Thank you!! My son, right as I tuck him in: "Dada, how do scientists know how old something is?" Me, cleverly and not showing my panic: "It's bedtime. Ask me first thing in the morning. I'll tell you all about it" as I run to the internet for answers! haha.
C-14 has a half of 5700 yrs So how can a fossil be millions of yrs old if it contains c-14 There was no millions of yrs - it’s just a fairy tale to remove God - as an ex atheist I thought the same as you - science (real science) proves there has to be a creator
Let's assume that C12 and C14 have 'reliable' half lives. How do we calculate how old something is unless we know the original C12:C14 ratio in an organism? Also, how do we know that radiation has collided with N14 at a constant rate throughout history? Wouldn't creatures near the poles be less exposed to it than creatures at the equator?
But you didn't answer my questions. If you have a lump of carbon and you don't know its *original* ratio of C12 to C14, how can you date it? The best you can do is get its oldest possible date of creation by assuming it started out 100% C14. I am not a creationist so please don't use the false dilemma of _"creationist or trust everything today's textbooks say"_. Have these half-lives all been measured in the last few decades at room temperature? Would they have been different at the bottom of the sea, or when earth had a different atmosphere?
Tim Crinion Carbon dating is getting it's last time it was alive, not created/born. How many years it lived before it died is the number you don't know. But you do know the closest century it was last alive, give or take 100 years, which you didn't know before carbon dating. In the videos they say on AVERAGE(not precise) C:14 has a half life of 5730. In life, science and math every positive has a negative. My question is can carbon dating be used to determine if something is from the future. Could you carbon date something and the number be -5730?
This video is a great introduction to radiometric dating. It provides a great baseline understanding of carbon-14 dating in a simple, easy to understand manner. It explains how the carbon gets into organic material and how the ratios work in calculating the half-life of a sample. However, this is too short to provide any in depth explanation of how carbon-14 is formed and some of the flaws of carbon-14 dating. For example, the description states “How do scientists determine the age of fossils” while radiocarbon dating is helpful in some cases, most fossils are too old to be radiocarbon dated. Overall, this video is a quick and basic introduction to radiocarbon dating.
This helped my class a lot in what were learning! They send you the thanks of all thanks! Ill keep showing my class these types of videos because your awesome!
Tell them THIS: A measurable amount of carbon-14 cannot last for more 50,000 to 75,000 years MAX - in ANY substance - yet it's not only found in DINOSAUR BONES, but ALSO in OIL, NATURAL GAS, COAL, and EVEN DIAMONDS - WHICH ARE ALLEGED TO BE 1 TO 3 BILLION YEARS OLD! This one, single, solitary fact ALONE, disproves "billions of years!" Period!
@notwendy3943 - I am hoping that you did NOT tell anyone you know that is interested in science about @ForeverBleedinGreen 's "young Earth creationist" pseudoscientific theory. It is a religious concept that requires only faith in that specific religion. It is NOT scientific, which requires the scientific method. All the best and stay curious!
Finally a straight forward video on the subject! Just a few questions: How did scientists determine the half-life of C14 ("5730 years on average") and other elements? Also, to measure the ratio of C12 to C14, don't you need to know where they both started to calculate? For example, if two different organisms lived and died around the same time, do they have the same ratio of C12 to C14 throughout their lives and at the very moment they die? I don't know if this chart was accurate, but it showed that an organism starts with more C14 than C12, but earlier he said that most Carbon molecules are C12. Am I missing something? Thanks!
JoeyJoey G Good questions. "How did scientists determine the half-life of C14 ("5730 years on average") and other elements?" -- The even better question would be: How do we know the half-lives of elements with half-lives in the millions of years? Of course you don't sit and wait until half of it is gone. In an exponential decay (one with a half-life), the amount of decays per second (or hour, or day... however long you have time to measure) is proportional to the amount of substance. The proportionality factor is related to the half-life. So you need a sample where you know how much C-14 is in it and then measure the amount of radiation that is emitted by it. Then some rather simple calculation gives you the half-life. (-dN/dt = k*N -- N is the number of atoms, dN/dt is the number of atoms decaying per unit time and k is the proportionality constant, with t_{1/2} = ln(2)/k (t_{1/2} is the half-life, ln the natural logarithm)) Here is one of the papers quoted in the recommendation for 5730 years (note that the puplication is older and has a result of 5780 years): www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0020708X61901338# "Also, to measure the ratio of C12 to C14, don't you need to know where they both started to calculate?" -- Not to measure the ratio, but to determine the age from the ratio. The coarsest approach is to use the present day fraction (or rather 1950s -- before a-bomb experiments changed it somewhat) as a starting point. But of course, e.g. the sun's activity has some influence on that, but by now the historical variations are known. For other sources of error, see: www.c14dating.com/corr.html "For example, if two different organisms lived and died around the same time, do they have the same ratio of C12 to C14 throughout their lives and at the very moment they die?" -- depends on what those organisms are. If they are the same species, feed on the same stuff etc., then yes. But there are some species for which it doesn't work because they get substantial parts of their carbon not from the atmosphere (especially marine organisms, see the link above: reservoir effect). "Am I missing something?" -- The y-axis was labeled: "Fraction of Elements present" -- but I agree, the C-12 line makes no sense. But it's difficult to plot them poth on the same graph (maybe with a log scale), because natural C-14 abundance is 1 part per trillion (so 10^-12). Which is still a large number, if your sample is on the order or 10^23 particles (two grams of carbon), it would be 10^11 particles or about 1400 decays per hour (unless I've made a mistake punching it into my calculator).
bio2020 The decay rate can usually only slightly be affected (less than 1%) by environmental effects. And that's on the order of the margin of error to which the half-life of C-14 is known. A large effect is only known for fully ionized large atoms, but that wouldn't be the case in biological samples.
bio2020 There is nothing that has been shown to affect the half life of any substance. Such a phenomenon would be a gamechanger for energy from nuclear fission.
