‘MECHS | The different types and styles of ‘mechs in Sci-Fi
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 พ.ค. 2023
- Generic greetings and welcome to a breakdown of the different styles and types of big stompy robots in Sci-Fi. Considering there's almost nothing science fiction is more in love with than big stompy robots, there have been as many takes on them as there have been mecha toys. So stick around and see if you agree with my assessment of our favorite war machines.
Want to support SCI? Check out our patreon to get access to our content a day early and send some space bucks out our way to improve the channel:
patreon.com/ScienceInsanity - บันเทิง
![PLANETARY DEFENSE | How to protect your world from invasion [FIXED]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/m8rkp7NPgvs/mqdefault.jpg)
![[TH] VCT Pacific Stage 2 - Week 1 Day 2 // GEN vs T1 | PRX vs TLN](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ZkFjjJNwzH0/mqdefault.jpg)
You’re acting like Gundam isn’t 95% of the reason this genre has grown and thrived. Don’t knock it so easily.
A little upset no shoutout to the Pacific Rim universe. Sure the sequel was a bit much but the original was a masterpiece.
No. Just no.
@@EricDKaufman care to elaborate?
@@bobbygraves5120 there is no Pacific rim sequel
It's better than the shitty cg Netflix show.
@@ironboy3245 denial is a river in egypt
I always considered armored core to be between Battletech and MSG. My favorite depiction of mechs by far.
What is MSG?
@@rossmelnyk1900 Mobile Suit Gundum
@@JohnDoe-sx6iw Armored Core are pretty tiny compared to even the most average Suits
Normal AC's are 10 Meter Tall while NEXT's are 15 Meter Tall
Comparison to other fiction Mechs, Metal Gear Rex is 13 Meters Tall while Ray is 20 Meters
Average AC and NEXT ARE Faster than average Suits tho, 400+ Km/Hour is INSANE
@@RenoKyriesaid AC can also jump up to 800+km/h with overboost....very real
@@RenoKyrie At least they are not space ballerinas. XD
I think there's also at least 3 size categories:
Expanded power armor: The prawn suit/powerloader/E-Frame size range. May extend into Arm Slaves and maybe even Titans (Titanfall)
Piloted robot: Strictly a vehicle. See Battlemechs, Mobile Suits, etc. Extending down into Arm Slaves or Titans(Titanfall) and up into Zords and smaller classes of Titan(40k).
Walking City Center: Anything so large it classifies as a vessel. See medium and up Titans(40k), the SDF-1, some of the bigger things from Armored Core from what I recall, etc. Small end may be Megazords, no upper end apparently.
I think you mean the armsforts from armored core for the 3rd category, tho only the spirit of motherwill and landcrabs have legs, all the other armsforts either swim, or got wheels/treads.
New class: world breaker: any that are bigger than a small moon, including unicron and primus, planetary annihilation titans and most forms of Gurren laggan.
@@primusstar5995 i was gonna bring up gurren laggan
4th category: batshit insane literal walking cathedrals with enough pewpew to deprive America 50 times over
@@3limin8ted89That's kinda what I meant for the no upper limit. But yeah I guess that could be considered characteristically different.
I personally dont like how you discount that it was essentially Gundam that defined the real robot genre. Yeah alot of Gundam is campy and silly but there's also a lot of series that take it seriously. I recommend 8th MS team
Always sad to see when it comes to Sci-fi channels. Either one of two things happen. Either they never talk about it and dismiss it, or the time they do bring it up it is usually just to diss it in some manner as some kind of thing not really worth any attention. And this is somewhat ironic given the kind of western sci-fi they usually talk about.
@@mattesteif you want good mecha content then you don't really get better than Gundam 08th ms team. Well yes there is Votoms but still
UC (Universal Century) Timeline has more lore about tactics being used and mech development history, than the other AU (Alternative Universe) timelines.
If you want Gundam with a little bit of realism then go for UC timeline.
I also recommend the MS Igloo.
You could also try to read other UC based comics and light novels.
8th ms team is only good for the animation, the story is so basic, even 0079 has a more unique story and characters.
I prefer the more "mature" series of the super-robot genre, where the mechs are basically mechanical lovercraftian gods.
Correction:
The missile spam is from Macross.
The rule of cool wackiness from Gundam extends the further you go away from the original UC Timeline.
Then again you've got stuff like Iron-Blooded Orphans which has a very gritty and pretty realistic combat focusing on melee weapons a lot
@@HubiKoshi Uhhhh.... you just said realistic combat and melee weapons.
@@pikadragon2783 modern soldiers continue to have bayonets and combat knives for a reason (I am mostly joking as it is not the same thing but still it is a thing)
@@pikadragon2783 To be fair, my point of comparison was crazy bullshit they pulled in Gundam 00 and Seed Destiny. Barbatos beating Mobile Suits into scrap with huge weapons is very down to earth XD
@@pikadragon2783 In IBO they have commonly used nanolaminate paint that diffuses and deflects particle beams, making them useless, so it's all slugthrowers and melee weapons in that timeline.
>Gundam invents real robot and the "humanoid war machine" genre.
>puts in other category
>Macross serves as the bedrock of Battletech
>Puts in different category than Battletech
Wtf dawg
Something to keep in mind: Japanese anime and manga were the origins of the "manned humanoid robot" trope in the first place. Previously, robots in sci-fi were seen as either a) autonomous units that moved and acted by themselves, e.g. androids or voice-commanded robots, or b) powered armor which wasn't nearly as common but still existed. 1972's Mazinger Z was the first to implement the concept of a humanoid robot piloted by a human inside of it as a vehicle. Mobile Suit Gundam in 1979 then introduced the concept of the piloted humanoid robot as a military weapon of war where the machines were mass produced and used for political conflicts. In fact, franchises like Battletech took a lot of designs wholesale from anime like Macross for some of their "iconic" designs (which lead to all sorts of legal kerfuffles since a lot of other American franchises at the time drew from the same anime sources).
