I enjoyed that a lot. 'Used to use a 'hobo-system' with a copper loop in a BBQ for hot showers while tree-planting... From that I learned that one of the risks of boiling the water(besides steam explosions(!)) is that you MIGHT be able to burn through the copper pipe if the water is flashing off too quickly to cool the coil. Very fun, though. Makes me want to tinker!
Oh, that is neat. I have had people ask me about heating water for a shower or bath. I consider myself pretty fortunate that I've never had to do that. I did choose stainless steel in my burner because it is really durable, and I knew it would get lots of abuse. I would have had coil failures for sure, if I was using aluminum or copper. Get out and tinker, my friend. If's good for your mind.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I missed that your coil was stainless--that ALSO makes me feel happier about watching you pound that cord-wood down into it with the back of your axe! :) ...Tinkering continues this week when my first diesel heater arrives. First mod: Heat-exchanger on the exhaust (T'd 3/4 copper for larger cross-sectional area to prevent back-pressure, then 4-feet of gentle slope to drain condensate... joints will be brazed) Keep having fun! (what's your plan to prevent the water from freezing? Are you planning to run glycol in the system, eventually?)
@@time7813 LOL... Oh, yes... it is stainless. I just recieved my new heat exchanger for my house, so the old one will be used to do some testing on the exhaust of a diesel heater. I'm excited to try it. I'm curious about how much condensate there will be, if it will soot up and if the heater will struggle and make more CO. The plan is to eventually switch to propylene glycol. Currently I just keep it circulating.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I imagine there MIGHT be issues if the Vevor heat exchanger is soldered with low-temperature solder (likely)--as opposed to BRAZED with something that has a higher melting-point... ALSO, I have SOME concern about corrosive condensate in copper lines... I'm going to TRY to keep the condensation at the OUTLET-END of my own homemade diesel-heater heat-exchanger, where I'm intending to switch BACK to two flexible, 1-inch stainless pipes (entire system sloped downward for drainage)... I SUSPECT those water-to-air heat-exchangers SHOULD be able to handle the diesel-heater exhaust without too much back-pressure; there's a crazy amount of cross-sectional area in the body, and it never drops below that of the 1-inch input... it'll be curious to see whether TURBULENCE in the unit plays any role(?)... My biggest concern would be the corrosive condensate in the copper lines, which COULD eat them, over time... maybe not in weeks, but possibly in months?
@@time7813 I get what you are saying about the soldering, but I'm not terribly concerned about this. If there wasn't any air movement, I can see it potentially getting hot enough to melt silver solder. It is rated to 180C at 360 PSI. I feel like the copper will be able to dissipate the heat quickly enough that this won't be an issue. The initial joints will either be 60/40 solder or just slip fit, and we'll see how it goes from there. For the condensate acidity, I plan to monitor it with PH strips, and if required, have a rinse cycle either after the heater shuts off or after every so many minutes of use. Obviously this robs some energy, but it should work. I don't plan on running this long term, but I would like to at least test the PH level so others know what they are getting into.
Joel, whether your heater is wood or oil burning you are losing too many BTU’s out through the top. Your coils should be longer and higher to absorb the heat. When you have flames coming from the top you are losing many, many, BTU’s. Also, have you considered increasing your fire insurance on your house? Your tinkering ability reminds me of myself, always searching for a better way of doing things. Thanks again for an entertaining video! Peace out, from California.
Hey Dave. Have you been following the project? I'm sure I've seen you around in the comments. The top normally isn't open. The hole in the top was originally for a chimney system that didn't work. When I am running on oil, the heater is warmed up with the top open, and then it is completely sealed up, so that all of the heat exits out through the slits in the side. Haha. I'm not concerned about burning my house, although I did sit outside with the heater for this entire test, and moved the heater away from my house, because I knew there would be lots of sparks and flames. In one of my last videos, I mentioned that one of the upgrades I would be doing is putting the entire unit into a 55 Gallon drum, with only a small slot for inspection and hose entrance etc. This will not only make it much safer, it will also keep a lot more heat in the system and make it more efficient. Take care.
I am enthralled with your videos and watch every episode. Your channel is one of my favorites. I do realize that you take precautions, but do be careful please. You are one of the very few video creators who answers your followers comments. That ranks pretty high in my book. Thanks again and please keep making videos for our interests.
It's interesting. The flame being right up against the coils seems to make it work pretty well, but it needs to be tended to regularly. I want to do an BTU test with oil and see what the results are. I'm going to try some other "fuels" in there as well.
Yeah. I have thought of the EGR cooler scavenging system. The reason why I chose not to take this route, is because you are introducing water, pumps and a heat exchanger into the picture, all for a maximum recovery of abou 800 watts. If you already had a hydronic system to dump the heat into, this could make sense, but I'm not sure it makes sense if you already have the heater as forced air, to then also use hydronic. You could set it up so that the EGR just dumped heat into a large water storage tank, and depend on a passive heat transfer, without any fans, but you still need a water pump. The air to air system that I plan on using only requires a heat exchanger and a fan.
@loweredexpectations4927 In my case blow hot air in the cabine and add free pre heat to engine block. My previous car had a liquid diesel heater and used the car heater and fan to heat the cab. If I would heat a house an air to air cooler would make more sense yes! But I have yet to see people use intercoolers from cars.
