Conspiracy theory: Chris didn't make any balance changes because there's something(s) we missed from the last patch that he was expecting us all to take advantage of he's disappointed in us not figuring it out during 3.17.
I always think there is still stuff that ppl didn't find.. If I remember right cremation took multiple patches without buffs before ppl rly played it a lot and same for bf bb because at first it seemed so clunky due to the double cast so it took multiple patches (without buffs) before it actually became meta Not sure if I remember right tho maybe they did get buffed before they became meta ^^
But.. The game is not solved? With the introduction of the new endgame items such as the chill ring the Lightee made, there will be new builds that might be able to overshadow the current meta builds. Also it doesn't affect YOU that other people are playing the same starter as last league. It's how you play that affects you. The game is balanced plenty well where so many builds are league start viable. I never understood this mentality of how just because someone else is playing the game in a certain way, it's affecting you somehow.
I do agree. I also don’t get the point of the game being solved already. With so many variables available for theory crafting, there are still so many possible builds to play.
@@fierypandaofdoom There are plenty of trickster builds that can clear endgame. Just because they aren't played, doesn't mean they don't exist or aren't viable.
I'm a casual and don't have much time. However new skills & balance changes are the best part of the league for me, discovering new builds, trying out old ones that "May work better now". between the League Mechanic/Additional End Game/Balance & Skill changes; I would take Balance & skill changes over the other two every time.
I agree with your take on the lack of balance changes, however - here's a few of my thoughts that might temper the disappointment a little, for me: 1. If they're planning a set of rolling additions to endgame league-over-league, using the first step to assess their baseline "siege of the atlas 1.1" with no player balance variables can help them assess whether they are hitting the mark on uber balancing. Since the ubers will likely create an additional tier of builds at the top end, this will help them test the content in a more controlled manner, to make sure they're happy with the size and accessibility of that tier. 2. The new monster mod balance might accidentally shake up the meta anyway, at least to an extent - and also can be assessed in a more controlled manner with no player-end balance shift. 3. If the meta does feel stagnant (and I suspect it will) it will serve as a form of sedative to the "never nerf anything" crowd, if nothing else. We'll be able to say "yeah we tried that, no don't do it again". And that may be cold comfort as we get stuck with the same stale (if arguably ok) meta for 6 months, but at least we'll disarm some of the madness and toxicity we've seen stemming out of the balance changes of recent times.
I hated the archnemesis league mechanic so much that i pretty much dropped the league about a week in, so this kind of approach they took is pretty exciting for me. I'll be able to enjoy some builds that I saw during the league with the new stuff. Its pretty much an extension of the league with new bosses and passive atlas points haha
The lack of new skills 2 leagues in a row really took the wind out of my sails for this league. I'll probably still play the league for a bit but I really hope ggg addresses this issue that's growing in the community right now.
Sure new skills are great and all but I personally see, and agree, that A LOT of skills need a rework and that would be more beneficial than new skills. Just my opinion tho.
@@xCushman I'd be fine with reworks as well but not having anything seems a bit bleh. I think if this league gimmick isn't super fun this is going to be the worst league for player retention.
I've only been playing since the tail end of 3.16, and haven't had much time to play since mid March, but I personally think the game's balance will change alot more than people are expecting right now, between the sentinels, a couple of the new items, and the new "recombinator" techs. I think the recombinator tech is the one that will have the biggest effects that we don't actually know about yet, but a couple of the new uniques I think will be alot more powerful than expected as well. So looking forward to trying to find the time to try all this out!
No balance change is a good thing for several reasons. First is seeing how much harder the new uber content is, since you already know the power level of builds at endgame. Second is that experimental builds that people got going later into last league now have a chance to mature and shake up the meta. And third is for more casual players to have access to better build guides. Also I think the shadow nerf to headhunter will be enough to affect the meta at the higher end
I'm going to start my first HC league in Sentinel. For me it's great that all these builds are proven to be strong to I can eventually test them all once my characters die one after another.
I'm a little disappointed by the lack of new skills or balance changes mostly because I enjoy theorycrafting and have new things to think about. But on the other hand, I quit Archnemesis after 34 challenges to help ensure I wouldn't burn out and could come back fresh for the next league. I had other build ideas I wanted to try and even started trading for some of the pieces before realizing it would be better, long term, to wait a month+ until the following league. So in that context, no major changes means I can dust off those shelved ideas and think about which "Impossible Escape" keystone will be best for my planned build.
I disagree, strongly. Claiming that the meta is solved when new builds are discovered all the time seems pretty naïve and arrogant to me. It not like nothing was changed. They added some new uniques that may enable builds that were previously subpar or impossible, like the chill ring or keystone intuitive leap jewel. The new keystones on the atlas may encourage a magic find meta, or something else, we don't know yet. Remember that poe ninja does not show you the strongest builds, it only shows you what is popular. Besides, no balance updates is in itself something new for this game. I played a dozen non-meta builds last league and I will play a dozen more this league, and they will be cheap and easy to gear because everyone will be clamoring for omniscience items. I for one, am very excited to continue trying new builds, and I hope you enjoy the new league too.
I felt the same way I kinda lost touch as soon as he said "builds are solved" - then why is reddit losing their collective minds over the rare monster changes saying HH is dead? We know for a fact what the best league starters will be. No argument there. With so many new end game uniques, new end game bosses, and a completely changed mapping experience (alter rebalancing, key stones, & rare monster changes) the idea that the "league is solved" just sounds like a projection of "I am not interested personally".
You don't seem to know what 'meta' is. Yes. The meta is solved. The best builds, are known. The fact that there are multiple more VIABLE builds, it's besides the point. The meta, the best builds, are solved. There are not going to be any new top-builds. Yeah. you can play any non meta build you want, and even those, there will be less new builds than last league, for obvious reasons.
@@elmaster65 I think I do know what meta is and I think you missed the point. Meta builds are the most powerful builds, and the point you missed was that we cannot know that the meta is solved. "There are not going to be any new top-builds." How can you know this? You can't.
I'm of your opinion as well, and the fact that there's been no new skills now 2 leagues in a row really kills me. Like last league I could somewhat understand as we had an entire atlas system rework so the league was pretty light/meh and we had no new skills but there was a lot to explore in the game through that atlas system. This time however the league mechanic looks again pretty lame/light like archnemesis was and there aren't new skills but they really aren't doing much of anything else either. Like we get a couple new atlas tree passives, couple hyper rare uniques (that honestly don't look build defining to me), and some additional uber bosses...it really feels like almost nothing worthwhile/interesting for builds is being added into the game alongside no buffs to bad or underperforming items/skills/ascendancies really hurts my enthusiasm as someone who usually spends more time theory crafting in PoB with the stuff I find interesting than actually playing said characters.
I think the lack of skill changes at the top end makes sense ; I’d have liked some buffs to lower skills BUT I believe this is due to Archnemesis going core in the manner it has being more impactful that we may suspect. The new Uber bosses and more specialist tree options will hopefully shake up the meta from mod league but not leaguestart
Yeah I agree, solving the meta and theory crafting a new build while you play the new changes is a very exciting part of each league. Although I can see how no major changes could appeal to more casual players, but I doubt they made the decision with that in mind, I’m pretty sure is more related to them focusing their efforts in other aspects of the game.
