Just had a 3.0 that was a nightmare. Even GM field engineers were not sure why the emissions system was not functioning properly. The truck had about 4,000 miles on it and GM purchased it back from us. I was told that there is a group of them with a similar issue.
Scott won't question unless cause I'm fixed and get a diesel truck probably picking up used get up used can those Can you remove the EGR system off those engines
RE: EMISSIONS the new 6-cylinder Duramax is an engine that takes EGR from after the DPF, meaning it's clean exhaust with the soot filtered out. For the life of me I can't figure out why this wasn't immediately done with EGR after DPF became common. Anyways, it cleans up the EGR to where soot no longer cakes up the intake.
Possibly heat dissipation? If the truck has to run a regen, it would also be dumping super heated exhaust gasses back into the cylinder. Could have also been trying to give the engine a second chance to burn the unused diesel particles. Maybe since it's a smaller motor they realized they didn't have to worry about either.
The reason it cakes up in the intake is due to the CCV gasses entering the intake which goes through the intercooler and into your intake manifold which mixes with EGR gasses. This is why a catch can is crucial.
I have a 2018 Colorado with a 2.8 diesel. I absolutely love this truck, it goes down the road so quiet and so smooth, and the mileage is consistently in the mid 30s. Average in the summer is 35. Makes that a pretty desirable engine in my book.
The 3.0 was meant for someone who wanted to have a truck for light duty applications and still get great efficiency when not working it, unlike its gas options which aren't super efficient in either side. Personally I'm excited to see how the 3.0 moves forward in the next 10 years or so if they keep it that long.
Exactly what I’m looking for in a truck, currently drive a sedan that gets 30 on the highway, I don’t want to go down 10+ mpg. Love the cabin size and the versatility of having a bed.
@@aaronfurman8208 on the LZ0 it’s a 200k mile service interval. It stinks but they claim that’s the only way they could fit the engine in the engine bay.
@@blackjaminboy 200K? Really? huh. That kind of makes me wonder, but still, I cant help but think when that truck hits 200K, is it going to be worth the $7K timing change? It's too much for me. Also, I am not being cynical, I appreciate this back and fourth.
As someone that works at a major GM service center, I say that that these engines are both OK, they don't seem to have as many issues as some of the gas engines, but I have yet to see anyone complain to me about the 2.8L, and those have been on the market longer, but I have had people complain about the 3.0L. That said, the primary issues that people have had are emissions related.
I have the 2016 Canyon 2.8, and it has been mostly trouble free since I purchased it. It is just about at 150k. After going on a 8k mile trip recently, it had a couple check engine lights come on with no noticeable changes to drive quality. P0300 & P2002. Also an exhaust temperature sensor needed replaced. Power output is obviously low, but that is expected for an engine of this size. I drive like a grampa anyway so it's a non issue for me. Overall it drives good and maintenance is easy to do. Fuel filters are easy to access, and def fill is behind the fuel door. But, my favorite thing about it is getting about 600 miles of range on a full 21 gallon tank.
I have 57k on my 2020 3.0L without any issues at all. I haul around a couple of ATV's and a truck camper and it handles both with ease. Great engine so far and can't beat the MPG either!
The 2.8 goes back to the Jeep Liberty diesel. I have it in my canyon. It's no race engine, but it's very efficient, has loads of low-end torque almost from idle, and has a nice tractor sound to it (if it's your thing.) I work mine pretty hard and it's been pretty reliable so far except exausth cracks developping 2 times and 2 check engine lights ( 1 was false alarm, 2nd was water developped in the intercooler wich is a known flaw on these) but i did not blow the turbo on it (yet) at 50 000km. I get 15.5L/100km towing a 6500lbs, 25 feet rv and it sleeps at 2000rpm, sometimes even going for the 6th keeping the speed at 1500rpm. It's a great engine, especially if you plan on towing a lot because that v6 will drain your wallet on fuel.
I just bought a 3.0 Duramax. So here's to hoping the long term reliability. I came from a Toyota Tacoma and we tow a 4000 pound travel trailer so I know this diesel will be much better for what I need.
I absolutely love my 2.8 baby max. Getting 30-32 mpg on the highway is great. My 6k pound RV takes it to 15mpg but still very happy. I will be curious how the 3.0 does as time goes on.
@@Texpete88 No probably 12. But that’s ok two different tools for two different jobs. The Colorado/Canyon won’t be towing a large 5th wheel RV either. Plus a gasser would be what 9 mpg. I mean all towing the same 6k RV at 65-70 mph.
I have an ‘18 Colorado ZR2 with the 2.8. I wasn’t expecting it to be a decent towing rig, but I was pleasantly surprised when I hooked it up to my 22’ camper. It’s no comparison to my 2001 LB7, but it is able to tow my camper at highway speeds (with a WD hitch of course). I’m now at 120k miles, with no emissions issues. Everything else is another matter (stabillitrak system keeps breaking…plastics falling off…those fancy ZR2 shocks/struts all started leaking/failing…etc). So far, the 2.8 has proven to be a fantastically reliable and capable motor. And the 6L50 is still shifting fine (although it does freak out on shift points every so often). I actually prefer it much more than the 8 gear in my dad’s v6 Colorado which just constantly hunts gears going down the highway into a headwind. TBH, I think the 2.8 is far better. Much more serviceable, simpler proven design, and it just “sounds” more like a diesel should. The only downside to me is the timing belt (FFS GM). Btw, Fiat only has a majority shareholder in VM Motori, not outright owned. Actually, you should do a video on VM Motori…They’ve made only diesel engines for about 70 years, and their engines make it into many diverse vehicles (2.8 dmax, the ram ecodiesel, etc). Regardless, thanks for the video. Very good info on both the baby dmaxes.
I also own an ‘18 zrz diesel, tows our 23’ boat surprisingly well. Pushes you around on the brakes a little bit but that might be more up to the trailer having hydraulic brakes instead of electric ones. Tows nearly 7k pounds in 105 degree weather with zero issues. I do wish I had more power when I take it out to the desert to have fun in, but in any other situation I’m using it in, I really don’t need more.
I suspect the iron block on the 2.8 is because of the knock (or imbalance) that is part of the I4 arrangement. The I6 is okay with the aluminum because of the balance. Iron was always used in diesel blocks as a way to absorb the shock. I have the LM2 in my 2022 Seirra and I have test driven a few LWN Colorado/Canyon ( while i was still truck shopping) The 2.8 always had a "diesel" feel. The 3.0 is incredibly smooth, the variable geometry turbo and 10 speed transmission give very smooth application of power and torque. The LWN felt less refined and more rocky
Have 2.8L Duramax in LT 4x4 Colorado. There is no detectable knock due to the timing of the injectors. The engine is pretty quiet IMO. Plus it has a ton of torque.
Here in Australia we've had the izuzu dmax referring to duramax ute since the early 2000s with a 3.0l diesel ljj1 duramax motor, they are a great vehicle
I’ll give my experience…. 2021 AT4 with 3.0. I just took a 270 mile trip, pulling a 28’ enclosed Haulmark trailer with 3600 lb car. At 70mph with cruise on, dash cluster said 16.7 mpg average. My math showed 17.0. I’m getting 25-28 without towing. Towed that trailer with ease The guy who I borrowed trailer from has 2011 GMC, crew cab, 8’ bed, 2500 with 6.6. The best he gets towing that same trailer is 14ish with a 3200 lb car, about 18mpg not towing. If you are not towing heavy on a weekly basis, the 3.0 is more than adequate as far as I’m concerned.
I got a 2.8L and I can tell you the best part of is that when I'm not towing I'm seeing well above 30mpg with just a tune and when I do have to do some light towing it does well enough for my needs. It's a bit more livable then a full size truck.