Winding the copper pipe in a conical shape (as in "wrapped around a cone") would also capture more of the heat that's traveling up, and possibly eliminate the need for a lid on top of the burner.
I have considered adding a secondary coil in a cone shape, or something like that... However, the current pipe is stainless steel and was prebent. The stainless is a lot less efficient, but also durable enough that I am not afraid of stacking firewood up against it.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Argh. You got me. I did see your videos, but forgot about the stainless part already... For about 2 1/2 videos I was certain it's copper :-D
Salut mec! I love yours expériences, You are incredible😀For your next experiment, I suggest you burn tractor tires But be careful not to burn down your house🤪 Continue, depuis la France 🙂
You are 100% correct. Even when burning the oil, it pulls in cold air from outside. I plan on enclosing the entire unit in a 55 gallon steel drum. Partly to make it safe, and partly to keep some heat in.
Yeah... I expect it to work well, but I am concerned about a few things. We will see how it goes. It is going to condensate, for sure, so I need to make sure it is able to drain well.
Oh... I did show a cat in this video. I thought it was a cat free video and was upset, haha. Yeah, the cat was / is fine. She knocked my meat thermometer on the floor a while back and almost busted it. She is a real troublemaker, haha. I agree, though. I would be quite upset if the cat was harmed in any way.
A lot of lost heat. To use wood, a different type of stove is needed, in my opinion it would work very well with a 200-220 L tin barrel, and the exhaust, the chimney, should be mounted 15 cm below the side top of the barrel (the heat should circulate up and down before exiting the chimney)
Yeah, this is not at all efficient. I did this experient out of curiosity. The heater is intended to burn oil, and I am in the process of making it better at burning oil, and using the energy more efficiently. It is nice to know I could burn a little wood and stop from freezing, if I needed to, but the design of this burner / heater is not at all suited for wood. In the near future I plan on increasing the whole unit inside of a 200L steel barrel, with a small opening for inspection, to let air in etc. This will be a safety shield, but also keep much more of the heat in the system.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Good idea! but you could also cover it with chamotte brick, inside the barrel to keep the heat longer, this way you will also save oil, burn less oil, everyone will be jealous of you, hahahaha. 👌
@@uncioclasprinlume Haha... I do want everyone to be jealous of my bricks !! If it all works out, I may insulate the inside or outside of the barrel depending how much clearance there is inside. The way it has been operating, the outside of the heater throws away a LOT of heat, and when it's windy, it's really bad. Anything at all would help, but of course, a little insulation would step up the performance, for sure.
The best way to heat with wood....is to bury it in the ground for a few million years until it turns into oil :) The BTU/Kg content of heating oil is (AFAIR) nearly twice that of wood, regardless of species. Also, I was in the surplus section of my local Princess Auto the other day, and they had some ungodly large stainless steel bowls. I was tempted, but didn't have an immediate use :)
HAHA... I agree. I lived in a house that was heated by wood till I was 17, and then we switched to oil. I won't say that burning wood doesn't make sense for anyone, but oil is far superior. HAHA... I should have headed to princess auto. I ended up spending probably two days looking for just the right one, on amazon. Princess Auto is one of those stores where I end up buying something.... and then starting a project so I can use the thing I bought.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I have had a number of interests over the years, Princess has always been a fruitful source for me. Whether I was sourcing parts for my rocketry hobby. My pyrotechnics fascination. My radio astronomy interests, and even when I made a still during COVID for hand sanitizer. Princess always had *something* :) I'm fortunate in a way these days. I don't have much in the way of disposable income, so I can't waltz into Princess and say "I'll take two of everything, please!". :)
Love the experiments and data you are able to collect. Definitely want to try my hand at some sort of project next year. Question for you though if you know. If you had both barrels to temp... how long could you keep you inside getting heat put into it without another fire?
Thanks for the comment. It depends a lot on the temperature outside, as that will determine how much heat is lost from my house. That being said I can give you some rough numbers. On a day around freezing, I could probably get about 12 hours. If it were down around -15C, then I would likely get more like 4 hours of effective heat. That's with 400L of water around 80C and pulling heat out if it until the barrels are 30C. The amount of energy transfer out of this calculation is about 20,000 BTU/h or 6 KW/h. It should be noted that my current system has considerable flaws that need to be addressed before I could do this. Currently I would lose too much heat back outside, and need to attach a bypass loop, so that I'm not dumping heat out when the pump is running, and the fire is out.
@loweredexpectations4927 i think your doing a great job myself. Even if you factor your flaws, they show more thoughtfulness than most to keep moving forward. Using water as a heat battery in itself would keep a room warm for quite some time let alone heating a house. Then also if you even break it down and could set it to do a burn every other day or so (yeah right) you could really offset a heating bill
@@VirtualCryptid For sure. When I started this project a few months ago, I wasn't even sure if the burner would even work well enough to bother pursuing. It has since impressed me enough that I have decided to try to improve on this system, and build a new system to heat my house full time for next winter.