Valo56 See my comment above: there are actually some boundary cases (namely electron capture, especially in highly ionized atoms) where the half-life of a nucleus can be changed somewhat (usually on the order of up to one percent, but in some exceptional cases even more).
I have a few questions: How do scientists know that the half life of C-14 is 5730 years? How do scientists know the initial amount of C-14 inside of the organism when the organism died?
Perfect! This video was the most helpful video I found on Carbon Dating! I've been trying to understand how scientists date the Earth as oppose to fossils, this video explained things in such a way that I could apply the wisdom to understand dating the planet better, thank you!
Thank you for your reply. Does it mean that the ratio of C14 to C12 in the atmosphere remain constant unless disturbed by "any occasional spikes of C14 levels"? If so, any living organisms that breath in the air should have a constant C14:C12 ratio until they die when the C14 level start to decrease because no new C14 is taken in. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
"For humans, you would ask to see their birth certificate." in what woRLD WOULD YOU NOT ASK THE PERSON, AND INSTEAD ASK TO SEE THEIR BIRTH CERTIFICATE LMAO
@@moritzkorsch9029 So every time you ask someone how old they are, you also ask them for an official copy of their birth certificate to make sure they aren't lying???
@@iambeepbop2452 Of course I wouldn't in a casual conversation. I cannot think of anyone needing concrete proof of your age casually. That being said, if you needed to prove it, for example if you apply for medical insurance, they would definitely want some proof beyond your word.
@@JohnSmith-li5pj The step to actually forge a document like this is rather big, compared to lying about your age in a conversation (especially casually). A big portion of crime is enabled by opportunity, so if it is absolutely necessary to know the age of a person, an official document has to be shown, which is hard to forge. If fake IDs are easy to get by in your area, that just enables more people to have an opportunity to lie about it (e.g. getting alcohol below 21 in the US).
How do you know how much of Carbon 14 the animal originally had? How do you know the composition of the atmosphere in which the creature lived to base the answer on?
My understanding is that you don't need to know the original amount of C14, the ratio of C12 and C14 is the same in every living organism. It's only when the organism dies that the C14 begins to decay, but crucially the C12 doesn't. Therefore, from the moment it dies the ratio between the two begins to change. Since we know the half life of the isotope, we can therefore know how long it's been since the organism died.
@@futurez12 That is because living organisms take in and expel carbon dioxide. This will leave the ratio of C12/C14 equal to that of the atmosphere. (Until death when CO2 is not exchanged) However his question is, how are we certain that previous ratios were the same as present day.
@Pepe - We know they're the same as present day because we can look at things like carbon concentration in ice core dating, for example. There's also some ways of testing that sort of thing via rock samples taken from different sedimentary layers, but that's beyond my basic understanding
moeman1984 5700 years for 50% 11400 years for 75% 17100 years for 87.5% 22800 years for 93.75% 28500 years for 96.875% 34200 years for ~ 98.5 % and still counts it never decays completely but we assume it to be completed at 6 or 7 half life times
It will not decay when it reaches a stable state. For example uranium, when it will decay, the neutrons will be reduced to radon (one of the daughters of uranium) so it will stay there. More like from radioactive elements broken up to be simpler elements.
Hanne Lindblad Environmental effects are known to effect half life but only in the 1% area. This is accounted for in the expected margin for error. Carbon dating gives a rough estimate on the age of the sample, but it's not expected to be precise down to the exact decade. Remember that the half life is only the *average speed* of decay.
"Animal and plant remains can undergo a variety of physical and chemical changes during fossilisation. This results in fossils showing varying styles and degrees of organic preservation: minimal decay with only some loss of soft tissue preservation of a skeleton with minimal change removal of all organic material except carbon, which remains as a film in the rock" TH-cam does not allow me to post the reference link :(
I believe in the Bible stating the earth and the universe is only about 6000 years old, which is enough time for fossils to develop. I don’t believe in the accuracy of radiocarbon dating because carbon decays relatively fast (C has a half life of 5730 years), and after that only half of the original amount remains. If say, after 10 half lives or 57,300 years, the amount of C remaining is only
Great questions below, and video, used it to explain this to my kids. For the questions, the ratio of C14 to C12 is relatively constant across geography and across time. For Geography this is due to the cosmic ray creation of C14 far up in our atmosphere, this is where light rays that are also relatively constant over the centuries create C14 with cosmic bombardment, similar to the norther lights phenomenon. Since it's so high in the atmosphere by the time it reaches ground level it's virtually homogeneous globally. Over time we know it's constant as we have carbon dated events from thousands of years ago, events who's dates we know from written tests, everything from Egyptian mummies to medieval artifacts, to trees that are still alive and over 4000 years old. We have proof that carbon dating is very effective. To go further back in time you can use other radioactive elements with much longer half lives, and unlike C14 turning into C12 + nitrogen gas, these other longer half life elements often break down into 2 other elements that are not gases such as nitrogen, as such with those you have further help determining the age as you have 2 remnants of the original radioactive isotope. These other longer range radioactive products come from the molten core of the earth, and they too are equally mixed in the molten core ,but with longer half lives you also get less precision and you'll usually see comments of plus or minus hundreds of thousands or millions of years, versus C14 that can date on a level of plus or minus a few decades. Lots of work and proof went into this marvelous insight into how to date something over thousands and millions of years.
Welp after hearing people say over and over, "carbon dating isnt that reliable" And hearing this, it seems like a very legitimate way to date things. I mean its not like you can get a accurate date but close enough is still pretty good.
Dinosaur bones technically do contain detectable levels of Carbon-14 beta particle emissions, but you would never use Carbon-14 to date it because the half life is much to short. They would use something like Potassium 40 which has a half life of millions of years instead of just 5730 years. The problem is creationists and science hating people usually just leave that part out.
