Do you like this direction of TTL first and then the First Review? Just to correct something in the video from BigScreen: the headset does not run at "2160x2160 per eye at 90Hz" Beyond runs at 2560x2560 per eye, at both 75Hz and 90Hz. DSC compression is used to fit the bandwidth into DisplayPort 1.4, similar to gaming monitors and other VR headsets.
It all depends on the ISO / f-stops used by the camera so yes.. the comparison is really unreliable ..even the pixilation is handled differently by the human eye.
@@Seanweekhaizhen if that's the impression you got, that's wrong. Beyond provides perfect black levels. Micro-OLED is incomparable to LCD. Worlds apart.
@@nasheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee4495 Superior audio, mic, tracking, refresh rate, all in 2019 Still holds up 5 years later The only downside is the clarity, which as shown compared to other headsets isn’t that big of a deal
Man I am soooo glad i got the reverb G2.. for ONLY 500 bucks... I have played countless hours with it (and although windows mixed reality kinda sucks) but I looooove this headset! won't be changing anytime soon. EXCELLENT review as always Tyriel!
@@bananenpflanzer6516still to date an amazing headset. Still rocking it! WMR is just another layer on top of steam VR if you use steam. If u get a htc vive or a valve index you just have the steamer layer. But for the price honestly it’s absolutely worth it! And controls aren’t the best but they are good enough
I think for the future we need to move away from reporting resolutions only and start reporting PPD. It’s more useful when it comes to VR where the FOV is very different from one headset to the other.
@@stclaws9580 yeah it should be both, because resolution is still important, specially for pc vr players since the higher it is, the harder to run it, and PPD doesnt tell you much, because FOV can difer and a lower PPD can be actually more taxing than another because its pushing more pixels yet it still has less clarity
no it aint.. PPD is not a good factor to rely on, as its so heavily FOV contaminated, and low FOV will elevate the PPD, and that aint ehat users want.. they want immersion in VR and like they are in the VR-scene (right?) and not like they are looking thrue a binocular. FOV and PPI values are relevant, as PPI will indicate the pixelsize. Pico4 is at 123 diagonal FOV (105 vertical and 105 horisontal) and 1193 PPI (pixel pr inch) it got like 2x 2.56" screens at 2160x2160 at each of the 2 screens. 9.33 mio pixels. BigScreen beyound is very small screens.. not sure its diagonal FOV, but it seems to have merely 90 horisontal FOV and 93 vertical, likely down to its very small screens. that are only 2x 1" big at 2560x2560 and gives an PPI at ludicris 3600 PPI.. but the screens that are merely 1" big and to give a immersion feel.. could be to small for an ideal screen for VR, as you need to magnifye the image a lot with lenses, as 1" screen is tiny as f.. and the less lens work you have to do on an image, the better, if you want an even sharpness and clarity.. but sofar I think it looks decent on Beyound.. there are quite alot of trailing at the edges, fx the "system map" at the left side 6:01 but could be the recording, and likely not magnifiying lens con.
I think it PPD should be reported with the FOV and the relationship explained. Only reporting resolution doesn’t tell us much because the FOV can vary a lot.
Been looking forward to this video! :D Btw Tyriel, just wanted to bring to your attention that your voice cuts out at 1:45 in case you didnt notice :) Love these videos!
Would be nice if you could zoom in on areas outside of the sweet spot to try to benchmark the quality of the lenses. Also, you can play around with the shutter speed and FPS in the camera to try to get better video, or just stick to long exposure photos to make the flicker irrelevant.
Why do you change positions? The first time was: 1.Beyond (left) 2.Index (center) 3.Reverb G2 (right). But the second show was: 1.Beyond (left) 2.Reverb G2 (center) 3.Index (right), and again Reverb G2 at the right side. I think it's better to mantain the same positions always.
@manerisports7937 I will go with Q3 that's sharp across the lens due to best pancake lenses on the market. Especially considering that G2 has the narrowest sweet spot available.
@@Pe11ePD yea q3 is nice but i sendet it back this morning, it was good but i was annyoid of that only USB 3.0 connection no direct power frm the GPU. its a good standalone thing tho.
@@manerisports7937 well I'm using usb-c to usb-c link cable with my Q2, 600mbit connection, and battery never drains lol. I can literally use it for like 12hrs, it won't go below 50%. USB-C port powers it really good, practically doesn't allow battery to discharge. Also the image is quite good at 600mbit compression, no sign of video compression artefacts at all, and I'm driving racing titles where stuff goes FAST near you. Q3 can only be better due to better resolution and way better lenses.
In hindsight, there are a few very important things in this video that hasn't been pointed out that I would like to mention about the big screen 1 this video is older and the headset is a older model. big screen now has different lenses with an increased FOV from this model, So you will be able to see more of the picture 2 you might not notice it but he mentions in the video that he runs the headset at 90 Htz instead of 75 htz. The issue with that is 90 htz is a different resolution 1920x1920 then is scaled up to 2560x2560. While 75htz is 2560x2560 native. If you want to take a look at the difference in quality you can go on the big screen main site and tap on the micro display options and it shows you comparisons of the 75 versus 90 modes. So big screen looks even better then what is showed here. Props to the G2 though still. Underrated headset. Other than that, this is a great video and is one of the best videos out there on the big screen.
i'm going to get the beyond one once it releases. I have the valve index already but it's heavy on the front. I would rather have a light comfortable headset with worse lens that doesn't feel heavy rather than a heavy headset with good lens
I only use VR for flight sims (DCS and MSFS 2020), which is why I came to this since you did some DCS stuff. I have a G2 and the biggest complaint I have is the off-center clarity. I look with my eyes and seeing anything off-center is fuzzy with the G2. The other complaint I have is I have an OLED monitor, so switching to the G2 is a major downgrade in visual quality (color/contrast, etc). This is one reason I'm considering the Beyond - how does the color/contrast of the Beyond compare to an OLED monitor?
