I once bought an old greenback online and when it arrived, it turned out to be from my favorite Dutch guitar player from the 90's. I asked him how long he's had it and he had used on one of my favorite albums from that era. It's got so much mojo and character, I'm never selling this one ever.
Old Pulsonics in decent shape are all their cracked up to be. Those that have never played them (and the awesome old cabs they belong in) are just hating for clickbait. Fricker's cred is evaproating
"this guy is too opinionated, he's controversial, he rubs people the wrong way, he's abrasive, swears way too much.....I'm going to subscribe to keep an eye on him and comment in his post" 😉
How dare you get an awesome Van Halen tone without spending hours arguing about what tubes to use! On a serious note though, very awesome video. Even though you didn't say it was "spot on" it's good enough to fool my ears, and honestly I like this more "modernized" sound quite a bit. Overall a definite sick tone that was achieved today, even though I certainly am not one to hold the capability of having high standards in terms of mixing and tone quality myself as I'd be a hypocrite given my lack of mixing on my own stuff, but I can definitely still appreciate a good tone when I hear one.
With the AC DC section, I actually found myself thinking that, with a slightly more prominent overdriven bass sound, that whole thing could sound enormous and quite heavy. Just goes to show you can get extremely heavy sounding guitars without needing a huge amount of gain - it's all about how it sounds in the mix
You converted me to "the speaker is the most important part of the tone" many videos ago, but fuck me, this video has driven me even further in that camp. Sick tone dude, the full mix was badass but also just melodic. The solo stood out and was the icing on the cake.
I don't know who you talked to at Celestion, but they are not telling you the important part. They switched from Pulsonic cones to Kurt Muller cones starting in about 1975. I believe 76 is when they switched to the black caps. So for the most part, Greenbacks are Pulsonic cones, Black Backs are Kurt Muller cones. Those are the differences in tone that people hear between those two speakers. Switching cone manufacturers makes a HUGE difference in sound of a speaker.
Those speakers sound absolutely amazing. Hearing something non v30 is so refreshing to the ears. I recently swapped from using the ownhammer mesa os412 to a choptone marshall g12 410 with a dynamic mic and a ribbon mic. The difference in my tone is night and day. Tighter low end. It's really bright, but nothing harsh. I'm currently running the Line 6 Pod Go with the Diezel VH4 amp and a 808OD. Even with my sub $200 Epiphone Les Paul Jr, it crushes.
@@metalinyourhead3604 do it man! I swapped out the stock speakers in my Marshal 4x12 cab with four green backs and it made an incredible difference! That said, I am a bit of a Celestion fan boy. But only because I can actually hear a difference with Celestion over a lot of the other 'big name' manufacturers. And for the price, they're incomparable. (In my opinion, of course.) [Edit:] I immediately realized I just assumed you're a male. I'm sorry.
I think this is the most pleasing guitar tone I've heard you get so far! Those speakers sound wonderfully balanced; nothing peaky or harsh anywhere! No mud! Awesome find!
Nice to meet you at NAMM again. Again love your videos and all the information you provide. Keep up the great work. Love to see the usage of Happy Cabs. Shout out to my friend Moshe Alvarez and the Happy Cabs team.
Loved this video. Made me realize most of my favorite old school metal distortion sounds are probably down to them using greenbacks! lol. Circa 1982-85. Early Savatage, Early Accept, on and on. Hmmm. Might have to get me some old greenbacks! Thank you!
Hey Glenn, that sounded absolutely amazing! Actually I'd go as far as saying, if you were to make an IR out of this one I would totally get myself a copy :)
I remember reading an old article in Guitar World magazine about Motley Crüe, or another 80’s band, where they were saying that before they would go on tour, they would run a Walkman trough their guitar cabs if they were equipped with new speakers with rap music, to break them in, because they hated the sound of a new speaker. So maybe that’s why old speakers sound so good. 🤷♂️🤷♂️
fun things i learned over the years ... 1: pedals give you the charactaristics of the distortion you want (mostly to boost an amp if the distortion channel just doesnt cut it the way you want , ts808 , clean boost , shaped boost , hm-2 , and all those other variants) , 2: the amps preamp section gives you the "base" for your distortion that can be shaped further with the tone stack (which is different from brands and models) 3: fx loop can be used to slap a gate in and shape your distored tone a little further with parametric/graphic eqs , cool trick i learned is to put a delay in the fx loop and set the feedback really low so you get 1 rep max , and the speed really fast so its just a few ms behind the original , and the level control can be used like a mix to dial it in as you want it , this will give you a really nice fat sound ! if you´re a dimebag fan , get a stereo chorus slap it in the fx loop and set the speed really low and the width as you like it , and set the mix knob so it is just slightly noticable . thats basicly what the mxr flanger doubler does too , not exactly the same but well its a budget solution . 4: Power amp , makes it loud , thats pretty much it ... 5 : the part that can gloryfy or destroy everything i just mentioned (well this and nr6) THE SPEAKERS !!! 6: as mentioned above ... can make or break everything but not as important as nr 5 , the mics ... and mic placement . 0.5mm of movement in any fuckin direction can make a difference ... that can be a good thing or a bad thing .. depends if the bass player is allowed around the miced up cab or not ... 7: the trick from terry date that glenn showed on here with the little two channel mixer ! everything after that is just processing to fit it in the mix . but if you record guitars with cabs and mics those things are really important to know in my opinion . and i kinda found myself doing the same stuff when using vst amp sims like bias fx or stuff like that PS : Loved the high gain tones you got out of the blackbacks ! definetly gonna get my hands on some of those if i can find em for a good price :D
Probably the best tones I’ve heard so far. Full and no harshness, like a Blue Moon on tap. Btw, I’m a local semi driver in St Louis MO, I got a 9% raise this year, no we’re not union either. The world needs more people willing to get their hands dirty and less desktop metal. Your future belongs to you. Hope you’re enjoying Europe.
