How the Titanic Disaster Was Almost Much Deadlier.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 มิ.ย. 2024
- The Titanic disaster was one of the worst peacetime maritime disasters in history in April 1912 - but it was almost way more deadly. If only four things had happened slightly more differently then hundreds more could have died!
PLEASE NOTE:
- At around the 5 minute 40 mark I mention a boat being lowered at 12.40am and then 1.40pm - I mean to say 1.40 AM for the second boat
- As many have mentioned yes indeed, Carpathia DID sink in 1918 after being torpedoed during the First World War. The title refers to the hypothetical question of what if she had sunk that night while attempting to rescue Titanic's passengers.
Join this channel to get access to perks:
/ @oceanlinerdesigns
Support us on Patreon! / oceanlinerdesigns
Oceanliner Designs explores the design, construction, engineering and operation of history’s great ocean liners - from Titanic to Queen Mary but not forgetting the likes of Empress of Ireland or Chusan. Join Mike Brady as he uncovers the myths, explains the timelines, logistics and deep dives into the lives of the people and ocean liner ships that we all know and love.
#titanic #history #engineering #documentary #steering #ships #oceanliners #sinking
0:00 Intro
0:38 Murdoch fails to 'port around'
3:26 The sea is choppier
7:45 Carpathia sinks
10:42 The Marconi wireless isn't fixed - บันเทิง
![[Watch Party] APL 2024 รอบ 8 ทีมสุดท้าย ไทยต้องแชมป์ !](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/NctOkvaex-Y/mqdefault.jpg)
DID YOU KNOW: You can join my channel as a member and get access to perks like badges, emojis, early video access and more! Step aboard and join the fun :)
th-cam.com/channels/sE8PTncfn2Vga48jH46HnQ.htmljoin
I highly recommend it!
I Love you!!! can you play Roblox Titanic!!!
I know you don't really make videos about tankers and other ships like that but I think it would be pretty cool if you did a video about the SS Pendleton. It was a tanker built near the end of WW2 in January of 1944 and sank on February 18, 1952, the ship split in half but only the bow sank and only 8 people died in the incident and 32 were rescued by U.S. Coast Guard.
But anyway love your content and keep up the great work.
DID YOU KNOW, the lifeboats certainly would've been lowered in the AM rather than PM 😬! Sorry, great video otherwise mate.
Umm carpathia sunk in ww1 buy 4 torpedoes
Crazy to imagine that if it weren't for Phillips and Bride, Titanic could have been one of the greatest unsolved disappearances in history...
@@McLarenMercedes Have you ever considered trying to argue a point *without* being a massive dick?
@@McLarenMercedes no one’s gonna read that long message lmao
@@McLarenMercedes You didn't really watch this video, did you?
@@McLarenMercedes you ok babe? You seem stressed.
bride also doomed many passengers by saying "shut up" to the californian
The idea of an entire ship, the largest in the world, carrying over 2000 people just vanishing with all hands is terrifying.
To think that it could’ve been a reality had Phillips and Bride followed the rules is amazing to me, because any other operator might’ve done so, and we’d be having totally different discussions 110 years later.
James Cameron would also be short a movie.
So true! Amazing to think it came so close to happening. Something similar happened to the Hans Hedtoft in 1959 on her maiden voyage; sunk by an iceberg, but conditions were so bad no rescue could reach her and she just disappeared with her passengers and crew!
Ha! Very good point!
@@OceanlinerDesigns Wow, I’d never even heard of that. Truly amazing but no doubt horrible to experience such a thing.
Do we know why they decided to go against protocol and fix it? Seems to me a broken wireless just would mean a few days off for the operators.
Carpathia was a pretty tough old bird: It took 2-3 torpedoes to do her in near the end of WWI and even so she took an hour or so to sink, I believe.
Facts
Basing ourselves on that info, it can be expected that she would've sunk in roughly 4 hours, if it was a similar scapping that titanic went through if it were to scale
torpedos may be strong, but iceberg is stronger.
@@Titanic-wo6bq As the video says the iceberg only ripped the skin and punchered around 6 inched. A torpedo can rip a hole about 20 feet wide.
Truly, the Carpathia was built different.
2: Had the sea been choppier, the consequences probably would have actually been positive as far as Titanic was concerned. Breaking water at the base would have made the berg easier to spot (briefly mentioned in the video but not really explored), and if the conditions were bad enough it would have forced the ship to slow. One or both of these things together may have bought enough time for Titanic to miss the berg entirely.
I agree. The calmness of the night actually caused the crash singlehandedly imo.