Yeah. I kinda did that, off camera, quite a while ago, and it does work fairly well. If you were doing this for emergency heat, then that would be the way to go, but for collecting data it wouldn't be ideal. I have some interesting "what if" fuels planned for some upcoming videos. Whenever I think something is very interesting and am excited to see the result, those videos usually don't do well, lol. Sometimes you gotta just do things out of curiosity.
Another fun possibility: Since you've got the whole water-to-air heat exchanger set up already, you MIGHT be able to use it to help COOL your house with the same system (especially if you put the exchanger in the forced air plenum)--I currently do this, using the ALREADY COLD (9C) municipal water run slowly through MISTERS onto the exterior brickwork of my 50's bungalow's south side--where I need the moisture for an herb garden anyway... Not QUITE as cold as air conditioning, but makes a SURPRISING difference in our scalding prairie summers(!)
I have thought of something like this. It's interesting what folks will come up with when you really need a solution. While this could work, misting water onto one of these exchanges would quickly decrease the efficiency of it, as water scale collected on it (especially where I live. A water to water (plate) exchanger is very efficient, so that would be a better solution for dumping the heat. Then you just have the issue of the cost of water and sewage. Where I live you are charged for sewage based on the amount of water used. If you had a few very large in ground water storage tanks, you could dump water into them, and recycle it until the temperature was too high to be effective. Then feed the pre warned water into your domestic water heater. That being said, a different style heat exchanger, that was more robust, could be misted with rain water and, like you said, not be as cold as AC, but effective.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I'm not misting onto the exchanger--merely passing air through it with my furnace fan... I agree that it would scale-up and become less effective in no time, if you misted onto it directly... To be clear, I have my water-to-air heat exchanger in the house's forced air plenum, connected in-line to the municipal water supply, and 'exhausted' outside the house via a dedicated garden-hose spigot. I mist a small amount of water into an herb garden, and onto the exterior brickwork on hot days, when the plants need water... The water-usage is trivial--but with the residence-time of the cold municipal water so long in the exchanger, I can often dump a LOT of heat from my house into it before it leaves to water the garden (plants prefer warm water anyway). Then I get a SECOND perk because the south-facing brickwork of the house acts like a large swamp-cooler: the misters dampen the brick, and a lot of heat is carried away from the house when it evaporates (conducted from inside, because the house is not especially well insulated). I'm in a rural area, and have the option of also running a loop in the bottom of my pond, but for now, this is just another way to scavenge a resource that is easily available...I don't need a pump, because I'm not paying for the water PRESSURE the municipality provides... and the heat-exchanger is super-versatile, as you've demonstrated in your videos!
@@time7813 OOOhhh. I think they call that a swamp cooler ? when the moisture is in the air. Oh... I see what you are saying with the water in your exchanger. That is much more efficient than what I had assumed. We had massive water use restrictions last summer due to a water line failure, and people were getting fined for using too much water. At one point some businesses were shut down and others were pulling water from the river. Hopefully they actually fixed it, this time.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Yes, I've got friends and family in Calgary (Manitoban, here), so am well aware of your recent water-issues(!)... The setup I've described seems WAY more efficient than it OUGHT to be (having done some napkin-math)--and best as I can figure, I'm GAINING efficiency because the phase-change energy as water condenses onto my heat-exchanger is ALSO being shuttled outside as I mist my herbs and house exterior (ie-->the secondary "swamp cooler"). It's pretty dramatic, actually, and typically costs me appx $300CAD for a FULL SUMMER of pretty decent cooling, even in our PUNISHINGLY hot prairie summers. (that's all the water cost, since I'm not paying for the PRESSURE which runs the system, which the municipality provides to me for free, so I don't require a pump!) I'd love your take on my diesel-heater exhaust heat-exchanger plan before I build it... Specifically, I'm curious to know whether any of your experimentation gives you any intuitions about: 1) The effect of corrosive condensate on the radiator (I'm PLANNING to condense exhaust H2O before it leaves my house for that bit of extra exothermic phase-change energy) 2) Whether you feel my diesel-heater exhaust heat exchanger will create carbon build-up in the burn chamber. (effectively two 3/4 inch copper pipes, 'finned' and run in parallel for 4ish feet through a 3-inch duct with a fan blowing through it, then run outside through two standard 1 inch stainless exhaust-lengths) ...I've been intrigued about ways to capture that diesel-heater exhaust energy, but wanted something a bit more COMPACT and efficient than your 5m daisy-chained stainless steel experiment... (Did you ever try COILING those for any length of time? Did YOUR system soot up at all when running with that extreme length?) 'Loving your content. Your playful experimentation, iteration, and scientific, data-gathering impulse is EXACTLY how we learn stuff(!) Part of me wonders whether your experiments will ultimately lead you towards something that looks a LOT like an automated Rocket Mass Heater...(but perhaps one optimized to burn waste oil?)...