Nice job on the comparison. Could you please do a comparison of the Bigscreen vs Pimax Crystal vs HP Reverb G2? I'm currently a G2 owner, but I recently put down a deposit for the Crystal. I'm really interested to see how the Bigscreen compares to the Crystal, though. The price of the Bigscreen is $999, while the Crystal is $1599. So, you can see my concern.
The biggest issue I have with my G2 which I could tell from the very beginning was the vignette blur that completely breaks immersion any time you look in your peripheral vision. The biggest complaint I have about the beyond is that it is not color accurate but hot damn what a headset
I am very sensitive to VR so the resolution needs to be high. But also the eyebox. If beyond had a bigger eyebox I would have tried to jump back into VR. Until high resolution clear screens with large eyeboxes are created I will just have to wait. VR is still the future of gaming though.
I think the benefit of higher Rez shows the most at 4:45 with the live footage. Shimmering and flickering on the index is horrendous. Look at the road barrier lines! Better on g2 until far away. World looks a lot more solid on the beyond
Keep in mind the G2 is only sharp in the very center, the rest is very blurry so you have to move your head constantly, unlike the Beyond and Index which have bigger sweet spots which creates a more seamless experience. The Assetto corsa part is the best example of this.
This more than anything is why I sold the G2 after a few weeks with it and went back to my Index as its just a better all rounder and still clear enough with good overall FOV. :)
@@davidburns1721 I tolerated it for 2 years and never got used to it, meanwhile my quest2 keep getting improving enough to close the gap, also a much better all rounder.
@@Verociity i just couldn't accept it as the edge to edge clarity was one of the worst id ever seen. Index has rathered spoiled my VR though as everything else i try while might have one or two better aspects, they fall far behind in so many others. I'd actually be happy if they made a 1.5 sort of version of it, even if just better lenses and resolution was all they did, id buy it 😃
The Index compares a lot better to the BigScreen Beyond than I thought it would in the Elite Dangerous photos at 5 minutes & 50 seconds in the video. I figured with the blacks of space the OLED of the Bigscreen Beyond would be way better, but they actually look comparable, resolution differences aside.
Screen and lenses looks very good but this headset is really too expensive without the mandatory steam camera. And for a so small headset it's too bad to have to use fixed lightroom cameras..
If you have a lot of money or at least already have Valve Index. Bigscreen Beyond costs $999 and you only get the headset. For motion controllers they require Valve Index base stations and motion controllers, so additional 2x$149 for base stations and $279 for controllers. $1576 total. It's an expensive toy for sure.
@@troliskimosko It's great, but I'm content with my Reverb G2 V2 for now. I'm very curious what Valve will do with their next VR headset that's in development for a few years already.
Looks a lot like the pico4 in sharpness and clarity and no obvious stairstepping on the lines th-cam.com/video/3rInrpCbYG8/w-d-xo.html vs 5:48 but the blacklevel seems all over the plce in Beyound, clearly not tuned well for this oled panel.
How nice of you to add Elite Dangerous into the test suite! Definitely a forgotten game by many, but it is one of my main VR games so it's nice to see here.
Eh, don't see enough difference to warrant upgrading from the G2 V2 atm, especially seeing as it lacks proper audio solution, and is gated behind an iphone. Glad to see more headsets coming to the market, though! But we really do need more games.
I would get a Beyond asap if it supported the Oculus sensor and controllers that i have with my CV1 setup . . . . Hopefully the Beyond V2 in the future (Could be far off . . .) does support or is cheaper and includes tracking cameras and controllers . . .
Time to come to present day, the pro controllers are fantastic with their own cameras. No need for wires anymore going to sensors or headsets for that matter!👍
I think the lack of screen door effect comes from the fact that those lenses can't resolve the pixels, so basically it's like a optical softener. Samsung Odyssey+ had this soft screen in front of the OLED panels to mitigate the screen door effect. But you do also lose sharpness. Micro oleds have so tiny pixels, that it requires extremely good lenses to resolve them. This then limites the actual real resolution you can get out of them.
Beyond is 2560 x 2560 per eye, and, 28 PPD. Samsung Odyssey + is 1440 x 1600 per eye, and 14 PPD. Not even close. Beyond is orders of magnitude greater in resolution and ppd. Nothing to do with a soft screen to mitigate sde like Samsung odyssey plus. It's entirely the resolution and density of the tiny pixels. There's no sde because it's really that sharp.
@@zackmac5917 I don't think you got the point. I was referring to the Odyssey+ simply as a device that used a soft filter to mitigate the screen door effect. If it were that sharp, then you would see the pixels. What i'm saying, is that its not sharp enough to resolve those pixels.. resulting a slightly soft image that then hides the screen door effect. Pixels on micro OLEDs are so small, that pancake lenses cant resolve them. They simply cant build them to that kind of resolving power.
@@zackmac5917 28 PPD is not that high, Aero & Crystal has 36PPD and you can still see the pixels. As they use larger panels so the lenses can resolve the pixels.
