Dammit i been doing this all wrong for so long. This makes alot more sense. I was locking in the calipers and not leaving them loose and I never tightened them down while holding the brake. I learn something new every video I watch.
i used to do this years(20)ago regulary with my dirtbikes when changing tyres. i havent had dirtbikes for 2 decades and lost this important knowledge. thanks very much for reminding me of this. youre instructions are clear and precise. thanks again.👍
Damn Dave Moss your deep into bikes man. Been riding for 44 years and am a mechanic by trade. Your videos are excellent and carefully thought out. Thanks for your contribution to motorcycling man. Cheers
Thanks for the tips and the tuning Dave. You set up my suspension a few months ago at Streets of Willow on my 2023 V4. It made a big difference at the track and so much better on the street. Hope to see you at the track again in November.
Besides your owners manual and shop manual specific to your vehicle, this gentleman is a goto for how to work on and properly set up your motorcycle for maximum enjoyment.
I LOVE the simplicity of setting stuff like this up correctly. Also thanks for highlighting the potential issue with the step I skipped when mounting my calipers
Thanks Dave I have found your channel useful so many times and I love to learn more and more. Too bad my thirst for knowledge began at a later time in life.
I wonder how many bikes leave dealers without any of this being done properly, never mind those of us messing around at home or at the track? Yet another really useful video.....keep them coming Fella!
Hi Dave thanks so much for making and posting this video. A so called bike mechanic ripped me off royally and made a right mess of my bike a year ago. Still trying to put everything right. Could have been killed riding home it was so bad. This video has given me something else to check. Certain he wouldn't have done any of this. I get a violent wobble on my steering at any speed no matter how slow.
Dave, about twenty years ago (!) I was a customer at the GMD Computrack shop in El Segundo, just outside LAX. They did work for the American Honda roadrace team in AMA, and I'd seen their CBR600 Supersport bikes in back of the shop. Morris told me that the team was chasing setup problems at the track with one of those CBRs, and it was traced back to front end misalignments which occurred when cinching down the straps inside the truck! One crew was doing it correctly (Miguel Duhamel's, if I recall) and the other crew was twisting things up. A simple matter to fix, once the problem was understood and the knowledge was shared. Even the professionals will mess things up sometimes!
Dave is _the man!_ This is superb information. I just put new tires on my VFR and wasn't aware of this protocol, but now that I've seen it, it makes perfect sense. Thank you, Dave. I had Dave set up the suspension on my CBR600F4i at a track day at Miller years ago, and it _transformed_ the handling of the bike; the bike's handling was *on rails* after Dave set me up. 👍
I had a hard time getting my axle back in, probably due to a misaligned fork. I'm going to follow this procedure and hopefully my fork will realign. Thanks for this tutorial. When you're not doing this type of maintenance on a consistent bases, it's tough to remember the correct steps.
I'm doing my first track day this weekend and just put on fresh tires for it. Glad I saw this video beforehand as I learned something new and it makes perfect sense to me why you did the things, in did in that order. I will redo my front end first thing tomorrow, thanks Dave!
I just did this to a bike I had rebuilt the forks on... Suberb. Now rides like it should. Thank you so much... Everyday is day to learn something new. 👍
@@stefan2meter If you do not do it the fork leg can be misaligned and bind giving 1. Stiction 2. Uneven brake pad contact 3. Angled braking forces 4. Wheel doesn't spin 4 or 5 times, maybe half a turns
Thank you so much! I replaced my rotors and pads, but for the life of me couldn't work out why I was getting uneven contact patches on my rotors... Subbed.
@@jamieadams9578 Thanks for subscribing! Next step is a toothbrush and soapy water for the caliper to make sure the pistons move evenly (yes, there's a video for cleaning brake calipers). Enjoy!
@@TeamSimpsonRacing Hi Toby, yes it did. If your discs are causing pulsing of the hand lever or judder then you should check them for warping. If the floating bobbins are dry and not allowing the disc to self correct or the disc has been overheated, then it could be warped. There are plenty of videos on youtube around how to service the bobbins and free them up.
Dave, you helped me tune my suspension with your video's. But there was a glitch I couldnt tune out of there. Ocassionally I would feel some unbalance in the front. Not all the time, but enough to notice in certain pieces of road. Sometimes the bike wanted me to lean at slow speeds, and 2 seconds later not Etc. Continuous small adjustments... . A motorcycle mechanic fixed a leaking fork seal couple months ago. I figured the oil must be old on one side or different viscosity... They claimed to me the other one was recently replaced already... Today I did what you showed here. And jezus, the floating axle side exluded about 1mm now, before it was flush. 1 hand springing the front imediatly felt a change in smoothness and balance/preload etc. between left and right. Not like the seals where binding... Drove today, and it cuts the cornerline way more stable. Bro, your my hero. Again you indirectly saved my life, and improved my driving experience.!!!! A question, I didnt release the calipers, should I calibrate those again to the new wheel position?
Thanks for watching and using the content to assist you and your motorcycle.. Yes and go through the full reset to 100% ensure the calipers are correct.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks Dave.Sorry I forgot to mention I do have older type calipers which are mounted sideways onto the fork. I had a buddy's fork in mind which has same as the video.
You are one of the GOAT per my knowledge and understanding based on what I have seen in my experience with various people and motorcycles! I have always wondered why sometimes I have so much drag in my front wheel after tyre/brake pad change! Do we need to loosen up front wheel axle and then brake adjust after replacing pads as well? Keep up the good work.
With a pad change, rotors need sanding. With the tyre change, you just follow the process. In either case, getting the axle torqued correctly is the first step. Leaving the pinch bolts loose on the leg the fork goes through for installation is the correct starting point. Thanks for watcxhing.
Wow, thanks a lot, I bought new bike and hear and fell some repeating friction from front wheel increasing accordingly with speed, so have to align wheel and brakes properly. Thanks for sharing !!!