@@time7813 For the condensate issue, the smart thing to do would be to actually test the condensate with PH strips. You want to make sure that it is able to drain well, as the condensate is much more harmful if it is able to dry out and concentrate. (by pooling in the system). If you find that the PH is too low, I think it would be smart to have a water valve on it that dumped a cup through after the heater had been running. You'd lose some energy this way your exchanger would be flushed. As long as everything else is working well, I don't see your system causing a soot issue. I ran over 20 feet of the stainless stuff and it didn't seem like much CO. The best way to monitor the system is by using a CO meter where the exhaust comes out. It should be 14ppm or les, ideally, but you probably won't have issues unless you are over 20. I did a test with the stainless in some water, but it was sort of a failure. I can't remember all of the details, but leaking water kinda through my results off. A cold exhaust does have an effect on how much CO is produced, and I think this has to do with the cold air being more dense, and therefore, harder to move. I didn't run it long enough for it to soot up. Haha... Yeah... For a few years now, I have wanted to experiment with building a pulsejet engine, burning waste oil, and have the outside of the unit jacketed to capture the heat. Problem being that they are insanely noisey. I don't think it would be the most efficient thing, but I think it would be fairly clean burning and self cleaning due to the energetic burning of the fuel. I need to love away from everyone before I start making things like that, haha.
I think what is needed next is a sand battery, figure out how to incorporate that in the system as you wouldn't need to run it 24/7 and if you use oil in the line you get get it much hotter.
There is a german Channel about chinese heaters too and he kinda "inspired" his thumbnails like yours. you have alot of range for 9k subs. Hope you are doing well😊
Joel, can you help me out with my diesel heater? I would like to install a regular thermostat so that it kicks on or off as needed. Thanks, from your loyal viewer in California.
I responded to another comment with the answer. You can get Vevor heaters that do this (both of their Bluetooth heaters) or a Bureck CD Thermostat. th-cam.com/video/bG2X5_pxjFE/w-d-xo.html
Grrrr. People keep telling me I should move my burner. I have the burner placed where it is because my neighbours furnace room is on the other side of the fence and I have a nice enclosed space. A few shots in this video I put the lid on the burner and it started making a lot of smoke ... I wanted to leave it go like this in hopes that it would come around and be more efficient, but I didn't want to make too much smoke, so I opted for flames shooting out the top. I also get along with my neighbours really well. On one side I have fixed his lawnmower, trimmer, snowblower, trimmer, boat fibreglass etc, and on the other side, I shovel for them, removed their tree, just helped install a garage door spring. They like having me around, haha.
@@loweredexpectations4927its good to have nice neighbors. Unfortunately the old couple on the one side of us like to be in everyone's business. I'm surprised they haven't called bylaw on my diesel heater exhaust yet. I couldn't get away with your crazy experiments or I'd have the police helicopter called on me😅
Hopefully that doesn't degrade the copper in your heat still...And hopefully no man or cat gets horribly burned by boiling water or steam explosions. But, very interesting..Those oil burners could be worth the trouble..Especially in a frigid climate..
I have thought of that, and that's the reason why I chose stainless steel, instead of copper. 👍 I knew that if I used copper I would destroy it, haha. I would feel terrible if anything happened to any of the pets... I am adding a lot of safeties and this was a test to see if it could be done. I am adding a lot of safeties to the system including enclosing the whole system in a steel barrel. Thanks for your support.
Hey there. I built this (as a waste oil burner) a few months ago, and just recently started using it to heat my house. I have been making modifications to it to make it more efficient and have used it to heat my house successfully for about two weeks. It is now not in use as I am doing some upgrades. This wood test was more or less for entertainment, but I was able to heat my house for part of the day and overnight.
It appears that way. Funny story. Where I went to elementary school was right next to a hospital, and they had an incinerator along side our playground. When we were out playing, it would sometimes snow down ashes on us, haha.
I have see this video. Not sure why you are sharing it with me though? Gerry is obviously a smart fellow, which makes me wonder if he really thinks this setup is clean or a good idea. It sure will make heat, but it's also not at all clean burning. There are methods for testing a clean burn, and he doesn't use any of them. Looking at the stack and saying "see how clean it is" is not only not a method of testing, but also sort of irresponsible when you have a huge audience. He also suggests mixing oil with sawdust, and burning it in a wood stove.
I enjoyed that a lot. 'Used to use a 'hobo-system' with a copper loop in a BBQ for hot showers while tree-planting... From that I learned that one of the risks of boiling the water(besides steam explosions(!)) is that you MIGHT be able to burn through the copper pipe if the water is flashing off too quickly to cool the coil. Very fun, though. Makes me want to tinker!
Oh, that is neat. I have had people ask me about heating water for a shower or bath. I consider myself pretty fortunate that I've never had to do that.
I did choose stainless steel in my burner because it is really durable, and I knew it would get lots of abuse. I would have had coil failures for sure, if I was using aluminum or copper.
Get out and tinker, my friend. If's good for your mind.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I missed that your coil was stainless--that ALSO makes me feel happier about watching you pound that cord-wood down into it with the back of your axe! :)
...Tinkering continues this week when my first diesel heater arrives. First mod: Heat-exchanger on the exhaust (T'd 3/4 copper for larger cross-sectional area to prevent back-pressure, then 4-feet of gentle slope to drain condensate... joints will be brazed)
Keep having fun! (what's your plan to prevent the water from freezing? Are you planning to run glycol in the system, eventually?)
@@time7813 LOL... Oh, yes... it is stainless.
I just recieved my new heat exchanger for my house, so the old one will be used to do some testing on the exhaust of a diesel heater. I'm excited to try it. I'm curious about how much condensate there will be, if it will soot up and if the heater will struggle and make more CO.
