Tool Review - Bench Dog 5-1/2 Bench Plane
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ก.ค. 2024
- Tool Review. Rob Cosman reviews the Bench Dog 5-1/2 bench plane and tells you his oppinon of it.
----------
If you like our content please LIKE us, SUBSCRIBE to our TH-cam channel, and RING THE BELL to be notified whenever we release a new video.
_______
* VIDEO ROB MENTIONS IN THIS VIDEO:
- Sharpening a Plane Blade: • Sharpening A Plane Bla...
- Router Plane Review: Bench Dog vs. Lie Nielsen: • Router Plane Reviews -...
* SUBSCRIBE TO ROB"S MONTHLY WOODWORKING TIPS NEWSLETTER - lp.constantcontactpages.com/s...
* SUBSCRIBE TO ROB'S TH-cam CHANNEL TO TAKE YOUR WOODWORKING TO THE NEXT LEVEL: / robcosmancom
* SUBSCRIBE TO ROB'S ONLINE WORKSHOP - robcosman.com/pages/rob-s-onl...
* LIVE TH-cam WORSHOPS - Every other saturday at 6:00pm Eastern Time
* QUESTIONS - Have a question about the Tools, Techniques, or Anything Else you saw in this video? Post your question in the comments section of this video!
* VISIT OUR STORE - To learn more or purchase any of the tools you saw Rob use in this video, please visit our retail store at www.robcosman.com
* LEARN ABOUT ROB'S PURPLE HEART PROJECT: robcosman.com/pages/php-what-...
* DONATE TO THE PURPLE HEART PROJECT: robcosman.com/products/how-to...
* FOLLOW US ON SOCIAL MEDIA:
FACEBOOK - / robcosman
INSTAGRAM - / robcosman_handtoolwood... - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
Just had a funny thought as this video was wrapping up.
I remember the first few times I ran across and watched Rob’s videos... and I was kind of terrified of him, intimidated even. Tried doing things on my own, watched other creator’s videos, made a mess of things. Eventually came back to Rob. Listened more. Decided to follow Rob and Rob’s methods more. Decided to place an order with Rob’s business. Shocked Rob called me. This was all last year.
Now, 1 year later, Rob’s my go to guy for learning how to do this woodworking thing. Border opens or not, I get selected for PHP or not, nothing will deter me from learning from Rob and finding the peace I need through woodworking with hand tools. I will succeed at this, one way or another, come hell or high water.
Thank you Rob and crew!
And you will do it!
I looked to buy a benchdog 5 1/2 after watching this video I'm really glad I waited for my woodriver 5 1/2 thanks again
Thanks for reviewing that plane. I like seeing tool reviews from a well respected woodworker. It gives us better info when making a purchase so we know what we're getting into.
Personally I know how to make those repairs but in all honesty its worth the extra $ to get one already set up with minor adjustments rather than spending hours setting up a lower quality plane.
I agree with you
I wanna say I love the quality of your AUDIO! Got bad hearing from getting blown up too many times and your one of the few channels I can actually hear while up n moving around the shop
We spent a lot of effort getting quality video and audio equipment. Thanks for the comment
Interesting for you to point this out. I’ve been wondering for awhile why robs videos just have a much more crisp feel and this make perfect sense. I just didn’t realize it.
It’s honestly really cool to hear the paper rustling around, dropping the thumb screw and hearing it bounce, and the “schoop” sound of the plane shavings coming off the wood. It literally sounds like I’m standing right in front of his bench. Lol
For 25 years I imported goods from Asia, China, Vietnam, Cambodia and India. In India they have good technically trained people who are proud of their work. I think the importer is responsible for the sub standard features in this brand of tools. The idea of "good enough" but at the lowest price is visible here, put a cherry on top with nice packaging to impress the galery and you have this result. The mark-up on this must be at least 250% landed. I imported goods that cost me 52$ CAD in my warehouse (freight, duty, insurance and broker included), from China with top specs, no corners cut, and I retailed them 134,95$. My competition was selling lesser quality item for 30$ more. Same quality goods from India cost me 15% less.
Thanks for the informative comment
Hey do you have any tips on how to find those good deals for non bulk purchases? Any websites or any people I can go to?
Thx, a very thorough investigation, helps to identify which plane i would like to buy👍
I just stumbled across this review. I bought a Bench Dog 5 1/2 about a month or so ago. I like it okay. But I am a beginner and I may not know any better. I ended up buying this plane for two main reasons: one was that an employee of my local Woodcraft store actually told me that he did notliek the Woodriver version of this plane. He mentioned something about the sides being out of spec for squarness and a few other issues. The second reason was they were, and still are, completely out of stock. The newly opened Rockler store in my area had this plane in stock and they had a 20% off coupon. So I only paid about $180 for mine. Since I am not a major user of hand planes, and because I got it at a lower price, I think I can live with many of the functional issues Rob mentioned. I know I can live with the cosmetic issues.
