Hi all! Thanks so much for watching this video and I'm glad so many of you have found it interesting. I do have a few corrections to mention: 1. In this video I erroneously refer to Charles Lightoller as Titanic's First Officer. He was in fact replaced by William Murdoch in this capacity and re-designated as the Second Officer for the voyage. 2. I also refer to water pressure as increasing exponentially; this is incorrect, it increases linearly with depth.
Nice outfit! Are you wearing clothing that matches the uniforms of White Star Lines? If so, is there an episode of your show where you talk about what you are wear and the White Star Line uniforms?
@@TomBatemanRT85 Hey Tom! I dress in s fairly old-fashioned way in my videos, the kind of outfit a chap would wear during the day at any point from about 1900-1950. That said there were some real nuances of Edwardian menswear that would be really interesting to go through!
@@OceanlinerDesigns the outfit looks good on you. It’s a nice touch for your videos. I would love to see a video about the uniforms of the White Star Line.
That happened to a woman on the Lusitania, albeit with the funnel itself and not the uptake hole. She was pounded by the water and covered in soot...but she actually survived.
One theory I’ve seen comes from when they were filming the 1997 Titanic movie. During the production, they found that they couldn’t get collapsible lifeboats C and D onto the davits with the shroud cables in place and they had to remove them. It’s theorized that Lightoller and Ismay would have had to do something similar, leading to the cables being released, weakening the funnel shroud.
@@Welv1987 Eh, they would have been relatively cold by that point. If water is coming up from the inside, the boilers have been cold for a good while and with an OAT of around 0°C it wouldn't take much for them to cool down before the water gets to them. They just weren't built for this kind of load.
Having to slacken the support lines to account for the chimneys expanding with the heat of use is pretty crazy. It’s always interesting to learn of all the little parts that make up massive endeavors
I never thought about the funnels internal structure, but that makes sense. Assuming that the inside of the funnels was like a column of air that suddenly was filled with water is a logic explanation why funnels 1 and 2 collapsed.
I THINK he's saying the interior of the funnels was Empty of water and therefore the growing water pressure on the exterior of the funnels caused a structural failure....exterior water pressure pushed the foot of the funnels off their seats leaving black gaping holes leading to the very bottom of the ship, filled with nothing....the water poured in taking some with it into the literally coal black depths....
@@manuelkong10 Correct they would have basically been pinched at the base and imploded. The water level inside can lag behind significantly for the simple reason that water needs to find a way in and air needs to find a way out. As the sinking progresses in speed you can get large differences in pressure as a result until structures begin failing as a result and creating new openings.
The production quality of this video is top-notch. Such a well presented, well narrated and visually pleasing video that's easy to follow along too. Well done my man.
@@OceanlinerDesigns I'm just now brand new to your site and wow, I'm impressed by this analysis. I had heard of other theories of why the funnels fell, but never this one about the inner casings being damaged by the water pressure from within internally compromising the funnels from the inside out. Fascinating and very well presented and laid out. I'm a fan of your channel and have just subscribed. Thank you for sharing these videos with the rest of us. I'm a lifelong Titanic follower and really appreciate the work you put into your presentation. Thank you for doing what you do!
I mean that for an object as tall as a six-story building the plating was comparatively thin, thin enough that without support the structures collapse flat and 'pancake', as seen during Berengaria's scrapping. ~Mike
I cannot imagine what it was like for the people in the water struggling to survive and look up and see those enormously huge funnels falling down. I know a lot of people were crushed when those came down😢😢😢❤️❤️❤️
D’oh! Who'd have thought a gigantic ocean liner’s funnel system would be so complicated! Funnels the great have fallen, have fallen. It was horrific, every time I think about what happened on that ship that night, I am deeply saddened.
Very good and informative video! By the way, I could suggest you to talk about why in the popular media, the sinking of the Titanic was always represented as the ship sinking in a single piece, like the movie "A Night To Remember" from 1958 that you showed scenes in the video. Why It wasn't until the discovery of the wreck in 1985 when we started to see the sinking with the breakup in the popular media? Implying we had testimonies of people saying that they watched the ship split in two, that would be a great video idea!
That's a great idea. It seems survivor testimony was overwhelmingly leaning towards some kind of breakup - but that they were largely ignored or dismissed. ~Mike
@@OceanlinerDesigns this is true. Renunciation of such testimony might be explained by the psychological condition known as 'confirmation bias' - the concept applied here is that to the general public as well as the juridic benches, the largest man-made floating object could not possibly break apart considering her complex advancements in marine engineering. It's further interesting to reflect on the fact that while many eyewitness testimonies conveyed the reality of break-up, the investigative bodies which heard this on both sides of the Atlantic turned a blind eye. Was it a final line? A ship of Titanic's proportions might succumb to the forces of nature in sinking but was the idea that she might disintegrate at the very end just too much to bear? That debate aside, we should all remind ourselves of the incredible resilience of a ship and crew that kept their girl alight until the last minutes. That IS incredible!
I had always heard that the White Star Line didn't want the public to think that their ship construction was weaker than their competitors, so they hid the witness testimony saying that the Titanic broke in half from the public consciousness.
@@fnaffoxy1987 Young Jack Thayer's drawings of the ship breaking in two still survive today. He drew what he witnessed from his lifeboat, but were generally disregarded on account of his youth, and lack of corroboration from others. Maybe he just had better night vision.