The plan is to eventually switch to propylene glycol. Currently I just keep it circulating.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I imagine there MIGHT be issues if the Vevor heat exchanger is soldered with low-temperature solder (likely)--as opposed to BRAZED with something that has a higher melting-point... ALSO, I have SOME concern about corrosive condensate in copper lines... I'm going to TRY to keep the condensation at the OUTLET-END of my own homemade diesel-heater heat-exchanger, where I'm intending to switch BACK to two flexible, 1-inch stainless pipes (entire system sloped downward for drainage)...
I SUSPECT those water-to-air heat-exchangers SHOULD be able to handle the diesel-heater exhaust without too much back-pressure; there's a crazy amount of cross-sectional area in the body, and it never drops below that of the 1-inch input... it'll be curious to see whether TURBULENCE in the unit plays any role(?)... My biggest concern would be the corrosive condensate in the copper lines, which COULD eat them, over time... maybe not in weeks, but possibly in months?
@@time7813 I get what you are saying about the soldering, but I'm not terribly concerned about this. If there wasn't any air movement, I can see it potentially getting hot enough to melt silver solder. It is rated to 180C at 360 PSI.
I feel like the copper will be able to dissipate the heat quickly enough that this won't be an issue. The initial joints will either be 60/40 solder or just slip fit, and we'll see how it goes from there.
For the condensate acidity, I plan to monitor it with PH strips, and if required, have a rinse cycle either after the heater shuts off or after every so many minutes of use. Obviously this robs some energy, but it should work. I don't plan on running this long term, but I would like to at least test the PH level so others know what they are getting into.
Joel, whether your heater is wood or oil burning you are losing too many BTU’s out through the top. Your coils should be longer and higher to absorb the heat. When you have flames coming from the top you are losing many, many, BTU’s. Also, have you considered increasing your fire insurance on your house? Your tinkering ability reminds me of myself, always searching for a better way of doing things. Thanks again for an entertaining video! Peace out, from California.
Hey Dave. Have you been following the project? I'm sure I've seen you around in the comments.
The top normally isn't open. The hole in the top was originally for a chimney system that didn't work. When I am running on oil, the heater is warmed up with the top open, and then it is completely sealed up, so that all of the heat exits out through the slits in the side.
Haha. I'm not concerned about burning my house, although I did sit outside with the heater for this entire test, and moved the heater away from my house, because I knew there would be lots of sparks and flames.
In one of my last videos, I mentioned that one of the upgrades I would be doing is putting the entire unit into a 55 Gallon drum, with only a small slot for inspection and hose entrance etc. This will not only make it much safer, it will also keep a lot more heat in the system and make it more efficient.
Take care.
I am enthralled with your videos and watch every episode. Your channel is one of my favorites. I do realize that you take precautions, but do be careful please. You are one of the very few video creators who answers your followers comments. That ranks pretty high in my book.
Thanks again and please keep making videos for our interests.
I think you would like experimenting with rocket stoves and maybe even wood gas 😁
I have thought about wood gas and biogas for probably over 10 years, but I always have something else on the go. Maybe someday... when I retire.
Fun to watch..👍
Thanks!
I didn't like it until you started putting wood inside the coils. Then i thought that could be fairly efficient. Nice build
It's interesting. The flame being right up against the coils seems to make it work pretty well, but it needs to be tended to regularly.
I want to do an BTU test with oil and see what the results are. I'm going to try some other "fuels" in there as well.
Recently I saw few people use EGR coolers to extract exhaust heat and yes looks like an excellent idea
Yeah. I have thought of the EGR cooler scavenging system.
The reason why I chose not to take this route, is because you are introducing water, pumps and a heat exchanger into the picture, all for a maximum recovery of abou 800 watts.
If you already had a hydronic system to dump the heat into, this could make sense, but I'm not sure it makes sense if you already have the heater as forced air, to then also use hydronic.
You could set it up so that the EGR just dumped heat into a large water storage tank, and depend on a passive heat transfer, without any fans, but you still need a water pump.
The air to air system that I plan on using only requires a heat exchanger and a fan.
@loweredexpectations4927 In my case blow hot air in the cabine and add free pre heat to engine block. My previous car had a liquid diesel heater and used the car heater and fan to heat the cab. If I would heat a house an air to air cooler would make more sense yes! But I have yet to see people use intercoolers from cars.
@@Fantaman900 Oh, very cool. That makes a lot of sense, then.
Happy New Year Joel.
Thanks Wallace. I hope things are going well for you.
I enjoy your videos a lot. If I lived in Canada, all I would do is spend my time working on heaters.
Winding the copper pipe in a conical shape (as in "wrapped around a cone") would also capture more of the heat that's traveling up, and possibly eliminate the need for a lid on top of the burner.
I have considered adding a secondary coil in a cone shape, or something like that... However, the current pipe is stainless steel and was prebent. The stainless is a lot less efficient, but also durable enough that I am not afraid of stacking firewood up against it.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Argh. You got me. I did see your videos, but forgot about the stainless part already... For about 2 1/2 videos I was certain it's copper :-D
@@HB-et5iv Haha. Copper would be a far better choice for heat absorption, but I'm sure I would have destroyed it by now, haha.
