Not cycling, but I have found that since I have been following your driving advice, my dashcam clips have become very boring indeed. Long may that continue.
I have a work colleague who phones me, at least twice a day - and almost always on his drive home from the office. In the space of a 30 minute call, I can guarantee the conversation will be interpersed with 2-3 moments of road rage. I, on the other hand tend to deal with @rsehole drivers by giving them the 'Ashley Neal' stare!! 😂
Well, I was riding in primary the other day and a driver tried to ram me off the road, then got out and told me I was "riding like I owned the road". A tussle ensued before he got tired and saw sense. I did remind him he was on camera. Was this being recorded for social media? No. But it might well end up there.
In my experience, too many motorists don't understand the concept of primary position and if/when cyclists will use it. Unfortunately, it's the same category of motorists that merely want to pass cyclists instead of overtake them. These motorists are also the ones that want the intimidate and bully cyclists. Alas I don't see it changing any time soon. Unfortunately, whilst I think Ashley is trying to do some good, videos like this are red meat to many.
@Shm5547 totally agree with you. One can't always take primary when needed because one ends up creating a new risk. Even if one goes fast enough to be close to the speed limit of 20mph, if it's a stretch of road where cars can go faster than that, some drivers see it as a deliberate attempt just to block them. This follows by them putting their car just inches from your back wheel and if it's possible, they'll have a go at you. And it's not even about getting on with their journey faster because they might end up in a red light not too far ahead, it's about how dare the cyclist ride anywhere else other than the gutter. In some situations where *I have to* take primary, I'm constantly checking behind me and get out of the way as soon as I can to minimise the risk that comes with this sort of drivers. This type of behaviour is a lot more common than drivers would think.
Really good point! I do about 40 km a day and cannot be riding in primary al the time I have to make a compromise and constantly evaluate the situation.
Saying taking primary will "discourage close passes", fails to consider that triggers severe road rage in some drivers, sometimes leading to much more dangerous situations - deliberate tailgating and being forced into the kerb.
Absolutely! I've tried AN's advice on my daily commute in Swindon and definitely got more aggro from motorist who (I think) perceive a cyclist in primary as intentionally holding up traffic.
You're absolutely right! Ashley Neal is still going for leisurely Sunday cycles on an electric bike and wanting to lecture people like me who do 80km every day in heavy rush hour traffic.
Absolutely disagree, there are parts of my commute where I have to take primary to avoid close passes and I get practically no agro from drivers for doing so, without taking primary I would get at least one if not two close passes on that 1 mile stretch daily.
@@simonrook5743 Without any scientifically collated data, we can only form an opinion based on personal experience. My experiences of commuting (in Swindon) are (mostly) at odds with yours. I think AN should try cycling during rush hour (or other very busy periods) - based on his videos, he rides at time when traffic is light. After doing this he may be less inclined to victim blame. In all honesty, I don't get that many close passes (despite heavy traffic) - may be one or two a day (with 100s poss 1000s of overtakes) but... when I tried ANs advice, there was a noticeable increase in tailgating, engine revving and shouting abuse. I'm not anti-Ashley, his driving vids have definitely helped me to become a better driver but... his cycling content doesn't come close.
Most drivers don't think primary position is ever valid. They think if it as "taking up the whole lane" or acting as if "they own the road" or "baiting drivers". These people almost definitely don't think close passing is a big deal. It's never the fault of the victim for "encouraging" dangerous behaviour in others.
Well said! This is what I have been trying to make Ashley understand... blaming the victim for the close pass is wrong! But whenever I try to reason with Ashley Neal he doesn't hesitate to use insults.
@@InBodWeTrust wouldn't have made a difference he'd still be claiming some rule out of context to justify it. Maybe even walk into the cyclist and start shouting at them for not giving way to him.
I agree that you should always let a pedestrian complete the crossing! But just like I have been trying to explain to Ashley, I do 40km a day and in some instances you need to evaluate what is less risky, in this point on the video I had a vehicle behind me and did not think it was appropriate to hit the brakes and skid to let the pedestrian through.
@@SilvioDiego like stopping for pedestrians at a roundabout, often very risky due to other traffic not expecting it. And this is the case with what you're saying, everyone should be considering others and flow, rather than getting on an entitled high horse & forcing yourself into a needlessly risky situation like our friend in the video here.
5:22 Why are there white lines making a supposed cycling lane? People driving expect people on bikes to be in that lane whatever the the circumstances. The pretend cycling infrastructure makes it more dangerous for people on bikes and more confusing for people driving.
The evidence is exactly that, paint only lanes have increased cycling casualty rates, one big problem is drivers don’t think they have to give 1.5m separation if they are in a different lane as seemingly phyiscs is suspended by the white paint.
3:13 That driver was despicable and should be prosecuted for dangerous driving. Actually disgusting. I don’t understand how you can have that little care for other people.
What I cannot stand is when I clearly make an effort to ride near the side so drivers can pass safely, but someone passes very close anyways. When this happens, I make a dramatic shift from secondary to primary position so that the driver and any others who observed the close pass can see me take back the lane upon being disrespected. I realize that the offending driver has already passed at this point so I'm effectively punishing other drivers who may have been more reasonable, but I dont want anyone to see the close pass and think that I was OK with it. I aim to convey this message: "If drivers wont safely use the space that I give them, then I wont give drivers that space." This story introduces optimism as a factor in the decision whether to take a primary or secondary position. If I'm optimistic that drivers will pass safely, then I will take a secondary position as soon as I feel there is enough room to share the lane. But if I become pessimistic, then I will hold a primary position until there is a very generous amount of room to pass.
Ashley, your driving videos are absolutely amazing, incredible insight; I genuinely feel grateful that we get the benefit of not only your skills, but also your judgement, and big picture lens in situations; I might even say it’s like having an adult in the room. However I do feel you would benefit from reaching out to some of these you tubers (perhaps you have), rather than confronting them. (I’ve commented something similar before). Appreciate they might also attack you, but ur often the ‘adult’ in these types of situations, and I think it would be amazing to see a conversation between you and some of these guys. I also feel you are really well placed to be a bridgehead to combat the tribal nature of a lot of this subject. When I watch some of these Cyclimg videos from TH-camrs (perhaps with the exception of cycling mikey who clearly is on a bit of a crusade), I recognise some of the behaviour in my own cycling in London (the good and the bad), and I dont see Silvio’s cycling as performative for views (although only he would know). I recognise the exhaustion of being constantly put in danger for zero reason by ‘must get in front ‘ and punishment passes. I also recognise that my emotional response sometimes makes me make the wrong decisions in situations. I’m a big car nut and also a cyclist, so I’ve got skin in both camps, and recognise I’ve got much to learn still in both disciplines, a fact I hadn’t appreciated until I started watching your videos several years ago. Sorry for the long post, I really want to see this channel land with cyclists. Keep up the excellent content ! Cheers .
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling well that’s disappointing, I actually just posted a comment on his video which this is a response to, I hope he reflects , but all credit to you for reaching out!
Top comment. Intent is often hard to prove, but I often wonder, despite learning alot from Ashley's perspective, if cyclists often stay in secondary for fear of creating more aggravation. Don't do much road cycling these days but know I've stayed beside the pavement in order to be as little nuisance as possible to drivers. I'm not saying that's the right mentality but I don't think I'm alone in that thought process. And like you I've still reacted angrily to close passes, and don't feel I've brought that upon myself, even if like Ashley says I could have done more to prevent said close pass...
@@Albert5522 totally agree, and reflecting on your comments, perhaps I watch some of those cycling videos as a form of catharsis, that its not just me, and it really is that bad, my despair is earned!. Totally different emotion to watching Ashleys videos where I genuinely watch to learn (unlike the many myriad of dashcam sites and ai channels, if u want to watch rubbish driving and road rage), that’s why I see the opportunity for cycling which Ashley cycling channel can provide. Acknowledge and validate the emotion, but also hopefully make people go… did I contribute to this situation? What could I have done differently? is being morally right worth dying for?
I have been intimidated many times into riding on secondary... and if I'm closed passed I should not be blamed for that... the fault always stays with the perpetrator.
I think it’s great you’re pointing out the cyclist’s contribution to these incidents, whilst still acknowledging the responsibility ultimately lies with the driver who’s going to do all the damage
04:02 Rule 67 is a should rule and advises to only pass to the left of large vehicles when they are stationary or slow moving. The van isnt a large vehicle...
It would have been great if, for once, you'd made a follow up video responding to the majority of the / top rated comments that also took issue with your original video, instead of doubling down with "a few of Silvio's clips that prove your point perfectly". How hard would it have been to maybe use one of his clips to help back up your point, but also maybe address some of the comments by including at least one clip where Silvio (or, at the very least, another active uploader) was riding in primary position, and the driver still passed them dangerously? Or maybe you could have found one or two clips to support your theory about how riding in secondary invites close passes, rather than doubling down on this ridiculous theory that it's done on purpose, when you have no evidence to support it. Again, could have been an interesting, balanced follow-up, yet somehow ended up being another take-down piece on a channel with far fewer viewers / subscribers than your own. Well done
Adopting primary on a hill in the town centre in rush hour surrounded by buses and taxis requires a force of will I just can't muster on some days and so I'm intimidated off the road. I've been cycling since age seven and so have been on the road for over 50 years and I currently do 1000s of KM every year. I'm experienced. AN is generally a force for good but I wish he'd remember he cycles for pleasure (and youtube content, oh the irony!) and does so on the flat, outside of rush hour and on an electric assist which gives a much quicker pick up from junctions so he can more easily keep up with the flow of traffic. AN challenge: ride one of those heavy hire bikes in heavy traffic and see how that alters the perception and ride.
you don't need the 1.5m stuff, what you need is the older "treat a cycle as the same size as a car", which will give you a similar passing distance, and indeed often result in safer passing
Problem with that is that most people don’t seem to know how wide their vehicle is and thus they think passing without touching the virtual vehicle still results in a scrape by…
The problem with that was the Courts generally interpreted it as 'no contact, no offence'. It used to be quite normal on a country road to have car go past at 60 mph with 30cms to spare.
4:15 I would have probably passed on the left there too. It's an opportunity to escape the dodgy driver. It's all about the balance of risk, that seemed the less risky option IMO. I would also say that Silvio might not have been looking to pass that van on the left earlier, just trying to keep momentum going and taking a position to the left of the van so he can see the road surface better. As the van driver accelerates away, Silvio moves back more centrally in the lane. Silvio isn't perfect, nobody is, but I don't think he is riding to create content. He's just trying to get somewhere by bicycle and documenting the awful driving he has to deal with.
