As much as I love analytical BK (and I’ve watched 100s of hrs of his idealism chats), I can’t help but TRULY resonate with the real BK that Artisan Tony accidentally teases out in each of his interviews. I need friends like this in my life! Keep it up gents.
Thanks Tony, great sharing and it made it all the way down under...hehe I always enjoy Bernado conversations. May I offer my version of an example of how our culture shapes us by Jaques Fresco RIP. "Unfortunately for me, my brother is the chief of our jarhead clan of headhunters, and he has several shrunken heads around his neck, worn with honor. As a pacifist, I have none which is likely to have me made an outcast, which will lead to my demise." Cheers from a retired soldier down under.
@@ArtisanTonywe don’t say that here in Oz. It’s very much an American thing to praise the enlisted janitor for their service when probably none was given. The whole warrior thang is anathema to the average Aussie, regarded as tasteless, jingoistic bs for the dumbass toxic male. Not bashing your fine country, America represents the best and the worst of humanity and I love it dearly, but some things just don’t wash.
So glad Bernardo dissected the interview with Tim Maudlin, more so than the article on his website. Maudlin took Bernardo's opening statement personally (which he shouldn't have, it was obviously not personal) and lashed back petulantly. It was a missed opportunity by Bernardo indeed to "wipe the floor with him" which would have been fun. I did like Maudlin's interviews -- he is good at nitty gritty of explaining Bell's theorem. Unfortunately after this I can't really watch him anymore. He is a child.
What is with people who can design computers that makes them leaders in modern renaissance of metaphysical idealism ( the notion that reality is essentially mental). Federico Faggin is known for designing the first commercial microprocessor, and now he has co authored a theory of consciousness. Perhaps, when science will acknowledge that a computer cannot be conscious, then, we will all accept that consciousness does not end with one’s biological life. Both Kastrup and Faggin explored how to make a computer conscious and both ended up developing their own version of metaphysical idealism. Jung said that he felt that our ancestors were waiting for our answers to questions they themselves, during their time, had. Certainly Professor Faggin’s father seem to be one of them; he wrote a book on Plotinus in 1945.
Great interview! So glad Bernardo addressed the issue with Tim Maudlin. I have so much respect for Bernardo and was disappointed with his reaction. It came across as if he was trying to avoid a contentious debate. I know that’s not true. As he said, his emotions got the best of him and it was a missed opportunity. Thanks for keeping it real Bernardo. Looking forward to more of your work!
I think his reaction was fine. At some point, you have to stand up to elitists otherwise the elitism and will continue. A lot of science is just philosophy anyway so treating people badly over philosophy it’s just being a bad human so we have to stand it to this kind of thing.
Lol! I should have mentioned my mom helped Robson Moura find his house here in Tampa. He’s a 7 time world champion in Brazilian Jiujitsu and started Nova Uneal (I don’t think the spelling is right.) either way, he trained me in jiujitsu, and I’m still a white belt no stripe bc the entire time he was teaching at MAA (martial arts advantage) I never actually enrolled. But was an instructor of the other martial arts there. Lol
1:07:37 there is nothing unnatural, if you follow monism. But ultimately, consciousness = suffering, so its natural. Consciousness is known to us directly only in the form of separation with ME in the center, so this is not surprising.
My father taught me that I had to discover the world on my own life he did the right thing to consider the possibility of FREEDOM of thought and say hey I'm watching you and I have an idea for a simple way to drawing in the state's of mindfulness I was into vacuum tubes for radio frequency and zero vibration and positioning waves that lazor was a refracting of the engine of plasmapheresis he said he hasn't thought of the same thing as I did but it was true the mathematical equations that provide by the meter is the pulse powerful tool for oseloscope and voltage layering in the same places as the light literally inside a circle that has circulated motion and circles with in circles has a opposable edge on the same pathway a pattern is followed by the amount of voltage and frequency that is involved
As a biological wonder I wonder if the day I was born I was born intelligent but the world made me ignorant of the past livestream of my own adventure 😅😅😅could we all have the same process and then reflect upon the depth of life itself is the truest meaning of learning the TRUTHFULNESS of 😅the reality?hmm and I think that we did have a lot of commonality in the before birth cycle.
You shocked me when you said you mentioned they taught you about hell in Sunday school! What kind of school did you go to? Or is that mainstream Christianity?