Perfect timing on the review. I just received a 5 1/2 tay tools on Amazon for $133. Had thought of getting the bench dog. Glad I did not spend the extra $. As they are almost identical, my lever cap is silver and poorer quality then the bench dog. Thanks keep up the great videos
Thanks for watching and commenting
I appreciate this deep dive. I am brand new to woodworking and was looking at a first bench plane and was considering this brand. Looks like it’s better to splurge the $50 or so on the more reliable brands. I think they trap you that the over $200 price makes you think it’s a good bang for your buck compared to the upper $200-$350 price range models.
I have a LN bronze #4 that is prized tool cabinet jewelry because my LN 5 1/2 feels so much more natural in use.
Ditto my Veritas Bevel up #5. Neither can beat out the 5 1/2.
Rob learned me well.
Thanks for the comment
Hi Rob .., thanks for the review, I know that it helps a lot of wood workers make the right decision when purchasing a new plane .., I personally have been sticking with the higher end makers , (Lie-Nielsen , Veritas , and Wood River) because I feel that the quality is going to be so much better right out of the box.., one plane maker that I wish that you would do a review on one of their tools is the new line of Clifton planes sold by Woodcraft .., these planes appear high quality in the photos ...., well judging by the cost .., they should be! , they’re up there with Lie-Nielsen!!
I just want to say as a person who recently started woodworking with one of these planes:
1. You are absolutely correct about the hand blister from the front knob. I got one pretty bad.
2. When you don't know what you're doing, adjusting the screw for the lever cap is a source of frustration. An actual lever is so much better.
3. I had problems with mine that I could tell needed fixing (chip breaker, frog adjustment) and at the same time I didn't (and mostly don't) know what I'm doing, so it was a long road of screwing the plane up and trying to fix it only to cave, buy a Lie-Nielson and have no problems whatsoever.
These planes are okay, but as a beginner, I'd not necessarily recommend. Either go cheap / flea market and have the same pain of getting it workable, or go pricey and get a really nice tool if you have the money. This plane lands squarely in the middle ground where an experienced wood worker will know how to set it up well and get their $200 worth out of it. Maybe a good buy as an upgrade once you've cut your teeth a bit on a cheapo.
The little bump under the front handle is there for a reason: keeps it from turning which it's likely to do when you grab it hard. Also, the short screw holding down the rear handle is perfect for its function. A flat head screw would tend to split the wood. I like that it's not counter bored thus maximizing the wood structure under the screw. Like you, I own Woodriver planes but I wouldn't ding someone for non-performance issues. Incidentally, I shoot air pistols and the handles on those come blocky - you're expected to use a rasp and file to shape to your preference. It's not possible to make a handle that fits every hand. PITA but not a deal breaker if you intend to use the tool long term.
I don’t think this is something that I can get into. Reviews like this are so cringe to me… I’m too casual of a woodworker to give a tool this much attention. Maybe if I was a world known TH-camr who does this for a living, but as a basement crafter/fix it guy, this plane is above and beyond my requirements. 😊
There's nothing better than having a perfectionist review a tool. Very thorough, and sold me on getting a Wood River instead. Double the price but triple the quality!
@@brucewilliamsstudio4932 → You certainly will never regret your purchase. Just be kind to the tool and the wood.
@@wilhelmtaylor9863 🙂 Always be kind to the wood..... I'm not a tree hugger, but they are beautiful just the same.
@@brucewilliamsstudio4932not double the price though. They're pretty close in price! WR is much, much nicer IMO.
Very good and honest review. It seams that for the additional 40 bucks, the Wood River offers greater value. Thanks, Rob.
What pricing are you looking at? Bench Dog at $220 versus the WR at $475.??
Incorrect. Bench Dog is $249.99 and the WoodRiver is $269.99.
A very unbiased review that I'd sure agree with Rob.
In today's volume production manufacturing environment CNC machine tools are an absolute necessity. I'm real confident that plane's machined and non ground areas were done using a manual mill and a really low skilled operator. The starting nick with the end mill edge at the incorrect elevation and non flat end milled areas prove that. I'd be embarrassed to produce surfaces and finished work that bad with my mill. Even a low end CNC mill could surface the the casting under the tote and properly make the radial cut under the handle in less than two minutes. Secondly whoever did the initial design and specified the + - tolerances didn't have a clue. Or if the drawings were were properly done the manufacturer ignored those and there's no real quality control inspection.