Whilst your points are valid, and you are instructing on correct protocol, as an experienced regular cyclist I can categorically tell you that in some situations cycling to the letter of the rules as they stand will put you in just as much danger, of not more. And this is because a minority of drivers behave with impunity and contempt for other road users. And considering that in those hands a car becomes a lethal weapon, sometimes you adjust your riding to suit, in order to avoid direct confrontation, because you never know if one of them will just snap and drive straight in to you.
It's a fair point but does not have any standing regarding this video when Silvio decides to pass moving vehicle on its left with parked cars so close.
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling Maybe not, and I wouldn't overtake on the right of moving traffic unless specifically in a turning lane, but you mentioned how secondary position invites overtake - on some wider roads even sitting in primary doesn't stop overtake attempts even when it isn't safe, especially when approaching a bottleneck or blind bend with oncoming traffic unaware of your presence.
The main takeaway from this video is: "Two wrongs make a wrong." I agree with you Ashley regarding cycling position. Cyclists don't do this correctly or safely enough in general, and this invites idiot motorists with little to no spatial awareness to perform a dangerous overtake.
Full disclosure, I'm also a Silvio subscriber. I do understand your point better in this video verses the original one, but I never thought you were measuring skirts like so many commenters made out. When I ride I try to minimise the friction when I have to take the lane, so for example @4:44 I would already be easing off and falling in behind the van if possible or behind the BMW if the driver is a space closer. Sure, the van driver should have seen the pinch point and waited to overtake, but once they're alongside it's an uphill battle to get a driver to acknowledge their mistake and correct it. What irritates me is that it's so obvious on the bike when a driver intends to go past or not -- especially ICE vehicles as I can easily hear their throttle position which tells me if they are letting off, maintaining speed, or even accelerating past (you can use the road noise / regen / brakes for electric cars, but it's not as effective). All that's needed then is a shoulder-check to confirm. Another example is @6:06 where I simply wouldn't have accelerated in the new road. There was nobody following the Renault so it's a perfect time to just aim at the back of the taxi and coast. Drivers understand the message surprisingly quickly when it's advantageous for them, so let the motor vehicle use its advantage and I'm back in behind them looking at the scenery rather than worrying about a car up my arse. However, I often see YT riders ending up beside vehicles and LOOKING AT OR IN THE VEHICLE! I've never had time to do that because I'm too busy indicating to the vehicle following them. I don't cycle in the UK, but I'd estimate on low-speed roads >80-90% of drivers give way when you signal next to the driver in front, i.e. if Silvio had signalled next to the van the drivers following would have grown their gap (though how much of this is a panic response to thinking I'm about to turn right I couldn't say). If you try to battle with the ones that can't or won't see the hazard developing, your experience of cycling on the roads will be poor.
I get your point about secondary enticing some drivers to come past, but primary is not a fix for dangerous overtakes. This is why I think saying that secondary means a cyclist is ok with coming past is an incorrect assumption. Just last saturday I was cycling on twisty forest roads (Finland) and taking primary before a blind bend or a crest of a hill literally had no effect. Drivers forced past closely when they couldn't even see behind the bend or hill. And in my experience, this is very common. So, if it has no effect, would I want to be closer to a potential head on crash or as far away from it as possible?
The main contributing factor of the incident in the penultimate clip was the sudden end of the cycle lane he was in. It forced bikes and cars into the pinch point. If the road markings and surface weren't terrible he might've spotted it sooner. However, he should have then backed off, and certainly shouldn't have had a go at the driver. It caught them both out. If you don't know the road, the bike lane might not be the safest place for the cyclist.
Another example of poorly designed bit of cycle infrastructure purporting to protect you with a paint line on the straight, wide road where you need protecting least and disappearing completely at the pinch point where you could do with a bit of protection.
5:43 "trouble follows you around" well I disagree. Anyone who cycles regularly will encounter this sort of driving behaviour. I recall even you Ashley getting into an interaction with a van driver the one time you tried cycling to the supermarket!
Yep common occurrence- admittedly Sylvio seems to start some kind of conversation rather than adapt a bit and just report the close passes. Being in primary may be a deterrent but more often than not it will result in an even closer pass - theory versus reality in my experience…
Plus the woman in a Fiesta complaining that Ashley ‘should be at the side of the road’ after making a dubious pass into a T junction. I’ve been side swiped more than once by drivers getting it wrong by trying to rush into the space ahead of me and been the target for a hard punishment pass that turned into a hit and run. There’s no road craft that can predict or control those drivers.
@@Umski I think Silvio is talking to the driver and using social media as he has had a very poor response from reporting incidents to the police. Reporting to the police in my area is a pointless task at the moment, it just seems to go into a black hole.
@shm5547 thanks for your comment! Been trying to convey the same message to Ashley, if he did about 40km a day in heavy rush hour traffic he would realise that reality sometimes is not as easy as 'take primary and you won't get close passed'. this is my last comment on this video cause otherwise TH-cam will think I'm a bot 😁
Has anyone seen the video on other dashcam videos of a cyclist riding in primary in roadworks and the car driver is leaning on the horn telling him to move over and the comments saying the cyclist is doing on purpose to make videos
On cycling Channels like Silvio there will always be trolls in the comments overly criticising his riding and defending the car driver for driving dangerously towards Silvio unprovoked. If you ride correctly during rush hour you still get many stupid drivers and pedestrians and just have to learn to deal with them. The trolls don’t even ride a bike so will never know why cyclists don’t always use the cycle lane or why cyclists filter which they keep calling undertaking or why cyclists ride in the middle of the “road” it’s the lane and they think that cyclists should move out of the way for cars when time and time again you will always catch the car in another traffic queue.
what's the answer if by riding in secondary baits a driver to pass you for the "content" but riding in primary ANGERS the driver to pass you even more dangerously? Is the cyclist baiting content in both scenarios?
@@_Shadbolt_ Ashley lives in a fantasy world where he goes for a leisurely Sunday cycle on an electric bike and then wants to lecture people like me who do 40km every day in heavy rush hour traffic.
Honestly, anybody that can have a TH-cam channel dedicated to poor driving clips, must have a large contribution to a lot of the situations. If you drive/ride defensively, there just won't be enough situations to keep a channel going. Just look at Ashley, he has maybe 10 minutes of driving fails per month, and he is a driving instructor, so is on the road for a large part of the day (and we all know what behaviour driving school vehicles cause in some drivers).
I have started a channel @MotorwayMadness-yq6eg and none of the clips have any bearing what I as the cammer was doing. My remit is that they will only be what others have done wrong. The only scrapes I get into are muppets tailgating me as I am being careful.
And even then, people unfamiliar with the Hanney moan because his clips aren't eventful enough! These people don't seem to comprehend that most normal people don't get into hair raising situations on the daily 😂
I agree mostly with Ashley but on this, NO. It is far better to get close passed than it is to get hit by a maniac, of which there are plenty out there. Ashley himself posted a few videos where a tiny inconvenience led to the maniac attempting to ram a car. A cyclist would have zero chance. Rule 72 is just advice, it is not legally enforceable and is completely in the grey area. What exactly is a quiet street? What is slower moving traffic? You do not invite another road user to close pass you by riding secondary, the driver chose to do so themselves. As a car driver, what a cyclist does or doesn't do, never leads me to break the law. Because I have eyes and a brain.
Yep agree - primary may be theoretically a deterrent but in reality results in even closer passes - the passer should be judging if it’s at a safe speed and distance otherwise drivers would be moaning constantly about annoying cyclists weaving in and out of primary and secondary- can’t have it both ways - it’s an everyday occurrence not just one for capturing content
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling not a good look calling your viewers idiots - when you’re close passed in primary, it’s usually aggressive and at speed - swinging into secondary does not happen as someone is passing which is what you’re suggesting - your theory and reality simply don’t match and this is from many people saying their real world experience is quite the opposite of how you perceive the world to work in the case of cycling - I follow your driving channel with interest but strongly disagree with you on this based on my casual, but substantial cycling experience on the roads 😐
@@AshleyNeal-JustCyclingI am confused - are you advising to sit in primary position and then try to dodge out of the way into secondary position if/when a car overtakes? I don't know many who would have the reflexes, or speed, to pull that off.
I agree. The sort of driver that close passes you probably doesn’t even understand the difference between primary and secondary and just sees bikes as annoying little mobile roadblocks. I find 99% of drivers are great and give you loads of space without being prompted but every so often one just flies by as if you don’t exist. I have an offside mirror and watch vehicles approaching. You can generally tell the ones that are likely to be dangerous and think about escape options.
5:50 I'm not happy to see Sylvio moving through like this at a pedestrian crossing. We can argue all day about whether he was technically infringing the Highway Code (rules 165 and 191 - yes, I had to look them up) but it doesn't seem like good practice to me. Some pedestrians are very vulnerable and a bike is quite sufficient to cause life-changing injury.
3:00 this is the junction at Herne Hill station in London approaching along Dulwich Road. There are three lanes with the centre lane able to go left or right, albeit that there is a left filter that comes on before full green. Car driver did nothing wrong initially in making the turn but, obviously, should have stayed behind the cyclist until safe to pass. It’s a dangerous junction with lots of pedestrians, the station, buses and Brockwell Park so always needs a high level of attention no matter what form of transport you’re riding/driving/walking.
1:35 there is some sort of cycling infrastructure on the left of the road here, and I wonder if I would be using it. It has short bits that look quite good, with kerbs separating from the main part of the road, but I cannot work out what cyclists are supposed to do at the end of each section, maybe it changes to shared use. Looks like it is not much use for getting anywhere at a reasonably fast speed.
I understand your point about primary position. For non-confident riders, this just isn’t an option and they get close passes. For more experienced riders taking primary, it can lead to more dangerous overtakes and unpleasant confrontations. Silvio could be more proactive with his position, but this doesn’t excuse those overtakes
Keep up the good work Ashley - your videos are excellent. On my commute, there is a nasty section of the A663 through the village of Newhey onto Jubilee near junction 21 of the M62. Going to work isn’t too bad as it is downhill and is easy to take the lane. Coming home uphill is a nightmare to be fair. The road is relatively narrow. Some drivers are still in “motorway” mode. I’ve reported maybe a 100 drivers to Operation Snap for careless driving (most have been prosecuted). Recently I enquired if the incident data is analysed with a view to putting safety measures in place. Unfortunately only collision data is taken into consideration. Since then, I have been riding the dangerous sections on the (quiet) pavement.
