I worked in a shop where a mechanic did the top and I did the bottom on a full oil change and tranny service. I did my work properly including pre filling the filter. The topside guy didn't put in the oil but did put in the tranny fluid, he started the truck to top off the tranny but never checked that the oil light went off. That engine seized up before it got out of the work bay. I wasn't fired, he was, but I learned a very valuable lesson by this, always check the oil before you turn the key. I also leave the dipstick and oil filler cap off till the oil goes back in.
@@davidedgar2818and THAT is exactly why I've never understood why anyone would ever think it's a good idea to have a 2-person oil change system. When i was a Chrysler tech they started doing that system for the lube techs and i remember thinking "i wonder how many engines will end up being started without oil in them" let's just say the whole 2 person oil change thing didn't last very long 😂😂
My 2001 Silverado has this engine. Not great on MPG, but I am now passing 360,000 all original miles on her. I am looking for 500,000 out of her. The only things that I have replaced are the spark plugs, every 100K, a pulley and the oil and filter.
I'd guess oil change but not refilled. On startup no oil to mains but oil in the crank gallery would feed rods for a few seconds. Main bearing debris isn't carried to rest of the engine, stays in mains & grinds them up. Engine locked before residual lube was exhausted.
OLD SCHOOL.... They have let it idle with no oil until it stopped. The big end bearings don't get used or heated much at idle while the flywheel does its job, and so a film of oil remains. But mains work as the engine comes up to temperature. The main caps definitely show heat, and this could mean many things... But its the dry crank that gives it all away. The crank shows heat sink via the bearings to the crank, BECAUSE the engine stopped with no oil in the pan, and not even enough oil vapour from the over heating to coat the crank. ?
For all those mentioning...it's got huge displacement and low power because that's good for longevity. Even Ford's new 7.3 godzilla engine makes 300hp/425tq in the heavy truck variant. That's how you get 500k miles out of them.
Ford's Godzilla engines have a habit of eating their valvetrains for breakfast before 40,000 miles though haha. They're shit. All the modern advancements in the intervening 50-odd years between the 460's introduction and the Godzilla's and all Ford managed to do was make it shittier...
Yes for a rule of thumb thats correct but there is more to it than that. The engine also must be installed in the right vehicle to last long. The famous VW 1.9L TDi that last 1.000.000km wouöd not last that long in a big truck.
The oil cooler circuit goes from the oil pump directly out to the cooler, then back to the block before lubing the mains. You can see the oil cooler lines right next to the oil filter. The oil cooler lines have a tendency to suddenly pop leaks at the rubber section between the hard lines and the hard lines at the radiator. It's about 6-10 inches long of rubber for vibration damping betweeen the 2 sections.That vibration can cause the crimps to leak over time. If it was a sudden catastrophic leak it would run all the oil directly out the line and onto the ground, lubing nothing. If it was low rpm the mains would wipe before the rods, and fairly quickly. The centripetal force of the crank rotating would fling oil out to the rods to keep them lubed at lower rpm. Higher rpm oil starvation wipes rods first due to the same reason, flings it out faster and leaves metal to metal. I've replaced a few of the oil cooler lines on 8.1s over the decades and even almost had the catrastrophic failure on my own 8.1 burb. My wife saw it start pouring out within 2 seconds of start and I shut it down. She was walking up from the front door. Luckily after being married to a pro mechanic for 24 years she knows to look for leaks and yell out "kill it!" immediately. Of course it could also be the classic oil change, new filter, forget to fill it up and it died backing out of the shop/garage. You know, the standard lube shop stuff like not putting drain plugs back, putting twice the oil in, forgetting the oil entirely, putting the oil into the transmission, not tightening drain plugs, cold revs to the rev limiter, etc. I get quite a lot of engine replacements and repair jobs from lube shops.
30+ years gm tech here and I concur with this hypothesis. Oil line pops, customer panics and sits on the side of the road with the engine low oil pressure light on, engine running and doesn't know what to do while starving the main bearings. I've seen that exact scenario before.
Why I like your videos. No long ass intros. Right to Eric and what he is doing. No loud ass music than drowns out life. Only the sounds of a man working and swearing and joking.
right many videos put more time work into the intro than the content. On tv, people leave it playing and the intro catches the attention to return to the sofa lol. but its not needed on youtube.
When the crankshaft passages are full of oil and for some reason the engine loses pressure, the centrifugal force of the crank spinning pushes the oil out to the rod journals, so that the mains starve first. Notice the front main, farthest from the oil pump, was the worst bearing, and the rear bearing, the thrust bearing, was the best. Some one ran the engine out of oil and put a new filter with some oil in it (probably used oil by the look of the filter) and put some oil in the pan and tried to start it.
Interesting theory, but if the engine was run without oil for long enough to spin and destroy the main bearings that badly, it seems very odd that the rod bearings would show absolutely no signs of abnormal wear.
@@averyalexander2303 If they filled that filter during an oil change but forgot to refill the crankcase before starting, that would explain the whole thing.
@@randr10 That would explain the filter being wet and the main bearings being destroyed, but it wouldn't explain why the rod bearings still looked virtually new. From what I have noticed, the rod bearings generally seem to wear faster than the main bearings during normal use, especially the upper halves.
Improper oil change intervals is my first thought, leading to small amounts of metal to build up in main bearings blocking the oil journal halfway through the crankshaft. That lack of oil will lead to only half of the engine with proper lube due to the cam and lifter oil journals are separate from the crank on that engine. This lack of lube will cause overheating and failure of only main bearings over time as the metal is stuck in crankshaft journals and leads to a blockage of oil ports in the crank. Another possibility is a dry start up that ran to long after an oil change without oil in it but was caught before it left shop but in the process leaving small amounts of blockage debris but not enough for a full failure until months down the line due to low lubrication in crank over time adding small amounts of metal in the meantime. None the less inadequate lubrication is the culprit causing over heating and finally a full seizure of the crankshaft.
SB Chevy engines require 4 psi of oil pressure to allow the engine to fire. If this thing was not refilled at the time of the oil change, I am surprised that the ECM allowed the fire command. Sad.
LT Tolman, built a turbo 8.1 from a junkyard motor and swapped it into a GMT800 1/2 ton 2WD. It put down over 1,000 ft lbs at the wheels and a 10.99 1/4 mile. He's building a new 572 out of an industrial block version of the 8.1. He's shooting for 1500hp on that one. I recommend his channel.
Another vehicle that could be powered by this engine is a school bus! I worked as a school bus mechanic back in 2007 and we had a whole fleet of the 8.1L gas motors powering 70 passenger school buses.
I had to replace MANY oil pan gaskets and rear main seals. Oil pan gasket leaks were common, but they leaked in the back so we could not tell if it was the oil pan or rear main seal. So, since the transmission had to come off for us to check the rear main seal, we would go ahead and replace it. It would take me about 8 hours to do each one.
It lived in box trucks topkick/Kodiak longer then anywhere else, until 2009, then it was sold to be used as marine and power generation lol. They are 1000hp capable WITH 15000$ in parts lolol.
I had a 2003 2500 Avalanche with one of these. Best truck I’ve ever owned. I’ll never forget pulling a 31’ travel trailer cross country, with a canoe on the truck (I made a special rack to fit the Avalanche), up over the Rockies, AC on, in 100-degree heat, WHILE accelerating uphill! It was amazing!
I've owned my '03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD (1-ton, single rear wheels) since new. I bought the 8.1 as it was offered as an alternative to the Duramax at that time. While the diesel did offer another 65 lb./ft of torque, the 8.1 offered 40 more horsepower. The Duramax was also $5000 more dear. Max tow rating on the truck was actually 300 lbs. less on the diesel because of its added weight. As was comically said at the time, it could pass everything except a gas station! All around unladen driving would net little more than 8 mpg, while cruising down the highway at 60 mph might get you 13-14 mpg on a good day. But what a workhorse! Ours has been used most of the time pulling our 5th wheel trailers, a duty it's never balked at. I do have a little leak from the rear main seal, but other than that it's just been routine maintenance. I understand that a significant percentage of these were used in marine applications.
Blue devil ………thats the brand of rear seal treatment you can add to the oil…it makes the oil swell up the rubber in the seals making them effective again, you can buy a bottle of it at auto zone, kragen, napa, car quest..etc etc, just about any parts house will have it and its cost around $30/$40 depending on where you purchase it…it cost so much more than the other brands cause it works….if not they will give you back your money 100%…..u just add the bottle to your oil and drive,usually after 100 miles you should see results, if the leak is really bad you might need 2 bottles, considering its an 8.1 big block i would probably plan on 2 bottles but then again i dont know how bad your leak is…….i used it on my LSA super charged LQ9 in the nova you see in my lil picture next to my name, i was skeptical at first but then again i didnt wanna pull the motor for such a stupid simple 5 minute job…so i poured a bottle in and not even a week later i noticed my leak was gone…….so now i try all of their products first whenever i find a leak somewhere…..they have a full line of products from diffs, trans, engine, radiators and some other few that i may have forgot…….just remember pay the good money for “BLUE DEVIL”……. Do not go cheap and use a different brand, it wont work!!!……..blue devil all the way…..no im not getting paid for saying this….they just make a great product and i wanna save you time and money!!!