If you get the time, def do a deep dive on Johan’s channel. Even if he does focus on more vintage tones, you can learn a lot about speakers and cabs. He has done almost every experiment you can think of. Like he even takes vintage speakers and puts them in new cabs. And the results might surprise you. Also check out scumback speakers for info on early Celestions. Plus he can recreate any of the variations also.
Blackbacks are not completely identical to Greenbacks. They are very similar in construction but they were launched after Celestion changed a cone supplier (1973). Greenbacks used a cone from a company called 'Pulsonic' whereas Blackbacks from a company called 'Kurt Muller'. The Kurt Muller Cone was originally a bit thicker and therefore a bit more punchy and aggressive. Blackbacks have their own sound for sure; It's the sound of the late 70's and 80's (Early Metal). The only Blackback reissues, that I know of, are made by a company called Scumback Speakers, which company also makes their own Greenback reissues. They are reissues on par with Celestion's own Heritage range (which I consider both very spot on). And actually tend to sound as good as the good Greenback and Blackback Bunches. And no, not all Vintage Celestions sound the best. A lot of them are poorly maintained and sound worse than Celestion or Scumback reissues. Don't buy the Vintage gear sounds best, lost recipes bullshit. There was no magic back then that cannot be replicated with today's technology. It's propaganda from vintage gear collectors that like to sell it for a lot of money.
What a great find Glenn and thanks for doing the hard yards to find out more about these mythical black-backs. Those things sounded amazing. I think you really lucked out with this pair of speakers in that the next batch off the line may have been dogs. Or there could be pixie dust in how they were broken in. I think the thing with older speakers is that they have much greater variation, so you need luck. Whereas modern speakers should be more uniform from batch to batch, but you need to find the ones that work for you.
Seeing you improve lately has inspired me to put in the work. I've started a couple years ago and over time began to believe this may be a young mans game. We are about the same age, so seeing it done wipes out that flawed thinking. Thanks Glenn.
The creamback was also originally just a G12M 25 watt (greenback), i have one from 1975 myself. They changed the speaker cones in the 70´s from the Pulsonic cones which probably makes most of the difference in sound compared to the 60´s greenbacks, i have some 60´s grenbacks as well. They also made greybacks according to the Celestion site.
I fully agree with this and the guys below. Johan knows his stuff! Also Celestion say don’t use guitar speakers in a ported cabinet as it will weaken the perimeter of the cone……those poor vintage speakers!!
I think a big important factor here is this speaker has a 16ohm impedance, which makes it sound brighter than its 8ohm counterpart. A detail that I noticed is often overlooked when people are trying different speakers.
I finally got a pair of celestion creamback G12m-65's after waiting for 6 months. I couldn't wait to get the right size connectors so I just soldered those bad boys in an old Peavey 2x12 and so worth the wait and no regrets. they sound so frikin awesome straight out of the box with no breaking in necessary. so warm, so smooth and I can't believe the bottom end on them. Keep up the great and informative videos glen.
Thanks for this show Glenn. Celestion Greenback delivered the sound for decades and is still a great choice. In the 80' some Greenback loade Marshall Cabs at cranked up 100W-JCM800 often killed at least one speaker when it comes to feedback at maximum volume (Amp set to 11). I had to replace some speakers for my friends at that time.(so the money for the gig was gone..) for a more rigid replacement i was asked to put a 5W-12V Car-lighting bulb in parallel to the Speaker to soak excessive power form each speaker to protect. Safety for the cost of changing the tone. Some highend got lost. So the 30W vintage30 was the perfect solution for the cranked 100W valve amps driving one single 412 Cab. I personaly favour the NEO Cramback with 16hms in a single 112Cabinet like my actual Egnater Rebell setup. I swaped the Elite80 out for a new NEO Creamback 16Ohms and i got a powerful lowend and smooth topend guitar tone out of the box, no matter what amp i was using (JoYo, Blackstar, Laney, Driftwood). The sound is awsome like i was expecting to be, even with a speaker that is brand new and has only few hours of playing time. Tone might get even better after 50 hours of moderate volume set shredding. friendly rocking greets from Bavaria/Germany
I have a 1979 Horner 212 it’s the best vintage sound I can muster. I put a classic OD on it and it blows my modern tube amps with boogie vin30 speakers away for vintage sounds…agreed older speakers might be a little better for tone.
Hey your guitar playing is good, and I've noticed steady improvement as you continue to get back into playing more. I liked seeing you play with backing music. I think you should record more of your own stuff. Good work Glen. Oh, and thanks for all of the fantastic info you share - this is valuable content which makes your channel top-notch. F-you.
Funny, the other day me and a couple other friends were talking about how cabinet speakers are one of the major keys to getting different guitar tones, and then this morning I came across your other video discussing that topic. Glad to see you talking about that factoid on your channel!
I sort of liken the amp to speakers relationship to the engine to tires relationship. Speakers are what's ultimately moving the air and tires are where the rubber meets the road. They're vital components and you're not going anywhere without them, no matter how powerful your amp or engine is, so it's never wise to undermine their significance. Killer sounds in the video Glenn!
it's awesome to see your confidence in your playing grow. you've clearly been putting time in the shed. also cool to know about the lower frequency cutoff of these blackbacks. I really wanna try one out for clean 8 string stuff.