Your right
Lightoler (spelt wrong), testified that the capacity of the lifeboats in choppy waves would have been 40.
Just think. If the Titanic had never existed then none of us would have needed to make any comments about this matter.
@@chrispoleson6118 thankfully because she existed and because what happened to her happened, they were able to learn from their mistake and prevent them from happening again: like putting 24 hrs wireless watch, enough boats for everyone on board, and ice patrol across the atlantic
I am 75 years old, and remember reading A Night To Remember when I was around 8 years old. I have been fascinated with Titanic since then. It never ceases to amaze me that ice can rip through steel. I guess nothing is unsinkable, even the iceberg meets its end.
You do a superb presentation and your research is much appreciated by us.
I am about your age and it was believed that the iceberg ripped a 300 foot gash in the hull.
@@leechandler3411 I've heard that if Titanic hit the iceberg head on it probably would have survived.
@@leechandler3411 It popped out the iron rivets. Some say had stronger steel rivets been used might have survived.
@@bobbywise2313 You are right, not only that but it bent the plates. When building the ship, steal rivets were impossible to use, in some places because it would have taken more force to do by hand and the machinery could not reach.
But I was referring to what was believed when I was child.
It is great you have such an interest.
@@leechandler3411 It is a very captivating story. I become interested as a child as well.
That 250-foot high curling wave in the thumbnail could be a problem.
I have been so depressed recently. 2 family members my aunty and uncle both diagnosed with cancer within 2 weeks of each other. your videos bring me so much joy, Mike. thank you so much for them, they are helping me not want to jump in front of a bus. you are a good man, mate*
I’m really sorry to hear you and your family are having such a tough time right now. I’m sure your love and support will make all the difference at this critical time! Thanks so much for watching and enjoying the content and I am touched to hear it brings some comfort :)
🙏
I find that so interesting that Titanic could have vanished without a trace and all that would be found are a few lifeboats with frozen cadavers. The wreck site would still be a mystery and the horror that happened that night would be unknown.
Just like _Naronic,_ only... bigger.
Sometimes it's just down to luck. I was a Marconi Radio Officer in 74, and we swerved violently to avoid an iceberg about 100 miles south of Titanic's collision. Flat calm and misty, the 1st mate noticed a sudden drop in temperature on the bridge, which alerted him. Radar often doesn't see icebergs.
Because Icebergs aren't moving at the speed the radars pick up
Not a lot of metal in an iceberg. Inconvenient!
Wow
@@ZGryphondoes radar require metal? I always figured it was like sonar, bouncing off of denser objects, not necessarily off of metal. But I'll honestly admit that I don't know shit about this kind of stuff. All I know is that we stole sonar from whales.
@@matthiasnagorski8411 No, that's true, in retrospect I don't know why I worded it that way. Weather radar images off non-metallic targets all the time. I must have been thinking about magnetic anomaly detection or something.
Beautiful visuals, as always.
A sea that calm may only occur once in a lifetime. That's unbelievable. And you make a great point about the survivors who would die of exposure in the lifeboats; if the heavier boats especially had sea water sploshing in from occasional waves it would have added to the more vulnerable cases that succumbed due to the cold water at their feet and legs.
Totally! It's amazing how short a time period they were in the water when you consider the sheer scale of the Atlantic ocean and that in the old old days people could be floating around for weeks on end without rescue! Even just one or two hours more could have seen the end of many - especially those on top of collapsible B!
The more I hear what could've happened the more I realize how lucky this disaster went. It almost seems planned (I know it wasn't) but just the luck they had is a miracle
The calm sea comment is bullshit. I've seen it at least twice on the Atlantic over a four month period. Mirror calm is rare. Flat calm isn't.
All too often we focus on how many were needlessly lost during the sinking of the Titanic. This video makes me marvel at how many were miraculously saved.
It is amazing to think of how perfect yet disastrous that entire night was. Chilling to think of how many more would have been lost if just one thing were different. Great topic for a video, Mike. Thank you.
And also had one or two things gone different, the ship would not have sank at all.
@@steveburke1519 Such as if she had hit that iceberg head on. A head on collision w as what RMS Titanic was designed to survive. Many other ship had already survived head on collisions.
By far, you are producing the best Titanic content on TH-cam. Congrats on your excellent videos. You have a knack for this stuff. Since you custom animations are so stellar, I want to make a suggestion for a future video: What did the Titanic look like from the deck of the Californian? I've always wondered how something as large as the Titanic would have appeared at ten miles away, especially as it started to dip and turn away as the Califorian crew described. They said they clearly saw each deck, which seems impossible to me from ten miles. What would the rockets have looked like? How tiny or big? I'd love to see a good animation of the view. Keep up the great work.