IMO, while Walking Tanks would be the easiest kind of mech to build, they're also the most pointless because a conventional tank would likely be far better at what they'd try to do - you're just adding the complication of legs for no real gain, like you're just half-assing being a mech. If you see how real world humanoid robots like say Boston Dynamic's Atlas moves, any humanoid piloted mecha seeking to become viable in the battlefield must posses at least that level of mobility and motility to be effective and be able to carve out a niche on the battlefield, i.e. they should be large armored infantry, not legged tanks. IMHO something like Titanfall's Titans would be the most realistically viable form of a large piloted mecha (if you the more exotic techs they have like energy shields): small and nimble enough that they're not sitting ducks compared to tanks, while large enough to be able to do stuff normal infantry can't.
Atlas kind of does move a bit like the Titanfall Titans maybe Respawn used their movement for reference.
I agree with you that the thing of making walking tanks is stupid lmao , making them have a different Niche would be better , per example using mechs in mountain warfare
So far in our world.
The most realistic approach is going for the Powered Armor tech.
Check out the obscure and forgotten Heavy Gear setting. Their mecha (Gears) are humanoid seem to be about 10 to 15 feet tall at most. Just big enough for a pilot in the torso.
It's stated in one of the old pc game manuals that Gears can go places and do things tanks can't. And while they are far more agile and mobile than tanks, tanks still tend to be a good deal tougher, have a lower profile, and carry just as heavy a weapons load if not heavier.
@@moondog8353 sounds like Tactical Armor from Gasaraki to me. The height is also similar to ATs in VOTOMS. Closest thing to that size IRL is the Kuratas. How can anyone forget that Suidobashi mech?
I will say though that at the very least, Gundam tries to make its mechs make sense within the setting, especially in the UC timeline. Just look at 08th MS team that took this concept the furthest. Of course, there are exceptions such as SEED and G Gundam.
Oh, and Gundam does make use of the whole rotating limb bit. Turn A Gundam really get's a lot of mileage out of this one.
But seriously though, putting Gundam and Gurren Lagann in the same category is near blasphemous given that they are very different breeds.
which ms in seed is the exception? i mean, unicorn can literaly turn back time.
transformable ms in the UC also make no sense from a design perspective, specially when they have a better solution for atmospheric flight.
@@marcosdheleno I am using SEED as he used it as footage when talking about Gundam. That series plays it very fast and loose with how the mechs are portrayed, and of course, Unicorn is no exception, especially as far as the title MS is concerned.
@@matteste i really disagree, if anything, seed actually gives ALOT of weight with the mobile suit movement.
just look at the strike's movement in ep1. or the ginn's landing.
the thing is, the strike movement does become far better as the series progress, but that's because of the programing kira does, which the series tells us all the time, its to advanced and not the norm.
@@marcosdheleno I'n pretty sure real robots aren't just about the mechs but the genre as a whole so is also define by the "war drama, characters, settings, story, plot, scifi-nest, etc." While super is how much they don't give a fuck and just have the coolest things. So I'd say all of Gundam (I haven't seen turn A, X and Age) except G Gundam are definitely in the real robot genre
@@marcosdheleno Seed's "good mech movement" went out the window when the mid season Gundam upgrade rolls in.
The main thing that I think makes a good mech focused IP is not realism, but plausibility. As long as they have some decent explanations for how and why the mechs work, then its fine. Suspension of disbelief can fill in the gaps. That's why I love Gundam and Battletech so much. They have enough realism and consistency to make sense internally, but enough fantasy to still be really fun.
For example: In Gundam, the mobile suits were originally developed from construction vehicles that were used to build the space colonies. Then the original military versions were intended to fight big space cruisers. So being huge human shaped vehicles with huge weapons actually makes sense. Plus, having limbs actually helps them maneuver in space, the same way modern astronauts can. Plenty of real physics based concepts there.
Then the fantasy is the Minovsky particles, which allow for ultracompact fusion reactors to power the mobile suits, and their powerful beam weaponry. They also explain why no one uses things like ICBMs or any other BVR guided munitions. Minovsky particles can jam all broadcast communications, like radar and radio. So close combat with manually aimed weapons has become necessary once again.
And Newtypes. But that's a whole other thing.
In my opinion, the most unrealistic thing about mobile suits is their size. Unless there is a very specific reason for them to be big, real mechs will most likely be small, probably closer to powered armor. Because the primary strength of a humanoid vehicle is agility and flexibility. And that rapidly diminishes as the size increases. All the necessary joints will be always very vulnerable, and the only real way to protect them is to simply not get hit. Making a mech an impenetrable walking fortress is never going to happen. That's what tanks are for.
Which is why I think the mech type that is actually the LEAST realistic are walking tanks. Making a mech big and slow is just plain dumb. Because tanks already do that way better than a mech ever could. That's the main fantasy aspect of Battletech. Battlemechs are only tougher that anything else because the rules say so.
I expect real mechs will be more like IFVs than tanks. Something designed to augment and support infantry, like the Tachikoma in Ghost in the Shell, or Landmates from Appleseed. Or, at the largest, the Titans from Titanfall. And like in those stories, they won't be general military units. They will be used by specialist groups. And they will mostly be used in urban environments, not open warfare, where their small size and agility will make them far more useful than heavy armor.
That bit with their size actually seems to be referenced in universe sometimes. In space where distances are so wast the size was less of an issue, but when combat moved onto Earth, then they all of a sudden had to fight against gravity and they lost one of their key advantages that they had had in space, which only served to help swing the war in the federations favor once they got their act together as the mobile suits gots easy pickings for tanks and fighters.
Ever watched patlabor
Ghost Bear? ASSF watching You!
AFFS😀
@@matteste I mean that makes a lot of sense however you will see the Federation using their own mobile suits on earth's gravity so that kind of ruined your explanation, you can say that the MGs are actually more agile and less bulky than the badies, however they are almost as big so almost as vunerable.
Nonetheless Gundam pioneered the concept of real robots so you can't blame them for not taking a lot of things in consideration, back then a humanoid walker thingy was completely imposible, nowadays it is each day more possible but the reality in the battlefield shows that mobility and practicality is the king of the modern battlefield so walking armored thingys are a no no, at least until the tech gets really viable and practical to use.
I'm surprised 40k didn't get a look in with Knights and Titans being both walking tanks and absolutely rule of cool in design "THE CATHEDERAL IS WALKING! AND IT HAS A PLASMA CANNON THE SIZE OF AN OFFICE BUILDING!"
sometimes you guy gotta shoot a building with a spicy building
Made even better by the Tau having learn of it.
