TIMESTAMPS: (00:00) Episode preview (02:00) Sam’s life’s work (04:00) Sam’s concerns around the marketplace of ideas (11:25) Sam is a mistake theorist (15:45) Sponsors: Secureframe | Mercury | MarketerHire (20:00) Why Sam is hated by both the left and the right (22:30) Fundamental conflict between the left and the right (31:00) Navigating group disparities (41:00) Individual rights vs group rights (47:00) Is wokeness the new religion? (51:00) Sam’s critique of populism (58:00) Sam’s defenses of experts/institutions (1:11:00) The right doesn’t sufficiently appreciate luck (1:16:45) Polarization is better than a one-party state (1:21:00) Global governance
I love how he talks about the role of luck in success. It drives me mad when people claim there was no luck involved with being born in a rich country to a rich family with a high IQ and EQ, being attractive to the opposite sex and finding a mate you find attractive, not having mental health or addiction issues, finding school enjoyable, making friends easily and not being victimized by heinous crime.
Most of these people actually believe those things, because they can't imagine someone with less opportunities. It's kind of hard to 'know' what it's like to have the odds stacked against you, when all you've known is privilege. Not justifying it, just trying to give a nuanced view on your justified grievances. You only have to look at the show Succession to understand how skewed your view on reality becomes when you are born in extreme wealth.
@@MrFrussel Not only that, but imagine how incredibly boring it would be to be told that your successes are in large part due to factors out of your control, if that’s the case.
If I was an American voter, I'd have a beef with the Left and the Right. 350 million people and you give me Biden Vs. Trump to choose from? Come on, be serious.
Joe Biden is the worst president in 100 years that none of his voters actually support. Trump had 75 million actual voters that thought he was plain and simple the best option and supported his policies.
Sam is the real deal. Unlike so many other "public intellectuals" he never devolved into grifting his fans. When he put his work behind a paywall, he gave people an option to have it for free if they really couldnt afford to contribute anything. I used that option the first year of subscribing and when the renewal came around I was able to pay full price.
@@jmc5335They weren't wrong on globalism. Like we just saw, If you only have a few different exports and rely entirely in other countries for products we can easily create here and then the world shuts down, we're screwed. The evidence literally just happened a couple years ago.
I was initially drawn to this because I enjoy Sam Harris. The content was fantastic but what really stood out for me was Erik’s interviewing style. He asks meaningful/insightful questions AND recognizes the potential for misunderstanding or mischaracterizing his guest’s position. That is genuine humility. Moreover, he doesn’t interrupt his guest. I don’t know about everyone else’s experience, but I rarely see that level of discipline and grace in interviews. Thank you both for your contribution.
@@Eternalspring22 What's the claim here? Andreessen is training people to type on their keyboards and paying them to antagonize specifically Sam Harris? What would that gain him?
That's a low bar. He makes obvious statements in a way that makes them sound as though they're unique. He's a good talker, who's had a good life, all his life.
@@JohnconnoYou pessimistic egg head. Hindsight bias is what you’re experincing. He observes society and relays from his thoughts and perspectives what he sees and thinks. That’s what makes them unique, not SEEM unique. You sound depressed “had good all his life” what does that even mean. Are you projecting on your own poor life?
@jamescarr4662 on economics maybe. Socially, at least in a soft power sense no way. Conservatives have reacerted themselves more recently with Supreme Court nominations and decisions. In almost every realm "the left", again at least Socially, dominates. Higher education, K-12, Hollywood, HR departments of major companies etc.
Sam is so convinced he is the smartest person in the room he is great at saying others need to recognize their bad behavior but incapable of recognizing his own bad behavior.
Renee De Resta is a totalitarian CIA agent but Sam has convinced himself that only dumb people believe in conspiracies and has allowed himself to become her tool.
You can't call out something and compromise your own integrity. He fell from lofty ideals, he failed to implement what he intellectual knew was right. An experience most of us go through. I hope he is well and paid attention to his lessons
that darn lunacy of the best presiden in moder nhistory with record economy growth for everyone and the first one in a century to not start a new war, but even decrease the them by several. thank god we haver such sane geniuses like sam who cheerso n this human vegetable who cant speak, humiliating america, destroying our relations and ruining our country at a pace never before seen
@@TheOlzee that darn lunacy of the best presiden in moder nhistory with record economy growth for everyone and the first one in a century to not start a new war, but even decrease the them by severral. thank god we haver such sane geniuses like sam who cheerso n this human vegetable who cant speak, humiliating america, destroying our relations and ruining our country at a pace never before seen
The MAGA cult is 90% of his "critics". You'll notice a lot of patterns with their comments, one very prevalent one being almost never providing or engaging with the full context of what he says, or shouting street protest level slogans without any elaboration like "Sam is a charlatan!!". I've so clearly seen this pattern with a lot of right wing activists even here in Europe, because they're trained to be "the opposite" no matter what it takes or how they look.
Jordan Peterson is honestly pretty thoughtful and insightful when it comes to psychology, but any time he steps out of that and into the realm of politics, social issues, climate change, etc., he ends up sounding like an idiot.
He's not thoughtful at all. He denies the science of physics regarding free will. He denies that voters should actually get what they vote for. Sam Harris is a special kind of evil
@@paulblart2179100%. I feel the exact same way about JBP. I love his books and lectures on the self help/psychological realm but he loses me whenever he gets into the left/right political drama
Jordan needs to learn to meditate. He's always worked up, really carries himself like guy with chip on his shoulder these days. I love the man, I do, but he needs a humility check.
@@phyphrus1934that's right. Also, the most level headed, healthy and clear thinking people don't want to go into politics. Politics attracts a certain kind of personality. You need to be at least somewhat narcissistic and able to play Machiavellian games with people in order to succeed.
It's a great paradox. Well-adjusted, compassionate, high EQ people typically don't want to run for office. Hell the same thing applies in the business world. I remember early in my career reading an EQ analysis about how at every level in a company (from entry level to CEO), the average EQ decreases as you move up. So typically the worst people from an emotional intelligence perspective, typically have the most power. Paradoxically, at every level, high EQ people perform better. The people who would normally do the best job in positions of power, aren't willing to do the things to get into power. We're a hilariously flawed species.
I probably won't have time to watch all of this right now, but I did want to share my appreciation for Sam's first point. I'm Australian but my parents are from Sri Lanka. I'm brown-skinned as you can see from this thumbnail. My cultural background is 10% of my identity. My skin colour is 1%. I want people do be interested in my actions and opinions, not my race, whether it's the things that I am more statistically likely to do due to group membership or their mental associations of my race (as in, true or imagined stereotypes). I'm a fucking person. We're all fucking people. I'd love to see us bring back the ideal of being colour blind, even if it doesn't always work perfectly. Because the alternative takes us backwards.
I used to listen to him a lot, less so last few years, more so again recently. He's been very consistent and still true to his style since last decade, if anything moved more center. Saying otherwise is very confusing to me and shows the ideological capture of folks that were seemingly apolitical pre-covid.
Great interview ! Eric you added significantly to the conversation and earned a subscriber. Interested in following your contributions to the rational conversation space
I see color, I see race, I see differences because we are all different. There is a difference between equal under the law and everyone being equal. One is fair and the other is just plain stupid.
That's right. We don't have to pretend like we don't have differences. It's just detrimental to make our differences front and centre of any discussion. Either our argument stands on its merits or it doesn't. Identity doesn't and shouldn't give us extra points in the discussion.
sidenote: dear US americans, there are no human "races" - and still using that word/concept in 2023 (which seems "normal" in the US ...) is difficult to find the right words right now so let me put it like this; using the word "rasse" here in germany (and this is not an overstatement) is probably the most nazi-esque thing you could do/say. words/concept matter "just sayin" anyways' 🌏🌎🌍✊
@@aerobique- I hear you. The term “race” is technically improperly used to describe the biological differences in various human populations (i.e. People from different areas of the world are physically different by phenotype (e.g. skin color, hair color/texture, height, etc.). What term do you suggest we use?
Not sure why you do it, but please don't cut your guests' footage to make the discussion go faster. Anyway, I just discovered your podcast and it's really great! Keep going!
In virtue's realm, let courtesy reside, A gentle grace that flows from heart's pure tide. Kind words and acts, like blossoms in the morn, Embrace the world, where love and peace are born. Integrity, a beacon shining bright, A steadfast guide through darkness and through light. With honesty, the soul stands tall and true, Unswayed by falsehoods, steadfast and imbued. In self-control, a sacred art is found, A mastery of self, where peace is crowned. Temper desires with wisdom's gentle hand, And find tranquility, like stillness of sand, Perseverance, a flame that burns within, Fanning the spirit, where dreams and hopes begin. Through trials and tribulations, ever strong, With steadfast courage, we shall journey along.
No one sufficiently appreciates luck. Luck determines everything in life. The fact that we hate mass shooters and terrorists demonstrates we don't appreciate luck. The heros and the villains are all products of luck.
Really appreciate this interview with Sam, and especially how much Erik asks one thoughtful question at a time and then largely stays out of the way. An interviewer's attentive space gives the guest the room to walk into amazing and insightful answers in real time. Which totally happens here. Sam is brilliant at parsing out the right questions, and the blind spots we all suffer from and wrongly argue about. Thanks so much to Sam and to Erik. @editmycharacterization
A lot of people have been taking shots at Sam’s TDR and other perceived missteps but I still see him as one of the most reliable voices for sense making.