Just imagine the pure terror a person would feel getting sucked back in the ship in pitch black darkness ... Idk what would get you first the cold, or drowning, or a heart attack
MB, Thank you for another great video. A semi-related subject that interests me is how the wreckage on the ocean floor came to have the upper decks deflected downward and the sides of the hull bulged outward at the break. I've seen all manner of explanations, such as the idea that the bow section somehow angled upward to crush the upper decks following the breakup. My own theory can be illustrated by taking the cardboard tube from a roll of paper towels and bending it. The cross section of the tube ovals with the shorter axis being in the plane of the bend. This happens with any thin-wall tube section regardless of whether it is circular or rectangular. None of the animations I've seen of the breakup show this phenomenon. -GV
Thanks for posting! Love your content on all your video posts. I recall Robert Ballard saying that there is no sign of any of the funnels anywhere in the debris field of Titanic and have often wondered what happened to them and where are they? Thanks again for posting, great work!
Excellent video I've learned many points today the detail you gave was top notch and the way you explained it all made it easy for me to understand thank you my grandson who is fascinated by the titanic is now watching this
You make an interesting point here, I thought that when those guy wires broke outside the ship while she got much lower in the water, that was what caused the number 1 and a little later number 2 funnel to fall over. However, it was because of the weight of water getting inside the ship that pushed the inner funnel casings in instead that made the guy wires break, then there wasn't any support and the funnels started to fall over the side of the ship.
Coulda been a possible small scale boiler explosion possibly from boiler room 3 maybe not being entirely evacuated or put out at the time the funnel began to fall
The pressure being the main cause makes a lot of sense. I had always assumed that maybe the expansion joint flexed so much that the cables broke and that caused the funnel to fall, but thinking about where the cables are attached to the deck in regards to the expansion joint, I was never convinced my theory was correct. I just couldn't think of a more plausible reason. But your video really got me thinking about how I had probably underestimated just how much pressure that various parts of the ship were being put under. It can be easy to forget that even when the ship hasn't sunk that deep yet, the forces acting on it can be insanely strong.
Loved it , i really think now how interesting and challenging must have been designing it . For content and future videos you could talk about some ideas of what would like " future " models of transatlantic ships .
It always seem to me that the breaking of the forward expansion joint contributed to the failure of funnel #1. The funnel, I think, was secured by wires both forward and aft of the break and, at very least, the break would have contributed to the weakening of the rivets running at the deck line. To me, this expansion joint failure was also evidence supporting the failure of the aft expansion joint which, again my opinion, is the most likely culprit in the breaking of the hull on the surface in the opposite direction as is commonly believed. Thanks, I enjoy your videos and your love of these great old ships and the tremendous work that went into them. I share that.
I have to admit that I had become bored with any Titanic discussion,at times it seemed her sinking was the only maritime disaster to have ever occurred. However,I find your take on the sinking with particular attention to the physics of the sinking to be very interesting. I’m interested in all things maritime and glad I found your channel.
There were easily over a hundred people in that area trying to get onto the last lifeboats. Between water being sucked into vents, funnel hole, grand staircase, and the funnel falling, this area was a death trap. I believe this is how the officers in that area died. The fidley vent was opened to the boiler room. A large open void with all that water flowing into it. Thats why the ship sank so fast after that. Lightoller o ly survived due to the push of hot air n steam from the boiler rooms. One survivors account was that when the wave washed over the deck, he found himself surrounded by the hair of women, and the bodies of womem and children. Chilling.
Perhaps the four loud explosions heard within the ship as it sank was actually the implosion of the funnel casings? Shortly thereafter it makes sense that the funnel would fail..
@@adriwidjaja True. By the time funnels 2 and 3 failed, I imagine that many parts of the ship were failing and the noise created would make it difficult to know exactly what is breaking and where. Plus, I don't think many people midship, and aft survived. However, there were more than a few survivors who were near the bow section and close to funnel one and they are the source of these reports of muffled explosions deep inside the ship. Making the assumption it was boilers seemed very logical to me, until I saw this presentation. After watching this, I think it is also equally reasonable to consider that at least one of those explosions was actually the implosion of the casing around the number one funnel. Impossible to know for sure, but it is at least a reasonable speculation given the construction details. Keep in mind this, the WSL successfully suppressed from the public the first hand eye witness accounts of the ship splitting apart. Who knows what else might have been dismissed or simply ignored in testimony from passengers. Plus, all of those eye witnesses are traumatized.
Wow, you're the one for the job! Excellent voice, accent and clarity of speech; your Germen sounds awesome; you dress thr part and manage to look both "of the period" and a man of today. Well researched, well presented.
This video shows that funnels are more than cylindrical structures that vent smoke out of the ship. You did well. However, there is one detail that you got wrong: While Charles Lightoller did sign on to the _Titanic_ as first officer, the transfer of Henry Wilde from _Olympic_ to _Titanic_ caused Chief Officer Murdoch to be bumped down to first officer, and First Officer Lightoller was "demoted" to second officer. David Blair, the original second officer, was transferred elsewhere, not yet knowing of his good fortune. I am under the impression that the two aft funnels fell for different reasons: Funnel four likely fell due to the momentum of the stern falling back, while the third funnel collapsed because the ship broke apart from beneath it. On a final note, if you owned a shipping line, what naming convention and livery would your ships' hulls and especially funnels have?