You do realize that all demons and even Satan are fallen angels? The Bible does not create different kinds of Christianity. Only one. Don't be so easily shocked.
Friend, I wasn't talking about demons. But telling a 5 year old that Jesus commands they get tortured in the timeless fire that last even longer than forever because there is no time. Kids have a great imagination that can be a nightmare. Bernardo's version of a possible after-bodily-death state is no much more logical.
@@moesypittounikos It could easily be said that the God character in the Bible is actually the evil one, not the Satan character. Satan only kills around 10 people whereas the God character kills several millions of people. By any modern metric, that makes the God character considerably more evil and malicious than any other character in the book. Somehow religious folk justify it in their minds but I find that quite creepy and just shows how easily people buy into these "religions", which are really just "socially-accepted" cults.
How is simulation theory silly? Give me a moment to explain, please. If you believe that we have an eternal component, such as a SOUL, that means by default that these flesh & blood bodies are NOT our original state of being, nor will these bodies be our final state of being. Correct? By extension, if these bodies are not our original form, it means (also by default) that these bodies are, in fact, AVATARS (vessels that our consciousness/souls are possibly projected into). That would mean that this is a simulation by default. Just because this realm has been CREATED, just because we perceive it as a physical reality, that doesn't mean it does not fulfill the definition of a simulation. sim·u·la·tion noun - imitation of a situation or process. - the action of pretending; deception. So, am I wrong in this thinking? If so, how?
There is no scientific evidence for simulation theory. Tell me why you like it? and yes, it is pretending alright? and yes, it's silly. We have free will to build and create what we want. I don't live in any prison called a simulation. End of story.
Do you believe that your life here on Earth is all there is? If so, there isn't much point in having a conversation about this. My point is, if you believe there is a "soul" or some form of consciousness that continues on after we die here, then we are in a "simulation" by default. The problem is, people get stuck on a simulation needing to exist inside of a COMPUTER. Nonsense. A physical reality can also be a simulation. The movie Avatar is the easiest example of this. In that movie, the protagonist's consciousness is transferred to an AVATAR. Everything he experienced from inside that AVATAR while his actual body was somewhere else was, technically, a simulation. That only means that he was experiencing a world via something OTHER than his original form. Are you seeing it yet?@@ArtisanTony
@@tygorton You are misunderstanding the difference between creation and a simulation. A simulation is deterministic and creation, which is what we are, is a sandbox where we have free will. Simulation theory was developed buy atheists who want to acknowledge creation without acknowledging God. It's lame and escapism.
Are you sure I'm the one misunderstanding? If a singular entity (God) creates a realm, then creates avatars that our souls are projected/placed into so we can then experience that realm, how is that not a simulation? There is absolutely ZERO reasons stopping a simulation from also having a free will component. Why would that be the case? Your garden variety open world video game features free will as its selling point. The game has a purpose, a place it is guiding each player toward, but within that context, the selling point is that the player can do whatever they want. You're going to have to prove to me that this isn't exactly what we are experiencing in this Earth realm.@@ArtisanTony
Do we experience the real world? Or is experience itself reality? If you believe the external world and the soul are real you are a dualist. If you believe only the external world is real and the soul is an illusion you are a materialist. If you believe only the soul exist and the material world is an illusion you are an idealist.