That whole time period, aces tone on Record. Scorpions had it. I also like early 80's albums, Diary of a Madman and Dont break the Oath etc, Maiden ( piece of mind). Is it difficult to obtain those classic tones from the late 70's and early 80's? I'm not in the know, but a man who claims to be says " all that is easy to reproduce now with pro tools, nothing to it." How come no one seems to tap into that warm sound if it is supposedly so reproducible?
I always thought the Sad Wings guitar tone was heavy for 1977, especially on Dissident Aggressor. That song still satisfies that spot that craves heaviness without going into thrash and death metal territories! The same goes for the Powerslave guitar tone, I wish Maiden would go back to finding tones without using a production board!
Incredible bargain find on your G12M 55Hz speakers! I have 4 G12H 55Hz blackbacks - the most incredible guitar speaker I’ve heard up close. I recently tried combining a G12M with a G12H - sounded amazing. Mr Segeborn has a cool video on that too, confirming my impression that they really complement each other. Keep going with this Glenn!
That is a smokin' guitar tone! I had a Boogie 4x12 cab a while ago that was loaded with a set of pre-Rola vintage greenbacks from the early 70's that I pulled out of an old beat to hell Marshall cab I had. That cab sounded amazing and recorded great. I use to run an old 100W Park Rock and Roll head into it back in the day, before I switched to Boogie heads - that was a pretty hellacious tone. Had to downsize, unfortunately, but I have another old greenback laying around - I think you've just motivated me to swap it into a cab and fire it up - thanks Glen!
Nice find! Original (first album) brown sound was indeed old greenbacks with a second cab of JBLs...blended. Driven by a late 60s power starved 100w plexi.
Apparently there were also a pair of JBL 120 speakers in the cab that was used on VH1 as well. Pete Thorn's video did a super deep dive on that sound & it's awesome!!
I found a 1980's Peavey F100 412 cab at GC and had it delivered for $138 but to my surprise it had a quad of October 5 1976 T1871 8 ohm!! These bad boys bring back memories of when speakers actually woofed! Bottom end all day long and as VH as it gets! I wanted to remember how I felt when I got mine by watching your video and you totally reminded me of that oh shit moment! Great video! Thanks Glenn!
Daaaaaaamn Glen, all that practice is really paying off. You're killing, love the vids man and keep up the good work with giving everyone facts and not falling into the guitar echo chamber.
I adapted your "fist style" of playing the guitar. My playing has improved by 300% and i can finally play tight as a machine. Going back to the "two finger" style, and i sound like an amateur that just picked up a guitar for the first time. My guitar teacher is impressed and aproves that play style. Thank you so much for that tiny but very important tip!
Oh man, now I understand why I like those 12M25 in the IR pack of Greenbacks I got to use with the amp sim. They are the SH@#@$, for sure those vintage ones, specially the 25's have a sound of their own. Gleen you are amazing, talk more about the speakers, more and more, they are super important. You don't have any idea how long I searched for the Golden IR to use in my sim haha. You are absolutely right, people or players don't even talk about speakers. I wonder why we have so much wrestle to find the magic sound. Keep doing this man, keep talking about things like that!
I have a Marshall 4x12 slant from '78 with Black backs. That cab cuts through everything and has a beautiful natural speaker breakup. Sold me on low wattage speakers. We usually run a 4x12 with BB's and a 4x12 with V30's live. It sounds big and the speakers really compliment each other well. Fills in the entire spectrum. Great Vid!
Greenbacks are ace for low tuned stuff, especially paired with T75s which are their opposites, grinding honky midrange + scooped tight response = full range covered
“You really got me” was originally written and recorded by The Kinks in march 1964, since then many covers have been recorded. Possibly the best known of the modern covers would be the Van Halen version, however the original is pretty heavy, especially when you consider when it was released. The story is that Ray Davies actually cut his speakers (very possibly celestion’s) with a razor blade to get the distorted sound on the recording. The version by 801 is also really interesting (featuring Brian Eno and Phil Manzanera from Roxy Music, and Kevin Peek from the classical rock band Sky, amongst others).
Ray's brother disputes that claim saying he kicked the speaker and it punched a hole into the speaker fabric... it's another one of those music mysteries...
@@FloridaManRacer no i heard that jimmy page got the session and dave davies slashed HIM with a razor blade and put his head thru the speakers and jeff beck walked in and clobbered him with his strat -rescued jimmy and whilst jimmy was recovering - showed ritchie blackmore how to play it - so it was ritchie who did the solo ....thats what i heard ,as i was living next door to the studio at the time
Very cool. There's such a fine line between the top end fizz either sounding like ripping, fiery gristle ...or a happy time bubble bath. No bubble baths here. After hearing this... Yeah, I mean, I already knew the tone comes from the speakers ...but now I'm wondering if in addition to the overall tone, the specific character of the top end fizz that I'm always obsessing about is made or broken by the speaker as well.
Have fun at Henning's! A couple years ago a band I was in opened for a cover band that's a real big deal here in the suburbs. The lead singer introduced one of the songs as "Anybody want to hear some Van Halen?" Crowd roars. Then they launched into "You Really Got Me."
You gotta think that most tones have been accidentally found by people like Angus, EVH, etc. simply because they were out there trying “all the things” before they found what sounded amazing. I feel like we, as musicians, are too reliant on internet information/disinformation and not willing to put in the trial and error and find out what works for ourselves. There’s probably a component of globalization/internet commerce that makes it harder to go to a physical location and try things out too. Love the content, keep it up.
What a killer video Glenn, finally someone who knows it’s the Speaker that makes the tone I’ve argued this point with so many of my guitar playing friends they are to busy changing pickups and tubes . Thanks for my proof video you kick ass Glenn.