@@Nobody-Nowhere ahh I see, yeah I sort of misread your comment. You might be right. If anything, that's going to greatly help, not hinder it. It's high enough resolution to be extremely sharp while showing no sign of actually being a display with pixels...aided by the Micro-OLED perfect black levels and colours so that also doesn't make it feel like a display... Sounds perfect! For me the best thing is tyriel's comment towards the end - that with the Beyond it feels like real life, with the G2, it feels like a game. Others are saying they are having the most immersive VR experience they've had, even having tried Crystal too. I'm sold on the Beyond tbh. But Crystal, if you can tolerate the size and weight, light leakage and greyer black levels etc, should be an incredible experience for sims, for a short sessions at least.
@@RyanEllerbe Well, with the Beyond you do need to spend another ~$750 or so for the controllers and base stations. But I'd bet that the difference in comfort is massive in comparison.
The Beyond seemed to loose a lot of sharpness towards the edges. Also I was surprised the black level didn’t look as good as the Reverb G2 in many of the comparisons, despite the Beyond being OLED. Perhaps this is just a camera settings issue?
@@Nobody-Nowhere I’ve never heard this before. Do you have a link that explains this in more detail? I would have thought this would more be a problem with fresnel lenses.
@@zackmac5917 Yes, I agree that OLED should give true blacks which LCD can’t do, but I was just pointing out that a number of the TTL side-by-side comparisons show a washed out grey on the Beyond image versus nice blacks on the same scene in the Reverb. As I said, perhaps this was just a camera issue?
I was given 3 new Reverb headsets because all of them had issues. You have to be really lucky to get one that actually works which I assume is one reason HP gave up making VR headsets! I ended up with the Pico which was half the price and way better because it actually works with 70% screen clarity unlike the Reverb with its rediculously small area of clarity. Trust me, you made a wise decision purchasing Beyond.
@@Davids6994 Compression is not visible 99,9% of the cases with modern software when using new headset line up like XR Elite, Quest Pro and Pico 4. Not mentioning that thanks to new hardware even Quest 2 looks better than before when it comes to compression. Not as good as the new headsets but still reasonably good.
Would you run a test like this with supersampling enabled on the Index? I bought a G2 after owning an index, and found the colors more washed out on the G2 than the Index when playing squadrons, and was not impressed by the increase in resolution at all like I expected to be. I have no idea why my experience didn't match the reviews. Running a 3090. But I do supersample in the Index, which does increase effective resolution; I think this might be the missing piece.
i really hope the next major headsets seriously consider this form factor. i understand this doesn't have a battery, and isn't wireless, but i don't see why you couldn't cheaply increase this with a wifi card, and a battery. honestly it could be a pocket battery.
if the beyond had inside out tracking or would not require me to buy 320€ of basesstations. The weight reduction would make me buy it. But given the high price I wont upgrade until visuals are also much better than on the g2. Also GPUs need to catch up or DFR needs to be widely adopted, to drive the res.
I just need more FOV. The most immersive thing I've ever run into was increasing my FOV via the Pimax. The Pimax has lots of downside compared to the likes of the Beyond but that FOV is a deal breaker. Beyond with significantly increased FOV and I'm buying.
Gentleman I've one question. Does Reverb g2 work on Aple Macbook laptops? Your answer will greatly appreciated since it will help me saving money from unnecessary investment. Thank you.
We can clearly see the disadvantage of the old index lenses here. As the image is only really clear if you have teh lenses very close to your eye AND in the right spot. BigScreen BEYOND is very impressive, will probably be many peoples first "second" headset. Especially if they have wornout their index XD Just the comfort alone makes it worth the price, and since the image is even a little sharper and clearer, I see no disadvantage here. Potentially it's a great daily driver rather then the occasional dive in to VR that the index is, due to the fatigue it brings.
Thanks Tyriel! Great job 👍. This makes me imagine how great things will be for VR in a few years when this form factor and decently capable PC VR rigs will be available at a more reasonable cost. Sadly, I have pretty much decided to skip PS VR2 as it still has reprojection and persistence motion blur issues. This made me sick on PS VR1 and I never adjusted to it. It was such a headache, literally speaking. If a PS5 PRO comes out and addresses the issue for triple-A games, I'll reconsider. Exciting times for VR nonetheless! 🙌🥳
Brad said the Beyond is very dark. Do the images in this comparison reflect this in any way or is the camera exposure changed so it shows all equally bright?
@@stclaws9580 Because my Pico 4 is also well isolated, my eyes adapt to the dark image and still it is waaayyy too dark. This is one of my main issues with the Pico 4, if the Beyond is worse, it's not for me.
@@bakakafka4428 sadlyitsbradley commented on this in his preview vid on the headset. If I remember right I think he confirmed it's about the same 60 nits in this and in the Pico 4. Edit: yep, at the 14:37 he says they are the same and also note that the persistence is as long as PSVR 2 which will unfortunately require to lower brightness even more for some people.
Hi , I would like to understand one thing, I use the sim only with the Reverb G2 vr, I have a rtx4090 + intel 12900k + 64gb ram. I have everything set to ultra and I’m not complaining about the performance, but I would like to improve, because yes I’m not complaining but I would like to have something more about fluidity. all this is accompanied by a 27" full hd monitor. if I had to play with the monitor I know that I would have bottlenecks, but I wanted to understand if they replace the monitor with a 4k one things would improve for virtual reality or if using virtual reality an upgrade on the monitor would not be needed. I searched the forum but didn’t find anything can you please help me understand? so in the end the question is simple: with the machine I have, would buying a 4k monitor help improve virtual reality?
That’s a very clear resolution and great form factor but the lack of HDR makes it too small an upgrade for movies in bigscreen (the program) and the small fov means I couldn’t sit in the front row of the big theater anymore. And the lack of eye tracked foveated rendering means I can’t run games with that resolution anyway. I’ll stick with the index until pc gets something like psvr2.