I think with no balance changes it also opens opportunity for us to play with the same tools and see if there is anything we missed. The meta is never really solved there is always things we miss. Im excited to come back and try to build my alt quality RoA build
I can understand your disappointment, but alternatively there are some things about it that excite me. I was really excited for last like, but my schedule was super busy, so I missed out on nearly every build. The chance to try the strong stuff that I couldn’t is quite good for me. Admittedly, I would’ve been happy to see buffs on weaker skills or some new skills, but I’m most happy to just not see any nerfs. And since it almost seems like you would’ve preferred nerfs on the current ops more than buffs on weaker stuff, I do find myself having a different viewpoint than you. Although, I can understand how players who made the most out of last league can feel a little let down.
I think this creates a great excuse to get those build crafting juices flowing. Yeah, there's a bunch of powerful builds we already know. And so, many players are going to be playing those builds. Which means the best items for those builds will be hard to get. I think this makes a great opportunity to look at off meta builds that are still great and see if you can get some more juice out of them. Or grind a ton of currency with EA or DD and then go ham on some crazy and experimental idea.
I understand crying about meta in competitive games, but not in games like poe. I played 40/40 challenges last league. I played 2 builds which one is I guess considered meta. There are a shit ton of builds I can still play. This angle is pretty much only for people who play this game as their job and for those who parrot what ever the pro player is talking.
in my defence, i only have enough time to try 1-3 builds per league, and for leagues like archnem where there were a crazy amount of different things I wanted to try but couldnt, this means i can just grab and go for trying out the other builds that I thought looked neat without most of them getting completely destroyed. I'm especially interested in the new uber endgame uniques that alter how we interact with the passive tree, such as massive thread of hope and the other one that lets you wormhole to specific keystones. New ways to minmax old builds even moreso, due to the way the endgame is being fleshed out, we have a lot more to figure out than just how character builds interact with content, we also have to figure out how to set up the content that we want to interact with altogether.
I can pretty much understand you. I already know now that i am starting Spectral Helix, grabbing my Omni and just clear everything that stands in my way. It is for sure not that fun to play the same builds again this league... but still lets see what new idea's we find after using the new crafting method and items. I think after realizing the potential of these new methods to enable builds, we will find new exciting stuff for sure!
I am looking forward to doing physical traps as I never gotten around to doing them and glad ashes of the stars hasn't been nerfed as it seems to open up a lot of interesting builds but I'm sad we're not going to see that many new builds.
Chris Wilson said this was done to keep all the build guides from 3.17 relevant, so everyone will be able to play a proven working build. That would still be the case if they only buffed the bottom tier of underused skills. Bex said there were no nerfs, but that would still be the case if they only buffed the bottom tier of underused skills. The only explanation is that they didn't want to dedicate developer man hours to balance changes for this league because other things (like PoE2) are taking up too much of their attention. Sorry, but my hype level for this league is zero. A league either needs new skills or balance changes. With neither, it is dead on arrival.
100% agree. Feels kinda like diablo with no changes. Most people won't see those "changes" anyway (uber content) as casual have problems with killing normal bosses.
I like the no balance changes. I wanted to try balistas for a long time but had to skip the last couple of leagues due to IRL stuff. Knowing explo arrow is super strong means i may be able to tackle the new pinicle fights this league with a build i want to play.
As a casual who started the league late I'm OK with this. I don't play the uber meta usually as it is. I can see why this is disappointing to hard core theory crafters and streamers. I have a feeling next league is nerf everything league.
i can entirely agree with the "game beeing solved" part. while i can understand their possible reasonings behind that decision, i still think it will make the next league a "rather short" league. what makes me sad is seeing so many skill gems (almost all strikes except LS in general) still left unloved and untouched for another league. hope you still find your way into motivation, fun and all.
As a softcore player it doesn't matter to me. First build is always a farm build anyway. Game has pretty much been solved for ages, even before PoB. Builds, Treepathing, Gear, everything has mostly been streamlined. There've been very few builds that were really interesting and not some kind of 'immune' to this or 'just stack that' build. The last one that was truly fun to me was Mirror Arrow Instability. Unless there is something new and mechanical interesting it's just damage differentials. Even game mechanics are pretty much a 'don't care for a specific build (that doesn't farm like ass)'. When reading the patchnotes I'm not thinking 'oh no, what am I gonna play when build xy is nerfed?', rather 'is the investment worth it?'. And tbh, GGGs balance and reworks are super shit. I'd rather have them not doing anything than explode a whole archetype just because. To be fair hardcore, private leagues and racing are a different story of course.
I've played in almost all the seasons, and even before seasons were a thing. Even though no balance changes were made I am still gonna play a different starter, and maybe for the first time switch into a build that works and I can enjoy. That being said it's none of the mentioned builds. As for being solved, it would be really good to see these ubers be insanely tanky and have more mechanics that make them a whole new experience. Hard to say how it's gonna play out but we shall see, i'm optimistic.
As someone who didn't really have time for last league, I'm pretty excited. However, I'm not sure what build to go. I think I'm torn between Tectonic Slam, Discharge, and Hexblast (i want big explosions). What do you folks think?
hey badger, have you thought about creating a build around the new uniques with a diff skill that could maybe be a contender with the current meta? Maybe you can try to "rush" to get that said unique, and respec into the build you would like to try with one of the new items? it sucks not having new stuff straight from the start, but maybe this would ease the stagnant feel a little bit for you.
I agree that no balance changes is a bit boring. The timing of this kinda works for me though. Because of time constraints I didn't do any Omniscience builds last league, so I guess I'll do it this time around. Most of the playerbase will not be affected by the no meta changes as most of us haven't played every build in the game yet. But I do understand how frustrating it might be for content creators, racers and most of us more experienced Wraeclastians
I rather appreciate the notion that the game is "solved". I take it as a bit of a challenge to see if I can unearth some hidden gem that hasn't been given proper attention. A lot of the time in these perceived stale metas people simple assume only a few builds are top tier and completely neglect to even try other builds.
I think the only people who don't like the lack of balance changes are the ones who have played everything already. I'm not one of those people. I regularly hit 38-40 achievements so I don't think I'm a casual but the are several builds I haven't tried that I know perform well and I'm going to switch it up this league. I usually play ignite builds but I'm going for poisonous concoction for league start.
I'm not interested in the league mechanic so I'm skipping the league but for someone who plans dozens of builds but only ends up playing maybe 4 because of poe retention issues, no balance changes would have given me a chance to continue down my list of planned builds without having to change anything on any of them, and the market might also be somewhat similar to last league so predicting the prices of certain items might be easier
I feel like its a try of GGG how the playerbase reacts towards a known meta how or what will be played or not played, how is the reaction and so on - and thats a realy interesting question
I like it for a change (not in general, I like balance changes). Firstly I always have the feeling ggg feels the need to do more new stuff and therefor has not the time to do things proper and them taking the risk to dial back every once in a while is imo a very good thing. Also I do not believe you one bit when you say we have the endgame figured out... I am not a pro in building new characters but simply from the complexity of the game I doubt the community has maxed the potencial of the last balance changes in merely 3 month. I believe there is room for a kind of min max improvement that we never hat the opportunity to develop.