Cool...👍
Thanks!
Big mistake Joel!!! Not one garaaaaage!!!😡 ooohhhh damn right at the end! Good save sir!🤣🤣🤟🏻👑
LOL. I slipped one in. In my rush, I did forget to put in some cat content tho.
Salut mec!
I love yours expériences, You are incredible😀For your next experiment, I suggest you burn tractor tires
But be careful not to burn down your house🤪
Continue, depuis la France 🙂
HAHA.. Tractor tires eh. I'll have to build a tire shredder and auger or conveyor delivery system.👍
Chips from a wood chipper and an auger might be interesting. Run auger for X seconds if the temp drops.
With the slots you made on the sides, with wood it sucks air from the outside of the burner from the combustion and cools the coil tube i think
You are 100% correct. Even when burning the oil, it pulls in cold air from outside. I plan on enclosing the entire unit in a 55 gallon steel drum. Partly to make it safe, and partly to keep some heat in.
Looking forward to the diesel heater exhaust heat exchanger video
Yeah... I expect it to work well, but I am concerned about a few things. We will see how it goes. It is going to condensate, for sure, so I need to make sure it is able to drain well.
Glad the Cat is OK
Oh... I did show a cat in this video. I thought it was a cat free video and was upset, haha.
Yeah, the cat was / is fine. She knocked my meat thermometer on the floor a while back and almost busted it. She is a real troublemaker, haha.
I agree, though. I would be quite upset if the cat was harmed in any way.
You're right. You obviously should have taped the cat in place while experimenting ;-)
@@HB-et5iv HAHA... Yes... Duct taping the cat to the wall would have been easier than taping down all of the things the cat will mess with.
That charcoal is great 👍 for the garden.
Yeah... I generally spread it over my lawn or compost it.
A lot of lost heat.
To use wood, a different type of stove is needed, in my opinion it would work very well with a 200-220 L tin barrel, and the exhaust, the chimney, should be mounted 15 cm below the side top of the barrel (the heat should circulate up and down before exiting the chimney)
Yeah, this is not at all efficient.
I did this experient out of curiosity. The heater is intended to burn oil, and I am in the process of making it better at burning oil, and using the energy more efficiently.
It is nice to know I could burn a little wood and stop from freezing, if I needed to, but the design of this burner / heater is not at all suited for wood.
In the near future I plan on increasing the whole unit inside of a 200L steel barrel, with a small opening for inspection, to let air in etc. This will be a safety shield, but also keep much more of the heat in the system.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Good idea! but you could also cover it with chamotte brick, inside the barrel to keep the heat longer, this way you will also save oil, burn less oil, everyone will be jealous of you, hahahaha. 👌
@@uncioclasprinlume Haha... I do want everyone to be jealous of my bricks !!
If it all works out, I may insulate the inside or outside of the barrel depending how much clearance there is inside. The way it has been operating, the outside of the heater throws away a LOT of heat, and when it's windy, it's really bad. Anything at all would help, but of course, a little insulation would step up the performance, for sure.
Make sure you don't burn your house down.
Yeah, the firewood sparks concerned me, and this is why I babysat it the whole time.
The best way to heat with wood....is to bury it in the ground for a few million years until it turns into oil :) The BTU/Kg content of heating oil is (AFAIR) nearly twice that of wood, regardless of species. Also, I was in the surplus section of my local Princess Auto the other day, and they had some ungodly large stainless steel bowls. I was tempted, but didn't have an immediate use :)
HAHA... I agree. I lived in a house that was heated by wood till I was 17, and then we switched to oil. I won't say that burning wood doesn't make sense for anyone, but oil is far superior.
HAHA... I should have headed to princess auto. I ended up spending probably two days looking for just the right one, on amazon. Princess Auto is one of those stores where I end up buying something.... and then starting a project so I can use the thing I bought.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I have had a number of interests over the years, Princess has always been a fruitful source for me. Whether I was sourcing parts for my rocketry hobby. My pyrotechnics fascination. My radio astronomy interests, and even when I made a still during COVID for hand sanitizer. Princess always had *something* :) I'm fortunate in a way these days. I don't have much in the way of disposable income, so I can't waltz into Princess and say "I'll take two of everything, please!". :)
Love the experiments and data you are able to collect. Definitely want to try my hand at some sort of project next year. Question for you though if you know. If you had both barrels to temp... how long could you keep you inside getting heat put into it without another fire?
Thanks for the comment.
It depends a lot on the temperature outside, as that will determine how much heat is lost from my house. That being said I can give you some rough numbers.
On a day around freezing, I could probably get about 12 hours. If it were down around -15C, then I would likely get more like 4 hours of effective heat. That's with 400L of water around 80C and pulling heat out if it until the barrels are 30C.
The amount of energy transfer out of this calculation is about 20,000 BTU/h or 6 KW/h.
It should be noted that my current system has considerable flaws that need to be addressed before I could do this. Currently I would lose too much heat back outside, and need to attach a bypass loop, so that I'm not dumping heat out when the pump is running, and the fire is out.