They should have used aspheric lenses instead of pancake, pancake look sharp in videos but are blurry and have a double vision effect in actual use. Whereas aspheric is crystal clear edge to edge
The problem with DisplayPort 1.4 was not really on my radar until now. Even if Valve or anyone else releases a headset with two 4k Micro OLEDs it won't be able to run that resolution at high refresh rates with current GPUs. AMD is too slow and not optimized for VR and Nvidia Lovelace doesn't support DP 2.0.
There is another possibility: a headset that doesn't even have a cable. I remember a discussion, not sure if it was Valve, but there was an argument that these long high bandwidth cables for VR are actually quite expensive and it might be reasonable to ship a headset with completely native wireless as the default mode. The codec from IMRNext that Nofio is using reduces the frame size 60x without noticeable degradation in picture and no latency (less than 1 ms so impossible to detect).
How does that compare with the Quest 2? Is that the Index but 5x worse? I can't read shit in the Quest 2, it's my biggest gripe, besides the fact that this thing dangles everywhere everytime you move your head.
ok old timer... that cv1 is like 7 yrs old by now lol. btw your "real vision fov" stuff already exists.. its called the Pimax headsets. But they too arent perfect but at least thats what ur looking for
I think you should include the Quest 2 in all TTL videos since it is still, by far, the HMD in most people's homes. No doubt about pancake lenses being the future!
Do you like this direction of TTL first and then the First Review?
Just to correct something in the video from BigScreen: the headset does not run at "2160x2160 per eye at 90Hz"
Beyond runs at 2560x2560 per eye, at both 75Hz and 90Hz. DSC compression is used to fit the bandwidth into DisplayPort 1.4, similar to gaming monitors and other VR headsets.
Yes
Yes
Missing some voice audio at 1:46-1:49
4 times cheaper Reverb G2 is still the best choice in 2023
@@ji3200 it has the worst controllers of all time
I can’t believe how clear the beyond screen looks!
It has 6.5MP resolution, and G2 has 4.6MP and on many cases, G2 looked better even though it has much lower resolution.
It all depends on the ISO / f-stops used by the camera so yes.. the comparison is really unreliable ..even the pixilation is handled differently by the human eye.
Funny how the reverb looks like it has deeper blacks than the beyond even though it should be the opposite
@@Seanweekhaizhen Why should it be opposite?
@@Seanweekhaizhen if that's the impression you got, that's wrong. Beyond provides perfect black levels.
Micro-OLED is incomparable to LCD. Worlds apart.
I would have expected the Pico 4 and the Quest Pro to be there in the comparison, since they also use pancake lenses!
Yeah, Pico 4 would have been a good comparison. Not sure why Index is even a thing anymore.. its like 2MP, ancient.
@@Nobody-Nowhere I guess because it's been pitched as an upgrade to the Index specifically, using the Index controllers and base stations.
@@Nobody-Nowhere Because it is people with Index's that will most likely be the people that would buy this headset.
you can just play a vid where he has the pico 4 amd compare with this one
The reverb G2 shouldn't have been in the comparison. It should have been either the Pico 4 or Quest Pro instead of that one.
I find it amazing how well the index has aged. Looking forward to index 2.
yeah, I'm significantly less impressed by this comparison than I thought I would be.
Nah... It didn't aged well xd
@@nasheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee4495
Superior audio, mic, tracking, refresh rate, all in 2019
Still holds up 5 years later
The only downside is the clarity, which as shown compared to other headsets isn’t that big of a deal
@@ellescer the only thing is i notice the pixels and its annoying
The colors, crispness, and pixel density in the Beyond is amazing. Looking forward to its release.
Man I am soooo glad i got the reverb G2.. for ONLY 500 bucks... I have played countless hours with it (and although windows mixed reality kinda sucks) but I looooove this headset! won't be changing anytime soon. EXCELLENT review as always Tyriel!
still happy with it ? and what sucks about the windows mixed reality eindows thingy? i am thinking of getting one.... should i?
@@bananenpflanzer6516still to date an amazing headset. Still rocking it! WMR is just another layer on top of steam VR if you use steam. If u get a htc vive or a valve index you just have the steamer layer. But for the price honestly it’s absolutely worth it! And controls aren’t the best but they are good enough
can't wait to see the Quest Pro vs XR Elite vs Beyond comparison
That's totally BEYOND anything I've seen so far, amazing !
I think for the future we need to move away from reporting resolutions only and start reporting PPD. It’s more useful when it comes to VR where the FOV is very different from one headset to the other.
why not both? (just as ppi used with smartphone comparisons)
@@stclaws9580 yeah it should be both, because resolution is still important, specially for pc vr players since the higher it is, the harder to run it, and PPD doesnt tell you much, because FOV can difer and a lower PPD can be actually more taxing than another because its pushing more pixels yet it still has less clarity
no it aint.. PPD is not a good factor to rely on, as its so heavily FOV contaminated, and low FOV will elevate the PPD, and that aint ehat users want.. they want immersion in VR and like they are in the VR-scene (right?) and not like they are looking thrue a binocular.
FOV and PPI values are relevant, as PPI will indicate the pixelsize.
Pico4 is at 123 diagonal FOV (105 vertical and 105 horisontal) and 1193 PPI (pixel pr inch) it got like 2x 2.56" screens at 2160x2160 at each of the 2 screens. 9.33 mio pixels.