And yes i have one of these motors in my eagle230 eliminator (boat) but the marine applications make more power and they are labeled as mercruiser mag 496 HO……..rated at 425hp
Nice to finally see the inside of one of these monsters. I have an 02 silverado 2500hd that I just yesterday rolled over 298k in. Love this engine. Pulled a 7400 lb travel trailer all over the west with it and never once broke a sweat. Took her from salt lake to Sacramento in August, 110 degrees the whole time. Up over Donner pass. Temps never got over the midline of the gauges.
bought an 03 2500 hd (6.0 lq4 with 4l80 trans) from my boss. (We used it for our tree service) This truck had 370k miles when i bought it. We would regularly tow a skid steer and sometimes a stump grinder at the same time on this truck on the freeway going 80+ mph. Straight up torture tests on the daily. My co-workers would also dog it anytime they had the chance lol. I don't think they changed the oil for a year. Got the truck, replaced coils and plugs, deleted the muffler and replaced stock cat with a cheap high flow cat and serviced the transmission just fluid, fillter and pan gasket. Changed the oil (puralator filter, used a mixture of 10/w30, lucus oil, and marvel mystery oil.( i called it motor milk 😂) Ended up selling it at 420k Miles after the manifold gasket slowly went. Had that truck been properly maintained from the start, it could've hit a million miles.
50 years as a mechanic and have seen this many times in the Chevrolet big block since the 70's. The oil pump is stock low volume and any mild damage causes it to not be able to supply the volume of oil the crank needs to survive. Chevrolet has a problem addressing small issues like this.
That's why they lasted so long. They were pulling reasonable numbers. What we get today is the poster child of 'burning the candle at both ends'. You ask 300hp out of 3 liters you're going to have a fleetingly short engine lifespan. You ask 300hp out of 8 liters and it's going to last basically for-fucking-ever. It's part of why I won't buy modern stuff. I like longevity and don't care about fast, so I'm quite happy to have 120hp out of 4.9 liters. I know I'll still be getting 120hp out of 4.9 liters 40 years from now.
@@TestECull I hear ya. My daily driver is a 72 Lemans 2 door hardtop. It just turned 90,000 miles. With it's slight mods, it probably only puts out about 200 net HP, but it does it all day long. LOL
@@TestECull I have a 6.2L F150 - says 411hp 430TQ. Also supposed to run forever. Gas mileage sucks though, even driving like grandma most I get is 15.5 combined.
@@alb12345672 If you had a manual transmission you might be able to nudge up a bit higher. But eh, still asking a bit much out of that 6.2. And I'd have my doubts you're getting 411/430 out of it anyway. These things don't always make what the brochure says they make; my mom's '04 4.2l/auto F150 with 270k on the clock will kick the snot out of our 14 3.6l Challenger in any area of the speedo it's legal to go despite supposedly having >100hp less than the Challenger does and weighing about the same. It's not even a contest the F150 pulls like a freight train the Challenger barely lumbers along. No way in hell that Pentashit is making the 320hp it's supposed to....I'd say 220.
The only GMT-400’s that got the 8.1 are the “1.5 ton” 3500 HD straight frame / I beam front axle Cab and chassis trucks. They were basically a 4500/5500 just named differently and the reason they built them with 8.1’s and Allison’s for a couple years is they didn’t have the new C4500-5500’s ready for market yet. They were 2wd chassis cab trucks only and had things like 19.5 wheels and unique frames and front axles that required mounting the body a few inches higher than on regular 1500-3500 trucks, hence the weird filler panel they had at the front below the grille. The look a LOT like the Mark IV big block Chevy internally, but they did have some minor upgrades based on LS engine features like the better sealing valve covers with coils mounted on them for the coil near plug ignition setup, heads with a more efficient port design, intakes with vertical bolts, and the better flowing “header” type exhaust manifolds.
Strange things have happened in life cuz we're only human. I remember one time that my grandpa changed the oil in a little Volkswagen that my grandmother drove. There was just a dip in it edge of the driveway where he would back up and then he could crawl under the vehicle and change the oil without using a jack. To make a story short some reason my grandmother hopped into the car before my grandpa got his hands on the oil and got it back into the car and she blew up on the way to town
Hmmm I’m betting it was the last oil change, someone left out the oil, drove off or maybe just idled it ? Couple years back a dealership did exactly that to one of my cars. Engine rapped for a minute then they shut it down. Wouldn’t crank then, seized up tight. Dealer bought car back, just 8000 miles. Thanks for your great videos, you should be a shop teacher for the next gen mechanics? 😅
Sold my 2001 2500HD 8.1 last Jan. 2023 with 299,000 miles on it, was still running perfectly fine in 22 years only changed 1 crank sensor under warranty....2 serpentine idlers, normal oil changes....
My brother's 5.3 looked somewhat like that when he took it apart; turned out it cracked between the coolant jacket and the intake port, including the valve guide area. We replaced the heads and reinstalled every single internal piece aside from oil pump and chain after extensive cleaning, wd40, brake clean, and brillow pad work. It runs like a dream 2 years later and weekly use.
The older big block, 454, etc. Are known for the bottom ends to knock after excessive mileage. Due to end play of the crankshaft brush washer bearing failure they will still run but they will knock a couple times when you first fire them up. Been wrenching for 40 years
Good Sir, I pose a theory: Someone changed the oil, new filter. Someone did NOT refill the oil. There was enough old oil still kicking around to wet the new filter, and even get to the top of the engine...just barely. But 8.1L of displacement was much less forgiving to the now very very limited supply of oil that the crank saw. I'd imagine theres more friction in the bottom end than the top, cuz...well...8point1leaderz. Big oof ensues. ~fin
That’s what I was thinking. Alternatively they drained the oil intending to just put fresh oil in It and not do a filter change….like maybe a rip-off oil change place that says they put a new filter on and didn’t and in this case didn’t put oil oil in either.
Oil change was my first thought too, though i was thinking oil filter not being sealed properly, they drive away, oil leaks away.... we know what happens next🤔💥
A local service center dependably maintained box trucks I drove for a warehouse in 1978. But the boss's 76 Coupe DeVille had a engine lockup and replacement after an oil change. Freudian slip maybe? The techs had a bunch of delivery trucks and one Cad in the service queue. Anyway, it's not always a flunky that slips up. I saw a guy putting fresh oil in his Mustang that poured straight out because he didn't replace, you know what. Stuff happens.
I'm gonna guess that it was ran with very low oil too, really lucky the block didn't get a new window or two installed. It does happen where the main bearings spin before the rods, but it's really not very often. All in all there's quite a few good parts from this one which is a nice bonus. I've always wanted an 8.1, my uncle had a Yukon XXL with one and he loved everything about it, except the fuel mileage.
3:20 My Haines manual states very explicitly that the fan and water pump are to be installed in the engine compartment, *not* into the interior of the car, even if it is faster that way. I hope you didn't charge the customer full flat rate for that non-traditional installation.
Where did u get a haynes manual for the 8.1?? I have 2 of them for an 02 GMC SIERRA 2500 HD and neither one shows anything about the 8.1 except for the engine code. I even asked the dealer where to get a manual and they dont know. They use all data !!
I worked on the factory that made the intakes for the first batch of these engines.. a complete nightmare. The castings varies in length by as much as 3/4 of an inch. So much shrinkage.. we had probably a 60% failure during machining
I @'d you in the title but thank you for doing what you do. Without you i wouldnt have had the confidence to rebuild my friends engine and eventually, a couple days ago, start it for the first time after he blew it up. After all, if someone who is "Taking bolts out til stuff falls off" cam do it. The so can I. Happiest day for me this year. Keep up the awesome work.
This has my vote. Just enough oil in the galleys to wet the oil filter, but that about it. The mains were completely dry, so it didn't run long enough to trash the rod bearings.
As an ins adjuster, thats what happens when you drive through a large puddle and suck up water, seeing the rusted intake areas, the water in the oil, and the burned center crank bearings due to lack of oil. Once that oil was mixed with water you have loads of issues, they probably drove it for a while after and thought it was fine, I wouldn't be surprised if there was a bent rod or 2 amongst those parts. Thanks for sharing!
Almost going to bet that this was a Jiffy Lube special oil change screw up. Aka they changed the oil and forgot to put oil back into the engine. My aunt had them do that to her 2020 Honda Crv and they bought her a new engine.
Jiffy lube TECHNICIAN's that's what they are called. Change oil on your bubba truck and now their Technicians. With a capital T. Something about being called a TECHNICIAN just rings your bell loud and your mum and pop proud. 😅😅😅
@@2nickles647 either way, PepBoys still has JiffyLube beat. PB's will either snap oil drain plug off ,strip your oil drain plug, or gorilla tighten oil filter on to 400 foot pounds torque
On the rod studs scratching the crank, a smart old time engine builder I new 45 years ago gave me a trick that I have used ever since, you can take a couple of old clean rod bearings and place them on the journals out 90 deg to protect the crank surface. Lots of guys use rubber hoses slipped on but I have seen threads of rubber and silicone in the threads of engines I have pulled down so I like the old bearing method. P.S. I need some 1990 Toyota 4Runner parts for interior and some 2000 tacoma under hood parts for my 3.4 swap that I have going, it's missing some evap goodies. Anyway, love your channel!!!! P.S.S. find an old Chrysler Slant Six to pull down, that would be a fun one, man we drove the crap out of those things back in the day. Guys did test running them without oil for days. Crazy. Reg
I stopped at the 37 minute mark because I've seen this twice before. Once 30 years ago on a 351C Australian Ford Fairlane and later on my neighbour's 3.2l GM/Isuzu quad cam V6. Both times the mains were toast, the rods were OK and the front main caps and the front of the crank were discoloured. Each time they simply ran out of oil. Like the BBC you show, both of these engines are notorious oil burners. They didn't lose oil pressure, they simply overheated what little oil was left in the sump. If it was a high load situation or low oil pressure, then the rod bearings would have failed first. Each time the engines started to knock as the mains went away, and both times there was still some oil in the sump. Enough to lubricate the crank, but not enough to cool it. As a 62yo mechanic/trade teacher in Australia, I've seen a lot. BTW, thanks for doing the 496. I have a TBI 454 1988 K3500 and was considering an 8100 swap, but having seen that the crank is only cast iron, not forged steel, I think I'll build my core with a lot of aftermarket parts.