With them thinking it was silly or impossible... Only to then notice the building walking towards them has a chainsaw... Or why the imperium would have a valid reason for a giant robot using a chainsaw and guns that are just as absurd.
Who needs fancy shields and armor when you have a system to send enemy bullets straight into the warp so that your paint job doesn't get scratched?
The Tau learned fast though... second time they encountered Titans (Taros campaign/IA:3) they strapped an orbital rail cannon to a bomber and left a smoking crater where the Titan should have been.
...course that snippet’s probably been retconned long before now.
The Titans of WH40k are classic examples of walking tanks. Though it makes no sense to build tanks and spaceships in the shape of cathedrals.
ON GOD!
I think Lancer, the Mech RPG is a great blend of all the categories of mechs. It lets you hard focus onto any side of the spectrum you like or mix and match between the two. Plus the aesthetics and gameplay are just amazing.
Lancer is badass
I think that the Front Mission games deserved an honorable mention. As well as Armored Troopers VOTOMS since the mechs featured in that series, like the Scopedogs, were a weird compromise between powered armor and more "full sized" mecha.
Votoms needs more love. Needs a modern reboot. They should also check out Obsolete.
@@wakjagner Obsolete was fantastic and reminded me a lot of Votoms. In fact I think there was a pro-model kit cross-over between the two franchises.
Doesn’t Obsolete opening also reference Votoms opening?
Anyway I’m planning on watching Obsolete anyway.
There is another division above what you list; there is the division between "Real" and "Super" Giant Robot/Mech settings. Everything you list would be Real Mech Settings, in that all of the mechs have no special resistance to damage and are moderately sized, where Super Giant Mechs are usually very much larger and virtually invulnerable to anything that isn't a similar scale mech or kaiju. Think Voltron, the Power Ranger Megazords, and (for a non mech and smaller example) the G1 Transformers, which canonically required atomic weapons to scratch their paint and alien tech to actually damage.
Still, the Real Mech settings tend to be (relatively) more popular in the west, so it makes sense that they are what you focused on.
Well yeah.
Essentially Japanese mechs fall under either super robots or real robots.
While Western mechs tend to be nearly always be real robots.
The division in Western mechs are the more humanoid/sleek (closer to Japanese style) mechs and more blocky walking tank type mechs.
Talking of 80's anime, Armored Trooper Votoms has probably the best representation of mech warfare of them all, with them being used as a main combat unit instead of highly specialized superweapons. Round Verniam Vifam is another gem for its time, another child soldier story, but with surprising moral and philosophical depth for a children tv show.
I agree. Plus they're small enough to not to stick out like a sore thumb and get instantly scrapped like their taller brethren. A newer one that is also good is 86. The Juggernaut is a very different take on mech combat. Its essentially a spider like 4 legged tank destroyer with a giant gun and very thin armor. In skilled hands it would be an absolute terror on the battlefield.
8:00
It should be mentionned that the Titans from Titanfall are some of the smallest mechas out there.
Titans are around 20 feet tall or 6 meters.
Battletech go from 9 meter talls for the light mech to 13 meters tall for the Atlas.
Valkyries in Macross are 12 to 15 meters tall
Gundams are 18,5 meters tall or 10 to 1 scale to an average human male
In my opinion - titanfall titans are some of the more realistic depiction of mecha warfare.
@@c0ya1 that too
I think only the Wanzers from Front Mission are smaller to be honest since those stand about 14-20 feet tall depending... though there were some larger ones, usually super prototypes or armored slabbed monsters like the Leopard series.
Yeah and titans are the absolute best because of that. They're more realistic especially since they dont look goofy like a gundam.
These categories make no sense. How you lump all of Gundam together is crazy and then on top of that throw it in with Gurren Lagann is wild. Gundam was a break away from super robot shows not the pinnacle of it.
I love how most of these franchises lead to a Corporate dytopia in some way. Also so hyped for the AC lore dump!
secret to stompy battle bots, capitalism?
Let the money rule the world even more!
that is because mecha are generally science fiction war machines, and those make sense in a setting with lots of technology and war.
I don't know battletech is pretty much every terrestrial war on earth blown up in magnitudes. The only thing corporate is probably the mercenaries and House Steiner (as they were the only government formed due to trade). Then later on comstar but they were a fragment of a pseudo galactic united nations (dtar league) who try to maintain some sense of power balance....
technology sufficiently advanced is indistinguishable from dystopia
Personally my favorite take on the concept of mechs is from 86 Eighty Six. The mechs in that series aren't humanoid, but instead are multi-legged vehicles similar to insects and coruscations, allowing to get full mobility in any environment while keeping armor and weapons at a low profile
I agree. The Juggernaut is an interesting take. To borrow from WWII they're tank destroyers like the M18 Hellcat. Big gun, paper thin armor (they complain about it in the second episode). A really skilled pilot like Undertaker make it dangerous enemy. But, it only takes one or two shots to wipe the floor with it. Something like a scaled down wolf Zoid would work too.
*Huge Gundam fan sheds single tear filled with both joy and pain* during Gundam section. Thank you for the down to earth description while still honoring the experience. So excited for AC6 and I've been really enjoying your battletech/Mechwarrior videos!
Why are you taking this clown's video so seriously (granted i cant tell if you're being serious rn so pardon me). This guy doesn't understand much about mecha at all and just because he has a couple views which he farmed from ac6 hype doesn't negate that fact.
So you didn't watch any Gundam anime at all? There's a distinction between real and super robot, and you just missed it entirely. There are the super robots full of hot-blooded young men whose mech's power correponds to the loudness of their screams, and real robots which are machines of war that are treated the same as any tank or plane yet fulfilling its own niche.
Gundam Wing brought up the controversial topic of drone type weapons as the real world drones were still in it's infancy
The original gundam started that with funnels. The first time they're used they wipe the floor against the federation because they're too fast for a normal human without training
Happened in war in Ukraine, Ukraine soldier use drone as long range as weapon use grenade and suicide drone just like Gundam anime, both federation and zeon use funnel/ drone as long range weapon
Macross is a great thing to look at for anyone newly into Battletech. Almost all of the original Battlemechs are lifted directly from there and two other 80's era anime.
The other two are Genesis Climber Mospeda and Super Dimension Southern Cross.
@@nicodalusong149 You're mixing things up with Robotech. Battletech originally used mechs from Macross and Dougram, with a few entries from Crusher Joe.