Yes I would like to know or see this too 🙏
In the conditions at sea that night, the cold can have strange lensing effects, a bit like a water mirage on a hot road, where distant objects are magnified and/or close objects made smaller.
Mee too
The Titanic did have a backup Marconi set with a range of about 50 miles. That set, (1.5 kW) was state of the art when first specified, I believe in 1909. By the time of installation, the technology had improved and Olympic and Titanic had the newest available, (5.0 kW) installed as the main set.
You know; everytime I see a new video on Titanic, I say to myself, what more can be said that hasn't already been told?
Then I click and watch and find something else interesting to learn.
Thanks Mike for your efforts and superb story telling. You really did have something to share that I never considered before.
I think it safe to conclude (just like Carpathia's Captain) that there was indeed a higher power intervening that night.
Yes, things could have been much worse indeed.
I may not fully believe in any one God, but I do believe there was a higher power watching over Carpathia the night she saved Titanic. That humble little ship only had a max speed of 13-14 knots. But that night, she managed to push her limits, and do 17 knots.
lol @ religious nuts.
"I don't understand something, therefore....god."
🤦♂
Another possible worse sinking would be if the ship didn't have a 2 degree port to list before the collision as even with that list it still went over 15 degrees to starboard. It's safe to say without that list she would've capsized. I believe a documentary proved this point but I can't remember which one
It's an interesting one James and something I'd be keen to look into further. Because Titanic was not fitted with longitudinal bulkheads my initial thoughts are that the crew would have been able to counteract any serious list through flooding ballast tanks and emptying others using pumps but I would need to look into it further :)
It really is amazing that it didn't capsize. The fact that it remained on somewhat of an even keel suggests they my have flooded some ballast tanks and none of the crew involved survived. On the other hand, you would think that someone would've heard the command and remembered. It's not like that order would've been whispered..lol. It's something I've always wondered about. I'm certainly no expert and I have no technical knowledge on this but it does make sense.
This is honestly overstated. The original study Parks Stephenson was referring to never said she'd capsize. Rather, she balanced at a 20 degree list in either direction (not exclusively port or starboard), which would have still been deadly. The article also cited the limitations of their model on this severe list, as it didn't model individual cabins and rooms, exaggerating the free surface effect.
@@TracyA123 from what I hear and going off of the 110 anniversary stream. They didn't counter flood or anything I'm guessing the Olympic class were stable( to a extent) when sinking. Look at britannic. She was mostly stable until the end, yeah she had a bad starboard list but it wasn't bad enough for the life boats.
@@flametitan100 interesting, I knew he mentioned something about how the port lost affected the flooding. But I stand corrected. The list may would've sped up the sinking maybe?
My friend, Mike Brady. Your videos keep getting better and so is the fan base. Please continue to bless us with these amazing videos.
It's unusual for ships to sink without capsizing. It's a small miracle that Titanic didn't turn over but instead settled gently, giving the crew time to organize the boats and call for help. From what we know there was no large-scale panic and all the boats got away, which is more than can be said for Britannic, despite its improved safety features.
If the crew made one mistake it was restarting the engines and carrying on for some after the collision. This is never featured in any of the films and probably cut their remaining time in half.
These are all great points that are often overlooked. I think it's important to keep these other scenarios in perspective, especially since Titanic is the quintessential maritime disaster we all think of.
The concept of the Titanic and all the life boats just vanishing sounds like the premise of a horror story
I like your comments, "What would happened if Titanic would have just completely disappeared?"... what a thought! The other alternate ending of, "What if both Carpathia and Titanic had sunk that night?" ... I'd never considered either of those possibilities before. Thanks for sharing the idea of those possibilities!
L. Isgrig in Northern, CA - 01/28/23
I often tell people to think of the Titanic as straddling the 19th and 20th centuries. Lots of new technologies but little practice using them. Sadly, it was her sinking that pushed these technologies to the forefront to benefit later ships.
i love these "what-if" videos of yours. it's always entertaining to see your take on possible outcomes had things not played out the way they did
I think that if the main wireless set broke, Bride and Phillips could still use the emergency one. The emergency set wasn't that powerful, I think it had about 40 miles range, but because it was night the range would be almost double and with a bit of luck it could have reached Carpathia.
Wasn't the Carpathia over 50 miles away? The message would have had to be passed along by another ship. Californian would still be in range, if they would have bothered to wake up the wireless operator.
@@gregorymoore2877 She was about 50 miles away. The backup wireless likely would have reached her.