Where I live in Southern California, it’s way more livable than a full sized truck. It’s a headache to own anything bigger than a 1500. Even that gets annoying sometimes. I used to have a 2014 tundra and I switched to this for that very reason. Smaller truck but still pulls our 7k pound boat just fine. Best of both worlds
A very good video. As noted, the 2.8L Duramax is essentially a modified (and emission-controlled) version of the 2.8L CRD engine found as an option in the 2005-6 Jeep Liberty (it only was available in the U.S. for those two years, it was available overseas for much longer). The weak point of the 2.8L engines is the timing belt--they are costly to replace as essentially the entire front end of the vehicle must be removed to replace the belt. The 3.0L, as noted, is stupidly designed with the timing chain AND a belt-driven oil pump located at the rear of the engine. Another costly maintenance issue. Like all other 2007+ MY diesels, both are plagued with emission system-related issues. I own a 2005 Jeep Liberty CRD where the main emission control issue is just the EGR, which is fairly easy to maintain or eliminate. That said, I won't buy another diesel so long as the EGR/SCR/DEF/DPF emission systems are in use. Been there and done that with an HD pickup, which I have since sold. The EPA has essentially killed the diesel engine for cost-effective consumer use.
Well I worked with GM engineers at the Pontiac Powertrain Division for 5 years on one specific aspect of a V8 engine. We had a 5 million dollar grant and GM put in an additional 10 million to do the reaseach, development, and fielding of a pilot test facility. The engineers that I worked with didn’t do anything Willy Nilly as you suggest. I have a 2023 GMC SIERRA with the improved LZ0 diesel. I can assure you that the GM engineers don’t sit around on their butts just saying “oh that’s good enough”.
In all reality, dual overhead cams, or single overhead. Are really common in modern semi diesels. Cummins isx used 2, and now single, overhead cams. DD engines are dual overhead cams, Volvo D13s ect.
Camshaft placement isnt the issue its how the cams are driven, all 3/4 ton diesels and class 8 diesel engines are gear driven (except the 5.0 cummins nissan titan but we dont talk about that) a chain driven diesel engine deeply decreases reliability, catastrophic failure isnt about if it will happen its when will it happen. And to make things worse its on the back of the engine, so all chain repairs are either engine out or cab out repairs.
@@e4die_on_ig chain driven diesel is only new to US, very common for Europe in their passenger diesels. The belt drive is just dumb. Also remember all of our light duty diesels, 2500/3500, we're medium engines shoved in light duty truck's.
Thanks for doing this, I have an '18 Canyon with the 2.8 and love it. Summer average mpg around 27, winter is 24. I baby it a bit, only tow a few times a year. Trailer 1850#, CJ5 at 3400 loaded gives me 17 mpg at 60-65 mph driving up into the White Mountains, I'm very happy with it so far.
Don’t baby it. Long runs & or towing moderate loads where it gets full operating temps for awhile and it will live & live. Baby it short commute you will have emissions problems and it will die early. Fwiw 875,000 on my tuned 3.0 Ram diesel transporting RVs commercially.
My 2022 LM2 has better fuel efficiency ratings in a full size crew cab pickup than a 2.8 Colorado diesel. Having the max tow package taking it up to 13000 lb tow rating is icing on the cake even though GM acknowledged the 3.0 was primarily developed to be an engine focused on fuel economy. The 3.0 is clearly the better engine.
I have the 2.8 in my ZR2 5yrs of ownership. 75K miles. One bad Injector, Def heater failed, now the head gasket is leaking. I was very impressed until the HG. I’m waiting on a 2023 Sierra AT4 3.0 I firmly believe that these trucks are great while the warranty is active. Things will become costly afterwards, as I’m experiencing this first hand.
I have a 2005 Jeep Liberty with the VM 2.8 Diesel. Superior to the 3.6 V6 and runs and runs! Lots of torque and great fuel economy. No need for DEF, but does throw some black out if you push it unnecessarily. Thinking about 3.0 V6 in a Yukon, whenever they can get some in stock....My other car is a 2016 Range Rover with the 3.0 V6 TD6, just passed 100K miles and smooth as silk still. When I tow at capacity 7,700 # occasionally the DEF indicator comes on. If I run it above 2,000 RPM for 15 minutes it resets. Love the diesels, too bad VM ruined it for the US with their shenanigan's.
I wish the 3.0 liter was also an option on the 2500. I’m just not the biggest fan of how squishy half ton suspensions feel when towing. I know I know airbags exist but it would be nice to have beefier suspension as an option from the factory.
@@robertcooper3273 i have one on order to replace my 2020 canyon denali diesel. I can't wait to compare fuel consumption between the 2. I'm pretty sure it will be very close since the 3.0 is a lot more advanced and backed by a better transmission. But still i love my 2.8, i like that tractor sound.
The new 3.0 has nearly, and I mean almost exactly, the same horsepower and torque as my 04 LLY sierra 2500, but with 30 mpg. Crazy how things improve over time.
The engines have merit of you want a light duty camping vehicle and don't want a work truck, and want an American made "truck". Or you just can't find a Tacoma right now. A friend has a 2016 and has 140,000 trouble free mileage on it but it's used as a light work truck. The fuel economy is pretty decent too, so I think for many people they have merit. Thanks for the detailed overview of these engines, you obviously know your stuff.
the 3.0 duramax is a good engine....besides the trans removal being mandatory to service the timing components(like servicing a clutch)....other than that it's very reliable.
2022 3.0L Duramax 277 horsepower. 460 lb-ft of torque. 2002 Duramax 6.6L 300 horsepower and 520 lb-ft of. Bet when you add truck transmission the 3.0L could be a great towing companion for the Occasional trip.
@@edwardpate6128 In Europe everyone is towing with Diesel engines between 2L and 3L and those engines last a long time and being worked hard. You don't need 6L or more of displacement for many applications.
You keep using the arguement that the 2.8 and 3.0 aren't "truck" engines or dont have "truck" transmissions. The 2.8 puts out damn near the same hp and torque as the 12v cummins when released and the 3.0 puts out more. The 2.8 makes peak torque at 2k rpm, the 3.0 at 1500rpm, sounds pretty truck like to me. You say the 6L50 wasn't designed to be behind a truck, last i checked transmissions cant tell what they are attached too, only how much torque is put through them. The 6L50 is well within its torque ratings for the 2.8 and has internals from the 6L90 which is found in the 6.0 gas trucks... Saying these engines aren't truck engines just because they aren't 6+ liters is just stupid. The 2.8 will out tow/haul and engine in the midsize class and get better mileage doing it.
3.0 is definitely better, actually has power to move itself. 2.8 is gutless. I currently own an AT4 3.0 with 57k miles and haven't had any issues and done plenty of towing.
I service my own vehicles, so the 2.8L gets my vote😉 I'm not spending extra money on more truck I don't need and then much higher maintenance cost as I wouldn't touch those dang chains🤦 Simpler is better. The 2.8L has a conventional water pump, but the 3.0L, I believe, has coolant system that's much more complicated.
I understand the 2.8mL diesel is discontinued 2022 & the 3.0 to be discontinued 2023 I believe. Both replaced by a 2.7 L gas engine w mega turbo. The gvmt has killed small diesels w exhaust systems which fail & price of diesel up to $2 above regular gas. That said my 2.8L Duramax Colorado LT 4x4 is not a dog like a Tacoma. Handles a ton or more of river rock in the bed w/o complaint & tows up to 7k well. Does what I need. Not meant for 6.6 L heavy duty work.
Thanks for the in depth look. Always curious what that 2.8 was all about. From all the years owning diesels and all things vehicles, having a solid transmission in the end usually ends up being very critical. Sounds like that old school 6L car trans with beefier truck parts still ain’t ideal… Like others have stated the emissions equip will normally get you sooner or later in the pocketbook!