What about Fang of The Sun Dougram?
@@d.shaffer8782 Oh right, my mistake.
@@Joshua_N-ADougram is good enough that even us BattleTech fans are like, yeah, we _wish_ BattleTech politics were written anywhere near that well.
6:45
Many Gundam mechs can hover above the ground with special jets. Those that are purpose-made for hovering (like Gundam's MS-09 Dom) usually have flaring leg armour and skirt-like parts.
Gundam was the first to do "real mecha" for it's mechs. Before then, it was stuff like super-robot, think of VoltesV, Mazinger, etc. Even then, the first Gundam still had some of that Super-robot DNA in it, mainly stuff like the core-righter and just the color-pallet for the Federation. Its a war-story disguised.
The only exception for gundam leaning heavily into super-robot is probably Mobile Fighter G Gundam.
See what gets me is that Mobile Suit Gundam and Macross get it right by not treating their mecha, with some minor exceptions, as tanks but as Aerospace craft. This makes more sense than most others.
Heck, even Heavy Gear trends this way when you compare the typical Gear loadout to an Attack Helicopter.
Edit: To go along with that, you could also include Power Dolls Power Loaders in that category as well.
Edit2: The glitch slide you mention is the Zaku hovering over the water inside an orbital space colony using thrusters.
Edit3: Mobile Suits and Variable Fighters are more the third category than the 2nd. Rule of Cool fits more the Super Robot style shows like Gurren-Lagann, Evangelion, or Big O.
Edit4: Battletech's Battlemechs actually move more like a Mobile Suit in the lore. Partially because 80s anime was the main source of inspiration. For example the subset known as the Unseen are literally designs that had to have artwork removed because they literally were the art of shows like Macross that caused legal disputes.
Edit5: That said. I love Armored Core as it is a unique blend of the various types of mecha. (AC4 era definitely felt very super robot side of Gundam. AC4 felt heavily inspired by G-Wing, G-00, and G Gundam.)
Edit6: Also go watch ID-0 on Netflix. It predates Gen:LOCK and explored a similar idea for its mecha but was so much better. And didn't get a disappointing second season.
Kudos for mentioning what I saw as the big omission in this video: Heavy Gear highly inspired by Armored Trooper VOTOMS.
@Ashley Pollard Was gonna reference Gate Walkers Trilogy and a few other books but got distracted rereading the books while trying to find the name of the trilogy...
The EVA series are not mechs by the traditional sense, as they are bio-mechanical creations with a person's soul inside.
@Kerbodynamic X A large amount of super robots are bio-mechanical in some form.
@@JTMC93 Glad you enjoyed the books.
Rule of cool is not a mech type, its an aspect of a show. If it look cool enough, you suspend your belief.
A Gundams blocky mid section to totally impractical, as are most of that type.
Super mecha like Mazinzer or Reideen use tech way above normal.
This video is half assed opinion of the creator. No information is provided... Lame
Glad to hear Macross mentioned, even if you only brought up the original. Macross Plus and Macross Frontier are both worth looking into if you can find them
I'm glad I saw someone else in the comments mention it but a big part of mobile suit and other "eastern" mecha survivability is their mobility, much like tanks and fighter aircraft in the real world. It helps to remember a lot of Japanese IP like Gundam but more especially Macross, Muv Luv, Yukikaze, and Ace Combat derive their design off of fighters and not tanks. This also makes the size of them more palatable when you realize mobile suits and the like are about as tall as modern fighters are as long, just boxier since they often fight in space and have to house a miniaturized nuclear reactor. For reference an F-22 is 18.9 meters long.
However, as far as I know, the mechs from MechWarrior don't have any sort of active protection which makes it all the more baffling that not only are they as massive and slow as they are but that they also have massive windows instead of the periscopes you see on tanks and patlabors. If the materials were as strong as the rest of the armor then much more of the mech would be made of it to preserve pilot situational awareness but that largely doesn't seem to be the case either. Not to say Gundam doesn't have examples of this (Turn A) but that's not the norm as it seems to be in Mechwarrior.
It's too bad he didnt mention or doesn't seem to be aware of any of the aforementioned Japanese real robot IP or others like gasaraki, 86, and heavy object.
Battle Mechs have active defenses like sensor jammers and point defense systems. Mostly armor tho.
technically, the cockpit glass in a BT mech isn't even glass. still far more fragile than the rest of the mech though.
Muv luv... I love muv luv.
Lemme add to the real robot list: dugrum,patlabor , votoms
That emphasis on mobility in Japanese mecha can be traced back to starship troopers with the exo suits that the mobile infantry wore, the creator of gundam originally wanted to do exosuits like that but he was convinced to do mecha instead and applied those principles to mobile suits.
"High heels on your mech, have fun with your femboy robot."
As someone that has played every installment of Armored Core.... I took that personally. Light Bipeds have always reigned supreme.
VOTOMs needs more love.
Came here to say that too. Along with Heavy Gear as a game.
Macross as well.
I think you did a huge disservice to Gundam. In Japan, it's sorta credited for creating, or at the very least popularizing, the Real Robot genre, the use of Mecha as an ordinary tool of war piloting a machine, with a specific focus put into the in-universe mechanics of the machines, as unrealistic as they might be. Prior to Mobile Suit Gundam, most mecha anime would be classified as Super Robot, these are your Gurren Lagans, Mazinger Z's, Getter Robos, these are all almost Superhero and Superhuman in fashion. Though you grouped them together in this video, they are actually quite distinct, and literally different styles/genre of Mechs.
The big issue I have with this video, which I imagine took a lot of hard work to make, is the failure to include Armored Trooper VOTOMS. Along with the game Heavy Gear. Plausible sized mecha that one could compare to Iron Man's Hulk Buster suit. Large, but not ridiculously so.
And no love for Patlabor either.
@@moondog8353 True, but Labors are big, and there's not enough love for #RealRobot going on here.
The real problem is that this video it's just an Opinion piece mascarading as an Informative video.
@@ashley-r-pollard while Labors are indeed big, they are not used for war unlike most mechs , and that gives them way more plausability regarding the designs as the difference between a law enforcement vehicle and a military vehicle is quite big
@@ulforcemegamon3094 My problem is that I don't like super sized mecha in real world settings. It's a taste thing.
that Titanfall 2 time jump level was my second favorite sequence of any game only falling short by the supremacy of the Cigar Maze
TAKE CONTROL
Need to have a distinction between "real robots" which rely on realism/plausibility and "super robots" reality breaking, kaiju slaying robots. Also needs to show how the Gundam franchise's interpretations of mechs varies heavily between each show.