BigScreen beyound is very small screens.. not sure its diagonal FOV, but it seems to have merely 90 horisontal FOV and 93 vertical, likely down to its very small screens. that are only 2x 1" big at 2560x2560 and gives an PPI at ludicris 3600 PPI.. but the screens that are merely 1" big and to give a immersion feel.. could be to small for an ideal screen for VR, as you need to magnifye the image a lot with lenses, as 1" screen is tiny as f.. and the less lens work you have to do on an image, the better, if you want an even sharpness and clarity..
but sofar I think it looks decent on Beyound.. there are quite alot of trailing at the edges, fx the "system map" at the left side 6:01 but could be the recording, and likely not magnifiying lens con.
@@stclaws9580 yh I meant both instead of resolution only.
I think it PPD should be reported with the FOV and the relationship explained. Only reporting resolution doesn’t tell us much because the FOV can vary a lot.
I would be so happy if there was a wide FOV version of this headset.
Your wish has been granted because they have a wider fov lense option that is starting to be showcased.
@@victormaniaci2104 it's not an option that's the new standard model
Been looking forward to this video! :D Btw Tyriel, just wanted to bring to your attention that your voice cuts out at 1:45 in case you didnt notice :)
Love these videos!
Daaaamn!! Didn't expect the Reverb G2 to still look that great!
Would be nice if you could zoom in on areas outside of the sweet spot to try to benchmark the quality of the lenses. Also, you can play around with the shutter speed and FPS in the camera to try to get better video, or just stick to long exposure photos to make the flicker irrelevant.
Perhaps the best comparison video I have seen to date.. thank you for doing this.
These videos always make me happy about having the G2, knowing I still have one of the top visual experiences (and audio) for a reasonable price.
yes, and if only people know the color realism we have for porn
Thank you for the side-to-side comparison, great review :)
Please compare it to the *Pico 4*
The Pico 4 is a lot better in text and in Assetto Corsa compared to the Reverb G2 and the Valve Index.
Why do you change positions? The first time was: 1.Beyond (left) 2.Index (center) 3.Reverb G2 (right). But the second show was: 1.Beyond (left) 2.Reverb G2 (center) 3.Index (right), and again Reverb G2 at the right side. I think it's better to mantain the same positions always.
Interestingly, G2 looks (and is according to the video) sharpest to me, especially after the TEXT test.
im trying so hard to swap the g2 against any new VR but than i see this videos and always think damn no the g2 is sharper and clearer
@manerisports7937 I will go with Q3 that's sharp across the lens due to best pancake lenses on the market. Especially considering that G2 has the narrowest sweet spot available.
@@Pe11ePD yea q3 is nice but i sendet it back this morning, it was good but i was annyoid of that only USB 3.0 connection no direct power frm the GPU. its a good standalone thing tho.
@@manerisports7937 well I'm using usb-c to usb-c link cable with my Q2, 600mbit connection, and battery never drains lol. I can literally use it for like 12hrs, it won't go below 50%. USB-C port powers it really good, practically doesn't allow battery to discharge. Also the image is quite good at 600mbit compression, no sign of video compression artefacts at all, and I'm driving racing titles where stuff goes FAST near you. Q3 can only be better due to better resolution and way better lenses.
In hindsight, there are a few very important things in this video that hasn't been pointed out that I would like to mention about the big screen
1 this video is older and the headset is a older model. big screen now has different lenses with an increased FOV from this model, So you will be able to see more of the picture
2 you might not notice it but he mentions in the video that he runs the headset at 90 Htz instead of 75 htz.
The issue with that is 90 htz is a different resolution 1920x1920 then is scaled up to 2560x2560. While 75htz is 2560x2560 native. If you want to take a look at the difference in quality you can go on the big screen main site and tap on the micro display options and it shows you comparisons of the 75 versus 90 modes.
So big screen looks even better then what is showed here. Props to the G2 though still. Underrated headset.
Other than that, this is a great video and is one of the best videos out there on the big screen.
i'm going to get the beyond one once it releases. I have the valve index already but it's heavy on the front. I would rather have a light comfortable headset with worse lens that doesn't feel heavy rather than a heavy headset with good lens
I only use VR for flight sims (DCS and MSFS 2020), which is why I came to this since you did some DCS stuff.
I have a G2 and the biggest complaint I have is the off-center clarity. I look with my eyes and seeing anything off-center is fuzzy with the G2. The other complaint I have is I have an OLED monitor, so switching to the G2 is a major downgrade in visual quality (color/contrast, etc). This is one reason I'm considering the Beyond - how does the color/contrast of the Beyond compare to an OLED monitor?
Nice job on the comparison. Could you please do a comparison of the Bigscreen vs Pimax Crystal vs HP Reverb G2? I'm currently a G2 owner, but I recently put down a deposit for the Crystal. I'm really interested to see how the Bigscreen compares to the Crystal, though. The price of the Bigscreen is $999, while the Crystal is $1599. So, you can see my concern.
Need one (preferably two) lighthouses for the bigscreen. That's another $500 next to the purchase of the headset.
@@bjrnchrstn $500???? I just got 2 base stations for $200, and on Ebay a used 2 station for $120
Could you compare it to Quest pro?
The biggest issue I have with my G2 which I could tell from the very beginning was the vignette blur that completely breaks immersion any time you look in your peripheral vision.
The biggest complaint I have about the beyond is that it is not color accurate but hot damn what a headset
could the colour inaccuracy be corrected in software?
@@Rhodochrone not sure, it may be a limitation with the panel itself.
i played elite dangerous mostly without vr, but seeing ship panels in game on the beyond is very impressive.
Will there be an updated version of this video. It would be great to see the difference of the improvements they have made.
