Done 12,000Ks of NZ bush tracks on my 2019 TREK bosch POWERFLY FS-5 , and the only work needed > replaced tyres, chains sprokets & brake-pads. Im not a materialistic consumer but.... this is the best fun & reliable product this 50yr old (lower stamina chemo recovery) man has ever owned.
Nice job mate & well done on the recovery. Look into a vitamin called K2mk7. You take it with vit D. It will boost your energy & immune system. Im a 49-year bloke & have been supplementing it for 5 years. Game changer. Good luck mate.
Sounds like long time fun what's the specs on the motor and battery my cup of tea is a 52 volt battery with a 1000 w Bafang BBSHD mounted on one's favorite bicycle. Under $1,000 for the kit battery and mid drive motor. And you sir?🎯
I have a Giant explore GTS e+4 e-bike. Had it for nearly 2 years & have done just over 11000 miles. Sync-drive sport motor. 75 nm of torque. 400W battery. I can honestly say I have NEVER had a single issue with it. (battery, motor, controller, wiring) I have hammered this bike & ride it in all conditions. I have had the bike serviced multiple times & replaced wheels, tyres, chains, cassettes, brakes etc but the motor is bulletproof. I live in Lancashire where it rains nonstop for half of the year. The reliability of the bike & its electronic components has been world-class. Say what you want about the range. I get around 60 miles max if I'm careful. Trust me 60 miles on a bike & you are done in for the day. I can only go off my own bike. I wouldn't opt for another brand. Giant are so well made. I know my bike is not a mountain bike it's a hybrid but I take it on some decent gravel trails.
Good to hear just bought a Giant fatom e+3 29er 80nm 400batteri..........so bought a good motor.Girl that had IT they Sade so ONLY gone 30 miles when a bought IT 2020 modell Tires was brand AS knew so that must be true,she sold beacouse IT was never used👍👍👍👍
Glad you asked! Bought emtb in 2019 april with shimano e8000, lasted 1500 mi.. That's when I discovered the actual bike maker pretty much tosses you to the dustbin for motor warranty. Shimano said replacement in summer of 2022, haha really makes me a fan. Bike mfg did step up and take a motor off a new bike and sent to my bike shop for replacement. 2500mi. later that motor went south and only replacement was a shimano e7000. Still waiting for warranty satisfaction and I cannot believe shimano is going to make any more e8000. Shopping for a bike with Bosch motor. Shimano is dead to me.
i have the Giant E1. it's an all around fantastic bike. the lowest setting and highest are useless, so it's all the middle 3. setting 2 is perfect most the time an very easy to control, very natural. no wheelspin.
Great video, thanks. I had a Focus Jam2 running Bosch CX4 which is a fantastic motor, the Jam2 itself was a good sturdy bike, but not very nimble. After 5500km on the Jam2, I recently upgraded to a Levo Expert with the Brose TCU. I did notice that the power delivery of the Brose was not as punchy as the Bosch, but not enough to cause any issues and as I have gotten used to it, now the motor feels really good as well. I would definitely recommend the Bosch to someone, but the main issues are the choice of controllers. I had the Purion controller, which was very basic and did not offer lots features. If I were to get another bike with the Bosch, I would choose this controller again or downgrade to it. The amount of handlebar space taken up by the newer Bosch controller and the screen with the wiring, don't seem very well thought out for an off road mountain bike. As for the Brose motor, a great system also and am very happy with it, but lot more expensive.
Did you have any reason to complain about the smaller wheel at the rear on your bike? I'd like to switch to the Brose system too, mainly because of the Speed Box, but I'm very wary of the 27.5. 4:11
@@AndyMialkowski-ct9szThe Jam2 was 27.5 front and rear, the Levo is a mullet. Having 27.5 on the rear is no trouble at all. I've done over 4000km in mountainous gnarly trail riding on the Levo. I don't go for drops, but love speed. All in all, a great bike and thumbs up for the mullet setup.
It’s nice to see someone giving the Shimano some love but I do wonder if it is deserved. My EP8 stopped working randomly after 850km. Some software error and they couldn’t fix it so they had to replace the motor. The new one is still going strong with about 800km on the clock but it’s a bit of a worry. Hopefully the 1st one was just an early unit and the 2nd one was a revised unit that’ll be more reliable. Also my range isn’t anything to brag about but then again I weigh 100+kg and my bike is a super enduro Commencal Meta Power SX Race with 180/165mm travel and weighs over 25kg so I suppose my range is always going to suffer.
Of the seven friends I ride with who have e-bikes four have Bosch motors, two Shimano and one Brose. The oldest (20/21), and hardest ridden, bikes are Bosch. The newest are Shimano. Of the two Shimano bikes one (MegaWatt) has had a new motor (fewer than 600 miles) the other (Heckler) is having one fitted today (fewer than 500 miles!) The other bikes have, touch wood, required nothing by way of repair or replacement. We’re not The Wild Bunch, either, just middle-aged blokes scudding about the Surrey Hills.
My EP8 equipped Commencal Meta Power SX Race needed a new motor at 850km because of a software error that bricked it. It was covered under warranty but still not a good sign. The new motor has about 800km on it now and it’s going sweet so far. Fingers crossed.
I went with the bike from the video - Giant Reign E+1 with Yamaha pwx3. I am quite happy, my friend had RM Dyname 3.0 and the new yamaha felt stronger. But the engine wasn ´t the only think why I went with Reign. Battery percentage is in the app (I just check it once when I am back home), I like display integration, conectivity, and mainly, the geometry. Reign has nice headtube angle and it ´s not so conservative. Overall, all the bikes in the test are nice machines, we are comparing best of the best....
Great review but I would have to strongly disagree with you on the range on the ep8. I have tested everything as well abs the ep8 is seriously lacking on range and confirmed by many of my subscribers and friends. Also nothing mentioned on the rattle from the ep8 and bosch? Anyway good work
I'm surprised on the love shown towards the EP8. I have 1800 miles on my ep8(SC bullit). The first motor died at 520 miles. I came from a Egenius with the 625wh Bosch motor. The first few days with the ep8 were horrible, I loved the new bike but hated the motor. I weight 135lbs and was averaging 17-22miles with 3500-4300ft of elevation gain. The bosch on mulitple occasions gave me 19-26miles with 4500-4900ft of elevation. Both had DH casings, and the Egenius was about 5lbs heavier. The ep8 tappers off so bad after 14mph, that little yellow power indicator is just frustrating!, I WANT FULL POWER, and it just spits little power surges at me. I bought a levo yesterday after riding my buddies, excited to see how much elevation I can get... One other thing to consider, yes the ep8 is on more bikes, but the warranty, when i blew mine up, was a 6-month wait... So have fun with that. Specialized may have a crapy track record, but their warranty turnaround is much quicker.
I have two Shimano EP8 pedal assist motors and still no issues, Shimano EP8 has good characteristics at lower cadences, but for me the best feeling pedal assist motor is Spesh Brose
Strange how different people feel about these motors. I have had three eMTB. First was a Husqvarna HC6 with EP8 and then a Sepc Kenevo with Brose and now an Orbea Rise with EP8rs. To be fair the Brose was the strongest and fastest, but I prefer the control of the EP8. So my choice is EP8! (No experience of Yam or Borsch).
Been researching a lot and tried the Bosch and I think it's the choice. Got an EP8 currently. Shimano has shit battery life unlike said in this review. Best on eco but worst on turbo. I think someone measured it 1100m for EP8 on about 720Wh battery and 1400+m for Bosch, Brose and Sync on turbo.