“ The Echo Chamber” In the depths of an echoing chamber I dwell, Where the sound of my own voice is all I can tell, A symphony of beliefs, no room for dissent, Where resonance drowns out any outside torment. Within these walls of assurance and certainty, I find solace in echoes that align with me, Words bouncing back, echoing in a loop, Reinforcing beliefs, like a constant truth. In this secluded realm, where harmony resounds, I become oblivious, closed off to other sounds, Unaware of the echoes I choose to embrace, The blindness that veils me from seeing new space. Every voice I hear echoes my own thought, Yet humanity’s chorus is left unheard, distraught, For empathy withers when all seems aligned, In a chamber so perfect, where sameness enshrined. In this echo chamber, diversity is erased, And the essence of life is bitterly displaced, For what is existence without differing views, When we fail to acknowledge others’ unique hues? Here, empathy crumbles, as echoes shout meek, Erroneously convincing, magnifying technique, To hear only oneself is a precarious plight, Dismissing the colors that blend in the light. For life is a symphony of disparate songs, A tapestry woven by voices, where we all belong, Let us step out of these chambers and break the mold, To embrace the harmony of perspectives untold. Open your heart to the echoes you’ve never heard, It’s through understanding that true empathy is stirred, For in the richness of thoughts, we find our true worth, In the chorus of voices, beyond the echoes of our own birth. So let us escape the confines of this chamber’s snare, And revel in the melodies that intertwine in the air, For the beauty of life lies in its vibrant array, Beyond the echo chamber, where empathy holds sway. By The New Aged Diogenes ( After Rehab )
Erik, you constantly use the term "conflict", and I'd use the word "tension" instead. "Tension" has a bunch of ways to be resolved, "conflict" insinuates that this tension can only be resolved in an aggressive retaliatory manner. Also, radicalism is definitely a problem, but here, it's not the radicalism of wokeness that's the root problem, and it's not the right's smug and overbearing response that's the problem either; an even deeper issue here is what Sam points out around the automatic contrarianism that a TON of people have. It's just this unquestioned little north star that nobody bothers to analyze and question. It's just there, after decades of post-dinner kitchen banter in a billion families, where people are indignant and disappointed with the world, humiliated, even. That being the case, what does it mean to just seek "alternative X" as opposed to "the mainstream" or "institution X"? People just do this automatically, for very understandable reasons, but there's a lot of apparently sacred ground here that we're not questioning, and we're reaping the consequences. "Seeking an alternative", "going for radical change" these are not the best guiding lights to seeking truth or finding common ground all the time. they're just not. If all you do is seek alternative takes, if everything has to be "alternative", that heuristic can very easily misfire or misdirect, there's going to be points where you, and/or whole populations are going to swirl in place in the psychological equivalent of an ant-death spiral, where nothing is gained, only mental and spiritual exhaustion is cultivated. When you're dividing things into "the government" and "the people", or "the people" and "the mainstream media", or "the people and "the pharmaceutical industry", or "the people" and "The Walt Disney Company", or "the black/gay/neuro-atypical experience" and "all the other more normalized types of experience" you've also already lost the plot. There have to be ways to look at our problems that stand above even that kind of framing, and that are deeply humanistic in their nature. It's what Sam says at 54:19 "Even when I'm noticing there are failures and I'm not feeling something less than respect, what I'm feeling is concern for institutions." I feel like a lot of people have an eagerness to see institutions suffer and pay a price, for I guess understandable psychological reasons, but distorted reasons in many cases nonetheless.
30 seconds in and he's already blowing my mind "We should think of skin color no different than eye color or hair color" really shows how silly caring about such differences is
@@tomdixon8950 I don't know if you are joking here, but blue-eyed people are not the victims of any meaningful discrimination or hostility in our society - and to suggest so is silly.
In Sam Harris I see a person calling out legitimate concerns on both sides , too a society , well represented on this comments board..locked into their individual indeology
@jmc Sir I send you responses and detailed answers . You claim I sent nothing . I don't play these games . I post , to engage in legitimate disagreement not to play games with idiots . Move on
@@jmc5335 oh you mean calling out tens of billions worth of university spots being taken from whit, and especially asian people who earned them, and gifted to undeserved blac people? yes, that strikes me as legitimate as i dont like theft, and society runs worse when theft is employed
@@jmc5335 People who think Governments should have zero involvement in the public sphere or encroaching onto your freedoms do often believe these institutions should not matter. Regardless, it is a good logical point that you agree with. This your question is answered.
@charliewalker9443 That's not an answer to my question. Libertarians almost always base their arguments on the fact that institutions are untrustworthy. So it appears that they are packing some potent punches of logic in saying so
Take A Moment 9:51 Sam, I feel your pain 10:14 Your work is vital to our survival. Ignore the white noise, ironically 12:35 12:35 From my perspective here in Calgary, I think we are seeing the fall of the American dream Sad but take a look 12:35 😢 Good luck 👍 💓 We are all this together ❤️ 12:35 Not sure how great some ape's 12:35 Peace and love etc 12:35 😢
While I can appreciate these endless conversations about the effects of social media , the fact remains. Prioritizing education is the only way to turn this corner. Grade school children need to understand how to evaluate information accurately. There are reliable methods, and we are not born knowing them. There are all kinds of new terminology just to describe the variety of symptoms but I'm not hearing anyone suggesting that we treat the problem itself. Every time Sam says "we" he's referring to a bunch of adults who are set in their ways. If we concentrate on providing intellectual tools for the next generation, we might have a fighting chance. Keep churning over a bunch of analogies and observations and opinions all you want. It won't go anywhere.
Love how Sam often inserts 'pragmatic' with 'ethical'. People's ethics are all over the map, we'll never agree and a huge gulf stands between the religious and non-religious (for one example) but what does work and what does not is often crystal clear. Wanting everyone to WIN is exactly right, another's gain is my gain. We know all this but teach different values to up-and-coming Americans, and most of them take the bait.
Actually, non-theistic ethics are universal. Property rights are universally agreed upon in a selfish matter. All humans agree that they own themselves, their labor, and the product of the labor. Logically, that means that violating those property rights is universally immoral. It follows the golden rule of "do unto others." Rape, murder, theft, slavery, assault, trespassing. All property rights violations that all people oppose happening to them.
Very often we attribute our success to our personal efforts but blame our failures to outside forces. And when it comes to judging others, we attribute their success mostly to luck and their failures to personal shortcomings.
Skin color will only not matter when skin color no longer matters. Skin color will no longer matter when race and ethnic differences no longer matter. We will only get to when race and ethnic differences no longer matter when kin preference no longer matters or exists. We will only get to a place where kin preference no longer matters when we are no longer marginally different in group properties affinities and utility. We will only get to the the place where group properties affinities and utility are no longer marginally different when we groups are marginally indiffierent in evolutionary neoteny, resulting domesticatin syndrome, in resulting rate and depth of maturity, and as such mirror one another's personality and IQ distributions. That will only occur if we are all indistinguishably an admixture of white and east asian, with south eurasian (MENA+Central Asia+India) and african gene pools have been diluted out of gene expression. Otherwise racially netural behavior except in cooperation between the upper classes is irrational and disadvantageous and devolutionary both politically and genetically. Interpersonal racisim is irrational (stupid really). But so is political anti-racism. Because we are always and everywhere dependent upon the ingroup because that is the greatest discount on cooperation. We can be anti-racist in markets. We can be anti-racist in personal interactions. We cannot be anti-racist in politics. And we never will be. Ever. And it's a supernatural religous fraud to claim so. There is no difference between this law of the universe and any other. If you don't believe so you don't grasp the first principle of the universe, and it's expression at the physical, biological, social, and individual levels as the defeat of entropy by evolutionary computation of the greatest capture and transfer of entropy into order, and that order among humans is dependent upon neotenic evolution, which produces agency over impulse, and that the four generations (races, species) of man, are incremental leaps in neotenic evolution. Period. End of story. No more lies. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam were and are as great an innovation in suggestion, deceit, fraud, and warfare as the indo european invention of horse, bronze, wheel and democracic rule of law, as the greek invention of reason empiricism politics, and phalanx. No More Semitic Lies. We must end the greatest risk to mankind in the jewish, christian, and islamic false promise that if we reduce outselves to semitic tribalism and superstition that we can resolve conflict rather than devolve civilizations in to dark ages of ignorance, dysgenia, and decline. Love one another. But do not lie to one another. DIversity is exceptional in creating markets between polities. But polities are as important as hoyuseholds, and the left is trying to destroy both just as the abrahamic religions tried to destroy politics, reason, and empiricism, and the western tradition of truth-before-face. Cheers Curt Doolittle The Natural Law Institute The Science of Cooperation/
This might trigger a few ppl but I think we should treat healthcare as we treat the military,the state should have the monopoly on doing the healthcare but collaborate with private business to develop and manufacture the treatments and equipment.
You're wrong. In all cases of this, healthcare systems rely on the hard work of others. The US funds and invents 90% of all drugs and technology. The social healthcare systems must wait for us to do so before they can benefit.
I have spent the last 30 years in sales and I've had the fortune of traveling around the US in various economic areas, almost all the states and I have found that people are not as horrible as they seem in the bubble of the extremes of social media. We find ourselves in a world where the minority radicals on both sides of the political spectrum are taking all the oxygen out of the room and hogging the debates. Get out and meet other Americans. Stop viewing them through screens. Go offline and come out here in the analog real world. Overwhelmingly most people are just fine. The divisions help sell clicks and views and books and podcasts. MSNBC, FOX News and all the others are selling a narrative, not representing us. Beware the click-bate.
