 1 and 3 of Outlaws is good so I may just trim a lot of Volume 2 when I run that. Kingmaker is another one I have the Foundry module for but not had time to look at yet.
Book two of outlaws kinda randomly forces you into a wilderness exploration section with little preparation that feels really at odds with the rest of the adventure. Im intending to make it a more planned/purposeful journey for the party instead of how the book forces you into it
I'm playing (as a player) Wardens of Wildwood and it's my favourite second edition AP for now. Not too long ( 3 books), strong, consistent theme of creatures of magical forest. You feel the grip of BBEG on your back most of the time, a lot of place for roleplay, a lot of subsystems. Many NPCs who you can interact with and basically accompany your team ( some batray you, some have redemption arc, some of them you have constantly rescue). I highly recommend.
@DiceAsylum no, straight from the box, I assume. The only downside I can think of, is the presumpion the party have a druid or they will miss a lot of content.
I think the answer to Abomination Vaults is to play through the Beginner Box (Menace Under Otari) first! I am planning on doing this for my second attempt at it! This should start with the players at level 2 or 3, if I understand it right, which should raise the survivability a lot!
@BlueSapphyre Ha, seriously! When I was taking my players through it, I was reading through the beginning part and outside of 'the players know an NPC that asked a favor', I couldn't really tell why they were there. I think I ended up just saying they were from Absalom and a letter arrived asking for help. I actually like the idea of them starting out from Otari though as fishermen that went off to an adventurer's academy or something, had just graduated and came home to rub into their friend's faces when stuff starts happening. But yeah, AV doesn't really have a good starting hook.
Rank 1 really caught me off guard, I never had much interest about Ruby Phoenix, but that's nice to know! Really wish that Strength of Thousands sticked with the Magical School theme in the later books, overall it's such a disappointment after book 3. Great vid, thanks!
As someone who has been running Strength of Thousands for her group for the past year (they are coming up to finishing the fourth book), I can say the AP is good, but man you hit the nail on the head about the lack of slice of life activities in the books. Yes, the AP does give a few scenarios that the GM can throw at the party, one of which was super endearing and has the players put on a birthday party for Tzeniwe, who my party instantly became attached to due to being both a literal mother of two unruely children, but also being the dorm mom as well, and was the one to first greet them when they arrived at the dorm originally. (I changed it to her over Esi since I felt Tzeniwe better fit that role as the welcoming committee. I also changed their primary teacher from Takula Otz to a returning NPC from our first campaign, which was Wrath of the Righteous, that being Arueshalae and by extension, one of the original PC's who ended up marrying everyone's favorite redeemed heroine by the end of that mythically-charged AP. :3) Another thing that bugged me and my party was the set-up of Act 2. Being Conservants is one thing, but nearly the entire act is built around what are essentially WoW side quests. The teachers give the party missions to do both in and out of the city, many of which actively put them in direct harm. One of them by Karama who is the leader of one of the main houses of the Magaambya, straight up has them track down actual criminals and handle them (including eventually, their leader) like, what? What kind of teacher asks her students to do the polices work for them? And all because she has some friends who have been victimized by these thieves. It's even more insane when that same Lore-Speaker asks them to essentially break into one of the city's leaders' humble abodes because "a lot of the problems our city has faced has been done to their inaction, something isn't right." Yes, the AP supplies some reasonable suspicions that something isn't right with that particular Magistrate, but enough for the party to essentially break several laws? O_o I changed Act 2 heavily, getting rid of most of the side-quests, and instead weaved them into more of a growing mystery and conspiracy with the Consortium since one of the players had a background story with that criminal organization, along with having Arueshalae be framed for supposed negligence and putting the school at risk from the Stone Ghost in the first book. So, the party had even more of a reason to investigate themselves since their favorite NPC was now facing prison time. Sorry about the long post, just out of all these APs SoT is one I have a lot of experience with next to Wrath of the Righteous, and even though you and your group only played the first two books (which is not an uncommon trend. Apparently Strength of Thousands has a pretty hefty drop-off point after Book 2) I wanted to give some of my thoughts on the AP because it is good, but I feel it required a lot more changing and altering on my part than say WOTR which I ran nearly beat-to-beat (with some minor changes including enemies and encounters) to make it more cohesive and fun, while also connecting Act 3 and 4 to better tie it into the story of the Magaambya. Regardless, totally understand if people skim through this, its not that cohesive of a response, just a GM sharing her thoughts on this AP. Overall, my party has loved the AP even with the changes I've made. Going from traditional European fantasy with WOTR, to this Central African-coded adventure was a great change of pace. Also, great list, haven't played any of these other AP's but it was great to hear your thoughts on them no matter what.