This is going to force people who enjoy creating builds to start digging even deeper, at least that's what it seems is the purpose of this. Also to give more casual players a chance to catch their breath and try different skills to see what they actually enjoy
They couldn't change skill balance when they change rare mods in the same patch. They need a base line of difficulty to then change skill balance the following league.
GGG can't win with balance changes and you know this. "You nerfed my favorite skill so bad it's dead.". "You only buffed skills that no one plays, basically no chances.". "You somehow buffed a skill that's already powerful, do you even play your game?". "You didn't buff or nerf anything, boring.". There are content creators that have thought all of these statements all within the last year.
Scrolled down to find this exact comment! It is 100% true. There's always disappointment to be found one way or another if you take a particular angle. Thanks for writing it so I didnt have to.
Silver lining is that I get to try out your discharge assassin! Looks super fun to play but I didn't get around to it last league because I really wanted to do ward loop before that gets nerfed (definitely a recommended build). How do you think your discharge build will hold up against the new uber bosses?
Completely agree, I fucking hate the fact the there are no balance changes. I mean I was so excited for the new update and then bam no balance. I love the fact that every league something else is playable and I can do a new build and it Wil be valid. Last league it felt like there where like 3 good builds and I dint like 2 of then, which means I probably wont like the league this time around.
I think a lot of people are sleeping on the fact that we got a new node for each ascendency. Are they likely to be crap? Probably, sure, but there are a lot of them. There's probably something OP in there!
I think the issue is rather that just because these nodes are new it will be super expensive and the drop rates of these jewels was bad enough already, adding 7 more possible outcomes makes it so every single one is even rarer. Adding the fact that bosses are harder, white and yellow map farming got nerfed (by changing several atlas passives) I suspect that you are technically right that there could be really fun things in there but also that the chance of experiencing them is similar to playing with Stasis Prison...
Do we know that they added only one unique node per Ascendancy (3 per class)? I had a thought that they might be using this to 'pre-check' some of the PoE2 Ascendancy nodes...
To be honest, this almost doesn't feel like a new league. I'm not a fan of GGG's usual nerfing approach (double or triple-tapping), but if they didn't want to nerf strong builds, they could've at least buffed weaker stuff to shake things up. Right now, with basically no changes... it kind of feels like we're just getting an extension of the current league. I doubt anyone would've complained about buffs to nonviable stuff that give more options, and they would have "unsolved" the game again, in part at least.
On the one hand I'd normally agree with you, but I feel like the whole reason to do this is to have a known proper benchmark for the new monster mod system.
i fully agree with your perspective and i feel a bit sad despite there are good things going to be added. It doesnt really feel like a new league since there are AGAIN no new skill gems which i didnt expect and no balance changes. Iam not to excited to be honest for the new league.
I started 3.17 with EA. It was great. This time I am starting with something silly. PathFinder summoner. I will have to be creative at least until HoAg, and I will travel across the scion area before hitting minion nodes. I... Don't... Care... It's gonna work, and I will have epic fun.
Having played this game for as long as I have I cannot believe that the game is "solved" after 3 months of a patch. I'd bet my life that there are quite a few builds that are at the same level or better than the current "meta" that we just havent figured out yet. I think you could have no balance changes for a year and not have the game be "solved". there is just too much crazy stuff in this game. I mean look at the builds that someone like Mathil and many other people made last league. I only use him as an example because i watched his vid just before this one but it seems like just about everyone that really dug deep into builds last league came up with ideas that were nowhere near the meta and made them work just fine, doing all content and most of them would do the new Uber content as well with enough time and skill. I guess my point is that just because the "meta" stays the same from one patch to another doesnt mean that the game is "solved" and there are still an un-countable number of builds that are still capable of melting everything the game has to offer.
As someone who only plays a limited number of builds and mostly play in standard, I am ok with no player balance changes. I never liked having to review my builds every 3 months and having some of my favorite skills getting nerfed and become obsolete just to "shake up the meta".
I mean, I dislike them not changing the EA not because of the meta itself but because it makes my fire dot build items more pricy. Personally, Idc what other people play, I play this game with friends and at my own pace. I don't play meta builds because I can get the same amount of power for less $ with off meta builds by yellow and early red maps. Beyond that, depending on what I am playing and market demand, usually things works out in my favor paying a lot less for upgrades. As someone who enjoys playing dot builds league start, I wanted to play ignite last league as my rotation is back on ignite, but EA made me shift to poison. It all depends on how you want to approach the game, I could care less what others play. The more people play the same build I don't, the more happy I am. 6link dark scorn last league by 5th week was sub 1.5ex for me on my 2nd poison build. Play what is fun, not what people preach to be meta in PoE and you will have a much better experience.
I am both excited and disappointed by this. It is very comforting to know the handful of cool builds out there i wanted to try this league are still going to be viable in the same way. but its always exciting to see changes though and there are definitely out layers right now that need it. I am over all happy with the lack of changes this time.
@Badger.... Want to play Blade Trap? My dude... IF you do I would love for you to entertain Energy Blade Blade Trap. And YES it DOES work. I haven't seen anyone really do it honestly.
2 leagues without new skills, makes it really hard to feel excited. well, I think they make no changes because they want to see how monster rekt us. probably need to tweak about defensive side a little bit considering archnemesis mod. oh and, they didn't mention (not even in trailer) that they removed the epic arhnemesis mod (innocence/brine king/ kitava) imagine juiced map with rare monster with those things, absolute clusterf*ck
I would like new skill yes BUT i dont mind lack of player balance change why? becouse game balance chenge with monster modifires they gonna flip alot around so i understand they chenge it and they wana see how that effect game
I'm quite sure the game is quite solved with archnemesis mods on all rares. I'll hold my judgement. I'm sad there are no new skills. I might also start Blade Trap.
What i don't like about the no balance changes is that if you don't like the current meta build, you don't really have a reason to play this league. I usually don't even play enough to reach the current uber end game content, adding uber uber end game content is not for me. They should have at least buffed under used skills. That way they don't remove existing build they just add more of them.
A double-edged sword for the build scientists out there. They lightened on the brain's firing neurons for problem solving builds in return for learning and problem solving those endgames that are coming. Not playing at a chill enough pace is going to be both awkward and a hit on retention perhaps.
No Blance changes is sad, I wait for boost again weak chaos skills like death aura and mabe add more scaling option... I wait for new skill gems, new supports etc. Sadly we don't get anyone yet ehhh
I wish we saw some buffs but I know they can't do just buffs and never nerf but the amount of leagues I have gone into with zero interest because what I enjoy playing is way worse then it needs to be is something I really get tired of. FOM with builds is pretty lame when you never know if next league the build you wanted to try is now lame. So that is a nice thing about no changes.