You should compare the BEYOND with other pancake lens headsets.
@@adrenalinejunkie3828 yeah you've got a point, nobody is mentioning the cons
I am very sensitive to VR so the resolution needs to be high. But also the eyebox. If beyond had a bigger eyebox I would have tried to jump back into VR. Until high resolution clear screens with large eyeboxes are created I will just have to wait. VR is still the future of gaming though.
Would be amazing and a more up to date tech if when it happens a comparison from a Bigscreen & Beyond, Varjo aero, amd Pimax Crystal. Cheers!
I think the benefit of higher Rez shows the most at 4:45 with the live footage. Shimmering and flickering on the index is horrendous. Look at the road barrier lines! Better on g2 until far away. World looks a lot more solid on the beyond
holy heck do the reverb colors really pop that much? you would think it was OLED
Keep in mind the G2 is only sharp in the very center, the rest is very blurry so you have to move your head constantly, unlike the Beyond and Index which have bigger sweet spots which creates a more seamless experience. The Assetto corsa part is the best example of this.
This more than anything is why I sold the G2 after a few weeks with it and went back to my Index as its just a better all rounder and still clear enough with good overall FOV. :)
@@davidburns1721 I tolerated it for 2 years and never got used to it, meanwhile my quest2 keep getting improving enough to close the gap, also a much better all rounder.
@@Verociity i just couldn't accept it as the edge to edge clarity was one of the worst id ever seen.
Index has rathered spoiled my VR though as everything else i try while might have one or two better aspects, they fall far behind in so many others.
I'd actually be happy if they made a 1.5 sort of version of it, even if just better lenses and resolution was all they did, id buy it 😃
you deserve millions of views. Thank you!
I cannot wait to get my hands on this headset.
The Index compares a lot better to the BigScreen Beyond than I thought it would in the Elite Dangerous photos at 5 minutes & 50 seconds in the video. I figured with the blacks of space the OLED of the Bigscreen Beyond would be way better, but they actually look comparable, resolution differences aside.
Just pre-ordered! Can't wait to get mine 😊
Screen and lenses looks very good but this headset is really too expensive without the mandatory steam camera. And for a so small headset it's too bad to have to use fixed lightroom cameras..
Thank you.
So now a comparison with the pico 4 and Quest pro is asked !
Would love a “Beyond vs Quest Pro” comparison
The beyond might be my next headset now....
If you have a lot of money or at least already have Valve Index. Bigscreen Beyond costs $999 and you only get the headset. For motion controllers they require Valve Index base stations and motion controllers, so additional 2x$149 for base stations and $279 for controllers. $1576 total. It's an expensive toy for sure.
@@Kondiqq Yeesh didn't know that haha. But i can see it being the future in a few years
@@troliskimosko It's great, but I'm content with my Reverb G2 V2 for now. I'm very curious what Valve will do with their next VR headset that's in development for a few years already.
Looks a lot like the pico4 in sharpness and clarity and no obvious stairstepping on the lines th-cam.com/video/3rInrpCbYG8/w-d-xo.html vs 5:48
but the blacklevel seems all over the plce in Beyound, clearly not tuned well for this oled panel.
How would you compare the Bigscreen Beyond to the Vive Pro 1 (microLED vs AMOLED), contrast and darkness wise?
How nice of you to add Elite Dangerous into the test suite! Definitely a forgotten game by many, but it is one of my main VR games so it's nice to see here.
Try quest pro, coming from the index. My gawd
@tyrielwood any chance you can do a video like this but with the beyond against the crystal and aero please? That would be an interesting one.
Eh, don't see enough difference to warrant upgrading from the G2 V2 atm, especially seeing as it lacks proper audio solution, and is gated behind an iphone. Glad to see more headsets coming to the market, though! But we really do need more games.
beyond looks so crisp, must amazing in person
I would get a Beyond asap if it supported the Oculus sensor and controllers that i have with my CV1 setup . . . .
Hopefully the Beyond V2 in the future (Could be far off . . .) does support or is cheaper and includes tracking cameras and controllers . . .
me too. in a heart beat. near 5K hours on steam and unknown in oculus app, 4 sensors, still going strong ;p CV1 is a work horse
Time to come to present day, the pro controllers are fantastic with their own cameras. No need for wires anymore going to sensors or headsets for that matter!👍
I think the lack of screen door effect comes from the fact that those lenses can't resolve the pixels, so basically it's like a optical softener.
Samsung Odyssey+ had this soft screen in front of the OLED panels to mitigate the screen door effect. But you do also lose sharpness.
Micro oleds have so tiny pixels, that it requires extremely good lenses to resolve them. This then limites the actual real resolution you can get out of them.
Beyond is 2560 x 2560 per eye, and, 28 PPD.
Samsung Odyssey + is 1440 x 1600 per eye, and 14 PPD.
Not even close. Beyond is orders of magnitude greater in resolution and ppd.
Nothing to do with a soft screen to mitigate sde like Samsung odyssey plus.
It's entirely the resolution and density of the tiny pixels. There's no sde because it's really that sharp.
@@zackmac5917 I don't think you got the point. I was referring to the Odyssey+ simply as a device that used a soft filter to mitigate the screen door effect.
If it were that sharp, then you would see the pixels. What i'm saying, is that its not sharp enough to resolve those pixels.. resulting a slightly soft image that then hides the screen door effect.
Pixels on micro OLEDs are so small, that pancake lenses cant resolve them. They simply cant build them to that kind of resolving power.
@@zackmac5917 28 PPD is not that high, Aero & Crystal has 36PPD and you can still see the pixels. As they use larger panels so the lenses can resolve the pixels.