@@SophiaLilithUwU Indeed. :3 Even her kids, which yes, can be a bit much, were quickly endeared to the party. One of my players is playing a Kitsune Summoner and two times when they found themselves in danger while Tzeniwe's kids were with them, the first instinct that player had was to run with them to get them out of the immediate zone of conflict (or have her adorable companion Artyfact, a construct of crystal and wood) carry them to safety via a little knook Arty made for them to make a little nest in. But, yes, Tzeniwe must be protected. :3 Currently she's a Lore-Speaker who with the help of another PC, championed for there to be a form of a daycare program on the Magaambya for single parent students.
@@SophiaLilithUwU Thank you. Right now most of the NPC's are doing their own thing. I try not to run NPC's with the party since, well, I just find it a bit of a hassle to juggle NPC's, combat encounters, and dungeons at the same time while also remembering things like status effects and possible dungeon quirks (like for example, the Sun Gods statues in the Temple of the Eclipse dungeon) But I'd be happy to talk more about our experience with the AP so far if you're interested. It is a fun story, but Book 3 and 4 really do kinda become derailed/decoupled from the events of the story unless the GM does some heavy retinkering.
@@kiearawagner7901 Oh, I think I will need to nab that daycare idea for my own run. I am GMing this AP now. We are on the last chapter of book 2, and Tzeniwe has become one of the most important student NPCs and has become one of the PC's, also a kitsune incidentally, romantic partner (Her kids have been subtly and steadily changing their human forms to look more and more like he is their biological father each semester too). I got them into the book 2 crime fighting by making it an extension of investigations into school security from the antagonist of book1. And when they got in deep enough, the aforementioned leader sent them a message to back off with a sketched picture of Tzeniwe and her kids in what they were wearing that day. That got the PCs motivated to fight crime with gusto. They actually nabbed the villain last session.
I don't play Pathfinder but found your take on Gate Walkers interesting. I was watching a live play of that AP but fell off it because it, through no fault of the cast, did not seem like a good adventure. I have also spent a lot of hours playing the Kingmaker video game. I like the game so much I have ordered the AP. I plan to read it for enjoyment and mine it for ideas for my home games.
I'm nearing the end of book 2 of Stolen Fate, and my players seem to be REALLY enjoying it. Significantly more than Age of Ashes and Extinction Curse (both of which they bailed on). I do agree with your criticisms of the AP, but in my case those issues didn't have any real negative impact.
I ran Abomination Vaults twice for both a 5 and 6 player groups. The 5 pcs had a TPK at the end of book one and they stopped the campaing. 6 pc group was doing well. But Kingmaker came out and I just had to run this AP so we start that for our game night. I award XP instead of milestones, and with random encounter, thee grroup started to overpower the campaign. So I recommend not awarding xp for random encounters (be fair and tell your players about that). I would also tweek thiis by making a new random table to see what type of enounter is available you rollon before that Zone table and have some social encounters on it. My group is also Level 9 after two years of playing. They also voted to stop the Kingdom building part of the AP and just go with the hex crawl. But over-all, Kingmaker is a fun AP.
Given that Abomination Vaults is considered the "Starter" AP for some ungodly reason... I think it may have given people some bad first impressions of the system.
As a GM, I prefer homebrew adventures over Adventure Paths(not that I"m doing anywhere near as many as you ofc). Sometimes I will take a peak at adventures if a friend has one. I can say I absolutely LOVE that Fist of the Ruby Phoenix has an encounter that offers what I'd call, to minimize spoilers, a "unique perspective" on how an encounter can be run.
We abandoned Fist of the Ruby Phoenix as it was really dull, repetitive team fights - the book 1 island really was a let down (DM quit after island, as book 2 just looked like more team fights to him which wasnt interesting) :( We started it after finishing AV...
I’ve actually run it, but it’s not an ap and hasn’t made this list. It’s ok! I would consider it a good dungeon crawl. Solid, although the town parts need work.
I'll be honest, there's a slim chance I'll get to the more recent ones. At least within the next year. My question is, would you still be interested in a video reviewing them if I read the APs without playing them?
@@CrusherEAGLE Definitely. There are not enough reviews of Paizo products and I made that mistake with Gatewalkers and Outlaws of Alkenstar. I'm sick and tired of being sold a concept and then have it yanked away because Paizo writers don't know how to stay on theme.
I get you don't want to be spoiler-y but the fact each chapter is "Rank 10", "Rank 9", and there is usually no mention of the AP name again, makes it very easy to lose track of which one you're talking about, espec when you don't know them that well.
I would run Paizo APs, but my players have a REALLY bad habit of wandering to the edge of the map & going, "Yeah, but what's over there...?" My players do NOT have the attention span for published adventures...
@@TheLocalDisasterTourGuide I would say that is a Session Zero discussion. Pulling a "Yeah, but what's over there...?" breaks the Social Contract of why you have all gathered to play the game, especially a published adventure.
Great vid! Just a quick question: Did you not play Edgewatch or not enjoy it? I would love to hear you reasoning for why you didn't like it or why you haven't ran it yet!