Good catch on Mr Lightoller - can you tell I have spent too much time thinking about the mechanics and structure and not enough time thinking about the personalities? Haha I think you're right about Number 3 - the superstructure - and casings, or "seating" as Mr Wilding puts it - likely just disintegrated beneath it. I like your question! I am Australian so would name them after our gulfs and bays.. SS Otway, SS Carpentaria, SS Denham. I am thinking dark green funnel with a golden band. :) ~Mike
Your artwork has helped me a lot with my own artwork of ships, and I thank you for that. It's rather telling that there are groups of people in any subject where, while they can and do know a lot about each other's strengths, some specialize in technical aspects and others can remember the details of the stories. And these people compliment each other's shortcomings to create an endgoal greater than any one of them. My digital sketches have many different namesakes, but the ships of my hypothetical line, which I've dubbed the United States Motor Mail Company, would be named after the chemical elements. Each group of elements, like the Halogens or the Noble Gases, have their ships as sister ships to each other. As I find the prefix "SS" to be both cliché and outdated, almost all the ships in the fleet are powered by diesel motors, with two types of exceptions: Ships whose namesakes exist in a gaseous state at room temperature, like the _Argon_ and the _Nitrogen,_ are powered by gas turbines, and as such have the prefix "GTS." Any elements whose isotopes are all radioactive have their corresponding ships have the prefix "NS," for nuclear ship. Their liveries consist of a dark cyan keel and a white hull, with a gold band separating the hull from the superstructure. The funnels would be cyan with a white band topped in black, probably because cyan is my favorite color. I did not think it through having gold on white. These ships, with many others, can be found on my Facebook and DeviantArt pages, Maritime Artwork of Daniel Huffman. www.deviantart.com/shipping-architect And now I feel guilty for advertising my sketches on your channel....
Probably because the funnels are far weaker than the ship structure, as mentioned in the video they were only a half inch thick plating or something, while the hull plates were much thicker. Funnels were more of a decorative piece, and only needed to carry exhaust gases, so they didn't need to be strong, and being so tall and high they need to be lightweight to avoid the ship being too top-heavy. I wonder if they also tended to rust out on ships in service quicker than everything else? I know that's one of the faster-rusting components on cars (except those that are stainless steel for this reason), as they have hot gas flowing through them that tends to burn off any protective coating or paint, heat speeds corrosion, and car exhaust is moist. Not sure if coal would have the same problems as coal smoke isn't as moist, and the soot might create somewhat of a protective coating on the inside - not to mention that corrosion is a major problem on ships as a whole due to being in salt water.
@@quillmaurer6563 I believe there would have been a fair bit of corrosion inside the funnels over time due to the heat and paint failing from that and the high amount of sulphur from the coal being corrosive
I'm always amazed by how much attention is paid to the minutiae of the sinking. Not that I don't love it, just that it's funny. In any other event like this, nobody asks questions like "When did the big piece detach?" or "Did the stern go straight down or at an angle?" or "What happened to the deck chairs after they were rearranged?"
Simple… The cables holding them in place, were not designed to withstand that much weight, so they snapped…the cables were only there to easy the forces of nature they’d face on a level sea, but the ship was at a minimum angle of 40 degrees…it’s all simple math.
This explains the aft two funnels - that's pretty much what he said - but the forward two collapsed far sooner, at no greater angle than would be expected in rough seas. He explained all that in the video.
IDK what it is but your videos have sparked a deep interest in Vintage ship disatsters and hostory. Ive always been a railway/automotive buff myself, but i have a new found fasination with the world of maritime.
I like your Emden picture in the background! Also the real reason why the Olympic class had four funnels was because their designers didn’t want the ships to look less powerful than their competitors. They were originally designed with three but the fourth was fitted for show, and I think was even used to store pets of passengers?
Hi Steven, Glad you like the Emden pic! The fourth funnel still served an important role as a ventilator for the machinery spaces, galleys etc. It is thought on Titanic that dogs might have been kept in a kennels at the base of funnel number 4 although in the deckhouse below and now the funnel itself. :) ~Mike
I've always thought the forward funnel collapsed when the bulkhead between the bow and superstructure gave wave around two fifteen am. The bulkhead gave way, there was an enormous inrush of water, hence the big wave everybody recounted. The shape of the Boat Deck changed and the funnel dislodged.
Basic to the topic: funnel design planned for downward force into the ship due to gravity, plus lateral forces due to pitch (rise and fall bow-to-stern) &/or yaw (lateral tipping along that fore-aft axis.) By your fine analysis: sidewise water pressure crumpling Funnels 1&2 at their bases, plus the bow-down increase gradually turning gravity on its ear (so to speak), likely brought on their collapse.
Can't imagine what it would be like to get sucked down into the ship's boiler. You're already in trouble from the ship sinking itself but now you're doomed for sure.
I’ve wondered about the physics of the funnel collapse since the day I became engulfed in Titanic history. I’ve always thought to myself: how can something made of steel designed to endure to pitch and roll of heavy seas just crumple and fall. Your presentation of the possible cause is solid. 👌🏻Thank you.👏🏻
Thankyou sir! You're right, the idea of gravity alone bringing these down does not track. Something much more insidious was at play and I think Wilding was absolutely on the right track. ~Mike
It pretty much was. It was used for ventilation, but wasn't really necessary for that, certainly didn't need to be that big. If wanting just an exhaust vent it would have been far smaller, but they wanted to put a fourth funnel for aesthetics and used it for this purpose since it was there.
I haven’t finished the video at the time of me writing this, but my theory is that the wires (that I can never remember how to spell the name of) snapped weakening the support on the funnels and then as she went down the increase of pressure caused them to break free of the titanic
I recently saw a news reel from 1985 when Ballard discovered the wreck. He said in that news conference that the RoV ran into the second funnel exploring the boat deck. That would mean the second funnel was still connected to the ship? Hard to imagine it held on throughout that entire decent to the sea floor but, that's what Ballard said, look it up the video if you don't believe me.
Can you do a video on what happened the the funnels after she sunk. Where they went and where they are now because I dont know where they are now. I think they might have disintegrated.
I answer because I just thought about that like 2 days ago and made some research 🙃 I found the same answer everywhere, as you said, they just disintegrated and probably really fast. In my opinion, they were probably crushed by the pressure when they reached the bottom of the Atlantic just after the sinking 😅 I don’t have proofs but at least they don’t exist anymore today lmao 😂
In the Ghosts of the Abyss book, the author writes about one possibility - that the crew disconnected or severed the shrouds because they were supposedly blocking Collapsibles A and B from being taken from the deckhouse roof to the boat deck. I think that's a ridiculous hypothesis. Firstly, they weren't really blocking the collapsibles. Secondly, no way would seamen have cut funnel shrouds knowing the huge thing would fall. Thirdly, how exactly would they have disconnected the shrouds even if they wanted to?