The totes bottom length isn't even close to matching the castings boss length, and those protruding screw heads on hand held surfaces? All that isn't exactly witchcraft to figure out and do properly without adding a single cent to the production costs. They've obviously cut corners for zero benefit and certainly lessened there chances of having any real long term customer loyalty. I'd bet the machining was farmed out to the absolute lowest bidder and it shows that all too well. Unlike most wood workers I could re-machine, fix, or replace parts for most of it's problem areas, but for $220, I'd pay a bit more and get something that works right out of the box. Imo that plane is an over priced starting kit of parts that just about needs access to machine tools to finish it off into something that's ok at most.
This Bench Dog looks really like a Rider 5 1-2 I just ordered from Axminster UK .. unfortunately the only one I could find in Europe. This video is quite useful for that setup as well .. thanks
I ordered the Wood River 5-1/2 back in March and it FINALLY arrived just last week. Oddly, it was on sale for $229 but back ordered and it was definitely worth the wait!
We just got out WR 5-1/2 shipment too
I’m still waiting for my order from Wood River , my be I’ll give them a call?
I got the first notification of back order that it would ship at the end of July. A second email said it would ship in December. Then a third email said something to the effect of indefinitely. Then out if the blue I got the shipping notice that it was on the way.
The WR here in 🇨🇦 J2024 is listed at $472.00 cad. Plus shipping and taxes I believe. Not sure what the current price for the BD is at present.
A WoodRiver 5-1/2 (as sold by Woodcraft) retails for $269.99, the Bench Dog (sold by Rockler) retails for $249.99. $20 difference.
Great review Rob ... the deal breakers for me are casting quality (this is a minor one but it does speak to attention to detail), the screw type "lever" cap and the big one is the frog design. I don't understand why anyone would design a Stanley Bailey type frog when many manufacturers are able to implement the Bedrock design. Years ago I bought and refurbished 6 Stanley planes from eBay. This was at the time when "collectors" were scooping up Bedrock planes for crazy money only to sit on a shelf as an ornament, never to be used. This drives me crazy but that's a subject for another day. Anyway I was only able to get one Bedrock (my #7) the rest were Bailey design. Used them for years (still do) but started to upgrade to WoodRiver bench planes 6 years ago (based on your comments and involvement in the design ... thank you for that) ... the time saved in adjustment alone is very helpful. I don't think the Bench Dog is a piece off junk but it's not for me ... I'm continuing on with WoodRiver as I know I'm getting a quality tool.
thanks
Hi Rob! You forgot the grinding of the lever cap. I personally would save up for a better planer. 😁
Your review is thorough, professional and informative. Well done. Having restored 8 or 10 old Stanley planes and a knock off plane, It took a lot of trial and error to learn about and appreciate the facets of your review. I really enjoy using hand planes and the feel of the iron slicing the wood is wonderful. It also tells you a lot about the grain direction, thickness of the cut, blade sharpness, and surface finish of the wood. I think the lack feel with this plane is in part caused by the rough bedding of the tote and knob, lighter than usual screws and questionable fit between the blade, frog and frog bed. A few refinements could improve this product a-lot. You probably spent an hour tuning the plane. If the manufacturer spent $10 in effort, they would have a much more competitive product.
I really have learned a lot from how you test new planes thanks
I really wish I would have seen this video before I spent $400 on the 5 1/2 and the 60 1/2. I’m new to hand planes these being my first. I had all the problems and then some you talked about. Im having a really hard time getting it to preform as I have no experience. 😢
The fundamentals are consistently missed on cheaper planes. Seems like the fundamentals are now being missed on mid price too.
I will take function over cosmetics any day.
Is it REALLY an awful lot more expensive to machine crucial contact points flat?
I don't imagine so but they consistently let themselves down
Thanks for another great review Rob.
Good review Rob, I had kicked around the idea of getting one of these, (purty picture and claims on their website), now, nope. I have the Woodriver, acquired after watching your set up video. I'm not wanting to go backwards on this journey, by choice anyway, I've already spent far too much time and effort restoring Stanley's, Miller Fall's, Sargent planes and ended up with okay planes but not stellar ones. I even have an obscure Co-mar #4. .....yeah, me neither.
Great feedback, thanks
I got a 4 1/2 in sale, same comments. It took me less time to get a beat up vintage Craftsman than the 4 1/2. Still happy with it for the price, but waaaaay more work than the cost when it's not in sale.
Thanks for sharing
Just curious Rob, even if it's not feasible right now, do you like the idea of having your own line of planes one day? That would be awesome.
I have a Veritas Custom 5-1/2 plane.It`s the best 5-1/2 plane my own! Better than LN and WR、Standly！Better feel,Easier to use, better accuracy, better blade！I would recommend it to anyone who asks. If you only buy a 5-1/2, choose Veritas Custom. If you have the budget.
Thanks for watching and commenting
My Woodriver 5 1/2 the tilt lever has to screws holding the tab onto the lever. It soon unscrewed and one was lost. I wish it had a low quality stamped and formed lever. That will never fail.