Main reason: there being no foundry module makes it more difficult to engage with. I also have heard it’s mediocre, but i DO like the premise overall. Maybe one day!
You had blood lords up way too high on this list. Granted I can understand if you as the DM do a LOT of retooling of the AP it can be pretty good. But as written its way worse than strength of thousands and possibly stolen fates. Those have systems that you interact with, but with blood lords, the faction system, the blood lord system, and the politics systems you don't interact with at all as written. Again the DM can do a lot of retooling using and including these systems and making new events and the AP gets way better as well as actually using the BBEG. (A friend who is running it has the BBEG be the sponsors of the people becoming blood lords and is buddy buddy with them at the start in a bid to find more powerful or better pawns.) Also this AP is very breakneck like Alkenstar once you become blood lords which are often the levels your players want to do downtime activities so yeah. AV.... As long as you the DM tone down the north challenges of floor1, 2 and 3, the lake encounter, the blood haunt, the disintegration trap, and the scythe trap the AP isn't too bad. Once you get to around floor 6 or so things get smoothed out a lot since your players wont be at risk to dying to a random crit from the +2/+3 encounters this AP constantly throws at them. (And screw that scythe trap. +19 to hit for 6 AOE hits vs level 5 players is so dumb. A crit is something like 60 damage from that thing and it has like a +23 to initiative so its going first. Its not uncommon for entire teams to TPK to that thing before they even get to go since it'll attack 12 times before anyone can act.)
I read through Sky King's Tomb and it looks great, but is also so niche that I would never find a party to run it. I'm currently GMing through Quest for the Frozen Flame and it's a hard thing to recommend. The story is good, but the loot is so poor that you are going to need to invent your own loot pool for every encounter. QftFF feels it's fair to give the party a single consumable for a boss fight. And while the story is good, "Conan the Barbarian/Cavemen" isn't a popular fantasy like it was 30 years ago. I think some of my players regret picking it.
Make sure you read ahead before touching book 3. The ending is not great as written (mechanically, and it makes some assumptions that can derail the plot if your players choose to do anything else). It may need some rewriting to make it a better fit for your group.
Gatewalkers was so bad that it could've been a DND 5e Adventure. I had such high hopes because the mini adventures in Dark Archive were so good, and then GW let me down hard.
@@CrusherEAGLE I fully agree about Outlaws though. It's a really fun adventure path, but holy shit that thing at the end of book 2, chapter 2 is overtuned. I had to house rule it extensively to make it a still very, very, very hard encounter, but manageable. I really like book 3 though. Has some great, thematic encounters, holds the theme and delivers some good payoff.
You lost me with Kingmaker. I'd rank that one as #20 out of a list of 10. It's one of the worst published adventures I've ever seen and my first tRPG experience was AD&D's S1, followed by D&D's B2 (yes, in that order), and being forced to play through some Sailor Moon thing in the 90s. Kingmaker just... starts with no context for the players. Welcome to a dinner party, talk to the important people - but no idea who or why. Then do some random combat. Then hex crawl and fill in excel spreadsheets for the next 4 months. It's the AP for people that get 'inappropriately excited' about accounting and filling out tax forms.
I feel you probably had a bad experience as a player... if ran right it can be a lot of fun. Except the accounting bit, which i agree. Sad to hear it wasn't a great game for you!!
That sounds like the GM didn't do a session zero where they lay out the premise to the players. And the very first thing that happens in the adventure as written is Lady Jamandi Aldori telling everyone why they are present, before the interaction with the NPCs at the tables with the party.
@@CrusherEAGLE It does actually sound fairly close to how Kingmaker was set up in 1e though, from my own recollection anyway. Maybe there is an edition confusion?
_Ugh, I got excited to post the video and didn't fully explain why I liked the first ranked AP as much as I did:_
The first book is so completely open world and sandboxy and there's threats that are above your level that can kill you... but also losing a fight is not actually a TPK because of the rules which allows the GM to go ham wild on their players.. and even if you ran the first book like 3 times each group would do it differently and would effectively run a different game every time.
I will say there's a LOT of combat though, most of our sessions have been tough combats. But, it's been a blast and I think it merits the #1 position.
I should have put this in the video. Whatever, you can read it now!
I have really enjoyed running the first book so far but it really feels like the author/s forgot some key facts while doing it or had some moments that really feel strange (like in part 3 when a major event happens and the party then fights...2 at level enemies) or that the enforcer is supposed to be with them at all times but will say stuff like "if they don't rescue this team in time, they can just loot them as there is no enforcers around"
I experienced Fist of the Ruby Phoenix as a player and it was pretty epic, I agree it deserves this #1 spot. We did all three books with a 4-player party and had a blast! As a lot of the people in our group are fighting game players, we homebrewed a meter system and our own 3-action attacks beginning from book 2 so we could do some cool Super Moves during tournament fights. (Book 2 was my favorite of the three but not for this reason, but I'll agree Book 1's sandbox intro is a strong opener)
@@TheHarDeOne What a cool idea! 3 action super moves seem super cool!!!