Armored core literally starts out with you being at long range taking slow pot shots with huge cannons and missiles as basically a walking tank and then accelerates to dancing around the battlefield as an invincible deus ex machina where the only weapon fast enough to keep up with you is a SWORD. (For those of you armored core 4A fans, I’ve killed CUBE/fragile with moonlight).
It definitely deserves the title of best mech game ever made.
For Gundam, I’d actually put it somewhere between rule of cool and humanoid war machines, but sort of leaning towards the former. Kind of like where Armored Core is placed. Gundam mobile suits are definitely over the top compared to the walking tank examples, but they’re also completely not on the same level of RoC absurdity that is *super robots* like Gurren Lagann, Voltes V, Getter Robot, and Mazinger. Gundam was influential back in the day for being so grounded compared to those kind of mecha, defining the *real robot* subgenre.
Gundam tries (for the most part) to keep things more grounded, especially when you take a look at stuff taking place in the early UC timeline like 08th MS Team and MS Igloo.
This of course differs depending in which Gundam timeline/series you’re looking at. Something from the later portions of Seed (like the Akatsuki at 4:50) and 00, and obviously everything G Gundam are much more towards the RoC super robot side of the spectrum.
Basically, what I’m trying to say is lumping all of Gundam together and brushing it off as the same level as Gurren Lagann was a mistake here. It’s more similar to how Armored Core is described in this video. There are series that are more grounded, and then there are series that goes more towards the super robot end of the spectrum.
Another rule of cool is zone of the enders
Kind of a shame with Full Metal Panic not being mentioned. Apart from like cloaking tech and a magic reactor that turns thought into reality, the mechs that everyone else uses (The standard ones) are just simple 10m tall mechs that don't have thrusters, they have to walk or be carried via helicopter, and they don't have beam weapons, you have your assortment of anti-material rifles, shotguns, machine guns and anti-armour knives. Another one that wasn't mentioned was Patlabour. Especially like Movies 1 and 2 are a real treat for real robot fans.
Gundam may vary between the two, depending on the instalment in question but it may be easier to just call it Hybrid rather than either Super or Real Robot.
Blud really just lobbed in Gundam to a super robot show like gurren lagan, like I get you don't like flashy mechas but know your roots
You're asking for the impossible from these nimrods
"know your roots" you meant to say "know what you're talking about"
Battletech
Chromehounds
Steel Battalion
Mobile Suit Gundam
Armoured Core
Metal Gear Solid
Metal Fox Chaos
Zone of the Enders
War Machines
Lost Planet
Gun Metal
Future Cop L.A.P.D
Pacific Rim
Robot Jox
Heavy Gear
Super Robot Wars
Titan Fall
Macross
Code Geese
Power Rangers
MechaGodzilla
Iron Giant
This is just a small sample of the best stompy robots I love.
You forgot Front Mission
You include Mechagodzilla but not Zoids?
Don't forget about Tau Battlesuits, and LANCER
This video is all over the place. Gundam together with Gurren Lagann? Really now?
what's really cool about armored core is how fast and maneuverable you are not only depends on the parts you buy but also on how good you are at the game, like even if you give a really good endgame mech to a new player they would probably move around as if they were in a ''tank on legs'' but the more techniques you learn the more you can do, like learning to use overboost to turn get your aim on an enemy instead of turning around in place, or learning to use boost hopping to more efficiently spend your energy, watching a beginner play and watching someone experienced play is like looking at 2 different games
Few things to consider with Gundam that those with zero knowledge of it often mistakenly assume that will lend a bit more credence to it's significant realism compared to a shockingly large amount of mecha media: Universal Century, the original Gundam timeline, is VERY much grounded in reality in it's beginnings, with mobile suits being made out of essentially weaponizing humanoid colony construction machines that used the limbic system to maneuver in space. Early gundam is very slow, plodding, and grounded, and being in space later on(in UC) makes significant sense, since the entire crux of the series is about the independence of space colonies!
Also those aren't lasers! Not even CLOSE, they're particle beams, which means that energy can be disrupted or deflected, using flashy coatings like shown at 5:00, though that's also from SEED, an absolutely not realistic series that has almost nothing to do with the original show.
Ummmm, mobile suits are humanoid war machines. Some of the gundams are a little more in the super robot category. But for the most part, the gundam franchise is in the same category as Armored Core, real robot.
Legged mechs like those in the 86 anime seem the most realistic to me, but likely only in either a post apocalyptic world with terrible terrain or in a lower gravity environment where you need the ability to both move and hold onto the terrain
I agree, or if you put more armor on it and make it more scaled down Zoids wolf or lion mech like and you'd have something that could go hull down for ambushing and still move around the battlefield relatively quickly
I'd like to see an Armoured Core that progresses from the Muscle Tracer style units, into Normals and finally endgame you get the NEXTs or equivalents.
That'd be cool in concept at least.
For the “rule of cool” mechs, an entire sub genre is there for ones that are literally just super heroes. The Super Robot genre. Which is where the ones that throw galaxies are from. So those are their own beasts entirely.
And they range from tiny small robots that are the size of human children (Astroboy and Mega Man) to hulking leviathans taller than entire galaxies. (Tengann Toppa Gurren Lagann and Demonbane) And even one that canonically killed everything in the Mech/Mecha/Giant Robot genre. (Shin Mazinger Zero. God I hate this one)
It’s where all the wacky shit is and I love it for that. You even have more grounded ones too like King of Braves GaoGaiGar. A show where the mech takes a lot of beatings from giant monsters and other mechs but keeps fighting. The costume mechs from old live action media are usually always super robots as well. (Giant Robo, Mechagodzilla, and the Megazord.)
And before anyone says anything, Evangelion is more of a real robot show masquerading as a super robot. Even though I wouldn’t even call it a mech either. If you know you know.
You fool, It was the classic 80's Mecha that brought me here
Sad there was no mention of VOTOMs, which is arguably halfway between Humanoid War Machine and Walking Tank.
They have VERY clear limitations and are often referred to as Steel Coffins.
