I'd say it would be impossible to guess how old Captain Jack would be, because he can time travel. He could potentially have seen the entire universe start to finish several times over
Like when he went back to catch the Doctor after Rose revived him, and the Doctor left him stranded. and overshot the timing backwards, having to live over a hundred years just to meet up with them again. This could have happened an innumerable amount of times.
I'm late but in the torchwood spin off series this is actually the case for a particular episode where he gets buried deep underground thousands of years in the past and has to be dug back up. After torchwood ended I wouldn't be surprised if events similar to this would happen in the billions of years he lived after
That's the problem with time Travel and figuring out someone's age. Just because The Master and The Doctor were school mates, doesn't mean their individual timelines synch up. As with River Song, their meetings could be out of sorts timeline wise.
I was thinking something similar about the Doctor and the Master. One of them might have done much more time travelling than the other and gone through more regenerations!
You should count the 4B years in the confession dial, as the Doctor said himself he remembered every regeneration while there. So he mentally lived through that time scale
He didn’t say 4 billion, Ohila (Sisterhood of Karn) confirmed it to Clara in the next episode and that he remembered everything. I think it was even something like 4.5B years
@@midaslife654 I think she was implying that she was kept alive in stasis that long. She wasn't actually revived until the Troughton years with the Great Intelligence.
you forgot to mention Rory- The Centurion. he was over 2000 years old as well although the universe was reset and all, Rory's age would still count right?
I would say yes, myself, because he still remembered everything He had 2000+ years of experiences, even if his physical body was reset, he was still there.
@@cedkira the doctor didnt have to experience each of those billions of years, as he just kinda died over and over but couldnt remember, but rory continuously experienced that
@@cedkira the confesion dial is something diferent, the doctor that came out of there has just been teleported, went threw the events in the episode and carried on
Wouldn't Jack still be older than Ashilder? In the spin off series Torchwood, Jack literally goes through the death of the universe, the big bang, only to relive up to the events of that episode again to meet someone.
Like Marvin the paranoid Android, Jack has traveled to the end of the universe and back so can be argued as being possibly older than the universe itself.
@@wastedtalent1625 I believe he stays the whole time, it's been a long time since I've seen the episode. I will admit I could definitely be wrong. I'd definitely need to rewatch.
The Bible is truth. Please read at least three books. The first book of each testament and one you chose yourself. It’s important to remember that it’s the doing that’s key. Look inside and do your inner healing. To be forgiven we must forgive:
Some years ago I was at a rennisance faire, and spotted someone dressed as The Doctor. Worth a bit of a chuckle, but not much more... Until one of the living statue performers grabbed an angel wings backpack and started following him around, freezing in place whenever he looked in her direction.
That's so cool! We have this High Middle Ages faire in my town every single year (because of the feast that ended with the king throwing his two younger brothers in jail to rot and then throw the key into the river nearby), and your comment makes me wanna dress up as the Doctor and go there whenever it will be next time (or whenever I can that is) I don't think anyone there would get the joke though lmao
The end of the universe is when the last of stars are extinguished. All the fuel is spent. But there are black holes that still exist. They will be the last things that finally go out. But by then everything will be dark as fuck.
@@wesleyc8101 There are iron stars which are theorised to be the last objects in the universe. These could potentially last upwards of 10^1500 years, whereas the oldest black holes will reach only around 10^100 years - a bloody long time, but miniscule by comparison. Edit: I was very wrong, they can *form* sometime after 10^1500 years, they will from that point on last much much longer. 10^10^26 years for small ones and 10^10^76 years for large ones, I beleive.
@@wesleyc8101 They were at the last few moments like less then ten minutes from what they were saying to each other....and no, she didn't have a TARDIS before then.
The problem with Ahsilder's age is that at some point in her life she acquired her own TARDIS, which means that here are at least a few instances in the show where she could have arrived in that time period via her TARDIS.
My problem with Ashildr's age is that she actually CAN die. This was made clear in The Woman Who Lives where even something as simple as drowning would be fatal if she hadn't taught herself to hold her breath for an abnormally long time, something that real people can do. It takes a considerable amount of training but Ashildr had centuries to learn to do that. Unless she time travelled to the end of the Universe and got stranded there (which is completely possible but was never established), she would have either been killed or committed suicide out of sheer boredom LONG before the Universe snuffed it. Ashildr made it clear that having a lifespan which functioned very similar to outright immortality was not only depressing but incredibly dull. However, unlike Captain Jack, she actually has the option of putting herself out of her misery if something or someone else doesn't kill her first.
An another problem the time is not linear in the Dr. Who universe, but it is timey wimey ball thing. So by this far also Clara and Rose are time traveller and it is challenging to count the time they have lived.
First off, the face of bo - being jack, would have travelled back in time many times making him WELL OVER 5 billion. Then there is Lady Cassandra who is the last 'Pure Human' - and she is found 5,000,000,000 years into the future.
Going from the shows, we can only say for certain Jack lived an additional 0.0000002 billion years due to time travel. I think it's probably still worth rounding down to 5bn. As for Cassandra, they never say how old she is, but I'd be shocked if the idea was that she'd been around for billenia. I never took her as an age-old being, so much as the last, sad member of a racist future colony trying to see how long "modern" medicine can keep her going. You could be right, of course, but I'd guess she's only a few hundred years old, max.
@@Mortlupo Before is subjective when time travel is involved. It's entirely plausible she is a future version of Ashilda who already had the Tardis. It seems unlikely she'd have survived 100tn years without going mad or being killed. The tech keeping her alive doesn't make her completely invulnerable.
@@nekogod she had her companion Clara and as Clara was at the brink of death, she couldn't die again. Ashildr and Clara could travel through time and space together. That's why she won't get mad, she will always somebody to talk to. And because we know that the Doctor ages during the offscreen adventures in past and future, Ashildr can as well, well she can't age because her cells cannot die.
There's a cool theory that the Doctor stopped counting their as of The War Doctor incarnation but started over after they 'destroyed' Galifrey and became The Doctor again. It would make sense seeing as The War Doctor is assumed to have lived for a very long time and the surprisingly low age of the Ninth Doctor.
What about Ohila and the Sisterhood of Karn? Ohila knew the Doctor since his first childhood and claimed to be an immortal in Heaven Sent. She implied she was older than the Doctor in that same episode when she referred to him as a boy.
And in that same episode the Doctor spends more than two billion years punching his way through a several metres thick wall of diamond. The Doctor himself is in excess of two billion years old, isn't he?
@@MrScifimadman no, because he keeps using his imprint or whatever you call it that's stored in the transmat to bring him back just before he dies, so in essence, he keeps going back to the first moment he arrives. Time goes forward but he doesn't age.
@@laigron7884 yes, he remembers his last time in the confession dial. He left behind enough clues that he was able to figure out what he had to do each time and he knew by the stars how far in the future he was, but I don't think that aged him in any way.
That's how I would see it, but it is something the master would do, just make something up. Hes done it before, well I think. If I, and many others, had it our way, we would have master just say it was a lie, or just say he made it up, have the doctor find that out, I personally have no problem with Jodie Whitaker as the doctor, it's just Chris chibnall and those who wanted the timeless child plotline. It, shouldn't have been done like that
th-cam.com/video/94tqYSkAOq8/w-d-xo.html Philip Hawkins did a video where he theorises that The Doctor is actually Tecteun instead of The Timeless Child, and The Timeless Child is actually The Master, it’s a well put together theory, and the way he tells it ties up quite a few loose ends from Classic Who. He doesn’t mention the Ruth Doctor, but my theory for her is that she’s between 2 and 3.
Love her or hate her, Clara is on the list having lived through the doctors entire lifetime. She was there for the theft of the T.A.R.D.I.S. (shown) and before (implied). She was born to save the Doctor. She's the impossible girl. Once she starts travelling with me, any additional time technically wouldn't count. She's dead: ambulatory, but dead.
She lived through the doctors timeline by living and dying to guide him to where he needed to be - would that still count as she was reborn for each time she was needed, rather than living permanently? Victorian Clara had no memory of the doctor, or of other incarnations of herself. Modern Clara was the same, which implies that she was spun into existence for her purpose rather than being permanent. Think along the same lines as Heroes of the Horn from Wheel of Time - they exist in the World of Dreams, but are only spun into life for a specific purpose rather than always living. Same Soul, Different Life.