@@xXAgeOfHadesXx Yeah, there's some editing errors. I usually have an enforcer around with the main group at all times, and I think even the number #1 slot is gonna need to benefit from GM fiat because yeah...
Pathfinder APs and casting aside the "hook" after the first book or two: Name a more iconic duo.
And then there's Age of Ashes which asks a lot of questions in book 1 that get only answered in book 6. xD
@@enduni 1-20 APs are well-liked, but the 3-book ones are where the design shines. More focused storytelling overall, and you're more likely to finish one.
Second Darkness has entered the chat. It's literally a completely different adventure once book 3 starts.
It too me forever to realize, that the subtitles are not from TH-cam but that you made and edited them in yourself. Now I speak fluent English but I absolutely love subtitles and they help me a lot in understanding everything in a video, and stay concentrated. So I absolutely appreciate these. Thank you so much!
On top of, thank you so much for this ranking and overview, as I was considering buying one of these to help with learning to DM! ♥
Holy crap... so many people agree with you with likes... i gotta keep putting in subtitles! i was *this* close to not putting them and I'm kicking myself for even thinking of not doing so. Thank you for the feedback!
@@CrusherEAGLE Personally don't like the burned-in subtitles like in this video. They are bad for my accessibility and would much rather you use the built in subtitle feature (otherwise I am relying on the machine-attempted auto generation) which allows me to use my own customisations and colour management that I have set up for my own ease of reading.
Unfortunately these burned-in ones do not add anything for me, and in fact add extra clutter to the otherwise clean visuals.
Appreciate the opinionated video though :)
@@ceolgar i could probably set up both, as long as you don't mind them overlapping!
Great job, thanks for sharing. I appreciate that your position is different from many reviews as you are looking at it from the perspective of someone who runs often, rather than the only adventure someone might run for 2 years. Some of them play/feel a lot differently than expected if you run them again. Subbed after this and your foundry videos.
You gave good reasons for your ranking, thanks.
I've been playing with the thought of combining Season of Ghosts and Fists of the Ruby Phoenix by making the Big Bads of both APs split parts of the same being (chaotic and lawful half, both evil) and have the players find silver feathers created by this Big Bad for Hao Jin in the past in Season of Ghosts which transport them to Danger Island immediately after the end of Season of Ghosts as irregular participants, which Hao Jin finds intriguing.
Thank you for the kind words.
I think both APs are doable as a 1-20, and really like your concept that you thought out!
@@CrusherEAGLE Feel free to use it. My players voted for a Reign of Winter conversion as the next game, and since we can only play 2-3 hours a week, and not even every week, it takes us VERY long to finish an AP.
Great content. Keep up the great work.
The Glass Cannon Network is running Gatewalkers. I'm enjoying it so much that I catch the weekly live premieres and rewatch episodes. They just started the 2nd book. Live premieres are Thursday nights at 8 pm Eastern, 90-ish minute games.
Nice to see Fists of the Riby Phoenix love! Ive run it foe two groups. Both had a blast. They also approached it very differently: one group was heroic heroes being role models. The other would cheat and lie if they thought they could get away with it.
Its got exploration, combat, a surprising amount of RP in book 2, and is very open for a GM to improvise. I added a new team foe each group that was tailored for them (one was our group from Curse of the Crimson Throne, minus my Bard who was performing duding the tournament so couldn't participate).
Kingmaker is one I'm having a harder time with. Because yeah, its really long, and thr kingdom rules are a mess. Having the deck stacked so hard against you after a few levels is just not fun when you are supposed to be building a kingdom. Its hard not to knock it down in the rankings when a core part of the premise is such a mess, but i also fond the story over rated somewhat as its so long that sometimes it foesnt feel like we actually have any stoey going on and are just out looking for something to do.
Maybe its just not suited to my group. (Meanwhile i rate Extinction Curse quite highly as i ran that and my players loved it. So I guess we could just be odd.)
Paizo’s more recent adventures have been banger after banger. Season of Ghosts is my favourite, with Curtain Call and Sky King’s Tomb close behind.
Thanks for the work producing this video. It's fantastic!
Glad you enjoyed it! Thank you so much!
As a player who is also about to finish Seasons of Ghosts, I agree its great though it has some mostly fixable issues, many of them can be fixed at session 0. A few non-spoiler things that kinda stickout:
1.) Despite the name, you aren't fighting that many undead. A lot of the monsters are pulled from Asian horror, and while undead are common you also get what is essentially equivalent to fae or fiends as well, so don't have players go all-in on undead fighting or they might be disappointed.
2.) Let the players understand that the town and NPCs matter, and they have to be willing to invest in it to make the AP work. I think one of the reasons why the combat is kinda easy, without going into spoilers, is that a big part of the campaign is also helping the town go through this crisis with as little loss as possible. Some of the most intense parts of the session were not in combat, but out of combat moments where the consequences were the consequences were dire from a story stand point. This is the type of AP that is built for players who really are into the story and will try to remember and interact with any named NPC you give them, so if your players are like that they will probably enjoy it.