I absolutely love my 2.8 mini max. I pull 7k RV regularly across the country. Only issue I've had is that dam 6L50 🤬That aluminum line pressure valve is cheap AF and failed. Trans go has the fix with a steel valve but have to pull the transmission to fix it. Pulled mine as soon as it started to shudder.
I have an H1 with 6.5 turbo that could uses a refresh. I'm contemplating engine swap but 6.6 requires body lift and other mods. The 3.0 LZ0 seems like I could improve power and mileage that would drop right in, as it's used for overlanding and not towing. Well maybe before gas goes to $15 a gallon.
I was thinking the same thing, I have an 08 Hummer H2 and was thinking about getting the 6.6, but I bought a 22 GMC Sierra with the 3.0 and I love it! I am now thinking about putting that in my hummer instead of the 6.6
@@v8chevy788 yup that 3.0 has some balls i did a few months of hotshot with it and pulled hard no problem but have removed it as a work truck and bought a 6.6 Duramax and the 3.0 is still being use by my wife with no problems what so ever
In Europe and Asia everyone is towing with Diesel engines between 2L and 3L and those engines last a long time and being worked hard. You don't need 6L or more of displacement for many applications. Look at Iveco or Mitsubishi Canter in the 7.5 Ton class GCWR 25.000lbs They come with either a 3L or 4L Diesel.
The 2.8 has very good engine braking while the 3.0 does not. This is very important for towing or going up and down steep grades. Check out the results from the Ike Gauntlet towing challenge
I get what you're saying about these smaller diesel engines not meant for heavy loads. The thing is half ton trucks shouldn't be towing or hauling as much as commercials tell you they can. Once you factor in tires, suspension, tongue weight and all the other things the sales staff leave out, its a different ball game. These baby duramax motors can do as much work as any any half ton truck should be doing, and get better fuel milage doing it.
4:45 My 7.3 Powerstroke turns heads as I drive past, because it sounds like a diesel is supposed to. It doesn't need a timing belt replacement at 150,000 miles either. In fact it should go at least 400,000 before it needs any major service at all.
I think both of these diesel motors are very truck worthy for their use in the mid size and 1/2ton applications, GM needs to figure out how to get the 3.0 in the mid size trucks with the ten speed, I have it in the Silverado and it’s an amazing motor. As for all the emissions crap, yes it’s a pain in the a$$; but if you’re hooking up a trailer and my truck is idling, there is not one hint of diesel exhaust fumes back there, as for checking the engine oil pump belt, it was recently priced out with all new parts including the cover, book says it’s 7.5 hours of work, with a total being $1300-1500. At an interval that has now been stretched to 200K miles.
From the factory, it is not even close, mainly due to their OEM tuning. The 2.8 is clearly GM's red headed stepchild, with sloppy trans tuning that shifts late and soft. The 2.8's engine tuning is not particularly refined either, running a bit like a diesel powered agricultural implement. In contrast, the 3.0 runs turbine smooth and it's 10 speed transmission works great. For reference sake, I own a '17 Canyon with a 2.8 and a friend owns a newer Sierra with the 3.0. The personal saving grace for my 2.8 was tuning it. Post tune it runs like it should have from the factory, this with EPA legal settings from Green Diesel Engineering. The laggy pedal response is long gone, power is up and more 3.0 like, the transmission shifts far earlier, firmer and yet smoothly, taking advantage of the 2.8's stout low end torque. The 3.0 does not seem to need tuning, which is good as I don't believe the 3.0 ECM is accessible to tuners. The 3.0 runs perfect out of the box as one would expect from an engine that is destined to go into a lot of expensive vehicles. The 3.0 has a far better 10 speed transmission while the 2.8 makes do with the now ancient 6L50 trans, which works acceptably after tuning, but it could do with a couple more ratios to keep the 2.8 in it's 1,800-2K RPM efficient and happy place. Would love to have a ZF 8 speed hooked up to my 2.8. Reliability wise it is still pretty early days for the 3.0. The 2.8s have had some stuck injector issues that can hole pistons. Always use fuel additive with each and every fill up on any modern diesel, especially if one is in the US, running America's generally crummy low cetane "dry" ultra low sulfur diesel fuel. Additive is not a big expense given my 2.8's thrifty 27.8 MPG overall lifetime (63K miles) fuel economy, which is remarkable for a 4x4 crew cab long box pickup truck. Don't get me wrong with my complaints about it's faults, I love my Canyon with it's 2.8. I love the big enough but not too big size of the GM twins with the torquey effortless diesel vibe. In my estimation the 2.8 is a decent power train that just needed a little owner involvement to get it to reach it's potential 😁 While common overseas a mid sizer with a diesel is unique in the US, so it is a pity the 2.8 is going away for '23. In fairness, the coming 2.7 turbo gas engine replacement, while lugging around too much truck in the full sizers, should be a sweet power train in the twins. The 2.7 won't get mid 30's MPG at 70 MPH cruise, or efficiently tow like my 2.8 does though...
My previous Canyon had the 2.8L diesel, great fuel economy, good towing my 5,000 trailer. Sadly in typical GM fashion, the 2.8L is going away 😣 I now have the 3.0L in the Sierra, wow is it smooth! with impressive fuel economy! Maybe GM will drop two cylinders off the new architecture and offer it in the midsize at a reasonable price? I’m Probably just dreaming….
When that 3.0 needs to have its timing chain replaced, you're pulling off the Transmission. Thats enough for me not to purchase it. If you are only leasing the Truck with the 3.0, I think you're fine, but if you are planning on keeping that truck long-term, Id put serious thought into that specific cost. I have the 2.8 duramax on my Colorado and I LOVE IT! Great all around truck.
Just to help the knowledge spread. Vgt doesn't make the turbo bigger it varies the size of the a.r. which is measure of the size of the housing. Aka you can go from small exhaust housing to big balancing low end spool and high end flow . How this help. Tried to keep simple lmao
Do you tink we going to see someting aftermarket to delete the dpf system on the 3.0 Duramax soon and if yes is this gonna make it sounds more like a true diesel truck. Thank
Really doesn’t matter now. I have a Colorado with a 2.8 and it’s great 30+ on the hwy put a tuner on it and increased it to 36 GM has pulled the plug on the 2.8 as of July of this year. So unless your buying a used Colorado/canyon all that is left is the 3.0
I think buying a 15pass with the diesel is a good invest, considering how in demand 15pass vans are in general. The 6.0 /4l80 seems to get 12mpg loaded. The 6.0/ 6speed is slightly better. Googleing looks like in the 30s for a stock 2.8l. Probably better deleted.
I like a good 6.6 but I can get 20 mpg all day long with my 6.5 loaded or not. I guess I'm not ready to update. And they make 1500s with 6.5s and they get 25mpg+
If I was going to swap one into a Jeep TJ it would be the 2.8. I'd like to see a review of the Cummins R2.8 crate engine. I looked hard at doing a swap into my jeep then I heard some mixed reviews on quality.
if you want to know about the cummins R2.8 engine in general look for "foton tunland" that is a chinese midsize with the R2.8 equipped right from the factory since quite some time ago
So I'm a little confused. How is the 6.6 going millions of miles? My 15l semi will only go about 1 and a quarter before an inframe and it has wet sleeves... or are the grandiose statements more for the drama of things?
2.4 liter would have been a better size for the 4-cylinder, .2 liter is much difference from the 3.0 six. The reason for a diesel is efficiency. 2.4 with a nice size turbo would be great.