No mention was made of the cold water hitting that hot metal, iron, not even steel, causing increased brittleness. There was also probably a surge of steam between the covers and the liners as the very cold water hit that 300+ degree iron, not to mention the steam and hot gasses forced up from the submerged fireboxes. It's a wonder the boilers themselves didn't explode, though I understand some of the Black Gang gave up their lives to vent the boilers and empty the fire boxes in the boiler rooms that could. Some others stayed behind to keep the lights running as long as possible as well. Unsung heroes.
Finally, someone made a video about it! I was so frustrated with the fact the community didn't make an observation on the cause of the funnels' collapse.
water pressure was what I thought it was. I also thought that It could be angles that the cables would have a bit trouble handling. But then again cables hold on to bridges just fine.
First, I'd like to state that I'm glad that over time, the amount of Titanic, and angle of her depicted above water during her final minutes, has steadily decreased! Even as late as 1997, James Cameron had nearly half the ship above water before she broke in half before her death plunge. Back to topic of funnels: The likely reason for the toppling during sinking was that fact that at least two of the funnels on the Olympic sisters had guywires attached to them that were anchored on both sides of an expansion joint in her upper decks. As the ship tilted down and forward, the superstructure surely strained(distorted under the forces of sinking) opening those joints up to varying degrees. Those forces, tugging on the guywires, combined with increasing forward downward decline, unanchored or snapped those guywires, leaving those funnels to the whim of gravity.
Water pressure is a good theory, I had assumed that it had been the temperature difference, Hot air from the boiler on the inside meeting the cold Atlantic water from the outside. The inside skin would be elongated due to the heat and the outside skin would shrink when in contact with the ocean, causing warping and would destabilize the funnel base causing the collapse.
Mike, Also remember that these places would have been hot, so the shock of cold water hitting these hot uptakes would have added so much more stress into the metal, potentially causing it to crack and shear
9:05 - 9:12 In 1997 film, one of the ways the character Fabrizio was originally going to die was through this very process. The storyboards showcase him managing to somehow survive the funnel's collapse, only to then be sucked into the void left by the funnel.
Hi all! Thanks so much for watching this video and I'm glad so many of you have found it interesting. I do have a few corrections to mention:
1. In this video I erroneously refer to Charles Lightoller as Titanic's First Officer. He was in fact replaced by William Murdoch in this capacity and re-designated as the Second Officer for the voyage.
2. I also refer to water pressure as increasing exponentially; this is incorrect, it increases linearly with depth.
Nice outfit! Are you wearing clothing that matches the uniforms of White Star Lines? If so, is there an episode of your show where you talk about what you are wear and the White Star Line uniforms?
@@TomBatemanRT85 Hey Tom! I dress in s fairly old-fashioned way in my videos, the kind of outfit a chap would wear during the day at any point from about 1900-1950. That said there were some real nuances of Edwardian menswear that would be really interesting to go through!
@@OceanlinerDesigns the outfit looks good on you. It’s a nice touch for your videos. I would love to see a video about the uniforms of the White Star Line.
Titanic 2 engine cylinder engineering diesel generator room
@@OceanlinerDesigns yeah but you look incredibly good in it Mike :)
Man, the idea of being sucked into the bowels of the sinking ship through the holes left by the funnels falling away is genuinely terrifying.
I can only imagine anyone getting sucked in would’ve gone straight into the boilers 😱
That happened to a woman on the Lusitania, albeit with the funnel itself and not the uptake hole. She was pounded by the water and covered in soot...but she actually survived.
@@DerpyPossum bruh. I would never get near the ocean ever again.
I got a feeling it was the water that made them fall....
@@mikeborgmann because it was
One theory I’ve seen comes from when they were filming the 1997 Titanic movie. During the production, they found that they couldn’t get collapsible lifeboats C and D onto the davits with the shroud cables in place and they had to remove them.
It’s theorized that Lightoller and Ismay would have had to do something similar, leading to the cables being released, weakening the funnel shroud.
this, combined to the thermal shock when they touched water
@@Welv1987 Eh, they would have been relatively cold by that point. If water is coming up from the inside, the boilers have been cold for a good while and with an OAT of around 0°C it wouldn't take much for them to cool down before the water gets to them.
They just weren't built for this kind of load.
To think her whistle survived largely intact all these years and still functions
Agreed - and I do wish they could blast it with steam at high pressure!
~Mike
Hey look another furry
do you think anyone got sucked into the void that the funnel left when it fell
randomrazr I frankly think yes.
@@wadpaw thats not a furry. its called a bronie.
Having to slacken the support lines to account for the chimneys expanding with the heat of use is pretty crazy.
It’s always interesting to learn of all the little parts that make up massive endeavors
I never thought about the funnels internal structure, but that makes sense. Assuming that the inside of the funnels was like a column of air that suddenly was filled with water is a logic explanation why funnels 1 and 2 collapsed.
I THINK he's saying the interior of the funnels was Empty of water and therefore the growing water pressure on the exterior of the funnels caused a structural failure....exterior water pressure pushed the foot of the funnels off their seats leaving black gaping holes leading to the very bottom of the ship, filled with nothing....the water poured in taking some with it into the literally coal black depths....
@@manuelkong10 Correct they would have basically been pinched at the base and imploded. The water level inside can lag behind significantly for the simple reason that water needs to find a way in and air needs to find a way out. As the sinking progresses in speed you can get large differences in pressure as a result until structures begin failing as a result and creating new openings.
The production quality of this video is top-notch. Such a well presented, well narrated and visually pleasing video that's easy to follow along too. Well done my man.