3.) Also, yeah MASSIVE TRIGGER WARNING for people with arachnophobia. You can probably edit a lot of that out, though note don't give them the player's guide because the art will definitely trigger it.
EDIT: (4.) Oh and this game is freaking stingy with money and items, though it has some cool unique stuff. Maybe a good campaign to ABP?
Hey man, a big thank you for the subtitles - I’m hearing impaired so I really appreciate them!
Session Zero with my players for Season of Ghosts is this Saturday and I couldn't be more excited! I fell in love after reading the story and I'm glad to hear from multiple sources it's as good as it reads.
I've just started DMing a campaign for the first time in 30 years (career, kids, etc). Running Agents of Edgewatch. We're halfway through book 2. More than anything, your videos keep me enthusiastic about PF2e and Foundry. "Motivational", if you will. Thanks!
Love the DRG reference. Rock and Stone! To the Bone!
Currently running Season of Ghosts and we’re having a blast. It’s definitely worthy of its spot on this list
Hi, first found your channel from your Starfinder Cosmic Birthday Actual Play. One of the few Actual Plays that made it past Ghost Levels for that adventure for me to be able to listen while doing house work as I also prep as a GM for that adventure.
This video was great quality in terms of editing and engagement. Very much enjoyed it and getting quality feedback about adventures is tough to find since it takes so long for any group to finish even a book of them. So appreciate the video.
Thank you so much! I can't believe someone actually watches my VODs haha. Thank you for being with me for a while!
Love the season of ghosts shout out. #1 for me.
More of these please!
Cool video man, I love how Paizo does put in more efforts into their Modules than 5e, tried reading a couple of them and I can certainly agree while Paizo's isn't perfect, they do provide enough content and base ground to make homebrewing or fixing things easier, compared to the other.
Prepping a Kingmaker campaign right now so this is cool.
I'm a player in a Kingmaker Campaign right now and I have really really loved it.
3 minutes in, and you got a new subscriber. Love the content
Thank you so much!
Love the video! Really interesting stuff and some APs I haven't even heard about!
Wow everybody's talking great stuff about Season of Ghosts all of sudden! Also your alert about how long Kingmaker lasts was a little scary since my party plays it twice monthly. We have been at it for 8 months and just hit level 5
Ya and if you do the actual kingdom stuff it takes even longer.
My premium kingmaker ap is a year and a month in and has hit level 5 right now. Crazy!
You should do a series reviewing the APs that you have run and making suggestions.
Great idea! Might just do that next!
Running season of ghosts in foundry as my first pf2e campaign and loving it
I am running Abomination Vault and Ruby Phoenix at the moment. It is my third time running AV and I have added a lot more links to town and side quests to improve the RP side of the mega dungeon.
We are nearing the end of Book 1 of Ruby Phoenix but I am finding the whole Tournament structure a bit boring actually. Not read the other two volumes yet.
Just grabbed Quest for the Frozen Flame as it was in the Humble Bundle which I am looking forward to running as I really like the description of that.
I have been told Volumes 1 and 3 of Outlaws is good so I may just trim a lot of Volume 2 when I run that. Kingmaker is another one I have the Foundry module for but not had time to look at yet.
Book two of outlaws kinda randomly forces you into a wilderness exploration section with little preparation that feels really at odds with the rest of the adventure. Im intending to make it a more planned/purposeful journey for the party instead of how the book forces you into it
I'm playing (as a player) Wardens of Wildwood and it's my favourite second edition AP for now. Not too long ( 3 books), strong, consistent theme of creatures of magical forest. You feel the grip of BBEG on your back most of the time, a lot of place for roleplay, a lot of subsystems. Many NPCs who you can interact with and basically accompany your team ( some batray you, some have redemption arc, some of them you have constantly rescue). I highly recommend.
I have heard bad things, believe or not! Is your GM heavily homebrewing it? Just curious!
@DiceAsylum no, straight from the box, I assume. The only downside I can think of, is the presumpion the party have a druid or they will miss a lot of content.
I think the answer to Abomination Vaults is to play through the Beginner Box (Menace Under Otari) first! I am planning on doing this for my second attempt at it! This should start with the players at level 2 or 3, if I understand it right, which should raise the survivability a lot!
I would also move the event in chapter 2 to the beginning of the adventure. Gives the PCs an initial reason to even go.
@BlueSapphyre Ha, seriously! When I was taking my players through it, I was reading through the beginning part and outside of 'the players know an NPC that asked a favor', I couldn't really tell why they were there. I think I ended up just saying they were from Absalom and a letter arrived asking for help. I actually like the idea of them starting out from Otari though as fishermen that went off to an adventurer's academy or something, had just graduated and came home to rub into their friend's faces when stuff starts happening.