Pretty clearly you have not watched Gundam 0080.
The Zaku "sliding" above ground is in an O'Neill Cylinder, where gravity is artificially generated by spinning the ground at about 167m/s. You can simply hover off the ground and there's no gravity any more, other than the wall spinning to and away from you causing wind.
The said Zaku also has a thrust to mass ratio of 1.03g, well enough for hovering even on Earth.
Bro,you didn't talked about the super robot subgenre,the one who popularized the mecha genre in the 70's. mazinger and getter robo are the big names in this subgenre,and the big name in live action is super sentai AKA power rangers in the west, transformers is basically the hybrid of this and the real robot subgenre (the subgenre that you talked mostly in your video)
"Bam, high heels on your mech. Have fun with your femboy robot."
You got me with that one I swear to god, you got me.
sadly no single pic of FSS on this quote
Japanese mecha = fast paced and western mecha= chunky slow tanks
Though Japanese mobile mecha has its roots in western media in starship troopers, they've certainly latched onto that concept much more than western mecha.
Armored core did it both
@@hare75 there are several mecha franchises who did mix both of em. Armored core is not the only one
your gundam hate, was uncalled for!
"shun the non believer, SHUUUUUUUUUN"
People that are thinking that development and practical deployment of future mechs is highly unlikely are not paying attention to current developmental progress of mecha and robotics... Sooner or later military will figure out how to practically and successfully deploy mecha on battlefields...
Agreed, Boston Dynamics has the Atlas and their range of dogs.
The primary problem that will have to be overcome in order to deploy Mechs on today's battlefields is the creation of a small, stable, sustainable, and long lasting power source. Most mecha described in the video have fusion powerplants, or some fantastical power source like protoculture or the soul of an extraplanar being. That's way beyond what we can produce right now.
mecha is not the same as robotics, you don't pilot a boston dynamic dog from the inside
@@oldcowbb is robot dogs all you're aware of?
@@oldcowbb Arguably true (terms and conditions apply; errors and omissions excepted), but your point misses the point.
Imaginary mecha can't exist with technology, of which robotics is one component.
i did not expect this video to be so entertaining
thank you kindly!
Thanks for such a useful video to show to newbies!
Ah I see your understanding of mobile suits is a bit lacking. They are a lot more grounded than you think 🙂
Depends on which series. Some do act closer to battletech than others while some are space ballerinas with the enemy fleet serving as the dance floor.
@@JohnDoe-sx6iw Yeah the examples he showed being mostly SEED and IBO. The grunt unit from early to mid UC and the early grunts suit from 00 (pre GN drive) are pretty realistic. In my very biased opinion i still think a Zaku II and its variants could wipe the floor against battlemechs. XD
@@christiangarcia5348 Without a doubt. XD
@@christiangarcia5348 Witch from Mercury is also showing some promise as well. Turn A Gundam was also really good with this despite how advanced the tech was.
I like how he goes from "I can tell you the exact intricate reason for why theese big metal stompers exist" to "realism? What are that?"
This is the first I’ve heard of Armored Core and I love mechs! Thank you.
You forgot to mention Zone of the Enders, am sad :(
Genuinely having an aneurysm at you putting Gundam and Gurren Lagann in the same category.
_Imagine humanity can finally ride a giant robot in the year of 2090, but by that time we all here already old or die._
_Yup, we all born to late to explore to earth & born to soon to see a giant (the real one) robot._
_Right here right now we all living in the entertainment era._
I feel like the "Rule of Cool Robots" category is its own spectrum altogether, there certainly are mechs that fit in the category as-is which are still on the realistic end, like Patlabor. On the other end of the spectrum you get your Evangelions and Gurren Laganns, with Gundam and Zone of the Enders somewhere in the middle depending on the specific show/game.
thank you for the video. love the stompy mech genre throughout all entertainment methods (books, animation, video games, etc etc.). In the genres, I never felt more immersed than when playing Xbox Steel Battalion with the insane controller and pedal system. Game came in a giant box shaped like an ammo can. Hardcore mode was always enabled and if you died in the game it wiped your save so the eject button was actually necessary. Also windshield wipers because mud and rain were part of the game too.
Nothing since has replaced that feeling and probably never will.
I have 4 main classifications my self.
Walker/Walking tank: Pretty much exactly what he said. Stuff like Star Wars walkers or 2242 walkers.
Mechs: Battletech. More like a giant humanoid war machine, but kept more inline with a realistic military setting.
Mecha: This is basically the rule of cool category he described. Where the mech is like an extension of the user. Where they move and fight like the laws of physics aren’t real.
Western Mecha: Rule of cool mechs. Just brought back enough to not have a universe where children rise to the level of literal gods. Think Titanfall.
I mean, some Gundam kinda applies to the "Western Mecha" category. Things like 08th MS Team and Stardust Memories are pretty grounded for the most part.
Other anime examples i think of right know is Votoms and Patlabour.
@@snimon5824 yeah but most gundams fall to the mecha category
One of my favorite tank on legs games was called Hawken, it felt heavy but for quick bursts you could also be nimble. Miss that game.
There is Hawken reborn tho
@@ulforcemegamon3094 hmmmm?
Tbh, I want mecha universe that'a mix of Macross & Titanfall & Code Geass. A mobile transform mid to small size mechas that could move dynamic & fast based on its transformantion, to negate the OPness. This can make air battle scenes so much more intruiging with it as fast as Ace Combat, meanwhile ground level can be pretty mobile like a soldiers in the battlefield. The smaller size also make sense for the appeal of realistic military mass productions & give relevancy to other military vehicles like tanks & battleships.
one thing that is often missed about the Titanfall Titans (what the mechs are called. Titans. go figure, when they deploy, the Titan is falling, hence the game name...yeah) is that they were originally used as tools of farming, construction and general labor on the Frontier before war broke out
there were never any tanks on the frontier because it was meant to be a peaceful colony away from all the Earth drama, so adapting these big, sturdy machines into tools of war actually has a degree of realism that would move it on the scale a bit closer to the Waling Tank style, as the devs to make an attempt to explain it and it isn't all that implausible, all things considered
source?