Another horrifying way that the sinking could've been much worse was if the Boiler rooms wherent put out. If the boiler rooms where active and the water reached them, the water would make contact with the boilers, resulting in a massive buildup in steam and a massive explosion. Had this happened, it may have become one of the worst explosions in all of naval history and could've completely destroyed the ship leaving no trace that it was even there.
If the sea were choppier in the first place, I doubt the Titanic would have hit the iceberg at all, as I doubt the Captain would have wanted to go full speed in choppy water, like he would if the weather were clear and the water was still. It was a flat calm, and there was no moon and it made the bergs harder to see.
It would be absolutely terrifying to be next to such a big beast that is sinking into the ocean , a giant ship disappearing completely into the pitch blackness of the ocean depths to never see daylight ever again is crazy.
Carpathia actually did sink sometime after the Titanic tragedy. The ship was used to transport American and Canadian troops during World War 1. She was sunk by a German U-boat.
Not when she was going to save the Titanic she didn't XD
Ngl this video is amazing. The visuals, the narration, the interesting 'what if' scenarios. Keep up the good work, Mike. I eagerly await the next upload while I write my next novel- Titanic: Swallowed by the Night
A whole video dedicated to the life of Carpathia would be awesome, such a fascinating ship in her own right!
This channel is honestly amazing. Thank you for your great content!
I can personally vouch that those “mirror-glass seas” happen more than once in a life time. I have done the crossing several times and have had those millpond seas the whole way across on at least two occasions. The worst seas I’ve ever faced were in the Pacific off the coast of California and in the Southern Ocean between Antartica and the Falklands.
One could argue that had it not been a flat calm that night the lookouts would have seen the berg earlier, and Titanic might have missed it. Then again you could also argue that the flat calm enable Titanic to manoeuvre more quickly, and was the reason why it became just a glancing blow.
Well also the fact that the lookouts couldn't access the binoclars because the guy who had the key to the locker they were in was told he was no longer going to be working on the ship because of mate changes forgot to leave the key is also another reason they didn't spot it
@@beverlyarcher546 It's not. Binoculars wouldn't help them. Not in complete darkness that was that night.
Terrifying to think (in regards to the first scenario), that a ship can so quickly be enveloped by the dark and endless, cold and uncaring void that is the ocean. A magnificent marvel slipping quietly beneath the waves, thousands trapped within as it plummets to the depths. So eerie
In order to surpass her rated maximum speed, Carpathia's crew overpressured the engines to the point where they were lucky not to have blown up the ship!
If Murdoch didn't order the ship to be turned towards starboard, the iceberg would've scraped the entire starboard side of Titanic, and might cause her to capsize.
Wow, that's chilling. Hard to believe all that.
We always talk about what went wrong during Titanic's sinking, but I think this video does an excellent job noting what exactly went right. If it wasn't for all of these things, then Titanic could've been far, far worse.
What a shame it needed to be terrible at all.
Amazing video as always! I could just imagine how scary it would have been if the Carpathia had sunk, or if the Titanic's wireless set was never repaired, truly haunting. Anyways, keep up the great work Mike :)
I wonder how mike makes his animations. They are pretty high quality.
@@kaiserschlachtfelder He showed how he makes them in last month's stream
Bravo on a well thought out and researched set of possibilities. It shows just how many things actually went right for Titanic even in the midst of the overall disaster that befell her and her passengers.
Titanic had a back up wireless set that had a range between 50-80 miles. If Philips and Bride had actually followed the Marconi regulations, they'd have used that set and as a consequence not been overwhelmed by the huge 6 hour backlog of passenger messages. This in turn would've also meant they would've been relying on other ships to relay their messages, and it is also likely they might not have had as much passenger traffic, and therefore would've been listening to and relaying ice reports to Titanic's bridge where Captain Smith would then have likely slowed the ship down once he realized the true scope of the ice field and steered further south than he did.
If only there had been waves that night! No calm sea, fog, or other such weather would've meant the ship slowing down, regardless, per Smith's orders, and the waves would be crashing against the base of the berg, making it more visible!
So all the things you mention could've actually saved the ship!
I heard or read somewhere that Captain Smith was receiving the iceberg warnings but shrugged them off. Granted if there were passengers nearby he probably didn't want to scare them (in this scenario Rose and some of her family in the movie). And to think that had Titanic survived we still might not have any lifeboat training or drills.
@@stevenfeagley3227 That's largely a myth and one perpetuated by movies, like James Cameron's Titanic, and various books. What we do know is that Titanic received several messages that did not get to the bridge and the officers, most notably ice warnings from the Mesaba and Californian.