"For those who did not 3/4 ton or bigger and wanted a Diesel" So in other words.. They want a truck without the biggest benefit of going Diesel with all the downsides of going Diesel over gasoline, got it. Meanwhile 5.9C goes a million miles without major work, 7.3 PSD can do it too. 6.7 PSD even bogged down by all the emissions BS does great. 6.6 has been rock solid too. But what they all bring to the table is torque, reliability, and mpg under load. So what you end up with is a 1/2 that is more complex than the bigger Diesels, and with less power and have all the EPA emissions BS all over it to boot killing reliability further. Also nice oil pump belt at the back of it, $1500 waiting to happen fix for a rubber belt because the transmission has to be pulled back to access it. Active thermal management is a problem waiting to happen as well. Diesels are already very expensive to fix, why would one want the downsides of that while adding on more complex features. The reason why it's okay on the bigger engines is unparalleled towing performance and MPG under heavy use. Just buy a 6.2L at that point. It's about 5 MPG difference overall but more HP, cheaper fuel, and cheaper repairs. 5MPG sounds great until you realize gas is on average $1.20 less per gallon.
I agree with everything you said except cheaper gas for the 6.2. That’s a “premium only” motor, and everyplace I’ve seen, that’s more than diesel…..and they still don’t have the torque the smaller diesels have, which is what you want when towing.
@@ss0073 That's true about the gas i guess, however 6.2 will not knock at 87, just less power. The ECU adjusts timing accordingly. As far as peak tq is concerned, the 6.2 only pulls 10 ft.lbs less. The timing adjust (it retards it) is not magic but it will allow the truck to burn it without knocking itself into oblivion. From what I've seen 89 seems to net the best results. Looking outside my window right now 91 is $4.8 whereas Diesel is $5.4, where you live makes a huge difference. So it's a tossup if 91 is cheaper than a full tank of Diesel overall at that point. No one in their right mind would buy a 1/2 ton work truck that could not burn 87. It's a light work vehicle not a sports car. 6.2's can even run E85 if you really wanted to just be prepared for much lower MPG :D 3.0 will hit the majority of its curve by 1500 rpm (It should it's a Diesel) the 6.2 does it around 4k. That's its advantage over the 6.2. The TQ numbers are 450 and 460 respectively.
In Europe they offered the Wrangler with the 2.8 diesel which seems to be the same as the duramax/vm motori 2.8. Almost all Wranglers i ser on the road has this diesel and it really sounds like some type of agricultural equipment. Very harsh knackering sound.
@@TheIamdevin no it seems they didnt offer the diesel Wrangler in the usa before they introduced the 3.0 V6. In Europe they had a 2.8 diesel version from maybe 2008 or so (only guessing the year)
Any diesel with a throttle body isn’t something you want to touch. Diesel injection systems are complex enough without all the extra emissions crap. Just buy a gasser at that point. They’re even making it to where large displacement gas engines are looking better than diesels just because of all the crap a diesel has to have to meet emissions now.
I'd buy a Duramax 2.8 litre or a 3.0 litre diesel engine. I've seen YT videos criticizing how poorly built the Duramax engine is, but I have to disagree. I see nothing inherently wrong with the engine itself. Like many engines, it needs maintenance and service. I'm sure even the D-max 6.6 litre V8 needed maintenance if it had any chance of lasting a long time. So the Duramax 2.8 litre and 3.0 litre diesel is no different.
Neither because having a diesel in a half ton truck is already a paradox in and of itself! Then with cost of maintenance plus cost of fuel its not worth it!
![[MV] A leap of faith...ความเชื่อใจครั้งสุดท้าย (From "Petrichor the series")](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/U1piZH2CNXA/mqdefault.jpg)
Which one do you think is better?
Probably the 3.0 if the engineering is done right. Hopefully the timing chain lasts
Neither 🤣
Just had a 3.0 that was a nightmare. Even GM field engineers were not sure why the emissions system was not functioning properly. The truck had about 4,000 miles on it and GM purchased it back from us. I was told that there is a group of them with a similar issue.
Scott won't question unless cause I'm fixed and get a diesel truck probably picking up used get up used can those Can you remove the EGR system off those engines
2.8
Bruh. This channel is so underrated. I havent seen many journalists go into this much detail of the mechanics of these engines.
I 2nd this opinion.
RE: EMISSIONS the new 6-cylinder Duramax is an engine that takes EGR from after the DPF, meaning it's clean exhaust with the soot filtered out. For the life of me I can't figure out why this wasn't immediately done with EGR after DPF became common. Anyways, it cleans up the EGR to where soot no longer cakes up the intake.
Possibly heat dissipation? If the truck has to run a regen, it would also be dumping super heated exhaust gasses back into the cylinder. Could have also been trying to give the engine a second chance to burn the unused diesel particles. Maybe since it's a smaller motor they realized they didn't have to worry about either.
Really?????? Thats good to know. The Eco diesel also takes exhaust gasses from after the DPF.
The reason it cakes up in the intake is due to the CCV gasses entering the intake which goes through the intercooler and into your intake manifold which mixes with EGR gasses. This is why a catch can is crucial.
@@codyt4019catch can may help overall, but with the 2.8 duramax’s you could blow a rear main seal. Very common talk in the forums
I have a 2018 Colorado with a 2.8 diesel. I absolutely love this truck, it goes down the road so quiet and so smooth, and the mileage is consistently in the mid 30s. Average in the summer is 35. Makes that a pretty desirable engine in my book.
Mine used to get 30mpg and then the recalls happened. It dropped to 25mpg and then down to 22mpg. I miss the 30+ range
The 3.0 was meant for someone who wanted to have a truck for light duty applications and still get great efficiency when not working it, unlike its gas options which aren't super efficient in either side. Personally I'm excited to see how the 3.0 moves forward in the next 10 years or so if they keep it that long.
Exactly what I’m looking for in a truck, currently drive a sedan that gets 30 on the highway, I don’t want to go down 10+ mpg. Love the cabin size and the versatility of having a bed.
the whole aspect of having to remove the tranny for the timing chain / belt is my biggest issue with the 3.0
@@aaronfurman8208 on the LZ0 it’s a 200k mile service interval. It stinks but they claim that’s the only way they could fit the engine in the engine bay.
@@blackjaminboy 200K? Really? huh. That kind of makes me wonder, but still, I cant help but think when that truck hits 200K, is it going to be worth the $7K timing change? It's too much for me. Also, I am not being cynical, I appreciate this back and fourth.
As someone that works at a major GM service center, I say that that these engines are both OK, they don't seem to have as many issues as some of the gas engines, but I have yet to see anyone complain to me about the 2.8L, and those have been on the market longer, but I have had people complain about the 3.0L. That said, the primary issues that people have had are emissions related.
In my country, the 2.8L is very used for more than a decade by GM in its light duty trucks. It is known to be very reliable if not neglected.
I have the 2016 Canyon 2.8, and it has been mostly trouble free since I purchased it. It is just about at 150k. After going on a 8k mile trip recently, it had a couple check engine lights come on with no noticeable changes to drive quality. P0300 & P2002. Also an exhaust temperature sensor needed replaced.
Power output is obviously low, but that is expected for an engine of this size. I drive like a grampa anyway so it's a non issue for me.
Overall it drives good and maintenance is easy to do. Fuel filters are easy to access, and def fill is behind the fuel door. But, my favorite thing about it is getting about 600 miles of range on a full 21 gallon tank.
The 600 mile range in mine is actually a drawback; my bladder has about a 300 mile range!
I have 57k on my 2020 3.0L without any issues at all. I haul around a couple of ATV's and a truck camper and it handles both with ease. Great engine so far and can't beat the MPG either!
Still holding up well? Looking at one myself now.
I love my 2.8 duramax in my Chevy Colorado, currently have 92k miles absolutely no issues. Wouldn’t trade it for anything
The 2.8 goes back to the Jeep Liberty diesel.