But yeah, AV doesn't really have a good starting hook.
That's what I did, the players started AV at level 2, and the fights have been challenging, but not overwhelming.
Rank 1 really caught me off guard, I never had much interest about Ruby Phoenix, but that's nice to know! Really wish that Strength of Thousands sticked with the Magical School theme in the later books, overall it's such a disappointment after book 3.
Great vid, thanks!
As someone who has been running Strength of Thousands for her group for the past year (they are coming up to finishing the fourth book), I can say the AP is good, but man you hit the nail on the head about the lack of slice of life activities in the books. Yes, the AP does give a few scenarios that the GM can throw at the party, one of which was super endearing and has the players put on a birthday party for Tzeniwe, who my party instantly became attached to due to being both a literal mother of two unruely children, but also being the dorm mom as well, and was the one to first greet them when they arrived at the dorm originally.
(I changed it to her over Esi since I felt Tzeniwe better fit that role as the welcoming committee. I also changed their primary teacher from Takula Otz to a returning NPC from our first campaign, which was Wrath of the Righteous, that being Arueshalae and by extension, one of the original PC's who ended up marrying everyone's favorite redeemed heroine by the end of that mythically-charged AP. :3)
Another thing that bugged me and my party was the set-up of Act 2. Being Conservants is one thing, but nearly the entire act is built around what are essentially WoW side quests. The teachers give the party missions to do both in and out of the city, many of which actively put them in direct harm.
One of them by Karama who is the leader of one of the main houses of the Magaambya, straight up has them track down actual criminals and handle them (including eventually, their leader) like, what? What kind of teacher asks her students to do the polices work for them? And all because she has some friends who have been victimized by these thieves. It's even more insane when that same Lore-Speaker asks them to essentially break into one of the city's leaders' humble abodes because "a lot of the problems our city has faced has been done to their inaction, something isn't right."
Yes, the AP supplies some reasonable suspicions that something isn't right with that particular Magistrate, but enough for the party to essentially break several laws? O_o
I changed Act 2 heavily, getting rid of most of the side-quests, and instead weaved them into more of a growing mystery and conspiracy with the Consortium since one of the players had a background story with that criminal organization, along with having Arueshalae be framed for supposed negligence and putting the school at risk from the Stone Ghost in the first book. So, the party had even more of a reason to investigate themselves since their favorite NPC was now facing prison time.
Sorry about the long post, just out of all these APs SoT is one I have a lot of experience with next to Wrath of the Righteous, and even though you and your group only played the first two books (which is not an uncommon trend. Apparently Strength of Thousands has a pretty hefty drop-off point after Book 2) I wanted to give some of my thoughts on the AP because it is good, but I feel it required a lot more changing and altering on my part than say WOTR which I ran nearly beat-to-beat (with some minor changes including enemies and encounters) to make it more cohesive and fun, while also connecting Act 3 and 4 to better tie it into the story of the Magaambya.
Regardless, totally understand if people skim through this, its not that cohesive of a response, just a GM sharing her thoughts on this AP. Overall, my party has loved the AP even with the changes I've made. Going from traditional European fantasy with WOTR, to this Central African-coded adventure was a great change of pace. Also, great list, haven't played any of these other AP's but it was great to hear your thoughts on them no matter what.
Tzeniwe needs to be protected at all costs!!
@@SophiaLilithUwU Indeed. :3 Even her kids, which yes, can be a bit much, were quickly endeared to the party.
One of my players is playing a Kitsune Summoner and two times when they found themselves in danger while Tzeniwe's kids were with them, the first instinct that player had was to run with them to get them out of the immediate zone of conflict (or have her adorable companion Artyfact, a construct of crystal and wood) carry them to safety via a little knook Arty made for them to make a little nest in.
But, yes, Tzeniwe must be protected. :3 Currently she's a Lore-Speaker who with the help of another PC, championed for there to be a form of a daycare program on the Magaambya for single parent students.
@@kiearawagner7901 Awww thats adorable!!!
@@SophiaLilithUwU Thank you. Right now most of the NPC's are doing their own thing. I try not to run NPC's with the party since, well, I just find it a bit of a hassle to juggle NPC's, combat encounters, and dungeons at the same time while also remembering things like status effects and possible dungeon quirks (like for example, the Sun Gods statues in the Temple of the Eclipse dungeon)
But I'd be happy to talk more about our experience with the AP so far if you're interested. It is a fun story, but Book 3 and 4 really do kinda become derailed/decoupled from the events of the story unless the GM does some heavy retinkering.
@@kiearawagner7901 Oh, I think I will need to nab that daycare idea for my own run.