Great video Glen. I love seeing you call out people who put too much stock in internet rumors with no backing. I will never understand the gear elitism. At the end of the day I think you could get a good album tone out of almost anything if you take the time to set it up and don't care too much about achieving something specific. Like all the 90s death metal bands that used the Ampeg VH140C that so many consider to be a 'holy grail' amp now days. It's objectively a bad amp, but it doesn't even matter. They took it and made something killer with it anyways. I honestly believe there's no such thing as a bad sound, just bad context.
Those speakers are AWESOME!!! A buddy of mine had a old marshall 412 cab with those speakers, and they just sounded amazing! But they were a pretty 2k heavy all of them
Very good video. I have the same T1511 blackbacks like you have in a 78' Marshall 412 and they are incredible. Also have the T1221 blackbacks 75hz version (what EVH supposedly used but who knows) in a 77' Mashall 412 that are similar but have more mids. Equally as incredible.
AC/DC played with very little gain; but they used the Schafer wireless unit, that really drove the signal. These days, they make the Schafer Replica - not wireless, but still drives the signal the same way.
Yeah you should do an ir Glen. These speakers sound insane. We will pay for that. You can tell by your playing that you're really enjoying the tone. Nice work
this was a great video Glenn ! i want to put some different speakers in one of my 4x12 cabs, yeah i am very excited about this thanks to u man thanks a bunch..,🤘💥🦖
on the Greenbacks(or Blackbacks) there are a big difference between the 55Hz and 75Hz Cones. I have always preferred the 55Hz ones. I really like the tone you got with these.
Yup, personal favorite guitar tone from this channel ever. Side note, if you ever think of expanding into the world of modern/classic rock within the channel, I think it would be really cool. I think I would enjoy it
I found an amp for 40euro that had been in storage for 20 years. It had a 1983 G12-65 in it in mint condition. Stuck it in my Classic 30 and it rocks. The cab from the old 1x12 is amazing too.
FYI for future reference, If a size spec is written with " (two small slashes that look like a quote symbol) after the number, then that is "inches". If it were metric the number is followed my "mm/millimeter", or "CM/centimeter", etc. You show the written spec for the quick connects as .20" x .205", then that is in inches.
Those things sound great! Just from my ears/memory and not an actual A/B comparison, the EVH riff you played, the tone sounded spot on to me. I have a redbear cab with 4 12T-75’s that sound good, but they’re a little bassey. I’m wanting to swap in a couple of V30’s in hope the spikeyness of the V30’s and the basseyness of the 12T75’s complement each other and even each other out.
Hey Glen!! Question for you, from a fellow Canadian (PEI) to another...... does the sound change a whole lot if you lay your cabinet on it's back, while it's mic'd up, compared to normal stand-up?
The celestion greenback cream back and blackbacks may be the same model number, but they vary because they used different cones. Also magnet composition and weights varied.
Sad that I built a 4x25W Greenback cabinet back around 1980 and didn't keep it, was fed by a 100W Traynor tube top at the time and sounded glorious from what I recall, what a gem to have now ... Happy with 4x65W Creambacks nowadays, makes the sounds I need
The fact that the time code for the AC/DC mix is called filthy acts for a reasonable price makes me happy beyond belief
Bet if AC/DC were canadian that's what they'd call it :D
@@VolatileDave I'd say if AC/DC were presidents from the 1880s that's what they'd call it
DOJYAAAAAAAAAAAAN
LMAAAOOO
"Great Value Bad Stuff"
I love how you are consistently helping to debunk myths surrounding tone and others. Nice job on this one.
I once bought an old greenback online and when it arrived, it turned out to be from my favorite Dutch guitar player from the 90's. I asked him how long he's had it and he had used on one of my favorite albums from that era. It's got so much mojo and character, I'm never selling this one ever.
Old Pulsonics in decent shape are all their cracked up to be. Those that have never played them (and the awesome old cabs they belong in) are just hating for clickbait. Fricker's cred is evaproating
"this guy is too opinionated, he's controversial, he rubs people the wrong way, he's abrasive, swears way too much.....I'm going to subscribe to keep an eye on him and comment in his post" 😉
How dare you get an awesome Van Halen tone without spending hours arguing about what tubes to use!
On a serious note though, very awesome video. Even though you didn't say it was "spot on" it's good enough to fool my ears, and honestly I like this more "modernized" sound quite a bit.
Overall a definite sick tone that was achieved today, even though I certainly am not one to hold the capability of having high standards in terms of mixing and tone quality myself as I'd be a hypocrite given my lack of mixing on my own stuff, but I can definitely still appreciate a good tone when I hear one.
With the AC DC section, I actually found myself thinking that, with a slightly more prominent overdriven bass sound, that whole thing could sound enormous and quite heavy. Just goes to show you can get extremely heavy sounding guitars without needing a huge amount of gain - it's all about how it sounds in the mix
You converted me to "the speaker is the most important part of the tone" many videos ago, but fuck me, this video has driven me even further in that camp. Sick tone dude, the full mix was badass but also just melodic. The solo stood out and was the icing on the cake.
Mondays aren’t the same without you, Glenn. Hope you’re having fun in Europe. 🤘🤘🤘
its thursday bro
Yeah but today is Thursday....lol.
I think we’re all going through Monday Glenn withdrawal 😩
@@kevinhill6079 its not that deep bro
Glad to see you playing guitar and giving these songs your best shot! Great tones especially the EVH tone I feel like it’s pretty close!
A comparison between these, Creambacks, and EVH speakers would be awesome since they all claim to be a variation of the Greenback.