I know the junction at 3:12 and can confirm that the lane the BMW was in is marked as both straight ahead and right turn. Although it tends to be used more commonly by buses for turning right than cars, because of the left lane after the turn being a bus lane and the right lane being a normal driving lane. The positioning of the 201 bus doing the right turn in this clip is unusual for that junction. Regardless, if cycling, I would have positioned in front of the BMW to do that turn to avoid the conflict. Silvio put himself in a risky position.
Riding like this does my head in. Personally, if I’m taking primary I check over my shoulder to make sure I won’t get squashed, then I take it. And I never undertake on the left because if you’re a driver, where are you looking for passing traffic? Not the left! Feels to me like this guy has a chip on his shoulder. Far better to share, if the car drivers around you want to rush then let them!
4:42 I find the roadmarking confusing here. So, in order to get into primary position because of the pinpoint just up ahead, the cyclist must leave the dedicated cycle lane early? If I wouldn't be familiar with the road, I would've been tempted to stay in secondary position because of that cycle lane. Here in the Netherlands that lane would probably just continue on that pinpoint, indicating that the room for cars will be temporarily too small for both roadusers to occupy, which should make it clear that cars should hold back for a moment.
I don't disagree with what Ashley says in this video but the clips to me demonstrate how tricky and dangerous it is to cycle in a busy city. It's almost impossible to maintain strict positioning in primary/secondary at times given how busy the traffic is and the amount of parked vehicles. When I cycle I do adopt primary then move over to allow a vehicle to pass then go back out into primary but this is on much quieter roads. Even then I still get numerous close and dangerous overtakes, and this is in a quiet rural area.
The one that then immediately runs straight into a free for all with pedestrians, posts, and then the entrance to a petrol station forecourt? Absolutely awful cycle lane. Everybody is safer with the cyclists not using it.
The cycle lane that ends right at the pinch point, becomes a poorly marked shared path at the same point as the pedestrian crossing and that appears to end totally 50m further on? Another bit of crap cycling infrastructure that is only ever going to bring cyclists into conflict with pedestrians. I will happily use cycle lanes where they reduce risk but that one doesn’t so I would have kept to the road.
@@Mw9d-m8nFirstly, please understand I’m only playing ‘devils advocate’ here but … ‘bring cyclists into conflict with pedestrians’? I see 3 pedestrians, of note, one of whom is stationary at the crossing. The pavement also seems only marginally less wide than the road itself! Rather than blaming ‘infrastructure’ (which you & I are unable to do much about, I suppose) I might suggest it’s a case of ‘absolving oneself from responsibility & placing the onus upon motor vehicles’!🤔😉✌️
I do a lot of street cycling and my bike is a Brompton so I'm not a heart monitor Strava type. It pays to take an active approach to managing traffic around you and that's thinking about who everyone is and what they're doing. and doing a lot of communication with other road users. I'm not beating a car on a clear road so I'll let them pass but only when I'm comfortable so pinch points I'm in primary but I'm not going primary when they're coming up behind me, I'll hold back.
I'm always flabberghasted by cyclists who (rightly) get upset when a car close passes them, but will happily move *even closer* to the car *while it is next to them* in order to close pass a slower cyclist. Is it dangerous or not?
As a dutchy the uk road design continues to disappoint me. But also, more than half of those 'close overtakes' wouldn't be considered close at all over here..
I will take a primary position at moments when an overtake would clearly put my life at risk, such as the approach to a roundabout when I do not intend to turn left, or yellow bollards that do not leave room for others to pass. Silvio's secondary position at 5:14 seems almost suicidal, given the risk of a side-swipe. Generally, though, I am not prepared to act as the lane police, and I don't feel particularly safe riding in the middle of a lane in front of an impatient driver. If someone overtakes me at a slightly inopportune moment and causes me to brake, I think I'm fairly forgiving.
4:35 Looks like the driver should have seen the cycle lane ending and held back. Notwithstanding that, I’ve got the impression that the 1.5m doesn’t apply (wouldn’t be prosecuted) when there is a solid line cycle lane like this at the start of this clip. The safest thing to do is give 1.5m at all times however just treat it as a cyclist in secondary.
I think I said in the original video that riding in urban area requires more primary position riding, due to proliferation of narrow streets, parked vehicles and street furniture. In the rural area I'm in, its more difficult to constantly command a primary position, especially with the speed some vehicles are approaching at. As an aside, I posted some videos of close passes on my TH-cam a couple of weeks ago, I'd be interested in your take Ashley. Border Velo is the channel. They cover several years.
All your doing is trying to adopt driving instructor mentality to cycling. They don’t think like that, head down, no red lights, and if they see a driver they take umbrage with. I’ll get him DONE !! What a world we live in
I remember seeing comments on Twitter after the original video stating how you are saying _every_ cyclist goes out looking for problems by putting themselves in danger purposely. They completely missed the point of the video and point blank refused to accept the message, even going as far to say Ashley was blaming cyclists for getting close passed I have tried correcting a few by saying it isn’t just limited to cyclists but is a “dash cam” mentality but they cannot see beyond their own agenda. I do believe a couple may have realised the message of the video but still go out to generate content
I would hope so. For me, when riding I try to give cyclists I'm passing 1-1.5m depending on the speed I'm passing them. On the receiving end, I've had plenty of close passes by other cyclists who think they're in the Pro Peloton or some X-Games assault course and weaving in and out squeezing past me and other cyclists and cars to gain a precious few seconds. And when they pass at a high relative speed which is just as scary as a car doing the same and they're usually a lot closer than many of the close passes from a car.
Despite applying to all road users, unfortunately The Highway Code is too often written as if it is only addressing car drivers. This means it is unclear whether all the rules apply to all road users at all times. It is also confusing that some aspects of the code are advice and some are laws. But, if the Code does apply to all road users, then Rule 163 also applies to cyclists: "give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders and horse drawn vehicles at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car. As a guide leave at least 1.5 metres when overtaking cyclists at speeds of up to 30mph, and give them more space when overtaking at higher speeds." Note, this is ADVICE only but it's good advice and choosing to ignore it opens up cyclists to the following LAW, which is all encompassing: Rule 68: "You [cyclists] MUST NOT ... ride in a dangerous, careless or inconsiderate manner." So, would passing another cyclist closer than 1.5m be dangerous, careless or inconsiderate? Depends on the circumstances, but it could certainly be seen as "inconsiderate" at best in many cases and, therefore, illegal.
Ashley's Sunday Roast gets served up two days early.... Good job that I had enough of an appetite to digest this even though I would prefer to crack on with Gran Turismo 4 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
It seems to be a certain similar age of both drivers and cyclists who are just inflexible or unwilling to help themselves or follow rules, like no close passing or taking priority. They've reached the point where "I'm right you're wrong and I'm going to keep doing what I'm doing even if it causes an accident because I'm right" is their only mindset and they are inflexible on their being a better way, especially if it can make their latest video tweet etc more popular
Silvio Diego has a video where he almost gets into an accident while overtaking a car turning right. His excuse was that he was going too fast to see the indicator. He has poor excuses like that for his mistakes but expects drivers to be perfect 100% of the time, no excuses There is also one where he almost hits a pedestrian trying to cross the road. The pedestrian is rushing, but Silvio cannot be seen as he is tucked right behind a double decker and dives out to undertake the bus at the last second. He uses the Hierarchy of road users as a shield all the time, but tries to blame the ped. He does not understand or care about blind spots. i have commented on a couple of incidents where he has approached at speed in the drivers blindspot. even in ones where the driver makes a mistake he still does not accept that there is more that he should be doing to ensure he is seen and rides straight into incidents where it is obvious he hadn't. Being right doesn't matter when you are dead
What about using the cycle lanes which are separated from the road (not the painted ones following the gutter)? I keep seeing videos where cyclists totally ignore a facility which would remove them from the vehicle traffic and any danger the bad drivers bring.
The cycle lanes that are used as car parks by motorists or the ones that are nothing other than a footpath with the same street furniture left in them . The ones that are not swept so have detritus in them causing slip hazards. The cycle lanes that don't actually lead to your destination or the ones that just randomly stop for no reason after 20 yards ? What about the ones that place cyclists in the door zone or do you mean the ones that lead to a ASL that motorists frequently ignore and illegally park in ?
I take up primary position when unsafe to be overtaking, I have a rear view camera so can see who’s approaching a few times some attempt to overtake but I blast my horn everyone close by starts looking and driver backs down is comical if you’re bark is loud they back off then soon it opens up I move over wave then it safe to overtake making them look silly with that earlier attempt, tho I always have space to my left just in case
if motorist was perfect there be no need for cycle cameras are speed cameras cyclist dont go out of there way for content its there all the time there 1000s of youtube dash cam footage that proves it
Exactly! What I don’t understand is why should we tolerate bad drivers and accept them to do the damage they cause. Roads Police will always say you might be a good driver but it’s the others you have to worry about. If the police actually banned drivers straight away when they drive dangerously we might have more safer drivers on the road. But no! They just give them a warning letter no wonder motorists still drive badly and they have an audacity that there is a “war on them”
I have been riding my bike in a rural market town and country lanes for more than 20 years and in that time I have seen a general improvement in driver behaviour towards cyclists. However, there remain some (very much a minority), who seem to have an attitude of this is my space, not yours and you should get out of my way. The main danger I still face is not being seen by traffic pulling out in front of me despite my hi-viz. My solution is to assume that I have not been seen and be prepared to alter my speed and direction.
when cycling it’s the constant need to make decisions. Staying clear enough of parked cars, drivers behind and in front not getting too close, whether to be in primary position or secondary position. Still, got to remember that cyclists are still more vulnerable especially on the road and car drivers are protected by 1.5-2 tonnes of metal, which have more than 100 bph to kill. doesn’t justify cyclists not following the highway code or creating situations to create content. If there is protected cycling infrastructure i would use it. But unfortunately the way our urban environments are designed vehicles will always be King and these conflicts with cyclists will always occur even if cyclists ride properly.
It isn't possible to constantly switch into primary position whenever the road becomes unsuitable for overtaking. If you were to do that you would be constantly weaving in front of often fast moving cars, and will annoy them. Surely you, with your mantra of making something a non incident, should recognise that a cyclist's reluctance to take up primary is likely due to the high proportion of motorists who take offence at having a cyclist in front of them and in their determination to get in front will make dangerous manoeuvres that put your life at even greater risk. If someone is a bad enough driver to close pass you when you are in secondary, they are not going to be any better when you are in primary and getting in front of them like that puts you in more danger.