One of the few intellectual honest humans in the public discourse realm. I understand why few want to do what he does, he takes it from both sides. Watching Twitter hacks pile on him over the last few days, including clowns like Bret Weinstein, that can't hold a candle to Sam, has been disheartening. Most of the voices that get heard are either grifters or ideological hacks.
No, it's a matter of communism. Collectivist government uses groups, a la bourgeoisie and proletariat, but with place holders like "black/white" or "LGBT/hetero." Statistically, poverty does not cause people to commit crimes. Criminals damaging communities causes poverty. These are communist revolutions playing out as the political class deigns proper.
I agree we should care no more about race/ethnicity than we do about hair/eye color. How do we get there? Blind job/school applications might work but only until references and school transcripts are blind as well.
I never could understand why so many on the right (Tucker Carlson) defend Russia over and over on the invasion... Yes I understand some of the deep implications of Ukraine and Russia ties to the past, my Russian wife and I often talk about this, but having so many conservatives blindly agreeing that Russia is on the right side of this war confounds me...
In the bipolar climate of conservative and liberal, what ever the other side supports is always bad. If Biden wants to do anything whether that be supporting Ukraine or kissing babies, it will be seen as bad by conservatives. Both sides need to wake up and realize the GOP and DNC are institutions that make the rich richer and are 2 sides of the same coin.
1. It's none of our business and it is a waste of our time and money. 2. The US caused a coup in Ukraine to overthrow a pro-russian government and install an actual actor as their stooge. This rightfully prompted taking Crimea. Period. Ukraine oppressing an killing ethnic and Russians in the Donbass region, which very strongly supports and the wants to be part of the Russian federation strongly supports the invasion. Especially given the US building power in a region that is meant to be a neutral area.
@@bobjohnson1633 1. See all foreign wars ever. 2. People's demonstrations = "US led coup", hilarious. Did the US make Yanukovich's police kill demonstrators too? Seriously funny stuff my guy. Oh and all of the oppression in Ukraine, a country that actually holds elections, vs Russia where even speaking well of the war in public will get you detained and Putin is "President for life" cough* DICTATOR cough*. All the while it is the "US building power in the region" aka supporting democracy and denuclearizing Ukraine under the conditions that Russia, not the West, and this should be a huge clue when you go back and read the Budapest Accords, RUSSIA does not invade or compromise Ukraine's territory, aka seizing Crimea, or you know, literally invading a neighboring country. Russia has brought Finland and Sweden under the NATO umbrella while doing so and has proven how far it's military has fallen since the days it was once a superpower, well played Russia.
Getting to a place where a circumstance exists that is real abundance, and this abundance is reasonably spread around, as Sam states it, has only ever been manifested under conditions of democratic socialism. I've yet to hear Sam make this specific statement. Arguments about the "left" and the "right", even ignoring the ludicrous extremes of both sides, fail to understand this key portion of what only (sane) left leaning though is fundamentally correct about.
At the 20:00 mark or so.... Sam is describing a comically ironic situation that he doesn't see from the correct direction. There is a parody song writer that has a joke song where he goes to a restaurant and smells marijuana, he goes to a library and smells marijuana, he goes to the grocery store and smells marijuana, he goes to a park and smells marijuana, and then finally at the end of the song he says maybe he should smoke less marijuana; the punchline being that he was the cause of all the things he was noticing, and he noticed it because he put it wherever he went. Sam is like that with how he was describing twitter and him starting to view people as psychopaths. Except Sam doesn't realize there were not more psychopaths approaching him, it was "Sam" that was the problem, it was "Sam" having a faulty psychology and it was Sam that would bring his logical fallacy to every interaction he had on twitter.
Both gents score low on the "completing a sentence without saying 'ya know' " scale. The host doesn't even enunciate it. For him, "you know" has morphed into a sound kinda like yee-o. Language is fascinating.
Did you blur your background on purpose so we can't see what you're reading? My identity is someone who pastes her eye to the screen to read the titles in your bookshelf.
It seems ridiculous to say our institutions and those running them are so massively flawed when we stand atop the world as the major military and economic superpower and have been here almost 80 years. We are an extremely prosperous, secure, and free country.
Not quite Secure when kids are go to a shooting range to get an education. That more people will have died of Gun Deaths in the USA between 2000-2050 than all US soldiers who have died from ALL USA involved wars combined. The political system is broken when more people can vote for X candidate but Candidate Y has won more governing seats to win the overall election. It may be a great economy, but it does not stand on top of the world. Much happier to live here in the UK and we are severely flawed also.
Sorry, but this country is a disaster. A rich disaster, sure, but culturally, morally, and simply in its population’s capacity for logical coherence, the US is far behind many other nations.
Exploitation and discrimination are fundamental features of a competitive class hierarchy economic system. People who are forced to compete against each other for resources will exploit and discriminate against their competitors. This is pretty simple stuff really.
@@NumeroSystem I don't think that necessarily follows. Or it may seem a good idea at some level, but implies a lot of other issues that require non-trivial resolution, especially at scale. Pure free-market capitalism has the issues you mention, but suggest an otherwise simple solution to the problems of resource allocation, innovation, incentive, social progress, personal responsibility, etc. In reality the simple solution of markets has its limitations and is not sufficient to address all issues, and so we add complexity through additional rules in the game, resource redistribution policies, public and private tribunals, etc. I don't think there is a single simple solution that is fully satisfying at any scale.
What does it mean to live the best possible life? 3:30 Well that ain’t happening! Maybe a better question, is sustainable-life possible… in a world of 8B, 10B, how about 0.5B???
I used to appreciate Sam Harris intellect and humour but after witnessing his refusal to admit or to see the dangerous totalitarian methods conducted by governments in dealing with the pandemic I sadly cant see him in the same light anymore as. It is okay to be wrong now and then (and Sam are probably right more often then the rest of us) but you have to admit when being wrong when its obvious and when the consequence of being wrong is dangerous.
We've been cutting taxes and government services for so long we've lost the plot. Then, Americans will be the last, are the last to realize that the profit motive in healthcare is the wrong one. The ethical response to the news of one getting cancer should not be figuring out how to make a buck, it should be how to help. Clearly, capitalism does not solve ALL problems but it did provide me a better phone.
Healthcare is the most highly government controlled system in the US. There is hardly a modicum of capitalism in US healthcare. Cutting taxes and regulations? Cities are more highly taxed and regulated than ever. Before the benefits Americans receive, we pay half of all of our money as taxes. Mostly to keep people poor and enrich politicians.
I’ve been a Sam Harris fan for many years, especially in regards to his deconstruction of religious faith. However, I’ve been enormously disappointed in what I perceive to be a biased barrier to speaking truth to power. I’m speaking specifically about the corporate and political capture of our esteemed institutions, such as the CDC, FDA, NIAID and the WHO. The influence of Big Pharma and the conflict of interest amongst our regulatory bodies is just outright depressing. I’d like to think our health comes before politics.
Those institutions you mentioned did their jobs . Pharmaceutical companies are not pillars of pure morality or ethics, no companies are , but they have saved billions of people . Tell me prior to covid , we're you in the habit of taking the prescription your doctor gave you and submitting it to a detailed analysis on efficacy ? Or did you just take it
@@troyzieman7177 Are you kidding me? Those institutions are rife with corruption, beyond belief. To the day, the CDC refuses to release efficacy data of the booster (the first one) in the 18-49 year old cohort. Two senior officials at the FDA resigned over it. Pfizer alone has had a long history of engaging in illegal activity. Including bribery, corrupt market practices, suppressing adverse trial results etc… They’ve paid out billions of dollars in criminal convictions in the last 2 decades. Chantix comes to mind, Bextra, Effexor, I believe there was one about Neurontin, and several more. To answer your question, hell yes I research any medication I take and/or recommend. I’ve been in this business for almost 30 years. I knew something was very wrong when it became a “liberal” value to give Big Pharma an underserved pass. Very wrong indeed. However, that is NOT to say that the vaccine didn’t save lives because I believe it did. Like most things, it’s complicated.
@@troyzieman7177 those instiotutions gave the MOST imagineably wrong advice on EVERY topic there were during this whole charade of a cough pandem. they are corrupt to the bone and following everything the DNC believes perfectly. are you drunk?
In my opinion, there's a vast vast difference between viewing race through the lens and mission of oppression vs viewing race through the lens and mission of equality. Trying to make these two equal and labelling both as racism is completely disingenuous in my opinion. Peterson is big on this concept, and unfortunately, Harris is as well. I just can't get my head around it, no matter how hard I try. If a segment of society uses race to oppress and disenfranchise, how can the rest of society deal with that problem and propose solutions, if simply referring to it makes us racist? It's ridiculous.
Anyone who speaks of the Left and the Right as if that were a legitimately precise terminology has already prejudiced the line of argument into zones of predictable stupidity and over-simplification.
Down with polarisation! I think problems start when either the left or the right get it into their heads that they hold the moral high ground or that their politics is some how more ethically sound than the other's. Are you left leaning? I always assumed you were
He's a new York democrat and is still more right wing than either the democrats or establishment republicans. The republican party has moved hard to the left and Republican voters don't support that move
I used to think this guy was one of the best thinkers in the world. I found him to be smart, creative, & knowledgeable on many things -- and practically a master of the English language in a discussion/conversation setting. On top of that, he called out hypocrisy all while being calm and rational, and he talked about meditation and mindfulness etc. Well.... talk about D.Trmp-derangement syndrome and COV cult-like hypochondria. The guy completely went off the deep end, or at the very least exposed his true self. He kind of ruined his credibility and career momentum. His recent interview on Trigonometry displayed his true hypocrisy and tantrum-like spazziness on a HILARIOUS level anyone needs a good laugh. There are some absolutely bonkers quotes in it.