I have it in my canyon. It's no race engine, but it's very efficient, has loads of low-end torque almost from idle, and has a nice tractor sound to it (if it's your thing.)
I work mine pretty hard and it's been pretty reliable so far except exausth cracks developping 2 times and 2 check engine lights ( 1 was false alarm, 2nd was water developped in the intercooler wich is a known flaw on these) but i did not blow the turbo on it (yet) at 50 000km.
I get 15.5L/100km towing a 6500lbs, 25 feet rv and it sleeps at 2000rpm, sometimes even going for the 6th keeping the speed at 1500rpm.
It's a great engine, especially if you plan on towing a lot because that v6 will drain your wallet on fuel.
It’s an in-line 6 I think, bit more fuel efficient
I have the 2.8L Duramax in my 2017 Colorado ZR2. Love it!
I just bought a 3.0 Duramax. So here's to hoping the long term reliability. I came from a Toyota Tacoma and we tow a 4000 pound travel trailer so I know this diesel will be much better for what I need.
I absolutely love my 2.8 baby max. Getting 30-32 mpg on the highway is great. My 6k pound RV takes it to 15mpg but still very happy. I will be curious how the 3.0 does as time goes on.
Love my 2.8 also. Sad to see it's no longer available. Getting close to timing belt change.
This isn't anything to be happy about lmfao a 2500 does it better while doing it better!🤣🤣
@@jenwright2577 my 3500 got 18 empty.
@@hotrod7938 And your 3500 probably got 18 with a 6k trailer behind it that’s light work for it
@@Texpete88 No probably 12. But that’s ok two different tools for two different jobs. The Colorado/Canyon won’t be towing a large 5th wheel RV either.
Plus a gasser would be what 9 mpg. I mean all towing the same 6k RV at 65-70 mph.
I have an ‘18 Colorado ZR2 with the 2.8. I wasn’t expecting it to be a decent towing rig, but I was pleasantly surprised when I hooked it up to my 22’ camper. It’s no comparison to my 2001 LB7, but it is able to tow my camper at highway speeds (with a WD hitch of course). I’m now at 120k miles, with no emissions issues. Everything else is another matter (stabillitrak system keeps breaking…plastics falling off…those fancy ZR2 shocks/struts all started leaking/failing…etc). So far, the 2.8 has proven to be a fantastically reliable and capable motor. And the 6L50 is still shifting fine (although it does freak out on shift points every so often). I actually prefer it much more than the 8 gear in my dad’s v6 Colorado which just constantly hunts gears going down the highway into a headwind. TBH, I think the 2.8 is far better. Much more serviceable, simpler proven design, and it just “sounds” more like a diesel should. The only downside to me is the timing belt (FFS GM). Btw, Fiat only has a majority shareholder in VM Motori, not outright owned. Actually, you should do a video on VM Motori…They’ve made only diesel engines for about 70 years, and their engines make it into many diverse vehicles (2.8 dmax, the ram ecodiesel, etc). Regardless, thanks for the video. Very good info on both the baby dmaxes.
Not only that, but GM did own a share of them at one point.
I also own an ‘18 zrz diesel, tows our 23’ boat surprisingly well. Pushes you around on the brakes a little bit but that might be more up to the trailer having hydraulic brakes instead of electric ones. Tows nearly 7k pounds in 105 degree weather with zero issues. I do wish I had more power when I take it out to the desert to have fun in, but in any other situation I’m using it in, I really don’t need more.
I suspect the iron block on the 2.8 is because of the knock (or imbalance) that is part of the I4 arrangement.
The I6 is okay with the aluminum because of the balance.
Iron was always used in diesel blocks as a way to absorb the shock.
I have the LM2 in my 2022 Seirra and I have test driven a few LWN Colorado/Canyon ( while i was still truck shopping)
The 2.8 always had a "diesel" feel. The 3.0 is incredibly smooth, the variable geometry turbo and 10 speed transmission give very smooth application of power and torque. The LWN felt less refined and more rocky
I drive a Cruze with a 4-cylinder Diesel. The block is aluminium and it’s fine.
@@aaronshipley5594 My son has a 2017 2nd gen Cruz with 1.6 diesel. 300k miles get crazy mileage doing pilot car work.
Have 2.8L Duramax in LT 4x4 Colorado. There is no detectable knock due to the timing of the injectors. The engine is pretty quiet IMO. Plus it has a ton of torque.
Here in Australia we've had the izuzu dmax referring to duramax ute since the early 2000s with a 3.0l diesel ljj1 duramax motor, they are a great vehicle
But the 2.8 came in the second gen colarado in 2012
I’ll give my experience….
2021 AT4 with 3.0. I just took a 270 mile trip, pulling a 28’ enclosed Haulmark trailer with 3600 lb car. At 70mph with cruise on, dash cluster said 16.7 mpg average. My math showed 17.0. I’m getting 25-28 without towing. Towed that trailer with ease
The guy who I borrowed trailer from has 2011 GMC, crew cab, 8’ bed, 2500 with 6.6. The best he gets towing that same trailer is 14ish with a 3200 lb car, about 18mpg not towing.
If you are not towing heavy on a weekly basis, the 3.0 is more than adequate as far as I’m concerned.
And yet some people still just don't get it or are just too stuck in the big diesel mentality. Even the video fails to mention any mpg numbers.
Need a ecodiesel video more specifically on the new 2020+ 3rd gen engines
I got a 2.8L and I can tell you the best part of is that when I'm not towing I'm seeing well above 30mpg with just a tune and when I do have to do some light towing it does well enough for my needs. It's a bit more livable then a full size truck.
Where I live in Southern California, it’s way more livable than a full sized truck. It’s a headache to own anything bigger than a 1500. Even that gets annoying sometimes. I used to have a 2014 tundra and I switched to this for that very reason. Smaller truck but still pulls our 7k pound boat just fine. Best of both worlds
I had the 2.8L and now 3.0L. Loved my 2.8 and now my 3.0 has been awesome. Tow my 7400lb boat and trail with no problem!
A very good video. As noted, the 2.8L Duramax is essentially a modified (and emission-controlled) version of the 2.8L CRD engine found as an option in the 2005-6 Jeep Liberty (it only was available in the U.S. for those two years, it was available overseas for much longer). The weak point of the 2.8L engines is the timing belt--they are costly to replace as essentially the entire front end of the vehicle must be removed to replace the belt. The 3.0L, as noted, is stupidly designed with the timing chain AND a belt-driven oil pump located at the rear of the engine. Another costly maintenance issue. Like all other 2007+ MY diesels, both are plagued with emission system-related issues. I own a 2005 Jeep Liberty CRD where the main emission control issue is just the EGR, which is fairly easy to maintain or eliminate. That said, I won't buy another diesel so long as the EGR/SCR/DEF/DPF emission systems are in use. Been there and done that with an HD pickup, which I have since sold. The EPA has essentially killed the diesel engine for cost-effective consumer use.
No the weak point of the 2.8L is the upper lifter rocker and timing belt
Well I worked with GM engineers at the Pontiac Powertrain Division for 5 years on one specific aspect of a V8 engine. We had a 5 million dollar grant and GM put in an additional 10 million to do the reaseach, development, and fielding of a pilot test facility. The engineers that I worked with didn’t do anything Willy Nilly as you suggest. I have a 2023 GMC SIERRA with the improved LZ0 diesel. I can assure you that the GM engineers don’t sit around on their butts just saying “oh that’s good enough”.
In all reality, dual overhead cams, or single overhead. Are really common in modern semi diesels. Cummins isx used 2, and now single, overhead cams. DD engines are dual overhead cams, Volvo D13s ect.