Used to plow snow for a landscaping company that had a truck with an 8.1. Had over 600k for kms (400k miles). Truck didn’t have a plow, just salt slinger in the bed. Thing was a tank that could easily get rowdy in a parking lot at will.
I suspect somebody started it bone dry after an oil change and ran the mains - just my opinion. A shame, because apart from the cam lobe trouble just starting, the rest of it didn't look bad. Thanks for the teardown video. Glad that fan and pump were put to good use. Cheers!
I have 1 of those in my 01 Yukon XL 2500. A beast motor. Your engine can be resurrected. Gonna take some $$'s to make it right for sure. But I think still worth the time & cost. The block is in good shape. Crosshatching still looked okay from here. They literally will run forever. Mine runs great still. Although I've already done the usual's..... Fuel pumps....etc....At 234k, I can hear and need to put a pinion bearing in the 4.10's rear, growling lately !!! Be prepared for someone who's NEVER had a big BIG BLOCK, in a full size, heavy Yukon/Suburban/truck.... IT LOVES GAS !!! Cool vlog !!!
I am the original owner of a 95 Surbarban K2500 . I ordered it from the build sheet in summer of 94 and took delivery in Oct same year. I am glad that I opted for the 454. Which at that time had transformed to the MK iv series. I wish I could find a 502 from the later generation to swap in. I know that mine has throttle body injection, but that should fit the 502 valley? Great engine, gold I didn't order it with the 6.2 diesel or small block.
@@Musclecar19722 is always better than 1……i can only imagine how much gas his boat uses (cost)…..im guessing its an offshore racer over 25’……….mine is a 23’ just at the brink of becoming a mini cigarette!!!
@@trentdawg2832 I don’t know what it would be classified as, it’s a nice boat, but yes he says it’s hard on fuel, I have never personally ridden in it, have only seen detailed pictures of it, we don’t live in the same state. He has owned a few boats, and is pretty well versed in them.
I bought a 8.1 , in pretty much the same condition, this year. I'm doing the exact some thing you are doing for the exact same reasons. I tow a lot, and my Avalanche isn't cutting pulling heavier loads. Good job lots of good tips. 8.1s tow great.
The no oil oil change did it. Started & run with no load until someone noticed and it was just starting to slow down, then shut off. The crank holds enough in it to centrifugal feed the rods and with no real loading they don't need too much, cam was back feed from that big gallery above it that feeds the hydraulic lifters. The upper mains are grooved and lowers aren't, so that breaks up the oil film, the 'hydrodynamic wedge' that keeps the shaft & bearing separated when there's pressure. Also, could be the pics, but the main's drilling doesn't look to have a nice radius at all compared the the rod journal's oil hole/port, more of a scraping edge to it.. Yes it defies experience, but those were killed under a load not idling. Nice work.
I have this engine in my Yukon 2500 and love it. Just under 200k miles and it pulls a 26 foot enclosed race trailer down the highway at 75 in overdrive all day. Just burns a little oil. Worth noting, factory spark plug gap spec was .080. Crazy big.
Yes. Thank you, I was gonna say this.... When you're looking at .032 Miata plugs all day, .080 looks pretty big.... Not that those plugs weren't smoked... They were... but they weren't WILDLY off from the .080....
trade skool mechanics,, learn to change oil..here in aus.. our trade system is a rort, employers get money teach you nothing.. plumbers same, you learn more working than bs trade.. employers cen hire people for 3 months, get a grant, then hire another for 3 months, another grant.. sacked after 3 months so some other suckers gets paid for 3 months then sacked,,.to start a bussiness here, you need to grow drugs for 4 yrs, to get enough capitol to survive the 5 yrs before the gov leaves you alone.. my first yr as a contractor, i paid double tax. ??.. you never get it back.. say 50k 1st yr. double tax at 30% is 60%.... no fkn insentive to work,, eh.. boilermaker.21 yrs, construction 22 yrs.. now on dole.. body died.. 4 u.s. trucks, 4x4, 1 challenger 340 r/t.
Almost looks like someone changed the oil but never refilled it with new oil and ran it dry. That's the only way I can see that it had dirty oil in the filter from what was left in the crevices of the engine but wasn't overly saturated in oil with no chunks of material in the filter like you mentioned or in the pickup screen. Looks like all the bearing material just fell down into a empty pan since there was no oil to carry it into the pump or pickup tube. Like someone forgot the most important step in a oil change. To refill it will oil lol
As a past(2004) 8100 owner. These things normally consume oil. GM included this in the owner's manual. They also came out with TSBs on this issue. They were built "loose" for longevity. They would normally use 2qts between easy driving. I'm sure it was ran low at highway speed.
Loved the "park a Miata in that gap" crack. Just out of curiosity, how much does that all iron lump weigh? I'm guessing somewhere north of 700 pounds? Woof!
I can honestly say that's the first time I've wanted to spend 40 mins looking at a BBC... As usual, thanks for the video Eric - the highlight of my week. And I'm sure that water pump will improve the scrap value of that car you installed it in. Sad about that white Miata with the blue stripe, that's a good look.
I really enjoy your videos. I was doing a lot of the same things I've watched you do, just 50 years ago. To my point when you have a rust stuck engine spray it with either muriatic or hydrochloric acid in a well ventilated area. Wait time will very due to rust severity, but it will break it loose. Flush with water to neutralize the acid. never had one I couldn't beat. I hope you'll give it a try.
My guess is that someone drained the oil and then left for the day. Next morning someone moved the vehicle because they didn’t know the oil was drained. All the damage was done at idle, which is why the rod bearings didn’t show the same damage.
I have a 2003 2500 with a 8.1, it has a diesel tank and an air compressor in the back and I have a few tractors and a dozer so it's my service truck. I Purchased it in about 2010 with 155k on it and I went out and looked at the odometer right now it has 318,000 miles. It's been the most reliable piece of equipment I've ever owned, I literally would jump in it and go to Alaska right now. Well I just got a 410 rear end it so maybe I won't drive it to Alaska🤣. The only thing I ever replaced which possibly could've happened to this truck the old cooler line busted and it dumped that all out of that truck probably in 10 seconds , And someone probably did not get that truck shut down until it started knocking. Then they got it where it was going and decided to change the hole and it still rattled that's why your filter would be clean.
The 8.1 was a great choice for people who wanted to tow their travel trailers but didn’t want the hassle and expense of owning a modern emissions diesel engine. I’m not sure what power numbers are acceptable to some people. The 8.1 would drag a 30 ft. trailer down the road like it was nothing but because it’s numbers on paper don’t show diesel torque numbers it’s underpowered according to a few geniuses. The horsepower competition amongst modern diesel engines coupled with their emissions systems has destroyed diesel engine reliability. The 8.1 is the exact opposite to modern diesel engines. Low technology, simplistic design, and not highly stressed. It worked well for what it was designed to do. I appreciate the effort put into your content 👍
You’re talking about “geniuses” but diesels didn’t have emmisions equipment other than cats until 2007 and a half. So how could the 8.1 be an alternative to unreliable emmisions laden diesels.
@@bigounce4108 By the time modern diesels were at war for who had the most torque in a light duty truck the simplicity of design was already compromised and reliability was suffering. Just EGR alone created a world of problems with the Big Three and it only got worse from there.
At 4:48 Large gap in plugs.... Those are rather large gaps, you did not mention if they were worn wider or gapped that way on purpose. It would be nice if you would measure the the gap and then tell us what the book says the gap should be.... If you still have access to the plugs, could you put that in a pinned comment?? Thank you in advance....
These engines are interesting, I own a few of them, used to hate them, have come to love them. I install kohler standby generators, and some of the larger units like the 250kw come with PSI (Power Solutions International) forged internal 8.8 with a turbo, based on the gm 8.1 architecture. Big power, extremely reliable, and the block isn't that hard to swap into a truck. On the note of boost, several people have been boosting these engines with very impressive results. I am currently building a gmt800 dually and intend to turbo my 8.1 and see how she does. The biggest downside to the platform to me is the cylinder heads. Heavy, horrible ports, almost no options unless you pay the money for Raylar parts. Luckily turbos tend to help in the airflow department. Something else interesting, gas mileage. It's terrible, always. But I have on several occasions gotten better mileage towing a large load than I have driving an empty truck. The engine craves load. I have a regular cab work truck 2500 with an 8.1, so about as light of a vehicle as you could get an 8.1 in, and it feels wrong. It's so much torque and without the weight the engine feels like weak, or maybe it's just that it becomes obvious that going fast isn't what it is intended for. Strap 18k lbs behind it and the power's pretty impressive, it just loves load.