@@troyzieman7177 makes a claim with no reasoning or backing. I dont even like DT hes an egomaniac and quite petty. Sam Harris lost it dude, nobody really respects him anymore. He completely abandoned his core tenants of reason and fairness. He's basically a Joke to his former friends in the podcasting circles. Also, he was DEAD WRONG on his Cov predictions. The dude literally was talking about losing 1/3 of the population with complete societal collapse. Complete Hysteria. He now says "we got lucky, and if things were a little different we'd. be having a different conversation" --- translation, if reality was different I would have been correct. I still think he is eloquent with words but he totally exposed his willingness to abondon rationalism when it suits him. Being a blood-hungry anti-maga is its own version of religious fanaticism, Sam drank the koolaid BIG TIME.
@demaccus I guess your amplifying my point that you are the problem . I don't measure the reason , logic or value of a person based on a head count of how many people like that person . Sam Harris gives a reasoned argument , and the fact that you think he has lost it because he differs from you is a demonstration of your smallness . Dude ...
@@troyzieman7177 Shame on you for calling me "the problem" without knowing a thing about me. You assume I'm some DT Megafan because Im seeing things objectively. DT is not Hitler, an evil Mastermind, or some nut who attempted a violent coup. He is funny and quick on his feet for sure, but hes obsessed with his own image and can't stomach a single insult... and is extremely petty in this regard. The fact that he could step in and completely eviscerate experienced politicians just speaks to how bad and out of touch most of them are. Its so easy to see through the heavy propaganda on all sides I don't know why people have to pretend he is Hitler when there so many legitimate criticisms lol.
@demaccus Donald Trump is a carnival barker . Being funny and quick on your feet are great criteria for that role , not for President. See the average janitor gets a more intense examination in his job interview , than the American people give a Presidential canidate . I notice there is no mention of Trump policies you liked when mentioning his attributes . I suppose you wouldn't want to spend any time evaluating policies that effect the country . If he can " evicerate" fellow politicians, good enough for Demarcus.
25:28 Im not sure what logcial fallacy this is or if it is one, but at the very least, Sam uses a poor example to make this argument. You could easily use a different example/parameter here, with the same argument, and get a different result. Ending racism in today's world does not have the singular goal of reducing deaths that result from racism. Its about brining social equality--making sure all races are considered equally for jobs, and judged fairly in the court of law etc.. If you magically ended racism in Chicago today, you WOULD in fact see a huge difference. Maybe not regarding gun deaths or violent crime, but you'd see a big difference socially. The reductions in crime and death and pain all around come many years after we are all treated fairly and with respect.
I love how Sammy generally keeps that right eyebrow cocked, loaded. Or as though his right hemisphere is meditating while his left is left alone to podcast without disturbance from his right. And you'd never know, But for the eyebrow.
The double constitution Rights premise is a facade. And also emphasize the war on clear logical coherent and rational communication use of words and word play
I am a center of the road who mostly has voted Democratic. Trump, DeSantis and Ramaswamy are not options for me for various reasons. Neither is Biden, because of his age ( though I would vote for him over the three men that I mentioned) I am seriously considering a more moderate Republican like Christie or Haley.
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I'm Danish and don't get to vote, but if I could I would have gone with Pete Buttigieg if he hadn't left the primaries. He is someone I would entrust the job of trying to try to close the division between the two parties, and to me that seems to be the most important role for any American politician today. People have got to be able to talk to each other about the pros and cons of each possible solution, in order to find the best one.
lmao Sam is such a good talker, I listen to him for that, honestly might be the best articulator I've seen since Hitchens He's really funny in his inability to hide his frustration at the masses waking up to the truths of the world (mixed in with a few ridiculous conspiracy theories) Praise kek!
I think we can be more precise. Sam's Bayesian prior is that technocratic liberalism is not only the best system but the only system that can deal with modern problems. Anything that threatens that system, including fair elections, can be sacrificed to further the goals of technocratic liberalism.
@@blooper6543Where has he ever disputed the sanctity of fair elections? He seems to talk often and at length about protecting free and fair elections, including the peaceful transfer of power and not trashing institutions or storming government buildings because we don't like our "side" losing?
@@michaelseanderry I totally agree that it was a stupid comment. I mean, newsflash: smart people say stupid stuff sometimes. But sweet baby cheeses, I'd take Sam Harris on his stupidest day than the best and brightest Jewish space laser nonsense people MAGA has to offer...
@@michaelseanderry That ill-considered comment revealed his true beliefs. "Protecting our democracy" and "peaceful transfer of power" are just rhetoric. I don't like Trump. I don't care if Sam doesn't like Trump. I care if Sam lies.
@@jamesmatson5205 how about when he said it was justified that theentire establishment orchestrated a coverup of a story bigger than watergate, a story that was proven would have changed 10% of democr voters had they heard the story, in an electio where 2% woul dhave bene enough?
TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) Episode preview
(02:00) Sam’s life’s work
(04:00) Sam’s concerns around the marketplace of ideas
(11:25) Sam is a mistake theorist
(15:45) Sponsors: Secureframe | Mercury | MarketerHire
(20:00) Why Sam is hated by both the left and the right
(22:30) Fundamental conflict between the left and the right
(31:00) Navigating group disparities
(41:00) Individual rights vs group rights
(47:00) Is wokeness the new religion?
(51:00) Sam’s critique of populism
(58:00) Sam’s defenses of experts/institutions
(1:11:00) The right doesn’t sufficiently appreciate luck
(1:16:45) Polarization is better than a one-party state
(1:21:00) Global governance
I love how he talks about the role of luck in success. It drives me mad when people claim there was no luck involved with being born in a rich country to a rich family with a high IQ and EQ, being attractive to the opposite sex and finding a mate you find attractive, not having mental health or addiction issues, finding school enjoyable, making friends easily and not being victimized by heinous crime.
Most of these people actually believe those things, because they can't imagine someone with less opportunities. It's kind of hard to 'know' what it's like to have the odds stacked against you, when all you've known is privilege. Not justifying it, just trying to give a nuanced view on your justified grievances. You only have to look at the show Succession to understand how skewed your view on reality becomes when you are born in extreme wealth.
Less than 2 percent of people have perspective on their own existence
@@MrFrussel Not only that, but imagine how incredibly boring it would be to be told that your successes are in large part due to factors out of your control, if that’s the case.
At least there is an adult in the room speaking on the effect that circumstances have on a person's reality.
@@wez3107 Is "boring" the word ?
If I was an American voter, I'd have a beef with the Left and the Right. 350 million people and you give me Biden Vs. Trump to choose from? Come on, be serious.
Where do you stay?
Venezuela
Lol
Trump, yes I agree. Biden? Biden is a relatively decent choice, in my opinion.
Joe Biden is the worst president in 100 years that none of his voters actually support. Trump had 75 million actual voters that thought he was plain and simple the best option and supported his policies.
Sam is the real deal. Unlike so many other "public intellectuals" he never devolved into grifting his fans.
When he put his work behind a paywall, he gave people an option to have it for free if they really couldnt afford to contribute anything. I used that option the first year of subscribing and when the renewal came around I was able to pay full price.
He didn't need to put it behind a pay wall right enough and then say he agreed with Trump on globalisation
@@jmc5335They weren't wrong on globalism. Like we just saw, If you only have a few different exports and rely entirely in other countries for products we can easily create here and then the world shuts down, we're screwed. The evidence literally just happened a couple years ago.
@@MatthewMortensen1 I'd say that the issues from the globalisation that both Trump and Harris engage in could be seen way before two years ago.
@@jmc5335 Doesn't make it any less right and they were proven right after the fact.
@@MatthewMortensen1 I think you don't realise they both engage in the fact
I was initially drawn to this because I enjoy Sam Harris.
The content was fantastic but what really stood out for me was Erik’s interviewing style.
He asks meaningful/insightful questions AND recognizes the potential for misunderstanding or mischaracterizing his guest’s position. That is genuine humility. Moreover, he doesn’t interrupt his guest. I don’t know about everyone else’s experience, but I rarely see that level of discipline and grace in interviews. Thank you both for your contribution.
Agreed!
I ❤ Sam’s ease of expressing his ideas!! Clarity and wit is a thing of beauty.
Yes standing strong against all the trolls too, I think they'll give up soon. Keep going Sam.
@@ryangardiner2967 given the trolls are trained and funded by Marc Andreessen I don’t see them stoping until we nationalize twitter.
@@Eternalspring22 What's the claim here? Andreessen is training people to type on their keyboards and paying them to antagonize specifically Sam Harris? What would that gain him?
@@Eternalspring22 hahahahahahahhaahhahhahahahhaa
@Eternalspring22 holy shit, are you being serious? Remember, Sam has no idea who you are and parasocial relationships are unhealthy. Touch grass.
Always good to hear Sam Harris.
Certainly one of the most brilliant mind of our time.
That's a low bar. He makes obvious statements in a way that makes them sound as though they're unique.
He's a good talker, who's had a good life, all his life.
@@Johnconno "makes them sound as though they're unique"
I didn't perceive it that way at all. Many people think like him, and he knows it.