I don't know who you talked to at Celestion, but they are not telling you the important part. They switched from Pulsonic cones to Kurt Muller cones starting in about 1975. I believe 76 is when they switched to the black caps. So for the most part, Greenbacks are Pulsonic cones, Black Backs are Kurt Muller cones. Those are the differences in tone that people hear between those two speakers.
Switching cone manufacturers makes a HUGE difference in sound of a speaker.
So it's not the tone-glue or the tone-paper?
@@mr.giggles4995 cone paper is where it's at!
They had no other choice : the Pulsonic factory was burnt to the ground in 1974.
Those speakers sound absolutely amazing. Hearing something non v30 is so refreshing to the ears. I recently swapped from using the ownhammer mesa os412 to a choptone marshall g12 410 with a dynamic mic and a ribbon mic. The difference in my tone is night and day. Tighter low end. It's really bright, but nothing harsh. I'm currently running the Line 6 Pod Go with the Diezel VH4 amp and a 808OD. Even with my sub $200 Epiphone Les Paul Jr, it crushes.
I love the sounds he’s getting. I really want to get some Greenback speakers .
@@metalinyourhead3604 do it man! I swapped out the stock speakers in my Marshal 4x12 cab with four green backs and it made an incredible difference!
That said, I am a bit of a Celestion fan boy. But only because I can actually hear a difference with Celestion over a lot of the other 'big name' manufacturers. And for the price, they're incomparable. (In my opinion, of course.)
[Edit:] I immediately realized I just assumed you're a male. I'm sorry.
I think this is the most pleasing guitar tone I've heard you get so far! Those speakers sound wonderfully balanced; nothing peaky or harsh anywhere! No mud! Awesome find!
Nice to meet you at NAMM again. Again love your videos and all the information you provide. Keep up the great work. Love to see the usage of Happy Cabs. Shout out to my friend Moshe Alvarez and the Happy Cabs team.
Loved this video. Made me realize most of my favorite old school metal distortion sounds are probably down to them using greenbacks! lol. Circa 1982-85. Early Savatage, Early Accept, on and on. Hmmm. Might have to get me some old greenbacks! Thank you!
Cool, thanks!
Hey Glenn, that sounded absolutely amazing! Actually I'd go as far as saying, if you were to make an IR out of this one I would totally get myself a copy :)
I remember reading an old article in Guitar World magazine about Motley Crüe, or another 80’s band, where they were saying that before they would go on tour, they would run a Walkman trough their guitar cabs if they were equipped with new speakers with rap music, to break them in, because they hated the sound of a new speaker. So maybe that’s why old speakers sound so good. 🤷♂️🤷♂️
I can definitely see how much your lead chops have improved a lot! Also your down picking is tight AF as well!!!! Love it! 🤘🎸
fun things i learned over the years ...
1: pedals give you the charactaristics of the distortion you want (mostly to boost an amp if the distortion channel just doesnt cut it the way you want , ts808 , clean boost , shaped boost , hm-2 , and all those other variants) ,
2: the amps preamp section gives you the "base" for your distortion that can be shaped further with the tone stack (which is different from brands and models)
3: fx loop can be used to slap a gate in and shape your distored tone a little further with parametric/graphic eqs , cool trick i learned is to put a delay in the fx loop and set the feedback really low so you get 1 rep max , and the speed really fast so its just a few ms behind the original , and the level control can be used like a mix to dial it in as you want it , this will give you a really nice fat sound ! if you´re a dimebag fan , get a stereo chorus slap it in the fx loop and set the speed really low and the width as you like it , and set the mix knob so it is just slightly noticable . thats basicly what the mxr flanger doubler does too , not exactly the same but well its a budget solution .
4: Power amp , makes it loud , thats pretty much it ...
5 : the part that can gloryfy or destroy everything i just mentioned (well this and nr6) THE SPEAKERS !!!
6: as mentioned above ... can make or break everything but not as important as nr 5 , the mics ... and mic placement . 0.5mm of movement in any fuckin direction can make a difference ... that can be a good thing or a bad thing .. depends if the bass player is allowed around the miced up cab or not ...
7: the trick from terry date that glenn showed on here with the little two channel mixer !
everything after that is just processing to fit it in the mix . but if you record guitars with cabs and mics those things are really important to know in my opinion . and i kinda found myself doing the same stuff when using vst amp sims like bias fx or stuff like that
PS : Loved the high gain tones you got out of the blackbacks ! definetly gonna get my hands on some of those if i can find em for a good price :D
Johann is just the best, I highly recommend his channel. He has a really similar mindset to your's- not all gear has to be expensive to sound good...
Probably the best tones I’ve heard so far. Full and no harshness, like a Blue Moon on tap. Btw, I’m a local semi driver in St Louis MO, I got a 9% raise this year, no we’re not union either. The world needs more people willing to get their hands dirty and less desktop metal. Your future belongs to you. Hope you’re enjoying Europe.
If you get the time, def do a deep dive on Johan’s channel. Even if he does focus on more vintage tones, you can learn a lot about speakers and cabs. He has done almost every experiment you can think of. Like he even takes vintage speakers and puts them in new cabs. And the results might surprise you.
Also check out scumback speakers for info on early Celestions. Plus he can recreate any of the variations also.
Dude that tone is pretty brutal not gonna lie... Nice find Glen!! 🔥🔥🔥
Great video Glen.. Imagine that "authentic" tone and no Gibson..love it..
Best tone you've had in a while. The power of the greenback.