Clara's echoes are their own characters. They don't have the real Clara's life experience and a throwaway line in Day of the Doctor revealed that she only remembers "a bit" of theirs. She only has a vague memory of the other lives she lived - actually, Rory seems to remember his time as an Auton more clearly than Clara remembers her echo lives - so it's understandable why she's not on this list. The original Clara may have decided to travel the universe for millennia after Hell Bent before going back to the fixed point in time that the Time Lords created for her in Face the Raven, but that's not confirmed in the show itself.
I like that in Shada, Professor Chronotis had been working as a professor at the university and living in the same apartment for some three hundred years but the university administration never noticed.
@@peterjf7723 That is also True, I just wonder what it was like for the University to discover The Doctor fully Disappeared and found his Sonics and photo of Susan with no one to give it to
@@peterjf7723 Yeah, It just mostly goes unexplained, which happens quiet a lot, Like some people know the Doctor for a while and just disappears, like with what happened at Trenzalore, he Protected the planet for 500 Years, and just doesn't tell them "Well it's been fun, but I need to go now" he just disappears without a trace
Although this species is relatively new to Doctor Who, what about the Hond? The Hond are...creatures that have existed since the dark times (like some other characters in the show) and they look like the Flans from Final Fantasy, but they're green. Flans can be any color according to their environment. The Hond have always been green. The Hond weren't originally from this universe. In fact, it's *because* they aren't from here that they want to destroy everything. They think life is pain and the only way they know to get rid of that pain is to destroy it...which was a big problem and why The Doctor sent the Hond back to their own universe.
Omega. Pioneer of time travel, same age as Rassilon or thereabouts, but unlike Rassilon who used stasis for very very long sleeps, Omega was entirely awake, and existed as anti-matter and mere conscious thought. You mention him in your 10 Smartest Doctor Who Characters video, but miss him here :( shame because I really liked him as a villain, where, through no fault of his own, had simply gone quite insane.
Wait, so THAT'S where Rassilon got the Final Sanction idea from. I assumed he just came up with it out of desperation to get out of the Time War by any means necessary but he was actually inspired by Omega.
Another thing is the beast is older than the universe too cos I remember the doctor talking about him believing the beast if he said he was as old as the universe but not when he said he was older than it
@@OverWims true, true. I actually had a theory that it the “Disciples of Light” who imprisoned him actually _worked_ for the Ancient Lights, and the two forces had some form of power struggle (two different “magics”, their Universe’s equivalent of science), so when the new Universe came and the Ancient Lights went into hiding until their foreseen time, the Disciples went rogue and imprisoned the presumably-weakened (like the Ancient Lights probably were) Beast in Krop Tor
The Shadow of the Valyard is the oldest being in the universe, this is established by the council of Galifrey during the Doctor's trial. The Face of Bo is the second oldest, established by the Doctor himself on screen and in the novels. The Eternals as a race are older than the Timelords, this is irrefutable canon, but since they sealed themselves away, they take third place. Fourth place goes to both Nineveh(7th doctor) and the House entity(11th doctor). ^^^These are the ONLY character's to be measured in BILLIONS of years. 5th - 10th place can be distributed among any number of characters from the early serials, as most of them have lifespans from thousands to millions of years. "Me" shouldn't be on this list at all, she isn't billions of years old, she cheated and time travelled to the end of the universe only a few years after the Doctor left her in "Face the Raven", this is canon and is thoroughly explained in the novels. The end of the universe was the only place she thought she'd be safe from the Doctor's wrath, she was wrong. She then time travels back to when she left with Clara and starts over. She didn't live much longer after that.
The Eternals, as well as other creatures like the black and white guardians and the celestial toy maker. they all pre-date the universe. thus anything in the universe cannot by process of elimination be older than they are. The Doctor as the timeless child puts the Doctor into a potential side class of unknown. Assuming it holds true, We know nothing yet about the Doctor's true origin. All the creatures from the "dark times" are still from the relative early universe and don't compare, this includes the satan pit and the Racnoss as well as other creatures which may or may not be reportedly that old. I'm also sure that Hell Bent is not nearly as far flung into the future as all that.
@@blankspace178 I can't say I've read many novels or listened to many audio stories. I'm not sure how they'd recon that, especially since the doctor's pre-hartnall era which his fixed Canon. But how do they plan to address that in the show?
You could also add Tzim-Sha to this list, since around the time of Battle Ranskoor Av Kolos, he is over 3,400 years old, and since he'll be in the stasis chamber for eternity, he's essentially immortalized in a prison forever.
You forget that Ashildr (I prefer to think of her name as Me) has a Tardis. There's no reason she HAS to take the long way around. She could potentially be just around 1500 years old.
@@t_r_a_y_e9858 There are other ways to travel through time then the Tardis. Especially to the future. Other time machines, suspended animation or space-time distortions (high intensity gravity field) could all send her to the future without increasing her age.
@@frantisekvrana3902 so tell me, if she had access to time travel, why would she choose to go to the end of the universe? I feel like that's the last place she'd wanna be
@@t_r_a_y_e9858 If it was an actual time machine, perhaps it sent her to the future by accident, then broke down. But personally, I am getting on the last option. She could have been stuck near a black hole for a few trillion years, while aging just a few days.
Not counting the timeless child as part of the Doctor's time makes sense but the confession dial should absolutely count for two reasons. One, it was the doctor doing it. Two, while it was effectively a time loop, he did remember all of every loop at the end if each one.
I still don't understand why Ashildr is more immortal than Captain Jack? Like it doesn't make sense to me that a scavenged piece of technology from a Mire helmet is more powerful than the Time Vortex itself lol
I would argue it isn't and Ashildr will eventually die and evolve the same. I think Jack lived to the end of time, then time travelled back to early humanity just to watch it again, a few times. That would make him MUCH older than her.
Agreed. Jack is a fixed point in space time. The only way he would devolve is if and when space time itself devolves. Needless to say I do not buy the whole jack being the Face of Boe, more likely it is a riddle or misdirection by the show (he did say it was just a nickname, who is to say the nickname did not originate from the future).
@@PartStupid I always viewed it as the headless monks taking his head at some point in the future. Lost the body to time after that and slowly turned to the face of boe do to him still actually being alive.
The Master reached and through shenanigans surpassed his limit of Regenerations during the Classic era of Doctor Who. Did he die more often than the Doctor, or was there many more years spent traveling through time and space doing evil stuff?
Im not sure what you mean in the last part but anyway I think the master was the best as a women, her personality and her eventually trying to be good was fantastic
Jon Pertwee first met the Silurians in Doctor Who and the Silurians. The Sea Devil versions have been in a few times, both Third doctor and Fifth doctor.
As long as there are time travelers popping about, the fact that someone like Ashildr is around at the end of time circa 100 trillion years in the future does not necessarily mean that she is 100 trillion years old. She might have hitched there on a Tardis.
maybe she used the TARDIS she and Clara stole after returning Clara to Gallifrey (after what I like to imagine were many, many adventures together) just so she could be there to meet up with the Doctor and steal the TARDIS with Clara....
True but even if you cut that time by 1000 you still end up far older than anything else. We know she's already been around for hundreds of years when we see her in The Raven, and in a commentary thing I've seen on the episode they do specifically mention she's far older than The Doctor. Obviously a lot of room there between 2000 and 100 trillion but still.
@@captainchaos5705I don't doubt she's ancient, but it's still possible that at the time we saw her at the end of the universe she may not necessarily have been there because she lived that long. I always wondered though. If she can't die, what would happen to her at the end of the universe? Would she still exist? How? Where would she go? If she has to go back to the end of time to steal the TARDIS with Clara so she can avoid, for a while at least, the end of the universe and live longer, does that put her in an endless loop? I'm way overthinking this lol
@@dallama2616 Yeah. The Doctor specifically mentions that she can still die, her response is basically that she's too good at literally everything to die
@GamingWithChu ok. sorry for the spelling mistake. and no. you aren't no one. but still, the timeless children is an insult to the legacy of the show and should've never been made.