My experience with Bosch performance ebike motor gen 2 over 7 years and now my e bike R&M Delite Bosch performance gen 4 ,very happy with my Bosch motor and ebike.
The very best Emtb is the one that is the most Reliable and the Quietest. Silence is golden. The latest Bosch is definitely the best option at the moment but what did Brose know in 2018 with the silent, powerful 90nm aluminium 1.3 motor that they all don't know now. Downhill the Shimano and Bosch rattle like 3 loose bricks in a steel box trailer on a corrugated dirt road and they all now sound to various degrees like a coffee grinder under power. Seriously if Specialized revamped the 2018 1.3 aluminium brose motors with upgrades ie : X ring crank water resistance sealing, latest belt, sprag bearing and firmware their reliability nightmare could be resolved and they would have the best, powerful , quietest, smoothest, most natural feeling Emtb ever. Rember the "it's you but younger ,faster and more fun, fun ,fun" Emtbs are a Time Machine. BUT WHAT WOULD I KNOW.🤔🤫🤪🤞 E=Mtb²
@@timeforabeer6338 2 weeks ago I bought another Emtb a quiet, light,flickable Trek Fuel EXe. Very impressive and is actually a mtb and a Emtb. Rides really well with motor off. 👌 9.7 model with Shimano gears and Fox suspension 19kg 👍.$11k Australian. E=Mtb²
Hey, on the Specialized, you didn't appear to try adjusting motor assist in those 10% increments - which could have given more support at lower or higher end of peddling Cadence. Wouldn't that change the motors performance in your view??? Also, can't the EP8 do the same, using the App?
Perhaps the most important aspects should be aftersafter sales support and reliability. I am just switching from Giant to Santa Cruz after only eight months due to shocking delays on replacing the Yamaha motor u der warranty due to “undiagnosed internal motor fault” it doesn’t matter how efficient or powerful the motor is if when it fails the “couldn’t care less” attitude of local bike shop and manufacturer means you can’t ride it for 3 months while waiting for repairs!!Great to hear the EP8 is your top choice - can’t wait to get it
I went from e8000 to ep8 and expected the clunking to be just something the journalists complained about to make themselves feel relevant. However it was very noticeable and even a bit off putting. But after about 300km of riding it pretty much disappeared. I guess the clutch system wears in or whatever.
Very surprised at the good review of the EP8. I went with a Gen3 Specialized Turbo Levo and love both the buttery smooth nature of the motor and the long battery life. I admit that I am a Brose fanboy from my experience riding the bike. I would consider a Bosch motor also.
The Yamaha PW-X3. Plenty of torque to get ya uphill, and the motor does not rapidly drain the battery. Works efficiently in freezing-temps, and humidity(and a-lot of motors tend to fail in humidity-prone areas. And where is the Dyname 4.0 motor? Shimano & Bosch have a real-world threat with Dyname 4.0. Highly improved over the 3.0 version. As a sufferer of sciatica, e-bikes are a necessity for me. Brose, as quiet as-it-is, suffers from needing constant(and expensive) maintenance. The Bosch motor, does poorly in wet/freezing temps. The EP-8 motor, of which many reviewers scorn the most microscopic flaws, is very reliable in Northeast wet weather, and eight-months with a after-market battery, still gets me home on a daily twenty-five mile work commute(gotta have a job to afford e-bikes). The PW-X3, puts all-to-shame. Yamaha, has options that Bosch & Brose, do not have. Yamaha, listened to consumers about the PW-X2, and refined the motor. For pure power(and pure battery drainage), get the Dyname 4.0. The best selling motor, will be the company that allows the pedals, to charge the batttery, as you're riding, without adding noticeable weight.
Bosch cx is my favorite For all around performance but the Sachs rs with 112 nm is the champ on hills . i have both and have compared the two motors on the same hill and the sachs destroyed the Bosch
The group of 8 I ride with do this test a few times a week. We have all these motors, plus a Rocky Mountain Dyname 4.0. When everyone rode a EP8/ Ep801 powered bike it was just up to rider effort, but when someone, like my 12 yr old grandson, gets a 5 yr old Brose 2.1 Levo for his birthday, and rides with the 2024 Shimano powered bikes, it really exposes just how underpowered and over rated the EP8/801 bikes are. They are way down on power in the low cadence on steep climbs, and they cut off abruptly on top and get real hard to pedal, there's just nothing to love about them compared to the others. The Yamaha bikes are torquey and great climbers, The Bosch are great as well, but when it comes to raw hill climb speed and power, nothing can touch the Dyname 4.0. If you can pedal above 80 rpm you get to pass any other rider, no matter how strong they are. The Dyname needs rpm, it is a bit soft at low cadence, but not Shimano soft. The Brose makes great power, especially at ridiculous low cadence, and allows new riders to cruise along and pull away, while their EP801 powered former BMX champion dads are getting dropped while pedaling hard two or three gears lower. The Yamaha bikes are similar, and great hill climbers. The Bosch CX Race is best for a wide powerband, and if I could find one in a bike with supple long travel that would be my choice. I made the mistake of buying a Canyon Torque On with an EP8, I love the bike, nothing rides better and is as much fun going downhill fast, like 30mph fast. but that whimpy EP8 is a real handicap up hill, so I bought a Rocky Mtn. W/ Dyname 4.0, not quite as smooth suspension wise, but power to spare, and my grandson with his 5 year old Levo is not leaving me the when the hill gets steep and long the way he does on my Shimano bike. There is no reason to ride a Shimano unless you ride alone, are not the least bit competitive, like pushing your bike up rocky technical hills while a kid pedals right up, or just ride groomed trails with gentle elevation changes. Shimano have the most bikes using their motors, but that just means they have the greatest number of slow bikes. Sure Ryan won some power stages on his Ep801, but not one you or I can buy. That was a FACTORY Blueprinted and modded motor.
Testing the effectiveness of motors in eco mode doesn't look right, as it basically shows which motor spends less power in the lightest mode. It is like the motor which doesn't support you at all has infinite effectiveness as it doesn't spend energy.
Noise comments climbing and descending should have been detailed and maybe time now for a warranty issue review from subscribers by brand, but otherwise nice review. Although am surprised with the recommendation of Shimano!
Hi...where was the descending review of each bike?...the clunk / rattle comparision is quite important when reviewing an e bike..can be a deal breaker on some bikes.
I managed to climb The Tourmalet on a single charge after traveling10 miles to get there on on my giant ebike with Yamaha motor and 625 watt battery and I’m 110 kgs, plus getting on a bit . Thank the Lord , just made it to the top as battery battery was about to die! Think the climb is over 6000 feet.
My findings are the exact opposite, I have a 22 reign e+ with 625watt and the range is impressive as is the motor. My other bike is a 504w Merida with shimano motor and I'm on the waiting list for a new motor like most shimano ebike owners, I barely gets half the range as the pwx3 and the Yamaha feels way better. There are so many variables with these sort of tests and other motors test have produced opposite results with shimano the least efficient and yamaha/boshe best in test..
My January 2023 Giant Fastroad E+ Pro has had none of the so called problems mentioned here.567 miles of average 18+ mph & 37 miles consistently @ 5'8" 135 lbs. 62 years old.80 Newton's of torque.Row those 10 gears like the old pro that I am & just fly!