Blackbacks are not completely identical to Greenbacks. They are very similar in construction but they were launched after Celestion changed a cone supplier (1973). Greenbacks used a cone from a company called 'Pulsonic' whereas Blackbacks from a company called 'Kurt Muller'. The Kurt Muller Cone was originally a bit thicker and therefore a bit more punchy and aggressive. Blackbacks have their own sound for sure; It's the sound of the late 70's and 80's (Early Metal). The only Blackback reissues, that I know of, are made by a company called Scumback Speakers, which company also makes their own Greenback reissues. They are reissues on par with Celestion's own Heritage range (which I consider both very spot on). And actually tend to sound as good as the good Greenback and Blackback Bunches. And no, not all Vintage Celestions sound the best. A lot of them are poorly maintained and sound worse than Celestion or Scumback reissues. Don't buy the Vintage gear sounds best, lost recipes bullshit. There was no magic back then that cannot be replicated with today's technology. It's propaganda from vintage gear collectors that like to sell it for a lot of money.
Glenn!!!
Thank you so much for using our Happy Cab for this demo, we really can’t thank you enough 🙏
Dang Glen! Your guitar work is coming along nicely
Good job old man... Thanks for all the great vids.
What a great find Glenn and thanks for doing the hard yards to find out more about these mythical black-backs.
Those things sounded amazing.
I think you really lucked out with this pair of speakers in that the next batch off the line may have been dogs.
Or there could be pixie dust in how they were broken in.
I think the thing with older speakers is that they have much greater variation, so you need luck.
Whereas modern speakers should be more uniform from batch to batch, but you need to find the ones that work for you.
Brilliant, nice one Glenn, great to hear them thunder in the background, very impressed. :)
Seeing you improve lately has inspired me to put in the work. I've started a couple years ago and over time began to believe this may be a young mans game. We are about the same age, so seeing it done wipes out that flawed thinking. Thanks Glenn.
The creamback was also originally just a G12M 25 watt (greenback), i have one from 1975 myself. They changed the speaker cones in the 70´s from the Pulsonic cones which probably makes most of the difference in sound compared to the 60´s greenbacks, i have some 60´s grenbacks as well. They also made greybacks according to the Celestion site.
THIS GUY DID NOT DO HIS HOME WORK VERY WELL.
@@bradleywright7066 Who is "this guy", do you mean me, Glenn or someone else ?
@@Stefan- Glenn
@@bradleywright7066 Johan made a video setting things straight!
I fully agree with this and the guys below. Johan knows his stuff! Also Celestion say don’t use guitar speakers in a ported cabinet as it will weaken the perimeter of the cone……those poor vintage speakers!!
I think a big important factor here is this speaker has a 16ohm impedance, which makes it sound brighter than its 8ohm counterpart. A detail that I noticed is often overlooked when people are trying different speakers.
I finally got a pair of celestion creamback G12m-65's after waiting for 6 months. I couldn't wait to get the right size connectors so I just soldered those bad boys in an old Peavey 2x12 and so worth the wait and no regrets. they sound so frikin awesome straight out of the box with no breaking in necessary. so warm, so smooth and I can't believe the bottom end on them. Keep up the great and informative videos glen.
Dude, that sounds amazazing! Your non-Van Halen sounds epically non-Van Halen! Keep up the great work Glenn!
Everytime there's a video about speakers I get fuckin' excited. You and Kristian khole Just anticipated Christmas for me today
Thanks for this show Glenn. Celestion Greenback delivered the sound for decades and is still a great choice. In the 80' some Greenback loade Marshall Cabs at cranked up 100W-JCM800 often killed at least one speaker when it comes to feedback at maximum volume (Amp set to 11). I had to replace some speakers for my friends at that time.(so the money for the gig was gone..) for a more rigid replacement i was asked to put a 5W-12V Car-lighting bulb in parallel to the Speaker to soak excessive power form each speaker to protect. Safety for the cost of changing the tone.
Some highend got lost. So the 30W vintage30 was the perfect solution for the cranked 100W valve amps driving one single 412 Cab. I personaly favour the NEO Cramback with 16hms in a single 112Cabinet like my actual Egnater Rebell setup. I swaped the Elite80 out for a new NEO Creamback 16Ohms and i got a powerful lowend and smooth topend guitar tone out of the box, no matter what amp i was using (JoYo, Blackstar, Laney, Driftwood). The sound is awsome like i was expecting to be, even with a speaker that is brand new and has only few hours of playing time. Tone might get even better after 50 hours of moderate volume set shredding. friendly rocking greets from Bavaria/Germany
I have a 1979 Horner 212 it’s the best vintage sound I can muster. I put a classic OD on it and it blows my modern tube amps with boogie vin30 speakers away for vintage sounds…agreed older speakers might be a little better for tone.
Hey your guitar playing is good, and I've noticed steady improvement as you continue to get back into playing more. I liked seeing you play with backing music. I think you should record more of your own stuff. Good work Glen. Oh, and thanks for all of the fantastic info you share - this is valuable content which makes your channel top-notch. F-you.
Funny, the other day me and a couple other friends were talking about how cabinet speakers are one of the major keys to getting different guitar tones, and then this morning I came across your other video discussing that topic. Glad to see you talking about that factoid on your channel!
I sort of liken the amp to speakers relationship to the engine to tires relationship. Speakers are what's ultimately moving the air and tires are where the rubber meets the road. They're vital components and you're not going anywhere without them, no matter how powerful your amp or engine is, so it's never wise to undermine their significance. Killer sounds in the video Glenn!
it's awesome to see your confidence in your playing grow. you've clearly been putting time in the shed. also cool to know about the lower frequency cutoff of these blackbacks. I really wanna try one out for clean 8 string stuff.
I love the Stained Class guitar tone. I wish bands would go back to that one.
An absolutely great tone, I agree
Great album!