Titanfall 2 opening cutscene you can clearly see Titans being used for general labor on a rather fertile and peaceful farm looking place
I think the best example of how a "walking tank" mech should be done are the Scopedogs from VOTOMS, they're big, bulky mass produced machines utilized in political conflicts but they're also able to zip around the battlefield like an Armored Core, giving them a justifiable excuse for why they're used instead of normal tanks.
Also the fact that they aren't super big unlike most mechs , in fact i remember the Scopedog being 4,20 meters tall , which is around as tall as the AMP suit from avatar
Well this video gets BattleTech's "walking tanks" wrong, anyways. The heaviest of those things can do handstands, some lighter mechs have done jump jet assisted backflips. Even the heaviest of mechs can jog around at 50kph, and the most iconic one, the Atlas, is actually considered a bit toothless because that's too slow for it's close-range payload. Just a big "shoot me first" paper tiger that freaks people out (and convinces people to buy it) because it could rip your mech's arms off and use them as clubs.
The mechs most most praised by in-universe pilots are stuff like the Shadow Hawk- 80kph, jump jets, mixed weapons that can deal with not-mech things at basically any range effectively. And while they _are_ big, the Shadow Hawk is 10 meters tall and the tallest ever was 16 (which was seen as excessive). Juuust big enough for a human being to believably fit in the cockpit. Not the Jager sized things you unfortunately get when artists screw the scale up.
I usually think about it this way:
-Legged Tank Mechs are interesting to think about, but usually boring to watch
-Hype Machine Mechs are interesting to watch, but usually boring to talk about
-Mechs in the middle often end up being far more intriguing than either of the extreme
That doesn't apply to the setting or story as a whole, but when it comes to the mechs themselves, this is usually what I've observed to be the case
5:15 - appreciate the subtle FTL background music! So apt
a huge thing people seem to forget is that tanks were kinda specifically designed to have low ground pressure, and can deal with muddy and soft terrain very very easily for the most part. Leggy tanks would be such a downgrade in that department, the arms of humanoid mecha would be essential to add another level of mobility and functionality to justify no tracks
This man hasn't seen a single gundam series, or any mecha anime for that matter.
So many people dismiss Gundam...
@@gundam5281 Or they just think gundam isn't worth paying attention
Like what sane man puts gundam and gurren laggan in the same category?
@@suncanny1418 Gundam is in the real-robot category and gurren laggam is in the super-robot category so that's just stupid
@@Reno_the_doofus In Unicorn the Gundams are basically just Starfighters that look like humans for reasons.
Would love to see a follow up video going over more mechs! Chromehounds, Zoids, Warhammer tau, etc. There are so many more that deserve to be revisited!
Great ost choice for the background music
I think you should have included the super-robot type, units ranging from being able to destroy entire armies onntgeor own to being able to destroy entire universes, like Mazingers and Getters.
I know a lot of people have already said something similar, but I really don't think your categories are very efficient, categorically, and I don't much care for your take on what qualifies as what. The only distinctions between walking-tank and humanoid-warmachine you gave were basically size and if they punch each other, for example. Meanwhile, anything even vaguely fanciful got lumped together into what effectively counts-as the more common "Super Robo" category. There's a pretty significant difference in the way the technology and tactics of something like like the original 1977 Mobile Suit Gundam and Aura Battler Dunbine are represented, but you lumped all "80s Japanese Mecha" into one category. What's more, while it's full of "beam gun" and the mechs don't move like something Boston Dynamics developed, a lot of the Universal Century puts a good bit of effort into explaining how it's technologies work, and there's often cases of mechs and super ships being totally undercut by on-foot military operations. Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War In The Pocket has about as much to do with Shin Tetsujin 28 as an ant does a light bulb, but they're both "80s Japanese Mecha."
To use a specific example from the video, there's technology originally developed on the Doms where a combination of vector thrusting and hovercraft-adjacent technology allows them to skim across the surface of the ground; just like a few feet off of it, so they can slide and boost around without having to step or stumble. This isn't just represented by a booster on the foot, but the legs have these wide skirts that hide additional boosters and engines and fuel that's used to facilitate this functionality. It sounds like bait, but google Rick Dom Foot, and you'll see what I'm talking about. This tech was compacted down into less functional, but more streamlined variations over the course of the One Year War, which the Zaku you used as an example where you asked "how is it [clip-gliding]?" The trade-off being that it can't do it as long as a Dom can, and is less stable.
Yeah, that's a bunch of non-sense, but the effort is there to explain how the suits work, and how this is all technology and not space-magic (until like 10 in-setting years later when they also develop space-magic, but that's besides the point). The Akatsuki Gundam (I had to google it; it's the golden one) certainly has a much more nonsensical gimmick, but it is a trick/gimmick-suit from a B-list Alternative Universe Gundam series; it's a horrid representation of the franchise, let alone the entire genre.
I'm not one to gatekeep or discourage involvement in any hobby, but it truthfully feels like you've made a video about a genre/trope that you don't actually have very much experience with. That's not really an issue in itself, but you speak of it so factually and confidently; with the overtones of someone who's explaining a subject like a professor, yet as is too often the case, it is a professor that's only about 30% familiar with the subject they're lecturing you on.
Also, why the apostrophe? I've never seen Mech spelled that way before. It's short for Mechanical too, so if anything the apostrophe should be on the other end, shouldn't it?
FYI BattleTech mechs are seriously less walking tank than MechWarrior would have you believe. Assault mechs can do handstands in controlled environments, they crouch, they go prone, they rip their enemy's arms off and use them as clubs Gears of War style... and they're a bit smaller than people expect, too. Like medium mechs are 10 meters tall. Now imagine that thing jogging around, bobbing and weaving to avoid fire, amd you're getting closer.
"Child soldiers were war-winning wonder weapons"
Me: What are you talking about? Lynn Minmay is not a child soldier. She's a teen idol.
5:30
No, there's a much simpler reason as to why... *laser*.
Its gundam seed destiny. It just works that way.
>Puts Gundam and Gurren Lagann in the same category (A Mech and the other, a Robot with super powers which is a genre of its own called Super Robot)
I've heard enough, I shall take my leave.
Oh, just going to point out the ARMA of mechs, M.A.S.S builder, its the game where you can make any mech, it functions like a gundam, but you can make it look like mecha Godzilla
You forgot the "A cathedral covered in guns" school of mechs.