Thanks so much!
~Mike
Let's be honest, we've all come because we're secret funnel enthusiasts
Who doesn't love the funnels of any steamship? The funnel is probably the coolest part!
@@CPorter -Along with the ship's "Screw Propellers." ; )
@Biden Sucks - Nice. Can I call you, BS?
@Biden Sucks clever euphemism
You can't spell FUNNEL without FUN!
Incredible analysis, a very welcome addition to the community
Very kind of you to say, thankyou!
~Mike
@@OceanlinerDesigns I'm just now brand new to your site and wow, I'm impressed by this analysis. I had heard of other theories of why the funnels fell, but never this one about the inner casings being damaged by the water pressure from within internally compromising the funnels from the inside out. Fascinating and very well presented and laid out. I'm a fan of your channel and have just subscribed. Thank you for sharing these videos with the rest of us. I'm a lifelong Titanic follower and really appreciate the work you put into your presentation. Thank you for doing what you do!
Great video! Didn’t expect to learn about the structure of the funnel and it’s uptake, that was great! Keep up the amazing work!
Thankyou!
~Mike
These videos are excellent. Good length, no melodrama, great narrative and graphics, and a touch of wit. 👍🏻
This is a extremely underrated video
Love this channel .. this dude is wise beyond his years and his illustrations are simply amazing.
Who would have ever imagined a video about funnels could be so, so (wait for it)--riveting.
Very well done. You kept my attention for every second.
Thanks for the kind words! Good pun too!
Buu-dum-tiss
TH-cam algorithm recommending me things I didn't even know I WANTED to know about.
The funnels were 'thin" at 1/2 inch thickness? The Titanic's hull thickness was only 6/10 inch fore and aft and 1 inch amidships.
I mean that for an object as tall as a six-story building the plating was comparatively thin, thin enough that without support the structures collapse flat and 'pancake', as seen during Berengaria's scrapping.
~Mike
@@OceanlinerDesigns - Fair enough! Thanks!
@Floyd1504 A mixer on a cement truck is only 1/4" !
@@LowellMorgan A cement mixer is also not 6 stories tall, nor is it made in the same way as these funnels.
@@whackyjinak4978 - The stack isn't tumbling tons of concrete.
I cannot imagine what it was like for the people in the water struggling to survive and look up and see those enormously huge funnels falling down. I know a lot of people were crushed when those came down😢😢😢❤️❤️❤️
D’oh! Who'd have thought a gigantic ocean liner’s funnel system would be so complicated!
Funnels the great have fallen, have fallen.
It was horrific, every time I think about what happened on that ship that night, I am deeply saddened.
Very good and informative video! By the way, I could suggest you to talk about why in the popular media, the sinking of the Titanic was always represented as the ship sinking in a single piece, like the movie "A Night To Remember" from 1958 that you showed scenes in the video. Why It wasn't until the discovery of the wreck in 1985 when we started to see the sinking with the breakup in the popular media? Implying we had testimonies of people saying that they watched the ship split in two, that would be a great video idea!
That's a great idea. It seems survivor testimony was overwhelmingly leaning towards some kind of breakup - but that they were largely ignored or dismissed.
~Mike
@@OceanlinerDesigns this is true. Renunciation of such testimony might be explained by the psychological condition known as 'confirmation bias' - the concept applied here is that to the general public as well as the juridic benches, the largest man-made floating object could not possibly break apart considering her complex advancements in marine engineering. It's further interesting to reflect on the fact that while many eyewitness testimonies conveyed the reality of break-up, the investigative bodies which heard this on both sides of the Atlantic turned a blind eye. Was it a final line? A ship of Titanic's proportions might succumb to the forces of nature in sinking but was the idea that she might disintegrate at the very end just too much to bear? That debate aside, we should all remind ourselves of the incredible resilience of a ship and crew that kept their girl alight until the last minutes. That IS incredible!
I had always heard that the White Star Line didn't want the public to think that their ship construction was weaker than their competitors, so they hid the witness testimony saying that the Titanic broke in half from the public consciousness.
@@fnaffoxy1987 Young Jack Thayer's drawings of the ship breaking in two still survive today. He drew what he witnessed from his lifeboat, but were generally disregarded on account of his youth, and lack of corroboration from others.
Maybe he just had better night vision.
@@Phaaschh That's really interesting
Just imagine the pure terror a person would feel getting sucked back in the ship in pitch black darkness ... Idk what would get you first the cold, or drowning, or a heart attack
This man has an SMS Emden in the background. He is a man of culture
Good eye!
~Mike
It’s great to get such a detailed and well informed explanation, please keep it up!
MB, Thank you for another great video. A semi-related subject that interests me is how the wreckage on the ocean floor came to have the upper decks deflected downward and the sides of the hull bulged outward at the break. I've seen all manner of explanations, such as the idea that the bow section somehow angled upward to crush the upper decks following the breakup. My own theory can be illustrated by taking the cardboard tube from a roll of paper towels and bending it. The cross section of the tube ovals with the shorter axis being in the plane of the bend. This happens with any thin-wall tube section regardless of whether it is circular or rectangular. None of the animations I've seen of the breakup show this phenomenon. -GV
Thanks for posting! Love your content on all your video posts. I recall Robert Ballard saying that there is no sign of any of the funnels anywhere in the debris field of Titanic and have often wondered what happened to them and where are they? Thanks again for posting, great work!
There probably already rotten
Excellent video I've learned many points today the detail you gave was top notch and the way you explained it all made it easy for me to understand thank you my grandson who is fascinated by the titanic is now watching this
Officer Lightholler was the 2nd Officer on Titanic. The 1st officer was Officer Murdoch
Edit 1: oh god 23 likes
Yes an obvious error on my part, thanks for correcting.