@@Nobody-Nowhere ahh I see, yeah I sort of misread your comment.
You might be right.
If anything, that's going to greatly help, not hinder it.
It's high enough resolution to be extremely sharp while showing no sign of actually being a display with pixels...aided by the Micro-OLED perfect black levels and colours so that also doesn't make it feel like a display... Sounds perfect!
For me the best thing is tyriel's comment towards the end - that with the Beyond it feels like real life, with the G2, it feels like a game.
Others are saying they are having the most immersive VR experience they've had, even having tried Crystal too.
I'm sold on the Beyond tbh.
But Crystal, if you can tolerate the size and weight, light leakage and greyer black levels etc, should be an incredible experience for sims, for a short sessions at least.
Can we get a comparison to the Aero? Or Quest Pro?
Hello, do need the SteamVR Base Stations for the bigscreen to work on DCS world? Thanks
Good to see the reverb give's a beating to newer headsets :)
The sharpness away from the centre looked quite bad to me. It shows how bad the sweet spot is on the G2.
@@dtz1000 Yeah I've got a G2, I wish the sweet spot wasn't so tiny
@@dtz1000but is the beyond $1000 better?
@@RyanEllerbe Well, with the Beyond you do need to spend another ~$750 or so for the controllers and base stations.
But I'd bet that the difference in comfort is massive in comparison.
Can you do TTL between beyond and. Pimax Crystal?
The Beyond seemed to loose a lot of sharpness towards the edges. Also I was surprised the black level didn’t look as good as the Reverb G2 in many of the comparisons, despite the Beyond being OLED. Perhaps this is just a camera settings issue?
Its a lens issue, pancakes have low contrast because they bounce the light inside the lenses.
@@Nobody-Nowhere I’ve never heard this before. Do you have a link that explains this in more detail? I would have thought this would more be a problem with fresnel lenses.
Beyond has perfect black levels.
In reality the G2 is not even close.
Micro-OLED vs LCD. Incomparable.
All impressions so far testify to this.
@@zackmac5917 Yes, I agree that OLED should give true blacks which LCD can’t do, but I was just pointing out that a number of the TTL side-by-side comparisons show a washed out grey on the Beyond image versus nice blacks on the same scene in the Reverb. As I said, perhaps this was just a camera issue?
@@gregclare yeah good question, basically it must be, it definitely isn't the displays.
Can you point me to where in the video you're talking about?
Have ordered a Beyond but this vid shows how well my G2 stands up. Great value for money atm.
I was given 3 new Reverb headsets because all of them had issues. You have to be really lucky to get one that actually works which I assume is one reason HP gave up making VR headsets! I ended up with the Pico which was half the price and way better because it actually works with 70% screen clarity unlike the Reverb with its rediculously small area of clarity. Trust me, you made a wise decision purchasing Beyond.
@@generalgrevous2458 compression 🤮
@@generalgrevous2458 I've 2 G2s and never had an issue. Lucky I guess
@@Davids6994 Compression is not visible 99,9% of the cases with modern software when using new headset line up like XR Elite, Quest Pro and Pico 4. Not mentioning that thanks to new hardware even Quest 2 looks better than before when it comes to compression. Not as good as the new headsets but still reasonably good.
Finally a G2 competitor!
Have you sold your Varjo? Or will you still compare them?
Are these screenshots at 75 hz or 90 hz? Because 90 hz is apparently upscaled 1920 res.
Could you please compare Beyond vs Pimax Crystal?
Which is the app used in the "TEXT" section to measure the visual acuity??
Would you run a test like this with supersampling enabled on the Index? I bought a G2 after owning an index, and found the colors more washed out on the G2 than the Index when playing squadrons, and was not impressed by the increase in resolution at all like I expected to be. I have no idea why my experience didn't match the reviews. Running a 3090. But I do supersample in the Index, which does increase effective resolution; I think this might be the missing piece.
i really hope the next major headsets seriously consider this form factor. i understand this doesn't have a battery, and isn't wireless, but i don't see why you couldn't cheaply increase this with a wifi card, and a battery. honestly it could be a pocket battery.
if the beyond had inside out tracking or would not require me to buy 320€ of basesstations. The weight reduction would make me buy it. But given the high price I wont upgrade until visuals are also much better than on the g2. Also GPUs need to catch up or DFR needs to be widely adopted, to drive the res.
my only question with the bsb is, why not have a mech ipd so its not set to one person...they are selling different face pads. makes no sense.
I just need more FOV. The most immersive thing I've ever run into was increasing my FOV via the Pimax. The Pimax has lots of downside compared to the likes of the Beyond but that FOV is a deal breaker. Beyond with significantly increased FOV and I'm buying.
I want to preorder the bigscreen beyond, but I need a shipping date before I can commit.
Gentleman I've one question. Does Reverb g2 work on Aple Macbook laptops? Your answer will greatly appreciated since it will help me saving money from unnecessary investment. Thank you.
How does the samsung odyssey + compare to the psvr2
We can clearly see the disadvantage of the old index lenses here. As the image is only really clear if you have teh lenses very close to your eye AND in the right spot. BigScreen BEYOND is very impressive, will probably be many peoples first "second" headset. Especially if they have wornout their index XD Just the comfort alone makes it worth the price, and since the image is even a little sharper and clearer, I see no disadvantage here. Potentially it's a great daily driver rather then the occasional dive in to VR that the index is, due to the fatigue it brings.