Using a Bosch gen 3 CX and am satisfied with the performance. My biggest gripe is batteries are not interchangeable. I have the 500 wh and cannot upgrade to the newer 630 and up. Bosch politics SUCK!
I thought it was the EP8 that drained the battery faster compared to the Bosch! Anyways, I am probably going with the new Moterra LT and the Bosch with 750wh battery or as a second choice, would be the Fantic XEF 1.9 Enduro 190mm of travel and the Brose motor with 720wh. I would go with a Shimano equipped bike only if the battery was at least 720wh!
@@chuckduck u just got to know how to use it, he explains it, it’s great at lower cadences, it probably does have the weakest programming out of the bunch though, which I think Shimano is working on
By far the best package is Specialized with Brose, which has unique unlimited customization options. The Brose engine has a unique soft feel on the pedals due to the belt. They are always two steps ahead of everyone and have no competition for the next 3 years.
Are they reliable? I had bafang and it died like 3times after only 200kms, 2times sensor fucked up and once something in the motor i think it were the gears, then i have bosch 800kms and everything fine.
What i'd like to know is more details about the construction of the motor itself.. meaning gears inside, material is it nylon , delrin, aluminum , stainless ???? how durable and what are the driving gears made of on them ? Nice take on how the bikes and motors feel but reliability and durability will be MOST important to me considering the replacement cost involved. Don't want to be shelling out big money every few years when if or when they die after warranty if the nylon gears wear. OR will it be serviceable, just replace the bad gears and good to go ?? All questions that are important I would think. Nice video. Would love to see a follow-up on " durabilty expectations ".
@Google Account Thanks good to know! I'd like to see them do a long term teardown on these. And inspect the gears. I'm sure some will turn out in better shape than others. Im not a fan of nylon gears though.
Rocky Mountain's Dyname 4.0 seems to consistently come out as the winner in comparisons that include it; unfortunately, like this review, it's often excluded from the mix. I assume because RM is a smaller company making their own motor platform...but I have to say, in my experience, they do have the best motor/interface. The power and organic engagement of that power is unmatched.
But how do they feel when you reach the speed limit? Which feels the easiest to pedal when they’re turned off or past that speed limit? Also everything else I’ve seen says the shimano isn’t that great. From the comments it seems to Yamaha is the most reliable.
The lack of yet another item to break off on handlebars is a deal breaker. SPECIALIZED and GIANT have the right idea for aggressive Enduro riders simply in top tube? Low end torque is more useful for climbing technical.... otherwise great for all riders on green and blue flows trails. I would never attach my expensive smartphone unless I'm riding on street lol. Another useless gadget from my perspective. Not much said about Giant Yamaha... again possibly a little biased like overrated Maxxis? (Torn a DD rear.... never a Mazza or Specialuzed lol).... not enough time on Giants E Reign? An entertaining review nonetheless, thanks for devoting the time though. Yes I am at home 3 weeks post bimalleolal ankle fracture surgery (not on trail but on way to work; my fault) so Enduro style freeride Emtb intrigues me to assist somehow in the near future; but with so much mixed reviews it's really down to renting and testing oneself lol Like I said entertaining
This question should be, which motor lasts the longest. The Brose is very good but on my 4th motor. The down time i have had is very annoying and it looks like i am on the way too my 5th as it is getting noisy.
so you do all sorts of tests and then your main criteria for choosing the best motor is how many bikes use them! That test is for the most widely available ebike motor
Shimano systems always get fault codes never again for me. Once the warranty runs out it’s just a matter of time until your buying a new one for 1k . Put me off emtbs. They need to be repairable.
In my opinion The EP8 is a long way behind the other motors, feels like less power and the range just isn’t there on the EP8, the Bosch Is better in every area..
Does anyone else have problems with motor overheating. I heared this is common issue with new syncdrive pro motor and you can find a lot off sad owners on the internet. I have giant reign e+2 2022 and I weight 77 kg and have problems with overheating and motor automaticly shift down modes from 5 to 4 or 3. Outside temp was only 20 deg celcius. Thanks for honest comments. I hope anyone has a solution for this issue.
As a owner of a very expensive Specialized Turbo levo S work ( 15’000 euros ) it’s really hard to live with In 4 months time it’s been on repair 7 times and now I am waiting since 10 days. When I ride all suddenly all shut off and erreur message saying no batterie check app mesafe showing. I stop turn off and on so I can maybe ride again 15 mins and it’s stars again Sooooo annoying for an expensive bike like that
Once again no mention at all of longevity of the motors. Can they be repaired when a part wears out after warranty? It seems all motors are designed to work without problems if u're lucky for max 10000 to 15000 km. When used on an mtb in allweather even less. Sealings, bearings, internal chainwheels all not up to their task. This is unacceptable. Shimano is the worst. No parts available, no repair possible. E-bikes eco friendly? Bike press critical???? Having to treat a very expensive motor like a worn out chainwheel, cassette or chain is unacceptable. Just like the fact u cannot even change yourself the wheeldiameter and other things when switching wheels, tyres, chainwheels, cassettes etc. On the other hand I like the EP8when spinning battery friendly in eco mode or trail. I hate the degressive indication of battery power left. And that in the last 20% the battery is really unpredictable. I also like the fact shimano allows to adapt the motor settings, but not as mucjh as i would like and not while riding. We use the motor on a tandem. For climbing it's a problem the smallest shimano chainwheel is a 34. I wonder if people do really 200m altimeter climbs on a 34-46. 51 sucks even more(no bacckpedaling, chainline that hurts your ears and eats aluminum parts of the cassette.
I had a Giant with Yamaha, a BH with brose a canyon with shimano and now I have 2 bikes with Bosch - a Moustache and a Scott which I love to use in TOUR+ mode. The other motor which i liked from the previous bikes was, weirdly enough, the yamaha. The least pleasure i had using the shimano. It felt the weakest by quite a lot and it was much less effiicient than any other motor...
Ok, lets ignore the Bafang Ultra, again. Thing is these feeble Euro spec hobbled, over priced, under powered motors also allow the bike makers to equip small batteries and include an enormous mark up on the price. If the Ultra motor was included there would be no contest. Bafang 620 Ultra will run indefinitely at 160nm and 1500w., also less pricey. Put that in your pipe and smoke it!
I would like to see it compared, but I have a 2022 Rail with the Bosch Performance Line and it’s smooth, quiet, and throws me up climbs with almost zero effort. I’m 250 lbs. I’ve never found myself wishing I had more. After seeing how impressive it is I don’t think I’d want even more torque on my drivetrain components. Maybe I don’t know what I’m missing though.
The Bafang does not overheat on difficult extended climbs. It cost less, it has a throttle, it can go almost 40mph, way more fun then the Bosch I used to have.
do not buy the shimano motors they have anti tamper sensors in them and will be software locked if you open them up to change a 5 quid bearing. the best motors for spares is yamaha as dont use can bus so the controllers can be bought and the metal gears if needed just not the giant ones as they use can bus with the yamaha motors.
Yamaha blows away Bosch and Brose for reliability every time. Sell and service many brands carrying these 3 motors. Yamaha's never come back to the shop. Bosch and Brose can't keep out of the shop. No matter the model and brand of ebike, the Yamaha just always has more power and more reliability and zero issues. I am amazed how many people get duped into buying brands with Bosch or Brose motors on them. Such a marketing scam those two have going, persuading all these big name brands into putting their garbage on to their ebikes. Of course Yamaha wont give away their controls which is part of the secret sauce, and the ebike manufacturers are too stupid to build out their own.