~Mike
@@OceanlinerDesigns welcome
Well he actually was a First Officer for a while, before captain Smith's "officer shuffle" :D
You make an interesting point here, I thought that when those guy wires broke outside the ship while she got much lower in the water, that was what caused the number 1 and a little later number 2 funnel to fall over. However, it was because of the weight of water getting inside the ship that pushed the inner funnel casings in instead that made the guy wires break, then there wasn't any support and the funnels started to fall over the side of the ship.
Great explanation!
Now I’m interested in your take on this debate: Did the 2nd funnel explode when it collapsed and if so why?
Coulda been a possible small scale boiler explosion possibly from boiler room 3 maybe not being entirely evacuated or put out at the time the funnel began to fall
Was there ever a ship that did lose a funnel mid voyage? That sounds like a hell of a story.
The pressure being the main cause makes a lot of sense. I had always assumed that maybe the expansion joint flexed so much that the cables broke and that caused the funnel to fall, but thinking about where the cables are attached to the deck in regards to the expansion joint, I was never convinced my theory was correct. I just couldn't think of a more plausible reason. But your video really got me thinking about how I had probably underestimated just how much pressure that various parts of the ship were being put under. It can be easy to forget that even when the ship hasn't sunk that deep yet, the forces acting on it can be insanely strong.
Loved it , i really think now how interesting and challenging must have been designing it .
For content and future videos you could talk about some ideas of what would like " future " models of transatlantic ships .
It always seem to me that the breaking of the forward expansion joint contributed to the failure of funnel #1. The funnel, I think, was secured by wires both forward and aft of the break and, at very least, the break would have contributed to the weakening of the rivets running at the deck line. To me, this expansion joint failure was also evidence supporting the failure of the aft expansion joint which, again my opinion, is the most likely culprit in the breaking of the hull on the surface in the opposite direction as is commonly believed. Thanks, I enjoy your videos and your love of these great old ships and the tremendous work that went into them. I share that.
You need more subs!!!!
Yours is greatly appreciated!
~Mike
You too TornadoHarry. Your videos are great.
I have to admit that I had become bored with any Titanic discussion,at times it seemed her sinking was the only maritime disaster to have ever occurred. However,I find your take on the sinking with particular attention to the physics of the sinking to be
very interesting.
I’m interested in all things maritime and glad I found your channel.
I lover your channel I was always fascinated with the titanic when I was little and even still this day thanks for your good content
There were easily over a hundred people in that area trying to get onto the last lifeboats. Between water being sucked into vents, funnel hole, grand staircase, and the funnel falling, this area was a death trap. I believe this is how the officers in that area died. The fidley vent was opened to the boiler room. A large open void with all that water flowing into it. Thats why the ship sank so fast after that. Lightoller o ly survived due to the push of hot air n steam from the boiler rooms.
One survivors account was that when the wave washed over the deck, he found himself surrounded by the hair of women, and the bodies of womem and children. Chilling.
Perhaps the four loud explosions heard within the ship as it sank was actually the implosion of the funnel casings? Shortly thereafter it makes sense that the funnel would fail..
Ooo that's a good point!
I believe the possible explosions heard could have been some of the boilers in boiler room 2 that imploded and sounded like an explosion.
But there were 3 functioning funnels right?
@@adriwidjaja True. By the time funnels 2 and 3 failed, I imagine that many parts of the ship were failing and the noise created would make it difficult to know exactly what is breaking and where. Plus, I don't think many people midship, and aft survived. However, there were more than a few survivors who were near the bow section and close to funnel one and they are the source of these reports of muffled explosions deep inside the ship. Making the assumption it was boilers seemed very logical to me, until I saw this presentation. After watching this, I think it is also equally reasonable to consider that at least one of those explosions was actually the implosion of the casing around the number one funnel. Impossible to know for sure, but it is at least a reasonable speculation given the construction details. Keep in mind this, the WSL successfully suppressed from the public the first hand eye witness accounts of the ship splitting apart. Who knows what else might have been dismissed or simply ignored in testimony from passengers. Plus, all of those eye witnesses are traumatized.
Boilers were found to be intact; so it was either funnel casings, bulkheads, or both.
Great video Brady! Very informative. Can’t wait to see interiors.
Too kind Jen :)
Imagine getting slapped by one of those cables
*Pain*
Goddamn you killed me
Extremely well done!
Wow, you're the one for the job! Excellent voice, accent and clarity of speech; your Germen sounds awesome; you dress thr part and manage to look both "of the period" and a man of today. Well researched, well presented.
This video shows that funnels are more than cylindrical structures that vent smoke out of the ship. You did well. However, there is one detail that you got wrong: While Charles Lightoller did sign on to the _Titanic_ as first officer, the transfer of Henry Wilde from _Olympic_ to _Titanic_ caused Chief Officer Murdoch to be bumped down to first officer, and First Officer Lightoller was "demoted" to second officer. David Blair, the original second officer, was transferred elsewhere, not yet knowing of his good fortune.
I am under the impression that the two aft funnels fell for different reasons: Funnel four likely fell due to the momentum of the stern falling back, while the third funnel collapsed because the ship broke apart from beneath it.
On a final note, if you owned a shipping line, what naming convention and livery would your ships' hulls and especially funnels have?
Good catch on Mr Lightoller - can you tell I have spent too much time thinking about the mechanics and structure and not enough time thinking about the personalities? Haha
I think you're right about Number 3 - the superstructure - and casings, or "seating" as Mr Wilding puts it - likely just disintegrated beneath it.
I like your question! I am Australian so would name them after our gulfs and bays.. SS Otway, SS Carpentaria, SS Denham. I am thinking dark green funnel with a golden band. :)
~Mike
Your artwork has helped me a lot with my own artwork of ships, and I thank you for that.