Thank you for this! I have R6 and always tightened everything at once!😅 well the bike has been working still great nothing is bended, but next time I will do it this way☺
Thanks Dave! I didn't know any of this. I'm about to use your tips to align the front end of a 2003 CRF150F dirt bike. They have a similar fork design as the sports bikes you were working on (a threaded left fork for the axle and pinch bolts on the right fork).
I tried to put my 06 axle back in and it wouldn't go through the other fork! Pounding it in ruined the whole axle and the fork! I had to sand down a lip on the fork and the axle and then ended up buying a new axle! I don't know how this happened! I think maybe my stand is not level, it's 100 degrees out? Do I have to put the axle in the freezer lol?
Was this a first time event for the axle installation? If so, what was different this time? Were the forks recently worked on? Is this a new stand? Something created an alignment issue and hopefully the new axle will go in with no issues once qwe find the cause.
@@catalystreactionsbw yes just got bike and never removed the wheels before. I do on my dirtbike all the time. I think it's the new stands I got. It was hot out so the parts may have just been expanded and tight.
I know that bike has less suspension travel than my dirt bike, but I have learned not to be a fan of any method of getting the fork legs parallel if you are not measuring it somehow. Using this method on my dirt bike is also standard YT procedure, but after I actually made a gauge, (1" dia. round stock aluminum that fits through my brake disk, faced off on a lathe on both ends to 5.661" long, the distance between my plated fork legs, calculated from a triple clamp.), I found the pump and brake method to be off about .030". After I got the legs parallel within + or - .001", I found that I had to go to the next stiffer fork springs because I eliminated the binding. Lots of riders are wearing out their bushings prematurely, and not getting the best action from their forks. It does not matter if the axle is threaded on one end, or clamped on both ends. The forks should be parallel, and not many are. :)
My workshop manual says to use feeler guages to check clearance between the calipers and the rotor. (Brembo calipers without guide bushings). I've just carefully eyeballed it every time with success so far.
Very understandable and logical with the sequence that these steps are done. If the rotors are not tightened last, is that why you can warp your rotors?
If you simply tighten the calipers without holding the brake on they can align off center. That can contribute to the rotor being stressed and potentially warped in time.
excellent video dave.j had problems with the front wheel not spinning freely. went to a lot of trouble. stripping down the calipers and changing all seals and a 4 hour brake bleed🙄got there eventually. had I seated the axle correctly like u have done in the first place everything would have been fine 😬 every days a school day.
A tip of my hat to you for the commitment to make it right and thank you for watching this video so you have a permanent method from this point on as the first step.
Wow I thought the other end was the captive end. And I’ve been having chatter. I’ve obviously been doing this so wrong. Wow thank you so much. I actually had put my front wheel on and left my tools on my seat so I could make sure I was doing things right and glad I did. I have also never used the front brakes method holding them while tightening the calipers. The reason I question my methods was during removal of my front wheel when I was loosening my pinch bolts I heard a click which seemed like one of the forks settled into a new position on the axle making me realize something wasn’t in line. I was definitely having chatter under hard braking and now I know why.
Thank you! You will be really pleased with the benefits as every time you do this the front wheel will spin free or show you the brake calipers need a cleaning via inconsistent rotation speed.
Wow....been doing it all wrong then for years. If you haven’t already, please make a video on setting up the rear wheel properly. Every day is a school day!
Thanks for this video! Even though it's been some time since upload and I keep coming back to this video to review the procedure to balance the free fork. I have one question: why would you first tighten the brake calipers which are mounted directly onto the forks before bouncing the front end and not first bounce it and then center and tighten the brake calipers? Only after bouncing, tightening the pinch bolts, lifting it back up to spin the wheel to get the brake calipers centered would give you the best braking performance no?
I set the caliper nut 1/4 turn from tight, bounce the front end and torque the pinch bolts. Then spin the wheel and hold the brake lever firmly on and torque the brake bolts. It has been a while, I am fighting cancer and need to take time for myself to win this fight.
The exception to this is the forks on an 06/07 zx10r that has a "normal" bolt and nut as an axle (neither side floats). The guy I bought my zx6r race bike from put on 06 zx10 forks and I get a bit of excess stiction in the front with no way to correct it. I might send one fork leg to a machine shop to bore the axle hole out and get a spacer made to float the fork. But that will be a winter project
u can use the bending on the free leg to square it.. with same procedures but instead, bend it (free leg) far in then out, measure it if u want to, and half the distance should be the middle.. for some its quicker and no bounce needed. whatever u comfort with:)
Thanks for the advise. After I've done this I saw there is a gap between the spacer and the fork leg. It's on the side where you put the axle in.I also saw some grooves sticking out on the bush on same side. How so?
Good instruction - for safety sake - double Check all screws before riding: leaving those calipers loose and tightening them later is a risk because you may forget them. My advice: never interrupt work when your assembling the wheels and brakes. Paint marks can help to be 100% sure.
Great Video. I am a newbie and have never disassembled the front axle. I am wondering whether the front wheel is free to move along the front axle without the calipers. If not, what is holding it? Thanks a lot!
The front wheel is free to move laterally if the spacer set up allows it and if so, the spacer(s) are worn and need to be replaced. Normally there is no lateral play.
I have an R6, same as shown in the video. Question: Doesn't it make more sense to torque the axle nut BEFORE the pinch bolts? Note that I do have a great big hex driver socket to hold the axle still so I'm able to torque without tightening the pinch bolts. Yeah, you are seating the axle from the right leg side and lightly tightening the axle bolt so in theory that left leg is where it's supposed to wind up, but doesn't the final torque move things just a bit more? Tightening the pinch bolts first prevents that (assuming it's true).
If you want to torque the nut at the beginning you need to trap the axle via the pinch bolts and then release the pinch bolts again to continue through the process,
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks. I have a big hex socket that I use to keep the axle from turning while tightening, so no need to do up/undo the pinch bolts. Is immobilizing the axle the only reason why you do up the left-side pinch bolts before torquing the axle bolt?
Great video without any needless chit chat. Thank you. Great work. Got a question also: When aligning a 4 pinch bolt fork, would it make a difference, if tightening the calipers after pushing the forks down and before tightening the second pair of pinch bolts? Instead of tightening the calipers right after tightening the first pair?