I worked at a Chevy dealership in the early 2000’s, and they were selling an Avalanche with the 8100 with a Borla exhaust on it. It sounded sweeeeeet. I also got to drive it. For a vehicle of that size, I was very impressed with the power. 😉
Love your videos, discovered the channel a few months ago and haven't stopped watching since! I would like to see a teardown of a Kia/Hyundai 2.4L Theta II MFI engine. My dad has a 2011 Kia Sorento with this engine and it abruptly seized on the highway with no warning at only 80k miles. After getting it towed, dealer said the engine was locked up and there were metal shavings in the oil, so he got a brand new engine because of an extended warranty (which normally would have costed $7,000+)! There's widespread failures for this engine and the 2.0L variant from 2011-2014 due to a manufacturing process issue. Debris left in the engine during manufacturing would cause premature wear and oil starvation, and the rod bearings usually would be the first to go.
That metal shaving story is a cover-up for a shity engine design in Hyundai is embarrassed I don't know who designed those Engineers but they are lacking support in all the heavy stress areas. For example the intake manifold looks like it should have one bolt on each side of each port and it almost does except for one port on the end there's not even a hole drilled and lo and behold that's where it leaks. The Dual Mass flywheels on the manual transmission seems to be held on with a chintzy input shaft pilot bearing it just feels like it's going to break if you look at a cross-eyed. Don't get me wrong they make good cars excellent cars but some of the places they cut corners just makes no sense
Some possible things that would cause the mains to fail without damaging rod bearings. Bending of the crankshaft. From lugging or high rpm. Another reason might be block warping. From fast heat or large heat cycles. Either could be checked by a machine shop. Oil starvation looks likely but rod bearings look really good.
Thanks for playing the (Stock) C5. surely somebody stole the cats off it? Does sound and puff out the ends of the pipes. Maybe anything that even looks like a muffler was deleted. Sounds like it might be even louder than that, like raised compression, 4 valve heads? My motorcycle engines (four valve) have that tached out sound, it makes. Be hard to get along with on a long trip. I watch as many of your shows as I can. Been wrenching 53 years but don't tear engines down as much as doing detail work and total replacements. Most customers want bullet warrantee coverage, not a patched had failed some way motor. I've had customers replace fairly low mileage (with then a failure with new motors just so they can trust it to run a long time, always new radiator and any oil coolant stuff if it has it. same with hoses and even heater cores). I guess it depends on what happened to them on other failures when they run a mixed fleet of different brands. Looks like a crank kit would make that motor good as new. I've done 318 Dodge V8 and 225 Dodge slant Six, both with mains out only and they were oil change shop, didn't refill and send, lock up just down the street from the shop that did it. traced back tot he guy that runs the shop, all done but the oil, called away to answer phone then that lead to something else someone else releases the truck just to have it fail. Both only had a gauge and no red light. driver didn't know till it stated to slow down, by then it was too late. Hot oil change even the lifters can be quiet. No notice at all they were out of oil till the last few seconds. I didn't even see any glitter in the oil, but couldn't get those motors to turn enough to even remove the torque converter bolts had to drag the converter out of the trans and then get into that when it leaked with the repaired motor. Whisper down the lane failures. One problem causes a new but related to the need to be worked on. I like your comments as you go along, like "lets see if there is any malfunction in the combustion palace" Oil filter may have looked that way as it wasn't changed, as in just the oil, or sabotaged, just drain the oil, or crash and still running the the oil lines on the oil cooler system failed in the crash. Just sit and idled till it locked. They do that kind of engine changing work just didn't even want to see it while the engine gets worked on or changed.
It looks like one of the mains spun and through the crank oil galley took debris to the rest of the mains and ruined them also. The centrifugal force will throw oil out to the rod journals. It was likely at idle and didn't take long to lock up. I'm surprised those pistons don't have a deeper skirt. That engine has a fairly long crank stroke, yet short rods, which means high piston side loading on the power stroke. A deeper piston skirt would distribute some of the side loading. A high volume oil pump sometimes on a big block can stop something like that from happening. As the engine builds miles on it the mains loosen up a little, and need the extra pumping volume of a H.V. oil pump, mainly at startup. The 8100 Vortec is an oil burner too, and if you don't stay on top of keeping the oil level up.... I've seen 400,000 on fleet maintained 8100's . We had wreckers with 8100 Vortec motors. This was in the Northeast. In the winter sometimes those engines were running for over three days steadily. We always used either straight 40 weight oil or straight 30 weight in really cold weather. In the morning let them warm up for at least 5 minutes before you start hammering on it too.
Its purposeful in its designed power though. These engines may not make absurd power, but they can take absurd abuse for very long periods of time, and handle being overloaded very well. I'd be willing to bet this one ran a very long time without oil in it lol
Literally all I can think of is that this engine was started dry but still had oil in the passages. Maybe it caught a jiffylube special and didn't get refilled after being drained. I just don't see any other way.
Another great Saturday night video Eric. Thanks man, and keep up the good work. Oh, and P.S. I totally believe you...that corvette at the end is absolutely stock! :)
Looks to me like they ran it out of oil and it locked up. As far as the crank goes you can turn it and it’ll be good as new. Rebuilt many big blocks, my favorite engine.
I think it was dry started after oil change. Filter might have been primed or wet from oil that was in the pump.
I worked in a shop where a mechanic did the top and I did the bottom on a full oil change and tranny service. I did my work properly including pre filling the filter. The topside guy didn't put in the oil but did put in the tranny fluid, he started the truck to top off the tranny but never checked that the oil light went off. That engine seized up before it got out of the work bay. I wasn't fired, he was, but I learned a very valuable lesson by this, always check the oil before you turn the key. I also leave the dipstick and oil filler cap off till the oil goes back in.
@@davidedgar2818and THAT is exactly why I've never understood why anyone would ever think it's a good idea to have a 2-person oil change system. When i was a Chrysler tech they started doing that system for the lube techs and i remember thinking "i wonder how many engines will end up being started without oil in them" let's just say the whole 2 person oil change thing didn't last very long 😂😂
My thought exactly. As soon as he said the filter looked new... Oof.
If you have a BMW with yellow chalk on the oil cap, that was me. No dipstick means I mark the oil cap after filling...
Was thinking the same. Clean oil filter and 'dry' looking engine internals plus the signs of running hot would suggest it was run without oil.
My 2001 Silverado has this engine. Not great on MPG, but I am now passing 360,000 all original miles on her. I am looking for 500,000 out of her. The only things that I have replaced are the spark plugs, every 100K, a pulley and the oil and filter.
why you refer to engine as 'her'? How do you know it is not 'him'?
I'd guess oil change but not refilled. On startup no oil to mains but oil in the crank gallery would feed rods for a few seconds. Main bearing debris isn't carried to rest of the engine, stays in mains & grinds them up. Engine locked before residual lube was exhausted.
I 100% agree!
👍👍👍👍💯💯💯 I just type and commented. Took me a while to get it right. I look down and see many old school got it. Here is mine....
OLD SCHOOL.... They have let it idle with no oil until it stopped. The big end bearings don't get used or heated much at idle while the flywheel does its job, and so a film of oil remains.
But mains work as the engine comes up to temperature. The main caps definitely show heat, and this could mean many things...
But its the dry crank that gives it all away. The crank shows heat sink via the bearings to the crank, BECAUSE the engine stopped with no oil in the pan, and not even enough oil vapour from the over heating to coat the crank.
?
Someone, that used the same plugs for likely 200k miles replaced oil? lol nope
@poprawa what? Jus bc someone doesn't change plugs in no way is anybody gonna assume they don't change there oil besides u lol
Had one in a 2001 2500 Silverado…you’re correct these engines are a beast! Hauled a trailer with my 3 horses and never broke a sweat…
For all those mentioning...it's got huge displacement and low power because that's good for longevity. Even Ford's new 7.3 godzilla engine makes 300hp/425tq in the heavy truck variant. That's how you get 500k miles out of them.
I had a 7.3L Godzilla in an F450 430hp 475 horse torques
Ford's Godzilla engines have a habit of eating their valvetrains for breakfast before 40,000 miles though haha. They're shit. All the modern advancements in the intervening 50-odd years between the 460's introduction and the Godzilla's and all Ford managed to do was make it shittier...
@@TestECull so does the modern chevys with there lifters with active fuel management.
Yes for a rule of thumb thats correct but there is more to it than that. The engine also must be installed in the right vehicle to last long. The famous VW 1.9L TDi that last 1.000.000km wouöd not last that long in a big truck.
@@TestECullVariable displacement oil pump driven by a teeny, little roller chain that will fail in time as well. . Garbage.
The oil cooler circuit goes from the oil pump directly out to the cooler, then back to the block before lubing the mains. You can see the oil cooler lines right next to the oil filter. The oil cooler lines have a tendency to suddenly pop leaks at the rubber section between the hard lines and the hard lines at the radiator. It's about 6-10 inches long of rubber for vibration damping betweeen the 2 sections.That vibration can cause the crimps to leak over time. If it was a sudden catastrophic leak it would run all the oil directly out the line and onto the ground, lubing nothing. If it was low rpm the mains would wipe before the rods, and fairly quickly. The centripetal force of the crank rotating would fling oil out to the rods to keep them lubed at lower rpm. Higher rpm oil starvation wipes rods first due to the same reason, flings it out faster and leaves metal to metal.
I've replaced a few of the oil cooler lines on 8.1s over the decades and even almost had the catrastrophic failure on my own 8.1 burb. My wife saw it start pouring out within 2 seconds of start and I shut it down. She was walking up from the front door. Luckily after being married to a pro mechanic for 24 years she knows to look for leaks and yell out "kill it!" immediately.