Just going by onscreen adventures, no audios/comics/vg/etc: -Jack was about 40yo when we first meet him. (JB actual age?) -He is then killed, resurrected as immortal, and goes back to 1870s-90s (sources differ; recruited by Torchwood in 1899). so about 150-170ish in Torchwood s1e1. -Gray and John send him back to 27AD, burying him alive. Torchwood finds him in 1901, where he moves to the cryo-chambers for 107 years to 2008/present. -At this point, Jack is ~2150-70yo. . We assume his next few years are relatively sane, but he does keep space and time traveling. He knows about 13's future encounter with the Lone Cyberman when he mistakes Graham for the 13th Doctor. He later states it took him about twenty years to get arrested by the Judoon to rescue 13, and then a few more years just to reach her. We don't know when he learns about LC danger, as everything after Fugitive of Judoon is presented as taking place after that. He's closing in on 2200, possibly older, here as far as Revolution of the Daleks.
I was about to say "Hey, what about the billions of years in the confession dial" I wanted to argue for it's inclusion but then i thought about it. He was rewritten every day. No actual time passed for that body save for the day spent punching the wall. God i love that episode.
@@jacobwright536 It was'nt the same day again and again. The time did pass as he can say that the stars keep shifting in the sky. Indicating that time do pass but the doctor is continuously being reboot. So for him it was just the time he spend on a run until he died repeating the same day.
yes you can they still age at the same rate. The age of a time traveler is constant other wise they would travel a 1000 years and be dust when they exit the TARTIS. So 1 year aged IS 1 year aged regardless of WHEN they are. As Einstein said it is all relative.
@@deepdragon2 There's actually something called the "twin paradox", which I believe Einstein established. If a twin moves at the speed of light, time will go by slower for him. When he stops to reunite with his other twin, he will be younger, even through they are still Born on the same day and meet at the same point in time. You can apply this to Doctor Who time travel as well. Let's say the Master and the Doctor meet on a planet, on a certain day. Then the Doctor leaves in the Tardis, while the Master stays there for a hundred years. Then, after the Master has waited hundred years, the Doctor returns to the planet, once again arriving in his tardis. But now you can't say, if the Doctor has aged more or less. He could've just traveled a hundred years into the Future right away, aging just a few minutes. Or he could've spent a thousand years going around in time and space and then travel back to the planet a hundred years after he left.
Honestly, i still like to include the years the doctor spent in the confession dial as his age so to me he'll always be "4 and a half billion" years old
The Beast wasn't specifically from the Dark Times, was it? According to it (though, yeah, may well have been exaggerating) the whole battle that took place to seal it away took place "Before time, and light, and space, and matter". The Doctor's response of "That's impossible, no life could have existed back then" also indicates that they were not aware of any other creatures from that time.
Well the Beast is literally Satan so it exists outside of Time. Can you even apply an age to something that doesn't conform to the rules of the Universe?
Lauren said you mentioned kind of recently remind me of the sleestaks from Land of the Lost TV shows from then and now including Doctor Who and from what I see a doctor who has definitely been seen better days but I am going to say rest in peace Doctor Who
Not counting 4.5 Billion Years.... yeah just one of the best episodes ever made. and one of the most impressive things ever done in any series I ever seen, and I have seen a lot!
But he didnt LIVE those years, he lives one day in the confession dial, on endless repeat, with no memory of having done that day before each time he restarts.
@@missjayspeechley9213 Well agree to disagree. From his perspective he awakens in that machine, and spends one day surrounded by a billion skulls and being chased by a ghost. He has no way to recall the other billion versions of himself, because they all die each day and a new copy is rebooted from the beginning.
I know RTD confirmed it with Jacks lines, but it doesn't make sense for Jack to be The Face of Boe. What makes much more sense is that The Face of Boe is Rex Matheson, and he lived an average life span after the destruction of his resurrection source, the Earth. (He even looks more like Rex than he looks like Jack.)
@@dallama2616 he can. But that line to Martha and the Doctor, where he was once the poster child for something or other, or whatever, doesn't really confirm him as the actual creature. Like how Google informs me now that Lily Rose Depp is the new Face of Chanel, the perfume co. Apparently. But she's not the first and she won't be the last... Jack's word's added up to a cute "no way - could it be... ?!" moment but future canon isn't written by a vague what if, or random concepts tweeted out by ex-showrunners years after the fact. Or maybe he is the Face, not really a Jack fan myself so not fussed either way Plus I managed to accidentally delete my previous comment so I'm blaming that stupid face
@@hgwells1899 Jack is confirmed to have died before the end of time by Me meaning he died at some point. He was there when yana became the master. Who else could be the face of boe?
@@dallama2616 A few reasons. Probably the biggest being that he was around when The Doctor and Martha were talking about the Face of Boe and didn't react at all. It's far more in character that he just thought it was funny, and wanted to leave them with more ponderings than when they got together.
Drax is nearly the same age as The Doctor. Morbius and the King Vampire are almost as old as Omega and Rassilon. The Black and White Guardians may predate the universe itself. And we can assume the Megara (Justice Machines) are quite old as well.
At @4:24 that is Dianna Rigg from the Avengers as Emma Peel and she also played Queen of Thorns Olenna Tyrell on Game of Thrones. She has made many performances, my favorite is A MIDSUMMER NIGHT’S DREAM (1968).
Ashilder is an incredible character. Too bad she couldn't find someone worthy enough to spend the rest of eternity with and how she couldn't even remember her own past, but it makes sense.
Something I've noticed is that people seem to forget that with time travel there are a polethora of characters alive AND dead who the doctor could still meet. For example the face of boe. Yes he's dead but there are still the thousands of years between the last time they see Jack to the first time they meet the tace of boe.
One problem. The Beast is from BEFORE time, BEFORE the universe. He/It says so in The Impossible Planet/Satan Pit. Making it/him far older than Ashildr by virtue of being older than the universe.
Also, there is a ship in doctor who podcast episode that grants you wishes, the doctor stated that the ship was from beyond this universe, he also mentioned that some creatures that exist in the universe are also beyond this universe meaning there were around when the old universe explode and formed the new one. The beast that was chained is one such creature he said he was beyond the universe and the doctor who ask was does that mean and he replied before this universe was formed.
Wasn't there a 4th doctor episode with immortal beings that wanted to steal the Doctor's regenerations in order to die? I can't remember how old they were at the time though.
yes you can they still age at the same rate. The age of a time traveler is constant other wise they would travel a 1000 years and be dust when they exit the TARTIS. So 1 year aged IS 1 year aged regardless of WHEN they are. As Einstein said it is all relative.
@@deepdragon2 you are indeed correct that they will age at the same rate. But as soon as they each go on their own “time path”, on a different occurrence of a meeting they might have lived/aged different amounts. One of them could even be younger (e.g. The Doctor and River)
There is a huge problem with Ashilda being given a TARDIS at the end of the universe: The Doctor's TARDIS is, according to the Doctor in many episodes, programmed to prevent him from visiting times and places he has already visited. We can assume all TARDIS's are programmed the same way so hers will be too. If she can live forever traveling throughout the universe and all time which are finite (if there is an end to the universe then it has to be finite in both size and time), then after a long long time travelling she will come to a point when she will no longer be able to visit anywhere or any time because she has been everywhere and every time, her TARDIS just will not allow her to travel! So then she will be stuck again living in sequential time until the end of the universe, so there should have been 2 of her there not one! How old would that make the 2nd version of her at the end of the universe? You would not be able to calculate that one's age because it would depend on how much time she spent travelling and where in time she ended up being stranded by the TARDIS! lol NOTE: I used TARDIS with all caps because it's an acronym of "Time and Relative Dimension in Space" and acronyms are meant to be written in all caps!
One gaffe is that Captain Jack was standing right there when the Doctor and Martha were talking about what the Face of Boe had said to them during Gridlock. He of course didn’t say “Hey that’s me!” It’s a slip that takes a little bit of the magic out of it for me.