Just like Maxxis tires lol. ( There are so many superior and better priced options...Mazza, Onza, WTB, Michelin) Yeah I also have a 21 Giant Trance X0 mullet ...Magura and DVO and XD mix upgrades. Super balance. All round great for Yamaha. Remember the more hyped the less sold?
Thanks for commenting !! Which bike carries Yamaha motors that you like the best? I was just about to buy either the specialized turbo comp carbon or the Santa Cruz heckler which has the ep8, But I'm now pausing hearing about all the maintenance issues for both motors. Always less interested in getting a giant bike. I live in California by the way Does Yamaha make their own bikes? I'm not sure what you were referring to. At any rate which bike carrying the Yamaha system do you like the best and which has the best controls also?
You Brits (I was born in Leeds) need to come get a taste of M620 Bafang in North America. 52V 1000 watts 160 ft lbs of torque. If that's not enough we can spice it up(Watt Wagaons) to 2000. Check out Biktrix Juggernaut Ultra. The thing needs two chains. It's like the goddamn wild west over here.
I just peddled 2.8 miles and 2.8 miles back as a test. it convicned me, i want an ebike whith a whole lot of torque to go up the hills and to naver have to peddle at all again. it's rough. if n ebike motor can't get you up a hill all by its own, which is where you need it and want it, there is no reason to have one. you might as well walk. all the rest of the way you can peddle assist on flat or coast down hislls, but where you need that motor is going up hills al the way on power. I wouldn't buy any system that you can't build your own batteries for out of Li-ion 27000 cells. That's like an up front given. Yes, it's extremely involved and time consuming and even a bit dangerous and I don't recommend it, however it's a must given for me as I've already done it for quadcopters.
Which needs insurance, road tax, mot, petrol. If not road legal need tow bar, trailer. Need room to store stuff. Noisy, smelly and even heavier. Much more limited where you can use it. Ruins trails. Less agile. Annoys everyone. Na think I’ll stick with my ebike!
@@craponlycomesoutadogsarse1731 Ruins trails? Dirt bikes are ridden on dirt bike trails! Annoys everyone? Again, they are dirt bike trails, who are they going to annoy, other dirt bikers?
@@kevinhollenbeck7503 fair play but I stay in Scotland and with our access laws I can pretty much ebike anywhere I like but the same can’t be said for a motorbike. (which you also need a license for, which I don’t have if you want to use it on the road)
After reading the text article then watching this video I can't believe you followed the exact wording like a script but completely ignored the noise section - arguably the section that benefits most from a video over written format. Take an L
These are pedal assisted bicycles, not mopeds. In most countries I know of there's a max limit of 250w and no throttles. Where I'm from the limit is 250w & 25km/h assist for the bike to still be considered a "bicycle". Anything above that needs to be registered as a moped (50cc petrol engine, 45km/h vmax. Mopeds need to be registered, have insurance and you need a moped drivers licence (complete a written and driving test) to drive it. Also you can't ride them on mtb trails and bikepaths/lanes. Not arguing, just something to consider. I would love a high spec powerful mid-drive with a throttle, but pedelecs are just easier.
Dude, Have you driven a stick shift? I guess you did not. What we need is the full control of the motor. SyncDrive is the best in this category, albeit still lacking a lot. All those automated modes are just junk. As a rider you will always know better than software which makes assumptions what you need. All those motor reviews don't address in detail motor control abilities, to me your review is pretty useless. You did not address second most important factor - control and third most important factor - battery status. I have been riding eMTB for over 4 years so I know a thing or two. And I still can't find an ebike worthy upgrade from SyncDrive 2018.
But the bikes still can't ride up the hill on their own so you don't have to push it before riding it downhill... ...watch this space! (follow me mode)
Junk review, you might as well have used step through bikes for your review since these motors are for those considering how far into the e-bike popularity we are now. We'd be better served by having the newcomers (bike builders) using a wider selection of motor options to know their performance and durability.
I have Giant liv vall e plus2 2018 Yamaha sport 80nm Im very happu about power i working uber eats 2 years never problem jist one time i chaning bearings still looks good Giant is Amaizng
What's your favourite electric mountain bike motor? Let us know in the comments! 👇
Me.
legs....
I agree the Bosch feels the most powerful but the controller is so bulky and ugly. I like the slim minimalist Shimano controls.
The Bafang BBSHD. Quite astounding compared to these units.
Rocky Mountain Dyname.
Done 12,000Ks of NZ bush tracks on my 2019 TREK bosch POWERFLY FS-5 , and the only work needed > replaced tyres, chains sprokets & brake-pads. Im not a materialistic consumer but.... this is the best fun & reliable product this 50yr old (lower stamina chemo recovery) man has ever owned.
Nice job mate & well done on the recovery. Look into a vitamin called K2mk7. You take it with vit D. It will boost your energy & immune system. Im a 49-year bloke & have been supplementing it for 5 years. Game changer. Good luck mate.
That sounds great, enjoy!
Sounds like long time fun what's the specs on the motor and battery my cup of tea is a 52 volt battery with a 1000 w Bafang BBSHD mounted on one's favorite bicycle. Under $1,000 for the kit battery and mid drive motor. And you sir?🎯
Hope you're doing well!
I have a Giant explore GTS e+4 e-bike. Had it for nearly 2 years & have done just over 11000 miles. Sync-drive sport motor. 75 nm of torque. 400W battery. I can honestly say I have NEVER had a single issue with it. (battery, motor, controller, wiring) I have hammered this bike & ride it in all conditions. I have had the bike serviced multiple times & replaced wheels, tyres, chains, cassettes, brakes etc but the motor is bulletproof. I live in Lancashire where it rains nonstop for half of the year. The reliability of the bike & its electronic components has been world-class. Say what you want about the range. I get around 60 miles max if I'm careful. Trust me 60 miles on a bike & you are done in for the day. I can only go off my own bike. I wouldn't opt for another brand. Giant are so well made. I know my bike is not a mountain bike it's a hybrid but I take it on some decent gravel trails.
Yamaha is Bullet Proof
I have a Yamaha Pw in a Haibike sduro rx, 17.000 Km, tuned. Allwas riddin hard. NO Problem.
Good to hear just bought a Giant fatom e+3 29er 80nm 400batteri..........so bought a good motor.Girl that had IT they Sade so ONLY gone 30 miles when a bought IT 2020 modell Tires was brand AS knew so that must be true,she sold beacouse IT was never used👍👍👍👍
@@gooldii1 Blue colar coool Bike ,not that thing in the midle but on the front wheel yes
Bosch cx gen 4...... FTW!
Absolut amazing.
Modulation is outstanding!!
Glad you asked! Bought emtb in 2019 april with shimano e8000, lasted 1500 mi.. That's when I discovered the actual bike maker pretty much tosses you to the dustbin for motor warranty. Shimano said replacement in summer of 2022, haha really makes me a fan. Bike mfg did step up and take a motor off a new bike and sent to my bike shop for replacement. 2500mi. later that motor went south and only replacement was a shimano e7000. Still waiting for warranty satisfaction and I cannot believe shimano is going to make any more e8000. Shopping for a bike with
Bosch motor. Shimano is dead to me.
Spezialiced‘s Brose in conjunction with BLEvo is unbeatable!