That whole time period, aces tone on Record. Scorpions had it. I also like early 80's albums, Diary of a Madman and Dont break the Oath etc, Maiden ( piece of mind). Is it difficult to obtain those classic tones from the late 70's and early 80's? I'm not in the know, but a man who claims to be says " all that is easy to reproduce now with pro tools, nothing to it."
How come no one seems to tap into that warm sound if it is supposedly so reproducible?
I always thought the Sad Wings guitar tone was heavy for 1977, especially on Dissident Aggressor. That song still satisfies that spot that craves heaviness without going into thrash and death metal territories! The same goes for the Powerslave guitar tone, I wish Maiden would go back to finding tones without using a production board!
@@saltpeter7429The Piece Of Mind tone was one of the best guitar tones to come out of the 80's...by far!
Incredible bargain find on your G12M 55Hz speakers! I have 4 G12H 55Hz blackbacks - the most incredible guitar speaker I’ve heard up close. I recently tried combining a G12M with a G12H - sounded amazing. Mr Segeborn has a cool video on that too, confirming my impression that they really complement each other. Keep going with this Glenn!
That is a smokin' guitar tone! I had a Boogie 4x12 cab a while ago that was loaded with a set of pre-Rola vintage greenbacks from the early 70's that I pulled out of an old beat to hell Marshall cab I had. That cab sounded amazing and recorded great. I use to run an old 100W Park Rock and Roll head into it back in the day, before I switched to Boogie heads - that was a pretty hellacious tone. Had to downsize, unfortunately, but I have another old greenback laying around - I think you've just motivated me to swap it into a cab and fire it up - thanks Glen!
Nice find! Original (first album) brown sound was indeed old greenbacks with a second cab of JBLs...blended. Driven by a late 60s power starved 100w plexi.
Apparently there were also a pair of JBL 120 speakers in the cab that was used on VH1 as well. Pete Thorn's video did a super deep dive on that sound & it's awesome!!
Sounding great DUDE! Total score on those speakers.
I found a 1980's Peavey F100 412 cab at GC and had it delivered for $138 but to my surprise it had a quad of October 5 1976 T1871 8 ohm!! These bad boys bring back memories of when speakers actually woofed! Bottom end all day long and as VH as it gets! I wanted to remember how I felt when I got mine by watching your video and you totally reminded me of that oh shit moment! Great video! Thanks Glenn!
Daaaaaaamn Glen, all that practice is really paying off. You're killing, love the vids man and keep up the good work with giving everyone facts and not falling into the guitar echo chamber.
Long time follower and that’s my favourite mix of yours so far! Drums are sounding great too 🤘
I adapted your "fist style" of playing the guitar. My playing has improved by 300% and i can finally play tight as a machine. Going back to the "two finger" style, and i sound like an amateur that just picked up a guitar for the first time. My guitar teacher is impressed and aproves that play style. Thank you so much for that tiny but very important tip!
9:40 WICKED looking LTD you got there. I love the finish on it. Almost looks like it's made out of granite ;) what model is that guitar?
FYI it turns out it's an MH-1000 series. Gonna get me one of those soon ;)
I'm glad you found what I'd call a perfect sound
I could play using that tone for the rest of my life
Oh man, now I understand why I like those 12M25 in the IR pack of Greenbacks I got to use with the amp sim. They are the SH@#@$, for sure those vintage ones, specially the 25's have a sound of their own. Gleen you are amazing, talk more about the speakers, more and more, they are super important. You don't have any idea how long I searched for the Golden IR to use in my sim haha. You are absolutely right, people or players don't even talk about speakers. I wonder why we have so much wrestle to find the magic sound. Keep doing this man, keep talking about things like that!
Great video as usual! Your channel as well as Kohle's discuss actual alternatives of the "status quo" that is the V30.
I have a Marshall 4x12 slant from '78 with Black backs. That cab cuts through everything and has a beautiful natural speaker breakup. Sold me on low wattage speakers. We usually run a 4x12 with BB's and a 4x12 with V30's live. It sounds big and the speakers really compliment each other well. Fills in the entire spectrum. Great Vid!
Greenbacks are ace for low tuned stuff, especially paired with T75s which are their opposites, grinding honky midrange + scooped tight response = full range covered
“You really got me” was originally written and recorded by The Kinks in march 1964, since then many covers have been recorded.
Possibly the best known of the modern covers would be the Van Halen version, however the original is pretty heavy, especially when you consider when it was released. The story is that Ray Davies actually cut his speakers (very possibly celestion’s) with a razor blade to get the distorted sound on the recording.
The version by 801 is also really interesting (featuring Brian Eno and Phil Manzanera from Roxy Music, and Kevin Peek from the classical rock band Sky, amongst others).
Ray's brother disputes that claim saying he kicked the speaker and it punched a hole into the speaker fabric... it's another one of those music mysteries...
@@FloridaManRacer no i heard that jimmy page got the session and dave davies slashed HIM with a razor blade and put his head thru the speakers and jeff beck walked in and clobbered him with his strat -rescued jimmy and whilst jimmy was recovering - showed ritchie blackmore how to play it - so it was ritchie who did the solo ....thats what i heard ,as i was living next door to the studio at the time
Thanks for the Wikipedia article, Captain Aspergers.
Those speakers sound incredible. You'll need to make an ir for them now 😂
Eyy, Glenn watches Johan too? Hell yeah, man! He a big reason why I learned to love the Greenback sound as much as I do now. Cool guy.
Very cool. There's such a fine line between the top end fizz either sounding like ripping, fiery gristle ...or a happy time bubble bath.