I was thinking the trickster (The Pantheon) because he exsisted in the void where their is no time or space so by definition hes beyond immortal and lives beyond any known universe
I do not think that this is an argument because how much you time travel isn´t important. For example spent the Master hundreds (maybe thousends) of years at the ship from Mondas with his disabled TARDIS. (At the point where he was the time was fast). And Missy herself said that she had her own adventures throughout the universe, on her own.
When it came to the episode about the Crimson Horror, madame Vastra stated that she hadn’t seen the poison for around 26,000,000 years.. so there for she is tens of millions of years old at least and not 100s of years old
The Dalek who hates Daleks- from “Into the Dalek”. In “Twice Upon a Time,” the Doctor states that its been billions of years since they had last met. Yes, the Dalek can travel in time, but it seems as if this particular one was just camping out, and wasn’t even leaving the planet. Davros and other Daleks also likely lived for thousands of years- especially since the in “The Witch’s Familiar” there are thousands of mulched up Daleks in the sewer, who are alive, and likely have been for ages.
Regarding Prof Chronitis, you need to check out Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency, by Douglas Adams... he literally took the abandoned Dr Who script and turned it into part of a novel.
When we first see 12 reach the diamond (Azbantium? Byzantium?) wall he mentions how everytime he reaches that wall at that moment he remembers everything which came before and what his plan is. So technically, when the looped doctor who broke the wall goes through it, he would have remembered all 4 and a half billion years inside the confession dial. To me, that does count to his age but it is understandable why the doctor doesnt state it and also why people dont typically count it. Also side note i said Byzantium up there but is that the ship that 11 and River fight the angels at?
8:28 Who else here thought at first the Doctor and all were saying "a shielder" as a strange and cheeky way to say she defended things? Took me a while to figure out this was her weird-ass name by the end of the episode.
ÁSHILDR LANGUAGE FAMILY: INDO-EUROPEAN > GERMANIC > NORTH GERMANIC > OLD NORSE ORIGIN: OLD NORSE NAME ROOT: *ANSUZ / ÁSS HILDR > ÁSHILDR MEANING: This name derives from the Old Norse name “Áshildr”, composed of two elements: “áss” (heathen god, god, deity), from the Proto-Germanic “*ansuz” plus “hildr” (battle, fight). In turn, the name means “God fights for us”.
My theory for Jack/The Face of Bo is that, as he's a fixed point, his maximum age is, and always will be, the same as the heat death of the universe, so he lived for the entire 100 trillion years +, and then when he was "near" death (by a few measly billion years) he hopped back to the start so he could give the doctor his prophecy.
Honestly the reveal that jack is the face of bo was the most profound moment for me in the show, i actually paused the show and had a bit of a mind explosion moment it did feel good though, sadly moments like that are so rare in all forms of entertainment.
The only entities that I suppose are consciously aware, not in suspended animation and not limited by the memory capacity of their humanoid brain, for the entire span of the Universe would be: the Guardians. The Guardians are part of the Universal mechanism of order/chaos before it is ultimately defeated by heat death; assuming that there isn`t another state of being in that time just like there is during the "Star Time" of Universe?
You know how Ashildr AKA Me and Clara AKA the impossible girl took the TARDIS at the end of time eluded to making a few stops on their way to returning Clara to her death, well a spin-off show that I would love to see if "The Impossible Girl and Me" the adventures of Clara and Ashildr......
One character I haven’t seen in the comments yet is The Solitract from “It Takes You Away”. It was exiled because of its incompatibility with the universe. That would have to make it older than the universe itself, right?
time moved differently in the pocket universe. A few hundred thousand years went by on Earth while Hilla Tachorian was "haunting" the well, but she was only stuck in the pocket universe a few days, so she didn't age all that much.
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I'd say it would be impossible to guess how old Captain Jack would be, because he can time travel. He could potentially have seen the entire universe start to finish several times over
Like when he went back to catch the Doctor after Rose revived him, and the Doctor left him stranded. and overshot the timing backwards, having to live over a hundred years just to meet up with them again. This could have happened an innumerable amount of times.
I'm late but in the torchwood spin off series this is actually the case for a particular episode where he gets buried deep underground thousands of years in the past and has to be dug back up. After torchwood ended I wouldn't be surprised if events similar to this would happen in the billions of years he lived after
Same kinda applies to the doctor too.
By the end of miracle day, he’s at the very least 2500 years old since that’s what we’ve seen on screen but yeah he’s definitely way older than that
for some reason this was my impression, but I don't remember why
That's the problem with time Travel and figuring out someone's age. Just because The Master and The Doctor were school mates, doesn't mean their individual timelines synch up. As with River Song, their meetings could be out of sorts timeline wise.
I was thinking something similar about the Doctor and the Master. One of them might have done much more time travelling than the other and gone through more regenerations!
You should count the 4B years in the confession dial, as the Doctor said himself he remembered every regeneration while there. So he mentally lived through that time scale
Rule number 1: the doctor lies
He didn’t say 4 billion, Ohila (Sisterhood of Karn) confirmed it to Clara in the next episode and that he remembered everything. I think it was even something like 4.5B years
Yes he lived, died and whittled away the barrier,by hand and felt it everytime. His bones and ashes proves it.
Yes he 4.5 billion years old
Yes you are absolutely ritht. Over more he sometimes fortgets his age and starts counting again from zero.
Madame vastra would actually be 66 million years old because she said she was around when the dinosaurs were
Yes in Deep Breath she mentioned having seen a T-Rex as a child.
As the text noted, the Silurians use suspended animation, so she hasn't "lived" that long.
@@MartinInBC yes but she also said she’s lived that long
@@midaslife654 I think she was implying that she was kept alive in stasis that long. She wasn't actually revived until the Troughton years with the Great Intelligence.
it could be even longer as that’s just when they died out
you forgot to mention Rory- The Centurion.
he was over 2000 years old as well
although the universe was reset and all, Rory's age would still count right?
I would say yes, myself, because he still remembered everything He had 2000+ years of experiences, even if his physical body was reset, he was still there.
I dont think they counted it, i dont know
If we don't cont the confession dial we don't count rory, unfortunately.
@@cedkira the doctor didnt have to experience each of those billions of years, as he just kinda died over and over but couldnt remember, but rory continuously experienced that
@@cedkira the confesion dial is something diferent, the doctor that came out of there has just been teleported, went threw the events in the episode and carried on
Wouldn't Jack still be older than Ashilder? In the spin off series Torchwood, Jack literally goes through the death of the universe, the big bang, only to relive up to the events of that episode again to meet someone.
Like Marvin the paranoid Android, Jack has traveled to the end of the universe and back so can be argued as being possibly older than the universe itself.
does he stay that whole time or just travel there because that would be different....torchwood is my favorite old school low budget sci-fi
@@wastedtalent1625 I believe he stays the whole time, it's been a long time since I've seen the episode. I will admit I could definitely be wrong. I'd definitely need to rewatch.
The Bible is truth. Please read at least three books. The first book of each testament and one you chose yourself. It’s important to remember that it’s the doing that’s key. Look inside and do your inner healing. To be forgiven we must forgive:
I'd say Ashildr is still older because we know when Jack dies, but Ashildr is still out there time travelling
Some years ago I was at a rennisance faire, and spotted someone dressed as The Doctor. Worth a bit of a chuckle, but not much more...
Until one of the living statue performers grabbed an angel wings backpack and started following him around, freezing in place whenever he looked in her direction.
that is pure genius.
😲 😲 😲
That's so cool!
We have this High Middle Ages faire in my town every single year (because of the feast that ended with the king throwing his two younger brothers in jail to rot and then throw the key into the river nearby), and your comment makes me wanna dress up as the Doctor and go there whenever it will be next time (or whenever I can that is)
I don't think anyone there would get the joke though lmao
@@ankaplanka At a Faire? They would ALL get the joke.
9:12
When they meet Ashildr at the end of the universe, they're a lot closer to the end of the universe than they were in the "Utopia" episode.
true
The end of the universe is when the last of stars are extinguished. All the fuel is spent. But there are black holes that still exist. They will be the last things that finally go out. But by then everything will be dark as fuck.
@@wesleyc8101 There are iron stars which are theorised to be the last objects in the universe. These could potentially last upwards of 10^1500 years, whereas the oldest black holes will reach only around 10^100 years - a bloody long time, but miniscule by comparison.