Yeah, I also don't understand this move. Not only is there a amount of players who will not even start without a new build but also player retention will be at an all time low. There is really no build with a power level that allows more casual players to achieve everything, which I havnt played yet.
Ngl, I have a feeling not many people will go back to EA. Totems aren't for everyone, and people like trying new builds. My money is on skeles personally
I hear this complaint and I think it's generally kinda valid, but with how GGG can take a freakin sledge hammer to build integrity sometimes, I'm also a bit relieved that they held back on making any hasty changes and instead take their time on it. I get a bit excited too trying to figure out what to play, but it can also be a bit frustrating when they kill entire archetypes when all they wanted to do was make ONE thing weaker. I feel like PoE is just too complex a game to expect GGG to really be shifting things adequately every 3-4 months. If they want time, I say give em.
So Hi, can I ask a question, anyone. I started playing frost witch a few leagues back and then two back I changed to a new cold build, now I'm not saying the builds are bad or anything, it may well be that I am bad, which is most likely. The best I have done is level 79 and just maps levels 1-5 and if I try the thief guild stuff I tend to just die :( So that is not good. So yes I like the build and I like the vortex because I can run away and cast it and that works great unlike the wither spell where I can set out 5 balls that go after targets for a bit then I need to recast, it works well until I get caught off balance and I get snuffed out like a candle. My build seems to have zero defence so again no complaints I'm sure the issue is self-inflicted. I have not figured out how to tell when an item is good, I may well always pick the bad things. Well OK, I can tell when I have defences in a place like frost, poison, etc. So can anyone suggest an easy build that I can play in SSF and be really defensive, and still being cold would be cool but not required I should probably move on?
I would have been ok with no balance changes this league, if they at least brought in some new skills. But both of those things weren't here, because the league mechanic is overly complex. (3 things to activate, 3 things to control how they interact by levelling them up, with new modifiers within themselves... And what's worse, it will probably be a league mechanic people will stop interacting way before the league ends, because it requires far too much tuning to be good. Not to mention, it's far TOO complex to ever go core. [just look at the leagues that did, they are mostly click and go] Which probably means, it's excess work that dies in 3 months.) And what did they give the "average" player? Ultra end-game content. Content only 5% or less of the playerbase will actually touch. Sure, this will keep some streamers playing before the dying point of the league, but I'm predicting right now that league rentention in 3.18 will be at an all time low. For the average player, it's exactly the last league with more buttom pressing. (Which no one likes.) For the streamers, it's the same with 7 more bosses, so most of them will just rush their insane boss killer builds to do them, and then what? Repeat the same 10 builds from last league "for content"? I don't know man, I want to be optimistic, but they made it hard this time around.
There's always someone who complains. Nerf shit, then the casuals u just mentioned are pissed as well. Now u leave them power in a known place and you still complain. And sorry, but nothing new for casuals? Even more atlas tree optimization/personalization in content, literally being able to kill content u dont want to play etc... But I guess there are people who are never happy
I am thinking that they are doing less at this point due to needing to putting work into the endgame. Along with putting more time into PoE 2, which I am hoping that they are doing. So that sometime within 2024 they can launch PoE 2. Although I would love to get more news on PoE 2.
I'm just disappointed that melee has kind of been left out again. Ofc there is melee builds that do well but most of us never see that kind of currency to even get our build anywhere near that lol. Or even just look into some skills that don't really get used a lot and just buff them or rework them. Id suck a banana for melee to be looked into and balanced a bit better just a bit ;) Ofc I have a few builds I'd like to try out and do my SB dex stacking as that was tons of fun watching bosses melt Haha!.
the big balance change is coming... i mean, i think its cool that we get another league to destroy shit and kill the uber bosses.. when the big balance change comes you'll get that same feeling. like, oh man, all the builds that killed the ubers aren't viable anymore. so its kind of like a X2. we get to go hard on the new content with the old meta again and next league we'll be forced to re think things. i was personally hoping for an ascendancy rework but.. whats the point.. poe 2 is coming soon and that will change everything. I think thats why they're just developing the end game from here until poe 2. when poe 2 comes its a big balance change and all that new end game content is there for us to enjoy.
I'm very glad for no balance changes once in a while. There are so many strong builds to play that 99% of people don't have the time to try all of them so I look at it as an opportunity to try out all the strong builds I didn't get to play last league and would've been maybe disappointed I missed out on.
I really dislike that nothing was changed due to how powerful certain builds (mainly through certain OP items) are. I just don't understand why underplayed skills weren't buffed. That would allow people to theorycraft and aim to beat the meta builds while having something strong to fall back on. I'm loving everything else about 3.18 but the lack of change for builds really leaves a bad taste in my mouth for this league's longevity.
Balance changes are a huge part for me to come back every league and test out new builds. So with no changes i'm tempted to not play this league at all
I think their main focus now is poe 2. that game should and needs to be 10 times better than current poe.. those are just filler expansions/leagues nothing too crazy can and will happen
The league doesn’t look exciting to me. It seems like a lot of work to keep track of your sentinels, decide when to use them and the different kinds. Having to repair them is another big oof. I hope the rewards are good enough to justify this amount of mental work when I just want to mindlessly kill shit and loot.
![I Got BANNED?? - Fresh Off The Beach EP. 2 [PoE 3.17]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/sJa2IOK5yIM/mqdefault.jpg)
![I Got BANNED?? - Fresh Off The Beach EP. 2 [PoE 3.17]](/img/tr.png)
Conspiracy theory: Chris didn't make any balance changes because there's something(s) we missed from the last patch that he was expecting us all to take advantage of he's disappointed in us not figuring it out during 3.17.
I love this theory.
Well if a certain alt quality gem was not bugged then damage immunity would still be possible granted super jank to pull off.
I always think there is still stuff that ppl didn't find.. If I remember right cremation took multiple patches without buffs before ppl rly played it a lot and same for bf bb because at first it seemed so clunky due to the double cast so it took multiple patches (without buffs) before it actually became meta
Not sure if I remember right tho maybe they did get buffed before they became meta ^^
Or they just forgot to make something, and then put something together 2 hours before the event
Clearly, not enough Glacial Hammer love. GGG demands more before they nerf it to oblivion.
But.. The game is not solved? With the introduction of the new endgame items such as the chill ring the Lightee made, there will be new builds that might be able to overshadow the current meta builds. Also it doesn't affect YOU that other people are playing the same starter as last league. It's how you play that affects you. The game is balanced plenty well where so many builds are league start viable. I never understood this mentality of how just because someone else is playing the game in a certain way, it's affecting you somehow.
clearly not spoken from a trickster point of view.
I do agree. I also don’t get the point of the game being solved already. With so many variables available for theory crafting, there are still so many possible builds to play.
@@fierypandaofdoom There are plenty of trickster builds that can clear endgame. Just because they aren't played, doesn't mean they don't exist or aren't viable.
@@mathiasjacobsen8433 People want to be told what builds to play. Sad.