No bubble baths here. After hearing this... Yeah, I mean, I already knew the tone comes from the speakers ...but now I'm wondering if in addition to the overall tone, the specific character of the top end fizz that I'm always obsessing about is made or broken by the speaker as well.
Thanks Glenn.
It was so much fun to watch you having so much fun.
How about a keyboards in metal video?
Have fun at Henning's! A couple years ago a band I was in opened for a cover band that's a real big deal here in the suburbs. The lead singer introduced one of the songs as "Anybody want to hear some Van Halen?" Crowd roars. Then they launched into "You Really Got Me."
You gotta think that most tones have been accidentally found by people like Angus, EVH, etc. simply because they were out there trying “all the things” before they found what sounded amazing. I feel like we, as musicians, are too reliant on internet information/disinformation and not willing to put in the trial and error and find out what works for ourselves. There’s probably a component of globalization/internet commerce that makes it harder to go to a physical location and try things out too. Love the content, keep it up.
Your cabinet sounds good but what glue is used on those puppies? Is that straight organic, 70s Elmers glue? The tone is in the glue!
That is an awesome tone it definitely feels like that 70s tone ( vh,dc ) for sure.
What a killer video Glenn, finally someone who knows it’s the Speaker that makes the tone I’ve argued this point with so many of my guitar playing friends they are to busy changing pickups and tubes . Thanks for my proof video you kick ass Glenn.
Great video Glen. I love seeing you call out people who put too much stock in internet rumors with no backing. I will never understand the gear elitism. At the end of the day I think you could get a good album tone out of almost anything if you take the time to set it up and don't care too much about achieving something specific. Like all the 90s death metal bands that used the Ampeg VH140C that so many consider to be a 'holy grail' amp now days. It's objectively a bad amp, but it doesn't even matter. They took it and made something killer with it anyways. I honestly believe there's no such thing as a bad sound, just bad context.
Those speakers are AWESOME!!! A buddy of mine had a old marshall 412 cab with those speakers, and they just sounded amazing! But they were a pretty 2k heavy all of them
The first few riffs of that mix gave me serious old school morbid angel vibes. Amazing tone!
That is the most...satisfying tone I've ever heard.
That is definitely one of the best git tones you've captured lately 👌
Never expected the Johan Segeborn shoutout, but nice!
Very good video. I have the same T1511 blackbacks like you have in a 78' Marshall 412 and they are incredible. Also have the T1221 blackbacks 75hz version (what EVH supposedly used but who knows) in a 77' Mashall 412 that are similar but have more mids. Equally as incredible.
AC/DC played with very little gain; but they used the Schafer wireless unit, that really drove the signal. These days, they make the Schafer Replica - not wireless, but still drives the signal the same way.
Yeah you should do an ir Glen. These speakers sound insane. We will pay for that. You can tell by your playing that you're really enjoying the tone. Nice work
Great video. You have been practicing a lot and it shows.
Killer video, Glenn! now I want some vintage Green/Black Backs.
Although I am bot a metal artist, since the 70's anyway, I learn so much from your righton presentations. Only in Canada you say, pity!
Holy shiiiiiiiiiit! That AC/DC tone is incredible, Glenn!
Great video. Love the sound of the Solar through the Iconic with the Black Backs.
How did you make fluence pick ups sound like old JB's run through a flimsy Marshall Mini stack, GG
this was a great video Glenn ! i want to put some different speakers in one of my 4x12 cabs, yeah i am very excited about this thanks to u man thanks a bunch..,🤘💥🦖
on the Greenbacks(or Blackbacks) there are a big difference between the 55Hz and 75Hz Cones. I have always preferred the 55Hz ones.
I really like the tone you got with these.
I would throw a significant donation to spectre digital to get some decent IRs of this speaker setup. This is fucking killer!
Yup, personal favorite guitar tone from this channel ever.
Side note, if you ever think of expanding into the world of modern/classic rock within the channel, I think it would be really cool. I think I would enjoy it
Oldschool goodness guarantee, never fails!
I found an amp for 40euro that had been in storage for 20 years. It had a 1983 G12-65 in it in mint condition. Stuck it in my Classic 30 and it rocks. The cab from the old 1x12 is amazing too.
Filthy acts for a reasonable price got me howling 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Awesome tone.
That is the best tone. It is slow clear and crisp, very articulate and sweet. Like you say, the speaker is the key.
That full mix was absolutely EPIC!
Stewmac has those connectors too. They'll send ya the connectors, wire and input jack ready to rock n roll.
FYI for future reference,
If a size spec is written with " (two small slashes that look like a quote symbol) after the number, then that is "inches".
If it were metric the number is followed my "mm/millimeter", or "CM/centimeter", etc.
You show the written spec for the quick connects as .20" x .205", then that is in inches.
Those things sound great! Just from my ears/memory and not an actual A/B comparison, the EVH riff you played, the tone sounded spot on to me. I have a redbear cab with 4 12T-75’s that sound good, but they’re a little bassey. I’m wanting to swap in a couple of V30’s in hope the spikeyness of the V30’s and the basseyness of the 12T75’s complement each other and even each other out.
Hey Glen!! Question for you, from a fellow Canadian (PEI) to another...... does the sound change a whole lot if you lay your cabinet on it's back, while it's mic'd up, compared to normal stand-up?
wow. what a perfect performance of a Van Halen song. you nailed it.
The celestion greenback cream back and blackbacks may be the same model number, but they vary because they used different cones. Also magnet composition and weights varied.
Sad that I built a 4x25W Greenback cabinet back around 1980 and didn't keep it, was fed by a 100W Traynor tube top at the time and sounded glorious from what I recall, what a gem to have now ... Happy with 4x65W Creambacks nowadays, makes the sounds I need