Of course it could also be the classic oil change, new filter, forget to fill it up and it died backing out of the shop/garage. You know, the standard lube shop stuff like not putting drain plugs back, putting twice the oil in, forgetting the oil entirely, putting the oil into the transmission, not tightening drain plugs, cold revs to the rev limiter, etc. I get quite a lot of engine replacements and repair jobs from lube shops.
I think you have the correct diagnosis.
Yep, that's why more need to do their own oil changes.
30+ years gm tech here and I concur with this hypothesis. Oil line pops, customer panics and sits on the side of the road with the engine low oil pressure light on, engine running and doesn't know what to do while starving the main bearings. I've seen that exact scenario before.
@demo2x if I see no leaks and my oil light is on I check my dip stick and then replace the $15 oil sending unit sensor before driving again.
I've worked on small blocks for a long time, but no big blocks, but this is exactly what I'd assume for main bearing failure. Happens on square s10s
Why I like your videos. No long ass intros. Right to Eric and what he is doing. No loud ass music than drowns out life. Only the sounds of a man working and swearing and joking.
right many videos put more time work into the intro than the content. On tv, people leave it playing and the intro catches the attention to return to the sofa lol. but its not needed on youtube.
When the crankshaft passages are full of oil and for some reason the engine loses pressure, the centrifugal force of the crank spinning pushes the oil out to the rod journals, so that the mains starve first. Notice the front main, farthest from the oil pump, was the worst bearing, and the rear bearing, the thrust bearing, was the best. Some one ran the engine out of oil and put a new filter with some oil in it (probably used oil by the look of the filter) and put some oil in the pan and tried to start it.
Interesting theory, but if the engine was run without oil for long enough to spin and destroy the main bearings that badly, it seems very odd that the rod bearings would show absolutely no signs of abnormal wear.
@@averyalexander2303 If they filled that filter during an oil change but forgot to refill the crankcase before starting, that would explain the whole thing.
@@randr10 That would explain the filter being wet and the main bearings being destroyed, but it wouldn't explain why the rod bearings still looked virtually new. From what I have noticed, the rod bearings generally seem to wear faster than the main bearings during normal use, especially the upper halves.
Improper oil change intervals is my first thought, leading to small amounts of metal to build up in main bearings blocking the oil journal halfway through the crankshaft. That lack of oil will lead to only half of the engine with proper lube due to the cam and lifter oil journals are separate from the crank on that engine. This lack of lube will cause overheating and failure of only main bearings over time as the metal is stuck in crankshaft journals and leads to a blockage of oil ports in the crank. Another possibility is a dry start up that ran to long after an oil change without oil in it but was caught before it left shop but in the process leaving small amounts of blockage debris but not enough for a full failure until months down the line due to low lubrication in crank over time adding small amounts of metal in the meantime. None the less inadequate lubrication is the culprit causing over heating and finally a full seizure of the crankshaft.
SB Chevy engines require 4 psi of oil pressure to allow the engine to fire. If this thing was not refilled at the time of the oil change, I am surprised that the ECM allowed the fire command. Sad.
I hate to say I'm sitting here waiting for this weeks video but I'm sitting here waiting for this weeks video.
You aren’t alone brother
The scatter pattern of metal shavings in the oil pan seemed to indicate that the pan was dry when the shavings were scattered around the pan.
I think this is right - something was whispering in my head at the end and this observant fan pointed it out. Good job!
This is a very good point. I agree fully
The bonus scene explains why Eric is always so chill
Best engine i have ever had.285000 miles .Towed 16000 lbs for over 7 years with only brakes tires and one crank sensor.I wish i had never sold it.😢
Well, that’s the nicest sounding Stock C5 I’ve ever heard
LT Tolman, built a turbo 8.1 from a junkyard motor and swapped it into a GMT800 1/2 ton 2WD. It put down over 1,000 ft lbs at the wheels and a 10.99 1/4 mile. He's building a new 572 out of an industrial block version of the 8.1. He's shooting for 1500hp on that one. I recommend his channel.
I'm also a huge LT fan. I believe though that his all wheel drive "ugly truck v2" (my words not his) is a 535... I could be wrong though.
@tenflat2009 That was the original plan for that engine, but now he's putting it into an different AWD project he started late last year.
Another vehicle that could be powered by this engine is a school bus! I worked as a school bus mechanic back in 2007 and we had a whole fleet of the 8.1L gas motors powering 70 passenger school buses.
I had to replace MANY oil pan gaskets and rear main seals. Oil pan gasket leaks were common, but they leaked in the back so we could not tell if it was the oil pan or rear main seal. So, since the transmission had to come off for us to check the rear main seal, we would go ahead and replace it. It would take me about 8 hours to do each one.
Great fun fact. Thanks for sharing.
Yeah - Pretty sure they put them in the Kodiak/Topkicks for a number of years and could see them in anything with that platform.
It lived in box trucks topkick/Kodiak longer then anywhere else, until 2009, then it was sold to be used as marine and power generation lol. They are 1000hp capable WITH 15000$ in parts lolol.
I bet better than that dron-y sounding ford v10 (tbh the only issue I can think of atm with those is exhaust manifolds cracked a lot)
I had a 2003 2500 Avalanche with one of these. Best truck I’ve ever owned. I’ll never forget pulling a 31’ travel trailer cross country, with a canoe on the truck (I made a special rack to fit the Avalanche), up over the Rockies, AC on, in 100-degree heat, WHILE accelerating uphill! It was amazing!
I've owned my '03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD (1-ton, single rear wheels) since new. I bought the 8.1 as it was offered as an alternative to the Duramax at that time. While the diesel did offer another 65 lb./ft of torque, the 8.1 offered 40 more horsepower. The Duramax was also $5000 more dear. Max tow rating on the truck was actually 300 lbs. less on the diesel because of its added weight. As was comically said at the time, it could pass everything except a gas station! All around unladen driving would net little more than 8 mpg, while cruising down the highway at 60 mph might get you 13-14 mpg on a good day. But what a workhorse! Ours has been used most of the time pulling our 5th wheel trailers, a duty it's never balked at. I do have a little leak from the rear main seal, but other than that it's just been routine maintenance. I understand that a significant percentage of these were used in marine applications.
Blue devil ………thats the brand of rear seal treatment you can add to the oil…it makes the oil swell up the rubber in the seals making them effective again, you can buy a bottle of it at auto zone, kragen, napa, car quest..etc etc, just about any parts house will have it and its cost around $30/$40 depending on where you purchase it…it cost so much more than the other brands cause it works….if not they will give you back your money 100%…..u just add the bottle to your oil and drive,usually after 100 miles you should see results, if the leak is really bad you might need 2 bottles, considering its an 8.1 big block i would probably plan on 2 bottles but then again i dont know how bad your leak is…….i used it on my LSA super charged LQ9 in the nova you see in my lil picture next to my name, i was skeptical at first but then again i didnt wanna pull the motor for such a stupid simple 5 minute job…so i poured a bottle in and not even a week later i noticed my leak was gone…….so now i try all of their products first whenever i find a leak somewhere…..they have a full line of products from diffs, trans, engine, radiators and some other few that i may have forgot…….just remember pay the good money for “BLUE DEVIL”……. Do not go cheap and use a different brand, it wont work!!!……..blue devil all the way…..no im not getting paid for saying this….they just make a great product and i wanna save you time and money!!!
And yes i have one of these motors in my eagle230 eliminator (boat) but the marine applications make more power and they are labeled as mercruiser mag 496 HO……..rated at 425hp
My experience, what looks like a rear main seal leak is actually just the oil pan gasket leaking.
Nice to finally see the inside of one of these monsters. I have an 02 silverado 2500hd that I just yesterday rolled over 298k in. Love this engine. Pulled a 7400 lb travel trailer all over the west with it and never once broke a sweat. Took her from salt lake to Sacramento in August, 110 degrees the whole time. Up over Donner pass. Temps never got over the midline of the gauges.
Had this engine in a 2500 suburban and absolutely loved it. I regret selling it every day.
bought an 03 2500 hd (6.0 lq4 with 4l80 trans) from my boss. (We used it for our tree service) This truck had 370k miles when i bought it. We would regularly tow a skid steer and sometimes a stump grinder at the same time on this truck on the freeway going 80+ mph. Straight up torture tests on the daily. My co-workers would also dog it anytime they had the chance lol. I don't think they changed the oil for a year. Got the truck, replaced coils and plugs, deleted the muffler and replaced stock cat with a cheap high flow cat and serviced the transmission just fluid, fillter and pan gasket. Changed the oil (puralator filter, used a mixture of 10/w30, lucus oil, and marvel mystery oil.( i called it motor milk 😂) Ended up selling it at 420k Miles after the manifold gasket slowly went. Had that truck been properly maintained from the start, it could've hit a million miles.
Love this engine. I have it in my 01 chevy 2500hd. Pulls like a beast. Makes max torque around 3200 rpms.
50 years as a mechanic and have seen this many times in the Chevrolet big block since the 70's. The oil pump is stock low volume and any mild damage causes it to not be able to supply the volume of oil the crank needs to survive. Chevrolet has a problem addressing small issues like this.
Yes, only 340 horsepower out of 8.1 Liters. While this isnt a lot it was rated 340 at 4k rpm and 450 at 3k. It was a big engine made for towing
That's why they lasted so long. They were pulling reasonable numbers. What we get today is the poster child of 'burning the candle at both ends'. You ask 300hp out of 3 liters you're going to have a fleetingly short engine lifespan. You ask 300hp out of 8 liters and it's going to last basically for-fucking-ever.