@@Johnconno Tell me one more clear thinker than him
@@Johnconnoif his statements are obvious, why does he get attacked by both sides of the political aisle?
@@JohnconnoYou pessimistic egg head. Hindsight bias is what you’re experincing. He observes society and relays from his thoughts and perspectives what he sees and thinks. That’s what makes them unique, not SEEM unique. You sound depressed “had good all his life” what does that even mean. Are you projecting on your own poor life?
This man is just my intellectual hero... Go Sam... 👍
He seems to forget that the deck is stacked more heavily against the left than the right. No contest.
@jamescarr4662 on economics maybe. Socially, at least in a soft power sense no way. Conservatives have reacerted themselves more recently with Supreme Court nominations and decisions. In almost every realm "the left", again at least Socially, dominates. Higher education, K-12, Hollywood, HR departments of major companies etc.
Sam is so convinced he is the smartest person in the room he is great at saying others need to recognize their bad behavior but incapable of recognizing his own bad behavior.
Sam is incapable of recognizing his own mistakes and needs to apologize for being a bad actor himself.
Renee De Resta is a totalitarian CIA agent but Sam has convinced himself that only dumb people believe in conspiracies and has allowed himself to become her tool.
Harris has called out the lunacy of MAGA and religion. It's a life well-lived on that basis alone.
Those are the very two things we need.
You can't call out something and compromise your own integrity. He fell from lofty ideals, he failed to implement what he intellectual knew was right. An experience most of us go through. I hope he is well and paid attention to his lessons
that darn lunacy of the best presiden in moder nhistory with record economy growth for everyone and the first one in a century to not start a new war, but even decrease the them by several.
thank god we haver such sane geniuses like sam who cheerso n this human vegetable who cant speak, humiliating america, destroying our relations and ruining our country at a pace never before seen
@@TheOlzee that darn lunacy of the best presiden in moder nhistory with record economy growth for everyone and the first one in a century to not start a new war, but even decrease the them by severral.
thank god we haver such sane geniuses like sam who cheerso n this human vegetable who cant speak, humiliating america, destroying our relations and ruining our country at a pace never before seen
The MAGA cult is 90% of his "critics". You'll notice a lot of patterns with their comments, one very prevalent one being almost never providing or engaging with the full context of what he says, or shouting street protest level slogans without any elaboration like "Sam is a charlatan!!".
I've so clearly seen this pattern with a lot of right wing activists even here in Europe, because they're trained to be "the opposite" no matter what it takes or how they look.
Sam Harris is the insanely thoughtful person and communicator that Jordan Peterson tries and fails so hard to be
Jordan Peterson is honestly pretty thoughtful and insightful when it comes to psychology, but any time he steps out of that and into the realm of politics, social issues, climate change, etc., he ends up sounding like an idiot.
@@paulblart2179 This idiocy he shares with Harris.
He's not thoughtful at all. He denies the science of physics regarding free will. He denies that voters should actually get what they vote for.
Sam Harris is a special kind of evil
@@paulblart2179100%. I feel the exact same way about JBP. I love his books and lectures on the self help/psychological realm but he loses me whenever he gets into the left/right political drama
Jordan needs to learn to meditate. He's always worked up, really carries himself like guy with chip on his shoulder these days. I love the man, I do, but he needs a humility check.
So glad you are encouraging people to quit Twitter / social media. You are fighting the good fight.
Need more people with Sam's level-headed thinking in our public offices.
It's always a pleasure to hear Sam's thoughts.
Like Sam says, it's an issue of incentives. People in public office don't have the right incentives to be level headed
@@phyphrus1934that's right. Also, the most level headed, healthy and clear thinking people don't want to go into politics.
Politics attracts a certain kind of personality. You need to be at least somewhat narcissistic and able to play Machiavellian games with people in order to succeed.
@@BMTroubleU Bernie Sanders has been successful despite not suffering from the narcissism of Sam Harris
It's a great paradox. Well-adjusted, compassionate, high EQ people typically don't want to run for office.
Hell the same thing applies in the business world. I remember early in my career reading an EQ analysis about how at every level in a company (from entry level to CEO), the average EQ decreases as you move up.
So typically the worst people from an emotional intelligence perspective, typically have the most power. Paradoxically, at every level, high EQ people perform better.
The people who would normally do the best job in positions of power, aren't willing to do the things to get into power.
We're a hilariously flawed species.
Great interview. Sam is very reasonable and is one of those adults that I would want in the room.
Erik, kudos on getting this off the ground! This is an excellent conversation.
“Close your eyes, and see if you can arrive immediately…Notice that the feeling of having a self is yet another appearance in consciousness.”
I probably won't have time to watch all of this right now, but I did want to share my appreciation for Sam's first point. I'm Australian but my parents are from Sri Lanka. I'm brown-skinned as you can see from this thumbnail.
My cultural background is 10% of my identity. My skin colour is 1%.
I want people do be interested in my actions and opinions, not my race, whether it's the things that I am more statistically likely to do due to group membership or their mental associations of my race (as in, true or imagined stereotypes).
I'm a fucking person.
We're all fucking people.
I'd love to see us bring back the ideal of being colour blind, even if it doesn't always work perfectly. Because the alternative takes us backwards.
Colorblindness was an abject failure tho
I used to listen to him a lot, less so last few years, more so again recently. He's been very consistent and still true to his style since last decade, if anything moved more center. Saying otherwise is very confusing to me and shows the ideological capture of folks that were seemingly apolitical pre-covid.
He hasn't moved to the center, the left and right have moved further from the center. He still has the same political views he did 20 years ago.
Min 28:00 - Sam starts talking about the end state we need to reach to forget about "race" as an ethical alucination. [Merit, Results, 実績 (jisseki) ]
Great interview ! Eric you added significantly to the conversation and earned a subscriber. Interested in following your contributions to the rational conversation space
Sensible centrists - world needs to hear more of them.
He's a far left authoritarian collectivists. His ideas cause dictatorships to rise.
You need to hear the truth.
This vid = required listening. Important and timely topics/issues.
I probably agree with Sam 99.8%. And have nothing to add to this valuable vid.
I see color, I see race, I see differences because we are all different. There is a difference between equal under the law and everyone being equal. One is fair and the other is just plain stupid.
That's right.
We don't have to pretend like we don't have differences.
It's just detrimental to make our differences front and centre of any discussion.
Either our argument stands on its merits or it doesn't. Identity doesn't and shouldn't give us extra points in the discussion.
sidenote:
dear US americans, there are no human "races" - and still using that word/concept in 2023 (which seems "normal" in the US ...) is difficult to find the right words right now so let me put it like this; using the word "rasse" here in germany (and this is not an overstatement) is probably the most nazi-esque thing you could do/say.
words/concept matter
"just sayin"
anyways'
🌏🌎🌍✊
@@aerobique- I hear you. The term “race” is technically improperly used to describe the biological differences in various human populations (i.e. People from different areas of the world are physically different by phenotype (e.g. skin color, hair color/texture, height, etc.). What term do you suggest we use?
@@aerobiquemind your own business. Big reason the US has the racial categories it has is because of Civil Rights law.
@@chickenfishhybrid44
lol no, it's racism.
Damn..He is dropping bombs!! 🙌🏾 thanks for this content.
Not sure why you do it, but please don't cut your guests' footage to make the discussion go faster. Anyway, I just discovered your podcast and it's really great! Keep going!
Great guest Mr. Torenberg. Thanks for the show.
In virtue's realm, let courtesy reside,
A gentle grace that flows from heart's pure tide.
Kind words and acts, like blossoms in the morn,
Embrace the world, where love and peace are born.
Integrity, a beacon shining bright,
A steadfast guide through darkness and through light.
With honesty, the soul stands tall and true,
Unswayed by falsehoods, steadfast and imbued.
In self-control, a sacred art is found,
A mastery of self, where peace is crowned.
Temper desires with wisdom's gentle hand,
And find tranquility, like stillness of sand,
Perseverance, a flame that burns within,
Fanning the spirit, where dreams and hopes begin.
Through trials and tribulations, ever strong,
With steadfast courage, we shall journey along.
Love "the right doesn't sufficiently appreciate luck"
If at first you don't succeed, the left blames luck and the right keeps going.
No one sufficiently appreciates luck. Luck determines everything in life. The fact that we hate mass shooters and terrorists demonstrates we don't appreciate luck. The heros and the villains are all products of luck.
Really appreciate this interview with Sam, and especially how much Erik asks one thoughtful question at a time and then largely stays out of the way. An interviewer's attentive space gives the guest the room to walk into amazing and insightful answers in real time. Which totally happens here. Sam is brilliant at parsing out the right questions, and the blind spots we all suffer from and wrongly argue about. Thanks so much to Sam and to Erik. @editmycharacterization
A lot of people have been taking shots at Sam’s TDR and other perceived missteps but I still see him as one of the most reliable voices for sense making.
He's capable of using logic to come to good conclusions UNLESS he has a personal opinion on it, then he's 100% wrong.
“ The Echo Chamber”
In the depths of an echoing chamber I dwell,
Where the sound of my own voice is all I can tell,
A symphony of beliefs, no room for dissent,
Where resonance drowns out any outside torment.
Within these walls of assurance and certainty,
I find solace in echoes that align with me,
Words bouncing back, echoing in a loop,
Reinforcing beliefs, like a constant truth.
In this secluded realm, where harmony resounds,
I become oblivious, closed off to other sounds,
Unaware of the echoes I choose to embrace,
The blindness that veils me from seeing new space.