Best v8 ive seen was the MITSIBUSHI FUSO 8M21
Camshaft placement isnt the issue its how the cams are driven, all 3/4 ton diesels and class 8 diesel engines are gear driven (except the 5.0 cummins nissan titan but we dont talk about that) a chain driven diesel engine deeply decreases reliability, catastrophic failure isnt about if it will happen its when will it happen. And to make things worse its on the back of the engine, so all chain repairs are either engine out or cab out repairs.
@@e4die_on_ig chain driven diesel is only new to US, very common for Europe in their passenger diesels. The belt drive is just dumb. Also remember all of our light duty diesels, 2500/3500, we're medium engines shoved in light duty truck's.
Thanks for doing this, I have an '18 Canyon with the 2.8 and love it.
Summer average mpg around 27, winter is 24.
I baby it a bit, only tow a few times a year.
Trailer 1850#, CJ5 at 3400 loaded gives me 17 mpg at 60-65 mph driving up into the White Mountains, I'm very happy with it so far.
Don’t baby it. Long runs & or towing moderate loads where it gets full operating temps for awhile and it will live & live. Baby it short commute you will have emissions problems and it will die early.
Fwiw 875,000 on my tuned 3.0 Ram diesel transporting RVs commercially.
My 2022 LM2 has better fuel efficiency ratings in a full size crew cab pickup than a 2.8 Colorado diesel. Having the max tow package taking it up to 13000 lb tow rating is icing on the cake even though GM acknowledged the 3.0 was primarily developed to be an engine focused on fuel economy. The 3.0 is clearly the better engine.
You should do a video like this comparing and going over the updates vs the LM2 and LZ0. Good video.
I have the 2.8 in my ZR2 5yrs of ownership. 75K miles. One bad Injector, Def heater failed, now the head gasket is leaking. I was very impressed until the HG. I’m waiting on a 2023 Sierra AT4 3.0 I firmly believe that these trucks are great while the warranty is active. Things will become costly afterwards, as I’m experiencing this first hand.
I'm approaching 100k miles on my 18 ZR2 2.8, with one replaced NOX sensor. It has been bulletproof so far.
I have a 2005 Jeep Liberty with the VM 2.8 Diesel. Superior to the 3.6 V6 and runs and runs! Lots of torque and great fuel economy. No need for DEF, but does throw some black out if you push it unnecessarily. Thinking about 3.0 V6 in a Yukon, whenever they can get some in stock....My other car is a 2016 Range Rover with the 3.0 V6 TD6, just passed 100K miles and smooth as silk still. When I tow at capacity 7,700 # occasionally the DEF indicator comes on. If I run it above 2,000 RPM for 15 minutes it resets. Love the diesels, too bad VM ruined it for the US with their shenanigan's.
Was looking at buying one, thing was fun to test drive, but sooooo much rust.
I think you meant VW and Dieselgate.
@@spiceyfrenchtoast9421 I bought it new and has been garage kept, lucky!
@@lamarzimmermanmennonitefar5269 you are right VW diesel-gate. .
3.0 isn’t a “V”, it’s inline
I wish the 3.0 liter was also an option on the 2500. I’m just not the biggest fan of how squishy half ton suspensions feel when towing. I know I know airbags exist but it would be nice to have beefier suspension as an option from the factory.
have a 2018 colorado 2.8L, tows great for a small rig, 150K with only issue was one sensor I replaced myself
You keep saying the 3.0 is no workhorse but the new 3.0 has 305hp and 500lbs/ft of torque. That's more than the 6.6 cube for cube.
I've got a 3.0 and it pulls like a champ 7.5/10 is a great workhorse
@@robertcooper3273 i have one on order to replace my 2020 canyon denali diesel.
I can't wait to compare fuel consumption between the 2. I'm pretty sure it will be very close since the 3.0 is a lot more advanced and backed by a better transmission.
But still i love my 2.8, i like that tractor sound.
@@ProbeGT2 I average about 30 mpg in mine
The new 3.0 has nearly, and I mean almost exactly, the same horsepower and torque as my 04 LLY sierra 2500, but with 30 mpg. Crazy how things improve over time.
The engines have merit of you want a light duty camping vehicle and don't want a work truck, and want an American made "truck". Or you just can't find a Tacoma right now. A friend has a 2016 and has 140,000 trouble free mileage on it but it's used as a light work truck. The fuel economy is pretty decent too, so I think for many people they have merit. Thanks for the detailed overview of these engines, you obviously know your stuff.
the 3.0 duramax is a good engine....besides the trans removal being mandatory to service the timing components(like servicing a clutch)....other than that it's very reliable.
Dropping the trans a lot easier than tearing the whole front of the truck apart to me.
The chain is now rated at 200,000 miles.
My 2.8 duramax has 88k miles and it had a new trans installed about 30k miles ago. Can confirm, it’s not a beefy trans.
2022 3.0L Duramax 277 horsepower. 460 lb-ft of torque. 2002 Duramax 6.6L 300 horsepower and 520 lb-ft of. Bet when you add truck transmission the 3.0L could be a great towing companion for the Occasional trip.
2023 3.0 will be 305 hp and 495 ft/lb of torque.
@@edwardpate6128 In Europe everyone is towing with Diesel engines between 2L and 3L and those engines last a long time and being worked hard. You don't need 6L or more of displacement for many applications.
@@edwardpate6128 would love to get that thing as a crate engine for my RV.
You keep using the arguement that the 2.8 and 3.0 aren't "truck" engines or dont have "truck" transmissions. The 2.8 puts out damn near the same hp and torque as the 12v cummins when released and the 3.0 puts out more. The 2.8 makes peak torque at 2k rpm, the 3.0 at 1500rpm, sounds pretty truck like to me. You say the 6L50 wasn't designed to be behind a truck, last i checked transmissions cant tell what they are attached too, only how much torque is put through them. The 6L50 is well within its torque ratings for the 2.8 and has internals from the 6L90 which is found in the 6.0 gas trucks... Saying these engines aren't truck engines just because they aren't 6+ liters is just stupid. The 2.8 will out tow/haul and engine in the midsize class and get better mileage doing it.
I have a 2017 Canyon with 101,000 miles on and love it
3.0 is definitely better, actually has power to move itself. 2.8 is gutless. I currently own an AT4 3.0 with 57k miles and haven't had any issues and done plenty of towing.
Research how much itll be to replace the timing chain and oil pump drive chain. LM2 is a throw away engine.
I service my own vehicles, so the 2.8L gets my vote😉
I'm not spending extra money on more truck I don't need and then much higher maintenance cost as I wouldn't touch those dang chains🤦
Simpler is better.
The 2.8L has a conventional water pump, but the 3.0L, I believe, has coolant system that's much more complicated.
I understand the 2.8mL diesel is discontinued 2022 & the 3.0 to be discontinued 2023 I believe. Both replaced by a 2.7 L gas engine w mega turbo. The gvmt has killed small diesels w exhaust systems which fail & price of diesel up to $2 above regular gas. That said my 2.8L Duramax Colorado LT 4x4 is not a dog like a Tacoma. Handles a ton or more of river rock in the bed w/o complaint & tows up to 7k well. Does what I need. Not meant for 6.6 L heavy duty work.
3.0 isn’t discontinued and as far as I’ve seen GM has no plan to axe them yet
Thanks for the in depth look. Always curious what that 2.8 was all about. From all the years owning diesels and all things vehicles, having a solid transmission in the end usually ends up being very critical. Sounds like that old school 6L car trans with beefier truck parts still ain’t ideal… Like others have stated the emissions equip will normally get you sooner or later in the pocketbook!
That is only with the Colorado. The 1/2 tons have the new 10 speed
I’ve got the 2.8 in my Colorado and I just had a dpf replaced at 68,000 miles
Was it covered? How much does that average?