Kyle Possai how do you determine when to use carbon and when to use another element? Do they date only specific parts of bones or do they date multiple parts of different bones and then use an average?
Careful with those "s" "j" "z" etc, I'm wearing headphones, almost killed my ears, and I'm at only 50% of max volume... Use a de-esser or even a mic foam cover
I still don’t believe in authenticity of the Carbon dating! Is there any other recent upgraded techniques that these paleochronologists use that could replace this carbondating?
I study in Electrical Engineering, but focus on Physics. I lightly know about the topic of fossilization. I shall concede, because you are probably much more knowledgable than I can even pretend to be on the subject. Thanks for the info. Good luck on the finals!
We can estimate the age by measuring the ratio of C-12 and C-14 ..... can we estimate the age by comparing the activity of C-14 in live and dead plant .. if yes then how🤔🤔???? Plz clear this point 🤯
Bulletproof1951 Creationist use science in the same way a hobo uses a light post; for support instead of illumination. And when that fails they try to piss on it.
Thank you! I have a question, why C14 starts to go away only after the creature died? Is it because it could gather new C14 atoms through metabolism when living? But I also heard it being used on detecting the age of non-lifes, such like ceramics, then how does it work?
Am I correct and understanding that the DK process for carbon-14 that exists in a given animal, does not begin to decay until that animal dies? Why is that?
It is not a single number, it is the ratio of radiocarbon C14 to stable carbon C12, measure either by mass spectrometry and/or by beta radiation rate counting.
I’m confused why does carbon-14 only start to break down after the death of its host? have we observed carbon 14 breaking down outside of an animal or plant?
Here's my non-college graduate answer: Because we know how C14 is made, by cosmic ray interaction with Nitrogen in the atmosphere, and that cosmic rays come at Earth at a relatively constant rate, we can infer that C14 levels are stable. Carbon dating provides an age range that should account for any occasional spikes in C14 levels. Sound good to anyone else?
And how do we know the C14 amount in the beginning ( the animal died day zero ) ? bc we deduct the remaining C14 from the initial amount according to the video.
By measuring the ratio of C14 to C12 and comparing that to the ratio of a known Standard to find out the starting value, you can calculate the age. Obviously it is a lot more complicated than that in reality but that is the basics.
false... contrary to previous scientific thinking, chemical environment does noticeably affects the half-life of radioactive decay by electron capture (said by geochemist Chih-An Huh)... and that radioactive isotopes fluctuates in sync with the rotation of the sun's core (said by a Purdue & Stanford scientists)... so although rare, rate of decay is not absolute and should be treated as absolute....
Who was the first to use this style of dating and get these numbers? Also how do we not know that the amount of C14 hasn't been affected by say An Asteroid the size of Texas to emit more C14 into dead organisms ?
Willard Libby. (1947). Asteroids typically aren't "loaded" with Carbon, and are usually rock/ Iron or Ice, silicates. The "dino asteroid" was more like 6 miles; not the size of Texas. moreover a new, recent article suggests thusly: Bottke and his colleagues identified a particular cluster of asteroids that hadn't been studied much yet. Scientists can use computer models and an understanding of the physical forces that affect asteroids to essentially rewind time and determine where these fragments might have come from. In this case, they traced the fragments back to a giant asteroid cluster, whose largest body is now called (298) Baptistina. But there was more to the story. Bottke's team also noticed that the breakup of Baptistina occurred near an "escape route" out of the asteroid belt. In this region, the gravitational kicks produced by the planets, in this case Mars and Jupiter, can change the orbits of the fragments, enough to push some of them out of the asteroid belt and into Earth's path. (Actually, about 100 million years would pass between their escape from the asteroid belt and one asteroid's collision with Earth, but that's not so long on a geologic time scale).
If it breathes in atmospheric air it gets the same ratio of C12 to C14, but when it dies, the C14 decays while the C12 is stable, so the ratio gives the age via the calculation.
@@karhukivi i guess there's a misunderstanding. He means how do you know when half of the c14 is already gone when you Don't know how much was there initially. So basically we can only measure the rate of decay from the day is was discovered and not from the day is started to decompose
@@jamestan4659 The ratio of C14 to C12 in 1 in 10^12 in the atmosphere, although it has varied slightly over time, so when an organism takes its last gasp, the C14 starts to decay while the C12 is stable. So measuring the ratio of C14 to C12 gives you the time elapsed since that last gasp. The ratio can be measured by mass spectrometry or by measuring the beta radiation from the C14 is a weighed amount of carbon material. The date given by simple decay rate can be inaccurate as the C14 ratio in the atmosphere varies, but this can be calibrated against known archaeological artefacts, tree-rings, etc and other dating techniques. The date is usually ±5% precise at best, more usually ±10% and ten half-lives of C14 or about 50,000 years is the practical limit as only 1 in 2^10 (
@@karhukivi ya sure it gives you the time that elapsed but again, there's no way you can tell how much c14 was there in the first place. We can let these so called "experts" be comfortable with their assumption about the c12,c14 ratios, the rate of decay of ç14 and all the other variables. But no one of them can answer the simple question. "When did c14 start to erode?" Which can only be answered if you know how much c14, was already there. Let me give you an example: Suppose we have a Glass of water with a maximum capacity of 300 ml at the time of recording , and that glass has a hole underneath it, now the water continues to drain as we speak. What are the variables? 1. Size of the glass 300 ml - constant 2. Atmospheric temperature - we'll make it constant for illustration purpose. 3. Water - 120 ml at the Time of recording. 4. Initial water volume - Unknown 5.rate of water drain - 20 ml per hour Now given all the variables at play. If i ask these scientist how long will it take before the glass is completely empty? I bet they'll be able to answer very well "assuming that atmospheric temperature constant". If i ask them how much water was there before it started to drain. None of them will be sble to answer. I even gave them the maximum volume capacity of the glass which should have been unknown as well.