I think it all exists simultaneously. I believe the physical world exists, we have a soul, we have free will, there is an external world, it is so complex, we cannot fathom it. Why does there have to be only one option? There isn't and of there were, humans certainly would not know the answer. :)
Oh I agree with the making process of thinking about how a proton pump system works it"s an assistant to the point of view towards a single bit and bite the direction it takes in one direction the one then quickly reversed to the other as a zero or opposite of of the expression that state of mind is it reverse of one zero or not?well it's both when you think about it all together the plasmphirisus is the most telling story of the radio tubes and inferred images of the camera shows a higher visual impact than just a lite wave and a parodic sweeping effect of infer red light and redirectionable as well hmm high strangeness ,indeed wondering how it works its magic in a way that the proteins of a human being and that the trick is in the blood stream and release the enzyme that white blood cell with many other cells have various genetic vibrations that talk with their partners in the flows so I started doing plasma tests and they have a lot more technology in the state's of motions and then reflect on the surface of the walls of it's tubes and traveling through without destruction or colisional damage it keeps a separation of each other in the works for Energy and mass transitional building the Gravity waves that weave through the disturbances or a straight face action id let the ball go and stopped measuring it and manipulate it into the process it actually cycles from the observation of my waves measuring the speed increases and decreases in the state's of mindfulness or Gravity and atmospheric placement is a bit more complicated or difficult to predict the outcome so you can see the difference between one the other Taloric currents bending into the process and trapping the whole cycle of flying through the disturbances of the vacuum of the Energy micro Gravity running slower but it's still a massive Taloric ejections happen every time they hit the emitters in a way they do a Quantum reality show
I disagree. There is volumes of concise BK content out there (which I love to soak up). These less formal discussions with BK really bring home many oh his deep ideas because you get to see that his philosophy is really one that doesn’t exist in his head but really colors and animates his life. One that he finds great meaning in. Yes, if this is the only BK content one consumes, it can feel a bit clunky and cumbersome to get to the meat, but the more familiar you become w BKs amazing perspectives, the more these colloquial conversations become. Super thankful to Tony for representing the every day person like me where BKs ideas have a chance to really land in to a common heart and mind like mine.
As much as I love analytical BK (and I’ve watched 100s of hrs of his idealism chats), I can’t help but TRULY resonate with the real BK that Artisan Tony accidentally teases out in each of his interviews.
I need friends like this in my life!
Keep it up gents.
Bernardo is a great guy. The moment he bailed me out on TOEnanza, I could tell :)
@@ArtisanTony I remember that! And you are correct. That was another exemplar moment of true humanity. I loved seeing that at the time.
Wot happened
@@pocketfullofshellz See the interview Bernardo did with Mauldin on TOE. :)
Three wonderful humans and fractals of light
A different discussion for Bernardo and a very interesting one! Thank you!
Thank you!
What Bernardo says about death is truly deep and fascinating.
Thanks Tony, great sharing and it made it all the way down under...hehe I always enjoy Bernado conversations. May I offer my version of an example of how our culture shapes us by Jaques Fresco RIP. "Unfortunately for me, my brother is the chief of our jarhead clan of headhunters, and he has several shrunken heads around his neck, worn with honor. As a pacifist, I have none which is likely to have me made an outcast, which will lead to my demise." Cheers from a retired soldier down under.
Haha, thanks for your service!
@@ArtisanTonywe don’t say that here in Oz. It’s very much an American thing to praise the enlisted janitor for their service when probably none was given. The whole warrior thang is anathema to the average Aussie, regarded as tasteless, jingoistic bs for the dumbass toxic male. Not bashing your fine country, America represents the best and the worst of humanity and I love it dearly, but some things just don’t wash.
❤🎉🥳😘😊😁☺️ Thank you! Enjoyed it SO much. Even, I cried a little with lot of Happiness.
I really enjoy Bernardo's visits :)
Happy birthday Tony belatedly
Thank you!! :)
I am enjoying this conversation so much!
Bernard make it easy to have a nice conversation :)
heck yea glad to see y'all talking again.
We have to talk again too :)
So glad Bernardo dissected the interview with Tim Maudlin, more so than the article on his website. Maudlin took Bernardo's opening statement personally (which he shouldn't have, it was obviously not personal) and lashed back petulantly. It was a missed opportunity by Bernardo indeed to "wipe the floor with him" which would have been fun. I did like Maudlin's interviews -- he is good at nitty gritty of explaining Bell's theorem. Unfortunately after this I can't really watch him anymore. He is a child.
I was hesitant to bring it up because we had such a good vibe going :)
💯
Bernardo ❤ Thank you Artisan.
Thank you :)
Wonderful conversation
Thank you!
Tony, could you pass a message to Bernardo that I have a complete Sinclair Z80 computer that he mentioned as his first…. Would he like to have it?
I spoke with Bernardo. Can you contact me here thepifishow.com/contact
What is with people who can design computers that makes them leaders in modern renaissance of metaphysical idealism ( the notion that reality is essentially mental). Federico Faggin is known for designing the first commercial microprocessor, and now he has co authored a theory of consciousness. Perhaps, when science will acknowledge that a computer cannot be conscious, then, we will all accept that consciousness does not end with one’s biological life.