You should test out the bridge city plane line
Just getting to see someone experienced going through these tools and showing what to look for is great!! I purchased a similar one with a different name but pretty sure its from the same manufacturer. I'll still do my best to make it work for me (just a hobbyist on a budget), and will pay extra care and attention to the points brought up here.
Thanks again, Rob!! And Keep putting out the outstanding videos!!!
Need some videos of you showing and using some of your wooden planes! I know they are more difficult to setup and use but I’d love to see your process and method for any of them
Well the only wooden plane I use is my drawer bottom plane. I prefer metal bodied planes
@@RobCosmanWoodworking gotcha, just curious about your thoughts on them, though they lack some things compared to metal. maybe if you used to use them and then stopped, your reasoning for such. thanks for the response!
I bought one of these 3 years ago. It is not the plane I grab regularly - I also have a Woodriver Cosmanized (blade and breaker) 5 1/2 jack. On the Bench Dog plane, I have never been able to get the iron angle to remain as set, and I really don't like the knurled thumb screw lever cap that locks the iron and breaker. The plane is heavy enough, but it just doesn't keep its set on the blade angle, and is also hard to adjust the iron depth with the thumb screw locked down on the lever cap.
Over all, I wish I hadn't bought it. No amount of fettling on my part has made this plane anything more than maybe a shooting board plane.
Rob - I watch your channel, and have appreciated all the content over the years, I've learned a lot from you and am grateful. That being said, I think it's really lame that you didn't mention in this video that you helped woodcraft with the Woodriver planes, and do a ton of work with Woodcraft who makes Woodriver while Rockler (Woodcraft's main competitor) is the one behind the Bench Dog planes. For those of us who are aware, this video comes across like you are nitpicking a competitor.
Steven, i have never hidden and state in in numerous videos that I Consulted with Woodcraft when they were designing their WoodRiver planes and that I use to sell Lie Nielsen.. I have not been associated with either company for years now but I am not bashful about stating my former relationship nor my belief that they both make extremely good planes
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thanks for your reply. Yes, you've been very transparent about it in your other videos. Remember though, as a prolific content creator (and a very good one at that) people won't watch every one of your videos. In this particular video you were comparing a tool you helped out with to a tool now being produced by that company's competitor. To me, it felt like it deserved a mention in this video as well, especially since so many content creators are getting more careful with these sorts of things.
Thanks again for your reply and content.
@@stevendamico8554 because I wasn’t comparing it to another plane I didn’t feel it was necessary to mention all of that. It was a straightforward review of the Bench dog (with the exception of the handle shape and the sound while planing) where I went over it with a fine-tooth comb. I shared those results in real-time. Not sure why you felt like I was knit-picking, but to each their own.
Any ideas on which Adjustar I would want for a Bench Dog?
This plane was made by Soba, you can tell by the frog adjustment screw which has a distinct shape, and also by the fact it was made in India. For 220 dollars you pretty much got scamed.
I have a No. 4 smoothing plane from them, which I bought roughly for 30 bucks a few years ago. It was a bit rough around the edges, literaly, but after a bit of sanding and smoothing it works great.
I bought a Rider 41/2 plane several years ago. This is a brand sold by Axminster tools in the UK, made in India and looks identical to the Bench dog 5 1/2 you've just reviewed right down to the square edged chip breaker! doesn't that take a time to correct.. My criticisms of the plane are exactly those that Bob describes. So over a period of several years they are consistent! In use the plane feels 'dead' in the hand not what you want.For comparison my refurbished pre war Record planes feel so much better so the choice seems to be Lie Neilsen, Wood River/Quangsheng or pre war Stanley/Record.
You must not forget Lee Valley
The ding in the front knob seat is on purpose? anit-rotation / index ?
Thank you for the review. I appreciate your teaching and learn something from each video. After months of waiting, I finally received my backordered Woodriver 5 1/2 Jack plane and I'm looking forward to fine tuning it right after I received my shipping-delayed IBC blades. My question for you is where do I get that neat star-shaped adjuster I see on your 5 1/2? Thanks.
Me too! Ordered in December 2020 and received two weeks ago!!!!
Rob makes the star shaped adjuster wheels and sells them on his website.
Will J - was your plane blade flat? Mine was so far out I had to have it replaced. No way I was ever going to get the chip breaker and plane iron to match up. New iron is on its way.
@@matthewlebo482 If you're asking about the WoodRiver blade, I have no idea. I'm still waiting on my IBC blade and chip breaker so I haven't bothered with the WoodRiver blade yet. If you mean your IBC was far from flat, then I'm nervous since I haven't received my blade yet.