It never ceases to amaze me that people will happily have a go about how everyone else is terrible and trying to kill them, yet won't lift a finger to protect their space bubble, nor regulate their speed to keep themselves safe. They will, however, post content that shows how crap their self-preservation skills actually are, and call it an example of everyone else being a poor road user...
I’ve never understood some cyclist's constant scolding of people for not keeping them safe when they don’t seem interested in doing that themselves. If you can't do what needs to be done to keep yourself safe why do you expect anyone else to do that?
I do think that plays a significant part in ill feeling towards them. The emphasis is always the accommodation to keep them safe. So ok, of course all motorists should drive responsibly with the safety of everyone in mind that obviously goes without saying. Yet, it’s this mindset that so many of them seem to have. This absolute freestyle, the ‘I can do anything and everyone else has to adapt around me’ attitude that sees them put themselves into the risky scenarios for essentially no reason at all. Least of all the deliciously ironic double standard of them treating pedestrians every bit as bad and worse than what they think motorists do to them.
@@andyedwards7800 But they still need to keep themselves safe. I understand motorists need to do their bit to keep cyclists safe, but if cyclists expect that from them, they need to lead by example and do what they can to keep themselves safe. If you know you are in a potentially dangerous situation, does it not make sense to act in a way that makes the situation less dangerous for you, rather than just hope others will do that for you? I know this isn't all cyclists and I know most of them are sensible on the road. It's just a small minority that gives them a bad reputation for riding dangerously and expecting motorists to ensure they are safe while not doing that themselves. I'm not victim-blaming here, I just don't get their attitude.
Ashley is so bitter and vindictive about these things sometimes. This is just one of those point-scoring videos, like when he invited that cyclist for a driving lesson just so he could talk down to him.
Bitter and vindictive? I genuinely don't see this. Help me see things through your lens and time stamp and explain where he's being bitter or vindictive?
Bitter and vindictive was probably a bit strong. I think I'd actually amend that to "petty" or "passive aggressive" like @tailspin80 above. I couldn't timestamp it - I'm referring to the actual premise of this video. What's happened is Silvio made a video about Ashley, so Ashley's just retaliating in a shameless bit of tit-for-tat criticism. That cyclist's riding really is quite a high level, so Ashley's jumped on very minor faults the rider made to try to assert his knowledge and authority over him.
Now if you comment on Silvio’s channel suggesting that he should be braking to avoid danger, you get accused of victim blaming and you get called a troll 😂
I actually find him rarther annoying and confrontational. If I see a pinch point it's simply do a shoulder check. I might say to the car following get past now or they might give a signal to go in front and they will act as a shield from behind. Then once safe back to secondary. I'm primary you have an escape route where secondary you have much less of an escape route. At times when you cycle to be safe you have to take control and you can only do that if you take the lane.
Because the cycle lane ends directly at the pinch point forcing you to either rejoin the road at the most dangerous point or navigate the shared, narrowing pathway at the pedestrian lights. It’s less risk to cycle in the road imho.
As all drvers have to pass a driving test who are we as cyclists to tell them when they should overtake is this not part of learning to drive along with controlling speed and direction. When cycling not only do you need to do all this for other road users but be able to do analysis of the driver's state of mind as there are a lot of people who turn into psychopaths behind the wheel.
More victim blaming this - fairly common in your cycling videos, which I feel are primarily designed to bait cyclists. In almost all of those situations the motorist shouldn’t have passed. I suspect they would have just passed closer (or got angrier) if the cyclist took up a more primary position. The cyclist is the victim in these instances, they can ride where they want and the motorist should overtake safely. They’re no more at fault than a woman who attracts unwanted attention because of what she’s wearing (I.e. not at all).
I posted a comment very similar to this - also highlighting how victim blaming like this would not be acceptable in other situations - someone on this channel seems to have not liked it and deleted my post.
The click bait worked for me! 😁 ... Very good point! That is what I cannot make Ashley Neal understand... if an offence is being commited the fault stays with the perpetrator ... not the victim as Ashley insists.
I did notice on a couple of the examples cycle lanes weren't being used and abruptly disappeared at the pinch points. Cycling is far from safe, I'd be inclined to use the cycle lane and pootle along the pavement when the road narrows, the chances of meeting a walker are very slim.
I ride like that sometimes but it’s hard to pootle when you are on your way to work. All the sections shown would be safer for people on bikes if those white lines didn’t exist.
1st of all I’m surprised you used some of my videos where the driver is clearly at fault. For what regards your suggestion that I like getting close passed or I put myself in danger for views on TH-cam is preposterous! I have read a bit the comments and is sad to see that you have no qualms calling whoever disagrees with you ‘1d1ots’ and ‘delusional’. You’re still going for leisurely Sunday cycles on an electric bike and wanting to lecture people like me who do 40km every day in heavy rush hour traffic. I publish videos of my cycling including some where I lost my cool or made a mistake, so unlike you I’m willing to own up to my mistakes.
@@SilvioDiego Bruh, Ashely has multiple videos titled "I was wrong" in which he admits his mistakes. You should take him up on that ride so you can communicate in person and better explain your views on how riding an ebike is different from normal cycling. You can never properly communicate in the heavily censored YT comments section.
@@Zeyr01there are two videos titled that way, neither of which have anything to do with cycling, and he's constantly doubling down in his comment sections. Better luck next time
@@SilvioDiego But he's not blaming he acknowledges the cars are at fault for close passing but like his other videos not just with cyclists adopts the attitude of you may be 100% in the right but what can you do to help fix or prevent a problem for everyone's benefit. That's what makes his channel different from other channels where it's all about blame. I think where he might admit where he's wrong is the accusation against yourself that you're doing things "deliberately" for views and clicks.
@@philipreid2542 Yes I see that 1 second of research in the yt search bar has really paid off. He has more which aren't tilted that way where he shows his mistakes. He even has a video where he talks about his younger days way before he was a driving instructor where he ended up going to court for his terrible driving.
This silvio guy is a very arrogant entitled bikey with a me-me-me attitude. He does not even play nicely eith other bike riders. Just look at the way he blasted though the peds at 7.20. or at 6.39, so enraged about close passes, he 'close passes' another bike rider, putting himself even closer to the orange car. Funny how these bikeys don't like being close passed, but are happy to do it themselves.
Sadly Silvio is probably going to end up as a RTC statistic. When.... not if. Silvio, if you read this.... is your life really worth the paltry pennies you might be getting from the TH-cam content?
I believe it is called Bikeability now, funded under Active Travel England "In 2023/24, ATE agreed a multi-year funding settlement of £50 million for the Bikeability Programme up to 2024/25. In 2023/24, more than 500,000 children booked on to cycle training, with more than 310,000 children booked on to level 2 on-road training."
I did the training course to teach it, although I didn't bother with the final assessment as I was never going to use it. I do know what it's all about though, and Silvio is a mile off. As are most of the social media cyclists.
Not cycling, but I have found that since I have been following your driving advice, my dashcam clips have become very boring indeed. Long may that continue.
Ashley is great on driving but his more limited experience on bikes - e-bikes at that - shows.
Excellent, just as we need it. Many thanks!
I have a work colleague who phones me, at least twice a day - and almost always on his drive home from the office. In the space of a 30 minute call, I can guarantee the conversation will be interpersed with 2-3 moments of road rage.
I, on the other hand tend to deal with @rsehole drivers by giving them the 'Ashley Neal' stare!! 😂
Well, I was riding in primary the other day and a driver tried to ram me off the road, then got out and told me I was "riding like I owned the road". A tussle ensued before he got tired and saw sense. I did remind him he was on camera. Was this being recorded for social media? No. But it might well end up there.
Send it to Ashley and let him review it. You might find you could’ve done something better, or most probably you came across an absolute throbber.
In my experience, too many motorists don't understand the concept of primary position and if/when cyclists will use it. Unfortunately, it's the same category of motorists that merely want to pass cyclists instead of overtake them. These motorists are also the ones that want the intimidate and bully cyclists. Alas I don't see it changing any time soon. Unfortunately, whilst I think Ashley is trying to do some good, videos like this are red meat to many.
@Shm5547 totally agree with you. One can't always take primary when needed because one ends up creating a new risk. Even if one goes fast enough to be close to the speed limit of 20mph, if it's a stretch of road where cars can go faster than that, some drivers see it as a deliberate attempt just to block them. This follows by them putting their car just inches from your back wheel and if it's possible, they'll have a go at you. And it's not even about getting on with their journey faster because they might end up in a red light not too far ahead, it's about how dare the cyclist ride anywhere else other than the gutter.
In some situations where *I have to* take primary, I'm constantly checking behind me and get out of the way as soon as I can to minimise the risk that comes with this sort of drivers.
This type of behaviour is a lot more common than drivers would think.
@@amendo78 100%.
Had exactly the same experiences you describe.
Really good point! I do about 40 km a day and cannot be riding in primary al the time I have to make a compromise and constantly evaluate the situation.
Saying taking primary will "discourage close passes", fails to consider that triggers severe road rage in some drivers, sometimes leading to much more dangerous situations - deliberate tailgating and being forced into the kerb.
Absolutely! I've tried AN's advice on my daily commute in Swindon and definitely got more aggro from motorist who (I think) perceive a cyclist in primary as intentionally holding up traffic.
You're absolutely right! Ashley Neal is still going for leisurely Sunday cycles on an electric bike and wanting to lecture people like me who do 80km every day in heavy rush hour traffic.
Neal is clueless.
Absolutely disagree, there are parts of my commute where I have to take primary to avoid close passes and I get practically no agro from drivers for doing so, without taking primary I would get at least one if not two close passes on that 1 mile stretch daily.
@@simonrook5743 Without any scientifically collated data, we can only form an opinion based on personal experience. My experiences of commuting (in Swindon) are (mostly) at odds with yours. I think AN should try cycling during rush hour (or other very busy periods) - based on his videos, he rides at time when traffic is light. After doing this he may be less inclined to victim blame. In all honesty, I don't get that many close passes (despite heavy traffic) - may be one or two a day (with 100s poss 1000s of overtakes) but... when I tried ANs advice, there was a noticeable increase in tailgating, engine revving and shouting abuse. I'm not anti-Ashley, his driving vids have definitely helped me to become a better driver but... his cycling content doesn't come close.
Most drivers don't think primary position is ever valid. They think if it as "taking up the whole lane" or acting as if "they own the road" or "baiting drivers". These people almost definitely don't think close passing is a big deal. It's never the fault of the victim for "encouraging" dangerous behaviour in others.