Odds are if the Titanic hadn't struck the iceberg, another ship would've. In fact, there had been several close calls, such as the S.S. Kronzprinz Willhelm that struck a small iceberg in July 8, 1907, damaging her bow, but not enough to sink her, and she limped her way to New York.
Also, the British Board of Trade, and similar organizations likely would've eventually come around and change the regulations, which is why Alexander Carlisle had the Welin davits installed on the Olympic-class ships in anticipation of just such a change.
@@mikedicenso2778 ok. So one way or another regulations would have changed. Makes sense.
@@stevenfeagley3227 There is absolutely no example of anyone on that ship “shrugging off” an ice warning. All that were delivered to the bridge were considered and heeded.
@@stevenfeagley3227 Captain Smith steered a more southern course because of the ice warnings, so the complete opposite of shrugged them off
That calm sea didn't last as we see with the voyage to New York on Carpathia, where they encountered a severe storm on their journey to New York with the survivors. Titanic, if she hadn't sunk, probably would have avoided that storm, as Carpathia took longer to get to New York due to her slower speeds.
This video alone has taught me so much more than many, many videos from other certain channels on Titanic. You have my sub! Thank you so much for the information. :)
Very interesting as usual. I was surprised to learn about the wireless technical issue that was fixed by the wireless operators hours before the fatal encounter with the ice berg ! Great work, thanks !
I was so confused by the thumbnail at first because I was like 'wait but Carpathia did sink' and then I realised you meant in 1912 😂 excellent video as always, my friend!
I was thinking of a joke to go with that statement but it wouldn't be nice
Haha 😂😂😂😂 YOU NO esrabar
So I’ve watched a few of your videos today and I just really have to thank you. You are the first person who has made me more interested in the Titanic, I don’t think I’ve ever looked this much into her crew and the stories about her even though I was interested in her as a kid. Even as my interest in ocean liners grew, I’ve just not been very interested in her. She’s still far from my favourite ocean liner, but you made me realise that there’s lots of stuff about her that I just had not heard yet, and that it really is an incredibly fascinating story (yes, yes, I know, impressive that I didn’t realise that until now but here we are). So again, thank you for making me realise that she is more than just the most famous shipwreck in the world, and thanks for yet another amazing video.
Just watching this one video earns you a new subscriber. Fantastic content that is not seen on other TH-cam channels or mainstream documentaries. Great work Sir!
I love your videos. You’re voice makes the story real and interactive and its great
How fascinating! I had considered the danger Carpathia was in by traveling at full steam and I was aware extra lookouts were placed on the bow. However, I was unaware that they barely missed an iceberg themselves. It really displays the bravery and honor of Commanders and their crews at the time. It would be easy to say that the honor so wonderfully displayed that awful night no longer exists. The Concordia and several other examples of cowardice can lead you to think that way. The reality is different. I think the overwhelming majority of crews are just as brave and honorable as the crews of Titanic, Carpathia and the other vessels that were involved that night. I thoroughly enjoyed this video Mike! 👍 The "what if" videos are definitely my favorite!🙂
It's quite the opposite. History recorded that in most cases it was basically every man for himself. There are few cases where the crew had the time and strength of character to act as Titanic's did. And by crew I do not mean the captain and senior officers, but all of the workers on the ship. Few similar situations come to mind, such as Birkenhead or perhaps Empress of Ireland > though this one sunk so fast that there wasn't much for the crew to actually do and prove their mettle. In most cases, the survival instincts kick in and then it's every man for himself and voila, you have an Arctic or Bourgogne situation. Even in Doria's case the first boats contained crew if I remember correctly, and not passengers. Although to be fair, the captain and officers remained until the last passenger was saved, and the only reason why the captain was saved was because the remaining officers refused to leave the sinking ship without him. And it took around 11 hours for the ship to sink, so there's that as well. The bottom line is that chivalry is al good and dandy until your life is on the line.
If titanic forgot the lifeboats it would be bad
Always eagerly waiting for the next upload, keep up the good work 👍👍👍
Thanks for watching, Alex!
Another great video, Mike!
Remember that the lifeboat laws in 1912 were outdated, measuring the number of lifeboats based on the gross tonnage not the number of passengers. Also, lifeboats were not viewed as lifesavers, but to transport passengers from a distress ship to a rescue ship. Also ships like Titanic were thought be their own lifeboat.
And what does this factoid have to do with the video?
@@mikedicenso2778 to inform why there where the minimum possible lifeboats on board the titanic
@@margaritapeggyschuylervanr2486 But his point still stands: what did that have to do with the video?