Every voice I hear echoes my own thought,
Yet humanity’s chorus is left unheard, distraught,
For empathy withers when all seems aligned,
In a chamber so perfect, where sameness enshrined.
In this echo chamber, diversity is erased,
And the essence of life is bitterly displaced,
For what is existence without differing views,
When we fail to acknowledge others’ unique hues?
Here, empathy crumbles, as echoes shout meek,
Erroneously convincing, magnifying technique,
To hear only oneself is a precarious plight,
Dismissing the colors that blend in the light.
For life is a symphony of disparate songs,
A tapestry woven by voices, where we all belong,
Let us step out of these chambers and break the mold,
To embrace the harmony of perspectives untold.
Open your heart to the echoes you’ve never heard,
It’s through understanding that true empathy is stirred,
For in the richness of thoughts, we find our true worth,
In the chorus of voices, beyond the echoes of our own birth.
So let us escape the confines of this chamber’s snare,
And revel in the melodies that intertwine in the air,
For the beauty of life lies in its vibrant array,
Beyond the echo chamber, where empathy holds sway.
By The New Aged Diogenes ( After Rehab )
Sam is the best!
Erik, you constantly use the term "conflict", and I'd use the word "tension" instead. "Tension" has a bunch of ways to be resolved, "conflict" insinuates that this tension can only be resolved in an aggressive retaliatory manner.
Also, radicalism is definitely a problem, but here, it's not the radicalism of wokeness that's the root problem, and it's not the right's smug and overbearing response that's the problem either; an even deeper issue here is what Sam points out around the automatic contrarianism that a TON of people have. It's just this unquestioned little north star that nobody bothers to analyze and question. It's just there, after decades of post-dinner kitchen banter in a billion families, where people are indignant and disappointed with the world, humiliated, even.
That being the case, what does it mean to just seek "alternative X" as opposed to "the mainstream" or "institution X"?
People just do this automatically, for very understandable reasons, but there's a lot of apparently sacred ground here that we're not questioning, and we're reaping the consequences. "Seeking an alternative", "going for radical change" these are not the best guiding lights to seeking truth or finding common ground all the time. they're just not. If all you do is seek alternative takes, if everything has to be "alternative", that heuristic can very easily misfire or misdirect, there's going to be points where you, and/or whole populations are going to swirl in place in the psychological equivalent of an ant-death spiral, where nothing is gained, only mental and spiritual exhaustion is cultivated. When you're dividing things into "the government" and "the people", or "the people" and "the mainstream media", or "the people and "the pharmaceutical industry", or "the people" and "The Walt Disney Company", or "the black/gay/neuro-atypical experience" and "all the other more normalized types of experience" you've also already lost the plot. There have to be ways to look at our problems that stand above even that kind of framing, and that are deeply humanistic in their nature.
It's what Sam says at 54:19 "Even when I'm noticing there are failures and I'm not feeling something less than respect, what I'm feeling is concern for institutions." I feel like a lot of people have an eagerness to see institutions suffer and pay a price, for I guess understandable psychological reasons, but distorted reasons in many cases nonetheless.
"The myth of the self-made man is such colossal bullshit...it's a total fiction, no one made themselves."
- Sam Harris, 1:12:05
So, sam Harris is an idiot. Well, we already knew that
30 seconds in and he's already blowing my mind "We should think of skin color no different than eye color or hair color" really shows how silly caring about such differences is
Paraphrasing very closely Haile Selassie's speech to the UN.
Not far from MLK's most famous speech either.
Yet he later demonstrates that he can't live up to this standard
“We” don’t think about eye and hair colour in the way he would like. People care, certain people rant about blue eyed devils for example - they care.
@@tomdixon8950 I don't know if you are joking here, but blue-eyed people are not the victims of any meaningful discrimination or hostility in our society - and to suggest so is silly.
@@jmc5335when?
"Sam, what do you think of Salon magazine?"
@56:19 😂😂jk
In Sam Harris I see a person calling out legitimate concerns on both sides , too a society , well represented on this comments board..locked into their individual indeology
Does that calling out of affirmative action and The Civil Rights Act strike you as legitimate?
@jmc Sir I send you responses and detailed answers . You claim I sent nothing . I don't play these games .
I post , to engage in legitimate disagreement not to play games with idiots . Move on
@@troyzieman7177 You claim to answer questions completely when you haven't. We've just added another to that list
@@jmc5335 oh you mean calling out tens of billions worth of university spots being taken from whit, and especially asian people who earned them, and gifted to undeserved blac people?
yes, that strikes me as legitimate as i dont like theft, and society runs worse when theft is employed
@@jmc5335 not to mention racism, society tends to run worse when that happerns as well
Sam packed some potent punches of logic.
Such as?
@@jmc5335 That we need trustworthy institutions.
@@charliewalker9443 Can't think of many people who argue that we need untrustworthy institutions. Can you?
@@jmc5335 People who think Governments should have zero involvement in the public sphere or encroaching onto your freedoms do often believe these institutions should not matter.
Regardless, it is a good logical point that you agree with. This your question is answered.
@charliewalker9443 That's not an answer to my question. Libertarians almost always base their arguments on the fact that institutions are untrustworthy. So it appears that they are packing some potent punches of logic in saying so
Take A Moment
9:51
Sam, I feel your pain 10:14
Your work is vital to our survival.
Ignore the white noise, ironically
12:35
12:35
From my perspective here in Calgary, I think we are seeing the fall of the American dream
Sad but take a look
12:35
😢
Good luck 👍 💓 We are all this together ❤️ 12:35
Not sure how great some ape's
12:35
Peace and love etc 12:35 😢
"Balancing between maniacs" great line!,I love Sam
While I can appreciate these endless conversations about the effects of social media , the fact remains.
Prioritizing education is the only way to turn this corner.
Grade school children need to understand how to evaluate information accurately.
There are reliable methods, and we are not born knowing them.
There are all kinds of new terminology just to describe the variety of symptoms but I'm not hearing anyone suggesting that we treat the problem itself.
Every time Sam says "we" he's referring to a bunch of adults who are set in their ways. If we concentrate on providing intellectual tools for the next generation, we might have a fighting chance.
Keep churning over a bunch of analogies and observations and opinions all you want. It won't go anywhere.
Love how Sam often inserts 'pragmatic' with 'ethical'. People's ethics are all over the map, we'll never agree and a huge gulf stands between the religious and non-religious (for one example) but what does work and what does not is often crystal clear. Wanting everyone to WIN is exactly right, another's gain is my gain. We know all this but teach different values to up-and-coming Americans, and most of them take the bait.
Actually, non-theistic ethics are universal. Property rights are universally agreed upon in a selfish matter. All humans agree that they own themselves, their labor, and the product of the labor. Logically, that means that violating those property rights is universally immoral. It follows the golden rule of "do unto others."
Rape, murder, theft, slavery, assault, trespassing. All property rights violations that all people oppose happening to them.
A lot of worries for no free will. And ultimately I agree that no one is in control. Just try and be the best you you can be
“There’s an elevation of the ‘they’” Absolutely! Well said!
Very often we attribute our success to our personal efforts but blame our failures to outside forces. And when it comes to judging others, we attribute their success mostly to luck and their failures to personal shortcomings.
Skin color will only not matter when skin color no longer matters. Skin color will no longer matter when race and ethnic differences no longer matter. We will only get to when race and ethnic differences no longer matter when kin preference no longer matters or exists. We will only get to a place where kin preference no longer matters when we are no longer marginally different in group properties affinities and utility. We will only get to the the place where group properties affinities and utility are no longer marginally different when we groups are marginally indiffierent in evolutionary neoteny, resulting domesticatin syndrome, in resulting rate and depth of maturity, and as such mirror one another's personality and IQ distributions. That will only occur if we are all indistinguishably an admixture of white and east asian, with south eurasian (MENA+Central Asia+India) and african gene pools have been diluted out of gene expression.
Otherwise racially netural behavior except in cooperation between the upper classes is irrational and disadvantageous and devolutionary both politically and genetically.
Interpersonal racisim is irrational (stupid really). But so is political anti-racism. Because we are always and everywhere dependent upon the ingroup because that is the greatest discount on cooperation. We can be anti-racist in markets. We can be anti-racist in personal interactions. We cannot be anti-racist in politics. And we never will be. Ever. And it's a supernatural religous fraud to claim so.
There is no difference between this law of the universe and any other. If you don't believe so you don't grasp the first principle of the universe, and it's expression at the physical, biological, social, and individual levels as the defeat of entropy by evolutionary computation of the greatest capture and transfer of entropy into order, and that order among humans is dependent upon neotenic evolution, which produces agency over impulse, and that the four generations (races, species) of man, are incremental leaps in neotenic evolution. Period. End of story. No more lies. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam were and are as great an innovation in suggestion, deceit, fraud, and warfare as the indo european invention of horse, bronze, wheel and democracic rule of law, as the greek invention of reason empiricism politics, and phalanx. No More Semitic Lies. We must end the greatest risk to mankind in the jewish, christian, and islamic false promise that if we reduce outselves to semitic tribalism and superstition that we can resolve conflict rather than devolve civilizations in to dark ages of ignorance, dysgenia, and decline.
Love one another.
But do not lie to one another.
DIversity is exceptional in creating markets between polities.
But polities are as important as hoyuseholds, and the left is trying to destroy both just as the abrahamic religions tried to destroy politics, reason, and empiricism, and the western tradition of truth-before-face.
Cheers
Curt Doolittle
The Natural Law Institute
The Science of Cooperation/
Am I the only human that has never looked at twitter?