I am GMing this AP now. We are on the last chapter of book 2, and Tzeniwe has become one of the most important student NPCs and has become one of the PC's, also a kitsune incidentally, romantic partner (Her kids have been subtly and steadily changing their human forms to look more and more like he is their biological father each semester too). I got them into the book 2 crime fighting by making it an extension of investigations into school security from the antagonist of book1. And when they got in deep enough, the aforementioned leader sent them a message to back off with a sketched picture of Tzeniwe and her kids in what they were wearing that day. That got the PCs motivated to fight crime with gusto. They actually nabbed the villain last session.
I don't play Pathfinder but found your take on Gate Walkers interesting. I was watching a live play of that AP but fell off it because it, through no fault of the cast, did not seem like a good adventure. I have also spent a lot of hours playing the Kingmaker video game. I like the game so much I have ordered the AP. I plan to read it for enjoyment and mine it for ideas for my home games.
Stay tuned for my next video, it’s a kingmaker review!
I'm nearing the end of book 2 of Stolen Fate, and my players seem to be REALLY enjoying it. Significantly more than Age of Ashes and Extinction Curse (both of which they bailed on). I do agree with your criticisms of the AP, but in my case those issues didn't have any real negative impact.
That’s good to know. I probably didn’t give it a fair chance!
@@CrusherEAGLE I wouldn't say that! More likely your table is just different than mine and what my players enjoy is different than yours.
I ran Abomination Vaults twice for both a 5 and 6 player groups. The 5 pcs had a TPK at the end of book one and they stopped the campaing. 6 pc group was doing well. But Kingmaker came out and I just had to run this AP so we start that for our game night. I award XP instead of milestones, and with random encounter, thee grroup started to overpower the campaign. So I recommend not awarding xp for random encounters (be fair and tell your players about that). I would also tweek thiis by making a new random table to see what type of enounter is available you rollon before that Zone table and have some social encounters on it. My group is also Level 9 after two years of playing. They also voted to stop the Kingdom building part of the AP and just go with the hex crawl. But over-all, Kingmaker is a fun AP.
Given that Abomination Vaults is considered the "Starter" AP for some ungodly reason... I think it may have given people some bad first impressions of the system.
'Join the discord to talk to like minded gamers?" more like "join the Discord to dunk on Pablo all day everyday!"
Diggy diggy hole. :)
perfect looking for a good 2e to start a new group
As a GM, I prefer homebrew adventures over Adventure Paths(not that I"m doing anywhere near as many as you ofc). Sometimes I will take a peak at adventures if a friend has one. I can say I absolutely LOVE that Fist of the Ruby Phoenix has an encounter that offers what I'd call, to minimize spoilers, a "unique perspective" on how an encounter can be run.
Is that an Elagato mic? I have the same one. It's really nice. Do you use the StreamDeck app when running games? If so what do you do with it?
That's a great question. Check out the material deck app! it syncs with foundry pretty nicely!
@@CrusherEAGLE Whooaa. Thanks! I haven't purchased the full Stream deck app yet, now I just might!
We abandoned Fist of the Ruby Phoenix as it was really dull, repetitive team fights - the book 1 island really was a let down (DM quit after island, as book 2 just looked like more team fights to him which wasnt interesting) :(
We started it after finishing AV...
Awesome breakdown.
Have you ever seen Crown of the Kobold King Adventure?
I’ve actually run it, but it’s not an ap and hasn’t made this list. It’s ok! I would consider it a good dungeon crawl. Solid, although the town parts need work.
Once you've played the more recent APs please do another video.
I'll be honest, there's a slim chance I'll get to the more recent ones. At least within the next year.
My question is, would you still be interested in a video reviewing them if I read the APs without playing them?
@@CrusherEAGLE Definitely. There are not enough reviews of Paizo products and I made that mistake with Gatewalkers and Outlaws of Alkenstar. I'm sick and tired of being sold a concept and then have it yanked away because Paizo writers don't know how to stay on theme.
How didnyoubget the kingmaker map to do that in foundry (where it was sepia and revealed as the player token moved)
Using the module “world explorer”!
I get you don't want to be spoiler-y but the fact each chapter is "Rank 10", "Rank 9", and there is usually no mention of the AP name again, makes it very easy to lose track of which one you're talking about, espec when you don't know them that well.
More of an adventure than adventure path but I've really been enjoying running Prey for Death for my players right now
I would run Paizo APs, but my players have a REALLY bad habit of wandering to the edge of the map & going, "Yeah, but what's over there...?"
My players do NOT have the attention span for published adventures...
Kingmaker might be a good one for you then!!
@DiceAsylum I loved the video game, but I'm really worried about my group's habits. It's an expensive purchase.
@@TheLocalDisasterTourGuide I would say that is a Session Zero discussion. Pulling a "Yeah, but what's over there...?" breaks the Social Contract of why you have all gathered to play the game, especially a published adventure.
Great vid! Just a quick question:
Did you not play Edgewatch or not enjoy it? I would love to hear you reasoning for why you didn't like it or why you haven't ran it yet!
Main reason: there being no foundry module makes it more difficult to engage with. I also have heard it’s mediocre, but i DO like the premise overall. Maybe one day!