Thanks for the compliment. Given your description it will not matter if the pinch bolts on the nut/fasten leg are tight, so just make sure the side that the axle goes through is loose. Then you can tighten pinch bolts and calipers as you choose.
For one set of pinch bolts on the axle, if im trying to straighten my forks and have the lower tree clamps loose as well, would i still torque the axle first before pumping the forks? This video has helped a lot since i believe having the axle threaded into one side has made all my attempts at aligning my wheels go all wrong.
When you nip up the callipers with the brake on it ads weight to the wheel and moves the caliper back a little the opposite way of the breaking force, whay i do is spin the wheel forward motion pull the brake fasten the lever on, with velcro strap, just before tightening caliper bolts i hold the wheel with a forward retention ?
4:00 I recently removed and cleaned my three piston front calipers and was surprised how much static drag they seem to have. They spin, but the dragging makes a sound much like this one, so I guess it’s normal?
Yes that's normal as long as they are not actually stopping the wheel completely it's not a real issue, this happens when the pistons pull back but the pads stay against the rotor ever so slightly, since there is no pressure on it, heating and wear is not a real issue, quick fix to this is using break pad glue against the pistons so they pull the pad back with them, on the road it's recommended to always use this, only reason not to use it would be on track and just so you keep things clean and easy to swap. Cleaning those little channels that the little flaps on the pad go into + the pins it slides on can go a long was too.
Glad you made the time to clean the calipers with a toothbrush and soapy water. As long as the pistons move evenly, job done! The dragging sound is normal and should be a continuous sound.
To Joao Santos. Your comment is not accessible. Yes, do it by tightening the pinch bolts on the bolt/nut side first and then tighten the free leg second.
Thank you Dave very useful info! I came off my honda 2000 cbr600FY a low speed low side. New mirror and repair the fairings and it was fine except the steering has to be slightly to the right to have the wheel forward? Forks have been dropped off at a specialist (mct) and he said the forks looked straight so I’m hoping it was just the forks turning in the yokes???
Remove the yokes and see if they are truly flat on a piece of glass. If they are on the bike, loosen the steering stem nut to finger tight and install one fork. Bring the other fork in and if it is off center the yokes need to be looked at.
Dave Moss Tuning when you say “bring the other fork in and see if it’s off centre” you mean install it but no need to torque everything and just see if both forks are parallel by measuring top and bottom? Thanks Dave, when I get my suspension back and the fairings i will be in touch regarding a set up. I ow you some £££ anyway tbh because I’ve leaned so much already.
@@Bikeadelic Locate one leg and bolt it in place. Bring the other leg through the lower yoke and see if it is on center with the upper yoke. If not, then the yokes need checking.
Very clear and very helpful, thank you. A quick question - why do we centre the calipers before bouncing the forks? If the 'free' fork leg does move, since the caliper is fixed to it, won't that mean that the caliper has moved slightly too and will need to be re-centred?
Yes, that can happen if the free leg 'adjusts' post bounce, then the caliper on it would be out of alignment and would ned to be reset. Centering calipers would be the last task logically.
@@catalystreactionsbw Came to post the exact question. Thanks for the explanation and the tips to center everything. Your video with the narrative explanation goes worlds beyond what the service manual says.
Dave, I just put a new front tyre on my Husky 701 Enduro and reinstalled it. The first ride noticed the front brake is very stiff and doesn't modulate. Assuming the legs being misaligned with the brake caliper is the cause? Will try this trick tonight.
If all you did was change the tyre, the only variable is the mounting procedure. So, try this trick tonight. If the wheel is still binding, you might take a closer look at the brake pad wear and take a tooth brush to the brake caliper pistons.
On my cb300r the forks are a little different. I plan on changing the fire tire and was wondering if the process is the same? It has clamps on both forks and is a single rotor set up
@@catalystreactionsbw thanks for that. I am trying to get comfortable doing servicing and maintenance on my bike but unfortunately tidbits like this aren't included in the workshop manual. Missed seeing you at Hampton Downs but look forward to the next opportunity.
Good tipper. It's what I do. I have to keep everything taut but wrenchable. 58mm marzocchi that apparently I'm the only person alive who has one on his Harley. They were huge money new. I got mine off a custom chrome buyout in 2007 for 100.00 trees also 100.00. Wanna hear something fun about brain injuries? I just realized this year why it vibrates so hard. I had a bad day and never oiled them. Yeah...get em in boys. I never said I was 100%.
Have a 2021 690 couple hundred miles and it appears the bars are not straight. Check the rear wheel to make sure it's straight, all good. Do you have a vid for straightening the bars?
We have this, and hope this is what you are looking for: th-cam.com/video/9O7naTxJeV8/w-d-xo.html. You can always use "handlebars" in the search window to bring up other videos.
Hi Dave. I followed theRSV4 front wheel removal and fitting guide on my ‘19 Tuono RR and finfpd that the axle sits 1mm to 2mm proud outside the left fork leg. Where might I have gone wrong? Cheers for the helpful videos. Andrew
And what to do if the forks are not the same length? When I lift the front with my 2 front stands one is shorter...does removing Preload help? Left is for Preload and right for rebound... Left I think is longer...
Check the measurement of your fork tubes in the triple tree and you may find that the shorter fork leg is set up further in the Triple Tree so you need to loosen it up and set it the same length as the other , that's my two cents anyhow
Great question. That would make sense when there is preload in one leg and when tuning, we do not make the forks align based on the engineering design.
Just asking... On 2nd Gen versys 650 are Preload adjustments in both legs.. On 3rd Gen only in one...on 2nd where forks vertically equal.. On 3rd none.. It was pain in the ass to install the axle and I was afraid not to damage the threads...
I did this yesterday and I get a lot of chatter from the forks when i come to a stop,I don't understand why. I have a bike with pinch bolts on both sides. I have pumped the forks first and did the correct procedure,and then i mounted the calipers and aligned those too. I did this multiple times before and I had no chatter,but for some reason now I have it,I can feel the binding through my handlebar when coming to a stoplight...