Thanks Tyriel! Great job 👍. This makes me imagine how great things will be for VR in a few years when this form factor and decently capable PC VR rigs will be available at a more reasonable cost. Sadly, I have pretty much decided to skip PS VR2 as it still has reprojection and persistence motion blur issues. This made me sick on PS VR1 and I never adjusted to it. It was such a headache, literally speaking. If a PS5 PRO comes out and addresses the issue for triple-A games, I'll reconsider. Exciting times for VR nonetheless! 🙌🥳
Brad said the Beyond is very dark. Do the images in this comparison reflect this in any way or is the camera exposure changed so it shows all equally bright?
why should it matter if beyond has much better light isolation and your eyes will adapt to the darkness?
Thrillseeker addressed this and said that because there is literally zero light leakage, your eyes adapt and it's insanely immersive.
@@stclaws9580 Because my Pico 4 is also well isolated, my eyes adapt to the dark image and still it is waaayyy too dark. This is one of my main issues with the Pico 4, if the Beyond is worse, it's not for me.
@@bakakafka4428 sadlyitsbradley commented on this in his preview vid on the headset. If I remember right I think he confirmed it's about the same 60 nits in this and in the Pico 4.
Edit: yep, at the 14:37 he says they are the same and also note that the persistence is as long as PSVR 2 which will unfortunately require to lower brightness even more for some people.
@@flyingmadpakke thanks!
Hi , I would like to understand one thing, I use the sim only with the Reverb G2 vr, I have a rtx4090 + intel 12900k + 64gb ram.
I have everything set to ultra and I’m not complaining about the performance, but I would like to improve, because yes I’m not complaining but I would like to have something more about fluidity.
all this is accompanied by a 27" full hd monitor.
if I had to play with the monitor I know that I would have bottlenecks, but I wanted to understand if they replace the monitor with a 4k one things would improve for virtual reality or if using virtual reality an upgrade on the monitor would not be needed.
I searched the forum but didn’t find anything can you please help me understand?
so in the end the question is simple: with the machine I have, would buying a 4k monitor help improve virtual reality?
That’s a very clear resolution and great form factor but the lack of HDR makes it too small an upgrade for movies in bigscreen (the program) and the small fov means I couldn’t sit in the front row of the big theater anymore. And the lack of eye tracked foveated rendering means I can’t run games with that resolution anyway. I’ll stick with the index until pc gets something like psvr2.
Why didn't you use Pico 4 for comparison?
Why do the black levels on the beyond look worse than lcd in this comparison ?
Can you make Quest Pro vs Beyond through lenses video ? :D Also wolf attack 00:11:50
Imagine what the G3 could have looked like
My god, the resolution is amazing!
Anyone know the piece of music playing? It's awesome!
Great vid as always, would love to see a through the lens with pic 4. quest pro. beyound and reverbe g2 next.
for the DCS test, is that the Su-25?
edit: I'm blind, it literally says "Su-25T". At least I got it right when I guessed!
Really looking forward for that review. I am juuuuuust about to preorder it, but still would like to hear yoir opinion
looks like quest pro remains the king of edge to edge clarity for the time being.
It's also king of data collection, as well.
@@DKTronics70 accurate 😂😂
tyriel's smile makes me happy
Keep using g2 as a benchmark but it’s only good at the center, show the outer edges should be a consideration
Bring back the old music please 😂 love that music
They should have used aspheric lenses instead of pancake, pancake look sharp in videos but are blurry and have a double vision effect in actual use. Whereas aspheric is crystal clear edge to edge
Yup, for sure. Though aspheric lenses are more expensive iirc, but they're definitely part of the reason why the Varjo is so damn good.
I was impressed with the Beyond vs the G2 until I saw 8:47 WOW what happened there, compression? That sucks!
At around 1:46 we loose your voice for a few seconds!
I'd love to see a comparison with the Index 2,
but I think you'd need a DeLorean to do that 😉.
But anyway,
thanks for the video 👍.
not a Mandalorian? :P
I wanna see Pimax Crystal thru the lens video
The problem with DisplayPort 1.4 was not really on my radar until now. Even if Valve or anyone else releases a headset with two 4k Micro OLEDs it won't be able to run that resolution at high refresh rates with current GPUs. AMD is too slow and not optimized for VR and Nvidia Lovelace doesn't support DP 2.0.
There is another possibility: a headset that doesn't even have a cable. I remember a discussion, not sure if it was Valve, but there was an argument that these long high bandwidth cables for VR are actually quite expensive and it might be reasonable to ship a headset with completely native wireless as the default mode. The codec from IMRNext that Nofio is using reduces the frame size 60x without noticeable degradation in picture and no latency (less than 1 ms so impossible to detect).
They can also do foveated transport
How does that compare with the Quest 2? Is that the Index but 5x worse? I can't read shit in the Quest 2, it's my biggest gripe, besides the fact that this thing dangles everywhere everytime you move your head.
Wow, this headset is really breaking boundaries!!🎉
The reverb 2 looked totally different like there was graphics mods or something
im still rocking the samsung odyssey plus.. for the money i think the HP reverb is the best
I still rock the CV1. I'll wake up once FOV is improved to near eye peripheral vision.
ok old timer... that cv1 is like 7 yrs old by now lol.
btw your "real vision fov" stuff already exists.. its called the Pimax headsets. But they too arent perfect but at least thats what ur looking for
I am confused, Big Screen Beyond or Pimax...
I think you should include the Quest 2 in all TTL videos since it is still, by far, the HMD in most people's homes. No doubt about pancake lenses being the future!
It doesn't compare to these headsets, the resolution is much lower, so no point
@@AxeDragon1989 quest 2 resolution is higher than index you dingwit