I think most drivers don't even understand why cyclists use primary position.
Well said! This is what I have been trying to make Ashley understand... blaming the victim for the close pass is wrong! But whenever I try to reason with Ashley Neal he doesn't hesitate to use insults.
Thay accept my positioning and dont close pass, must be different drivers you encounter.
7:18 If Sylvio was the pedestrian he'd be making a video on how the cyclist didn't stop for him.
And he'd have been wrong - the pedestrian had no priority at that point. 🤷♂
@@InBodWeTrust wouldn't have made a difference he'd still be claiming some rule out of context to justify it. Maybe even walk into the cyclist and start shouting at them for not giving way to him.
I agree that you should always let a pedestrian complete the crossing! But just like I have been trying to explain to Ashley, I do 40km a day and in some instances you need to evaluate what is less risky, in this point on the video I had a vehicle behind me and did not think it was appropriate to hit the brakes and skid to let the pedestrian through.
@@SilvioDiego like stopping for pedestrians at a roundabout, often very risky due to other traffic not expecting it. And this is the case with what you're saying, everyone should be considering others and flow, rather than getting on an entitled high horse & forcing yourself into a needlessly risky situation like our friend in the video here.
No, he wouild make a video on how other pedestrains and prams dont stop for him
5:22 Why are there white lines making a supposed cycling lane? People driving expect people on bikes to be in that lane whatever the the circumstances. The pretend cycling infrastructure makes it more dangerous for people on bikes and more confusing for people driving.
The evidence is exactly that, paint only lanes have increased cycling casualty rates, one big problem is drivers don’t think they have to give 1.5m separation if they are in a different lane as seemingly phyiscs is suspended by the white paint.
3:13 That driver was despicable and should be prosecuted for dangerous driving. Actually disgusting. I don’t understand how you can have that little care for other people.
What I cannot stand is when I clearly make an effort to ride near the side so drivers can pass safely, but someone passes very close anyways.
When this happens, I make a dramatic shift from secondary to primary position so that the driver and any others who observed the close pass can see me take back the lane upon being disrespected. I realize that the offending driver has already passed at this point so I'm effectively punishing other drivers who may have been more reasonable, but I dont want anyone to see the close pass and think that I was OK with it. I aim to convey this message:
"If drivers wont safely use the space that I give them, then I wont give drivers that space."
This story introduces optimism as a factor in the decision whether to take a primary or secondary position. If I'm optimistic that drivers will pass safely, then I will take a secondary position as soon as I feel there is enough room to share the lane. But if I become pessimistic, then I will hold a primary position until there is a very generous amount of room to pass.
They will tell you if they cool from their actions. In harder inclines or narrow points il hop on path for cool. Im in primary before i find out.
Ashley, your driving videos are absolutely amazing, incredible insight; I genuinely feel grateful that we get the benefit of not only your skills, but also your judgement, and big picture lens in situations; I might even say it’s like having an adult in the room. However I do feel you would benefit from reaching out to some of these you tubers (perhaps you have), rather than confronting them. (I’ve commented something similar before). Appreciate they might also attack you, but ur often the ‘adult’ in these types of situations, and I think it would be amazing to see a conversation between you and some of these guys. I also feel you are really well placed to be a bridgehead to combat the tribal nature of a lot of this subject. When I watch some of these Cyclimg videos from TH-camrs (perhaps with the exception of cycling mikey who clearly is on a bit of a crusade), I recognise some of the behaviour in my own cycling in London (the good and the bad), and I dont see Silvio’s cycling as performative for views (although only he would know). I recognise the exhaustion of being constantly put in danger for zero reason by ‘must get in front ‘ and punishment passes. I also recognise that my emotional response sometimes makes me make the wrong decisions in situations. I’m a big car nut and also a cyclist, so I’ve got skin in both camps, and recognise I’ve got much to learn still in both disciplines, a fact I hadn’t appreciated until I started watching your videos several years ago. Sorry for the long post, I really want to see this channel land with cyclists. Keep up the excellent content ! Cheers .
I asked Silvio for a ride out and he wouldn’t because I ride an e-bike. Inclusive cycling for everyone is not in his psyche
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling well that’s disappointing, I actually just posted a comment on his video which this is a response to, I hope he reflects , but all credit to you for reaching out!
Top comment. Intent is often hard to prove, but I often wonder, despite learning alot from Ashley's perspective, if cyclists often stay in secondary for fear of creating more aggravation. Don't do much road cycling these days but know I've stayed beside the pavement in order to be as little nuisance as possible to drivers. I'm not saying that's the right mentality but I don't think I'm alone in that thought process. And like you I've still reacted angrily to close passes, and don't feel I've brought that upon myself, even if like Ashley says I could have done more to prevent said close pass...
@@AshleyNeal-JustCyclingThis reaction simply proves that he's an idiot and probably not worth talking to.
@@Albert5522 totally agree, and reflecting on your comments, perhaps I watch some of those cycling videos as a form of catharsis, that its not just me, and it really is that bad, my despair is earned!. Totally different emotion to watching Ashleys videos where I genuinely watch to learn (unlike the many myriad of dashcam sites and ai channels, if u want to watch rubbish driving and road rage), that’s why I see the opportunity for cycling which Ashley cycling channel can provide. Acknowledge and validate the emotion, but also hopefully make people go… did I contribute to this situation? What could I have done differently? is being morally right worth dying for?
I got hit by a car a few weeks ago whilst stationary and in primary plus some. It's no wonder cyclists don't do it
I have been intimidated many times into riding on secondary... and if I'm closed passed I should not be blamed for that... the fault always stays with the perpetrator.
I think it’s great you’re pointing out the cyclist’s contribution to these incidents, whilst still acknowledging the responsibility ultimately lies with the driver who’s going to do all the damage
04:02 Rule 67 is a should rule and advises to only pass to the left of large vehicles when they are stationary or slow moving. The van isnt a large vehicle...
Go and do some research on cyclists who are KSI while passing any vehicle on the left.
@ go and read rule 67 again and correct me if I am wrong about what it says…
It would have been great if, for once, you'd made a follow up video responding to the majority of the / top rated comments that also took issue with your original video, instead of doubling down with "a few of Silvio's clips that prove your point perfectly".
How hard would it have been to maybe use one of his clips to help back up your point, but also maybe address some of the comments by including at least one clip where Silvio (or, at the very least, another active uploader) was riding in primary position, and the driver still passed them dangerously?
Or maybe you could have found one or two clips to support your theory about how riding in secondary invites close passes, rather than doubling down on this ridiculous theory that it's done on purpose, when you have no evidence to support it.
Again, could have been an interesting, balanced follow-up, yet somehow ended up being another take-down piece on a channel with far fewer viewers / subscribers than your own. Well done
Adopting primary on a hill in the town centre in rush hour surrounded by buses and taxis requires a force of will I just can't muster on some days and so I'm intimidated off the road. I've been cycling since age seven and so have been on the road for over 50 years and I currently do 1000s of KM every year. I'm experienced.
AN is generally a force for good but I wish he'd remember he cycles for pleasure (and youtube content, oh the irony!) and does so on the flat, outside of rush hour and on an electric assist which gives a much quicker pick up from junctions so he can more easily keep up with the flow of traffic.
AN challenge: ride one of those heavy hire bikes in heavy traffic and see how that alters the perception and ride.
you don't need the 1.5m stuff, what you need is the older "treat a cycle as the same size as a car", which will give you a similar passing distance, and indeed often result in safer passing
Problem with that is that most people don’t seem to know how wide their vehicle is and thus they think passing without touching the virtual vehicle still results in a scrape by…
@@Umski yes this is true, as a casual glance round a carpark demonstrates
The problem with that was the Courts generally interpreted it as 'no contact, no offence'. It used to be quite normal on a country road to have car go past at 60 mph with 30cms to spare.
4:15 I would have probably passed on the left there too. It's an opportunity to escape the dodgy driver. It's all about the balance of risk, that seemed the less risky option IMO.
I would also say that Silvio might not have been looking to pass that van on the left earlier, just trying to keep momentum going and taking a position to the left of the van so he can see the road surface better. As the van driver accelerates away, Silvio moves back more centrally in the lane.
Silvio isn't perfect, nobody is, but I don't think he is riding to create content. He's just trying to get somewhere by bicycle and documenting the awful driving he has to deal with.
Whilst your points are valid, and you are instructing on correct protocol, as an experienced regular cyclist I can categorically tell you that in some situations cycling to the letter of the rules as they stand will put you in just as much danger, of not more. And this is because a minority of drivers behave with impunity and contempt for other road users. And considering that in those hands a car becomes a lethal weapon, sometimes you adjust your riding to suit, in order to avoid direct confrontation, because you never know if one of them will just snap and drive straight in to you.
It's a fair point but does not have any standing regarding this video when Silvio decides to pass moving vehicle on its left with parked cars so close.
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling Maybe not, and I wouldn't overtake on the right of moving traffic unless specifically in a turning lane, but you mentioned how secondary position invites overtake - on some wider roads even sitting in primary doesn't stop overtake attempts even when it isn't safe, especially when approaching a bottleneck or blind bend with oncoming traffic unaware of your presence.
Silvio often moves out towards overtaking vehicles, and this obviously makes any overtake look closer than it was.
Silvio’s number one fanboy Roadbiker thinks he does absolutely nothing wrong 😂😂😂
@@scottlaaa My two biggest trolls meet outside my channel? I feel betrayed! 🤣
@@SilvioDiego pointing out your poor cycling and road use doesn’t make someone a troll 😂
be called@@scottlaaa makes you a troll
@@SilvioDiego that’s troll behaviour bullying online calling names etc
The main takeaway from this video is: "Two wrongs make a wrong."
I agree with you Ashley regarding cycling position. Cyclists don't do this correctly or safely enough in general, and this invites idiot motorists with little to no spatial awareness to perform a dangerous overtake.
main takeaway? If ya gonna have a YT channel on road behaviour...at least read up on the Highway Code!
Full disclosure, I'm also a Silvio subscriber. I do understand your point better in this video verses the original one, but I never thought you were measuring skirts like so many commenters made out. When I ride I try to minimise the friction when I have to take the lane, so for example @4:44 I would already be easing off and falling in behind the van if possible or behind the BMW if the driver is a space closer. Sure, the van driver should have seen the pinch point and waited to overtake, but once they're alongside it's an uphill battle to get a driver to acknowledge their mistake and correct it. What irritates me is that it's so obvious on the bike when a driver intends to go past or not -- especially ICE vehicles as I can easily hear their throttle position which tells me if they are letting off, maintaining speed, or even accelerating past (you can use the road noise / regen / brakes for electric cars, but it's not as effective). All that's needed then is a shoulder-check to confirm.