It's part of why I won't buy modern stuff. I like longevity and don't care about fast, so I'm quite happy to have 120hp out of 4.9 liters. I know I'll still be getting 120hp out of 4.9 liters 40 years from now.
@@TestECull Japan has been pumping out 300bhp 3 liters that are wayyy more reliable than any american junk
@@TestECull I hear ya. My daily driver is a 72 Lemans 2 door hardtop. It just turned 90,000 miles. With it's slight mods, it probably only puts out about 200 net HP, but it does it all day long. LOL
@@TestECull I have a 6.2L F150 - says 411hp 430TQ. Also supposed to run forever. Gas mileage sucks though, even driving like grandma most I get is 15.5 combined.
@@alb12345672 If you had a manual transmission you might be able to nudge up a bit higher. But eh, still asking a bit much out of that 6.2. And I'd have my doubts you're getting 411/430 out of it anyway. These things don't always make what the brochure says they make; my mom's '04 4.2l/auto F150 with 270k on the clock will kick the snot out of our 14 3.6l Challenger in any area of the speedo it's legal to go despite supposedly having >100hp less than the Challenger does and weighing about the same. It's not even a contest the F150 pulls like a freight train the Challenger barely lumbers along.
No way in hell that Pentashit is making the 320hp it's supposed to....I'd say 220.
I currently daily one of these in a 2500 Suburban. Nice to see a full tear down to get a better idea of what these things are like on the inside.
Same here. I have a 2001 with 160k. Drove it to Texas and Back to Wisconsin with NO problems. I love this truck
I have a 2001 2500 HD with 255k, still running strong. Pulls my 7K travel trailer just fine.
The only GMT-400’s that got the 8.1 are the “1.5 ton” 3500 HD straight frame / I beam front axle Cab and chassis trucks. They were basically a 4500/5500 just named differently and the reason they built them with 8.1’s and Allison’s for a couple years is they didn’t have the new C4500-5500’s ready for market yet. They were 2wd chassis cab trucks only and had things like 19.5 wheels and unique frames and front axles that required mounting the body a few inches higher than on regular 1500-3500 trucks, hence the weird filler panel they had at the front below the grille. The look a LOT like the Mark IV big block Chevy internally, but they did have some minor upgrades based on LS engine features like the better sealing valve covers with coils mounted on them for the coil near plug ignition setup, heads with a more efficient port design, intakes with vertical bolts, and the better flowing “header” type exhaust manifolds.
Strange things have happened in life cuz we're only human. I remember one time that my grandpa changed the oil in a little Volkswagen that my grandmother drove. There was just a dip in it edge of the driveway where he would back up and then he could crawl under the vehicle and change the oil without using a jack. To make a story short some reason my grandmother hopped into the car before my grandpa got his hands on the oil and got it back into the car and she blew up on the way to town
My 02 Yukon XL just hit over 200k this year. And it’s still purring like a kitten.
They're great
These engines were damn strong.
I was training a tow truck driver. 3500HD with a car on the hook. She started off in 3rd gear and it did not stall.
Hmmm I’m betting it was the last oil change, someone left out the oil, drove off or maybe just idled it ? Couple years back a dealership did exactly that to one of my cars. Engine rapped for a minute then they shut it down. Wouldn’t crank then, seized up tight. Dealer bought car back, just 8000 miles. Thanks for your great videos, you should be a shop teacher for the next gen mechanics? 😅
Still have mine 270 k miles and she’s still running strong.
Classic : drained the oil, forgot to put more back in.
Not with the 8100's, they burn oil as much as they burn gas.
Thankyou Eric for taking the time to enlighten us once again!. Well, that’s the nicest sounding Stock C5 I’ve ever heard.
These big blocks definitely last a long time if you take care of them
I have a 2001 2500 hd with the 8.1, 380k miles and still going strong!
Lt Tolman knows just about all there is to know about these. His made mad power.
Sold my 2001 2500HD 8.1 last Jan. 2023 with 299,000 miles on it, was still running perfectly fine
in 22 years only changed 1 crank sensor under warranty....2 serpentine idlers, normal oil changes....
My brother's 5.3 looked somewhat like that when he took it apart; turned out it cracked between the coolant jacket and the intake port, including the valve guide area. We replaced the heads and reinstalled every single internal piece aside from oil pump and chain after extensive cleaning, wd40, brake clean, and brillow pad work. It runs like a dream 2 years later and weekly use.
oh well i typed before the main bearing issue showed up, lol.
The older big block, 454, etc. Are known for the bottom ends to knock after excessive mileage. Due to end play of the crankshaft brush washer bearing failure they will still run but they will knock a couple times when you first fire them up. Been wrenching for 40 years
Good Sir, I pose a theory: Someone changed the oil, new filter. Someone did NOT refill the oil. There was enough old oil still kicking around to wet the new filter, and even get to the top of the engine...just barely.
But 8.1L of displacement was much less forgiving to the now very very limited supply of oil that the crank saw. I'd imagine theres more friction in the bottom end than the top, cuz...well...8point1leaderz. Big oof ensues. ~fin
Sounds reasonable 🤔
Murdered
That’s what I was thinking. Alternatively they drained the oil intending to just put fresh oil in It and not do a filter change….like maybe a rip-off oil change place that says they put a new filter on and didn’t and in this case didn’t put oil oil in either.
This is my theory as well
Oil change was my first thought too, though i was thinking oil filter not being sealed properly, they drive away, oil leaks away.... we know what happens next🤔💥
A local service center dependably maintained box trucks I drove for a warehouse in 1978. But the boss's 76 Coupe DeVille had a engine lockup and replacement after an oil change. Freudian slip maybe? The techs had a bunch of delivery trucks and one Cad in the service queue. Anyway, it's not always a flunky that slips up. I saw a guy putting fresh oil in his Mustang that poured straight out because he didn't replace, you know what. Stuff happens.
I'm gonna guess that it was ran with very low oil too, really lucky the block didn't get a new window or two installed. It does happen where the main bearings spin before the rods, but it's really not very often. All in all there's quite a few good parts from this one which is a nice bonus. I've always wanted an 8.1, my uncle had a Yukon XXL with one and he loved everything about it, except the fuel mileage.
Proud owner of an 06 Avvie 2500!! Its truly a rare beast!!
It's awesome to see you get excited about an engine like this. It reminds me of me when I get to work on something I don't normally work on.
3:20 My Haines manual states very explicitly that the fan and water pump are to be installed in the engine compartment, *not* into the interior of the car, even if it is faster that way. I hope you didn't charge the customer full flat rate for that non-traditional installation.
Where did u get a haynes manual for the 8.1?? I have 2 of them for an 02 GMC SIERRA 2500 HD and neither one shows anything about the 8.1 except for the engine code. I even asked the dealer where to get a manual and they dont know. They use all data !!
These came in the GMC Topkick and Chevy Kodiak too!!!
I worked on the factory that made the intakes for the first batch of these engines.. a complete nightmare. The castings varies in length by as much as 3/4 of an inch. So much shrinkage.. we had probably a 60% failure during machining
I @'d you in the title but thank you for doing what you do. Without you i wouldnt have had the confidence to rebuild my friends engine and eventually, a couple days ago, start it for the first time after he blew it up. After all, if someone who is "Taking bolts out til stuff falls off" cam do it. The so can I. Happiest day for me this year. Keep up the awesome work.
That "bad" spray can - pull the nozzle off, refill it with compressed air though a blow gun. Works great.
What are the chances someone did an oil change and forgot to put the oil back in?
That’s what I’m thinking too
I would wager it happened at a quick lube location.
This has my vote. Just enough oil in the galleys to wet the oil filter, but that about it. The mains were completely dry, so it didn't run long enough to trash the rod bearings.
Likely fired her up , started backing up and spotted the unopened oil jugs on the seat. 😬@@Markomyt1
And then they let it idle for a while.... till it stopped. That at least sounds plausible.
As an ins adjuster, thats what happens when you drive through a large puddle and suck up water, seeing the rusted intake areas, the water in the oil, and the burned center crank bearings due to lack of oil. Once that oil was mixed with water you have loads of issues, they probably drove it for a while after and thought it was fine, I wouldn't be surprised if there was a bent rod or 2 amongst those parts. Thanks for sharing!
You need some Mechanic classes . Oil changed and pre-filled filter then started with an empty oil pan …..
Almost going to bet that this was a Jiffy Lube special oil change screw up. Aka they changed the oil and forgot to put oil back into the engine. My aunt had them do that to her 2020 Honda Crv and they bought her a new engine.
Jiffy lube TECHNICIAN's that's what they are called. Change oil on your bubba truck and now their Technicians. With a capital T.