I'm curious as to which motor is the quietest? Great video
i have the Giant E1. it's an all around fantastic bike. the lowest setting and highest are useless, so it's all the middle 3. setting 2 is perfect most the time an very easy to control, very natural. no wheelspin.
I have to disagree the modes are just like gears depending on rider one may find them self's using them differently or not using some.
Great video, thanks. I had a Focus Jam2 running Bosch CX4 which is a fantastic motor, the Jam2 itself was a good sturdy bike, but not very nimble. After 5500km on the Jam2, I recently upgraded to a Levo Expert with the Brose TCU. I did notice that the power delivery of the Brose was not as punchy as the Bosch, but not enough to cause any issues and as I have gotten used to it, now the motor feels really good as well. I would definitely recommend the Bosch to someone, but the main issues are the choice of controllers. I had the Purion controller, which was very basic and did not offer lots features. If I were to get another bike with the Bosch, I would choose this controller again or downgrade to it. The amount of handlebar space taken up by the newer Bosch controller and the screen with the wiring, don't seem very well thought out for an off road mountain bike. As for the Brose motor, a great system also and am very happy with it, but lot more expensive.
Did you have any reason to complain about the smaller wheel at the rear on your bike?
I'd like to switch to the Brose system too, mainly because of the Speed Box, but I'm very wary of the 27.5. 4:11
@@AndyMialkowski-ct9szThe Jam2 was 27.5 front and rear, the Levo is a mullet. Having 27.5 on the rear is no trouble at all. I've done over 4000km in mountainous gnarly trail riding on the Levo. I don't go for drops, but love speed. All in all, a great bike and thumbs up for the mullet setup.
Thank you for your reply. I have to try 😂
It’s nice to see someone giving the Shimano some love but I do wonder if it is deserved. My EP8 stopped working randomly after 850km. Some software error and they couldn’t fix it so they had to replace the motor. The new one is still going strong with about 800km on the clock but it’s a bit of a worry. Hopefully the 1st one was just an early unit and the 2nd one was a revised unit that’ll be more reliable. Also my range isn’t anything to brag about but then again I weigh 100+kg and my bike is a super enduro Commencal Meta Power SX Race with 180/165mm travel and weighs over 25kg so I suppose my range is always going to suffer.
Of the seven friends I ride with who have e-bikes four have Bosch motors, two Shimano and one Brose.
The oldest (20/21), and hardest ridden, bikes are Bosch.
The newest are Shimano.
Of the two Shimano bikes one (MegaWatt) has had a new motor (fewer than 600 miles) the other (Heckler) is having one fitted today (fewer than 500 miles!)
The other bikes have, touch wood, required nothing by way of repair or
replacement.
We’re not The Wild Bunch, either, just middle-aged blokes scudding about the Surrey Hills.
That means nothing. My Bosch CX4 needed a new motor at 600 miles.
@@Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Are you a bit thick? Of course, it's not definitive, it's a sample of seven bikes FFS.
My EP8 equipped Commencal Meta Power SX Race needed a new motor at 850km because of a software error that bricked it. It was covered under warranty but still not a good sign. The new motor has about 800km on it now and it’s going sweet so far. Fingers crossed.
@@eightlivesdownmtb Are you a bit thick for being triggered by that ?
I went with the bike from the video - Giant Reign E+1 with Yamaha pwx3. I am quite happy, my friend had RM Dyname 3.0 and the new yamaha felt stronger. But the engine wasn ´t the only think why I went with Reign. Battery percentage is in the app (I just check it once when I am back home), I like display integration, conectivity, and mainly, the geometry. Reign has nice headtube angle and it ´s not so conservative. Overall, all the bikes in the test are nice machines, we are comparing best of the best....
Great review but I would have to strongly disagree with you on the range on the ep8. I have tested everything as well abs the ep8 is seriously lacking on range and confirmed by many of my subscribers and friends. Also nothing mentioned on the rattle from the ep8 and bosch? Anyway good work
I'm surprised on the love shown towards the EP8. I have 1800 miles on my ep8(SC bullit). The first motor died at 520 miles. I came from a Egenius with the 625wh Bosch motor. The first few days with the ep8 were horrible, I loved the new bike but hated the motor. I weight 135lbs and was averaging 17-22miles with 3500-4300ft of elevation gain. The bosch on mulitple occasions gave me 19-26miles with 4500-4900ft of elevation. Both had DH casings, and the Egenius was about 5lbs heavier. The ep8 tappers off so bad after 14mph, that little yellow power indicator is just frustrating!, I WANT FULL POWER, and it just spits little power surges at me. I bought a levo yesterday after riding my buddies, excited to see how much elevation I can get... One other thing to consider, yes the ep8 is on more bikes, but the warranty, when i blew mine up, was a 6-month wait... So have fun with that. Specialized may have a crapy track record, but their warranty turnaround is much quicker.
I have two Shimano EP8 pedal assist motors and still no issues, Shimano EP8 has good characteristics at lower cadences, but for me the best feeling pedal assist motor is Spesh Brose
Strange how different people feel about these motors. I have had three eMTB. First was a Husqvarna HC6 with EP8 and then a Sepc Kenevo with Brose and now an Orbea Rise with EP8rs. To be fair the Brose was the strongest and fastest, but I prefer the control of the EP8. So my choice is EP8! (No experience of Yam or Borsch).
Tried most of these motors. The Bosch every time for me. Consistent power and good battery life
Been researching a lot and tried the Bosch and I think it's the choice. Got an EP8 currently. Shimano has shit battery life unlike said in this review. Best on eco but worst on turbo. I think someone measured it 1100m for EP8 on about 720Wh battery and 1400+m for Bosch, Brose and Sync on turbo.
@@Raumancefr
My experience with Bosch performance ebike motor gen 2 over 7 years and now my e bike R&M Delite Bosch performance gen 4 ,very happy with my Bosch motor and ebike.
The very best Emtb is the one that is the most Reliable and the Quietest. Silence is golden. The latest Bosch is definitely the best option at the moment but what did Brose know in 2018 with the silent, powerful 90nm aluminium 1.3 motor that they all don't know now. Downhill the Shimano and Bosch rattle like 3 loose bricks in a steel box trailer on a corrugated dirt road and they all now sound to various degrees like a coffee grinder under power.
Seriously if Specialized revamped the 2018 1.3 aluminium brose motors with upgrades ie : X ring crank water resistance sealing, latest belt, sprag bearing and firmware their reliability nightmare could be resolved and they would have the best, powerful , quietest, smoothest, most natural feeling Emtb ever.
Rember the "it's you but younger ,faster and more fun, fun ,fun"
Emtbs are a Time Machine.
BUT WHAT WOULD I KNOW.🤔🤫🤪🤞 E=Mtb²
The giant sycdrive pro is super clunky when descending..so disappointed.
@@timeforabeer6338 2 weeks ago I bought another Emtb a quiet, light,flickable Trek Fuel EXe. Very impressive and is actually a mtb and a Emtb. Rides really well with motor off. 👌 9.7 model with Shimano gears and Fox suspension 19kg 👍.$11k Australian. E=Mtb²
Thank you for your video, but for around town and it’s hills. Which would you recommend?
Hey, on the Specialized, you didn't appear to try adjusting motor assist in those 10% increments - which could have given more support at lower or higher end of peddling Cadence.
Wouldn't that change the motors performance in your view???
Also, can't the EP8 do the same, using the App?