Another example is @6:06 where I simply wouldn't have accelerated in the new road. There was nobody following the Renault so it's a perfect time to just aim at the back of the taxi and coast. Drivers understand the message surprisingly quickly when it's advantageous for them, so let the motor vehicle use its advantage and I'm back in behind them looking at the scenery rather than worrying about a car up my arse.
However, I often see YT riders ending up beside vehicles and LOOKING AT OR IN THE VEHICLE! I've never had time to do that because I'm too busy indicating to the vehicle following them. I don't cycle in the UK, but I'd estimate on low-speed roads >80-90% of drivers give way when you signal next to the driver in front, i.e. if Silvio had signalled next to the van the drivers following would have grown their gap (though how much of this is a panic response to thinking I'm about to turn right I couldn't say). If you try to battle with the ones that can't or won't see the hazard developing, your experience of cycling on the roads will be poor.
As with most 'bad driving/riding channels, I watch a few videos and never return if they look like a content-warrior.
I get your point about secondary enticing some drivers to come past, but primary is not a fix for dangerous overtakes. This is why I think saying that secondary means a cyclist is ok with coming past is an incorrect assumption.
Just last saturday I was cycling on twisty forest roads (Finland) and taking primary before a blind bend or a crest of a hill literally had no effect. Drivers forced past closely when they couldn't even see behind the bend or hill. And in my experience, this is very common. So, if it has no effect, would I want to be closer to a potential head on crash or as far away from it as possible?
if you're in primary, you can dodge to secondary.
Primary will give you more space to escape than secondary.
1 foot off the centre line. Dam if they polite and im holding them up il hop on path for them. If they rude and impatient il "not see the drop path"
The main contributing factor of the incident in the penultimate clip was the sudden end of the cycle lane he was in. It forced bikes and cars into the pinch point. If the road markings and surface weren't terrible he might've spotted it sooner. However, he should have then backed off, and certainly shouldn't have had a go at the driver. It caught them both out.
If you don't know the road, the bike lane might not be the safest place for the cyclist.
Another example of poorly designed bit of cycle infrastructure purporting to protect you with a paint line on the straight, wide road where you need protecting least and disappearing completely at the pinch point where you could do with a bit of protection.
@@Mw9d-m8n they're only really useful when the traffic isn't moving.
5:43 "trouble follows you around" well I disagree. Anyone who cycles regularly will encounter this sort of driving behaviour. I recall even you Ashley getting into an interaction with a van driver the one time you tried cycling to the supermarket!
Yep common occurrence- admittedly Sylvio seems to start some kind of conversation rather than adapt a bit and just report the close passes. Being in primary may be a deterrent but more often than not it will result in an even closer pass - theory versus reality in my experience…
Plus the woman in a Fiesta complaining that Ashley ‘should be at the side of the road’ after making a dubious pass into a T junction.
I’ve been side swiped more than once by drivers getting it wrong by trying to rush into the space ahead of me and been the target for a hard punishment pass that turned into a hit and run. There’s no road craft that can predict or control those drivers.
@@Umski I think Silvio is talking to the driver and using social media as he has had a very poor response from reporting incidents to the police. Reporting to the police in my area is a pointless task at the moment, it just seems to go into a black hole.
@shm5547 thanks for your comment! Been trying to convey the same message to Ashley, if he did about 40km a day in heavy rush hour traffic he would realise that reality sometimes is not as easy as 'take primary and you won't get close passed'.
this is my last comment on this video cause otherwise TH-cam will think I'm a bot 😁
Has anyone seen the video on other dashcam videos of a cyclist riding in primary in roadworks and the car driver is leaning on the horn telling him to move over and the comments saying the cyclist is doing on purpose to make videos
On cycling Channels like Silvio there will always be trolls in the comments overly criticising his riding and defending the car driver for driving dangerously towards Silvio unprovoked. If you ride correctly during rush hour you still get many stupid drivers and pedestrians and just have to learn to deal with them. The trolls don’t even ride a bike so will never know why cyclists don’t always use the cycle lane or why cyclists filter which they keep calling undertaking or why cyclists ride in the middle of the “road” it’s the lane and they think that cyclists should move out of the way for cars when time and time again you will always catch the car in another traffic queue.
what's the answer if by riding in secondary baits a driver to pass you for the "content" but riding in primary ANGERS the driver to pass you even more dangerously? Is the cyclist baiting content in both scenarios?
Ashley doesn't cycle enough to realise that riding in primary is not the solution to all problems that he thinks it is.
@@_Shadbolt_ Ashley lives in a fantasy world where he goes for a leisurely Sunday cycle on an electric bike and then wants to lecture people like me who do 40km every day in heavy rush hour traffic.
Honestly, anybody that can have a TH-cam channel dedicated to poor driving clips, must have a large contribution to a lot of the situations. If you drive/ride defensively, there just won't be enough situations to keep a channel going. Just look at Ashley, he has maybe 10 minutes of driving fails per month, and he is a driving instructor, so is on the road for a large part of the day (and we all know what behaviour driving school vehicles cause in some drivers).
I have started a channel @MotorwayMadness-yq6eg and none of the clips have any bearing what I as the cammer was doing. My remit is that they will only be what others have done wrong. The only scrapes I get into are muppets tailgating me as I am being careful.
By being observant and driving safely and normally it is still possible to have enough numpties to fill a channel.
And even then, people unfamiliar with the Hanney moan because his clips aren't eventful enough! These people don't seem to comprehend that most normal people don't get into hair raising situations on the daily 😂
*Channel
I agree mostly with Ashley but on this, NO. It is far better to get close passed than it is to get hit by a maniac, of which there are plenty out there. Ashley himself posted a few videos where a tiny inconvenience led to the maniac attempting to ram a car. A cyclist would have zero chance. Rule 72 is just advice, it is not legally enforceable and is completely in the grey area. What exactly is a quiet street? What is slower moving traffic? You do not invite another road user to close pass you by riding secondary, the driver chose to do so themselves. As a car driver, what a cyclist does or doesn't do, never leads me to break the law. Because I have eyes and a brain.
Yep agree - primary may be theoretically a deterrent but in reality results in even closer passes - the passer should be judging if it’s at a safe speed and distance otherwise drivers would be moaning constantly about annoying cyclists weaving in and out of primary and secondary- can’t have it both ways - it’s an everyday occurrence not just one for capturing content
More idiocy. Primary gives you a larger safety space to the left if someone’s going to overtake.
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling not a good look calling your viewers idiots - when you’re close passed in primary, it’s usually aggressive and at speed - swinging into secondary does not happen as someone is passing which is what you’re suggesting - your theory and reality simply don’t match and this is from many people saying their real world experience is quite the opposite of how you perceive the world to work in the case of cycling - I follow your driving channel with interest but strongly disagree with you on this based on my casual, but substantial cycling experience on the roads 😐
@@AshleyNeal-JustCyclingI am confused - are you advising to sit in primary position and then try to dodge out of the way into secondary position if/when a car overtakes?
I don't know many who would have the reflexes, or speed, to pull that off.
I agree. The sort of driver that close passes you probably doesn’t even understand the difference between primary and secondary and just sees bikes as annoying little mobile roadblocks. I find 99% of drivers are great and give you loads of space without being prompted but every so often one just flies by as if you don’t exist. I have an offside mirror and watch vehicles approaching. You can generally tell the ones that are likely to be dangerous and think about escape options.
5:50 I'm not happy to see Sylvio moving through like this at a pedestrian crossing. We can argue all day about whether he was technically infringing the Highway Code (rules 165 and 191 - yes, I had to look them up) but it doesn't seem like good practice to me. Some pedestrians are very vulnerable and a bike is quite sufficient to cause life-changing injury.
First clip had a perfectly good cycle lane
And heres me thinking the drivers had to be trained to use the road...
There is also the benefit that if in primary and a close pass begins you have the space of secondary as an escape.
3:00 this is the junction at Herne Hill station in London approaching along Dulwich Road. There are three lanes with the centre lane able to go left or right, albeit that there is a left filter that comes on before full green. Car driver did nothing wrong initially in making the turn but, obviously, should have stayed behind the cyclist until safe to pass. It’s a dangerous junction with lots of pedestrians, the station, buses and Brockwell Park so always needs a high level of attention no matter what form of transport you’re riding/driving/walking.
1:35 there is some sort of cycling infrastructure on the left of the road here, and I wonder if I would be using it. It has short bits that look quite good, with kerbs separating from the main part of the road, but I cannot work out what cyclists are supposed to do at the end of each section, maybe it changes to shared use. Looks like it is not much use for getting anywhere at a reasonably fast speed.
Clearly shared use
I understand your point about primary position.
For non-confident riders, this just isn’t an option and they get close passes.
For more experienced riders taking primary, it can lead to more dangerous overtakes and unpleasant confrontations.
Silvio could be more proactive with his position, but this doesn’t excuse those overtakes
Keep up the good work Ashley - your videos are excellent. On my commute, there is a nasty section of the A663 through the village of Newhey onto Jubilee near junction 21 of the M62. Going to work isn’t too bad as it is downhill and is easy to take the lane. Coming home uphill is a nightmare to be fair. The road is relatively narrow. Some drivers are still in “motorway” mode. I’ve reported maybe a 100 drivers to Operation Snap for careless driving (most have been prosecuted). Recently I enquired if the incident data is analysed with a view to putting safety measures in place. Unfortunately only collision data is taken into consideration. Since then, I have been riding the dangerous sections on the (quiet) pavement.
I know the junction at 3:12 and can confirm that the lane the BMW was in is marked as both straight ahead and right turn. Although it tends to be used more commonly by buses for turning right than cars, because of the left lane after the turn being a bus lane and the right lane being a normal driving lane. The positioning of the 201 bus doing the right turn in this clip is unusual for that junction. Regardless, if cycling, I would have positioned in front of the BMW to do that turn to avoid the conflict. Silvio put himself in a risky position.
Riding like this does my head in. Personally, if I’m taking primary I check over my shoulder to make sure I won’t get squashed, then I take it. And I never undertake on the left because if you’re a driver, where are you looking for passing traffic? Not the left! Feels to me like this guy has a chip on his shoulder. Far better to share, if the car drivers around you want to rush then let them!