Wow number four. If Titanic had sunk without trace with no survivors Titanic videos would probably be called "The mystery of Titanic" and can you imagine the conspiracy theories that would have grown up around it, from being sunk by sea monsters to being sunk during a training exercise by a prototype German U-boat lol.
I am really impressed with the reasoning involved in this, as well as the very good simulations. Thanks!!!
Thank you for sharing these stories. Top Marks.
Option 2. If the seas had been rougher iceberg would have been seen earlier. So yes, better for life boats etc, but also may have meant the incident not have happened...
Beautiful visuals as in every video. The final shot of the lone boat adrift is certainly eerie.
If the seas had been rougher, I have to wonder if the lifeboats would have also swamped or capsized with their occupants. There were several incidents out here on the Pacific Coast where large wooden or steel lifeboats of similar dimensions just were overcome by the waves and drowned their occupants. The side effect of that was also that often people still onboard chose to take their chances on the sinking ship rather than the boats.
Say if one of the earlier boats capsized, would many on Titanic be more reluctant to take their chances on the main lifeboats, never mind the emergency boats or the collapsibles.
I don't think they needed to see that to be afraid. There were many well reported cases of lifeboats being capsized, dashed to bits, thrown on the rocks etc killing everyone on board. I firmly believe that was a huge part of why boats were designed to be their own life boat instead of worrying about putting everyone off in boats. It was and still is safer to stay on the boat as long as possible and ideally to transfer off onto another boat instead of a flotilla of life boats. Sadly we still haven't made an unsinkable ship and plans need made to get all off.
That was very interesting! Loved it! Congrats!
Once in a lifetime to see calm waters where she sunk wow. Thanks for another great video of this beauty of a liner.
Be interesting to know if Murdoch had decided to ram the ice berg straight on, with engines in reverse, even though the bow would have crushed, could it have survived? Would the crushed metal have effectively ‘sealed’ the rest of the ship? Together with closing the balance of the water tight doors?
It's an interesting what if, it comes down to how many compartments would've flooded in such a scenario. If the damage was limited to the first three or four compartments, she may well have made port.
@@butchs.4239 And then Murdoch might have received a severe reprimand for not trying to avoid the berg. Who knows?
There was a simulation done I believe. She'd have survived, hundreds would have died in the impact with the bow acting as a crush zone but she'd have limped into port.
And then everyone would have still believed she was unsinkable but who knows.
I was shocked when I discovered the fifth way it could've been worse - that there'd been no coal strike, meaning tickets stayed cheap and Titanic left port full of passengers, instead of half-full as she was.*
*Or half empty.
The coal strike had ended, and Titanic carried as many passengers on he maiden voyage as Olympic did on hers.
The Titanic was late making her maiden voyage. She missed the season departure due to the Olympic booting her out of the graving dock for repairs. Had she been running on her original intended schedule there may have been a much greater compliment of passengers.
I don't think that would have made it worse. As it was passengers were transferred from ships that lacked the coal to sail. She was just undersold even at a time when outbound ships were scarce. Not all that surprising as she was late, was the second in the series and really was expecting to serve with little fanfare as the little sister of the grand Olympic.
@@Dallas_K by that logic, had the titanic left on time then it would have missed the iceberg ( or hit a different one).
I love your channel keep up the great stuff!
Thanks for this material!
Regarding scenario #2 - you could argue that a choppier sea would have worked in the Titanic's favor that night as Fleet and Lee would have seen the iceberg sooner due to the waves breaking against the base. Of course, I get that you are making this comparison to examine how those conditions would have effected the sinking.
A man named Fleet on a ship that sank
A choppier sea would have also increased the visibility of the iceberg, so it's possible that Titanic never would have hit it in the first place.
Thanks for the work you do, detailed well researched videos much appreciated.
Thanks so much Ernie, that is so generous of you!
Congrats on 40k subs!!!
Imagine if the Titanic sunk, then the Carpathia sunk trying to rescue Titanic's passengers, then another liner sunk trying to rescue Carpathia's passengers, then a fourth ship sunk trying to rescue those passengers, and it went on and on. Like a pile-up on the freeway, but in the ocean.
I shouldn't have laughed at this but the way you put it pile up on the freeway made me chuckle
If it hasn't been a dead calm there would have been no thermal inversion (upside down mirage) and the iceberg might have been spotted in time. Also the surviving officer Boxhall claimed that as well as steering, William Murdoch tried to put Titanic into reverse. The rudder was most efficient with the middle screw going full ahead, even slowing down that screw might have made the difference between hitting and missing the iceberg.