I own a Giant Explore E and enjoy it a lot I now even cycle to work, something I never did before.
@@Neil.C57510 Good to know
Perhaps the most important aspects should be aftersafter sales support and reliability. I am just switching from Giant to Santa Cruz after only eight months due to shocking delays on replacing the Yamaha motor u der warranty due to “undiagnosed internal motor fault” it doesn’t matter how efficient or powerful the motor is if when it fails the “couldn’t care less” attitude of local bike shop and manufacturer means you can’t ride it for 3 months while waiting for repairs!!Great to hear the EP8 is your top choice - can’t wait to get it
EP8 wasn't the top choice bozo
I bought Giant because I thought it is the most reliable 🫣
No mention of the Shimano clunking noise?
I went from e8000 to ep8 and expected the clunking to be just something the journalists complained about to make themselves feel relevant. However it was very noticeable and even a bit off putting. But after about 300km of riding it pretty much disappeared. I guess the clutch system wears in or whatever.
Very surprised at the good review of the EP8. I went with a Gen3 Specialized Turbo Levo and love both the buttery smooth nature of the motor and the long battery life. I admit that I am a Brose fanboy from my experience riding the bike. I would consider a Bosch motor also.
My SC Bullit and Yeti 160 e feel great as an complete eMTB but the Spesh Brose pedal assist motor still feels so smooth and natural
I find with the Shimano rs motor in my Rise H15, the harder I pedal at higher cadences the motor keeps on giving.
The Yamaha PW-X3. Plenty of torque to get ya uphill, and the motor does not rapidly drain the battery. Works efficiently in freezing-temps, and humidity(and a-lot of motors tend to fail in humidity-prone areas. And where is the Dyname 4.0 motor? Shimano & Bosch have a real-world threat with Dyname 4.0. Highly improved over the 3.0 version. As a sufferer of sciatica, e-bikes are a necessity for me. Brose, as quiet as-it-is, suffers from needing constant(and expensive) maintenance. The Bosch motor, does poorly in wet/freezing temps. The EP-8 motor, of which many reviewers scorn the most microscopic flaws, is very reliable in Northeast wet weather, and eight-months with a after-market battery, still gets me home on a daily twenty-five mile work commute(gotta have a job to afford e-bikes). The PW-X3, puts all-to-shame. Yamaha, has options that Bosch & Brose, do not have. Yamaha, listened to consumers about the PW-X2, and refined the motor. For pure power(and pure battery drainage), get the Dyname 4.0. The best selling motor, will be the company that allows the pedals, to charge the batttery, as you're riding, without adding noticeable weight.
I find that the PW-X3 in my trance is more clunky than the PW-X2 i had when descending..so disappointed.
@timeforabeer6338 maybe it's more the bike than the motor.
Why do they never include Bafang Mid drive 610 E bikes that have a rated torque of 160 Nm ?
This is a UK test, the motor isn’t common or legal to use in this island.
Bosch cx is my favorite For all around performance but the Sachs rs with 112 nm is the champ on hills . i have both and have compared the two motors on the same hill and the sachs destroyed the Bosch
The group of 8 I ride with do this test a few times a week. We have all these motors, plus a Rocky Mountain Dyname 4.0. When everyone rode a EP8/ Ep801 powered bike it was just up to rider effort, but when someone, like my 12 yr old grandson, gets a 5 yr old Brose 2.1 Levo for his birthday, and rides with the 2024 Shimano powered bikes, it really exposes just how underpowered and over rated the EP8/801 bikes are. They are way down on power in the low cadence on steep climbs, and they cut off abruptly on top and get real hard to pedal, there's just nothing to love about them compared to the others. The Yamaha bikes are torquey and great climbers, The Bosch are great as well, but when it comes to raw hill climb speed and power, nothing can touch the Dyname 4.0. If you can pedal above 80 rpm you get to pass any other rider, no matter how strong they are. The Dyname needs rpm, it is a bit soft at low cadence, but not Shimano soft. The Brose makes great power, especially at ridiculous low cadence, and allows new riders to cruise along and pull away, while their EP801 powered former BMX champion dads are getting dropped while pedaling hard two or three gears lower. The Yamaha bikes are similar, and great hill climbers. The Bosch CX Race is best for a wide powerband, and if I could find one in a bike with supple long travel that would be my choice. I made the mistake of buying a Canyon Torque On with an EP8, I love the bike, nothing rides better and is as much fun going downhill fast, like 30mph fast. but that whimpy EP8 is a real handicap up hill, so I bought a Rocky Mtn. W/ Dyname 4.0, not quite as smooth suspension wise, but power to spare, and my grandson with his 5 year old Levo is not leaving me the when the hill gets steep and long the way he does on my Shimano bike. There is no reason to ride a Shimano unless you ride alone, are not the least bit competitive, like pushing your bike up rocky technical hills while a kid pedals right up, or just ride groomed trails with gentle elevation changes. Shimano have the most bikes using their motors, but that just means they have the greatest number of slow bikes. Sure Ryan won some power stages on his Ep801, but not one you or I can buy. That was a FACTORY Blueprinted and modded motor.
My Brose s mag powered bike is in the shop now getting it's 3rd motor! It's a year and a half old. I would not recommend Brose without a warranty.
and when the waranty is terminated ?
Testing the effectiveness of motors in eco mode doesn't look right, as it basically shows which motor spends less power in the lightest mode. It is like the motor which doesn't support you at all has infinite effectiveness as it doesn't spend energy.
Noise comments climbing and descending should have been detailed and maybe time now for a warranty issue review from subscribers by brand, but otherwise nice review. Although am surprised with the recommendation of Shimano!
Looking forward to the 'it rides itself mode', so you can spend all day in the pub.
Hi...where was the descending review of each bike?...the clunk / rattle comparision is quite important when reviewing an e bike..can be a deal breaker on some bikes.
Good luck changing the bearings in any of them
Great video!
I managed to climb The Tourmalet on a single charge after traveling10 miles to get there on on my giant ebike with Yamaha motor and 625 watt battery and I’m 110 kgs, plus getting on a bit . Thank the Lord , just made it to the top as battery battery was about to die! Think the climb is over 6000 feet.
Good review. But why didn't you have the Canyon Spectral On? It has a EP8.
This was all about the motors so which bike they're attached to wasn't really important
My findings are the exact opposite, I have a 22 reign e+ with 625watt and the range is impressive as is the motor. My other bike is a 504w Merida with shimano motor and I'm on the waiting list for a new motor like most shimano ebike owners, I barely gets half the range as the pwx3 and the Yamaha feels way better. There are so many variables with these sort of tests and other motors test have produced opposite results with shimano the least efficient and yamaha/boshe best in test..
My January 2023 Giant Fastroad E+ Pro has had none of the so called problems mentioned here.567 miles of average 18+ mph & 37 miles consistently @ 5'8" 135 lbs. 62 years old.80 Newton's of torque.Row those 10 gears like the old pro that I am & just fly!
Using a Bosch gen 3 CX and am satisfied with the performance. My biggest gripe is batteries are not interchangeable. I have the 500 wh and cannot upgrade to the newer 630 and up. Bosch politics SUCK!
I thought it was the EP8 that drained the battery faster compared to the Bosch! Anyways, I am probably going with the new Moterra LT and the Bosch with 750wh battery or as a second choice, would be the Fantic XEF 1.9 Enduro 190mm of travel and the Brose motor with 720wh. I would go with a Shimano equipped bike only if the battery was at least 720wh!