Both Kastrup and Faggin explored how to make a computer conscious and both ended up developing their own version of metaphysical idealism. Jung said that he felt that our ancestors were waiting for our answers to questions they themselves, during their time, had. Certainly Professor Faggin’s father seem to be one of them; he wrote a book on Plotinus in 1945.
Great interview!
So glad Bernardo addressed the issue with Tim Maudlin. I have so much respect for Bernardo and was disappointed with his reaction. It came across as if he was trying to avoid a contentious debate. I know that’s not true. As he said, his emotions got the best of him and it was a missed opportunity. Thanks for keeping it real Bernardo. Looking forward to more of your work!
I think his reaction was fine. At some point, you have to stand up to elitists otherwise the elitism and will continue. A lot of science is just philosophy anyway so treating people badly over philosophy it’s just being a bad human so we have to stand it to this kind of thing.
Is there a time stamp for that? The chapters only mark the first hour
Found it 1:47:00
3 genuine men , keep up the good work big fella.
Thank you!
Thank you for this
Thank you!
Lol! I should have mentioned my mom helped Robson Moura find his house here in Tampa. He’s a 7 time world champion in Brazilian Jiujitsu and started Nova Uneal (I don’t think the spelling is right.) either way, he trained me in jiujitsu, and I’m still a white belt no stripe bc the entire time he was teaching at MAA (martial arts advantage) I never actually enrolled. But was an instructor of the other martial arts there. Lol
1:19:55 great definition
I could get my own podcast started and Bernado will get on before he goes to rogan.
Joe is missing out :)
1:07:37 there is nothing unnatural, if you follow monism. But ultimately, consciousness = suffering, so its natural. Consciousness is known to us directly only in the form of separation with ME in the center, so this is not surprising.
My father taught me that I had to discover the world on my own life he did the right thing to consider the possibility of FREEDOM of thought and say hey I'm watching you and I have an idea for a simple way to drawing in the state's of mindfulness I was into vacuum tubes for radio frequency and zero vibration and positioning waves that lazor was a refracting of the engine of plasmapheresis he said he hasn't thought of the same thing as I did but it was true the mathematical equations that provide by the meter is the pulse powerful tool for oseloscope and voltage layering in the same places as the light literally inside a circle that has circulated motion and circles with in circles has a opposable edge on the same pathway a pattern is followed by the amount of voltage and frequency that is involved
Do the family thing after the stream. OKAY???
3 hours of anecdotes !!
Sounds like the rest of science :)
As a biological wonder I wonder if the day I was born I was born intelligent but the world made me ignorant of the past livestream of my own adventure 😅😅😅could we all have the same process and then reflect upon the depth of life itself is the truest meaning of learning the TRUTHFULNESS of 😅the reality?hmm and I think that we did have a lot of commonality in the before birth cycle.
1:13:00
You shocked me when you said you mentioned they taught you about hell in Sunday school! What kind of school did you go to? Or is that mainstream Christianity?
You do realize that all demons and even Satan are fallen angels? The Bible does not create different kinds of Christianity. Only one. Don't be so easily shocked.
@@ArtisanTony And yet there are many different interpretations of it.
Friend, I wasn't talking about demons. But telling a 5 year old that Jesus commands they get tortured in the timeless fire that last even longer than forever because there is no time. Kids have a great imagination that can be a nightmare. Bernardo's version of a possible after-bodily-death state is no much more logical.
@@moesypittounikos No parent does that :)
@@moesypittounikos It could easily be said that the God character in the Bible is actually the evil one, not the Satan character. Satan only kills around 10 people whereas the God character kills several millions of people. By any modern metric, that makes the God character considerably more evil and malicious than any other character in the book. Somehow religious folk justify it in their minds but I find that quite creepy and just shows how easily people buy into these "religions", which are really just "socially-accepted" cults.
How is simulation theory silly? Give me a moment to explain, please.
If you believe that we have an eternal component, such as a SOUL, that means by default that these flesh & blood bodies are NOT our original state of being, nor will these bodies be our final state of being. Correct? By extension, if these bodies are not our original form, it means (also by default) that these bodies are, in fact, AVATARS (vessels that our consciousness/souls are possibly projected into). That would mean that this is a simulation by default. Just because this realm has been CREATED, just because we perceive it as a physical reality, that doesn't mean it does not fulfill the definition of a simulation.
sim·u·la·tion
noun
- imitation of a situation or process.