We can test this all day . We can go to some grave dated back 1800s i bet you this experts wouldn't be able to tell or even at least give a rough estimate as to when did that person die unless we let them know how much c14 was present at the time of death.
+Hari Taqwan Santoso The initial amount of carbon is estimated from the geological layer the fossils were found in.How do we know the the age of these layers?It is estimated by the amount of carbon found in the fossils they contain.
+Hari Taqwan Santoso Sadly ,i am dead serious.I was disgusted when i found out.This is called 'modelling' & the conclusions are totally dependant on the variables you input.The variables you input tend to reflect your desired output & pre suppositions(a bit like a business plan).It is 'scientific' in the same way that astrology is 'scientific'.The entire evolutionary narrative rests upon long ages (ie: imaginary chronology).Given that Darwinism is the official State Religion of of most modern nations, it is basically illegal to criticise.The ACLU,being the humanist religion's latter day Torquemada, ensures academic compliance with all aspects of secular humanism's creation story.
+MegaFloyd100 I think I start to be confused with your statements. I know radioactive decay, but If we want to determine the age of a certain fossil using that radioactive method, then we should already knew the initial amount of carbon-14 in that fossil with its isotope. Otherwise, the determination can't be done.
+Hari Taqwan Santoso There is also no way to determine the RATE at which the carbon decays.They just assume it has decayed at a constant rate.They once dated a freshly dead seal at 1300 years old.The laboratories who date them come up with many different dates.The scientist chooses the one that he likes best.
How do they know how much carbon 14 was in the fossil when it was fossilized? If it had more or less because of some environmental factors, wouldn't that throw off the dating?
The only thing you need to understand is that carbon dating does not work. None of the methods work. They're all scams designed with the sole intention of getting people to believe in "millions and billions of years" - period...
Sounds about right. The only way I could see spikes would be caused by increases in cosmic rays interacting with Nitrogen. Animals and Plants breathe to take in different gases. We need O2 and plants want CO2. So it may be that plants and animals absorb at different rates and that may be part of the range of dates too.
Thank you!! My son, right as I tuck him in: "Dada, how do scientists know how old something is?" Me, cleverly and not showing my panic: "It's bedtime. Ask me first thing in the morning. I'll tell you all about it" as I run to the internet for answers! haha.
Haha you got kids
Elisha Rankine Haha ikr wow thats so crazy wow haha he got kids no way haha
@@Julie-ox1ez haha
Oml
thats a good dad
You've just explained this better than 3 of my Geology professors. Thank you.
🤣🤣😂😂oh myy
fr
me too😂😂😂😂
C-14 has a half of 5700 yrs
So how can a fossil be millions of yrs old if it contains c-14
There was no millions of yrs - it’s just a fairy tale to remove God - as an ex atheist I thought the same as you - science (real science) proves there has to be a creator
It's edited , sound + animation then how you compare you professor to online teaching
Let's assume that C12 and C14 have 'reliable' half lives. How do we calculate how old something is unless we know the original C12:C14 ratio in an organism? Also, how do we know that radiation has collided with N14 at a constant rate throughout history? Wouldn't creatures near the poles be less exposed to it than creatures at the equator?
But you didn't answer my questions. If you have a lump of carbon and you don't know its *original* ratio of C12 to C14, how can you date it? The best you can do is get its oldest possible date of creation by assuming it started out 100% C14.
I am not a creationist so please don't use the false dilemma of _"creationist or trust everything today's textbooks say"_.
Have these half-lives all been measured in the last few decades at room temperature? Would they have been different at the bottom of the sea, or when earth had a different atmosphere?
Tim Crinion
Carbon dating is getting it's last time it was alive, not created/born. How many years it lived before it died is the number you don't know. But you do know the closest century it was last alive, give or take 100 years, which you didn't know before carbon dating. In the videos they say on AVERAGE(not precise) C:14 has a half life of 5730.
In life, science and math every positive has a negative. My question is can carbon dating be used to determine if something is from the future. Could you carbon date something and the number be -5730?
Rondu01 But how do we know what the *original* ratio of C12 to C14 is?
Tim Crinion
You don't need C12 you just need C14 because it's unstable. When a living thing dies C14 also does. They carbon date C14.
Rondu01 But it's impossible to make the calculation unless you know the original C12:C14 ratio and the current C12:C14 ratio.
i have a carbon dating asignment and ihad no idea what i was doing. after i watched this i still have no idea what im doing
still need help with your assignment?
I hope you are a student, not an actual engineer or scientist otherwise this world is doomed.
This video is a great introduction to radiometric dating. It provides a great baseline understanding of carbon-14 dating in a simple, easy to understand manner. It explains how the carbon gets into organic material and how the ratios work in calculating the half-life of a sample. However, this is too short to provide any in depth explanation of how carbon-14 is formed and some of the flaws of carbon-14 dating. For example, the description states “How do scientists determine the age of fossils” while radiocarbon dating is helpful in some cases, most fossils are too old to be radiocarbon dated. Overall, this video is a quick and basic introduction to radiocarbon dating.
This helped my class a lot in what were learning! They send you the thanks of all thanks! Ill keep showing my class these types of videos because your awesome!
Tell them THIS: A measurable amount of carbon-14 cannot last for more 50,000 to 75,000 years MAX - in ANY substance - yet it's not only found in DINOSAUR BONES, but ALSO in OIL, NATURAL GAS, COAL, and EVEN DIAMONDS - WHICH ARE ALLEGED TO BE 1 TO 3 BILLION YEARS OLD! This one, single, solitary fact ALONE, disproves "billions of years!" Period!
@notwendy3943 - I am hoping that you did NOT tell anyone you know that is interested in science about @ForeverBleedinGreen 's "young Earth creationist" pseudoscientific theory. It is a religious concept that requires only faith in that specific religion. It is NOT scientific, which requires the scientific method. All the best and stay curious!