Agree. This is probably the only review online who favor Ep8 !!! The Ep8 is the worst motor in the game.
@@chuckduck u just got to know how to use it, he explains it, it’s great at lower cadences, it probably does have the weakest programming out of the bunch though, which I think Shimano is working on
By far the best package is Specialized with Brose, which has unique unlimited customization options. The Brose engine has a unique soft feel on the pedals due to the belt. They are always two steps ahead of everyone and have no competition for the next 3 years.
Are they reliable? I had bafang and it died like 3times after only 200kms, 2times sensor fucked up and once something in the motor i think it were the gears, then i have bosch 800kms and everything fine.
Next 3 years? You can foresee the future too? I see bullshit but can't smell it- yet.
No.Wrong.Just wrong- on all levels- 😎 dude.
What about the noise.
? Rattle noise?
Several similar motor reviews concluded the EP8 near the last place, if not the last.
Giant!
What i'd like to know is more details about the construction of the motor itself.. meaning gears inside, material is it nylon , delrin, aluminum , stainless ???? how durable and what are the driving gears made of on them ? Nice take on how the bikes and motors feel but reliability and durability will be MOST important to me considering the replacement cost involved. Don't want to be shelling out big money every few years when if or when they die after warranty if the nylon gears wear. OR will it be serviceable, just replace the bad gears and good to go ?? All questions that are important I would think. Nice video. Would love to see a follow-up on " durabilty expectations ".
@Google Account Thanks good to know! I'd like to see them do a long term teardown on these. And inspect the gears. I'm sure some will turn out in better shape than others. Im not a fan of nylon gears though.
LOVE the bike list.....too bad I cant find an ebike anywhere in Canada :(
Igo biktrix and rize all have bikes.
I feel your pain ! Can't find any in Tennessee either
L👀K up johnnynerdout on this format, he should be able to help U2 out.
О 👍 отличное видео тест 👏 спасибо 🤝 даже вот не знаю теперь что лучше купить самокат 2вд 2х1000ватт 🖐️ или такой велосипед 🤯
I got only 41ks on a 2022 Focus Jam with a Bosch motor with not a lot of climbing before the battery died.
Imo the motor is one of the least important factors when choosing an e-bike. Geometry is king.
Rocky Mountain's Dyname 4.0 seems to consistently come out as the winner in comparisons that include it; unfortunately, like this review, it's often excluded from the mix. I assume because RM is a smaller company making their own motor platform...but I have to say, in my experience, they do have the best motor/interface. The power and organic engagement of that power is unmatched.
But how do they feel when you reach the speed limit? Which feels the easiest to pedal when they’re turned off or past that speed limit?
Also everything else I’ve seen says the shimano isn’t that great. From the comments it seems to Yamaha is the most reliable.
The lack of yet another item to break off on handlebars is a deal breaker. SPECIALIZED and GIANT have the right idea for aggressive Enduro riders simply in top tube? Low end torque is more useful for climbing technical.... otherwise great for all riders on green and blue flows trails. I would never attach my expensive smartphone unless I'm riding on street lol. Another useless gadget from my perspective. Not much said about Giant Yamaha... again possibly a little biased like overrated Maxxis? (Torn a DD rear.... never a Mazza or Specialuzed lol).... not enough time on Giants E Reign?
An entertaining review nonetheless, thanks for devoting the time though. Yes I am at home 3 weeks post bimalleolal ankle fracture surgery (not on trail but on way to work; my fault) so Enduro style freeride Emtb intrigues me to assist somehow in the near future; but with so much mixed reviews it's really down to renting and testing oneself lol
Like I said entertaining
This question should be, which motor lasts the longest. The Brose is very good but on my 4th motor. The down time i have had is very annoying and it looks like i am on the way too my 5th as it is getting noisy.
I think it's better not to buy an used bike with brose motor
@@enrinat4326 I don't know if warranty is original owner.
so you do all sorts of tests and then your main criteria for choosing the best motor is how many bikes use them! That test is for the most widely available ebike motor
Shimano systems always get fault codes never again for me. Once the warranty runs out it’s just a matter of time until your buying a new one for 1k . Put me off emtbs. They need to be repairable.
shimano's software is fault laden just like Specialized with the Brose. pure garbage.
Get a bafang very reliable and cheap and easy to get parts for and repair yourself if you have problems
In my opinion The EP8 is a long way behind the other motors, feels like less power and the range just isn’t there on the EP8, the Bosch Is better in every area..
So strange that Rocky Mountain’s Dyname motor is consistently missing from a lot of these comparisons even though it has the highest torque output.
WELL SAID.
torque is not everything, lol .
The 'out-front' displays are a damn stupid idea
If I bout a new Emtb it would be one of those bikes.
Which one would you get and why? 👍
motorised bikes cost more than cars
thats not true
Not a new car. But they are more expensive than a lot of new motorcycles.
Does anyone else have problems with motor overheating. I heared this is common issue with new syncdrive pro motor and you can find a lot off sad owners on the internet. I have giant reign e+2 2022 and I weight 77 kg and have problems with overheating and motor automaticly shift down modes from 5 to 4 or 3. Outside temp was only 20 deg celcius. Thanks for honest comments. I hope anyone has a solution for this issue.
GIANT YAMAHA SYNCRONE DRIVE SPORT 85 NM 👍👍👍👍🇧🇻🇨🇮🦍 PERFEKT.
My ecobike mx500 with ananda central engine 940W is the best
Boch 4 eme generation the best
Nice video but all these are out of my price range.
As a owner of a very expensive Specialized Turbo levo S work ( 15’000 euros ) it’s really hard to live with
In 4 months time it’s been on repair 7 times and now I am waiting since 10 days. When I ride all suddenly all shut off and erreur message saying no batterie check app mesafe showing. I stop turn off and on so I can maybe ride again 15 mins and it’s stars again
Sooooo annoying for an expensive bike like that
Once again no mention at all of longevity of the motors. Can they be repaired when a part wears out after warranty? It seems all motors are designed to work without problems if u're lucky for max 10000 to 15000 km. When used on an mtb in allweather even less. Sealings, bearings, internal chainwheels all not up to their task. This is unacceptable. Shimano is the worst. No parts available, no repair possible. E-bikes eco friendly? Bike press critical???? Having to treat a very expensive motor like a worn out chainwheel, cassette or chain is unacceptable. Just like the fact u cannot even change yourself the wheeldiameter and other things when switching wheels, tyres, chainwheels, cassettes etc. On the other hand I like the EP8when spinning battery friendly in eco mode or trail. I hate the degressive indication of battery power left. And that in the last 20% the battery is really unpredictable. I also like the fact shimano allows to adapt the motor settings, but not as mucjh as i would like and not while riding. We use the motor on a tandem. For climbing it's a problem the smallest shimano chainwheel is a 34. I wonder if people do really 200m altimeter climbs on a 34-46. 51 sucks even more(no bacckpedaling, chainline that hurts your ears and eats aluminum parts of the cassette.
I had a Giant with Yamaha, a BH with brose a canyon with shimano and now I have 2 bikes with Bosch - a Moustache and a Scott which I love to use in TOUR+ mode. The other motor which i liked from the previous bikes was, weirdly enough, the yamaha. The least pleasure i had using the shimano. It felt the weakest by quite a lot and it was much less effiicient than any other motor...