@@catalystreactionsbw just when I am about to stop,the last few rotations of the wheel,it almost sounds like a quiet trumpet,but now i did the process again and it is fine for now. Could it be the bushings inside the forks making the noise? They are overdue for service anyway,in the winter
@@TheCvac 1. Sand blast the rotors over Winter then clean them with alcohol. 2. Make sure the brake pads are even in wear between both sides. 3. Clean the brake calipers with a tooth brush and soapy water. That sound is normally from pad to rotor friction.
Trying to get the "free leg" straight by pushing down on the forks, and then calipers to ensure they are perfectly aligned with the rotors. That harmony allows the front wheel to spin for several revolutions.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thx "Dave". I could see the process and related to equipment I have worked on in the past. (rotating assemblies). We would minimize friction/stiction and listen to it when it would rotate to tune it. Cheers
@@catalystreactionsbw Sorry for the late reply. You would feel//hear the system as it worked. With power and freewheeling. It had to be very smooth in operation. Friction meant wear. Wear meant particles which would contaminate the coatings. Cheers
I’ve ended up here after watching you replacing fork seals on the R6, making it look a simple job! Not sure if should be attacking the job or not, or if should just pay to have the job done properly. If I was to carry this job out, what fork oil would you recommend.? I’m a bit of a fatty weighing in at 14st, 200lbs! Great advice on the front wheel alignment tho Dave, I to will be following the great advice given in this video as I’m a sucker for being meticulous 👍🏻
None of this matters at all if your forks are twisted. Remove the forks and roll them to make sure they are straight. Then make sure the steering stem nut is loose. Install one fork and tighten the lower triple clamp bolt/bolts. Install the other fork and see if it will not locate. If that is the case, the lower is bent and needs straightening.
I’m on a tracer 9gt which has the semi active suspension. This means that I can’t push down on the front forks when the bike is not running. My understanding is the bike has to be moving in order for the suspension to move. How would you handle that?
@@catalystreactionsbw Yes I have achieved it! I have left my front wheel and brakes perfect thanks to you, now my wheel spins and spins! hahaha :D greetings from Galicia, Spain. a big hug!
It’s the little things like this that people miss. 27 years as a car mechanic and I’m still learning stuff like this. Love your work Dave
Thank you for watching!
Dammit i been doing this all wrong for so long. This makes alot more sense. I was locking in the calipers and not leaving them loose and I never tightened them down while holding the brake. I learn something new every video I watch.
i used to do this years(20)ago regulary with my dirtbikes when changing tyres. i havent had dirtbikes for 2 decades and lost this important knowledge.
thanks very much for reminding me of this. youre instructions are clear and precise. thanks again.👍
Thank you for being nudged and sharing what you will start doing again based on the importance it had for you with your dirt bikes!
Damn Dave Moss your deep into bikes man. Been riding for 44 years and am a mechanic by trade. Your videos are excellent and carefully thought out. Thanks for your contribution to motorcycling man. Cheers
Thanks for your honest comments, thank you! I appreciate you watching and enjoying the content.
Thanks for the tips and the tuning Dave. You set up my suspension a few months ago at Streets of Willow on my 2023 V4.
It made a big difference at the track and so much better on the street.
Hope to see you at the track again in November.
Thank you. Next SoCal date is Chuckwalla Nov 6th with Moto Forza.
Besides your owners manual and shop manual specific to your vehicle, this gentleman is a goto for how to work on and properly set up your motorcycle for maximum enjoyment.
Wow, thanks!
I LOVE the simplicity of setting stuff like this up correctly.
Also thanks for highlighting the potential issue with the step I skipped when mounting my calipers
Dave, you are a good man for sharing your extensive knowledge with the motorcycle community.
I appreciate that!
Thanks Dave I have found your channel useful so many times and I love to learn more and more. Too bad my thirst for knowledge began at a later time in life.
I wonder how many bikes leave dealers without any of this being done properly, never mind those of us messing around at home or at the track? Yet another really useful video.....keep them coming Fella!
14.2 million
Most of them.
Been researching this for 2 years. Can tell you with 99% accuracy that the number is 11.3 million. You were close though!
If not all of them! I’m doing this myself in a few minutes, what a great help this video has been.
Dave did a video on this a long time back, I’ve been doing this ever since and it certainly makes your bike run true! 👍
Hi Dave thanks so much for making and posting this video.
A so called bike mechanic ripped me off royally and made a right mess of my bike a year ago. Still trying to put everything right. Could have been killed riding home it was so bad.
This video has given me something else to check. Certain he wouldn't have done any of this.
I get a violent wobble on my steering at any speed no matter how slow.
Dave, about twenty years ago (!) I was a customer at the GMD Computrack shop in El Segundo, just outside LAX. They did work for the American Honda roadrace team in AMA, and I'd seen their CBR600 Supersport bikes in back of the shop. Morris told me that the team was chasing setup problems at the track with one of those CBRs, and it was traced back to front end misalignments which occurred when cinching down the straps inside the truck! One crew was doing it correctly (Miguel Duhamel's, if I recall) and the other crew was twisting things up. A simple matter to fix, once the problem was understood and the knowledge was shared. Even the professionals will mess things up sometimes!
Great information and thank you for sharing!
Finally - we waited for that to come now for serveral years, thank you for your service!
Thanks for this video Dave. I’m about to take both my wheels out to change the tyres and this content is a great help. Keep it up!
Thank you!
Dave is _the man!_ This is superb information. I just put new tires on my VFR and wasn't aware of this protocol, but now that I've seen it, it makes perfect sense. Thank you, Dave. I had Dave set up the suspension on my CBR600F4i at a track day at Miller years ago, and it _transformed_ the handling of the bike; the bike's handling was *on rails* after Dave set me up. 👍
I had a hard time getting my axle back in, probably due to a misaligned fork. I'm going to follow this procedure and hopefully my fork will realign. Thanks for this tutorial. When you're not doing this type of maintenance on a consistent bases, it's tough to remember the correct steps.