3 half lives!!!!!!!! PRAISE LORD GABEN
LMAO!
@Shad Gragg that's not the joke
It takes a really long time for the 2nd half life to the 3rd half life. I've been waiting for quite a while.
@@chizpa305 No more waiting now..
Only one word- Best Video ever on Carbon dating
Simple and to the point. Thanks Michael!
going insane in quarantine
Hang in there bud.
yeah
Same stuck in the house all day
These comments look depressing
Finally a straight forward video on the subject!
Just a few questions:
How did scientists determine the half-life of C14 ("5730 years on average") and other elements?
Also, to measure the ratio of C12 to C14, don't you need to know where they both started to calculate? For example, if two different organisms lived and died around the same time, do they have the same ratio of C12 to C14 throughout their lives and at the very moment they die?
I don't know if this chart was accurate, but it showed that an organism starts with more C14 than C12, but earlier he said that most Carbon molecules are C12. Am I missing something?
Thanks!
JoeyJoey G Good questions.
"How did scientists determine the half-life of C14 ("5730 years on average") and other elements?" -- The even better question would be: How do we know the half-lives of elements with half-lives in the millions of years?
Of course you don't sit and wait until half of it is gone. In an exponential decay (one with a half-life), the amount of decays per second (or hour, or day... however long you have time to measure) is proportional to the amount of substance. The proportionality factor is related to the half-life. So you need a sample where you know how much C-14 is in it and then measure the amount of radiation that is emitted by it. Then some rather simple calculation gives you the half-life.
(-dN/dt = k*N -- N is the number of atoms, dN/dt is the number of atoms decaying per unit time and k is the proportionality constant, with t_{1/2} = ln(2)/k (t_{1/2} is the half-life, ln the natural logarithm))
Here is one of the papers quoted in the recommendation for 5730 years (note that the puplication is older and has a result of 5780 years): www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0020708X61901338#
"Also, to measure the ratio of C12 to C14, don't you need to know where they both started to calculate?" -- Not to measure the ratio, but to determine the age from the ratio. The coarsest approach is to use the present day fraction (or rather 1950s -- before a-bomb experiments changed it somewhat) as a starting point. But of course, e.g. the sun's activity has some influence on that, but by now the historical variations are known.
For other sources of error, see:
www.c14dating.com/corr.html
"For example, if two different organisms lived and died around the same time, do they have the same ratio of C12 to C14 throughout their lives and at the very moment they die?" -- depends on what those organisms are. If they are the same species, feed on the same stuff etc., then yes. But there are some species for which it doesn't work because they get substantial parts of their carbon not from the atmosphere (especially marine organisms, see the link above: reservoir effect).
"Am I missing something?" -- The y-axis was labeled: "Fraction of Elements present" -- but I agree, the C-12 line makes no sense. But it's difficult to plot them poth on the same graph (maybe with a log scale), because natural C-14 abundance is 1 part per trillion (so 10^-12). Which is still a large number, if your sample is on the order or 10^23 particles (two grams of carbon), it would be 10^11 particles or about 1400 decays per hour (unless I've made a mistake punching it into my calculator).
Harm10412
And a third question - are there any conditions that can affect, or alter, the deterioration rate?
bio2020
The decay rate can usually only slightly be affected (less than 1%) by environmental effects. And that's on the order of the margin of error to which the half-life of C-14 is known. A large effect is only known for fully ionized large atoms, but that wouldn't be the case in biological samples.
bio2020 There is nothing that has been shown to affect the half life of any substance. Such a phenomenon would be a gamechanger for energy from nuclear fission.
Valo56
See my comment above: there are actually some boundary cases (namely electron capture, especially in highly ionized atoms) where the half-life of a nucleus can be changed somewhat (usually on the order of up to one percent, but in some exceptional cases even more).
I have a few questions:
How do scientists know that the half life of C-14 is 5730 years?
How do scientists know the initial amount of C-14 inside of the organism when the organism died?
I just wanted to know something brief about carbon dating and this short video clips helps me a great deal. Thanks!!!
Perfect! This video was the most helpful video I found on Carbon Dating! I've been trying to understand how scientists date the Earth as oppose to fossils, this video explained things in such a way that I could apply the wisdom to understand dating the planet better, thank you!
Thank you for your reply. Does it mean that the ratio of C14 to C12 in the atmosphere remain constant unless disturbed by "any occasional spikes of C14 levels"? If so, any living organisms that breath in the air should have a constant C14:C12 ratio until they die when the C14 level start to decrease because no new C14 is taken in. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
"For humans, you would ask to see their birth certificate." in what woRLD WOULD YOU NOT ASK THE PERSON, AND INSTEAD ASK TO SEE THEIR BIRTH CERTIFICATE LMAO
Because people can lie. Orignal birth certificates are made when you are born and are a proof that you can show. You cannot prove your age with words.
@@moritzkorsch9029 So every time you ask someone how old they are, you also ask them for an official copy of their birth certificate to make sure they aren't lying???
@@iambeepbop2452 Of course I wouldn't in a casual conversation. I cannot think of anyone needing concrete proof of your age casually. That being said, if you needed to prove it, for example if you apply for medical insurance, they would definitely want some proof beyond your word.
@@moritzkorsch9029 You can fake birth certificates although I do not know how easy it is to ascertain the legitimacy of a birth certificate.
@@JohnSmith-li5pj The step to actually forge a document like this is rather big, compared to lying about your age in a conversation (especially casually). A big portion of crime is enabled by opportunity, so if it is absolutely necessary to know the age of a person, an official document has to be shown, which is hard to forge. If fake IDs are easy to get by in your area, that just enables more people to have an opportunity to lie about it (e.g. getting alcohol below 21 in the US).
How do you know how much of Carbon 14 the animal originally had? How do you know the composition of the atmosphere in which the creature lived to base the answer on?