Lightoiler was actually the highest ranking officer to survive he was second mate
good stuff. also, you have a great voice and presence for narration
If it weren't for Phillips and Bride we likely would’ve never even found the titanic, it would’ve just disappeared with all the people aboard
From personal experience, ice bergs are much easier to spot in rougher waters at night as you can see the water break at the water line. If you see water break multiple times in the same spot there's probably something in the water and its much easier to spot the white of water foam than it is an iceberg that looks black at night. Had there been a storm they likely would have been able to spot it earlier and avoid it.
It’s amazing to me how a disaster which resulted in 1,496 innocent lives lost was, in many ways, the best case scenario…
Really, the best case scenario would have been going at reasonable speed given the conditions and not sinking the ship.
@@Helmut83 Going at generally higher speeds in an ice field unless in immediate danger was a standard (yet outdated) practice at the time, though. So the best case scenario by that logic would be if humanity had the extreme foresight to update the outdated regulations and procedures of the whole shipping industry…
Nice one indeed Mike! Well done!
I’ve been writing a book set in 1915 where the titanic is brought up quite often because one of the characters lost someone on the ship. Your videos have been an amazing resource for cross referencing, quick facts, and just something to listen to while writing. Thank you for your videos on it!
Conversly, I believe that it was argued that if Titanic had run straight into the iceberg, the bow probably would have lodged itself into the berg. And while the bow would have been compromised and taken in some water, the fact that the ship was lodged in the ice, might have prevented the bow from going down, or greatly increased the amount of time that the ship stayed afloat. Possibly past the point of other ships arriving.
With the compartments as it was it highly plausible that only a single compartment would have been crushed. Meaning that the ship could not have sunk at all. Even with the front two compartments crushed there still would have been zero risk of sinking. It was estimated that some 50 crew would have been killed in the forequarters of the ship. But this is small compared to the actual toll.
@@smitajky I mostly agree, someone did an analysis conluded that the forepeak and first cargo hold would be crushed, though I thinkthere might be some damage slightly further aft in the second cargo hold and the mail room. Also passengers in the front might feel the impact fairly strongly.
We dove into this in grade 7, since our teachers grandpa was a carpenter on her! It was determined that although she would travel much slower, she would not have sunk. But in the moment, he wanted to avoid damage altogether.. And even though he’d saved the ship, he probably been reprimanded for the damage not knowing how bad things could have gone..
@ClubTepes - To the best of my understanding, that's a theory which was advanced by some prior to the discovery of the wreck - it might possibly have been informed by the case of another White Star vessel, "SS Suevic", which ran aground at full speed on the rocks of The Lizard at Cornwall in the UK - as a result of which she was successfully evacuated, salvaged (which required the removal of her entire bow section) and towed - minus her bow and with her watertight doors closed - to Belfast for repairs.
This theory does not take into account several important factors, however. Firstly, for decades, the myth of the "300 foot 'gash'" persisted - neither the press, the public, nor either of the inquiries could conceive that "Titanic" could have sunk without the iceberg literally ripping open the steel plating along 300 feet of the starboard side. As it turns out, Edward Wilding (Thomas Andrews' deputy at Harland & Wolff) and his team knew differently and had in fact calculated the actual nature and area of damage with surprising accuracy back in 1912 - but no-one wanted to hear it at the time. It wasn't until Ballard's 1986 expedition that a close look at the starboard hull was possible, and what they discovered was not torn metal, but a buckling of the hull plating and consequent popping of the rivets holding the plates together.
Note that this neither implies that the plating was weak nor the rivets substandard (as some have tried to claim in more recent times)... Rather it's a simple matter of physics and metallurgy plus a bit of engineering know-how. "Titanic's" tonnage was almost four times that of "Suevic", and her cruising speed almost 10 knots faster - as near as damn-it double that of the older liner. "Titanic" may have been the largest and heaviest man-made moving object at the time, but the mass of the kind of iceberg with which she was believed to have collided was significantly greater. Once you take her greater tonnage and speed (compared to "Suevic") into account, the forces involved in the collision become multiplied exponentially. Theoretically, a direct collision with the iceberg would have at worst collapsed the bow up to her collision bulkhead (killing any passengers or crew forward of that point) - but that theory doesn't take into account how the impact forces would have been propagated through the hull structure. The dynamic loading of those forces would have been beyond immense, and would have been propagated through the hull plating to the rivets holding those plates together. Remember that in the actual event, due to the mass of the iceberg, even a glancing blow was enough to buckle the plating and pop rivets for as long as the hull was in contact with the ice. Now imagine how much greater the forces involved would have been in the event of a direct collision - you may have seen videos of car safety tests demonstrating head-on collisions, and if you have, you can see that the chassis bends downwards and the plating bends outwards on both sides. It's likely that had "Titanic" collided directly with the iceberg, the bending forces on the plating would have caused rivets to fail much further back than the collision bulkhead on both sides, leading to catastrophic water ingestion on both sides and the ship sinking in a matter of minutes rather than hours.