I'm doing my first track day this weekend and just put on fresh tires for it. Glad I saw this video beforehand as I learned something new and it makes perfect sense to me why you did the things, in did in that order. I will redo my front end first thing tomorrow, thanks Dave!
Have a great time and welcome to the track! Don't forget to find your pressures and gain cold to hot should be 3-4psi ideally.
Thanks Mr Moss brilliant advice👌 Most of us just don't know these intricacies and encounter problems when we least expect it
Thank for the comment - tips and tricks can really make a difference!
Dave glad to see you're doing well and looking forward to seeing you again up here in Canada or at the Ridge when this mess is over :)
I, like everyone else am anxious to get back to traveling to help riders worldwide. A little more patience......
This is a great video , after watching loads of different people and doing my own bikes I learnt the proper way here . I tightened the caliper first
Thanks for your thoughts! Glad the video helped you.
after all those years i just learned quite a bit in this video thanks Dave
I just did this to a bike I had rebuilt the forks on... Suberb. Now rides like it should.
Thank you so much... Everyday is day to learn something new. 👍
Thank you for sharing your experience!
I learn something new every video I watch, thank you for your time.
Glad I saw this, It`s good to see a Professional show how it should be done !! >>> Thank You Dave !!
Thank you for this video. I am learning every day something new about my bike and your videos are pretty much the best.
Thank you for the kind words and enjoy your learning from our videos!
Ooopsie, I’ve learned something today
Same for me! Will be redoing mine soon... the right way. Would be nice to learn -why- this needs to be done.
@@stefan2meter If you do not do it the fork leg can be misaligned and bind giving 1. Stiction 2. Uneven brake pad contact 3. Angled braking forces 4. Wheel doesn't spin 4 or 5 times, maybe half a turns
Thank you so much! I replaced my rotors and pads, but for the life of me couldn't work out why I was getting uneven contact patches on my rotors... Subbed.
@@jamieadams9578 Thanks for subscribing! Next step is a toothbrush and soapy water for the caliper to make sure the pistons move evenly (yes, there's a video for cleaning brake calipers). Enjoy!
Thanks, will do. Got the seal kit ready to go
Dave, how did you know I was going to need this vid ? Thanx !!!!
Errr.... hmmmmm...... tea leaves? :)
@@catalystreactionsbw I like people like you who know their stuff !
2:14 "Don't you die on me!"
Ha.
great vid, helped me a lot for my 1st front wheel removal. My addition ? a zip tie to hold the break leaver :)
I had major issues with calipers binding on my BMW S1000R following the replacement of fork seals. This will be the solution - thanks very much Dave!
Did it fix it? I have a problem with my discs not being central to my calipers and causing massive brake judder
@@TeamSimpsonRacing Hi Toby, yes it did. If your discs are causing pulsing of the hand lever or judder then you should check them for warping. If the floating bobbins are dry and not allowing the disc to self correct or the disc has been overheated, then it could be warped. There are plenty of videos on youtube around how to service the bobbins and free them up.
Dave, you helped me tune my suspension with your video's. But there was a glitch I couldnt tune out of there. Ocassionally I would feel some unbalance in the front. Not all the time, but enough to notice in certain pieces of road. Sometimes the bike wanted me to lean at slow speeds, and 2 seconds later not Etc. Continuous small adjustments... . A motorcycle mechanic fixed a leaking fork seal couple months ago. I figured the oil must be old on one side or different viscosity... They claimed to me the other one was recently replaced already... Today I did what you showed here. And jezus, the floating axle side exluded about 1mm now, before it was flush. 1 hand springing the front imediatly felt a change in smoothness and balance/preload etc. between left and right. Not like the seals where binding... Drove today, and it cuts the cornerline way more stable. Bro, your my hero.
Again you indirectly saved my life, and improved my driving experience.!!!! A question, I didnt release the calipers, should I calibrate those again to the new wheel position?
Thanks for watching and using the content to assist you and your motorcycle.. Yes and go through the full reset to 100% ensure the calipers are correct.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks Dave.Sorry I forgot to mention I do have older type calipers which are mounted sideways onto the fork. I had a buddy's fork in mind which has same as the video.
Love the sounds of the track!! Another great video.
Thank you, glad you enjoyed it.
You are one of the GOAT per my knowledge and understanding based on what I have seen in my experience with various people and motorcycles! I have always wondered why sometimes I have so much drag in my front wheel after tyre/brake pad change! Do we need to loosen up front wheel axle and then brake adjust after replacing pads as well? Keep up the good work.
With a pad change, rotors need sanding. With the tyre change, you just follow the process. In either case, getting the axle torqued correctly is the first step. Leaving the pinch bolts loose on the leg the fork goes through for installation is the correct starting point. Thanks for watcxhing.
Wow, thanks a lot, I bought new bike and hear and fell some repeating friction from front wheel increasing accordingly with speed, so have to align wheel and brakes properly. Thanks for sharing !!!
Perfect timing on this video, have to do this today! Thank you.
Thank you for this! I have R6 and always tightened everything at once!😅 well the bike has been working still great nothing is bended, but next time I will do it this way☺
Glad it helped!
I'm so glad my bike can't watch Dave's videos. I feel it'd be pretty upset with me if it could.
Would be great if my service place knew this
Thanks Dave! I didn't know any of this. I'm about to use your tips to align the front end of a 2003 CRF150F dirt bike. They have a similar fork design as the sports bikes you were working on (a threaded left fork for the axle and pinch bolts on the right fork).
Excellent - and the end result will be a front wheel that spins far more easily.
I tried to put my 06 axle back in and it wouldn't go through the other fork! Pounding it in ruined the whole axle and the fork! I had to sand down a lip on the fork and the axle and then ended up buying a new axle! I don't know how this happened! I think maybe my stand is not level, it's 100 degrees out? Do I have to put the axle in the freezer lol?
Was this a first time event for the axle installation? If so, what was different this time? Were the forks recently worked on? Is this a new stand? Something created an alignment issue and hopefully the new axle will go in with no issues once qwe find the cause.