Edit: I was very wrong, they can *form* sometime after 10^1500 years, they will from that point on last much much longer. 10^10^26 years for small ones and 10^10^76 years for large ones, I beleive.
Have to wonder, though, how long Clara hung around with her, while taking the long way back to Galifrey.
@@wesleyc8101 They were at the last few moments like less then ten minutes from what they were saying to each other....and no, she didn't have a TARDIS before then.
The problem with Ahsilder's age is that at some point in her life she acquired her own TARDIS, which means that here are at least a few instances in the show where she could have arrived in that time period via her TARDIS.
Are you talking about the Diner TARDIS or is there a TARDIS that I have forgotten?
My problem with Ashildr's age is that she actually CAN die. This was made clear in The Woman Who Lives where even something as simple as drowning would be fatal if she hadn't taught herself to hold her breath for an abnormally long time, something that real people can do. It takes a considerable amount of training but Ashildr had centuries to learn to do that. Unless she time travelled to the end of the Universe and got stranded there (which is completely possible but was never established), she would have either been killed or committed suicide out of sheer boredom LONG before the Universe snuffed it. Ashildr made it clear that having a lifespan which functioned very similar to outright immortality was not only depressing but incredibly dull. However, unlike Captain Jack, she actually has the option of putting herself out of her misery if something or someone else doesn't kill her first.
An another problem the time is not linear in the Dr. Who universe, but it is timey wimey ball thing. So by this far also Clara and Rose are time traveller and it is challenging to count the time they have lived.
As soon as you hit 2000, you can start saying your thousands of years old. After all it's now plural ;)
Yes, that's true, but isn't this skipping like a few things cus I feel like he's older then 2000
Or you just start counting by centuries instead of years. LOL
@@ironbunky He is...way older like with a few Bs.
Do a list about 10 characters that need to be redeemed. Like what they did with Nardole
Pretty easy #1 then. The doctor
🤣
Nardole wasn’t a bad guy though.
@@zedarkenigma nah like characters who people didnt rlly like but then were re shaped so people liked him
@@tommillington6730 Ah
First off, the face of bo - being jack, would have travelled back in time many times making him WELL OVER 5 billion.
Then there is Lady Cassandra who is the last 'Pure Human' - and she is found 5,000,000,000 years into the future.
Going from the shows, we can only say for certain Jack lived an additional 0.0000002 billion years due to time travel. I think it's probably still worth rounding down to 5bn.
As for Cassandra, they never say how old she is, but I'd be shocked if the idea was that she'd been around for billenia. I never took her as an age-old being, so much as the last, sad member of a racist future colony trying to see how long "modern" medicine can keep her going. You could be right, of course, but I'd guess she's only a few hundred years old, max.
As Hilda is probably a lot more older than 100 trillion as she did end up with a tardis, so she could literally go on for eternity
Auto correct messed up the name
She is as that 100 Trillion was done before she got the Tardis.
@@dylanshields7106 I giggled, it was a good mistake :o)
@@Mortlupo Before is subjective when time travel is involved. It's entirely plausible she is a future version of Ashilda who already had the Tardis. It seems unlikely she'd have survived 100tn years without going mad or being killed. The tech keeping her alive doesn't make her completely invulnerable.
@@nekogod she had her companion Clara and as Clara was at the brink of death, she couldn't die again. Ashildr and Clara could travel through time and space together. That's why she won't get mad, she will always somebody to talk to.
And because we know that the Doctor ages during the offscreen adventures in past and future, Ashildr can as well, well she can't age because her cells cannot die.
if you can count the Silurian's being frozen underground as their age then the confession dial should count
There was that one Silurian priest from the audio adventures that didn't freeze and spent millions of years awake protecting a certain place
Just because you CAN make a character ludicrously old doesn't mean you SHOULD.
There's a cool theory that the Doctor stopped counting their as of The War Doctor incarnation but started over after they 'destroyed' Galifrey and became The Doctor again. It would make sense seeing as The War Doctor is assumed to have lived for a very long time and the surprisingly low age of the Ninth Doctor.
In an eighth doctor audio the Doctor says he's lost count of his age so decides to start over, he was over 1000 at that time.
@@finnstewart4747 Ah well, close enough. I haven't been able to catch up on all the audio dramas but that makes sense.
And always the very legitimate answer, "The Doctor lies".
What about Ohila and the Sisterhood of Karn? Ohila knew the Doctor since his first childhood and claimed to be an immortal in Heaven Sent. She implied she was older than the Doctor in that same episode when she referred to him as a boy.
And in that same episode the Doctor spends more than two billion years punching his way through a several metres thick wall of diamond. The Doctor himself is in excess of two billion years old, isn't he?
@@MrScifimadman no, because he keeps using his imprint or whatever you call it that's stored in the transmat to bring him back just before he dies, so in essence, he keeps going back to the first moment he arrives. Time goes forward but he doesn't age.
@@MrScifimadman the narrator said specifically that the time in the confession dial was not being counted. Maybe due to what Tracy said above.
@@tracyroweauthor It is implied that as Timelord he could remember his time in confesion dial so his mental age could be more than two billion :D
@@laigron7884 yes, he remembers his last time in the confession dial. He left behind enough clues that he was able to figure out what he had to do each time and he knew by the stars how far in the future he was, but I don't think that aged him in any way.
Can we pretend the Timeless Child was the Master screwing with the Doctor and the past version of herself was actually a future incarnation?
That's how I would see it, but it is something the master would do, just make something up. Hes done it before, well I think. If I, and many others, had it our way, we would have master just say it was a lie, or just say he made it up, have the doctor find that out, I personally have no problem with Jodie Whitaker as the doctor, it's just Chris chibnall and those who wanted the timeless child plotline. It, shouldn't have been done like that
th-cam.com/video/94tqYSkAOq8/w-d-xo.html Philip Hawkins did a video where he theorises that The Doctor is actually Tecteun instead of The Timeless Child, and The Timeless Child is actually The Master, it’s a well put together theory, and the way he tells it ties up quite a few loose ends from Classic Who. He doesn’t mention the Ruth Doctor, but my theory for her is that she’s between 2 and 3.
@@Catherine.Catherine to be fair, we dont really see two regenerate into three but still why would the ruth doctor use a gun then
@@jamiemarshall6832 Plus Ruth doesn't know what the sonic screwdriver is, when Two was the first to use it.
@@evildeathcuddles886 oh yeah good point
No honorable mention for Plastic Rory?
Love her or hate her, Clara is on the list having lived through the doctors entire lifetime. She was there for the theft of the T.A.R.D.I.S. (shown) and before (implied). She was born to save the Doctor. She's the impossible girl. Once she starts travelling with me, any additional time technically wouldn't count. She's dead: ambulatory, but dead.
She lived through the doctors timeline by living and dying to guide him to where he needed to be - would that still count as she was reborn for each time she was needed, rather than living permanently? Victorian Clara had no memory of the doctor, or of other incarnations of herself. Modern Clara was the same, which implies that she was spun into existence for her purpose rather than being permanent. Think along the same lines as Heroes of the Horn from Wheel of Time - they exist in the World of Dreams, but are only spun into life for a specific purpose rather than always living. Same Soul, Different Life.
Clara's echoes are their own characters. They don't have the real Clara's life experience and a throwaway line in Day of the Doctor revealed that she only remembers "a bit" of theirs. She only has a vague memory of the other lives she lived - actually, Rory seems to remember his time as an Auton more clearly than Clara remembers her echo lives - so it's understandable why she's not on this list. The original Clara may have decided to travel the universe for millennia after Hell Bent before going back to the fixed point in time that the Time Lords created for her in Face the Raven, but that's not confirmed in the show itself.
I like that in Shada, Professor Chronotis had been working as a professor at the university and living in the same apartment for some three hundred years but the university administration never noticed.
Or the Fact the 12th Doctor worked at the University in Series 10 for over 50 years at that point, and never got older
@@shadowthecatukVODS True, but not as extreme as doing it for around three hundred years.