@loweredexpectations4927 i think your doing a great job myself. Even if you factor your flaws, they show more thoughtfulness than most to keep moving forward. Using water as a heat battery in itself would keep a room warm for quite some time let alone heating a house. Then also if you even break it down and could set it to do a burn every other day or so (yeah right) you could really offset a heating bill
@@VirtualCryptid For sure. When I started this project a few months ago, I wasn't even sure if the burner would even work well enough to bother pursuing. It has since impressed me enough that I have decided to try to improve on this system, and build a new system to heat my house full time for next winter.
So how about a slow oil drip to help burn the wood?
Yeah. I kinda did that, off camera, quite a while ago, and it does work fairly well. If you were doing this for emergency heat, then that would be the way to go, but for collecting data it wouldn't be ideal.
I have some interesting "what if" fuels planned for some upcoming videos. Whenever I think something is very interesting and am excited to see the result, those videos usually don't do well, lol. Sometimes you gotta just do things out of curiosity.
Another fun possibility: Since you've got the whole water-to-air heat exchanger set up already, you MIGHT be able to use it to help COOL your house with the same system (especially if you put the exchanger in the forced air plenum)--I currently do this, using the ALREADY COLD (9C) municipal water run slowly through MISTERS onto the exterior brickwork of my 50's bungalow's south side--where I need the moisture for an herb garden anyway... Not QUITE as cold as air conditioning, but makes a SURPRISING difference in our scalding prairie summers(!)
I have thought of something like this. It's interesting what folks will come up with when you really need a solution.
While this could work, misting water onto one of these exchanges would quickly decrease the efficiency of it, as water scale collected on it (especially where I live.
A water to water (plate) exchanger is very efficient, so that would be a better solution for dumping the heat. Then you just have the issue of the cost of water and sewage. Where I live you are charged for sewage based on the amount of water used.
If you had a few very large in ground water storage tanks, you could dump water into them, and recycle it until the temperature was too high to be effective. Then feed the pre warned water into your domestic water heater.
That being said, a different style heat exchanger, that was more robust, could be misted with rain water and, like you said, not be as cold as AC, but effective.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I'm not misting onto the exchanger--merely passing air through it with my furnace fan... I agree that it would scale-up and become less effective in no time, if you misted onto it directly...
To be clear, I have my water-to-air heat exchanger in the house's forced air plenum, connected in-line to the municipal water supply, and 'exhausted' outside the house via a dedicated garden-hose spigot. I mist a small amount of water into an herb garden, and onto the exterior brickwork on hot days, when the plants need water... The water-usage is trivial--but with the residence-time of the cold municipal water so long in the exchanger, I can often dump a LOT of heat from my house into it before it leaves to water the garden (plants prefer warm water anyway). Then I get a SECOND perk because the south-facing brickwork of the house acts like a large swamp-cooler: the misters dampen the brick, and a lot of heat is carried away from the house when it evaporates (conducted from inside, because the house is not especially well insulated).
I'm in a rural area, and have the option of also running a loop in the bottom of my pond, but for now, this is just another way to scavenge a resource that is easily available...I don't need a pump, because I'm not paying for the water PRESSURE the municipality provides... and the heat-exchanger is super-versatile, as you've demonstrated in your videos!
@@time7813 OOOhhh. I think they call that a swamp cooler ? when the moisture is in the air.
Oh... I see what you are saying with the water in your exchanger. That is much more efficient than what I had assumed. We had massive water use restrictions last summer due to a water line failure, and people were getting fined for using too much water. At one point some businesses were shut down and others were pulling water from the river. Hopefully they actually fixed it, this time.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Yes, I've got friends and family in Calgary (Manitoban, here), so am well aware of your recent water-issues(!)...
The setup I've described seems WAY more efficient than it OUGHT to be (having done some napkin-math)--and best as I can figure, I'm GAINING efficiency because the phase-change energy as water condenses onto my heat-exchanger is ALSO being shuttled outside as I mist my herbs and house exterior (ie-->the secondary "swamp cooler"). It's pretty dramatic, actually, and typically costs me appx $300CAD for a FULL SUMMER of pretty decent cooling, even in our PUNISHINGLY hot prairie summers. (that's all the water cost, since I'm not paying for the PRESSURE which runs the system, which the municipality provides to me for free, so I don't require a pump!)
I'd love your take on my diesel-heater exhaust heat-exchanger plan before I build it... Specifically, I'm curious to know whether any of your experimentation gives you any intuitions about:
1) The effect of corrosive condensate on the radiator (I'm PLANNING to condense exhaust H2O before it leaves my house for that bit of extra exothermic phase-change energy)
2) Whether you feel my diesel-heater exhaust heat exchanger will create carbon build-up in the burn chamber. (effectively two 3/4 inch copper pipes, 'finned' and run in parallel for 4ish feet through a 3-inch duct with a fan blowing through it, then run outside through two standard 1 inch stainless exhaust-lengths)
...I've been intrigued about ways to capture that diesel-heater exhaust energy, but wanted something a bit more COMPACT and efficient than your 5m daisy-chained stainless steel experiment... (Did you ever try COILING those for any length of time? Did YOUR system soot up at all when running with that extreme length?)