@@catalystreactionsbw yes just got bike and never removed the wheels before. I do on my dirtbike all the time. I think it's the new stands I got. It was hot out so the parts may have just been expanded and tight.
I know that bike has less suspension travel than my dirt bike, but I have learned not to be a fan of any method of getting the fork legs parallel if you are not measuring it somehow. Using this method on my dirt bike is also standard YT procedure, but after I actually made a gauge, (1" dia. round stock aluminum that fits through my brake disk, faced off on a lathe on both ends to 5.661" long, the distance between my plated fork legs, calculated from a triple clamp.), I found the pump and brake method to be off about .030". After I got the legs parallel within + or - .001", I found that I had to go to the next stiffer fork springs because I eliminated the binding.
Lots of riders are wearing out their bushings prematurely, and not getting the best action from their forks.
It does not matter if the axle is threaded on one end, or clamped on both ends. The forks should be parallel, and not many are. :)
Agreed, very few are. Thanks for sharing your ingenious solution to remove binding.
My workshop manual says to use feeler guages to check clearance between the calipers and the rotor. (Brembo calipers without guide bushings). I've just carefully eyeballed it every time with success so far.
Very understandable and logical with the sequence that these steps are done. If the rotors are not tightened last, is that why you can warp your rotors?
If you simply tighten the calipers without holding the brake on they can align off center. That can contribute to the rotor being stressed and potentially warped in time.
Great video! Should’t the fork pinch bolts be loosened through this procedure to truly get everything “square?”
Thank you. The pinch bolts on the leg the axle goes through should be loose as part of this procedure.
excellent video dave.j had problems with the front wheel not spinning freely. went to a lot of trouble. stripping down the calipers and changing all seals and a 4 hour brake bleed🙄got there eventually. had I seated the axle correctly like u have done in the first place everything would have been fine 😬
every days a school day.
A tip of my hat to you for the commitment to make it right and thank you for watching this video so you have a permanent method from this point on as the first step.
Sir that's been very very helpful thank you very much for your time and dedication very good
Awesome as always Dave, thanks for sharing the knowledge, Nice mask 👏
Wow I thought the other end was the captive end. And I’ve been having chatter. I’ve obviously been doing this so wrong. Wow thank you so much.
I actually had put my front wheel on and left my tools on my seat so I could make sure I was doing things right and glad I did. I have also never used the front brakes method holding them while tightening the calipers.
The reason I question my methods was during removal of my front wheel when I was loosening my pinch bolts I heard a click which seemed like one of the forks settled into a new position on the axle making me realize something wasn’t in line. I was definitely having chatter under hard braking and now I know why.
Muchas gracias! One million likes. Very instructive. Saludos desde Guatemala!
Tons of great content on this channel!
Thank you for watching!
Never ever done it that way but I will from now on. Excellent tutorial.👍
Thank you! You will be really pleased with the benefits as every time you do this the front wheel will spin free or show you the brake calipers need a cleaning via inconsistent rotation speed.
Thank you I’m going to be removing my wheels and tires for new rubber and I had no idea you had to do this
Wow....been doing it all wrong then for years. If you haven’t already, please make a video on setting up the rear wheel properly. Every day is a school day!
Thanks for this video! Even though it's been some time since upload and I keep coming back to this video to review the procedure to balance the free fork. I have one question: why would you first tighten the brake calipers which are mounted directly onto the forks before bouncing the front end and not first bounce it and then center and tighten the brake calipers? Only after bouncing, tightening the pinch bolts, lifting it back up to spin the wheel to get the brake calipers centered would give you the best braking performance no?
I set the caliper nut 1/4 turn from tight, bounce the front end and torque the pinch bolts. Then spin the wheel and hold the brake lever firmly on and torque the brake bolts. It has been a while, I am fighting cancer and need to take time for myself to win this fight.
Excellent and thorough video thank you Dave
The exception to this is the forks on an 06/07 zx10r that has a "normal" bolt and nut as an axle (neither side floats). The guy I bought my zx6r race bike from put on 06 zx10 forks and I get a bit of excess stiction in the front with no way to correct it. I might send one fork leg to a machine shop to bore the axle hole out and get a spacer made to float the fork. But that will be a winter project
Dave Moss, I hope you have many children, they all tune suspension, and they would be craftsmen and prosperous.
Thanks awesome.
A velcro strap be good to hold lever
amazing the uses in the garage for an old bicycle inner tube.👍
Or my old favourite, a zippy tie!
u can use the bending on the free leg to square it.. with same procedures but instead, bend it (free leg) far in then out, measure it if u want to, and half the distance should be the middle.. for some its quicker and no bounce needed. whatever u comfort with:)
Definitely was taught the proper way thanks Dave
Thanks for the advise. After I've done this I saw there is a gap between the spacer and the fork leg. It's on the side where you put the axle in.I also saw some grooves sticking out on the bush on same side. How so?
On the axle insert side, that is a miss aligned leg. Not sdure what grooves refers to? Axle or spacer?
Learning is occurring. Thank you Dave!
Good instruction - for safety sake - double Check all screws before riding: leaving those calipers loose and tightening them later is a risk because you may forget them. My advice: never interrupt work when your assembling the wheels and brakes. Paint marks can help to be 100% sure.
VERY, Very, very helpful! THANK YOU!!!
Much appreciated and glad you enjoyed the video.
Thank you dave moss. Learned something really useful.
Great Video. I am a newbie and have never disassembled the front axle. I am wondering whether the front wheel is free to move along the front axle without the calipers. If not, what is holding it? Thanks a lot!
The front wheel is free to move laterally if the spacer set up allows it and if so, the spacer(s) are worn and need to be replaced. Normally there is no lateral play.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks Dave! That's helpful.
Same for axial mounted calipers?
I have an R6, same as shown in the video. Question: Doesn't it make more sense to torque the axle nut BEFORE the pinch bolts? Note that I do have a great big hex driver socket to hold the axle still so I'm able to torque without tightening the pinch bolts. Yeah, you are seating the axle from the right leg side and lightly tightening the axle bolt so in theory that left leg is where it's supposed to wind up, but doesn't the final torque move things just a bit more? Tightening the pinch bolts first prevents that (assuming it's true).