Not ever.
💜
Make that two ✋️
I tried it sometimes. Couldn't last morevthan a month. Stupid platform.
Me three
You didn't miss anything.
Such a well-hosted podcast! Sam is an amazing example.
Very interresting talk. Money is exstremely corrupting, so I think it will hard to meet on the simple solution, that pretty much is honesty.
This might trigger a few ppl but I think we should treat healthcare as we treat the military,the state should have the monopoly on doing the healthcare but collaborate with private business to develop and manufacture the treatments and equipment.
You're wrong. In all cases of this, healthcare systems rely on the hard work of others. The US funds and invents 90% of all drugs and technology. The social healthcare systems must wait for us to do so before they can benefit.
I don't need hear anymore. How could anyone claiming they are a HUMAN BEING NOT WANT THEIR NEIGHBOR TO GROW???
The analogy between skin color and hair (or eye) color is genius
Excellent conversation
What's with the little jump cuts while each person is talking?
Nice Podcast! I enjoyed it a lot!
I have spent the last 30 years in sales and I've had the fortune of traveling around the US in various economic areas, almost all the states and I have found that people are not as horrible as they seem in the bubble of the extremes of social media. We find ourselves in a world where the minority radicals on both sides of the political spectrum are taking all the oxygen out of the room and hogging the debates. Get out and meet other Americans. Stop viewing them through screens. Go offline and come out here in the analog real world. Overwhelmingly most people are just fine. The divisions help sell clicks and views and books and podcasts. MSNBC, FOX News and all the others are selling a narrative, not representing us. Beware the click-bate.
One of the few intellectual honest humans in the public discourse realm. I understand why few want to do what he does, he takes it from both sides. Watching Twitter hacks pile on him over the last few days, including clowns like Bret Weinstein, that can't hold a candle to Sam, has been disheartening.
Most of the voices that get heard are either grifters or ideological hacks.
What does it mean to be intellectually honest?
The problem isn't about race...it's about poverty and inequality of opportunity. We address those issues and we begin improving everyone's lives.
There is less poverty and inequality than ever before in history.
So peoples lives today should be far more improved in comparison. Right?
No, it's a matter of communism. Collectivist government uses groups, a la bourgeoisie and proletariat, but with place holders like "black/white" or "LGBT/hetero."
Statistically, poverty does not cause people to commit crimes. Criminals damaging communities causes poverty.
These are communist revolutions playing out as the political class deigns proper.
I agree we should care no more about race/ethnicity than we do about hair/eye color.
How do we get there?
Blind job/school applications might work but only until references and school transcripts are blind as well.
I never could understand why so many on the right (Tucker Carlson) defend Russia over and over on the invasion... Yes I understand some of the deep implications of Ukraine and Russia ties to the past, my Russian wife and I often talk about this, but having so many conservatives blindly agreeing that Russia is on the right side of this war confounds me...
Conservative here. I completely agree with you. Frankly, there are a lot of conservatives that agree with you.
In the bipolar climate of conservative and liberal, what ever the other side supports is always bad.
If Biden wants to do anything whether that be supporting Ukraine or kissing babies, it will be seen as bad by conservatives.
Both sides need to wake up and realize the GOP and DNC are institutions that make the rich richer and are 2 sides of the same coin.
1. It's none of our business and it is a waste of our time and money.
2. The US caused a coup in Ukraine to overthrow a pro-russian government and install an actual actor as their stooge. This rightfully prompted taking Crimea. Period. Ukraine oppressing an killing ethnic and Russians in the Donbass region, which very strongly supports and the wants to be part of the Russian federation strongly supports the invasion. Especially given the US building power in a region that is meant to be a neutral area.
@@bobjohnson1633Vatnik bot alert.
@@bobjohnson1633 1. See all foreign wars ever.
2. People's demonstrations = "US led coup", hilarious. Did the US make Yanukovich's police kill demonstrators too? Seriously funny stuff my guy. Oh and all of the oppression in Ukraine, a country that actually holds elections, vs Russia where even speaking well of the war in public will get you detained and Putin is "President for life" cough* DICTATOR cough*. All the while it is the "US building power in the region" aka supporting democracy and denuclearizing Ukraine under the conditions that Russia, not the West, and this should be a huge clue when you go back and read the Budapest Accords, RUSSIA does not invade or compromise Ukraine's territory, aka seizing Crimea, or you know, literally invading a neighboring country. Russia has brought Finland and Sweden under the NATO umbrella while doing so and has proven how far it's military has fallen since the days it was once a superpower, well played Russia.
Getting to a place where a circumstance exists that is real abundance, and this abundance is reasonably spread around, as Sam states it, has only ever been manifested under conditions of democratic socialism. I've yet to hear Sam make this specific statement. Arguments about the "left" and the "right", even ignoring the ludicrous extremes of both sides, fail to understand this key portion of what only (sane) left leaning though is fundamentally correct about.
Except the language, this was a joy. Thank you for bringing him!
Sams use of swearing is brilliant! A touch of the piquant!
At the 20:00 mark or so.... Sam is describing a comically ironic situation that he doesn't see from the correct direction. There is a parody song writer that has a joke song where he goes to a restaurant and smells marijuana, he goes to a library and smells marijuana, he goes to the grocery store and smells marijuana, he goes to a park and smells marijuana, and then finally at the end of the song he says maybe he should smoke less marijuana; the punchline being that he was the cause of all the things he was noticing, and he noticed it because he put it wherever he went. Sam is like that with how he was describing twitter and him starting to view people as psychopaths. Except Sam doesn't realize there were not more psychopaths approaching him, it was "Sam" that was the problem, it was "Sam" having a faulty psychology and it was Sam that would bring his logical fallacy to every interaction he had on twitter.
Thanks for this I love Sam!!
Both gents score low on the "completing a sentence without saying 'ya know' " scale. The host doesn't even enunciate it. For him, "you know" has morphed into a sound kinda like yee-o. Language is fascinating.
Did you get enough ads in there? Good lord.
Did you blur your background on purpose so we can't see what you're reading? My identity is someone who pastes her eye to the screen to read the titles in your bookshelf.
The line about monkeys was spot on, and hilarious LOL!!!
If Sam was in charge of society things would be so much better
It would be like society Russia or DPRK. If that's what you call "better," then okay.
Really enjoyed this discussion. A voice of reason and rationality . Thank you. Meaningful things for (and that) people can digest and get behind.
01:32:09
What does it mean to say that we need a government that we can trust, when we don't have a government we can trust?
Harris Rocks! 🤘🤘🤘
Great talk.
Since I can't hear Christopher Hitchens come out with new thought-provoking content I am so glad you are still around.
It seems ridiculous to say our institutions and those running them are so massively flawed when we stand atop the world as the major military and economic superpower and have been here almost 80 years. We are an extremely prosperous, secure, and free country.
Not quite prosperous or free.
If your basis on how good of a society is is by the size of their military you are massively flawed
what....
Not quite Secure when kids are go to a shooting range to get an education. That more people will have died of Gun Deaths in the USA between 2000-2050 than all US soldiers who have died from ALL USA involved wars combined.
The political system is broken when more people can vote for X candidate but Candidate Y has won more governing seats to win the overall election.
It may be a great economy, but it does not stand on top of the world. Much happier to live here in the UK and we are severely flawed also.
Sorry, but this country is a disaster. A rich disaster, sure, but culturally, morally, and simply in its population’s capacity for logical coherence, the US is far behind many other nations.
Sam is gaining support from the left. I don't think he is hated by the left at all.
I'm so curious how with 7k subs you have an interview with Sam Harris. I'm really curious your relationship with this man
Exploitation and discrimination are fundamental features of a competitive class hierarchy economic system. People who are forced to compete against each other for resources will exploit and discriminate against their competitors. This is pretty simple stuff really.
Yes, so rules are needed in the game to make it fair. Power relations need to be called out and explicited.
@@schok51 Yup. The fix is pretty simple, but not easy. The distribution of the issuance of money must be equal, rather than selective.
@@NumeroSystem I don't think that necessarily follows. Or it may seem a good idea at some level, but implies a lot of other issues that require non-trivial resolution, especially at scale.
Pure free-market capitalism has the issues you mention, but suggest an otherwise simple solution to the problems of resource allocation, innovation, incentive, social progress, personal responsibility, etc.
In reality the simple solution of markets has its limitations and is not sufficient to address all issues, and so we add complexity through additional rules in the game, resource redistribution policies, public and private tribunals, etc.
I don't think there is a single simple solution that is fully satisfying at any scale.
Capitalism, property rights, and government protections only for property rights solves all of those problems
I was on Twitter one week and that cured me. It’s full of crazies.
Sam is one of the internets' very few wise men. Let's hope his presence increases.
What does it mean to live the best possible life? 3:30
Well that ain’t happening! Maybe a better question, is sustainable-life possible… in a world of 8B, 10B, how about 0.5B???
I used to appreciate Sam Harris intellect and humour but after witnessing his refusal to admit or to see the dangerous totalitarian methods conducted by governments in dealing with the pandemic I sadly cant see him in the same light anymore as. It is okay to be wrong now and then (and Sam are probably right more often then the rest of us) but you have to admit when being wrong when its obvious and when the consequence of being wrong is dangerous.
He's as polarized and extreme as the people he criticizes.
We've been cutting taxes and government services for so long we've lost the plot. Then, Americans will be the last, are the last to realize that the profit motive in healthcare is the wrong one. The ethical response to the news of one getting cancer should not be figuring out how to make a buck, it should be how to help. Clearly, capitalism does not solve ALL problems but it did provide me a better phone.