This one earnes my suscribe. Debating to up my zr2 2.8 to a zr2 3.0. Prob gonna wait
Wish the 6.6 duramax was in the van. I would buy it now.
I absolutely love my 2.8 mini max. I pull 7k RV regularly across the country. Only issue I've had is that dam 6L50 🤬That aluminum line pressure valve is cheap AF and failed. Trans go has the fix with a steel valve but have to pull the transmission to fix it. Pulled mine as soon as it started to shudder.
I have an H1 with 6.5 turbo that could uses a refresh. I'm contemplating engine swap but 6.6 requires body lift and other mods. The 3.0 LZ0 seems like I could improve power and mileage that would drop right in, as it's used for overlanding and not towing. Well maybe before gas goes to $15 a gallon.
I was thinking the same thing, I have an 08 Hummer H2 and was thinking about getting the 6.6, but I bought a 22 GMC Sierra with the 3.0 and I love it! I am now thinking about putting that in my hummer instead of the 6.6
DRAJ: "none of these engines are designed for any heavy work"
ME : Laughing while pulling 17k lbs gooseneck thru florida 🤣
Only in Florida 😄
With a 3.0???
@@v8chevy788 yup that 3.0 has some balls i did a few months of hotshot with it and pulled hard no problem but have removed it as a work truck and bought a 6.6 Duramax and the 3.0 is still being use by my wife with no problems what so ever
That's pretty far above the max tow rating for those trucks which even with Max Tow is 12,500.
In Europe and Asia everyone is towing with Diesel engines between 2L and 3L and those engines last a long time and being worked hard. You don't need 6L or more of displacement for many applications. Look at Iveco or Mitsubishi Canter in the 7.5 Ton class GCWR 25.000lbs They come with either a 3L or 4L Diesel.
The 2.8 has very good engine braking while the 3.0 does not. This is very important for towing or going up and down steep grades. Check out the results from the Ike Gauntlet towing challenge
I get what you're saying about these smaller diesel engines not meant for heavy loads. The thing is half ton trucks shouldn't be towing or hauling as much as commercials tell you they can. Once you factor in tires, suspension, tongue weight and all the other things the sales staff leave out, its a different ball game. These baby duramax motors can do as much work as any any half ton truck should be doing, and get better fuel milage doing it.
4:45 My 7.3 Powerstroke turns heads as I drive past, because it sounds like a diesel is supposed to. It doesn't need a timing belt replacement at 150,000 miles either. In fact it should go at least 400,000 before it needs any major service at all.
It also doesn't have anywhere near the power or fuel efficiency of a modern diesel.
Funny how a 3L diesel makes more power then a 7.3
new release, 2023 3.0 chain is now rated at 200,000 miles. 305 HP 495 Torque with same efficiency.
I had a 2.8 and loved it, I would kill to get a 3.0 but my LBZ is all i can afford
Check the auto yards for wrecks.
Had a 2005 Jeep Liberty with the 2.8L VM Motori 😎 I miss her
I think both of these diesel motors are very truck worthy for their use in the mid size and 1/2ton applications, GM needs to figure out how to get the 3.0 in the mid size trucks with the ten speed, I have it in the Silverado and it’s an amazing motor. As for all the emissions crap, yes it’s a pain in the a$$; but if you’re hooking up a trailer and my truck is idling, there is not one hint of diesel exhaust fumes back there, as for checking the engine oil pump belt, it was recently priced out with all new parts including the cover, book says it’s 7.5 hours of work, with a total being $1300-1500. At an interval that has now been stretched to 200K miles.
That 3.0 and 10 speed will never fit into the Canyon/Colorado platform, even the new ones coming out.
From the factory, it is not even close, mainly due to their OEM tuning. The 2.8 is clearly GM's red headed stepchild, with sloppy trans tuning that shifts late and soft. The 2.8's engine tuning is not particularly refined either, running a bit like a diesel powered agricultural implement. In contrast, the 3.0 runs turbine smooth and it's 10 speed transmission works great. For reference sake, I own a '17 Canyon with a 2.8 and a friend owns a newer Sierra with the 3.0.
The personal saving grace for my 2.8 was tuning it. Post tune it runs like it should have from the factory, this with EPA legal settings from Green Diesel Engineering. The laggy pedal response is long gone, power is up and more 3.0 like, the transmission shifts far earlier, firmer and yet smoothly, taking advantage of the 2.8's stout low end torque.
The 3.0 does not seem to need tuning, which is good as I don't believe the 3.0 ECM is accessible to tuners. The 3.0 runs perfect out of the box as one would expect from an engine that is destined to go into a lot of expensive vehicles. The 3.0 has a far better 10 speed transmission while the 2.8 makes do with the now ancient 6L50 trans, which works acceptably after tuning, but it could do with a couple more ratios to keep the 2.8 in it's 1,800-2K RPM efficient and happy place. Would love to have a ZF 8 speed hooked up to my 2.8.
Reliability wise it is still pretty early days for the 3.0. The 2.8s have had some stuck injector issues that can hole pistons. Always use fuel additive with each and every fill up on any modern diesel, especially if one is in the US, running America's generally crummy low cetane "dry" ultra low sulfur diesel fuel. Additive is not a big expense given my 2.8's thrifty 27.8 MPG overall lifetime (63K miles) fuel economy, which is remarkable for a 4x4 crew cab long box pickup truck. Don't get me wrong with my complaints about it's faults, I love my Canyon with it's 2.8. I love the big enough but not too big size of the GM twins with the torquey effortless diesel vibe. In my estimation the 2.8 is a decent power train that just needed a little owner involvement to get it to reach it's potential 😁
While common overseas a mid sizer with a diesel is unique in the US, so it is a pity the 2.8 is going away for '23. In fairness, the coming 2.7 turbo gas engine replacement, while lugging around too much truck in the full sizers, should be a sweet power train in the twins. The 2.7 won't get mid 30's MPG at 70 MPH cruise, or efficiently tow like my 2.8 does though...
My previous Canyon had the 2.8L diesel, great fuel economy, good towing my 5,000 trailer. Sadly in typical GM fashion, the 2.8L is going away 😣 I now have the 3.0L in the Sierra, wow is it smooth! with impressive fuel economy! Maybe GM will drop two cylinders off the new architecture and offer it in the midsize at a reasonable price? I’m Probably just dreaming….
If they did turn it into a 4 it wouldn’t be quite the same.
I agree , I would like a 4cyc as well, but not going to happen 🥲
Check the time of the oil pump belt on the 3.0. Problems later.
inline 6 is the king
When that 3.0 needs to have its timing chain replaced, you're pulling off the Transmission. Thats enough for me not to purchase it. If you are only leasing the Truck with the 3.0, I think you're fine, but if you are planning on keeping that truck long-term, Id put serious thought into that specific cost. I have the 2.8 duramax on my Colorado and I LOVE IT! Great all around truck.
Thank you for all the information you dogged out on these engines!
Just to help the knowledge spread. Vgt doesn't make the turbo bigger it varies the size of the a.r. which is measure of the size of the housing. Aka you can go from small exhaust housing to big balancing low end spool and high end flow . How this help. Tried to keep simple lmao
Mercedes OM617 is best. Mine's 1983 and has never been out of the car.
gm should have done a 3.3 litre mini max by cutting the 6.6 in half to make a 4 cylinder
Like Pontiac's old Trophy 4 cylinder in the early 60's Tempest?
Can you please do a vid on the R2.8 cummins?
Do you tink we going to see someting aftermarket to delete the dpf system on the 3.0 Duramax soon and if yes is this gonna make it sounds more like a true diesel truck. Thank
Really doesn’t matter now.