@@peterjf7723 That is also True, I just wonder what it was like for the University to discover The Doctor fully Disappeared and found his Sonics and photo of Susan with no one to give it to
@@shadowthecatukVODS There could be a side story about the university launching an investigation to find him.
@@peterjf7723 Yeah, It just mostly goes unexplained, which happens quiet a lot, Like some people know the Doctor for a while and just disappears, like with what happened at Trenzalore, he Protected the planet for 500 Years, and just doesn't tell them "Well it's been fun, but I need to go now" he just disappears without a trace
Although this species is relatively new to Doctor Who, what about the Hond? The Hond are...creatures that have existed since the dark times (like some other characters in the show) and they look like the Flans from Final Fantasy, but they're green. Flans can be any color according to their environment. The Hond have always been green. The Hond weren't originally from this universe. In fact, it's *because* they aren't from here that they want to destroy everything. They think life is pain and the only way they know to get rid of that pain is to destroy it...which was a big problem and why The Doctor sent the Hond back to their own universe.
Omega. Pioneer of time travel, same age as Rassilon or thereabouts, but unlike Rassilon who used stasis for very very long sleeps, Omega was entirely awake, and existed as anti-matter and mere conscious thought. You mention him in your 10 Smartest Doctor Who Characters video, but miss him here :( shame because I really liked him as a villain, where, through no fault of his own, had simply gone quite insane.
Nope, he's namechecked in the "Dark Times" segment.
Wait, so THAT'S where Rassilon got the Final Sanction idea from. I assumed he just came up with it out of desperation to get out of the Time War by any means necessary but he was actually inspired by Omega.
The ancient lights from Sarah Jane adventures are from before the universe so they would beat 13 billion
Hurrah, another SJA rememberer!
@@patchworkfellow4262 haha
Another thing is the beast is older than the universe too cos I remember the doctor talking about him believing the beast if he said he was as old as the universe but not when he said he was older than it
@@OverWims true, true. I actually had a theory that it the “Disciples of Light” who imprisoned him actually _worked_ for the Ancient Lights, and the two forces had some form of power struggle (two different “magics”, their Universe’s equivalent of science), so when the new Universe came and the Ancient Lights went into hiding until their foreseen time, the Disciples went rogue and imprisoned the presumably-weakened (like the Ancient Lights probably were) Beast in Krop Tor
@@patchworkfellow4262 makes sense
The Shadow of the Valyard is the oldest being in the universe, this is established by the council of Galifrey during the Doctor's trial.
The Face of Bo is the second oldest, established by the Doctor himself on screen and in the novels.
The Eternals as a race are older than the Timelords, this is irrefutable canon, but since they sealed themselves away, they take third place.
Fourth place goes to both Nineveh(7th doctor) and the House entity(11th doctor).
^^^These are the ONLY character's to be measured in BILLIONS of years.
5th - 10th place can be distributed among any number of characters from the early serials, as most of them have lifespans from thousands to millions of years.
"Me" shouldn't be on this list at all, she isn't billions of years old, she cheated and time travelled to the end of the universe only a few years after the Doctor left her in "Face the Raven", this is canon and is thoroughly explained in the novels. The end of the universe was the only place she thought she'd be safe from the Doctor's wrath, she was wrong. She then time travels back to when she left with Clara and starts over. She didn't live much longer after that.
I did not know that "Me" travelled to the end of the universe because I have read that book.
Actually wouldn’t The Beast from Impossible Planet and The Satan Pit be the oldest since it was from before the universe?
The Eternals, as well as other creatures like the black and white guardians and the celestial toy maker. they all pre-date the universe. thus anything in the universe cannot by process of elimination be older than they are.
The Doctor as the timeless child puts the Doctor into a potential side class of unknown. Assuming it holds true, We know nothing yet about the Doctor's true origin. All the creatures from the "dark times" are still from the relative early universe and don't compare, this includes the satan pit and the Racnoss as well as other creatures which may or may not be reportedly that old.
I'm also sure that Hell Bent is not nearly as far flung into the future as all that.
@@sykeassai The Doctor is NOT the timeless child, nothing after Whitaker came on board is canon. Her entire run was retconned in the new novel series.
@@blankspace178 I can't say I've read many novels or listened to many audio stories. I'm not sure how they'd recon that, especially since the doctor's pre-hartnall era which his fixed Canon. But how do they plan to address that in the show?
You could also add Tzim-Sha to this list, since around the time of Battle Ranskoor Av Kolos, he is over 3,400 years old, and since he'll be in the stasis chamber for eternity, he's essentially immortalized in a prison forever.
You forget that Ashildr (I prefer to think of her name as Me) has a Tardis. There's no reason she HAS to take the long way around. She could potentially be just around 1500 years old.
She didn't get the tardis until she ran into the doctor at the end of the universe though, meaning she lived through it all
@@t_r_a_y_e9858 There are other ways to travel through time then the Tardis. Especially to the future. Other time machines, suspended animation or space-time distortions (high intensity gravity field) could all send her to the future without increasing her age.
@@frantisekvrana3902 so tell me, if she had access to time travel, why would she choose to go to the end of the universe? I feel like that's the last place she'd wanna be
@@t_r_a_y_e9858 If it was an actual time machine, perhaps it sent her to the future by accident, then broke down.
But personally, I am getting on the last option. She could have been stuck near a black hole for a few trillion years, while aging just a few days.
Great video!
I love how a video about age came out on my birthday...thanks whoculture for reminding me of my finite age with immortal/very old beings..
That’s a great video mate!!!!
Excellent host who knows his stuff! Really loving this channel. Keep it up!
I’d say the Doctor is even older than that because Doc 8 started again from 2, thus must be about 3000 years old.
try closer to 4
Luckily, we Time Lords have developed special cake technology that allows us to put thousands of candles on a tiny surface area.
It's bigger on the candleside.
Wouldn’t it be bigger on the outside then?
Not counting the timeless child as part of the Doctor's time makes sense but the confession dial should absolutely count for two reasons. One, it was the doctor doing it. Two, while it was effectively a time loop, he did remember all of every loop at the end if each one.
I still don't understand why Ashildr is more immortal than Captain Jack? Like it doesn't make sense to me that a scavenged piece of technology from a Mire helmet is more powerful than the Time Vortex itself lol
I would argue it isn't and Ashildr will eventually die and evolve the same.
I think Jack lived to the end of time, then time travelled back to early humanity just to watch it again, a few times. That would make him MUCH older than her.
Agreed. Jack is a fixed point in space time. The only way he would devolve is if and when space time itself devolves. Needless to say I do not buy the whole jack being the Face of Boe, more likely it is a riddle or misdirection by the show (he did say it was just a nickname, who is to say the nickname did not originate from the future).
@@PartStupid I always viewed it as the headless monks taking his head at some point in the future. Lost the body to time after that and slowly turned to the face of boe do to him still actually being alive.
@@nevarstormdragon - That does not help, in fact it is even less believable.
I always understood it in the way that jack had so much live energy, he just could not die, while ashildr simply did not age
I love this channel
The Master reached and through shenanigans surpassed his limit of Regenerations during the Classic era of Doctor Who. Did he die more often than the Doctor, or was there many more years spent traveling through time and space doing evil stuff?
Thing is, we haven't seen 13 Masters running around so we've missed several of those incarnations.
Oh come ON, as a woman the Master was perhaps the most deadly and,dare I say it, bananas? The snark wasn't lost on me...
I suspect you’re just looking to be offended. Go back to Twitter.
no no that is just woman in general....
Im not sure what you mean in the last part but anyway I think the master was the best as a women, her personality and her eventually trying to be good was fantastic
What about the Family of Blood? They all wanted to live forever, and The Doctor taught them it's not good to get what you wish for.
they probably hadn’t lived that long before the doctor came along
Jon Pertwee first met the Silurians in Doctor Who and the Silurians. The Sea Devil versions have been in a few times, both Third doctor and Fifth doctor.
As long as there are time travelers popping about, the fact that someone like Ashildr is around at the end of time circa 100 trillion years in the future does not necessarily mean that she is 100 trillion years old. She might have hitched there on a Tardis.
maybe she used the TARDIS she and Clara stole after returning Clara to Gallifrey (after what I like to imagine were many, many adventures together) just so she could be there to meet up with the Doctor and steal the TARDIS with Clara....