- the action of pretending; deception.
So, am I wrong in this thinking? If so, how?
There is no scientific evidence for simulation theory. Tell me why you like it? and yes, it is pretending alright? and yes, it's silly. We have free will to build and create what we want. I don't live in any prison called a simulation. End of story.
Do you believe that your life here on Earth is all there is? If so, there isn't much point in having a conversation about this.
My point is, if you believe there is a "soul" or some form of consciousness that continues on after we die here, then we are in a "simulation" by default. The problem is, people get stuck on a simulation needing to exist inside of a COMPUTER. Nonsense. A physical reality can also be a simulation. The movie Avatar is the easiest example of this. In that movie, the protagonist's consciousness is transferred to an AVATAR. Everything he experienced from inside that AVATAR while his actual body was somewhere else was, technically, a simulation. That only means that he was experiencing a world via something OTHER than his original form. Are you seeing it yet?@@ArtisanTony
@@tygorton You are misunderstanding the difference between creation and a simulation. A simulation is deterministic and creation, which is what we are, is a sandbox where we have free will. Simulation theory was developed buy atheists who want to acknowledge creation without acknowledging God. It's lame and escapism.
Are you sure I'm the one misunderstanding? If a singular entity (God) creates a realm, then creates avatars that our souls are projected/placed into so we can then experience that realm, how is that not a simulation? There is absolutely ZERO reasons stopping a simulation from also having a free will component. Why would that be the case? Your garden variety open world video game features free will as its selling point. The game has a purpose, a place it is guiding each player toward, but within that context, the selling point is that the player can do whatever they want. You're going to have to prove to me that this isn't exactly what we are experiencing in this Earth realm.@@ArtisanTony
Read "My 8 bug ideas" by Arnold Zuboff.
Do we experience the real world? Or is experience itself reality?
If you believe the external world and the soul are real you are a dualist.
If you believe only the external world is real and the soul is an illusion you are a materialist.
If you believe only the soul exist and the material world is an illusion you are an idealist.
I think it all exists simultaneously. I believe the physical world exists, we have a soul, we have free will, there is an external world, it is so complex, we cannot fathom it. Why does there have to be only one option? There isn't and of there were, humans certainly would not know the answer. :)
Oh I agree with the making process of thinking about how a proton pump system works it"s an assistant to the point of view towards a single bit and bite the direction it takes in one direction the one then quickly reversed to the other as a zero or opposite of of the expression that state of mind is it reverse of one zero or not?well it's both when you think about it all together the plasmphirisus is the most telling story of the radio tubes and inferred images of the camera shows a higher visual impact than just a lite wave and a parodic sweeping effect of infer red light and redirectionable as well hmm high strangeness ,indeed wondering how it works its magic in a way that the proteins of a human being and that the trick is in the blood stream and release the enzyme that white blood cell with many other cells have various genetic vibrations that talk with their partners in the flows so I started doing plasma tests and they have a lot more technology in the state's of motions and then reflect on the surface of the walls of it's tubes and traveling through without destruction or colisional damage it keeps a separation of each other in the works for Energy and mass transitional building the Gravity waves that weave through the disturbances or a straight face action id let the ball go and stopped measuring it and manipulate it into the process it actually cycles from the observation of my waves measuring the speed increases and decreases in the state's of mindfulness or Gravity and atmospheric placement is a bit more complicated or difficult to predict the outcome so you can see the difference between one the other Taloric currents bending into the process and trapping the whole cycle of flying through the disturbances of the vacuum of the Energy micro Gravity running slower but it's still a massive Taloric ejections happen every time they hit the emitters in a way they do a Quantum reality show
25 minutes and counting of small talk is not really entertaining to listen to.
I disagree. There is volumes of concise BK content out there (which I love to soak up). These less formal discussions with BK really bring home many oh his deep ideas because you get to see that his philosophy is really one that doesn’t exist in his head but really colors and animates his life. One that he finds great meaning in. Yes, if this is the only BK content one consumes, it can feel a bit clunky and cumbersome to get to the meat, but the more familiar you become w BKs amazing perspectives, the more these colloquial conversations become.
Super thankful to Tony for representing the every day person like me where BKs ideas have a chance to really land in to a common heart and mind like mine.
Just stumbled upon this interesting interview today! Gracias