@@willj2147 No - I’m US so I bought mine from Woodcraft so I got the wood river blade. Woodcraft did make right on the deal - sending me a replacement blade and chipbreaker - the second set was much flatter and took very little time to hone & match the pair.
Good video Rob. Can you reiterate a bit on “having suspicion that the sole isn’t flat based on the performance”? My Benchdog is 0.0025” out of flat at spots and I am unable to get quite as good performance as you
My sharpening regimen is identical to yours so I am wondering how the effect of the sole plays into it possibly
I would be happy buying either the Wood River or the Lie-Nielsen. IF I COULD FIND ONE!!!
Yes I know. We just got our first shipment of WR so maybe the logjam is busting up!
I see that you do, but I can’t have one! And woodcraft still says backorder. …Sigh!
The Bench Dog No. 5 is currently available $130. Do you think that at a ~$80 discount the shortcomings of this plane can be more easily overlooked? Or should I get a Big Box Store Stanley for $60 and tune that up?
Watching this video now. Knowing more about planes and restoring them. I’m realizing these guys need to cut Rob Cosman a check. He just did what a team of engineers and product testers would take a few years to get. And he did it for free and in twenty minutes. So, they need to send the man a thank you card, and some cash. They take this and implement the changes they can have a contender in the hand plane market.
Your tool reviews are great, they're very helpful. Have you compared the Wood River to the Lie Nielsen 5 1/2. In your opinion is the Nielsen worth the extra money?
If you want the best get Lie Nielsen, if you want the best value get WoodRiver
@@RobCosmanWoodworkingif you want to compromise, Veritas . Quality, innovative and built in 🇨🇦, just like IBC chisels and blades.👍👨🦳
Is it only a tote if its been replaced?
Good morning Rob :) Have you ever looked at Busy Bee (100% Canadian) hand planes? If so, any reviews, any comments?
I acquired an old Soviet era bench plane some months back and it looks like a reasonably close copy of a Stanley Bailey #4. Its got 'USSR' cast into the lever cap. One oddity with it is that the block the frog is made from is made from a chunk of aluminium. Would that have an affect on how the plane performs?
That sounds like an interesting plane. So yes, you want heavy metals to dampen any vibration. Aluminum just doesn't do that
i bought a benchdog no 7 recently. came in fairly good shape. the contacts for the frog needed a decent amount of work to seat properly. the sole looked very nice aesthetically. the piece of paper said it was .004 flat which it definitely was not. not even close lol. if it wasnt a long plane like a 7 it wouldnt of bothered me that much but the fact that they give u some signed off piece of paper authenticating it... also had the same problem with trigger finger having nowhere to sit. i'd rub up against the adjustment while planing until modifying.
It was probably flat when they milled it and it warped over time
@@UserNameAnonymous does cast iron warp easily? thinking back on it everything felt a little overtightened out of the box so maybe the stress from that?
@@ConfiscatedZyra In his review of a new Jorgensen plane, Rex Kruger discusses the need for cast iron to season awhile before milling. Apparently it can move around for up to a year after casting. It has me wondering whether that's what's meant when higher quality planes say "stress relieved."
@@mikestewart505 oh wow. well i learned something new today. much appreciated!
Casually searching for planes, it would seem that there is a fair bit larger price difference than mentioned here. The first place I looked, the Bench Dog was $179 and the Woodriver was $299...
There was a slight perkup in your voice once you started planning though lol. I thought that was pretty cool. It's like the sound of wood shaving allowed you to forget the issues, temporarily. Thanks for the honest review Rob!...alas, someday!
This same plane, under the Busy Bee brand in Canada is sold for 159.99 Canadian. Used to be $195. At $159 it's pretty tempting to buy one just to see if it can be easily tuned to perform as well as a higher end plane - the parts certainly seem to be there.
Problem is it’s only for you Canadians.
@@CarlYotaso what’s wrong with that, I am Canadian but I wouldn’t buy one from them. Veritas is the way to go if you can afford them. Innovative and a high level of quality. I’m sure Rob must have one around, don’t you think? Manufacturers are stuck in the old Stanley design with updated manufacturing techniques.
Lookding at WoodCraft Seattle, I find that a Woodriver #5 1/2 is listed at $269.99. For an additional $49.99 the buyer gets a fully adjustable plane that is of better quality in every aspect. Case closed.
I agree
Great video! Always amazed by the knowledge. Would you spend your money on that plane? I know Jake spent your money, but would you? After watching your assessment I could not buy that plane. More knowledge for me thanks to you. Always appreciate your thoughts. Thank you.
As I said I dont think its worth the money
Boy am I glad I bought the wood river .
Fair review of a fair handplane. For another fifty bucks you could have a WR. Thanks Rob.