If Murdock would have let the ship hit the iceberg head on without taking evasive action they would have crucified him for the damage to the ship afterwards, labeled an idiot because if he'd have just ordered the helm hard over the ship *surely* would have missed iceberg. He would have been held responsible for the deaths of all the people in the forward 100 or so feet of the ship that would have been killed instantly by the head on impact at full speed. Hindsight is 20/20...
When I was young my mom used to think I could have been someone on the Titanic, on account of a picture I had drawn of a ship before knowing the story. She said it was uncanny how similar they looked. I have since been highly curious in whether past lives could be possible, or they are just amazing coincidences.
Of course past lives are possible. Look into Tibetan Buddhist lamas.
Coincidence.
Many ships look like the Titanic it's a coincidence
Media has been bashing Titanics makers and crew all the time, but tge truth is, they did the best they could with what they were given
I actually genuinely agree with you
Viola is main character material. She survived all 3 Olympic Class ships. Absolutely incredible lady.
The wireless operators were not supposed to fix the wireless machine after it broke. The rules were that they were wait until they got to land and hand it over to Marconi for fixing. But the operators decided to fix it overnight, thus saving lives
Titanic actually had a backup set. It was shorter in range than the main set, but was still pretty effective. Had they switched to the shorter ranged one, the two Marconi operators wouldn't have been overwhelmed with passenger traffic and likely they'd not have been tired and grumpy, either, thus no "SHUT UP! SHUT UP! I AM WORKING CAPE RACE!" to the Californian's operator.
6:02 that's a good point - in the Great Storm of 1953, lifeboats launched from the Princess Victoria actually smashed against the side of the ferry killing all those on board
It had allot of heroes that night but the wireless operators by taking the initiative to fix the system no doubt impacted the chances of rescue.
Everyone had a role to play that fateful night and it won’t be forgotten.
Thank you for producing yet another thoroughly remarkable vignette on one of the highest calibre TH-cam channels with a historical focus. The subject of Titanic never ceases to amaze as a more contemporary Greek tragedy. The scenarios you mentioned certainly would have led to an even greater tragedy, most notably where the world's largest passenger ship disappears without a trace, like the SS Pacific and so many others before her, and on her maiden voyage. That radio silence would have added sheer terror to the shaken confidence and subsequent superstitions seen in the reality that played out. A second iceberg collision by the Carpathia would have been catastrophic. Additionally, had a sizeable amount of coal had not been allegedly shoveled to the port side of Titanic, to help efforts in putting out a starboard coal fire, the incoming seawater that gave Titanic an initial five degree list to starboard would have been worse. Some computer simulations indicate Titanic would have capsized on her starboard side an hour before her real-life sinking were it not for the counterbalanced weight of coal on her port side resulting in the 2-3 degree list to port before the collision, as reported by some survivors, including Lawrence Beesley. Your content is superb and presentation style is always very polished - many thanks.
Great Video!
Thank you for posting this video. The Titanic was a terrible disaster that claimed too many lives, but this video has shown that there is still much to be thankful for, and that things could have gone much worse.
Captain Rostron really said "simply we are built differently"
Super interesting!! Thanks a million!
Nice video, very interesting!
Excellent presentation......many thanks
I Just Love This Type Of Videos What A Great Storyteller You Really Are Mike 🤗❤️
Cheers Chad!
I’ve never heard the tale of Bride and Phillips breaking protocol to fix the wireless. That is very interesting and stopped a Bermuda Triangle type mystery from happening.
Subscribed. This is a hell of a channel man, thank you for all you do.
I digg your content g!! You even dress the part!! Excellent work gangsta!! Even your accent is immaculate!!
What a great video!
4:24 Christ... Violet's description of the sea is wonderfully poetic!
Great video, Mike
Was wondering if you have thought about doing a video on the mysterious third ship some of the passengers claim to have seen (commonly supposed to have been either the Californian or the Mount Temple)
Holly guacamole, to think how close they were to it being EVEN WORSE than it was. Well done video, virtual applause
Hi Michael absolutely amazing work! I was wondering could you do a video on what would have happened if Titanic rammed the iceberg instead of taking it on the side? Thank you
"Things could have been far far worse..." an excellent opening line for any good story!