I have a Colorado with a 2.8 and it’s great 30+ on the hwy put a tuner on it and increased it to 36
GM has pulled the plug on the 2.8 as of July of this year. So unless your buying a used Colorado/canyon all that is left is the 3.0
I just speced out a 15pas van with the 2.8l just a few weeks past
@@lamarzimmermanmennonitefar5269 be interesting how it runs, and mileage you get. Good engine GM idiots don’t want it.
I think buying a 15pass with the diesel is a good invest, considering how in demand 15pass vans are in general. The 6.0 /4l80 seems to get 12mpg loaded. The 6.0/ 6speed is slightly better. Googleing looks like in the 30s for a stock 2.8l. Probably better deleted.
Is the 3.0 taking place of the 2.8 in all applications?
Nope, No diesel option for the Colorado/canyon anymore.@@lamarzimmermanmennonitefar5269
Can you do a video on the LM2 vs the LZO 3.0L next?
will u make a video about the new 3.0l lzo please? love ur vids👍
Cant wait til my warranty is up on mu 2.8 then i'll tune and mod it for reliability and moooaaarrr power
I can go to the 3.0 Duramax.
I Love my 3.0 Duramax!
FIAT Engineered in Turin Italy
I like a good 6.6 but I can get 20 mpg all day long with my 6.5 loaded or not. I guess I'm not ready to update. And they make 1500s with 6.5s and they get 25mpg+
If I was going to swap one into a Jeep TJ it would be the 2.8. I'd like to see a review of the Cummins R2.8 crate engine. I looked hard at doing a swap into my jeep then I heard some mixed reviews on quality.
if you want to know about the cummins R2.8 engine in general look for "foton tunland" that is a chinese midsize with the R2.8 equipped right from the factory since quite some time ago
Doesnt the 3.0 use the Bosch CP4 high pressure fuel pump. If not I am buying one!
33.8 mpg is my best in my 22 lm2
33 even for me.
So I'm a little confused. How is the 6.6 going millions of miles? My 15l semi will only go about 1 and a quarter before an inframe and it has wet sleeves... or are the grandiose statements more for the drama of things?
Because a duramax isn’t under the stress that your semi goes thru
@@BigDaddy-jk6yt I just rebuilt one at 238k.. old man owned. Can't say I ever seen a durmax with those miles, have seen a clapped out 7.3 go that far.
I love the 3.0 duramax engine.
In 2001 did Isuzu partnered with the 6.6 Duramax V8 engines
What about the oil pump belt !?!?!
2024 Silverado zr2 announced with the 3.0 dmax as an option. I can't wait to throw a 90k truck off the mountains of western Colorado.
If it had been available with a manual transmission it would have been more compelling to its intended consumer.
Shoot I thought that they'd kept with Isuzu like a modified 4HK1 or something similar.
I wish my 2.8 had a 10 speed transmission
What about the oil pump belt that has a 165K miles service life
They keep bumping the mileage later and later
Started at 150K and now raised to 200K based on long term test fleet evaluations.
I heard 150 bumped up to 165 so far
2.4 liter would have been a better size for the 4-cylinder, .2 liter is much difference from the 3.0 six. The reason for a diesel is efficiency. 2.4 with a nice size turbo would be great.
"For those who did not 3/4 ton or bigger and wanted a Diesel"
So in other words.. They want a truck without the biggest benefit of going Diesel with all the downsides of going Diesel over gasoline, got it.
Meanwhile 5.9C goes a million miles without major work, 7.3 PSD can do it too. 6.7 PSD even bogged down by all the emissions BS does great. 6.6 has been rock solid too. But what they all bring to the table is torque, reliability, and mpg under load.
So what you end up with is a 1/2 that is more complex than the bigger Diesels, and with less power and have all the EPA emissions BS all over it to boot killing reliability further. Also nice oil pump belt at the back of it, $1500 waiting to happen fix for a rubber belt because the transmission has to be pulled back to access it. Active thermal management is a problem waiting to happen as well.
Diesels are already very expensive to fix, why would one want the downsides of that while adding on more complex features. The reason why it's okay on the bigger engines is unparalleled towing performance and MPG under heavy use. Just buy a 6.2L at that point. It's about 5 MPG difference overall but more HP, cheaper fuel, and cheaper repairs. 5MPG sounds great until you realize gas is on average $1.20 less per gallon.
I agree with everything you said except cheaper gas for the 6.2. That’s a “premium only” motor, and everyplace I’ve seen, that’s more than diesel…..and they still don’t have the torque the smaller diesels have, which is what you want when towing.
@@ss0073 That's true about the gas i guess, however 6.2 will not knock at 87, just less power. The ECU adjusts timing accordingly. As far as peak tq is concerned, the 6.2 only pulls 10 ft.lbs less. The timing adjust (it retards it) is not magic but it will allow the truck to burn it without knocking itself into oblivion. From what I've seen 89 seems to net the best results. Looking outside my window right now 91 is $4.8 whereas Diesel is $5.4, where you live makes a huge difference. So it's a tossup if 91 is cheaper than a full tank of Diesel overall at that point.
No one in their right mind would buy a 1/2 ton work truck that could not burn 87. It's a light work vehicle not a sports car. 6.2's can even run E85 if you really wanted to just be prepared for much lower MPG :D
3.0 will hit the majority of its curve by 1500 rpm (It should it's a Diesel) the 6.2 does it around 4k. That's its advantage over the 6.2.
The TQ numbers are 450 and 460 respectively.
How reliable is 3.0 power stoke ?
Does anyone know the difference in size of piston? Can not find 2.8 pistons ?
you have to use best motor oil what you can get with Dura motors
In Europe they offered the Wrangler with the 2.8 diesel which seems to be the same as the duramax/vm motori 2.8. Almost all Wranglers i ser on the road has this diesel and it really sounds like some type of agricultural equipment. Very harsh knackering sound.
You referring to the wranglers with the 3 liter ecodiesel?
@@TheIamdevin no it seems they didnt offer the diesel Wrangler in the usa before they introduced the 3.0 V6. In Europe they had a 2.8 diesel version from maybe 2008 or so (only guessing the year)
Is this the same engine they use in everything in thailand?
Isuzu 4jj1?
Yes, same engine on ASEAN's Colorado and Trailblazer.
And Brazil
2.8 "duramax" was really stolen from the Jeep Liberty in 2006 lol. Pretty good engine, really.
That's a Mercedes, not an Isuzu
@@spiceyfrenchtoast9421 That Jeep diesel is neither a Mercedes or an Isuzu engine. It's VM Motori which is Italian... not German or Japanese.
2.8 is dead in the USA for 2023
@@phileasler5401 all diesels are going to be dead here soon if the EPA keeps it up :(
Any diesel with a throttle body isn’t something you want to touch. Diesel injection systems are complex enough without all the extra emissions crap. Just buy a gasser at that point. They’re even making it to where large displacement gas engines are looking better than diesels just because of all the crap a diesel has to have to meet emissions now.
Great content bro.
Garett is Honeywell. Just FYI
I'd buy a Duramax 2.8 litre or a 3.0 litre diesel engine. I've seen YT videos criticizing how poorly built the Duramax engine is, but I have to disagree. I see nothing inherently wrong with the engine itself. Like many engines, it needs maintenance and service. I'm sure even the D-max 6.6 litre V8 needed maintenance if it had any chance of lasting a long time. So the Duramax 2.8 litre and 3.0 litre diesel is no different.
I love my 2.8
Can you get the 3.0 in Colorado ?
No, only a gas 2.7 for 2023
Neither because having a diesel in a half ton truck is already a paradox in and of itself! Then with cost of maintenance plus cost of fuel its not worth it!
They should have looked at a DD5-derived engine.