True but even if you cut that time by 1000 you still end up far older than anything else. We know she's already been around for hundreds of years when we see her in The Raven, and in a commentary thing I've seen on the episode they do specifically mention she's far older than The Doctor. Obviously a lot of room there between 2000 and 100 trillion but still.
@@captainchaos5705I don't doubt she's ancient, but it's still possible that at the time we saw her at the end of the universe she may not necessarily have been there because she lived that long.
I always wondered though. If she can't die, what would happen to her at the end of the universe? Would she still exist? How? Where would she go? If she has to go back to the end of time to steal the TARDIS with Clara so she can avoid, for a while at least, the end of the universe and live longer, does that put her in an endless loop?
I'm way overthinking this lol
@@tracyroweauthor pretty sure Me can still die if killed but her body will keep being repaired as long as she isn't killed too quickly
@@dallama2616 Yeah. The Doctor specifically mentions that she can still die, her response is basically that she's too good at literally everything to die
1:45
You don't need to clear that up. No one counts that as canon anyways
@GamingWithChu ok. sorry for the spelling mistake. and no. you aren't no one. but still, the timeless children is an insult to the legacy of the show and should've never been made.
@GamingWithChu as a lifelong Who fan (since the Pertwee years) I absolutely consider the Timeless Child an insult to the legacy and the canon.
@GamingWithChu the point is, no one speaks for everyone. Not even you.
@GamingWithChu okay. i understand. sorry if it was insulting
Jack had to live through from about 100 years ago back to when he was born in the 51st century too.
And when was he buried alive to live and die over and over?
Just going by onscreen adventures, no audios/comics/vg/etc:
-Jack was about 40yo when we first meet him. (JB actual age?)
-He is then killed, resurrected as immortal, and goes back to 1870s-90s (sources differ; recruited by Torchwood in 1899). so about 150-170ish in Torchwood s1e1.
-Gray and John send him back to 27AD, burying him alive. Torchwood finds him in 1901, where he moves to the cryo-chambers for 107 years to 2008/present.
-At this point, Jack is ~2150-70yo.
.
We assume his next few years are relatively sane, but he does keep space and time traveling. He knows about 13's future encounter with the Lone Cyberman when he mistakes Graham for the 13th Doctor.
He later states it took him about twenty years to get arrested by the Judoon to rescue 13, and then a few more years just to reach her. We don't know when he learns about LC danger, as everything after Fugitive of Judoon is presented as taking place after that.
He's closing in on 2200, possibly older, here as far as Revolution of the Daleks.
I was about to say "Hey, what about the billions of years in the confession dial" I wanted to argue for it's inclusion but then i thought about it. He was rewritten every day. No actual time passed for that body save for the day spent punching the wall. God i love that episode.
I was gonna say that too lol
Yeah, but mentally he still lived 4.5 billion years, even if it was the same week over and over. So mentally hes old as hell
@@jacobwright536 It was'nt the same day again and again. The time did pass as he can say that the stars keep shifting in the sky. Indicating that time do pass but the doctor is continuously being reboot. So for him it was just the time he spend on a run until he died repeating the same day.
@@popolloi2962 And then there the piles of bones.
@@Mortlupo proving that it's not the same doctor ☺️
I did expect that moon egg creature to have been on the list
The Master and the Doctor being childhood friend does not mean they're the same age. That is not how time traveling characters work.
yes you can they still age at the same rate. The age of a time traveler is constant other wise they would travel a 1000 years and be dust when they exit the TARTIS. So 1 year aged IS 1 year aged regardless of WHEN they are. As Einstein said it is all relative.
@@deepdragon2 There's actually something called the "twin paradox", which I believe Einstein established. If a twin moves at the speed of light, time will go by slower for him. When he stops to reunite with his other twin, he will be younger, even through they are still Born on the same day and meet at the same point in time. You can apply this to Doctor Who time travel as well. Let's say the Master and the Doctor meet on a planet, on a certain day. Then the Doctor leaves in the Tardis, while the Master stays there for a hundred years. Then, after the Master has waited hundred years, the Doctor returns to the planet, once again arriving in his tardis. But now you can't say, if the Doctor has aged more or less. He could've just traveled a hundred years into the Future right away, aging just a few minutes. Or he could've spent a thousand years going around in time and space and then travel back to the planet a hundred years after he left.
Honestly, i still like to include the years the doctor spent in the confession dial as his age so to me he'll always be "4 and a half billion" years old
10,000 hours and you can learn any skill, 100,000 hours and you become a master ... a million or so years and you become brilliant ...
The Beast wasn't specifically from the Dark Times, was it?
According to it (though, yeah, may well have been exaggerating) the whole battle that took place to seal it away took place "Before time, and light, and space, and matter". The Doctor's response of "That's impossible, no life could have existed back then" also indicates that they were not aware of any other creatures from that time.
Well the Beast is literally Satan so it exists outside of Time. Can you even apply an age to something that doesn't conform to the rules of the Universe?
Lauren said you mentioned kind of recently remind me of the sleestaks from Land of the Lost TV shows from then and now including Doctor Who and from what I see a doctor who has definitely been seen better days but I am going to say rest in peace Doctor Who
Musn't forget the creature that took Heather, it traveled through time like we walk through air.
Not counting 4.5 Billion Years.... yeah just one of the best episodes ever made. and one of the most impressive things ever done in any series I ever seen, and I have seen a lot!
But he didnt LIVE those years, he lives one day in the confession dial, on endless repeat, with no memory of having done that day before each time he restarts.
@@lesigh1749 Regardless of how many repeats of the same day, the Doctor lived everyone of them. So they should still be counted
@@missjayspeechley9213 Well agree to disagree. From his perspective he awakens in that machine, and spends one day surrounded by a billion skulls and being chased by a ghost. He has no way to recall the other billion versions of himself, because they all die each day and a new copy is rebooted from the beginning.
I know RTD confirmed it with Jacks lines, but it doesn't make sense for Jack to be The Face of Boe.
What makes much more sense is that The Face of Boe is Rex Matheson, and he lived an average life span after the destruction of his resurrection source, the Earth.
(He even looks more like Rex than he looks like Jack.)
why can't jack be the face of boe?
@@dallama2616 he can. But that line to Martha and the Doctor, where he was once the poster child for something or other, or whatever, doesn't really confirm him as the actual creature. Like how Google informs me now that Lily Rose Depp is the new Face of Chanel, the perfume co. Apparently. But she's not the first and she won't be the last... Jack's word's added up to a cute "no way - could it be... ?!" moment but future canon isn't written by a vague what if, or random concepts tweeted out by ex-showrunners years after the fact. Or maybe he is the Face, not really a Jack fan myself so not fussed either way
Plus I managed to accidentally delete my previous comment so I'm blaming that stupid face
@@hgwells1899 Jack is confirmed to have died before the end of time by Me meaning he died at some point. He was there when yana became the master. Who else could be the face of boe?
@@dallama2616
A few reasons. Probably the biggest being that he was around when The Doctor and Martha were talking about the Face of Boe and didn't react at all.
It's far more in character that he just thought it was funny, and wanted to leave them with more ponderings than when they got together.
@@dallama2616 Me never said he died. She said he was gone.
Drax is nearly the same age as The Doctor. Morbius and the King Vampire are almost as old as Omega and Rassilon. The Black and White Guardians may predate the universe itself. And we can assume the Megara (Justice Machines) are quite old as well.
If the tardis is sentient, how old is it?!
At @4:24 that is Dianna Rigg from the Avengers as Emma Peel and she also played Queen of Thorns Olenna Tyrell on Game of Thrones. She has made many performances, my favorite is A MIDSUMMER NIGHT’S DREAM (1968).
Insane, terrifying, deadly and sometimes a woman
Ashilder is an incredible character. Too bad she couldn't find someone worthy enough to spend the rest of eternity with and how she couldn't even remember her own past, but it makes sense.
Something I've noticed is that people seem to forget that with time travel there are a polethora of characters alive AND dead who the doctor could still meet. For example the face of boe. Yes he's dead but there are still the thousands of years between the last time they see Jack to the first time they meet the tace of boe.