Would you mind sharing good places to steal maps from?
I literally just google. Also really like cze peku patreon for fancier maps.
google is a great place to 'steal' maps from. as for paid, good patreons are also tom cartos and cze peku.
Dude no sentance of extinction or Agents of Absalom? Agents specifically is one of the best modules I have ever run.
I would, if I had run these! Glad you had fun though!
You had blood lords up way too high on this list. Granted I can understand if you as the DM do a LOT of retooling of the AP it can be pretty good. But as written its way worse than strength of thousands and possibly stolen fates. Those have systems that you interact with, but with blood lords, the faction system, the blood lord system, and the politics systems you don't interact with at all as written. Again the DM can do a lot of retooling using and including these systems and making new events and the AP gets way better as well as actually using the BBEG. (A friend who is running it has the BBEG be the sponsors of the people becoming blood lords and is buddy buddy with them at the start in a bid to find more powerful or better pawns.) Also this AP is very breakneck like Alkenstar once you become blood lords which are often the levels your players want to do downtime activities so yeah.
AV.... As long as you the DM tone down the north challenges of floor1, 2 and 3, the lake encounter, the blood haunt, the disintegration trap, and the scythe trap the AP isn't too bad. Once you get to around floor 6 or so things get smoothed out a lot since your players wont be at risk to dying to a random crit from the +2/+3 encounters this AP constantly throws at them. (And screw that scythe trap. +19 to hit for 6 AOE hits vs level 5 players is so dumb. A crit is something like 60 damage from that thing and it has like a +23 to initiative so its going first. Its not uncommon for entire teams to TPK to that thing before they even get to go since it'll attack 12 times before anyone can act.)
I am guessing you never ran Quest for the Frozen Flame. Many seem to score that one with high marks.
I have not. I have heard things though, like you should use the ABP/ARP rules variant for it, and that it lacks maps.
Spot on for 10, 9, 2 and 1. Everything in the middle should be moved around. Sky Kings Tomb is super boring imo.
I read through Sky King's Tomb and it looks great, but is also so niche that I would never find a party to run it.
I'm currently GMing through Quest for the Frozen Flame and it's a hard thing to recommend. The story is good, but the loot is so poor that you are going to need to invent your own loot pool for every encounter. QftFF feels it's fair to give the party a single consumable for a boss fight. And while the story is good, "Conan the Barbarian/Cavemen" isn't a popular fantasy like it was 30 years ago. I think some of my players regret picking it.
I would definitely recommend ABP/ARP if you are running that one.
Augment Battlezoo's monster parts system in that AP as substitution for loot, it fits so well almost like it's specifically made for it
Make sure you read ahead before touching book 3. The ending is not great as written (mechanically, and it makes some assumptions that can derail the plot if your players choose to do anything else). It may need some rewriting to make it a better fit for your group.
Gatewalkers was so bad that it could've been a DND 5e Adventure. I had such high hopes because the mini adventures in Dark Archive were so good, and then GW let me down hard.
Wait... Fists as number one!? Really? It usually gets a pretty bad rap
Criminally underrated!
@@CrusherEAGLE I fully agree about Outlaws though. It's a really fun adventure path, but holy shit that thing at the end of book 2, chapter 2 is overtuned. I had to house rule it extensively to make it a still very, very, very hard encounter, but manageable. I really like book 3 though. Has some great, thematic encounters, holds the theme and delivers some good payoff.
I already hit the subscribe button. If Inhit it again, it will unsubscribe me. Please advise.
Then just hit it again and it’ll resubscribe! Easy! Hitting buttons is fun!
Anime lol, 😂 why man why
You lost me with Kingmaker. I'd rank that one as #20 out of a list of 10. It's one of the worst published adventures I've ever seen and my first tRPG experience was AD&D's S1, followed by D&D's B2 (yes, in that order), and being forced to play through some Sailor Moon thing in the 90s.
Kingmaker just... starts with no context for the players. Welcome to a dinner party, talk to the important people - but no idea who or why. Then do some random combat. Then hex crawl and fill in excel spreadsheets for the next 4 months. It's the AP for people that get 'inappropriately excited' about accounting and filling out tax forms.
I feel you probably had a bad experience as a player... if ran right it can be a lot of fun. Except the accounting bit, which i agree.
Sad to hear it wasn't a great game for you!!
That's your GMs fault, the AP is more than fine.
That sounds like the GM didn't do a session zero where they lay out the premise to the players. And the very first thing that happens in the adventure as written is Lady
Jamandi Aldori telling everyone why they are present, before the interaction with the NPCs at the tables with the party.
@@CrusherEAGLE It does actually sound fairly close to how Kingmaker was set up in 1e though, from my own recollection anyway. Maybe there is an edition confusion?
Although I liked the video, I downvoted because I don't want hard captions on videos to be normalized, they are very distracting
christ almighty this comment reeks