Yes new items slightly change things, but Items are somewhat simple to math out.
I'm a casual and don't have much time. However new skills & balance changes are the best part of the league for me, discovering new builds, trying out old ones that "May work better now". between the League Mechanic/Additional End Game/Balance & Skill changes; I would take Balance & skill changes over the other two every time.
I agree with your take on the lack of balance changes, however - here's a few of my thoughts that might temper the disappointment a little, for me:
1. If they're planning a set of rolling additions to endgame league-over-league, using the first step to assess their baseline "siege of the atlas 1.1" with no player balance variables can help them assess whether they are hitting the mark on uber balancing. Since the ubers will likely create an additional tier of builds at the top end, this will help them test the content in a more controlled manner, to make sure they're happy with the size and accessibility of that tier.
2. The new monster mod balance might accidentally shake up the meta anyway, at least to an extent - and also can be assessed in a more controlled manner with no player-end balance shift.
3. If the meta does feel stagnant (and I suspect it will) it will serve as a form of sedative to the "never nerf anything" crowd, if nothing else. We'll be able to say "yeah we tried that, no don't do it again".
And that may be cold comfort as we get stuck with the same stale (if arguably ok) meta for 6 months, but at least we'll disarm some of the madness and toxicity we've seen stemming out of the balance changes of recent times.
I don't mind that there are no changes or new skills. I rather have them improve other parts of the game and work on PoE2.
I hated the archnemesis league mechanic so much that i pretty much dropped the league about a week in, so this kind of approach they took is pretty exciting for me. I'll be able to enjoy some builds that I saw during the league with the new stuff. Its pretty much an extension of the league with new bosses and passive atlas points haha
How do you feel about the archnemesis mods now being on rare and magic monsters? Or was there other aspects of the league that you hated?
3.17 v2.0
The lack of new skills 2 leagues in a row really took the wind out of my sails for this league. I'll probably still play the league for a bit but I really hope ggg addresses this issue that's growing in the community right now.
Sure new skills are great and all but I personally see, and agree, that A LOT of skills need a rework and that would be more beneficial than new skills. Just my opinion tho.
@@xCushman I'd be fine with reworks as well but not having anything seems a bit bleh. I think if this league gimmick isn't super fun this is going to be the worst league for player retention.
I've only been playing since the tail end of 3.16, and haven't had much time to play since mid March, but I personally think the game's balance will change alot more than people are expecting right now, between the sentinels, a couple of the new items, and the new "recombinator" techs. I think the recombinator tech is the one that will have the biggest effects that we don't actually know about yet, but a couple of the new uniques I think will be alot more powerful than expected as well. So looking forward to trying to find the time to try all this out!
No balance change is a good thing for several reasons. First is seeing how much harder the new uber content is, since you already know the power level of builds at endgame. Second is that experimental builds that people got going later into last league now have a chance to mature and shake up the meta. And third is for more casual players to have access to better build guides. Also I think the shadow nerf to headhunter will be enough to affect the meta at the higher end
I'm going to start my first HC league in Sentinel. For me it's great that all these builds are proven to be strong to I can eventually test them all once my characters die one after another.
I'm a little disappointed by the lack of new skills or balance changes mostly because I enjoy theorycrafting and have new things to think about.
But on the other hand, I quit Archnemesis after 34 challenges to help ensure I wouldn't burn out and could come back fresh for the next league. I had other build ideas I wanted to try and even started trading for some of the pieces before realizing it would be better, long term, to wait a month+ until the following league. So in that context, no major changes means I can dust off those shelved ideas and think about which "Impossible Escape" keystone will be best for my planned build.
I disagree, strongly. Claiming that the meta is solved when new builds are discovered all the time seems pretty naïve and arrogant to me. It not like nothing was changed. They added some new uniques that may enable builds that were previously subpar or impossible, like the chill ring or keystone intuitive leap jewel. The new keystones on the atlas may encourage a magic find meta, or something else, we don't know yet. Remember that poe ninja does not show you the strongest builds, it only shows you what is popular. Besides, no balance updates is in itself something new for this game. I played a dozen non-meta builds last league and I will play a dozen more this league, and they will be cheap and easy to gear because everyone will be clamoring for omniscience items. I for one, am very excited to continue trying new builds, and I hope you enjoy the new league too.
I felt the same way I kinda lost touch as soon as he said "builds are solved" - then why is reddit losing their collective minds over the rare monster changes saying HH is dead? We know for a fact what the best league starters will be. No argument there. With so many new end game uniques, new end game bosses, and a completely changed mapping experience (alter rebalancing, key stones, & rare monster changes) the idea that the "league is solved" just sounds like a projection of "I am not interested personally".
You don't seem to know what 'meta' is. Yes. The meta is solved. The best builds, are known. The fact that there are multiple more VIABLE builds, it's besides the point. The meta, the best builds, are solved. There are not going to be any new top-builds. Yeah. you can play any non meta build you want, and even those, there will be less new builds than last league, for obvious reasons.
@@elmaster65 I think I do know what meta is and I think you missed the point. Meta builds are the most powerful builds, and the point you missed was that we cannot know that the meta is solved. "There are not going to be any new top-builds." How can you know this? You can't.
I'm of your opinion as well, and the fact that there's been no new skills now 2 leagues in a row really kills me.
Like last league I could somewhat understand as we had an entire atlas system rework so the league was pretty light/meh and we had no new skills but there was a lot to explore in the game through that atlas system. This time however the league mechanic looks again pretty lame/light like archnemesis was and there aren't new skills but they really aren't doing much of anything else either. Like we get a couple new atlas tree passives, couple hyper rare uniques (that honestly don't look build defining to me), and some additional uber bosses...it really feels like almost nothing worthwhile/interesting for builds is being added into the game alongside no buffs to bad or underperforming items/skills/ascendancies really hurts my enthusiasm as someone who usually spends more time theory crafting in PoB with the stuff I find interesting than actually playing said characters.
I think the lack of skill changes at the top end makes sense ; I’d have liked some buffs to lower skills BUT I believe this is due to Archnemesis going core in the manner it has being more impactful that we may suspect.
The new Uber bosses and more specialist tree options will hopefully shake up the meta from mod league but not leaguestart
:)
Yeah I agree, solving the meta and theory crafting a new build while you play the new changes is a very exciting part of each league.
Although I can see how no major changes could appeal to more casual players, but I doubt they made the decision with that in mind, I’m pretty sure is more related to them focusing their efforts in other aspects of the game.
I think with no balance changes it also opens opportunity for us to play with the same tools and see if there is anything we missed. The meta is never really solved there is always things we miss. Im excited to come back and try to build my alt quality RoA build
I think this will allow new builds to be made it also allows them to see how item rarity affects the meta. I think this makes for a great data point.
I can understand your disappointment, but alternatively there are some things about it that excite me. I was really excited for last like, but my schedule was super busy, so I missed out on nearly every build. The chance to try the strong stuff that I couldn’t is quite good for me.