4:42 I find the roadmarking confusing here. So, in order to get into primary position because of the pinpoint just up ahead, the cyclist must leave the dedicated cycle lane early? If I wouldn't be familiar with the road, I would've been tempted to stay in secondary position because of that cycle lane.
Here in the Netherlands that lane would probably just continue on that pinpoint, indicating that the room for cars will be temporarily too small for both roadusers to occupy, which should make it clear that cars should hold back for a moment.
You've just summed up nearly all dashcam uploaders, cyclists and drivers
I don't disagree with what Ashley says in this video but the clips to me demonstrate how tricky and dangerous it is to cycle in a busy city. It's almost impossible to maintain strict positioning in primary/secondary at times given how busy the traffic is and the amount of parked vehicles. When I cycle I do adopt primary then move over to allow a vehicle to pass then go back out into primary but this is on much quieter roads. Even then I still get numerous close and dangerous overtakes, and this is in a quiet rural area.
2:14… “Silvio should have been here”
How about Silvio considers using the bloody cycle lane 6ft to the left 🤷♂️🤦♂️
The one that then immediately runs straight into a free for all with pedestrians, posts, and then the entrance to a petrol station forecourt? Absolutely awful cycle lane. Everybody is safer with the cyclists not using it.
The cycle lane that ends right at the pinch point, becomes a poorly marked shared path at the same point as the pedestrian crossing and that appears to end totally 50m further on? Another bit of crap cycling infrastructure that is only ever going to bring cyclists into conflict with pedestrians. I will happily use cycle lanes where they reduce risk but that one doesn’t so I would have kept to the road.
@@Mw9d-m8nFirstly, please understand I’m only playing ‘devils advocate’ here but … ‘bring cyclists into conflict with pedestrians’? I see 3 pedestrians, of note, one of whom is stationary at the crossing. The pavement also seems only marginally less wide than the road itself!
Rather than blaming ‘infrastructure’ (which you & I are unable to do much about, I suppose) I might suggest it’s a case of ‘absolving oneself from responsibility & placing the onus upon motor vehicles’!🤔😉✌️
@@razzle1964 you can only see three people when you get there!
I see Ashley's "cycling education" is being put to excellent use right here
I do a lot of street cycling and my bike is a Brompton so I'm not a heart monitor Strava type.
It pays to take an active approach to managing traffic around you and that's thinking about who everyone is and what they're doing. and doing a lot of communication with other road users.
I'm not beating a car on a clear road so I'll let them pass but only when I'm comfortable so pinch points I'm in primary but I'm not going primary when they're coming up behind me, I'll hold back.
I'm always flabberghasted by cyclists who (rightly) get upset when a car close passes them, but will happily move *even closer* to the car *while it is next to them* in order to close pass a slower cyclist. Is it dangerous or not?
As a dutchy the uk road design continues to disappoint me. But also, more than half of those 'close overtakes' wouldn't be considered close at all over here..
I will take a primary position at moments when an overtake would clearly put my life at risk, such as the approach to a roundabout when I do not intend to turn left, or yellow bollards that do not leave room for others to pass. Silvio's secondary position at 5:14 seems almost suicidal, given the risk of a side-swipe. Generally, though, I am not prepared to act as the lane police, and I don't feel particularly safe riding in the middle of a lane in front of an impatient driver. If someone overtakes me at a slightly inopportune moment and causes me to brake, I think I'm fairly forgiving.
4:35 Looks like the driver should have seen the cycle lane ending and held back.
Notwithstanding that, I’ve got the impression that the 1.5m doesn’t apply (wouldn’t be prosecuted) when there is a solid line cycle lane like this at the start of this clip. The safest thing to do is give 1.5m at all times however just treat it as a cyclist in secondary.
I think I said in the original video that riding in urban area requires more primary position riding, due to proliferation of narrow streets, parked vehicles and street furniture. In the rural area I'm in, its more difficult to constantly command a primary position, especially with the speed some vehicles are approaching at.
As an aside, I posted some videos of close passes on my TH-cam a couple of weeks ago, I'd be interested in your take Ashley. Border Velo is the channel. They cover several years.
Completely agree @SilvioDiego does this on purpose for views.
All your doing is trying to adopt driving instructor mentality to cycling. They don’t think like that, head down, no red lights, and if they see a driver they take umbrage with. I’ll get him DONE !! What a world we live in
I remember seeing comments on Twitter after the original video stating how you are saying _every_ cyclist goes out looking for problems by putting themselves in danger purposely. They completely missed the point of the video and point blank refused to accept the message, even going as far to say Ashley was blaming cyclists for getting close passed
I have tried correcting a few by saying it isn’t just limited to cyclists but is a “dash cam” mentality but they cannot see beyond their own agenda. I do believe a couple may have realised the message of the video but still go out to generate content
Trouble is that stupid does not know that its stupid. Have a nice weekend Smilerbob. 😊
Cycling twitter is on another planet. A lot of them can't see beyond 2 pixels. Whether this is deliberate or stupidity it's hard to say.
Ashley, did you notice on the last clop Slivo cycled through a crossing after a pedestrian started to cross.
I have a question. Does a cyclist have to give another cyclist 1.5 meters when they pass them?
I would hope so.
For me, when riding I try to give cyclists I'm passing 1-1.5m depending on the speed I'm passing them.
On the receiving end, I've had plenty of close passes by other cyclists who think they're in the Pro Peloton or some X-Games assault course and weaving in and out squeezing past me and other cyclists and cars to gain a precious few seconds. And when they pass at a high relative speed which is just as scary as a car doing the same and they're usually a lot closer than many of the close passes from a car.
Despite applying to all road users, unfortunately The Highway Code is too often written as if it is only addressing car drivers. This means it is unclear whether all the rules apply to all road users at all times. It is also confusing that some aspects of the code are advice and some are laws.
But, if the Code does apply to all road users, then Rule 163 also applies to cyclists: "give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders and horse drawn vehicles at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car. As a guide leave at least 1.5 metres when overtaking cyclists at speeds of up to 30mph, and give them more space when overtaking at higher speeds."
Note, this is ADVICE only but it's good advice and choosing to ignore it opens up cyclists to the following LAW, which is all encompassing:
Rule 68:
"You [cyclists] MUST NOT ... ride in a dangerous, careless or inconsiderate manner."
So, would passing another cyclist closer than 1.5m be dangerous, careless or inconsiderate? Depends on the circumstances, but it could certainly be seen as "inconsiderate" at best in many cases and, therefore, illegal.
I think the Renault driver at 6:43 thinks they aren't allowed in the chevron area.
Ashley's Sunday Roast gets served up two days early....
Good job that I had enough of an appetite to digest this even though I would prefer to crack on with Gran Turismo 4 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
meanwhile, in the US, a cyclist uploaded video of himself riding in the oncoming traffic lane with oncoming traffic.
Maybe he was watching Ashley Neal for tips, forgetting that this is a UK channel, and got himself confused on which lane he was supposed to be in 🙃
@@thecrispymaster no, he was doing it on purpose, for content.
Storm Ashley incoming.😅
😂😂😂
Now I’ve just read the news this makes sense 😂
@@AshleyNeal-JustCycling Enlighten me, please.... Even if it requires sending an email.
I'm intrigued
LOL Brill.
There is a storm due Sunday night to the UK and they’ve named it Ashley 👍
It seems to be a certain similar age of both drivers and cyclists who are just inflexible or unwilling to help themselves or follow rules, like no close passing or taking priority. They've reached the point where "I'm right you're wrong and I'm going to keep doing what I'm doing even if it causes an accident because I'm right" is their only mindset and they are inflexible on their being a better way, especially if it can make their latest video tweet etc more popular
Cycling in secondary is not meant to encourage people to overtake and it is not a message to overtake .
Silvio Diego has a video where he almost gets into an accident while overtaking a car turning right. His excuse was that he was going too fast to see the indicator. He has poor excuses like that for his mistakes but expects drivers to be perfect 100% of the time, no excuses
There is also one where he almost hits a pedestrian trying to cross the road. The pedestrian is rushing, but Silvio cannot be seen as he is tucked right behind a double decker and dives out to undertake the bus at the last second. He uses the Hierarchy of road users as a shield all the time, but tries to blame the ped.
He does not understand or care about blind spots. i have commented on a couple of incidents where he has approached at speed in the drivers blindspot. even in ones where the driver makes a mistake he still does not accept that there is more that he should be doing to ensure he is seen and rides straight into incidents where it is obvious he hadn't.
Being right doesn't matter when you are dead
What about using the cycle lanes which are separated from the road (not the painted ones following the gutter)? I keep seeing videos where cyclists totally ignore a facility which would remove them from the vehicle traffic and any danger the bad drivers bring.
The cycle lanes that are used as car parks by motorists or the ones that are nothing other than a footpath with the same street furniture left in them . The ones that are not swept so have detritus in them causing slip hazards. The cycle lanes that don't actually lead to your destination or the ones that just randomly stop for no reason after 20 yards ? What about the ones that place cyclists in the door zone or do you mean the ones that lead to a ASL that motorists frequently ignore and illegally park in ?
I take up primary position when unsafe to be overtaking, I have a rear view camera so can see who’s approaching a few times some attempt to overtake but I blast my horn everyone close by starts looking and driver backs down is comical if you’re bark is loud they back off then soon it opens up I move over wave then it safe to overtake making them look silly with that earlier attempt, tho I always have space to my left just in case
if motorist was perfect there be no need for cycle cameras are speed cameras cyclist dont go out of there way for content its there all the time there 1000s of youtube dash cam footage that proves it
Exactly! What I don’t understand is why should we tolerate bad drivers and accept them to do the damage they cause. Roads Police will always say you might be a good driver but it’s the others you have to worry about. If the police actually banned drivers straight away when they drive dangerously we might have more safer drivers on the road. But no! They just give them a warning letter no wonder motorists still drive badly and they have an audacity that there is a “war on them”
I have been riding my bike in a rural market town and country lanes for more than 20 years and in that time I have seen a general improvement in driver behaviour towards cyclists. However, there remain some (very much a minority), who seem to have an attitude of this is my space, not yours and you should get out of my way. The main danger I still face is not being seen by traffic pulling out in front of me despite my hi-viz. My solution is to assume that I have not been seen and be prepared to alter my speed and direction.
when cycling it’s the constant need to make decisions. Staying clear enough of parked cars, drivers behind and in front not getting too close, whether to be in primary position or secondary position. Still, got to remember that cyclists are still more vulnerable especially on the road and car drivers are protected by 1.5-2 tonnes of metal, which have more than 100 bph to kill. doesn’t justify cyclists not following the highway code or creating situations to create content.