My understanding is that you don't need to know the original amount of C14, the ratio of C12 and C14 is the same in every living organism. It's only when the organism dies that the C14 begins to decay, but crucially the C12 doesn't. Therefore, from the moment it dies the ratio between the two begins to change. Since we know the half life of the isotope, we can therefore know how long it's been since the organism died.
@@futurez12 That is because living organisms take in and expel carbon dioxide. This will leave the ratio of C12/C14 equal to that of the atmosphere. (Until death when CO2 is not exchanged) However his question is, how are we certain that previous ratios were the same as present day.
@Pepe - We know they're the same as present day because we can look at things like carbon concentration in ice core dating, for example. There's also some ways of testing that sort of thing via rock samples taken from different sedimentary layers, but that's beyond my basic understanding
you have explain it better than my teacher and 3 other books of Anthropology in 2minutes.. Thank You..
One thing I don't get about half life, say every 5700 years half of it decays, and it keeps going on that pattern, when does it decay completely?
theoretically never.
moeman1984 5700 years for 50% 11400 years for 75% 17100 years for 87.5% 22800 years for 93.75% 28500 years for 96.875% 34200 years for ~ 98.5 % and still counts it never decays completely but we assume it to be completed at 6 or 7 half life times
It will not decay when it reaches a stable state. For example uranium, when it will decay, the neutrons will be reduced to radon (one of the daughters of uranium) so it will stay there. More like from radioactive elements broken up to be simpler elements.
60000 yrs later
Why doesn't carbon decay linearly?
how do you know how much carbon 14 did it originally have?
Great explanation. It had always confused me, now I can understand the history books better.
Excellent video. Right to the point and clear. Subscribed and liked.
How do you now the time on this? Over 5000 years for the carbon to half? How many other things can influence that, i wonder..?
Not many. If you studied Chemistry or even Molecular Biology you would know this.
Hanne Lindblad Environmental effects are known to effect half life but only in the 1% area. This is accounted for in the expected margin for error. Carbon dating gives a rough estimate on the age of the sample, but it's not expected to be precise down to the exact decade. Remember that the half life is only the *average speed* of decay.
"Animal and plant remains can undergo a variety of physical and chemical changes during fossilisation. This results in fossils showing varying styles and degrees of organic preservation:
minimal decay with only some loss of soft tissue
preservation of a skeleton with minimal change
removal of all organic material except carbon, which remains as a film in the rock"
TH-cam does not allow me to post the reference link :(
i finally understood this! thank you soooo much
The ONLY thing to "UNDERSTAND" is that radiometric dating is a SCAM!
loved the video it was short easy to comprehend and follow up on its accuracy, thank you all including my favorite platform TH-cam!
Very informative and easy to understand explanation, thanks :)
I believe in the Bible stating the earth and the universe is only about 6000 years old, which is enough time for fossils to develop. I don’t believe in the accuracy of radiocarbon dating because carbon decays relatively fast (C has a half life of 5730 years), and after that only half of the original amount remains. If say, after 10 half lives or 57,300 years, the amount of C remaining is only
That’s why c14 dating isn’t used on objects millions of years old. Did you even watch the video?
thanks this really helps with my homework
Great classroom resource, thanks!
Great questions below, and video, used it to explain this to my kids. For the questions, the ratio of C14 to C12 is relatively constant across geography and across time. For Geography this is due to the cosmic ray creation of C14 far up in our atmosphere, this is where light rays that are also relatively constant over the centuries create C14 with cosmic bombardment, similar to the norther lights phenomenon. Since it's so high in the atmosphere by the time it reaches ground level it's virtually homogeneous globally. Over time we know it's constant as we have carbon dated events from thousands of years ago, events who's dates we know from written tests, everything from Egyptian mummies to medieval artifacts, to trees that are still alive and over 4000 years old. We have proof that carbon dating is very effective. To go further back in time you can use other radioactive elements with much longer half lives, and unlike C14 turning into C12 + nitrogen gas, these other longer half life elements often break down into 2 other elements that are not gases such as nitrogen, as such with those you have further help determining the age as you have 2 remnants of the original radioactive isotope. These other longer range radioactive products come from the molten core of the earth, and they too are equally mixed in the molten core ,but with longer half lives you also get less precision and you'll usually see comments of plus or minus hundreds of thousands or millions of years, versus C14 that can date on a level of plus or minus a few decades. Lots of work and proof went into this marvelous insight into how to date something over thousands and millions of years.
Yeah, go tell some more lies to your kids. Why not? They get lied to every day anyway, right?
amazing explanation, thank you.
Wow....you never mentioned climate change or social justice. That's pretty good!
Even though climate change is a serious issue.
Welp after hearing people say over and over, "carbon dating isnt that reliable" And hearing this, it seems like a very legitimate way to date things. I mean its not like you can get a accurate date but close enough is still pretty good.
why does dino bone contain detectable levels of C14
Dinosaur bones technically do contain detectable levels of Carbon-14 beta particle emissions, but you would never use Carbon-14 to date it because the half life is much to short. They would use something like Potassium 40 which has a half life of millions of years instead of just 5730 years. The problem is creationists and science hating people usually just leave that part out.
Kyle Possai how do you determine when to use carbon and when to use another element? Do they date only specific parts of bones or do they date multiple parts of different bones and then use an average?
Dilithium Crystals because they are less that 250000 yrs old. Why do diamonds have c14?
yea n who the fuck was around to measure the half life of potassium 40.
@@hurricane1nox That's not how it works dum dum
Great short and informative piece, great for teacher use!
And carbon dating is also a crock of shit.
Careful with those "s" "j" "z" etc, I'm wearing headphones, almost killed my ears, and I'm at only 50% of max volume... Use a de-esser or even a mic foam cover
I still don’t believe in authenticity of the Carbon dating! Is there any other recent upgraded techniques that these paleochronologists use that could replace this carbondating?