Something about being called a TECHNICIAN just rings your bell loud and your mum and pop proud. 😅😅😅
@@2nickles647 either way, PepBoys still has JiffyLube beat. PB's will either snap oil drain plug off ,strip your oil drain plug, or gorilla tighten oil filter on to 400 foot pounds torque
@@harveylong5878 😂 👍🤣
On the rod studs scratching the crank, a smart old time engine builder I new 45 years ago gave me a trick that I have used ever since, you can take a couple of old clean rod bearings and place them on the journals out 90 deg to protect the crank surface. Lots of guys use rubber hoses slipped on but I have seen threads of rubber and silicone in the threads of engines I have pulled down so I like the old bearing method. P.S. I need some 1990 Toyota 4Runner parts for interior and some 2000 tacoma under hood parts for my 3.4 swap that I have going, it's missing some evap goodies. Anyway, love your channel!!!! P.S.S. find an old Chrysler Slant Six to pull down, that would be a fun one, man we drove the crap out of those things back in the day. Guys did test running them without oil for days. Crazy. Reg
8.1 the original duramax killer. Love that engine
I stopped at the 37 minute mark because I've seen this twice before. Once 30 years ago on a 351C Australian Ford Fairlane and later on my neighbour's 3.2l GM/Isuzu quad cam V6. Both times the mains were toast, the rods were OK and the front main caps and the front of the crank were discoloured. Each time they simply ran out of oil. Like the BBC you show, both of these engines are notorious oil burners. They didn't lose oil pressure, they simply overheated what little oil was left in the sump.
If it was a high load situation or low oil pressure, then the rod bearings would have failed first. Each time the engines started to knock as the mains went away, and both times there was still some oil in the sump. Enough to lubricate the crank, but not enough to cool it. As a 62yo mechanic/trade teacher in Australia, I've seen a lot.
BTW, thanks for doing the 496. I have a TBI 454 1988 K3500 and was considering an 8100 swap, but having seen that the crank is only cast iron, not forged steel, I think I'll build my core with a lot of aftermarket parts.
I look forward to Saturday when I Do Cars comes out. Thanks Eric. 👧
It's also the day my Runescape clan's citadel resets! What a night!
Used to plow snow for a landscaping company that had a truck with an 8.1. Had over 600k for kms (400k miles). Truck didn’t have a plow, just salt slinger in the bed. Thing was a tank that could easily get rowdy in a parking lot at will.
I suspect somebody started it bone dry after an oil change and ran the mains - just my opinion. A shame, because apart from the cam lobe trouble just starting, the rest of it didn't look bad. Thanks for the teardown video. Glad that fan and pump were put to good use. Cheers!
I have 1 of those in my 01 Yukon XL 2500. A beast motor. Your engine can be resurrected. Gonna take some $$'s to make it right for sure. But I think still worth the time & cost. The block is in good shape. Crosshatching still looked okay from here. They literally will run forever. Mine runs great still. Although I've already done the usual's..... Fuel pumps....etc....At 234k, I can hear and need to put a pinion bearing in the 4.10's rear, growling lately !!! Be prepared for someone who's NEVER had a big BIG BLOCK, in a full size, heavy Yukon/Suburban/truck.... IT LOVES GAS !!! Cool vlog !!!
I am the original owner of a 95 Surbarban K2500 . I ordered it from the build sheet in summer of 94 and took delivery in Oct same year. I am glad that I opted for the 454. Which at that time had transformed to the MK iv series. I wish I could find a 502 from the later generation to swap in. I know that mine has throttle body injection, but that should fit the 502 valley? Great engine, gold I didn't order it with the 6.2 diesel or small block.
These 8.1L motors were great marine engines in the early-to-mid 2000s. 425hp and over 500lb-ft and definitely overbuilt for that power output.
My son has 2 of them in his boat, they run great, lots of power. 👍
I have one in my eagle 230 eliminator…..yeah its a blast!!!
@@Musclecar19722 is always better than 1……i can only imagine how much gas his boat uses (cost)…..im guessing its an offshore racer over 25’……….mine is a 23’ just at the brink of becoming a mini cigarette!!!
@@trentdawg2832 I don’t know what it would be classified as, it’s a nice boat, but yes he says it’s hard on fuel, I have never personally ridden in it, have only seen detailed pictures of it, we don’t live in the same state. He has owned a few boats, and is pretty well versed in them.
I bought a 8.1 , in pretty much the same condition, this year. I'm doing the exact some thing you are doing for the exact same reasons. I tow a lot, and my Avalanche isn't cutting pulling heavier loads. Good job lots of good tips. 8.1s tow great.
This looks like they may have started it with no to little oil during an oil change or a bad oil pump
The no oil oil change did it. Started & run with no load until someone noticed and it was just starting to slow down, then shut off. The crank holds enough in it to centrifugal feed the rods and with no real loading they don't need too much, cam was back feed from that big gallery above it that feeds the hydraulic lifters. The upper mains are grooved and lowers aren't, so that breaks up the oil film, the 'hydrodynamic wedge' that keeps the shaft & bearing separated when there's pressure. Also, could be the pics, but the main's drilling doesn't look to have a nice radius at all compared the the rod journal's oil hole/port, more of a scraping edge to it.. Yes it defies experience, but those were killed under a load not idling. Nice work.
I have this engine in my Yukon 2500 and love it. Just under 200k miles and it pulls a 26 foot enclosed race trailer down the highway at 75 in overdrive all day. Just burns a little oil.
Worth noting, factory spark plug gap spec was .080. Crazy big.
Yes. Thank you, I was gonna say this.... When you're looking at .032 Miata plugs all day, .080 looks pretty big.... Not that those plugs weren't smoked... They were... but they weren't WILDLY off from the .080....
Yeah over 100k mi and they start to burn oil regularly….by boss had to keep 2qt’s of oil behind the seat for weekly oil top offs!!!!
Switch to Amsoil 10w 30 signature series
The oil pump and he might have had a filter that he didn't fill up he only put a little bit in it and it never started to recirculate
Ah his favorite, an 8.1 inch BBC. On a real note keep up the awesome work man I went to trade school and still constantly learn from you.
trade skool mechanics,, learn to change oil..here in aus.. our trade system is a rort, employers get money teach you nothing.. plumbers same, you learn more working than bs trade.. employers cen hire people for 3 months, get a grant, then hire another for 3 months, another grant.. sacked after 3 months so some other suckers gets paid for 3 months then sacked,,.to start a bussiness here, you need to grow drugs for 4 yrs, to get enough capitol to survive the 5 yrs before the gov leaves you alone.. my first yr as a contractor, i paid double tax. ??.. you never get it back.. say 50k 1st yr. double tax at 30% is 60%.... no fkn insentive to work,, eh.. boilermaker.21 yrs, construction 22 yrs.. now on dole.. body died.. 4 u.s. trucks, 4x4, 1 challenger 340 r/t.
@mattedward6155 I'm shocked. I thought you knew everything after trade school.
Almost looks like someone changed the oil but never refilled it with new oil and ran it dry. That's the only way I can see that it had dirty oil in the filter from what was left in the crevices of the engine but wasn't overly saturated in oil with no chunks of material in the filter like you mentioned or in the pickup screen. Looks like all the bearing material just fell down into a empty pan since there was no oil to carry it into the pump or pickup tube. Like someone forgot the most important step in a oil change. To refill it will oil lol
Great video, going to be doing my own tear down this week on a 7.5 hp refrigeration compressor that had no oil pressure.
Avalanche 2500 owner here with the 8.1. Love this thing. Only around 10k of them made.
As a past(2004) 8100 owner. These things normally consume oil. GM included this in the owner's manual. They also came out with TSBs on this issue. They were built "loose" for longevity. They would normally use 2qts between easy driving. I'm sure it was ran low at highway speed.
A lot of windage with high displacement, a lot of vaporization and pcv work for sure.
I agree, dry start, forgot the new oil after the oil change, and it probably 250,000 mile plus also by the looks of the pistons.
Loved the "park a Miata in that gap" crack.
Just out of curiosity, how much does that all iron lump weigh? I'm guessing somewhere north of 700 pounds? Woof!
Around 750 lbs from what I've read
Crazy that its 6 liter LS counter part literally wieghs half that😂😂😂
Came to complement you on your musical prowess… Mary Had a Little Lamb on the windage tray was special!
I can honestly say that's the first time I've wanted to spend 40 mins looking at a BBC...
As usual, thanks for the video Eric - the highlight of my week. And I'm sure that water pump will improve the scrap value of that car you installed it in.
Sad about that white Miata with the blue stripe, that's a good look.
Come one. We all know you love the BBC. That's what Bubba told us.
Oh don’t play coy, you know you’re all about the BBCs. No shame in it.
We all have a soft spot those lovely BbCs.
I really enjoy your videos. I was doing a lot of the same things I've watched you do, just 50 years ago. To my point when you have a rust stuck engine spray it with either muriatic or hydrochloric acid in a well ventilated area. Wait time will very due to rust severity, but it will break it loose. Flush with water to neutralize the acid. never had one I couldn't beat. I hope you'll give it a try.
My guess is that someone drained the oil and then left for the day. Next morning someone moved the vehicle because they didn’t know the oil was drained. All the damage was done at idle, which is why the rod bearings didn’t show the same damage.
I have a 2003 2500 with a 8.1, it has a diesel tank and an air compressor in the back and I have a few tractors and a dozer so it's my service truck.
I Purchased it in about 2010 with 155k on it and I went out and looked at the odometer right now it has 318,000 miles.
It's been the most reliable piece of equipment I've ever owned, I literally would jump in it and go to Alaska right now. Well I just got a 410 rear end it so maybe I won't drive it to Alaska🤣.
The only thing I ever replaced which possibly could've happened to this truck the old cooler line busted and it dumped that all out of that truck probably in 10 seconds ,
And someone probably did not get that truck shut down until it started knocking.
Then they got it where it was going and decided to change the hole and it still rattled that's why your filter would be clean.