That's what I think too
I was just going to look up the price difference (well, I did anyway. Trust, but verify.). 25% more is not enough to steer me away from a competing - superior - product. There’s also the issue of the lever cap being a screw cap. Remove or reinstall the blade/chip breaker is a lever flip versus loosen/tighten screw.
I would have to agree entirely with this review. I bought one of these Indian made fellows to accompany me in the van, the premium planes very seldom get a day out. It is good enough for what I ask of it, but the comparison is with Record and Stanley, certainly not Lie Nielson, or even the Chinese bedrocks that appear in a multitude of guises. Did I pay too much? Given Axminster sell them badged as "Rider" for under £100 in the UK, ($160ish US) I felt I did, on balance.
You are the second person who has said the are also sold as Rider. Is that an educated guess or a fact?
How would this compare against the Luban plane that you reviewed in the past?
Luban by a landslide.
Just a suggestion; If you're going to totally dismantle and its packaged with oil coating. A can of brake clean from auto parts store is $2. Spray it down, it evaporates quickly and will keep your bench clean. Thanks for the review, will help some to not make the same mistake I made.
Great tip
A better product for removing preservative oils or grease on any object would be CRC Electrical Contact Cleaner. Works almost instantly and evaporates almost as fast. I use it around my metal cutting lathes and mills where if your doing things properly there's always an excess of way oil that also collects metal chips etc.
@@turningpoint6643 Yes, I have been using this for years and I tell everyone to use it in place of brake cleaner which is flammable. CRC Lectra-motive Cleaner is non-flammable and leaves no residue and much safer to use and store in your shop.
@@bobd. Yeah I'd certainly agree, that CRC contact cleaner is a lot safer and afaik ok around most paint, plastics etc. It does strip every lube product I've tried it with.
I'm just starting to watch this review and I'm at the point where Rob says the inspection report shows that the base is square to the sole within 0.0015". I'm retired from aerospace as a mechanical designer and spent 35 years applying geometric dimensioning and tolerancing (GD&T) to drawings as I determined what the design needed.
That is not a square to the sole dimensional tolerance. The GD&T feature control frame (the box with symbol and tolerance value) says that flatness (parallelogram symbol) of the feature (in this case a flat surface) shall be flat within 0.0015". The text table at the bottom of the sheet says sole flatness 0.0015 - 0.002. That is in disagreement with the feature control frame above. The feature control frame is read as flat within 0.0015" or as 0.0015" max. The table says flatness better than 0.0015" or worse than 0.002" is unacceptable. Better is better.
I don't understand how a management team can look at the product and not see these simple issues. How can some thing be good and let the others be poor. It doesn't make sense. What's even more troubling with sellers is how they make the consumers there quality control staff!
This is so wrong. I never buy any thing made in India yet, there manaufacting is not to par yet! It just don't make sense I'd like to know who's ainthe wheel house and why can't we confront them with these issues really the Board of Directors!
If you have a concern say on a Lie-Nielsen product you can get an response right from the Captian himself Mr. Thomss Lie-Neilsen himself!. I know cause I have, even if it is cosmetic!
I don't like woodworkers stores that just sell things to make a buck! Look at the work Rob and team puts into his products! He would never sign of on that plan before shipping it! So why do companies do this and hide behind board doors? Who are the people???????? And Rockler should be avoided cause there board desided to sell this stuff also!!!!! who are these people! I don't buy much from Rockler either cause there prices are too high! There like Ace Hardware, way too pricey to buy from! In any case do your home work and you won't get taken br these kind of stores or products.
Rob. your doing a great service for the wood work h community! My hard off to you and your team!
Folks do your home work or waist your money! India products still not there!
Steven Columbus Michigan 🇺🇸
We all know that sign is for flatness of the surface. I think Rob knows the difference and it’s just a slip of the tongue.
@@1967urban True. Rob has slips of the tongue on his live shows that are things he obviously knows.
@@makenchips are you illiterate?
I didn't even have to watch the video to know what the outcome would be at the end if it's not a Wood River or a Nelson as far as rob concerned it's inferior oh and by the way rob is one of the more knowledgeable in the trade
Do any of your AdjuSTARs fit this plane?
Yes, the Lie-Nielsen version will fit them.
The Bench Dog planes were updated a couple of years ago.
When the previous version was being closed out I bought a box set with a #4 and a block plane.
I am a sucker for a deal and just bought them because the set was $100.
I do not see any difference between the #4 I have and the #5 1/2 Rob is evaluating.
I am not much of a hand tool woodworker so for the occasional use the planes are okay but if given a do over I would not buy them again.
Glad I watched this, thanks for creating and sharing. I'll skip this brand.