It's rather telling that there are groups of people in any subject where, while they can and do know a lot about each other's strengths, some specialize in technical aspects and others can remember the details of the stories. And these people compliment each other's shortcomings to create an endgoal greater than any one of them.
My digital sketches have many different namesakes, but the ships of my hypothetical line, which I've dubbed the United States Motor Mail Company, would be named after the chemical elements. Each group of elements, like the Halogens or the Noble Gases, have their ships as sister ships to each other. As I find the prefix "SS" to be both cliché and outdated, almost all the ships in the fleet are powered by diesel motors, with two types of exceptions: Ships whose namesakes exist in a gaseous state at room temperature, like the _Argon_ and the _Nitrogen,_ are powered by gas turbines, and as such have the prefix "GTS." Any elements whose isotopes are all radioactive have their corresponding ships have the prefix "NS," for nuclear ship.
Their liveries consist of a dark cyan keel and a white hull, with a gold band separating the hull from the superstructure. The funnels would be cyan with a white band topped in black, probably because cyan is my favorite color. I did not think it through having gold on white.
These ships, with many others, can be found on my Facebook and DeviantArt pages, Maritime Artwork of Daniel Huffman. www.deviantart.com/shipping-architect
And now I feel guilty for advertising my sketches on your channel....
This is really underrated. Good job keep it up!
Love your videos! Very informative, yet concise. Keep ‘em coming!
I've been trying to find this answer for 7 years...
Who would have ever thought a lecture on funnels could be so interesting 🤪
Finally, the question that's caused me many a sleepless night will be answered.
Thought I knew the answer but I really enjoy the great detail you go into with all your videos, subscribed for sure 👍
Here's a good idea for a video why do funnels decay faster than shipwrecks
Different materials used, and different thicknesses probably have something to do with it.
Probably because the funnels are far weaker than the ship structure, as mentioned in the video they were only a half inch thick plating or something, while the hull plates were much thicker. Funnels were more of a decorative piece, and only needed to carry exhaust gases, so they didn't need to be strong, and being so tall and high they need to be lightweight to avoid the ship being too top-heavy.
I wonder if they also tended to rust out on ships in service quicker than everything else? I know that's one of the faster-rusting components on cars (except those that are stainless steel for this reason), as they have hot gas flowing through them that tends to burn off any protective coating or paint, heat speeds corrosion, and car exhaust is moist. Not sure if coal would have the same problems as coal smoke isn't as moist, and the soot might create somewhat of a protective coating on the inside - not to mention that corrosion is a major problem on ships as a whole due to being in salt water.
@@quillmaurer6563 I believe there would have been a fair bit of corrosion inside the funnels over time due to the heat and paint failing from that and the high amount of sulphur from the coal being corrosive
"Why did the funnels collapse?"
"Physics."
*roll credits*
This was very interesting! I enjoyed your presentation and voice. I’ll have to stick around :D
Thanks and welcome aboard!
~Mike
never hought I would watch a almost 10 min video about a funnel collapse yet here i am.
great work
First video I've seen of yours and just from the intro, I approve 100000%. Great job
Welcome aboard!
I'm always amazed by how much attention is paid to the minutiae of the sinking. Not that I don't love it, just that it's funny. In any other event like this, nobody asks questions like "When did the big piece detach?" or "Did the stern go straight down or at an angle?" or "What happened to the deck chairs after they were rearranged?"
That’s Titanic for ya. It’s practically a field of research in of itself!
Simple… The cables holding them in place, were not designed to withstand that much weight, so they snapped…the cables were only there to easy the forces of nature they’d face on a level sea, but the ship was at a minimum angle of 40 degrees…it’s all simple math.
This explains the aft two funnels - that's pretty much what he said - but the forward two collapsed far sooner, at no greater angle than would be expected in rough seas. He explained all that in the video.
I was looking for cooking recipes with fennel and now i’m here
Haha glad you made it!
I love the way this guy is dressed. So dignified. So English. Splendid. Quick Sticks!
Very good video man. Hope your channel will grow 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Thanks very much, your supported is very much appreciated.
~Mike
IDK what it is but your videos have sparked a deep interest in Vintage ship disatsters and hostory. Ive always been a railway/automotive buff myself, but i have a new found fasination with the world of maritime.
3:40 I didn't know that, I thought the funnels look symmetrical and equal because it is slanted.
I like your Emden picture in the background! Also the real reason why the Olympic class had four funnels was because their designers didn’t want the ships to look less powerful than their competitors. They were originally designed with three but the fourth was fitted for show, and I think was even used to store pets of passengers?
Hi Steven,
Glad you like the Emden pic!
The fourth funnel still served an important role as a ventilator for the machinery spaces, galleys etc. It is thought on Titanic that dogs might have been kept in a kennels at the base of funnel number 4 although in the deckhouse below and now the funnel itself. :)
~Mike
I've always thought the forward funnel collapsed when the bulkhead between the bow and superstructure gave wave around two fifteen am. The bulkhead gave way, there was an enormous inrush of water, hence the big wave everybody recounted. The shape of the Boat Deck changed and the funnel dislodged.
"Just the tip of the iceberg" bro... idk if that was a joke or what but you killed it either way
Great presentation. Articulate, knowledgeable and loaded with facts. Visuals are great also.
That was superb and has given me much to think about.
Very good! I appreciate the insights shared about something that is often assumed about the forensics of the Titanic's sinking.
Great animation! Wow! Can’t believe what was in my minds eye, was not that way at all. Much more frightening in the pitch dark………..
Basic to the topic: funnel design planned for downward force into the ship due to gravity, plus lateral forces due to pitch (rise and fall bow-to-stern) &/or yaw (lateral tipping along that fore-aft axis.) By your fine analysis: sidewise water pressure crumpling Funnels 1&2 at their bases, plus the bow-down increase gradually turning gravity on its ear (so to speak), likely brought on their collapse.