Admittedly, I would’ve been happy to see buffs on weaker skills or some new skills, but I’m most happy to just not see any nerfs. And since it almost seems like you would’ve preferred nerfs on the current ops more than buffs on weaker stuff, I do find myself having a different viewpoint than you. Although, I can understand how players who made the most out of last league can feel a little let down.
I think this creates a great excuse to get those build crafting juices flowing. Yeah, there's a bunch of powerful builds we already know. And so, many players are going to be playing those builds. Which means the best items for those builds will be hard to get.
I think this makes a great opportunity to look at off meta builds that are still great and see if you can get some more juice out of them. Or grind a ton of currency with EA or DD and then go ham on some crazy and experimental idea.
I understand crying about meta in competitive games, but not in games like poe. I played 40/40 challenges last league. I played 2 builds which one is I guess considered meta. There are a shit ton of builds I can still play. This angle is pretty much only for people who play this game as their job and for those who parrot what ever the pro player is talking.
in my defence, i only have enough time to try 1-3 builds per league, and for leagues like archnem where there were a crazy amount of different things I wanted to try but couldnt, this means i can just grab and go for trying out the other builds that I thought looked neat without most of them getting completely destroyed. I'm especially interested in the new uber endgame uniques that alter how we interact with the passive tree, such as massive thread of hope and the other one that lets you wormhole to specific keystones. New ways to minmax old builds
even moreso, due to the way the endgame is being fleshed out, we have a lot more to figure out than just how character builds interact with content, we also have to figure out how to set up the content that we want to interact with altogether.
I can pretty much understand you. I already know now that i am starting Spectral Helix, grabbing my Omni and just clear everything that stands in my way. It is for sure not that fun to play the same builds again this league... but still lets see what new idea's we find after using the new crafting method and items. I think after realizing the potential of these new methods to enable builds, we will find new exciting stuff for sure!
I am looking forward to doing physical traps as I never gotten around to doing them and glad ashes of the stars hasn't been nerfed as it seems to open up a lot of interesting builds but I'm sad we're not going to see that many new builds.
Chris Wilson said this was done to keep all the build guides from 3.17 relevant, so everyone will be able to play a proven working build. That would still be the case if they only buffed the bottom tier of underused skills. Bex said there were no nerfs, but that would still be the case if they only buffed the bottom tier of underused skills. The only explanation is that they didn't want to dedicate developer man hours to balance changes for this league because other things (like PoE2) are taking up too much of their attention. Sorry, but my hype level for this league is zero. A league either needs new skills or balance changes. With neither, it is dead on arrival.
100% agree. Feels kinda like diablo with no changes. Most people won't see those "changes" anyway (uber content) as casual have problems with killing normal bosses.
I like the no balance changes. I wanted to try balistas for a long time but had to skip the last couple of leagues due to IRL stuff. Knowing explo arrow is super strong means i may be able to tackle the new pinicle fights this league with a build i want to play.
As a casual who started the league late I'm OK with this. I don't play the uber meta usually as it is. I can see why this is disappointing to hard core theory crafters and streamers.
I have a feeling next league is nerf everything league.
thats a fair call! I completely understand it from this point of view too.
nerf melee kekw
i can entirely agree with the "game beeing solved" part.
while i can understand their possible reasonings behind that decision, i still think it will make the next league a "rather short" league.
what makes me sad is seeing so many skill gems (almost all strikes except LS in general) still left unloved and untouched for another league.
hope you still find your way into motivation, fun and all.
As a softcore player it doesn't matter to me. First build is always a farm build anyway. Game has pretty much been solved for ages, even before PoB. Builds, Treepathing, Gear, everything has mostly been streamlined. There've been very few builds that were really interesting and not some kind of 'immune' to this or 'just stack that' build. The last one that was truly fun to me was Mirror Arrow Instability. Unless there is something new and mechanical interesting it's just damage differentials. Even game mechanics are pretty much a 'don't care for a specific build (that doesn't farm like ass)'. When reading the patchnotes I'm not thinking 'oh no, what am I gonna play when build xy is nerfed?', rather 'is the investment worth it?'.
And tbh, GGGs balance and reworks are super shit. I'd rather have them not doing anything than explode a whole archetype just because.
To be fair hardcore, private leagues and racing are a different story of course.
I've played in almost all the seasons, and even before seasons were a thing. Even though no balance changes were made I am still gonna play a different starter, and maybe for the first time switch into a build that works and I can enjoy. That being said it's none of the mentioned builds. As for being solved, it would be really good to see these ubers be insanely tanky and have more mechanics that make them a whole new experience. Hard to say how it's gonna play out but we shall see, i'm optimistic.
As someone who didn't really have time for last league, I'm pretty excited. However, I'm not sure what build to go. I think I'm torn between Tectonic Slam, Discharge, and Hexblast (i want big explosions). What do you folks think?
hey badger, have you thought about creating a build around the new uniques with a diff skill that could maybe be a contender with the current meta?
Maybe you can try to "rush" to get that said unique, and respec into the build you would like to try with one of the new items?
it sucks not having new stuff straight from the start, but maybe this would ease the stagnant feel a little bit for you.
I agree that no balance changes is a bit boring. The timing of this kinda works for me though. Because of time constraints I didn't do any Omniscience builds last league, so I guess I'll do it this time around.
Most of the playerbase will not be affected by the no meta changes as most of us haven't played every build in the game yet. But I do understand how frustrating it might be for content creators, racers and most of us more experienced Wraeclastians
Me: Alright... let see which on my nerf prediction list got touched...
Criwson: No nerfs!
Me: Oh boy...
I rather appreciate the notion that the game is "solved". I take it as a bit of a challenge to see if I can unearth some hidden gem that hasn't been given proper attention. A lot of the time in these perceived stale metas people simple assume only a few builds are top tier and completely neglect to even try other builds.
I think the only people who don't like the lack of balance changes are the ones who have played everything already. I'm not one of those people. I regularly hit 38-40 achievements so I don't think I'm a casual but the are several builds I haven't tried that I know perform well and I'm going to switch it up this league. I usually play ignite builds but I'm going for poisonous concoction for league start.
I'm not interested in the league mechanic so I'm skipping the league but for someone who plans dozens of builds but only ends up playing maybe 4 because of poe retention issues, no balance changes would have given me a chance to continue down my list of planned builds without having to change anything on any of them, and the market might also be somewhat similar to last league so predicting the prices of certain items might be easier
I feel like its a try of GGG how the playerbase reacts towards a known meta
how or what will be played or not played, how is the reaction and so on - and thats a realy interesting question
the meta is solved within two weeks at most anyway and there are only so many variations of "hit pack, make it go boom".
I like it for a change (not in general, I like balance changes). Firstly I always have the feeling ggg feels the need to do more new stuff and therefor has not the time to do things proper and them taking the risk to dial back every once in a while is imo a very good thing. Also I do not believe you one bit when you say we have the endgame figured out... I am not a pro in building new characters but simply from the complexity of the game I doubt the community has maxed the potencial of the last balance changes in merely 3 month. I believe there is room for a kind of min max improvement that we never hat the opportunity to develop.