I'm the answer to everything
hahahah cool
Give the solution to the Rieman Hypothesis
you would die from the immense intensity of the answer, that's why he's dead
***** Risk I'm willing to take
I study in Electrical Engineering, but focus on Physics. I lightly know about the topic of fossilization. I shall concede, because you are probably much more knowledgable than I can even pretend to be on the subject. Thanks for the info. Good luck on the finals!
Do the 1945 bombings affect dating process?
No arrogant ignorance does though!
We can estimate the age by measuring the ratio of C-12 and C-14 ..... can we estimate the age by comparing the activity of C-14 in live and dead plant .. if yes then how🤔🤔???? Plz clear this point 🤯
Christians don't use science to try to find God; God uses science to draw us to him.
Bulletproof1951 Creationist use science in the same way a hobo uses a light post; for support instead of illumination. And when that fails they try to piss on it.
Roddy Yang "7 days" isnt actually 7 days. Just because some people believe in God, doesnt mean they'll believe the bible word for word.
>>>G-D uses science
Very informative and interesting. Thank you.
Do you know of the single scientific dating method used for accurately dating any object?
If so, what is it, and how does it work?
There is no chemical method of dating ANY object, PERIOD! Radiometric dating is a SCAM!
@@ForeverBleedinGreenproof
Thank you! I have a question, why C14 starts to go away only after the creature died? Is it because it could gather new C14 atoms through metabolism when living? But I also heard it being used on detecting the age of non-lifes, such like ceramics, then how does it work?
That initial slow, deliberate turn to camera was epic. This guy Fs
so i'm watching this to find an answer to a question witch one is the oldest bone,granite,fossil,wood,or quartzite can someone pls answer
Finally I can truly understand Car Seat Headrest
This information was pretty good, bro
Am I correct and understanding that the DK process for carbon-14 that exists in a given animal, does not begin to decay until that animal dies? Why is that?
Because when something is alive, it keeps replenishing its radioactive carbon through breathing.
so interesting ! I made notes to keep it memorized !
This info is almost like reading a Cook Book
So that carbon dating was usually used to analyzed how old already is an animal's remaining parts like their bones?
For example. But only for quite recent stuff (less than 50.000 years old).
Simple and easy explanations
cool video. to the point.
what are the elements they use to see if something is older?
Uranium-Lead
It's really very helpful. Thank u.
i thought the eggheads just counted how many candles the fossils mama put on the cake each year.
I've found it's the short and simple explanations that are the easiest to understand.
How does we know their initial count in rate ?
It is not a single number, it is the ratio of radiocarbon C14 to stable carbon C12, measure either by mass spectrometry and/or by beta radiation rate counting.
It is necessary to know the starting quantity of C-14. How can that be known with a high degree of certainty?
Most living things have carbon 12 and 14 in equal amounts.
how does the carbon 14 get into the animal? does it breath it? do plant absorbed the carbon 14 and then animal eat it?
Way simpler then the rest of the videos, thanks
I’m confused why does carbon-14 only start to break down after the death of its host? have we observed carbon 14 breaking down outside of an animal or plant?
That's not how it works.
Thanks for this bruh.
THANK YOU. biology is hard and the wording in lectures make it even harder. this explained it simply. thank you.
THANK YOU you explain this way more easily then my archaeology professor now I get it
I was just wrecking my brain over it.
Now it's all clear.
Thanks a lot sir
In the graph, shouldn't the C12 line be way higher than the C14 curve?
They may be on different scales. I'm sure the graph is purely for illustration.
great video and explanation. appologies if this was answered already but how do we know how many carbon 14 atoms the animal had?
Most living things have carbon 12 and 14 in equal amounts. The carbon 14 decays, 12 stays.
explaining scientific phenomenons as its best, in the most easy way. Guys you are owesame, very intelligent and simple :)
perfect explanation
Excellent explained thank you
Thanks mate that was really helpful.
how is age determined by calculating the ratio of c12 and c14 ?
The C14 decays with an exponential decay constant while the C12 does not.
Great Explanation ❤
Here's my non-college graduate answer: Because we know how C14 is made, by cosmic ray interaction with Nitrogen in the atmosphere, and that cosmic rays come at Earth at a relatively constant rate, we can infer that C14 levels are stable. Carbon dating provides an age range that should account for any occasional spikes in C14 levels.
Sound good to anyone else?
such an easy explanation thanks
And how do we know the C14 amount in the beginning ( the animal died day zero ) ?
bc we deduct the remaining C14 from the initial amount according to the video.
By measuring the ratio of C14 to C12 and comparing that to the ratio of a known Standard to find out the starting value, you can calculate the age. Obviously it is a lot more complicated than that in reality but that is the basics.
@@AlbertaGeek Thank you
@@kaankaral Cheers!
So will the rate of decay be the same regardless of the past conditions or any other circumstances that could have risen thousands of years ago?
Yes.
false... contrary to previous scientific thinking, chemical environment does noticeably affects the half-life of radioactive decay by electron capture (said by geochemist Chih-An Huh)... and that radioactive isotopes fluctuates in sync with the rotation of the sun's core (said by a Purdue & Stanford scientists)... so although rare, rate of decay is not absolute and should be treated as absolute....
How do you count them?
Who was the first to use this style of dating and get these numbers? Also how do we not know that the amount of C14 hasn't been affected by say An Asteroid the size of Texas to emit more C14 into dead organisms ?
Willard Libby. (1947). Asteroids typically aren't "loaded" with Carbon, and are usually rock/ Iron or Ice, silicates. The "dino asteroid" was more like 6 miles; not the size of Texas. moreover a new, recent article suggests thusly: Bottke and his colleagues identified a particular cluster of asteroids that hadn't been studied much yet. Scientists can use computer models and an understanding of the physical forces that affect asteroids to essentially rewind time and determine where these fragments might have come from. In this case, they traced the fragments back to a giant asteroid cluster, whose largest body is now called (298) Baptistina.