Wher is state in India rob
So I grew up with a father who worked in a machine shop and foundry here in Southern California and built parts for the Apollo missions back in the day. He used to say All craftsmen need to know how to fix, repair and maintain their tools. He also said a true Craftsman can get superior results Out of worn out tools. What he meant Was that if you were a true Craftsman you didn't have to have the latest greatest most expensive tool to get the job done properly. As to the aerospace engineer that commented down below all your jibber jabber about tolerances is a complete waste of time and doesn't apply to woodworking. Growing up with a father/engineer everything I did was measured intolerances with micrometers regardless of task. So when I moved to woodworking trying to achieve machineist tolerance's on wood drove me nuts. With lumber being the material your tolerances can move many thousands just because of temperature, moisture, And hell with large guys like me I can put my weight into it and compress the fibers way farther out of tolerance than any of those numbers you were talking about. I think it was a stumpy nubs video that showed how you should not prep your wood until you're ready to glue it up. He showed some material that he had prepped the day before that was flat and square and the next day it was not flat and square just because of the moisture. As in all rob cosman videos this is just a giant bitch fest on who has the biggest penis. The bottom line is buy what you can afford learn how to fix it up and tune it and get to work. We all can't afford Lie Nielsen.
Ill stick to my approach, "get it as close as my hand or eye can tell". Most of the woodworkers we cater to are not coming from an experienced background, better tools make the learning process easier. Better tools dont require a newbie to try and figure out how to repair the tool HE BARELY KNOWS HOW TO USE! Am I getting through?
It shaved the wood. Good enough for me. Done and done
Has anyone verified the certified tolerances for this plane as being square?
Does some of the shape and size of handles have to do with many Asians having smaller hands?
I actually own this plane under a different brand name. It`s ok but not great. Mine doesn`t have the vibration problem. The adjustment leaver is kinda meh but still works after 2 years. The worst part of this plane is actually the blade. It is tempered maybe for the 1st 3mm, after that it`s just hardened. Fixed it by sticking it in the oven to temper the whole thing and now it seems fine. Also i bought 2 woodriver blades for it and they had the same exact problem. After a couple of months of sharpening they just won`t form an edge anymore. The solution was the same.
Great comment. Thanks for sharing your long term experience with this plane
I’ve been trying to fix mine for a week. I don’t know what I’m doing either so it really is turning me off of hand planes.
Currently through July Rockler has this 5-1/2 Bench Dog plane on sale for $124.99. If one went through it knowing what they would have to address it might be a good value at that price. At full price it doesn’t seem like a good purchase.
I know I don’t like the screw lever cap. Cam lever cap is so much better. But when I saw the frog face and lateral lever, it’s a big turn down, at least for me. Seems like it’s patterned after a Bailey’s type 20 style. Bedrock style is better.
Tote is similar to the one on taytools’ low angle jack plane.
The Norris style frog adjustment thing is there probably because they don’t have access to tap the regular hole parallel to sole.
I agree
Was it square? Just got a Woodriver and it was 0.006" out of square on the shooting board side. Should I return it?
there unstated standard is .0015". The squareness to the sole is an issue. Chances are that you wont find another WoodRiver much better.
Return it?
How square the actual cut in wood on the shooting board depends on the lateral adjustment.
More to the point, is the wing flat so the plane doesn't rock lying on its side. That would be unacceptable to me.
Having said all that, I'd like it to be better machined but I wouldn't return it.
It doesnt have to be square, you have a lateral adjuster 😁
Looks like a plane sold as Rider in the UK, its about £99, or $137 here.
Bench Dog is a brand that confuses me (ignoring the confusion with the Bench Dogs UK brand). I see the company frequently on Amazon and other places and for all the tools they have, they don't sell any bench dogs or anything dog hole related.
It is a rockler related company
Hi Rob
When are you doing a review of a Dictum plane? Or Kunz plus? Both planes are sold in continental Europe. Because of Brexit people in continental Europe can't really buy WR or Luban without high import taxes...
Good idea
Yes a DICTUM or Kunz Plus would be nice.
Not even in Germany anyone buys Kunz for known reasons, so why bother 🤷
@@zujung Really? Not even the Kunz plus? They look really high quality, but I have never tried one, så I wouldn't know 😅
@@niklasjespersen9903 Best don't touch Kunz in my opinion. I've heard good things about Juuma if you're looking in that price range. Dictum would also be interesting. But in the end I guess you will always kind of get what you pay for. In my opinion either go for LN or Veritas if you want top quality or go Stanley/Record if you'd rather put some time into it than $$.
Dang.. thought if I upgraded to a benchdog some of my troubles would be over. The Taytools jack plane for 125$ has given me nonstop problems. Guess I’m stuck waiting for a wood river. Don’t have the knowledge/skill to make a cheap plane function like a premium brand. I’m between a rock and a hard place with these hand planes at the moment.
Could you review Dictum or Juuma planes? They're quite popular in Europe.