This is going to force people who enjoy creating builds to start digging even deeper, at least that's what it seems is the purpose of this. Also to give more casual players a chance to catch their breath and try different skills to see what they actually enjoy
They couldn't change skill balance when they change rare mods in the same patch. They need a base line of difficulty to then change skill balance the following league.
I feel ya. But since i usually dont play that many hours in the league, and usually 1or2builds this doesn't make a difference to me.
GGG can't win with balance changes and you know this. "You nerfed my favorite skill so bad it's dead.". "You only buffed skills that no one plays, basically no chances.". "You somehow buffed a skill that's already powerful, do you even play your game?". "You didn't buff or nerf anything, boring.". There are content creators that have thought all of these statements all within the last year.
Scrolled down to find this exact comment! It is 100% true. There's always disappointment to be found one way or another if you take a particular angle. Thanks for writing it so I didnt have to.
Silver lining is that I get to try out your discharge assassin! Looks super fun to play but I didn't get around to it last league because I really wanted to do ward loop before that gets nerfed (definitely a recommended build). How do you think your discharge build will hold up against the new uber bosses?
Completely agree, I fucking hate the fact the there are no balance changes. I mean I was so excited for the new update and then bam no balance. I love the fact that every league something else is playable and I can do a new build and it Wil be valid. Last league it felt like there where like 3 good builds and I dint like 2 of then, which means I probably wont like the league this time around.
I think a lot of people are sleeping on the fact that we got a new node for each ascendency. Are they likely to be crap? Probably, sure, but there are a lot of them. There's probably something OP in there!
I think the issue is rather that just because these nodes are new it will be super expensive and the drop rates of these jewels was bad enough already, adding 7 more possible outcomes makes it so every single one is even rarer. Adding the fact that bosses are harder, white and yellow map farming got nerfed (by changing several atlas passives) I suspect that you are technically right that there could be really fun things in there but also that the chance of experiencing them is similar to playing with Stasis Prison...
Do we know that they added only one unique node per Ascendancy (3 per class)? I had a thought that they might be using this to 'pre-check' some of the PoE2 Ascendancy nodes...
To be honest, this almost doesn't feel like a new league. I'm not a fan of GGG's usual nerfing approach (double or triple-tapping), but if they didn't want to nerf strong builds, they could've at least buffed weaker stuff to shake things up. Right now, with basically no changes... it kind of feels like we're just getting an extension of the current league. I doubt anyone would've complained about buffs to nonviable stuff that give more options, and they would have "unsolved" the game again, in part at least.
I only played 2 builds last league, didn't even try any Omni builds so I still have plenty to discover. :)
Havent played in a few leagues, but I do agree that for me the league cadence was more about the meta shift/reset than the league mechanic
On the one hand I'd normally agree with you, but I feel like the whole reason to do this is to have a known proper benchmark for the new monster mod system.
I’m less sad about no nerfs and more sad about no buffs. Not sure how excited I am not having new builds to think about.
I'm ok with no balance changes, but I tihnk that a couple new/reworked skills would have been great with that approach
i fully agree with your perspective and i feel a bit sad despite there are good things going to be added. It doesnt really feel like a new league since there are AGAIN no new skill gems which i didnt expect and no balance changes.
Iam not to excited to be honest for the new league.
I started 3.17 with EA. It was great.
This time I am starting with something silly. PathFinder summoner. I will have to be creative at least until HoAg, and I will travel across the scion area before hitting minion nodes.
I... Don't... Care... It's gonna work, and I will have epic fun.
Having played this game for as long as I have I cannot believe that the game is "solved" after 3 months of a patch. I'd bet my life that there are quite a few builds that are at the same level or better than the current "meta" that we just havent figured out yet. I think you could have no balance changes for a year and not have the game be "solved". there is just too much crazy stuff in this game. I mean look at the builds that someone like Mathil and many other people made last league. I only use him as an example because i watched his vid just before this one but it seems like just about everyone that really dug deep into builds last league came up with ideas that were nowhere near the meta and made them work just fine, doing all content and most of them would do the new Uber content as well with enough time and skill. I guess my point is that just because the "meta" stays the same from one patch to another doesnt mean that the game is "solved" and there are still an un-countable number of builds that are still capable of melting everything the game has to offer.
As I love theory crafting the most, I am pretty disappointed too
As someone who only plays a limited number of builds and mostly play in standard, I am ok with no player balance changes. I never liked having to review my builds every 3 months and having some of my favorite skills getting nerfed and become obsolete just to "shake up the meta".
I don't mind the lack of balance changes. But I am sorely disappointed we've gone 2 leagues in a row now without a handful of new skills.
I mean, I dislike them not changing the EA not because of the meta itself but because it makes my fire dot build items more pricy. Personally, Idc what other people play, I play this game with friends and at my own pace. I don't play meta builds because I can get the same amount of power for less $ with off meta builds by yellow and early red maps. Beyond that, depending on what I am playing and market demand, usually things works out in my favor paying a lot less for upgrades.
As someone who enjoys playing dot builds league start, I wanted to play ignite last league as my rotation is back on ignite, but EA made me shift to poison. It all depends on how you want to approach the game, I could care less what others play. The more people play the same build I don't, the more happy I am. 6link dark scorn last league by 5th week was sub 1.5ex for me on my 2nd poison build. Play what is fun, not what people preach to be meta in PoE and you will have a much better experience.
maybe I'll try to do ice trap build this league, don't know how the sentinel mechanics gonna add to all of this 🤔
I am both excited and disappointed by this. It is very comforting to know the handful of cool builds out there i wanted to try this league are still going to be viable in the same way.
but its always exciting to see changes though and there are definitely out layers right now that need it.
I am over all happy with the lack of changes this time.
@Badger.... Want to play Blade Trap? My dude... IF you do I would love for you to entertain Energy Blade Blade Trap. And YES it DOES work.
I haven't seen anyone really do it honestly.
2 leagues without new skills, makes it really hard to feel excited.
well, I think they make no changes because they want to see how monster rekt us.
probably need to tweak about defensive side a little bit considering archnemesis mod.
oh and, they didn't mention (not even in trailer) that they removed the epic arhnemesis mod (innocence/brine king/ kitava)
imagine juiced map with rare monster with those things, absolute clusterf*ck
I would like new skill yes BUT i dont mind lack of player balance change
why?
becouse game balance chenge with monster modifires they gonna flip alot around so i understand they chenge it and they wana see how that effect game
I'm quite sure the game is quite solved with archnemesis mods on all rares. I'll hold my judgement.
I'm sad there are no new skills.
I might also start Blade Trap.
Honesly, not having new skills or balance changing is a great shame
What i don't like about the no balance changes is that if you don't like the current meta build, you don't really have a reason to play this league. I usually don't even play enough to reach the current uber end game content, adding uber uber end game content is not for me.
They should have at least buffed under used skills. That way they don't remove existing build they just add more of them.
A double-edged sword for the build scientists out there. They lightened on the brain's firing neurons for problem solving builds in return for learning and problem solving those endgames that are coming. Not playing at a chill enough pace is going to be both awkward and a hit on retention perhaps.