Healthcare is the most highly government controlled system in the US. There is hardly a modicum of capitalism in US healthcare.
Cutting taxes and regulations? Cities are more highly taxed and regulated than ever. Before the benefits Americans receive, we pay half of all of our money as taxes. Mostly to keep people poor and enrich politicians.
I’ve been a Sam Harris fan for many years, especially in regards to his deconstruction of religious faith.
However, I’ve been enormously disappointed in what I perceive to be a biased barrier to speaking truth to power.
I’m speaking specifically about the corporate and political capture of our esteemed institutions, such as the CDC, FDA, NIAID and the WHO.
The influence of Big Pharma and the conflict of interest amongst our regulatory bodies is just outright depressing.
I’d like to think our health comes before politics.
Those institutions you mentioned did their jobs . Pharmaceutical companies are not pillars of pure morality or ethics, no companies are , but they have saved billions of people .
Tell me prior to covid , we're you in the habit of taking the prescription your doctor gave you and submitting it to a detailed analysis on efficacy ? Or did you just take it
@@troyzieman7177 Are you kidding me? Those institutions are rife with corruption, beyond belief.
To the day, the CDC refuses to release efficacy data of the booster (the first one) in the 18-49 year old cohort. Two senior officials at the FDA resigned over it.
Pfizer alone has had a long history of engaging in illegal activity.
Including bribery, corrupt market practices, suppressing adverse trial results etc…
They’ve paid out billions of dollars in criminal convictions in the last 2 decades.
Chantix comes to mind, Bextra, Effexor, I believe there was one about Neurontin, and several more.
To answer your question, hell yes I research any medication I take and/or recommend. I’ve been in this business for almost 30 years.
I knew something was very wrong when it became a “liberal” value to give Big Pharma an underserved pass.
Very wrong indeed.
However, that is NOT to say that the vaccine didn’t save lives because I believe it did.
Like most things, it’s complicated.
@@troyzieman7177 those instiotutions gave the MOST imagineably wrong advice on EVERY topic there were during this whole charade of a cough pandem.
they are corrupt to the bone and following everything the DNC believes perfectly. are you drunk?
In my opinion, there's a vast vast difference between viewing race through the lens and mission of oppression vs viewing race through the lens and mission of equality. Trying to make these two equal and labelling both as racism is completely disingenuous in my opinion. Peterson is big on this concept, and unfortunately, Harris is as well. I just can't get my head around it, no matter how hard I try.
If a segment of society uses race to oppress and disenfranchise, how can the rest of society deal with that problem and propose solutions, if simply referring to it makes us racist? It's ridiculous.
Anyone who speaks of the Left and the Right as if that were a legitimately precise terminology has already prejudiced the line of argument into zones of predictable stupidity and over-simplification.
Down with polarisation! I think problems start when either the left or the right get it into their heads that they hold the moral high ground or that their politics is some how more ethically sound than the other's. Are you left leaning? I always assumed you were
Have you got an example for this hypothesis?
@@jmc5335 hypothesis!? I remember that word from school! Hated science
@@petespeight3350 Didn't think you'd give any
@@jmc5335 ouch that hurt!
@@petespeight3350 That's centrism for you
Erik: 'at some point Trump will be expunged from the Republican party'. No he won't be lol.
He's a new York democrat and is still more right wing than either the democrats or establishment republicans. The republican party has moved hard to the left and Republican voters don't support that move
Trump is the Republican Party now.
I used to think this guy was one of the best thinkers in the world. I found him to be smart, creative, & knowledgeable on many things -- and practically a master of the English language in a discussion/conversation setting. On top of that, he called out hypocrisy all while being calm and rational, and he talked about meditation and mindfulness etc.
Well.... talk about D.Trmp-derangement syndrome and COV cult-like hypochondria. The guy completely went off the deep end, or at the very least exposed his true self. He kind of ruined his credibility and career momentum. His recent interview on Trigonometry displayed his true hypocrisy and tantrum-like spazziness on a HILARIOUS level anyone needs a good laugh. There are some absolutely bonkers quotes in it.
Congratulations you are exactly the problem
@@troyzieman7177 makes a claim with no reasoning or backing. I dont even like DT hes an egomaniac and quite petty. Sam Harris lost it dude, nobody really respects him anymore. He completely abandoned his core tenants of reason and fairness. He's basically a Joke to his former friends in the podcasting circles. Also, he was DEAD WRONG on his Cov predictions. The dude literally was talking about losing 1/3 of the population with complete societal collapse. Complete Hysteria. He now says "we got lucky, and if things were a little different we'd. be having a different conversation" --- translation, if reality was different I would have been correct. I still think he is eloquent with words but he totally exposed his willingness to abondon rationalism when it suits him. Being a blood-hungry anti-maga is its own version of religious fanaticism, Sam drank the koolaid BIG TIME.
@demaccus I guess your amplifying my point that you are the problem . I don't measure the reason , logic or value of a person based on a head count of how many people like that person .
Sam Harris gives a reasoned argument , and the fact that you think he has lost it because he differs from you is a demonstration of your smallness .
Dude ...
@@troyzieman7177 Shame on you for calling me "the problem" without knowing a thing about me. You assume I'm some DT Megafan because Im seeing things objectively. DT is not Hitler, an evil Mastermind, or some nut who attempted a violent coup. He is funny and quick on his feet for sure, but hes obsessed with his own image and can't stomach a single insult... and is extremely petty in this regard. The fact that he could step in and completely eviscerate experienced politicians just speaks to how bad and out of touch most of them are. Its so easy to see through the heavy propaganda on all sides I don't know why people have to pretend he is Hitler when there so many legitimate criticisms lol.
@demaccus Donald Trump is a carnival barker . Being funny and quick on your feet are great criteria for that role , not for President.
See the average janitor gets a more intense examination in his job interview , than the American people give a Presidential canidate . I notice there is no mention of Trump policies you liked when mentioning his attributes . I suppose you wouldn't want to spend any time evaluating policies that effect the country . If he can " evicerate" fellow politicians, good enough for Demarcus.
As Steven Tyler said "Dream on"
I love Sams instincts. So bright...
25:28 Im not sure what logcial fallacy this is or if it is one, but at the very least, Sam uses a poor example to make this argument. You could easily use a different example/parameter here, with the same argument, and get a different result.
Ending racism in today's world does not have the singular goal of reducing deaths that result from racism. Its about brining social equality--making sure all races are considered equally for jobs, and judged fairly in the court of law etc.. If you magically ended racism in Chicago today, you WOULD in fact see a huge difference. Maybe not regarding gun deaths or violent crime, but you'd see a big difference socially. The reductions in crime and death and pain all around come many years after we are all treated fairly and with respect.
I love how Sammy generally keeps that right eyebrow cocked, loaded. Or as though his right hemisphere is meditating while his left is left alone to podcast without disturbance from his right. And you'd never know, But for the eyebrow.
The double constitution Rights premise is a facade. And also emphasize the war on clear logical coherent and rational communication use of words and word play
I'm kind of impressed Sam spent almost two hours on a kinda small channel?
This interviewer pushes his narrative too much in guiding these questions. You can tell that his mind is closed on such issues.
@ 26 min mark. Poor Chicago.Doesnt even make too 5 in cities of highest murder rate.Yet its our favorite example of the homicide problem.
I am a center of the road who mostly has voted Democratic.
Trump, DeSantis and Ramaswamy are not options for me for various reasons. Neither is Biden, because of his age ( though I would vote for him over the three men that I mentioned)
I am seriously considering a more moderate Republican like Christie or Haley.
I'm Danish and don't get to vote, but if I could I would have gone with Pete Buttigieg if he hadn't left the primaries. He is someone I would entrust the job of trying to try to close the division between the two parties, and to me that seems to be the most important role for any American politician today.
People have got to be able to talk to each other about the pros and cons of each possible solution, in order to find the best one.
lmao Sam is such a good talker, I listen to him for that, honestly might be the best articulator I've seen since Hitchens
He's really funny in his inability to hide his frustration at the masses waking up to the truths of the world (mixed in with a few ridiculous conspiracy theories)
Praise kek!
Sam’s bayesian prior is that he is correct, and the task at hand is how to convince everyone else about his ideas
I think we can be more precise.
Sam's Bayesian prior is that technocratic liberalism is not only the best system but the only system that can deal with modern problems. Anything that threatens that system, including fair elections, can be sacrificed to further the goals of technocratic liberalism.
@@blooper6543Where has he ever disputed the sanctity of fair elections? He seems to talk often and at length about protecting free and fair elections, including the peaceful transfer of power and not trashing institutions or storming government buildings because we don't like our "side" losing?
@@michaelseanderry I totally agree that it was a stupid comment. I mean, newsflash: smart people say stupid stuff sometimes. But sweet baby cheeses, I'd take Sam Harris on his stupidest day than the best and brightest Jewish space laser nonsense people MAGA has to offer...
@@michaelseanderry That ill-considered comment revealed his true beliefs. "Protecting our democracy" and "peaceful transfer of power" are just rhetoric.
I don't like Trump. I don't care if Sam doesn't like Trump. I care if Sam lies.
@@jamesmatson5205 how about when he said it was justified that theentire establishment orchestrated a coverup of a story bigger than watergate, a story that was proven would have changed 10% of democr voters had they heard the story, in an electio where 2% woul dhave bene enough?