But there was more to the story. Bottke's team also noticed that the breakup of Baptistina occurred near an "escape route" out of the asteroid belt. In this region, the gravitational kicks produced by the planets, in this case Mars and Jupiter, can change the orbits of the fragments, enough to push some of them out of the asteroid belt and into Earth's path. (Actually, about 100 million years would pass between their escape from the asteroid belt and one asteroid's collision with Earth, but that's not so long on a geologic time scale).
You didn't explain what they use for older observations.
Elements with longer half-lives, like Uranium, Plutonium.
Hmmm…so to date backwards you would need to know EXACTLY the ORIGINAL C14 to C12 ratio. What do you use to determine this ratio?
Thank you Micheal
But how do we know the initial ratio?
The explantion is lacking, do we know the initial ration of C14 to C12 in a living organizm? Does it the same for all life?
If it breathes in atmospheric air it gets the same ratio of C12 to C14, but when it dies, the C14 decays while the C12 is stable, so the ratio gives the age via the calculation.
@@karhukivi i guess there's a misunderstanding. He means how do you know when half of the c14 is already gone when you Don't know how much was there initially.
So basically we can only measure the rate of decay from the day is was discovered and not from the day is started to decompose
@@jamestan4659 The ratio of C14 to C12 in 1 in 10^12 in the atmosphere, although it has varied slightly over time, so when an organism takes its last gasp, the C14 starts to decay while the C12 is stable. So measuring the ratio of C14 to C12 gives you the time elapsed since that last gasp. The ratio can be measured by mass spectrometry or by measuring the beta radiation from the C14 is a weighed amount of carbon material. The date given by simple decay rate can be inaccurate as the C14 ratio in the atmosphere varies, but this can be calibrated against known archaeological artefacts, tree-rings, etc and other dating techniques. The date is usually ±5% precise at best, more usually ±10% and ten half-lives of C14 or about 50,000 years is the practical limit as only 1 in 2^10 (
@@karhukivi ya sure it gives you the time that elapsed but again, there's no way you can tell how much c14 was there in the first place. We can let these so called "experts" be comfortable with their assumption about the c12,c14 ratios, the rate of decay of ç14 and all the other variables. But no one of them can answer the simple question. "When did c14 start to erode?" Which can only be answered if you know how much c14, was already there.
Let me give you an example:
Suppose we have a Glass of water with a maximum capacity of 300 ml at the time of recording , and that glass has a
hole underneath it, now the water continues to drain as we speak.
What are the variables?
1. Size of the glass 300 ml - constant
2. Atmospheric temperature - we'll make it constant for illustration purpose.
3. Water - 120 ml at the Time of recording.
4. Initial water volume - Unknown
5.rate of water drain - 20 ml per hour
Now given all the variables at play. If i ask these scientist how long will it take before the glass is completely empty? I bet they'll be able to answer very well "assuming that atmospheric temperature constant".
If i ask them how much water was there before it started to drain. None of them will be sble to answer. I even gave them the maximum volume capacity of the glass which should have been unknown as well.
We can test this all day .
We can go to some grave dated back 1800s i bet you this experts wouldn't be able to tell or even at least give a rough estimate as to when did that person die unless we let them know how much c14 was present at the time of death.
At 1:04 he's reading off a screen with a straight face to get that number pinpoint accurate. 5 thousand 7 hundred and thirty years.
How do we know the initial amount of carbon-14 in certain animal?
+Hari Taqwan Santoso The initial amount of carbon is estimated from the geological layer the fossils were found in.How do we know the the age of these layers?It is estimated by the amount of carbon found in the fossils they contain.
+MegaFloyd100 What a circular argument? Are you serious?
+Hari Taqwan Santoso Sadly ,i am dead serious.I was disgusted when i found out.This is called 'modelling' & the conclusions are totally dependant on the variables you input.The variables you input tend to reflect your desired output & pre suppositions(a bit like a business plan).It is 'scientific' in the same way that astrology is 'scientific'.The entire evolutionary narrative rests upon long ages (ie: imaginary chronology).Given that Darwinism is the official State Religion of of most modern nations, it is basically illegal to criticise.The ACLU,being the humanist religion's latter day Torquemada, ensures academic compliance with all aspects of secular humanism's creation story.
+MegaFloyd100 I think I start to be confused with your statements. I know radioactive decay, but If we want to determine the age of a certain fossil using that radioactive method, then we should already knew the initial amount of carbon-14 in that fossil with its isotope. Otherwise, the determination can't be done.
+Hari Taqwan Santoso There is also no way to determine the RATE at which the carbon decays.They just assume it has decayed at a constant rate.They once dated a freshly dead seal at 1300 years old.The laboratories who date them come up with many different dates.The scientist chooses the one that he likes best.
this is So neat,thanks 👍😀
Would you please explain how exactly the figure 5730 years half life for C14 was calculated?
Thnx much... It helps me a lot.
Thank you!!!!!! This is very helpful!
How do they know how much carbon 14 was in the fossil when it was fossilized? If it had more or less because of some environmental factors, wouldn't that throw off the dating?
Teacher made me watch this
Thanks for the video, it is the best (by far!) that explains carbon dating in a way I can understand. Thanks! :3
The only thing you need to understand is that carbon dating does not work. None of the methods work. They're all scams designed with the sole intention of getting people to believe in "millions and billions of years" - period...
So the decay rate slows down after the first half life?
Very helpful vdo❤
Sounds about right. The only way I could see spikes would be caused by increases in cosmic rays interacting with Nitrogen. Animals and Plants breathe to take in different gases. We need O2 and plants want CO2. So it may be that plants and animals absorb at different rates and that may be part of the range of dates too.
By logic... how can you ASSUME, that the carbon is incorporated the same as it is today. Is this what we call science?
No one assumes anything