If you want to torque the nut at the beginning you need to trap the axle via the pinch bolts and then release the pinch bolts again to continue through the process,
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks. I have a big hex socket that I use to keep the axle from turning while tightening, so no need to do up/undo the pinch bolts. Is immobilizing the axle the only reason why you do up the left-side pinch bolts before torquing the axle bolt?
@@andrewdouglas4211 Yes, correct. That would be efficient.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thank you sir!
Great video without any needless chit chat. Thank you. Great work. Got a question also: When aligning a 4 pinch bolt fork, would it make a difference, if tightening the calipers after pushing the forks down and before tightening the second pair of pinch bolts? Instead of tightening the calipers right after tightening the first pair?
Thanks for the compliment. Given your description it will not matter if the pinch bolts on the nut/fasten leg are tight, so just make sure the side that the axle goes through is loose. Then you can tighten pinch bolts and calipers as you choose.
Thank you for taking the time to respond and helping me out to understand the matter better. I appreciate.@@catalystreactionsbw
For one set of pinch bolts on the axle, if im trying to straighten my forks and have the lower tree clamps loose as well, would i still torque the axle first before pumping the forks?
This video has helped a lot since i believe having the axle threaded into one side has made all my attempts at aligning my wheels go all wrong.
Yes, you would torque the axle first.
When you nip up the callipers with the brake on it ads weight to the wheel and moves the caliper back a little the opposite way of the breaking force, whay i do is spin the wheel forward motion pull the brake fasten the lever on, with velcro strap, just before tightening caliper bolts i hold the wheel with a forward retention ?
4:00 I recently removed and cleaned my three piston front calipers and was surprised how much static drag they seem to have. They spin, but the dragging makes a sound much like this one, so I guess it’s normal?
Yes that's normal as long as they are not actually stopping the wheel completely it's not a real issue, this happens when the pistons pull back but the pads stay against the rotor ever so slightly, since there is no pressure on it, heating and wear is not a real issue, quick fix to this is using break pad glue against the pistons so they pull the pad back with them, on the road it's recommended to always use this, only reason not to use it would be on track and just so you keep things clean and easy to swap. Cleaning those little channels that the little flaps on the pad go into + the pins it slides on can go a long was too.
Glad you made the time to clean the calipers with a toothbrush and soapy water. As long as the pistons move evenly, job done! The dragging sound is normal and should be a continuous sound.
To Joao Santos. Your comment is not accessible. Yes, do it by tightening the pinch bolts on the bolt/nut side first and then tighten the free leg second.
Oh wow that was useful. I'll definitely do this next time i get me tires replaced.
When you do, please post the differences in distance for the front and rear so others can see a real/live experience in action.
i wish you were closer to the east coast man
Thank's from Nice,Azur Coast, good job ,nobody do this,I've learned something too
Nicolas
Thank you Dave very useful info!
I came off my honda 2000 cbr600FY a low speed low side. New mirror and repair the fairings and it was fine except the steering has to be slightly to the right to have the wheel forward? Forks have been dropped off at a specialist (mct) and he said the forks looked straight so I’m hoping it was just the forks turning in the yokes???
Remove the yokes and see if they are truly flat on a piece of glass. If they are on the bike, loosen the steering stem nut to finger tight and install one fork. Bring the other fork in and if it is off center the yokes need to be looked at.
Dave Moss Tuning when you say “bring the other fork in and see if it’s off centre” you mean install it but no need to torque everything and just see if both forks are parallel by measuring top and bottom?
Thanks Dave, when I get my suspension back and the fairings i will be in touch regarding a set up. I ow you some £££ anyway tbh because I’ve leaned so much already.
@@Bikeadelic Locate one leg and bolt it in place. Bring the other leg through the lower yoke and see if it is on center with the upper yoke. If not, then the yokes need checking.
Dave Moss Tuning ohhhhh ok yes that makes sense!
Thank you Dave 🙏
Very clear and very helpful, thank you. A quick question - why do we centre the calipers before bouncing the forks? If the 'free' fork leg does move, since the caliper is fixed to it, won't that mean that the caliper has moved slightly too and will need to be re-centred?
Yes, that can happen if the free leg 'adjusts' post bounce, then the caliper on it would be out of alignment and would ned to be reset. Centering calipers would be the last task logically.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks for taking the time to reply. Much appreciated.
@@catalystreactionsbw Came to post the exact question. Thanks for the explanation and the tips to center everything. Your video with the narrative explanation goes worlds beyond what the service manual says.
Dave, I just put a new front tyre on my Husky 701 Enduro and reinstalled it. The first ride noticed the front brake is very stiff and doesn't modulate. Assuming the legs being misaligned with the brake caliper is the cause? Will try this trick tonight.
If all you did was change the tyre, the only variable is the mounting procedure. So, try this trick tonight. If the wheel is still binding, you might take a closer look at the brake pad wear and take a tooth brush to the brake caliper pistons.
On my cb300r the forks are a little different. I plan on changing the fire tire and was wondering if the process is the same? It has clamps on both forks and is a single rotor set up
Aleays so informative.
Would this be the same for smaller bikes with single calipers like my Ninja 300?
There are no pinch bolts on the small bikes, so that aspect is moot. For the brake caliper, 100% yes to align it to the rotor.
@@catalystreactionsbw thanks for that. I am trying to get comfortable doing servicing and maintenance on my bike but unfortunately tidbits like this aren't included in the workshop manual. Missed seeing you at Hampton Downs but look forward to the next opportunity.
Good tipper.
It's what I do.
I have to keep everything taut but wrenchable.
58mm marzocchi that apparently I'm the only person alive who has one on his Harley.
They were huge money new.
I got mine off a custom chrome buyout in 2007 for 100.00 trees also 100.00.
Wanna hear something fun about brain injuries?
I just realized this year why it vibrates so hard.
I had a bad day and never oiled them.
Yeah...get em in boys.