It's implied as soon as you know someone's dead, you can't meet them earlier.
Audio is a bit echoey might want to look into fixing that
One problem. The Beast is from BEFORE time, BEFORE the universe. He/It says so in The Impossible Planet/Satan Pit. Making it/him far older than Ashildr by virtue of being older than the universe.
Also, there is a ship in doctor who podcast episode that grants you wishes, the doctor stated that the ship was from beyond this universe, he also mentioned that some creatures that exist in the universe are also beyond this universe meaning there were around when the old universe explode and formed the new one. The beast that was chained is one such creature he said he was beyond the universe and the doctor who ask was does that mean and he replied before this universe was formed.
Wasn't there a 4th doctor episode with immortal beings that wanted to steal the Doctor's regenerations in order to die? I can't remember how old they were at the time though.
River Song was 224 when the Doctor was 2000, the Doctor is gonna get cancelled for the second time since the timeless Children
One cannot compare the age of time travellers based on the fact that they were “borne” at about the same time.
yes you can they still age at the same rate. The age of a time traveler is constant other wise they would travel a 1000 years and be dust when they exit the TARTIS. So 1 year aged IS 1 year aged regardless of WHEN they are. As Einstein said it is all relative.
@@deepdragon2 you are indeed correct that they will age at the same rate. But as soon as they each go on their own “time path”, on a different occurrence of a meeting they might have lived/aged different amounts. One of them could even be younger (e.g. The Doctor and River)
That’s the same jumper Howard wears in the Channel 4 show ‘Fresh Meat’.
Never have I needed something so badly And never known
There is a huge problem with Ashilda being given a TARDIS at the end of the universe: The Doctor's TARDIS is, according to the Doctor in many episodes, programmed to prevent him from visiting times and places he has already visited. We can assume all TARDIS's are programmed the same way so hers will be too. If she can live forever traveling throughout the universe and all time which are finite (if there is an end to the universe then it has to be finite in both size and time), then after a long long time travelling she will come to a point when she will no longer be able to visit anywhere or any time because she has been everywhere and every time, her TARDIS just will not allow her to travel! So then she will be stuck again living in sequential time until the end of the universe, so there should have been 2 of her there not one! How old would that make the 2nd version of her at the end of the universe? You would not be able to calculate that one's age because it would depend on how much time she spent travelling and where in time she ended up being stranded by the TARDIS! lol
NOTE: I used TARDIS with all caps because it's an acronym of "Time and Relative Dimension in Space" and acronyms are meant to be written in all caps!
What happened to the begging of the videos with the Tardis coming in and tilting sideways i miss that?
One gaffe is that Captain Jack was standing right there when the Doctor and Martha were talking about what the Face of Boe had said to them during Gridlock. He of course didn’t say “Hey that’s me!” It’s a slip that takes a little bit of the magic out of it for me.
Or he didn't say anything because "spoilers!" ;)
Aw you got me there. I thought he was several billion years by the time he got to Galifrey. Resets. Tch!
What about Rory William? Does his time as the last centurion not count.
I was thinking the trickster (The Pantheon) because he exsisted in the void where their is no time or space so by definition hes beyond immortal and lives beyond any known universe
There are several characters that predate the universe, even ones that go back several universes, like Shada.
"It's not the years, it's the mileage."
I think the master is probably a lot younger than the doctor considering he hasn't traveled in time nearly as much.... Idk it just makes sense to me.
I do not think that this is an argument because how much you time travel isn´t important. For example spent the Master hundreds (maybe thousends) of years at the ship from Mondas with his disabled TARDIS. (At the point where he was the time was fast). And Missy herself said that she had her own adventures throughout the universe, on her own.
Not forgetting that time acts differently the closer or further away from gravity the subject is.
When it came to the episode about the Crimson Horror, madame Vastra stated that she hadn’t seen the poison for around 26,000,000 years.. so there for she is tens of millions of years old at least and not 100s of years old
Scaroth of the Jagaroth,City of Death episode was 400 million years old.
100 trillion years old
wow, just-
wow
The Dalek who hates Daleks- from “Into the Dalek”. In “Twice Upon a Time,” the Doctor states that its been billions of years since they had last met. Yes, the Dalek can travel in time, but it seems as if this particular one was just camping out, and wasn’t even leaving the planet. Davros and other Daleks also likely lived for thousands of years- especially since the in “The Witch’s Familiar” there are thousands of mulched up Daleks in the sewer, who are alive, and likely have been for ages.
Regarding Prof Chronitis, you need to check out Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency, by Douglas Adams... he literally took the abandoned Dr Who script and turned it into part of a novel.
The 7th doctor is mentioned as being known from the dark times by that lady in Battlefield.
Awesome
When we first see 12 reach the diamond (Azbantium? Byzantium?) wall he mentions how everytime he reaches that wall at that moment he remembers everything which came before and what his plan is. So technically, when the looped doctor who broke the wall goes through it, he would have remembered all 4 and a half billion years inside the confession dial. To me, that does count to his age but it is understandable why the doctor doesnt state it and also why people dont typically count it.
Also side note i said Byzantium up there but is that the ship that 11 and River fight the angels at?
then there are people like the Celestial Toymaker who are older than the current universe and will likely out live this one and into the next
According to the new series and even suggested earlier during the original the Dr precedes the Time Lord's by an unknown amount.
5:28 reminds me of that woman from 'The Candyman' films.
I knew it wouldn't be the writers. They are the 10-year-old characters in the Dr. Who Universe.
Happy birthday to me
8:28
Who else here thought at first the Doctor and all were saying "a shielder" as a strange and cheeky way to say she defended things? Took me a while to figure out this was her weird-ass name by the end of the episode.
ÁSHILDR
LANGUAGE FAMILY: INDO-EUROPEAN > GERMANIC > NORTH GERMANIC > OLD NORSE
ORIGIN: OLD NORSE
NAME ROOT: *ANSUZ / ÁSS HILDR > ÁSHILDR
MEANING: This name derives from the Old Norse name “Áshildr”, composed of two elements: “áss” (heathen god, god, deity), from the Proto-Germanic “*ansuz” plus “hildr” (battle, fight). In turn, the name means “God fights for us”.
@@Mortlupo Yeah, not a totally common name today then. ;)
No, I got that it was her name right away.
My theory for Jack/The Face of Bo is that, as he's a fixed point, his maximum age is, and always will be, the same as the heat death of the universe, so he lived for the entire 100 trillion years +, and then when he was "near" death (by a few measly billion years) he hopped back to the start so he could give the doctor his prophecy.
You should have gone into all the Torchwood stuff for Jack, to explain the Face of Boe.
The Image of the Fendahl...
Notably including Thea Ransome played by Wanda Ventham aka Benedict Cumberbatch's mum...
Honestly the reveal that jack is the face of bo was the most profound moment for me in the show, i actually paused the show and had a bit of a mind explosion moment it did feel good though, sadly moments like that are so rare in all forms of entertainment.
The only entities that I suppose are consciously aware, not in suspended animation and not limited by the memory capacity of their humanoid brain, for the entire span of the Universe would be: the Guardians. The Guardians are part of the Universal mechanism of order/chaos before it is ultimately defeated by heat death; assuming that there isn`t another state of being in that time just like there is during the "Star Time" of Universe?
You know how Ashildr AKA Me and Clara AKA the impossible girl took the TARDIS at the end of time eluded to making a few stops on their way to returning Clara to her death, well a spin-off show that I would love to see if "The Impossible Girl and Me" the adventures of Clara and Ashildr......
One character I haven’t seen in the comments yet is The Solitract from “It Takes You Away”. It was exiled because of its incompatibility with the universe. That would have to make it older than the universe itself, right?
There was that time traveler who got stuck in a pocket spot and was discovered by the guy with the weird ghost detection devices
time moved differently in the pocket universe. A few hundred thousand years went by on Earth while Hilla Tachorian was "haunting" the well, but she was only stuck in the pocket universe a few days, so she didn't age all that much.
Very new to doctor who. Nearly finished with S1 but if anyone can link me how to watch anything before 2005 in the right order that'd be super pluggg.