Lightning tendrils OP confirmed
No Blance changes is sad, I wait for boost again weak chaos skills like death aura and mabe add more scaling option... I wait for new skill gems, new supports etc. Sadly we don't get anyone yet ehhh
I wish we saw some buffs but I know they can't do just buffs and never nerf but the amount of leagues I have gone into with zero interest because what I enjoy playing is way worse then it needs to be is something I really get tired of. FOM with builds is pretty lame when you never know if next league the build you wanted to try is now lame. So that is a nice thing about no changes.
Love the new endgame stuff but disappointed with 6 months of no new skills and where the leagues aren’t nearly as exciting as the atlas passive tree
Yeah, I also don't understand this move. Not only is there a amount of players who will not even start without a new build but also player retention will be at an all time low. There is really no build with a power level that allows more casual players to achieve everything, which I havnt played yet.
Ngl, I have a feeling not many people will go back to EA. Totems aren't for everyone, and people like trying new builds. My money is on skeles personally
Imo EA totems was bait for the most part. Strong? Yes, but the play style is certainly not for everyone (for most people I would think)
80% elementalists were playing a bow in 3.17 according on poe ninja on week one. Why would a caster class be supposed to use a bow? it sucks
I think thats exactly why they didnt change anything, so we dont have to deal with new builds AND uber content
I hear this complaint and I think it's generally kinda valid, but with how GGG can take a freakin sledge hammer to build integrity sometimes, I'm also a bit relieved that they held back on making any hasty changes and instead take their time on it.
I get a bit excited too trying to figure out what to play, but it can also be a bit frustrating when they kill entire archetypes when all they wanted to do was make ONE thing weaker. I feel like PoE is just too complex a game to expect GGG to really be shifting things adequately every 3-4 months. If they want time, I say give em.
...maybe one league a year without player balance changes IS a solid plus...
So Hi, can I ask a question, anyone. I started playing frost witch a few leagues back and then two back I changed to a new cold build, now I'm not saying the builds are bad or anything, it may well be that I am bad, which is most likely. The best I have done is level 79 and just maps levels 1-5 and if I try the thief guild stuff I tend to just die :( So that is not good. So yes I like the build and I like the vortex because I can run away and cast it and that works great unlike the wither spell where I can set out 5 balls that go after targets for a bit then I need to recast, it works well until I get caught off balance and I get snuffed out like a candle. My build seems to have zero defence so again no complaints I'm sure the issue is self-inflicted. I have not figured out how to tell when an item is good, I may well always pick the bad things. Well OK, I can tell when I have defences in a place like frost, poison, etc.
So can anyone suggest an easy build that I can play in SSF and be really defensive, and still being cold would be cool but not required I should probably move on?
Look up a "SSF cold dot occultist" and you'll find a ton of build guides.
I would have been ok with no balance changes this league, if they at least brought in some new skills. But both of those things weren't here, because the league mechanic is overly complex. (3 things to activate, 3 things to control how they interact by levelling them up, with new modifiers within themselves... And what's worse, it will probably be a league mechanic people will stop interacting way before the league ends, because it requires far too much tuning to be good. Not to mention, it's far TOO complex to ever go core. [just look at the leagues that did, they are mostly click and go] Which probably means, it's excess work that dies in 3 months.)
And what did they give the "average" player? Ultra end-game content. Content only 5% or less of the playerbase will actually touch. Sure, this will keep some streamers playing before the dying point of the league, but I'm predicting right now that league rentention in 3.18 will be at an all time low. For the average player, it's exactly the last league with more buttom pressing. (Which no one likes.) For the streamers, it's the same with 7 more bosses, so most of them will just rush their insane boss killer builds to do them, and then what? Repeat the same 10 builds from last league "for content"?
I don't know man, I want to be optimistic, but they made it hard this time around.
There's always someone who complains. Nerf shit, then the casuals u just mentioned are pissed as well. Now u leave them power in a known place and you still complain.
And sorry, but nothing new for casuals? Even more atlas tree optimization/personalization in content, literally being able to kill content u dont want to play etc...
But I guess there are people who are never happy
Ah yes, Tornado and Link skills are still meta
/s
actually, if you play hardcore ... the game does not feel solved because the monsters have really rippy archnemesis mods.
I am thinking that they are doing less at this point due to needing to putting work into the endgame. Along with putting more time into PoE 2, which I am hoping that they are doing. So that sometime within 2024 they can launch PoE 2. Although I would love to get more news on PoE 2.
"The Game is Solved" ?????????????????????????????????????????? This statement actually hurt my brain...
I'm just disappointed that melee has kind of been left out again.
Ofc there is melee builds that do well but most of us never see that kind of currency to even get our build anywhere near that lol.
Or even just look into some skills that don't really get used a lot and just buff them or rework them. Id suck a banana for melee to be looked into and balanced a bit better just a bit ;)
Ofc I have a few builds I'd like to try out and do my SB dex stacking as that was tons of fun watching bosses melt Haha!.
Lol I've actually wanted this for a long time. I HATE NERFS AND HAVE QUIT MANY TIMES OVER THEM. I HATE NERFS WAY MORE THEN YOU HATE NOT HAVING THEM.
the big balance change is coming... i mean, i think its cool that we get another league to destroy shit and kill the uber bosses.. when the big balance change comes you'll get that same feeling. like, oh man, all the builds that killed the ubers aren't viable anymore. so its kind of like a X2. we get to go hard on the new content with the old meta again and next league we'll be forced to re think things. i was personally hoping for an ascendancy rework but.. whats the point.. poe 2 is coming soon and that will change everything. I think thats why they're just developing the end game from here until poe 2. when poe 2 comes its a big balance change and all that new end game content is there for us to enjoy.
I'm very glad for no balance changes once in a while. There are so many strong builds to play that 99% of people don't have the time to try all of them so I look at it as an opportunity to try out all the strong builds I didn't get to play last league and would've been maybe disappointed I missed out on.
I really dislike that nothing was changed due to how powerful certain builds (mainly through certain OP items) are. I just don't understand why underplayed skills weren't buffed. That would allow people to theorycraft and aim to beat the meta builds while having something strong to fall back on. I'm loving everything else about 3.18 but the lack of change for builds really leaves a bad taste in my mouth for this league's longevity.
Balance changes are a huge part for me to come back every league and test out new builds. So with no changes i'm tempted to not play this league at all
I think their main focus now is poe 2. that game should and needs to be 10 times better than current poe.. those are just filler expansions/leagues nothing too crazy can and will happen
Having no balance changes is insanely boring, i hate it
Maybe this is the QOL league people has been asking for….
Couldn't agree more.
The league doesn’t look exciting to me. It seems like a lot of work to keep track of your sentinels, decide when to use them and the different kinds. Having to repair them is another big oof. I hope the rewards are good enough to justify this amount of mental work when I just want to mindlessly kill shit and loot.
Ice trap build Update when?
I'd rather see some hype about things, I want to be excited about the league!
yea i wanted ability changes, alot needs buffs imo.