I never said I was 100%.
Thank you Dave that's an essential video
5:21 Tightening the axle after you tighten the pinch bolts?
Axle has to be tightened then pinch bolts can be released for the bounce task. You can tighten the axle as per what you feel is right.
Have a 2021 690 couple hundred miles and it appears the bars are not straight. Check the rear wheel to make sure it's straight, all good. Do you have a vid for straightening the bars?
We have this, and hope this is what you are looking for: th-cam.com/video/9O7naTxJeV8/w-d-xo.html. You can always use "handlebars" in the search window to bring up other videos.
Hi Dave. I followed theRSV4 front wheel removal and fitting guide on my ‘19 Tuono RR and finfpd that the axle sits 1mm to 2mm proud outside the left fork leg. Where might I have gone wrong? Cheers for the helpful videos. Andrew
‘Find’
If the front axle torqued correctly and the front wheel spins easily with no brake drag, nothing is wrong.
And what to do if the forks are not the same length? When I lift the front with my 2 front stands one is shorter...does removing Preload help? Left is for Preload and right for rebound... Left I think is longer...
Check the measurement of your fork tubes in the triple tree and you may find that the shorter fork leg is set up further in the Triple Tree so you need to loosen it up and set it the same length as the other , that's my two cents anyhow
Great question. That would make sense when there is preload in one leg and when tuning, we do not make the forks align based on the engineering design.
Just asking... On 2nd Gen versys 650 are Preload adjustments in both legs.. On 3rd Gen only in one...on 2nd where forks vertically equal.. On 3rd none.. It was pain in the ass to install the axle and I was afraid not to damage the threads...
@@northeastadventuremotorcycleri they are 99% the same high
Dave, can you do an indepth video on a post crash check? Like resettling the frame, forks, engine, checking to make sure the frame isn't bent etc.
something like this but in more detail? th-cam.com/video/vGkPOk2fbYc/w-d-xo.html
I did this yesterday and I get a lot of chatter from the forks when i come to a stop,I don't understand why. I have a bike with pinch bolts on both sides. I have pumped the forks first and did the correct procedure,and then i mounted the calipers and aligned those too. I did this multiple times before and I had no chatter,but for some reason now I have it,I can feel the binding through my handlebar when coming to a stoplight...
Do you have chatter like the pads grip and let go - more of a shudder?
@@catalystreactionsbw just when I am about to stop,the last few rotations of the wheel,it almost sounds like a quiet trumpet,but now i did the process again and it is fine for now. Could it be the bushings inside the forks making the noise? They are overdue for service anyway,in the winter
@@TheCvac 1. Sand blast the rotors over Winter then clean them with alcohol. 2. Make sure the brake pads are even in wear between both sides. 3. Clean the brake calipers with a tooth brush and soapy water. That sound is normally from pad to rotor friction.
How can i spread the pads safely before putting the calipers back on the rotors? Don't feel like putting a screw driver inside
www.tooldiscounter.com/product/otc-motorcycle-brake-caliper-spreader-otc4743?gclid=Cj0KCQjwuZGnBhD1ARIsACxbAVhVoqNk9uVGxEYIu-8oSkad4YyTIQIT-JqtAE0bUHYikmKhTr9rUUYaAsyXEALw_wcB
Yamaha fhr 1300 has the same system axle and pinch bolts but not upsidown forks ...do i have to do the same as you do?
Yes, it is worth the effort as the task completed applies to both type of forks.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thanks
Your trying to "Harmonize-balance" the external forces in the forks/brakes/wheels/hardware...?
Trying to get the "free leg" straight by pushing down on the forks, and then calipers to ensure they are perfectly aligned with the rotors. That harmony allows the front wheel to spin for several revolutions.
@@catalystreactionsbw Thx "Dave". I could see the process and related to equipment I have worked on in the past. (rotating assemblies). We would minimize friction/stiction and listen to it when it would rotate to tune it. Cheers
@@mikejohnson9118 Great information Mike -learn something every day. What were you listening to? The tone or frequency when in movement?
@@catalystreactionsbw Sorry for the late reply. You would feel//hear the system as it worked. With power and freewheeling. It had to be very smooth in operation. Friction meant wear. Wear meant particles which would contaminate the coatings. Cheers
I’ve ended up here after watching you replacing fork seals on the R6, making it look a simple job! Not sure if should be attacking the job or not, or if should just pay to have the job done properly.
If I was to carry this job out, what fork oil would you recommend.? I’m a bit of a fatty weighing in at 14st, 200lbs!
Great advice on the front wheel alignment tho Dave, I to will be following the great advice given in this video as I’m a sucker for being meticulous 👍🏻
If you us the pause button regularly and take your time, it is a simple job to do with very few tools. Give it a go! :)
So what if your fork tubes are twisted in the triple clamps?
None of this matters at all if your forks are twisted. Remove the forks and roll them to make sure they are straight. Then make sure the steering stem nut is loose. Install one fork and tighten the lower triple clamp bolt/bolts. Install the other fork and see if it will not locate. If that is the case, the lower is bent and needs straightening.
I need help with my bike , it's start acting weirdly when I corner after riding on bumpy road. What seems to be the problem?
Brilliant. going to share this with so many home mechanics. thanks for the awesome information...
Please do!
I’m on a tracer 9gt which has the semi active suspension. This means that I can’t push down on the front forks when the bike is not running. My understanding is the bike has to be moving in order for the suspension to move. How would you handle that?
I have ridden the semi active Tracer. I check with the engine running once the suspension oil is hot. I also look at tire wear for verification.
thanks Dave! I need this for my Yamaha R1 2004 :D
Excellent - thanks for going the extra yards and getting it done.
@@catalystreactionsbw Yes I have achieved it! I have left my front wheel and brakes perfect thanks to you, now my wheel spins and spins! hahaha :D greetings from Galicia, Spain. a big hug!
I have a Velcro strap that I wrap around the brake lever to hold it. It's impossible to hold and reach around on a tall dirt bike.
Great tip and thanks for the comment to help others with an excellent idea!