The dictum planes are very very good! I’d love to see robs opinion on them
They are the same as woodriver, luban etc etc. Identical Chinese made
@@CabinetFramingUK They might all be chinese made, but there are big differences in them with regards to design and materials I’m sure. Do you have any source to support your claim? I’d love to look into it
Does your Adjustar suite the Luban planes also. If it did, then I'd get it for my No.6.
Yes it does, even says so on the product page
thanks rob buying a wood river
*Just as I expected I have nothing bad to say about this jointer **MyBest.Tools** make a solid clean and level cut and adjusts in increments of 1/8ths and 1/4s I ran stock 2"x4" x8" at 12' long and had no issue.*
Want to learn how Rob sharpened the Bench Dog plane's blade: th-cam.com/video/okLIEoz00v0/w-d-xo.html
They should have put more effort into the plane and less into the box. I’ve seen this with some products out there lately, where I wonder how much I paid for a box that I end up tossing. Never had that thought with LN (std cardboard and a bit of that special paper) or with RC’s items (nicely packaged but not overboard).
I've seen an other grinder
It looks alot like my Tay-Tools hand plane. Both were probably made in the same factory. Love my Tay-Tools hand plane, hated the bowed blade.
I do not know if they are the same plane
Save your money. In fourty years as a full time craftsman, I have never used a no 5. No 4 and 4.5 smoothers, yes, all the time and a no 8 for jointing long thin boards and truing soundbars on pipe organ chests. But that's it.
Jack planes are much more of a carpenter's tool. Trimming doors to fit jams, floorboards and the like. But if you like showing off a big collection of dust collectors behind your bench....
Are you saying because that is what you use that is what has to be?
i have a bench dog low angle block plane i got on sale.. its much like this one. it works good for me, but its definitely crude casting. i think there price point is to high for how rough it is.
I agree with you
The Luban you reviewed seems better for that price.
I have the same pet peeve. I hate those cheap folded stamped metal levers.
It seems like they used an average casting but did some precision grinding to the sides & sole. I think the brass cap is more for looks than function because a stainless cap would resist deforming better. The threaded cap screw will protect the blade but, because the cap and screw are both brass, those threads will become worn much faster than a lever cap.
Good comment, thanks
Wow - nice video. For that money, I'll spend a little more and get a Veritas.
Smart
Yes but Rob will never say that. 😛. The obvious legal restrictions he has over Veritas is disappointing to say the least. It makes all his tool comparison videos incomplete.
@@AdamKirbyMusic Yeah - you can tell how much he's holding back in the videos.
March 2024; prices. Bench Dog 5-1/2 price at Amazon is $249.99 (US dollar).
WOODRIVER 5-1/2 price at Woodcraft is $269.99 (US dollar). For $20.00 more the WOODRIVER is a good deal!
Or, even better, wait until Woodcraft has a 20% off-sale and get the WOODRIVER for about $215.00!
As it should be
Yep, video went about how I expected. Spend a few more dollars, get a better product with the WR 5 1/2. You get what you pay for. Buy once, cry once.
ditto
In Europe it's an axminster rider ..I just bought one and all the same complaints are there ...plus there is a 0.13 mm hollow behind the mouth and the sides are nowhere near sq to the sole ..pretty poor quality control.
Overall, kind of a blah plane. Not that I'm in the market for any of them. But as an amateur maker, the two things that stand out are the upright rear handle (sore wrist with heavier use). Just no reason to copy anything other than Stanley's handle, which had the same angle as better wooden planes from England. And the 58 hardness iron is going to have beginners coming up short on sharpness and wondering why, as well as reduced edge strength at the apex. I'd much rather have a Stanley plane and flatten the sole and prep the parts.
Great review all the way up until you put Lie Nielsen and Wood River in the same sentence. 😂
How to say "save your money" in 24 minutes. The video is actually great. My opening sentence was just sarcasm. Even though the plane isn't the one to buy, the video breaks down and addresses the essentials of what a top-notch tool has over another. I just started watching your channel and am trying to get educated on all the different types of planes and where I should start. What brand, types, and sizes, etc. I literally had a BenchDog plane in my cart but have gone over to the WoodRiver site now. Thank you for saving me from having to learn the hard way. It's going to take me a few days to go through all the content here, but the amount of knowledge I can get in a few days of watching a pro will save me countless amounts of money and time. Again, thank you for passing on your years of knowledge to the rest of us!
Thanks Rob. I've looked at Bench Dog stuff. Nah.
I agree
The nub of metal under the knob is to stop it turning 😁
I dont think so. Thats what the screw does and the nub doesn’t look like its a design feature
my guess is that any plane made by a proud craftsmen eventually would find its way to Rob free of charge.. Manufacturers who charge for this kinda exposure ie no comp plane have more to loose than gain