'Loving your content. Your playful experimentation, iteration, and scientific, data-gathering impulse is EXACTLY how we learn stuff(!) Part of me wonders whether your experiments will ultimately lead you towards something that looks a LOT like an automated Rocket Mass Heater...(but perhaps one optimized to burn waste oil?)...
@@time7813 For the condensate issue, the smart thing to do would be to actually test the condensate with PH strips. You want to make sure that it is able to drain well, as the condensate is much more harmful if it is able to dry out and concentrate. (by pooling in the system). If you find that the PH is too low, I think it would be smart to have a water valve on it that dumped a cup through after the heater had been running. You'd lose some energy this way your exchanger would be flushed.
As long as everything else is working well, I don't see your system causing a soot issue. I ran over 20 feet of the stainless stuff and it didn't seem like much CO. The best way to monitor the system is by using a CO meter where the exhaust comes out. It should be 14ppm or les, ideally, but you probably won't have issues unless you are over 20.
I did a test with the stainless in some water, but it was sort of a failure. I can't remember all of the details, but leaking water kinda through my results off. A cold exhaust does have an effect on how much CO is produced, and I think this has to do with the cold air being more dense, and therefore, harder to move. I didn't run it long enough for it to soot up.
Haha... Yeah... For a few years now, I have wanted to experiment with building a pulsejet engine, burning waste oil, and have the outside of the unit jacketed to capture the heat. Problem being that they are insanely noisey. I don't think it would be the most efficient thing, but I think it would be fairly clean burning and self cleaning due to the energetic burning of the fuel.
I need to love away from everyone before I start making things like that, haha.
I think what is needed next is a sand battery, figure out how to incorporate that in the system as you wouldn't need to run it 24/7 and if you use oil in the line you get get it much hotter.
There is a german Channel about chinese heaters too and he kinda "inspired" his thumbnails like yours. you have alot of range for 9k subs. Hope you are doing well😊
Thanks for the comment and your support. I have a lot of loyal viewers.
Joel, can you help me out with my diesel heater? I would like to install a regular thermostat so that it kicks on or off as needed. Thanks, from your loyal viewer in California.
I responded to another comment with the answer. You can get Vevor heaters that do this (both of their Bluetooth heaters) or a Bureck CD Thermostat.
th-cam.com/video/bG2X5_pxjFE/w-d-xo.html
Thank you!
I'd like to experiment like this, but my neighbors are so damn nosey, I'd have bylaw knocking on my door.
Grrrr. People keep telling me I should move my burner. I have the burner placed where it is because my neighbours furnace room is on the other side of the fence and I have a nice enclosed space.
A few shots in this video I put the lid on the burner and it started making a lot of smoke ... I wanted to leave it go like this in hopes that it would come around and be more efficient, but I didn't want to make too much smoke, so I opted for flames shooting out the top.
I also get along with my neighbours really well. On one side I have fixed his lawnmower, trimmer, snowblower, trimmer, boat fibreglass etc, and on the other side, I shovel for them, removed their tree, just helped install a garage door spring. They like having me around, haha.
@@loweredexpectations4927its good to have nice neighbors. Unfortunately the old couple on the one side of us like to be in everyone's business. I'm surprised they haven't called bylaw on my diesel heater exhaust yet. I couldn't get away with your crazy experiments or I'd have the police helicopter called on me😅
Wood!
If it smells like wood, it's good. 🤷♂️
👍
Thanks.
Hopefully that doesn't degrade the copper in your heat still...And hopefully no man or cat gets horribly burned by boiling water or steam explosions. But, very interesting..Those oil burners could be worth the trouble..Especially in a frigid climate..
I have thought of that, and that's the reason why I chose stainless steel, instead of copper. 👍 I knew that if I used copper I would destroy it, haha.
I would feel terrible if anything happened to any of the pets... I am adding a lot of safeties and this was a test to see if it could be done.
I am adding a lot of safeties to the system including enclosing the whole system in a steel barrel.
Thanks for your support.
Hey Joel, Do you use this to help heat your house every night?
Hey there.
I built this (as a waste oil burner) a few months ago, and just recently started using it to heat my house. I have been making modifications to it to make it more efficient and have used it to heat my house successfully for about two weeks.
It is now not in use as I am doing some upgrades. This wood test was more or less for entertainment, but I was able to heat my house for part of the day and overnight.
I think you need 3 bat toes and an eye of newt and that will fix all of your problems....
LOL... I hadn't thought of that ... Probably need to chant something also.
your making a incinerator
It appears that way.
Funny story. Where I went to elementary school was right next to a hospital, and they had an incinerator along side our playground. When we were out playing, it would sometimes snow down ashes on us, haha.
@@loweredexpectations4927 same same
That's Crazy lol@@loweredexpectations4927
th-cam.com/video/9oTg7ToOXGU/w-d-xo.html
I have see this video. Not sure why you are sharing it with me though?
Gerry is obviously a smart fellow, which makes me wonder if he really thinks this setup is clean or a good idea. It sure will make heat, but it's also not at all clean burning.
There are methods for testing a clean burn, and he doesn't use any of them. Looking at the stack and saying "see how clean it is" is not only not a method of testing, but also sort of irresponsible when you have a huge audience.
He also suggests mixing oil with sawdust, and burning it in a wood stove.