Ya I really wanted a giant/ Yamaha, the dealer near me went out of business and I got a specialized levo sl i really like
@@Neil.C57510 hey the specialized is going strong , ive just abuot wore out my 2nd back tire and nothing has broken so far
All that Bosch head unit stuff is just asking to get destroyed in a crash. Shimano takes the win.
My levo sl has only top tube lights , nothing on the bars
What ever motor is silent and has 90nm
Where is the Bafang?
Bafang M620 Mid Moto.
Ok, lets ignore the Bafang Ultra, again. Thing is these feeble Euro spec hobbled, over priced, under powered motors also allow the bike makers to equip small batteries and include an enormous mark up on the price. If the Ultra motor was included there would be no contest. Bafang 620 Ultra will run indefinitely at 160nm and 1500w., also less pricey. Put that in your pipe and smoke it!
Or even the lowly BBSHD. Still 160 NM ( the number that really counts on a MTB), but doesn't need a custom frame , leaving a larger choice of bikes)
I would like to see it compared, but I have a 2022 Rail with the Bosch Performance Line and it’s smooth, quiet, and throws me up climbs with almost zero effort. I’m 250 lbs. I’ve never found myself wishing I had more. After seeing how impressive it is I don’t think I’d want even more torque on my drivetrain components. Maybe I don’t know what I’m missing though.
The Bafang does not overheat on difficult extended climbs. It cost less, it has a throttle, it can go almost 40mph, way more fun then the Bosch I used to have.
do not buy the shimano motors they have anti tamper sensors in them and will be software locked if you open them up to change a 5 quid bearing. the best motors for spares is yamaha as dont use can bus so the controllers can be bought and the metal gears if needed just not the giant ones as they use can bus with the yamaha motors.
Is it me or did they actually leave the 2 best ebike motors out of this search for the "best" ebike motor?
The end of the day you know the brose motor will break
Did Shimano paid you for what you said?:))
Why not wireless controls for how expensive these bikes are
Yamaha blows away Bosch and Brose for reliability every time. Sell and service many brands carrying these 3 motors. Yamaha's never come back to the shop. Bosch and Brose can't keep out of the shop. No matter the model and brand of ebike, the Yamaha just always has more power and more reliability and zero issues. I am amazed how many people get duped into buying brands with Bosch or Brose motors on them. Such a marketing scam those two have going, persuading all these big name brands into putting their garbage on to their ebikes. Of course Yamaha wont give away their controls which is part of the secret sauce, and the ebike manufacturers are too stupid to build out their own.
Just like Maxxis tires lol. ( There are so many superior and better priced options...Mazza, Onza, WTB, Michelin) Yeah I also have a 21 Giant Trance X0 mullet ...Magura and DVO and XD mix upgrades. Super balance. All round great for Yamaha.
Remember the more hyped the less sold?
Thanks for commenting !! Which bike carries Yamaha motors that you like the best? I was just about to buy either the specialized turbo comp carbon or the Santa Cruz heckler which has the ep8, But I'm now pausing hearing about all the maintenance issues for both motors.
Always less interested in getting a giant bike. I live in California by the way
Does Yamaha make their own bikes? I'm not sure what you were referring to.
At any rate which bike carrying the Yamaha system do you like the best and which has the best controls also?
Stop being childish and calling rival motors a scam. They are not a scam. How old are you 12?
You Brits (I was born in Leeds) need to come get a taste of M620 Bafang in North America. 52V 1000 watts 160 ft lbs of torque. If that's not enough we can spice it up(Watt Wagaons) to 2000. Check out Biktrix Juggernaut Ultra. The thing needs two chains. It's like the goddamn wild west over here.
@@Neil.C57510 Hell"s no. They are not technically legal on North American roads either ,750 watt limit. But so far enforcement has been lax .
No befang?
So the review is about the best motor outright but it turns into a popularity vote.... very strange
Bfang
BAFANG! 1000w Motor 😂
I just peddled 2.8 miles and 2.8 miles back as a test. it convicned me, i want an ebike whith a whole lot of torque to go up the hills and to naver have to peddle at all again. it's rough. if n ebike motor can't get you up a hill all by its own, which is where you need it and want it, there is no reason to have one. you might as well walk. all the rest of the way you can peddle assist on flat or coast down hislls, but where you need that motor is going up hills al the way on power.
I wouldn't buy any system that you can't build your own batteries for out of Li-ion 27000 cells. That's like an up front given. Yes, it's extremely involved and time consuming and even a bit dangerous and I don't recommend it, however it's a must given for me as I've already done it for quadcopters.
Rather have my motorcycle with a 2-stroke.
Which needs insurance, road tax, mot, petrol. If not road legal need tow bar, trailer. Need room to store stuff. Noisy, smelly and even heavier. Much more limited where you can use it. Ruins trails. Less agile. Annoys everyone. Na think I’ll stick with my ebike!
Just get both
I have both!
@@craponlycomesoutadogsarse1731 Ruins trails? Dirt bikes are ridden on dirt bike trails! Annoys everyone? Again, they are dirt bike trails, who are they going to annoy, other dirt bikers?
@@kevinhollenbeck7503 fair play but I stay in Scotland and with our access laws I can pretty much ebike anywhere I like but the same can’t be said for a motorbike. (which you also need a license for, which I don’t have if you want to use it on the road)
After reading the text article then watching this video I can't believe you followed the exact wording like a script but completely ignored the noise section - arguably the section that benefits most from a video over written format. Take an L
bosch is the best dont @ me
Hey, a moped review; not something you'd expect on a cycling channel.
A mOpEd ReVieW - A twat
Hey, a stupid and unoriginal joke about e-bikes on a cycling channel; exactly what you'd expect to find.
Also to spend that type of money and not be able to add a throttle. No one talks about that
These are pedal assisted bicycles, not mopeds. In most countries I know of there's a max limit of 250w and no throttles. Where I'm from the limit is 250w & 25km/h assist for the bike to still be considered a "bicycle". Anything above that needs to be registered as a moped (50cc petrol engine, 45km/h vmax. Mopeds need to be registered, have insurance and you need a moped drivers licence (complete a written and driving test) to drive it. Also you can't ride them on mtb trails and bikepaths/lanes. Not arguing, just something to consider. I would love a high spec powerful mid-drive with a throttle, but pedelecs are just easier.
Dude, Have you driven a stick shift? I guess you did not. What we need is the full control of the motor. SyncDrive is the best in this category, albeit still lacking a lot. All those automated modes are just junk. As a rider you will always know better than software which makes assumptions what you need. All those motor reviews don't address in detail motor control abilities, to me your review is pretty useless. You did not address second most important factor - control and third most important factor - battery status. I have been riding eMTB for over 4 years so I know a thing or two. And I still can't find an ebike worthy upgrade from SyncDrive 2018.
But the bikes still can't ride up the hill on their own so you don't have to push it before riding it downhill... ...watch this space! (follow me mode)
Junk review, you might as well have used step through bikes for your review since these motors are for those considering how far into the e-bike popularity we are now.
We'd be better served by having the newcomers (bike builders) using a wider selection of motor options to know their performance and durability.
I have Giant liv vall e plus2 2018
Yamaha sport 80nm
Im very happu about power i working uber eats 2 years never problem jist one time i chaning bearings still looks good Giant is Amaizng
YOURASTAR
I motori servono per salire e meglio del Bosch non c'è ne