Very good video. Thanks for posting. I like your analysis of why the funnels fell. Looking forward to more of your future videos on ship design.
Can't imagine what it would be like to get sucked down into the ship's boiler. You're already in trouble from the ship sinking itself but now you're doomed for sure.
I’ve wondered about the physics of the funnel collapse since the day I became engulfed in Titanic history. I’ve always thought to myself: how can something made of steel designed to endure to pitch and roll of heavy seas just crumple and fall. Your presentation of the possible cause is solid. 👌🏻Thank you.👏🏻
Thankyou sir!
You're right, the idea of gravity alone bringing these down does not track. Something much more insidious was at play and I think Wilding was absolutely on the right track.
~Mike
Seems like a wonderful explanation as to why they failed the way they did....
Great job and would love to see videos and artwork about the SS Normandie.
Then I think some of my upcoming projects will make you very happy!
~Mike
7:35 aww that poor crab. Terrifying but id like to know more about that video
I always thought the fourth funnel was there just for show. Interesting fact about the fourth one, thanks!
It pretty much was. It was used for ventilation, but wasn't really necessary for that, certainly didn't need to be that big. If wanting just an exhaust vent it would have been far smaller, but they wanted to put a fourth funnel for aesthetics and used it for this purpose since it was there.
I haven’t finished the video at the time of me writing this, but my theory is that the wires (that I can never remember how to spell the name of) snapped weakening the support on the funnels and then as she went down the increase of pressure caused them to break free of the titanic
Very informative and well done!
Excellent and well done. It was 1st class. I look forward to more Titanic and other vessels.
I recently saw a news reel from 1985 when Ballard discovered the wreck. He said in that news conference that the RoV ran into the second funnel exploring the boat deck. That would mean the second funnel was still connected to the ship? Hard to imagine it held on throughout that entire decent to the sea floor but, that's what Ballard said, look it up the video if you don't believe me.
Can you do a video on what happened the the funnels after she sunk. Where they went and where they are now because I dont know where they are now. I think they might have disintegrated.
I answer because I just thought about that like 2 days ago and made some research 🙃 I found the same answer everywhere, as you said, they just disintegrated and probably really fast.
In my opinion, they were probably crushed by the pressure when they reached the bottom of the Atlantic just after the sinking 😅 I don’t have proofs but at least they don’t exist anymore today lmao 😂
@@ttclr3310 ok thanks
In the Ghosts of the Abyss book, the author writes about one possibility - that the crew disconnected or severed the shrouds because they were supposedly blocking Collapsibles A and B from being taken from the deckhouse roof to the boat deck. I think that's a ridiculous hypothesis. Firstly, they weren't really blocking the collapsibles. Secondly, no way would seamen have cut funnel shrouds knowing the huge thing would fall. Thirdly, how exactly would they have disconnected the shrouds even if they wanted to?
SMS Emden in the behind? Nice! Greetings from Emden, Germany 😄
Brilliant, Mike.
No mention was made of the cold water hitting that hot metal, iron, not even steel, causing increased brittleness. There was also probably a surge of steam between the covers and the liners as the very cold water hit that 300+ degree iron, not to mention the steam and hot gasses forced up from the submerged fireboxes. It's a wonder the boilers themselves didn't explode, though I understand some of the Black Gang gave up their lives to vent the boilers and empty the fire boxes in the boiler rooms that could. Some others stayed behind to keep the lights running as long as possible as well. Unsung heroes.
i'm pretty sure that lightoller was 2nd officer than 1st, 1st officer was William Murdoch
yea, 1st officer wassnt lightoller it was murdoch
but dont go all out on him
I'm going to need a link to that crab water pressure video. That was awesome.
This was really interesting and informative.
Funny thing is I was just asking myself this question a few days ago and now this video appears!
i like how you do your intros sometimes your so creative with them anyway just keep doing you and keep up the good work :)
Finally, someone made a video about it! I was so frustrated with the fact the community didn't make an observation on the cause of the funnels' collapse.
It is a fascinating topic from an engineering standpoint!
HISTORIC TRAVELS has a funnel vid too!
water pressure was what I thought it was. I also thought that It could be angles that the cables would have a bit trouble handling. But then again cables hold on to bridges just fine.
That was very interesting honestly
First, I'd like to state that I'm glad that over time, the amount of Titanic, and angle of her depicted above water during her final minutes, has steadily decreased! Even as late as 1997, James Cameron had nearly half the ship above water before she broke in half before her death plunge.
Back to topic of funnels: The likely reason for the toppling during sinking was that fact that at least two of the funnels on the Olympic sisters had guywires attached to them that were anchored on both sides of an expansion joint in her upper decks.
As the ship tilted down and forward, the superstructure surely strained(distorted under the forces of sinking) opening those joints up to varying degrees. Those forces, tugging on the guywires, combined with increasing forward downward decline, unanchored or snapped those guywires, leaving those funnels to the whim of gravity.
Many thanks for the video.
Great information.
What became of the cutaway illustration? Haven't seen much of it since this video.
Water pressure is a good theory, I had assumed that it had been the temperature difference, Hot air from the boiler on the inside meeting the cold Atlantic water from the outside. The inside skin would be elongated due to the heat and the outside skin would shrink when in contact with the ocean, causing warping and would destabilize the funnel base causing the collapse.
Mike, Also remember that these places would have been hot, so the shock of cold water hitting these hot uptakes would have added so much more stress into the metal, potentially causing it to crack and shear
What happened to the funnels on Britannic?
Engineer here. This sounds spot-on.
9:05 - 9:12 In 1997 film, one of the ways the character Fabrizio was originally going to die was through this very process. The storyboards showcase him managing to somehow survive the funnel's collapse, only to then be sucked into the void left by the funnel.