The 8.1 was a great choice for people who wanted to tow their travel trailers but didn’t want the hassle and expense of owning a modern emissions diesel engine. I’m not sure what power numbers are acceptable to some people. The 8.1 would drag a 30 ft. trailer down the road like it was nothing but because it’s numbers on paper don’t show diesel torque numbers it’s underpowered according to a few geniuses. The horsepower competition amongst modern diesel engines coupled with their emissions systems has destroyed diesel engine reliability. The 8.1 is the exact opposite to modern diesel engines. Low technology, simplistic design, and not highly stressed. It worked well for what it was designed to do.
I appreciate the effort put into your content 👍
You’re talking about “geniuses” but diesels didn’t have emmisions equipment other than cats until 2007 and a half. So how could the 8.1 be an alternative to unreliable emmisions laden diesels.
@@bigounce4108 By the time modern diesels were at war for who had the most torque in a light duty truck the simplicity of design was already compromised and reliability was suffering. Just EGR alone created a world of problems with the Big Three and it only got worse from there.
At 4:48
Large gap in plugs....
Those are rather large gaps, you did not mention if they were worn wider or gapped that way on purpose.
It would be nice if you would measure the the gap and then tell us what the book says the gap should be....
If you still have access to the plugs, could you put that in a pinned comment?? Thank you in advance....
Would it be possible to buy a bad piston? Im a car guy and want one as a paper weight.
When I was a smoker, they made great ashtrays in the shop.
Ebay is an option. I like Corvette titanium connecting rods.
Absolutely! I have plenty to choose from. Email us, email is importapartsales@gmail.com
I have 1997 honda prelude engine i want to donate to you
I agree, 100%. Could even sign them and make them like a fan shop thing.
Ugh. Had one of these in my first shop’s short wheelbase C4500 wheel lift tow truck. 6.3 mpg average with a 16.8 gallon tank. Absolutely brilliant.
I had an Avalanche 2500 with this engine. It was an awesome engine and would outrun almost everything. It was a great tow engine.
These engines are interesting, I own a few of them, used to hate them, have come to love them.
I install kohler standby generators, and some of the larger units like the 250kw come with PSI (Power Solutions International) forged internal 8.8 with a turbo, based on the gm 8.1 architecture. Big power, extremely reliable, and the block isn't that hard to swap into a truck.
On the note of boost, several people have been boosting these engines with very impressive results. I am currently building a gmt800 dually and intend to turbo my 8.1 and see how she does. The biggest downside to the platform to me is the cylinder heads. Heavy, horrible ports, almost no options unless you pay the money for Raylar parts. Luckily turbos tend to help in the airflow department.
Something else interesting, gas mileage. It's terrible, always. But I have on several occasions gotten better mileage towing a large load than I have driving an empty truck. The engine craves load. I have a regular cab work truck 2500 with an 8.1, so about as light of a vehicle as you could get an 8.1 in, and it feels wrong. It's so much torque and without the weight the engine feels like weak, or maybe it's just that it becomes obvious that going fast isn't what it is intended for. Strap 18k lbs behind it and the power's pretty impressive, it just loves load.
I'm working on a turbo'd psi 8.8 combo backed with allison 6 speed in my 04 2500 suburban 🙂
I worked at a Chevy dealership in the early 2000’s, and they were selling an Avalanche with the 8100 with a Borla exhaust on it. It sounded sweeeeeet. I also got to drive it. For a vehicle of that size, I was very impressed with the power. 😉
Yeah the 2500 avalanches did have those in them as well, talk about a unique vehicle
Love your videos, discovered the channel a few months ago and haven't stopped watching since!
I would like to see a teardown of a Kia/Hyundai 2.4L Theta II MFI engine. My dad has a 2011 Kia Sorento with this engine and it abruptly seized on the highway with no warning at only 80k miles. After getting it towed, dealer said the engine was locked up and there were metal shavings in the oil, so he got a brand new engine because of an extended warranty (which normally would have costed $7,000+)! There's widespread failures for this engine and the 2.0L variant from 2011-2014 due to a manufacturing process issue. Debris left in the engine during manufacturing would cause premature wear and oil starvation, and the rod bearings usually would be the first to go.
That metal shaving story is a cover-up for a shity engine design in Hyundai is embarrassed I don't know who designed those Engineers but they are lacking support in all the heavy stress areas. For example the intake manifold looks like it should have one bolt on each side of each port and it almost does except for one port on the end there's not even a hole drilled and lo and behold that's where it leaks. The Dual Mass flywheels on the manual transmission seems to be held on with a chintzy input shaft pilot bearing it just feels like it's going to break if you look at a cross-eyed. Don't get me wrong they make good cars excellent cars but some of the places they cut corners just makes no sense
That ending with the stock Corvette was epic.
Nothing like the sound of an LS. 😂🎉😂
Other than the ford Godzilla 7.3 ready to eat everyone's lunch 😊
Straight piped this is a beast.. I have this 8.1 in 2002 avalanche.. it's a project for sure but they do run strong
Some possible things that would cause the mains to fail without damaging rod bearings. Bending of the crankshaft. From lugging or high rpm. Another reason might be block warping. From fast heat or large heat cycles. Either could be checked by a machine shop. Oil starvation looks likely but rod bearings look really good.
This’ll happen with a pre-filled oil filter and a dry sump ….
Thanks for playing the (Stock) C5. surely somebody stole the cats off it? Does sound and puff out the ends of the pipes. Maybe anything that even looks like a muffler was deleted. Sounds like it might be even louder than that, like raised compression, 4 valve heads? My motorcycle engines (four valve) have that tached out sound, it makes. Be hard to get along with on a long trip. I watch as many of your shows as I can. Been wrenching 53 years but don't tear engines down as much as doing detail work and total replacements. Most customers want bullet warrantee coverage, not a patched had failed some way motor. I've had customers replace fairly low mileage (with then a failure with new motors just so they can trust it to run a long time, always new radiator and any oil coolant stuff if it has it. same with hoses and even heater cores). I guess it depends on what happened to them on other failures when they run a mixed fleet of different brands. Looks like a crank kit would make that motor good as new. I've done 318 Dodge V8 and 225 Dodge slant Six, both with mains out only and they were oil change shop, didn't refill and send, lock up just down the street from the shop that did it. traced back tot he guy that runs the shop, all done but the oil, called away to answer phone then that lead to something else someone else releases the truck just to have it fail. Both only had a gauge and no red light. driver didn't know till it stated to slow down, by then it was too late. Hot oil change even the lifters can be quiet. No notice at all they were out of oil till the last few seconds. I didn't even see any glitter in the oil, but couldn't get those motors to turn enough to even remove the torque converter bolts had to drag the converter out of the trans and then get into that when it leaked with the repaired motor. Whisper down the lane failures. One problem causes a new but related to the need to be worked on. I like your comments as you go along, like "lets see if there is any malfunction in the combustion palace" Oil filter may have looked that way as it wasn't changed, as in just the oil, or sabotaged, just drain the oil, or crash and still running the the oil lines on the oil cooler system failed in the crash. Just sit and idled till it locked. They do that kind of engine changing work just didn't even want to see it while the engine gets worked on or changed.
Thanks for showing us pictures of the vehicles that the engine are used in.
Us internationals are not always familiar with US cars
👍😎
It looks like one of the mains spun and through the crank oil galley took debris to the rest of the mains and ruined them also. The centrifugal force will throw oil out to the rod journals. It was likely at idle and didn't take long to lock up. I'm surprised those pistons don't have a deeper skirt. That engine has a fairly long crank stroke, yet short rods, which means high piston side loading on the power stroke. A deeper piston skirt would distribute some of the side loading.
A high volume oil pump sometimes on a big block can stop something like that from happening. As the engine builds miles on it the mains loosen up a little, and need the extra pumping volume of a H.V. oil pump, mainly at startup. The 8100 Vortec is an oil burner too, and if you don't stay on top of keeping the oil level up.... I've seen 400,000 on fleet maintained 8100's . We had wreckers with 8100 Vortec motors. This was in the Northeast. In the winter sometimes those engines were running for over three days steadily. We always used either straight 40 weight oil or straight 30 weight in really cold weather. In the morning let them warm up for at least 5 minutes before you start hammering on it too.
I think that truck went for an oil change and someone forgot to put oil in. See if the oil filter is dry.
Did you not watch the vid....?
Dude, i been watching you since the beginning of this year had no idea you were local I live in Florrisant.
hahaha the way you edited the part where you're pulling out the cam. i didn't know gm made an 8.1 v12
block and heads look the part of being a good rebuild candidate, really good cleanout, then fresh internals..
I had to take a double take when i heard the horsepower and torque numbers. There so low for such a big engine, but that's just how it was back than.
Its purposeful in its designed power though. These engines may not make absurd power, but they can take absurd abuse for very long periods of time, and handle being overloaded very well. I'd be willing to bet this one ran a very long time without oil in it lol
Its not low tho. Everyone hears the peaks and forgets about rpm where that peak is.
Literally all I can think of is that this engine was started dry but still had oil in the passages. Maybe it caught a jiffylube special and didn't get refilled after being drained. I just don't see any other way.
Another great Saturday night video Eric. Thanks man, and keep up the good work. Oh, and P.S. I totally believe you...that corvette at the end is absolutely stock! :)
Just subscribed and a first time viewer. Like the way you do things.
Looks to me like they ran it out of oil and it locked up. As far as the crank goes you can turn it and it’ll be good as new. Rebuilt many big blocks, my favorite engine.