Tell me you don’t watch gundam without saying you don’t watch gundam
I can't believe he didn't talk about THE mecha movie of the last decade, Pacific Rim. There is no sequel in ba sing se
My favorite is the small economy size. Armored Trooper VOTOMS/Heavy Gear sized. VOTOMS are 100% ammunition based because they're too small to mount huge reactors. And they're small enough to actually use concealment behind a single story house. They also work along side more conventional armor, MLMS, and VTOLS.
They're about the largest scale mechs that could practically be fielded. Though honestly a quad with the same chassis size would have been even more practical. Anything bigger would be a missile/artillery magnet. Another good design that is wildly unlikely but would be a pain in the ass to actually face down are the spider like Juggernauts from 86. And its low enough to avoid being automatically turned into scrap.
I'll leave a list of notable mechs in Sci-fi for those of you that care:
1. Mazingers (Mazinger Z)
2. Getters (Getter Robo)
3. Variable Fighters (Macross)
4. Mobile Suits (Gundam)
5. Evagelions (Evangelion)
6. Battlemechs (Battletech)
7. Titans (Titanfall)
8. Jaegers (Pacific Rim)
9. Armored Cores (Armored Core)
10. Wanderpanzers (Front Mission)
11. Vital Suits (Lost Planet)
12. Frame Arms (Frame Arms)
13. TSF's (Muv-Luv)
14. Assugly Cans (Hawken)
15. Armored Troopers (AT Votoms)
16. Knightmare Frames (CG)
17. Orbital Frames (ZOE)
18. Arm Slaves (FMP)
19. Golems (Break Blade)
20. Ingrams/Labors (Patlabor)
21. Armored Shrikes (Blue Gender)
22. Heavy Gears (Heavy Gear)
23. Hounds (Chromehounds)
24. HIGH-MACHS (Gungriffon)
25. Aquarions (GOA)
26. Combat Armors (Dougram)
27. Tactical Armors (Gasaraki)
28. Gunmen (Gurren Lagann)
29. Metal Armors (Dragonar)
30. Gardes (Knights of Sidonia)
31. Yunboros (Gargantia)
32. Battle Frames (Project Nimbus)
33. IFO/LFO's (Eureka Seven)
34. Herculans (Earthsiege)
35. Virtuaroids (Virtual On)
36. Mechanaughts (Exteel)
37. Kataphrakts (Aldnoah Zero)
38. Megadeus (The Big O)
39.
40.
42.
43.
44.
45.
46.
47.
48.
49.
50.
I'll keep updating this list (probably, probably not)
Ps: Why do i have a feeling this comment section will turn a battleground of morons arguing about which type of mech is the best?
How about Metal Gears?
I personally prefer Armored Cores more, their size being super tiny(10 Meters for Normals, 15 Meters for NEXTs) is pretty interesting
@@RenoKyrie Thought about adding Metal Gears but decided against since because idk honestly.
And yeah, Armored Cores are cool
Growing up with mecha anime make in accustomed with certain designs of mechs. Time to expand my taste. Thanks for the list..
Any opinions about animal like mechs (86's Juggernaut, Gundam's Bucue)
@@m.firdausshaharum3860 Animal type mechs are cool but i prefer the more standard humanoid mech
@@m.firdausshaharum3860 If we are talking the size of the Animal Mechs in Horizon, yeah i like them
Personally prefer the more Humanoid Mechs, especially ones leaning closer to Armored Cores
I'm currently playing Phantom Brigade, it's a great mech tactics game. Though the story is even more shallow than Ace Combat.
Ace Combat's Story, while kind of absurd at times, is by no means shallow.
Phantom Birgade, ironically, is a better representation of how turn order works in tabletop BattleTech than BattleTech's own tactics game.
Honestly. Does anyone really need a pretense to nerd out about armored core? Opinions; I love mecha! However, an exo armor would be a much more functional set of kit.
I'll have you know the Zaku diaper is an important part of its design, it allows it to operate in space for long periods without needing to vent its exhaust!
Man my boy out here misrepresenting Gundam hard. It's more based in the Humanoid war machine camp but definitely strays into the Super Robot rule of cool thing not too uncommonly.
even though i get the section about the "rule of cool", Gundam and Gurren Lagann have quite the distance between them imo
I know right Gunam is all most fully real robot and Gurren Lagann is fully super robot
0/10. Youre ignoring the actually genre to boil it down to nothing. This was made by someone who is dismissive and just another hater who never bothered to watch the genre but instead watched voltron 30 years ago and called it a day. 6:55 the gundam doesnt win the war, the whole point is how the gundam cant win but you know who does? The thousands of tanks, jets and ms that are used by the federation.
“The robots are wearing diapers” with a zaku, my brother in zeon, the z’gok is way sillier
"an entire america's worth of weapons"
best thing i've heard all year
1. 4:03 ironic because between all the incarnations of mechs I know, IBO Mobile Suits are the ones that come with an explanation to at least one of the issues of mechs in general: weight. Their energy source can also be used to generate gravity and it's located around the torso, meaning that there is an extra force pulling the mech up… still pretty much unrealistic and we don't know if “making gravity” is even possible but hey it's a nice detail(?
2. 6:09 seeing how crazy anime goes with choreography when the characters got superhuman powers or even just “yeah a human can do that trust me bro'', it's really weird that there aren't many anime that take advantage of this :v7 like Baki and Tokyo Ghoul fights make the human body feels like steel-dense plastic xd
3. 9:10 it's even established that pilots are trained and equipped not just to pilot a mech but also to fight against a piloted robot
4. 10:47 *this is what I felt seeing the technology progression in Code Geass*
What Code Geass did with their mechs is really unforgivable. : (
What category does ZOIDS fall into?
Basic Info:
Animal robot that can be piloted
Semi-sentient that can be found in the wild with no pilot
Units can have physical, laser, electric, ranged and close combat weapons
Can have equipable/swapable parts
Has a "food" that acts like its energy source
In some cases can undergo evolution
Maybe they are robots trying to imitate an ecolgic niche.
Bilogical mimicry is somethig very used in robotics and servofishes, and even speculated in terraformation to test different genomes and anatomies on a robot, there is also horizon zero dawn
I would say that zoids are biomech since they are more like creatures than machines
I love gundam there designs are so cool.
Feldres from 86 would be the best fit for the walking tank category
If anime has taught us anything, wars are won by robots driven by child soldiers.