If there is protected cycling infrastructure i would use it. But unfortunately the way our urban environments are designed vehicles will always be King and these conflicts with cyclists will always occur even if cyclists ride properly.
It isn't possible to constantly switch into primary position whenever the road becomes unsuitable for overtaking. If you were to do that you would be constantly weaving in front of often fast moving cars, and will annoy them.
Surely you, with your mantra of making something a non incident, should recognise that a cyclist's reluctance to take up primary is likely due to the high proportion of motorists who take offence at having a cyclist in front of them and in their determination to get in front will make dangerous manoeuvres that put your life at even greater risk.
If someone is a bad enough driver to close pass you when you are in secondary, they are not going to be any better when you are in primary and getting in front of them like that puts you in more danger.
6:58 Luckily, the cyclist didn't move out for the man next to the van.
It never ceases to amaze me that people will happily have a go about how everyone else is terrible and trying to kill them, yet won't lift a finger to protect their space bubble, nor regulate their speed to keep themselves safe.
They will, however, post content that shows how crap their self-preservation skills actually are, and call it an example of everyone else being a poor road user...
I’ve never understood some cyclist's constant scolding of people for not keeping them safe when they don’t seem interested in doing that themselves. If you can't do what needs to be done to keep yourself safe why do you expect anyone else to do that?
Because the people in the 2 tonne metal boxes have almost all the control in the situation.
I do think that plays a significant part in ill feeling towards them. The emphasis is always the accommodation to keep them safe. So ok, of course all motorists should drive responsibly with the safety of everyone in mind that obviously goes without saying. Yet, it’s this mindset that so many of them seem to have. This absolute freestyle, the ‘I can do anything and everyone else has to adapt around me’ attitude that sees them put themselves into the risky scenarios for essentially no reason at all. Least of all the deliciously ironic double standard of them treating pedestrians every bit as bad and worse than what they think motorists do to them.
@@andyedwards7800 But they still need to keep themselves safe. I understand motorists need to do their bit to keep cyclists safe, but if cyclists expect that from them, they need to lead by example and do what they can to keep themselves safe. If you know you are in a potentially dangerous situation, does it not make sense to act in a way that makes the situation less dangerous for you, rather than just hope others will do that for you? I know this isn't all cyclists and I know most of them are sensible on the road. It's just a small minority that gives them a bad reputation for riding dangerously and expecting motorists to ensure they are safe while not doing that themselves. I'm not victim-blaming here, I just don't get their attitude.
Ashley is so bitter and vindictive about these things sometimes. This is just one of those point-scoring videos, like when he invited that cyclist for a driving lesson just so he could talk down to him.
The cyclist invited him.
He is a bit passive-aggressive. I think it masks aggressive-aggressive from his younger driving days!
Bitter and vindictive? I genuinely don't see this. Help me see things through your lens and time stamp and explain where he's being bitter or vindictive?
Bitter and vindictive was probably a bit strong. I think I'd actually amend that to "petty" or "passive aggressive" like @tailspin80 above.
I couldn't timestamp it - I'm referring to the actual premise of this video. What's happened is Silvio made a video about Ashley, so Ashley's just retaliating in a shameless bit of tit-for-tat criticism.
That cyclist's riding really is quite a high level, so Ashley's jumped on very minor faults the rider made to try to assert his knowledge and authority over him.
@@_Shadbolt_ There were some key mistakes Silvio made in fairness such as the convergence in which his bike lane ended and joined the road
Poor silvio. After 1 criticism , you sure gave him a good bashing. He will keep his mouth shut in future.
6:14 The Renault driver is a serial close pass merchant.
Probably got their "Licence" from a CEREAL Packet 🤣
I rode a bike in London for years, and never had so many problems as these videoers have.
Now if you comment on Silvio’s channel suggesting that he should be braking to avoid danger, you get accused of victim blaming and you get called a troll 😂
Heaven forbid the brakes having a purpose.🫨
I actually find him rarther annoying and confrontational. If I see a pinch point it's simply do a shoulder check. I might say to the car following get past now or they might give a signal to go in front and they will act as a shield from behind. Then once safe back to secondary. I'm primary you have an escape route where secondary you have much less of an escape route. At times when you cycle to be safe you have to take control and you can only do that if you take the lane.
Why in Silvio's first clip is he even in the road when there is a cycle lane?
Because the cycle lane ends directly at the pinch point forcing you to either rejoin the road at the most dangerous point or navigate the shared, narrowing pathway at the pedestrian lights. It’s less risk to cycle in the road imho.
As all drvers have to pass a driving test who are we as cyclists to tell them when they should overtake is this not part of learning to drive along with controlling speed and direction. When cycling not only do you need to do all this for other road users but be able to do analysis of the driver's state of mind as there are a lot of people who turn into psychopaths behind the wheel.
Deelited Manchester has Ashley on his channel, Worth teaching him some safety lessons.
The increase in cyclists has invariably led to the increase of cycling clip hunters, as if dash cam channels didn’t have enough of them.
What about his close pass of the cyclist he overtakes during the orange Renault incident?
Rules don't apply to social medial cyclists.
Clearly not enough education for many people on roads cyclists and motorists alike .
Another deluded and victim-blaming video
Silvio is a cyclist with very little ability to cycle, Silvio thinks everybody but Silvio is responsible for Silvio's safety.
Ashley has no ability whatsoever. No qualifications, just an ego.
@@BobsBurgers1234 He drives cars....He is NOT a cyclist.
More victim blaming this - fairly common in your cycling videos, which I feel are primarily designed to bait cyclists. In almost all of those situations the motorist shouldn’t have passed. I suspect they would have just passed closer (or got angrier) if the cyclist took up a more primary position. The cyclist is the victim in these instances, they can ride where they want and the motorist should overtake safely. They’re no more at fault than a woman who attracts unwanted attention because of what she’s wearing (I.e. not at all).
I posted a comment very similar to this - also highlighting how victim blaming like this would not be acceptable in other situations - someone on this channel seems to have not liked it and deleted my post.
The click bait worked for me! 😁 ... Very good point! That is what I cannot make Ashley Neal understand... if an offence is being commited the fault stays with the perpetrator ... not the victim as Ashley insists.
I wonder if Ashley blames his learners when they are tailgated for driving a bit slow?
@@stevejohnson506 somehow I'm not surprised.
@@SilvioDiego you are all about clicks and views!!! Just like that other tosser the tv personality!
I did notice on a couple of the examples cycle lanes weren't being used and abruptly disappeared at the pinch points. Cycling is far from safe, I'd be inclined to use the cycle lane and pootle along the pavement when the road narrows, the chances of meeting a walker are very slim.
Do you think it's why some motorists get triggered and pass dangerously?
I ride like that sometimes but it’s hard to pootle when you are on your way to work. All the sections shown would be safer for people on bikes if those white lines didn’t exist.
5:08 he undertook him
Silvio is possibly the worst TH-cam cyclist I've seen ... considering I've also seen Jeremy Vine, that's saying something.
1:23 this should be fun..... carry on Ashley.... I've got my popcorn and diet cola drink.
Useful advice
I find that on this channel I get quality advice both as a car driver and as a cyclist
1st of all I’m surprised you used some of my videos where the driver is clearly at fault. For what regards your suggestion that I like getting close passed or I put myself in danger for views on TH-cam is preposterous! I have read a bit the comments and is sad to see that you have no qualms calling whoever disagrees with you ‘1d1ots’ and ‘delusional’.
You’re still going for leisurely Sunday cycles on an electric bike and wanting to lecture people like me who do 40km every day in heavy rush hour traffic.
I publish videos of my cycling including some where I lost my cool or made a mistake, so unlike you I’m willing to own up to my mistakes.
@@SilvioDiego Bruh, Ashely has multiple videos titled "I was wrong" in which he admits his mistakes.
You should take him up on that ride so you can communicate in person and better explain your views on how riding an ebike is different from normal cycling.
You can never properly communicate in the heavily censored YT comments section.
@@Zeyr01 he needs to admit that he's wrong when victim blaming cyclists for close passes... that would be a good start.
@@Zeyr01there are two videos titled that way, neither of which have anything to do with cycling, and he's constantly doubling down in his comment sections. Better luck next time
@@SilvioDiego But he's not blaming he acknowledges the cars are at fault for close passing but like his other videos not just with cyclists adopts the attitude of you may be 100% in the right but what can you do to help fix or prevent a problem for everyone's benefit.
That's what makes his channel different from other channels where it's all about blame.
I think where he might admit where he's wrong is the accusation against yourself that you're doing things "deliberately" for views and clicks.
@@philipreid2542 Yes I see that 1 second of research in the yt search bar has really paid off.
He has more which aren't tilted that way where he shows his mistakes. He even has a video where he talks about his younger days way before he was a driving instructor where he ended up going to court for his terrible driving.
Silvio is a class bad example of commuting
It's like Ashley has been reading my comments! 😂😂😂
Noticed roadbiker isn’t here defending Silvio! 😂
@TheMirrorGuy lol I think we definately have some validation here. But it's not legal tender on silvios page 😁
This silvio guy is a very arrogant entitled bikey with a me-me-me attitude. He does not even play nicely eith other bike riders.
Just look at the way he blasted though the peds at 7.20.
or at 6.39, so enraged about close passes, he 'close passes' another bike rider, putting himself even closer to the orange car.
Funny how these bikeys don't like being close passed, but are happy to do it themselves.
🍿 😂
Sadly Silvio is probably going to end up as a RTC statistic. When.... not if. Silvio, if you read this.... is your life really worth the paltry pennies you might be getting from the TH-cam content?
@@chrisl1797 How else is he going to pay for his pod? Absolutely Bugbroken.
Keep it up boss videos
Thank you Ashley
Silvio seems like the type of rider that never did Cycling Proficiency in school (do they even still do that?).
yes, and road safety training.
He just annoys me
I believe it is called Bikeability now, funded under Active Travel England
"In 2023/24, ATE agreed a multi-year funding settlement of £50 million for
the Bikeability Programme up to 2024/25. In 2023/24, more than 500,000 children booked on to cycle
training, with more than 310,000 children booked on to level 2 on-road training."
Yes, I have seen kids do it, will depend on the LTA though.
I did the training course to teach it, although I didn't bother with the final assessment as I was never going to use it. I do know what it's all about though, and Silvio is a mile off. As are most of the social media cyclists.
Ashley is talking nonsense. In the first example, the road does NOT narrow, so why would Silvio change position?